:00:53. > :01:03.Will reduce housing benefit payments leave families in our
:01:03. > :01:03.
:01:03. > :40:05.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2342 seconds
:40:05. > :40:12.region without a roof over their Welcome to the Politics Show in the
:40:12. > :40:16.South East. Coming up, could the coalition government's benefit
:40:16. > :40:19.changes leave families homeless at Christmas?
:40:19. > :40:25.Already in the South East we have a thousand families being made
:40:25. > :40:30.homeless in the last quarter. Why super-hospitals could signal
:40:30. > :40:35.the end of local medical care. And Ashford's Immigration Minister
:40:35. > :40:39.comes under fire. Thousands of people across the
:40:39. > :40:42.South East will be worse off as a result of changes to housing
:40:42. > :40:48.benefit. Research from the Chartered Institute of Housing,
:40:48. > :40:53.which we can exclusively reveal suggests one in three people in
:40:53. > :40:58.Eastbourne alone will lose out. The local MP supports the changes,
:40:58. > :41:03.despite the fact that one in 10 of his constituents get help with
:41:03. > :41:13.their red -- of their rent. In a moment I will be speaking to him,
:41:13. > :41:19.but first this report. I'd read the last day of any month
:41:19. > :41:27.because if we do not pay, the next day they are on the phone
:41:27. > :41:34.threatening us with repossession. - - I dread. They put us in a room
:41:34. > :41:40.the size of allowed -- a large lounge. I pay �13 a month, which is
:41:40. > :41:45.what I can afford. It will take me 50 years plus to pay them back.
:41:45. > :41:52.35,000 households across the country face losing their homes
:41:52. > :41:56.between now and Christmas, one family every two minutes. The
:41:56. > :42:00.government is making cuts to housing benefits. Some areas of the
:42:00. > :42:08.South East have a higher than average number of people on housing
:42:08. > :42:12.benefits, especially in East Sussex. Shelter is running an awareness
:42:12. > :42:17.campaign. It is getting harder out there at a time when the wider
:42:18. > :42:22.living costs are starting to rise. In the South East we have 1,000
:42:22. > :42:27.families being made homeless in the last quarter. Changes to housing
:42:27. > :42:30.benefit are of particular concern in Eastbourne, which along with
:42:30. > :42:35.Hastings and Brighton has more people on housing benefits been
:42:35. > :42:44.anywhere else in the region. One in 10 people in the town gets housing
:42:44. > :42:48.benefit. The average in Kent is one in 14. The Politics Show has had an
:42:48. > :42:57.advance look at a report from the Chartered Institute of Housing
:42:57. > :43:04.which looks -- says that one in three residents in Eastbourne is
:43:04. > :43:09.set to lose out if they are on benefits. Nobody seems to account
:43:09. > :43:15.for the recession. Nobody thinks, we will keep it down a bit, give
:43:16. > :43:21.them a chance. It should be going up because the cost of living is
:43:21. > :43:25.going up. But they are reducing the benefits are. Housing benefits are
:43:25. > :43:29.available to tenants in social and private accommodation. Some changes
:43:29. > :43:35.were introduced in April and include introducing Max on local
:43:35. > :43:39.housing allowances, so that unless somebody's rent is in the lowest 30
:43:39. > :43:46.% in their area the benefit they will be paid will be less than
:43:46. > :43:55.their rent. There are more Chinese on the way in the New Year. -- and
:43:55. > :43:59.more changes. From the beginning of January 2012 the age will be
:43:59. > :44:03.increased to people under 35, meaning that in Eastbourne somebody
:44:03. > :44:08.would be receiving a reduced rate of housing benefit by approximately
:44:08. > :44:12.�45 a week. This is going to present a lot of difficulties to
:44:12. > :44:15.people, where they will have to consider moving to cheaper
:44:15. > :44:20.accommodation or shared accommodation. We have done a
:44:20. > :44:25.survey locally of properties that are available within that price
:44:25. > :44:29.bracket and we have found that only 5 % of the properties advertised
:44:29. > :44:35.would be affordable in that case. The shortage of suitable housing is
:44:35. > :44:39.not easy to fix. Local housing experts say there has been
:44:39. > :44:43.unintentional shift away from this kind of property. Eastbourne is
:44:43. > :44:53.less able to house some of its single people because it used to
:44:53. > :44:54.
:44:54. > :44:58.have more bed-and-breakfasts, which was seen as problem accommodation.
:44:58. > :45:07.What that means is the fall-out of that is that some people had
:45:07. > :45:12.nowhere to go at all. There are also signs that in the future there
:45:12. > :45:17.will not be a mixture of affluent and less well P -- less well-off
:45:17. > :45:22.people living side by side. There is a worried that people will be
:45:22. > :45:32.pushed into areas of deprivation with the cheapest housing. -- a
:45:32. > :45:34.
:45:34. > :45:37.worry. There will be a ghetto loaf reduced housing. We understand the
:45:37. > :45:41.government is dealing with an enormous deficit but it appears
:45:41. > :45:46.that they are targeting the people in society who are least able to
:45:46. > :45:50.afford it. With so many changes to housing benefit being brought in,
:45:50. > :45:54.thousands of people across the region are expected to fall behind
:45:55. > :45:58.on their rent, and the problem is expected to be particularly bad in
:45:58. > :46:02.Eastbourne, where a lot of residents are reliant on help with
:46:02. > :46:06.their housing costs. What can be done to ensure that thousands of
:46:06. > :46:12.people across the South East do not end up homeless?
:46:12. > :46:14.With me in the studio is Stephen Lloyd, the MP for Eastbourne. We
:46:14. > :46:19.know that more of that -- more than 3,000 people in Eastbourne will be
:46:19. > :46:23.worse off as a result of these changes, because we have had
:46:23. > :46:30.advance access to this report from the Chartered Institute of Housing.
:46:30. > :46:34.Why did you support a policy that is potentially so damaging? It is
:46:34. > :46:38.never as straightforward as that. One of the main reasons is that we
:46:38. > :46:43.have a situation in the UK built up over the last 30 years where quite
:46:43. > :46:48.often people who are out of work and on benefit can live in better
:46:48. > :46:53.houses that people in work. Something needed to be changed. I
:46:53. > :46:56.am working very close with the Chartered Institute of Housing in
:46:56. > :47:00.Eastbourne and the local authority to try to make sure that the
:47:00. > :47:07.changes are as smooth as possible. In Parliament and I have been
:47:07. > :47:14.lobbying very hard that the D W P allows as a default the landlords
:47:14. > :47:20.to receive the money directly. there anything else in the overall
:47:20. > :47:25.policy that you are less comfortable with? There is 1.
:47:25. > :47:35.Nobody likes cutting but I do believe the general direction is
:47:35. > :47:41.
:47:41. > :47:45.correct. I have lobbied Iain Duncan Smith personally about the change
:47:45. > :47:55.in benefit if you are under 25, that you can only receive benefit
:47:55. > :47:59.for a room, they are moving back to 35. Did you vote against that?
:47:59. > :48:05.came as a package and I voted in favour of the package but I spoke
:48:05. > :48:08.out against that. If you are they 35-year-old man and you have two
:48:08. > :48:16.children, where are you going to put them if they stay with you for
:48:16. > :48:21.a night? You might be a 28-year-old on the autistic spectrum and it
:48:21. > :48:27.would be very difficult for you to share a room. Up to now you would
:48:27. > :48:32.be able to have a one-bedroomed flat. In Eastbourne, there is just
:48:32. > :48:36.not the right kind of accommodation, there are not shared house is.
:48:36. > :48:41.don't agree with that. You have to understand that in difficult times
:48:41. > :48:50.a lot of people moved to the south coast. One of the challenges we
:48:50. > :48:57.have locally, and by get over 1,000 inquiries a month, so I know the
:48:57. > :49:01.issues, one of the problems that we have is that in recession and a
:49:01. > :49:05.difficult economic climate many people move to the south coast. One
:49:05. > :49:09.of the challenges is that we are trying to deal with people within
:49:09. > :49:15.Eastbourne who are waiting on the housing ladder while at the same
:49:15. > :49:20.time getting a fairly regular influx of people. You disagree that
:49:20. > :49:26.there is a shortage of bedsits and shared houses for people under 35?
:49:26. > :49:32.I do, that is why I continue to lobby the government. I also want
:49:32. > :49:40.more flexibility. You simply can't have a plumber working hard and
:49:40. > :49:50.only able to afford a certain rent, and a family down the road
:49:50. > :49:51.
:49:51. > :49:55.receiving more in benefits. At �20 billion the cost is enormous. --
:49:55. > :50:04.�20 billion a year. Why doesn't the Government go further? If you have
:50:04. > :50:12.one in 10 people in your constituency on housing benefits,
:50:12. > :50:19.you could have gone further. don't think that is being realistic.
:50:19. > :50:29.I think moving from 25-35 is unrealistic. I think it needs more
:50:29. > :50:33.
:50:33. > :50:39.realistic. -- more thought. The Housing Trust are working hard and
:50:39. > :50:45.they hope to have access to just... What happens when be discretionary
:50:45. > :50:50.won't -- money runs out? reality is we don't want people to
:50:50. > :50:56.lose their homes. The local authority still has a
:50:56. > :51:00.responsibility to look after them. They will not be hurled onto the
:51:00. > :51:05.street. I do think it is the right direction of travel, I just want
:51:05. > :51:11.the government to be more flexible. I am hopeful that we would get a
:51:11. > :51:21.bit of movement on that. Stephen Lloyd will join us on our next
:51:21. > :51:28.
:51:28. > :51:38.subject. There is a campaign to reopen a local hospital. Stephen
:51:38. > :51:44.Lloyd is fighting a proposal to close wards at Eastbourne Hospital.
:51:44. > :51:48.Is there anybody in your field to disagrees, who thinks the district
:51:48. > :51:53.hospitals are the future? There is a consensus that some things need
:51:53. > :51:59.to be done in bigger hospitals. Some kinds of specialised surgery
:51:59. > :52:02.for very young people, for cancer, the kind of high quality services
:52:02. > :52:06.which need to be done in specialised centres. That does not
:52:06. > :52:10.mean there are not going to be local services but a hospital that
:52:10. > :52:13.used to do everything needs to start doing different things. It is
:52:13. > :52:17.a question of how we can get changed in the health service but
:52:17. > :52:22.it is difficult to deliver this locally because people see service
:52:22. > :52:31.is going and they feel that they are losing them. Stephen Lloyd, you
:52:31. > :52:35.are running scared of the truth, the medical consensus we heard
:52:35. > :52:43.their -- and there is that there is better care in larger hospitals.
:52:43. > :52:46.You are scared of losing votes, aren't you? Unfortunately for Ruth,
:52:46. > :52:51.what she will not know is that locally there are exceptions to the
:52:51. > :53:01.rule. The breeze and his that we had a campaign around closing
:53:01. > :53:03.
:53:03. > :53:08.maternity a few years ago. -- the exception is. The road travel time
:53:08. > :53:12.from Eastbourne to Hastings was unacceptable for maternity. The
:53:12. > :53:19.manager's decision was overturned. I suspect they are trying to bring
:53:19. > :53:25.it back but if anything the roads have got worse. I understand her.,
:53:25. > :53:30.in areas like Oncology there are advantages to having a specialised
:53:30. > :53:35.unit. -- her point. People do appreciate having a local hospital
:53:35. > :53:42.because it is part of the community Gloup. I do not think one or the
:53:42. > :53:51.other is 100 % right or wrong. But you have to take an independent
:53:51. > :53:55.view of the hospital. You see that there is an argument for a super-
:53:55. > :54:05.hospitals across the country but you are not convinced of the
:54:05. > :54:08.
:54:08. > :54:14.argument in your constituency. What about the Conquest in Hastings?
:54:14. > :54:19.local MPs were in partnership with us a few years ago. The problem
:54:19. > :54:23.with biggest is best, which has been post for quite a few years ago,
:54:23. > :54:27.from a hospital perspective, is that it may sometimes look
:54:27. > :54:31.appropriate on paper and clinically... All of the medical
:54:31. > :54:36.experts agree about that. disagree, because one of the things
:54:36. > :54:44.that has changed in the last few years is the blanket approval that
:54:44. > :54:47.biggest is best... Let's go back to Ruth and see... An interesting
:54:47. > :54:53.article in the Guardian says that if you are going to move towards
:54:53. > :54:58.centralising services, you have to and -- carried the public would be.
:54:58. > :55:03.It seems that they think that all of the arguments are about money.
:55:03. > :55:08.There are lots of different issues here big -- and I can't comment on
:55:08. > :55:11.a local case. I think all the clinical evidence needs to be
:55:11. > :55:17.weighed about the local needs and the local needs are obviously
:55:17. > :55:21.difficult -- different in different areas. You will have older mothers
:55:21. > :55:26.in some areas, who will need different care. The discussion has
:55:26. > :55:30.to be had locally. But the difficulty is that if in an area
:55:30. > :55:40.and Max Dunn is preserved and Kit - - and maternity services are not
:55:40. > :55:44.
:55:44. > :55:51.cut, something else will be cut. -- and in -- if in an area and and --
:55:51. > :55:54.an accident mack is preserved. Of - - we need to release the money to
:55:54. > :55:59.start preventing some of this ill- health in the first place. That is
:55:59. > :56:03.a much bigger debate that also has to be had at a local level.
:56:03. > :56:08.other thing that frightens people is travelling times. A hospital
:56:08. > :56:14.might have bigger help -- better health care but it is further away
:56:14. > :56:18.and at worst it can be life threatening getting there. When you
:56:18. > :56:22.lay the evidence in front of people, for example in terms of stroke, if
:56:22. > :56:27.it is 10 minutes further away but you are getting better treatment,
:56:27. > :56:37.your survival will depend on that. If you explain that your relative
:56:37. > :56:37.
:56:37. > :56:42.will have a better survival rate further down the road... I think it
:56:42. > :56:45.is important to understand that once the attitude area is over
:56:45. > :56:49.people need to be moved back locally because that is where the
:56:49. > :56:53.best care will be delivered to get people better. Clearly families do
:56:53. > :56:58.not want to be travelling a long way. Both kinds of health services
:56:58. > :57:03.need to be developed but it is the trade-off between them that are the
:57:03. > :57:10.difficult conversations. We need to say that we have a cash limited
:57:10. > :57:14.system and the trade-offs are critical. It has been a bad week
:57:14. > :57:21.for Immigration Minister Damian Green, who has been under fire on
:57:21. > :57:30.two France and has faced tough questions about claims that
:57:30. > :57:35.ministers have weekend border controls. Louise Stewart joins us
:57:35. > :57:40.now. He is going to be in front of the Home Affairs Select Committee.
:57:40. > :57:44.What is the killer question? key question is what he knew and
:57:44. > :57:50.when. He is the Immigration Minister, so it is crucial the
:57:50. > :57:55.evidence he gives. There has been so much so far from Brodie Clark,
:57:55. > :58:05.from Theresa May. Arguably he is the man who would have known more
:58:05. > :58:05.
:58:05. > :58:13.about the day-to-day running of the UK border -- UK Border Agency.
:58:13. > :58:17.he can't answer the questions about how much he knew, it begs the
:58:17. > :58:22.question why he did not know. Is he not curious enough about his
:58:22. > :58:27.department? Yes, and Labour MPs have been making political capital
:58:27. > :58:33.out of this, asking him how many times he has visited airports,
:58:33. > :58:37.trying to get to, if he did not know, why not. I think he gave a
:58:37. > :58:42.pretty bullish performance in the Commons, he did not look like a man
:58:42. > :58:46.he was worried about his position, but he tried to open up the debate,
:58:46. > :58:56.saying they had to be cross-party debate about immigration and
:58:56. > :58:59.
:58:59. > :59:05.whether it had to be more risk led. Do you let schoolchildren through
:59:05. > :59:09.without questions, for example. The Conservatives always say they are
:59:09. > :59:14.tough on immigration and it seems like they are closing the door once
:59:14. > :59:19.the horse has bolted. He said he wanted a mature debate on
:59:19. > :59:23.immigration. Some people would welcome that, wouldn't they?
:59:23. > :59:28.Absolutely. I think there is a cross-party recognition at a time
:59:28. > :59:31.when they are making quite significant cuts to the UK Border
:59:31. > :59:36.Agency that they can't have the level of cheques that everybody is
:59:36. > :59:42.fingerprinted all the way through. He has to give evidence this
:59:42. > :59:46.Tuesday and the pressure is still very much on. Louise, thank you
:59:46. > :59:52.very much. That is it for this week. Thank you for watching. If you want