:00:41. > :00:43.Good morning. After Dr Fox's departure, a few opening words from
:00:43. > :00:53.a key politician quoted in today's Observer newspaper, warning about
:00:53. > :00:55.
:00:55. > :00:58.the dangers of lobbying. He said, we all know how it works - the
:00:58. > :01:03.lunches, the hospitality, the quiet, quiet word in your ear, the ex-
:01:03. > :01:07.ministers and ex-advisers for hire, helping big business to get its way.
:01:07. > :01:10.He went on to say it was time for politics to come clean about who is
:01:10. > :01:14.buying power and influence. Well, who said that? Someone who can help
:01:14. > :01:20.sort things out and help politics. Because that was the then
:01:20. > :01:22.opposition leader, David Cameron. And joining me today for our review
:01:23. > :01:28.of the Sunday newspapers, the Labour peer, Helena Kennedy, and
:01:28. > :01:31.the Daily Mail columnist and historian, Sir Max Hastings. Liam
:01:31. > :01:35.Fox has gone but, as today's papers make clear, there are still plenty
:01:35. > :01:42.of questions to be answered about this strange story. Who exactly was
:01:42. > :01:45.funding Adam Werritty's global travels and why? What was Atlantic
:01:45. > :01:48.Bridge, the organisation at the middle of this? Well, the Foreign
:01:48. > :01:52.Secretary, William Hague, can help with the last question because he
:01:52. > :01:55.was one of its patrons. He has got a lot more to think about than that,
:01:55. > :01:59.of course, with the European crisis and the end-game in Libya -
:01:59. > :02:02.something for which, by the way, Mr Fox can take some credit. I'll also
:02:02. > :02:06.be joined by Senator George Mitchell, one of the big guys of
:02:06. > :02:09.American politics and business. Having helped bring peace to
:02:09. > :02:11.Northern Ireland, he was asked by President Obama to try and find a
:02:11. > :02:15.solution to the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians. With
:02:15. > :02:21.no breakthrough, he resigned in May. What hope does he see for the
:02:21. > :02:24.region? And from man of peace to a master of verbal aggression. We
:02:24. > :02:28.know him best as the inventively foul-mouthed Malcolm Tucker in The
:02:28. > :02:31.Thick of It. Now he is planning to be a Ladykiller in London's West
:02:31. > :02:41.End. Peter Capaldi joins me to talk about why he is bringing an old
:02:41. > :02:49.
:02:49. > :02:52.Ealing classic to the stage. Plus, from Genesis to Revelations. One of
:02:52. > :02:56.the prophets of British rock music, Peter Gabriel, will be here to sing
:02:56. > :02:58.and talk about The Elders. Who are they? We'll find out more later on.
:02:59. > :03:01.Let's kick off with the news with Louise Minchin. Good morning.
:03:01. > :03:03.Police in London are considering whether to investigate Adam
:03:04. > :03:06.Werritty, the close friend of the former Defence Secretary Liam Fox,
:03:07. > :03:09.for fraud. The Labour MP, John Mann, asked police to probe allegations
:03:09. > :03:14.that Mr Werritty used business cards falsely claiming he was an
:03:14. > :03:18.adviser to Dr Fox. A company set up by Mr Werritty also received
:03:18. > :03:21.thousands of pounds from several wealthy backers. Liam Fox resigned
:03:21. > :03:27.on Friday, admitting that he had allowed the distinction between his
:03:27. > :03:30.personal interests and government activities to become blurred.
:03:30. > :03:33.Demonstrations are still going on in cities around the world from New
:03:33. > :03:36.Zealand to the USA against what protesters call corporate greed.
:03:36. > :03:41.Most have been peaceful although many people were injured during
:03:41. > :03:44.violence in Rome. Around 70 people were also arrested in New York.
:03:44. > :03:47.Several thousand people gathered in the City of London, but their
:03:47. > :03:57.numbers dropped to a few hundred overnight. Alexandra Mackenzie
:03:57. > :03:57.
:03:58. > :04:04.reports. New York's Times Square, 5000 anti-war street protesters
:04:04. > :04:08.stopped traffic been busy Manhattan streets. Demonstrations in the city
:04:08. > :04:13.began a month ago. They're angry that US banks are enjoying profits
:04:13. > :04:17.after getting bail-outs. Many Americans are dealing with high
:04:17. > :04:22.unemployment and a high cost of limits -- living. Demonstrations
:04:22. > :04:27.came on a day off worldwide protests against austerity in what
:04:27. > :04:34.has been described as corporate greed. At least 70 people were
:04:34. > :04:40.injured after a rally in Rome descended into street battles. They
:04:40. > :04:43.rock also rallyes in Spain, Greece and Portugal. In London, 3000
:04:43. > :04:49.people demonstrated in the financial district but were
:04:49. > :04:55.prevented from reaching the Stock Exchange. A handful of arrests were
:04:55. > :04:58.made. Away from the protests, but finance ministers of the G20, some
:04:59. > :05:04.of the world's most powerful economies, where meeting in Paris.
:05:04. > :05:07.Top of the agenda was the eurozone crisis. France and Germany say they
:05:07. > :05:12.have a comprehensive plan and the consensus at the meeting was that
:05:12. > :05:16.European leaders were making progress towards finding a solution.
:05:16. > :05:20.The question is, what can this global mood than to achieve and
:05:20. > :05:26.will it continue to gather momentum? In London, some
:05:26. > :05:29.protesters said they could be a continued protest until December. A
:05:29. > :05:32.British soldier has been killed while manning a checkpoint in the
:05:32. > :05:35.Helmand province of Afghanistan. The soldier, from the 2nd Battalion,
:05:35. > :05:41.The Royal Gurkha Rifles, was shot by insurgents in the Nahr-e Saraj
:05:41. > :05:45.region of Helmand. His family has been informed. He is the 35th
:05:45. > :05:49.soldier to die there this year. Wootton Bassett will formally
:05:49. > :05:54.receive a royal title in a ceremony today. The Wiltshire town is being
:05:54. > :05:56.recognised for its dedication in honouring Britain's war dead. The
:05:56. > :05:59.coffins of soldiers killed in action in Iraq and Afghanistan
:05:59. > :06:05.passed through it for many years after arriving at nearby RAF
:06:05. > :06:15.Lyneham. It is the first town in more than 100 years to receive
:06:15. > :06:15.
:06:15. > :06:20.royal status. Sebastian Vettel has won the Korean Grand Prix. His
:06:20. > :06:28.rebel team take the constructors title. Lewis Hamilton came in
:06:28. > :06:38.second place. -- Red Bull team take the constructors title. Bad news
:06:38. > :06:38.
:06:38. > :06:48.for me in the Mail on Sunday. Bake up attacking facelifts. -- they are
:06:48. > :06:57.
:06:57. > :07:02.In the Sunday Telegraph, donors fury over lies with the Liam Fox of
:07:03. > :07:07.her. There is a nice picture of the Queen. Michael Gove is at war with
:07:07. > :07:12.top civil servant in the Education Department - sacking many of them.
:07:12. > :07:18.In the Sunday Express, it is warning it is the end of cheap
:07:18. > :07:28.flights. In the Sunday Mirror, it seems to have found the love
:07:28. > :07:28.
:07:28. > :07:33.hideaway of Paul McCartney. There is at only one story to start with.
:07:33. > :07:39.That is the Liam Fox affair. It has not been as much of a fox hunt, as
:07:39. > :07:44.far as I'm concerned. There is still a sense of a benign response
:07:44. > :07:48.on all of this that I think is inappropriate. In the Daily
:07:49. > :07:54.Telegraph, it says the donors who gave money to Adam Werritty - the
:07:54. > :07:59.friend of Liam Fox - a cross because he was spending it on first
:07:59. > :08:04.class flights and staying in fancy hotels. They wanted the money to be
:08:04. > :08:09.spent on political stuff and their agenda. That is what should be
:08:09. > :08:17.concerning people. Her I was amazed by the General lost -- the
:08:17. > :08:21.generosity of a lot of political pitches on it. I am not persuaded
:08:21. > :08:28.he would ever have become Defence Secretary if the justification were
:08:28. > :08:34.that he was a leadership contender. As for the job he has done, I am
:08:34. > :08:42.not satisfied he has been much good. Can he take credit for what has
:08:42. > :08:46.happened in Libya? A bit. The armed forces will be ecstatic at his
:08:46. > :08:51.departure. I feel a lot of people feel Philip Hammond is a very good
:08:51. > :08:56.appointment. There is a very good line in the Sunday Times saying,
:08:56. > :09:01.for Mr Cameron, it was a failure in the Civil Service and Number 10.
:09:01. > :09:05.Senior civil servants should have warned him and told Downing Street.
:09:05. > :09:09.The question my wife has asked repeatedly, what was going on that
:09:09. > :09:14.nobody said that this guy was amusing himself around the world
:09:14. > :09:19.while he was supposed to be Defence Secretary? It should not have been
:09:19. > :09:25.necessary for senior civil servants to say, sir, Canada say, we are a
:09:25. > :09:32.bit worried about the presence of this chap all the time. It is worse
:09:32. > :09:38.than that. It is about this awful business... Here we have the
:09:38. > :09:42.doneness being cross that he was being lavished on his expenses. It
:09:42. > :09:48.is the fact that people buy access to power and some out it is taken
:09:48. > :09:54.as read. At the beginning, the Observer was quoting to David
:09:54. > :09:58.Cameron, who was pointing at the danger of lobbyists. He said it was
:09:58. > :10:04.worse potentially for the reputation of politics. We have not
:10:04. > :10:09.seen much done about it. reality of power is always about
:10:09. > :10:16.this business of... Here were right-wing businessmen, who think
:10:16. > :10:20.their own personal agenda fixes with a bigger political agenda. It
:10:20. > :10:29.links him with people on the right in America. There is something
:10:29. > :10:33.nasty about this. This is a bipartisan comment made. Some
:10:33. > :10:37.ministers think the rules are made for little people. Liam Fox has
:10:37. > :10:42.always behaved as a semi-detached member of this government. It is
:10:42. > :10:47.very dangers when people start to do this. We saw that in the last
:10:47. > :10:52.government with Gordon Brown. was it that we suddenly had casino
:10:52. > :10:59.is being introduced in Britain? Why was Labour doing that? We have to
:10:59. > :11:03.flush it out. This is all over the newspapers. Behind this passing
:11:03. > :11:09.political story, there is a much bigger story about the world
:11:09. > :11:14.economy, the European economy, the British economy. Lots of anti-
:11:14. > :11:19.capitalist protests going on - some of them violent. We have this
:11:19. > :11:24.business going on in Wall Street. It is going global. It is young
:11:24. > :11:28.people but it has the support of lots of people. Far more people are
:11:28. > :11:32.supporting us because they really do feel that, if you like, the
:11:32. > :11:39.money men have got away with it. Somehow we are not addressing the
:11:39. > :11:45.serious problems and the kind of capitalism, free-market ideology,
:11:45. > :11:49.which has gone mad. It has to be constrained in some way. Democratic
:11:49. > :11:53.politicians all over the West will have a hell of a job in the next
:11:53. > :11:59.few years. They need to reconcile electorates to the fact they will
:11:59. > :12:05.have less of everything. I hear a lot of talk around the place. Will
:12:05. > :12:09.the social fabric hold together in the light of this? We have a column
:12:09. > :12:15.by Janet Daley of the Sunday Telegraph about being poorer. That
:12:15. > :12:20.may be true if you are in the upper middle classes. In the bottom of
:12:20. > :12:24.society, we are all asking questions. We have never had a
:12:24. > :12:30.downturn like this which has not had some kind of political kickback.
:12:30. > :12:34.We have not felt the impact yet. It will be painful for the middle-
:12:34. > :12:39.classes and less well-off people. It will be really hard. Politicians
:12:39. > :12:45.are going to have a hard time. We are always going to be disappointed
:12:45. > :12:48.in them. The people with power are not the politicians. We have to
:12:48. > :12:54.find a new way to consider politics to examine this and look at the
:12:54. > :12:59.ways in which... It is a difficult call for newspapers about the
:12:59. > :13:03.gravity of the euro crisis. It is difficult for the media and
:13:03. > :13:08.politicians to never, how big do you play it? Do you pretend these
:13:08. > :13:15.are normal times what do you say, this is a historic crisis that may
:13:16. > :13:20.change all our lives? So much of this is so complicated. These
:13:20. > :13:24.trillions and billions and complicated packages by obscure
:13:24. > :13:30.European organisations. People find it very hard to get their heads
:13:31. > :13:35.around it. There is a story closer to home with Scotland. This is one
:13:35. > :13:42.we have to watch. We can easily leave this on the back-burner but
:13:42. > :13:46.we should be talking about it more. In the Independent, Westminster has
:13:46. > :13:50.no argument to be Alex Salmond effect. It is about the growing
:13:50. > :13:54.sense that Alex Salmond is playing something of a blinder on this
:13:54. > :14:00.business of Wescott then goes. People in Scotland of getting free
:14:00. > :14:09.personal care. -- where Scotland goes up. There is free education
:14:09. > :14:13.for students who are Scottish. All this business where there is a far
:14:13. > :14:19.more -- where far more public services are being maintained than
:14:19. > :14:23.in England. They are offering a referendum, not about full-scale
:14:23. > :14:30.nationalism and independence, but something less than that, which is
:14:30. > :14:34.greater autonomy in terms of the economy. Does that mean that the
:14:34. > :14:39.Scot should pay all the bills? he is able to make corporation tax
:14:39. > :14:45.much lower than England, he might be inviting a lot of big corporates
:14:45. > :14:48.into... We will hear more from the man himself very shortly. The real
:14:48. > :14:56.question is, have we had much of a discussion about the implications
:14:56. > :15:06.of this for the whole of the United Kingdom and the way in which...?
:15:06. > :15:09.
:15:09. > :15:13.More next week for those interested Tomorrow is a summit about energy,
:15:14. > :15:18.presided over by Chris Huhne. I think this is a looming problem, a
:15:18. > :15:22.number of people have said this Government has no credible energy
:15:22. > :15:28.policy. Unless it can do better, Elle we'll have a huge energy
:15:28. > :15:30.crunch. What, in sum, does it have crunch. What, in sum, does it have
:15:30. > :15:36.to do? They've got to get on, as a very good report published last
:15:36. > :15:41.year said, the options facing us are so bleak about an energy crunch
:15:41. > :15:47.ten years down the line, they've got to embrace all the options:
:15:47. > :15:51.nuclear, renewables, the whole work. I would like to talk about face-
:15:51. > :15:58.lifts. It seems to me that here is one that I think most people might
:15:58. > :16:07.agree with, the idea of putting VAT on cosmetic surgery, since it is a
:16:07. > :16:12.luck ry thing. -- luxury thing. People don't want to talk about
:16:12. > :16:17.face-lifts any more or breast enlargements. I think all the
:16:17. > :16:23.surgeons will start patting their patients on the soldier and saying,
:16:23. > :16:28."Don't worry, I will tell them it is a medical they assessity."
:16:28. > :16:34.You've done a one-volume excellent history of the Second World War,
:16:35. > :16:39.which I have read. I'm terribly flattered you have had time to read
:16:39. > :16:43.it. You are up there with the best sellers. We are just behind the
:16:44. > :16:49.comedians and that's the best you can hope for in our business,
:16:49. > :16:52.Andrew. The great thing about this book is he has gone around the
:16:52. > :16:57.world and talked about the effects of the Second World War. We've
:16:57. > :17:01.looked at it nationally rather than globally. At this stage in the game
:17:01. > :17:06.if you are going to justify writing a book like that you have to look
:17:06. > :17:15.at it in a new way. One of the shocks to me was the idea that the
:17:15. > :17:22.people in India starved, the Bengal famine. We've covered a lot. We've
:17:22. > :17:28.been quite rude about Liam Fox, who isn't here to defend himself...
:17:28. > :17:34.half as rude as I would liked to have been if we had more time.
:17:34. > :17:38.Perhaps another occasion. For now, thank you very much indeed.
:17:38. > :17:44.It was gorgeous, glittering weather in the south yesterday as we wept
:17:44. > :17:46.for Wales. We read of gales to come. What's the outlook for today? Over
:17:46. > :17:49.the Chris Fawkes in the Weather the Chris Fawkes in the Weather
:17:49. > :17:53.Centre. It's been quite a mild start to the month so far, but
:17:53. > :17:57.things are set to change over the next couple of days. Colder air to
:17:57. > :18:02.our north-west is going to flood across the country. Temperatures
:18:02. > :18:06.will have dropped everywhere by Tuesday. It will feel much more
:18:06. > :18:11.like autumn shoot. For the north- west of the country, blustery
:18:11. > :18:15.showers for Northern Ireland and Scotland. South and east, fog
:18:15. > :18:19.patches linger in south-east England. Temperatures will be slow
:18:19. > :18:23.to rise in some eastern counties, perhaps reaching 17 degrees. This
:18:23. > :18:26.evening and overnight we'll see more rain in Northern Ireland and
:18:26. > :18:30.Scotland. The winds continue to strengthen here, touching gale-
:18:30. > :18:36.force. Further south, it will be a chilly night. Temperatures in the
:18:36. > :18:40.countryside down to 3-4 Celsius. Tomorrow looks like it is a windy
:18:40. > :18:43.day in northern areas in particular. A band of rain sets in during the
:18:43. > :18:47.day in Northern Ireland, spreading to Scotland. This band of rain is a
:18:47. > :18:52.cold front. Just to the southern side of our cold front is where the
:18:53. > :18:56.winds will be at their strongest on Monday afternoon, touching gusts of
:18:56. > :19:00.60-70 miles per hour to southern parts of Scotland and the far north
:19:00. > :19:06.of England. There is going to be a bit of mountain snow as well. A
:19:06. > :19:10.cold day in Glasgow, cloudy and wet, 9 degrees. The cold air is yet to
:19:10. > :19:14.arrive in London, but it will do by Tuesday. Autumn is just around the
:19:14. > :19:17.corner. corner.
:19:17. > :19:20.Thank you Chris. Within days of becoming US
:19:20. > :19:22.President, Barack Obama signalled his commitment to finding peace in
:19:22. > :19:25.the Middle East by appointing Senator George Mitchell as his
:19:25. > :19:28.special envoy. A big figure in American politics for years, and
:19:28. > :19:31.boss of the Disney Corporation, credited with turning it around,
:19:31. > :19:33.he's best known here as the man who accomplished so much in Northern
:19:33. > :19:37.Ireland. Appointed to talk to Israel and the Palestinians, he
:19:37. > :19:41.once said every conflict could be ended. They're created and
:19:41. > :19:44.sustained by human beings, they can be ended by human beings. After two
:19:44. > :19:47.years of trying, Senator Mitchell resigned his post this spring amid
:19:47. > :19:50.suggestions that he was exasperated by the lack of movement. Well, he's
:19:50. > :19:53.visiting the UK to speak at an event organised by OneVoice, a
:19:53. > :20:03.conflict resolution group working with both Israelis and Palestinians.
:20:03. > :20:08.And he joins me now. Senator Mitchell, welcome. Thanks for
:20:08. > :20:11.having me. Can I ask why you decided it was time to move on from
:20:11. > :20:15.what must have been I'm sure a frustrating role and a difficult
:20:15. > :20:20.one? Did you think that in the end the United States didn't have
:20:20. > :20:25.enough heft to shift the Israelis? No, the reason I left is that when
:20:25. > :20:29.President Obama asked me to accept the position, I told him I could
:20:29. > :20:33.serve for no more than two years, that I would do so and then I would
:20:33. > :20:38.leave, and that's what happened. I do think that the situation is very
:20:38. > :20:44.difficult, obviously. Conflicts that are centuries in the making
:20:44. > :20:49.often taking years to overcome. But I still believe that if not in the
:20:49. > :20:52.immediate future, where it is hard to be optimistic, over some time
:20:52. > :20:56.the parties, Israel and Palestine, their people will recognise that
:20:56. > :21:01.the pain of getting to an agreement is less than the pain they will
:21:01. > :21:06.endure if they don't get to an agreement. I think that will
:21:06. > :21:13.prevail. Quite a few commentators nonetheless after President Obama
:21:13. > :21:17.made his great speech in Cairo and raised so many hopes wondered why
:21:17. > :21:21.America didn't do more. In terms of military contacts and commercial
:21:21. > :21:28.contacts and cultural contacts and the rest of it, there was the
:21:28. > :21:33.ability to put pressure on Mr Binyamin Netanyahu. He is a tough
:21:33. > :21:38.character. We all knew where he was coming from. There didn't seem to
:21:38. > :21:42.be that pressure, it was hard to see how things would change. From
:21:42. > :21:46.the other side's perspective there was too much pressure. I think it
:21:46. > :21:49.depends on your point of view as to how much is the right amount of
:21:49. > :21:54.pressure. They are all tough guys in the region, not only the Prime
:21:54. > :21:59.Minister but everyone involved. We made a real effort, but in the end,
:21:59. > :22:02.Andrew, the decisions made there will have to be made by Israelis
:22:02. > :22:07.and Palestinians. Withive and sustained support of the United
:22:07. > :22:11.States and our allies, and many friends in the region, but it won't
:22:11. > :22:14.be the American people who decide if future of Israelis and
:22:14. > :22:19.Palestinians but Israelis and Palestinians. And you were at the
:22:19. > :22:27.core of this for two years. What, in your view, has been the toughest
:22:27. > :22:30.part of the whole situation to shift? Israel has a state, a very
:22:30. > :22:33.successful one. They don't have security for their people and
:22:33. > :22:37.that's what they want. The Palestinians do not have a state
:22:37. > :22:42.and they want one, and independent, viable state, so that they can
:22:42. > :22:45.enjoy the self respect that comes from self governance. I believe
:22:45. > :22:48.that neither can attain its objective by denying to the other
:22:49. > :22:53.side its objective. That is to say I don't think the Palestinians are
:22:53. > :22:56.going to get a state until Israelis feel a sense ofen reasonable and
:22:56. > :22:59.sustainable security. I don't think the Israelis can get that until the
:22:59. > :23:04.Palestinians get a state. So the outcome, it seems to me, is clear.
:23:04. > :23:08.The problem is getting there. Both societies are deeply divided and it
:23:08. > :23:11.is very difficult politically for any leader to make anything
:23:11. > :23:14.resembling the compromise that's necessary to accommodate the other
:23:14. > :23:19.side's concerns. And that's the big hurdle. Of course, the Palestinians
:23:19. > :23:24.are making a push at the moment in the United Nations for statehood.
:23:24. > :23:29.Yes. And the United States appears likely to veto this. That's going
:23:29. > :23:31.to be very hard to explain across the wider region, given that
:23:31. > :23:34.Palestinian statehood has been part of what the United States says it
:23:34. > :23:39.is fighting for? The United States does strongly favour the creation
:23:39. > :23:42.of a Palestinian state as part of a two-state solution, which provides
:23:42. > :23:47.to both sides their principal objective. But we believe and the
:23:47. > :23:51.parties themselves - President Abbas and Prime Minister Netanyahu
:23:51. > :23:57.- have both said the only way it will be achieved is through direct
:23:57. > :24:01.negotiation. Did you regard this as a propagandist thing in the United
:24:01. > :24:05.Nations? That's a pejorative phrase. They are obviously trying to trance
:24:05. > :24:09.their objective. But if the goal is a state, they themselves have
:24:09. > :24:13.acknowledged the only way to get a state is to get into negotiations.
:24:13. > :24:19.The concerns we have about that approach is it makes negotiations
:24:19. > :24:23.less likely rather than more likely. Meanwhile there's a problem in the
:24:23. > :24:31.sense that Hamas is gaining traction and gaining credibility.
:24:31. > :24:35.They've been very big -- a very big prisoner swap deal has been agreed.
:24:35. > :24:40.If Hamas are on the rise and Prime Minister Abbas is on the down it is
:24:40. > :24:43.going to be harder isn't it? course, there are ups and downs.
:24:44. > :24:49.Just a couple of weeks ago when President Abbas appeared before the
:24:49. > :24:53.United Nations to file his request, he went up. Now Hamas is coming up.
:24:53. > :24:56.So wait another week and something else will happen drities up and
:24:56. > :25:01.down. But it's a concern. The United States favours the
:25:01. > :25:05.involvement of all parties, provided they meet the simplest,
:25:05. > :25:10.basic democratic demands that everyone has in the region, and
:25:10. > :25:14.among the EU and other allies in the West. When you took on the job
:25:14. > :25:17.you must have thought there was the chance of a breakthrough, that this
:25:17. > :25:22.is a moment of hope. You heard the President talking about hope. What
:25:22. > :25:26.went wrong, do you think? Well, it is a conflict centuries in the
:25:26. > :25:30.making and there were deep roots. I never was certain there would be an
:25:30. > :25:34.agreement but I was optimistic and hopefully. And I still am. I think
:25:34. > :25:39.that with patience and perseverance this can be done. I think what went
:25:39. > :25:45.wrong is that the parties so far have been unwilling to take the
:25:45. > :25:49.painful steps politically, in terms of their internal dynamics, to move
:25:49. > :25:54.to the next level and to accommodate the other side, because,
:25:54. > :25:58.I repeat, the only way each can get what it wants is to accommodate the
:25:58. > :26:03.principal return of the other side. President Carter told us he thought
:26:03. > :26:08.the time had come to talk to Hamas, that they had moved to a position
:26:08. > :26:14.where they the become a genuine interlocutor. Hamas made many
:26:14. > :26:18.statement to many people, many of them contradictory, some private,
:26:18. > :26:21.some public. Once they've made a statement they will comply with
:26:21. > :26:26.democratic norms they will be welcomed into the process. Until
:26:26. > :26:31.they do so, however, as in other conflicts, they should not be. You
:26:31. > :26:35.know, Andrew, in Northern Ireland a principal step was taken when I set
:26:35. > :26:44.forth what became known as the Mitchell Principles and all the
:26:44. > :26:48.paramilitaries agreed with them. They included the renounciation --
:26:48. > :26:52.renunciation of violence. When people make clear their willingness
:26:52. > :26:56.to participate in a manner that's consistent with democratic
:26:56. > :27:01.principles, they will be very welcome. So you can help people
:27:01. > :27:04.make peace but they have to be ready for it? That's exactly right.
:27:04. > :27:08.Senator Mitchell, thank you for joining us this morning. Thank you,
:27:08. > :27:10.Andrew. For more than four decades Peter
:27:10. > :27:13.Gabriel has been one of the most revered British musicians, an
:27:13. > :27:16.artist of the first rank, ever since the ground-breaking days with
:27:16. > :27:18.Genesis. He was also at the forefront of the world music
:27:18. > :27:22.movement, has been an activist for Amnesty International, and is
:27:22. > :27:25.behind a fascinating organisation called simply The Elders. His new
:27:25. > :27:29.album revisits the Peter Gabriel back catalogue, accompanied by an
:27:29. > :27:36.orchestra. We'll be hearing more of that later, but first the man
:27:36. > :27:41.himself joins me. Welcome. Thank you for coming in. You're welcome.
:27:41. > :27:46.Can I start by asking, it is perhaps a strange place to start
:27:46. > :27:56.but about The Elders? This is an organisation of extremely
:27:56. > :27:59.experienced world states people is it? Indeed. The idea was really as
:27:59. > :28:03.trust in institutions and Government declines around the
:28:03. > :28:06.world, there are still individuals around who are trusted and have led
:28:06. > :28:09.extraordinary lives. The thought was you could get a small group of
:28:09. > :28:13.them together and they could focus their energies, that there might be
:28:13. > :28:18.some ways that their wisdom and experience could be usefully
:28:18. > :28:25.engaged. Like a world Senate or upper house of the real grey beards.
:28:25. > :28:35.Nelson Mandela has been on it in the past? He founded it, Tutu is
:28:35. > :28:35.
:28:35. > :28:39.our chair, Brundtland... Senator Mitchell might be a candidate
:28:39. > :28:46.before long. So they come together, what happens to the discussions,
:28:46. > :28:50.are they going to be publicised? Some of the activities are kept
:28:50. > :28:53.fairly quiet, for obvious reasons, but they choose various places in
:28:53. > :28:58.the world where they think they may make an incremental perhaps but a
:28:58. > :29:03.difference to what's going on there. The whole concept of people power
:29:03. > :29:07.which we are beginning to see in the Arab awakening, with the
:29:07. > :29:17.internet, social networks, mobile phones, that they would have a role
:29:17. > :29:33.
:29:33. > :29:40.I sort of fell into it and wrote a song about Stephen be, in South
:29:40. > :29:45.Africa. That was my calling card. I was invited to other things. The
:29:45. > :29:50.amnesty Tour went around the world and it was like changing stuff. You
:29:50. > :29:56.met people for whom it was a real and every day story. The sum you
:29:56. > :30:04.are going to sing at the end of the show it is a political song. -- the
:30:04. > :30:10.song. It was inspired by torture in Argentina. It was really trying to
:30:10. > :30:17.talk about prisoner conscience. actually put your money into these
:30:17. > :30:22.things. You do not sign a petition and way. There is of money. I work
:30:22. > :30:26.with another organisation - a human rights organisation using
:30:26. > :30:35.technology and video. That is more of my human rights focus but I
:30:35. > :30:40.still do things with Amnesty and The Elders. You have a full
:30:40. > :30:45.orchestra. It makes a heck of a noise. It is amazing. You get used
:30:45. > :30:51.to performing with a small group and some pre-recorded elements.
:30:52. > :30:57.Here is a large stage full of wonderful players. Being of a
:30:57. > :31:04.generation that bought Genesis albums from way back. Nowt to a
:31:04. > :31:09.kind of almost silence and piece of vocal music and back up again. --,
:31:09. > :31:19.it seems that putting an orchestra behind you lets you play at a
:31:19. > :31:21.
:31:21. > :31:27.deeper level. The range is much deeper and Fuller. -- more fall. Do
:31:28. > :31:33.you recognise the life young man who was there in the old days?
:31:33. > :31:38.about. All a healthy part of growing up. Presumably we will not
:31:38. > :31:42.see Genesis Again? We had conversations a few years back but
:31:42. > :31:48.it was the bigger project and I thought I could take on. The door
:31:48. > :31:52.is not locked. Meanwhile some great music. We will hear from you a bit
:31:52. > :31:54.later on. Few characters in British comedy have seized our imagination
:31:55. > :31:57.as forcibly as that of Malcolm Tucker, the foul-mouthed
:31:57. > :32:02.Westminster bruiser, played so memorably by Peter Capaldi in The
:32:02. > :32:07.Thick of It. It's been so successful that the series
:32:07. > :32:10.transferred to the cinema - In The Loop was a Box Office hit. Having
:32:10. > :32:14.conquered the small screen and the big screen, Capaldi is now back on
:32:14. > :32:16.the stage in London. He is starring in a new theatre adaptation of that
:32:16. > :32:20.wonderful Ealing comedy, The Ladykillers. I'll be talking to him
:32:20. > :32:29.about that in a moment. But first a brief reminder of Malcolm Tucker at
:32:29. > :32:39.his most malevolent. This job will not get anywhere near my husband
:32:39. > :32:40.
:32:40. > :32:45.and my kids. You are now belt and owned by the state. You are under
:32:45. > :32:53.the spotlight 24 hours a day, darling! We were going to play a
:32:53. > :32:59.bit where you were very rude about my ears but it was all swearing.
:32:59. > :33:04.Before we talk about other things, obviously your character was based
:33:04. > :33:10.on Alastair Campbell. You met Alastair Campbell. I always tried
:33:10. > :33:15.to avoid him. I did not want to be charmed. Politicians are terribly
:33:15. > :33:18.charming and I did not want to be drawn into his circle. I saw the
:33:19. > :33:26.name plate next to mine was Alastair Campbell. I thought I
:33:26. > :33:31.would be stuck. He turned up large as life and he said, what is with
:33:31. > :33:37.the hair? He has a great interest in hair and hair products, as you
:33:37. > :33:42.know. He was very charming and very funny. Lots of quips and remarks
:33:42. > :33:48.about everyone. With his northern accent it gave him an air of a
:33:48. > :33:56.second rate comedian at the Batley Variety Club or something. I should
:33:56. > :34:01.not have been surprised at this there were lots of prominent Tories
:34:01. > :34:10.who came up to him and said, hello. Politicians are human beings. We
:34:10. > :34:20.forget that. Now with the coalition, we're going to seek a remix of The
:34:20. > :34:26.Thick Of It. Are you going to be in it? I am. I cannot tell you what I
:34:26. > :34:34.will be doing because I do not really know. Malcolm is going to be
:34:34. > :34:39.there. Excellent! The Ladykillers is one of the great comedies of all
:34:39. > :34:46.time. Why transfer it to the stage? What is the point of the stage
:34:46. > :34:51.version? Is it different? The point of doing it is it is banned. The
:34:51. > :34:57.Ladykillers, the movie, it is almost a perfect maybe but it is
:34:57. > :35:06.full of great stuff you cannot leave alone. It is very stylish and
:35:06. > :35:12.has a ghoulish quality about it. It has great ideas. We'd tell the same
:35:12. > :35:16.story and we use a lot of the same elements. Obviously it is a live
:35:16. > :35:20.show full of real actors and routines and gags. You are
:35:20. > :35:27.following in the shoes of one of the all-time great British actors.
:35:27. > :35:34.It is quite terrifying. We have just seen Gary Coltman. The key
:35:34. > :35:41.thing about Alec Guinness in the Ladykillers is, he said, my dear
:35:41. > :35:46.boy, surely you want Alastair Sim for less? He was doing a version of
:35:46. > :35:51.Alastair Sim. Alastair Sim had been influenced by lots of different
:35:51. > :36:01.actors as well. I joined that line of actors channelling other people.
:36:01. > :36:07.
:36:07. > :36:12.This is a homage to the great days of cinema, isn't it? You have done
:36:12. > :36:18.another programme. It is a documentary looking at my passion
:36:18. > :36:28.for lost stars of the British film industry, including people like
:36:28. > :36:32.
:36:32. > :36:40.Floyd Fonteyn. They raise a series of films called -- there is a
:36:40. > :36:45.series of films called the thumbs up gang, which are worse than the
:36:45. > :36:52.Carry On films. Without any language you cannot use at this
:36:52. > :36:59.time of mourning, what would Malcolm Tucker be a dressing David
:36:59. > :37:04.Cameron with? -- addressing. think the thing is, the very first
:37:04. > :37:10.episode, the very first scene in the very first episode, it has
:37:10. > :37:16.almost this exact situation where Malcolm has a minister who is being
:37:16. > :37:20.the drip drip drip of what people are saying is making the Government
:37:20. > :37:30.look weak. Malcolm would have sacked him immediately. What would
:37:30. > :37:37.he say? I cannot say it. I cannot say it pulls up you know that.
:37:37. > :37:40.cannot say it. You know that. Well, we've talked this morning already
:37:40. > :37:43.about Libya, the Middle East and about the Fox resignation. A man
:37:43. > :37:49.who can help us with all of those, and more, is the Foreign Secretary,
:37:49. > :37:52.William Hague. Welcome. Let's start, if we may, with the resignation of
:37:52. > :38:02.Liam Fox. At the beginning of the show a red or what the Prime
:38:02. > :38:06.Minister had said about the need to clean up lobbying and he said there
:38:06. > :38:11.should be a register of lobbyists and it should be published. There
:38:11. > :38:15.should be quarterly updates and so on. None of that has happened. In
:38:15. > :38:20.order to stop this problem becoming generic, shouldn't the Government
:38:20. > :38:27.do more? The Cabinet secretary is doing a report that will be
:38:27. > :38:32.published in the coming days. It will depend on Match report if they
:38:32. > :38:38.are wider implications. It was part of the original coalition deal that
:38:38. > :38:44.there would be a larger measure on lobbying. I think ministers will
:38:44. > :38:48.have to discuss that. With the advantage of having seen that
:38:48. > :38:53.report. We do not have that advantage on Sunday morning. It
:38:53. > :38:57.will be published in the coming days. I do not think that the
:38:57. > :39:04.arrangements that have been described in the press, although I
:39:04. > :39:08.will have to see the report, are generic across the Government.
:39:08. > :39:14.Nevertheless, if action needs to be taken, the Prime Minister will want
:39:14. > :39:18.to take it. What we do know is that people with defence related
:39:18. > :39:22.interests had been paying for somebody who was then organising
:39:22. > :39:27.meetings with the Defence Secretary without MoD officials being present.
:39:27. > :39:33.What would be a good phrase for that? Again you are trying to get
:39:34. > :39:38.me on to what may be in this report. I would not be so bold as to say
:39:38. > :39:42.that what we read in newspapers is what we know about already. Let's
:39:42. > :39:46.see what the report from the Cabinet secretary has to say. I
:39:46. > :39:52.would say that the idea it is possible to run a completely
:39:52. > :39:57.separate policy by one minister is a fanciful idea. The foreign policy
:39:57. > :40:02.of this country is set by myself and the Prime Minister, working
:40:02. > :40:09.through the National Security Council, there are 140 ambassadors
:40:09. > :40:13.in consulates, etc. One adviser to one minister is not able to run the
:40:13. > :40:20.totally different policy from the rest of the Government. People can
:40:20. > :40:23.be reassured about that. And about all the allegations. There are very
:40:23. > :40:29.legitimate questions about all these things. We will have to see
:40:29. > :40:35.the report in a few days' time. When you hear, if it is true, that
:40:35. > :40:45.Mr Werritty was in Iran, has been dealing with Iranian Excise,
:40:45. > :40:46.
:40:46. > :40:51.discussing the overthrow of LEA regime, it might be a good thing to
:40:51. > :40:54.discuss. When you hear about discussions in Sri Lanka, you are
:40:54. > :41:02.not at all concerned that policies are being discussed outside the
:41:02. > :41:07.FCO? We will have to see what the report says. My own observations
:41:07. > :41:14.about Liam Fox and true banquette is, is if I asked him not to go to
:41:15. > :41:18.Sri Lanka at a particular time, he did not go. If it was about
:41:18. > :41:24.conveying the messages of the Government, he conveyed those
:41:24. > :41:28.messages. He acted, in my experience, in co-ordination with
:41:28. > :41:33.myself and on the instructions of the Foreign Office on foreign
:41:33. > :41:39.policy. I do not want to anticipate anything that is in this report but
:41:39. > :41:45.I hope that is of some reassurance. Did you know Mr Werritty? I have
:41:45. > :41:51.not met him while I have been Foreign Secretary. I did not know
:41:51. > :41:56.him. If did you have a sense of what he was doing? I do not have
:41:56. > :42:01.any sense of it other than what has been discussed openly in the last
:42:01. > :42:06.few days. I have not come across him as Foreign Secretary while we
:42:06. > :42:10.have been in government. That puts things into perspective. Clearly
:42:10. > :42:15.there are important questions to answer. Mistakes have been made.
:42:15. > :42:20.Liam Fox, in his resignation, has said he has made mistakes in his
:42:21. > :42:26.personal interests and government responsibilities that he had. That
:42:26. > :42:32.is acknowledged. We do not make light of that. To be absolutely
:42:32. > :42:35.clear, where it to be the case that somebody was organising meetings
:42:35. > :42:39.between potential defence contractors and clients and the
:42:39. > :42:44.mess that outside the system, that would be a fundamental breach of
:42:44. > :42:52.everything that a minister is supposed to do? It is wrong to the
:42:53. > :42:58.ports do things on behalf of the Government if it is not. -- purport.
:42:58. > :43:03.Have you seen the business card he was handing out? The Cabinet
:43:03. > :43:09.Secretary is going to address... It's my job is to say, to be fair,
:43:09. > :43:15.the Cabinet Secretary is addressing these things. Atlantic Bridge. What
:43:15. > :43:19.was all that about? It was one of many organisations that promote
:43:19. > :43:25.good transatlantic links between American and British politicians
:43:25. > :43:31.and communities in general. There are many such organisations. It is
:43:31. > :43:35.a good thing to do. I spoke once at one event organised by Atlantic
:43:35. > :43:44.Bridge in the United States and there was a wide range of people
:43:44. > :43:49.there. The idea it was only a tea- party connection was that it was
:43:49. > :43:53.wrong. It helps British and American politicians to know each
:43:53. > :43:58.other. It claimed to be a charity and then got into trouble and had
:43:58. > :44:05.to stop being a charity. Clearly there were some things wrong.
:44:05. > :44:12.were on the board at the time. I was Advisory Council, which is a
:44:12. > :44:16.name on the letterhead. It does not mean you know how the thing was run.
:44:16. > :44:21.The concept of supporting strong ties between Britain and America
:44:21. > :44:31.was the good one. Atlantic Bridge was part of supporting that concept.
:44:31. > :44:32.
:44:32. > :44:37.You did not come across Mr Werritty in that context? I do not think so,
:44:38. > :44:43.no. Contact with other ministers apart from Liam Fox would be very
:44:43. > :44:46.slight. Organisations that support strong Atlantic ties are to be
:44:47. > :44:56.supported. It does not mean that any of us know the details about
:44:57. > :45:02.
:45:02. > :45:08.We hear about a 2 trillion euro boost to help the Greeks out of
:45:08. > :45:17.their trouble. It does seem to look like there is no alternative to
:45:17. > :45:23.some sort of oldly Greece by -- orderly default by Greece? The need
:45:23. > :45:28.to ring-fence the problem in Greece by having a very substantial
:45:28. > :45:32.expansion of the stability fund to recapitalise certain banks, and to
:45:32. > :45:36.resolve the situation in Greece. There are various ways of doing
:45:36. > :45:41.that, on which we've given private advice as we believe as the public
:45:41. > :45:47.advice I've just referred to. We want to see the eurozone stabilised.
:45:47. > :45:52.I yield to no-one as a critic of the euro. I've always been a strong
:45:52. > :45:56.critic of the euro. I think it has many fundamental problems, but it
:45:56. > :46:02.is in our interests now in Britain for it to be stabilised and to have
:46:02. > :46:06.a healthy eurozone. You are in the strange position of being a critic
:46:06. > :46:11.of the whole euro project, and yet the British position seems to be
:46:11. > :46:16.that those in it have to go even further towards a single economic
:46:16. > :46:21.policy, a single fiscal policy to save the currency? They will have
:46:21. > :46:27.to integrate to a greater extent. One of our criticisms criticisms
:46:27. > :46:30.has been that if you set up a single currency there are logical
:46:30. > :46:36.consequences of that. One reason Britain shouldn't join ask we don't
:46:36. > :46:43.want to be caught up in that eurozone policy. They will have to
:46:43. > :46:46.follow some of the logic of having a single currency. Britain will
:46:46. > :46:51.support stabilising it. It doesn't mean we'll be involved in eurozone
:46:51. > :46:55.bail-out. We've helped Ireland but we are not involved in our eurozone
:46:55. > :46:59.bail-outs. Sir John Major said on the programme last week he thought
:46:59. > :47:03.the possibility of repatriating powers as a result of this, and he
:47:03. > :47:08.singled out some of the employment laws, fisheries and other things
:47:08. > :47:12.that could be repatriated, could be much closer than people thought,
:47:12. > :47:17.that we were close to some kind of crisis in the European structure
:47:17. > :47:22.which would allow us to repatriate powers and presumably allow a
:47:22. > :47:28.referendum? The repatriation of powers, which I'm in favour of, is
:47:28. > :47:33.not an immediate prospect, because no countries are proposing wide-
:47:33. > :47:37.scale treaty change. At the moment that is not what they are proposing.
:47:37. > :47:40.A British opportunity to address those issues comes if there's a
:47:40. > :47:44.major change in the European treaties and the other nations need
:47:44. > :47:50.our co-operation in order to do that. So, our priorities, given
:47:50. > :47:54.there is no major treaty change on the cards, are to protect our own
:47:54. > :47:58.financial services industry, to hold down the European budget and
:47:58. > :48:03.to make sure the 17 eurozone countries can't impose their view
:48:03. > :48:09.on the other ten who are not in the euro about matters that are not
:48:09. > :48:13.concerned with the euro. And that is more important to you now than a
:48:13. > :48:19.referendum, because any treaty change could, in theory, according
:48:19. > :48:23.to the original Conservative Party policy, trigger a referendum?
:48:23. > :48:27.treaty that transfers power from Britain to the EU will be subject
:48:27. > :48:31.to a referendum. We've passed the European Union Act of 2011, which
:48:31. > :48:35.in contrast to what happened under the last Government... So you are
:48:35. > :48:42.not going soft on this because you are Foreign Secretary? I believe in
:48:42. > :48:46.being in Europe but not run by Europe, in my slogan of ten years
:48:46. > :48:51.ago. That is still my belief. But the opportunity for major changes
:48:51. > :48:54.in the European treaties is not there yet. Our priority is for the
:48:54. > :49:00.eurozone to be stabilised and at the same time to protect the
:49:00. > :49:05.British national interest. Libya is really clearly now absolutely at
:49:05. > :49:10.the end endgame, it is over for the Gaddafi loyalists, even though
:49:10. > :49:14.Gaddafi hasn't been found. You are going to the region shortly. Yes.
:49:14. > :49:19.Talk us through what now needs to happen in terms of the elections
:49:19. > :49:26.and if dangers of violence against ex-Gaddafi people now, I guess.
:49:26. > :49:30.There is still fighting going on in Sirte and in Bani Walid. Once the
:49:30. > :49:35.fighting is over we expect the National Transitional Council to
:49:35. > :49:41.declare the formal liberation of Libya. That starts the clock
:49:41. > :49:45.ticking, on 30 days to inclusive government in Libya, an eight-month
:49:45. > :49:50.timetable for elections. We want that to happen, for Libya to have a
:49:50. > :49:53.democratic and free future. It is important they address any
:49:53. > :49:57.accusations, there've been accusation over the mistreatment of
:49:57. > :50:03.prisoners. Our embassy have already raised that with them. I will raise
:50:03. > :50:09.it with them when I visit Libya shortly. But I have to say, the
:50:09. > :50:12.leadership of the NTC in Libya has been clear about the standards they
:50:12. > :50:16.must uphold. I think their commitment to a free and democratic
:50:16. > :50:21.country is very sincere, so we should support them in achieving
:50:21. > :50:27.that goal. And you are not worried that there are Islamistic extremist
:50:27. > :50:32.elements there that might come to the fore? This term cover as vast
:50:32. > :50:37.range... That's why I used it! That's right. There are people who
:50:37. > :50:43.could be described as Islamists who are in favour of a moderate Muslim
:50:43. > :50:48.country. Others are what we would call... Terrorists Extremists. It
:50:48. > :50:53.is important that Libya moves in that moderate Muslim direction.
:50:53. > :50:59.That's the direction they are moving in. The opportunity for
:50:59. > :51:02.Libya, Egypt, Libya, Morocco, there's a tremendously exciting
:51:03. > :51:07.opportunity for them to have closer links with Europe, to develop their
:51:07. > :51:11.economies, for a huge advance in human freedom. So amidst all the
:51:11. > :51:15.problems of the world this has tremendous positive potential, the
:51:15. > :51:20.Arab Spring. Just to be clear, you are concerned about stories that
:51:20. > :51:25.there could now be pretty unpleasant mistreatment of Gaddafi
:51:25. > :51:30.loyalists and people, and you are going to raise that? Any report by
:51:30. > :51:34.Amnesty International we take very seriously. Of course we will be
:51:34. > :51:37.raising that further but I believe they are sincere in their
:51:37. > :51:41.determination to root out abuses. You said in the House of Commons
:51:41. > :51:46.that Syria had been faced by a fork in the road and had taken the wrong
:51:46. > :51:51.road. I know the various Arab Governments are coming together
:51:51. > :51:54.shortly to decide what to do. are meeting today in Cairo. I
:51:54. > :51:59.discussed this with the Prime Minister of Qatar yesterday. I
:51:59. > :52:04.urged them to take a steadily stronger stand. I think they will
:52:04. > :52:09.do that. They require unaninity to do that. It's a problem for them.
:52:09. > :52:13.Lebanon has deep links with Syria and it is not easy for the Lebanese
:52:13. > :52:17.Government to take a strong stand on this. We've banned all Syrian
:52:18. > :52:21.crude oil imports into the European Union, which is 90% of their crude
:52:21. > :52:25.oil exports, so we will keep up and intensify the international
:52:26. > :52:30.pressure on this appalling regime which has now killed at least 3,000
:52:30. > :52:35.of their own people. Can I ask a more general question? Sir Max
:52:35. > :52:40.Hastings was discussing this earlier on. The thought that we are
:52:40. > :52:45.actually as a country and indeed across the West facing a much more
:52:45. > :52:49.severe and difficult economic outlook that will have political
:52:49. > :52:55.consequences, perhaps than politicians tend to accept, tend to
:52:55. > :52:59.admit to, that we are facing much, much harder years ahead and that at
:52:59. > :53:04.some point politicians will have to tell us about it and be straight
:53:04. > :53:07.with us? This Government has been very clear with people that we
:53:07. > :53:11.cannot go on in the way that we were in previous years. We've got
:53:11. > :53:15.to tackle the debts and the deficits. One of the argument I
:53:15. > :53:19.made at our party conference a couple of weeks ago is that growth
:53:19. > :53:27.is not automatic. Some western countries will make this transition
:53:27. > :53:30.to increase the flexibility of their countries and some won't. We
:53:30. > :53:33.have to make sure we are one of the countries that does make that
:53:33. > :53:36.transition. That's the importance of what Michael Government is doing
:53:36. > :53:39.in education and Iain Duncan Smith in welfare, so we can make that
:53:40. > :53:44.change this this country. And what about all the protesters now around
:53:44. > :53:51.the world, including in London, who feel that the bankers and the old
:53:51. > :53:55.guard have got away with it? Well, we support the right to a peaceful
:53:55. > :54:00.protest. It is important those protests are kept peaceful. It is
:54:01. > :54:05.true that a lot of things have to be faced up to in the western world.
:54:05. > :54:10.There've been too many debts built up by states. Clearly in the
:54:10. > :54:14.banking system a lot has gone wrong. So you have some sympathy with
:54:14. > :54:20.those young people who've been up all night, in tents, protesting?
:54:20. > :54:24.have sympathy of course with people who are unhappy at the dump what we
:54:24. > :54:28.are facing in the world. However, protest isn't the answer. If answer
:54:28. > :54:31.is for Governments to control their debts and deficits, for us to boost
:54:31. > :54:36.the human capital of our country. That's why we are increasing the
:54:36. > :54:40.number of apresentistships, the number of University places this
:54:40. > :54:44.year. These are the positive answers that will address it. I'm
:54:44. > :54:48.afraid protesting in the streets isn't going to solve the problem.
:54:48. > :54:55.William Hague, thank you very much for joining us.
:54:55. > :55:00.Now over to Louise for the news headlines. The Foreign Secretary
:55:00. > :55:05.has confirmed that a report into the relationship between Adam
:55:05. > :55:15.Werritty and Liam Fox will be published.
:55:15. > :55:17.He said the idea was fanciful. Police in London are considering
:55:17. > :55:20.whether to investigate Adam Werritty, the close friend of the
:55:20. > :55:23.former Defence Secretary, Liam Fox, for fraud. The Labour MP, John Mann,
:55:23. > :55:26.asked police to probe allegations that Mr Werritty used business
:55:26. > :55:28.cards falsely claiming he was an adviser to Dr Fox. Crowds are
:55:28. > :55:30.gathering in Wootton Bassett for a ceremony in the Wiltshire town will
:55:30. > :55:34.be formally granted royal status. It's been recognised for its
:55:34. > :55:37.dedication in honouring Britain's war dead. The coffins of soldiers
:55:37. > :55:42.killed in action in Iraq and Afghanistan passed through the town
:55:42. > :55:49.for many years after arriving at nearby RAF Lyneham.
:55:49. > :55:55.The next news on BBC One in at 11.15.
:55:55. > :56:01.On Sunday morning live, teenagers say they want better sex education
:56:01. > :56:05.less sons but a campaigner says she doesn't want teachers talking dirty,
:56:05. > :56:15.in her words, to her kids. Should we get rid of retirement and
:56:15. > :56:24.
:56:24. > :56:27.work until we drop? Join us at 10.15.
:56:27. > :56:31.Thanks to all my guests. Join us again next Sunday, we're back at
:56:31. > :56:34.our normal time of 9.00am. Until then, we leave you as promised with
:56:34. > :56:37.Peter Gabriel and "Wallflower". # 6 x 6 from wall to wall.
:56:37. > :56:42.# Shutters on the windows, no light at all.
:56:42. > :56:50.# Damp on the floor, you got damp in the bed.
:56:50. > :56:55.# They're trying to get you crazy. # Get you out of your head.
:56:55. > :57:01.# And they feed you scraps and they feed you lies.
:57:01. > :57:06.# To lower your defences, no compromise.
:57:06. > :57:12.# Nothing you can do, the day can be long.
:57:12. > :57:22.# Your mind is working overtime. # Your body's not too strong.
:57:22. > :57:26.
:57:26. > :57:32.# Hold on, hold on. # They put you in a box so you
:57:32. > :57:38.can't get heard. # Let your spirit stay unbroken.
:57:38. > :57:47.# May you not be deterred. # Hold on.
:57:47. > :57:57.# You've gambled with your own life. # And you face the night alone.
:57:57. > :57:58.
:57:58. > :58:02.# While the builders of the cages sleep with bullets, bars and stone.
:58:02. > :58:12.# They do not see the road to freedom that you build with flesh
:58:12. > :58:21.