:00:36. > :00:41.Morning, folks. Welcome to the Sunday Politics. The unions helped
:00:42. > :00:45.him beat his brother to the top. Now Ed Miliband wants to change Labour's
:00:46. > :00:49.relationship with them. Who will come out on top? We will be asking
:00:50. > :00:52.one union baron what he thinks. Cracks in the coalition after
:00:53. > :00:56.Education Secretary Michael Gove sacks the chairwoman of Ofsted. His
:00:57. > :01:00.Lib Dem deputy is said to be hopping mad. We will be talking to the new
:01:01. > :01:04.deputy leader of the Lib Dems, Malcolm Bruce.
:01:05. > :01:06.Caught a bout of the EU blues? David Cameron has been drowning his
:01:07. > :01:10.sorrows with the President of France. Who better? We will be
:01:11. > :01:13.asking if the EU referendum bill is dead in the water.
:01:14. > :01:17.And bad weather getting you down? Getting from A to B a bit of a
:01:18. > :01:19.nightmare? Fear not! The leader of the Greens will be here with her
:01:20. > :01:32.traffic and travel report. Dutch In the midlands: ten years after
:01:33. > :01:45.Birmingham was done a banana Will it provide the kind of
:01:46. > :01:48.reassurance people want? Yes, all that and more in today s
:01:49. > :01:52.action-packed Sunday Politics. And blowing more hot air than I have had
:01:53. > :01:58.hot dinners, Helen Lewis, Nick Watt and Iain Martin.
:01:59. > :02:00.After the row about candidate selection in Falkirk, Ed Miliband
:02:01. > :02:04.said he wanted to reshape the relationship between Labour and the
:02:05. > :02:07.unions. The biggest changes involve union membership of the party, which
:02:08. > :02:14.in turn will affect future Labour leadership elections. Some claim
:02:15. > :02:17.this is Ed's Clause 4 moment. But the unions will continue to be
:02:18. > :02:20.powerful at conference and on the party's ruling committees, and they
:02:21. > :02:24.will still be able to bankroll the election campaign. Here is Labour's
:02:25. > :02:34.deputy leader, Harriet Harman, speaking earlier. What he is
:02:35. > :02:37.proposing for the March the 1st conference is a huge change in
:02:38. > :02:44.financing, in the election of the leader, in what goes on at local
:02:45. > :02:48.level. In due course, it might have implications for the NEC elections
:02:49. > :02:50.and conference. But this is already a big issue to take forward.
:02:51. > :02:54.Joining me now is Paul Kenny, general secretary of the GMB union
:02:55. > :03:03.and chair of the Trade Union and Labour Party Liaison Organisation.
:03:04. > :03:10.Is this Ed Miliband's Clause 4 moment? I don't know about that It
:03:11. > :03:16.is certainly a bold move, particularly to have an electoral
:03:17. > :03:21.college, which as you said was the system which elected him in the
:03:22. > :03:26.first place. Everybody admits that has needed reforming for some time.
:03:27. > :03:32.Moving to a one member, one vote situation seems to me to be
:03:33. > :03:39.sensible. I know some people are upset, mostly MPs, who will lose
:03:40. > :03:47.their golden share. But it is nonsense that one MP should have the
:03:48. > :03:58.same vote as 1000 party members So the MPs have lost out. Have the
:03:59. > :04:01.unions lost out? Well, the system is currently that union members get a
:04:02. > :04:06.ballot paper, but they have to declare that they are a Labour
:04:07. > :04:11.supporter and they have to sign to that effect in order to participate.
:04:12. > :04:18.Then their vote is counted. At the last election, about 200,000 trade
:04:19. > :04:22.union members gave that indication, and they participated in that way.
:04:23. > :04:29.That will not change. The way it is organised will be different. The big
:04:30. > :04:35.change in the electoral college is that the logical weight given to MPs
:04:36. > :04:40.will disappear. I wonder if you have really lost anything. At the moment,
:04:41. > :04:43.there are about 3 million people automatically affiliated from the
:04:44. > :04:48.unions to the Labour Party. If only 10% of them opt in, that will still
:04:49. > :04:56.mean twice as many union individual members, 300,000, versus about
:04:57. > :05:01.180,000 Labour Party members. So union members and maybe even the
:05:02. > :05:08.unions will have as big an influence on the leadership elections as you
:05:09. > :05:11.do now, maybe bigger? Well, they are individual votes. Different unions
:05:12. > :05:18.support different candidates. It is lost in the media myth of barons and
:05:19. > :05:22.block votes, but there is an individual vote. Different unions
:05:23. > :05:25.recommend different candidates, and union members vote accordingly. Ed
:05:26. > :05:32.Miliband won more individual votes by a country mile than David, but it
:05:33. > :05:38.got messed up in the process of this electoral college. As I have
:05:39. > :05:44.understood the proposals so far they are not a done deal. There is a
:05:45. > :05:50.lot of discussion. But it seems there are three hurdles. Firstly,
:05:51. > :05:53.union members themselves will have to agree whether they want to
:05:54. > :05:59.affiliate to the Labour Party. If they don't, the rest of it falls. If
:06:00. > :06:04.they decide they do my they will ask union members to support that an
:06:05. > :06:09.individual basis the next five years, which will have financial
:06:10. > :06:12.implications. Then there will be a third position, which is that people
:06:13. > :06:17.who may want to agree with the union's position and affiliate with
:06:18. > :06:20.the Labour Party may want to go further and become active supporters
:06:21. > :06:24.of the Labour Party, participating in leadership elections. They will
:06:25. > :06:29.have to give their sanction to that at a third stage. So the
:06:30. > :06:34.implications in terms of constituency parties and so on are a
:06:35. > :06:40.lot less than the idea that the 3 million who are currently affiliated
:06:41. > :06:46.will change. At the moment, the unions, because of the automatic
:06:47. > :06:51.affiliation, hand over a affiliation fees of about ?8 million a year to
:06:52. > :06:54.Labour. You will now get to keep that money, because the individuals
:06:55. > :07:02.will have to put up the money themselves. You can keep that money
:07:03. > :07:06.and determine if you give it to Labour to fight the election
:07:07. > :07:11.campaign, correct? Incorrect. Firstly, the affiliation fees are
:07:12. > :07:14.paid from what is called the political fund, which most unions
:07:15. > :07:18.have to set up in order to participate. The union will continue
:07:19. > :07:25.to pay the ?3 a affiliation fee for those members who want the union to
:07:26. > :07:33.be affiliated. But you get to keep a lot more money. In reality, we will
:07:34. > :07:41.see a transitional period of a few years. Less people will probably say
:07:42. > :07:45.yes, depending on how popular Labour are, about whether they want the
:07:46. > :07:57.union to give money to the Labour Party. The GMB has already done
:07:58. > :08:04.this. By the way, don't call me kneel. It is Andrew or Mr Neil. The
:08:05. > :08:08.unions will have a bigger chunk of money because the unions will not be
:08:09. > :08:13.handing over all of the money at one time. But you could still play a
:08:14. > :08:17.major part in funding the Labour election campaign. We'll how much
:08:18. > :08:24.you give the dependent on what the Labour Party puts in its manifesto?
:08:25. > :08:29.Of course it will. It will have to justify our support to Labour for
:08:30. > :08:35.the members who provide money to the political fund. If we did not argue
:08:36. > :08:39.for the cert is social justice campaigns and laws we want to see,
:08:40. > :08:42.we would be failing in our job. I don't intend to hide that from
:08:43. > :08:50.anybody. The unions are there to fight for their members. That is our
:08:51. > :08:54.job. So you will still be a major part of the bankroll of the Labour
:08:55. > :08:59.campaign. You will still have 5 % of the votes at a Labour conference,
:09:00. > :09:02.and you will still have a major part in the Labour National executive
:09:03. > :09:06.committee and the policy committee. It is right to say the unions are
:09:07. > :09:15.still at the heart of Labour, are they not? Well, if you sick to break
:09:16. > :09:20.the affiliated link between trade unions and the Labour Party, the
:09:21. > :09:23.whole thing collapses. That is what anchors the Labour Party as far as
:09:24. > :09:27.we are concerned. Many of our members think that when they want to
:09:28. > :09:31.look for ferrochrome and rights social justice, housing and the
:09:32. > :09:36.health service, Labour are better it quipped to deliver that for working
:09:37. > :09:39.people than the current parties That is why we have traditionally
:09:40. > :09:44.supported them. But not at all of our members support Labour, which is
:09:45. > :09:50.why we don't affiliate all of them to Labour. There are over 30 million
:09:51. > :10:01.people in the British labour force now. Union membership is only 6 5
:10:02. > :10:06.million out of that 30. A 6.5% of that do not vote Labour, they vote
:10:07. > :10:12.Tory or liberal or nationalist in Scotland. So you are a relatively
:10:13. > :10:18.small pressure group. Why should Labour be in thrall to you? We are
:10:19. > :10:24.the biggest voluntary organisation in this country. Sorry about that,
:10:25. > :10:28.but that is the fact. People make conscious choices. My own union the
:10:29. > :10:34.GMB, has been growing for eight years. So this dying picture you are
:10:35. > :10:38.trying to paint... In terms of accounting for the fact that some do
:10:39. > :10:45.not support Labour, that is why unions do not affiliate all of their
:10:46. > :10:49.members to the Labour Party. We have adjusted to that. If you don't like
:10:50. > :10:57.being called Neil, I don't like being called a barren either. What
:10:58. > :11:01.about Mr Baron? I don't like that either. We are representatives of
:11:02. > :11:05.working organisations. It may be inconvenient for politicians to have
:11:06. > :11:10.to listen to working people, but we will continue to press. Lord Baron,
:11:11. > :11:17.thank you very much. So, is this a Clause 4 moment for Ed
:11:18. > :11:21.Miliband? Not really, but to his credit, he is going ahead with this.
:11:22. > :11:26.There was a point at which it looked as though Ed Miliband would back
:11:27. > :11:30.away from reform. To his credit he is trying to create a mass
:11:31. > :11:33.membership party again. But when it comes to the crucial business of
:11:34. > :11:38.funding a general election campaign, these reforms will make Labour more
:11:39. > :11:44.reliant on large donations from trade unions. They could have more
:11:45. > :11:48.power now, because they get to hold back this money, whereas beforehand,
:11:49. > :11:54.they had to hand it over automatically. As Mr Kenny just
:11:55. > :12:00.said, how much they handover will be dependent on good behaviour. Yes,
:12:01. > :12:04.but these are pragmatic reforms The fact that Ed Miliband has a lot of
:12:05. > :12:08.capital in not being seen as a Blairite has helped him get these
:12:09. > :12:12.through . The response has been muted, which suggests good party
:12:13. > :12:16.management on his behalf. That may be because they will still have 50%
:12:17. > :12:20.of the votes at a party conference. Mr Kenny was clear that that could
:12:21. > :12:23.be deal-breaker if they tried to take that away. They have more
:12:24. > :12:31.places at the NEC than anyone else, and party members, if only 10% of
:12:32. > :12:35.them signed up, they will outweigh individual members in the
:12:36. > :12:39.constituencies. It was interesting, how relaxed Paul Kenny was. He was
:12:40. > :12:42.taking thousands of pounds from the Labour Party a few months ago
:12:43. > :12:46.because he was annoyed about these reforms, and now he is relaxed
:12:47. > :12:50.because they still have 50% of the vote at Labour Party conference and
:12:51. > :12:54.Labour Party Parliamentary candidates are still selected in the
:12:55. > :12:58.same way. But there is a simple point here. Yes, you can pick apart
:12:59. > :13:02.what Ed Miliband said and said the unions have too much influence, but
:13:03. > :13:06.the only way he could have gone all the way was to break the link with
:13:07. > :13:11.the trade unions, and he was not going to do that. It was not the
:13:12. > :13:14.Labour Party that founded the unions, it was the unions that
:13:15. > :13:21.founded the Labour Party. Even Tony Blair did not break the link. In
:13:22. > :13:26.that context, Ed Miliband has gone incredibly far. For the last 50
:13:27. > :13:30.years, this opting into the union, you have to turn to page 50 of your
:13:31. > :13:34.union terms and conditions to say, do you want to opt out of the
:13:35. > :13:40.political levy 's that is going to go, which will mean that when the
:13:41. > :13:44.next Labour leader is elected from the union votes, they will get their
:13:45. > :13:49.ballot from the Labour Party and you will append the fast where ballots
:13:50. > :13:52.went out from Unison macro and GMB with a picture of Ed Miliband on the
:13:53. > :13:58.front of the ballot paper saying, vote for aid. They were Stasi and
:13:59. > :14:05.Saddam Hussein ways of trade union members electing the Labour leader,
:14:06. > :14:07.which will go. I am sorry his Lordship is not still here to answer
:14:08. > :14:11.that question. HMS Coalition is not a happy ship.
:14:12. > :14:15.The lovey-dovey days in the rose garden are long gone. It is not a
:14:16. > :14:18.loveless marriage, perhaps even an open one. The latest split is over
:14:19. > :14:21.the decision by Education Secretary Michael Gove to replace Labour peer
:14:22. > :14:25.Sally Morgan as head of the schools inspectorate, Ofsted. Mr Gove's
:14:26. > :14:27.deputy, Lib Dem David Laws, is said to be spitting blood about her
:14:28. > :14:35.removal, although only through surrogates. He has not said a word
:14:36. > :14:46.on the record. Here was the Education Secretary a little
:14:47. > :14:49.earlier. If there is another opportunity for Sally to serve in a
:14:50. > :14:53.different role at a different time, then I would be delighted to support
:14:54. > :14:57.her in the role which she thinks it is appropriate to do. There is
:14:58. > :15:01.nothing wrong with Sally but there is a principle across government
:15:02. > :15:06.that there should be no automatic reappointment, and that after three
:15:07. > :15:11.or four years, it is appropriate to bring in a fresh pair of eyes. That
:15:12. > :15:17.is good corporate practice in order to ensure that you refresh boards,
:15:18. > :15:23.bring a new perspective, and have tough questions asked. We're joined
:15:24. > :15:26.now by the newly elected deputy leader of the Liberal Democrats
:15:27. > :15:31.Malcolm Bruce. He's in Aberdeen Welcome to the Sunday Politics.
:15:32. > :15:37.David Laws is said to be furious with Michael Gove, is he? I think he
:15:38. > :15:42.is because Sally Morgan has been doing a good job and that has been
:15:43. > :15:47.generally agreed across the whole spectrum. I think Ofsted is an
:15:48. > :15:51.impartial body that inspects all schools and it shouldn't be subject
:15:52. > :15:56.to some kind of political direction. That is the concern, that she is
:15:57. > :15:59.being removed when she was doing a good job and most people thought she
:16:00. > :16:13.should be reappointed. It is strongly rumoured her successor will
:16:14. > :16:19.be a high-ranking Tory backer. Why hasn't David Laws said this himself,
:16:20. > :16:24.have you spoken to him? I have, and I know he is not very pleased about
:16:25. > :16:28.it but he will want to speak to Michael Gove himself when he gets to
:16:29. > :16:33.see him on Monday. The question you have to take on board is that David
:16:34. > :16:38.Laws is the schools minister, effectively the one who has
:16:39. > :16:43.engagement with Ofsted, and he is seeing it being undermined by the
:16:44. > :16:47.Secretary of State. There is a question that if Michael Gove is so
:16:48. > :16:52.pleased with Sally Morgan why is he replacing her, and who will he be
:16:53. > :16:56.replacing her with, and on what basis? Maybe parliament should have
:16:57. > :17:00.a confirmation hearing so that we can be assured that whoever is put
:17:01. > :17:09.in charge is there because they are good at it. Why has he licensed his
:17:10. > :17:15.surrogates to save this rather than saying it himself? He didn't, he
:17:16. > :17:22.knew I was on the programme this morning so I am giving you the
:17:23. > :17:29.answers as best I can. David is perfectly capable of speaking for
:17:30. > :17:33.himself. He hasn't so far. You asked me to come on this programme and
:17:34. > :17:37.David was anxious for me to know he wasn't happy about it, and I can
:17:38. > :17:42.certainly tell you that. I can also give you my own opinion which is
:17:43. > :17:50.that Ofsted is not the Department for Education, it is an independent
:17:51. > :17:54.body. The question you have to ask is will Michael Gove but someone in
:17:55. > :18:01.charge of Ofsted who will have a political agenda? If so, that is not
:18:02. > :18:07.what Ofsted should be used for. Let's move on to your own position.
:18:08. > :18:18.You are 69, white male, middle-class, what is your answer to
:18:19. > :18:22.the party with diversity problems? I don't think that is what they voted
:18:23. > :18:26.on. They felt I had a wealth of experience that would be vulnerable
:18:27. > :18:30.to the party from the period now until the election, not least
:18:31. > :18:35.because the central issues that will concern voters are the economy, and
:18:36. > :18:42.I have a track record of promoting the party's economic policy over
:18:43. > :18:46.many years. But you are not even standing at the next election. No,
:18:47. > :18:59.but we need to get to the next election and my colleagues have
:19:00. > :19:01.confidence that I can do a useful job for the party in that situation.
:19:02. > :19:04.We have developed and delivered policies that I have helped to shape
:19:05. > :19:06.and I want to persuade people to understand the Liberal Democrats
:19:07. > :19:11.have made a fundamental difference to the economic recovery. But you
:19:12. > :19:14.know what has been happening with the Liberal Democrats and their
:19:15. > :19:22.problems with women. Wasn't this a chance to select a woman in a major
:19:23. > :19:30.part? You only have seven female MPs out of 57, not a single Lib Dem
:19:31. > :19:35.woman in the Parliament. Again, why you rather than making a break and
:19:36. > :19:41.bringing someone in onto major positions? My colleagues have
:19:42. > :19:46.concluded that the role I am best qualified to do it, that is why they
:19:47. > :19:52.voted for me. We do only have seven women and that is an issue we need
:19:53. > :20:04.to address. Two of those women are ministers, one is a government whip.
:20:05. > :20:08.We seem to have lost our line to Aberdeen, just as Malcolm Bruce was
:20:09. > :20:15.in full flight defending his position. I'm not sure if we can get
:20:16. > :20:21.the line back, just bear with me for a few seconds to see if we can get
:20:22. > :20:25.it. It looks as if we have lost Malcolm Bruce, I do apologise to
:20:26. > :20:33.Malcolm Bruce and the viewers that we were not able to continue that
:20:34. > :20:36.interview. Fierce winds, torrential rain and a
:20:37. > :20:39.tidal surge have brought more misery to thousands. Official records show
:20:40. > :20:42.that southern England has seen the wettest January since records began
:20:43. > :20:45.in 1767. I remember it well. The Somerset Levels have been hit by
:20:46. > :20:51.weeks of flooding, with little respite from relentless rain. And,
:20:52. > :20:56.the residents of one village on the Levels, Muchelney, has been cut off
:20:57. > :21:11.for almost a month. We sent our Adam out with his wellies and a properly
:21:12. > :21:19.filled out risk assessment form The very wet road to Muchelney. This
:21:20. > :21:23.village of about 100 residents has been cut off for about four weeks,
:21:24. > :21:32.and like the weather vane, it feels a little bit spooky. It came up to
:21:33. > :21:37.here and your front door was there. Anita is just relieved the water
:21:38. > :21:43.stopped here, practically on her doorstep. Now it is the
:21:44. > :21:51.practicalities that are the problem. Driving around for food is quite a
:21:52. > :21:55.hassle. You are foraging. It's not as bad as that but we do have a few
:21:56. > :21:59.bits in the vegetable garden still, and we had some nice apples until
:22:00. > :22:07.the rats ate them but we are not doing too badly on that score. It
:22:08. > :22:13.sounds like the medieval! That's what it feels like. Talking of
:22:14. > :22:22.retro, who knew Somerset still had a Coleman, this is Brian's first
:22:23. > :22:26.delivery since Christmas. Everything has gone old-fashioned. We are now
:22:27. > :22:31.talking to neighbours we might never have seen before or spoken to so we
:22:32. > :22:37.are getting to know more people in the village. She's right, there has
:22:38. > :22:40.been an outbreak of Dunkirk spirit, quite literally. The council and the
:22:41. > :22:50.Fire Brigade have put on this boat service to get people to work and
:22:51. > :22:59.school. The church has become an unofficial flood HQ. This is where
:23:00. > :23:03.people pick up their mail, and this is where the people who run the boat
:23:04. > :23:09.stopped for their tea breaks. It all seems quite jolly, if a bit boring,
:23:10. > :23:15.but it is no fun for the homes and businesses that have been inundated,
:23:16. > :23:20.or for the farmers whose land is underwater, an area the size of
:23:21. > :23:24.Bristol, or for the villages which are less isolated but where the
:23:25. > :23:29.flooding is worse. People like the parish chairman are starting to get
:23:30. > :23:35.angry with how the Government has responded. It was all a bit late. We
:23:36. > :23:40.knew what was going to happen with the amount of rain on the fields and
:23:41. > :23:43.the Government was so slow to react. The county council got the
:23:44. > :23:48.boat going quickly but it was another four weeks nearly before the
:23:49. > :23:54.button was pressed for the major incident. Right on cue, the cavalry
:23:55. > :23:59.arrived in the shape of emergency crews from other parts of the UK.
:24:00. > :24:03.The rumour is that they will bring in a hovercraft but the bad news is
:24:04. > :24:09.that the weather is becoming more grim this weekend. There has been a
:24:10. > :24:14.surge in bookings at the campsite where people have seen the Somerset
:24:15. > :24:21.Levels on holiday and would like to come on holiday, if it ever stops
:24:22. > :24:26.raining. I'm delighted to say we have got the line back to Aberdeen,
:24:27. > :24:31.somebody has put a shilling in the meter. We can go back to Malcolm
:24:32. > :24:35.Bruce. We were talking about the Lib Dem women and your election, I
:24:36. > :24:45.suppose the point some people are making is that your party has as
:24:46. > :24:51.many knights in Parliament as it has women and you are one of them. The
:24:52. > :24:56.good news is that for the five MPs who are standing down, who have had
:24:57. > :25:02.candidates elected in their constituencies so far, all five
:25:03. > :25:06.candidates that have been selected are women. We need to fight hard to
:25:07. > :25:10.get behind those women and get them elected so that we have a much
:25:11. > :25:14.better balanced parliament in the future, but given that we have few
:25:15. > :25:22.women, you really have to pick people appropriate for the job and
:25:23. > :25:39.we have appointed the women as I have said but we need our image to
:25:40. > :25:44.be balanced. How many women candidates will there be come the
:25:45. > :25:49.next election? At the moment, 1 , five more than we have now, and we
:25:50. > :25:54.haven't finished selection. Where there are men sitting and standing
:25:55. > :25:58.again, that is not likely to change, but where they are standing down we
:25:59. > :26:06.are overwhelmingly choosing women, and in my view good and very able
:26:07. > :26:10.women. What I would want to say to people is that if you want to see
:26:11. > :26:21.the Lib Dems have more women, go to those seats and help us hold them.
:26:22. > :26:24.We are told that only 20% of the 57 seats have female candidates and in
:26:25. > :26:31.the unlikely event that you were able to hold onto them all, it still
:26:32. > :26:38.wouldn't be a sea change to have 20%. The point is you have to build
:26:39. > :26:43.them up. We are supporting female candidates. These are really good
:26:44. > :26:48.candidates who will make first-class MPs and I certainly believe you will
:26:49. > :26:53.gradually see the Liberal Democrats taking them on. We don't have 3 0
:26:54. > :27:01.seats that we currently hold like other parties, but what I can tell
:27:02. > :27:05.you is that increasing -- increasingly we will have female
:27:06. > :27:09.candidates. One newspaper has said that you will deal with the Chris
:27:10. > :27:15.Rennard fallout quickly and privately, what does that mean? It
:27:16. > :27:20.means I will not be telling you because these things are not helped
:27:21. > :27:23.by comments on the airwaves. I hope it will be possible to have a
:27:24. > :27:28.resolution without people going to court but I don't think it helps
:27:29. > :27:34.anybody for me to comment on any aspect of how this will be done and
:27:35. > :27:39.I'm not prepared to do so. If you are not in full possession of the
:27:40. > :27:45.facts, why did you say you will deal with this privately? I have come
:27:46. > :27:53.into this halfway through, I don't have full possession of the facts, I
:27:54. > :27:59.doubt you do, and we have a process that needs to be followed through.
:28:00. > :28:04.Any comments in public do not help. Isn't it hypocrisy of a high order
:28:05. > :28:10.to hear from a party that is constantly calling for transparency
:28:11. > :28:16.in other institutions but when it comes to your own, you say, I am not
:28:17. > :28:20.going to talk about it. There are all sorts of disputes that happen in
:28:21. > :28:24.the world and often people don't talk about them because talking
:28:25. > :28:28.about them aggravates the situation. I believe you have to
:28:29. > :28:32.deal with them privately and I don't think trial by media in this context
:28:33. > :28:36.is helpful and I don't believe that those who choose to make those
:28:37. > :28:42.comments are making it easier to solve them. There are problems in
:28:43. > :28:47.other walks of life and the Liberal Democrats are not the only ones with
:28:48. > :28:51.these problems. We are trying to change that culture and I think we
:28:52. > :28:56.will do it effectively in our own way. We have a pastoral care officer
:28:57. > :29:07.now and I think that is the right way to do it. Thank you for that.
:29:08. > :29:11.Let's now go back to the story of the flooding in Somerset. We are
:29:12. > :29:19.joined by the leader of the Green party, Natalie Bennett in Millbank.
:29:20. > :29:27.Natalie Bennett, don't the Green party bears some responsibility for
:29:28. > :29:31.these floods? You have sided with the Environment Agency in the
:29:32. > :29:37.decision not to dredge rivers and that is one of the reason why these
:29:38. > :29:44.places have been flooded. Firstly I want to give my sympathy to everyone
:29:45. > :29:52.dealing with these floods. The homeowners, the farmers seeing
:29:53. > :29:56.sodden fields for weeks and weeks. We get that, we all have huge
:29:57. > :30:01.sympathy, particularly because so little seems to be done to help
:30:02. > :30:05.them. What is the answer to my question? I think there is strong
:30:06. > :30:12.evidence that dredging is not the answer. If you think about the flow
:30:13. > :30:17.of the river, where the pinch points are is things like bridges, weirs
:30:18. > :30:22.and towns. If you dredge the river in between those barriers, you just
:30:23. > :30:27.make the water faster to those points. The experts are saying that
:30:28. > :30:31.dredging is not the answer, it may be in particular cases, but you have
:30:32. > :30:35.to look at each river system on its own merits and very often the best
:30:36. > :30:39.way of dealing with this is working out ways to slow the watered down
:30:40. > :30:46.and make sure that people don't suffer unduly while you are doing
:30:47. > :30:50.that. The west of England agricultural Society, which I would
:30:51. > :30:54.venture knows more about the Somerset Levels than either of us,
:30:55. > :30:58.has said that without dredging, this was a disaster waiting to happen.
:30:59. > :31:02.The local drainage boards have been calling for years for dredging to be
:31:03. > :31:07.resumed. The National Farmers' Union has called for it, and the chairman
:31:08. > :31:11.of the West Sussex flood defences has called for more drainage, and he
:31:12. > :31:14.is a drainage engineer by profession. So I don't know where
:31:15. > :31:22.your experts are, but the experts on the ground am not the urban ones in
:31:23. > :31:25.London, seem to think this has not been caused, but made worse by the
:31:26. > :31:30.failure of the Environment Agency to continue to dredge. If you look at
:31:31. > :31:34.the example of the planning and climate change coalition, which is
:31:35. > :31:38.led by the town and country planning Association, who you would not
:31:39. > :31:41.describe as a group of radical greens, these people have said we
:31:42. > :31:47.have to look at how we deal with flooding in the future. But not in
:31:48. > :31:49.Somerset. These are the people currently being flooded, not
:31:50. > :31:55.somebody sitting in a quango office in London. They have asked for this
:31:56. > :31:59.to happen and it hasn't, and they are now flooded in definitely. We
:32:00. > :32:03.have to look at what is happening on a case-by-case basis. If you look at
:32:04. > :32:08.Germany, there are many cases there were, to deal with flooding, many
:32:09. > :32:12.farmers are paid to hold water on their land. Maybe we need to
:32:13. > :32:18.introduce those systems, because we have to protect farmland, but we
:32:19. > :32:26.also have to protect urban areas for safety. We saw a horrible flood in
:32:27. > :32:31.Wales were lines were endangered -- where lives were endangered. That is
:32:32. > :32:35.the priority, to protect lives, property and farmland. Lives are
:32:36. > :32:40.endangered at the moment, particularly as this stagnant water
:32:41. > :32:43.turns toxic. And yet we are in a situation, again encouraged by the
:32:44. > :32:46.Greens and the lobbying Environment Agency, it says it does not want to
:32:47. > :32:53.dredge because dredging is expensive, yet it spends millions on
:32:54. > :32:56.a bird sanctuary. That is getting everything totally wrong. The
:32:57. > :33:01.government is getting everything one by cutting on flood defences. It has
:33:02. > :33:10.not cut on a bird sanctuaries. I don't know the details of that. But
:33:11. > :33:16.looking at the broader issue, we have to prepare for climate change.
:33:17. > :33:19.The government has slashed funding to the Environment Agency and has
:33:20. > :33:23.cut back on the number of staff available to deal with it and has
:33:24. > :33:27.removed the requirement on local councils to plan for climate change.
:33:28. > :33:32.These are all gambling the future of our lives and property and the
:33:33. > :33:37.future of our environment. Hasn t the high watermark of greenery now
:33:38. > :33:41.gone well past? You don't come out of the Somerset Levels with any
:33:42. > :33:45.great reputation. The UK government is now going to start fracking as
:33:46. > :33:51.quickly as it can. Brussels is loosening the CO2 obligations for
:33:52. > :33:55.2030. The President of America is about to give the go-ahead to the
:33:56. > :34:01.keystone pipeline, a totemic issue for American greens, and your party
:34:02. > :34:07.is in a state of civil war in Brighton. It is over, isn't it?
:34:08. > :34:12.Absolutely not. We are seeing large amounts of extreme weather around
:34:13. > :34:17.the world. Any one event is whether, but we are seeing a lot of it and
:34:18. > :34:20.people are recognising that climate change is happening. If we are going
:34:21. > :34:25.to quote international experts, I can quote to you Ban Ki-Moon, the UN
:34:26. > :34:29.Secretary-General, not known as a radical green, and he said after the
:34:30. > :34:33.IPCC report came out that the heat is on and we must act. If you go to
:34:34. > :34:36.Christine Lagarde, head of the International Monetary Fund, again
:34:37. > :34:40.not a radical green, she was asked what kept her awake at night, and
:34:41. > :34:44.she said, we are not doing enough about climate change. So actually,
:34:45. > :34:48.people around the world are looking at what is happening around them are
:34:49. > :34:53.both people on the ground and people in high positions are saying we have
:34:54. > :34:58.to act on climate change. And in the case of Britain, that should
:34:59. > :35:02.absolutely not mean fracking. Sorry to interrupt, but I have evidence
:35:03. > :35:06.that you are planning a little career change. Don't go away. This
:35:07. > :35:12.is what happens when you let Nigel Farage present the weather. One
:35:13. > :35:14.thing leads to another and low and behold, the Sunday Politics now has
:35:15. > :35:22.a new traffic and travel reporter. Let's go back to Green Party leader,
:35:23. > :35:27.Natalie Bennett. Thanks, Andrew It is easy out that, so let's start
:35:28. > :35:32.with our airports. I am pleased to say that Heathrow's third runway,
:35:33. > :35:38.Boris Island and all short-haul flights are, just like our
:35:39. > :35:45.arguments, well grounded. We suggest making or alternative arrangements,
:35:46. > :35:48.like a re-nationalised rail network, although it would be a
:35:49. > :35:52.glaring omission if we did not admit that that plan is currently being
:35:53. > :35:56.delayed by Labour Party foot dragging. Speaking of trains, we are
:35:57. > :36:03.hearing that high-speed two may well be derailing, or at least getting
:36:04. > :36:07.bogged down in political fog. One viewer, Ed Balls, has texted in to
:36:08. > :36:12.say he is completely lost. Thanks for the update, Ed. You are not
:36:13. > :36:19.alone among political commuters Meanwhile, dumped UKIP manifestoes
:36:20. > :36:24.are causing major tailbacks across the South, apparently stretching all
:36:25. > :36:30.the way to Brussels. This does make driving road tricky, but UKIP's MEPs
:36:31. > :36:38.can, of course, just hop on their gravy train. The tree had a
:36:39. > :36:45.roundabout is blocked after reports of a political earthquake. It seems
:36:46. > :36:48.that a green unwound his beard to block a dodgy gas extractor. A
:36:49. > :36:52.motorist who turned out to be the environment minister object into the
:36:53. > :36:57.delay and was told to frack off as furious badgers demanded that he
:36:58. > :37:02.stopped moving the goalposts. Unregulated traffic in the city of
:37:03. > :37:09.London continues unchecked. Pedestrians should try to block
:37:10. > :37:15.bankers with sacks of loot rushing for the payments. But do beware the
:37:16. > :37:21.Lib Dem Exodus that is clogging up the motorways. Although they are in
:37:22. > :37:25.a jam, or is it a fudge, we are happy to make way for them, as, like
:37:26. > :37:32.all refugees, we say they are welcome here in muesli green. That
:37:33. > :37:37.is the travel. Back to you, Andrew. Natalie, I think you make my point.
:37:38. > :37:41.You are now preparing a new career in traffic and travel. Well, I do
:37:42. > :37:46.believe in lifelong education and that was an example of it. We know
:37:47. > :37:54.you have had a tough time today to get to our studio. Thank you for the
:37:55. > :37:58.effort. You are watching the Sunday
:37:59. > :38:11.Politics. Coming up in just over 20 minutes, we will have
:38:12. > :38:18.Hello. Welcome to the Sunday Politics in the midlands. I am
:38:19. > :38:22.joined by the Prime Minister's right`hand man and a formal Euro MP
:38:23. > :38:30.who is hoping to stage a political comeback. He is David Cameron's
:38:31. > :38:37.parliamentary private secretary. And Labour's lead candidate in the West
:38:38. > :38:50.Midlands. According to the American chat show horse `` horse show host
:38:51. > :38:57.Jean Reno, politics is just a stage. Are the main parties just too
:38:58. > :39:03.uncool for the thespians? Rufus hound announced he is planning to
:39:04. > :39:16.stand in the forthcoming unit `` European elections. Gavin, what do
:39:17. > :39:20.you make of this? Is this a gimmick or good for politics? Anything that
:39:21. > :39:24.brings people 's attention to politics can be a good thing. You
:39:25. > :39:28.want to see people with no real commitment to the communities. It is
:39:29. > :39:34.not a joke politics. We hope people go into it with a good art and real
:39:35. > :39:38.intention to make an improvement. Nina, Rufus has strong issues about
:39:39. > :39:42.things like the health service. Is there a concern that someone like
:39:43. > :39:47.him is turning to a small party like this, perhaps a protest groups,
:39:48. > :39:52.instead of turning to the main political parties. I think it is up
:39:53. > :39:57.to Rufus as to why he has decided it. What people want in their
:39:58. > :40:01.elected representative as someone who understands their concerns, we
:40:02. > :40:05.will stand up and make sure the needs of that local community,
:40:06. > :40:09.whether it is in the health service, education, and in terms of
:40:10. > :40:16.investment and jobs, those are the issues. I hope that confining to one
:40:17. > :40:20.issue is a problem for a politician. Those may be the issues,
:40:21. > :40:27.but it must be helpful to have a celebrity person on board. That will
:40:28. > :40:32.help, won't it? I think that is down to this electorate, it features the
:40:33. > :40:36.person and the electorate. Of course, everybody is looking for a
:40:37. > :40:43.little bit of extra publicity. That is accepted. In our party, we have
:40:44. > :40:47.our few stars as well. Indeed you do, Eddie izzard is a big fan of the
:40:48. > :40:51.Labour Party. Is it something you would like to see more of, more
:40:52. > :40:56.people in the public eye getting involved in politics? We want to
:40:57. > :41:00.bring as much interested in politics. We want to bring passion
:41:01. > :41:04.into politics. It is about a whole range of people, it does not matter
:41:05. > :41:09.what you background is, as long as you have a passion for your
:41:10. > :41:13.community and principles. That is the sort of people we want pounding
:41:14. > :41:21.the streets getting your message across. So celebrities are very
:41:22. > :41:25.welcome to join us. Coming up, the good news keeps on coming for the
:41:26. > :41:29.Chancellor with the economy improving. But is it happening here
:41:30. > :41:34.in the Midlands or is it just a London thing? We will have more on
:41:35. > :41:39.that later in the programme. How would you feel about having to
:41:40. > :41:44.produce photo I D to prove who you are when you go to vote. That is
:41:45. > :41:48.what is being proposed after a number of boat rigging scandals. We
:41:49. > :41:52.have 60 locations where there have been problems, that includes
:41:53. > :41:57.Birmingham, Coventry and Wallsall. The new measures will in the minute
:41:58. > :42:01.fraud. Opponents say it could damage the democratic process. Our
:42:02. > :42:07.political reporter has been to Aston, an area that was blighted by
:42:08. > :42:12.fraud a decade ago. At the 2004 local elections and
:42:13. > :42:17.Birmingham, of vote rigging scandal rocked the political world and made
:42:18. > :42:26.headline news. Boxes of evidence, a demonstration and an historic
:42:27. > :42:32.occasion. Weibo `` Labour councillors were involved in a
:42:33. > :42:41.postal fraud `` postal vote fraud. It led to political mudslinging and
:42:42. > :42:45.public protests. This man is a community activist in Aston, one of
:42:46. > :42:50.the wards where the election had to be rerun. It was a difficult time.
:42:51. > :42:55.The media was focused on the area given the massive postal fraud and
:42:56. > :42:59.irregularities that two ways. The electoral commission is worried that
:43:00. > :43:04.communities from Pakistan and Bangladesh could be at risk. People
:43:05. > :43:10.voted according to who they wanted, not being forced to vote in a
:43:11. > :43:15.particular manner. What do you think about the idea of bringing in photo
:43:16. > :43:20.ID at polling booths? It could be the way forward. This may put off
:43:21. > :43:27.people going to vote. It was in this room here at the Birmingham and
:43:28. > :43:31.Midland Institute that that famous banana republic, it was made and
:43:32. > :43:35.said the system was open to fraud. So what to do? The electoral
:43:36. > :43:38.commission says it wants every individual to register to vote for
:43:39. > :43:45.themselves, rather than one person in the house all doing it. ``
:43:46. > :43:48.household. It wants every voter to have ID at the polling station,
:43:49. > :43:57.something like a passport or driving licence. And it is bringing a strict
:43:58. > :44:03.code of candidates `` for candidates. We need to up our game
:44:04. > :44:10.and we have done that over the past few years. The electoral commission
:44:11. > :44:15.comes and looks at what we are doing in order to learn how to improve
:44:16. > :44:19.things across the area. We have turned around. The electoral
:44:20. > :44:23.commission says voter ID is already working in Northern Ireland but not
:44:24. > :44:29.everybody thinks it is a good idea. It is not necessary. There has been
:44:30. > :44:32.a problem identifying with. Falters in the system. The electoral
:44:33. > :44:42.commission has done very little on that. `` voters in the system. John
:44:43. > :44:48.Henning has voted `` campaign for stronger regulation. It is normally
:44:49. > :44:51.who do not vote whose vote is cast by somebody else. These proposals
:44:52. > :44:58.would substantially deal with that. It would make it harder. Obviously
:44:59. > :45:01.it is not the complete solution. There are problems with people being
:45:02. > :45:06.intimidated into voting in particular ways during postal votes.
:45:07. > :45:11.West Midlands police said they investigated 21 cases in 2012.
:45:12. > :45:21.Electoral fraud is an issue that has not gone away.
:45:22. > :45:29.Joining me now is Peter Wardle who is chief executive of the electoral
:45:30. > :45:33.commission. He has been at conference advising police on how to
:45:34. > :45:38.deal with the issue. There have been a limited number of these cases
:45:39. > :45:43.especially in urban areas. Is this a sledgehammer to crack a walnut? We
:45:44. > :45:52.have made a lot of changes to the postal system says the 2040 40s and
:45:53. > :45:56.Birmingham. In 2006`2007 we change the system. People have designing
:45:57. > :46:01.give the date of birth when the vote by post. This year we are
:46:02. > :46:06.introducing a new system which makes it much harder to create a false
:46:07. > :46:12.identity on the ill `` register, which is one of the things people
:46:13. > :46:16.would do when they tried to commit postal fraud. It becomes popular
:46:17. > :46:21.with people who find it more convenient and do want to take part
:46:22. > :46:28.in democracy. So why the photo ID? That will not help with the postal
:46:29. > :46:33.vote problems. That will help with people voting in polling stations
:46:34. > :46:37.which the majority of people do. With the evidence we collect we are
:46:38. > :46:41.seeing more cases and more concern of people attempting to impersonate
:46:42. > :46:45.other voters in the polling station. It is hard to detect that. How do
:46:46. > :46:52.you know that? On a nationwide basis whether please read collect all the
:46:53. > :46:55.information and cases and we see a trend over the years between
:46:56. > :47:02.tightening up the postal vote system, there are limited attempts
:47:03. > :47:07.that the electoral system is safe in the country, where people tried to
:47:08. > :47:11.defraud the system, they are equally interested in polling station fraud
:47:12. > :47:16.and there are very few controls on that. What we have found talking to
:47:17. > :47:21.voters as well as people in the system, talking to voters, they are
:47:22. > :47:24.concerned still about the security of the system. They want to be able
:47:25. > :47:29.to trust the system. What we have said is the time has come to change
:47:30. > :47:35.the system that was originally entered in the 19th century where
:47:36. > :47:39.fewer than the `` have the adult population could vote. In those days
:47:40. > :47:48.you relied on people to identify imposters. We are often concerned
:47:49. > :47:52.about voter apathy and people not turning out to vote. Is there a
:47:53. > :47:56.concern that by making it more difficult that it can put people
:47:57. > :48:00.off? They might think, I have not got my passport, I cannot be
:48:01. > :48:03.bothered to go to the polling station. We are absolutely concern.
:48:04. > :48:11.That is why we have said it should not be rushed. We are going to work
:48:12. > :48:13.for at least the next 12 months with the electro` commission, talking to
:48:14. > :48:18.voters, talking to political parties, the police and the people
:48:19. > :48:22.who run elections out local level, to look at how rescue more work.
:48:23. > :48:27.We're not suggesting it should be into just before 2019. The important
:48:28. > :48:31.thing about getting it right is to make sure people who are concerned
:48:32. > :48:36.they don't have ID have got an alternative. That is we do not put
:48:37. > :48:42.people off. Nina, this did involve Labour activists at the time,
:48:43. > :48:46.particularly the case ten years ago. At the time, was your party guilty
:48:47. > :48:52.of trying to play it down slightly because it was generally your
:48:53. > :48:56.activists that were involved? Not at all. We have taken a robust and
:48:57. > :49:02.strong stance against it. We have put in place systems that really
:49:03. > :49:08.make sure that no activist can ever get involved in something like this
:49:09. > :49:13.again. I think that the electoral commission are the first to say that
:49:14. > :49:19.what we have is beyond what any other party, or any other region,
:49:20. > :49:24.have done. So I believe that we have learnt from it, we have put in
:49:25. > :49:30.strong measures, and we want to make sure that only the people who should
:49:31. > :49:38.vote to vote. I am concerned about the system of IDs. You think that
:49:39. > :49:43.could be a disincentive? For some people. Not everybody have an idea.
:49:44. > :49:49.Most people do have an idea and have no problem with that. There are
:49:50. > :49:56.those who are more on the margin. `` and IDE. Are the proposals are good
:49:57. > :50:04.idea? The voting showed that over 90% of people harder in fuel `` are
:50:05. > :50:09.in favour. They can turn up to a polling station. If I knew someone
:50:10. > :50:13.was on the electoral roll, I could present myself and say that I was a
:50:14. > :50:19.person and cast a vote. Of course I would not. There is a weakness in
:50:20. > :50:23.that system. It is right to properly consult, carefully work with local
:50:24. > :50:27.authorities and see if this can be taken forward. But the electoral
:50:28. > :50:32.commission is an independent nonparty political body. It would be
:50:33. > :50:38.bad if politicians do not listen to their advice. You heard what was
:50:39. > :50:43.said there. The Labour Party feels it has got its house in order. We
:50:44. > :50:48.heard from Birmingham City Council saying the same thing. Are you as
:50:49. > :50:53.confident as they are that what `` when we have the European elections
:50:54. > :50:59.in May that everything will be all right? I have spent the whole day in
:51:00. > :51:02.the last few days with police and local authority representatives
:51:03. > :51:06.right across the country, that was all about how we maintain
:51:07. > :51:11.vigilance, it is really important for the health of our system, the
:51:12. > :51:14.trust in our system. You mention people having apathy in the system.
:51:15. > :51:18.People need to know that if they come to vote, their vote will be
:51:19. > :51:22.safe, no one will interfere with it or steal it. We need to work really
:51:23. > :51:30.hard and that includes with the parties who don't want trust in the
:51:31. > :51:35.system to melt away because of things people have done. We are keen
:51:36. > :51:40.to hear from a lot of people about how this will be tackled. We do
:51:41. > :51:46.already have a system of ID in Northern Ireland. It does not depend
:51:47. > :51:49.on passwords and driving licences. It is a different political
:51:50. > :51:53.situation there. I am sorry, we will have to leave it there.
:51:54. > :51:57.The Chancellor George Osborne must be barely able to contain themselves
:51:58. > :52:02.as the good economic news just gives on coming. In the last couple of
:52:03. > :52:05.weeks he has seen unemployment go down, inflation falling and GDP
:52:06. > :52:10.going up. Here in the Midlands the last fortnight has brought news of
:52:11. > :52:12.major investments at Cadburys and Birmingham and from Nissan in
:52:13. > :52:16.Coventry. But there are warnings that while things are getting
:52:17. > :52:21.better, much of the recovery is happening not here, but in London.
:52:22. > :52:26.While the politicians argue about whether we are feeling better off,
:52:27. > :52:30.the GDP figures released this week showed the UK plc grew by 1.9% in
:52:31. > :52:35.2013. The largest growth since before the recession. In the
:52:36. > :52:40.Midlands, Nissan announced the ?6 million contract with a Coventry
:52:41. > :52:45.firm to develop new green taxis. We have the skills base year to do what
:52:46. > :52:49.we want and obviously it is urging as our business. We change the way
:52:50. > :52:54.that people think about mobility and in particular taxis, particularly by
:52:55. > :53:01.the use of electric taxis which is part of the mandate that we are to
:53:02. > :53:04.create the electric London taxi. Good news. But as the Governor of
:53:05. > :53:09.the Bank of England has warned, much of the growth is coming from the
:53:10. > :53:13.consumer sector, not manufacturing or construction. The economy is
:53:14. > :53:17.still smaller than it was in 2008. Also out this week was a report from
:53:18. > :53:21.the Centre for cities which told us the recovery is being driven by
:53:22. > :53:25.London and that we are underachieving. The report is bang
:53:26. > :53:29.on. Over many years Birmingham and other cities like Manchester have
:53:30. > :53:34.not pull their weight on a whole range of things. Employers, business
:53:35. > :53:38.start`ups, average wages. That is in stark contrast with countries like
:53:39. > :53:43.France and Germany. Cities where they have control over their
:53:44. > :53:48.destiny. The solution is devolving more power and cash to the regions.
:53:49. > :53:53.Where have we heard that before? Indeed we have heard it before, most
:53:54. > :53:58.recently in the review carried out by Lord Heseltine on behalf of the
:53:59. > :54:01.government. It was launched here in the Midlands. Gavin Williamson, we
:54:02. > :54:06.heard the Centre for cities report suggest that the recovery is largely
:54:07. > :54:11.happening in London, not here in the Midlands. Do you think that is fair?
:54:12. > :54:24.Certainly not. We have seen growth year. We see massive investment, not
:54:25. > :54:31.just on Mike and said she, ?500,000 in Land Rover Jaguar. The Midlands
:54:32. > :54:38.is in the Premier position to benefit. Is it powering ahead? 75%
:54:39. > :54:42.of our economy is still focused in the consumer sector. Unemployment
:54:43. > :54:47.here is still above the national average, 220000 and region are still
:54:48. > :54:53.unemployed. They would say we are not powering ahead and we... We have
:54:54. > :54:57.seen the highest number of business start`ups here and biggest drops in
:54:58. > :55:02.unemployment here in the West Midlands. These are positives. I do
:55:03. > :55:07.not want to talk our region down. This is the workhouse of the whole
:55:08. > :55:09.of the UK in terms of creating jobs, manufacturing jobs, and driving
:55:10. > :55:15.exports forward. That is where we have some great success stories.
:55:16. > :55:20.People 's white Rolls`Royce have been investing. This is how we
:55:21. > :55:26.create a balanced economy. `` people like. We are reversing things under
:55:27. > :55:33.the last government and that is what we want to see growing. I could see
:55:34. > :55:39.you shaking your head. What about this idea of devolving power to the
:55:40. > :55:43.regions? Birmingham, Coventry and Stoke`on`Trent see we do not want
:55:44. > :55:48.that. Eight out of ten jobs that have been created are created in
:55:49. > :55:52.London. This idea that we have this massive growth year and the number
:55:53. > :56:01.of jobs created rings hollow to me. Devolution, when we had this in
:56:02. > :56:05.2010, for every pounds that was given to the company, they were
:56:06. > :56:15.bringing in another eight. In 2010 they had ?2 billion. Do you want
:56:16. > :56:19.development agencies back? You do need some form of regional
:56:20. > :56:24.organisation that really encourages inward investment. Labour has
:56:25. > :56:30.suggested we have regionals back, the real economic drivers here in
:56:31. > :56:34.the West Midlands is the small and medium`sized businesses. We need to
:56:35. > :56:39.make sure that they can access funding and they can create those
:56:40. > :56:44.jobs. To come back to this, you two have different views on this. Your
:56:45. > :56:50.party has spoken so much about rebalancing. Yet for all you are
:56:51. > :56:53.saying about manufacturing, it is just not really materialising. We
:56:54. > :56:58.are seeing real growth in manufacturing, we have seen output
:56:59. > :57:03.grow. We are producing more cars here in this country than in Italy.
:57:04. > :57:07.We are actually seeing more money. The government has committed more
:57:08. > :57:12.money to the Midlands than any other region. This is good news. I am
:57:13. > :57:17.sorry, we are going to have to leave it there. This will be a key issue
:57:18. > :57:23.at the next election. Here is a round`up of political week in 60
:57:24. > :57:30.seconds. It is brought up `` as this week by Sarah Falkland.
:57:31. > :57:33.13 people were arrested during disturbances at the University of
:57:34. > :57:43.Birmingham. The students were protesting against rising tuition
:57:44. > :57:49.fees and low staff wages. The county council wants to rent this hole out
:57:50. > :57:52.or sell it. It is a valuable, historic and educational resource.
:57:53. > :57:57.To lose that along with moving the library and radiating the art
:57:58. > :58:01.gallery would be a tragedy. The government has investment another ?6
:58:02. > :58:08.million at the business park near Wolverhampton. It is a fantastic
:58:09. > :58:13.example of how this particular part of the world is thriving at the
:58:14. > :58:17.moment. Conservative MP for West Worcestershire has been appointed by
:58:18. > :58:24.the Prime Minister as the new trade envoy to Russia. And the Solihull MP
:58:25. > :58:30.has missed out to become the Lib Dem deputy leader losing to Sir Malcolm
:58:31. > :58:36.Bruce by two votes. And finally, as we heard there, she
:58:37. > :58:42.missed out on becoming the Libertarian deputy leader this
:58:43. > :58:49.week. `` Lib Dem. Disappointing to see, not to see more women in
:58:50. > :58:53.prominent roles. Clearly, for the other parties it is a real issue.
:58:54. > :59:01.When you look at the Cabinet at the moment, you have four out of 22 the
:59:02. > :59:06.Lib Dems only have seven MEPs. `` seven MPs. Labour can be proud on
:59:07. > :59:19.this. Our last intake, we had 50% were women MPs. Although in this
:59:20. > :59:24.region, there are... All the candidates are women. At the moment
:59:25. > :59:31.we have 11 women out of 63 in this region. Five Labour, five
:59:32. > :59:37.Conservative. Your party does not have a great record on this, Gavin?
:59:38. > :59:40.Nina is right about the Cabinet. Only for women. We are trying to
:59:41. > :59:45.improve the number of women we have in government and parliament. Before
:59:46. > :59:50.the last election we had 18 women, now we have over 48 who got elected
:59:51. > :59:55.in 2010. We have a long way to go, we have a long way to improve it.
:59:56. > :00:01.People who have been selected as candidates are women, we have got to
:00:02. > :00:06.get that higher and we will work to make sure that happens. What more do
:00:07. > :00:12.we need to do? I think there has to be a recognition to see that having
:00:13. > :00:18.something similar to what Labour does, to make sure that more women.
:00:19. > :00:25.The other parties could follow our party `` example to look at the
:00:26. > :00:29.Cabinet make up, make sure there are role models in that position which
:00:30. > :00:35.encourages more women to come forward. Encouraging those women.
:00:36. > :00:38.Malcolm Bruce is stepping down in 2015, so maybe Laura Lee will get
:00:39. > :00:44.another chance then. That is where we need to leave it today. Thank you
:00:45. > :00:50.to our guests today. There is a busy week of budget setting this week
:00:51. > :00:53.over the next seven days. Stage into your local BBC Radio Scotland on the
:00:54. > :00:57.latest on that. Patrick Burns returns to the seat next week. ``
:00:58. > :01:01.your local Not a complete denial! Hopefully a
:01:02. > :01:17.Conservative mayor again. Not a good week for David Cameron on
:01:18. > :01:22.the tricky European front last week. President Hollande said he was not
:01:23. > :01:26.interested in major treaty reform for 2017. That is when Mr Cameron
:01:27. > :01:29.hopes to hold his in-out referendum. And the private member's bill to put
:01:30. > :01:34.that referendum on the statute bill was killed by Labour and Lib Dem
:01:35. > :01:41.peers in the Lords. James Wharton was the Tory MP behind the bill and
:01:42. > :01:46.he joins me now. What happens now? It is out of my hands what happens
:01:47. > :01:50.now, because Labour and the Liberal Democrats conspired in the Lords to
:01:51. > :01:54.kill off my bill. One of the options is for another private member to
:01:55. > :01:58.bring a bill forward when they have the next private member's bill at,
:01:59. > :02:01.and we can try again. The prime minister has indicated that he will
:02:02. > :02:08.support that. But whatever happens, it will be in the Conservative
:02:09. > :02:13.manifesto at the next election. Do you accept that cost this is Tory
:02:14. > :02:16.policy and not government policy that the government policy elite
:02:17. > :02:22.macro cannot bring forward a bill? That is the problem. The Liberal
:02:23. > :02:25.Democrats, despite having promised a referendum in their manifesto at the
:02:26. > :02:30.last election, now will not allow government time for a bill to
:02:31. > :02:33.enshrine that in law. That was why I brought it forward as a private
:02:34. > :02:37.member's bill. David Cameron and the Conservative Party through
:02:38. > :02:40.everything behind that. To many people's surprise, we got it through
:02:41. > :02:45.all the House of Commons stages Sadly, to their discredit, Labour
:02:46. > :02:50.and Liberal Democrat peers, doing the bidding of their masters in the
:02:51. > :02:54.Commons, is conspired to kill it. Do you accept that it is Conservative
:02:55. > :02:57.policy, but not government policy, that you could not use the
:02:58. > :03:01.Parliament act to get this through the Lords? That is not the case The
:03:02. > :03:06.Parliament act is clear that if a public bill passes through the House
:03:07. > :03:10.of Commons twice in one Parliamentary period, there is a
:03:11. > :03:14.certain amount of time that has to be between both bills being
:03:15. > :03:18.presented. There are some procedural steps to be overcome, but there is
:03:19. > :03:21.no legal reason why the Parliament act could not come into effect. I
:03:22. > :03:27.was talking about you not having a majority in this case. That remains
:03:28. > :03:30.to be seen. We saw previously that Labour and the Liberal Democrats
:03:31. > :03:35.sent enough people to frustrate its progress to make it as difficult as
:03:36. > :03:40.possible, but not huge numbers to vote against it. On a Friday, huge
:03:41. > :03:46.numbers of MPs do not attend normally. Getting that number might
:03:47. > :03:51.prove difficult. The Parliament act, which is a bit of an atomic bomb in
:03:52. > :03:55.constitutional terms, if that was used, they would turn up to vote
:03:56. > :04:01.against you. Is it not the case that after the countryside Alliance tried
:04:02. > :04:06.to involve the courts in the hunting ban that it was made clear that the
:04:07. > :04:11.Parliament act was not to be used for constitutional issues? I don't
:04:12. > :04:16.think we know how many would turn up and we don't know how they would
:04:17. > :04:19.vote. One of the things that has been revealed as I have gone through
:04:20. > :04:23.the process of getting this bill to get a referendum through the Commons
:04:24. > :04:26.is that there are big splits in the Labour Party. One of the reasons we
:04:27. > :04:30.did not see them turning up in large numbers to stop this bill from
:04:31. > :04:33.happening was that Ed Miliband knew that if he tried to lead his own MPs
:04:34. > :04:38.through the lobbies to block a bill, the only purpose of which is
:04:39. > :04:43.to let Britain decides to give people a say on membership of the
:04:44. > :04:47.union, a lot of his MPs may not have followed him. It is all fantasy
:04:48. > :04:52.politics anyway. The French president has made clear that he has
:04:53. > :04:58.no interest in treaty change this side of 2017. He would need a
:04:59. > :05:03.referendum as well . And he needs that like a hole and had. Merkel is
:05:04. > :05:06.not keen, as she is in coalition with the social Democrats. Without
:05:07. > :05:14.the French or the Germans, it will not happen, end of story. The policy
:05:15. > :05:18.is that we will try to negotiate on getting a better deal. I hear what
:05:19. > :05:22.you are saying, but I don't recognise it as reality. We have a
:05:23. > :05:25.strong bargaining position. But whatever the result of that
:05:26. > :05:30.negotiation, it will be put in an in-out vote to the Britain people.
:05:31. > :05:34.It is time people were allowed to decide. It has been over a
:05:35. > :05:37.generation since we last had a say. David Cameron has committed to
:05:38. > :05:41.delivering that referendum. The Conservative Party will have it in
:05:42. > :05:45.our next manifesto for the election. Whatever happens to my bill or any
:05:46. > :05:49.other of the bill that comes forward. If people want a
:05:50. > :05:56.referendum, the only party that can deliver that in British politics is
:05:57. > :06:00.the Conservatives. Let me bring the panel in. Nick, where is this going?
:06:01. > :06:03.It is clear to me and anyone who follows European politics that there
:06:04. > :06:06.is no appetite for major treaty change in the short run,
:06:07. > :06:12.particularly for the kind of major changes that Vista Cameron says he
:06:13. > :06:16.is going to get, and yet the Tories are talking about Europe again when
:06:17. > :06:19.they should be talking about the economy. And Francois Hollande is
:06:20. > :06:24.looking at 2017, the year we are meant to have this referendum. There
:06:25. > :06:28.will be a French presidential election going on, and Nicolas
:06:29. > :06:34.Sarkozy will be back in play by then. But James has an interesting
:06:35. > :06:39.point, which is that it is down to Angela Merkel. She would be more
:06:40. > :06:43.receptive to David Cameron's ideas of reform than people assume. She
:06:44. > :06:48.has looked over the edge at a Europe without the UK and said, that is not
:06:49. > :06:52.acceptable, and I am willing to pay a price, not any price, but a price
:06:53. > :06:57.to keep the UK in the European Union. And the French, because the
:06:58. > :07:01.UK and France are the only serious military powers in Europe, will
:07:02. > :07:07.eventually come to that position. So there is more support for David
:07:08. > :07:10.Cameron than people assume. The French are also not a strong
:07:11. > :07:19.position in terms of the euro and French economy. The Foreign Office
:07:20. > :07:29.seem a bit more optimistic about it. Of course they are. Douglas Hurd
:07:30. > :07:32.once told me, we are winning the arguments on the single currency. Of
:07:33. > :07:36.course anything from the Foreign Office comes with a health warning,
:07:37. > :07:39.but if David Cameron had won a majority and was determined to
:07:40. > :07:45.renegotiate, he is in a strong position with Merkel. There is a
:07:46. > :07:48.possibility that the French could eventually be talked around. So it
:07:49. > :07:55.is not entirely bleak on that front for Cameron. When do the Tory party
:07:56. > :08:00.managers say, look, stop banging on about Europe again? The economy is
:08:01. > :08:04.going away. We still have an electoral mountain to climb. Let's
:08:05. > :08:08.just talk about that and not be divided. They should have done that
:08:09. > :08:15.some time ago. It is already too late. The Tories need a seven point
:08:16. > :08:20.lead in the polls to get image are tea. The way things are, that would
:08:21. > :08:24.require a huge change from where we are now . It is very unlikely to
:08:25. > :08:32.happen. So all this is happening in some bizarre imaginary space with
:08:33. > :08:38.wonderful rainbows and sunshine But we can detect the beginnings of a
:08:39. > :08:44.shift in the last couple of weeks. If you talk to Tory backbenchers,
:08:45. > :08:48.Douglas Carswell is now saying in public that it is time to stop the
:08:49. > :08:56.fighting. If they are to get even close to winning the election, they
:08:57. > :09:01.can't do it if they are all against each other. I don't think it is an
:09:02. > :09:05.imaginary space. It is likely that David Cameron will have the largest
:09:06. > :09:08.party in the election. If it is a hung parliament and it is the
:09:09. > :09:13.Liberal Democrats and the Conservative Party, David Cameron
:09:14. > :09:16.will save to Nick Clegg we gave you an AV referendum, I am having this
:09:17. > :09:22.referendum. And it will be difficult for Nick to say no. Let me go back
:09:23. > :09:26.to Mr Wharton. You are going to get a referendum in the manifesto. Other
:09:27. > :09:31.than Ken Clarke, everybody wants it. So why don't you just banked that
:09:32. > :09:36.and get behind the leadership Institute causing endless problems
:09:37. > :09:40.and coming across as a Europe accessed, divided party? I am
:09:41. > :09:45.absolutely behind the leadership. David Cameron announced the policy I
:09:46. > :09:51.am trying to bring forward in this bill. It is in line with the speech
:09:52. > :09:57.he gave this time last year. But getting that commitment into law
:09:58. > :10:04.will help to kick-start the negotiation process and mean
:10:05. > :10:06.everyone will know where we stand. But whatever happens, the
:10:07. > :10:10.Conservatives are committed to delivering a referendum. And to
:10:11. > :10:13.address the point that we talk about Europe too much, that is not the
:10:14. > :10:19.case. We have a good message on the economy, on tackling immigration and
:10:20. > :10:26.reforming welfare. There is more to do, but this is also an important
:10:27. > :10:31.part of policy. But at a time when the economic news seems to be
:10:32. > :10:36.turning in your direction, you are talking about the European
:10:37. > :10:39.referendum. Your backbench colleagues are trying to change the
:10:40. > :10:44.Immigration Bill every which way. Dominic Rather is putting in an
:10:45. > :10:49.amendment is and Mr Nigel Mills has been on this programme, putting in
:10:50. > :10:54.amendments that are clearly illegal. How is that helpful? The fact is
:10:55. > :10:56.that we are in a coalition, so there are areas of policy where
:10:57. > :11:03.Conservatives might want to go further and we are not able to do
:11:04. > :11:06.that. In other areas, we are delivering good reforms. But this is
:11:07. > :11:13.not a matter of going further. The mill 's amendment was clearly a
:11:14. > :11:17.contravention of the Treaty of Rome. That is where you get the headlines
:11:18. > :11:22.from. Some of your colleagues have a death wish? Would they rather have a
:11:23. > :11:27.Miliband government if the choice is an impure Cameron one instead? I
:11:28. > :11:31.don't think anyone in their right mind would rather have a Miliband
:11:32. > :11:36.government. Then why are they behaving that way? We have had some
:11:37. > :11:42.disagreements into the leak and debate within the party, but it was
:11:43. > :11:45.talked about on the panel just now. The Conservative Party is behind
:11:46. > :11:50.David Cameron and focused on winning the next election. Europe is one
:11:51. > :11:56.part of that. We have policies in a range of areas, but we are getting
:11:57. > :12:02.back on the right track. Thank you for being patient with us.
:12:03. > :12:06.Is this ghost story going to go somewhere? Mr Laws is talking
:12:07. > :12:12.through surrogates at the moment, but there is a strategy by the Lib
:12:13. > :12:19.Dems make these differential points now. I think it is fantastic
:12:20. > :12:23.coalition sports and entertaining, but in terms of out there, it has
:12:24. > :12:28.almost no traction whatsoever. I don't think any voters know who
:12:29. > :12:30.Baroness Morgan is and it sounds like one but politicians shouting at
:12:31. > :12:35.another bunch of politicians about their ability to give each other
:12:36. > :12:40.jobs. There is a larger point about the way Michael Gove runs his
:12:41. > :12:44.government. He is notoriously a very polite man surrounded by Rottweiler
:12:45. > :12:47.is, his advisers. He has made enemies of a lot of people in the
:12:48. > :12:52.media, and some of that will come back on him in the next 18 months.
:12:53. > :12:56.We shall see if Mr Laws himself sticks his head above the parapet.
:12:57. > :13:01.That is it for this week. The Daily Politics is on throughout the week
:13:02. > :13:05.at midday on BBC Two, except on Wednesdays, when we are on at
:13:06. > :13:08.11:30am. I will be back next week at the same time. Remember, if it is
:13:09. > :13:15.Sunday, it's the Sunday Politics.