:00:37. > :00:40.It's Sunday morning and this is the Sunday Politics.
:00:41. > :00:43.Theresa May unveils plans to build many more affordable homes
:00:44. > :00:46.in England, but with no price tag, timetable or building targets -
:00:47. > :00:53.Labour takes aim at the City with what it calls a Robin Hood Tax
:00:54. > :00:55.to fund public services, but will traders just
:00:56. > :00:59.Don't look at the polls - Jeremy Corbyn, at least,
:01:00. > :01:01.insists he can win this election - so which way will
:01:02. > :01:06.We'll hear from a focus group in Leeds.
:01:07. > :01:10.On the Sunday Politics in Yorkshire and Lincolnshire:
:01:11. > :01:12.The EU migrants watching our election campaign very closely.
:01:13. > :01:16.What do they think about the debate surrounding immigration?
:01:17. > :01:25.saying about tackling the air pollution problem in London.
:01:26. > :01:28.And with me, our own scientifically selected focus group
:01:29. > :01:30.of political pundits - they're not so much
:01:31. > :01:32.undecided as clueless - Tom Newton Dunn, Isabel Oakeshott
:01:33. > :01:40.They'll be tweeting throughout the programme.
:01:41. > :01:42.So, we've got two new policies this morning.
:01:43. > :01:44.Labour say they will introduce a financial transaction tax
:01:45. > :01:46.if they win the general election and what they're calling
:01:47. > :01:49."the biggest crackdown on tax avoidance in the country's history".
:01:50. > :01:51.The Conservatives say they'll work with local authorities in England
:01:52. > :01:53.to build council houses with the right to buy.
:01:54. > :01:56.Theresa May says the policy "will help thousands of people
:01:57. > :02:03.get on the first rung of the housing ladder".
:02:04. > :02:11.Steve, what do you make of them? I have been conditioned after doing
:02:12. > :02:15.tax and spend debates in pre-election periods for many
:02:16. > :02:20.decades to treat policy is not as literal but as arguments. In other
:02:21. > :02:24.words if you look back to 2015 the Tory plan to wipe out the deficit
:02:25. > :02:28.was never going to happen and yet it framed and large event. In that
:02:29. > :02:32.sense the Robin Hood tax is a sensible move for Labour to make at
:02:33. > :02:37.this point because it is part of a narrative of reconfiguring taxation
:02:38. > :02:43.to be fair. Treating it as an argument rather than something that
:02:44. > :02:46.would happen in day one of Labour government is sensible. In terms of
:02:47. > :02:49.building houses Theresa May said right from the beginning when she
:02:50. > :02:53.was in Number Ten that there is a housing deficit in this country
:02:54. > :02:58.rather than the economic deficit George Osborne was focusing on, and
:02:59. > :03:01.this is an example of trying to get house-building going. It seems
:03:02. > :03:05.entirely sensible, not sure how it works with right to buy but again as
:03:06. > :03:14.framing of a 90 minute it makes sense. I disagree with Steve on one
:03:15. > :03:19.front which is how sensible Theresa May's policy is on the housing
:03:20. > :03:22.announcement. I think more broadly these two announcements have
:03:23. > :03:28.something in common which is that over the next 24 hours both will
:03:29. > :03:32.probably unravel in different ways. Ye of little faith! The Mayor of
:03:33. > :03:37.London has already said he doesn't agree with this, and when people see
:03:38. > :03:43.the actual impact of what looks like a populist tax will very potentially
:03:44. > :03:48.affect people's pensions, it might become a lot less popular. On the
:03:49. > :03:53.Tory housing plans, I think it is difficult to imagine how they are
:03:54. > :03:58.going to implement this huge, what looks like a huge land and property
:03:59. > :04:02.grab. Through compulsory purchase orders, which are not a simple
:04:03. > :04:06.instrument. They say they will change the law but really the idea
:04:07. > :04:10.of paying people below the market value for their assets is not
:04:11. > :04:17.something I can see sitting easily with Tory backbenchers or the Tories
:04:18. > :04:21.in the House of Lords. Tom. Both would appear superficially to be
:04:22. > :04:28.appealing to traditional left and traditional right bases. What is
:04:29. > :04:35.more Tory than right to buy, then councils sell on these houses, and
:04:36. > :04:40.Labour slapping a massive tax on the city. The Tories' plan, I would say
:04:41. > :04:44.look a bit deeper and all of the Tory narrative from the last six
:04:45. > :04:48.years which hasn't worked well is talking about the private sector
:04:49. > :04:54.increasing supply in the market. Now Mrs May is talking about the role
:04:55. > :04:59.for the state after all so this is the shift creeping in. On the Labour
:05:00. > :05:06.transaction tax, one of the most interesting things I heard in days
:05:07. > :05:10.was from Paul Mason, former BBC correspondent, now a cog in Easter
:05:11. > :05:15.extreme. On Newsnight he said don't worry about whether the Labour
:05:16. > :05:19.manifesto will add up, I'm promising it will, the bigger Tory attack line
:05:20. > :05:28.should be what on earth will be the macroeconomic effect of taking so
:05:29. > :05:29.much tax out of the system. Very well, we shall see. At least we have
:05:30. > :05:31.some policies to talk about. Now, on Tuesday Labour
:05:32. > :05:34.will launch its manifesto. But we've already got a pretty good
:05:35. > :05:36.idea of what's in it - that's because most of its contents
:05:37. > :05:39.were leaked to the media Labour has a variety of spending
:05:40. > :05:48.pledges including an extra ?6 billion a year for the NHS,
:05:49. > :05:51.an additional ?8 billion for social care over the lifetime
:05:52. > :05:53.of the next parliament, as well as a ?250 billion
:05:54. > :05:55.in infrastructure over The party will support the renewal
:05:56. > :06:02.of the Trident submarine system, although any Prime Minister should
:06:03. > :06:04.be extremely cautious about its use, and the party
:06:05. > :06:07.will hold a strategic defence and security review immediately
:06:08. > :06:09.after the election. In terms of immigration,
:06:10. > :06:12.Labour will seek "reasonable management of migration",
:06:13. > :06:14.but it will not make "false Elsewhere, university tuition
:06:15. > :06:20.fees will be abolished, and the public sector pay cap,
:06:21. > :06:23.which limits pay rises for public sector workers
:06:24. > :06:27.to 1%, will be scrapped. The party also aims to renationalise
:06:28. > :06:29.the railways, the Royal Mail and the National Grid,
:06:30. > :06:36.as well as creating at least one A senior Labour backbencher
:06:37. > :06:42.described it to the Sunday Politics as a manifesto for a leadership
:06:43. > :06:44.who don't "give a toss about the wider public",
:06:45. > :06:47.and several other Labour candidates told us they thought it
:06:48. > :06:48.had been deliberately leaked by the leadership,
:06:49. > :06:52.with one suggesting the leak was intended to "bounce
:06:53. > :06:55.the National Executive" And we're joined now from Salford
:06:56. > :07:04.by the Shadow Business Secretary, Welcome to the programme. The draft
:07:05. > :07:10.manifesto proposed to renationalise the number of industry. You will
:07:11. > :07:13.wait for the franchises to run out rather than buy them out at the
:07:14. > :07:19.moment so can you confirm the railways will not be wholly
:07:20. > :07:24.nationalised until 2030, after three Labour governments, and Jeremy
:07:25. > :07:28.Corbyn will be 80? I'm not going to comment on leaks, you will just have
:07:29. > :07:35.to be patient and wait to see what is in our manifesto. But you have
:07:36. > :07:39.already announced you will nationalise the railways, so tell me
:07:40. > :07:43.about it. We have discussed taking the franchises into public ownership
:07:44. > :07:48.as they expire, however the detail will be set out in the manifesto so
:07:49. > :07:53.I'm not prepared to go into detail until that policy is formally laid
:07:54. > :07:59.out on Tuesday. That doesn't sound very hopeful but let's carry on. You
:08:00. > :08:04.will also nationalise the National Grid, it has a market capitalisation
:08:05. > :08:08.of ?40 billion, why do you want to nationalise that? Again, I'm not
:08:09. > :08:13.going to speculate on leaks, you will just have to be patient. But
:08:14. > :08:19.you said you will nationalise the National Grid so tell's Y. The leaks
:08:20. > :08:24.have suggested but you will just have to wait and see what the final
:08:25. > :08:29.manifesto states on that one. So is it a waste of time me asking you how
:08:30. > :08:34.you will pay for something that costs 40 billion? Be patient, just
:08:35. > :08:39.couple of days to go, but what I would say is there is growing
:08:40. > :08:43.pressure from the public to reform the utilities sector. The
:08:44. > :08:48.Competition and Markets Authority stated in 2015 that bill payers were
:08:49. > :08:51.paying over till debt -- ?2 billion in excess of what they should be
:08:52. > :08:58.paying so there is a clear need for reform. The bills we get are from
:08:59. > :09:00.the energy companies, you are not going to nationalise them, you are
:09:01. > :09:06.going to nationalise the distribution company and I wondered
:09:07. > :09:10.what is the case for nationalising the distribution company? As I said,
:09:11. > :09:15.our full plans will be set out on Tuesday. In relation to the big six
:09:16. > :09:22.energy companies, we know in recent years they have been overcharging
:09:23. > :09:26.customers... There's no point in answering questions I am not asking.
:09:27. > :09:31.I am asking what is the case for nationalising the National Grid?
:09:32. > :09:35.There is a case for reforming the energy sector as a whole and that
:09:36. > :09:39.looks at the activities of the big six companies and it will look at
:09:40. > :09:45.other aspects too. You will have to be patient and wait until Tuesday.
:09:46. > :09:52.What about the Royal Mail? Again, you will have to wait until Tuesday.
:09:53. > :09:56.Why can't you just be honest with the British voter? We know you are
:09:57. > :10:04.going to do this and you have a duty to explain. I'm not even arguing
:10:05. > :10:09.whether it is right or wrong. The Royal Mail was sold off and we know
:10:10. > :10:13.it was sold under value and British taxpayers have a reason to feel
:10:14. > :10:16.aggrieved about that. There is a long-term strategy that would ensure
:10:17. > :10:20.the Royal Mail was classified as a key piece of infrastructure but the
:10:21. > :10:25.details of that will be set out in our manifesto because we want to
:10:26. > :10:28.ensure businesses and households ensure the best quality of service
:10:29. > :10:35.when it comes to their postal providers. You plan to borrow an
:10:36. > :10:39.extra 25 billion per year, John McDonnell has already announced
:10:40. > :10:43.this, on public investment, on top of the around 50 billion already
:10:44. > :10:48.being planned for investment. You will borrow it all so that means, if
:10:49. > :10:57.you can confirm, that many years after the crash by 2021, Labour
:10:58. > :11:04.government would still be borrowing 75 billion a year. Is that correct?
:11:05. > :11:09.We have set out ?250 billion of capital investment, and ?250 billion
:11:10. > :11:13.for a national investment bank. Our financial and fiscal rules dictate
:11:14. > :11:16.we will leave the Government in a state of less debt than we found it
:11:17. > :11:23.at the start of the parliament so we won't increase the national debt at
:11:24. > :11:27.the end of our Parliamentary term. How can you do that if by 2021 you
:11:28. > :11:33.will still be borrowing around 75 billion a year, which is more than
:11:34. > :11:37.we borrow at the moment? The 500 billion figure is set out over a
:11:38. > :11:41.period of ten years, it's a figure that has been suggested by Peter
:11:42. > :11:46.Helm from Oxford University as a figure that is necessary to bring us
:11:47. > :11:51.in line with other industrial competitors. Similar figures have
:11:52. > :11:58.been suggested by groups such as the CBI. By the way I have not included
:11:59. > :12:02.all 500 billion, just the 250 billion on public spending, not the
:12:03. > :12:06.extra money. You talk about the fiscal rules. The draft manifesto
:12:07. > :12:10.said you will leave debt as a proportion of trend GDP law at the
:12:11. > :12:17.end of each parliament, you have just said a version of that. What is
:12:18. > :12:21.trend GDP? In clear terms we will ensure the debt we acquire will be
:12:22. > :12:25.reduced by the end of the parliament. We won't leave the
:12:26. > :12:34.Government finances in a worse state than we found them. OK, but what is
:12:35. > :12:38.trend GDP? Our rule is we will ensure public sector net debt is
:12:39. > :12:43.less than we found it when we came to power in Government on June the
:12:44. > :12:49.8th. But that is not what your draft manifesto says. I'm not going to
:12:50. > :12:53.comment on leaks, you are just going to have to wait until Tuesday to
:12:54. > :12:59.look at the fine detail and perhaps we will have another chat then. You
:13:00. > :13:02.have published your plans for corporation tax and you will
:13:03. > :13:06.increase it by a third and your predictions assumed that will get an
:13:07. > :13:12.extra 20 billion a year by the end of the parliament. But that assumes
:13:13. > :13:16.the companies don't change their behaviour, that they move money
:13:17. > :13:22.around, they leave the country or they generate smaller profits. Is
:13:23. > :13:25.that realistic? You are right to make that point and you will see
:13:26. > :13:29.when we set out our policies and costings in the manifesto that we
:13:30. > :13:34.haven't spent all of the tax take. We have allowed for different
:13:35. > :13:38.differentials and potential changes in market activity because that
:13:39. > :13:45.would be approved and direction to take. But corporation tax is allowed
:13:46. > :13:50.to be cut in France and the United States, it's only 12.5% in Dublin.
:13:51. > :13:53.Many companies based in Britain are already wondering whether they
:13:54. > :13:58.should relocate because of Brexit, if you increase this tax by a third
:13:59. > :14:03.couldn't that clinch it for a number of them? No, we will still be one of
:14:04. > :14:08.the lowest corporation tax rate in the G7. Let's look at what's
:14:09. > :14:12.important for business. Cutting corporation tax in itself doesn't
:14:13. > :14:17.improve productivity, or business investment and there's no suggestion
:14:18. > :14:22.cutting corporation tax in recent years has achieved that. Businesses
:14:23. > :14:26.need an investment in tools in things they need to thrive and
:14:27. > :14:31.prosper, they also need to reduce the burden at the lower end of the
:14:32. > :14:35.tax scale, before we get to the Prophet stage. One key example is
:14:36. > :14:43.business rates. We have made the proposal to government to in --
:14:44. > :14:44.exclude machinery so businesses can invest and grow operations in the
:14:45. > :14:58.future but the Government refused. Corporation tax has been cut since
:14:59. > :15:05.2010. When it was 28% it brought in ?43 billion a year. Now it is down
:15:06. > :15:11.to 20%, it brought in ?55 billion a year. By cutting it in the last
:15:12. > :15:17.year, it brought in 21% more, so what is the problem? It might have
:15:18. > :15:21.brought in more money, but has it increased business investment in the
:15:22. > :15:27.long term. It is not just about cutting corporation tax, but it is
:15:28. > :15:32.on the ability of businesses to thrive and prosper. Business
:15:33. > :15:37.investment in the UK is below are industrial competitors. Wages are
:15:38. > :15:43.stagnating which doesn't indicate businesses are not doing well. Let
:15:44. > :15:49.me get it right, you are arguing if we increase business tax by a third,
:15:50. > :15:57.that will increase investment? I am not saying that. You just did. Know
:15:58. > :16:02.I didn't, I said reducing business tax isn't enough, you have to invest
:16:03. > :16:06.in the things businesses need to thrive and prosper. You have also
:16:07. > :16:16.got to lessen the burden on business. You have announced a
:16:17. > :16:22.financial transaction tax. Your own labour Mayor of London said he has
:16:23. > :16:26.vowed to fight it. He said I do not want a unilateral tax on business in
:16:27. > :16:31.our city, so why are you proceeding with it? This isn't a new
:16:32. > :16:36.initiative, there is a growing global pressure to make sure we have
:16:37. > :16:39.fairness in the financial sector. Ordinary British people are paying
:16:40. > :16:46.for our banking crisis they didn't cause. Another important point,
:16:47. > :16:51.stamp duty reserve tax was brought in in the 1600 and there have been
:16:52. > :16:54.little reforms. The sector has changed and we have do provide
:16:55. > :17:00.changes to the system for that change. High-frequency trading where
:17:01. > :17:04.we have a state of affairs where a lot of shares are traded on
:17:05. > :17:10.computers within milliseconds. We need a tax system that keeps up with
:17:11. > :17:16.that. What happens if they move the computers to another country? Emily
:17:17. > :17:20.Thornaby said this morning, other countries had already introduced a
:17:21. > :17:27.financial transaction tax, what other countries have done that?
:17:28. > :17:35.There are ten countries looking at introducing a transaction tax. Which
:17:36. > :17:40.ones have done it so far? They will be later announcing a final package,
:17:41. > :17:43.going through the finer detail at the moment. But the European
:17:44. > :17:48.Commission tried to get this done in 2011 and it still hasn't happened in
:17:49. > :17:52.any of these countries. But you are going to go ahead unilaterally and
:17:53. > :17:58.risk these businesses, which generate a lot of money, moving to
:17:59. > :18:04.other jurisdictions. There is not a significant risk of that happening.
:18:05. > :18:13.The stamp duty reserve tax is levied at either where the person or
:18:14. > :18:18.company is domiciled or where the instrument is issued rather than
:18:19. > :18:22.worth the transaction takes place. This tax in itself is not enough to
:18:23. > :18:26.make people leave this country in terms of financial services because
:18:27. > :18:30.there is more to keep these businesses here in terms of the
:18:31. > :18:34.investment we are making, the economy that Labour will build, in
:18:35. > :18:37.terms of productivity improvement we will see. Thank you very much,
:18:38. > :18:41.Rebecca Long-Bailey. And listening to that was the Home
:18:42. > :18:52.Office Minister, Brandon Lewis. Over the years, you have got
:18:53. > :18:56.corporation tax by 20%, it is lower than international standards, so why
:18:57. > :19:02.are so many global companies who make money out of Great Britain,
:19:03. > :19:07.still not paying 20%? It is one of the problems with the point Labour
:19:08. > :19:11.were making and Rebecca could not answer, these companies can move
:19:12. > :19:15.around the world. One of the important things is having a low tax
:19:16. > :19:20.economy but these businesses, it encourages them to come at a rate
:19:21. > :19:27.they are prepared to pay. People may say they are right, if they were
:19:28. > :19:33.paying 19, 20% incorporation tax. But they are not. Google runs a
:19:34. > :19:39.multi-million pound corporation and did not pay anywhere near 20%. There
:19:40. > :19:43.are companies that are trading internationally and that is why we
:19:44. > :19:52.have to get this work done with our partners around the world. Has there
:19:53. > :19:56.been an improvement? It is more than they were paying before. Whether it
:19:57. > :20:01.is Google or any other company, alongside them being here, apart
:20:02. > :20:06.from the tax they pay, it is the people they employ. The deal was, if
:20:07. > :20:09.you cut the business tax, the corporation tax on profits, we would
:20:10. > :20:15.get more companies coming here and more companies paying their tax. It
:20:16. > :20:18.seems it doesn't matter how low, a number of companies just pay a
:20:19. > :20:25.derisory amount and you haven't been able to change that. As you
:20:26. > :20:32.outlined, the income taken from the changing corporation tax has gone
:20:33. > :20:35.up. That is from established British companies, not from these
:20:36. > :20:39.international companies. It is because more companies are coming
:20:40. > :20:43.here and paying tax. That is a good thing. There is always more to do
:20:44. > :20:48.and that is why we want to crack down. In the last few weeks in the
:20:49. > :20:53.Finnish Parliament, Labour refused to put to another ?8.7 billion of
:20:54. > :20:59.tax take we could have got by cracking down further. You claim to
:21:00. > :21:05.have made great progress on cracking down on people and companies to pay
:21:06. > :21:10.the tax they should. But the tax gap is the difference between what HMRC
:21:11. > :21:17.takes in and what it should take in. It has barely moved in five years,
:21:18. > :21:21.so where is the progress? He have brought in 150 billion more where we
:21:22. > :21:29.have cracked down on those tax schemes. The gap is still the same
:21:30. > :21:34.as it was five years ago. It's gone from 6.8, 26.5. It has gone down.
:21:35. > :21:37.The Prime Minister and the Chancellor said they want to
:21:38. > :21:40.continue work on to get more money on these companies while still
:21:41. > :21:50.having a competitive rate to encourage these companies. While big
:21:51. > :21:52.business and the wealthy continue to prosper, the Office for Budget
:21:53. > :21:57.Responsibility tell us those on average earnings in this country
:21:58. > :22:03.will be earning less in real terms by 2021 than they did in 2008. How
:22:04. > :22:09.can that be fair? I don't see it that way. I haven't seen the figures
:22:10. > :22:12.you have got. What I can say to you, Andrew, we have made sure the
:22:13. > :22:17.minimum wage has gone up, the actual income tax people pay has gone down.
:22:18. > :22:26.So in their pocket, real terms, people have more money. You are the
:22:27. > :22:29.self-styled party of work. We keep emphasising work. Under your
:22:30. > :22:34.government you can work for 13 years and still not earn any more at the
:22:35. > :22:41.end of it, and you did at the start. Where is the reward for effort in
:22:42. > :22:46.that? I have not seen those figures. There are 2.8 million more people,
:22:47. > :22:51.more jobs in economy than there was. 1000 jobs every day and people are
:22:52. > :22:55.working and developing through their careers. This is what I thought was
:22:56. > :22:58.odd in what Rebecca was saying, investing in people is what the
:22:59. > :23:03.apprenticeship levy is about, companies are investing their works
:23:04. > :23:08.force to take more opportunities that there. We are talking about
:23:09. > :23:11.fairness, politicians talk about hard-working people and we know the
:23:12. > :23:17.average earnings are no higher than they were in 2008. We know the pay
:23:18. > :23:21.and bonuses of senior executives have continued to grow and the
:23:22. > :23:25.Institute for Fiscal Studies has shown 3 million of the poorest
:23:26. > :23:29.households will lose an average of ?2500 a year in the next Parliament,
:23:30. > :23:37.benefits frozen, further sanctions kick in. 3 million of the poorest
:23:38. > :23:42.losing 2500. Under the Tories, one law for the rich and another for the
:23:43. > :23:47.poor. It is quite wrong. First of all, we have got to be fair to the
:23:48. > :23:51.taxpayer who is funding the welfare and benefit system. Which is why the
:23:52. > :24:01.welfare was right. Get more people in work and then it is important to
:24:02. > :24:04.get more people upscaling. As that allowance rises, people have more of
:24:05. > :24:11.the money they earn in their pocket to be able to use in the economy.
:24:12. > :24:16.People will be worse off. 2500, among the poorest already. They will
:24:17. > :24:23.have more money in their pocket as we increase the allowance before
:24:24. > :24:28.people pay tax. We have seen millions of people coming out of tax
:24:29. > :24:32.altogether. The reason I ask these questions, you and the Prime
:24:33. > :24:36.Minister go on and on about the just about managing classes. I am talking
:24:37. > :24:41.about the just about managing and below that. It is all talk, you
:24:42. > :24:44.haven't done anything for them. We have made sure they have an
:24:45. > :24:51.increasing minimum wage, it has gone up more under us than any other
:24:52. > :24:57.previous government. Their wages will be still lower in real terms.
:24:58. > :25:01.Let me come on to this plan for housing. We have announced a new
:25:02. > :25:06.plan to increase affordable housing, social housing, some council housing
:25:07. > :25:11.and social housing built by the associations. How much money is
:25:12. > :25:16.behind this? It is part of the 1.4 billion announced in the Autumn
:25:17. > :25:21.Statement. How many homes will you get for 1.4 billion? That depends on
:25:22. > :25:25.the negotiations with local authorities. It is local
:25:26. > :25:32.authorities, who know the area best. I will not put a number on that. 1.4
:25:33. > :25:37.billion, if you price the house at 100,000, which is very low,
:25:38. > :25:43.particularly for the South, back at you 14,000 new homes. That is it.
:25:44. > :25:47.What we have seen before, how the local government can leveraged to
:25:48. > :25:51.build thousands more homes. That is what we want to see across the
:25:52. > :25:54.country. It is not just about the money, for a lot of local
:25:55. > :26:00.authorities it is about the expertise and knowledge on how to do
:26:01. > :26:03.this. That is why support from the housing communities minister will
:26:04. > :26:10.help. What is the timescale, how many more affordable homes will be
:26:11. > :26:15.built? I will not put a number on it. You announced it today, so you
:26:16. > :26:19.cannot tell me how many more or what the target is? It is a matter of
:26:20. > :26:23.working with the local authorities who know what their local needs are,
:26:24. > :26:27.what land they have got available. What we saw through the local
:26:28. > :26:32.elections with the Metro mayors, they want to deliver in their areas,
:26:33. > :26:35.whether it is the West of England, the north-east, Liverpool,
:26:36. > :26:41.Manchester and we want to work with them. You have said variations of
:26:42. > :26:44.this for the past seven years and I want some credibility. When you
:26:45. > :26:50.cannot tell us how much money, what the target and timescale is, and
:26:51. > :26:55.this government, under which affordable house building has fallen
:26:56. > :26:59.to a 24 year low. 1.2 million families are on waiting lists for
:27:00. > :27:04.social housing to rent. That is your record. Why should we believe a word
:27:05. > :27:09.you say? This is different to what we have been doing over the last two
:27:10. > :27:14.years. We want to develop and have a strong and stable economy that can
:27:15. > :27:23.sustain that 1.4 billion homes. This is important. In 2010, we inherited
:27:24. > :27:27.the lowest level of house building, 75,000 new homes. That is about
:27:28. > :27:32.189,000 over the last four years. That is a big step forward after the
:27:33. > :27:42.crash, getting people back into the industry. More first-time buyers
:27:43. > :27:47.onto the market. Final question, in 2010, 2011, your first year in
:27:48. > :27:54.government, there were 60,000 affordable homes built. May not be
:27:55. > :27:59.enough, but last day it was 30 2000. So why should we trust anything you
:28:00. > :28:07.say about this? On housing, we have delivered. We have delivered more
:28:08. > :28:13.social housing. Double what Labour did in 13 years, in just five years.
:28:14. > :28:16.This is what this policy is about, working with local authorities to
:28:17. > :28:20.deliver more homes to people in their local areas. Thank you.
:28:21. > :28:23.Now, they have a deficit of between 15 and 20% in the polls,
:28:24. > :28:26.but Jeremy Corbyn and those around him insist Labour can win.
:28:27. > :28:29.If the polls are right they've got three and half weeks to change
:28:30. > :28:31.voters' minds and persuade those fabled undecided voters
:28:32. > :28:36.We enlisted the polling organisation YouGov to help us find out how
:28:37. > :28:38.the performance of party leaders will affect behaviour
:28:39. > :28:47.Leeds, a city of three quarters of a million people,
:28:48. > :28:52.eight Parliamentary seats and home to our very own focus group.
:28:53. > :28:55.Our panel was recruited from a variety of backgrounds
:28:56. > :28:59.and the majority say they haven't decided who to vote for yet.
:29:00. > :29:01.Watching behind the glass, two experts on different sides
:29:02. > :29:08.Giles Cunningham, who headed up political press at Downing Street
:29:09. > :29:14.under David Cameron and Aaron Bastani, Corbin supporter,
:29:15. > :29:16.under David Cameron and Aaron Bastani, Corbyn supporter,
:29:17. > :29:21.I think Theresa May sees herself as a pound shop Thatcher.
:29:22. > :29:41.Milliband's policies but when it came
:29:42. > :29:44.about who you want, if you wake up on maybe a 2015,
:29:45. > :29:48.We found in a couple of focus groups, people saying
:29:49. > :29:51.we'd be quite relieved, even though some of those same
:29:52. > :29:53.people have been saying we quite like the Labour policies.
:29:54. > :29:57.I think the fact that Corbyn's going so hard on his values,
:29:58. > :29:59.this is a really progressive manifesto, they live
:30:00. > :30:04.But I think that's a new challenge, that wasn't there in 2015.
:30:05. > :30:06.Is there anyone here that you don't recognise?
:30:07. > :30:08.After a little warm up, the first exercise, recognising
:30:09. > :30:14.I think it's nice to have a strong woman in politics, I do.
:30:15. > :30:17.But I've got to say, when she comes on the news,
:30:18. > :30:19.I kind of do think, here we go again.
:30:20. > :30:22.Tell me about Tim Farron, what are your impressions of Tim Farron?
:30:23. > :30:27.It isn't going to do anything, it isn't going to change anything.
:30:28. > :30:35.You'll be surprised to hear it's actually the Greens.
:30:36. > :30:48.Strong and stable leadership in the national interest.
:30:49. > :30:52.Yes, Team May, it's the British equivalent of make
:30:53. > :31:02.What do we think about this one for the many and not the few?
:31:03. > :31:05.It's not quite as bad as strong and stable,
:31:06. > :31:07.but it will probably get on our nerves after a while.
:31:08. > :31:18.We must seize that chance today and every day until June the 8th.
:31:19. > :31:25.But that's not quite my question, my question is,
:31:26. > :31:28.if you are Prime Minister, we will leave, come hell or high
:31:29. > :31:31.water, whatever is on the table at the end of the negotiations?
:31:32. > :31:34.If we win the election, we'll get a good deal with Europe.
:31:35. > :31:36.Assertive and in control and he felt comfortable
:31:37. > :31:41.But the second one, I thought he was very hesitant.
:31:42. > :31:50.I thought he was kind of, hovering around, skirting around
:31:51. > :31:52.and that's the second time I've seen a similar
:31:53. > :31:54.interview with the question being asked regarding Brexit.
:31:55. > :31:56.I don't think I'd have any confidence with him
:31:57. > :32:00.You think you are going up against some quite strong people,
:32:01. > :32:02.how are you going to stand up for us?
:32:03. > :32:07.When you are in negotiations, you need to be tough.
:32:08. > :32:09.And actually is right to be tough sometimes,
:32:10. > :32:11.particularly when you are doing something for the country.
:32:12. > :32:14.There's a reason for talking about strong and stable leadership.
:32:15. > :32:16.It's about the future of the country, it's
:32:17. > :32:20.It's just that people kind of listen to that kind of thing and think
:32:21. > :32:26.Both on The One Show and in the news.
:32:27. > :32:32.She attracts the public better than what Corbyn does.
:32:33. > :32:35.She didn't answer the question in a more articular way than Corbyn
:32:36. > :32:41.Imagine that Theresa May is an animal.
:32:42. > :32:44.So, in your minds, what animal is coming to mind
:32:45. > :32:58.I've done a Pekinese because I think she's all bark and no bite.
:32:59. > :33:04.Alpaca because she's superior looking and woolly
:33:05. > :33:20.I don't think his policies are for the modern, real world.
:33:21. > :33:23.A mouse because they are weak and they can be easily bullied,
:33:24. > :33:26.but also they can catch you by surprise if you're
:33:27. > :33:34.What do you take away from what you saw then,
:33:35. > :33:36.and what message would you send back to the Tories now?
:33:37. > :33:40.I think what came over is people see Theresa May as a strong politician,
:33:41. > :33:42.not everyone likes her, but you don't need to be
:33:43. > :33:45.liked to be elected, because ultimately it's about who do
:33:46. > :33:47.you trust with your future and your security.
:33:48. > :33:49.I think what I also take out of that focus group,
:33:50. > :33:52.was it was a group of floating voters, there was no huge appetite
:33:53. > :33:55.for the Lib Dems and there was no huge appetite for Ukip.
:33:56. > :33:58.So my messaged back to CCHQ would be stick to the plan.
:33:59. > :34:01.I thought the response to the manifesto was excellent.
:34:02. > :34:04.It's clear that people aren't particularly keen on Theresa May,
:34:05. > :34:09.There are some associations with her about strength and stability,
:34:10. > :34:12.which is exactly what the Tory party want of course, but they are not
:34:13. > :34:14.positive and nobody thinks that she has a vision
:34:15. > :34:20.So, what I'd say the Jeremy Corbyn, what I'd say to the Labour Party is,
:34:21. > :34:23.they need to really emphasise the manifesto in
:34:24. > :34:29.Jeremy Corbyn himself has to perform out of his skin and I think
:34:30. > :34:31.he has to reemphasise those characteristics which may be have
:34:32. > :34:34.come to the fore may be over the last 12 months,
:34:35. > :34:36.resilience, strength and the fact that he's come this far,
:34:37. > :34:39.why not take that final step and go into ten Downing Street?
:34:40. > :34:41.We're joined now by the American political consultant
:34:42. > :34:51.For the sake of this discussion, assume the polls at the moment are
:34:52. > :34:57.broadly right, is there any hope for Mr Corbyn in the undecided voters?
:34:58. > :35:01.Know, and this is a very serious collection with serious consequences
:35:02. > :35:05.to who wins. Nobody cares whether you can draw and what animal they
:35:06. > :35:09.represent, they want to know where they stand, and I felt that was
:35:10. > :35:15.frivolous. I come to Britain to watch elections because I learned
:35:16. > :35:18.from here. Your elections are more substantial, more serious, more
:35:19. > :35:22.policy and less about personality and that peace was only about
:35:23. > :35:27.personality. That's partly because Mrs May has decided to make this a
:35:28. > :35:42.presidential election. You can see on the posters it is all Team May. I
:35:43. > :35:46.agree with that, and in her language she says not everyone benefits from
:35:47. > :35:50.a Conservative government, I don't see how using anything Republicans
:35:51. > :35:54.have used in the past. In fact her campaign is more of a centrist
:35:55. > :35:59.Democrats but it is a smart strategy because it pushes Corbyn further to
:36:00. > :36:04.the left. Of course you said Hillary Clinton have won. On election night
:36:05. > :36:10.the polling was so bad in America, the exit polls that were done, the
:36:11. > :36:16.BBC told America she had won. No, I was anchoring the programme that
:36:17. > :36:24.night, I ignored your tweet. The BBC had the same numbers. Yes, but we
:36:25. > :36:28.did not say she had won, I can assure you of that. Because of
:36:29. > :36:35.people like you we thought she had but we didn't broadcast it. That was
:36:36. > :36:40.a smart approach. My point is other than teasing you, maybe there is
:36:41. > :36:45.hope for Jeremy Corbyn. I think you will have one of the lowest turnout
:36:46. > :36:49.in modern history and I think Labour will fall to one of the lowest
:36:50. > :36:55.percentages, not percentage of number of seats they have had, and
:36:56. > :36:59.this will be a matter of soul-searching for both political
:37:00. > :37:02.parties. What you do with a sizeable majority, and she has a
:37:03. > :37:08.responsibility to tell the British people exactly what happens as she
:37:09. > :37:13.moves forward. He and Labour will have to take a look at whether they
:37:14. > :37:18.still represent a significant slice of the British population. Do you
:37:19. > :37:22.see a realignment in British politics taking place? I see a
:37:23. > :37:25.crumbling of the left and yet there is still a significant percentage of
:37:26. > :37:35.the British population that once someone who is centre-left. And they
:37:36. > :37:38.like a lot of Mr Corbyn's policies. I'm listening to Michael foot. I
:37:39. > :37:41.went to school here in the 1980s and I feel like I'm watching the Labour
:37:42. > :37:42.Party of 35 years ago, in a population that wants to focus on
:37:43. > :37:49.the future, not the past. Thank you. It's just gone 11.35,
:37:50. > :37:51.you're watching the Sunday Politics. We say goodbye to viewers
:37:52. > :37:54.in Scotland, who leave us now Hello you're watching
:37:55. > :38:03.the Sunday Politics Is Labour facing its Last Tango
:38:04. > :38:12.in Halifax or could voters end up dancing to a different tune
:38:13. > :38:14.to the one many predict? What can Halifax tell us
:38:15. > :38:17.about the mood of the nation? I think the NHS, ambulance
:38:18. > :38:25.and police service. And the EU migrants watching our
:38:26. > :38:28.election campaign very closely. What do they think about the debate
:38:29. > :38:41.surrounding immigration? You have the normal concerns, food,
:38:42. > :38:46.job, friends, you have a plan what to do and then you have the news of
:38:47. > :38:50.Brexit. We are treated like bargaining chips.
:38:51. > :38:53.If Theresa May is to achieve her aim of increasing her majority
:38:54. > :38:55.in parliament, then Halifax is a must-win seat for the Tories.
:38:56. > :38:58.In 2015, Labour won Halifax with a majority of just 428 votes.
:38:59. > :39:02.Labour say they'll fight hard to retain all the seats they're
:39:03. > :39:06.defending across Yorkshire and North Lincolnshire.
:39:07. > :39:08.But of course, the voters will have the final verdict
:39:09. > :39:10.and here's what some voters in Halifax are saying about
:39:11. > :39:19.The biggest issue is the Tories taking over
:39:20. > :39:24.Personally, I voted to leave the EU because I think it will be better
:39:25. > :39:27.for England and Britain to be able to trade freely with America
:39:28. > :39:30.and China and all the big trading blocks and for us to have free
:39:31. > :39:33.Theresa May is picking over the corpse of England.
:39:34. > :39:39.The NHS is going to go and everything else will follow it.
:39:40. > :39:42.I think tax and the financial system, because when I'm older
:39:43. > :39:46.What is the biggest issue in the election?
:39:47. > :39:51.I think NHS, ambulance and the police service.
:39:52. > :39:53.People are wondering whether to remain or not
:39:54. > :39:59.It is confusing a lot of people and it is dividing a lot
:40:00. > :40:12.We are joined today by three of the candidates in the Halifax
:40:13. > :40:20.constituency. Labour's Holly Lynch, Liberal Democrat and Ukip candidate.
:40:21. > :40:24.The Conservative candidate has declined our invitation to take part
:40:25. > :40:29.in this programme. Every political number cruncher you speak to has
:40:30. > :40:34.Halifax town as a Conservative game based on the size of the Tory
:40:35. > :40:39.leader. You must be gloomy about your prospects? We have always known
:40:40. > :40:43.it has been a key marginal. It is a battle ground people look at going
:40:44. > :40:49.into a general election. We knew that when I became the MP to years
:40:50. > :40:53.ago. I have not been complacent in that time. We have hit the ground
:40:54. > :41:00.running as a local party. The things we have been keen to work on. We had
:41:01. > :41:05.the last Tango in Halifax and allergy but it has not been happy
:41:06. > :41:10.Valley under this Conservative Government either. Cuts to policing,
:41:11. > :41:17.education and squeeze is on the NHS. People are not happy about and it
:41:18. > :41:21.has come up on the doorsteps. You were campaigning to remain within
:41:22. > :41:24.the European union. Your constituency is in favour of leaving
:41:25. > :41:30.the European Union, does that make you vulnerable? I did go into the
:41:31. > :41:35.referendum as a remain porter but I am a Democrat and I recognise the
:41:36. > :41:40.referendum. We are keen to get on with this process of Brexit and it
:41:41. > :41:42.is coming up on the doorsteps. We have had conversations with 7000
:41:43. > :41:48.people going into this general election. It is interesting that
:41:49. > :41:51.Theresa May triggered Article 50 and the first thing she did was postpone
:41:52. > :41:55.the negotiations to have a general election. We want get on with that
:41:56. > :42:00.process but we have seen these issues coming up on the doorstep.
:42:01. > :42:05.James Baker, the last general election, the Liberal Democrat
:42:06. > :42:08.candidate came a distant fourth lost his deposit. Halifax is a battle
:42:09. > :42:14.between Labour and the Tories. You do not stand a chance, do you?
:42:15. > :42:18.Things can only improve. I have a great track record as a local
:42:19. > :42:22.councillor representing people in Halifax. I am someone who delivers
:42:23. > :42:25.and offering people something unique in this election. You have other
:42:26. > :42:29.candidates who are going to be supporting a hard Brexit, which will
:42:30. > :42:35.be damaging to jobs and the economy in Halifax. We rely on Lloyds and
:42:36. > :42:39.large companies like Nestle, if you lose those then people are going to
:42:40. > :42:43.suffer. I am the only candidate that is offering people a final say on
:42:44. > :42:46.the Brexit deal so they can have a choice whether they want to accept
:42:47. > :42:52.the deal that politicians negotiate whether they want to reject it and a
:42:53. > :43:00.chance to stay in the EU. URL Ukip candidate. It is surprising that
:43:01. > :43:03.Ukip are not standing in many constituencies in Yorkshire and
:43:04. > :43:08.Lincolnshire riveted stand and the last election. Why have you chosen
:43:09. > :43:14.to stand in Halifax? Ukip as a guard dogs of Brexit. People in Halifax
:43:15. > :43:17.voted overwhelmingly during the referendum to leave the European
:43:18. > :43:21.union. We want to put a strong voice on that's not forget that Brexit has
:43:22. > :43:26.not happened yet. Nothing has been delivered. There were delays in
:43:27. > :43:31.writing a letter to say we were leaving. The people of Halifax need
:43:32. > :43:34.a strong voice to go to Westminster and say we demanded to leave and
:43:35. > :43:39.that is what is going to happen. The question we are asking is will
:43:40. > :43:41.Brexit trump traditional loyalties on major issues?
:43:42. > :43:44.This morning we're looking at immigration - and education.
:43:45. > :43:46.In recent months teachers' unions have been speaking out
:43:47. > :43:52.The government says it is looking to correct historical imbalances
:43:53. > :43:55.But we've spoken to one parent in Calderdale,
:43:56. > :43:57.a mother of five children, who has begun campaigning
:43:58. > :44:00.against what she claims are gravely damaging cuts in her part
:44:01. > :44:18.What we are seeing in Calderdale is schools which have already had
:44:19. > :44:20.to meet a number of redundancies, which are already losing staff,
:44:21. > :44:22.class sizes are increasing and problems are occurring.
:44:23. > :44:24.Children are being asked to pay for exercise books.
:44:25. > :44:28.In some schools the head teachers are actively asking parents
:44:29. > :44:31.to contribute to school funding and in some cases actually asking
:44:32. > :44:34.if they can set up a direct debit so they are getting a regular source
:44:35. > :44:40.of funding to the school on a regular basis.
:44:41. > :44:43.One school, for example, here in Calderdale just a couple
:44:44. > :44:46.of miles away from where we are, is subject to cuts of over half
:44:47. > :44:52.And have already had to make several redundancies,
:44:53. > :44:55.resulting in the loss of number of teachers, support staff
:44:56. > :45:02.It means they can offer a lot less subjects as a school.
:45:03. > :45:05.Not so far away from here, one school who only 12 subjects
:45:06. > :45:08.There has been a significant reduction in language.
:45:09. > :45:15.Design and technology subjects have been scrapped.
:45:16. > :45:18.And music and art have also been very hardly hit.
:45:19. > :45:21.Teachers are becoming increasingly stressed
:45:22. > :45:25.50% of more experienced teachers are wanting to quit over the next
:45:26. > :45:27.two years and headteachers in particular are finding it really
:45:28. > :45:29.difficult to recruit teachers, especially in the areas
:45:30. > :45:36.My fears going into the election is that this subject has
:45:37. > :45:46.How much longer can it go on before schools are literally
:45:47. > :45:48.brought to their knees and many of them start fail?
:45:49. > :45:57.Well, in the absence of the Conservative candidate,
:45:58. > :45:59.we asked for a Conservative Party statement on education funding -
:46:00. > :46:02.and they told us that the government has been putting record investment
:46:03. > :46:05.into schools, protecting core schools budgets,
:46:06. > :46:07.and consulting on a fairer funding formula which it will further
:46:08. > :46:21.Holly Lynch, nobody wants to see bigger class sizes and fewer
:46:22. > :46:26.teachers. Where are Labour going to find the money to plug the black
:46:27. > :46:30.hole in the education budget? Some of the details for this will be in
:46:31. > :46:35.our manifesto which is out next week. We are looking at corporation
:46:36. > :46:36.tax any way of launching an education service, doing things
:46:37. > :46:41.differently. We all want to see a differently. We all want to see a
:46:42. > :46:46.good, well funded quality education that is available to everybody. That
:46:47. > :46:50.is not what is happening at the moment. Headteachers across Halifax
:46:51. > :46:54.are really desperate about the financial situation. I have been
:46:55. > :46:57.meeting with those teachers and we have secured a meeting with the
:46:58. > :47:02.schools minister. That was cancelled because of this general election.
:47:03. > :47:09.This Government did not want to talk about education but people do. ?5
:47:10. > :47:13.billion. Jeremy Corbyn said he would put ?5 billion extra into schools.
:47:14. > :47:17.Down the back of which so far is it going to find that money? This is
:47:18. > :47:21.looking at how he can use corporation tax. When I meet with
:47:22. > :47:25.businesses, we are talking about how this would be cost-effective.
:47:26. > :47:28.Businesses are talking about the skills gap where people do not have
:47:29. > :47:32.the skills and the qualifications that we need is a thriving economy.
:47:33. > :47:37.This is one of the ways we are looking to do that. You are going to
:47:38. > :47:42.tax businesses more. Assuming those companies do not leave the country
:47:43. > :47:48.and the economy continues at the same pace it is doing now, those
:47:49. > :47:52.sums do not add up, do they? Education is so important. If we
:47:53. > :47:55.wanted a thriving economy and bright future for this country, we have to
:47:56. > :47:59.get education right. The details will be a neat manifesto next week.
:48:00. > :48:06.We are looking at doing that whilst protecting Smalls businesses. Can we
:48:07. > :48:13.trust the liberal Democrats again after you broke your promise on
:48:14. > :48:25.Jewish and fees? You can trust me. Education is -- education fees. She
:48:26. > :48:31.went off to university part-time. I have seen the power education can
:48:32. > :48:35.change lives. The education premium to give money to the most
:48:36. > :48:40.disadvantaged children to make sure there is a level playing field. We
:48:41. > :48:44.are committed to improving the educational opportunities are people
:48:45. > :48:49.in Halifax. Halifax under the Conservative Government in Halifax,
:48:50. > :48:53.people's education has fallen behind. We are behind the national
:48:54. > :49:00.averages and I want to tackle that as MP. All I know about Ukip
:49:01. > :49:05.education policy is that you want more grammar schools. Is that about
:49:06. > :49:10.it? We do and we want technical schools as well. There is more to it
:49:11. > :49:14.than that. I think when people see that video that we have seen, it is
:49:15. > :49:17.disgraceful with the Conservative cuts that they are not coming to
:49:18. > :49:20.talk about today. I think when people are out there and they are
:49:21. > :49:24.saying we're going to vote Conservatives because of Brexit, the
:49:25. > :49:28.also need to at things like that we are when they are voting for the
:49:29. > :49:34.Conservatives, they are voting for cuts in the area. I using Ukip wants
:49:35. > :49:38.more money put into schools? We would you find that from? A good
:49:39. > :49:43.place to start would be the foreign aid budget. 13.2 billion last year.
:49:44. > :49:48.Which we would significantly cut to spend more money in this country and
:49:49. > :49:52.Halifax. Calderdale has two grammar schools. Would you support my
:49:53. > :49:58.grammar schools in your area? No, we are different in Halifax. Two of the
:49:59. > :50:05.secondary schools are grammar schools. Where trees are made as
:50:06. > :50:08.seeing that grammar schools are the future. -- Theresa May. Grammar
:50:09. > :50:13.schools are coming to me saying we have to make desperate decisions
:50:14. > :50:17.about staff and resources and they cannot see a financial future at the
:50:18. > :50:21.moment. She is not funding the grammar schools we have got properly
:50:22. > :50:25.so how can we trust her judgment on grammar schools in the future? I
:50:26. > :50:30.presume Ukip would want to see my grammar schools? And to be clear,
:50:31. > :50:33.technical skills. There are a lot of people out there who are more
:50:34. > :50:36.technically minded and would have a far better opportunity if they went
:50:37. > :50:42.to a technical school in order to learn about the technology. What is
:50:43. > :50:46.wrong with that, more technical schools? Teach children practical
:50:47. > :50:49.skills. There is nothing wrong with teaching children practical skills.
:50:50. > :50:54.We have an effect of College in Calderdale that does that already
:50:55. > :50:57.and they have a great track record of success. The problem with grammar
:50:58. > :51:01.schools, they are not working and they are not helping the people who
:51:02. > :51:06.do not get into the grammar schools. We see a situation where the
:51:07. > :51:10.children who can afford it, pay for extra tuition. It is not helping to
:51:11. > :51:15.tackle the problems. There is a lack of social mobility and to many
:51:16. > :51:19.people think they do not have the life chances that other people may
:51:20. > :51:23.have. We need to improve those life opportunities for people living in
:51:24. > :51:25.Halifax. I am sure at this debate will go on long after this election
:51:26. > :51:28.campaign, no doubt. Now - our cameras have been out
:51:29. > :51:31.in the fields of Yorkshire this week as both Labour and Conservative
:51:32. > :51:33.party leaders arrived in the region to set
:51:34. > :51:36.out their policies on immigration. Freedom of movement of workers
:51:37. > :51:38.was a crucial battleground for leavers and remainers
:51:39. > :51:40.in the referendum last June. Almost a year on, we sent
:51:41. > :51:42.Richard Edwards to talk He is one of the tens of thousands
:51:43. > :51:53.of EU nationals living In Yorkshire, their numbers rose by
:51:54. > :51:59.a quarter in the four years to 2015. But as Britain waits for the Brexit
:52:00. > :52:02.talks to get into full swing, Victor and other EU migrants
:52:03. > :52:04.are asking big questions When I go to work now, I know
:52:05. > :52:11.I have a limited time for two years. If you look at the normal concerns,
:52:12. > :52:15.food, job, friends, everything, you have a plan what to do and then
:52:16. > :52:19.you get the news of Brexit. We are treated like
:52:20. > :52:20.bargaining chips. Can I have a pack
:52:21. > :52:26.of asparagus, please? Claire Thomas runs a farm
:52:27. > :52:34.called Warfedale Grange Claire relies on Victor's labour
:52:35. > :52:37.and says she wants answers I could not continue without someone
:52:38. > :52:44.doing the sort of day-to-day Victor will get up at the crack
:52:45. > :52:48.of dawn and say, you know, I have bunched 50 lots of 25 bunches
:52:49. > :52:51.of marguerites for me I feel very sorry for Victor
:52:52. > :52:56.because he does not know when he goes home next
:52:57. > :52:59.time whether he will So he can't make any
:53:00. > :53:04.permanent plans. And, you know, he is like a member
:53:05. > :53:09.of the family, really. So what do the two possible
:53:10. > :53:12.Prime Ministers say about this? Well, they have both been
:53:13. > :53:14.in our region this week. Conservative party leader
:53:15. > :53:16.Theresa May found herself put on the spot by a foreign-born worker
:53:17. > :53:26.while on a factory visit. Are you going to preserve our right
:53:27. > :53:29.to reside in this country or maybe in the future are you going to send
:53:30. > :53:33.us back to our home country? What I want to do,
:53:34. > :53:36.and what I expect to do and intend to guarantee EU citizens
:53:37. > :53:40.who are living here their rights and status but, I am sure
:53:41. > :53:42.you understand as the UK Prime Minister, I also want to think
:53:43. > :53:45.about UK citizens who are living While Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn
:53:46. > :53:49.popped into the Look North studios in between campaign visits
:53:50. > :53:51.to Leeds and Garforth. We will also make sure
:53:52. > :53:53.that we protect those achieved through Europe,
:53:54. > :53:56.such as working time directive We will also guarantee the rights
:53:57. > :54:02.of EU nationals to remain here. In the background to all of this
:54:03. > :54:06.a counselling company in York says it is helping Eastern European
:54:07. > :54:08.clients who are being bullied They are definitely related to
:54:09. > :54:12.Brexit because the underlying issues are if I separate from my partner,
:54:13. > :54:15.will I still have I have lived in this
:54:16. > :54:18.country for a long time, will I have to go back
:54:19. > :54:21.to my own country? So those are definitely
:54:22. > :54:30.related to their future. So that evidence coming from a firm
:54:31. > :54:32.in remain supporting York. Welcome to strongly
:54:33. > :54:35.leave voting Wakefield. Let's see what people in this cafe
:54:36. > :54:40.have to say about in it. Because they are foreigners
:54:41. > :54:48.they come first every time. They get the best houses,
:54:49. > :54:51.best jobs and it is all wrong. I do not think they
:54:52. > :54:55.are being picked on. I think it is them
:54:56. > :54:57.that are causing it. Put in for compensation
:54:58. > :55:10.and causing trouble. I have worked in the industry
:55:11. > :55:13.where are was a majority of Eastern Europeans
:55:14. > :55:14.that were supervisors. I don't think English
:55:15. > :55:16.people like that. The fact they are coming to our
:55:17. > :55:19.country and telling us what to do. It's a bit of a smack
:55:20. > :55:22.in the mouth, really. Does Victor have any message
:55:23. > :55:29.for the the new Government once You are English, you have
:55:30. > :55:32.to love your country, Try to look in your soul
:55:33. > :55:36.and be a human being. I'm sure everything will come up
:55:37. > :55:56.very good for England in the future. Richard Edwards reporting. We are
:55:57. > :56:00.joined live by the candidates in the Halifax constituency. The
:56:01. > :56:05.Conservative Party candidate declined our invitation to take part
:56:06. > :56:10.Ukip message to the hard-working Ukip message to the hard-working
:56:11. > :56:14.migrant workers across our part of the world who are worried they may
:56:15. > :56:17.not have a future in this country after Brexit? I would like to see to
:56:18. > :56:24.Victor directly that he should not be worried. Our policy is and has
:56:25. > :56:29.always been that anyone who came to the UK legally to work will remain
:56:30. > :56:35.after Brexit. It is concerning that there are so many scare stories out
:56:36. > :56:42.there. Likewise, for expats abroad, they are also concerned. To reason
:56:43. > :56:46.may yesterday saying that she intends to, or a wants to, she
:56:47. > :56:50.should do something and deliver something and bring this to the
:56:51. > :56:54.fronts of people stop worrying. -- Theresa May. If someone comes up to
:56:55. > :56:59.you on the streets of Halifax and says to you, I going to be allowed
:57:00. > :57:05.to stay in this country, what is your response? As far as Ukip are
:57:06. > :57:08.concerned, yes, you are allowed to stay. Do the liberal Democrats
:57:09. > :57:15.believe in any form of border control? Can I respond to what Mark
:57:16. > :57:19.said. I think the we heard from Ukip around the referendum campaign was
:57:20. > :57:24.appalling. Use these posters... It is fine saying we will protect them
:57:25. > :57:31.but there were posters with queues of immigrants and rhetoric that
:57:32. > :57:39.demonises people like Victor who have come here. We had been
:57:40. > :57:42.increased racism under is all around this culture of fear and division
:57:43. > :57:47.that we have seen in this country. I want to break away from that and
:57:48. > :57:49.have a politics where we treat other people like human beings and we
:57:50. > :57:53.value the contribution that value the contribution that
:57:54. > :57:56.immigrants make in the UK. There might be a problem about immigration
:57:57. > :58:01.and we need funding for local Government. You do not believe in
:58:02. > :58:04.any form of immigration control? I believe you should have checks and
:58:05. > :58:09.people come in here to make sure they are not criminals. I believe in
:58:10. > :58:21.the freedom of movement between the European Union. I am a liberal and I
:58:22. > :58:23.believe in freedom and the freedom of movement and freedom of capital
:58:24. > :58:26.is better for our society. It enriches people's lives and help our
:58:27. > :58:31.economy. Do you one to answer that point? Nigel Swaraj and that poster
:58:32. > :58:41.of queues of people. -- NIgel Farage. People who are already here
:58:42. > :58:45.should be able to stay. The difference is, looking at future
:58:46. > :58:50.immigration, we need to put some control on that and the Liberal
:58:51. > :58:53.Democrats are not going to control that and Ukip by the party to
:58:54. > :58:58.control immigration in the future. Is Jeremy Corbyn right to refuse to
:58:59. > :59:04.commit to reducing immigration if he becomes Prime Minister? One of the
:59:05. > :59:07.things I have been doing, I was in the Parliamentary group on
:59:08. > :59:12.immigration and that was going out and having conversations with people
:59:13. > :59:18.to see what we have to do to make sure to amenities are comfortable
:59:19. > :59:25.with immigration. We took evidence that was from Australia. What
:59:26. > :59:28.industry needs and the use that information to feed into the
:59:29. > :59:32.education policy and their immigration policy. Where we have
:59:33. > :59:36.seen this Conservative Government just setting these targets, which by
:59:37. > :59:41.their own measures keep failing to hit, would not be good if we were
:59:42. > :59:44.working with communities to say what we want from immigration... The
:59:45. > :59:48.answer to the questionnaires otherwise, no, you do not want to
:59:49. > :59:52.see immigration reduced. That is not true. We have to start to work out
:59:53. > :59:58.what we need and then use that a basis to work out figures. Could I
:59:59. > :00:03.suggest an Australian points-based system would be a good place to
:00:04. > :00:06.start? It has to be about education... Hollick, I hear you
:00:07. > :00:09.speak in favour of immigration but you do not want to come out and say
:00:10. > :00:14.you are in favour of immigration because you are aware that there are
:00:15. > :00:20.people in Halifax who are concerned about it that. I think there are
:00:21. > :00:26.people who are confused. Sometimes you say you are in favour of opening
:00:27. > :00:31.up... I do not wear where labour stands on this. The 55% of people in
:00:32. > :00:36.Calderdale who voted to leave the European Union, due not accept they
:00:37. > :00:41.did so with the hope that net migration would be reduced? Yes, I
:00:42. > :00:47.accept that. There was a lady there in that clip saying... She was
:00:48. > :00:52.trying to suggest people who come to this country are making trouble. We
:00:53. > :00:55.have to challenge that as well. We need to manage migration but it is
:00:56. > :00:57.healthy 40 minute is as well. Thank you for your thoughts today.
:00:58. > :01:04.emotive subject and we have run out of time.
:01:05. > :01:09.On Thursday nominations closed in the 650 parliamentary
:01:10. > :01:11.seats across the country, so now we know exactly who's
:01:12. > :01:19.We've been analysing the parties' candidates to find out
:01:20. > :01:21.what they might tell us about the make-up of the House
:01:22. > :01:26.Well, we know Theresa May is committed to delivering Brexit and
:01:27. > :01:31.analysis of Conservative candidates has shown that
:01:32. > :01:33.in their top 100 target seats, 37 candidates supported leave
:01:34. > :01:41.during last year's referendum campaign
:01:42. > :01:43.and 20 supported remain; 43 have not made public
:01:44. > :01:49.In the last parliament, the vast majority of Labour MPs
:01:50. > :01:52.were hostile to Jeremy Corbyn so how supportive are Labour
:01:53. > :01:58.Well, of 50 of Labour's top 100 target seats
:01:59. > :02:01.17 candidates have expressed support for Mr Corbyn.
:02:02. > :02:05.20 candidates supported Owen Smith in last year's leadership contest
:02:06. > :02:10.or have expressed anti-Corbyn sentiment, and
:02:11. > :02:15.If they won those, the Labour benches would be
:02:16. > :02:18.marginally more sympathetic to Mr Corbyn than they are now.
:02:19. > :02:20.What do the figures tell us about where the other
:02:21. > :02:24.Well, the Lib Dems have decided not to stand against the Greens
:02:25. > :02:26.in Brighton Pavilion, and are fielding 629
:02:27. > :02:28.candidates this year - that's two fewer than 2015.
:02:29. > :02:32.The number of Ukip candidates has fallen dramatically.
:02:33. > :02:38.They are standing in 247 fewer constituencies than 2015,
:02:39. > :02:41.throwing their support behind solidly pro-Brexit Tories
:02:42. > :02:45.in some areas such as Lewes and Norfolk North.
:02:46. > :02:49.The Greens are fielding 103 fewer candidates
:02:50. > :02:59.than at the last election, standing down to help
:03:00. > :03:06.other progressive candidates in some places.
:03:07. > :03:18.The most liking statistic is the demise in Ukip candidates, is this
:03:19. > :03:25.their swansong? And I think so. It is remarkable how few Ukip
:03:26. > :03:28.candidates are standing. It is hard to see they will suddenly revive in
:03:29. > :03:38.the next couple of years. I think this is probably the end. Frank
:03:39. > :03:43.Luntz mentioned the fragmentation of the left was a feature of this
:03:44. > :03:45.election, but also there is the consolidation of the right, and if
:03:46. > :03:50.you take the things together that could explain why the polls are
:03:51. > :03:55.where they are. Absolutely, that's precisely what happened at the start
:03:56. > :04:00.of the 1980s, the right was incredibly united and that's when we
:04:01. > :04:08.started talking about majorities of over 100 or so. No matter what the
:04:09. > :04:12.size of Theresa May's majority, it will be the total collapse of Ukip,
:04:13. > :04:18.but not just because we are now leaving the EU and that was their
:04:19. > :04:22.only reason for being, but a whole lot of people voted for Ukip because
:04:23. > :04:30.they felt the Tories were no longer listening. Theresa May has given the
:04:31. > :04:33.impression that she is listening, and that is the biggest possible
:04:34. > :04:41.thing that could happen to the Tory vote. Fragmentation of the left,
:04:42. > :04:47.consolidation of the right? It's one of the lessons that is never learnt,
:04:48. > :04:52.it happened in the 1980s, it doesn't take much for the whole thing to
:04:53. > :04:58.fracture so now you have on the centre-left the SNP, the Labour
:04:59. > :05:03.Party, the Greens, the Liberal Democrats all competing for the same
:05:04. > :05:06.votes and when you have, fleetingly perhaps, large numbers coalescing on
:05:07. > :05:12.the right in one party, there is only going to be one outcome. It
:05:13. > :05:18.happens regularly. It doesn't mean the Tories haven't got their own
:05:19. > :05:21.fragility. Two years ago, David Cameron and George Osborne the
:05:22. > :05:26.dominant figures, neither are in Parliament now which is a symptom of
:05:27. > :05:31.the fragility this election is disguising. Mrs May's position in a
:05:32. > :05:36.way reminds me of Mrs Thatcher in the 1980s, I won't be outflanked on
:05:37. > :05:40.the right, Nicolas Sarkozy in France, I won't be outflanked on the
:05:41. > :05:44.right, so the National Front didn't get through either timed he ran to
:05:45. > :05:51.the second round on like this time, and now Mrs May on Brexit won't be
:05:52. > :05:55.outflanked Iver and as a result has seen off right flank. And also she
:05:56. > :05:58.is looking to the left as well with some of the state interventions.
:05:59. > :06:01.What was interesting about the analysis you showed a few minutes
:06:02. > :06:07.ago was the number of Tory candidates who have apparently not
:06:08. > :06:11.declared which way they voted in the referendum, and you would have
:06:12. > :06:15.thought if this election was all about Brexit, as some would claim,
:06:16. > :06:20.that would become an unsustainable position, and actually more it's
:06:21. > :06:25.about leadership. But the point that I'm now hearing from a number of
:06:26. > :06:31.Labour candidates that they are seeing Tory leaflets that don't even
:06:32. > :06:36.have the Tory candidate's name on them, it is just about Theresa May.
:06:37. > :06:40.I am glad they are keeping to the law because by law they have to put
:06:41. > :06:46.it on. It has been harder for some of the smaller parties too because
:06:47. > :06:52.of the speed of the election being called. We have the manifesto is
:06:53. > :06:57.coming out this week. I think Labour Forshaw on Tuesday, we are not yet
:06:58. > :07:01.sure when the Tories will bring bears out. I suggest one thing, it
:07:02. > :07:09.will at least for people like me bring an end to the question you
:07:10. > :07:12.will have to wait for the manifesto. And Rebecca Long baby will never
:07:13. > :07:22.have that excuse again, isn't it wonderful! She is not the only one.
:07:23. > :07:27.When you are trying to take the north and Midlands from Labour, I
:07:28. > :07:32.would go to one or the other. For me, I can barely hold back my
:07:33. > :07:36.excitement over the Tory manifesto. This will be, I think, the most
:07:37. > :07:44.important day for the British government for the next five years.
:07:45. > :07:50.That wasn't irony there? You actually meant that? I'm not even
:07:51. > :07:57.being cynical at all on Sunday Politics! This is a huge day and
:07:58. > :08:01.it's because I think we will see... I don't think Mrs May will play it
:08:02. > :08:06.safe and I don't think we will get the broadbrush stuff that she might
:08:07. > :08:11.be advised to do. I think she will lay out precisely what you want to
:08:12. > :08:15.do over the next five years and take some big risks. Then finally after a
:08:16. > :08:20.year of this guessing and theorising, we will finally work out
:08:21. > :08:22.what Mrs May is all about. She will say she doesn't want the next
:08:23. > :08:26.parliament to be all about Brexit, though she knows that's the next
:08:27. > :08:31.important thing she has to deliver in some way, so she gets a mandate
:08:32. > :08:42.for that if the polls are right but she
:08:43. > :08:46.does have very different ideas from Mr Cameron about how to run a
:08:47. > :08:48.country. She will I assume one to mandate for what these different
:08:49. > :08:51.ideas are. Otherwise there is no point in holding an early election.
:08:52. > :08:54.You will get a majority, but if you get a mandate to carry on
:08:55. > :08:58.implementing the Cameron and Osborne manifesto it would be utterly
:08:59. > :09:01.pointless. I agree, it is the pivotal event of the election and it
:09:02. > :09:05.will be interesting to see the degree to which she expands on the
:09:06. > :09:10.line which interests me about its time to look at the good that
:09:11. > :09:17.government can do. Because in a way this moves the debate on in UK
:09:18. > :09:20.politics from, from 97 the Blair Brown governments were insecure
:09:21. > :09:24.about arguing about the role of government. Cameron Osborne
:09:25. > :09:29.government similarly so, so here you have a Labour Party talking about
:09:30. > :09:32.the role of government and the state, and Tory leader apparently
:09:33. > :09:37.doing so was well. I think that will be really interesting to see whether
:09:38. > :09:42.it is fleshed out in any significant way. And it is not a natural Tory
:09:43. > :09:50.message. Harold Macmillan talked about the role of the state, Ted
:09:51. > :09:55.Heath Mark two was pretty big on the state, the industrial policy and so
:09:56. > :09:59.on, and even if it is not thought to be that Tory, does she get away with
:10:00. > :10:04.it because she deliver such a big victory if that's what she does
:10:05. > :10:09.deliver? Just inject a little note of scepticism, I wonder how much of
:10:10. > :10:18.this is authentically Theresa May. I was interested to and talk to
:10:19. > :10:21.someone who used to sit in cabinet meetings during which Theresa May
:10:22. > :10:24.never expressed an opinion on anything outside the Home Office
:10:25. > :10:32.briefs. Other ministers were roving all over their colleagues' briefs.
:10:33. > :10:40.So where are the ideas coming from? I think we can point to Nick
:10:41. > :10:45.Timothy. One of her closest advisers in Downing Street. It will be
:10:46. > :10:51.interesting to see how that evolves. On Thursday I think we will all be
:10:52. > :11:00.talking about something called Urdington Toryism. Urdington is the
:11:01. > :11:05.suburb of Birmingham where Nick Timothy comes from, who is very much
:11:06. > :11:11.Theresa May's policy brain and leading inspiration. Urdington
:11:12. > :11:15.Toryism is about connecting the party with traditional working class
:11:16. > :11:20.voters, and their belief to do that is not just taking away government
:11:21. > :11:24.out of their lives but showing them that government can actually help
:11:25. > :11:36.their lives. It can be a force for good to rebuild the trust. A lot of
:11:37. > :11:39.what Mrs May talks about is all... It is talk and then a lot of it
:11:40. > :11:48.suddenly goes by the wayside. What happened to worker directors on the
:11:49. > :11:53.boards. It is designed to appeal to that constituency and then nothing
:11:54. > :11:58.happens. She had an excuse before in the sense that it wasn't in the 2015
:11:59. > :12:01.manifesto and she had a small majority so therefore she arguably
:12:02. > :12:06.had to water down some of the stuff for example in her Tory conference
:12:07. > :12:11.speech, which had a lot of this active government material in it. If
:12:12. > :12:15.she puts it in the manifesto, it is a sign she plans to do it and will
:12:16. > :12:19.have no excuse if she then gets nervous afterwards because it will
:12:20. > :12:25.be in there. If it wasn't for Brexit, this great overwhelming
:12:26. > :12:28.issue, I think this election will be seen as quite a significant
:12:29. > :12:33.development in terms of an argument around the role of government,
:12:34. > :12:38.much-needed. But Brexit unfortunately overshadows it all. As
:12:39. > :12:41.much as we like our arguments over the role of government we will hear
:12:42. > :12:50.strong and stable, stable and strong ad nauseam, aren't we? Absolutely,
:12:51. > :12:55.and we heard the same old lines from the Labour Party as well so they are
:12:56. > :12:59.all at it. It will be a fascinating week, stop talking it down! Thanks
:13:00. > :13:01.to our panel. The Daily Politics will be
:13:02. > :13:04.back on BBC Two at noon I'll be back here at the same time
:13:05. > :13:08.on BBC One next Sunday. Remember - if it's Sunday,
:13:09. > :13:42.it's the Sunday Politics. When it came to my TV habits,
:13:43. > :13:46.I'd watch anything... But now I can sign in online
:13:47. > :13:50.and get more of what I love. I'm kept up to date
:13:51. > :13:53.with the shows I love and I get suggestions
:13:54. > :13:55.on subjects I'll like. A new personalised BBC
:13:56. > :14:08.is on its way. To tailor the benefits to you,
:14:09. > :14:12.sign in and introduce yourself.