:00:37. > :00:46.Good morning. Remembrance Sunday. It's a serious day, when we reflect
:00:47. > :00:49.on war - those who die to keep us safe - but also war's brutalising
:00:50. > :00:53.effect. This week, for the first time since the Second World War, a
:00:54. > :00:56.British soldier has been convicted of murdering an enemy captive. It is
:00:57. > :00:59.a difficult issue, and we'll be talking about that. But mainly we'll
:01:00. > :01:06.be remembering heroes. If only today was just about history. And joining
:01:07. > :01:09.me today for our review of the Sunday newspapers, the Lib Dem peer,
:01:10. > :01:13.Baroness Shirley Williams, and the editor of The Spectator magazine,
:01:14. > :01:15.Fraser Nelson. The pull-out from Afghanistan is the biggest
:01:16. > :01:20.logistical exercise for UK forces since the Second World War came to
:01:21. > :01:26.an end. Once that's done, where are the Army's next challenges? To talk
:01:27. > :01:29.about that and to reflect on what Remembrance Day means for the
:01:30. > :01:33.services, I'll be talking to the new head of the Army, General Sir
:01:34. > :01:37.Nicholas Houghton. But we're going to talk too about the job of
:01:38. > :01:40.politics, which is to prevent future war. With talks in Geneva failing,
:01:41. > :01:44.just a few hours ago, to conclude a deal over Iran's nuclear ambitions,
:01:45. > :01:47.I'll also be joined by the Foreign Secretary, William Hague, who has
:01:48. > :01:50.spent the last 24 hours with his American and Iranian counterparts
:01:51. > :01:56.battling to reach an agreement that would enable the West to lift
:01:57. > :01:59.economic sanctions. To bring Iran in from the cold. What happens now?
:02:00. > :02:02.This year marks the 70th anniversary of Bomber Command's biggest raid on
:02:03. > :02:05.Germany. One of the most hotly-debated aspects of British
:02:06. > :02:10.warfare in the Second World War was the aerial bombardment of Germany by
:02:11. > :02:14.the RAF. Was it right? Did strategic bombing shorten the war or did it
:02:15. > :02:16.strengthen German resolve? The war historian, Sir Max Hastings, and
:02:17. > :02:22.ex-RAF gunner, Bernard Mason, are here to discuss all that. Bletchley
:02:23. > :02:26.Park is a symbol of the sheer genius and the mind-boggling hard work that
:02:27. > :02:28.was so vital in winning that war. Sophie Raworth has been talking to
:02:29. > :02:35.two Bletchley veterans about code-breaking and keeping secrets.
:02:36. > :02:38.And from Hogwarts to gang wars. Rupert Grint will be telling me
:02:39. > :02:50.later about his theatre debut, and why life after Harry Potter lost its
:02:51. > :03:07.magic for a time. We were out in the real world. It was a scary time.
:03:08. > :03:10.Plus, we have some good music. An arrangement by Benjamin Britten,
:03:11. > :03:13.perhaps most famous for his War Requiem. All that coming up soon on
:03:14. > :03:18.this special, extended programme. First, the news with Sian Lloyd.
:03:19. > :03:23.Authorities in the Philippines fear as many as 10,000 people may have
:03:24. > :03:29.died in the devastation caused by Typhoon Haiyan. The storm is one of
:03:30. > :03:34.the most powerful on record and hit the central islands especially hard.
:03:35. > :03:41.Huge rescue operation is underway. As rescue teams begin to reach the
:03:42. > :03:44.communities, the storm hit hardest, the picture and faults of waves as
:03:45. > :03:52.high as trees and panicked escapes through rising floodwaters. This is
:03:53. > :03:56.one of six central Philippine islands devastated by the super
:03:57. > :04:03.typhoon. People of all ages are shaken by what they have seen. This
:04:04. > :04:13.man says his family fled for shelter. I thought our neighbours
:04:14. > :04:16.did the same, he says. They did not. Despite mass evacuation efforts
:04:17. > :04:22.before the storm, bodies lined the streets, covered in any thing people
:04:23. > :04:28.can find - tarpaulin, clots, sheets of metal which have blown off roofs.
:04:29. > :04:33.Most of the victims drowned or were crushed under collapsed buildings. I
:04:34. > :04:42.was so blessed because I am still alive. I told my husband to just
:04:43. > :04:48.save our baby and forget me. People here have no clean water, no
:04:49. > :04:52.electricity and very little food. The relief operation needed is fast.
:04:53. > :04:58.Helicopters are bringing supplies but officials are struggling to give
:04:59. > :05:01.it to them and pollution is widespread. The United States is
:05:02. > :05:07.sending ships and planes and other governments have offered
:05:08. > :05:12.assistance. Some areas are isolated by broken power lines and blocked
:05:13. > :05:20.roads. The dates of all communities is not yet known. -- the states.
:05:21. > :05:25.Talks on Iran in nuclear programme have ended without agreement. There
:05:26. > :05:30.were expectations of a breakthrough. There were positive
:05:31. > :05:33.indications that genuine progress had been made. Discussions are
:05:34. > :05:39.scheduled to be resumed later this month. The Queen will lead the
:05:40. > :05:43.Remembrance Sunday commemorations from Whitehall this morning. 10,000
:05:44. > :05:46.military veterans will join the Prime Minister and leading
:05:47. > :05:50.politicians for the two-minute silence to remember fallen service
:05:51. > :05:55.men and women. Ed Miliband has said that a Labour government would ban
:05:56. > :05:58.payday lenders from advertising during children's television
:05:59. > :06:06.programmes. The party leader wants him to face the same restrictions as
:06:07. > :06:20.gambling and junk food companies. That is all from me for now. Thank
:06:21. > :06:23.you. Now to the papers. The Sunday Times has the trade union story
:06:24. > :06:31.which is beginning to play Ed Miliband. In the Observer, a story
:06:32. > :06:38.about falsified cancer records. A really big scandal hitting the NHS.
:06:39. > :06:42.They are also talking about one of the Greenpeace activists held in
:06:43. > :06:49.Russia. In the Sunday Telegraph, a story about a new green tax. That
:06:50. > :06:55.was all on the programme too big to go but it has been rediscovered by
:06:56. > :07:04.the Sunday Telegraph. In the dependent, an end to ageing? That is
:07:05. > :07:08.not a reader offer. Unfortunately. In the Sunday Mirror, energy firms
:07:09. > :07:13.to pay back ?2 billion to the rest of us. They are taking that as a
:07:14. > :07:17.major triumph for the newspaper and the campaign against overpriced
:07:18. > :07:21.energy bills. And with me to review the papers are Shirley Williams and
:07:22. > :07:25.Fraser Nelson. You have chosen probably the most poignant of the
:07:26. > :07:31.wartime related stories, which is in the Sunday Times. This is a touching
:07:32. > :07:38.story about a boy of 12, who lied his way into the army at the age of
:07:39. > :07:43.12. He pretended he was 16. Within a few weeks of being recruited, he was
:07:44. > :07:50.sent to the Somme, when no less than 60,000 people died on the very first
:07:51. > :07:55.day. This young man managed to get himself there. His mother was
:07:56. > :08:00.outraged. She got hold of the War office and got him sent back. This
:08:01. > :08:05.young man had seen some of the most awful things. It is an extraordinary
:08:06. > :08:09.story. One thing important to remember on Remembrance Sunday, it
:08:10. > :08:17.is not just the deaths or injuries on a particular day, for people like
:08:18. > :08:23.Andy, who lost three limbs very recently in Helmand province, it is
:08:24. > :08:29.a lifetime sentence. Many people suffer for the rest of their lives.
:08:30. > :08:36.You have chosen an extraordinary photographic record of this. It is
:08:37. > :08:40.funny how this Sunday we remember. There was one amputee for every
:08:41. > :08:57.person killed in Afghanistan and Iraq. Bryan Adams, he has taken some
:08:58. > :09:02.extremely pertinent photographs. This is a marine who accidentally
:09:03. > :09:09.stood on an IED. Every day in the House of Commons you read out -
:09:10. > :09:15.every Wednesday - those who died. The amputees do not get the same
:09:16. > :09:21.publicity. This photo spread in the Sunday Times Magazine shows it. The
:09:22. > :09:26.proceeds are going to combat stress, which is all psychological
:09:27. > :09:33.injuries after the war. Not all those wounded have physical things.
:09:34. > :09:39.The IED is an inexpensive and devastating weapon. We think about
:09:40. > :09:46.machine guns but this is colossally effective and deeply cool. We talk
:09:47. > :09:51.about the front pages and the big stories. Also stories are bubbling
:09:52. > :09:59.under the whole time which are more important. You have chosen one. We
:10:00. > :10:05.tend to get bored with scandals about banking. I think we thought
:10:06. > :10:09.last year we would get the better of them with people coming forward and
:10:10. > :10:20.admitting they had fixed the live-born rate. This is the next big
:10:21. > :10:25.scandal coming up. 12 traders have been suspended -1 might call them
:10:26. > :10:33.sacked - for beginning to fix the foreign exchange rate. Is nobody
:10:34. > :10:47.ever learning? Do we have to go from one scandal to the next? This is
:10:48. > :10:53.being - ?3 trillion a day. It was unregulated. It was not actually
:10:54. > :10:59.breaking the law. It is like MPs expenses - it may be technically all
:11:00. > :11:04.right but if it is seen as morally deplorable they will face huge
:11:05. > :11:11.fines. A lot of people on holiday are paying more than they are asked
:11:12. > :11:16.to. It looks like it will be another climate change scandal in banking. A
:11:17. > :11:26.lot of security related stories. You have chosen one about Theresa May.
:11:27. > :11:32.After not quite getting there last week, she is back with a vengeance.
:11:33. > :11:40.She wants to stop jihad he's going to mosques, which are regarded as
:11:41. > :11:47.radical. Hardly a Sunday goes by without Theresa May clamping down in
:11:48. > :11:52.one way or another. She was at awards for politician of the year.
:11:53. > :11:57.She got an award for Boris Johnson. Do you think she will eventually
:11:58. > :12:06.become Prime Minister? She has been the action woman of the government.
:12:07. > :12:10.I have got to pick up on that one. Crime has been falling for several
:12:11. > :12:21.years. It is entirely a function of the fact crime group has fallen. The
:12:22. > :12:32.Home Office budget has gone down a lot. The Home secretaries explode.
:12:33. > :12:35.Theresa May has been rather effective. She is appealing to the
:12:36. > :12:44.right wing of the Conservative Party. Not a foolish thing to do at
:12:45. > :12:48.the moment. She is the bookmakers favourite to succeed David Cameron.
:12:49. > :12:55.Let's move onto another story - green taxes. There is a huge storm
:12:56. > :13:02.in the far east, utter devastation. A terrible picture. The worst
:13:03. > :13:09.recorded. 10,000 dead and many more to come. It is huge. You connect
:13:10. > :13:17.this with climate change. Others do not. In the Sunday Telegraph, the
:13:18. > :13:23.top story, new green tax threat. Let's be quite direct about this.
:13:24. > :13:27.Where there are climate change, one effect is the huge increase in the
:13:28. > :13:33.number of devastating weather crises. That is what we see here.
:13:34. > :13:41.The science shows the opposite. You are intensities of storms recently.
:13:42. > :13:47.It has not been the case in the last few hundred years - the opposite has
:13:48. > :13:51.been the case. I am going to close that off now. I want to say that Ed
:13:52. > :13:56.Davis is absolutely right to say we have two have green taxes. They need
:13:57. > :14:00.to come out of income tax. You cannot hit people with big families
:14:01. > :14:06.and not much income and treat them as people who should not be
:14:07. > :14:20.protected. We are now going to move on to a wonderful woman Malala. In
:14:21. > :14:27.Pakistan half of the schools are run privately. The government is
:14:28. > :14:32.incapable of doing that. In her book, she describes how her dad was
:14:33. > :14:41.curious how the book by Salman Rushdie was banned. I think she has
:14:42. > :14:51.her answer. Herbert is hardly Satanic verses but it is critical of
:14:52. > :14:58.religious attics have taken over dashes-macro fanatics who have taken
:14:59. > :15:07.over these establishments. Private schools are the answer. Let's move
:15:08. > :15:14.if we may from one band conversation to another will stop this is George
:15:15. > :15:25.Bush and Tony Blair. More is to come out. It is the argument about
:15:26. > :15:29.blocking the memos from the Iraq war. The Iraq war was a disaster by
:15:30. > :15:49.any standards and it is important that we know why. I think of all the
:15:50. > :16:02.things to ban, this is a big mistake. White
:16:03. > :16:08.third of adults are now being pestered by their kids to take out
:16:09. > :16:15.payday loans, because they are so wooed by the adverts. It is
:16:16. > :16:20.interesting, this warms to his theme about the cost of living and waging
:16:21. > :16:26.war against companies he regards as a responsible. It will claim the
:16:27. > :16:31.U-turn on energy companies as a victory for him. Yes, when you read
:16:32. > :16:40.it, they are saying it is over payments they will return. Thank
:16:41. > :16:43.you. It was the deal that terrified Israel and infuriated hardliners in
:16:44. > :16:48.Iran but in the end at the last minute, it didn't happen. Senior
:16:49. > :16:52.ministers from all over the world including William Hague had gathered
:16:53. > :17:14.in Geneva for talks meant to rein in Iran 's nuclear weapons ambitions in
:17:15. > :17:17.return for an end to sanctions. Hopes rose, and rose, but right at
:17:18. > :17:21.the last minute something went wrong. What was it? It's just a few
:17:22. > :17:26.hours after the talks ended, and Mr Hague joins me now from Geneva. What
:17:27. > :17:30.went wrong? A great deal went right. This is fundamental to international
:17:31. > :17:36.peace and security over the next few years so we have two persist. These
:17:37. > :17:40.talks have been very detailed, about every aspect of Iran 's nuclear
:17:41. > :17:44.programme. They have made a lot of progress and there is no doubt
:17:45. > :17:49.Secretary John Kerry said during the night that the parties are closer
:17:50. > :17:54.together than before we had these talks so we haven't been wasting our
:17:55. > :18:00.time. It is a formidably difficult negotiation of course and we are
:18:01. > :18:05.going to reconvene these talks in ten days in Geneva and try to
:18:06. > :18:10.maintain that momentum. It is vital to keep the momentum and there is a
:18:11. > :18:16.deal on the table and it can be done. Would it be right to say that
:18:17. > :18:21.the big problem is proving that enrichment for civil purposes cannot
:18:22. > :18:26.be used for nuclear weapons? Naming that is the big problem we have
:18:27. > :18:33.got? That is right and of course it is a very big problem. There is a
:18:34. > :18:36.lack of trust of course about Imran 's intentions and nuclear
:18:37. > :18:41.programme. Over many years they have hidden things from the rest of the
:18:42. > :18:46.world, they have disregarded the resolutions from the United Nations
:18:47. > :18:50.Security Council, disregarded the International Atomic Energy Agency,
:18:51. > :18:55.so there is bound to be a terrible lack of trust and that means we have
:18:56. > :18:59.to go over every detail of it, we have to look at every aspect of the
:19:00. > :19:05.programme and be sure of what would happen in a deal with Iran. One of
:19:06. > :19:22.the other good things about this is that the so-called E3 plus three
:19:23. > :19:27.countries are united. We were all saying the same thing to Iran and
:19:28. > :19:31.supporting the same deal which can be done and that is something for
:19:32. > :19:40.the Iranians to think about over the next few days. Do you trust the
:19:41. > :19:45.Iranian negotiators? We have a good relationship, a working
:19:46. > :19:50.relationship, amicable, personal relationship with the Iranian
:19:51. > :19:55.Foreign Minister. He is a tough negotiator but he is very
:19:56. > :19:59.constructive. I do believe that he wants to solve this problem, that he
:20:00. > :20:05.is out to do a deal, he would like to do a deal with the international
:20:06. > :20:09.community. After all, Iran is under very serious pressure. This is one
:20:10. > :20:15.of those cases where sanctions applied by a large part of the world
:20:16. > :20:18.are having a big impact. It is putting the Iranian leadership and
:20:19. > :20:23.economy under serious pressure, and as long as there isn't a deal that
:20:24. > :20:29.pressure will continue. I do believe in his sincerity about it, but there
:20:30. > :20:35.is a complex power structure in Iran and many different views about this,
:20:36. > :20:39.just as there are in our own countries. Israel will have relief
:20:40. > :20:47.and delight that there hasn't been a deal. They are terrified of the
:20:48. > :20:51.Iranian bomb, do you think a deal will happen in the next few weeks
:20:52. > :20:55.and that you will be able to get clear guarantees that will satisfy
:20:56. > :21:01.people like the Israeli Government there will not be an Iranian bomb
:21:02. > :21:05.any time soon? There is a good chance it will happen in the next
:21:06. > :21:10.few weeks but there is a formidably difficult negotiation and I cannot
:21:11. > :21:16.say when it will conclude. We will be trying again on the 20th and the
:21:17. > :21:21.21st of November so we will keep an enormous amount of energy and
:21:22. > :21:26.persistence behind solving this. Will that be a deal which will
:21:27. > :21:30.please everybody? No, because compromises will have to be made but
:21:31. > :21:35.I have discussed things yesterday with Israeli ministers on the
:21:36. > :21:38.telephone while I have been here in Geneva and put the case for the kind
:21:39. > :21:44.of deal we are looking at making, and it is in the interests of the
:21:45. > :21:48.whole world including Israel, including all nations of the world,
:21:49. > :21:59.to reach a diplomatic agreement that the -- we can be confident in. Let
:22:00. > :22:03.me take you to an issue closer to home. There is a furious row going
:22:04. > :22:09.on here about the spying revelations, the fact that so many
:22:10. > :22:13.of us are being spied on by the Americans using digital cables and
:22:14. > :22:20.the rest of it. Liam Fox has called for the Guardian to be prosecuted,
:22:21. > :22:26.who told us all of this, and I am wondering what your view is. That is
:22:27. > :22:32.a legal matter, something on which the Attorney General decides so you
:22:33. > :22:43.can see the Government's position on that. You allowed our top three
:22:44. > :22:46.spooks from security services to be questioned by Parliament very
:22:47. > :22:50.briefly and they spoke about Al-Qaeda rubbing their hands with
:22:51. > :22:56.glee, but that wasn't really a proper investigation. It was very
:22:57. > :23:02.short. A lot of people see that more as a propaganda exercise than a real
:23:03. > :23:06.act of individuation or interrogation. I think that
:23:07. > :23:13.committee hearing the other day with the three chiefs of the intelligence
:23:14. > :23:17.agencies did show to the public how seriously we look at these issues
:23:18. > :23:21.and the number of terrorist plots against the United Kingdom which
:23:22. > :23:25.have been detected, defeated or disrupted through the hard work of
:23:26. > :23:30.our intelligence agencies, and we should pay tribute to them on this
:23:31. > :23:34.remembrance day as well because a great deal of dangerous and
:23:35. > :23:38.difficult work goes on to protect this country by the people who work
:23:39. > :23:44.for our intelligence agencies. People have been able to see that we
:23:45. > :23:50.take the decisions about any interception of anyone's
:23:51. > :23:57.communications in a strong and robust legal framework with many
:23:58. > :24:02.checks and balances. Is that only looking at part of this when you do
:24:03. > :24:07.it in a public airing? Yes, but the same people appear before the
:24:08. > :24:14.committee in secret, and it has to be in secret because if we don't,
:24:15. > :24:19.then terrorists can take advantage of our situation. It is a new
:24:20. > :24:26.programme to use fibre-optic cables to listen in on everybody's e-mails
:24:27. > :24:31.and text messages and so forth which is a huge extension of what has been
:24:32. > :24:37.done in the past. We gather it was not discussed in Cabinet. You were
:24:38. > :24:42.there, you must have known about it. Why did you not tell your colleagues
:24:43. > :24:46.about it? It seems extraordinary that something so important to the
:24:47. > :24:52.privacy of individual British citizens would not have been
:24:53. > :24:58.discussed. Firstly, I cannot confirm or deny various stories about our
:24:59. > :25:02.intelligence agencies for very good reasons, even if they are
:25:03. > :25:06.speculative or not true we cannot make that clear because otherwise
:25:07. > :25:13.people go on to ask other questions would be damaging to our national
:25:14. > :25:18.security to reveal, but are these things discussed in Government? Yes,
:25:19. > :25:23.because myself and the Home Secretary have very important
:25:24. > :25:29.responsibilities that we take very seriously. But not apparently in
:25:30. > :25:34.Cabinet or the National Security Council? ? That is because we do
:25:35. > :25:38.have a particular system for dealing with these things where the Foreign
:25:39. > :25:44.Secretary and the Home Secretary take those decisions, overseen by
:25:45. > :25:50.commissioners who are senior judges who report to the Prime Minister on
:25:51. > :25:55.how we carry out our tasks, and that is the political and legal framework
:25:56. > :26:00.in which these decisions about intelligence are made. Are they made
:26:01. > :26:05.in much larger groups? No, but that is because so much of what we do has
:26:06. > :26:11.to be secret, in trying to protect the country from the threats I have
:26:12. > :26:19.been referring to. All around the world, senior politicians have been
:26:20. > :26:23.upset about Angela Merkel finding out the phone has been booked by the
:26:24. > :26:34.Americans. How would you feel if your phone had been bugged by the
:26:35. > :26:38.Americans? We all have to anticipate that somewhere, someone is trying to
:26:39. > :26:45.look at our communications but again, I cannot go into any details
:26:46. > :26:50.about what we do. I can say that we work closely with other countries
:26:51. > :26:57.including the European countries to protect their security as well as
:26:58. > :27:02.our own, and what our intelligence agencies do very often saves lives
:27:03. > :27:07.in other countries. I have seen many specific instances of that in the
:27:08. > :27:12.last three and a half years as Foreign Secretary. Are you
:27:13. > :27:20.personally convinced that the Edward Snowden leaks have caused real harm
:27:21. > :27:23.to the search for Al-Qaeda terrorists in this country?
:27:24. > :27:29.Intelligence chiefs were saying the other day that the Edward Snowden
:27:30. > :27:35.allegations, let me put it that way, have certainly endangered our
:27:36. > :27:39.national security and made it harder to protect our country and other
:27:40. > :27:46.countries from terrorist attacks by speculating about our capabilities,
:27:47. > :27:50.that makes it easier for people who want to evade interception, but are
:27:51. > :27:55.seeking to damage our country or to kill people, it makes it easier for
:27:56. > :28:01.them to evade interception. That is something which is very serious. We
:28:02. > :28:06.are on the edge of the Commonwealth summit in Sri Lanka, not just the
:28:07. > :28:09.Canadian prime minister but now also the Prime Minister of India has
:28:10. > :28:15.decided to boycott this because of the accusation made about their
:28:16. > :28:21.Government at the end of the Civil War. Do you understand that
:28:22. > :28:26.boycott? We do understand it but we are not joining that. The foreign
:28:27. > :28:31.minister will be attending, so in the case of some of these countries
:28:32. > :28:35.although the Prime Minister is not going other representatives will be
:28:36. > :28:40.going. If we stayed away from this meeting, it would damage the
:28:41. > :28:45.Commonwealth without changing things positively in Sri Lanka. We need to
:28:46. > :28:49.be there, we are discussing the future of international
:28:50. > :28:52.development, and I want to discuss with the whole Commonwealth our
:28:53. > :29:00.efforts to prevent sexual violence and conflict. Are you going with a
:29:01. > :29:07.heavy heart? And are you going to read the riot act to some of your
:29:08. > :29:11.Sri Lankan counterparts? We are going to say that Sri Lanka is in
:29:12. > :29:17.the spotlight so let's make full use of that, rather than sitting in
:29:18. > :29:27.London talking about it, we will be in Sri Lanka. The Prime Minister
:29:28. > :29:30.will be there, I will be visiting places to promote reconciliation in
:29:31. > :29:39.Sri Lanka, talking about our efforts there to prevent sexual violence in
:29:40. > :29:44.conflict. It makes more sense to be doing that rather than sitting in
:29:45. > :29:48.London. In Geneva you have been talking to your Russian
:29:49. > :29:51.counterparts, have you raised the issue of the Greenpeace activists
:29:52. > :30:00.who have been banged up for hooliganism? Yes, we have been
:30:01. > :30:04.raising that over the last six weeks or so since this happened and I
:30:05. > :30:09.discussed it in the last week with the Russian Foreign Minister. The
:30:10. > :30:14.Prime Minister has discussed it with President Putin so they are very
:30:15. > :30:19.clear about our concerns. They have ensured that we have consular access
:30:20. > :30:23.to the individuals who have been arrested in Russia so we are keeping
:30:24. > :30:27.in close touch with the people concerned, keeping their families
:30:28. > :30:36.informed, and the Russians are very well aware of our concerns about
:30:37. > :30:44.this case. It was horrible yesterday, better today. That could
:30:45. > :30:48.be my very quick summary of world history. But, in fact, I'm talking
:30:49. > :31:02.about the weather. Yes, I know. It's all in the detail. So, to get that,
:31:03. > :31:12.over to Chris Fawkes in the studio. Lots of sunshine in the forecast.
:31:13. > :31:24.Foremost, there will be sunshine from to dusk. Exceptions will be in
:31:25. > :31:29.the West. There will be wet weather overnight. An early touch of frost
:31:30. > :31:34.in the countryside in the north-eastern part of the British
:31:35. > :31:46.Isles. Eventually we will see milder air flowing in. The 11-13d is pretty
:31:47. > :31:51.mild in the West. 30 millimetres of rain in the South West of England.
:31:52. > :31:57.As the rain moves in, it will turn more light and patchy. The skies
:31:58. > :32:03.will brighten. An improvement the weather for Scotland. There will be
:32:04. > :32:11.a fair amount of cloud and a fair amount of rain.
:32:12. > :32:17.Thank you. Well, as we heard in the news, the Cenotaph in Whitehall will
:32:18. > :32:19.shortly be the focus for the national act of Remembrance. And, of
:32:20. > :32:27.course, just as important as national act of Remembrance. And, of
:32:28. > :32:28.And they have been national act of Remembrance. And, of
:32:29. > :32:28.early morning. Sophie Raworth is on horse guards Parade, where
:32:29. > :32:34.gathering. Welcome to Horse Guards Parade where
:32:35. > :32:34.gathering. Welcome to Horse Guards civilians are gathering, getting
:32:35. > :32:38.ready to civilians are gathering, getting
:32:39. > :32:44.come from all over the United Kingdom, as well as many
:32:45. > :32:51.come from all over the United Commonwealth countries right around
:32:52. > :32:53.the world to be here today. I am joined by someone who is marching
:32:54. > :32:57.with the Commonwealth War Graves commission, but is also professor of
:32:58. > :33:03.the history of war at Oxford University. As we look towards next
:33:04. > :33:13.year and the centenary, how much is the way we remember changing? The
:33:14. > :33:17.First World War is history. We have a patent derived from the First
:33:18. > :33:21.World War. We have taken the pattern from one world war and apply it to
:33:22. > :33:28.all the other walls, which we now think about and remember on
:33:29. > :33:34.Remembrance Sunday. There is a distinction on history and how we
:33:35. > :33:46.remember will stop what do you think needs to be achieved? It is not a
:33:47. > :33:54.single event. For years is a long time to commemorate an anniversary.
:33:55. > :34:00.It gives an opportunity to increase historical understanding. Almost
:34:01. > :34:04.everybody in this country thinks it is important that we commemorate the
:34:05. > :34:11.First World War. A great many of them have little idea about why this
:34:12. > :34:18.war was caused, where it was bought, extraordinary high levels of
:34:19. > :34:26.ignorance. -- Ft. What is the legacy for us? Each generation has taken
:34:27. > :34:32.its own interpretation of this war. We must use it to help us understand
:34:33. > :34:37.why we go to war at all. What is the purpose and when does it have a
:34:38. > :34:43.purpose? When does it ceased to have a purpose because the loss of life
:34:44. > :34:47.has got so high? In 1916, they had had the battle of the Somme and they
:34:48. > :34:55.felt it was still important to carry on fighting. Thank you for joining
:34:56. > :34:58.us. The RAF offensive against the cities of Nazi Germany was one of
:34:59. > :35:02.the deadliest campaigns of World War II. 600,000 Germans died in the
:35:03. > :35:06.course of Bomber Command's attempt to win the war from the air. More
:35:07. > :35:09.than 55,000 aircrew lost their lives, over half of Bomber Command's
:35:10. > :35:13.total number, and one of the highest casualty rates of any fighting unit.
:35:14. > :35:17.One man who survived the war, and whose memories of that period are
:35:18. > :35:20.still vivid, seven decades on, is Bernard "Bunny" Mason, who was a
:35:21. > :35:33.19-year-old gunner in a Stirling Bomber. What were you actually doing
:35:34. > :35:50.in the plane? I was a rear gunner - tail and C as they used to call us.
:35:51. > :35:56.-- tail end Charlie. Planes were coming up behind you all the time?
:35:57. > :36:08.Not so much, fortunately, otherwise I would not be here. I was flying in
:36:09. > :36:17.Stirling 's. It was the largest aircraft -- the largest of the three
:36:18. > :36:22.bombers we had. The Stirling unfortunately had its downside.
:36:23. > :36:29.Unfortunately, due to that lack of altitude, we were pushing it at
:36:30. > :36:40.13,000 feet will stop with Lancaster, it is 20 plus. -- 13,000
:36:41. > :36:47.feet. We had good, thick outer close to start with. Latterly, they
:36:48. > :36:57.provided me with an electric suit. It was very then anti-war it over
:36:58. > :37:05.your battle dress blouse, etc. -- then and you wore it. You plugged it
:37:06. > :37:17.in. You plug it into the electrics of the plane? Yes. I cannot remember
:37:18. > :37:22.where. When flying one day, my foot started to hurt. I realised what had
:37:23. > :37:28.happened. I had been wearing my flying boots with these slippers in
:37:29. > :37:34.and the wire had become a bit there and I had to switch it off. You were
:37:35. > :37:38.an early historian of Bomber Command and you have been very engaged in
:37:39. > :37:51.the argument about whether it was worth it. Did it shortened the war?
:37:52. > :37:57.Was it worth the huge loss of life? There are two or three things we had
:37:58. > :38:02.to remember. There was a time when events in the past are now in the
:38:03. > :38:09.future. Winston Churchill could see no other way it could carry the ball
:38:10. > :38:22.to Germany. 1944/45, there were a huge amount of bombers. -- carried
:38:23. > :38:26.the war to Germany. I wrote a book in 1979 where I was critical of a
:38:27. > :38:33.lot of things that were done in the bomber offensive. The talk of war
:38:34. > :38:38.crimes is nonsense. The idea of associating those that did it, who
:38:39. > :38:44.were incredibly brave, it is perfectly possible to honour the men
:38:45. > :38:49.who did these things and, at the same time, to feel sorry for the
:38:50. > :39:04.Germans who have died. Winston Churchill distanced himself from
:39:05. > :39:08.Bomber Command. In the Bomber Command Memorial, thanks to the
:39:09. > :39:17.British public and one or two very wealthy people, who kindly donated,
:39:18. > :39:23.I belonged to a group of ten - we worked well but now we are down to
:39:24. > :39:30.ten - for the last three and a half years, we have been going around to
:39:31. > :39:38.various places, airshows, garden centres, signing books and prints
:39:39. > :39:43.and we have raised ?35,000. So, the atmosphere has changed a bit about
:39:44. > :39:52.that. We are talking on Remembrance Sunday. What we had to do is to
:39:53. > :39:57.remember that war is organised confusion. We should honour those
:39:58. > :39:59.who died even in some of the more controversial and less successful
:40:00. > :40:05.things that were done during the war and have debates about whether it
:40:06. > :40:12.was a good or a bad idea on a different day. I was listening to
:40:13. > :40:24.safely in the centre of town about the lessons we could learn from the
:40:25. > :40:34.way the First World War started. -- Sophie. What historians much more
:40:35. > :40:38.distinguished than me are arguing for about the centenary which is
:40:39. > :40:45.coming up next year, we should not just go the poets root of saying, it
:40:46. > :40:50.was also awful and stand in cemeteries talking about mud. We
:40:51. > :40:55.should teach a new generation about why it happened. It is no good
:40:56. > :41:02.saying it was so wicked to bomb women and children. You had to
:41:03. > :41:11.explain why it happens and explained that wars are always a mess. -- why
:41:12. > :41:18.it happened and explain that wars are always a mess. No matter what
:41:19. > :41:35.rank you were, except, for most part, most of us were billeted in
:41:36. > :41:39.this and hearts. -- Nissan huts. When it hit he was when you found
:41:40. > :41:46.that three beds had not been slept in. The hundreds of British troops
:41:47. > :41:49.who have died in recent campaigns such as Iraq and Afghanistan will be
:41:50. > :41:52.remembered today, along with the fallen from the two world wars and
:41:53. > :41:56.many other conflicts. Earlier I spoke to the new Chief of the
:41:57. > :41:58.Defence Staff, General Sir Nicholas Houghton, about some of the
:41:59. > :42:02.challenges ahead for the armed forces. But, first, he told me what
:42:03. > :42:05.Remembrance Day means to him. It is true. In many respects, the armed
:42:06. > :42:10.Forces have never been held in great esteem by the nation. The purposes
:42:11. > :42:15.to which we have been put has never been more deeply questioned. As a
:42:16. > :42:19.nation, today we come together to remember service and to remember
:42:20. > :42:25.service that has involved sacrifice. That act of remembrance
:42:26. > :42:31.happens at a number of levels - a national level but also on a very
:42:32. > :42:36.personal level. People reflect on their own personal losses. From my
:42:37. > :42:41.own perspective, I spent some time thinking about friends from my own
:42:42. > :42:46.regiment who have fallen in conflict over the years. Do you think the
:42:47. > :42:55.Armed Forces - after people leave the service - are properly treated
:42:56. > :43:02.in this country? In terms of housing and help and so forth. I think this
:43:03. > :43:07.is an area where we always have to maintain a dynamic overwatch. Within
:43:08. > :43:12.the Armed Forces, we feel there is a moral duty to our people that never
:43:13. > :43:18.ends, even when they have formally left the Armed Forces. The battle is
:43:19. > :43:23.taken on by such things as the National Health Service, social
:43:24. > :43:28.services and by charities. The vast majority of service people that
:43:29. > :43:33.leave go on to have second careers and very successful careers. At the
:43:34. > :43:37.moment, particularly because of the casualties that have arisen from
:43:38. > :43:42.Afghanistan, there is a particular concern about individuals who have
:43:43. > :43:46.had life changing injuries. I am confident that what the Armed Forces
:43:47. > :43:51.have put in place over the last few years genuinely is the state of the
:43:52. > :43:57.art in terms of what we call the pathways to recovery. We are very,
:43:58. > :44:04.very careful that a combination of both charitable support and
:44:05. > :44:09.government support is brought together in a way that ensures there
:44:10. > :44:13.is constant overwatch of the journey that individual wounded service men
:44:14. > :44:21.and women make, from the point of winding to the time when they are
:44:22. > :44:26.settling into civilian life. What do you say to relatives who fear that
:44:27. > :44:33.once the huge drawdown happens from Afghanistan, things returned to the
:44:34. > :44:37.Caliban, and it has all been wasted? It is difficult to capture the
:44:38. > :44:44.strategic benefit of the campaign like Afghanistan in the moment. You
:44:45. > :44:49.can turn to things. At a local level in Helmand, the individual potential
:44:50. > :44:53.for individual human lives has been significantly enhanced. You can turn
:44:54. > :44:57.to the fact that not a single terrorist attack against the Western
:44:58. > :45:03.world has been launched from Afghanistan in over ten years. I
:45:04. > :45:08.think the genuine case is one that is better made in retrospect, when
:45:09. > :45:13.there has been more of a strategic audit of the benefits. There is
:45:14. > :45:19.always a counterfactual about going into Afghanistan. What might have
:45:20. > :45:24.happened had we not done it? Afghanistan was in a state of civil
:45:25. > :45:29.war. There was a very strong chance it would have disintegrated. The
:45:30. > :45:34.area of ungoverned space across the border between Afghanistan and
:45:35. > :45:38.Pakistan would have increased. Pakistan might have been
:45:39. > :45:42.destabilised. That has not happened. We will be leaving
:45:43. > :45:48.Afghanistan with the chance of fledgling democracy, some prospect
:45:49. > :45:52.of some prosperity, with the ability of Afghan National Security forces
:45:53. > :46:02.to provide security in a sovereign sense in turn lead to see more
:46:03. > :46:13.attempts to make Al-Qaeda in the bud? I am a believer that armed
:46:14. > :46:21.forces should not, in a binary sense, be at war or in a contingent
:46:22. > :46:26.posture at home. There are a lot of places in the world that have
:46:27. > :46:32.potential to become seriously destabilised. Somalia, Yemen, parts
:46:33. > :46:37.of South Africa. Whereas if we can proactively get in there and use
:46:38. > :46:41.some of our unique access that British forces enjoyed because
:46:42. > :46:47.British reputation is very high in these respects, we have an ability
:46:48. > :46:54.to build institutions, to help train Armed Forces so that they can bring
:46:55. > :46:57.stability to their own countries. , turned to the terrible story that we
:46:58. > :47:07.are still seeing the aftermath of, which is sentencing the Marine to
:47:08. > :47:12.life imprisonment. A lot of newspapers have called for in
:47:13. > :47:20.clemency, because he had just seen the body parts of his comrades used
:47:21. > :47:29.as trophies and there were special circumstances. Others say that
:47:30. > :47:38.murder is murder, life is life. Which side do you come down on? No
:47:39. > :47:46.serviceman is above the law, the law of the country or the law of armed
:47:47. > :47:54.conflict. This was a scene -- terrible crime and it would be quite
:47:55. > :48:00.wrong for the Armed Forces to adopt some special pleading, some special
:48:01. > :48:05.exemption. We do expect immaculate standards of our people. He had just
:48:06. > :48:12.seen the body parts of comrades being used as trophies. I accept
:48:13. > :48:18.that but if we try to put ourselves beyond the law or expect special
:48:19. > :48:22.provision, then we start to erode the position where we have the moral
:48:23. > :48:28.ascendancy over our enemies and that is the wrong thing to do. There is a
:48:29. > :48:34.Jeep process that will lead to sentencing. It is for that process
:48:35. > :48:39.to determine whether any clemency should be shown in the sentencing.
:48:40. > :48:44.Whereas I fully understand the views of the likes of Julian Thompson,
:48:45. > :48:47.they are personal views, not the views expressed from the position of
:48:48. > :48:53.current authority within the services, where we would not want
:48:54. > :49:00.our position to be eroded. So you are not ruling out the idea of
:49:01. > :49:06.clemency through judicial process? No, I am saying those in authority
:49:07. > :49:11.in the Armed Forces should not request any form of leniency. I
:49:12. > :49:15.think it is dangerous to do so. We should be immaculate in these
:49:16. > :49:21.respects, murder is murder. Thankfully it is an exceptional
:49:22. > :49:25.lax. Are you concerned about the amount of time this took to become
:49:26. > :49:30.public knowledge? There is a suggestion there was some kind of
:49:31. > :49:35.cover-up, and the video of this was being passed around almost like
:49:36. > :49:40.award trophy, and some are calling for an internal inquiry as to
:49:41. > :49:44.whether this was covered up. I have not myself heard or seen evidence of
:49:45. > :49:50.the fact that the video has been common knowledge for many months. As
:49:51. > :49:54.far as I am aware, this thing has only relatively recently
:49:55. > :49:59.materialised, and due process was initiated as soon as the evidence of
:50:00. > :50:08.this crime had come to light. Do you think this has stained the Marines'
:50:09. > :50:13.reputation? No, I stand by the statement couple of days ago when
:50:14. > :50:24.the verdict was passed. I think by and large the standard of the
:50:25. > :50:28.Marines is immaculate, and they will be deeply shocked, deeply upset,
:50:29. > :50:34.they will feel their reputation hit hard but I think they should not
:50:35. > :50:38.rest on the laurels of their wider competence on quality, but they will
:50:39. > :50:50.move on from this. We have been talking to Alex Salmond who has been
:50:51. > :50:59.talking about the division following the potential independence of
:51:00. > :51:07.Scotland. Are you aware of this? It is not like there will be some sort
:51:08. > :51:11.of de-merger on the stocks. There is no active planning on what will
:51:12. > :51:20.happen in the event of Scotland voting for independence. We are
:51:21. > :51:31.providing objective information and support for the case of keeping the
:51:32. > :51:43.UK together. Assuming they will have independence, your assets will be
:51:44. > :51:49.part of that? Wait for the vote. It is not as if suddenly there will be
:51:50. > :51:53.a crisis and Scotland becomes enemy forces and they have some of their
:51:54. > :51:59.assets behind our lines. This should be a mature debate, one would hope.
:52:00. > :52:03.I think the most important thing for the people of Scotland to weigh your
:52:04. > :52:09.pin their considerations is how much better the security of the UK is
:52:10. > :52:13.delivered by the maintenance of the United Kingdom's Armed Forces as an
:52:14. > :52:19.integrated whole rather than attempting to think of separating
:52:20. > :52:25.out a small fraction. But if the vote goes that way, that is what
:52:26. > :52:28.will happen. There will be military bases in Scotland and of course the
:52:29. > :52:35.Trident submarines which will be sent south after the vote. That is
:52:36. > :52:40.one of the reasons why it is better not to speculate, but to do it more
:52:41. > :52:45.coolly if that is the scenario which faces us. What about Portsmouth
:52:46. > :52:52.because there is a worry this was a political decision to buy out the
:52:53. > :52:58.Scots. If this happens, is it a case that the rest of the UK will rely on
:52:59. > :53:03.Scotland to provide vessels for the Navy? I don't hold to the view that
:53:04. > :53:08.the decision on the future of British shipbuilding is one born of
:53:09. > :53:21.political mandate. It was very much a matter of business Russell --
:53:22. > :53:27.rationalisation. They have the best depth of skills on the Clyde so it
:53:28. > :53:32.was driven by a business decision. If Scotland becomes independent, the
:53:33. > :53:40.rest of UK would rely on them to build all service ships. Would this
:53:41. > :53:44.decision be revisited if took place? There may have to be some
:53:45. > :53:48.reconsideration of that if that were to be the scenario. For reasons I
:53:49. > :53:54.have explained earlier, I don't think that is going to be the most
:53:55. > :53:59.likely outcome, but I think we live in a world now where it is not the
:54:00. > :54:03.purposes of the defence budget to underwrite elements of industry. We
:54:04. > :54:08.will go and get our ships in the place where it makes the most sense
:54:09. > :54:15.for the British taxpayer in terms of getting the right capability for the
:54:16. > :54:19.Armed Forces. There will be another ?800 million spent on these two
:54:20. > :54:25.carriers, do you think you have been lumbered with a political decision
:54:26. > :54:28.which is now on your budget when there are intense cutbacks
:54:29. > :54:33.elsewhere? If we could turn the clocks back, might we make a
:54:34. > :54:37.different decision, it might be that we go for a smaller version of that
:54:38. > :54:42.carrier, but the more often you change your mind on these things,
:54:43. > :54:48.the more costly they become. I think it was everybody's view in 2010 at
:54:49. > :54:56.the last strategic review that these carriers were very useful part of
:54:57. > :55:00.our future structure, which is postulated on the structure for 2020
:55:01. > :55:07.and that is the time by which we will have regenerated our carrier
:55:08. > :55:12.capability. Thank you. And now for something completely
:55:13. > :55:18.different. By his own admission, Rupert Grint's childhood was ruled
:55:19. > :55:22.by Harry Potter and Hogwarts. As trainee wizard Ron Weasley, he spent
:55:23. > :55:26.much of his life from the age of 11 onwards in front of movie cameras.
:55:27. > :55:29.Recently, Grint has exchanged the film set for the theatre and is
:55:30. > :55:33.making his stage debut in London's West End. The play in question is a
:55:34. > :55:36.revival of Jez Butterworth's hit, Mojo. Set in the 1950s, it's a
:55:37. > :55:39.sinister look at the underbelly of London clubland. Grint plays a
:55:40. > :55:46.pill-popping hood called Sweets, and when we met recently he told me
:55:47. > :55:55.about Mojo. It is set in a seedy Soho
:55:56. > :56:01.nightclub, and I play Sweets, one of the employees who works there. The
:56:02. > :56:08.club has a singer who does the show a couple of nights a week and he
:56:09. > :56:15.goes missing. It is pretty violent, fairly foul-mouthed, not most
:56:16. > :56:21.people's idea of London in the 1950s. How much research did you do?
:56:22. > :56:32.people's idea of London in the We did tonnes of research and we had
:56:33. > :56:36.a board of 1950s paraphernalia and the icons of that era. We also met
:56:37. > :56:41.up with a load of 1950s Soho locals. It was a violent, drunken time in
:56:42. > :56:50.Soho, one of the notorious places, and your
:56:51. > :56:53.Soho, one of the notorious places, most vulnerable people in the club.
:56:54. > :57:00.He is quite a sweet guy. He is kind of the drug man. Handing out the
:57:01. > :57:02.pills. You are on stage night after night, so it is physically
:57:03. > :57:09.exhausting and unlike the world of Harry Potter and big films, behind
:57:10. > :57:16.the set it is not very luxurious and glamorous. It is a different world.
:57:17. > :57:25.Theatre is something I always ruled out. Too much like hard work! Yes, I
:57:26. > :57:29.am quite nervous person naturally, and the thought of that much work
:57:30. > :57:35.seem quite impossible to me. But this came along and it is such a
:57:36. > :57:39.great script, a great cast. The characters have this unique way of
:57:40. > :57:46.communicating each other. It is quite hard for the audience to tune
:57:47. > :57:50.into at first. Harry Potter is in one respect the fantastic stroke of
:57:51. > :57:56.luck for anyone as an actor, but at the same time it then stops and you
:57:57. > :58:02.have to reinvent yourself again. Is that how you see it? I suppose that
:58:03. > :58:09.is the challenge. It was a very strange time. It was basically my
:58:10. > :58:17.whole childhood. It must have been a funny childhood. It was interesting,
:58:18. > :58:22.but it became routine because it consumed us. It was this bubble that
:58:23. > :58:27.we lived in the ten years and it became normal. Suddenly it finished,
:58:28. > :58:34.it came down to one take and we were out in the real world. It was scary.
:58:35. > :58:42.You have all gone off in different directions. Daniel Radcliffe had his
:58:43. > :58:48.kit off in his play, are you doing something similar? In your play, you
:58:49. > :58:51.are playing a foul-mouthed rocker. It has never been a conscious effort
:58:52. > :58:59.to find something that detaches me from that role, it has just happened
:59:00. > :59:11.that way. This is about the birth of ink in America and you are a member
:59:12. > :59:16.of a band called The Dead Boys. Yes. It was a real band. Yes, the singer
:59:17. > :59:23.is still very much alive and he was on set when we were filming. What
:59:24. > :59:30.did he think? He was very pleased, he was even a cameo in the film. It
:59:31. > :59:39.is daunting, when he was watching offstage. This is the beginning of
:59:40. > :59:45.the bands coming through the same club. I think it is probably Alan
:59:46. > :59:58.Rickman's most brilliant part so far. I am impressed with the youth
:59:59. > :00:12.of Cleveland. You shouldn't be. Why? You seem relatively polite. He is
:00:13. > :00:14.great. You know him very well. Crazy to see him in such a different
:00:15. > :00:49.role. Nice to see to see him in such a different
:00:50. > :00:54.world. It is so thrilling. The Potter fans are part of it. It has
:00:55. > :01:01.become part of my life over the last ten years. It is like someone asking
:01:02. > :01:09.for directions now. It is that routine. It is a weird thing but it
:01:10. > :01:16.is part of it. It is nice to have the support as well. A lot of them
:01:17. > :01:25.turned up to the show. A mixed audience age wise. Of course. Thank
:01:26. > :01:28.you for joining us. On Remembrance Sunday, we rightly think of the
:01:29. > :01:32.bravery of men and women sent into battle - often through no choice of
:01:33. > :01:36.their own. But, in the Second World War, vital work was done behind the
:01:37. > :01:38.scenes back home, by those who gathered and de-coded intelligence
:01:39. > :01:41.on German military plans. The nerve centre of the code-breaking
:01:42. > :01:44.operation was Bletchley Park in Buckinghamshire - now famous as the
:01:45. > :01:50.place where the mathematician Alan Turing worked on the German enigma
:01:51. > :01:58.codes. In the war, it was known as Station X, and Sophie Raworth has
:01:59. > :02:03.been there to find out more. It is said the work carried out here in
:02:04. > :02:07.the mansion at Bletchley Park and the hut surrounding it helped to
:02:08. > :02:13.shorten the war by at least two years. It was an official secret.
:02:14. > :02:17.Until the 1970s, only a handful of people knew what had gone on here. I
:02:18. > :02:22.am about to meet two women who trained and worked here during the
:02:23. > :02:31.war who were both part of the secret army of codebreakers. After I had
:02:32. > :02:38.done my basic training with the ATS in Wrexham, I was ordered to go to
:02:39. > :02:44.London, to be interviewed by an intelligence officer, who
:02:45. > :02:49.interviewed me in German. During the conversation, he said, here is a
:02:50. > :02:54.rail warrant to Bletchley will stop I had no idea where Bletchley was or
:02:55. > :03:04.what went on there. That is how I came to be there. You had no idea?
:03:05. > :03:08.None at all. The following morning, I was taken into the office and
:03:09. > :03:14.given the official secrets act to read and sign. I signed to say I
:03:15. > :03:24.would not talk about anything that I saw, read or heard for 30 years. You
:03:25. > :03:32.were very young at the time? I was 18. I remember going into a small
:03:33. > :03:39.room. The Petty Officer said, five words. We are breaking German codes.
:03:40. > :03:43.That is all we knew. Had we known the ramifications of the work we
:03:44. > :03:51.were doing, it might have been more difficult to keep the secret. There
:03:52. > :03:55.was this phrase, hush-hush. Quite often people would say to all kinds
:03:56. > :04:01.of service men, where are you going? They would say, we cannot tell you,
:04:02. > :04:08.it is hush-hush. It was really rather rude if people were pushing
:04:09. > :04:13.you once you have said hush-hush. My mother said, you can tell me, I am
:04:14. > :04:19.your mother. I thought, if I tell her, it'll be all over Birmingham in
:04:20. > :04:27.ten minutes. She died and never knew what I was doing. My answer to a
:04:28. > :04:33.question like that was, I am just doing a boring secretarial job. "
:04:34. > :04:40.story. Tell me about the work you are doing. I was with a group who
:04:41. > :04:51.worked on registration and callsign order. How many messages did you
:04:52. > :04:57.have a day? I understood later they were coming in at a rate of 10,000 a
:04:58. > :05:04.day, roughly. Everyone associates Bletchley Park with Enigma. You were
:05:05. > :05:11.brought here for training to learn how to use the bombe machine - the
:05:12. > :05:17.machine that was going to crack it. There were a feud training bombs
:05:18. > :05:24.here when I arrived. We were trained to use these complicated bombe
:05:25. > :05:32.machines but we had no idea of what they were actually doing, which was
:05:33. > :05:42.to replicate Enigma machine and look for the answers. We never knew that.
:05:43. > :05:54.I never heard the word, Enigma. You work very hard. Younger people
:05:55. > :05:59.became, not ill but distressed. When I did not feel well, I was sent to a
:06:00. > :06:09.rehabilitation centre. The irony was, as soon as I arrived, I heard a
:06:10. > :06:23.doodlebug coming over. It was within doodlebug range and I had to put on
:06:24. > :06:28.my tin hat and dive under the bed. There was some form of central
:06:29. > :06:34.heating but it was not very good. The huts had to be sealed at night -
:06:35. > :06:40.the windows had to be sealed because of light. There was poorer air
:06:41. > :06:46.separation and it was not pleasant. When you are training, how do you
:06:47. > :06:55.remember day-to-day life? You had to lives - one at work and one outside
:06:56. > :07:01.of work. Outside of work, it was a good social life. I found it very
:07:02. > :07:08.friendly. There was a true menders mixed bag of people, from all walks
:07:09. > :07:16.of life. Dashes-macro a tremendous mix bag of people. A gramophone
:07:17. > :07:22.group will stop every now and again, a very good play would be put on.
:07:23. > :07:27.How they managed to put a play together and work, I do not know,
:07:28. > :07:41.but they did. We worked hard and played hard. Why was there so much
:07:42. > :07:46.going on? When Churchill came to visit, he asked about the
:07:47. > :07:51.recreational side of the setup. When he heard we did not have tennis
:07:52. > :07:56.courts, he ordered for them to be put in. How much did you know about
:07:57. > :08:04.the people you were working for, working alongside? Only in recent
:08:05. > :08:14.years have they been recognised as important people. That is how I have
:08:15. > :08:20.found it, anyway. So, at the time they were not recognised? They would
:08:21. > :08:25.disappear into their prospective huts and that is all you knew. The
:08:26. > :08:31.huts were not named, they were only numbered. We did not know what was
:08:32. > :08:38.going on behind closed doors. What do you think now you know what those
:08:39. > :08:46.people did? They were extraordinary and I am very proud to have been, in
:08:47. > :08:50.a small way, involved in it. There was a moment in the 1970s when it
:08:51. > :08:57.was no longer an official secret and it became public. You were allowed
:08:58. > :09:03.to talk about it. What was that like? 30 years after the security
:09:04. > :09:09.blanket was lifted, they published a book. I said to my husband, this is
:09:10. > :09:17.the work I did chewing the war. He said, that is very interesting
:09:18. > :09:26.dear, what is 40? -- during the war. What does it say on your badge?
:09:27. > :09:30.It says, we also served. We were not part of the war machine that people
:09:31. > :09:38.knew about but we were here and we did do something. You are both
:09:39. > :09:43.modest and humble but it is fascinating talking to you both. And
:09:44. > :09:46.Bletchley Park, for so long shrouded in secrecy, is now open to the
:09:47. > :09:58.public. Both the veterans Sophie was talking to still regularly help out
:09:59. > :10:04.there as volunteers. Shirley Williams, your mother was a pacifist
:10:05. > :10:13.during the war. Is this the day you remember her?
:10:14. > :10:20.She lost her fiance, paid the price for World War I, and came out with
:10:21. > :10:26.the contradiction of the air force's carpet bombing. She thought
:10:27. > :10:30.it was completely unacceptable. We will be hearing some Benjamin
:10:31. > :10:35.Britten music and he was a pacifist and they knew each other. They
:10:36. > :10:43.campaigned together to send food out so that children could survive. You
:10:44. > :10:48.have heard the Chief of defence staff talking about the issue of
:10:49. > :10:54.clemency for the Marine, what do you think? I think he is right, the law
:10:55. > :10:59.has got to be seen to be enforced. The Nuremberg trials were writing
:11:00. > :11:04.what they did with the Nazis but they would have been more plausible
:11:05. > :11:11.if some of the Russians and Americans and British people had
:11:12. > :11:17.been tried for crimes. I think he must accept the punishment of the
:11:18. > :11:22.law. Fraser Nelson, I don't know if you watched the William Hague
:11:23. > :11:28.interview, what struck you about that? When you raised the issue of
:11:29. > :11:35.the Greenpeace campaign is being banged up, he does not seem to have
:11:36. > :11:39.discussed it in Geneva. He said he had discussed it over the last six
:11:40. > :11:47.weeks. I suspect he is not being as forceful as he could and telling the
:11:48. > :11:52.Russians it is more acceptable. The most horrific circumstances, it is a
:11:53. > :11:57.really hard place to be a prisoner. Absolutely, they have been moved to
:11:58. > :12:03.a different jail but it looks if anything worse than the one before.
:12:04. > :12:08.I think they are going through the motions, but I hope William Hague
:12:09. > :12:13.has been more forceful than he appeared to be in his interview.
:12:14. > :12:16.Thank you. Officials in the Philippines say
:12:17. > :12:23.that around 10,000 people have died in one province alone after Typhoon
:12:24. > :12:27.Haiyan hit on Friday. A police spokesman said most of the victims
:12:28. > :12:33.drowned or they were crushed under buildings. A rescue operation is
:12:34. > :12:39.under way. Britain has pledged ?6 million to help. International talks
:12:40. > :12:45.on Iran 's nuclear programme had ended in Geneva without an agreement
:12:46. > :12:47.being reached. The presence of top diplomats had heightened
:12:48. > :12:52.expectations of a breakthrough but there were positive indications from
:12:53. > :12:58.all sides that genuine progress had been made. The Foreign Secretary
:12:59. > :13:03.said a deal can be done. The parties are closer together than before we
:13:04. > :13:07.had these talks so we have not been wasting our time but it is a
:13:08. > :13:13.formidably difficult negotiation and we are going to reconvene these
:13:14. > :13:19.talks in ten days in Geneva, and try to maintain that momentum. It is
:13:20. > :13:25.vital to keep the momentum and a deal is on the table. The Chief of
:13:26. > :13:28.defence staff has said he cannot join calls for clemency towards the
:13:29. > :13:35.Royal Marine convicted last week of murdering a Taliban prisoner in
:13:36. > :13:38.Afghanistan. General Sir Nicholas Houghton told this programme that
:13:39. > :13:49.members of the armed forces were not above the law. That is all. Those in
:13:50. > :14:00.authority of the Armed Forces should not request leniency, it is danger
:14:01. > :14:05.to do -- dangerous to do so. Thankfully it is an exceptional act.
:14:06. > :14:10.That is all from me now. Back to you, Andrew.
:14:11. > :14:12.Many thanks. This year is the centenary of Benjamin Britten, that
:14:13. > :14:15.most revered of English musicians -- an exemplary composer, conductor and
:14:16. > :14:19.pianist. I'm joined now by two illustrious fans of Britten who will
:14:20. > :14:29.be performing an arrangement by him in a moment. Ian Bostridge, one of
:14:30. > :14:34.our finest tenors, and Sir Antonio Pappano, director of music at the
:14:35. > :14:46.Royal Opera House. Welcome. Britain's reputation has gone up and
:14:47. > :14:53.down over the years. -- Britten. But lately there has been a revival.
:14:54. > :15:02.Internationally, the name Britten has exploded. There is a break-out
:15:03. > :15:07.opera in Rome where his music is hardly ever performed. It went over
:15:08. > :15:14.like a bomb, emotionally, people just got it and I was so heartened
:15:15. > :15:22.by this. A great new British exports. Yes, drama, poetry, life.
:15:23. > :15:39.And later you will be playing one of his arrangements, and English folk
:15:40. > :15:46.song. Yes, 'O Waly Waly' . Everyone will recognise it. I think you have
:15:47. > :15:54.just been recording the War Requiem? Yes, with Tony and his Rome
:15:55. > :15:59.Orchestra. It is a piece which is done again and again and with huge
:16:00. > :16:05.success in cities all over the world. We talked about the bombing
:16:06. > :16:12.campaign and this was a response to that. Yes, he had a strong visceral
:16:13. > :16:18.pacifism from the 1930s onwards. You don't just get the Latin setting of
:16:19. > :16:25.the Requiem, you also get the poem running through it. Yes, with
:16:26. > :16:29.tenderness and bitterness as well. We will hear that in a moment. Thank
:16:30. > :16:33.you. I'm afraid that's all we've got time
:16:34. > :16:41.for this morning. Thanks to all my guests. Join us again next Sunday at
:16:42. > :16:45.nine o'clock when I'll be talking to the actor Richard E Grant, and the
:16:46. > :16:48.one and only Oprah Winfrey. In a couple of minutes, BBC One will be
:16:49. > :16:51.broadcasting the national act of Remembrance from the Cenotaph in
:16:52. > :16:54.Whitehall. But we leave you with Ian Bostridge and Antonio Pappano. This
:16:55. > :16:55.is an arrangement by Benjamin Britten of the traditional folk
:16:56. > :17:17.song, 'O Waly Waly'. Goodbye. # The water is wide, I can-not cross
:17:18. > :17:28.o'er. And neither have I wings to fly.
:17:29. > :17:38.Give me a boat that can carry two, And both shall row, my love and I.
:17:39. > :17:53.# A ship there is and she sails the seas.
:17:54. > :17:58.# She's loaded deep, as deep can be. # But not as deep as the love I'm
:17:59. > :18:36.in. # And I know not if I sink or swim.
:18:37. > :18:59.Love is handsome and love is fine, and love is a jewel when it is new.
:19:00. > :19:02.But when it is old, it groweth cold and fades away like morning dew. #