:00:30. > :00:33.In the South: The costs of policing after the
:00:33. > :00:36.riots - should we rethink police budgets cut?
:00:36. > :00:40.And from mice to miner birds - if you had to describe the Liberal
:00:40. > :00:50.Democrats as an animal, what we did be and why? Find out in half-an-
:00:50. > :00:50.
:00:50. > :36:22.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2132 seconds
:36:22. > :36:27.Hello and welcome to the part of the show especially for us here in
:36:28. > :36:33.the south. On today's show, what price the police service in the
:36:33. > :36:38.wake of this summer's riots. One Conservative MP tells us the cuts
:36:38. > :36:42.of wrong and what has happened to the strike over the city council's
:36:42. > :36:47.cuts to staff pay? I will be talking to management and union to
:36:47. > :36:52.find out if they have made any headway. But first, the Lib Dems
:36:52. > :36:56.are gathering in Birmingham. It is safe to say they have taken a
:36:56. > :37:06.nosedive in public opinion but we thought we would test that by
:37:06. > :37:12.
:37:13. > :37:22.asking people if the lead Dems were A mouse. Because they are quiet.
:37:23. > :37:28.
:37:28. > :37:37.Behind the scenes. A pig. They all are. A teddy bear. They are yellow.
:37:37. > :37:47.A badger. Because you do not see a lot of them. Possibly an otter.
:37:47. > :37:49.
:37:49. > :37:53.Slyly endangered but making strong return. Eight chihuahua. They are
:37:53. > :38:02.green and save the world, save the planet but sometimes they lose
:38:02. > :38:10.track of the real world. A mynah bird. Mimicking exactly what the
:38:10. > :38:14.Tories do. It was just a bit of fun and we will be trying it out on
:38:14. > :38:18.Labour and the Conservatives in future weeks. But now Peter is up
:38:18. > :38:25.in Birmingham in the thick of the Lib Dem Conference. Do they seem
:38:26. > :38:29.like otters or teddy bears to you? Not teddy bears! There is a touch
:38:29. > :38:36.of stardust he had the Lib Dem Conference. Hugh Grant, the actor,
:38:36. > :38:42.has had a meeting with the Nick Clegg, talking about phone hacking.
:38:42. > :38:47.That was a meeting organised by Evan Harris, former boxer Jack MP
:38:47. > :38:51.but now he is a thorn in the side of the coalition. Then there are
:38:51. > :38:55.all the councillors who lost their seats in the May election having
:38:55. > :39:00.lost the referendum on alternative vote. You would think the Lib Dems
:39:00. > :39:04.are down in the mouth. They are not. That stardust is helping a bit but
:39:04. > :39:09.there are a lot of them complaining at the grass roots. That is what
:39:09. > :39:15.they do at every conference. With me is the leader of Eastleigh
:39:15. > :39:22.Borough Council. Hugh Grant did have some great one-liners! We
:39:22. > :39:27.cannot repeat them! Some of the ministers as well. The conference
:39:27. > :39:33.slogan about being in government but does that make up for the sense
:39:33. > :39:37.of loss? There is something which is very unusual for Lib Dems. The
:39:37. > :39:43.first year was difficult for them. This time last year there were a
:39:43. > :39:50.lot of people saying, did we do the right thing? Some people laughing
:39:50. > :39:56.Nick Clegg, others live in him. The May elections were cathartic. It
:39:56. > :40:01.was said clearly, we are not in bed with the Tories. That is not what
:40:01. > :40:08.the public think. They say you are parroting the lines of the Tories.
:40:08. > :40:12.A I have been really pleased that the mood here is so positive,
:40:12. > :40:17.because we are getting things done in government. We have announced
:40:17. > :40:23.more money for pupils in deprived wards. Things that would never have
:40:23. > :40:29.been done by a Tory government. More money for infrastructure as
:40:29. > :40:34.well but it is about balancing the economy. Who would ever thought
:40:34. > :40:40.that Danny Alexander would be a start announcing more tax
:40:40. > :40:46.inspectors. Wonder.! But not for us. It is for us. We have to make sure
:40:46. > :40:51.we get spending in the South East as well. The south-east is the main
:40:51. > :40:58.engine in the economy. But if that stalls, there will be a massive
:40:58. > :41:01.loss of money for the Treasury. One of the messages we have to give is
:41:01. > :41:05.to make sure we have that investment in the south-east.
:41:05. > :41:12.Things like the new homes bonus people worry about because they
:41:12. > :41:16.think it is just councils trying to make money. There is not an open
:41:17. > :41:20.book for developers. We have slashed the building programme that
:41:20. > :41:25.was put forward by the last government which will save hundreds
:41:25. > :41:30.of acres of green field sites. Councils are not approaching it in
:41:30. > :41:36.that way but we have a real housing need and we do have to find places
:41:36. > :41:45.for homes to be built. suggestion is this is an open
:41:45. > :41:49.cheque, that councils will want to make money. Peanuts will be made.
:41:49. > :41:54.No council anywhere in the country will be influenced by the new homes
:41:54. > :41:59.bonus to say we will be allowing more building. Infrastructure costs
:41:59. > :42:04.are enormous. We need tens of millions of pounds to go along with
:42:04. > :42:13.new homes and we have to extract that from the developers. It is
:42:13. > :42:17.hard work. Thank you. This is not the first conference of the
:42:17. > :42:20.conference season. The smaller parties have been very busy and
:42:20. > :42:25.politicians from the south have been making waves at those
:42:25. > :42:29.gatherings across the country. Conference time is crunch time for
:42:29. > :42:34.party leaders. Some expected Britain's Caroline Lucas to be
:42:34. > :42:38.distracted by Westminster work but she was setting the tone at the
:42:38. > :42:42.Green Party's gathering in Sheffield. Nationally there are
:42:42. > :42:46.challenges because we have an electoral system stacked against us,
:42:46. > :42:54.but we are showing that despite that we can win our first seeds and
:42:54. > :42:59.so I would hope at the next election we might win. As well as
:42:59. > :43:07.David Cameron, the South is home to one other party leader -- Nigel
:43:07. > :43:10.Farage of the UKIP party. He had been knocked down for a while but
:43:10. > :43:16.for us back for his party conference in Eastbourne rebuffing
:43:16. > :43:22.criticism of his leadership been rung by star star. Thank you very
:43:22. > :43:27.much indeed. This is my first conference back as leader of UKIP
:43:27. > :43:32.at a time when absolutely everything we have stood for and
:43:32. > :43:39.fought for is now at the centre of the national debate. Nobody can say
:43:39. > :43:48.it other than a new kit man -- UKIP is a mainstream British party.
:43:48. > :43:50.year, are calls from delegates will have. Rollins roads and public
:43:50. > :43:55.demonstrations were proving effective in disputes over city
:43:55. > :44:00.council pay cuts and could be applied in national protests.
:44:00. > :44:06.give formal notice to 9,000 employers that we are now balloting
:44:06. > :44:14.for industrial action. We are proud to support must just this side but
:44:14. > :44:19.the move to industrial action ballots. We notice our intention to
:44:19. > :44:24.ballot for industrial action. will be the biggest trade union
:44:24. > :44:27.mobilisation for a generation. are likely to see the first co-
:44:27. > :44:33.ordinated union protests in November over changes to public
:44:33. > :44:36.sector pensions. An important thing for the Coalition for if Lib Dem
:44:36. > :44:40.ministers involved to see how they will be dealing with industrial
:44:40. > :44:45.dispute in the future and there will be questions from the
:44:45. > :44:48.grassroots for those ministers. They do not like ministers being
:44:48. > :44:53.self-important but they liked the fact that the country is taking
:44:53. > :44:57.notice of what the Lib Dems think. For the best part of the year
:44:57. > :45:02.around has been rumbling away at Southampton City Council to save
:45:02. > :45:07.money and jobs, the council wanted to reduce pay and change terms and
:45:07. > :45:11.conditions. 99 % of workers have signed new contract in July but
:45:11. > :45:15.this dispute is far from over. Unison and denied members took part
:45:15. > :45:23.in strike action this summer and are still working to rule. Joining
:45:23. > :45:28.me to discuss where we go from here is councillor Jeremy Malton. The
:45:28. > :45:34.contracts have been signed, do you think you can force a U-turn?
:45:34. > :45:41.We have been in negotiations now for some town which had led to some
:45:41. > :45:43.new proposals. That proposal was rejected because it was not good
:45:44. > :45:48.enough and reopened negotiations. The strikes have proved our members
:45:48. > :45:52.on not accept a pay cut so we will continue with the strikes or
:45:52. > :45:59.negotiations depending on which will bring a resolution. You are
:45:59. > :46:03.also thinking of legal action. One is already in the tribunal for
:46:03. > :46:07.lack of consultation and we have 500 unfair dismissal claims to
:46:07. > :46:11.submit and Unite have 300 claims to submit which will happen in the
:46:11. > :46:18.next few days. This was meant to save you money but hearing about
:46:18. > :46:23.legal action, you have had to make concessions. It is about saving
:46:23. > :46:27.money but also about protecting jobs and services. We do think it
:46:27. > :46:32.is the right thing to do. There is an alternative and the Labour group
:46:32. > :46:36.have said they would get rid of 1,500 jobs at the council. That is
:46:37. > :46:41.what we want to avoid but since we were last here, we have made huge
:46:41. > :46:45.progress and we are much closer together now and that proposal that
:46:45. > :46:49.Andy talked about, that is something we want to see go to all
:46:49. > :46:55.the union members. You say you have made progress but there are threats
:46:56. > :46:59.of further strikes, so it does not sound like it is going well. There
:46:59. > :47:03.is an understanding now from the union side that there is not the
:47:03. > :47:08.money that perhaps they thought there was an certainly from the
:47:08. > :47:12.council's side we have shown we are willing to move opposition. That
:47:12. > :47:17.proposal is worth a million pounds to council employers. If that is a
:47:17. > :47:22.good deal. We are working on how we can strengthen that and hopefully
:47:22. > :47:25.that can go to all council staff and reach an agreement. Are you
:47:25. > :47:34.making progress because it does not seem to match up that staff are
:47:34. > :47:37.talking about more strikes and yet we are hearing of progress.
:47:37. > :47:42.Discussions have improved and we have been continuing with them. The
:47:42. > :47:47.problem was if you put an extra million pounds into our members'
:47:47. > :47:51.pockets, the trouble is the council took �6 million out of their wages.
:47:51. > :47:55.We are a long way off of where our members want to be but we will
:47:55. > :48:00.continue discussions and we will make a decision on whether the
:48:00. > :48:09.offer is good enough or not. At the moment it is not. We will not put
:48:09. > :48:14.the last offer back to it, members. Four asked to have a ballot, the
:48:14. > :48:18.offer needs to improve. People who are looking outside of their
:48:18. > :48:23.windows and seeing their bins are not collected, they want to know
:48:23. > :48:27.when you will resolve this. How long will it take? We are
:48:27. > :48:32.continuing fierce discussions and we will meet Again with Andy and
:48:32. > :48:35.other unions to try and get that deal discussed back in August
:48:36. > :48:43.fleshed out and hopefully something they feel they can take to all
:48:43. > :48:49.their members. The public are still suffering because there is this
:48:49. > :48:52.work to Raul and particularly with the bin collections staff, that is
:48:52. > :48:59.meaning people are not getting their bins collected when it should
:48:59. > :49:03.be and that is causing a lot of problems. But what are you doing to
:49:03. > :49:10.try to improve morale? You have a lot of staff who are unhappy at how
:49:10. > :49:14.you are treating them. We are trying to make it clear to them
:49:14. > :49:18.that this is about protecting jobs and social workers who have been on
:49:18. > :49:24.strike, we have said to them all their jobs are safe, we are
:49:24. > :49:27.recruiting more people. One thing I have done is I have been around the
:49:27. > :49:31.building they were again that they have complaints about and we have
:49:32. > :49:36.drawn up a list of things to improve. We are looking at all
:49:36. > :49:41.possible options but at the root of it is our message that we want to
:49:41. > :49:46.keep more people in work delivering those services. Do you think your
:49:46. > :49:51.members have the stamina to see this through? Will they keep going
:49:51. > :49:56.with this strike and this action? think they will. They are angry
:49:56. > :49:59.about the money that has been taken from their wages. The November
:49:59. > :50:07.strikes up over the national government going to take money out
:50:07. > :50:12.of their wages. Our members are under attack in not -- by not only
:50:12. > :50:22.the national government but the council. They are not working for
:50:22. > :50:23.
:50:23. > :50:28.less money, people keep dipping into their pockets. Thank you both
:50:28. > :50:33.for coming in today. We will update people on what happens in future.
:50:33. > :50:36.The idea is to make sure criminals fear the police. That is the
:50:36. > :50:40.thinking of the new met Police Commissioner Bernard Hogan-Howe. He
:50:40. > :50:45.made the statement when he started his new job but with police budgets
:50:45. > :50:50.being cut by 20 %, will there be enough coppers to make the robbers
:50:50. > :51:00.are afraid? Even in Dorset there is concern about how the police can
:51:00. > :51:01.
:51:01. > :51:05.Like forces up and down the country, Dorset sent several dozen officers
:51:05. > :51:10.to the capital and elsewhere to help restore order after the riots.
:51:10. > :51:18.Also like forces across England and Wales, Dorset are facing cuts of 20
:51:18. > :51:22.%. Locally that means over 100 police officers and 145 support
:51:22. > :51:27.staff are to go. Other savings include the closure of the 24 hour
:51:27. > :51:31.custody suite here, one of only three in the whole county. Cuts to
:51:31. > :51:36.the police marine section and the halving of the flying time of the
:51:36. > :51:41.Dorset police helicopter. These tours -- to MPs are partners in the
:51:41. > :51:46.coalition but phone be the impact of a cut on policing the County.
:51:46. > :51:52.do live in austere times but I am against the cuts as they are
:51:52. > :51:56.proposed in the police. It is incredibly challenging for police
:51:56. > :52:01.forces and particularly for Dorset. Let's look for efficiencies that
:52:01. > :52:04.are not affecting frontline services. I want to see it our
:52:04. > :52:08.policemen out on the streets rather than being tied up with paperwork
:52:08. > :52:13.and that bureaucracy has been an issue ever since I have been an MP.
:52:13. > :52:17.If we can get to grips with that, then a good job will have been done.
:52:17. > :52:23.The police should not be tampered with. The police numbers should
:52:23. > :52:29.remain as they are. Police homes, houses and offices should be
:52:29. > :52:34.reopened. Their reliance on IT, CCTV, of course they are important
:52:34. > :52:38.but what is most important is human intelligence and that is putting an
:52:38. > :52:44.officer in every village, town and insuring the public have access to
:52:44. > :52:48.them 24 hours a day. That have caused is highly unlikely. Labour
:52:48. > :52:53.meanwhile say the 20 % cuts are irresponsible and the former Labour
:52:53. > :52:59.MP for South Dorset who lost his seat degrees of. I am very
:52:59. > :53:05.pessimistic about the impact on crime and on people's sense of
:53:05. > :53:09.safety in Dorset. We are lucky in Dorset. We have low levels of crime
:53:09. > :53:13.but whole communities will feel abandoned. They have is a certain
:53:13. > :53:19.amount it will not achieve it but at less they have professionals to
:53:19. > :53:24.work with, they will not be able to do a professional job. 20 % cuts
:53:24. > :53:31.are unrealistic. We said a certain amount of cuts will be necessary to
:53:31. > :53:35.make the contribution to deficit reduction, but 20 %, nationally as
:53:35. > :53:41.16,000 police, that is the same number that was needed to restore
:53:41. > :53:45.order after the riots. Last year, Her Majesty's Inspectorate of
:53:45. > :53:50.Constabulary said forces should be cut by 12 % and any more would
:53:50. > :53:53.impact frontline services. But speaking earlier this year,
:53:53. > :53:58.Dorset's Chief Constable said they were in the position to make the
:53:58. > :54:06.savings of 20 %. We have to save �18 million over the next four
:54:06. > :54:11.years. So it is quite a substantial saving to say the least. Having
:54:11. > :54:15.said that, we have been changing the force for a number of years,
:54:15. > :54:19.incremental development, we have put ourselves in a good place.
:54:19. > :54:25.There is no hiding from the fact it will cause a difficult decisions
:54:25. > :54:29.but what we have is a good process to make sure that we are as good as
:54:29. > :54:34.we can be with the resources we have. The organisation that
:54:34. > :54:38.represents the rank and file is less optimistic. My concerns are
:54:38. > :54:44.that the government are cutting far too much too quickly. They are
:54:44. > :54:47.cutting police budgets by 20 %. It will impact frontline services as
:54:47. > :54:52.we can see in relation to the helicopter. I have would ask the
:54:52. > :54:57.government to heed the advice of Her Majesty's Inspectorate of
:54:57. > :55:01.Constabulary and only go to top the cent. There is a growing clamour
:55:01. > :55:06.for the scale of the cuts to be reviewed. Which the Prime Minister
:55:06. > :55:12.responded to in Parliament this week. Even after the changes, the
:55:12. > :55:17.police will be able to surge in the way they did in Croydon, Tottenham,
:55:17. > :55:21.Manchester and Salford. The problem on the night of the riots was that
:55:21. > :55:25.surge did not take place soon enough. What is so complacent about
:55:25. > :55:30.the party opposite is they are not prepared to consider any reforms to
:55:30. > :55:34.get more police on to the frontline, on to our streets. The team cast
:55:34. > :55:37.with delivering the cars in Dorset is being monitored and their
:55:37. > :55:43.progress will be reviewed again at the next meeting of the police
:55:43. > :55:47.authority in a week's time. That is about it for our part of
:55:47. > :55:53.the show. Peter will be reporting from the Lib Dem Conference
:55:53. > :55:58.throughout the week. You can keep up-to-date with all things
:55:58. > :56:02.political here in the self by following Peter's blog. Next week
:56:02. > :56:05.we will be looking at the contentious issue of changes to