:00:42. > :00:44.Coming up in the South East: Figures for school exclusions show
:00:44. > :00:47.the majority of children permanently excluded from Kent's
:00:47. > :00:50.schools have special educational needs.
:00:50. > :01:00.Will the Government have elected Police Commissioners in place by
:01:00. > :01:00.
:01:00. > :42:58.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2518 seconds
:42:58. > :43:05.Welcome to the politics show. Coming up: 90% of primary school
:43:05. > :43:09.children excluded from Kent schools have special educational needs. We
:43:09. > :43:14.ask the leader of Kent council why the figures are so high. Would
:43:14. > :43:21.elected police commissioners make our police forces more accountable
:43:21. > :43:25.ought to political? The Education Secretary has intervened in a Kent
:43:25. > :43:32.primary school where almost three- quarters of the children do not
:43:32. > :43:34.Startling figures for school exclusions show the majority of
:43:34. > :43:36.children permanently excluded from Kent's schools have special
:43:36. > :43:39.educational needs. A Freedom of Information request by a former
:43:39. > :43:45.Kent head teacher shows 90% of primary and 54% of secondary
:43:45. > :43:49.exclusions involved children with conditions like autism. In Medway,
:43:49. > :43:53.not a single child with special educational needs was excluded. And
:43:53. > :43:56.in East Sussex, the figures are also much lower than in Kent. In a
:43:56. > :44:06.moment I'll be speaking to the Conservative Leader of Kent County
:44:06. > :44:08.
:44:09. > :44:17.Council, Paul Carter, but first How would we make it an equal
:44:17. > :44:21.number each? Joshua from Tonbridge has asked burgers. He was
:44:21. > :44:26.temporarily excluded from a mainstream school at the start of
:44:26. > :44:33.the year. His mother said there was no option but to home-school him.
:44:33. > :44:39.We were tired of fighting the battles. We always had assumed it
:44:39. > :44:46.was a child's right to have an education. We thought the support
:44:46. > :44:50.would be in place when we had the initial diagnosis. We were just
:44:50. > :44:56.tired of fighting and tired of the stress. We took it as far as we
:44:56. > :45:03.could and got it know where. There was no option but to home school.
:45:04. > :45:08.Recent figures give an idea of the scale of the issue in Kent. Of the
:45:09. > :45:16.children excluded in secondary schools in the county last year,
:45:16. > :45:23.54% had educational needs. That rises for primary school exclusions
:45:23. > :45:30.to 91%. This is in stark contrast with other authorities. Medway
:45:30. > :45:34.excluded no children last year. In East Sussex, it was just over 9%.
:45:34. > :45:39.believe these figures are then indictment of Kent County Council
:45:39. > :45:45.which sets the tone for treatment of children with special needs. A
:45:45. > :45:50.large number compared to other local authorities says Gent has got
:45:50. > :45:57.it wrong. Kent should have been doing something more. What I want
:45:57. > :46:03.to see now is for Kent to will take a more proactive role. What could
:46:03. > :46:11.Kent be doing? Some say they should use independent advocates. John
:46:11. > :46:19.runs a club for fathers of children with autism. We were talking about
:46:19. > :46:24.a club in Maidstone. We feel everything that is put against the
:46:24. > :46:30.parents is in a house. Perhaps some sort of independent advocate who
:46:30. > :46:40.could look at these situations rather than someone on the county
:46:40. > :46:41.
:46:41. > :46:48.council looking at it so that it is Rebecca Beazley also believes Kent
:46:48. > :46:56.council should take a more active role. We had always been under the
:46:56. > :47:01.impression that schools fell under the remit of the council. When we
:47:01. > :47:11.have contacted the council about these problems, we get pushed back
:47:11. > :47:13.
:47:13. > :47:23.For many professionals such as those teaching at special needs
:47:23. > :47:26.
:47:26. > :47:31.schools, the real problem lies in Maxy -- mainstream schools going --
:47:31. > :47:41.I think it may be because mainstream schools are not able to
:47:41. > :47:41.
:47:42. > :47:46.deal with the wide range of special needs that we have. Special --
:47:46. > :47:51.children with special educational needs being excluded is down to the
:47:51. > :47:56.fact that more schools need additional support in terms of
:47:56. > :48:01.understanding the needs. message from teachers and parents
:48:01. > :48:06.is clear, they went Kent County Council to take more responsibility
:48:06. > :48:11.for the education of children with special educational needs. They say
:48:11. > :48:16.it is time the council stopped washing its hands of this problem
:48:16. > :48:19.by simply allowing schools to wash their hands of this problem.
:48:19. > :48:27.Joining me in the studio is the Conservative Leader of Kent County
:48:27. > :48:32.Council, Paul Carter. This was your department before you became
:48:32. > :48:37.council leader. There is at serious problem here when you look at the
:48:37. > :48:42.number of exclusions. What will you do about it? I do have concerns. It
:48:42. > :48:49.is worth understanding that hour exclusion rate is virtually the
:48:49. > :48:54.same as virtually every other authority in the country. But there
:48:54. > :48:58.seems to be an extraordinary number with special educational needs
:48:58. > :49:08.within that grouping. We have been on a journey to make sure we do
:49:08. > :49:08.
:49:08. > :49:18.have good schools for children with special needs. And I think it is
:49:18. > :49:22.
:49:22. > :49:25.the halfway house indecent port -- in support. Are they failing to
:49:25. > :49:33.support children with special educational needs and is it not
:49:33. > :49:43.time you went into banks and heads together? We invented an outreach
:49:43. > :49:44.
:49:44. > :49:48.source support. It is being rolled out across the county. What we need
:49:49. > :49:53.more units attached to mainstream schools. We have been slow in
:49:53. > :50:03.getting that under way. I will now focus to make sure we have more
:50:03. > :50:08.units. The autism unit in one school is a perfect example. Should
:50:08. > :50:18.you ask every school that wants to exclude a pupil with special
:50:18. > :50:19.
:50:19. > :50:29.educational needs Kazakh it is outreach support. Kent council does
:50:29. > :50:32.
:50:32. > :50:40.not exclude pupils, it is schools that exclude pupils. We have to
:50:40. > :50:44.will support these children with educational needs. The mother of
:50:44. > :50:53.the boy in the report said nobody is holding the schools to account.
:50:53. > :50:57.Why I am not asking these questions of the head teachers? Let us
:50:57. > :51:05.examine this in great detail. We need to understand why schools are
:51:05. > :51:11.finding it necessary to exclude so many pupils as part of this with
:51:11. > :51:18.educational needs? We need more units attached to mainstream
:51:18. > :51:25.schools. We could get the Smile Centre Initiative under way in the
:51:25. > :51:29.other districts in the county. Medway and not excluding any pupils
:51:29. > :51:39.with special educational needs. At their procedures there that you
:51:39. > :51:44.
:51:44. > :51:49.could put in place? We are doing managed moves in Kent. Local
:51:49. > :51:54.authorities up and down the land 10 years ago close their special
:51:54. > :52:00.schools. We preserve them. When it comes to vulnerable children, we
:52:00. > :52:05.have high levels of exclusion. At the end of last year, a highly
:52:05. > :52:12.critical report after a surprise Ofsted visit revealed serious
:52:12. > :52:14.problems with your children's services. Is there a wider issue
:52:14. > :52:20.that a big council with a lot of money is failing vulnerable
:52:20. > :52:30.children? We are supporting children with special educational
:52:30. > :52:30.
:52:30. > :52:32.needs. I am looking beyond education are now. We and now
:52:32. > :52:42.starting to implement a significant improvement plan to make sure we
:52:42. > :52:46.
:52:46. > :52:51.have the best support to vulnerable young people in Kent. We have
:52:51. > :53:01.looked after children of our own and those from London boroughs
:53:01. > :53:08.
:53:08. > :53:14.placed into Kent. It has said on radio this week -- I have had long
:53:14. > :53:19.conversations with Jenny. We have to innovate and modernise the way
:53:19. > :53:29.we support our vulnerable young people. That is what we will do in
:53:29. > :53:30.
:53:30. > :53:40.the next few weeks but that it is one plank that has to be in place.
:53:40. > :53:47.It could transform the lives for young people. Will your exclusions
:53:47. > :53:54.be lower next year? I very much hope so. Our exclusion rate is the
:53:55. > :53:59.same as for the rest of the country, why so many with educational needs
:53:59. > :54:01.are in these figures, we must work on it.
:54:01. > :54:04.The introduction of Police Commissioners would be a sad day
:54:04. > :54:08.for British Policing according to Anne Barnes, who's the Chairman of
:54:08. > :54:10.Kent's Police Authority. But the Government is determined to have
:54:10. > :54:16.elected Police Commissioners in place and earning �122,000 a year
:54:16. > :54:19.by next spring. Critics say with both Kent and Sussex Police forces
:54:19. > :54:21.having to make more than �50 million worth of savings over the
:54:21. > :54:30.next four years, elected Police Commissioners are an expense our
:54:30. > :54:33.forces cannot afford. Joining me now from Dover is the
:54:33. > :54:40.Conservative MP for Folkestone and Hythe, Damian Collins, and the
:54:40. > :54:45.former Labour MP for Gillingham, Paul Clark, is in Chatham. You are
:54:45. > :54:51.a politician, you believe in elections, why you Against these
:54:51. > :55:01.elections? What the whole scheme will will do is put in the hands of
:55:01. > :55:06.
:55:06. > :55:12.one single politician a great deal This person will have the right to
:55:12. > :55:18.hire and fire the chief constable. We have no checks and balances in
:55:18. > :55:26.place to stop that one individual who is elected on a four-year cycle.
:55:26. > :55:32.Our police force is are facing some 1500 job cuts. To spend �100
:55:32. > :55:37.million on elected commissioners does not seem the right priority.
:55:38. > :55:43.Let us pick up a couple of those points. Let us start with the to
:55:43. > :55:48.much power in one set of hands. Why I your party so determined to go
:55:48. > :55:53.ahead with this? We want greater accountability for what the police
:55:53. > :55:57.do. The public needs to know some and they have elected is
:55:57. > :56:07.accountable to them. The problem with police and authorities is
:56:07. > :56:08.
:56:08. > :56:12.nobody knows who were there aren't what they do. People would take a
:56:12. > :56:15.great deal of confidence knowing someone they have elected is
:56:15. > :56:19.standing for them. The person elected will not have day-to-day
:56:19. > :56:24.operational command of the police, they were not tell the Chief
:56:24. > :56:27.Constable what to do. They will be the people's representative in
:56:27. > :56:37.those meetings at police headquarters and reminding the
:56:37. > :56:38.
:56:38. > :56:46.Chief Constable about the work. chief constable said he didn't have
:56:46. > :56:50.any problem with the current system. What is wrong with the current
:56:50. > :56:54.system if people are happy with it? The current chief constable is
:56:54. > :56:59.doing a good job and he will run his foster the best of his
:57:00. > :57:09.abilities. The question here is public confidence and public
:57:09. > :57:13.accountability. If you have someone the public elects directly, that is
:57:14. > :57:17.the most important thing. The biggest complaint you have from
:57:17. > :57:21.local communities is what are the police doing and why are they not
:57:21. > :57:26.listening to us. This reform put the public voice at the heart of
:57:26. > :57:31.policing. I know you want to come in on this point. The public voice
:57:31. > :57:35.is an important point. If the public went the police to
:57:35. > :57:41.concentrate on a particular form of policing, why is that a bad thing.
:57:41. > :57:51.What was being argued there is that the police commissioner would not
:57:51. > :57:55.
:57:55. > :58:05.have direct control over day-to-day policing. The other point was the
:58:05. > :58:06.
:58:06. > :58:11.What is the point of spending �100 million on this contract you would
:58:11. > :58:16.have power in the hands of one politician while at the moment, the
:58:16. > :58:23.Kent police are authority has turned the odd members who are all
:58:23. > :58:27.elected meant birds. They are not elected to the police of poverty.
:58:27. > :58:33.They are put in place. They have a role to play and be cover the
:58:33. > :58:41.political spectrum. If the issue is that people do not know who or and
:58:41. > :58:46.dances, let us deal with that problem. They work with the police
:58:46. > :58:56.to deliver safer communities and safe at St. Let us talk about the
:58:56. > :58:58.
:58:58. > :59:02.issue of money. The Home Secretary says there are value for money.
:59:02. > :59:08.You're not taking into account the savings in the police of poverty
:59:08. > :59:14.Budget. That role will change with police commissioners coming in. You
:59:14. > :59:19.would have a leaner structure. The Kent police have done a good job on
:59:19. > :59:27.focusing savings on the backroom costs and efficiency is at keeping
:59:27. > :59:31.more money in the front line. They will be more resources in front
:59:31. > :59:34.line services after the reforms. Pike are very much for being with
:59:34. > :59:37.us today. We're back with education now, our
:59:37. > :59:39.political editor Louise Stewart has been looking at the problems and
:59:39. > :59:42.possible solutions for a Gravesend Primary where 63% of the children
:59:42. > :59:45.don't have English as a first language. Teachers at Chantry
:59:46. > :59:49.primary school says it's putting a strain on the education system.
:59:49. > :59:52.Well an intervention has come from on high. The Education Secretary,
:59:52. > :59:58.Michael Gove, has stepped in and linked the school with nearby
:59:58. > :00:07.Meopham Community Academy. Louise what's the idea behind linking
:00:07. > :00:11.these two schools? The whole idea is that the school was taking
:00:11. > :00:15.special measures last January. What is happening now is that it has
:00:15. > :00:21.made good progress since that time with an advisory head teacher being
:00:21. > :00:28.taken in. But from September, it will be linked with a community
:00:28. > :00:36.Academy. It is hoped that is now a standing school and this is all
:00:36. > :00:40.behind me to go's big idea on academies. They will be asked to be
:00:40. > :00:48.twinned with schools like this who have taken special measures who
:00:48. > :00:50.seemed to be failing schools. He believes this will bring them up.
:00:50. > :00:57.This is part of the education secretary Michael Gove's big plan
:00:57. > :01:03.to get every school to apply for academy status isn't it? Michael
:01:03. > :01:09.Gove has asked and written to every school asking them if they went to
:01:09. > :01:13.become academies. What that will give them is greater freedom from
:01:13. > :01:17.the local a authorities and from national government. They will be
:01:17. > :01:21.able to lengthen school terms if they want to. They will have much
:01:21. > :01:28.more say and they will be able to pay teachers what they want to know.
:01:28. > :01:33.They will be able to attract better teachers by paying more. In Kent,
:01:33. > :01:43.57 applications have been approved to become academies. 27 in Surrey.
:01:43. > :01:45.
:01:45. > :01:50.Medway has 10. West Sussex has five and East Sussex have one. This book
:01:50. > :01:57.to Paul Clark about academies, there is a stark difference between
:01:57. > :02:02.those under Tony Blair and those now. It is strange that they have
:02:02. > :02:07.the same name because they have a different philosophy. Many people
:02:07. > :02:16.said it was a good renaming. But this has been content just and
:02:16. > :02:22.confusing. The idea of academies for Tony Blair was failing schools.
:02:22. > :02:30.They would get more money and help with their infrastructure. That
:02:30. > :02:33.would help to bring standards up. These academies are elite schools
:02:33. > :02:38.which are already getting outstanding marks. That is the