:00:42. > :00:45.And in the North West: "Preparing for the fight of their
:00:45. > :00:47.lives." In the week that Unison threaten widespread strike action,
:00:48. > :00:51.we'll be reporting from their annual conference in Manchester.
:00:51. > :01:01.And justice for Jane. The family of a murdered Lancashire nurse take
:01:01. > :01:01.
:01:01. > :42:54.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2512 seconds
:42:54. > :43:01.Hello and welcome to The Politics Show in the North West. I'm at
:43:01. > :43:06.Manchester Central - the venue of this year's Unison conference. It
:43:06. > :43:09.is all over now but throughout the week, 2000 delegates have been here.
:43:09. > :43:12.The message from them was very clear.
:43:12. > :43:21.If this government fails to heed our warnings to negotiate in good
:43:21. > :43:24.faith, I say to David Cameron, you ain't seen nothing yet.
:43:24. > :43:26.Also in the programme: Justice for Jane. We'll be hearing from the
:43:26. > :43:29.family of a murdered Lancashire nurse taking their campaign to
:43:29. > :43:31.Westminster. And a woman on a mission. Meet the
:43:31. > :43:40.historian raising money for a statue of Seaforth's most famous
:43:40. > :43:43.But first, "preparing for the fight of our lives", "sustained strike
:43:43. > :43:48.action" and "a wretched government". Just some of the statements to come
:43:48. > :43:50.out of this week's Unison conference here in Manchester.
:43:50. > :43:53.Members of the UK's largest public sector union, including nurses,
:43:53. > :43:55.social workers and paramedics, have threatened the biggest outbreak of
:43:55. > :44:05.industrial unrest since the 1926 General Strike over changes to
:44:05. > :44:07.
:44:07. > :44:12.their pension schemes. They're all the air campaign on
:44:12. > :44:18.strike action without precedent. Yes, we hope for the best. Yes, we
:44:18. > :44:25.will negotiate. But we plan for the worst, and our preparations are
:44:25. > :44:31.well advanced. But there is much more to do. And today, this is our
:44:31. > :44:34.union's call to arms. Fighting talk from Dave Prentis,
:44:34. > :44:40.the general secretary of Unison, and he is with me now. Thank you
:44:40. > :44:45.for joining us today. We are in Manchester, the heartland of the
:44:45. > :44:49.Union Movement. What have your members been saying to you? The big
:44:49. > :44:56.issues over the last week were the massive cutback in jobs, 500,000
:44:56. > :45:01.jobs to go from our public services. We had a massive debate not just on
:45:01. > :45:06.public services but on the private sector. One of the big issues is
:45:06. > :45:13.public sector pensions. You are in negotiations with the Government on
:45:13. > :45:17.that on Monday. The straw that breaks the camel's back is what
:45:17. > :45:21.this coalition is trying to dig to public service pension schemes.
:45:21. > :45:28.They are not gold plated. The biggest is the local government
:45:29. > :45:35.pension scheme. On average, most people are women and the average
:45:35. > :45:41.they get is �54 a week. It is not a king's ransom. If she saves all her
:45:41. > :45:46.life for that and if she had not paid in, she would go back on
:45:46. > :45:50.benefits. Is your official line that you are negotiating? We are
:45:50. > :45:54.negotiating tomorrow. It is the final meeting. The Cabinet Office
:45:54. > :45:58.have made it clear so far that they do not want any further meetings.
:45:58. > :46:03.We are expecting them to row back from what Danny Alexander said over
:46:03. > :46:08.a week ago when he announced a 50% increase in contributions,
:46:08. > :46:11.everybody would have to work longer, especially women, and we want him
:46:11. > :46:16.to row back from those silly statements. If we do not get a
:46:16. > :46:19.negotiated settlement, we are moving into industrial action.
:46:19. > :46:22.what has been coming out of the conference is pretty strong
:46:22. > :46:26.rhetoric. You have been saying things like unprecedented strike
:46:26. > :46:30.action, so it sounds like you have already made your minds up. If it
:46:30. > :46:35.gets to a point when you think that the negotiations have been running
:46:35. > :46:39.publicly through the media, the talks we have had over the last
:46:39. > :46:42.four months have come to nothing, obviously we only take industrial
:46:42. > :46:46.action as a final resort. Our members provide a caring services.
:46:46. > :46:50.We know that our members want that industrial action ballot now.
:46:50. > :46:55.you get into a long and protracted fight with the government, have
:46:55. > :46:58.your members got the stomach for the fight? We have over 1 million
:46:58. > :47:02.women members and they are really up for this flight. They have seen
:47:02. > :47:06.their jobs going, they have seen the pay freeze, they have seen all
:47:07. > :47:11.the excesses of the bankers, and to have their pensions taken away is a
:47:11. > :47:15.final straw. When we talk about it being bigger than the general
:47:15. > :47:20.strike, just factual. 700,000 public sector workers will be
:47:20. > :47:26.taking action on 30th June. We will be balloting 1.2 million workers.
:47:26. > :47:30.We will get a yes vote for action. It will be absolutely enormous.
:47:30. > :47:34.you support the teachers on Thursday, but what about health
:47:34. > :47:41.workers, paramedics and nurses? Would you support them going out on
:47:41. > :47:46.strike? They are our members. Our members will not walk away from
:47:46. > :47:51.patients. We will make sure that patients are safeguarded. But we
:47:51. > :47:55.will be taking effective action to out our health care services and
:47:55. > :47:59.our local community services. We are also looking for public support.
:47:59. > :48:04.That has changed over the last week. You may say that the rhetoric has
:48:04. > :48:09.been hard. We did a survey 10 days ago. 65% of the public or against
:48:09. > :48:15.unions taking action over pensions. By the end of our conference, the
:48:15. > :48:18.latest ballot has shown it is split 48% in favour, 48% against. We are
:48:18. > :48:22.winning the argument and that is really important. This coalition
:48:22. > :48:25.has got to realise that there are so many people involved, there will
:48:25. > :48:29.be sapped much support for them that it will hit them in the ballot
:48:29. > :48:32.box as well. We shall see. Thank you very much for joining us.
:48:32. > :48:36.Jane Clough was brutally murdered by her ex-partner almost a year ago.
:48:36. > :48:39.At the time, he was on bail charged with raping her. Jane's parents say
:48:39. > :48:43.she was badly let down by the legal system and should still be alive
:48:43. > :48:45.today. They're now being backed by their local MP who is highlighting
:48:45. > :48:55.their campaign in Parliament. Here's our political editor Arif
:48:55. > :48:57.
:48:57. > :49:06.Ansari. Jane was so considerate, so nothing,
:49:07. > :49:09.so generous with her love, her friends, everybody thought so much
:49:09. > :49:13.of her and she always had time for everybody.
:49:13. > :49:15.26-year-old nurse Jane Clough was stabbed to death in the car park of
:49:16. > :49:20.Blackpool Victoria Hospital in July last year. Her killer was Jonathan
:49:20. > :49:30.Vass - her ex-partner and the father of her baby. He was on bail,
:49:30. > :49:34.charged with rape. Jane's death was completely preventable. It is
:49:34. > :49:41.completely inconceivable to asked an to anybody we have spoken to,
:49:41. > :49:46.really, why bail was granted a with the number of charges levelled at
:49:46. > :49:49.him. Nine counts of rape and four counts of assault. Vass was granted
:49:49. > :49:57.bail in December 2009 on the condition he stayed away from Jane
:49:57. > :50:02.Clough. But her diary shows she was living in fear. I have been
:50:02. > :50:06.worrying today about Johnny coming to get me, even killing me. If he
:50:06. > :50:10.is found guilty when he is released waiting sentence, what will stop
:50:10. > :50:15.him? He is probably going to blame me. Most people are raped by people
:50:15. > :50:18.they know, so a fat person is given bail, they are going to know where
:50:18. > :50:23.they live. Maybe that is something they would be taking him to
:50:23. > :50:25.consider -- consideration. The Bail Act presumes people shall be
:50:25. > :50:35.granted bail, except in specific circumstances. The office
:50:35. > :50:42.
:50:42. > :50:52.But Jane's family say she was let down by the legal system and the
:50:52. > :50:52.
:50:52. > :50:57.law needs changing. When a bill decision is made by the judge, it
:50:57. > :51:01.seems that only the person in front of him matters. The victim has no
:51:01. > :51:06.part in this bail decision. problem is that at that stage of
:51:06. > :51:12.the proceedings, very often we don't know who the victim is. So I
:51:12. > :51:19.think there is far too much almost hysteria surrounding this concept
:51:19. > :51:23.of victim's rights, victims should and do have rights, but very often
:51:23. > :51:29.until the trial is completed, we don't know who the victim is.
:51:29. > :51:33.the Clough family have vowed to keep on campaigning. People who
:51:33. > :51:37.write the laws, from our point of view, tend to be too professional
:51:37. > :51:43.and dispatched and look at things in black and white. We need some
:51:43. > :51:47.human touch in these decisions. And until that comes, the world is not
:51:47. > :51:52.going to get any better. Let's discuss this further. I am
:51:52. > :51:56.joined by Andrew Stephenson, the Conservative MP for Pendle. You
:51:56. > :52:01.actually want the law changed. I think this case highlights a need
:52:01. > :52:05.to change the law, to ensure the prosecution has the right of appeal
:52:05. > :52:10.in a Bell case. I think if the law had been that way, when Jonathan
:52:10. > :52:14.Vass was granted bail, he simply would not have been granted bail.
:52:15. > :52:19.Just explain precisely how the law would be different. Basically, what
:52:19. > :52:25.my Bill proposes is that the prosecution, in this case the CPS,
:52:25. > :52:28.who were working on the family's behalf, when they found Jonathan
:52:28. > :52:32.Vass had been granted bail, they would have been able to appeal the
:52:32. > :52:35.decision and hopefully get it overturned. We know from the
:52:35. > :52:39.transcripts that it would have been overturned and Jonathan Bass would
:52:39. > :52:44.have been kept inside. I think this highlights a problem in the legal
:52:44. > :52:49.system. If you are detained by the police, you can appeal time and
:52:49. > :52:54.time again to be granted bail. Yet if you are the victim, you have no
:52:54. > :52:58.right of appeal. If the person who has done very stings against is
:52:59. > :53:02.granted bail, you have no right to appeal. So any case like this, we
:53:02. > :53:05.really do believe the prosecution should have the right to appeal and
:53:05. > :53:11.be up to say that people like Jonathan Vass should be kept behind
:53:11. > :53:16.bars awaiting their court cases. But there is a real danger of
:53:16. > :53:19.changing the law on the basis of a very tragic case but quite an
:53:19. > :53:23.exceptional one. That is right. When you look at this case, there
:53:23. > :53:27.is a whole range of issues coming out of it. Whether we should look
:53:27. > :53:32.at the way that judges behave, whether we should look at a bail
:53:32. > :53:35.proceedings in this country. I have spent a long time working with the
:53:35. > :53:40.family thinking about what is the most appropriate way to take this
:53:40. > :53:44.forward. I have been speaking to MPs and others and I have 40 or 50
:53:44. > :53:48.who are backing me to say that in a case like this the prosecution
:53:48. > :53:55.should have the right to say, hang on a minute, we think the judge has
:53:55. > :54:00.got this wrong. At the moment that right does not exist. Thank-you. Mr
:54:00. > :54:04.Stearman son's Ten Minute Rule Bill will be introduced into the House
:54:04. > :54:06.of Commons on Tuesday. Now for the latest in our series
:54:07. > :54:10.looking at moments in medical history. The NHS was formally
:54:10. > :54:12.launched in the North West in a Trafford hospital 63 years ago. As
:54:13. > :54:22.Gill Dummigan reports, it's a hospital which today finds itself
:54:23. > :54:29.
:54:29. > :54:32.In 1948, a radical new idea arrived in Britain.
:54:33. > :54:38.On July 5th, the new National Health Service starts, providing
:54:38. > :54:41.hospital and specialist services, medicines, drugs and appliances...
:54:41. > :54:44.It was the brainchild of Health Secretary Nye Bevan and he chose
:54:44. > :54:47.Park Hospital in Trafford to launch it. Britain's first NHS patient was
:54:47. > :54:50.13-year-old Sylvia Diggory. She'd already spent months in what was
:54:50. > :55:00.then a local authority hospital, being treated for a kidney
:55:00. > :55:00.
:55:00. > :55:04.condition. A very exciting day. It lightened the life in the hospital.
:55:04. > :55:08.There was a very sudden appearance of the man. So everybody had to
:55:08. > :55:13.rush round. It was very interesting. This leaflet is coming through your
:55:13. > :55:16.letterbox one day soon. The NHS was part of a package of social reform
:55:16. > :55:18.gifted to a war-weary Britain. Before then, people often had to
:55:19. > :55:26.plead their case to get free hospital care and, crucially, many
:55:26. > :55:29.had to pay to see a GP. People could consult their doctor in the
:55:29. > :55:35.first place because they could not afford the doctor and therefore
:55:35. > :55:39.never had access to secondary care. So it was there that the great
:55:39. > :55:42.social injustice was being perpetrated. The scheme is
:55:42. > :55:45.comprehensive. It is not only to help you when you are real but to
:55:45. > :55:48.help keep you well. Unsurprisingly, the new NHS became massively
:55:48. > :55:52.popular. The hope was that it would improve the nation's health so
:55:52. > :55:58.radically, demand to treat the sick might actually drop. But fast
:55:58. > :56:00.forward to 2011 and demand for the NHS is as high as ever. And Park
:56:01. > :56:10.Hospital? It's now Trafford General, run by Trafford Healthcare Trust,
:56:11. > :56:12.
:56:12. > :56:16.which can no longer afford to go it alone. It is a small district
:56:16. > :56:20.hospital and over the last three years, hospitals have become
:56:20. > :56:24.specialised or become more closer to home. More services are being
:56:24. > :56:34.delivered elsewhere and so our size has reduced. We are no longer
:56:34. > :56:37.
:56:37. > :56:44.viable independent labels stop -- Independent. The trust has invited
:56:44. > :56:48.neighbouring, larger trusts to take it over. We are confident that we
:56:48. > :56:55.will get bids. The deadline was Friday. If for any reason no other
:56:55. > :56:59.trust can take Trafford on, it will be offered to a private bidder.
:56:59. > :57:03.What would you say to people who are campaigning now, saying this is
:57:03. > :57:08.the birthplace of the NHS, it is fundamentally wrong to be taken
:57:08. > :57:12.over potentially by a private company? We have always said that
:57:12. > :57:15.our preferred option is to be taken over by a foundation Trust. We are
:57:15. > :57:19.hopeful that will happen. Sylvia Diggory became a lifelong champion
:57:19. > :57:27.of the NHS and was delighted when her son became a GP. Under the new
:57:27. > :57:34.NHS, he's now having to make tough decisions about what he can fund.
:57:34. > :57:38.What do you think your mother would say about what is going on now?
:57:38. > :57:43.was a wartime generation and so the concept of rationing was more clear
:57:43. > :57:46.to them than to me, so I think she would be pragmatic about the
:57:46. > :57:50.financial constraints and supportive of people making this
:57:50. > :57:56.difficult decisions. Joining me now is Professor Colin
:57:56. > :58:00.Talbot from the Manchester Business School. The funding of the NHS and
:58:00. > :58:05.hospitals is not nearly as simple as it was 63 years ago and it could
:58:05. > :58:09.get more complicated. Absolutely. Up until about 20 years ago, we had
:58:09. > :58:11.a very simple system where money cascaded from the Department of
:58:12. > :58:15.Health through regions and districts down to individual
:58:15. > :58:20.hospitals and family health services. Starting about 20 years
:58:20. > :58:23.ago, it got more complicated. It is going to get even more complicated
:58:23. > :58:26.under the new system the Government is introducing because of the
:58:26. > :58:30.changes they have made to legislation. It is not clear how it
:58:30. > :58:33.is going to operate. If you don't understand it, I'm not sure what
:58:33. > :58:39.hope there is for the rest of us, but are some hospitals at threat of
:58:39. > :58:42.closure? The general view is that there are probably around 20
:58:42. > :58:49.General Hospitals at least within England that are financially
:58:49. > :58:54.performing badly and are probably not needed because of the changing
:58:54. > :58:57.pattern of health care provision and a lot more can be provided in
:58:57. > :59:03.GP surgeries. It is difficult to say how many will close but some
:59:04. > :59:09.will. Our PFI hospitals more at risk? They have to find the money
:59:09. > :59:12.to pay their private partners. Bearing a strange position. Some of
:59:12. > :59:15.them are suffering financially because they're having to pay
:59:15. > :59:19.awards that are rented because they don't need them any longer. But at
:59:19. > :59:24.the same time, they have 30 year contracts so it is buried difficult
:59:24. > :59:27.to such bash to shut them down. It says some of those 20 hospitals in
:59:27. > :59:31.financial difficulty a PFI hospitals but they will probably be
:59:31. > :59:35.protected because they have PFI contracts. Are more hospitals going
:59:35. > :59:38.to find themselves in the position where perhaps Trafford does were
:59:39. > :59:41.they looking for other partners to take them over? I think a lot of
:59:41. > :59:46.hospitals are going to have to look carefully at where they get their
:59:46. > :59:49.funding streams and how they maintain themselves in the future.
:59:49. > :59:52.What ever the system the Government introduces, it will be more
:59:52. > :59:56.competitive than we have had up to now and it will be more difficult
:59:56. > :59:59.for hospitals to get hold of the resources to keep them going.
:00:00. > :00:02.you for joining us. Born in Liverpool in 1809, William
:00:02. > :00:06.Gladstone has the record for being Britain's oldest serving prime
:00:06. > :00:09.minister. He held the post four times, more than any other person.
:00:09. > :00:12.And now a historian from his home town is raising money for a
:00:12. > :00:22.permanent statue of Seaforth's most famous resident. Leanne Harper
:00:22. > :00:31.
:00:31. > :00:34.This is Rodney Street in Liverpool city centre and is here where
:00:34. > :00:41.William Gladstone was born. But what many people don't realise is
:00:41. > :00:47.that he spent most of his chartered down the road in C four. -- most of
:00:47. > :00:50.his childhood down the road in Seaforth. A lot of the you just
:00:50. > :00:58.don't know Ruhi years. But the older generation, yes. Who is
:00:58. > :01:04.William Gladstone? This woman wants that to change. Because Gladstone
:01:04. > :01:11.lived in C four for 17 years, I decided to get a memorial to him.
:01:11. > :01:16.The motivation I had in the first place was to make everybody think
:01:16. > :01:21.well of Seaforth. I love Seaforth and I want everyone else to love it.
:01:21. > :01:26.The bronze bust of a stone which will sit on a stone column has been
:01:26. > :01:30.made by Liverpool sculpture. -- Dr. It has been on display in a nearby
:01:30. > :01:33.jewellers. It has already attracted a lot of attention. It took a lot
:01:33. > :01:37.longer to dress the Winder than we had hoped because people kept
:01:38. > :01:42.stopping to look in and we had to stop every time they did. But the
:01:42. > :01:46.memorial does not come cheap. So far �10,000 of the �18,000 needed
:01:46. > :01:52.has been raised, including a special donation. The first
:01:52. > :01:57.donation I had was from Sir William Gladstone of pardon Castle. He is
:01:57. > :02:04.the great-grandson. When I wrote to tell him what I was doing, he said
:02:04. > :02:08.he was delighted, and so he sent me �1,000. The memorial will
:02:08. > :02:15.eventually overlook where Gladstone went to school. He will then be
:02:15. > :02:19.facing exactly the site of St Thomas's Church, which his father
:02:19. > :02:26.built. He wrote in his diary when he was nine, I hope that my father
:02:26. > :02:30.will bequeath this church to me because I love it so much. Brenda
:02:30. > :02:34.Marriott hopes it will not be too long before Gladstone returns to
:02:34. > :02:38.his childhood home and is revived in people's memories for all stop
:02:38. > :02:41.That's all we have time for. There's no programme next week