:00:38. > :00:43.There's another candidate in the race to become Ukip's next
:00:44. > :00:45.leader: Suzanne Evans, the party's former deputy chairman,
:00:46. > :00:52.This man might have something to say about that.
:00:53. > :00:55.Paul Nuttal was Nigel Farage's deputy for many years.
:00:56. > :00:58.So is he now ready to throw his hat in the ring?
:00:59. > :01:03.The battle for Mosul: the Iraqi army and its allies advane
:01:04. > :01:06.on the country's second city which has been in the hands of
:01:07. > :01:14.But what will be the fallout from this key clash?
:01:15. > :01:17.In the West: The Stroud mum behind Momentum Kids.
:01:18. > :01:19.They hit back at claims that their brand of
:01:20. > :01:22.political childcare is creating a generation of tiny Trots.
:01:23. > :01:26.one of the richest cities in the world. Should all private landlords
:01:27. > :01:31.be licensed to help tackle the squalor?
:01:32. > :01:34.And with me - as always - the best and the brightest political
:01:35. > :01:37.panel in the business: Toby Young, Polly Toynbee and Tom Newton Dunn -
:01:38. > :01:46.The last leader was in the job a mere 18 days before she decided
:01:47. > :01:52.The favourite to succeed her then quit the party after a now infamous
:01:53. > :01:57.Ukip's biggest donor says the party is at "breaking point".
:01:58. > :02:04.This morning, the former Deputy Chairman, Suzanne Evans,
:02:05. > :02:06.announced that she would be running for the leadership.
:02:07. > :02:11.I've thought long and hard about this leadership bid,
:02:12. > :02:14.and one of the reasons I've perhaps delayed announcing it is
:02:15. > :02:17.because I wanted to be absolutely sure that I had the support
:02:18. > :02:21.And I can confirm that I have more than enough signatures
:02:22. > :02:24.on the nomination form already to be able to go forward.
:02:25. > :02:28.Let's not forget that 3,000 people signed a petition in support of me
:02:29. > :02:33.I know head office was besieged with letters in support.
:02:34. > :02:36.I would not be doing this if I didn't have the backing
:02:37. > :02:39.of our members, because our members are the most important
:02:40. > :02:47.Well, Paul Nuttall was Nigel Farage's deputy for many years
:02:48. > :02:50.and plenty of people saw him as a leader-in-waiting.
:02:51. > :02:59.Let's ask the man himself - Paul Nuttall joins me now.
:03:00. > :03:06.Yes. I've made the decision that I'm going to put my name forward to be
:03:07. > :03:11.the next leader of Ukip. I have huge support across the country, not only
:03:12. > :03:16.amongst people at the top of the party in Westminster and with the
:03:17. > :03:20.MEPs, but also the grassroots. I want to be the unity candidate. Ukip
:03:21. > :03:24.needs to come together. I'm not going to gild the lily. Ukip is
:03:25. > :03:36.looking over a political cliff at the moment. It will either step four
:03:37. > :03:38.step back, and I want to tell us to step backwards. You say it faces an
:03:39. > :03:41.ex-distension or threat, which means it's possible it has no future at
:03:42. > :03:47.all. Students of political history know that political parties take a
:03:48. > :03:52.long time to get going. They can disappear pretty quickly. Ukip is
:03:53. > :03:57.facing an existential crisis. What happened over the summer has put us
:03:58. > :04:02.on a... We could be on a spiral that we can't get off. But I believe I am
:04:03. > :04:06.the man to bring the factions together, to create unity within the
:04:07. > :04:10.party, and to build on the structure and get us ready for the common
:04:11. > :04:15.challenges. Why didn't you stand last time? Because I have spent the
:04:16. > :04:19.last four or five years of my life travelling around the country. I
:04:20. > :04:25.have done more Ukip meetings than anybody else, spending a lot of time
:04:26. > :04:29.away from home. With Brexit, I felt that my job and Nigel's job was done
:04:30. > :04:33.and we could hand over to the next generation. That doesn't seem to be
:04:34. > :04:38.the case, and maybe it's time for someone who is an old hand. I'm very
:04:39. > :04:43.experienced and I know the party inside out. Maybe it's time to step
:04:44. > :04:50.in and bring the party together You told the Liverpool Echo on the night
:04:51. > :04:53.of July that you didn't wish to take on Nigel Farage, you didn't want
:04:54. > :05:03.that to happen to your family and friends. What has changed? The party
:05:04. > :05:07.is facing an existential crisis and I want to make sure that Ukip is on
:05:08. > :05:13.the pitch to keep the ball into the open net we have in politics. We
:05:14. > :05:20.have a Conservative Party who is moving toward Brexit, but we have to
:05:21. > :05:25.be there too. Why would you be better than Suzanne Evans? Suzanne
:05:26. > :05:29.would be an excellent candidate I thought the 2015 manifesto was the
:05:30. > :05:33.best out of all the political parties. I would be the best
:05:34. > :05:39.candidate because of my experience. I am not part of any faction within
:05:40. > :05:43.the party. Is she? I get on well with everybody, and I believe I
:05:44. > :05:50.could be the man to bring the party together. Do you get on with Iain
:05:51. > :05:55.Banks, -- Aaron Banks, who is supporting one of your rivals? Yes,
:05:56. > :06:00.I get on well with him. He is able to choose whoever he wants to be the
:06:01. > :06:04.next leader of the party. After November 28, the leadership
:06:05. > :06:10.election, we all say, the past the past. It becomes Daisy row for the
:06:11. > :06:16.new leader. We forget all that has before and move on. You won the
:06:17. > :06:20.referendum. Mrs May is adopting some of your policies, like grammar
:06:21. > :06:26.schools. What is the point of Ukip these days? Twofold. We don't have
:06:27. > :06:30.Brexit. Mrs May said she would not invoke Article 50 until the end of
:06:31. > :06:36.March, and we don't know if that will happen. We need to ensure a
:06:37. > :06:41.strong Ukip to make sure that Brexit really does mean Brexit. We have a
:06:42. > :06:45.huge opportunity in working class communities where the Labour Party
:06:46. > :06:50.no longer represents them. I believe Ukip can become the voice of working
:06:51. > :06:54.people. If you were the leader, would Ukip be a bigger threat to
:06:55. > :06:59.Labour in the north or the Tories in the South? You save Labour in the
:07:00. > :07:03.north, and people often to make that mistake. There's working class
:07:04. > :07:05.communities right across the country is. There are working-class
:07:06. > :07:20.communities in Bristol just as in Newcastle. We are second in a
:07:21. > :07:22.number of northern seats, and southern seats as well, and I
:07:23. > :07:25.believe the party can move into these communities. It can only do so
:07:26. > :07:28.if Ukip is on the pitch, and I intend to make sure that's the case.
:07:29. > :07:35.I don't think we have portrayed a good image over the summer. Is that
:07:36. > :07:42.called British understatement? A bit. It is dysfunctional. We have to
:07:43. > :07:46.move on beyond Nigel Farage. We have to build a strong national Executive
:07:47. > :07:52.Committee. We need to ensure our branches are ready for the fight and
:07:53. > :07:56.concentrate on local elections. I've got the experience. I'm now throwing
:07:57. > :08:02.my hat into the ring, and I'm the only person who can keep Ukip in the
:08:03. > :08:06.game. What role would you give Nigel Farage, if any? I will be the
:08:07. > :08:11.candidate of compromise. I would see what Nigel wanted to do. Would you
:08:12. > :08:15.keep in the leader of the freedom and democracy group in the European
:08:16. > :08:18.Parliament? There would have to be compromise on both sides, and we
:08:19. > :08:26.would need to talk about it. I don't know what Nigel wants to do. Do you
:08:27. > :08:30.think his support, his association with Donald Trump, helps Ukip win
:08:31. > :08:34.female votes in this country? Personally, I would not have gone
:08:35. > :08:40.out and campaigned or said anything about Donald Trump, but I don't
:08:41. > :08:45.think Ukip has come out and backed Donald Trump 100%. Personally, I
:08:46. > :08:47.wouldn't have even spoken about the American election, because I think
:08:48. > :08:54.the two candidates are quite appalling. Some up for us. If you
:08:55. > :08:59.win, what would be the hallmark of your Ukip leadership? The first
:09:00. > :09:05.couple of months would be ensuring that Ukip unifies. Saying no to
:09:06. > :09:11.factions, bringing people together. Suzanne Evans, Nigel Farage, all of
:09:12. > :09:15.the MEPs, and ensuring that Ukip can move forward. If we don't unify
:09:16. > :09:17.Ukip will not be around for much longer. Thanks for being with us
:09:18. > :09:19.this morning. We won't have to wait too long
:09:20. > :09:22.to find out who Ukip's new leader will be -
:09:23. > :09:32.the winner will be announced Who would be the best leader for
:09:33. > :09:36.Ukip? I think the difference between the field a few weeks ago and today
:09:37. > :09:44.is that this field is a lot stronger. Whether it's Paul or
:09:45. > :09:52.Suzanne, I think... It is hard to say, with Aaron Banks and apparently
:09:53. > :09:59.Nigel Farage hacking another candidate, Raheem, but I want Ukip
:10:00. > :10:06.to be a strong force in British politics. I think the fact there is
:10:07. > :10:14.a stronger field now is good news for Ukip. Is it a Labour's worst
:10:15. > :10:20.nightmare in the north of England? It is. I think the personality
:10:21. > :10:23.difference and presentational difference is interesting. Suzanne
:10:24. > :10:28.Evans is going for the Conservative county vote. There's a lot to be
:10:29. > :10:35.taken there by Ukip. He would probably be more appealing to the
:10:36. > :10:42.Labour vote. It is interesting. At the moment, pollsters say that the
:10:43. > :10:53.Ukip vote splits pretty easily between Labour and Tory. But things
:10:54. > :10:56.always collapse. When they have made inroads into Tower Hamlets and
:10:57. > :11:05.Barking, they collapse, because they fight amongst each other so much.
:11:06. > :11:13.But not always with fists! Does Ukip have a future? And who would best
:11:14. > :11:17.secure that future? It does for at least two years, until we Brexit. We
:11:18. > :11:24.have to believe that that will happen. That was an impressive pitch
:11:25. > :11:28.there from Paul, certainly as the unity candidate, after the car crash
:11:29. > :11:34.we have seen on TV screens this morning. But it doesn't go beyond
:11:35. > :11:36.May 20 19. What then? There is no point being called the United
:11:37. > :11:44.Kingdom Independence party any longer. What will happen after May
:11:45. > :11:48.2019? If you want to hoover up votes of the back of Brexit, you need to
:11:49. > :11:53.start looking further ahead than two years. The person who wins that
:11:54. > :11:55.leadership contest is the person who will sum that up the best. We shall
:11:56. > :11:58.see. In June 2014, the group which calls
:11:59. > :12:01.itself the Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant captured Iraq's
:12:02. > :12:03.second city, Mosul. Later that month the group announced
:12:04. > :12:06.it was establishing a 'caliphate', or an Islamic state,
:12:07. > :12:08.on the territories it This week 30,000 Iraqi troops, aided
:12:09. > :12:17.by Iranian-backed Shia fighters Kurdish Peshmerga and Western air
:12:18. > :12:22.support, began the assault Then they spot a truck bomb
:12:23. > :12:40.from so-called Islamic State. They destroy it before
:12:41. > :12:44.it destroys them. These are the first steps
:12:45. > :12:47.in the battle for Mosul, the Northern Iraqi city IS has
:12:48. > :12:52.made its stronghold since 2014. Controlling the city of around
:12:53. > :12:57.2 million people means that they established governance,
:12:58. > :13:01.they establish a territorial base. This is what has obsessed everyone,
:13:02. > :13:04.because with a territorial base you are capable of doing more
:13:05. > :13:09.than if you are simply an insurgency movement in the fabric
:13:10. > :13:13.of another society. It's being billed as the biggest
:13:14. > :13:17.military operation in Iraq since the war in 2003, the biggest
:13:18. > :13:21.moment in the international effort Here is how the various forces
:13:22. > :13:26.are approaching the city. Heading to Mosul from the south
:13:27. > :13:31.the elite troops of the Iraqi army. Known as the Golden division,
:13:32. > :13:33.trained and accompanied From the North, a force made up
:13:34. > :13:40.of Kurds, known as the Peshmerga, Also from the South,
:13:41. > :13:45.a militia made up of Shia fighters who have been accused
:13:46. > :13:48.of human rights abuses. British planes have bombed outlying
:13:49. > :13:51.villages, reportedly guided in by British personnel
:13:52. > :13:59.on the ground. To the North West, a corridor
:14:00. > :14:02.has been left for some of the 3000 plus IS fighters,
:14:03. > :14:04.in theory an escape route which could limit the bloodshed
:14:05. > :14:07.when fighting starts in the city. We've had 4-5 days of battle
:14:08. > :14:10.and it's taking place in the outlying villages
:14:11. > :14:12.and there have been some successes and some failures,
:14:13. > :14:15.but the momentum is building. And the real question will be
:14:16. > :14:18.when the attackers get towards the city itself,
:14:19. > :14:22.how strong are the defences? It will crack but it might crack
:14:23. > :14:29.within 48 hours or 2-3 weeks. IS has fought back,
:14:30. > :14:34.on Friday they attack sites in the city of Kirkuk,
:14:35. > :14:36.including a power station. The United Nations believes hundreds
:14:37. > :14:38.of thousands of families have been rounded up
:14:39. > :14:41.as potential human shields. The battle could be bloody,
:14:42. > :14:45.but what about when it's over? The Shia militias, the Iraqi army,
:14:46. > :14:48.the Peshmerga guerrillas, some of the Turkish elements,
:14:49. > :14:51.they all want a share of the action. They are in Mosul, not
:14:52. > :14:55.for altruistic reasons. They are there because they want
:14:56. > :14:58.to be part of whatever happens next. The biggest issue is how the Sunni
:14:59. > :15:03.majority in Mosul reacts to the Shia militias which have
:15:04. > :15:07.helped to liberate them. ARCHIVE FOOTAGE: When Sir Francis
:15:08. > :15:09.Humphrey went to Mosul If it all seems like something
:15:10. > :15:13.from the archive, when the Middle East went up in flames
:15:14. > :15:16.and was then carved up, it is because that is what is
:15:17. > :15:19.happening in Iraq right now. National identity has been cut
:15:20. > :15:24.across by other identities such And that means that putting together
:15:25. > :15:34.a so-called nation state again Almost certainly there will be
:15:35. > :15:40.a new form of Kurdish state, almost certainly in northern Iraq
:15:41. > :15:43.at the end of this crisis, and what is happening in Mosul
:15:44. > :15:46.is a microcosm of what is happening elsewhere across the Levant
:15:47. > :15:50.which is that it is melting down. Big questions, questions that
:15:51. > :15:53.come after the battle. The coalition forces are advancing
:15:54. > :15:55.but this is just the beginning. I'm joined now by the International
:15:56. > :16:05.Development Minister Rory Stewart. In a former life he was
:16:06. > :16:08.the coalition Deputy-Governor of two provinces in Southern Iraq following
:16:09. > :16:23.the Iraq intervention of 2003. Is there any doubt that at some
:16:24. > :16:33.stage Mosul will fall to the forces of Iraq and its allies? The first
:16:34. > :16:36.thing is that war is very uncertain and there are cliches about it being
:16:37. > :16:39.the graveyard of predictions and we don't want to make confident
:16:40. > :16:48.predictions but the basic structure is that there are 30,000 Iraqi
:16:49. > :16:54.forces outside and only a few thousand Daesh fighters inside and I
:16:55. > :17:03.would say it is overwhelmingly likely that the batter will one
:17:04. > :17:06.STUDIO: -- the battle the won by the Iraqi forces.
:17:07. > :17:14.June 2014 was a great success, they took a city of over in people and
:17:15. > :17:18.they created what they tried to create a million state of 7 million
:17:19. > :17:23.people, stretching across the Iraqi Syrian border, but since then they
:17:24. > :17:26.have lost territory quite rapidly. Now they are losing the outskirts of
:17:27. > :17:31.Mosul, and that is a fundamental blow. Islamic State is all about
:17:32. > :17:34.territory and holding state, that is what makes it different from
:17:35. > :17:42.Al-Qaeda. If they lose Mosul that will be a cynic -- significant blow
:17:43. > :17:46.to their credibility. Hillary Clinton said on Wednesday's
:17:47. > :17:49.presidential debate that when Iraqi forces with their allies including
:17:50. > :17:55.the United Kingdom gain control of Mosul they should continue to press
:17:56. > :18:01.into Syria to take back Raqqa which is the de facto capital of the
:18:02. > :18:08.caliphate, what is left of it, do we want Iraqi forces to pursue IS into
:18:09. > :18:12.Syria? Very important question. Delayed in Raqqa needs to come from
:18:13. > :18:18.people on the Syrian side of the border and that is an important
:18:19. > :18:23.principle -- the lead. In the end of that enemy, Islamic State, is a
:18:24. > :18:29.common enemy for odd members of the coalition including the Iraqi
:18:30. > :18:33.government. -- all members. There is likely to be a humanitarian crisis
:18:34. > :18:36.especially if it ends up with street to street fighting and IS are
:18:37. > :18:43.difficult to dislodge what are we doing about that? We are doing very
:18:44. > :18:47.detailed scenario planning. It is very uncertain what the scenario
:18:48. > :18:55.will be but much investment has gone into creating a network of camps,
:18:56. > :19:04.refugees STUDIO: Refugee camps around cash refugee camps, and that
:19:05. > :19:07.is where money, British money, 40 million has gone recently into
:19:08. > :19:14.supporting that, especially in terms of medical support to people. The
:19:15. > :19:17.United nation's emergency response budget is ?196 million but only one
:19:18. > :19:21.third funded which sounds like we are putting up a big chunk of what
:19:22. > :19:26.is already being funded. Why is that? The international committee
:19:27. > :19:31.can't say they haven't seen this assault coming, and the humanitarian
:19:32. > :19:36.fallout they may see from it. You are absolutely right. We have seen
:19:37. > :19:39.it coming and we have been planning since debris and we have put in
:19:40. > :19:45.about ?167 million into this -- planning since February. There has
:19:46. > :19:48.been a change in the nature of the appeal, and if there is a lag in the
:19:49. > :19:52.accounting of it, but the money we need at this stage is in place and
:19:53. > :19:56.we do have the support structure in place for those refugees. You are
:19:57. > :20:00.right the United Nations is continuing with its appeal and is
:20:01. > :20:03.asking for more money at the moment. The converse magazine wrote this
:20:04. > :20:08.week that preparations for a big exodus of people leaving the city
:20:09. > :20:13.have been made -- Economist magazine. But confidence is not high
:20:14. > :20:19.in the preparations, is that a unfair conclusion? If you can
:20:20. > :20:22.imagine the different scenarios it could be a few thousand and it could
:20:23. > :20:25.be a few hundred thousand coming out of the city through a front line
:20:26. > :20:30.where the war is going on, that is very difficult. You have to screen
:20:31. > :20:34.those people and disarm them, and keep families together, and
:20:35. > :20:38.transport them and you have to bring them into the refugee camps. The
:20:39. > :20:41.people working on this have been working on this for long time, we
:20:42. > :20:47.have mapped the different routes we have good camp infrastructure in
:20:48. > :20:51.place and we have people who have worked in south to dam and other
:20:52. > :20:56.areas who are putting their structures in place -- South Sudan.
:20:57. > :20:59.It is never easy but I think we have done everything we can in the
:21:00. > :21:06.preparation for this. What is the British role in what will probably
:21:07. > :21:11.be an even bigger issue, assuming that Mosul is liberated and retaken,
:21:12. > :21:17.the humanitarian crisis is dealt with, what role will we play in the
:21:18. > :21:21.rebuilding of Mosul? That will be crucial to the future of Iraq, the
:21:22. > :21:27.second-biggest city and it will need to be rebuilt. It will need to be
:21:28. > :21:32.rebuilt as a community as well as bricks and mortar. And eight Sunni
:21:33. > :21:40.community that is not harassed by the Shia. -- and eight. You are
:21:41. > :21:42.right. One of the core drivers is that the Sunni community felt
:21:43. > :21:46.excluded and they did not feel they have the trust from the Baghdad
:21:47. > :21:54.government. A lasting solution is stopping some of Islamic State
:21:55. > :21:58.coming back, that involves making sure the Sunni community have a
:21:59. > :22:03.stake in their future. That is making sure that the governing
:22:04. > :22:07.structures are in place. The UK s response is twofold, we have got to
:22:08. > :22:11.get the humanitarian aid right, that is the short term, people who might
:22:12. > :22:16.be malnourished, coming out of the front line. The second thing is
:22:17. > :22:21.working with the Iraqi government to make sure that as we rebuild Mosul
:22:22. > :22:26.we do so in a way that that population feels a connection to the
:22:27. > :22:31.Iraqi state. Islamic State is losing territory everywhere in the Levant,
:22:32. > :22:36.it is almost finished in Iraq, we think. It is down to one district in
:22:37. > :22:43.Libya, as well, just one small part of the town. I suppose the risk is,
:22:44. > :22:48.if life is becoming more difficult across these areas, it can start to
:22:49. > :22:52.look more in Europe and the United Kingdom as a place to continue its
:22:53. > :22:58.terrorist attacks? That is a real danger. You are right. This is a
:22:59. > :23:02.group which has proved over the last five years very unpredictable and it
:23:03. > :23:07.changes for it quickly full stop often it does unexpected things In
:23:08. > :23:13.2009 its predecessor had been largely wiped out in Iraq and when
:23:14. > :23:16.it was under pressure in Syria it went back into Iraq, and in the past
:23:17. > :23:21.it didn't hold territory but now it holds territory, so you are right.
:23:22. > :23:25.There is a serious risk that as it gets squeezed in the middle East it
:23:26. > :23:29.will try to pop up somewhere else and Mac could include Europe and the
:23:30. > :23:33.United States -- that could. They say that is something they have
:23:34. > :23:38.focused on full stop we also have a big focus on counterterrorism
:23:39. > :23:46.security and making sure that we keep the United Kingdom and Europe
:23:47. > :23:52.say. One final question. -- say -- safe. Maybe events in Mosul could
:23:53. > :23:57.add to the migration crisis in Europe, is that a possibility?
:23:58. > :24:03.Again, you are right, we have seen in Syria it can push migration, the
:24:04. > :24:06.biggest push the migration was the conflict in Syria, and that's the
:24:07. > :24:10.reason why we have but so much energy into getting those refugee
:24:11. > :24:15.camps in place and getting the humanitarian response in place -
:24:16. > :24:18.put so much energy. People will want to remain in their homes, this is
:24:19. > :24:21.their country, but we have got to make it possible for them and that
:24:22. > :24:26.means in the short term looking after their shelter and in the
:24:27. > :24:30.medium to long-term making sure they have livelihoods, jobs and an
:24:31. > :24:34.economic development which is why our support in Iraq is in the UK
:24:35. > :24:40.National interests because it deals with these issues of migration and
:24:41. > :24:44.terrorists. Thanks for joining us. I'm joined now by the Shadow Defence
:24:45. > :25:01.Secretary. Does Labour support British
:25:02. > :25:05.participation in this offensive We fully support the participation in
:25:06. > :25:10.this offensive, extremely important move forward and we voted for this
:25:11. > :25:14.back in 2014. We are asking the government question is, of course, I
:25:15. > :25:20.was asking the Secretary of State this week about this very offensive
:25:21. > :25:23.but we are fully behind our RAF pilots out there and be trading that
:25:24. > :25:29.has been going on to help the forces on the ground. -- the training full
:25:30. > :25:35.stop that is very clear. I wonder if you'll lead it shares that clarity
:25:36. > :25:38.and that position. -- is your leader. This is what Jeremy Corbyn
:25:39. > :25:40.has said. What's been done in Iraq
:25:41. > :25:42.is done by the Iraqi government, and currently
:25:43. > :25:44.supported by the British government. I did not support it
:25:45. > :25:46.when it came up. Well, I'm not sure how successful
:25:47. > :25:50.it's been, because most of the action now appears to be
:25:51. > :26:01.moving in to Syria, so I think we He doesn't sound very supportive.
:26:02. > :26:04.The issue about Mosul, it has been very carefully prepared as Rory
:26:05. > :26:10.Stewart said and I hope we have learned the lessons from previous
:26:11. > :26:14.offensives where we haven't learnt sufficiently, and that is going to
:26:15. > :26:19.be crucial in this context. How the aftermath is going to be dealt with.
:26:20. > :26:24.Of course will stop that clip was from November last year, and things
:26:25. > :26:30.have changed. Two weeks ago he told the BBC" I'm not sure it is
:26:31. > :26:34.working", in reference to air strikes in Iraq, but it is working.
:26:35. > :26:38.We have got to see what happens in Mosul, it is a very high-risk
:26:39. > :26:42.operation, but we also have to face the fact that the people there are
:26:43. > :26:49.living under tyranny at the moment. We have to ask very cirrus question
:26:50. > :26:52.shall stop he says he's not sure it is working, when Mosul is the last
:26:53. > :26:57.major target be cleared of Islamic State in Iraq. The combination of
:26:58. > :27:01.Allied air power has worked, why is he not sure it is working? Because
:27:02. > :27:08.we have seen difficulties in the past. But this was two weeks ago. It
:27:09. > :27:11.is essential that the work is done, both planning for the refugees as
:27:12. > :27:14.Rory Stewart referred to, but also in terms of reconstruction of the
:27:15. > :27:20.city and its community as you mentioned. These are vital. This was
:27:21. > :27:25.about the ability to make progress with Allied air power, special
:27:26. > :27:30.forces in Iraq, on the ground, do you accept so far that has a
:27:31. > :27:42.strategy that seems to be working to read Iraq of Islamic -- to read Iraq
:27:43. > :27:55.of Islamic State the question of the car began placement. Ulloa -- we
:27:56. > :27:57.can't be complacent. The problems they are creating where ever they
:27:58. > :28:03.are urged that we must continue to pursue them. This is the first time
:28:04. > :28:06.we have spoken to since you have become the Shadow Defence Secretary.
:28:07. > :28:12.I hope we will have a longer interview. Will Labour's next
:28:13. > :28:17.manifesto include a commitment to the renewal of Trident? It will We
:28:18. > :28:21.made that commitment in 2007, that is a firm commitment and we will
:28:22. > :28:24.honour that to our coalition allies and our industrial partners and that
:28:25. > :28:28.is the vote which was taken democratically and repeatedly has
:28:29. > :28:34.been reaffirmed by Labour conference and we are a democratic party vote
:28:35. > :28:40.up you have squared that with Jeremy Corbyn? He's in favour of democracy
:28:41. > :28:44.and he understands the situation, but we also want to push for the UK
:28:45. > :28:49.to play a much bigger role on the international stage on multilateral
:28:50. > :28:53.disarmament talks. You were very clear there, I thank you for that.
:28:54. > :28:57.Support for Trident will be in the next Labour manifesto. What has
:28:58. > :29:03.happened to Labour's review of Trident policy? That review has been
:29:04. > :29:08.taking place over the year, we had a very clear reaffirmation in the
:29:09. > :29:11.conference boat this year, we are reaffirming our commitment to
:29:12. > :29:18.Trident -- vote. The review can t change that? There is a process of
:29:19. > :29:24.review and a fair number of issues related to defence, all parties do
:29:25. > :29:28.this. Of course. The review can t change the commitment to Trident? We
:29:29. > :29:34.are not changing the commitment to Trident. Russia is now the main
:29:35. > :29:36.strategic threat to this country? It is a major strategic threat and we
:29:37. > :29:40.have got to work with our Nato allies very closely and make sure
:29:41. > :29:44.that we respond and that we do not let things pass. For example, we
:29:45. > :29:50.should be calling out Russia for the way it has been a bombing
:29:51. > :29:52.humanitarian aid and we should be taking them to international court
:29:53. > :30:00.over this, but we should also be strengthening sanctions, somewhat
:30:01. > :30:05.imposed over Ukraine. We try to do that, but the Italians wouldn't let
:30:06. > :30:06.us. The Italians did not want to participate in the European
:30:07. > :30:13.initiative but that doesn't stop individual countries for the Britain
:30:14. > :30:16.should step up? Yes, we should look at what is practical to impose.
:30:17. > :30:21.Thanks for joining us. Mosul is not the only major battle
:30:22. > :30:24.being waged in the Middle East. The city of Aleppo in northern Syria
:30:25. > :30:28.has seen some of the heaviest bombardment since Syria's
:30:29. > :30:31.five-year-long civil war began. This week Russian warships,
:30:32. > :30:34.in a deliberate show of power, sailed west through the English
:30:35. > :30:38.channel en route to Syria. Nato says it's Russia's "largest
:30:39. > :30:41.surface deployment" since the end of the Cold War in what is thought
:30:42. > :30:44.to be preparation for a final assault
:30:45. > :30:48.on the besieged city of Aleppo. In the city itself fighting
:30:49. > :30:52.resumed overnight - following a 3-day ceasefire -
:30:53. > :30:57.with more air strikes and heavy clashes in the city's
:30:58. > :31:00.rebel-held eastern districts. Almost 500 people have been
:31:01. > :31:03.killed and 2,000 injured since Syrian government forces,
:31:04. > :31:07.backed by Russian air strikes, This week Theresa May condemned
:31:08. > :31:14.Vladimir Putin's involvement in Syria, accusing Moscow
:31:15. > :31:17.of being behind "sickening atrocities" in support
:31:18. > :31:20.of President Assad's regime. But European leaders are divided
:31:21. > :31:24.on how to respond and, with the United States preoccupied
:31:25. > :31:27.with domestic politics, President Putin senses this
:31:28. > :31:31.is his moment to bring the Syrian I'm joined now by the BBC's former
:31:32. > :31:39.Diplomatic and Moscow Correspondent, Bridget Kendall, who is now Master
:31:40. > :31:52.of Peterhouse College in Cambridge. Welcome. Good to see you in the BBC
:31:53. > :31:59.studio again. Let me put up this satellite image of Aleppo here, to
:32:00. > :32:04.get an idea of the scale. It was the biggest city in Syria. It was the
:32:05. > :32:09.commercial capital and a huge cultural hub as well. Almost the New
:32:10. > :32:14.York of Syria, to give you an idea of its significance to the country.
:32:15. > :32:19.Let me show you now how it's been divided. The rebels are now in
:32:20. > :32:26.control of the eastern part, about eight miles long and three miles
:32:27. > :32:30.wide there, they're in purple. They are under great attacks still. Is it
:32:31. > :32:39.inevitable that that purple part falls to the regime? That is what
:32:40. > :32:45.President as Saad, the Russians and the Iranians hope. The fierce
:32:46. > :32:49.bombardments we have seen is part of that. I'm reminded very much in the
:32:50. > :32:54.Russian tactics of what happened in grudgingly in Chechnya in 2000, when
:32:55. > :33:00.the Russians said, a warning for all civilians to lead, and then they
:33:01. > :33:05.went ahead and they basically raised it to the ground. They are talking
:33:06. > :33:11.about Al Nusrah as being one of the rebel groups. They got rid of all of
:33:12. > :33:15.the terrorists. They talk about it being an Al-Qaeda offshoot. The
:33:16. > :33:19.purpose of going in is to get rid of them. You get the civilians out and
:33:20. > :33:24.then you take it. But this isn't like Chechnya. It is much more
:33:25. > :33:29.complex. We have seen an attempt to take Aleppo before, and then there
:33:30. > :33:33.was a rebel counter offensive. It's not so certain. And there are so
:33:34. > :33:37.many different parties involved We have seen the alarm in the west of
:33:38. > :33:47.the extent of the civilian casualties. There have been
:33:48. > :33:50.rumblings in the west of, shouldn't the United States do something?
:33:51. > :33:53.Shouldn't they stop the Syrian air force? This Russian aircraft carrier
:33:54. > :33:59.steaming its way towards the Eastern Mediterranean is a symbolic gesture,
:34:00. > :34:05.both to its own people, but also to the West, to say, don't get involved
:34:06. > :34:11.in Aleppo if we go ahead. Don't try and stop us because we could up the
:34:12. > :34:15.ante. They have not been great visual pictures, because the
:34:16. > :34:22.aircraft carrier looks a bit clapped out, belching out smoke! If the
:34:23. > :34:26.rebel controlled area does fall it would be seen as a great victory for
:34:27. > :34:31.President as Saad and his Russian allies. What is the aim of Russia
:34:32. > :34:36.here? What would they then do, if Aleppo Falls? It is part of a plan
:34:37. > :34:43.that President Putin set out in his UN speech in 2014, before Russia
:34:44. > :34:46.went into Syria. The aim is to put President Assad back in charge.
:34:47. > :34:51.President Putin said this weekend that either is Assad in Damascus, or
:34:52. > :34:56.its Al Nusrah. There is nothing in between. They want to eliminate the
:34:57. > :35:02.argument for a moderate opposition. They want to make it plain that the
:35:03. > :35:10.only way to get a stable Syria is to have Assad back in charge. Even sue
:35:11. > :35:18.argue for a rump steak lit, leaving aside what is happening with IAS.
:35:19. > :35:22.They have already said they want to have an enlarged military presence
:35:23. > :35:30.at their bases. And they have a big naval base. It is. It is a chance to
:35:31. > :35:36.push for this when he sees the West is being distracted and divided
:35:37. > :35:41.Europe and America, by elections and so on. Just before the US elections.
:35:42. > :35:46.The Americans are worried about that, Europeans are being distracted
:35:47. > :35:51.by Brexit. He can push to his maximum advantage now, before there
:35:52. > :36:01.is a new US president. If they do take that part of Aleppo, and that
:36:02. > :36:06.part of northern Syria, does Mr Putin want us to recognise, to
:36:07. > :36:12.admit, that that is now his sphere of influence? I think the rhetoric
:36:13. > :36:17.from the Russians is that they want the West to recognise that they are
:36:18. > :36:21.an equal powerful partner. It's not just the US that runs the writ in
:36:22. > :36:27.the Middle East. Russia is as important as it is. It is engaging
:36:28. > :36:32.with Saudi Arabia and has mended fences with Turkey. Syria is the
:36:33. > :36:38.place from which it can launch its message that it is a big player in
:36:39. > :36:43.the Middle East. Russia wants the West to understand that this isn't a
:36:44. > :36:47.country that was dismembered after the end of the Soviet Union and is
:36:48. > :36:53.now a week. It is back, and it is strong. That is an important
:36:54. > :36:58.message. Looking at the economy It is in recession. GDP has been
:36:59. > :37:03.falling, partly because of the price of oil. It is highly dependent on
:37:04. > :37:08.hydrocarbons, and is expected to fall again. Its people are falling
:37:09. > :37:14.again. People don't realise how small the Russian economy is. Its
:37:15. > :37:19.GDP is about the size of Italy's. It is smaller than the UK economy.
:37:20. > :37:29.Bigger than it was 15 or 20 years ago. But so is Britain's does it
:37:30. > :37:35.help to take people's mind of this? A huge shock to the Russian economy
:37:36. > :37:40.was a drop in the price of oil and a price of gas. A drop in the price of
:37:41. > :37:45.the ruble as well. This is hurting the people of Russia. On the one
:37:46. > :37:50.hand, it is the war in Syria, which is very important for Russia to sort
:37:51. > :37:58.out that part of the world and dispensed terrorists who might be
:37:59. > :38:03.danger to -- is dangerous to Russia. But he had also has presidential
:38:04. > :38:07.election is going up. They are supposed to be 2018, but some feel
:38:08. > :38:12.he will bring them forward to 2 17, because the economy is not doing so
:38:13. > :38:14.well. But you need a good story for the Russian people. Thank you very
:38:15. > :38:16.much. We say goodbye to viewers
:38:17. > :38:27.in Scotland who leave us now Hello and welcome to
:38:28. > :38:29.Sunday Politics here in the West. Coming up: When politics
:38:30. > :38:33.is child's play. We hear from one of the founders
:38:34. > :38:36.of Momentum Kids which organises activities for children
:38:37. > :38:40.with a political flavour. They'll respond to claims that
:38:41. > :38:43.they're making a generation of mini I'm joined by two grown-ups
:38:44. > :38:49.with youngsters of their own. It's a Coalition pairing just
:38:50. > :38:52.like the old times. Conservation group leader
:38:53. > :38:57.on Bristol City Council Mark Weston and for the Lib Dems,
:38:58. > :38:59.their general election candhdate for Kingswood when the election
:39:00. > :39:11.comes, Carole Wilkinson. Let's start with the
:39:12. > :39:15.by-election in Whitney. Are you shocked or surprised
:39:16. > :39:19.by the Lib Dem's surge? I have to confess to being puite
:39:20. > :39:23.happy with the result. When David Cameron first won
:39:24. > :39:26.the seat he won with 45% of the vote We've been in government for six
:39:27. > :39:31.years and we won it So, from a Conservative point
:39:32. > :39:36.of view I'm quite happy. But the Lib Dems had a pretty good
:39:37. > :39:39.result and bucked the trend Our vote's been going up
:39:40. > :39:46.across the country. Partly they ran an excellent
:39:47. > :39:59.campaign and got stuck into that. The other thing I think is people
:40:00. > :40:02.are really very worried about what is going on with Brexit,
:40:03. > :40:05.about noises they're hearing It will be interesting
:40:06. > :40:09.to see what happens Do you think it's a sign th`t people
:40:10. > :40:15.don't want a hard Brexit? I don't think you can read too much
:40:16. > :40:18.into a single by-election. There needs to be a much wider
:40:19. > :40:21.sampling of the vote. I think one of the problems we have
:40:22. > :40:27.with Brexit is we need more information but it's a complicated
:40:28. > :40:29.negotiations so the information But I'm happy with the result
:40:30. > :40:35.and glad I'm not in Ukip's shoes. OK, even though you lost
:40:36. > :40:38.a lot of support. How's this for a solution
:40:39. > :40:41.to the financial woes faced by some A big one-off leap in counchl tax
:40:42. > :40:47.without restrictions. That is what Swindon is doing
:40:48. > :40:49.with a catch, you have to create a whole new layer
:40:50. > :40:57.of local government. They've cut and cut and cut,
:40:58. > :41:00.but now Swindon Borough Council wants to hand over jobs likd grass
:41:01. > :41:04.cutting to parish councils. There aren't any in most of the town
:41:05. > :41:07.so three would be created. They could then add a chargd
:41:08. > :41:20.to council tax bills, perhaps ? 5. We're facing unprecedented budget
:41:21. > :41:22.pressures and we are facing unprecedented pressure
:41:23. > :41:24.on our services for vulnerable That squeezes in important local
:41:25. > :41:33.services, like street cleanhng and grass cutting and looking
:41:34. > :41:35.after children's playgrounds. This allows us to ring fencd that
:41:36. > :41:37.money and provide the It was backed by the ruling
:41:38. > :41:43.Conservative cabinet and there was much talk
:41:44. > :41:45.of the rising cost of social services and falling
:41:46. > :41:49.funding from Whitehall. But that may not mean much
:41:50. > :41:52.to the 130,000 residents We pay a lot of money
:41:53. > :42:01.out and they don't do It seems to be an excuse
:42:02. > :42:04.to put everything up It's bad isn't it because wd pay
:42:05. > :42:12.enough now for different thhngs It is also being
:42:13. > :42:17.considered in Bristol. At present, it has no town or parish
:42:18. > :42:20.councils in contrast As people in Bristol want to know
:42:21. > :42:28.what it's like to have an extra local council all they need to do
:42:29. > :42:31.is cross the city boundary. Although it is part of urban
:42:32. > :42:33.South Gloucestershire, It's interesting to
:42:34. > :42:39.compare it to Kingswood. Kingswood is a suburb that's also
:42:40. > :42:42.part of South Gloucestershire but it Filton has a leisure centre
:42:43. > :42:52.and so does Kingswood. They have similar facilities and,
:42:53. > :42:55.yes, both have playgrounds though the town council boasts
:42:56. > :42:58.that they have rather You're saying people in Filton
:42:59. > :43:02.get better facilities No, I think just maybe
:43:03. > :43:15.we get a bum deal. Yes, because these things are extra
:43:16. > :43:18.and this is why our services are a bit higher than counchls
:43:19. > :43:23.nearby because they don't h`ve Filton's ?190 council tax charge
:43:24. > :43:30.also funds offices and staff. Councillors themselves aren't paid,
:43:31. > :43:34.but holding elections aren't cheap The problem is getting
:43:35. > :43:41.people to do it. We struggle here quite often to be
:43:42. > :43:44.quorate at meetings because it's Back in Swindon like in Swindon
:43:45. > :43:55.dozens of new councillors whll be needed if the plan gets a fhnal
:43:56. > :44:00.go-ahead next month. Joining me is David Reynard,
:44:01. > :44:02.the leader of Swindon The plan is to complete this
:44:03. > :44:10.patchwork of parish councils and, therefore, you will be able to say
:44:11. > :44:14.to the parish councils, Half of Swindon is parished
:44:15. > :44:21.half isn't in Swindon, mainly for historical reasons,
:44:22. > :44:24.but we want to extend the bdnefits It would give local
:44:25. > :44:33.residents more choice over And less choice over
:44:34. > :44:38.how much cash they pay? You quoted ?75, but I represent
:44:39. > :44:44.and live in a parished area and pay ?35 a year and I get really good
:44:45. > :44:48.services for that money. What many people may suspect is that
:44:49. > :44:52.council spending is tight so you devolve it to parish level
:44:53. > :44:56.and there is no cap That is true but the governlent
:44:57. > :45:02.is consulting on that. And we're already doing that
:45:03. > :45:17.with existing parishes. So it's a way of getting more money
:45:18. > :45:20.out of the tax taxpayer? No, it's about protecting
:45:21. > :45:26.services people value. If they stay with the borough
:45:27. > :45:29.council, more of our money hs going on adult and children social care,
:45:30. > :45:32.therefore there will be less to pay Actually, it's about raising
:45:33. > :45:36.extra revenue as well? You are on Bristol City Council
:45:37. > :45:44.would you support parishes springing No, I must confess
:45:45. > :45:53.to not being a fan. As David said, half of their
:45:54. > :45:58.residents are already in parishes. In Bristol, it's a new structure
:45:59. > :46:02.for everybody and I must confess to being nervous about sudddnly
:46:03. > :46:05.having additional As far as I see it, I would end up
:46:06. > :46:12.paying for another level of I'm slightly concerned that some
:46:13. > :46:18.of the wealthier areas of the city would be able to have a fairly low
:46:19. > :46:23.charge to do what they want and the poorer areas
:46:24. > :46:29.can least afford it. It would be up to each individual
:46:30. > :46:32.parish council to decide wh`t level of services they want to provide
:46:33. > :46:37.and we have that in Swindon. Are you putting up the council tax
:46:38. > :46:46.by the maximum you can each year? We are, as I think you'll fhnd
:46:47. > :46:50.all top tier councils are doing You're a former parish
:46:51. > :46:52.councillor, aren't you? This has come about because of
:46:53. > :46:55.severe cuts in government ftnding In South Gloucestershire,
:46:56. > :47:01.they had to take ?38 million a year out of the budget announced
:47:02. > :47:07.an additional 40 million. Bristol council had to get rid
:47:08. > :47:09.of 1,000 jobs in a month As a parish councillor,
:47:10. > :47:17.do you support it? Parish councils are extremely
:47:18. > :47:20.valuable where the people involved are engaged and represent
:47:21. > :47:27.a whole load of different people in the community
:47:28. > :47:29.add a constructive. Some parish councils
:47:30. > :47:33.don't function very well. It's all about the people you can
:47:34. > :47:38.get on board and moving forward OK, other cities miss out bx not
:47:39. > :47:42.having local representation that There is a difference betwedn places
:47:43. > :47:50.which are in cities and havd a good At the moment, parish counchls
:47:51. > :47:56.are being asked to do things like fund all the things
:47:57. > :48:00.which the council used to ftnd before and if they don't find
:48:01. > :48:11.it, who does? It doesn't have to just
:48:12. > :48:22.be parish councillors! Let us talk about the bigger issue
:48:23. > :48:24.of council tax rises. Bristol has announced
:48:25. > :48:26.cuts to services to come and still the council tax
:48:27. > :48:29.going up by 4% a year over That's a tremendous amount
:48:30. > :48:33.of money, isn't it? We have a particular demogr`phic
:48:34. > :48:35.with more older people. So, you support the mayor's plan
:48:36. > :48:41.to put up the council tax? We're still in consultation
:48:42. > :48:44.so I can't commit, but I can understand the reasons why
:48:45. > :48:47.you'd have to do it. And 4% a year is going to bd
:48:48. > :48:54.a couple of hundred quid, isn't it? Theresa May talks about hard-working
:48:55. > :49:02.families not losing out but that's a weekend away or a holiday perhaps
:49:03. > :49:07.in five years' time? As Conservatives, we're keen to keep
:49:08. > :49:10.tax as low as possible, but Mark is right, the incrdase
:49:11. > :49:13.in the number of elderly who need care and support,
:49:14. > :49:16.the number of young people By 2020, we anticipate that 80%
:49:17. > :49:23.of our budget will be spent on supporting vulnerable people
:49:24. > :49:28.and that is the challenge. Few political ideas have catsed
:49:29. > :49:35.delight and derision in such equal At its heart it's about combining
:49:36. > :49:41.childcare with politics, but some believe more sinister
:49:42. > :49:45.motives are at play. Robin Markwell takes up a t`le that
:49:46. > :49:49.began in Gloucestershire. Once upon a time in the land not
:49:50. > :50:01.so far-away, there lived a lan One day the people who really
:50:02. > :50:06.liked him and wanted him to be Prime Minister
:50:07. > :50:11.held a big conference. But they found talking
:50:12. > :50:14.about politics whilst looking after their children hard
:50:15. > :50:17.so they formed a childcare group It's immediately clear wherd
:50:18. > :50:27.the founder of momentum kids lives, from the sign on the window
:50:28. > :50:33.to the banner in the front room This is apolitical household
:50:34. > :50:39.and this Stroud mum wants From asking them what poliches their
:50:40. > :50:48.teddy bear should be championing... The teddy bear has a whole list
:50:49. > :50:53.of ideas about how the teddx bear ..to word searches with
:50:54. > :50:58.a radical bent. We've got words here
:50:59. > :51:02.like equality, state, love. You don't often see that
:51:03. > :51:07.in a child's word search! But Momentum Kids, to put it mildly,
:51:08. > :51:12.has not been without its crhtics. From being lampooned on sochal media
:51:13. > :51:16.- in this case D is for desdlection They've even seized the nurseries,
:51:17. > :51:24.too, opening branches of Molentum Or my particular
:51:25. > :51:37.favourite, Tiny Trots. I don't think people are re`lly
:51:38. > :51:43.getting why we're doing this. It was about inclusion
:51:44. > :51:47.and about making our lives lore interesting and better
:51:48. > :51:49.and bringing our families There is an element
:51:50. > :51:55.of indoctrination of childrdn They are shown adverts,
:51:56. > :52:02.pink for girls in blue for boys They are constantly
:52:03. > :52:05.being marketed to. We're trying to create an atmosphere
:52:06. > :52:08.for children to be curious I'm not particularly interested
:52:09. > :52:14.in my children being mini Corbynistas because,
:52:15. > :52:17.quite frankly, in 20 years when they're out doing thei
:52:18. > :52:21.grass roots activism, The aim is to roll this out
:52:22. > :52:28.nationwide and that evening we were given a sneak previdw of how
:52:29. > :52:30.it might work. At a gym in Swindon
:52:31. > :52:33.they held a trial session, Tell me when the bad guy
:52:34. > :52:39.is about to grab you. The lesson here was
:52:40. > :52:46.about empowerment. And while inside they learn
:52:47. > :52:50.to deal with an attack... It meant the mums could go outside
:52:51. > :52:55.and talk politics with a sm`ll P. Children are a lot more savvy today
:52:56. > :52:59.with what's going on. Certainly more so than
:53:00. > :53:02.I was at that age. It's fun, challenging and vdry
:53:03. > :53:12.improving on our skills. And you get too big to mum
:53:13. > :53:20.up as well? It's trying to get kids
:53:21. > :53:26.to be more listened I'm interested in politics
:53:27. > :53:30.and I think that maybe bringing politics to children
:53:31. > :53:33.might be a bit useful. So, is this a bid to create
:53:34. > :53:43.the Corbyn street fighters of tomorrow or a movement
:53:44. > :53:46.to be applauded? Getting more youngsters
:53:47. > :53:52.to grapple with politics. Joining us now is Natasha
:53:53. > :53:56.who you saw in that film. Welcome and we saw your delhghtful
:53:57. > :53:58.children. Do they go on strike
:53:59. > :54:01.for more pocket money? It's all about bribery
:54:02. > :54:10.with kids, isn't it? Is it indoctrination or is ht common
:54:11. > :54:16.sense and fun? It's like I said in the clip just
:54:17. > :54:22.then, children are indoctrinated. We're talking about questioning
:54:23. > :54:29.curious children and whilst we ,as activists, are going out
:54:30. > :54:32.and having meetings, whether it's Labour Party
:54:33. > :54:38.meetings at seven o'clock when I want to put the kids to bed,
:54:39. > :54:41.or Momentum activism, there is a platform that's
:54:42. > :54:44.completely inclusive. Momentum is regarded
:54:45. > :54:48.as being on the left of Labour and if there were a group
:54:49. > :54:51.on the right of the Conserv`tives for young kids telling them
:54:52. > :54:55.about immigration and self-reliance and that sort of stuff,
:54:56. > :55:00.what would you say about th`t? I think to a certain extent people
:55:01. > :55:04.are missing the point with what we're trying to do
:55:05. > :55:08.because yes there are children's activities but actually
:55:09. > :55:10.the most important thing If we're talking about a group
:55:11. > :55:15.like Momentum who are opening out to so many people,
:55:16. > :55:19.20,000 members, we're talking about inclusion,
:55:20. > :55:24.equality and diversity and hn order to do that you have two provide
:55:25. > :55:35.support for everybody. As a mum what I wanted to do
:55:36. > :55:38.was start something that made it easy for people
:55:39. > :55:41.like me, actually. OK, let us bring
:55:42. > :55:43.in our other guests. You're from the group called
:55:44. > :55:46.the Parents' Union, is Do you think it's right for mums
:55:47. > :55:52.and dads to have time out and for the kids to get somd sort
:55:53. > :55:56.of political awareness? For parents, like you say,
:55:57. > :56:01.it's getting women into polhtics... I have three kids and it's
:56:02. > :56:05.been really difficult. Luckily mine are getting older
:56:06. > :56:07.but I would have thought I think there's no harm whatsoever
:56:08. > :56:14.in children being told it's fine to question the status quo
:56:15. > :56:17.and asking questions and becoming aware of issues because children
:56:18. > :56:20.are affected by politics evdry day. Do their parents have
:56:21. > :56:24.to pay for the school bus? What did they teach
:56:25. > :56:33.you at Lib Dem school? Probably from my own perspective,
:56:34. > :56:48.because I don't come from a political family,
:56:49. > :56:50.when I was a kid we went to Sunday school creche
:56:51. > :56:52.and then Sunday school. I've grown up and made
:56:53. > :56:54.my own decisions. Have you stuck with those
:56:55. > :56:57.Sunday school views? I coloured in pictures of prophets
:56:58. > :57:02.and Jesus but I certainly don't We want people to be
:57:03. > :57:10.involved in politics. I think probably the word sdarch
:57:11. > :57:13.with "Unionise" has allowed what they're trying
:57:14. > :57:18.to do to come into it. If "Capitalism" is the next word I'm
:57:19. > :57:21.sure it will be fine! Children are susceptible
:57:22. > :57:35.to a lot of things and that impression and influence coles
:57:36. > :57:39.from all manner of directions. In politics we're trying
:57:40. > :57:43.keep that balance. If nothing else, they will rebel
:57:44. > :57:47.against us horribly in later life. You might find yourself
:57:48. > :57:51.with rebellious children. We would welcome them
:57:52. > :57:53.to the fold, of course! Childhood is probably one
:57:54. > :57:58.of the least democratic timds Your parents always
:57:59. > :58:03.tell you what to do. How do you get from that to sending
:58:04. > :58:06.them out into the world as electorates, they will bd voting,
:58:07. > :58:09.to question and think about what they want
:58:10. > :58:15.in a political party? And what they can do
:58:16. > :58:17.to change the world. You don't have to worry
:58:18. > :58:21.about those things. You've got years to be concdrned
:58:22. > :58:23.with grown-up issues. You need space just to play
:58:24. > :58:27.and have fun. Actually, if you have been
:58:28. > :58:31.to our Facebook page and sedn some of the placards the children did,
:58:32. > :58:34.own their own, "Proper jobs There are already thinking
:58:35. > :58:42.about this stuff. And you take them to
:58:43. > :58:44.demonstrations as well? We would like our members
:58:45. > :58:53.to have a presence there so there is a safe place for families to come
:58:54. > :58:59.and share their feelings. We have no minimum age
:59:00. > :59:03.of membership. I see no problem with that `nd it
:59:04. > :59:18.if it helps carers... Are children naturally soci`list,
:59:19. > :59:20.do you think? I don't know if it's
:59:21. > :59:28.socialism or capitalism. I don't think it's defined
:59:29. > :59:39.as an ideology which is why if we talking about education it has
:59:40. > :59:42.to be a balanced approach I'm fully fearful that mine
:59:43. > :59:45.will rebel hard and join With news of defections and Brexit
:59:46. > :59:56.themed Christmas card here's a round-up in 60 seconds and this
:59:57. > :00:01.week it is by Robin. The Swindon Labour councillor
:00:02. > :00:03.performed a double He decided to join the Torids
:00:04. > :00:09.as he was unhappy with Jerely Corbyn and then he rejoined Labour claiming
:00:10. > :00:12.he'd made a mistake. Nick Clegg said his
:00:13. > :00:17.door was always open. He can always try the Lib Ddms
:00:18. > :00:25.and make it a hat-trick. The NHS trusts in Gloucestershire
:00:26. > :00:27.and Cheltenham was placed After months of doubt,
:00:28. > :00:33.Somerset is a 303 will be We are right to invest in pdak
:00:34. > :00:46.infrastructure like the A303. And if it ever to early to talk
:00:47. > :00:49.Christmas? We are very humorous people and it's
:00:50. > :00:55.not all doom and gloom. Campaign group Bristol for Durope
:00:56. > :00:58.has launched a range of Brexit themed Christmas cards designed
:00:59. > :01:07.to wish weaving remainders `re very And, on that festive note
:01:08. > :01:11.we must leave it for today. My thanks to all my guests
:01:12. > :01:14.were coming along to our sttdio We will be back next week,
:01:15. > :01:17.but for now letters go back go ahead with this policy, I know.
:01:18. > :01:29.And now back to Andrew. So, Brexit, airports,
:01:30. > :01:51.Calais and the chances With what Rory Stewart was saying
:01:52. > :01:54.there, it is clear that Islamic State is losing territory in Iraq
:01:55. > :02:01.now, and could come under pressure in Syria as well. It used to control
:02:02. > :02:10.a whole swathe of the coast of Libya, and is now down to a small
:02:11. > :02:13.area of Sirte in Libya. But curiously, it could make them more
:02:14. > :02:18.dangerous here if they are being driven out of the Maghreb and the
:02:19. > :02:23.Levant, they could be more dangerous here. Discuss. That was a very
:02:24. > :02:28.interesting admission from a government minister, of all people,
:02:29. > :02:35.and a well-informed one. Chasing Isis around the Middle East is
:02:36. > :02:38.about... Like chasing Al-Qaeda around Afghanistan and Pakistan You
:02:39. > :02:48.smash them somewhere, and they pop up somewhere else. He is right to
:02:49. > :02:59.warn that these guys will go somewhere. And it may well be, in
:03:00. > :03:04.Sirte, for example, across the magic oration -- across the Mediterranean
:03:05. > :03:08.into Italy. A lot of the foreign fighters in Mosul have already gone,
:03:09. > :03:16.we heard, which raises the question, to where? I think it is quite right
:03:17. > :03:21.for government ministers to warn that it might have repercussions
:03:22. > :03:26.here. We have been involved in this, with full public consent, as far as
:03:27. > :03:30.we can tell. If it doesn't happen, if there are horrors and outrages
:03:31. > :03:37.here and in the rest of Europe, that's fine. If it does happen, at
:03:38. > :03:45.least the government is prepared. We knew surprised about how categorical
:03:46. > :03:51.Nia Griffith was? She was categorical about support for the
:03:52. > :03:58.Allied action in Iraq, and categorical about Russia. So much so
:03:59. > :04:02.that perhaps written should take tougher sanctions on its own, even
:04:03. > :04:07.if it can't get the Europeans to fall in line. I found that
:04:08. > :04:12.interesting. I was surprised by that. Tom may be right that Rory
:04:13. > :04:17.said more than perhaps he was intending, but I thought that some
:04:18. > :04:22.of what she said sounded politically imprudent in the current context of
:04:23. > :04:26.the Labour Party. I'm not sure she cleared those lines with the Labour
:04:27. > :04:32.office. I'm not sure she and Jeremy are in the same place about it. I'm
:04:33. > :04:35.not sure there is that much leadership. People at the moment get
:04:36. > :04:40.out there and say what they think it's right for the party. She
:04:41. > :04:46.sounded dead right to me. Whether it is ill-advised or not, people should
:04:47. > :04:52.answer... I want to move on, because Brexit never goes away. This week we
:04:53. > :04:56.saw Hilary Benn, former Shadow Foreign Secretary. He is going to be
:04:57. > :05:00.the chair of the select committee in the Commons which will monitor the
:05:01. > :05:03.Department for Brexit. All sorts of people will be coming to give
:05:04. > :05:06.testimony and so one. Let's hear what he told Andrew Marr.
:05:07. > :05:10.I think it will be very important for the government to indicate that
:05:11. > :05:13.if it is not possible within the two years provided for by Article 5
:05:14. > :05:15.to negotiate both our withdrawal agreement and a new trading
:05:16. > :05:17.relationship, market access, including for services,
:05:18. > :05:19.80% of our economy, million jobs, in financial services,
:05:20. > :05:22.that it should tell the House of Commons that it will seek
:05:23. > :05:28.a transitional arrangement with the European Union.
:05:29. > :05:36.If the deal is not done at the end of the two-year Article 50 process,
:05:37. > :05:42.would the government go for an interim agreement, or would it fall
:05:43. > :05:47.back on WTO, World Trade Organisation, Rawls? My
:05:48. > :05:50.understanding is the article 15 negotiation doesn't specifically
:05:51. > :05:55.include what Britain's future trading relationship with the EU
:05:56. > :06:00.would be. It is perfectly possible that Article 50 could be triggered,
:06:01. > :06:05.and after two years we don't have a trade deal, but the trade deal
:06:06. > :06:16.negotiations are ongoing when we are outside the EU. But the trade deal
:06:17. > :06:18.negotiations are the most important thing. If Article 50 doesn't cover
:06:19. > :06:21.it, what is it about? Absolutely essential. The trade deal with
:06:22. > :06:29.Canada has taken nine years, and now it looks like it is fading, because
:06:30. > :06:38.of the Walloons. Just one small part of the country. If you cannot do a
:06:39. > :06:41.free-trade deal with Canada, a progressive, social Democratic
:06:42. > :06:46.Canada, who can the EU do a trade deal with? You would think it would
:06:47. > :06:49.be easy with us, because we have all of the level playing field
:06:50. > :06:55.agreements in place. You would hope it would be easier, but it may not
:06:56. > :07:00.be, because in the end, it will hinge on the single market and if we
:07:01. > :07:09.are in or out. If we are in, can we have a small break on immigration?
:07:10. > :07:11.It looks like not. What is interesting about the opinion polls
:07:12. > :07:15.is, in the last two opinion polls there was a significant change in
:07:16. > :07:20.public opinion, where people are now saying they think that actually
:07:21. > :07:24.trade, the economy, the single market is more important than
:07:25. > :07:29.immigration. If it is really true, as the observer is reporting today,
:07:30. > :07:33.that banks are on the move, and in a year's time there could be a
:07:34. > :07:38.significant collapse in the income we get from finance, the income that
:07:39. > :07:49.the Treasury gets, then public opinion might change. They may say,
:07:50. > :07:51.we don't want more immigration, but this isn't a price worth paying
:07:52. > :07:59.Everything tends to be seen through the Brexit lens at the moment.
:08:00. > :08:03.Things are not always as they seem. The Canadian- EU free trade
:08:04. > :08:08.agreement was about increasing free trade between the EU and Canada and
:08:09. > :08:12.therefore subject to the ratification of all members. Any
:08:13. > :08:17.deal we do will not give us the same access we have at the moment. The
:08:18. > :08:24.question is, how much will it be diminished? It may not be subject to
:08:25. > :08:26.the same ratification process. Absolutely right. Another
:08:27. > :08:33.unbelievably technical point that we still don't know is, if we can get
:08:34. > :08:37.this free-trade deal with the EU at the same time as our Brexit talks
:08:38. > :08:46.and deal, the divorce deal as well as the remarriage deal, then one
:08:47. > :08:54.gets signed off by QM V. The trade deal may still need all 28, all 27,
:08:55. > :09:01.including the people from the Walloons. And the MEPs. The majority
:09:02. > :09:04.of parliament. This is exactly why Theresa May would like the
:09:05. > :09:08.transitional deal to push this one deeper. I was surprised to hear
:09:09. > :09:13.Hilary Benn pushing this line this morning. The remainers have been all
:09:14. > :09:18.over the place. They wanted a vote after Article 50 had been triggered
:09:19. > :09:26.about the deal. Then they wanted a vote before Article 50. Now they are
:09:27. > :09:30.talking about a vote before article Article 50 is triggered about a
:09:31. > :09:35.trade deal. They need to make up their minds about what it is they
:09:36. > :09:41.are pushing for, and what their best hope of obstructing Brexit is, and
:09:42. > :09:46.stick with it. Something else we see through the Brexit lens, which isn't
:09:47. > :09:50.always helpful, is Calais. The French bulldozers will move in
:09:51. > :09:55.tomorrow. We will see some pretty disturbing scenes on the TV. We will
:09:56. > :09:59.see some horrible scenes. The government has handled this very
:10:00. > :10:05.badly. Having passed an amendment in April saying we would take something
:10:06. > :10:08.like 3000 children, a lot of those children have disappeared. Save the
:10:09. > :10:12.Children, one of the charities there, are very worried that people
:10:13. > :10:20.traffickers have been in there, and a lot of those children have
:10:21. > :10:24.vanished. We haven't sent social workers in. No preparations have
:10:25. > :10:31.been made what ever. You are raising an interesting point. We don't know
:10:32. > :10:35.how many we are meant to be taking. The huge argument has arisen over
:10:36. > :10:42.what the age is of some of the ones coming in. Is this another problem
:10:43. > :10:47.for the Home Office? To some extent. Didn't Theresa May 's too well to
:10:48. > :10:51.survive six weeks of this? Amber Rudd has been there for three
:10:52. > :10:55.months. It is clear that the Home Office didn't prepare for this. They
:10:56. > :11:03.didn't prepare for the age verification or when it will go It
:11:04. > :11:09.needs to be an perfect. We don't know how many we will take, because
:11:10. > :11:13.the Home Office will not say. I want to talk about airport capacity, but
:11:14. > :11:18.I won't, because I don't think we have anything to say about it until
:11:19. > :11:23.the statement on Tuesday from Transport Minister Grayling. When
:11:24. > :11:26.you look at the polls and see the decision on airport runway expansion
:11:27. > :11:31.being kicked into the long grass for a year, are we heading for an early
:11:32. > :11:36.election next year or not? I think Theresa May will do everything she
:11:37. > :11:43.can to avoid it. If there is an election before 2020, it is bound to
:11:44. > :11:46.be about Europe, and that is a much harder case for her to win than just
:11:47. > :11:51.a question of who is the best Prime Minister. She will have a tough
:11:52. > :11:56.time, because it will be a general election about in or out of the
:11:57. > :12:01.single market. Half of her party will peel away. How do she conduct a
:12:02. > :12:06.general election when the likes of Anna Soubry will not stand on the
:12:07. > :12:16.same platform? It will be difficult. But she may reach such a stalemate
:12:17. > :12:19.that she just calls one. No general election next year because it will
:12:20. > :12:23.split the Tory party. There will be won in 2019 when she cannot get
:12:24. > :12:27.Brexit through the House of Commons. You really can have too much of a
:12:28. > :12:32.good thing. I just want to show a little clip of the former Shadow
:12:33. > :12:36.Chancellor, Ed Balls, from Strictly last night. Let's just watch this.
:12:37. > :12:48.There he is. Where is the hand? That is the
:12:49. > :12:56.worrying bit! We will no longer be saying that Ed Balls is a safe pair
:12:57. > :13:00.of hands! Can we agree on that? Remarkable that he was once the man
:13:01. > :13:08.most feared by David Cameron! Labour leader 2021. He has hit popular
:13:09. > :13:14.culture in the way that many few politicians do. Charm, gusto,
:13:15. > :13:21.bravery, no worries about being embarrassed. All the things that you
:13:22. > :13:24.don't like about being a politician. We have run out of time. You can get
:13:25. > :13:27.it on social media. Jo Coburn will be back
:13:28. > :13:29.with the Daily Politics tomorrow And I'll be back here next
:13:30. > :13:33.Sunday at the same time. Remember if it's Sunday,
:13:34. > :14:06.it's the Sunday Politics. Everyone's living these
:14:07. > :14:09.amazing lives, You're like a...
:14:10. > :14:19.Different person? Delve deeper.
:14:20. > :14:29.Ordinary Lives continues... They have something on me
:14:30. > :14:30.that I can actually remember. They have something on me
:14:31. > :14:34.that I can actually remember. The final chapter between
:14:35. > :14:39.Gibson and Spector.