0:00:02 > 0:00:03The Welsh coastline.
0:00:04 > 0:00:07Depths teeming with wonders.
0:00:10 > 0:00:15But there's more to nature than a feast for the eyes.
0:00:15 > 0:00:17In many parts of the world...
0:00:18 > 0:00:21..there's real concern about the effect of over-fishing...
0:00:21 > 0:00:23..on the ocean environment.
0:00:24 > 0:00:27If the seabed is destroyed...
0:00:27 > 0:00:31..it can take a very long time for something similar to return.
0:00:32 > 0:00:37But controversial plans to introduce more conservation...
0:00:37 > 0:00:41..and close parts of the Welsh coastline have caused anger.
0:00:43 > 0:00:47If this error-strewn scheme comes into existence...
0:00:47 > 0:00:51..this is the biggest threat to our community in Lleyn...
0:00:51 > 0:00:53..in living memory.
0:00:54 > 0:00:56These are my wages.
0:00:57 > 0:00:59There wouldn't be any work.
0:01:00 > 0:01:04Tonight, Taro Naw is visiting the first place in Britain...
0:01:05 > 0:01:08..to establish a Marine Conservation Zone...
0:01:08 > 0:01:11..to ask whether a similar scheme in Wales...
0:01:11 > 0:01:13..could undermine communities...
0:01:13 > 0:01:15..while attempting to protect wildlife.
0:01:16 > 0:01:16Subtitles
0:01:16 > 0:01:18Subtitles
0:01:49 > 0:01:51The tip of Lleyn...
0:01:51 > 0:01:55..and a fisherman from the area preparing for a big day.
0:01:56 > 0:02:02He'll be battling politicians in Cardiff Bay and opposing plans...
0:02:02 > 0:02:05..which he feels could change his life forever.
0:02:05 > 0:02:09We're losing a traditional way of living...
0:02:09 > 0:02:13..which has been in my family for six generations.
0:02:14 > 0:02:18I feel I have a duty to protect that way of life...
0:02:18 > 0:02:20..to the end.
0:02:28 > 0:02:32This is the bay where he works every day.
0:02:32 > 0:02:36Colin Evans fishes the sea around Bardsey Island...
0:02:36 > 0:02:39..by using the same methods as his ancestors.
0:02:39 > 0:02:41With static pots.
0:02:43 > 0:02:45This one is perfectly healthy.
0:02:46 > 0:02:51It can go back in and hopefully it'll come back in a year or two.
0:02:51 > 0:02:53It's a male.
0:02:55 > 0:02:58Conservation is our daily life.
0:02:58 > 0:03:03If we over-fish an area or disrespect it in an way...
0:03:03 > 0:03:07..it's not there for us tomorrow or for future generations.
0:03:07 > 0:03:11But that continuity is under threat...
0:03:11 > 0:03:15..if the Welsh Government's consultation on banning...
0:03:15 > 0:03:19..fishing around the island is approved.
0:03:21 > 0:03:26And this is the reason - the rich wildlife.
0:03:26 > 0:03:31It's home to many species and, as a result, there are plans...
0:03:32 > 0:03:34..to create a nature reserve...
0:03:34 > 0:03:37..or Marine Conservation Zone near Bardsey.
0:03:38 > 0:03:42For Colin Evans, who uses the profits from fishing...
0:03:42 > 0:03:46..to subsidise his boat business, which carries goods and visitors...
0:03:46 > 0:03:51..back and forth to the island, it would be a major blow.
0:03:51 > 0:03:56Commercial fishing for crabs and lobsters has existed here...
0:03:56 > 0:03:59..since the mid-18th century, if not earlier.
0:03:59 > 0:04:04The island has relied upon it and still relies upon it today.
0:04:05 > 0:04:07My concern, other than my own livelihood...
0:04:07 > 0:04:12..is that the island will die and we'll lose the community.
0:04:12 > 0:04:15But others are more concerned about the implications...
0:04:15 > 0:04:19..of losing more sea life.
0:04:19 > 0:04:23Across the world, there's concern about environmental damage...
0:04:23 > 0:04:27..climate change and the effects of over-fishing.
0:04:28 > 0:04:32The European parliament wants to introduce more conservation...
0:04:32 > 0:04:38..and strengthen regions which have some regulation, like Cardigan Bay.
0:04:38 > 0:04:42After research carried out by the Countryside Council for Wales...
0:04:42 > 0:04:45..these are the 10 areas under consideration...
0:04:45 > 0:04:47..as Marine Conservation Zones.
0:04:47 > 0:04:51The objective is to agree on three or four possible areas.
0:04:52 > 0:04:54The regulations could be strict.
0:04:54 > 0:04:57No fishing or activities which could damage wildlife.
0:04:57 > 0:05:00The Welsh habitat needs protecting because...
0:05:00 > 0:05:03..even within the protected zones we have...
0:05:03 > 0:05:06..over 50% aren't in favourable conservation status.
0:05:06 > 0:05:09They're being impacted, not only from fishing, but dredging...
0:05:09 > 0:05:13..and the potential of climate change, so we need to...
0:05:13 > 0:05:18..build in some resilience and that's what these sites will do.
0:05:20 > 0:05:22In the Pencaer area of Pembrokeshire...
0:05:22 > 0:05:26..four square kilometres of the sea is under consideration...
0:05:26 > 0:05:29..including Abercastle Bay.
0:05:30 > 0:05:33Neville George is a crab and lobster fisherman.
0:05:33 > 0:05:37He says eight local fisherman with small boats...
0:05:37 > 0:05:41..who work for themselves, could be affected.
0:05:41 > 0:05:47I fish a mile down the coast and I'm in the thick of it.
0:05:47 > 0:05:49These are my wages.
0:05:50 > 0:05:54There wouldn't be any work.
0:05:55 > 0:05:57It's not just the fishermen.
0:05:58 > 0:06:02It's also the people we buy the bait and pots from...
0:06:02 > 0:06:04..the buyers.
0:06:04 > 0:06:06There are a lot of people involved.
0:06:08 > 0:06:11The Government wants to reduce the impact on the sea...
0:06:11 > 0:06:16..to promote biodiversity, rather than protecting specific species.
0:06:16 > 0:06:20The fishermen are worried that they will be pushed to work...
0:06:20 > 0:06:23..in nearby areas and intensify the fishing there.
0:06:23 > 0:06:29The fishermen argue against change if there's no environmental damage.
0:06:29 > 0:06:32There's no scientific evidence at all.
0:06:32 > 0:06:37We go on the sea every day and the crabs and lobsters are good.
0:06:37 > 0:06:41The mackerel are good. I'd say the stocks are good.
0:06:41 > 0:06:48They say otherwise, but they don't have the evidence.
0:06:51 > 0:06:55Anthony Harris is a builder who has enjoyed fishing...
0:06:55 > 0:06:59..from the coast and on the sea since he was young.
0:07:01 > 0:07:04Leisure time is important.
0:07:06 > 0:07:11It's what my brother and I did when we were young boys.
0:07:11 > 0:07:15We'd cycle to Strumble Head and to Abermawr and Aberbach...
0:07:15 > 0:07:17..with lunch boxes from Mam.
0:07:17 > 0:07:23We'd spend all day, every day, enjoying ourselves on the rocks.
0:07:24 > 0:07:26But under the proposals...
0:07:27 > 0:07:30..this would have to stop if Abercastle was chosen.
0:07:30 > 0:07:36Fishing as a hobby, from land or a boat, could be banned.
0:07:37 > 0:07:41The feeling locally is that far more would be lost.
0:07:41 > 0:07:45I couldn't ask for a better life than this.
0:07:45 > 0:07:49Being out, doing something we've enjoyed for years...
0:07:50 > 0:07:52..especially with the boys...
0:07:52 > 0:07:57..catching fish, enjoying the views, the fresh air...
0:07:57 > 0:08:01..and everything this area gives us.
0:08:02 > 0:08:04Where are the fish today?
0:08:05 > 0:08:10It's about socialising, keeping the community together...
0:08:10 > 0:08:13..to enjoy what we have here.
0:08:14 > 0:08:17It would be very sad to lose that.
0:08:18 > 0:08:22It's not just fishing which is under threat.
0:08:22 > 0:08:27The consultation lists all kinds of activities...
0:08:27 > 0:08:32..like pedalos, walking the quay and riding horses on the beaches...
0:08:32 > 0:08:34..if they affect wildlife.
0:08:34 > 0:08:38That's how foolish these plans are...
0:08:38 > 0:08:42..and how much common sense they lack.
0:08:42 > 0:08:45Banning such activities would affect...
0:08:45 > 0:08:50..local people and visitors in these tourist areas.
0:08:50 > 0:08:53Although the Welsh Government has promised to consider...
0:08:54 > 0:08:56..economic and social factors...
0:08:56 > 0:09:01..there has been strong opposition in many coastal communities.
0:09:01 > 0:09:05If visitors found out that the Lleyn Peninsula is closed...
0:09:05 > 0:09:07..they wouldn't come.
0:09:07 > 0:09:11We would lose our tourism industry overnight.
0:09:12 > 0:09:17If this continues, people might buy boats and go elsewhere.
0:09:17 > 0:09:22The cost is a stamp and two minutes to write a letter.
0:09:23 > 0:09:27The cost of not doing that is a serious blow to the area.
0:09:29 > 0:09:31The Countryside Council and the government...
0:09:32 > 0:09:34..have explained that many of the activities...
0:09:34 > 0:09:38..protestors were worried about won't be banned...
0:09:38 > 0:09:43..such as building sand castles on beaches and swimming in the sea.
0:09:43 > 0:09:47But the uncertainty has made it difficult to win the support...
0:09:47 > 0:09:50..of communities which could be affected...
0:09:50 > 0:09:54..and has failed to calm many people's fears.
0:09:55 > 0:09:58However, environmentalists are emphasising the purpose...
0:09:58 > 0:10:00..and size of the zones.
0:10:00 > 0:10:05These are conservation measures, not fisheries measures.
0:10:05 > 0:10:10We'll see benefits, not only from the wildlife point of view...
0:10:10 > 0:10:14..but improved fisheries will also improve the Welsh economy.
0:10:14 > 0:10:18It is less than 1% of the marine environment.
0:10:18 > 0:10:23Many tropical countries have been dealing with the problem for years.
0:10:23 > 0:10:26If they work overseas without affecting the communities...
0:10:26 > 0:10:30..are we in Wales making an unnecessary fuss?
0:10:38 > 0:10:40In the Severn Estuary is an island...
0:10:41 > 0:10:44..which could show the way forward for the Welsh coastline.
0:10:44 > 0:10:47It's home to all kinds of wildlife.
0:10:53 > 0:10:57Twelve miles off the North Devon coast...
0:10:57 > 0:11:00..is a well-known nature reserve.
0:11:03 > 0:11:07It's the first in Britain to be free of any human interference.
0:11:07 > 0:11:10Ten years since the experiment started...
0:11:10 > 0:11:14..Lundy Island is a successful Marine Conservation Zone.
0:11:14 > 0:11:18One person who has followed developments there for decades...
0:11:18 > 0:11:22..is the marine biologist, Professor Tegwyn Harris.
0:11:22 > 0:11:25If the seabed is destroyed...
0:11:26 > 0:11:31..it can take a very long time for something similar to return.
0:11:32 > 0:11:35There are different levels of conservation...
0:11:36 > 0:11:41..and activities which don't cause damage are permitted in some areas.
0:11:41 > 0:11:45That is where the most protected Marine Zone is.
0:11:46 > 0:11:49In the four square kilometres on this side...
0:11:50 > 0:11:53..everything except diving and swimming is banned...
0:11:53 > 0:11:58..including mooring boats, which is what's being considered in Wales.
0:11:58 > 0:12:03The aim is to prevent the seabed being damaged by man...
0:12:03 > 0:12:06..and there are other obvious advantages.
0:12:06 > 0:12:10Fish are easily frightened...
0:12:11 > 0:12:15..and you can have shoals of fish avoiding specific places...
0:12:15 > 0:12:20..because they are frightened time and again.
0:12:20 > 0:12:24If you remove those factors, then the fish will return...
0:12:24 > 0:12:30..and that can affect animals like seals, which eat the fish.
0:12:30 > 0:12:33The effects can spread...
0:12:33 > 0:12:36..way beyond the original objective.
0:12:37 > 0:12:41According to a study on the Marine Zone, within five years...
0:12:42 > 0:12:46..there were four times more lobsters of commercial size.
0:12:46 > 0:12:50The evidence suggests that has a positive impact on nearby areas...
0:12:50 > 0:12:53..where some forms of fishing are allowed.
0:12:53 > 0:13:00The result is that underwater life around this island has increased.
0:13:00 > 0:13:05Even the animals people are allowed to fish have increased.
0:13:05 > 0:13:09It's improved the fisheries for lobsters, for example.
0:13:09 > 0:13:13They are protected so well...
0:13:13 > 0:13:16..around this island...
0:13:16 > 0:13:19..that more of them survive...
0:13:20 > 0:13:23..and grow big enough to be eaten.
0:13:23 > 0:13:28They move out of the areas where they're born...
0:13:28 > 0:13:31..and they get caught.
0:13:32 > 0:13:35It's not just fishermen who are affected.
0:13:35 > 0:13:38Lundy Island is further from the mainland...
0:13:39 > 0:13:41..than the areas being considered in Wales.
0:13:42 > 0:13:45But the island has benefited from its special status.
0:13:45 > 0:13:49Some ten years down the line, what we're seeing here...
0:13:49 > 0:13:52..is that tourism has actually benefited greatly...
0:13:52 > 0:13:57..from the zone because a lot of divers now come to Lundy...
0:13:57 > 0:14:00..where they may have gone somewhere else.
0:14:00 > 0:14:05We're seeing an increase in tourism directly as a result of the zone...
0:14:05 > 0:14:07..and the wider Marine Nature Reserve.
0:14:07 > 0:14:11Nature is not black and white.
0:14:11 > 0:14:14Of the 20 species used in the Lundy study...
0:14:14 > 0:14:18..only three saw a change since the restrictions came to force...
0:14:18 > 0:14:22..all of which used to be fished.
0:14:22 > 0:14:26And while lobster numbers have increased significantly...
0:14:26 > 0:14:31..red eyed crab numbers, eaten by the lobsters, have declined.
0:14:31 > 0:14:34Scientifically, it's too early to assess...
0:14:34 > 0:14:39..the ecological effects of the reserve and celebrate success.
0:14:39 > 0:14:44The fishermen report back that they've seen larger lobsters...
0:14:44 > 0:14:48..but they tend to be male lobsters.
0:14:48 > 0:14:51Lobsters are predatory and cannibalistic...
0:14:52 > 0:14:54..and they eat their own stock.
0:14:54 > 0:14:59The large males have been eating the smaller females so we wonder...
0:14:59 > 0:15:03..how long this explosion of lobsters will continue.
0:15:03 > 0:15:07But what do spill out into the adjacent area...
0:15:07 > 0:15:12..it's such a small area that the amount of lobsters is going to...
0:15:13 > 0:15:17..make an insignificant benefit to the incomes of those fishermen.
0:15:20 > 0:15:23Back in Wales and, unlike Lundy Island...
0:15:23 > 0:15:26..there are complaints of a lack of consultation.
0:15:26 > 0:15:29The general reaction of fishermen in Lleyn was anger...
0:15:30 > 0:15:34..as they filled a questionnaire on the possible effects on them.
0:15:34 > 0:15:38The authorities say there were plenty of meetings...
0:15:38 > 0:15:40..to discuss the proposals...
0:15:40 > 0:15:45..and that there will be further consultation before moving forward.
0:15:46 > 0:15:49The fishermen wanted to be consulted sooner...
0:15:49 > 0:15:53..before the possibility of banning fishing in some areas was chosen.
0:15:54 > 0:15:57It wasn't published. We didn't know it was happening.
0:15:57 > 0:16:02We didn't get a chance to express our views at that time...
0:16:02 > 0:16:07..and that is when the damage was done, to be honest.
0:16:08 > 0:16:13I've told them to come out with us and see how it's done.
0:16:13 > 0:16:16We don't want to destroy anything.
0:16:16 > 0:16:18Did anyone come?
0:16:18 > 0:16:19No.
0:16:20 > 0:16:21No-one.
0:16:22 > 0:16:24At one meeting in Pembrokeshire...
0:16:24 > 0:16:28..we understand the residents of Abercastle were surprised...
0:16:28 > 0:16:31..when representatives from the Welsh Government...
0:16:31 > 0:16:34..acknowledged they had never visited the area.
0:16:34 > 0:16:37We asked the government whether they had visited...
0:16:37 > 0:16:41..any of the ten areas being considered to learn about...
0:16:41 > 0:16:43..the community and the possible effects...
0:16:44 > 0:16:46..the Marine Zones could have.
0:16:46 > 0:16:50A spokesperson told us that Welsh Government officials...
0:16:50 > 0:16:53..weren't aware of any formal visits...
0:16:53 > 0:16:57..to any of the ten areas.
0:17:01 > 0:17:04There may be lessons to be learnt abroad.
0:17:04 > 0:17:07Tanzania in east Africa has a Marine Conservation Zone...
0:17:08 > 0:17:12..to protect one of the richest marine habitats in the world.
0:17:14 > 0:17:19One person who helped establish the Marine Zones...
0:17:19 > 0:17:24..in Tanzania during the 1990s says they have been a success...
0:17:24 > 0:17:26..with the help of one vital element.
0:17:27 > 0:17:31We made sure we communicated with local people.
0:17:31 > 0:17:34That process took around two years.
0:17:34 > 0:17:38Without their support through that communication...
0:17:38 > 0:17:40..I don't know if it's possible.
0:17:41 > 0:17:45Dr Evans and his team were in daily contact with the local people...
0:17:46 > 0:17:50..to prevent damaging methods of fishing, such as using dynamite.
0:17:50 > 0:17:54Because they were using big boats, they had to establish...
0:17:54 > 0:17:57..a partnership with local people.
0:17:57 > 0:18:02You have so many people, including the fishermen, backing the idea.
0:18:02 > 0:18:05They have the right to fish in certain places...
0:18:05 > 0:18:08..if they do it in a sustainable way...
0:18:08 > 0:18:12..and respect the conservation regulations.
0:18:12 > 0:18:15They need the place to work for them.
0:18:15 > 0:18:19With so many communities backing this idea...
0:18:19 > 0:18:22..you have hundreds of police officers.
0:18:22 > 0:18:27You only need a few people to see something like this happening.
0:18:27 > 0:18:32They won't stop it every time, but 90 times out of 100...
0:18:32 > 0:18:35..with information, radios, simple equipment...
0:18:36 > 0:18:41..you can call the enforcement officer into the area...
0:18:41 > 0:18:44..and, after five years, it stopped.
0:18:46 > 0:18:48There are similar complaints in Wales.
0:18:49 > 0:18:52During the night, boats come into our waters...
0:18:52 > 0:18:55..with more damaging fishing methods...
0:18:55 > 0:18:59..like trawling with nets which scrape the seabed.
0:18:59 > 0:19:03Some are calling for this to be stopped...
0:19:03 > 0:19:07..rather than the protection of areas rich in wildlife.
0:19:07 > 0:19:10When the scallops season starts...
0:19:10 > 0:19:15..boats from all over the UK will come to Wales, to Cardigan Bay...
0:19:15 > 0:19:18..and they will trawl up and down.
0:19:19 > 0:19:23They come into the Special Area of Conservation illegally at night...
0:19:24 > 0:19:29..around a mile from land, and then they leave.
0:19:29 > 0:19:33The Government can't do anything about it.
0:19:33 > 0:19:38They say they are monitoring it, sometimes with the RAF or Navy...
0:19:38 > 0:19:43..and they monitor it at times, but you say it doesn't happen.
0:19:43 > 0:19:45It doesn't happen enough.
0:19:46 > 0:19:49According to Welsh Government statistics...
0:19:49 > 0:19:53..seven captains of boats were successfully prosecuted in 2010.
0:19:53 > 0:19:55Six last year.
0:19:55 > 0:19:58The guilty fishermen came from Wales...
0:19:58 > 0:20:00..England, Scotland and other European countries.
0:20:00 > 0:20:04The majority were guilty of breaking fishing laws...
0:20:04 > 0:20:07..six miles or more out at sea.
0:20:08 > 0:20:12Cardiff Bay, and members of the Welsh Fishing Association...
0:20:12 > 0:20:17..putting forward their proposals for the Marine Conservation Zones.
0:20:17 > 0:20:22They suggest working together to police the Marine Zones...
0:20:22 > 0:20:25..but call for areas which would allow...
0:20:25 > 0:20:28..sustainable methods of traditional fishing.
0:20:28 > 0:20:30The Welsh Government promised...
0:20:30 > 0:20:35..that the fishermen's economic and social views would be considered...
0:20:35 > 0:20:39..along with the 7,000 replies received during the first...
0:20:39 > 0:20:42..consultation period.
0:20:42 > 0:20:46The Striking the Balance document is very valuable for us...
0:20:46 > 0:20:50..as part of that engagement and part of that process.
0:20:50 > 0:20:54The title, Striking the Balance, is absolutely what we're trying to do.
0:20:55 > 0:20:57Following the dispute...
0:20:57 > 0:21:03..it is acknowledged that they are better off working together.
0:21:03 > 0:21:06That's the view of an academic who is carrying out...
0:21:06 > 0:21:10..a three-year government study of Welsh fisheries.
0:21:10 > 0:21:13It will provide some suggestions on the best way...
0:21:14 > 0:21:16..to adopt sustainable fishing methods.
0:21:16 > 0:21:19We could look into more spatial-based management...
0:21:19 > 0:21:24..and protect areas to which there is a greater threat...
0:21:24 > 0:21:28..and then areas which are quite resilient...
0:21:28 > 0:21:31..we can allow some activities to continue.
0:21:31 > 0:21:36Evidently, some of these activities have been around the Welsh coats...
0:21:36 > 0:21:40..for quite a while and they haven't done any harm...
0:21:40 > 0:21:43..so that would be the way forward.
0:21:43 > 0:21:46Unless the Assembly provides the resources...
0:21:46 > 0:21:49..to employ a team of people to police it...
0:21:50 > 0:21:51..how will it work?
0:21:53 > 0:21:56The Welsh Government's plans have angered many.
0:21:56 > 0:21:59We wanted to speak to the Environment Minister...
0:21:59 > 0:22:03..John Griffiths, whose department is responsible for the proposals...
0:22:03 > 0:22:06..and will decide on the next step, but he refused.
0:22:07 > 0:22:10We also wanted to speak to the agency which advised...
0:22:10 > 0:22:13..the government and carried out scientific research...
0:22:13 > 0:22:16..the Countryside Council...
0:22:16 > 0:22:21..but they refused because the minister wouldn't be interviewed.
0:22:22 > 0:22:25The Government's next step is getting closer.
0:22:25 > 0:22:29It's committed to establishing Conservation Zones...
0:22:29 > 0:22:33..and feels strongly that something must be done.
0:22:33 > 0:22:38The big question is what sort of regulations will be introduced?
0:22:38 > 0:22:41We mustn't miss this opportunity.
0:22:41 > 0:22:44We can't let the Government bury this...
0:22:44 > 0:22:46..and make no changes.
0:22:47 > 0:22:51We have an opportunity to create a new form of marine conservation...
0:22:51 > 0:22:55..but I don't think Conservation Zones are the way forward.
0:23:19 > 0:23:21S4C subtitled by Red Bee Media Ltd
0:23:22 > 0:23:22.