:00:10. > :00:13.Amongst all the justified hubbub about the Syria vote, perhaps we
:00:14. > :00:17.haven't been looking closely enough at another of David Cameron's
:00:18. > :00:21.crises, the negotiations over Britain's future in Europe,
:00:22. > :00:38.increasingly difficult, increasingly fraught.
:00:39. > :00:44.Joining me this morning, the Cabinet's most prominent
:00:45. > :00:48.Eurosceptic, Iain Duncan Smith, plus Tristram Hunt, a key Labour
:00:49. > :00:57.moderate, on his new proposals for a major wealth tax that he says will
:00:58. > :01:02.make Britain fairer. And we have not won, but two of our
:01:03. > :01:08.greatest actors. Toby Jones on bankers and remaking Dad's Army. And
:01:09. > :01:13.David Morris, starring in the West End's most unlikely hit, a comedy
:01:14. > :01:16.about capital punishment. Plus, reviewing the newspapers, the former
:01:17. > :01:19.adviser to both the primary to anti-chancellor, tech entrepreneur
:01:20. > :01:23.Rohan Silva, the country's most prominent Labour supporting the
:01:24. > :01:29.list, the Guardian's Polly Toynbee and with the RAF in action over
:01:30. > :01:30.Syria, the Times' defence editor, David Haynes. First, the news with
:01:31. > :01:32.Roger Johnson. There is severe flooding
:01:33. > :01:34.across parts of Cumbria and southern Scotland this morning,
:01:35. > :01:37.with waters continuing to rise, and dozens of severe flood warnings
:01:38. > :01:39.still in place. Hundreds of homes
:01:40. > :01:41.and businesses have been evacuated, roads are underwater,
:01:42. > :01:43.and some towns have been cut off. In London, a 90-year-old man has
:01:44. > :01:46.died after being blown The Metropolitan Police are treating
:01:47. > :01:54.a knife attack at Leytonstone Underground station last
:01:55. > :02:03.night as a terrorist incident. A suspect was tasered by the police
:02:04. > :02:05.and arrested. One man is being treated for serious
:02:06. > :02:09.injuries after he was stabbed. Eyewitnesses said the attacker
:02:10. > :02:16.shouted "This is for Syria!" Visitors from outside the EU could
:02:17. > :02:22.face charges for some NHS services in England, such as blood tests,
:02:23. > :02:25.prescriptions and care in A The idea is part of a consultation
:02:26. > :02:28.which begins next week. But both the British Medical
:02:29. > :02:31.Association and the Royal College
:02:32. > :02:34.of GPs have already expressed Here's our health correspondent,
:02:35. > :02:39.Jane Dreaper. The Government wants
:02:40. > :02:41.a tougher stance on the use of the NHS by foreign migrants
:02:42. > :02:46.and visitors from outside Europe. These patients are already liable
:02:47. > :02:49.for the cost of planned hospital care. Recently,
:02:50. > :02:53.it emerged that ministers want to Now, a three-month consultation will
:02:54. > :03:00.also seek people's views about charging for some primary
:03:01. > :03:03.care, such as blood tests, Ministers think all these measures
:03:04. > :03:11.together could save ?500 million A health surcharge
:03:12. > :03:20.for overseas visitors has already The Government says GP and nurse
:03:21. > :03:24.consultations would remain free, and asylum seekers and refugees
:03:25. > :03:28.would be exempt from any charges. The Royal College of GPs says family
:03:29. > :03:34.doctors can't be expected to act as immigration control,
:03:35. > :03:39.and is concerned that charging for some services might deter
:03:40. > :03:46.patients from seeking medical help. President Obama will make
:03:47. > :03:49.a rare televised address from the Oval Office tonight, to warn
:03:50. > :03:52.that the United States is facing on the shooting of 14 people at San
:03:53. > :04:00.Bernardino in California, which is Overnight,
:04:01. > :04:05.FBI agents have raided a house Reports say
:04:06. > :04:09.the property belongs to a friend who's believed to have bought
:04:10. > :04:14.assault rifles used in the murders. France goes to the polls in regional
:04:15. > :04:18.elections today, just three weeks after Islamic State militants
:04:19. > :04:21.attacked Paris, killing 130 people. Some opinion polls suggest
:04:22. > :04:26.the far-right National Front will make gains, especially in the
:04:27. > :04:28.economically depressed north-east, where the party's leader,
:04:29. > :04:31.Marine Le Pen, is a candidate. A state of emergency is still
:04:32. > :04:34.in place and ballots will be cast I'll be back with the headlines
:04:35. > :04:41.just before ten o'clock. Now to the papers, and with me to
:04:42. > :05:01.review the papers are Rohan Silva, It is interesting how quickly the
:05:02. > :05:05.papers can remake their front pages. The Sunday Telegraph have
:05:06. > :05:21.gone with the tube attack in London. There have also been a lot
:05:22. > :05:29.of whether stories. And the Labour Party's war. Corbyn critics fear
:05:30. > :05:32.revenge reshuffle. There is a suggestion that Hilary Benn might be
:05:33. > :05:38.booted into another world. We will talk about that later. Sunday Times,
:05:39. > :05:42.the RAF launching a round-the-clock blitz on Isis. And some good news on
:05:43. > :05:47.a front page - it says greenhouse gases are falling. And in the
:05:48. > :05:52.Scotland on Sunday, William Macca Valley, a great Scottish writer, has
:05:53. > :06:00.died. I remember sharing a bottle of whiskey with him, as remembering it
:06:01. > :06:05.would be a lie. We will start with the knife attack in Leytonstone.
:06:06. > :06:09.Terrible news of a lone knifeman in east London, Leytonstone Station,
:06:10. > :06:16.last night. What is terrifying here is the echoes with the Paris attack
:06:17. > :06:22.recently. The cry of "this is for Syria" that the knifeman is said to
:06:23. > :06:27.have yelled is the same cry that the gunman yelled in the Bataclan before
:06:28. > :06:31.opening fire at that concert. Also some echoes with the Lee Rigby
:06:32. > :06:35.murder, the last terrorist incident. All we know for now is
:06:36. > :06:40.that it was an individual with a relatively ordinary night. A very
:06:41. > :06:45.easy thing to do -- an ordinary knife. Hard for the security
:06:46. > :06:49.services to get on top of that. Very scary, this kind of lone wolf
:06:50. > :06:55.attack. In the aftermath last night, Scotland Yard said more terrorist
:06:56. > :07:02.attacks are likely, which is obviously frightening. And this is
:07:03. > :07:06.taking place after the RAF launching a round the clock blitz on Isis,
:07:07. > :07:12.which is based on Mr Fallon giving a briefing to people in Cyprus. Yes,
:07:13. > :07:17.he went out to RAF Akrotiri, the base from which we are spearheading
:07:18. > :07:22.our air war against Islamic State. He gave an interview to the Sunday
:07:23. > :07:29.Times in which he talks about the ramping up of our mission against
:07:30. > :07:36.Isis to five missions a day, compared to only one day previously.
:07:37. > :07:42.The language being used about this concerns me. It is really buys'
:07:43. > :07:45.toys, gung ho. Like I commando comic rather than a newspaper sometimes,
:07:46. > :07:50.with all those pictures and graphs of where the bombs are going to
:07:51. > :07:55.fall. It is a shame. It is that simply stick thing that people can
:07:56. > :07:58.understand -- that simply stick thing. You have heard Michael Fallon
:07:59. > :08:03.using the language of a second Battle of Britain, which is nonsense
:08:04. > :08:07.in terms of the number of aircraft we are using. Yes, it is an
:08:08. > :08:13.important part of the mission, but it is only part of it. Remind us how
:08:14. > :08:18.many aircraft we are using? We did have eight Tornado jets. Not all
:08:19. > :08:22.eight of them are flying. At least a couple will be on maintenance. Since
:08:23. > :08:28.the vote on Wednesday, we have flown out six typhoons jets, the newer
:08:29. > :08:32.version. It is not like 1940. Polly, we would normally be talking about
:08:33. > :08:35.this all the way through the paper review, but the Labour Party has
:08:36. > :08:40.gathered lots of front-page stories of its own. You have the Observer
:08:41. > :08:47.and the reshuffle story. Yes, Corbyn critics fear revenge reshuffle.
:08:48. > :08:51.There is a lot of agitation going on, with people there in that there
:08:52. > :08:56.will be retaliation against them. A lot of people voted for the Syria
:08:57. > :09:01.action and are finding themselves abused and are blaming the Momentum
:09:02. > :09:06.movement, which is plainly organising a lot of it, even if the
:09:07. > :09:10.top people say otherwise. There is a danger of them right wolf in that
:09:11. > :09:14.real attacks may come and they may start getting deselected, and they
:09:15. > :09:18.are all being slightly wimpy about somebody being a bit rude to them.
:09:19. > :09:23.You only have to look at what people write under our columns and feel
:09:24. > :09:28.they are bigger little bit wimpish. Oh, dear, I am being abused. We are
:09:29. > :09:33.all abused and threatened in social media. You were in the eye of the
:09:34. > :09:38.storm during the rise of the SDP and the original Bennite movement. Is
:09:39. > :09:41.this familiar to you? It is amazingly familiar. When you see the
:09:42. > :09:46.Momentum people, people I thought they were dead have come out of
:09:47. > :09:49.their graves, actual people from the old militants days. I don't know
:09:50. > :09:54.where they have been all these years. But not in the Labour Party.
:09:55. > :10:00.And the Momentum movement is a party within a party. They are organising
:10:01. > :10:03.events inside Labour held constituencies without telling the
:10:04. > :10:11.MP, even when the MP did and vote for action in Syria. This is about
:10:12. > :10:13.MPs who don't have a likelihood of forming the next government soon. On
:10:14. > :10:19.the other hand, there is a real fight inside the Tory party. Yeah,
:10:20. > :10:25.there is an interview with Justin Greening -- Justine Greening, a
:10:26. > :10:29.senior cabinet member who is very strongly opposed to Heathrow, as is
:10:30. > :10:35.Boris Johnson, the Mayor of London. At the same time, 30 Tory MPs have
:10:36. > :10:41.signed a letter calling for Heathrow. So there is tension in the
:10:42. > :10:46.party. Zac Goldsmith, the Tory candidate for mayor, the government
:10:47. > :10:52.is obviously keen that he wins. So what that will mean for the Heathrow
:10:53. > :10:59.decision, we don't know. Give us your instinct on that? If you were
:11:00. > :11:02.watching closely last week, a Parliamentary committee published a
:11:03. > :11:06.report on the environmental impact of a new runway at Heathrow. That
:11:07. > :11:13.gives the government permission potentially to delay this decision
:11:14. > :11:17.until after May 2016, when the London mayoral election has taken
:11:18. > :11:21.place. So there is a chance that it will be delayed. I can think of lots
:11:22. > :11:25.of people watching in Scotland saying, you are talking about
:11:26. > :11:29.Heathrow, you are not put the about the Forth Road Bridge. Let's go back
:11:30. > :11:35.to Debra. Lots of interesting interviews in today's paper, not
:11:36. > :11:42.least with Mr Assad of Syria. Yes, the Sunday Times' reporter has done
:11:43. > :11:46.a number of interviews with Bashar al-Assad during their nearly
:11:47. > :11:50.five-year civil war. It gives the other face to this and underlines
:11:51. > :11:58.the competitions and the fact that it is so much more than a bombing
:11:59. > :12:01.campaign. Mr Assad calls Britain's bombing actions illegal. The
:12:02. > :12:05.interview did happen before the vote on Wednesday, but assume the vote
:12:06. > :12:10.would go the way it did. Talk us through the highlights of this
:12:11. > :12:14.interview. He claims that Europe rather than Syria has become the
:12:15. > :12:23.incubated for the terrorism that is threatening the West. So we are
:12:24. > :12:27.sending him the terrorists? We are creating the problem for ourselves.
:12:28. > :12:32.He is also scathing about the 70,000 figure which was a key part of David
:12:33. > :12:37.Cameron's argument when he put his case to Parliament for extending
:12:38. > :12:43.Britain's air strikes in Syria. He said, where are the 70,000 moderates
:12:44. > :12:49.he is talking about? There is no 70,000, there is no 7000. Obviously,
:12:50. > :12:58.there are lots of countries involved in Syria, and he says Russia is the
:12:59. > :13:01.only one helping. He talks about how he personally wrote to President
:13:02. > :13:05.Putin to ask him to get involved, and he does not rule out the idea of
:13:06. > :13:10.Russian troops being put on the ground, which would be a big
:13:11. > :13:15.development. So we would have the RAF protecting Russian troops. That
:13:16. > :13:19.would be new. Polly, I was talking about David Cameron's new problem
:13:20. > :13:25.being over Europe. There is a piece and the Mail On Sunday. Very
:13:26. > :13:30.interesting. It looks as if Cameron is telling people that he might go
:13:31. > :13:37.for Brexit. If he doesn't get what he wants, particularly on the
:13:38. > :13:42.question of benefits, he could lead the campaign to take us out. The
:13:43. > :13:44.Tory party is as crazy as the Labour Party at the moment. The
:13:45. > :13:49.Eurosceptics running the anti-European campaign say, we don't
:13:50. > :13:52.want Cameron on our side. They are bonkers. They say they want Boris,
:13:53. > :13:58.but if they get Cameron on their side, the danger for those of us who
:13:59. > :14:03.are extremely worried about staying in Europe is that Cameron could
:14:04. > :14:09.swing it. It is a really frightening moment. Rohan Silva, what is your
:14:10. > :14:14.instinct about Cameron? Could he do this? The Prime Minister will be
:14:15. > :14:17.delivering a big speech tomorrow about delivering on an investor
:14:18. > :14:21.commitments. The reason they are giving that speech is that their
:14:22. > :14:23.internal polling suggests that the public is concerned that the
:14:24. > :14:29.government doesn't have an effective opposition and therefore are not
:14:30. > :14:33.being scrutinised enough. There is opposition, it is just inside the
:14:34. > :14:38.Tory party. You know this man well. Could you see him leading a campaign
:14:39. > :14:43.to take us out of Europe? And effectively go shish and strategy in
:14:44. > :14:47.business or in government is one in which you say you are willing to
:14:48. > :14:51.walk away. We are seeing negotiation happening. No one could have
:14:52. > :14:54.predicted during the beginning of this call for renegotiation that
:14:55. > :15:01.there would also be a migrant crisis, a terror crisis. The Euro
:15:02. > :15:05.crisis was already in play. Britain is at the bottom of that list of
:15:06. > :15:08.crises. I am surprised they don't throw us out, because we are
:15:09. > :16:14.behaving so badly at a time of real crisis for Europe. This is beginning
:16:15. > :16:17.to change the mood. There are suggestions that Obama, once he
:16:18. > :16:24.steps down, might campaign on the issue of the arming America --
:16:25. > :16:27.disarming America. But will it make people realise how dangerous it is
:16:28. > :16:34.to have these lax rules about arms, or will it make people want to be
:16:35. > :16:38.more armed? We don't talk enough about business stories on this paper
:16:39. > :16:44.review. S now has a story about Tata Steel. And Polly, you have a story
:16:45. > :16:49.about Cadbury. Yes. People were upset when Cadbury was taken over by
:16:50. > :16:52.Kraft Foods in 2010. The government, Labour at the time, said
:16:53. > :16:56.there was nothing they could do about it. Kraft Foods promised they
:16:57. > :17:00.would fire people. They fired huge amounts of people and closed a lot
:17:01. > :17:05.of facilities. Now it turns out they are not paying tax on ?2 billion
:17:06. > :17:09.worth of earnings they are making here. They have an elaborate deal
:17:10. > :17:15.with the Channel Islands, another of these tax swivels, and they are
:17:16. > :17:19.paying virtually no tax. This is a shocker. We could stop it
:17:20. > :17:26.immediately. By thinking about which chocolate bars we buy. Don't buy
:17:27. > :17:31.Cadbury 's. Finally? Hopefully, some good news for Christmas.
:17:32. > :17:38.Scunthorpe's steelworks, owned by Tata Steel, there was talk of it
:17:39. > :17:41.closing. Apparently, three bidders have emerged for that. A lot will
:17:42. > :17:49.depend on what they decide to do with it, but the hope is that the
:17:50. > :17:54.steelworks will continue to stay open. Thanks to all of you.
:17:55. > :18:02.It has been a wet and windy weekend. Will it continue? When we'll stormed
:18:03. > :18:07.Desmond blow over? Over to Philip Avery.
:18:08. > :18:12.Without further ado, let me show you the centre of Storm Desmond, which
:18:13. > :18:16.never was that close. My finger is touching Iceland, the centre moving
:18:17. > :18:20.to Scandinavia. It is the trailing portion of the weather front that
:18:21. > :18:23.has brought the wet and windy weather to so many parts of the
:18:24. > :18:28.British Isles. The bit we are interested in is now clear of
:18:29. > :18:36.Cumbria. It is slumping towards the Midlands. Drier conditions following
:18:37. > :18:40.behind. Gusty showers, with snow across Scotland. Mild air trapped in
:18:41. > :18:50.the south. What will not change rapidly is the severe flood warning
:18:51. > :18:55.count. Just when you thought you had seen the last of that weather front,
:18:56. > :19:00.the western portion returned. But two things. It is on the move, and
:19:01. > :19:06.nowhere near the intensity of rainfall. Five to ten millimetres
:19:07. > :19:10.widely, rather than 200 or 300. And it will gradually move through the
:19:11. > :19:14.north of England, up through southern Scotland on its way to the
:19:15. > :19:19.north of Scotland. Following behind for Monday, a lot more dry weather
:19:20. > :19:26.is the encouraging acid. And mild as well. A word to the wise. Over the
:19:27. > :19:32.front is gradually sweeping back through the flood affected areas.
:19:33. > :19:35.But again, at its worst, it will only produce 30 to 40 millimetres
:19:36. > :19:40.across the high ground of northern England.
:19:41. > :19:43.David Morrissey is a pretty constant presence on stage
:19:44. > :19:45.and television, from Shakespearean roles to Gordon Brown.
:19:46. > :19:50.He's been on the frontline of the refugee crisis with the UN.
:19:51. > :19:53.His latest play is about the last British hangmen
:19:54. > :20:04.I'd have been happy to hang some Germans, I would have been chuffed.
:20:05. > :20:07.I never liked them before the war, never mind during, the accent alone.
:20:08. > :20:14.I were asked, first time around, around Nuremberg,
:20:15. > :20:18.but I was still a part-time bookie then and it coincided with Grand
:20:19. > :20:21.I probably should have gone, I fobbed them off,
:20:22. > :20:25.She probably was, she always is, but they never called me back
:20:26. > :20:36.Well, there was something going on in Grand National week that we do
:20:37. > :20:41.not hear about in that particular clip as well. When I see it is
:20:42. > :20:46.darkly comic, it is very dark and very comic, a strange subject for
:20:47. > :20:52.what is essentially a social comedy. Your character is based on two
:20:53. > :20:58.different hangmen, the web brothers. Harry Allen and a guy called Stephen
:20:59. > :21:07.weighed. Excuse me. He combines those two characters. We all have
:21:08. > :21:10.rivalries in life. He has this absolutely agonising rivalry with
:21:11. > :21:17.Albert Pierrepoint two is the most famous hangman. They cannot really
:21:18. > :21:21.stand it. Yes, he hates Pierrepoint. Everyone knows Pierrepoint, so when
:21:22. > :21:30.he says he is a hangman, everybody brings up your point. -- Albert
:21:31. > :21:35.Pierrepoint. The play takes place on the day that hanging is abolished,
:21:36. > :21:41.so it is the day that Harry loses his status. He runs his own pub.
:21:42. > :21:46.People come in and out and so on. It is very funny, but lots of critics
:21:47. > :21:53.have said it is incredibly politically incorrect. It is set in
:21:54. > :21:59.1965. It is off its time. Scottish people, women, they all get it in
:22:00. > :22:21.the neck. Yes, but it is off its time. Martin's rating is
:22:22. > :22:24.provocative. It is about presenting those people the way they should be.
:22:25. > :22:26.It is shocking but funny. Giving the subject, a great deal of laughter,
:22:27. > :22:28.even at the beginning when someone is hanged on stage, people are
:22:29. > :22:31.roaring with laughter. It is unsettling. It is a shocking thing
:22:32. > :22:34.to see. It is state murder. People laugh out of the shock of it. I do
:22:35. > :22:37.not think people laugh in ridicule way. I think they find it unnerving.
:22:38. > :22:40.You have done lots of work with the United Nations. You went to southern
:22:41. > :22:47.Europe to help with the refugee crisis yourself. You got your hands,
:22:48. > :22:54.if not dirty, at least wet. I went to Lesbos and I saw the crisis
:22:55. > :22:59.first-hand. As we know, tens of thousands of people are arriving in
:23:00. > :23:07.Europe every week, practically. We see the pictures. It is really hard
:23:08. > :23:14.to talk about this without being very upset about it. This is a real
:23:15. > :23:20.humanitarian crisis happening on our doorstep. I do feel that Europe
:23:21. > :23:23.needs to come together in some way to be able to help these people who
:23:24. > :23:32.are running away from the very people we see who are in Paris and
:23:33. > :23:37.Beirut. Murderous people that we see first hand. These people are trying
:23:38. > :23:41.to escape those people. In the maelstrom that is going on, it is
:23:42. > :23:47.important for us to try to keep hold of our own humanity for our fellow
:23:48. > :23:50.man. I know you have been a long-time supporter of the Labour
:23:51. > :23:59.Party. What are your reflections after the vote about Jeremy
:24:00. > :24:04.Corbyn's position, as leader, Andy Reid action to the vote. My worry is
:24:05. > :24:13.the repercussions for people who voted for the air strikes. It seems
:24:14. > :24:17.very split, lots of bullying within the party. There needs to be a
:24:18. > :24:24.united front within the party. It is in a terrible state. The Labour
:24:25. > :24:25.Party. It is hard to see how it gets out of this. David Morrissey, thank
:24:26. > :24:28.you for speaking to us. Tristram Hunt was one of several
:24:29. > :24:30.high profile figures in the Labour party, who left the front bench
:24:31. > :24:33.when Jeremy Corbyn became leader. "It is important to be honest about
:24:34. > :24:36.it. I have substantial political
:24:37. > :24:38.differences with Jeremy." We've not heard a great deal
:24:39. > :24:40.from him since. But's he's giving a big speech
:24:41. > :24:48.on tackling inequality tomorrow Good morning. You talk in this
:24:49. > :24:53.speech about moral outrage, about inequality and poverty in this
:24:54. > :24:58.country. IAG suggesting that in the past labour governments have not had
:24:59. > :25:02.of that. There has always been moral outrage about inequality. That is
:25:03. > :25:06.the purpose of the Labour Party who came into being to promote social
:25:07. > :25:10.mobility. The message of my speech tomorrow is that the nature of
:25:11. > :25:14.inequality is changing and as the nature changes, we need new tools
:25:15. > :25:18.and policies to deal with that. What do you mean that the nature of
:25:19. > :25:26.inequality is changing? We cannot focus on income inequality any more.
:25:27. > :25:30.We also have to think about family, community, culture, the
:25:31. > :25:35.opportunities that young people have to fulfil their potential above and
:25:36. > :25:39.beyond material poverty. It is about ladders, the accumulation of
:25:40. > :25:43.capital. People have lots of money tied up in the houses and you're
:25:44. > :25:47.proposing a new wealth tax? I want to see a tax system which reflects
:25:48. > :25:52.the great concentrations of wealth we are seeing in assets,
:25:53. > :25:56.particularly in property. I would get rid of the council tax system
:25:57. > :26:01.and have a new property tax based on the value of the property. I am not
:26:02. > :26:06.interested in taxing for the sake of tax. It is what you do with it, and
:26:07. > :26:12.I want to tackle inequality at root, to focus on quality, universal
:26:13. > :26:17.childcare, technical and vocational education, the mental health of
:26:18. > :26:24.mothers, to do all those things that we noble tackle and disadvantage. At
:26:25. > :26:30.the moment, by the age of seven, 80% of the attainment rate for GCSEs is
:26:31. > :26:34.already set in stone. We have to challenge that, that is what the
:26:35. > :26:38.Labour Party is about. David said quite rightly that the Labour Party
:26:39. > :26:44.needs to get together, show some unity, and tackle inequality. This
:26:45. > :26:48.attack on inequality is very centralised. You're taking away from
:26:49. > :26:52.local authorities one of their last real powers, to lead the council
:26:53. > :26:59.tax, and making it a centralised tax. That is one problem. I am a
:27:00. > :27:02.great supporter of evolution and having more a tonne in May over
:27:03. > :27:07.business rates for councils. We have to make sure that councils, as they
:27:08. > :27:13.do in America, most OECD countries have this system of taxation, and
:27:14. > :27:17.they have a very devolved model of city and regional governance. People
:27:18. > :27:22.will say, here we go again, back to the mansion tax which did not do
:27:23. > :27:27.well for the Labour Party at the last election. This is a class envy
:27:28. > :27:33.tax. It is fine to have moral outrage and be the anti-austerity
:27:34. > :27:38.party, but you have to win over lots of people who are not pure, but who
:27:39. > :27:42.feel it is their duty to pay something back. That is the other
:27:43. > :27:47.message of my speech. When we talk about inequality, it cannot be
:27:48. > :27:52.hammering the top 1%. We need to think about how inequality affects
:27:53. > :27:57.the totality of society. People did not like the mansion tax because it
:27:58. > :28:03.seemed very arbitrary and unfair. This ?2 million hit, what is and is
:28:04. > :28:07.not an mansion. We need to have a progressive property tax. At the
:28:08. > :28:11.moment council tax. At the moment council taxes very regressive for
:28:12. > :28:16.those in the poorest areas, and it is generous for those in property is
:28:17. > :28:22.worth ?5 million. It is not just tax for the sake of it, it is what you
:28:23. > :28:26.do with the money. Over the course of the 20th century, taxation began
:28:27. > :28:31.focusing on wealth and assets. We have focused more and more on income
:28:32. > :28:36.tax and national insurance. We need to go back to wealth and assets.
:28:37. > :28:40.That is more progressive. That is where I disagree with the front
:28:41. > :28:45.bench because I am not interested in picking the top rate of income tax
:28:46. > :28:49.up to 50p. I am interested in tackling inequality. To what extent
:28:50. > :28:54.is this also a tactical move? We keep being told in the papers there
:28:55. > :28:58.are two Michael Labour Party is, Jeremy Corbyn's Labour Party with
:28:59. > :29:02.the leadership and a mass movement behind him, and the moderate right
:29:03. > :29:07.wing Labour Party, by and large the MPs. This feels like an olive branch
:29:08. > :29:13.from your side of the party towards the other side? All parties are
:29:14. > :29:18.broad churches in one way or another. In the Labour Party, we
:29:19. > :29:24.need to have intellectual and political renewal. We have lost two
:29:25. > :29:28.general elections. We have not made a radical, exciting case for why
:29:29. > :29:33.people want to vote labour and why it will make Britain be a better
:29:34. > :29:37.place to live and grow up. You are saying, I am Tristram Hunt, I am not
:29:38. > :29:43.a right-winger, this is what I believe? This is radical politics,
:29:44. > :29:48.what the Labour Party is about. As David said, the Labour Party has
:29:49. > :29:53.been looking to internally recently. Who is in, who is out? We were
:29:54. > :29:59.founded to tackle inequality. We need to get back to that. As the
:30:00. > :30:03.nature of inequality changes, we need different responses. You voted
:30:04. > :30:09.with the government on Syria. What kind of personal response did you
:30:10. > :30:12.get? I have had a mixed response from constituents and party members.
:30:13. > :30:18.Some were supportive and others would impose -- opposed. In my local
:30:19. > :30:22.party, the majority were opposed to that decision. On Friday, we will
:30:23. > :30:28.have a discussion about that. Have you had a lot of personal abuse,
:30:29. > :30:33.your family threatened, anything like that? No. There have been some
:30:34. > :30:37.pretty ugly comments on Facebook but we can take those as politicians.
:30:38. > :30:42.Polly is right, we need to have an active debate, but when you do get
:30:43. > :30:47.members of Parliament having to call in police protection to their
:30:48. > :30:51.family, we have crossed a line. Some of the ugly comments around the Stop
:30:52. > :30:56.The War Coalition, they have been very responsible with their language
:30:57. > :31:00.and activities, picketing Labour Party headquarters while we were
:31:01. > :31:05.trying to fight for the baulk by election -- Oldham by-election. The
:31:06. > :31:10.leader said there will be no hiding place for a people like you who
:31:11. > :31:15.voted with the government. We should all be open and accountable about
:31:16. > :31:18.which way we vote. That is about modern politics. One of the
:31:19. > :31:23.advantages of digital democracy is that people can get in touch with
:31:24. > :31:29.you to express their views. One of the downsides is that people lose
:31:30. > :31:32.some of their arrest of their arrest evasions. What is your message to
:31:33. > :31:37.the party generally about the tone of this debate?
:31:38. > :31:43.We have to have a much more respectful tone about differences
:31:44. > :31:47.within the party. Every time Jeremy says we need a gentler, kinder kind
:31:48. > :31:53.of politics, we have outrage from some parts the party. Let me ask you
:31:54. > :31:55.about one of the story which has been in the papers, which is the
:31:56. > :31:59.possibility of a reshuffle on the back of a very good by-election
:32:00. > :32:03.result for Jeremy Corbyn. It is now being suggested that he might use
:32:04. > :32:06.this opportunity to remove some of his critics, notably Hilary Benn
:32:07. > :32:10.from firstly, let's pay tribute to Jim
:32:11. > :32:17.McMahon. He is just the kind of mainstream MP
:32:18. > :32:30.we want in Westminster. You want lots of people from
:32:31. > :32:37.different parts of the party. I would go back to my message, which
:32:38. > :32:41.is that rather than who is up or down, let's focus on what is
:32:42. > :32:47.important, challenging inequality. That is what the Labour Party is
:32:48. > :32:51.about. What frustrates people are the divisions. You will join us at
:32:52. > :32:53.the end of the programme, but for now, thank you very much.
:32:54. > :32:55.Toby Jones is one of the most in-demand actors around.
:32:56. > :32:58.His next two leading roles, one on the big screen, one on the small,
:32:59. > :33:01.see him playing very different members of the banking profession.
:33:02. > :33:03.In the Dad's Army movie next year, he'll be starring alongside
:33:04. > :33:05.Bill Nighy and Michael Gambon, reinterpreting that iconic
:33:06. > :33:11.Currently, he's starring in BBC One's major new drama Capital,
:33:12. > :33:14.based on John Lanchester's acclaimed book.
:33:15. > :33:17.In the series, Jones plays an investment banker
:33:18. > :33:23.facing marital strife and financial meltdown.
:33:24. > :33:34.I think evil bankers have been done to death.
:33:35. > :33:36.I'm not sure they need dramatising much more.
:33:37. > :33:39.I think they are already a kind of stock type.
:33:40. > :33:44.I think the banker that is in John's book is a banker who is slightly
:33:45. > :33:51.He belongs to, or can relate to an earlier culture of bankers,
:33:52. > :33:55.when there was at least a residual honour.
:33:56. > :34:00.But that has all gone, and the banks are being run by mathematicians.
:34:01. > :34:12.You would be surprised how little ?1 million actually covers these days.
:34:13. > :34:15.Conrad's school fees, the nannies, your car, my car, the family car,
:34:16. > :34:19.Weekend house, the extension on the weekend house,
:34:20. > :34:27.Slate tiles, kitchen, the extension, the basement,
:34:28. > :34:33.Name one of those things that isn't absolutely essential?
:34:34. > :34:36.So he's effectively the boss of people he doesn't really
:34:37. > :34:40.understand and is under threat from them as a result.
:34:41. > :34:45.That makes him an interesting character to play.
:34:46. > :34:48.Not only is that going on, but there's a sense that money is
:34:49. > :34:52.not delivering the promised pleasure and happiness and contentment.
:34:53. > :34:57.It just sometimes feels as though the bonus has already been
:34:58. > :35:14.but a lecture on thrift does not constitute foreplay.
:35:15. > :35:22.To what extent is this a full-frontal attack
:35:23. > :35:27.There he is, leafing through the brochures for his next lavish
:35:28. > :35:30.house abroad and so forth, and there is an enormous amount of talk
:35:31. > :35:32.about new kitchens and extensions and basements,
:35:33. > :35:35.very familiar to a lot of people living in London now.
:35:36. > :35:37.I don't know if it is an attack on that.
:35:38. > :35:42.I think what John has written is more of a state of the nation,
:35:43. > :35:45.in which he says this is what people talk about.
:35:46. > :35:48.This is the lingua franca of a certain class.
:35:49. > :35:51.It is how couples relate to each other, through objects
:35:52. > :35:55.and the purchase of objects and the redecoration of houses.
:35:56. > :36:00.When you show it in a drama, the emptiness and the slight sadness
:36:01. > :36:08.And in the end, your bonus is not all that you hope.
:36:09. > :36:12.It is a mere 30,000 - in your world, nothing.
:36:13. > :36:19.When I went to speak to a banker at Credit Suisse about bonus time,
:36:20. > :36:24.he said that John's account of what happened is entirely true.
:36:25. > :36:30.The emotions of the moment at which a bonus is given and accepted, he
:36:31. > :36:36.said that these meetings are often highly charged emotional affairs,
:36:37. > :36:41.where people lose it, and then they move into a second stage
:36:42. > :36:43.where a phone call is made and even a third stage where
:36:44. > :36:49.People calm down and accept the numbers for what they are.
:36:50. > :36:53.These are people who define their numbers by numbers, so
:36:54. > :36:57.The other big project you are involved in is a film remake
:36:58. > :37:05.Apart from anything else, in terms of leading with
:37:06. > :37:08.your chin and setting yourself up for a big fall, I can't think of
:37:09. > :37:12.It's a totally foolhardy career move.
:37:13. > :37:19.When the idea was first mooted and they said
:37:20. > :37:21."We're thinking about making a movie,
:37:22. > :37:25."we think you are perfect casting", I said,
:37:26. > :37:27."Fantastic. I would love to hear about it".
:37:28. > :37:30.Then they told me it was Dad's Army.
:37:31. > :37:32.Any sensible person would say goodbye at that moment,
:37:33. > :37:37.because you're not really dealing with a drama or comedy any more,
:37:38. > :37:49.you're dealing with a national institution.
:37:50. > :37:56.I like to think that if we met, we would both be the richer for it.
:37:57. > :38:06.Arthur Lowe is my only reference to the character.
:38:07. > :38:09.I did watch, obviously, loads of his portrayal.
:38:10. > :38:18.But I think the pragmatics of film-making are that scenes are shot
:38:19. > :38:23.at such a rate that after a while, you're no longer Arthur Lowe.
:38:24. > :38:25.You are my version of Captain Mainwaring
:38:26. > :38:30.The jackboot will not tread upon this hallowed land
:38:31. > :38:41.We have talked about a big new film coming out, and a big TV series.
:38:42. > :38:53.I suppose as an actor, you're not hoping for moments,
:38:54. > :38:56.you're hoping for a sustained engagement with a series
:38:57. > :39:00.of projects for the rest of your life.
:39:01. > :39:04.We want a great Toby Jones moment, followed by a crash and burn,
:39:05. > :39:10.I am looking into addiction next year,
:39:11. > :39:17.and adultery the year after and a sequence of events.
:39:18. > :39:20.If you watch this space, we will get the peaks and troughs you're
:39:21. > :39:25.And you can see Toby Jones in the final episode of Capital
:39:26. > :39:31.Well, as we've been hearing, David Cameron says he's fighting
:39:32. > :39:33.like mad to secure a new deal or Britain in Europe
:39:34. > :39:37.but there are growing suspicions that he's fighting and losing.
:39:38. > :39:40.So where does this leave the Tories over our EU membership?
:39:41. > :39:44.One of the government's most outspoken Brussels-sceptics is
:39:45. > :39:46.Iain Duncan Smith, the Welfare Secretary, who was also at the
:39:47. > :39:55.centre of recent controversies over tax credits and the Welfare Bill.
:39:56. > :40:01.If the papers are not entirely wrong, it has been a rough few weeks
:40:02. > :40:07.for negotiations on Europe. They have been put off until next year.
:40:08. > :40:13.What is the mood like? The mood is actually very good. I am involved in
:40:14. > :40:16.putting together the package that the Prime Minister wants to take to
:40:17. > :40:20.the council, so we have been in discussion about that. The Prime
:40:21. > :40:23.Minister has been clear that he wants to take a package that
:40:24. > :40:28.supports the manifesto commitment. So in my area, on welfare, he wants
:40:29. > :40:32.to have that commitment to people living here and contributing to the
:40:33. > :40:39.system. That would be one of the key elements. A 4 year moratorium if you
:40:40. > :40:45.are a worker from outside the EU if you come to Britain, you don't get
:40:46. > :40:48.any benefits for four years? Yes, most people listening would be
:40:49. > :40:52.thinking, if you have not been in the UK, why should you be able to
:40:53. > :40:57.walk in and select which country you go to for the benefit you receive?
:40:58. > :41:03.This would bring an end to the idea of what we call benefit tourism. We
:41:04. > :41:05.do not mind people working, we mind people claiming off British
:41:06. > :41:11.taxpayers for things they don't deserve. Is this the acid test of
:41:12. > :41:15.these negotiations? There are a lot of things in these negotiations. Is
:41:16. > :41:19.this crucial? Well, the Prime Minister has made it crucial to
:41:20. > :41:24.himself in the sense that he has always talked about it. During the
:41:25. > :41:27.newspaper reviews, I noticed that Rohan Silva made it clear that the
:41:28. > :41:31.Prime Minister is making a speech reminding the Conservatives that we
:41:32. > :41:35.were elected on a manifesto, and we need to deliver on that, regardless
:41:36. > :41:39.of the state of the opposition. And the manifesto commitments were clear
:41:40. > :41:42.on this. I am a little surprised about the newspaper articles today,
:41:43. > :41:47.because I think the Prime Minister has been clear from the start that
:41:48. > :41:50.he wants to deliver what he said he would deliver at the time of the
:41:51. > :41:53.election. There is also a suggestion that if he doesn't get what he
:41:54. > :41:58.wants, he would be prepared to lead the outcome paying, which to a lot
:41:59. > :42:03.of people watching seems incredible. I always take articles written about
:42:04. > :42:08.these things with a pinch of salt. I do know that the Prime Minister has
:42:09. > :42:13.made it clear from the beginning that he was not prepared, and he
:42:14. > :42:21.said this before, to come back with a deal that he did not think would
:42:22. > :42:25.deliver on his commitments. He has been after reforming the European
:42:26. > :42:28.Union, changing things in the welfare area and making sure we get
:42:29. > :42:35.a much better system in Europe for us as well as for the rest of the
:42:36. > :42:40.European Union. I was in Germany not long ago and I have spoken to the
:42:41. > :42:46.French. Behind closed doors, almost every developed country in Europe
:42:47. > :42:48.wants to see some kind of end to the idea of people just popping around
:42:49. > :42:53.and taking benefits in different countries. Germany is very strong
:42:54. > :42:58.about that. You say you are not sure why this is a story at the moment. I
:42:59. > :43:02.can help you on this, because every time David Cameron is sitting in
:43:03. > :43:06.that chair and he is asked about this, he avoids the possibility of
:43:07. > :43:08.him ever leading the campaign against British member ship of
:43:09. > :43:13.Europe. I wonder if the mood has changed in the last few weeks?
:43:14. > :43:19.Again, it depends how you phrase these things. I have complete faith
:43:20. > :43:25.that the Prime Minister wants to deliver on what he said he would at
:43:26. > :43:29.the time of the election. It is worth reminding my colleagues and
:43:30. > :43:31.everybody else that it is the Prime Minister who has done something
:43:32. > :43:35.which people like me have been asking for four years, which is
:43:36. > :43:39.deliver a referendum on whether we should stay in the European Union or
:43:40. > :43:45.be outside it. Every other government has shifted away from
:43:46. > :43:48.that. He has given us this. That is a huge starting point. On top of
:43:49. > :43:53.that, he has always said that he wasn't just going to go through the
:43:54. > :43:58.motions is. He wanted to deliver something that benefited Britain.
:43:59. > :44:07.Every viewer will have the right to make that decision, not just me. But
:44:08. > :44:11.right now, let me ask you about the benefits proposal. We are told that
:44:12. > :44:15.not only are other European leaders against it, but even if it went
:44:16. > :44:19.through, it would be illegal under European law to discredit against
:44:20. > :44:25.people who are not your own citizens in this way. Do you understand
:44:26. > :44:30.that? It is not as true as that. Let's start with universal credit
:44:31. > :44:33.coming in now. That is already classed as a social assistance
:44:34. > :44:39.programme in the European Union. That means it will deliver on two or
:44:40. > :44:42.three of the items that we want to. For example, the child elements
:44:43. > :44:49.under universal credit cannot be exported as they are at the moment.
:44:50. > :44:53.Somebody can currently send money home. That cannot happen under
:44:54. > :44:57.universal credit. Secondly, under universal credit, you will not be
:44:58. > :45:02.able to claim unemployment benefit, no matter how long you have been
:45:03. > :45:07.here. Those are two areas which have already delivered. There are other
:45:08. > :45:11.things the Prime Minister is talking about, which is being here and
:45:12. > :45:15.contributed. But universal credit already delivers on that. But
:45:16. > :45:18.they're still legal problems. It has been suggested that one way around
:45:19. > :45:23.this might be to say that nobody gets in work benefits until they
:45:24. > :45:25.have been here for four years, including British citizens. So
:45:26. > :45:30.younger British people might have to work for four years before they get
:45:31. > :45:33.benefits to ensure that this covered Europe wide legality. The good news
:45:34. > :45:36.is that universal credit already says that nobody from outside the UK
:45:37. > :45:42.will be able to claim the benefits for being out of work. Then why are
:45:43. > :45:48.we having this argument? It is the in work element of it that is the
:45:49. > :45:52.debate. The European Union assumes that the in work supplement, which
:45:53. > :45:54.will become universal credit, should be payable to anybody who comes in
:45:55. > :46:06.to take up work. How would you react to a proposal to
:46:07. > :46:11.remove benefits from British people who had to work for four years in
:46:12. > :46:15.order to get round the problem? This is not part of proposal, we will
:46:16. > :46:20.wait and see. Would you be against it? I am not going to put a position
:46:21. > :46:24.down on this. I am in the business, with the Prime Minister, to deliver
:46:25. > :46:28.what the Prime Minister said he won two that the time of the election
:46:29. > :46:33.through the manifesto. He has said to his European colleagues that we
:46:34. > :46:36.need to do this. I think this is a sign of strength. The Prime Minister
:46:37. > :46:43.is determined not to come back with just any deal but a deal he knows he
:46:44. > :46:45.can sell to the British people. That speaks volumes about his
:46:46. > :46:49.determination. If you get what you collectively want on welfare
:46:50. > :46:55.changes, would that be an offer you to want to stay inside the EU? Would
:46:56. > :46:59.you campaign to stay in? I have always said and every single viewer
:47:00. > :47:03.of this programme will reach the same conclusion, when the dealers on
:47:04. > :47:07.the table, that is when you assess whether it is in the benefit of
:47:08. > :47:11.Britain to stay in the European Union or leave. At that moment, my
:47:12. > :47:19.position will become clear but it is dependent on what we get back. For
:47:20. > :47:24.you, issues like Parliamentary sovereignty, getting out from the
:47:25. > :47:27.European Court of Justice, those are important? All my life I have
:47:28. > :47:32.campaigned that the European Union should never become a superstate.
:47:33. > :47:38.That is why I was against the idea of joining the euro. The
:47:39. > :47:40.Conservatives have said we are never going to join the euro. Thank
:47:41. > :47:44.goodness we did not, look what happened to Greece and Italy, they
:47:45. > :47:49.had deficits that were large, and we would be in a terrible state. But
:47:50. > :47:54.cooperating and trading, that lies at the heart of Europe. That is what
:47:55. > :47:58.this negotiation is about. You have been critical of the European
:47:59. > :48:03.project, the waiters developing towards what you would see as a
:48:04. > :48:09.superstate. Lots of people in continental Europe agree with that.
:48:10. > :48:13.Marine Le Pen has given an interview today saying that British exit from
:48:14. > :48:18.the EU would be like the Berlin Wall falling down, and a good thing as
:48:19. > :48:25.well. I never listen to anything that Marine Le Pen or her supporters
:48:26. > :48:31.say, they have such odious views. She might yet be president of
:48:32. > :48:35.France? The reality is that you have two bits of Europe already within
:48:36. > :48:40.the European Union, those within the euro, who required deeper and closer
:48:41. > :48:45.ties and taxation, and those who are outside, of which Britain is the
:48:46. > :48:48.leading part, who do not require that. That is the basis for why you
:48:49. > :48:52.need to have a reformed Europe because you now have different types
:48:53. > :48:57.of Europe within the European Union. For those who say we must not
:48:58. > :49:04.touch it, my answer is that bank closed doors, every European nation
:49:05. > :49:08.knows there are differentials. The other day, Eastern Europe was forced
:49:09. > :49:14.to take migrants when they did not want it. What kind of inner group
:49:15. > :49:18.have you got and all of that. Can I move to welfare? After the Autumn
:49:19. > :49:22.Statement there was a general feeling that people at the bottom of
:49:23. > :49:28.the keeper had the big threat of the tax credit cuts removed from them,
:49:29. > :49:30.but subsequently there has been reports from the Resolution
:49:31. > :49:35.Foundation saying that those same people would be just as worse off
:49:36. > :49:38.because of universal credit by the end of this Parliament, the
:49:39. > :49:44.Resolution Foundation says that average families will be ?1000 a
:49:45. > :49:49.year worse off. Is that true? Let me explain something. I do not believe
:49:50. > :49:53.it is. The Resolution Foundation result did not take into account
:49:54. > :49:58.shall care, which they admitted. These figures are very movable. Add
:49:59. > :50:05.the budget, the levels of the paper, the withdrawal rates, and the
:50:06. > :50:08.allowances, how much you can earn before you have money taking away --
:50:09. > :50:12.taking away in universal credit, they were set. Nothing has changed.
:50:13. > :50:15.That was a fight you had with George Osborne and one? Those were
:50:16. > :50:20.discussions we had at the time and we at the time of the budget. The
:50:21. > :50:33.rest of the discussion about tax credits has had the IFA said that by
:50:34. > :50:37.the end of this period there is no doubt that families at the bottom
:50:38. > :50:44.will be considerably worse off than they would have been had the current
:50:45. > :50:50.system continued? Nobody will lose any money on universal credit, tax
:50:51. > :50:53.credits, because the cash protected. It is transitional protection. I
:50:54. > :50:58.argued for that at the time and the Chancellor agreed that. Nobody loses
:50:59. > :51:04.a penny, and likely would have done under tax credits. Universal credit
:51:05. > :51:09.is not tax credit. It is six benefits, it is a much bigger
:51:10. > :51:14.benefit, it has housing benefit in it for example, child benefit, all
:51:15. > :51:20.sorts of bits and pieces. So they have misunderstood it? It is an
:51:21. > :51:26.unemployment benefit as well. The ISS have misunderstood this? They
:51:27. > :51:29.say people will be worse off. Tax credits subsidise massively somebody
:51:30. > :51:34.at 16 hours of work. And occasionally a 30 hours. I thought
:51:35. > :51:39.this was terrible. They had a low taper rate but if they went to 17,
:51:40. > :51:46.18, they lost nearly 100% of their earnings. People would get confused
:51:47. > :51:50.by taper rates. There were always points under tax credits that were
:51:51. > :51:55.more generous than universal credit. That is why we protected
:51:56. > :51:58.them. What universal credit does, as we should in the reports that have
:51:59. > :52:02.been published this week which have been released to this programme,
:52:03. > :52:07.under universal credit more people going to work faster, they stay in
:52:08. > :52:11.work longer and earn more money. There are independent review coming
:52:12. > :52:15.forward showing that universal credit is a massive progressive. I
:52:16. > :52:20.know that Leytonstone is part of your area. After this appalling
:52:21. > :52:24.attack in the station, what are your reflections about it in terms of
:52:25. > :52:29.security? One-off people grabbing a iPhone going to a shopping centre or
:52:30. > :52:34.tube station, no one can protect against that? This is my area and it
:52:35. > :52:41.grieves me to think this kind of incident took place. I know the
:52:42. > :52:48.police work incredibly hard, we have an anti-gangs programme. It is not
:52:49. > :52:51.party political. The police are treating it as a terrorist attack
:52:52. > :52:58.but it is an abomination to think of when a body doing this, whatever the
:52:59. > :53:01.circumstances. This is one of the reasons why and the budget changes,
:53:02. > :53:04.sorry, the spending review, we have not cut the police budget and they
:53:05. > :53:08.will get the money necessary for them to secure the areas that might
:53:09. > :53:13.be most threatened by terrorist attacks. Lots of people watching are
:53:14. > :53:19.scared about going into public spaces, using public transport. What
:53:20. > :53:22.is your message to them? We cannot let these people, terrorists,
:53:23. > :53:27.dominate our space. The way we defeat them at the end of the day is
:53:28. > :53:31.that our values, our freedom of expression, our freedom of
:53:32. > :53:35.association, the freedom that capitalism brings to us, our ability
:53:36. > :53:40.to take our families and children out at Christmas, none of that must
:53:41. > :53:45.be curtailed. That is the reason why they attack us. We have a moderate
:53:46. > :53:48.state that believes in help and assistance to people and does not
:53:49. > :53:53.believe in this totalitarian idea which was described brilliantly by
:53:54. > :54:00.Hilary Benn the other day as a fascist concept, are fascist regime
:54:01. > :54:02.that we are up against, and we have always had to fight fascism. Iain
:54:03. > :54:04.Duncan Smith, we will talk more after the news, but for now, thank
:54:05. > :54:05.you. Now over to Roger
:54:06. > :54:07.for the news headlines. A prominent Labour MP has called
:54:08. > :54:10.for a "more respectful tone" Tristram Hunt,
:54:11. > :54:14.who left the front bench when Jeremy Corbyn became leader,
:54:15. > :54:16.said people were "frustrated" by the current divisions,
:54:17. > :54:18.and he called on the different wings of the party to pull together rather
:54:19. > :54:29.than fighting each other. We need to have a big and active
:54:30. > :54:33.debate, but when you do get members of Parliament having to call in
:54:34. > :54:38.police protection to their family, then we have crossed the line. Some
:54:39. > :54:44.of the ugly comments surrounding the Stop The War Coalition, for example,
:54:45. > :54:55.they have been very irresponsible with their and activities. -- their
:54:56. > :54:56.language. There is severe flooding
:54:57. > :54:58.across parts of Cumbria and southern Scotland this morning,
:54:59. > :55:01.with waters continuing to rise and dozens of severe flood warnings
:55:02. > :55:03.still in place. Hundreds of homes
:55:04. > :55:05.and businesses have been evacuated, roads are underwater,
:55:06. > :55:07.and some towns have been cut off. Floodwaters are expected to reach
:55:08. > :55:10.their peak between now and midday. The next news on BBC One is
:55:11. > :55:14.at 1 o'clock. Iain Duncan Smith is still with me,
:55:15. > :55:21.and we're joined by Tristram Hunt. We were watching you on the news
:55:22. > :55:27.having a real go at stop the war and so on. Your leader is going to break
:55:28. > :55:30.bread with them soon as a special honorary guest at an event. We did
:55:31. > :55:35.not send a strong message about the kind of abuse you're talking about
:55:36. > :55:39.for him not to go there? Yes, I do not think he should go. The Stop The
:55:40. > :55:44.War Coalition picketed the party headquarters when we were trying to
:55:45. > :55:47.run a phone bank for the Oldham by-election. They were preventing
:55:48. > :55:51.the election of a Labour member of Parliament. We have seen ugly
:55:52. > :55:56.comments from them about Hilary Benn and the fact that Hilary Benn should
:55:57. > :56:01.be sacked. He cannot work safe on the streets of Leeds ever again,
:56:02. > :56:06.that was one of the comments. And the comments about Islamic State,
:56:07. > :56:11.how the French always -- almost had it coming to them. There are
:56:12. > :56:16.disreputable organisation. Jeremy Corbyn should step back and not good
:56:17. > :56:21.to the fundraiser. Universal credit has been a long process, possibly
:56:22. > :56:25.more expensive than you would have liked. How long is it before we see
:56:26. > :56:30.universal credit across the country? It was cheaper and delivery
:56:31. > :56:35.than it was forecast to be so it is cheaper. It is already rolling out.
:56:36. > :56:41.There are quarter of a million people getting it. They are the easy
:56:42. > :56:45.ones, are they? I will never do a big bang approach with everything
:56:46. > :56:50.happens at once. You do it stage by stage. You learn the lessons and
:56:51. > :56:53.roll it out in different areas. It will be in every single job centre
:56:54. > :56:59.by early next year and then restart the full expansion of the other
:57:00. > :57:03.benefits. If they will be shut down by 2018 for new entrants and then
:57:04. > :57:10.you migrate all those on the other that or anything. -- on the other
:57:11. > :57:14.benefits that are relevant. This is the right way to do this, it has an
:57:15. > :57:19.amber rating. Amber can mean that you're about to stop. It is very
:57:20. > :57:24.strong, it is the way that benefit should be ruled out in future. You
:57:25. > :57:28.have very different policy solutions. Do you both share a moral
:57:29. > :57:33.outrage about the discrepancies between the wealthy and the pool in
:57:34. > :57:37.this country? The discrepancy is growing at the moment. When you look
:57:38. > :57:42.at the charts, we are seeing more inequality, not just in Britain but
:57:43. > :57:46.across the Western world. How you have policies to deal with that is
:57:47. > :57:51.the call of labour pars purpose. The labour -- the Conservative
:57:52. > :57:55.government thinks that you should cut tax for the wealthiest while
:57:56. > :57:59.also closing centres to help the disadvantaged, I think those are the
:58:00. > :58:03.wrong choices. You have to have an economy that functions and works.
:58:04. > :58:08.Under the present government, I want to put a figure on the table, income
:58:09. > :58:13.inequality is lower than it was under the last government. Is that
:58:14. > :58:21.true? It is true. Income inequality was lower than it was in 2010. We
:58:22. > :58:25.have put on the table a huge range of child care packages. Massive
:58:26. > :58:28.support through universal credit. We need to focus on the quality of the
:58:29. > :58:34.provision. THEY ALL SPEAK AT ONCE
:58:35. > :58:38.Gentlemen, we are out of time. I am so sorry. Unless Iain Duncan Smith
:58:39. > :58:40.is going to give us a go on the spoons, we have no music. That is
:58:41. > :58:42.all for today. Jo Coburn will be here with
:58:43. > :58:45.the Sunday Politics in an hour. Her guests will include Labour's
:58:46. > :58:47.shadow welfare minister, Owen Smith, Emily Maitlis will be
:58:48. > :58:51.in this seat next Sunday morning when her guests will include rock
:58:52. > :58:53.legend Chrissie Hynde and the man leading Labour's campaign to
:58:54. > :59:20.remain in the EU, Alan Johnson. as BBC Two brings you some inspiring
:59:21. > :59:27.cultural treats - Let Darcey introduce us
:59:28. > :59:31.to her ballet heroes.