:00:38. > :00:41.Hello all. It's day for thinking back, hard
:00:41. > :00:46.day for those who have lost people they loved on 9/11, and in the
:00:46. > :00:50.attacks and wars that followed, tens or hundreds of thousands of
:00:50. > :00:55.people dead. It is also a time to think about the future, that was
:00:55. > :01:00.taken from us, by Osama Bin Laden. A world by still had robust civil
:01:00. > :01:05.liberties in the west, and the Twin Towers, but also, perhaps, had
:01:05. > :01:10.Saddam Hussein's Iraq, and the Afghanistan of the Taliban. A world
:01:10. > :01:15.where names like Abu Ghraib, and Guantanamo Bay meant nothing much.
:01:15. > :01:19.Where passengers in airports never had to take off shoes or belts or
:01:19. > :01:22.be patted down. And a world in which where we argued about the
:01:22. > :01:27.legacies of George Bush and Tony Blair, we were thinking about
:01:27. > :01:31.mangled syntax, or Northern Ireland. We will never know, but it was
:01:31. > :01:36.probably a gentler, rather more innocent future that was stolen
:01:36. > :01:42.from us all ten years ago. There is a lot of very good writing
:01:42. > :01:50.about it in today's papers. Looking through it are the former US State
:01:50. > :01:53.Department official, and Charles Kennedy a vocal critic on the war
:01:53. > :01:57.in Iraq. In a few hours President Obama will lead Americans in a
:01:57. > :02:03.ceremony at Ground Zero in New York. Here, one major poll suggests most
:02:03. > :02:08.people think there is still a war on terror going on. And they tend
:02:08. > :02:14.to think it is being won. Among my guests the boss of the company that
:02:14. > :02:20.lost most of its employees, 658 people, and only survived himself
:02:20. > :02:23.by a strange quirk of fate, Howard Lutnick's strange tale. And US
:02:23. > :02:27.Ambassador to the UK, Louise Susman, also in New York on that terrible
:02:27. > :02:29.morning. We will talk about some other
:02:29. > :02:33.British dilemmas as well, an announcement that people in work
:02:33. > :02:37.are going to be working for longer, and tough new plans for people who
:02:37. > :02:42.aren't in work. All of that with the Work and Pensions Secretary,
:02:43. > :02:47.Iain Duncan Smith, whose hopes for radical change are challenged, of
:02:47. > :02:51.course, by the pretty grim state of the economy. Also the main topic at
:02:51. > :02:56.the TUC conference which starts in London. I will talk to Len
:02:56. > :02:59.McCluskey, Eider of the biggest union, Unite, who is warning about
:02:59. > :03:04.every conceivable form of action against the Government, from
:03:04. > :03:09.strikes to civil disobedience. We will end, despite all of that, on a
:03:09. > :03:18.note of harmony. I'm joined by the great British soprano, Susan
:03:18. > :03:22.Bullock, fresh from the Proms, who will be performing for us.
:03:23. > :03:26.Many different voices. First the news.
:03:26. > :03:32.Good morning, America is preparing to mark the tenth anniversary of
:03:32. > :03:34.the 9/11 attacks which killed nearly 3,000 people in New York,
:03:34. > :03:39.Washington and Pennsylvania. An official memorial to those who died
:03:39. > :03:44.will be unveiled at the site of the World Trade Center, whose Twin
:03:44. > :03:47.Towers were destroyed in the attacks. The ceremony will take
:03:47. > :03:52.place amid tight security. We joined people gathering there
:03:52. > :03:56.late last night. As darkness fell on Ground Zero,
:03:56. > :04:00.they kept coming. New Yorkers, tourists, those in uniform.
:04:00. > :04:06.All drawn here by the almost magnetic pull of this place.
:04:06. > :04:11.Shining above them, ten years on, Twin Towers of light. It is amazing,
:04:11. > :04:15.now that ten years later, there is a building that is erected, we are
:04:15. > :04:20.celebrating that we have been strong, and you know, people are
:04:20. > :04:24.very emotional. It is tough, yeah, it really is. But America, you
:04:24. > :04:29.can't break the Spirit of America. Today's anniversary will play out
:04:29. > :04:32.amid the tightest of security. Following an intelligence tip,
:04:32. > :04:35.which suggested Al-Qaeda intends to attack New York or Washington,
:04:35. > :04:45.using a vehicle bomb. The authorities still don't know
:04:45. > :04:45.
:04:45. > :04:49.whether a plot is active. The ceremonies are going ahead, in
:04:49. > :04:54.Pennsylvania yesterday, two former Presidents led tributes to the
:04:54. > :05:01.passengers and crew of United Flight 93, who brought down their
:05:01. > :05:07.plain here, after overpouring four hijackers. One of the lessons of
:05:07. > :05:10.9/11 is evil is real and so is courage. What happened above this
:05:10. > :05:14.Pennsylvania field ranks among the most courageous acts in American
:05:14. > :05:19.history. From start to finish, the September
:05:19. > :05:24.11th attacks lasted less than two hours, planes used as missiles,
:05:24. > :05:29.almost 3,000 lives lost. The effects of what happened here are
:05:29. > :05:33.still reverberating, both in America, and a world away, in Iraq,
:05:33. > :05:38.and Afghanistan. This cemetery was covered in debris,
:05:38. > :05:43.some places six inches to a foot, it was an alien landscape in many
:05:43. > :05:47.respects. Ten years ago, Lyndon Harris was a priest at the
:05:47. > :05:53.ebusiness cop pal chapel facing Ground Zero. As then, now the
:05:53. > :05:57.church has become a focus for those seeking meaning. I believe that
:05:57. > :06:03.love wins, hope and resurrection, I know that some how in the mercy of
:06:03. > :06:07.God, even this tragedy is being healed. So the giant cranes
:06:07. > :06:13.rebuilding Ground Zero, have fallen silent as America pauses. Later
:06:13. > :06:18.President Obama will join a simple ceremony beside two reflecting
:06:18. > :06:22.pools, built where the towers once stood.
:06:22. > :06:27.Remembrances services will also be held around the UK today, to mark
:06:27. > :06:31.the tenth anniversary of 9/11, wreaths will be laid at the
:06:31. > :06:35.memorial garden in Grosvenor Square near the US Embassy in central
:06:35. > :06:39.London. Service also also take place at St Paul's Cathedral, in
:06:39. > :06:43.Birmingham Truro and Exeter. The leader of Libya's National
:06:44. > :06:47.Transitional Council, Abdul Jalil, is in Tripoli for the first time,
:06:47. > :06:51.since forces opposed to Colonel Gaddafi, took over the capital last
:06:51. > :06:56.month. Speaking after his arrival last night, he told supporters they
:06:56. > :06:59.should direct all their energies towards liberating the remaining
:06:59. > :07:03.Gaddafi strongholds. The leaders of Israel and Egypt have pledged their
:07:03. > :07:06.support for the peace treaty between the two countries, despite
:07:06. > :07:11.the attack on the Israeli Embassy in Cairo. Three people died after
:07:11. > :07:15.protestors stormed the building on Friday. The Egyptian Government has
:07:15. > :07:20.accused activists of damaging the country's international reputation.
:07:20. > :07:23.It says, they will be tried in emergency courts.
:07:23. > :07:27.Here, on the eve of the annual Trades Union Congress, the leader
:07:27. > :07:29.of Britain's biggest union has called on a union movement to
:07:29. > :07:33.mobilise against the Government's programme of cuts.
:07:33. > :07:38.Len McCluskey, the general secretary of Unite, told the
:07:38. > :07:41.Observer newspaper, that every form of protest should be considered,
:07:41. > :07:51.including non-violent civil disobedience and co-ordinated
:07:51. > :07:57.strike action. That is all from me. Front pages today. I think the most
:07:57. > :08:02.striking 9/11 front page is the Independent on Sunday. Advertise
:08:02. > :08:06.ago very good essay by its distinguished journalist, Rupert
:08:06. > :08:10.Cornwall. Lots of white space, it is called The Lost Decade. The
:08:10. > :08:17.Observer has strong stories today, a lot of papers with strong stories,
:08:17. > :08:21.it is a good news day. That is the pensions story, saying that Steve
:08:21. > :08:25.Webb says, the Pensions Minister, says we will be told to work
:08:25. > :08:28.considerably longer earlier than we realised. I will ask Iain Duncan
:08:28. > :08:32.Smith about that, and we have the Len McCluskey interview. The Sunday
:08:32. > :08:36.Times, one of many papers picking up more and more stories about the
:08:36. > :08:40.embarrassing and some would say, shameful connections between
:08:40. > :08:46.British politicians and Gaddafi's regime. Lots and lots of stuff
:08:46. > :08:49.coming out on bits of paper in Tripoli about that. The top tax 50%
:08:49. > :08:54.raises nothing, says the fiscal studies institute. We will be
:08:54. > :08:58.talking about that too later on. Finally, the Sunday Telegraph,
:08:58. > :09:01.interesting story, the secret life of the if anythingive Lib Dem donor.
:09:01. > :09:05.You might remember Michael Brown, who gave the Liberal Democrats huge
:09:05. > :09:11.amounts of money, and turned out to be almost certainly a serious
:09:11. > :09:14.fraudster, skipped, disappeared, and has now been tracked down to a
:09:14. > :09:19.Caribbean hideaway by the Sunday Telegraph. Many things to discuss
:09:19. > :09:25.today. Thank you for coming in.
:09:25. > :09:29.Colleen, as a former official yourself, as well as a leading
:09:30. > :09:32.figure in Republicans Abroad, an important day for all Americans
:09:32. > :09:36.today. Very much so, and the papers are,
:09:36. > :09:40.as you would guess, filled with many stories about 9/11. The
:09:40. > :09:44.Telegraph has a six-page special, and just when you think you are
:09:44. > :09:47.immune to it all, you read another story about a missed meeting that
:09:47. > :09:55.saved their life, or a phone call that put them in touch with their
:09:55. > :09:58.loved one who they would never hear from again. Very strong stories,
:09:58. > :10:04.and coverage of what will be happening in Washington, New York
:10:04. > :10:07.and fill Delphiia. On the other side, we have Fukiama, who talk
:10:07. > :10:13.about putting it into perspective, and 9/11 will not be what we
:10:13. > :10:17.remember from this decade, it will be the rise of China. Then there is
:10:17. > :10:26.another story that modesty prevents me from mention, but Charles?
:10:26. > :10:33.That's my cue. Colleen has an article, if nothing else it sparks
:10:34. > :10:36.debate, diplomatically, shall we say b the legacy, the aftermath of
:10:36. > :10:46.the terrible decade for New York and elsewhere in the states. Which
:10:46. > :10:47.
:10:47. > :10:50.is that led on to the war in Iraq, and all the things we occupy
:10:50. > :10:55.ourself at. We come from radically different perspectives. You were
:10:55. > :11:00.one of the earliest and most vocal opponents of Tony Blair's war plans
:11:00. > :11:05.at that time? I remember getting criticised, the events of ten years
:11:05. > :11:11.ago, you mentioned at the Lib Dem conference this year, and ten years
:11:11. > :11:15.it was the same thing. We forget the dreadful international impact
:11:15. > :11:20.of what took place for a while. For several days we were sitting there,
:11:20. > :11:25.Tony Blair and myself were sitting there and we didn't know if we
:11:25. > :11:30.could have a party conference season. You didn't know if there
:11:30. > :11:34.would be a kas said of attacks, you didn't know if this was one after
:11:34. > :11:39.another? Yes, you are talking about George Bush's strategy, there was
:11:39. > :11:42.an excellent programme on during the week on the Geographic Channel,
:11:42. > :11:45.he's accounting in a very impressive way the events of the
:11:45. > :11:51.day. He said when he heard of the news of the first plane, terrible
:11:51. > :11:54.accident, second plane, terrorism, third plane, we're at war, then, of
:11:54. > :12:00.course everything changed. Although you might not go entirely with the
:12:00. > :12:04.headline that is there. No war is good. "it was a good war ".
:12:04. > :12:07.Nonetheless, you would argue what came out of it, the Iraq war?
:12:07. > :12:10.was the catalyst for the Arab Spring, that once people in the
:12:10. > :12:14.Middle East, we look at Iraq through different i, but for the
:12:14. > :12:18.Middle East, here was a henchman who had an iron grip on the region
:12:18. > :12:24.forever, when they saw him crumble and fall, it was just that first
:12:24. > :12:27.crack in the edifice, that empowered others to say, you know,
:12:27. > :12:31.there is actually an alternative vision for the Middle East. That
:12:32. > :12:34.was Bush's freedom agenda, which people scoffed at at the time, but
:12:34. > :12:39.the fact is it is happening now, and we never believed it would
:12:39. > :12:45.happen. There are many other factors including the use of
:12:45. > :12:50.internet and cellphone, but you can see along the way, to the changes
:12:50. > :12:58.in Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and Egyptian, fledgling reforms that
:12:58. > :13:01.leads up to this point. The images are astonishing, but you need the
:13:01. > :13:07.perspective that good writing in the newspaper gives you.
:13:07. > :13:13.Let's turn to politics, the Liberal Democrats conference coming up, and
:13:13. > :13:17.helpfully we have the faut lines provided here between David Cameron
:13:17. > :13:22.and Nick Clegg? Another iconic photograph, the first coalition
:13:22. > :13:25.spring of 15 months ago, the two of them doing that initial joint press
:13:25. > :13:31.conference in Downing Street. And of course a lot of water has gone
:13:31. > :13:35.under the bridge in the 15 months. Just as this is a day to stand
:13:35. > :13:39.shoulder-to-shoulder with all Americans. The media focuses how
:13:39. > :13:42.much are these two guys standing shoulder-to-shoulder now, after the
:13:42. > :13:46.experience of Government and some of the very tough times they have
:13:46. > :13:50.been through. What is interesting about this, about this kind of
:13:50. > :13:54.analysis, our opposite numbers in continental politics in Europe, for
:13:54. > :13:58.whom coalition is the norm, rather than the exception, they all say
:13:58. > :14:02.one of the things you have to deal with and get used to is that the
:14:02. > :14:04.press are going to be almost exclusively focused on every
:14:04. > :14:07.persuceptible difference between you and the other party of
:14:07. > :14:11.coalition, and in fact, I personally think the more
:14:11. > :14:14.interesting thing, both from a Lib Dem and Conservative and an
:14:14. > :14:16.observer's point of view is actually the differences within the
:14:17. > :14:21.parties, not just across the coalition.
:14:21. > :14:25.The press don't have to work very hard to find the differences, as
:14:25. > :14:28.you would acknowledge. I wonder on that, which is the most important
:14:28. > :14:38.current argument between the coalition partners for you? Given
:14:38. > :14:43.that it is the "economy stupid", to quote a former American Pastoral
:14:43. > :14:49.President, I think the economics won't go away, and all the other
:14:49. > :14:53.policies are very dependant on how that goes.
:14:53. > :14:59.In the Mail on Sunday there is an article suggesting that bankers
:14:59. > :15:03.should be paid much less and so on. But to a certain extent, is a lot
:15:03. > :15:06.of this just window dressing, in other words Nick Clegg and the
:15:06. > :15:09.Conservative ministers? This is the Machiavellian interpretation.
:15:09. > :15:13.get together and say there is a party conference, let's get a few
:15:13. > :15:18.row, get it into the papers, David Cameron says yes, Nick I know you
:15:18. > :15:21.have to say this, and Nick says, David Cameron I know you have to
:15:21. > :15:26.have something Euro-sceptic. Once the conference season is over, it
:15:26. > :15:30.is back to business as usual? strategy. I'm not in the loophole
:15:30. > :15:33.of those kind of discussions. is high-level plotting. I think it
:15:33. > :15:36.is well understood, it is adult politics, afterall, in the run up
:15:36. > :15:40.to the conference season you have to think of your own constituency,
:15:40. > :15:46.your own party membership. I think there has been a genuine shift
:15:46. > :15:48.within the Lib Dems, post the electoral setbacks of May, that we
:15:49. > :15:52.have to emphasise more our own identity. I think that is coming
:15:52. > :15:56.through. As a working entity, I have thought from day one, and
:15:56. > :15:59.everybody knows I was, shall we say, at the sceptical end of this
:15:59. > :16:04.coalition, I didn't vote for it being formed, but I have always
:16:04. > :16:07.felt it would see the course, I haven't changed my view. Let's turn
:16:07. > :16:12.to another story running in different papers, the Sunday Times
:16:12. > :16:20.has front page, Cameron told to get tough with Russia, almost the same
:16:20. > :16:24.in the Observers? There are - Observer? Several papers are
:16:24. > :16:28.covering this. When Cameron goes to Moscow he will be there today and
:16:28. > :16:31.tomorrow, he has to communicate the porpbts of human rights,
:16:31. > :16:37.particularly in - importance of human rights, particularly in lieu
:16:37. > :16:42.of the businessmen, lawyers, journalists killed, missing and
:16:42. > :16:48.attacked. This in particular talk about the Russian who was revealing
:16:48. > :16:53.the largest tax fraud in the history of Russia, Magnitzki, he
:16:53. > :16:58.was tortured and killed, and yet Britain has not said anything about
:16:58. > :17:02.this. Secretary of State Clinton has put in place, I think, it is 60
:17:02. > :17:08.travel bans, frozen assets and so the call from all of the British
:17:08. > :17:18.papers are that Cameron needs to get tough, and it is not just on
:17:18. > :17:20.
:17:20. > :17:28.him but it is on Litvenko, and others. We have the BRICK countries
:17:28. > :17:33.and now we have the BIC countries, because of human rights violations.
:17:33. > :17:36.This in the east is a very profound story, I happen to be one of the
:17:36. > :17:41.all-party representatives now from the British parliament on the
:17:41. > :17:43.Council of Europe, just last week we had a meeting where
:17:43. > :17:48.representatives of freedom associations and campaigner about
:17:48. > :17:53.this particular case were meeting with the council to take it up on
:17:53. > :17:57.the human rights basis, Senator McCain is one of those supporting
:17:57. > :18:01.in Washington, it is a very big story. Just as the Middle East is
:18:01. > :18:06.moving towards democracy, Russia falling back like this is not.
:18:06. > :18:09.contact with Putin in the two, which is an amazing revelation.
:18:09. > :18:19.helpful story, no doubt from the Sunday Telegraph for your party.
:18:19. > :18:19.
:18:19. > :18:25.Talking about amazing revelations. Michael Brown in Puerto Plata in
:18:25. > :18:29.the Dominican Republic. We don't have an extradition freety. There
:18:29. > :18:35.is lots of pick - Treaty. There is lots of pictures of his home life
:18:35. > :18:40.and the high life and all that. Your party has money from this man
:18:40. > :18:44.and hasn't handed it back? It was long since spent. I was leader when
:18:44. > :18:48.the donation was given. Although they were very careful, we were
:18:49. > :18:53.always very careful to keep a distance, to keep a buffer zone
:18:53. > :18:56.over donations. Between the leader and the person racing money? I knew
:18:56. > :19:01.Michael Brown, I had a number of dealings with them. The important
:19:01. > :19:06.point p that is I know, or I was told, and I don't doubt the
:19:06. > :19:10.voracity of this at all, that not only were all responsible checking
:19:10. > :19:17.taken before his company made this donation, but indeed, they went the
:19:17. > :19:22.extra mile with the authorities in making checks. The Electoral
:19:22. > :19:26.Commission certainly accepted that, because the he behaved OK. I notice
:19:26. > :19:29.there is a reference in the report to the fact they may be revisiting
:19:29. > :19:35.the issue, it doesn't say any more than that, I don't know what that
:19:35. > :19:41.means, we will have to wait and see. Public funding of political parties,
:19:42. > :19:45.that goes down like a lead balloon. Even time, we have Tim Montgomery
:19:45. > :19:50.on the fate of the Government in George Osborne's hands, and that
:19:50. > :19:58.porn born needs to face down the Liberal Democrats - Osborne needs
:19:58. > :20:01.to face down the the opposition, he has the deficit reduction strategy
:20:02. > :20:05.down, but he doesn't have a strategy for emergency economy
:20:06. > :20:11.growth, that is what needs to be focused on. How about that. That is
:20:11. > :20:15.interesting, plan A plus, not plan B, but plan A plus.
:20:15. > :20:20.There is an interesting little story in the Sunday Times. Which we
:20:20. > :20:26.will finish on Charles about the statues, all around Britain are
:20:26. > :20:29.being nicked? And manhole covers and bus shelters. I was first
:20:29. > :20:35.alerted to this in Scotland, there was a story, a special thing has
:20:35. > :20:40.been put out by the borders police in Scotland, manhole covers being
:20:40. > :20:47.stolen. Such is the demand for raw material for the economies running
:20:47. > :20:54.away at a rate of knots, that theft has gone up in all kind of unlikely
:20:54. > :20:58.areas, where you can get bronze and copper. Quite a lot of train delays
:20:58. > :21:08.is a lot of copper being stoleen from the railway system, no mam now
:21:08. > :21:08.
:21:08. > :21:14.are going to be replaced with plastic replicas the statue.S.
:21:14. > :21:21.replicas of the statue. Not the railway lines now.
:21:21. > :21:31.It is beginning to feel autumnal despite temperatures. Good morning
:21:31. > :21:40.
:21:40. > :21:44.it is set to turn windy for the A curl of cloud in Scotland Turn we
:21:44. > :21:48.will across Cumbria. Showers heaviest in the morning,
:21:48. > :21:52.lighter in the afternoon, feeling cool particularly in the breeze for
:21:52. > :22:01.most of us, temperatures in the teens. Overnight the first batch of
:22:01. > :22:04.rain will fade away, dry for a time. Picking up in the far North West,
:22:05. > :22:08.mild for all temperatures in double figures. The real concern for the
:22:08. > :22:11.strength of wind tomorrow will be for the northern half of the UK,
:22:11. > :22:17.Scotland, Northern Ireland into the far north of northern England,
:22:17. > :22:21.gusts of wind of 60-70, damage and disruption is certainly a
:22:21. > :22:25.possibility. Windy for all, but particularly so for the northern
:22:25. > :22:29.half of the UK, there will be rain as well from Northern Ireland,
:22:29. > :22:32.pushing northwards into Scotland. Despite the temperatures in the
:22:32. > :22:35.high teen, feeling much cooler when you factor the strength of the wind.
:22:35. > :22:41.The strongest of the winds are likely to be for the evening rush
:22:41. > :22:44.hour, for the northern half of the UK, gustings of wind of 60-70, if
:22:44. > :22:48.you are travelling for the latter part of tomorrow, it is worth
:22:48. > :22:58.looking at the travel situation, and look at the local radio station
:22:58. > :22:58.
:22:59. > :23:03.Since President Obama appointed him to the Court of St James's, Louise
:23:03. > :23:08.Susman has been a high-profile representative not just in London
:23:08. > :23:12.but all of the UK. Before this political career, Louise Susman was
:23:12. > :23:17.a leading investment banker, ten years ago on 11th September he
:23:17. > :23:20.watched in disbelief as the second plane crashed into the south tower
:23:20. > :23:29.of the World Trade Center. He didn't watch it from television,
:23:29. > :23:33.but from a jet in the skies above Before we talk about what is
:23:33. > :23:37.planned in London to remember 9/11, let's talk, you yourself, you
:23:37. > :23:43.happened to be flying through the airspace? I was on a private plane
:23:43. > :23:53.flying into New York, landing at a private airport in New Jersey. The
:23:53. > :23:58.pilot told me that unbelievably a plane had hit the World Trade
:23:58. > :24:01.Center. We were in disbelief, they called me into the cockpit, landing
:24:01. > :24:05.we were watching and saw the second plane hit. Immediately we knew it
:24:05. > :24:11.was not an accident and we were under attack. Your son was in the
:24:11. > :24:15.World Trade Center? My son was in the Merrill Lynch tower, right next
:24:15. > :24:19.door to it. Unfortunately as he was exiting he saw people jumping out
:24:19. > :24:24.of buildings, covered with dust, and walked all the way from Wall
:24:24. > :24:29.Street all the way up to the east side. And you lost, your son
:24:29. > :24:36.survived, but you lost colleagues? We lost six colleagues at the, I
:24:36. > :24:40.was with Citibank at that time. And it is a tragedy that no-one will
:24:40. > :24:44.ever forget, and Americans sure round the world too, but Americans
:24:44. > :24:48.always remember where they were on two dates, the assassination of
:24:48. > :24:52.President Kennedy, and 9/11. Many of the rest of us do, certainly the
:24:52. > :24:55.latter. So, tell us a little bit about what is going to be happening
:24:55. > :25:05.in Britain, London and elsewhere? Today there is church services
:25:05. > :25:11.everywhere. I'm going to St Paul's, for a service. Subsequently there
:25:11. > :25:16.is a major service in Grosvenor Square, where Americans have built
:25:16. > :25:22.a memorial garden to the British, 67 British lost, as well as to our
:25:22. > :25:26.own. A royal will be there, and the Prime Minister and the deputy Prime
:25:26. > :25:32.Minister, the mayor, and your's truly.
:25:32. > :25:36.A very important moment. Very hard to analyse what has happened
:25:36. > :25:45.overall since 9/11, both to America and the rest of the world. You have
:25:45. > :25:48.had the patriot act, everything has changed, in some respects. Do you
:25:48. > :25:53.worry that the price in terms of liberty, for Americans, in America,
:25:53. > :25:58.as well as people travelling around the world, has been too high?
:25:58. > :26:03.really don't. It is easy to say you shouldn't do something and then
:26:03. > :26:09.something happens and you say wow, I wish I would have done something.
:26:09. > :26:13.You know the big thing that we have seen, is the incredible resilience
:26:13. > :26:17.of both the American people and people around the world. Because
:26:18. > :26:22.besides these acts of terrorism, both 9/11 and other acts of
:26:22. > :26:28.terrorism, it hasn't caused our life to change. We don't live in
:26:28. > :26:33.fear, our societies move forward, our businesses work, in trade,
:26:33. > :26:38.people can go to any place of worship they like. So while we will
:26:38. > :26:45.never forget this day, it is a moment which we feel confident of
:26:45. > :26:54.that, whatever we did, we protected America, and in some places the
:26:55. > :26:58.world. It was staumbling block, but in one direction, not radical.
:26:58. > :27:01.I wonder about the huge focus American politics has had to put on
:27:02. > :27:06.security, the war in Afghanistan and Iraq took people as attention
:27:06. > :27:12.away from other things, such as the deficit and economic problems we
:27:12. > :27:17.are going through now? We have to be multitaskers in the world. And I
:27:17. > :27:20.think that the efforts towards security, whether done through the
:27:20. > :27:25.Homeland Security, or through our security agencies, or intelligence
:27:25. > :27:29.agencies, et cetera, is on going and always is foremost in the
:27:29. > :27:33.President's mind, to protect Americans. At the same time, our
:27:34. > :27:39.ability to function with a strong economy, a strong balance sheet is
:27:39. > :27:44.equally as important in many ways, because that is our way of life.
:27:45. > :27:48.And we need to be economically protected. I think the attention is
:27:48. > :27:52.focused today on deficit reduction, and getting our economy in growth
:27:52. > :27:56.mode, and getting unemployment down. We focused a lot, and rightly, on
:27:56. > :28:01.the American loss on that day. There was considerable British loss
:28:01. > :28:04.as well. What is the American view, would you say of Tony Blair's role
:28:05. > :28:12.at the period immediately after 9/11, and indeed generally speaking
:28:12. > :28:18.the British contribution? I think we are overwhelmed at all levels,
:28:18. > :28:24.of the level of support and sympathy that we received. I
:28:24. > :28:27.particularly was moved when I heard that while many Americans gathered
:28:27. > :28:32.at Buckingham Palace to console themselves in some ways, that the
:28:32. > :28:40.Queen ordered for the first time in the history, that on the Changing
:28:40. > :28:43.of the Guard they played the Star Spangled Banner instead of God Save
:28:43. > :28:47.The Queens. I remember the Last Night of the Proms it was very
:28:47. > :28:50.American? I love that very much, it is an event that has no equal.
:28:50. > :28:57.Thank you very much indeed for joining us. It is always a pleasure
:28:58. > :29:01.to be here. No company with offices in the World Trade Center was as
:29:01. > :29:06.devastated as Cantor Fitzgerald, it occupied four floors of the North
:29:06. > :29:09.Tower. After a hijacked plane struck it, all of the firm's 658
:29:09. > :29:15.employees in the office that morning were trapped, none made it
:29:15. > :29:18.out alive. The firm's CEO, Howard Lutnick, was late into work, it was
:29:18. > :29:23.his four-year-old son's first day at school in Manhattan, and he had
:29:23. > :29:28.gone to take him. Then, in the kindergarten his phone kept ringing
:29:28. > :29:30.and then going silent, he heard about a plane, he rushed to the
:29:30. > :29:34.office, earlier he described to me what happened next.
:29:34. > :29:38.When I got to the trade centre, obviously everyone was running away.
:29:38. > :29:41.I got to the trade centre, I stood at the doorway of our building
:29:41. > :29:45.grabbing people and asking them what floor they had gotten up to.
:29:45. > :29:51.What did you floor did you come from, someone would say 52 or 75,
:29:51. > :29:54.and I had gotten up to the 92nd floor when there was the loudest
:29:54. > :29:58.crash that you ever heard, I thought another plane had come and
:29:58. > :30:04.hit the building. Are I hadn't seen any of the video that you have all
:30:04. > :30:07.seen, I just headed down to the building. It was the sound was two
:30:07. > :30:11.World Trade Centres collapsing, I didn't know it at the time, I heard
:30:11. > :30:15.this loud sound I started running, here I am the guy with the suit and
:30:15. > :30:19.the shoes, running my tail off, I run to the right, fortunately if I
:30:19. > :30:25.had run to the left I would have run into the crashing building and
:30:25. > :30:29.I would have been killed. I ran to the right and this giant black
:30:29. > :30:35.tornado was chasing me. You have seen it, giant, rolling black fog
:30:35. > :30:39.and smoke, I dove under a war, and the world turned black, I tried to
:30:39. > :30:44.hold my breath, as if I was drowning, but obviously sooner or
:30:44. > :30:47.later you have to breathe, so I was breathing in this thick black air
:30:47. > :30:51.and I laid under the war probably for five minutes, not knowing if I
:30:51. > :30:57.was blind, because I couldn't see, deaf, because you couldn't hear, or
:30:57. > :31:02.dead, ultimately I figured I could stand, and I walked out of the mess,
:31:02. > :31:07.walked up be town, I was covered in soot. Covered just head to toe in
:31:07. > :31:10.soot. I walked up town until people were clean. And when people were
:31:10. > :31:13.clean, obviously cellphones didn't work, I went up to the first pay
:31:13. > :31:17.phone, there was a line of people, a clean woman was talking on the
:31:17. > :31:22.phone, took the phone on her, I hung up the phone, she looked at me,
:31:22. > :31:27.I was covered in the ash, she looked at me as if I was a ghost, I
:31:27. > :31:31.called my wife and I tolder I was alive. You lost, of course - I told
:31:31. > :31:34.her I was alive. You lost, of course, your own brother, and
:31:34. > :31:37.everybody in the work force in New York who was at work that day. It
:31:37. > :31:41.must have been an utterly devastating time, yet you were in a
:31:41. > :31:45.position of leadership, you had to, not only save the company, but
:31:45. > :31:49.start work to help all the bereaved families? I gave everyone who
:31:49. > :31:55.worked for the firm two choices. I said we could shut the firm and go
:31:55. > :31:58.to our friends' funerals, 700 funerals is 20 funeral as day for
:31:58. > :32:02.35 straight days, it is inconceivable, or we will have to
:32:02. > :32:06.work harder than we have ever worked before. To do that would be
:32:06. > :32:10.to take care of our friends' families. I didn't want to go to
:32:10. > :32:14.work, nobody wanted to go to work and make moneyment we decided what
:32:15. > :32:18.we wanted to do is help our friends' families. So we committed
:32:18. > :32:22.right there, on the evening of the 11th, unanimously, all the
:32:22. > :32:27.employees of the firm, that we would work harder than we would
:32:27. > :32:30.ever work before for one purpose, that is to try to take care of our
:32:30. > :32:34.friends' families, so many of our friends that we lost. As you began
:32:34. > :32:38.the work of rewhrilding the company, what sort - rebuilding the company,
:32:38. > :32:43.what sort of help did you get from rival firms as well as your clients,
:32:43. > :32:53.did they come to your aid? customers were the most incredible.
:32:53. > :32:54.
:32:54. > :32:59.They came to our aid. The first day we opened our equities business,
:32:59. > :33:03.which was on the 17th, we barely stitched the company together with
:33:03. > :33:07.string and bubble gum, just sort of barely connected things. We had a
:33:07. > :33:10.rule, we would only do one transaction per client, to make
:33:10. > :33:14.sure we could process these things. Remember everyone who worked for us
:33:14. > :33:18.had been killed. We really didn't have any experienced people
:33:18. > :33:21.processing our transactions. Our clients came in and said, no, no,
:33:21. > :33:27.we are not doing one trade with you, we are going to do everything with
:33:27. > :33:31.you, and we had, in equities, on the 17th of September, bun of the
:33:31. > :33:35.busiest days the firm has ever had a - one of the busiest days the
:33:36. > :33:40.firm has ever had. My wife asked how my day was, I said I think we
:33:40. > :33:45.were killed with kindness. I didn't think it was possible that we could
:33:45. > :33:49.process all these trades. When we did process those trades, on the
:33:49. > :33:53.19th, it was on the 19th of September that I knew the firm
:33:53. > :33:56.would survive. Because we could process the trades, and we were
:33:57. > :34:01.then able to announce that we would give 25% of our profits to the
:34:01. > :34:05.families for five years and pay for their health care, which is very
:34:05. > :34:10.expensive in America, for ten years. Finally, can you tell us what you
:34:10. > :34:20.are doing as a company, and you are doing yourself on the anniversary
:34:20. > :34:23.of this appalling event? Well, the National 11th September Memorial
:34:23. > :34:28.will open tomorrow morning, the President will be there and all the
:34:28. > :34:32.politicians. I won't be there for, that that is too much pomp and
:34:32. > :34:36.circumstance for me, my friends and family will go after that. We will
:34:36. > :34:40.go to the memorial, which is beautiful, we will put our hands on
:34:40. > :34:45.my brother's names and our friends names, then we will head up town,
:34:45. > :34:50.and at 4.00pm in Central Park, we will have a memorial with friends
:34:50. > :34:54.and families. We will say the names of all of the men, 658 men and
:34:54. > :34:58.women we will lost, we will show their pictures on big screens, and
:34:58. > :35:00.we will remember their faces and keep their memory alive. The next
:35:00. > :35:05.business day, which is September 12th, will be our global charity
:35:05. > :35:09.day. On that day, not only do we giveaway, we don't just giveaway
:35:09. > :35:15.our profit, all of our employees agree, all of our salesmen and
:35:15. > :35:21.brokers all agree to earn no money, and all of our revenues go to
:35:21. > :35:25.charity. We have so many of our clients help us. We invite
:35:25. > :35:30.celebrities to come and help us make the day fun and exciting. We
:35:30. > :35:34.take of about 100 charities. Well done all of you, good luck for the
:35:34. > :35:39.day. Thank you. The TUC conference opens in London
:35:39. > :35:41.tomorrow, it is the first-ever time in the capital, with much
:35:41. > :35:45.speculation about what the Labour leader Ed Miliband might have to
:35:45. > :35:48.say about the relationship between his party and the union's 6.5
:35:48. > :35:51.million members. The main subject will be the continuing campaign
:35:51. > :35:55.against public sector cuts. With threats of future strike action,
:35:55. > :36:00.civil disobedience by the unions this autumn, including from Len
:36:00. > :36:06.McCluskey, the leader of Britain's biggest union, Unite. Good morning,
:36:07. > :36:10.you have 1.5 million members, what is the mood as the TUC gathers? You
:36:10. > :36:14.have the challenge on pensions, the challenge on public sector cuts,
:36:14. > :36:19.describe the mood? I think it is simple. It is a very, very angry
:36:19. > :36:23.mood. Our members throughout the public service sector, are
:36:23. > :36:27.infuriated by the fact that the Government has launched the
:36:27. > :36:31.ideolgical take on their work, their pensions, their jobs, but
:36:31. > :36:35.also within the private sector itself. The users of public
:36:35. > :36:39.services are angry that everything that has held our nation together
:36:39. > :36:43.for the past 65 years under threat. That is why we have to stand up and
:36:43. > :36:47.be counted. So it is a sort of Council of War? Yes, if you want to
:36:47. > :36:52.put it that way. Obviously it is more a question of trying to build
:36:52. > :36:55.a campaign of resistance, so that the Government will take stock and
:36:55. > :36:59.perhaps take a step back. What people need to understand is that,
:36:59. > :37:02.it was our parents and our grandparents who, having returned
:37:02. > :37:06.from the Second World War, decided that they were going to build a
:37:06. > :37:09.land fit for heros, they built the welfare state, and created the
:37:09. > :37:14.National Health Service, they gave us universal education. All of that
:37:14. > :37:18.is now under threat. I, for one, don't want my grandchildren saying,
:37:18. > :37:21.well you did nothing, when our heritage was being taken away. That
:37:21. > :37:26.is the anger we feel, from the grassroots, right throughout.
:37:26. > :37:29.seems, on the face of it, slightly unlikely that George Osborne is
:37:29. > :37:34.going to saying, Len McCluskey you're right, I'm going to change
:37:34. > :37:37.course. What kind of action follows this autumn, this winter? You can
:37:37. > :37:42.only build a campaign of protest. I'm one of these people, perhaps it
:37:42. > :37:47.is old fashioned, to believe that, in a democracy, if you protest
:37:47. > :37:49.sufficiently, if sufficient numbers protest, in various ways, then the
:37:49. > :37:54.Government of the day, who are supposed to be responsible in
:37:54. > :37:58.governing on behalf of the people, will take note. I think this
:37:58. > :38:03.Government is becoming increasingly isolated from economists, from a
:38:03. > :38:06.number of their own supporters. What kind of action? I think the
:38:06. > :38:12.actions that will be taken will be widespread, and I don't think we
:38:12. > :38:16.can rule anything out. I noted recently a senior citizens
:38:16. > :38:20.protesting in Bristol by walking backwards and forwards across a
:38:20. > :38:28.zebra crossing and bringing things to stand still. If you look at
:38:28. > :38:30.people on UK Uncut, bringing banks into creches and turning them into
:38:30. > :38:33.different places, and including industrial action. That is
:38:33. > :38:37.precisely what our members want. They expect their leaders to give
:38:37. > :38:41.that type of leadership and stand shoulder-to-shoulder with emthis,
:38:41. > :38:44.when their terms and conditions are being attacked. What do you say to
:38:44. > :38:48.those who say these are very bleak times, we have a huge, huge
:38:48. > :38:51.borrowing debt, the money has to be paid back, and there is no other
:38:51. > :38:55.way of paying it back but by implementing the cuts the
:38:55. > :38:58.Government has agreed? There is a dogma of despair and fear, that is
:38:58. > :39:02.what this Government represents, right-wing Governments throughout
:39:02. > :39:06.the globe represent that. We have got to give something different, we
:39:06. > :39:10.have to give hope, we have to say there is an alternative to this
:39:10. > :39:14.type of, these types of cuts. time when public sector pensions
:39:14. > :39:17.are still overall more generous than private sector pension, do you
:39:17. > :39:23.think people will be supporting strikes and disruption? I think we
:39:23. > :39:29.need, I think we need to explode some of the myths. You know, these
:39:29. > :39:33.are attacks on pensions and talk about gold-plated pensions, we are
:39:33. > :39:37.talking about dinner ladies getting �4,000 though a year pension, and
:39:37. > :39:42.being cut back to �3,000 by the Government attacks. It is not what
:39:42. > :39:47.is being projected. Compare that with the top, the chief executives
:39:47. > :39:50.of the top 100 in the FTSE. Their average salary is �3.4 million. So
:39:50. > :39:54.much for us all being in it together. The Government come out
:39:54. > :39:57.with lie after lie, and the truth of the matter is it is about whose
:39:57. > :40:01.side are they on. At the moment they are certainly not on the side
:40:01. > :40:09.of ordinary working people. Labour leader, Ed Miliband, seems
:40:09. > :40:13.to want the voting in the Labour Party Conference to be at least 50%
:40:13. > :40:17.non-union, more than 50% non-union voting, in other words to push you
:40:17. > :40:21.below a majority of voting s that a worry for you? Not particularly a
:40:21. > :40:28.worry for me. I mean the issue of refounding Labour and the question
:40:28. > :40:33.of trying to make the Labour Party more vibrant is something I'm happy
:40:33. > :40:37.to look at. If there is a perceived democratic deficit I'm prepared to
:40:37. > :40:41.look at it. Were you disappointed by the things he was saying about
:40:41. > :40:45.the strikes and demonstrations? Without a shadow of a doubt. He
:40:45. > :40:50.made a fundamental error by attacking the strikes on the 30th
:40:50. > :40:53.of June. He's laying in his job, he has to be given time to construct a
:40:53. > :40:56.hopefully radical alternative. I hope that will mean he understands
:40:56. > :40:59.he has to be on the side of ordinary working people. If he's
:40:59. > :41:05.going to get Labour back into power, Labour needs to be on the side of
:41:05. > :41:09.ordinary working people. Thank you very much for joining us.
:41:09. > :41:13.Those of us who are working are going to have to work for longer.
:41:13. > :41:17.One minister says this morning that the pension age is going to go up
:41:17. > :41:22.first to 67 and then later to 68, much more quickly than was planned
:41:22. > :41:25.by the last Government. Meanwhile, for people who aren't working,
:41:25. > :41:29.there is huge changes on the way. A single universal benefit, and a cap
:41:29. > :41:34.on how much anyone can get in benefits of �26,000. The man with
:41:34. > :41:38.all that and much more on his plate is the Work and Pensions Secretary,
:41:38. > :41:45.Iain Duncan Smith. Welcome. Let as start off with the economy,
:41:45. > :41:49.if I may. All your hopes for radical change in the welfare
:41:49. > :41:53.system presumably threatened by a long period of stagnant growth,
:41:53. > :41:57.rising unemployment and so on. Obviously the economy is critical
:41:57. > :42:01.to everything we do. We need to get the economy back in shape, the
:42:01. > :42:05.deficit down, the debt paid off, so the economy can grow again and
:42:05. > :42:09.properly. At the moment it is growing, and all the forecasts
:42:09. > :42:14.suggest it will grow. Pretty flat, though really? Your point though,
:42:14. > :42:18.that would we do this, or can we do these changes, make work pay, get
:42:18. > :42:22.people back to work, all the changes you were decribing, if the
:42:22. > :42:25.economy is in dits, the answer is we have to any - difficulties, the
:42:26. > :42:29.answer is we have to any way, one of the reasons why the economy has
:42:29. > :42:33.underperformed over the last ten or 15 years, is because the welfare
:42:33. > :42:37.system isn't shaped to deliver people to the work force in the way
:42:37. > :42:41.it should. That has dragged us backwards. As one of the ministers
:42:41. > :42:45.most concerned with the economy, that is where the money is all
:42:45. > :42:50.decided, do you favour further steps to boost jobs and the economy,
:42:50. > :42:57.maybe getting rid of the 50p tax rate, if, as the newspaper says
:42:57. > :43:01.this morning, it is bringing in no money at all and stifling
:43:01. > :43:05.entrepeneurship? On the 50p tax rate, both the Prime Minister and
:43:05. > :43:11.George Osborne decided it was never forever, in terms of when it has
:43:11. > :43:15.helped to get the deficit down that was always the position of the
:43:15. > :43:20.Government it would grow. On growth, we are doing the enterprise stuff,
:43:20. > :43:23.and work on apprenticeships and work placements, and making sure
:43:23. > :43:28.small businesses get exemptions from certain taxations and lower
:43:28. > :43:31.corporation tax. There is more we can do. I know George is looking
:43:31. > :43:34.carefully at a whole new raft of things we can do to give the
:43:34. > :43:39.economy another push and another kick start in the direction of
:43:39. > :43:42.greater growth. This is not plan B, but pla. A plus, people are saying?
:43:42. > :43:45.It is just what you do. When you manage an economy you must
:43:45. > :43:49.recognise the circumstances you are in, and make sure your main
:43:49. > :43:52.position, which is right, we have to get the deficit down, pay off
:43:52. > :43:56.our debt, because we were basically bust, that is what we inherited
:43:56. > :43:58.from the Labour Government, but nonetheless we have a growth
:43:58. > :44:02.strategy, it is whether that strategy is working well enough,
:44:02. > :44:07.he's reviewing that, and making sure the right things are done.
:44:07. > :44:10.That will mean infrastructure projects and things like that?
:44:10. > :44:14.key thing that is we have to reduce the deficit, without which we would
:44:14. > :44:19.be paying interest rates, people forget this, at the like of Spain
:44:19. > :44:22.and Portugal, which would cost home owners and business owners a
:44:22. > :44:26.dramatic amount. Your big Welfare Reform Bill lands in the House of
:44:26. > :44:30.Lords this coming week, where no doubt there will be lots of
:44:30. > :44:36.argument about it, one of the arguments is about the �26,000 cap
:44:36. > :44:41.on benefits going to one household, there have been suggestions, Lord
:44:41. > :44:44.Freud has talked about there being special conditions, where perhaps
:44:44. > :44:50.there is just a huge number of children in a household so they
:44:50. > :44:54.don't get caught by that, is that cap absolute or are there ways
:44:54. > :44:58.around in in a particular circumstance? The cap will stand.
:44:58. > :45:03.No exceptions? I'm not happy about defending it. There are exemptions,
:45:03. > :45:06.if people are on disability allowance, or war widows, or
:45:06. > :45:09.working in tax credits, it is for people not in work. That is the key.
:45:09. > :45:14.Of course people out there listening to this and watching me
:45:14. > :45:18.at the moment, when I tell them we are capping it at �26,000 net, that
:45:18. > :45:23.is a gross income of �35,000 a year. I have people in my constituency in
:45:23. > :45:27.north-east London, who will say, hold on a second, why is it so high.
:45:27. > :45:32.So although people are moaning about it. Because I'm working.
:45:32. > :45:35.is average earnings. People work hard and often commute an hour and
:45:35. > :45:39.an hour-and-a-half in the morning and evenings, and live in a
:45:39. > :45:42.location they can afford. That is what we are using people to do with
:45:42. > :45:46.housing benefit and reforms, look you need to cut your cloth in
:45:46. > :45:50.accordance with the nature of what you are doing. Just a minute, I
:45:50. > :45:54.think Lord Freud was talking about circumstances where you have,
:45:54. > :46:00.whatever you think about it, family with I don't know, nine children
:46:00. > :46:02.living at home? What he was talking about, and which he was slightly
:46:03. > :46:06.misrepresented on, we have always had within there, discretionary
:46:06. > :46:09.measures to make sure that the cap is not about trying to drive people
:46:09. > :46:12.into homelessness, it is about getting them into situations in
:46:13. > :46:17.terms of their housing where they could then take work, that is the
:46:17. > :46:21.key. We will make sure that as people are brought under the cap,
:46:21. > :46:28.that we take consideration of their circumstances, but the cap is firm.
:46:28. > :46:32.Firm and clear and stated. It is fair, if somebody is in this a
:46:32. > :46:38.house paying up to �100,000 in central London, they can't afford
:46:38. > :46:41.to take a job, they are basically disenfranchised from the whole jobs
:46:41. > :46:45.markets, the moment they take a job they lose their housing benefit and
:46:45. > :46:50.can't live there any more. Is that the answer to what Boris Johnson
:46:50. > :46:52.was saying when he talked about Kosovo-style social cleansing,
:46:52. > :46:55.people being driven out of the capital by the cap on housing
:46:55. > :46:59.benefit? The point is, people need to be living in housing that they
:46:59. > :47:03.can afford to take work from. Most people do that who are not on
:47:03. > :47:07.benefits, people on benefits must do the same. What he said is there
:47:07. > :47:11.would be no Kosovo-style cleansing, he's right. He was warning about
:47:11. > :47:14.its danger of it? There isn't. London is not like Paris, we have
:47:14. > :47:18.lots of social housing in central London, for people who want to live
:47:18. > :47:22.in that housing. What we are talking about is getting these
:47:22. > :47:26.social housing and private rented areas separated, so people get to
:47:26. > :47:30.live in housing they can afford if they go to work, that is fair and
:47:30. > :47:33.reasonable position to be in. The cap makes sense, I think. Another
:47:33. > :47:37.major controversial has been about the way that people who have some
:47:37. > :47:41.kind of disability are tested for their ability to work. A lot of,
:47:41. > :47:44.not just the usual suspects, but quite a lot of reputable
:47:44. > :47:48.organisations of one kind or another, have expressed worry that
:47:48. > :47:52.the tests are a little bit too intrusive, a bit too aggressive at
:47:52. > :47:56.times and a bit unfair. Is this something you can look at again?
:47:56. > :48:01.There are two things, one is the proposal for disability living
:48:01. > :48:06.allowance reform, and the other is this Incapacity Benefit, sickness
:48:06. > :48:10.tests. They will both have tested. The Incapacity Benefit one is on
:48:10. > :48:14.going at the moment. When we inherited it from the Government,
:48:14. > :48:17.this is what we proposed to do, there were people sitting for 25
:48:17. > :48:21.years on sickness benefit and they often got better and no-one ever
:48:21. > :48:25.saw them. This check is reasonable, because it gets us certain that
:48:25. > :48:29.people who are on it need it, and those who aren't should be in work.
:48:29. > :48:34.We have had it under review constantly, we are changing it all
:48:34. > :48:37.the time. Professor Harrington I asked him to review it permanently,
:48:37. > :48:46.he's taking cancer patients on treatment out of that process, we
:48:46. > :48:50.are adjusting it all the time. I this at this it is - it is fair and
:48:50. > :48:56.reasonable at the time. You took control of the Government looking
:48:56. > :48:59.at gang culture after the riots of the early summer. And I wondered,
:48:59. > :49:03.Theresa May said, actually, most of the people involved weren't in
:49:03. > :49:06.gangs, where you have come to at the moment about the importance, or
:49:06. > :49:09.otherwise, of gangs at the centre of your response to this? Most
:49:09. > :49:12.people, who are involved in it, weren't necessarily part of gangs,
:49:12. > :49:16.but of course the thing that happened, particularly in London,
:49:16. > :49:20.was a number of the gangs did manipulate quite a lot of activity
:49:20. > :49:25.around the capital and did a lot of criminal work behind it. The key
:49:25. > :49:28.thing about the gangs, it is not that the riots are the reason, the
:49:28. > :49:31.fact is, in too many communities and cities in Britain, gangs now
:49:31. > :49:35.have become completely rooted into these communities, they destroy
:49:35. > :49:39.them around them. There will be no business investment in that area.
:49:39. > :49:44.They take kids from as young as 11 or ten, they are involved in
:49:44. > :49:49.criminal activity, they are very violent. In my own area of Waltham
:49:49. > :49:51.Forest, we have had many murders as a result of the gang violence,
:49:51. > :49:55.often innocent bystanders get caught up in it. This is a
:49:55. > :49:59.priority? They are not only just the products of social breakdown in
:49:59. > :50:05.these areas, kids from broken homes, they are also driving breakdown in
:50:05. > :50:08.their communities. Dealing with them and Teresa and I are jointly
:50:08. > :50:11.doing this, than means everywhere, for the rest of our time will be
:50:11. > :50:18.about dealing with gangs. Pension age, we learned under the last
:50:18. > :50:22.Government that the pension age was going up to 66, 67, ultimately to
:50:22. > :50:28.68. It seems you want to bring that earlier, that it is too delayed, as
:50:28. > :50:31.far as the Government is concerned s that true? First of all, empp
:50:31. > :50:36.should know that the last Government left us with a deadline
:50:36. > :50:40.to get to 67, we are already bringing equalisation, and then
:50:40. > :50:44.rising to 66 in 2020, we have always said that the time scale
:50:44. > :50:48.left by the last Government was too slow, because, in fact, there has
:50:48. > :50:52.been an accelerating longevity, people are living longer but still
:50:52. > :50:56.retiring at the same age. The purpose now is to look at that, and
:50:56. > :51:00.we are reviewing that, and to see what might be reasonable, but
:51:00. > :51:03.giving good warning about what happens. We will be moving to 67,
:51:03. > :51:06.the question is when. That will happen earlier than originally
:51:06. > :51:10.planned or announced? Government left us with the
:51:10. > :51:14.deadline in the 30s, we think that is too late because people's age
:51:14. > :51:17.levels have increased even since they made that announcement. We
:51:17. > :51:20.have been about this all along. The move to 67 will happen, the
:51:20. > :51:23.question is only on the timings of it. We haven't made a decision
:51:23. > :51:29.about that yet. The new Conservative Euro-sceptic backbench
:51:29. > :51:32.group is getting together for the first time this week. They have got
:51:33. > :51:36.some ideas, lots of ideas and proposals, I think William Hague
:51:36. > :51:40.has said this is no longer a career-damaging, it didn't damage
:51:40. > :51:43.your career in the old days, but it is no longer a career-damaging
:51:43. > :51:46.thing to do. What do you feel about relations with Europe when it comes
:51:46. > :51:50.to, for instance, the large numbers of people coming in, taking jobs
:51:50. > :51:54.that might otherwise be done pi people who are getting off benefits
:51:54. > :51:58.and so on? William is right about this. We are in the European Union,
:51:58. > :52:02.we have to try to make this work best for us. But I think he's also
:52:02. > :52:06.conscious and all of us are conscious, that there are often far
:52:06. > :52:09.too many stupidties that go on in there, interferences, we are
:52:09. > :52:13.suffering some of those, where they make judgment that is don't seem to
:52:13. > :52:17.make a lot of sense. There is a problem over the human rights issue,
:52:17. > :52:20.we are looking at that at the moment, trying to find a way of
:52:20. > :52:24.resolving. Europe is an important market place for us. We are friends
:52:24. > :52:27.and allies with many European countries, as part of NATO, and as
:52:27. > :52:31.historic allies. We need to get the balance right about how the
:52:31. > :52:34.relationship works with Europe. Almost everywhere you look you must
:52:34. > :52:37.think there are problems with European legislation, I come up
:52:37. > :52:43.against it again and again. You say you don't want to leave Europe, is
:52:43. > :52:46.there a middle way, where you can repatriate considerably more powers,
:52:47. > :52:50.in some sense renegotiate the relationship to give people like
:52:50. > :52:53.yourself, British ministers, more freedom of manoeuvres? That was
:52:53. > :52:56.always the Conservative policy, we are in a coalition, these things
:52:57. > :53:00.have 0 get modified. I know some of my Conservative colleagues are
:53:00. > :53:05.concerned about that. William has accepted that. Nonetheless, the
:53:05. > :53:10.reality for us is, we have made it clear, any future treaties, there
:53:10. > :53:15.will be a referendum on, that has locked any further fuer Government
:53:15. > :53:19.and this future Government about taking decision about further power
:53:19. > :53:23.transferal. And there is a looking at how to get some of the powers
:53:23. > :53:29.not exercised by the European Union back. William is clear about that.
:53:29. > :53:33.What p the idea of giving parliament back - about the idea of
:53:33. > :53:35.giving parliament back the right to agree or veto plans from Europe?
:53:35. > :53:40.I'm always in favour of giving parliament greater power and
:53:40. > :53:44.authority. I have no doubts about that. Governments, of course, have
:53:44. > :53:47.to look carefully about how this affects them. I'm in favour,
:53:47. > :53:50.personally, of anything that gives parliament a greater say, that is
:53:50. > :53:54.what we were elected for. Thank you very much indeed for
:53:55. > :53:58.joining us. Now the news headlines. America is preparing to mark the
:53:58. > :54:01.tenth anniversary of the 9/11 attack, that killed nearly 3,000
:54:01. > :54:06.people in York, Washington and Pennsylvania. An official memorial
:54:06. > :54:09.to those who died will be unveiled at the site of the world trade
:54:09. > :54:14.centre. The Twin Towers were destroyed in the attacks.
:54:14. > :54:17.Ceremonies will also take place in London and other cities around the
:54:17. > :54:22.UK, to remember the victims from Britain and many other countries
:54:22. > :54:26.who died in the attacks. On the eve of the annual Trades Union Congress,
:54:26. > :54:29.the leader of the biggest union, Unite, has called for campaign of
:54:29. > :54:32.direct action, including civil disobedience and strikes, against
:54:32. > :54:37.the Government's suspending cuts, Len McCluskey told this programme,
:54:37. > :54:41.the mood in the union movement was very, very angry at what he called
:54:41. > :54:50.an ideolgical attack on the public sector.
:54:50. > :54:54.That's all, the next news is at midday. We go back to Andrew Marr
:54:54. > :54:59.show soon. On the anniversary of 9/11, we
:54:59. > :55:03.debate how a decade of terrorism has affected our ability to be
:55:03. > :55:07.tolerant. One Iman says we are now so slam phobic, Muslims can barely
:55:07. > :55:10.live in Britain. The war on terror, despite the bloodshed, could it
:55:10. > :55:17.still be necessary. It has been a record-breaking
:55:17. > :55:21.season for the BBC proms, more than 300,000 people, went to over three
:55:21. > :55:27.months of concerts. Yesterday was the Last Night of the Proms. What a
:55:27. > :55:31.night it was. That great interpreter of Wagner, Susan
:55:31. > :55:37.Bullock was there, with crowd pleasing songs.
:55:37. > :55:40.# A dream that will need # All the love you can give
:55:40. > :55:45.Susan Bullock joins me now, thank you for being here so early after a
:55:45. > :55:48.late night last night. I have to ask you, the size of the
:55:48. > :55:52.Albert Hall, is that a particular technical problem for somebody,
:55:52. > :55:57.even with a voice like your's? is quite a difficult hall, in some
:55:57. > :56:00.ways, in just when you look at it it is terrifying, as a sound
:56:00. > :56:06.problem, it is not a problem at allment you can sing so quietly in
:56:06. > :56:10.there, if you want, or as loudly, it really takes the sound, it is a
:56:10. > :56:15.fantastic acoustic, you would think it is terrifying, but it is not.
:56:15. > :56:20.You are famous for the roles you sing in, Wagner and Richard Strauss,
:56:20. > :56:27.and so on, to sing us out today, you have chosen something
:56:27. > :56:34.appropriate to the anniversary of 9/11. It is an American song, it is
:56:34. > :56:38.At The River, Aaron Copland set it with a piano accompaniment, I'm
:56:38. > :56:43.singing it unaccompanied this morning. That is all we have time
:56:44. > :56:48.for, join me earlier next week, 8.30 we go on air, 30 minutes
:56:48. > :56:51.before, to allow coverage of the Great North Run. I will be talking
:56:51. > :56:54.to the deputy Prime Minister, Nick Clegg, ahead of the Liberal
:56:54. > :56:58.Democrats annual conference, and also the cricket legend and
:56:58. > :57:00.politician, Imran Khan. Until then, on the anniversary of 9/11, we
:57:00. > :57:06.leave you with Susan Bullock performing Aaron Copland's
:57:06. > :57:16.arrangement of the American hymn, Shall We Gather At The River.
:57:16. > :57:20.
:57:20. > :57:30.# Shall we gather at the river # When the angels feet have trod
:57:30. > :57:32.
:57:32. > :57:41.# With its crystal tide forever # Flowing by the throne of God
:57:41. > :57:48.# Yes we'll gather by the river # The beautiful
:57:48. > :57:58.# The beautiful # River # Gather with the saints by the
:57:58. > :58:00.
:58:00. > :58:09.river # That flows by the throne of God
:58:10. > :58:19.# Soon we'll reach the shining river
:58:20. > :58:21.
:58:21. > :58:31.# Soon our pilgrimage will cease # Soon our happy hearts will quiver
:58:31. > :58:34.
:58:34. > :58:42.# With the melody of peace # Yes' we will gather by the river
:58:42. > :58:49.# The beautiful # River