:01:38. > :01:42.State with us for the North The Sunday Politics when we ask whether
:01:42. > :01:52.your money should subsidise their offshore wind industry with an --
:01:52. > :01:52.
:01:52. > :35:13.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2001 seconds
:35:13. > :35:19.You are watching The Sunday Politics for Yorkshire,
:35:19. > :35:23.Lincolnshire and the North Midlands. Coming up before 12 o'clock: we are
:35:23. > :35:28.asking whether your money should subsidise the offshore wind
:35:28. > :35:33.industry with evidence of coalition discussion over the cost of green
:35:33. > :35:36.energy. We will also be asking whether the
:35:36. > :35:40.current Sunday trading laws at outdated in our 24-hour consumer
:35:40. > :35:47.society. At yesterday at David Ward, Craig
:35:47. > :35:52.Whitaker, and another at Hull studio is Karl Turner they it
:35:52. > :35:57.Labour MP for Hull East. Party conference season is under
:35:57. > :36:00.way this week with the Lib Dems are gathering on the South coast. Your
:36:00. > :36:06.party's ratings are still not great, what will be the mood of the
:36:06. > :36:10.delegates there? I think the mood will be one of grim determination
:36:10. > :36:17.to battle on. We are halfway through Parliament and we have done
:36:17. > :36:23.many of the things which were necessary but unpalatable and it is
:36:23. > :36:29.really know about delivering that implementation of those things. At
:36:29. > :36:35.the end of the day, it will all depend on the economy and believe.
:36:35. > :36:41.Is the gap wider than ever? No I do not think it is. As has been said,
:36:41. > :36:43.that task has been huge. I do not think any Government in recent
:36:43. > :36:49.modern history have had to deal with what this coalition Government
:36:49. > :36:52.has had to deal with. With the odd tension week there and about, the
:36:53. > :37:00.two parties will work together closely to make sure that the
:37:00. > :37:04.programme is delivered and begins to show signs of delivery. Karl
:37:04. > :37:09.Turner, can you afford to be nasty to the Lib Dems? You might need
:37:09. > :37:16.them for the next Government. is a fair argument. But the truth
:37:16. > :37:19.is, the coalition is in complete disarray. You can see them in
:37:19. > :37:23.Parliament arguing between themselves. Not just outside of the
:37:23. > :37:26.chamber but inside of the chamber also. They came into Government as
:37:26. > :37:30.a coalition on the basis that they would work together for the good of
:37:30. > :37:35.the country and clearly that is not happening. The economy is failing
:37:35. > :37:38.and quite frankly, they are in disarray. It is going to be an
:37:38. > :37:43.interesting party conference season. We will talk more later, first of
:37:43. > :37:48.all we will get energy. We are told there is a jobs bonanza flowing in
:37:48. > :37:52.from the North Sea. Engineering companies are queuing up to build
:37:52. > :37:56.and assemble a new generation of wind turbines to be situated off
:37:56. > :38:01.the East coast. But to pay for them it will mean big public subsidies
:38:01. > :38:06.which would add an estimated �25 on to every household electricity bill.
:38:06. > :38:16.Many industry figures feel that the Government is not fully committed
:38:16. > :38:18.
:38:18. > :38:22.to the green energy revolution. Len For centuries the River Humber has
:38:23. > :38:28.brought waves of industry and jobs to its banks. That could be about
:38:28. > :38:33.to happen again here. This is a side with water on one side and
:38:33. > :38:37.fast access to rail and road on the other. It also happens to be the
:38:37. > :38:43.biggest single piece of industrial development land in the country.
:38:43. > :38:46.That is the River Humber over there. The factories would be built on
:38:46. > :38:50.this land then they would assemble those giant wind turbines which
:38:50. > :38:53.would be put straight on to ships to be installed in the North Sea.
:38:53. > :39:01.Everything would be ready to go but they would just be one thing
:39:01. > :39:06.missing, compensation. developers need to know exactly
:39:06. > :39:09.what they would get once they provide the infrastructure and
:39:09. > :39:11.putting their elegist a back into the crowd. By keeping the
:39:11. > :39:17.Government has been so slow in being able to say to the industry
:39:17. > :39:25.that this is what sort of level of return you will get? A thing that
:39:25. > :39:28.is a question for the policy makers. 80 miles inland business leaders
:39:28. > :39:32.are gathered at this conference in Sheffield and they want an answer
:39:32. > :39:37.to that question also. They are ready to join a supply chain
:39:37. > :39:40.creating thousands of jobs. But without Government agreement on
:39:40. > :39:45.subsidising the elegists D eventually greeted the believe it
:39:45. > :39:48.is in jeopardy. How could the Government get their
:39:48. > :39:58.act together and get the full backing behind this industry before
:39:58. > :39:58.
:39:58. > :40:02.all these plans fall apart? We have seen presentations today from the
:40:02. > :40:09.likes of different energy companies investing money already and there
:40:09. > :40:14.has been big investment already. They have been investing here too.
:40:14. > :40:17.This manufacturer is already making huge steel access letters --
:40:17. > :40:23.ladders for the wind turbines. Customers are mostly in Germany at
:40:23. > :40:28.the moment but they need the orders from the UK it wind farms off of
:40:28. > :40:34.the Humber. We're already created something in the region of 15 extra
:40:34. > :40:38.jobs. When the market starts to take off the projections in the
:40:38. > :40:45.future and that that figure could be two or three or four or five as
:40:45. > :40:49.many jobs. As a long-term jobs. Government's recent reshuffle has
:40:49. > :40:52.dented the fledgling industries confidence and the new energy
:40:52. > :40:56.minister has walked through the doors of Number Ten and announced
:40:56. > :41:02.yet more consultations this week before deciding how he would next
:41:02. > :41:08.nuclear, gas and wind power. We do not want to only subsidise one
:41:08. > :41:14.technology. We call for evidence from all the proponents and their
:41:14. > :41:18.opponents. It is an open court. Renewals are very much part of our
:41:18. > :41:22.structure and there is no doubt about that. It has to be in the
:41:22. > :41:27.right places. Wind power in the right places with community
:41:27. > :41:31.engagement and community benefit can work there is no doubt about it.
:41:31. > :41:36.With ministers in one department against wind and now with John
:41:36. > :41:40.Hayes we have a minister with in their department who is also is
:41:40. > :41:46.rather equivocal to say the least about the opportunities that wind
:41:46. > :41:50.turbines provide an this is bad news. That leaves business stuck in
:41:50. > :42:00.the middle. Investing and gearing up for an offshore industry that
:42:00. > :42:03.
:42:03. > :42:07.could be blown away before it even Craig Whitaker you were one of
:42:07. > :42:10.their it Tory MPs calling for the subsidies to onshore wind farms.
:42:10. > :42:15.What about offshore wind? Is this something that the Government
:42:15. > :42:20.should do more about to make sure that the jobs come to a region?
:42:20. > :42:24.is a really fine banner -- balance but I think the cost at the moment
:42:24. > :42:28.for tax payers is far too high. There are other ways of alternative
:42:28. > :42:32.energy that does not need as much subsidy that we can deliver the
:42:32. > :42:35.things that the Government is to deliver. It is a fine line. I would
:42:35. > :42:39.personally like to see a much bigger reduction in subsidies to
:42:39. > :42:44.those that were on onshore a rather than offshore. But it is something
:42:44. > :42:49.that the Government needs to listen to and take heed. To people and
:42:49. > :42:55.communities are up in arms about wind turbines being put up next to
:42:55. > :42:59.their properties. This morning in my surgeries I spoke to 2 back
:42:59. > :43:03.ladies who were incandescent about the local farmer wanting to develop
:43:03. > :43:08.wind turbines. It was all about the subsidies and for me we need to get
:43:08. > :43:14.it right. Is there a certain amount in frustration, David Ward, and the
:43:14. > :43:20.Lib Dems about this Tories scepticism about wind-power? There
:43:20. > :43:23.is an we must not mess about on this one. This is not just of local
:43:23. > :43:28.interest it is of national interest lies. It is not just about the
:43:28. > :43:31.green agenda it is about our manufacturing base here. We are
:43:31. > :43:37.world leaders in this area and we will lose that position unless we
:43:37. > :43:40.fully go for this absolutely full pelt. Asked the lady said, it is
:43:40. > :43:44.bad news. If there was a Lib Dem reading on this a thing most people
:43:44. > :43:48.would accept that it would be a green agenda and I am worried about
:43:48. > :43:53.John Hayes, wonderful in his previous role, but using the wrong
:43:53. > :43:57.place for this I believed. offshore wind industry, Karl Turner,
:43:57. > :44:01.is going to give boosts to jobs in your constituency but it will cost
:44:01. > :44:04.money in the form of subsidies and it is ordinary households are or
:44:04. > :44:08.have to pay, do think people struggling at the moment are
:44:08. > :44:12.willing to pay more run their energy bills? I am not sure about
:44:12. > :44:18.that but what I am sure about is the advantages to the economy. That
:44:18. > :44:23.is the point that the Government seemed to miss. The Lib Dems are
:44:23. > :44:29.absolutely right, we have to get behind this. This will create many
:44:29. > :44:33.hundreds and thousands of jobs in the economy. There is the
:44:33. > :44:38.renewables issue but also the economic advantages to this going
:44:38. > :44:43.ahead. We're getting mixed messages from Government. The Government's
:44:43. > :44:47.message on the one hand are people like the Tories signing open letter
:44:47. > :44:51.is in some parts speaking against onshore wind which is very
:44:51. > :44:55.different after except from offshore wind, but that does not
:44:55. > :45:00.encourage their industry. Investors are looking for up investment in
:45:00. > :45:02.hundreds of millions of pounds and the need confidence for up -- from
:45:02. > :45:08.the Government be in order to be able to make that investment
:45:09. > :45:11.themselves. Lib Dems are telling their conference that there would
:45:11. > :45:17.be the greenest Government ever, but we have to see the reality of
:45:17. > :45:22.that. The Government now need to walk the top. Mixed messages from
:45:22. > :45:26.the Government? No I do not think so. It is about as these investors
:45:26. > :45:29.and these people wanting to build factories been confident enough to
:45:29. > :45:34.do it themselves and not necessarily take it from taxpayers'
:45:34. > :45:40.money. If there that confident than they need to get on and do it. They
:45:40. > :45:43.are not needing to rely on every man and child in this country is
:45:43. > :45:47.having to subsidise and pay the price for what they want to do.
:45:47. > :45:52.Karl Turner, is that a fair point? If this is going to be such a boom
:45:52. > :45:56.industry were not the City boys paying for it? There is no doubt
:45:56. > :46:02.about this issue. I am not going to argue about the advantages to the
:46:02. > :46:06.economy as a whole. The 7,000 extra jobs just to be average as a city.
:46:06. > :46:11.We are desperate for this investment. You say it is not mixed
:46:11. > :46:15.messages, we now have a minister who is a climate change denier in
:46:16. > :46:20.John Hayes. It could not be any worse than that. We need confidence
:46:20. > :46:24.from the Government to the industry. The money to get on with it and
:46:25. > :46:30.plan ahead. It strikes to the heart over whether we have an active
:46:30. > :46:33.industrial strategy at all. We cannot sit back... This is not
:46:33. > :46:38.about supporting lame-duck businesses as it was in the past,
:46:38. > :46:46.this is world-leading technology which we need to be supporting.
:46:46. > :46:50.You're absolutely right on that point. This is a big industry. It
:46:50. > :46:53.is absolutely right. We will come back to this debate many more times
:46:54. > :46:57.no future am sure but we have to leave it there for now.
:46:57. > :47:04.The also asking whether Sunday should remain our traditional the
:47:04. > :47:08.of rest or becoming a shopping free-for-all. Many at calling for
:47:08. > :47:12.the current Sunday trading laws to be scrapped in a bid to boost the
:47:12. > :47:14.economy. Opening hours were extended during the Olympics and
:47:14. > :47:23.Paralympics and many believe those restrictions should be lifted
:47:24. > :47:28.Over the past few weeks shoppers in London have been taking advantage
:47:29. > :47:34.of longer opening hours on Sundays. It is all thanks to a temporary
:47:34. > :47:38.change in the law to coincide with the Olympics and Paralympics.
:47:38. > :47:43.tend to shop on a Sunday because it is more convenient for my life. It
:47:43. > :47:46.fits in better with working and children. A enjoy shopping on a
:47:46. > :47:52.Sunday because to go to church and then come out and go around and
:47:52. > :47:57.shop, gets into Eton see the shops open, especially shut supermarkets
:47:57. > :48:01.and things like that is good. current Sunday trading laws allowed
:48:01. > :48:07.big high-street stores and supermarkets and garden centres to
:48:07. > :48:11.open for a limited period of six hours. But is there any real
:48:11. > :48:20.appetite for a permanent change in the law to allow it all-day Sunday
:48:20. > :48:26.People are working all sort of hours and Sunday is an opportunity
:48:26. > :48:31.to do their shopping and yes, it does give an appetite to extend the
:48:31. > :48:34.service and the business would be there for it. They have to look for
:48:34. > :48:39.every opportunity for businesses. If it is an opportunity to make
:48:39. > :48:47.money then they have to look at it. Every opportunity has to be looked
:48:47. > :48:53.at and validated. In a recent survey 45% of shoppers said they
:48:53. > :48:59.supported extended opening hours on a Sunday. 16% opposed all it Shun -
:48:59. > :49:05.- Sunday shopping. But moves to extend Sunday trading hours on a
:49:05. > :49:11.permanent basis are up opposed by church leaders, many MPs and the
:49:11. > :49:16.shop workers' union. Some retailers are also not convinced. Nick Brown
:49:16. > :49:21.runs for department stores in York, Helmsley, Beverley and Gainsborough.
:49:21. > :49:25.I really passionately believe that six hours enough -- is enough on a
:49:25. > :49:30.Sunday. It is a special day and I think that society wants to have a
:49:30. > :49:33.different feel to that day. We have six days of full shopping and six
:49:33. > :49:39.hours on a Sunday is the right balance and we will be pushing for
:49:39. > :49:43.it that had to keep it that way. The Government is currently looking
:49:43. > :49:46.at the economic arguments of extended opening hours. But it
:49:46. > :49:56.seems opinion is divided over whether it that tell should ring
:49:56. > :49:59.
:49:59. > :50:04.Craig Whitaker, do we need Sunday shopping all day? Absolutely not,
:50:04. > :50:07.and an ex retailer of 30 years' experience and I disagree with that.
:50:08. > :50:11.I remember when Sunday trading first came in and I felt it was a
:50:12. > :50:15.huge step back in society and people not having time for their
:50:15. > :50:19.families. Shopworkers when this first came and they got loaded
:50:19. > :50:23.extra penalty rates for a Sunday. They can opt out to not work on
:50:23. > :50:27.Sundays if they wish. I was with retailers who were saying that the
:50:27. > :50:32.new contracts do not give the opt- out option for them workers. Not
:50:32. > :50:35.only that, the workers because it is only a short working day, have
:50:35. > :50:39.to make up their hours during the week. One of the other day's
:50:39. > :50:43.becomes a longer working day. I think it is a disaster and a thing
:50:43. > :50:47.we should go back to not trading on a Sunday. Labour always complain
:50:47. > :50:52.there is no growth strategy, this would keep people in the shops,
:50:52. > :50:56.wouldn't it? What is wrong with extended Sunday opening? In it
:50:56. > :50:59.would have there was evidence to support it. I do not think there is.
:50:59. > :51:03.If there is economic evidence to show that there is an advantage in
:51:03. > :51:09.the economy and I might be tempted -- tempted to support it but that
:51:09. > :51:12.is not the situation here. It is absolutely not the possession. They
:51:12. > :51:18.are stable said initially that this was not going to be a pilot for the
:51:18. > :51:22.real thing. He has gone back on his word on that. Some people are
:51:22. > :51:28.annoyed about it. People who work on a Sunday already do not want to
:51:28. > :51:32.have to be forced by their own financial positions to work extra
:51:32. > :51:38.hours. I am absolutely opposed to this idea. I certainly will not
:51:38. > :51:45.support it. David Ward, the internet is not closed on the
:51:45. > :51:49.Sunday why not see this opt-out as part of the ghost town? You go and
:51:49. > :51:53.get your Sunday paper is in your hat roast beef in Yorkshire at
:51:53. > :51:59.bidding for dinner and you listen to the radio. You sound like John
:51:59. > :52:04.Major now. Come on, the world has moved on now. There is an issue of
:52:04. > :52:06.protection of workers and we all understand that but the world is
:52:07. > :52:10.different my Sunday is different. Yes and meet my family and watch
:52:11. > :52:15.some football and have the grand children over and take them out. It
:52:15. > :52:19.is a different day because I choose to make a different for me. It is
:52:19. > :52:23.up to people how they want to spend their Sundays. If they want to shop,
:52:23. > :52:29.let them shop. The Tories seem to be leading on this with Eric
:52:29. > :52:32.Pickles and other senior Cabinet ministers. But you're not. So I do
:52:32. > :52:35.not think the whole Government do. On this issue I have always been
:52:35. > :52:39.against Sunday trading, not because I am incredibly religious or
:52:39. > :52:43.anything like that, I just think it is the one day in everybody's busy
:52:43. > :52:48.lives but people can choose to have family life together and I think
:52:48. > :52:58.that is incredibly important. us get more of the week's political
:52:58. > :53:01.
:53:01. > :53:04.using a part of the world here is Seconds.
:53:04. > :53:10.More Yorkshire soldiers killed in Afghanistan which is opening up the
:53:10. > :53:13.debate over by a drop -- troops are still there. I think it would be
:53:13. > :53:21.disrespectful to those who have paid the ultimate sacrifice to cut
:53:21. > :53:26.and run. There are new calls to save the heart surgery unit for
:53:26. > :53:30.children in York. The councillors are behind us and there it needs to
:53:30. > :53:36.be a compromise. And Annick Greggs Liberal-Democrats
:53:36. > :53:41.heading for the Brighton tomorrow with at song in their heart? --
:53:41. > :53:45.Nick Clegg. Or will his recent apology prove more up popular than
:53:45. > :53:55.he is. I am sure there are some people for whom this will never be
:53:55. > :54:04.
:54:04. > :54:07.enough. Have you downloaded that song?
:54:07. > :54:12.is fantastic. I do not know who did it but to do so quickly is
:54:12. > :54:18.absolutely fantastic and it is done so well. A complimentary ever did
:54:18. > :54:22.it. Was he right to say sorry? proportion of people who voted
:54:22. > :54:26.Labour or Tory has gone down over the last 60 years and there are
:54:26. > :54:29.likely to get coalitions. What we're learning is not to make
:54:29. > :54:37.pledges because you do not know what is going to happen after the
:54:37. > :54:40.election. It was foolish. It is easy to stick the knife into Nick
:54:40. > :54:46.Clegg, Karl Turner, but all politicians break promises at some
:54:46. > :54:51.stage, don't they? A do not think on that scale. What he pledged to
:54:51. > :54:57.do was to vote against any increase whatsoever of tuition fees and we
:54:57. > :55:01.have seen than trebled. What a sorry mean? What I have said on
:55:01. > :55:07.Twitter is what the Deputy Prime Minister should have been
:55:07. > :55:11.apologising for his helping the Tories to privatise the NHS. 49% of
:55:11. > :55:16.the NHS is effectively going to be private as a result of the Liberal
:55:16. > :55:20.Democrats supporting the Tory MPs in Parliament. That is what he
:55:20. > :55:25.should beat saying sorry for. that is just coalition politics,
:55:25. > :55:29.you might need to play that game at some point when you? I am on record
:55:29. > :55:32.saying that I would not be very happy at all with getting into bed
:55:33. > :55:37.with the Liberal Democrats. Adding the way they have treated their
:55:37. > :55:40.electorate, or those that have voted for the Liberal Democrats, in
:55:40. > :55:45.the 2.5 years that the coalition have been an existent, they have
:55:45. > :55:49.been appalled. What I have said to my colleagues in the Labour Party,
:55:49. > :55:54.indeed, when given the opportunity to my leader, I am not keen on
:55:54. > :56:00.being in a collision with the Lib Dems.. But let us see what happens
:56:00. > :56:03.at the election. It might be a situation where we have to talk to
:56:03. > :56:07.other political parties. It would never happen that we would talk to
:56:07. > :56:11.the Tories of course, I am not in favour but the old, I am opposed it
:56:12. > :56:16.because they have behaved dreadfully. Craig Whitaker, will
:56:16. > :56:21.you see more at politicians apologise now? But they are trying
:56:21. > :56:25.to correct the mistakes of their past? I just wonder whether at the
:56:25. > :56:34.Labour Party will apologise for the mess that Labour left their country
:56:34. > :56:39.and and the mess that it wasn't that endured for the last few years.
:56:39. > :56:45.That is a rich coming from Craig Whitaker. A beer in the first
:56:45. > :56:50.double decision for 37 years, at the time of the last general
:56:50. > :56:54.election the economy was growing. We're now in a double-dip recession.
:56:54. > :57:00.People in my constituency are losing their jobs and losing their
:57:00. > :57:04.homes as a result of a double-dip recession which was made in Downing
:57:04. > :57:09.Street. I have nothing to apologise on behalf of my colleagues who were
:57:09. > :57:13.in the previous Government. So does not matter that we have a 1.6
:57:13. > :57:17.trillion pound debt. That is not us that our generation but for the
:57:17. > :57:23.rest of our children's generation has to pay off. But do not worry
:57:23. > :57:28.about that, Karl Turner, because that does not matter when
:57:28. > :57:33.Government overspending contributed to that. You talk about Nick Clegg
:57:33. > :57:38.making an apology and the size of the issue, but that is nothing in
:57:38. > :57:45.comparison to what Auden ground and dead. The deficit is just as
:57:45. > :57:51.important to the Labour Party as it is to any other political party.
:57:51. > :57:57.-- Gordon Brown. If borrowing is actually going up
:57:57. > :58:00.not coming down. I do not think the word sorry is going to be mentioned