08/11/2015

:00:07. > :00:11.As we remember the dead, are we really prepared for today's

:00:12. > :00:37.With me for today, the Foreign Secretary,

:00:38. > :00:43.Philip Hammond, the Chief of Defence Staff, General Sir Nick Horton,

:00:44. > :00:45.the Shadow Defence Secretary, Maria Eagle on Labour's very different

:00:46. > :00:56.It's a specially extended programme this morning, running through to

:00:57. > :00:58.BBC One's coverage of the remembrance ceremony at

:00:59. > :01:07.Two of our greatest actors, Ian McKellen and Simon Russell Beale,

:01:08. > :01:10.are here to read some of the most powerful war poetry ever written.

:01:11. > :01:13.We'll also hear from the film director, Danny Boyle,

:01:14. > :01:15.on his film portrait of Apple founder Steve Jobs,

:01:16. > :01:24.We have a trio of newspaper reviewers -

:01:25. > :01:26.the Sunday Times journalist AA Gill, the Spectator's Isabel Hardman,

:01:27. > :01:37.Beautiful music from Amy Dixon on the soprano sax.

:01:38. > :01:39.So, a lot to come, starting with the news from Christian Fraser.

:01:40. > :01:45.A service of remembrance will be held in the Russian capital,

:01:46. > :01:48.St Petersburg, today for the 224 passengers and crew who

:01:49. > :01:52.died on the Russian airliner that crashed in Egypt's Sinai Peninsula.

:01:53. > :01:54.Egyptian officials say investigators will be carrying out further

:01:55. > :01:58.analysis to try to identify a noise heard in the final second of the

:01:59. > :02:13.Laying flowers on a wing, and a prayer for those who died

:02:14. > :02:16.when the Metrojet airliner broke up in the sky and fell to earth.

:02:17. > :02:18.At the crash site, Russian emergency service workers

:02:19. > :02:23.Later, in St Petersburg, there will be a memorial service.

:02:24. > :02:29.Egyptian investigators have confirmed early reports that

:02:30. > :02:32.in the second before the disaster, on the flight recordings, there is

:02:33. > :02:36.Detailed analysis will be needed to determine whether it was caused

:02:37. > :02:43.The Egyptians said that other nations underestimate the challenges

:02:44. > :02:47.they face, as intelligence sources say the evidence is pointing towards

:02:48. > :02:51.the so-called Islamic State being responsible.

:02:52. > :02:53.Overnight, more British tourists stranded in Sharm

:02:54. > :02:56.You start to really get a bit frightened and throughout

:02:57. > :03:02.the whole experience, you do question your mortality a bit.

:03:03. > :03:04.We did not know when we would be getting back or anything.

:03:05. > :03:08.One man says that despite improvements in security,

:03:09. > :03:11.he was still able to carry this water bottle on board his flight.

:03:12. > :03:18.Nothing has changed, it is completely the same.

:03:19. > :03:27.It was hectic today. Such news will do nothing to reassure British

:03:28. > :03:30.travellers still waiting to return home or Egyptian struggling to save

:03:31. > :03:35.the beleaguered tourism industry. David Cameron will warn his European

:03:36. > :03:37.counterparts that he might campaign for Britain to leave the EU if his

:03:38. > :03:41.demands for reforms are ignored. The Prime Minister will set out how

:03:42. > :03:43.he wants to change Britain's relations with the rest of the EU

:03:44. > :03:47.in a letter to be made public on Tuesday,

:03:48. > :03:48.as our political correspondent, David Cameron

:03:49. > :03:51.and other ministers have already held a series of meetings with

:03:52. > :03:57.European leaders to discuss demands In a speech on Tuesday,

:03:58. > :04:03.the Prime Minister will use his strongest language yet to deliver

:04:04. > :04:11.a blunt warning to his EU partners. He will say, "If Britain's

:04:12. > :04:14.concerns were to be met with a deaf ear, which I do not believe

:04:15. > :04:17.will happen, then we will have to think again about whether this

:04:18. > :04:20.European Union is right for us." The speech will accompany

:04:21. > :04:22.a letter to the President of the European Council, Donald Tusk,

:04:23. > :04:26.setting out what Downing Street say will be the broad outlines

:04:27. > :04:30.of the Prime Minister's agenda. David Cameron will challenge those

:04:31. > :04:34.already campaigning to leave the EU now to consider the risks for

:04:35. > :04:39.our economic and national security. And he will say to those campaigning

:04:40. > :04:41.to remain in the EU that there are real problems

:04:42. > :04:48.with the existing arrangements. The Prime Minister has already said

:04:49. > :04:52.he wants an end to the commitment to an ever closer

:04:53. > :04:54.union, more power for national governments, and restrictions

:04:55. > :04:58.on benefits for EU migrants. This week, he will kick

:04:59. > :05:00.off the formal negotiations before the referendum to decide whether or

:05:01. > :05:04.not we should remain in the EU to Sebastian Coe has promised to

:05:05. > :05:13.strengthen procedures within the governing body

:05:14. > :05:15.of world athletics in his first response to allegations of extortion

:05:16. > :05:19.and bribery at the organisation. Lord Coe, who became president

:05:20. > :05:24.of the IAAF in August, said it was abhorrent that people had allegedly

:05:25. > :05:26.extorted money from Russian athletes The joint author

:05:27. > :05:31.of a report due to be published tomorrow says it will expose a whole

:05:32. > :05:36.different scale of corruption. Figures obtained

:05:37. > :05:40.by the BBC suggest that many police forces are struggling to investigate

:05:41. > :05:43.a growing number of reported cases Hi-tech crime units,

:05:44. > :05:48.which look at seized electronic devices for evidence of online

:05:49. > :05:50.exploitation and grooming, have Officials insist the most urgent

:05:51. > :06:00.investigations are fast tracked. Voting is under way in Myanmar, also

:06:01. > :06:03.known as Burma, in the country's The opposition National League

:06:04. > :06:08.for Democracy, led by Aung San Suu Kyi, is expected

:06:09. > :06:12.to win most seats in parliament. But with a quarter reserved

:06:13. > :06:15.for the military, she needs at least two thirds of those being

:06:16. > :06:18.contested for the party's candidate I'll be back with

:06:19. > :06:36.the headlines just before 10am. This is one of those days when the

:06:37. > :06:40.night news editors, if there are still night news editors, they

:06:41. > :06:51.cannot agree. The Observer has calls for new deer of airport security. I

:06:52. > :06:56.love the Independent, but in terms of gripping the front page

:06:57. > :07:02.headlines, it is 50-50 no one was watching CCTV, it does not quite

:07:03. > :07:05.make it. The Scotland on Sunday front-page, very interesting, Alex

:07:06. > :07:13.Salmond calling for Holyrood to get the power to call another

:07:14. > :07:20.independence referendum. The mail on Sunday has... They have missed the

:07:21. > :07:25.word wrapped. The Sunday express will be talking about bombers

:07:26. > :07:35.speaking with British accents, they say. The Sunday Times, very wealthy

:07:36. > :07:39.men have had money taken from them by fraudsters. Shocking story. It is

:07:40. > :07:45.Remembrance Sunday and you have a beautiful photograph from Liverpool.

:07:46. > :07:52.The Sunday Telegraph, the beautiful ceramic poppies, they are now

:07:53. > :07:55.spilling out of St George's Hall in Liverpool. Such a beautiful tribute

:07:56. > :08:00.last year, it would have been a shame not to use it again. To see it

:08:01. > :08:06.in another part of the country is an example of what a good piece of art

:08:07. > :08:10.it was, popular, people flocked to see it, now they can see it in

:08:11. > :08:14.Liverpool as well. We were talking earlier, you are shocked by a story

:08:15. > :08:23.in the Express about the merchant Navy not getting proper attendance

:08:24. > :08:27.invitations, like Ukip of course. Let us put Ukip aside. We are

:08:28. > :08:32.talking about men and women who gave their lives, who supplied the UK as

:08:33. > :08:37.part of the war effort, without those individuals, they took huge

:08:38. > :08:42.losses in terms of ships and submarines, to see them excluded

:08:43. > :08:48.from the Remembrance Sunday celebrations, I think it is a very

:08:49. > :08:51.bad mark on the government. A new book out by Jonathan Dimbleby

:08:52. > :08:54.suggesting the Battle of the Atlantic was the single most

:08:55. > :09:01.important battle in the Second World War. These boats were bringing

:09:02. > :09:05.fuel, wood, metal. Everything contributing to the war effort. And

:09:06. > :09:09.huge numbers of sailors died when the ships were sunk. I think we are

:09:10. > :09:15.looking at a degree of discrimination and it is unfair. We

:09:16. > :09:19.need to recognise the whole war effort, all of the people involved,

:09:20. > :09:26.all of the units, and not just be very selective. Adrian, the big

:09:27. > :09:35.story, the downing of the Russian jet. The front-page of the Express.

:09:36. > :09:41.This is a story that says that that jihadis celebrating, maybe the

:09:42. > :09:47.bombing of the aeroplane, they were celebrating with Birmingham accents.

:09:48. > :09:58.Good grief. Intelligence chatter, we think must or just from the Sunday

:09:59. > :10:03.Express backbench. Now, now. Nobody really... There does not seem to be

:10:04. > :10:09.hard news, an awful lot of speculation and stuff coming out of

:10:10. > :10:14.unnamed sources. Tough questions. The Telegraph has a big spread. A

:10:15. > :10:20.really useful briefing on the six key questions about the holiday jet

:10:21. > :10:23.bombing. Useful for anyone finding it slightly confusing. Very good

:10:24. > :10:29.comment from Edward Lucas on the Russian position. We saw an about

:10:30. > :10:33.turn from Russia at the end of last week where Vladimir Putin initially

:10:34. > :10:36.criticised David Cameron for suspending flights but then did

:10:37. > :10:45.exactly the same. We think that the Russians have just hit Isis's base.

:10:46. > :10:50.That was the question, what will the Russians do next? A bomb again.

:10:51. > :10:54.Domestic politics and the EU reform story is everywhere. You will be

:10:55. > :11:01.surprised for me to ask you about that! David Cameron tough words, if

:11:02. > :11:06.I do not get what I want, I will leave the outcome pain. Do you

:11:07. > :11:13.believe him? I do not. I can see you smiling, by the same token, Ukip

:11:14. > :11:16.MEPs, and the vast proportion of Eurosceptic voters, they will be

:11:17. > :11:22.looking at this with a degree of cynicism, sarcasm may be, and

:11:23. > :11:25.amusement, but here he is, walking a tightrope, we know the Prime

:11:26. > :11:31.Minister wants to stay in, he has made no secret of that, he is

:11:32. > :11:35.saying, I will ask, I have supposedly got tough demands, but my

:11:36. > :11:45.backstop position is to stay in. You agree? The Sun, Brussels muscle, he

:11:46. > :11:52.is playing good cop, bad cop with himself. A few weeks ago, he said

:11:53. > :11:56.the idea that Britain could be like Norway, not the land of milk and

:11:57. > :12:01.honey. Now he says he is prepared to leave. As Diane says, Eurosceptics

:12:02. > :12:06.do not believe that. Those waiting to hear what he wants from the

:12:07. > :12:10.renegotiation of getting impatient. They have not heard the tale that is

:12:11. > :12:15.encouraging or suggests there might be a point when he would walk away.

:12:16. > :12:21.Will we see the detail? In terms of the four year ban on migrants

:12:22. > :12:26.getting in work benefits, if it is not there, it will be more

:12:27. > :12:29.suspicious. You have hit the nail on the head. Over the last few weeks

:12:30. > :12:37.and months, the consistent message from others European leaders, no,

:12:38. > :12:42.that is non-negotiable. In some cases unlawful, contrary to the

:12:43. > :12:47.treaty and such. We have had an admission this week that treaty to

:12:48. > :12:52.range is not possible -- treaty change. A lot of what David Cameron

:12:53. > :12:58.is setting out does not have that critical foundation that would

:12:59. > :13:03.deliver it. You used to write about politics a lot, would you give David

:13:04. > :13:10.Cameron a pass on this? Yes, I think he is in an invidious position and

:13:11. > :13:17.you have to go into negotiations appearing that you have got a stick.

:13:18. > :13:23.But actually, I think he is using his carrot as a stick, if you see

:13:24. > :13:29.what I mean. I think I do! He wants us to stay in. I happen to agree

:13:30. > :13:37.with him on that, I want to stay in. I think there will be more agreement

:13:38. > :13:40.from a lot of the smaller countries in Europe for some of the things he

:13:41. > :13:48.wants. I have been travelling through the Balkans, the refugees

:13:49. > :13:54.coming from Greece, and there is an awful lot of fundamental dislike of

:13:55. > :14:02.what is happening in Berlin and Paris. A moment for playing clever,

:14:03. > :14:08.one could get alliances with smaller countries. I think so. We looked too

:14:09. > :14:12.much towards Germany for what the European Community thinks. Let us

:14:13. > :14:21.jump onto another big story, Jeremy Corbyn and Trident. Maria Riegel is

:14:22. > :14:33.coming on later on -- Maria Eagle. The new shadow defence minister. She

:14:34. > :14:36.will know more. Apparently Jeremy Corbyn has not met her to talk about

:14:37. > :14:42.Trident. They may have talked about other things. He looked very

:14:43. > :14:52.uncomfortable yesterday at the Royal Albert Hall at the Singh day. Is

:14:53. > :15:08.there a gentle media bullying going on? -- at the Poppy Day. Nothing

:15:09. > :15:12.gentle about it. It will be very important for Ukip. Nigel Farage is

:15:13. > :15:18.doing a lot of hammering of Jeremy Corbyn for not being that drastic

:15:19. > :15:24.enough. He will read a poem today to demonstrate he is -- patriotically

:15:25. > :15:28.stop this is the first election test for Labour and Jeremy Corbyn and the

:15:29. > :15:34.Tory party. We have got that aspects that George Osborne being defeated

:15:35. > :15:38.on tax credits and such, the roll-out of the universal credit,

:15:39. > :15:43.this is a test not just for the Labour Party, although of course the

:15:44. > :15:46.Tory party would like to focus on that, it is a test, the first

:15:47. > :15:52.critical test, since the general election. If we can turn what was a

:15:53. > :15:56.huge amount of support, although we only got one MP, into a second MP,

:15:57. > :16:01.it would be fabulous news from Ukip's point of view. If the Tories

:16:02. > :16:07.can seriously bury Jeremy Corbyn with the by-election, it will be a

:16:08. > :16:11.win-win for them. If Labour can survive and retain the seat, Jeremy

:16:12. > :16:17.Corbyn is safe for some considerable time. In terms of what is going on

:16:18. > :16:21.inside the Tory party, tax credits were mentioned, as he searches for

:16:22. > :16:26.money, George Osborne is homing in on Iain Duncan Smith's budget for

:16:27. > :16:33.universal credit, and if the papers are right, he is boiling with anger

:16:34. > :16:40.about this and on the edge of resignation?

:16:41. > :16:47.Osborne's quite suspicion of that way of making policy according to

:16:48. > :16:52.beliefs. In this row, Owen Patterson's weighed in in favour of

:16:53. > :16:58.Iain Duncan Smith saying George Osborne can't go for universal

:16:59. > :17:03.credit. The headline says tax credits a fiasco. Your fault George.

:17:04. > :17:07.There is a suspicion in Westminster that Osborne blames Iain Duncan

:17:08. > :17:15.Smith for a tax credits row as well. Somehow it's Iain Duncan Smith

:17:16. > :17:19.fault. Buckets of bad blood? Yes. I can't fully understand it given this

:17:20. > :17:23.was Osborne's idea. Adrian, we don't plug anything on this programme very

:17:24. > :17:28.well. You've written an interesting memoir of your ups and downs over

:17:29. > :17:34.the years, the drinking and writing of columns of different kinds. One

:17:35. > :17:38.thing which struck me is how much time you've spent looking at refugee

:17:39. > :17:43.a cite Is. You've opinion just following people from Kos. There's a

:17:44. > :17:47.story in the Sunday Telegraph saying the EU's trying to do a deal with

:17:48. > :17:51.Africa. They are going to send back lots of African immigrants in return

:17:52. > :17:57.for doctors and engineers and nurses? In is the most depressing

:17:58. > :18:04.story. Even if it's a tiny bit true. It's ghastly. The idea we would say

:18:05. > :18:10.to developing countries in Africa, look, we'll give you all the people

:18:11. > :18:15.we really don't need or don't want here but can you give us all the

:18:16. > :18:20.people you really do need, all the doctors, the engineers... All the

:18:21. > :18:24.talented, trained ones. We'll bring them here, educate them and use

:18:25. > :18:30.them. We don't care what happens to you in the meantime? Appalling way

:18:31. > :18:37.of manufacturing more refugees. On a slightly lighter note. The John

:18:38. > :18:42.Lewis advert? Such a disappointment. It's the big moment, the beginning

:18:43. > :18:48.of Christmas. You wait for the John Lewis add. It's become a thing. It

:18:49. > :18:56.used to be Christmas car rolls and snow men, now the John Lewis ad. It

:18:57. > :19:01.seems to suggest you send your demented old people to the moon.

:19:02. > :19:05.What you then give lonely people as a Christmas present is a telescope

:19:06. > :19:12.so they can see at a distance other people having fun! It's very bleak?

:19:13. > :19:17.It is supposed to be raising awareness of loneliness amonks the

:19:18. > :19:22.elderly. I wonder if it becomes, people saying I wept at the John

:19:23. > :19:26.Lewis advert, very sad but don't visit any elderly relatives or

:19:27. > :19:32.connect with older people in the community. They see everyone else

:19:33. > :19:36.having a lovely Christmas. Then they get sent a telescope to see it in

:19:37. > :19:46.greater detail whilst still being lonely. It is the ultimate ideal of

:19:47. > :19:50.this society? . That was a fascinating review as ever. To the

:19:51. > :19:57.weather. Where have the crisp autumn days gone? It has been oddly warm

:19:58. > :20:02.for the time of year. Might have to wait a week before the crisp

:20:03. > :20:04.mornings return. If you're off to any Remembrance Sunday

:20:05. > :20:10.commemorations, pretty wet for most at 11.00. The driest, south-east and

:20:11. > :20:14.eastage Lee Y some rain heavy at times. Gusty winds across western

:20:15. > :20:17.areas. Touches grail force. Things brightening up in Northern Ireland

:20:18. > :20:22.this afternoon. Sunshine and a few showers. Parts of the Midlands, East

:20:23. > :20:26.Anglia and the south-east staying dry. 17 or 18 degrees possible.

:20:27. > :20:31.Heavy rain into the west later. Gusty winds. The winds will

:20:32. > :20:37.strengthen further in northern Scotland. 50-0 mph gusts for a time.

:20:38. > :20:41.Strengthening towards dawn on Monday. More rain returns. We stay

:20:42. > :20:44.dry for much of the night towards the south and east after that

:20:45. > :20:48.evening rain. A cooler start here tomorrow. Many will stay dry. Some

:20:49. > :20:52.brighter weather in northern Scotland at times with a few

:20:53. > :20:55.showers. For southern Scotland, Northern Ireland and Northern

:20:56. > :21:00.England and north-west Wales rain on and off throughout Monday. Some rain

:21:01. > :21:05.particularly heavy over the hills. Temperatures above where they should

:21:06. > :21:09.be. The rest of the week, bit of sunshine, dark clouds never too far

:21:10. > :21:11.away bringing further rain, some windy conditions at times. And,

:21:12. > :21:16.temperatures still above average for the time of year. It's going to be

:21:17. > :21:18.like living in a dirty old washing machine for the next few days? Is

:21:19. > :21:23.short! The horrors of the First World War

:21:24. > :21:27.inspired some extraordinary poetry - perhaps the greatest

:21:28. > :21:30.of those poets was the young Wilfred Owen who died just a week

:21:31. > :21:32.before the Armistice was signed. Here to mark this solemn day,

:21:33. > :21:35.I'm delighted to say that one of our greatest actors,

:21:36. > :21:38.Ian McKellen, is here to read What passing-bells

:21:39. > :21:46.for these who die as cattle? Only the monstrous anger

:21:47. > :21:49.of the guns. Only the stuttering rifles'

:21:50. > :21:53.rapid rattle No mockeries now

:21:54. > :22:01.for them, no prayers nor bells, Nor any voice of mourning

:22:02. > :22:04.save the choirs - The shrill, demented choirs of

:22:05. > :22:09.wailing shells And bugles calling for them

:22:10. > :22:14.from sad shires. What candles may be held

:22:15. > :22:19.to speed them all? Not in the hands of boys but

:22:20. > :22:23.in their eyes Shall shine

:22:24. > :22:27.the holy glimmers of goodbyes. The pallor

:22:28. > :22:30.of girls' brows shall be their pall, Their flowers the tenderness

:22:31. > :22:34.of patient minds, And each slow dusk

:22:35. > :22:46.a drawing-down of blinds. Well, there are, of course, no

:22:47. > :22:50.remaining survivors of the First World War and those who fought

:22:51. > :22:53.in the Second are a dwindling band. But there will be some,

:22:54. > :22:56.along with veterans of more recent conflict, gathering

:22:57. > :23:00.for the ceremony of Remembrance Sophie Raworth is nearby

:23:01. > :23:15.on Horse Guards Parade. Good morning, almost 10,500 veterans

:23:16. > :23:19.and civilians are gathering here on horse guards parade. They've been

:23:20. > :23:24.arriving all morning for all corners of the UK and from abroad. So many

:23:25. > :23:30.faces, young and old, so many stories. So many conflicts out there

:23:31. > :23:34.on Whitehall, huge crowds already. They've been gathering since very

:23:35. > :23:38.early this morning, queueing to get in to take their places so they can

:23:39. > :23:46.watch the march-past later this morning. Here on Horse Guards Parade

:23:47. > :23:51.is Royal Marine JJ Chalmers who served in Afghanistan in 20011.

:23:52. > :23:57.Lovely to have you here. What does it mean for you to be here this

:23:58. > :24:01.morning? It is an incredible honour. I've never been here for

:24:02. > :24:12.Remembrance. I've grown up watching it. Once I joined the military,

:24:13. > :24:19.Remembrance took on a whole new meaning. Once I served in

:24:20. > :24:21.Afghanistan, it really is specialalised. An incredible honour

:24:22. > :24:23.to be here. You were in Afghanistan for two months. You suffered

:24:24. > :24:28.terrible injuries? I was wounded by a bomb we went off very close to me.

:24:29. > :24:32.All the shards and glass came my way ander to me to pieces. Crushed my

:24:33. > :24:37.face, arms, legs. I walked away from it more or less in tact but with a

:24:38. > :24:40.new body. You say you walked away from it. You've undergone something

:24:41. > :24:46.like 30 operations in the last four years? You're right. I never walked

:24:47. > :24:50.away from it, I was carried away from incredible friends, guys who

:24:51. > :24:56.saved my lives into this incredible journey of recovery. Surgeons have

:24:57. > :24:59.done incredible things for me. I've been held together by physios.

:25:00. > :25:04.Staggering. We have the best healthcare and best service for our

:25:05. > :25:10.military we could ever hope for. I'm proof of that. Who will you be

:25:11. > :25:14.remembering today? I lost two friends in the blast that claimed my

:25:15. > :25:20.life and several others throughout the tour. I remember them every

:25:21. > :25:25.single day. They are the reason I continue in life and go from

:25:26. > :25:28.strength to strength. I want to make them and their families proud and

:25:29. > :25:33.show the opportunity and chance and luck I was given to survive. It

:25:34. > :25:37.makes this whole experience and conflicts of the years gone past so

:25:38. > :25:42.much more personal to me. When you look around here this morn thing, it

:25:43. > :25:46.is extraordinary seeing people who come here, many year after year,

:25:47. > :25:51.there is an amazing bond, isn't there? It is incredible. Conflicts

:25:52. > :25:55.change, countries change but the thing which doesn't change is the

:25:56. > :26:00.people involved in it. It's ordinary men and women being asked to do

:26:01. > :26:03.extraordinary things. We find ourselves in some extremely

:26:04. > :26:08.difficult situations. But the bond you get through that cannot be

:26:09. > :26:12.created anywhere else, I believe. What about the public support? You

:26:13. > :26:17.walked along Whitehall with me a few minutes ago ago. The crowds are big?

:26:18. > :26:23.It is staggering, a wonderful reminder we do this job to serve the

:26:24. > :26:27.people. This is an incredible country to have them come out and

:26:28. > :26:32.support us is fan ohm fall, really. A lot of the people who will be

:26:33. > :26:35.taking part in the march-past will represent charities, people who've

:26:36. > :26:40.helped you in your journey along the way? We have an incredible care

:26:41. > :26:45.system provided by the MoD and military. Throughout it, the

:26:46. > :26:48.charities inter spores. They really improve that and bring it forward.

:26:49. > :26:54.It is staggering how many people come together to make this happen.

:26:55. > :26:59.Whether it is surgeons or a lovely lady in Aberdeen who put on a bake

:27:00. > :27:04.sale to provide me with a better quality of life. Thank you.

:27:05. > :27:09.If the Russian plane returning from Sharm el-Sheikh was downed

:27:10. > :27:12.by a bomb planted by Isis, then we are under more direct threat

:27:13. > :27:17.Would that change the mood at Westminster over air strikes

:27:18. > :27:23.I'm joined by the Foreign Secretary Philip Hammond.

:27:24. > :27:31.Back to you What's your instinct from everything you've seen about

:27:32. > :27:35.this Downing of the plane? Is it a terrorist attack? We think it is

:27:36. > :27:40.more likely than not that it was caused by an explosive device on

:27:41. > :27:44.board. We are now seeing others taking action. Most importantly the

:27:45. > :27:47.Russians, right in the heart of the investigation into the crash of

:27:48. > :27:52.their plane, taking similar action to us. There are a lot of British

:27:53. > :27:56.people still out there apparently very angry, many of them. What's

:27:57. > :28:03.your message? How long will it be before they all get back? I've just

:28:04. > :28:10.spoken to our ambassador to Egypt who's in Sharm. Rather a rough time

:28:11. > :28:13.in the airport from some people? The media will always find discontent

:28:14. > :28:17.people. He says the mood is calm generally. They appreciate their

:28:18. > :28:23.safety is being put above all other considerations. We are getting

:28:24. > :28:29.people out. 3,300 out so far by the end of the today, should be 5,000

:28:30. > :28:33.people back home. Many people will want to stay and complete their

:28:34. > :28:36.holidays and then leave. We haven't changed our advice with regard to

:28:37. > :28:40.the resort of Sharm el-Sheikh itself. Those who want to come out

:28:41. > :28:45.early, the airlines will do their best to accommodate them. There is a

:28:46. > :28:50.constraint. We've imposed that on the system. A much higher level of

:28:51. > :28:54.security checking. The Egyptians have been very co-operative in

:28:55. > :28:57.making that happen. We're running up against the capacity limits of the

:28:58. > :29:01.airport given the additional measures being applied. That's

:29:02. > :29:07.what's causing the delay to some flights. How long before everybody

:29:08. > :29:12.who wants to get out now gets out? What we are understanding is at most

:29:13. > :29:18.people will experience a delay of two or three days. That's what

:29:19. > :29:22.EasyJet have indicated, beyond their scheduled travel date if they want

:29:23. > :29:26.to come out early. Other people will want to remain and complete their

:29:27. > :29:30.holidays. If it was a bomb put on board at the airport, then

:29:31. > :29:36.presumably this changes our view of lots and lots of airports across the

:29:37. > :29:40.Middle East through parts of Turkey, North Africa, is the Foreign Office

:29:41. > :29:45.conducting a review of airport security in that part of the world?

:29:46. > :29:50.It is the department of transport who has that responsibility. But its

:29:51. > :29:55.a he issior advice? We set the travel advice but the department for

:29:56. > :30:00.transport has a body of aviation security experts who constantly

:30:01. > :30:05.travel around airports. This scent' a one--- this isn't a one off. They

:30:06. > :30:12.review security particularly in vulnerable airports. If this turns

:30:13. > :30:17.out to be a device planted by ISIL or somebody inspired by ISIL, we'll

:30:18. > :30:20.have to look at the level of the security we expect to see in

:30:21. > :30:26.airports where ISIL is active. It is hard to see how this could be done

:30:27. > :30:31.and keep those airports operating at the same level as they are now. If

:30:32. > :30:36.everybody has to be properly screened across a third of the

:30:37. > :30:40.world, it will change the whole way we think about flying, where we go

:30:41. > :30:46.on holidays, the committees of many countries? It will have an impact.

:30:47. > :30:50.It is doable. We know there are people in this country who would

:30:51. > :30:54.love to smuggle an explosive device on to aeroplanes who would do it if

:30:55. > :31:01.it was possible. Because our airport security is what it is, we have been

:31:02. > :31:04.remarkably successful for over 25 years in ensuring nobody is able to

:31:05. > :31:09.get an explosive device on to a plane. We have to ensure airport

:31:10. > :31:14.security everywhere is at the level of the best. And that airport

:31:15. > :31:20.security reflects the local conditions and whether there is

:31:21. > :31:23.higher local threat level that will mean higher levels of security are

:31:24. > :31:27.required and that may mean additional costs. It may mean

:31:28. > :31:37.additional delays at airports. There will be a lot of people

:31:38. > :31:41.wanting to fly to all sorts of parts of the Middle East and they will be

:31:42. > :31:48.asking if it is still safe? That is the point of our aviation security

:31:49. > :31:54.effort across the world. We rate and score airports. If we believe an

:31:55. > :31:57.airport is unsafe, we would say so. We work with local authorities who

:31:58. > :32:03.are almost always very keen to work with us. We support them and provide

:32:04. > :32:08.expert advice we advise them on equipment they need. But it is not

:32:09. > :32:12.just about equipment, it is about training and management and

:32:13. > :32:18.motivation of staff. But as the key issue to keeping airport say. What

:32:19. > :32:21.about the apparent missile that went towards a British plane over the

:32:22. > :32:27.Sinai desert a few weeks ago, why did we not hear about it at the

:32:28. > :32:31.time? A few months ago now. The Thompson incident. I looked

:32:32. > :32:35.carefully at that, at the time. I am pretty sure it was a red herring and

:32:36. > :32:39.we have a very good explanation of what happened. There was an Egyptian

:32:40. > :32:47.military exercise going on on the ground and I was satisfied,

:32:48. > :32:50.everybody in our system was satisfied, that it was not an

:32:51. > :32:57.attempt on the plane. The plane was not in danger. Isil have accumulated

:32:58. > :33:01.quite a lot of ex-Iraqi military material, some American and in due

:33:02. > :33:06.course some Russian as well. What do you feel about the possibility of

:33:07. > :33:10.this organisation having surface to air missiles and bringing down jets

:33:11. > :33:13.across the region? It is not impossible but we have seen no

:33:14. > :33:19.evidence that they have this equipment. Clearly, airlines and

:33:20. > :33:24.aviation security organisations take into account the risks when they set

:33:25. > :33:28.guidance to airlines about minimum heights they should fly out and

:33:29. > :33:35.areas they should avoid altogether. Do we need a new strategy for Isil?

:33:36. > :33:38.You have been talking about going to the House of Commons to get

:33:39. > :33:47.permission for bombing and one of the reasons that MPs are lots -- are

:33:48. > :33:53.not supporting it is because they have said it is not going to be a

:33:54. > :34:01.war winning operation. So they say, why are we doing it? Clearly, we are

:34:02. > :34:05.part of the coalition of more than 60 nations and a decision we make on

:34:06. > :34:09.its own will not tip the balance in the campaign on the battlefield. To

:34:10. > :34:16.be successful against Isil, we have to destroy Isil in its heartland in

:34:17. > :34:19.eastern Syria and to do that effectively we have to get a

:34:20. > :34:24.political solution to the broader civil war in Syria. That process is

:34:25. > :34:29.now under way again with a meeting held in Vienna ten days ago, we are

:34:30. > :34:34.having another meeting in Vienna next Saturday to take forward the

:34:35. > :34:39.process. We have to get a ceasefire on the battlefield, a political

:34:40. > :34:43.dialogue going involving the legitimate opposition groups in

:34:44. > :34:47.Syria. So that we can get all people who believe in a future for Syria

:34:48. > :34:52.working together against the terrorists in Isil. This is really

:34:53. > :34:55.interesting because I was talking to Sir Nick Houghton and he thinks this

:34:56. > :35:00.is a possible turning point in our relations with the Russians. They

:35:01. > :35:05.may look again at the transition from Assad and it may be the moment

:35:06. > :35:12.when Vladimir Putin becomes in some sense an ally. On this issue, Syria

:35:13. > :35:17.and Isil, we see I do I with the Russians on lots of things, our

:35:18. > :35:22.vision for a future Syria is broadly similar. Except for Assad. I will

:35:23. > :35:27.come to that. The Russians agree with us on destroying Isil, they

:35:28. > :35:30.have a very large Muslim population in the Russian Federation and they

:35:31. > :35:36.are very alert to the risks of radicalisation. The one thing we

:35:37. > :35:40.disagree on is the future of Bashar al-Assad. We and most of our allies

:35:41. > :35:45.and partners believe he needs to go at a point in the transition process

:35:46. > :35:49.and the Russians at the moment are still saying, no, he must be allowed

:35:50. > :35:54.to stand in future elections if he wishes to. We are talking about a

:35:55. > :35:59.transition, it does not sound like we are that far apart? It would be

:36:00. > :36:05.perfect if Assad was to decide he did not want to do this job anymore.

:36:06. > :36:09.It would be great. Then he would not be standing in a future presidential

:36:10. > :36:14.election. The one person who has the power to persuade him that is in his

:36:15. > :36:19.and his country's best interests is President Putin and I hope at some

:36:20. > :36:23.point he will decide to do that. Is there any evidence the Russians are

:36:24. > :36:28.spending more time focused attacking Isil themselves rather than other

:36:29. > :36:31.enemies of Assad? That is the problem. We have a fundamental

:36:32. > :36:36.difference of view. The Russians believe the way to deal with Isil is

:36:37. > :36:42.first of all to strengthen the regime and then allow the regime to

:36:43. > :36:48.finish off Isil. We believe so long as Assad is still there, the

:36:49. > :36:52.opposition in Syria will be primarily focused on the Assad

:36:53. > :36:55.regime. You will never get the opposition and the regime working

:36:56. > :37:00.together and less an exit for Assad has been guaranteed, so that we know

:37:01. > :37:09.he is going at a certain point. That is the crux. The talks are going to

:37:10. > :37:13.happen? Next Saturday. Our plans for a vote in the House of Commons to

:37:14. > :37:19.allow the RAF to target Isil in Syria, are they of the table? No,

:37:20. > :37:25.not at all. We are in the same place despite the story that ran earlier

:37:26. > :37:29.last week. When we think it is right to do so and when we are confident

:37:30. > :37:33.there is a consensus in the House of Commons, we will go to the House of

:37:34. > :37:36.Commons and hold a debate. With respect, there will never be a

:37:37. > :37:42.consensus. Have you got enough Labour MPs to back you estimate we

:37:43. > :37:46.are in a slightly different situation now -- to back you? The

:37:47. > :37:50.Labour Party is a different organisation to that which we faced

:37:51. > :37:53.before the summer. We need to understand where the Labour Party is

:37:54. > :37:58.on this. At the moment, even its leader does not agree with its

:37:59. > :38:02.policies always. There is an exploration process of understanding

:38:03. > :38:06.whether a majority of Labour MPs would in fact back this action. When

:38:07. > :38:14.we have worked in this country with one notable exception, 20 13th vote

:38:15. > :38:18.on the Syria strike, the way we have always worked, for hundreds of

:38:19. > :38:24.years, is that when it is a question of putting British troops in danger

:38:25. > :38:27.in military action, we have always sought to work with cross-party

:38:28. > :38:33.consensus. In government and opposition, that has been the toy

:38:34. > :38:38.party's approach. Until 2013, it was the Labour Party's approach. -- the

:38:39. > :38:42.Tory party. I want to get back to that approach. As soon as you think

:38:43. > :38:47.you have enough Labour votes to do this, you will do it? When we think

:38:48. > :38:52.it is right and we have a consensus to get a majority, we will go back

:38:53. > :38:55.to Parliament. Another subject inquiry, all over the papers, the

:38:56. > :39:01.Prime Minister's much tougher words about leading Britain out of Europe

:39:02. > :39:06.if he does not get what he wants. This week a letter will go to Donald

:39:07. > :39:10.Tusk setting out the objectives, have you seen it? I have seen a

:39:11. > :39:16.draft of the letter, we have been working on it. Will it include

:39:17. > :39:22.detail? People are interested on the detail above the four year ban on

:39:23. > :39:26.migrants getting in work benefits. We were asked by the president of

:39:27. > :39:32.the council specifically to write the letter in this format, drawing

:39:33. > :39:35.together our arguments and our asks we have set them up before in

:39:36. > :39:42.speeches and articles. We have never yet collated them into a single

:39:43. > :39:48.document which sets out what it is Britain is seeking to change, why we

:39:49. > :39:52.are seeking that change and to set out some parameters for the change.

:39:53. > :39:57.What it does not do and will not do at this stage is set out detailed

:39:58. > :40:01.specific legislative changes. That is for the negotiation. In many

:40:02. > :40:05.cases, there will be more than one way of delivering the change that

:40:06. > :40:09.Britain wants to see and it will be for a discussion with our neighbours

:40:10. > :40:14.in Europe about how best to do it. We will not see details of four

:40:15. > :40:21.instance that in work benefit proposals? We will set out a clear

:40:22. > :40:25.marker for what we need to achieve. There could be different ways of

:40:26. > :40:31.doing that, combinations of use of domestic and European legislation,

:40:32. > :40:35.changes to treaties or other ways of delivering legislative change. We do

:40:36. > :40:38.not want to be excessively prescriptive at the beginning of a

:40:39. > :40:44.discussion. I understand. This is the beginning of the process. In

:40:45. > :40:48.domestic terms, this issue has made headlines since 2014, talked about a

:40:49. > :40:54.lot during the election and before and after. Lots of people are

:40:55. > :41:00.focusing on this as the acid test as to whether the Prime Minister gets

:41:01. > :41:05.what he wants. Do you accept, as a lot of MPs do, that the proposal for

:41:06. > :41:11.a four-year ban on in work benefits would be illegal under EU law? Under

:41:12. > :41:18.current EU law, it may not complied, but that is why we... Illegal? We

:41:19. > :41:23.are looking for changes and some of the changes will require changes to

:41:24. > :41:26.the body of law, the treaties and the EU secondary legislation, that

:41:27. > :41:31.are currently in place. We would not be having to have a complex

:41:32. > :41:34.renegotiation if we did not require substantial changes in the law

:41:35. > :41:40.governing the EU. Do you accept that if you do not get big changes to

:41:41. > :41:46.stop the inward flow of EU workers you will not be able to win

:41:47. > :41:50.referendum? What I have said repeatedly, not just migration,

:41:51. > :41:53.there are several areas where we have to get substantive,

:41:54. > :41:57.irreversible, legally binding change, in order to satisfy the

:41:58. > :42:03.British people. They will not be fobbed off with a set of cosmetic

:42:04. > :42:08.alterations. This is about fundamental change in the direction

:42:09. > :42:13.of travel of the European Union to make sure it works for Britain and

:42:14. > :42:18.that it is an effective organisation for all of the citizens of Europe,

:42:19. > :42:21.driving our prosperity and competitiveness in the 21st century.

:42:22. > :42:26.If we cannot do that, we will not win the referendum. If you do not

:42:27. > :42:30.get fundamental irreversible change of the kind you are talking about,

:42:31. > :42:35.the Prime Minister has made clear he would not be in favour of staying in

:42:36. > :42:40.the EU, is that your view? The Prime Minister has said and I agree, if

:42:41. > :42:45.our partners turn a deaf ear to the reasonable demands of the British

:42:46. > :42:49.people, in the interests of all of the people of the European Union, we

:42:50. > :42:54.will have to think again about how to protect Britain's interests in

:42:55. > :43:00.the future. If Britain gains significant economic benefits from

:43:01. > :43:04.being in the European Union, but the European Union has serious problems

:43:05. > :43:09.that need fixing and in this process we have to fix those things. Is

:43:10. > :43:13.there a perfectly tolerable life of this country outside the EU if it

:43:14. > :43:17.does not work? There would be big challenges for Britain outside the

:43:18. > :43:21.European Union because many of our important trade and investment

:43:22. > :43:26.partners around the world see us are merrily as a very user-friendly

:43:27. > :43:32.gateway into the European Union. If you talk to Americans, Chinese, Arab

:43:33. > :43:38.investors, they understand London and the British legal system, we are

:43:39. > :43:43.an entry point for them to the EU. If we were not in the EU, we would

:43:44. > :43:46.have to find a different way of promoting our economy. Not

:43:47. > :43:50.impossible but it would be challenging. You sit in the Cabinet

:43:51. > :43:53.and you know your colleagues very well, is it the case that things are

:43:54. > :43:57.so bad between the Chancellor and Iain Duncan Smith that we are on the

:43:58. > :44:03.verge of a Cabinet resignation? I do not think so. You do not think Iain

:44:04. > :44:08.Duncan Smith is angry about a tense to go for universal credit? We all

:44:09. > :44:13.have robust conversations with the Chancellor. Inevitably, we have

:44:14. > :44:18.tough discussions. He very rarely comes with good news? The Chancellor

:44:19. > :44:21.has a really tough job to do but the headline commitment we made to the

:44:22. > :44:26.British people in the general election earlier this year was to

:44:27. > :44:34.get Britain out of deficit and into surplus. That underpins everything

:44:35. > :44:37.else we are doing and our ability to deliver a better quality of life and

:44:38. > :44:44.education and health service for people in this country, we have to

:44:45. > :44:50.deliver on that. Is Cabinet solidarity sufficient on that? Of

:44:51. > :44:56.course people fight their corner and seek to sway the agenda in one way

:44:57. > :44:59.or another, but every one of my Cabinet colleagues would agree that

:45:00. > :45:06.the number one task in front of us is eliminating the deficit, getting

:45:07. > :45:12.Britain's economy on an even keel for the future. Thank you for

:45:13. > :45:15.joining us. Danny Boyle is one of Britain's true visionaries.

:45:16. > :45:16.The man who gave us Slumdog Millionaire

:45:17. > :45:19.and Trainspotting, he also directed the spectacular opening ceremony

:45:20. > :45:22.His latest film is all about another visionary, Steve Jobs,

:45:23. > :45:26.Boyle has made a revealing and compelling film about Jobs which

:45:27. > :45:29.delves into the difficult nature of the man who some deemed a monster,

:45:30. > :45:37.When we met, Danny Boyle told me why he saw this as a film about faith.

:45:38. > :45:43.I sat in a garage and invented the future because artists lead.

:45:44. > :45:47.Right, well, this guy's out of control.

:45:48. > :45:50.They treated it with almost a religious fervour.

:45:51. > :45:56.Early on in the film, you see him trying to convince people

:45:57. > :46:04.The vision was a computer that would feel personal,

:46:05. > :46:12.The way you express that vision, the fervour with which you express

:46:13. > :46:16.It caused some of the damage, of course.

:46:17. > :46:18.Anybody who was hostile or unappreciative of it,

:46:19. > :46:23.He's a difficult guy, to put it gently.

:46:24. > :46:28.He's the visionary to the question that Wozniak asks at one point.

:46:29. > :46:34.You're not a great coder, not a great designer,

:46:35. > :46:40.How come ten times in a day I read Steve Jobs is a genius.

:46:41. > :46:46.It's a very uncomfortable question, that,

:46:47. > :46:55.I don't really know how to operate these cameras, the same with

:46:56. > :46:59.You sort of bring everybody together who has those skills.

:47:00. > :47:03.You're the conductor of the orchestra?

:47:04. > :47:09.Responsible for the rhythm of it arriving.

:47:10. > :47:13.And you're responsible for the arc of the story, the stories of others.

:47:14. > :47:16.The choices to make, Jobs relationship with his daughter

:47:17. > :47:19.who at first he doesn't acknowledge but then grows up alongside him,

:47:20. > :47:26.It was the way you could hold him to account.

:47:27. > :47:29.It's that Shakespearean thing, the personal.

:47:30. > :47:33.With all the achievements, history and products, the way you

:47:34. > :47:36.hold into account his personal relationship with his daughter

:47:37. > :47:40.but the responsibility of where you come from and what you've done.

:47:41. > :47:42.Morally, you have to take that on board.

:47:43. > :47:53.She was hugely helpful to Aaron Socking in writing the script.

:47:54. > :47:56.The family, certainly his widow, and a lot of people at Apple, hated

:47:57. > :48:03.Do you get why they hated it so much?

:48:04. > :48:10.It's very difficult with the family. When a family's grieving, what do

:48:11. > :48:17.you do accept to say this man was by his own choice a huge public figure

:48:18. > :48:22.and a significant change-maker. The company I don't have any sympathy

:48:23. > :48:25.with. This is the most powerful company in the word at the moment.

:48:26. > :48:29.They want their narrative their way. It is crucial for everybody,

:48:30. > :48:35.journalists, artists to tell the story not quite how Apple want it.

:48:36. > :48:40.They get enough chance to tell their story their way. I believe it is a

:48:41. > :48:47.very decent account of this man who was full of such contradictions.

:48:48. > :48:53.It's neither a deif I can casing or a hatchet job. If I was going to do

:48:54. > :48:56.a biopic of you, I'd ask questions about faith and so forth. You were

:48:57. > :49:02.on the road to can abouting a Catholic priest at one stage? I was

:49:03. > :49:06.until I was about 13 or 14. I was very close to becoming, my mother

:49:07. > :49:12.was a very devout Catholic woman. She wanted me to be a priest. It is

:49:13. > :49:17.weird, there's a number of film directors who have trod that path

:49:18. > :49:20.early on. There's clearly a con ex-between the two jobs, poncing

:49:21. > :49:24.around telling people what to do, I think. It is a great pulpit, a great

:49:25. > :49:30.place to give your account of the world? You would think it would be

:49:31. > :49:34.more acting. But, obviously, feel like you're more in control if

:49:35. > :49:39.you're behind the scenes. Very often in your films, there and an uplift,

:49:40. > :49:45.essentially benign view of the world. Slumdog Millionaire got

:49:46. > :49:49.hammered by some for being too nice about poverty. It was very important

:49:50. > :49:55.in that film that the human spirit wins through? I'm believer in that.

:49:56. > :49:59.I'm an optimist about everything really, apart from success. Very

:50:00. > :50:03.pessimistic about success which is quite healthy. You have to keep a

:50:04. > :50:08.balance. Otherwise, I'm a very optimistic person. I certainly

:50:09. > :50:12.believe in the trajectory of storytelling. There is a sense the

:50:13. > :50:20.more you belong to the story the more it deserves to lift you out of

:50:21. > :50:27.it towards the end of it. I am A believer in that. The opening of the

:50:28. > :50:32.Olympic Games. You are in charge of how the British see themselves. You

:50:33. > :50:39.discovered a bit of pat reO'Ism after it? I read a thing Orwell said

:50:40. > :50:46.that Britain's the only country where the intellect use ensure you

:50:47. > :50:51.should be ashamed of patriotism. We have that tendency, the intellectual

:50:52. > :50:54.class to be very suspicious of it. Suspicion that's healthy sometimes.

:50:55. > :50:59.We have a lot to admire about ourselves. We should only

:51:00. > :51:05.occasionally admire it. We should measure it out. It is inspiring to

:51:06. > :51:09.the world. One of the things about doing the games, you meet so many

:51:10. > :51:14.people from so many different parts of the world who are part of it.

:51:15. > :51:18.They look to us as a beacon of freedom, personal liberty. Our

:51:19. > :51:24.culture as well, they admire and aspire to. It is a good thing. We

:51:25. > :51:28.should celebrate it occasionally. Some folks said it was a little

:51:29. > :51:35.roast tinted. The NHS and all the rest of it. We are not nearly as

:51:36. > :51:39.democratic and open and optimistic and so forth as the ceremony

:51:40. > :51:44.suggested? The slight wave of cynicism we usually have has swept

:51:45. > :51:50.back in again. That's as it should be. Occasionally it clears. We do

:51:51. > :51:56.have, certainly in comparison, we do live in a generally peaceful and

:51:57. > :51:58.tolerant multi-cultural society. That's a thing a lot of people would

:51:59. > :52:01.aspire to. Thanks for joining. In a moment,

:52:02. > :52:06.you can see my interview with the Chief of the Defence Staff,

:52:07. > :52:08.but first, over to Christian Fraser A memorial service will be held this

:52:09. > :52:19.morning in St Petersburg for the 224 people killed

:52:20. > :52:20.on the Russian airliner that crashed Egyptian officials say investigators

:52:21. > :52:25.will be carrying out further analysis to try to identify a noise

:52:26. > :52:27.heard in the final second of the The Foreign Secretary told this

:52:28. > :52:33.programme that the Government will look again at

:52:34. > :52:36.the security of airports in areas of the world where Islamic extremist

:52:37. > :52:39.terrorists are active, if the plane Philip Hammond said it was important

:52:40. > :52:43.to ensure that airport security reflected local threat levels

:52:44. > :52:47.and warned that could involve extra costs and more delays

:52:48. > :52:49.for travellers. Mr Hammond insisted the Government

:52:50. > :52:53.still plans to have a vote in Parliament

:52:54. > :52:56.about extending airstrikes to IS targets in Syria, when it judged it

:52:57. > :52:59.was the right thing to do and there That's all from me for now. The next

:53:00. > :53:05.news on BBC One is at 1.30pm. Now, appropriately on

:53:06. > :53:11.Remembrance Sunday, I've been talking to the Chief of the Defence

:53:12. > :53:13.Staff, General Sir Nick Horton. We discussed Syria and the

:53:14. > :53:16.forthcoming defence review, but I began by asking him if this is the

:53:17. > :53:20.most important day of the year for So I think so in many ways,

:53:21. > :53:26.on a day when everybody has their own thoughts about Remembrance,

:53:27. > :53:29.the Armed Forces, some of that is Some is still very raw because,

:53:30. > :53:38.sadly, we continue to lose people I do think there is, over the last

:53:39. > :53:45.few years, a growing awareness within the nation as a whole that

:53:46. > :53:48.it's more than just a single day There is a remarkable sense

:53:49. > :53:53.of remembrance about the whole Are you at all concerned

:53:54. > :53:59.about the fact some communities in Britain have been

:54:00. > :54:03.so hostile to recent conflicts that the general national consensus is

:54:04. > :54:06.fragmenting at the edges? There has been public concern and

:54:07. > :54:10.an awakening of public conscience In many ways,

:54:11. > :54:30.I think this is a good thing. At the moment we're experiencing a

:54:31. > :54:34.remarkable list the remembrances. For those who reflect on this, it

:54:35. > :54:39.tells a story of a remarkable evolution of our country and its

:54:40. > :54:43.democracy and what it's come to be today which is a remarkably

:54:44. > :54:48.privileged country. Open society and freedoms. It documents over all

:54:49. > :54:51.those years, the degree of service and sacrifice that's had to be in

:54:52. > :54:54.vested in creating the country we enjoy today. Of course, for a lot of

:54:55. > :54:57.people think enjoy today. Of course, for a lot of

:54:58. > :55:02.people think being today. They'll be thinking about the Second World War

:55:03. > :55:08.and the defeat of fascism. In that context do you think it is fair to

:55:09. > :55:13.see ISIS as a fascist expansionist state? I wouldn't give it that

:55:14. > :55:18.particular label myself. It present as significant threat. Perhaps an

:55:19. > :55:22.extraordinary threat to what one might call the normal run of

:55:23. > :55:26.terrorism. David Cameron said exostings? I think when the Prime

:55:27. > :55:30.Minister speaks like that, I don't think he necessarily means in terms

:55:31. > :55:37.of they are going to come and take our territory off us. But in terms

:55:38. > :55:41.of, to undermine our way of life, freedoms, liberty, the values we

:55:42. > :55:47.stand for, that's the true nature of the threat. A threat like Isis has

:55:48. > :55:52.the potential to present. We do seem to be in this strange position where

:55:53. > :55:56.there is a proposal for another eight tornado jets to help with the

:55:57. > :56:01.American attacks inside Syria, which most people think will not be enough

:56:02. > :56:04.to defeat ISIS but the Commons is against, without there being an

:56:05. > :56:10.overall plan which is big and Booed enough to defeat ISIS on the

:56:11. > :56:14.battlefield. If the politicians said, we've changed our mind, we

:56:15. > :56:21.want to defeat ISIS on the battlefield, could you do it? Could

:56:22. > :56:25.the West do it? I don't think you defeat an ideology militarily.

:56:26. > :56:30.That's always been behind the international formulation of what we

:56:31. > :56:37.are doing about ISIS. From a national perspective. The only thing

:56:38. > :56:43.we can unilaterally own as a country is a strategy about ISIS which keeps

:56:44. > :56:47.the people of this country safe. Our national strategy is about border

:56:48. > :56:53.security, the remarkable work about our intelligence services. Reaching

:56:54. > :56:58.out through the Muslim society within the country to assist them in

:56:59. > :57:04.de-radicalising and delegitimising ISIS. But we've only ever said we

:57:05. > :57:09.could make a contribution to the international defeat of ISIS. This

:57:10. > :57:13.is as much down an eyed elogical route as a military route. It is

:57:14. > :57:18.important in the end the military dimension of this is done by

:57:19. > :57:23.regional players, by Muslim countries, local armed forces.

:57:24. > :57:29.Therefore, I don't think we should play the decisive military role. It

:57:30. > :57:33.runs the risk of adding fuel to the radicalisation of ISIS as an

:57:34. > :57:40.abhorrent cult. How much do you think of bringing down of this

:57:41. > :57:44.airline, don't know if you've security sources saying ISIS did it,

:57:45. > :57:48.how much does that change the game? The important thing is how it might

:57:49. > :57:51.impact on the thoughts of Russia. You can't just look at the

:57:52. > :57:55.activities of Russia over the last year or so through the focus purely

:57:56. > :58:01.of Syria. You have to fake a step back. This is actually part of them

:58:02. > :58:07.wanting to secure regional influence in a part of world close to their

:58:08. > :58:12.near abroad. What this might really make them think, this is more than

:58:13. > :58:17.propping up our equity there. We've serious interest here in the

:58:18. > :58:21.destrurnings of this abhorrent eyed e-Ogee. We've gone through a couple

:58:22. > :58:25.of years where Putin has been raised as one of the big threats to the

:58:26. > :58:31.West. Do you think this is a turning point in our relationships with

:58:32. > :58:35.Russia? It could be. Those who talk about these things, attendant at

:58:36. > :58:40.National Security Council debates, make the point there is also an

:58:41. > :58:45.opportunity here. An opportunity for an element of political convergence

:58:46. > :58:52.between America, ourselves, the West and Putin. That there will be some

:58:53. > :58:58.identification of a common view on how a political transition of Assa

:58:59. > :59:03.darks could work. Five years ago, there is what everybody seems to

:59:04. > :59:08.accept a brutal strategic defence and security review. The army coming

:59:09. > :59:12.down and navy coming down quite dramatically. Since then, the number

:59:13. > :59:15.of troops has fallen faster than expected and the number of

:59:16. > :59:21.reservists hasn't risen nearly as fast. I think there were only 20 net

:59:22. > :59:26.reservists added to the army last year. Are you concerned now about

:59:27. > :59:32.the state of the armed forces ahead of this new SR? Am I concerned? I'm

:59:33. > :59:39.always concerned. That's my professional job. At I concerned in

:59:40. > :59:43.a way as we approach this SDSR, more of the same? Not at all. Because the

:59:44. > :59:48.world has changed since then? Not just that but the domestic situation

:59:49. > :59:54.has changed. I think we have to base, as we look forward to this

:59:55. > :59:57.defence review, which should be one primarily about confidence and

:59:58. > :00:02.optimism and a reassurance to the people of the country that there

:00:03. > :00:08.will be a bit of realism in the fact the world has become a somewhat more

:00:09. > :00:13.dangerous place. If you like, the latent threats have become patent

:00:14. > :00:18.ones. On defence spending, George Osborne promised you the extra 2%.

:00:19. > :00:20.Are you concerned the Chancellor of the treasury will nibble away by

:00:21. > :00:32.adding military pensions into if? It would be a miracle if defence and

:00:33. > :00:37.the Treasury did not submit to Nato the things that are permissible as

:00:38. > :00:41.defence expenditure. However the figures are done, my concern is that

:00:42. > :00:45.is real additional spending for defence and that is the case. For

:00:46. > :00:52.the first time in a long time, probably 25 years, this is about not

:00:53. > :00:55.the management of decline but the management of betterment. What about

:00:56. > :01:01.Trident? People like Crispin Blunt have suggested the amount of money

:01:02. > :01:05.Trident is taking over the next 20 years is unreasonable compared with

:01:06. > :01:20.all of the other threats we face? It is one of those things we have got

:01:21. > :01:26.to keep a running ion. -- running eye on. It is not just the forces of

:01:27. > :01:31.the UK, in concert with our allies. You should never run the risk of

:01:32. > :01:35.creating an imbalance between nuclear and conventional forces or

:01:36. > :01:40.the whole credibility of deterrence. Part. We seem quite

:01:41. > :01:43.close to that given the small size of the Royal Navy, for instance.

:01:44. > :01:47.That is why deterrence in the Western sense is all about

:01:48. > :01:54.deterrence within Nato not just on our own. Collective security is

:01:55. > :01:57.ultimately what preserves the security of the country. We now have

:01:58. > :02:01.the Leader of the Opposition saying he would never press the nuclear

:02:02. > :02:09.button. Does it worry you? It would worry me if that thought was

:02:10. > :02:14.translated into power, as it were. If he wins, he is a problem? There

:02:15. > :02:19.are a couple of hurdles to cross before we get to that. The reason I

:02:20. > :02:24.say this, not based on a personal thing, pew early based on the

:02:25. > :02:35.credibility of deterrence. The whole thing about deterrence rests on the

:02:36. > :02:38.credibility of its use. When people say you are never going to use the

:02:39. > :02:43.deterrent, you use it every second of every day, but the purpose is you

:02:44. > :02:46.do not have to use it because you successfully deter. No point

:02:47. > :02:52.spending billions of pounds if we would never use it. The deterrence

:02:53. > :02:59.is completely than undermined. Most of the politicians I know understand

:03:00. > :03:06.that and I think, dare I say, the responsibility of power is probably

:03:07. > :03:09.quite a sobering thing and you come to a realisation, I understand how

:03:10. > :03:13.this thing works. There has been a lot of coverage of the legal threats

:03:14. > :03:17.faced by British forces abroad and we read today a new Bill of Rights

:03:18. > :03:22.giving members of the Armed Forces new protections. Can you explain why

:03:23. > :03:26.you think it is essential? There is a very specific thing within the

:03:27. > :03:30.European Court of Human Rights and the act about the right to life.

:03:31. > :03:36.Everybody does have a right to life but on a battlefield it is slightly

:03:37. > :03:41.different. At a very low tactical level, occasionally, a young man's

:03:42. > :03:46.Corporal, might have to buy design risk the life of one of his section

:03:47. > :03:53.to achieve the mission or save the lives of the balance of the section.

:03:54. > :03:59.If he is going to hesitate or stop doing that or worry about doing it,

:04:00. > :04:02.it undermines the whole basis of the way in which we operate at a

:04:03. > :04:06.tactical level. You can expand that right up the chain of command. At a

:04:07. > :04:11.personal level, do you have any sympathy with Marine A bust up of

:04:12. > :04:19.course I would have sympathy. Two years ago on the show I said what I

:04:20. > :04:25.absolutely abide by the view is that we institutionally should not allow

:04:26. > :04:32.ourselves or demand some default right to leniency as and of itself.

:04:33. > :04:37.-- do you have any sympathy with Marine A? The judicial process has

:04:38. > :04:43.to judge these things on their merits. I do not think we should

:04:44. > :04:48.drop our standards institutionally. Do you think the press campaign on

:04:49. > :04:52.this is misguided? To an extent, it is. The judicial process has run.

:04:53. > :04:57.Some leniency has been shown. Another review potentially... Was

:04:58. > :05:05.there any evidence that was not brought to bear which might afford a

:05:06. > :05:10.review of the degree of leniency shown? But this is down to the legal

:05:11. > :05:13.process, it is not down... Most of the people I talk to in the Armed

:05:14. > :05:20.Forces absolutely get this. We might see a review? That I do not know, it

:05:21. > :05:25.is a judicial process and not one I will be personally fighting for. You

:05:26. > :05:31.have a very long day ahead of you, thank you very much. Ting it here.

:05:32. > :05:36.Thank you, Andrew. -- thank you very much for starting it here.

:05:37. > :05:38.Well, Labour's defence policy has been thrown into question

:05:39. > :05:40.following the election of the CND-supporting Jeremy Corbyn

:05:41. > :05:43.as leader and the vote by Scottish Labour against the renewal

:05:44. > :05:46.Leading what she says is an open-minded review is the Shadow

:05:47. > :05:58.Can I ask how many times you have met Jeremy Corbyn 121 to Trident? I

:05:59. > :06:03.have a meeting with the diary but I have not met him yet to discuss that

:06:04. > :06:11.aspect. Are you surprised? I am pretty relaxed. We are in opposition

:06:12. > :06:15.for five years. This has got to be a serious meaningful review and we

:06:16. > :06:19.need to design it properly. He needs to get his feet under the table and

:06:20. > :06:24.then we will go ahead, design the review and do it. We were committed

:06:25. > :06:27.at the election to having a much more transparent public facing

:06:28. > :06:31.discussion about our place in the world and what our defence policy

:06:32. > :06:36.should be. It is important we designed it correctly before we set

:06:37. > :06:40.off on the part. You are a supporter of the Trident nuclear deterrent.

:06:41. > :06:46.Have you heard anything in the debate that has changed your mind or

:06:47. > :06:51.altered your view? Not at present, but I do not think it is surprising.

:06:52. > :06:57.There are very important and respectable views held on both sides

:06:58. > :07:01.of this argument. I do not think that simply setting them out without

:07:02. > :07:06.going through the process of review is likely to change anybody's mind.

:07:07. > :07:11.That is why we have got to get this right. I am not concerned about

:07:12. > :07:16.this. I think the review will be genuine. It is going to be a serious

:07:17. > :07:21.piece of work. It has to be. The Labour Party has had this policy of

:07:22. > :07:26.having an independent nuclear deterrent, every Labour government

:07:27. > :07:30.has had it. It is a moral confrontation between two different

:07:31. > :07:33.views of the world. You cannot do the numbers between a moral

:07:34. > :07:37.opposition to Trident and someone who believes that is the right

:07:38. > :07:42.thing. Some people take a moral view of this. Others take a more

:07:43. > :07:47.practical view. We still have to devise how we would defend our

:07:48. > :07:51.nation and how we would meet our obligations to other nations, with

:07:52. > :07:56.or without a nuclear deterrent. There is a lot of serious work that

:07:57. > :08:00.has to be done ahead of any decision about this and at present, of

:08:01. > :08:04.course, the Labour Party has a policy on this, it is very clear. It

:08:05. > :08:10.was rewritten rated and reinforced at our conference in Brighton. --

:08:11. > :08:14.reiterated. It is in favour of renewing the submarines. You are in

:08:15. > :08:18.a very strange position where you have a leader who has said clearly

:08:19. > :08:22.he would never press the button and Sir Nick Houghton expressed grave

:08:23. > :08:25.concerns of the military, what is the point of having a deterrent if

:08:26. > :08:31.everyone knows the new Prime Minister would never use it? It

:08:32. > :08:36.becomes a waste of money and ceases to be a deterrent. We have to

:08:37. > :08:41.explore ideas of deterrents. You have to convince him to change his

:08:42. > :08:46.mind, don't you? We have to have a process setting out fully the

:08:47. > :08:52.arguments on whether deterrents are effective, whether they work, it

:08:53. > :08:56.requires evidence and a lot of input from party members, from those

:08:57. > :08:59.affected by the decisions, not least our defence industry workers who

:09:00. > :09:06.build the submarines and are going to be building the submarines. I

:09:07. > :09:11.think we cannot do that without a serious long-term approach. It has

:09:12. > :09:15.taken the Government a year to do the Strategic Defence and Security

:09:16. > :09:22.Review will stop Whitehall started it in January -- Strategic Defence

:09:23. > :09:26.and Security Review. The idea the defence team could do a review in

:09:27. > :09:31.much less time than that is for the birds. How do you respond to Sir

:09:32. > :09:36.Nick Houghton when he says he would be gravely worried if this policy

:09:37. > :09:40.was translated into power? I understand the point he is making

:09:41. > :09:44.and it is a point I made myself one Jeremy said what he said. I said

:09:45. > :09:49.there are those who do not believe deterrence works. I am not one of

:09:50. > :09:53.them. I think Jeremy's point of view is about whether he believes in the

:09:54. > :09:59.effectiveness of deterrence. These are arguments we can have within the

:10:00. > :10:06.process of the defence review, a space to be discussed and debated

:10:07. > :10:10.and argued and conclusions to be formed in due course. You

:10:11. > :10:17.comfortable with the CDF being involved in this debate question I

:10:18. > :10:26.am comfortable with him being asked questions by journalists like you. I

:10:27. > :10:31.do not think there is anything like wrong with him at stressing himself.

:10:32. > :10:34.Everyone has to be open and make their arguments in front of the

:10:35. > :10:37.public but at the end of that, if you have a leader who is completely

:10:38. > :10:45.committed to never pressing the button, the whole thing is, in your

:10:46. > :10:49.words, is for the birds, is it? We have to go through the process and

:10:50. > :10:53.see what comes out. In the end, you have to persuade him you are right?

:10:54. > :10:58.Yes, I will be attempting to do that, we will base our decision on

:10:59. > :11:01.the outcomes of the review. The Labour Party has policy-making

:11:02. > :11:07.structures and we will feed our review into those structures and the

:11:08. > :11:11.great good sense of the Labour Party and its members and supporters will

:11:12. > :11:16.come to a conclusion in the end. Nobody really knows what it would be

:11:17. > :11:18.at this point. Could you be Secretary of State for Defence in

:11:19. > :11:25.the unilateralist Labour government? I am not a unilateral nuclear

:11:26. > :11:29.disarmament. I do not believe it works. I think I would find it

:11:30. > :11:34.difficult. But we are not there yet. We have a big process to go

:11:35. > :11:39.through. I think we should engage in that, in gauge the country in these

:11:40. > :11:44.discussions. For too long, these decisions have been taken behind

:11:45. > :11:49.closed doors. Agreed. Absolutely. Part of the reason Jeremy was

:11:50. > :11:53.elected was on the back of this sense, not just in the Labour Party,

:11:54. > :11:57.that people want a bigger say in decision-making in this country on

:11:58. > :12:02.big issues like this. At the end of this long process, what happens? The

:12:03. > :12:06.Labour Party has to come to a few, will there be a special conference?

:12:07. > :12:11.Do you think new members should be part of that? Should it be

:12:12. > :12:15.fundamentally for parliamentarians? It will be for the national policy

:12:16. > :12:20.forum. The reviews will feed into that. The national policy forum have

:12:21. > :12:26.an away day about the policy-making processes over the next few days.

:12:27. > :12:30.Lucky them! It will feed into processes and we will have an

:12:31. > :12:35.answer. Syria and the bombing of Syria is another big issue. Philip

:12:36. > :12:38.Hammond is waiting to see if he can persuade enough Labour MPs to

:12:39. > :12:43.support bombing in Syria to go back to the House of Commons for another

:12:44. > :12:47.vote. What will happen in your view on the Labour side? It would help if

:12:48. > :12:55.the Government came forward with proposals which they have not done.

:12:56. > :13:00.We have seen noise and brief -- briefings in the newspapers. There

:13:01. > :13:04.have been general briefings among backbench colleagues about the

:13:05. > :13:09.situation in Syria but nobody has come forward with proposals. We have

:13:10. > :13:12.been very clear. We will treat with the utmost seriousness any proposal

:13:13. > :13:16.the Government comes forward with on the situation in Syria, but they

:13:17. > :13:22.must tell us what the legal basis is, they must tell us the aims and

:13:23. > :13:26.objectives, what is hoped to be achieved by adding our planes to the

:13:27. > :13:31.60 countries already there engaged in action in Syria, what is the

:13:32. > :13:34.military advantage? We must come up with a process through the United

:13:35. > :13:38.Nations to make sure we can tackle the root cause of this problem which

:13:39. > :13:44.is the Civil War in Syria. Simon Fisher, a young enthusiastic

:13:45. > :13:48.socialist advising your leader, he appears to have advised people in a

:13:49. > :13:52.particular constituency to vote for class war rather than a Labour Party

:13:53. > :13:58.candidate and he has been suspended for that. Should he be fired? As far

:13:59. > :14:03.as I am aware, his suspension is an administrative suspension, whilst

:14:04. > :14:08.there is an investigation. It is not unusual. It does not carry with it

:14:09. > :14:13.any suggestion that he is guilty or not guilty. The NEC which is charged

:14:14. > :14:18.with doing these things, they have all of the fun, they have to

:14:19. > :14:22.investigate and they will do that, and at the end of that process, they

:14:23. > :14:30.will make a decision about his future. I re-christened him Simon

:14:31. > :14:34.Fisher. He is Andrew Fisher. A lot of people around the new leadership

:14:35. > :14:37.comes from, as it were, parts of the world to the left of the traditional

:14:38. > :14:43.Labour Party. Are you concerned there is too much of that already

:14:44. > :14:47.coming in? I think it is good new people are joining the Labour Party.

:14:48. > :14:52.For years, we have talked about increasing membership, 164,000 new

:14:53. > :14:57.members, I think that is important. We will have a lot of debates that

:14:58. > :15:10.perhaps will go wider now than in the past 20 years. If you are

:15:11. > :15:12.obdurate and confident politics matters and the Labour Party

:15:13. > :15:15.matters, you welcome these things, and I do. Maria Eagle, you have a

:15:16. > :15:20.fascinating few months ahead of you. Thank you for joining us today.

:15:21. > :15:24.Simon Russell Beale is regularly referred to as the leading actor

:15:25. > :15:29.A regular on our screens in everything

:15:30. > :15:33.He's back on stage in London's West End playing the leading actor

:15:34. > :15:48.There will be people out there who don't know about Samuel Foote. He

:15:49. > :15:53.knew everybody in London at the time. He had an extraordinary life.

:15:54. > :16:06.He set up a theatre that specialised in comedy. He was a satirist. Is it

:16:07. > :16:13.true he redid O'The low? -- Othello. He tried to do it and it was rubbish

:16:14. > :16:19.so he turned it into a comedy. He was great friends with Garrick, a

:16:20. > :16:25.great actor of his time. He had a bet which involved horse riding and

:16:26. > :16:31.he lost a leg. Mr Foote lost a foot. The leg had to be amputated? There

:16:32. > :16:36.is an unbearable moment on stage where that leg disappears. It is

:16:37. > :16:41.horrible. In the play, Ian Kelly, the writer, goes through in a lot of

:16:42. > :16:44.detail what it's like to amputate a leg without anaesthetic, of course.

:16:45. > :16:55.It is horrible to live through, even in your mind. He then very bravely

:16:56. > :17:01.went back on stage, unheard of at the time, but he became

:17:02. > :17:06.progressively more reckless in his tatter Calais tacks. Ended up

:17:07. > :17:13.attacking a woman for big ohmy, which was true. She went on trial, a

:17:14. > :17:18.very wealthy woman. She replied by accusing him of sodomy. A hanging

:17:19. > :17:26.offence at the time? Indeed. But he had the support of the king for a

:17:27. > :17:32.short period. He cross-dressed? He was an extraordinary man. An Oscar

:17:33. > :17:36.Wilde-style wit? A huge celebrity. The play is partly about celebrity?

:17:37. > :17:42.Yes. It's about a lot of thing. Stuffed with stuff actually. It may

:17:43. > :17:48.be slightly over-stuffed? A lot of things talked about. The celebrity

:17:49. > :17:53.thing, his main concern in the play is to be remembered actually. As he

:17:54. > :17:59.now is, of course? We is one of the delights of doings it, to resurrect

:18:00. > :18:05.him I I don't know why he was so forgotten? Perhaps being a comic. It

:18:06. > :18:08.is a wonderfully fun play. A lot of people will remember you most from

:18:09. > :18:09.Spooks where you are the Home Secretary.

:18:10. > :18:13.You've told me we can't risk letting that aircraft reach the mainland.

:18:14. > :18:15.Interceptors are making contact in 60 seconds.

:18:16. > :18:17.They're trying to force us to do it for them.

:18:18. > :18:22.The plane's in cloud cover, the fighters can't get

:18:23. > :18:25.a visual with the cockpit and they're still not responding.

:18:26. > :18:28.The men on board interfering with communications.

:18:29. > :18:33.But we have a non-response of aircraft in our airspace.

:18:34. > :18:39.How late can we issue the go code? We should fire now.

:18:40. > :18:45.How late, damn it? Six minutes but we'd risk debris striking land.

:18:46. > :18:57.Wow! Exciting, isn't it? Very. It's more complicated than that. Not that

:18:58. > :19:01.simple, the Home Secretary says, now we've heard Philip Hammond dodging

:19:02. > :19:07.various questions from time to time and answering others. Did you have

:19:08. > :19:13.more sympathy with the complexity of decision making? He didn't have much

:19:14. > :19:20.support from his political lieges in Spooks. All my scenes were with one

:19:21. > :19:26.actor, with Peter. I never saw the rest of the outfit. But the idea of,

:19:27. > :19:31.yes, I did have sympathy for him. The idea the pressures that man must

:19:32. > :19:36.have been under. The last time we talked was national poetry day. You

:19:37. > :19:43.did fantastic readings for us. That was a remarkable moment in a sense.

:19:44. > :19:50.You're reading some for us in a moment, but we don't celebrate our

:19:51. > :19:57.extraordinarily rich poetic culture. That hour I spent reading the 17th

:19:58. > :20:01.Century poetry with Michael Sharma, it was one of the most enjoyable

:20:02. > :20:06.hours I spent. The BBC should do more of this. Poetry year. British

:20:07. > :20:11.maths day. That's much more tough for me. We might do this entire

:20:12. > :20:16.programme in rhyming poetry. Marvellous. You're going to read one

:20:17. > :20:22.of the great war poems in a second. Do you read much poetry yourself?

:20:23. > :20:26.Yes. Not professionally. You have a slim volume at the side of the bed?

:20:27. > :20:32.I consider three shelves by the side of my bed. So have I. Snap. Good

:20:33. > :20:34.man. Thank you very much for joining us.

:20:35. > :20:37.Thanks to all my guests today on this special programme.

:20:38. > :20:40.Next week, we'll be joined by the man heading Labour's campaign

:20:41. > :20:45.and we'll talk and hear the blues with Lenny Henry.

:20:46. > :20:48.For more politics, join Andrew Neil and the Sunday Politics team

:20:49. > :20:52.at the later time of 12.25pm after the Service of National Remembrance

:20:53. > :20:58.We're going to leave you with some more poetry and some music.

:20:59. > :21:02.In a moment, the saxophonist Amy Dickson will play us out

:21:03. > :21:07.But first, Simon Russell Beale is going to read

:21:08. > :21:12.one of the most famous of all war poems, The Soldier by Rupert Brooke.

:21:13. > :21:20.If I should die, think only this of me:

:21:21. > :21:23.That there's some corner of a foreign field

:21:24. > :21:29.There shall be in that rich earth a richer dust concealed

:21:30. > :21:33.A dust whom England bore, shaped, made aware

:21:34. > :21:38.Gave, once, her flowers to love, her ways to roam

:21:39. > :21:41.A body of England's, breathing English air

:21:42. > :21:46.Washed by the rivers, blest by the suns of home.

:21:47. > :21:50.And think, this heart, all evil shed away

:21:51. > :21:58.Gives somewhere back the thoughts by England given

:21:59. > :22:02.Her sights and sounds; dreams happy as her day

:22:03. > :22:06.And laughter, learnt of friends; and gentleness

:22:07. > :22:14.In hearts at peace, under an English heaven.