:01:30. > :01:33.And in the Midlands: What does it cost to have a decent standard of
:01:33. > :01:43.living? Increasing numbers of councils here say they'll pay staff
:01:43. > :01:43.
:01:43. > :37:13.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2130 seconds
:37:13. > :37:16.the living wage, 20% more than the Hello once again from the Midlands,
:37:16. > :37:19.I'm Patrick Burns. We have a distinctive perspective on the
:37:19. > :37:22.political week here in our part of the country. We're joined from the
:37:22. > :37:27.Upper House by one of our Lords spiritual, the Right Reverend
:37:27. > :37:32.Jonathan Gledhill, the Bishop of Lichfield. Also with us, the
:37:32. > :37:34.Conservative MP for Rugby, Mark Pawsey. And a little later we'll
:37:34. > :37:44.also be talking to one of Birmingham's Labour MPs, Shabana
:37:44. > :37:45.
:37:45. > :37:52.Mahmood. Let us think broadly about the Autumn Statement. How did it go
:37:52. > :37:58.down? Do you feel better or worse off? I think we were confused first
:37:58. > :38:02.of all. I put my towel on my head trying to understand the detail.
:38:02. > :38:06.More and more, I felt the next stage is going to be vital and that
:38:06. > :38:10.we take everybody with us. If people feel that what is happening
:38:10. > :38:17.is not fair and the rich are getting richer and the poor are
:38:17. > :38:21.getting poorer and the Autumn Statement did not do much to stop
:38:21. > :38:27.that, we have got trouble on our hands. But is a big challenge for
:38:27. > :38:30.you, the politicians. Absolutely. We are carrying on with the work of
:38:30. > :38:40.making certain that the next generation do not end up having to
:38:40. > :38:40.
:38:40. > :38:45.pay the bills of this generation. It is not fare of us to pass it on
:38:45. > :38:52.to our children. How do you answer the specific challenge that the
:38:52. > :38:55.bishop has set? The worry of the disconnect between those who are
:38:55. > :39:01.weathering the downturn quite well and those who are being hit very
:39:01. > :39:06.hard. I am not sure the disconnect exists. We have worked very hard to
:39:06. > :39:10.support families. A great example is getting rid of the few will rise.
:39:10. > :39:14.That will save the average family about �80 a year. We are bringing
:39:14. > :39:21.the amount that people can earn before they pay tax... That is
:39:21. > :39:27.going up. We are doing the right things for people who have got
:39:27. > :39:30.ambition and want to get on in life. Are you satisfied with that? A I am
:39:30. > :39:36.certainly satisfied with the intention but it will be how it is
:39:36. > :39:39.translated into action. To be continued. Thank you for the moment.
:39:39. > :39:42.So the Chancellor with no money duly delivered the capital projects
:39:42. > :39:45.that the Midlands' unions, business and political leaders had all been
:39:45. > :39:48.crying out for, but only by cutting �5 billion from current spending in
:39:48. > :39:51.central Government departments. I came away from the day at
:39:51. > :39:58.Westminster with the definite conclusion that it really is still
:39:58. > :40:02.plan A for austerity for five more years.
:40:02. > :40:05.A budget in all but name. It's the second biggest event in
:40:05. > :40:08.Parliament's calendar, surpassed only by Budget Day itself. This
:40:08. > :40:11.autumn statement did find some feel-good projects. Super fast
:40:11. > :40:14.broadband for Coventry, M6 widening in Staffordshire and, in response
:40:14. > :40:16.to a friendly question from James Morris the Conservative MP for
:40:16. > :40:26.Halesowen and Rowley Regis, a Black Country super-hospital paid for by
:40:26. > :40:29.
:40:29. > :40:34.a revamped private finance arrangement. We have identified the
:40:34. > :40:39.hospital as a prime candidate for the new project. I know it would
:40:39. > :40:43.help improve facilities for the many people he represents as well.
:40:43. > :40:46.I think it is a very good project and I hope we are able to proceed
:40:46. > :40:49.with it. I wondered how he could pay for it
:40:49. > :40:52.all. By capping working age benefits at 1% for a start. That's
:40:52. > :40:54.a real terms cut in living standards, as I reminded the
:40:54. > :41:02.Liberal Democrat who is now Parliamentary Assistant to the
:41:02. > :41:07.Treasury's Chief Secretary. 1% on benefits but at the same time
:41:07. > :41:10.public servants are only receiving 1% as well. There is a sort of
:41:10. > :41:13.fairness, I think. But a former West Midlands Minister
:41:13. > :41:17.drove home the Opposition's attack, the Chancellor hits the weakest the
:41:17. > :41:20.hardest. The central point for ordinary families and pensioners
:41:20. > :41:24.who are already struggling to make ends meet is that the difficulty
:41:24. > :41:29.they are facing is going to go on for much longer because he has
:41:29. > :41:30.failed to create jobs. He is failing to deal with the deficit as
:41:30. > :41:32.well. Conspicuous by their absence from
:41:32. > :41:35.this trade-off between coalition partners, Liberal Democrats could
:41:35. > :41:38.only shake their heads when the mansion tax was kicked into touch.
:41:38. > :41:41.While senior Tories including the Chancellor himself were left to rue
:41:41. > :41:48.the fact that regional pay deals for public sector workers had also
:41:48. > :41:51.been consigned to the political long grass.
:41:51. > :41:56.And as I mentioned earlier, we're also joined here today by the
:41:56. > :41:58.Shadow Business Minister Shabana Mahmood. She's the Labour MP for
:41:58. > :42:06.Birmingham Ladywood, one of the most deprived constituencies in the
:42:06. > :42:09.UK. As a shadow Business Minister, you have got to welcome the
:42:10. > :42:15.business-friendly tax holidays, cuts in corporation tax because
:42:15. > :42:19.that is really what is going to help you constituents. I think we
:42:20. > :42:24.have also been calling for bringing forward infrastructure investment
:42:24. > :42:29.and projects. The welcome those as well. I would welcome that but what
:42:29. > :42:32.we have seen already is delay when it comes to the delivery of these
:42:32. > :42:38.projects. The flagship Regional Growth Fund is a complete fiasco.
:42:38. > :42:41.You would not find anyone who would say it has gone off to a good start.
:42:41. > :42:48.Only a very small number of businesses have had money to help
:42:48. > :42:51.them grow and thereby grow the economy. It is not just the
:42:51. > :42:57.projects they are bringing forward, they have got to deliver on them.
:42:57. > :43:00.They are not treating it with the urgency it deserves. They are
:43:00. > :43:05.devolving all of the money Lord Heseltine has been recommending
:43:05. > :43:15.through to the local economic partnerships. That is a significant
:43:15. > :43:18.move. A slow start but it is moving now. The slow start... Lower and
:43:18. > :43:25.middle income families are paying the price. We cannot afford to get
:43:25. > :43:29.off to a slow start. We need urgent action. The government does not
:43:29. > :43:34.understand how much of an emergency we have when it comes to jobs and
:43:34. > :43:37.growth. There is not much money about. They are trying to sort out
:43:38. > :43:40.the mess they say they inherited from the government. What we have
:43:40. > :43:44.seen from this government is every single economic judgment that
:43:44. > :43:51.needed to be made is one they have got wrong. They have borrowed much
:43:51. > :43:57.more money than they would have had to borrow if they had followed the
:43:57. > :44:01.plans put in place by the previous government. It is not good enough.
:44:01. > :44:04.You see the case from the opposition. It is too slow and
:44:04. > :44:09.delay and divert is costing the country dear. We can all agree that
:44:09. > :44:13.more money needs to get into these projects more quickly. I am pleased
:44:13. > :44:16.the government has put the money into the new hospital in Sandwell.
:44:16. > :44:20.One of the challenges of the past government was that they did not
:44:20. > :44:23.have enough scrutiny on cost. Building Schools for the Future
:44:23. > :44:28.programme, the schools were very expensive to build a matter is one
:44:28. > :44:34.of the reasons why the project ended. We have got to get value for
:44:34. > :44:38.money. We also touched in the report on fairness. Given the
:44:38. > :44:42.challenges the politicians... We hear this in the discussion already.
:44:42. > :44:48.Politicians are battling to so, it is difficult, challenging, but we
:44:48. > :44:54.are being fair. Is that the key to the argument? If they can convince
:44:54. > :44:58.us that is the case, just to take one example about the PFI hospital.
:44:58. > :45:02.We have been worried for years that all we are doing is leaving the
:45:02. > :45:06.costs to our children and grandchildren. He said that
:45:06. > :45:11.yourself. The new private finance, I do not know enough about it to
:45:11. > :45:16.know if it is going to safeguard the interests of our children or
:45:16. > :45:21.penalise them. The Labour leader of Sandwell Council was there singing
:45:21. > :45:25.the praises of the government announcement. That was a moment to
:45:25. > :45:32.treasure. The devil is going to be in the detail. When the plans come
:45:32. > :45:36.forward... This is an early stage and we do not have detail.
:45:36. > :45:39.enshrines the public interest to a greater extent. If it helps us get
:45:39. > :45:46.to a place where we can build the Birmingham Metropolitan Hospital,
:45:46. > :45:49.that is something that we want to see. I have to say no government
:45:49. > :45:53.can claim to be behaving in a fair way when it comes to difficult
:45:53. > :46:00.decisions on the economy if one of their central policies has been a
:46:00. > :46:04.tax cut for millionaires. Ordinary people are paying more money.
:46:04. > :46:08.issue about benefits. We have got to make it right that people are
:46:08. > :46:12.better off in work. Let us not forget that under the last
:46:12. > :46:18.government benefits increased at twice the rate of average earnings.
:46:18. > :46:21.We have got to rebalance the economy. We have 1.2 million more
:46:21. > :46:25.jobs and the private sector. We are changing the mix between the
:46:25. > :46:28.private and public sector. The private sector is now coming
:46:28. > :46:33.forward with the jobs and that is where the growth will come from.
:46:33. > :46:40.That needs the infrastructure like improvements to the motorways.
:46:40. > :46:42.Jaguar Land Rover, we are building the junction on the M40 in order to
:46:42. > :46:46.service them. These are growth projects that will improve the
:46:46. > :46:51.wealth of people throughout the country. Can I just pick up on one
:46:51. > :46:55.thing about confusion that many people... Beryl lots of ideas and
:46:55. > :47:00.percentages and images and warnings flying around -- there are lots of
:47:00. > :47:04.ideas. There is a premium on communicating all of this. You are
:47:04. > :47:08.professional communicators, as politicians. We are but we need to
:47:08. > :47:12.get the message across that everyone is bearing their share.
:47:13. > :47:17.The richest took the biggest burden out of the Autumn Statement. We
:47:17. > :47:21.need to be patient. There is light at the end of the tunnel. I accept
:47:21. > :47:25.it is further away because of the situation in the world economy
:47:25. > :47:29.right now. Our biggest trading partner the eurozone... We are
:47:29. > :47:35.going in the right direction. It would be a complete mistake to put
:47:35. > :47:41.behind us the hard work we have got through over the past two years and
:47:41. > :47:44.prejudice that. We have got to keep going. If the government wants to
:47:44. > :47:47.communicate fairness, they should cancel the tax cut for millionaires.
:47:47. > :47:51.That was Sunday very clear message that the burdens are going to be
:47:51. > :47:56.placed on the whole of the country and shared fairly. They are not
:47:56. > :48:01.prepared to do that which shows us that their priorities and ideology
:48:01. > :48:05.is inherently wrong and deeply, deeply unfair. More wealthy people
:48:05. > :48:10.have come back to the UK and now paying more income tax so the total
:48:10. > :48:13.tax has gone up in that period. Every single independent for car
:48:13. > :48:19.shows that it is middle and lower income families paying the cost of
:48:19. > :48:23.the economic failure that the Chancellor has brought to us.
:48:23. > :48:26.your diocese, you will Minister to over 2 million people who are going
:48:26. > :48:32.through a tough time. We now know they're going to go through a tough
:48:32. > :48:37.time for longer. What are the challengers for you? It is going to
:48:37. > :48:42.be tough and over the weekend the commentators have said it may be
:48:42. > :48:48.worrying leap half. That will work if people feel everybody is working
:48:48. > :48:52.together -- worryingly tough. One in five mothers of certain income
:48:52. > :48:55.brackets go without food each week to protect their children. That
:48:55. > :49:00.obviously cannot be allowed to continue otherwise people will get
:49:00. > :49:04.really angry. Socially with the situation they find themselves in,
:49:04. > :49:10.they will get really angry. Very challenging times. Thank you for
:49:10. > :49:14.taking on the challenges head on. A growing number of Midlands
:49:14. > :49:19.councils say they'll pay their staff the living wage. That's more
:49:19. > :49:22.than �1 an hour above the minimum wage. When it was introduced by
:49:22. > :49:26.Tony Blair's government, the minimum wage was �3.60. It's now
:49:26. > :49:29.�6.19. But more organisations are now committing to the principle of
:49:29. > :49:38.a higher rate, as BBC Hereford and Worcester's political reporter Tom
:49:38. > :49:42.Turrell explains. How much do you need to earn for a
:49:42. > :49:46.basic standard of living? Increasingly, it seems the minimum
:49:46. > :49:49.wage simply isn't enough. Elaine's one of more than 2,500 workers at
:49:49. > :49:55.Birmingham City Council now receiving what's known as the
:49:55. > :49:59.living wage. It's a policy brought in by the Labour-run authority
:49:59. > :50:08.aimed at putting a bit more money in the pockets of its lowest paid
:50:08. > :50:16.workers. I get �50 a month more. It is a lot of money. To some people,
:50:16. > :50:20.in may not be. But to low-paid workers, �50 as a lot of money.
:50:20. > :50:30.What is it all about? You could be forgiven for thinking we already
:50:30. > :50:34.
:50:34. > :50:37.have a statutory minimum wage. You are absolutely right. It currently
:50:37. > :50:40.pays �6.19 an hour. But now campaigners are pressing for
:50:40. > :50:42.employers to pay a living wage of �7.45 per hour. That's an extra
:50:42. > :50:45.�1.26. Almost 100 organisations nationwide have committed to paying
:50:45. > :50:47.the living wage, many of them charities and local authorities. In
:50:47. > :50:52.the past few weeks, Labour-run councils in Stoke-on-Trent and
:50:52. > :50:54.Newcastle-under-Lyme signed up to it too. But the Conservative-
:50:54. > :51:00.controlled council in Stafford rejected the idea saying it would
:51:01. > :51:03.lead to job losses. At the moment, half of the eight councils across
:51:03. > :51:13.Herefordshire and Worcestershire are looking at paying the living
:51:13. > :51:14.
:51:14. > :51:18.wage. One of those is Wyre Forest. We want to pay our people pay fair
:51:18. > :51:28.rate for their services. We want them to be able to live. We think
:51:28. > :51:32.
:51:32. > :51:35.the living wage is absolutely the right thing to do. Here at Top Barn
:51:35. > :51:38.Farm on the outskirts of Worcester, the Christmas spirit is in full
:51:38. > :51:40.flow. Seasonal workers are in high demand. But much like when the
:51:40. > :51:43.minimum wage was brought in 1999, the response from some businesses
:51:43. > :51:47.to the living wage is less glad tidings, more bah humbug. Margins
:51:47. > :51:54.are very tight at the moment. The Labour bill is very high. If we had
:51:54. > :52:04.to increase that by 20%, it would have serious implications. I am not
:52:04. > :52:06.
:52:06. > :52:09.sure what the future of growing our crops would be. The farm's grotto
:52:09. > :52:12.is pulling in the punters. But if the living wage were to become law,
:52:12. > :52:16.it could see staff pay rise by one fifth, something businesses like
:52:16. > :52:20.this one feel is a gift they can't afford to give. A pay rise isn't
:52:20. > :52:25.just for Christmas. Tom Turrell reporting. You have taken a bit of
:52:25. > :52:29.a lead on this issue with a new diocese. We had a debate about
:52:29. > :52:33.whether we should make it part of our policy and we rehearsed the
:52:33. > :52:37.argument of the Christmas Tree growers and that we would have to
:52:37. > :52:41.cut some of our staff if we were to do that. In the end, people decided
:52:41. > :52:46.it was so important because of people suffering that we should go
:52:46. > :52:52.ahead. So far, it has worked. you say it has worked, it has not
:52:52. > :52:55.cost jobs. It has not. We have found the extra money. The genius
:52:55. > :52:59.of the thing is that it is voluntary so it takes into account
:52:59. > :53:03.the fact that some people are in different positions. I quite
:53:03. > :53:06.understand the argument of the Christmas tree grow up. I hope he
:53:07. > :53:12.will see colleagues managing to pay it and maybe next year he will be
:53:12. > :53:18.able to pay the living wage. Is it implicit that the minimum wage is
:53:18. > :53:22.insufficient? For an awful lot of people, yes. That is what we are
:53:22. > :53:27.finding too. Parishes themselves are of course different. It is
:53:27. > :53:32.quite different in Shrewsbury to the Black Country for instance. It
:53:32. > :53:38.is important to have flexibility in the system. How do you reflect on
:53:38. > :53:41.this? We have seen Labour councils doing it and some Conservative
:53:41. > :53:46.council's thinking about it. It is highly desirable that people should
:53:46. > :53:50.be paid more. My party believes in giving people incentives to work.
:53:50. > :53:54.The higher the wages, the more incentive there will be to move on
:53:54. > :53:58.to work from benefit. But I think we need to separate the private
:53:58. > :54:03.sector from the public sector. In the public sector, it is a matter
:54:03. > :54:13.for individual councils. We had two Conservative councils there with
:54:13. > :54:16.different views. That is localism. Very interested in the Bishop's
:54:16. > :54:23.view of the regional difference. The council has a budget to deliver
:54:23. > :54:27.a service. The council countries do have a large number of people at
:54:27. > :54:31.one wage rate. Provided the services delivered, it does not
:54:31. > :54:35.matter. On the issue of the private sector, I ran a business for 25
:54:35. > :54:40.years before becoming an MP. It would worry me immensely have
:54:40. > :54:43.suddenly I had to find an extra 20% on my wage bill. Lots of small
:54:43. > :54:48.businesses will see this proposal as something that is desirable but
:54:48. > :54:52.it would be a massive struggle for them. That is the concern. Is it
:54:52. > :54:56.affordable for many businesses when if you look back... George Osborne
:54:56. > :55:06.is trying to cap everything up 1% as far as the public sector is
:55:06. > :55:10.concerned that alone a 20%. I quite see that argument. But it is
:55:10. > :55:17.amazing how much money they it still is in the system if people
:55:17. > :55:22.are inspired to do something fresh and new -- how much money there is.
:55:22. > :55:28.Let us leave each council to decide. I am a great believer in devolving
:55:28. > :55:32.power down to local councils. This is an area where they can beat this
:55:32. > :55:36.agreement. Yes, provided they are willing to go and chat with their
:55:36. > :55:41.colleagues who take a different view. Your diocese joins an
:55:41. > :55:45.interesting range of organisations who are interested in taking this
:55:45. > :55:52.initiative. An interesting range of groups. Yes. I think we have found
:55:52. > :56:00.in the last recession when there was a question about what we should
:56:00. > :56:04.do about people in poverty. An interesting idea was the idea that
:56:04. > :56:09.if you asked your employees if they would take a wage cut in order for
:56:09. > :56:19.someone else to keep their job but a dive people are inspired, they
:56:19. > :56:22.did deeper into their pockets. Now our regular round-up of the
:56:22. > :56:26.political week in the Midlands in 60 seconds, with BBC Radio
:56:26. > :56:29.Shropshire's political reporter Liz Roberts.
:56:29. > :56:32.They're no mugs in the Potteries. Less than 24 hours after it was
:56:32. > :56:39.announced the Duchess was pregnant, commemorative ware rolled off the
:56:39. > :56:41.production lines. Two weeks ago, our exclusive
:56:41. > :56:49.investigation revealed what became of land once owned by Advantage
:56:49. > :56:54.West Midlands. Now the issue's been taken up in Parliament. I wonder if
:56:54. > :57:00.the Chancellor is aware of the recent BBC investigation into the
:57:00. > :57:07.fate of �107 million worth of assets. He is the backbencher's
:57:07. > :57:10.backbencher of the year. Congratulations to Hereford MP
:57:10. > :57:12.Jesse Norman for picking up the award. Meanwhile, after 20 years as
:57:12. > :57:14.an MP, Labour's Bob Ainsworth revealed to BBC Coventry and
:57:14. > :57:17.Warwickshire he'll stand down at the next election.
:57:17. > :57:20.And more tea vicar? Supporters of women Bishops in the Diocese of
:57:20. > :57:30.Hereford are wearing aprons to services today saying women
:57:30. > :57:34.
:57:34. > :57:40.shouldn't just be associated with A witty protest by the women in
:57:40. > :57:44.Hereford. Where are we going with women bishops? Can you envisage
:57:44. > :57:50.yourself appointing a woman bishop? I hope so. I think it would have
:57:50. > :57:57.been better if the rent for the aprons instead of women.
:57:57. > :58:01.ultimate in Liberation -- if the men. The question that we were
:58:01. > :58:07.divided over his had to protect the very small minority but significant
:58:07. > :58:11.minority who are against it. That is what we have got to work on next.
:58:11. > :58:16.We will see what the lawyers allow us up to do and I hope we can make
:58:16. > :58:20.progress this year. There is some wriggle room in this, you are
:58:20. > :58:25.suggesting? The lawyers will tell us. I was very disappointed we were
:58:25. > :58:30.not able to go ahead in July and then last month. I hope desperately
:58:30. > :58:34.we will be able to after Christmas. There is lurking in this debate
:58:34. > :58:38.political issues about how to protect minorities. Mike is not
:58:38. > :58:41.always right. I think this is a matter for the Church rather than
:58:41. > :58:45.for politicians. But politics is about getting a message across and
:58:45. > :58:50.I think in the choice of the way they are going about this they have
:58:50. > :58:54.done so with a sense of humour. It means we are talking about the
:58:54. > :58:58.protest in no way we might not have done. The notion that the gentleman
:58:58. > :59:04.might join them with an apron on is a fund one and one that will
:59:04. > :59:14.certainly attract people's attention. -- a fund one. They have
:59:14. > :59:16.
:59:16. > :59:23.not wasted much time making pottery. There are lots of ways of boosting
:59:23. > :59:30.the economy. The entrepreneurial spirit is there. Staffordshire, the
:59:30. > :59:37.creative county, why not? Final word about bob Ainsworth. It would
:59:37. > :59:41.be a great shame to see him go. I have seen lots of very senior MPs
:59:41. > :59:51.and it has been an honour to work with him. That is where we have to
:59:51. > :59:54.leave it. My thanks... My thanks to Mark Pawsey MP and to