:00:00. > :00:28.Tonight: Anna Lo provokes a storm of criticism from unionists as she
:00:29. > :00:30.announces support for a united Ireland and brands Northern Ireland
:00:31. > :00:36.as 'artificial'. But what does her party leader make of it? I'll be
:00:37. > :00:40.asking David Ford for his views and hearing from two very different
:00:41. > :00:44.shades of unionism. Also on the programme: Gleaming
:00:45. > :00:47.civic monuments or white elephants? Why have so many councils splashed
:00:48. > :00:53.out on top-notch headquarters ahead of major reforms that could render
:00:54. > :00:54.them redundant? Plus find out what's got Arlene Foster dancing in the
:00:55. > :01:00.streets. And two new faces in Commentators'
:01:01. > :01:06.Corner - academic Cathy Gormley Heenan and columnist and satirist
:01:07. > :01:10.Newton Emerson. And you can, of course, follow the debate on Twitter
:01:11. > :01:16.during, and after, the programme - that's @BBCtheview.
:01:17. > :01:20.Good evening. The Alliance Party might have been hoping to grab a few
:01:21. > :01:23.headlines this weekend with its annual conference, but no-one would
:01:24. > :01:27.have predicted the political firestorm that's threatening to
:01:28. > :01:30.overshadow proceedings. Comments by the party's Euro candidate and South
:01:31. > :01:35.Belfast MLA, Anna Lo, supporting a united Ireland have provoked fury
:01:36. > :01:38.among unionists. Traditionally agnostic on the constitutional
:01:39. > :01:43.question, Alliance dislikes being pigeon-holed as either unionist or
:01:44. > :01:47.nationalist. In an interview with the Irish News today, however, Anna
:01:48. > :01:53.Lo says she would ultimately like to see a united Ireland. She describes
:01:54. > :01:56.partition and the creation of Northern Ireland as "artificial",
:01:57. > :01:59.and says a united Ireland would be "better placed economically,
:02:00. > :02:06.socially and politically". So, how has that gone down with the party
:02:07. > :02:11.leadership? David Ford joins me now. The evening. Thanks very much for
:02:12. > :02:17.joining us. Some people might be surprised that you are sitting here
:02:18. > :02:23.tonight rather than Anna Lo. I was invited.
:02:24. > :02:26.That was the message I got. We were delighted to have you here but we
:02:27. > :02:29.did first of all ask for another blow to be on the programme and told
:02:30. > :02:36.she wasn't available. -- for Anna Lo.
:02:37. > :02:41.She has spent the last two days in the Assembly chamber, effectively
:02:42. > :02:47.leading on three of the six sections because of her role and she spent
:02:48. > :02:53.today working on the half of her constituents so she has had a busy
:02:54. > :02:59.week. If you look at Eric? Her record, she has had a successful
:03:00. > :03:03.time. -- if you look at her record. I am sure you have been busy as
:03:04. > :03:08.well, as Justice Minister. This perhaps is a reflection on the
:03:09. > :03:11.seriousness of the situation for your party?
:03:12. > :03:16.I find this bizarre because two years ago in a conference speech I
:03:17. > :03:22.talked about the diversity of backgrounds the Alliance party. I
:03:23. > :03:29.said some purpose in -- some people would have long-term nationalist
:03:30. > :03:39.views. Nobody batted an eyelid. I would prefer to talk about work we
:03:40. > :03:44.are doing an Alliance proposals. Have you spoken to Anna Lo?
:03:45. > :03:48.Yes. She spoke to me this evening and she was concerned about the way
:03:49. > :03:54.she was being described as a nationalist, expressing a view about
:03:55. > :04:02.a long-term potential future. People have described her as nationalist
:04:03. > :04:05.but she sits on Assembly the same as the rest of us because that is their
:04:06. > :04:09.primary focus, like the rest of the Alliance group. So it is a very
:04:10. > :04:13.personal view. Yes.
:04:14. > :04:18.And we have made it clear there are a range of personal views and there
:04:19. > :04:22.is a commitment to building a united community which is the defining
:04:23. > :04:26.point for Alliance. We don't define ourselves by the lines on a map, we
:04:27. > :04:31.define ourselves by the type of society we want.
:04:32. > :04:36.But she did say she supports the idea of a united Ireland and she
:04:37. > :04:40.thinks of the creation of Northern Ireland as artificial. She made a
:04:41. > :04:44.comment about being anti-colonial. Whether you like it or not, that has
:04:45. > :04:50.provoked quite a ruckus on the Unionist benches. There was a
:04:51. > :04:55.statement released today saying that Anna Lo needs to apologise and
:04:56. > :05:00.withdraw her comments, making it clear she made a mistake.
:05:01. > :05:04.Talk about apology, this last time I was sitting in this chair it was
:05:05. > :05:10.discussing on the runs and I was accused by one DUP member around and
:05:11. > :05:20.issues relating to the police report which came up around the same sort
:05:21. > :05:27.of time as being" a little Nero" . There have been no apology on that.
:05:28. > :05:31.A reference to colonialism is considered more serious by the DUP
:05:32. > :05:36.than equating the Democratic politician with a mass murderer. You
:05:37. > :05:38.can for inferences from all sorts of things.
:05:39. > :05:46.You might comment on your former deputy leader who is a commentator,
:05:47. > :05:51.he said that the comments of Anna Lo were damaging to the party. Is that
:05:52. > :05:54.right? He says lots of things as a paid commentator for the BBC.
:05:55. > :05:59.He's not particularly in touch with party thinking and to the best of my
:06:00. > :06:04.knowledge, he hasn't been with the team for many years. I don't know
:06:05. > :06:08.how he would know how people are reacting because I would not have
:06:09. > :06:13.thought we have had an opposition damaged by recent events. The issue
:06:14. > :06:17.might be this - the Alliance party has come under witticisms from
:06:18. > :06:22.Unionists over the flag issue. You are aware of that.
:06:23. > :06:29.Most of it is incorrect and ill informed. Your critics say that it
:06:30. > :06:35.wants to water down the petitioners and the comments of Anna Lo play
:06:36. > :06:43.into their hands. -- the Britishness. That was nothing
:06:44. > :06:47.to do with Naomi Long and it was an issue where Alliance produced a
:06:48. > :06:57.balanced arrangement for a divided city as part of the United kingdom.
:06:58. > :07:00.So, yes, our critics will attack us. That is what happens when you are a
:07:01. > :07:07.significant political party and we are achieving things. Naomi Long is
:07:08. > :07:10.achieving things at Westminster. We are achieving things in the Assembly
:07:11. > :07:17.as well. What I want to know is if you think Anna Lo has created a
:07:18. > :07:19.stick to beat her own back with the comments she made?
:07:20. > :07:24.She is your European candidate and she is going to have a tough fight
:07:25. > :07:27.on her hands. I wonder if she has kissed goodbye to a knot of soft
:07:28. > :07:34.Unionist transfers because she is not sitting on the fence any more
:07:35. > :07:39.and she is supporting the idea of a united Ireland.
:07:40. > :07:42.She said she supported the principle of consent, which is party policy.
:07:43. > :07:48.She said she didn't think any change will likely in the short and medium
:07:49. > :07:55.term and I'm not sure she even thought it was likely at all.
:07:56. > :07:58.To be clear, if the Alliance party policy a united Ireland with
:07:59. > :08:06.consent? No, it is the principle of consent
:08:07. > :08:11.based on the good Friday agreement. That could be a long-term aspiration
:08:12. > :08:17.for some people won't way or another but we want Northern Ireland to work
:08:18. > :08:21.as a successful community and economy. You don't think it will
:08:22. > :08:25.damage your campaign is a Europe candidate?
:08:26. > :08:30.I see no evidence for that. Might it damage the Naomi Long
:08:31. > :08:34.campaign? Given that we have said we are a
:08:35. > :08:39.diverse party, why would the individual view of one person affect
:08:40. > :08:44.the electoral chances of another? A storm in a teacup?
:08:45. > :08:49.I think it has given the media a 24-hour wonder.
:08:50. > :08:51.It illustrates the diversity of opinions within Alliance but it did
:08:52. > :08:57.strictly commitment to build a united community.
:08:58. > :09:01.She retains your full support, does she, as an MLA for South Belfast,
:09:02. > :09:06.chair of the environment committee and your European candidate?
:09:07. > :09:12.Nobody is more important than anybody else but she has my full
:09:13. > :09:16.support because her views are within the Alliance party and she went into
:09:17. > :09:22.a longer term aspiration which not everybody would share that the key
:09:23. > :09:30.policy about consent was within party policy.
:09:31. > :09:34.We are also joined by the DUP MP for North Antrim, Ian Paisley, and John
:09:35. > :09:45.McCallister of NI21. Storm in a teacup? The comments were shocking.
:09:46. > :09:50.Anna Lo is a paid elected representative and that is language
:09:51. > :09:56.Unionists have always been insulted by and felt it was very damaging to
:09:57. > :10:03.us. The question isn't where Anna Lo is tonight. She has been transparent
:10:04. > :10:08.about her position but where is the Alliance party? It has a policy
:10:09. > :10:12.based on confusion. It is a house divided against itself cannot stand.
:10:13. > :10:18.If there was a border poll tomorrow, where would it stand? But there
:10:19. > :10:21.isn't going to be. But it is a question, it doesn't
:10:22. > :10:27.know what it stands for on this key issue which, whether people are
:10:28. > :10:30.moving on or not in Northern Ireland, it is still an important
:10:31. > :10:34.issue and it goes to the heart of being honest with people.
:10:35. > :10:42.The party should be taking a position. David in the past have
:10:43. > :10:51.said he was sick in his stomach when he was in the divine in 2001. -- the
:10:52. > :10:56.pantomime. Now Anna Lo has a Republican aspiration and I think
:10:57. > :11:11.the question is where is Naomi Long? Is cheap pro-or anti-quiz-mac
:11:12. > :11:16.-- is she pro-or anti-quiz-mac a house divided is a house in severe
:11:17. > :11:22.difficulty. It is united on the key issue that
:11:23. > :11:30.divides the Alliance party. We want to build a united community.
:11:31. > :11:36.But it is confusing. As you just said, there isn't going
:11:37. > :11:42.to be a border poll was that not the case? The Alliance party campaigned
:11:43. > :11:47.for Northern Ireland to stay in the United Kingdom but now a leader has
:11:48. > :11:57.said she supports united Ireland. What would you do?
:11:58. > :12:03.Since 1921 and 1973, position has changed significantly. We are not
:12:04. > :12:09.talking about a choice. We are actually talking about a complex set
:12:10. > :12:15.of relationships within Northern Ireland and the relationships
:12:16. > :12:18.between people within these islands. But you are not sending out a clear
:12:19. > :12:27.message to people so they can understand way things stand.
:12:28. > :12:30.We are committed to building a community for the people of Northern
:12:31. > :12:34.Ireland, regardless of the Constitution, because that is the
:12:35. > :12:38.issue which creates faculties and it bites the development of our
:12:39. > :12:46.children's lives and the opportunity for them to build up in today's
:12:47. > :12:54.society. John McCallister, where do you stand on this? One of our key
:12:55. > :12:58.things is that we need the Northern Ireland to build a sense of the Wii
:12:59. > :13:03.instead of us and them and I think a key way of doing that is to build on
:13:04. > :13:08.a Northern Arras identity. If you describe it as artificial, that
:13:09. > :13:14.brings into question that whole question of a Northern Irish
:13:15. > :13:17.identity. The remarks Anna Lo made a road in the artificial I think
:13:18. > :13:24.belong to a different era. It has nothing to do with where we are from
:13:25. > :13:27.the Good Friday Agreement and in the debate on local government reform
:13:28. > :13:32.and the red flags we would have supported some of the Alliance
:13:33. > :13:35.amendments that that type of language is not representative of
:13:36. > :13:41.what the Good Friday Agreement was about. It is quite a complex issue
:13:42. > :13:45.and maybe we shouldn't over civil Fayette. I did an interview with
:13:46. > :13:51.Anna Lo last year about identity and she said, my identity would be
:13:52. > :13:57.Northern Irish. I don't see myself as Irish at all. How does that
:13:58. > :14:03.square with seeing Northern Ireland as an artificial state? Don't ask me
:14:04. > :14:12.but you have to take on board other comments. I do believe in a Northern
:14:13. > :14:18.Irish identity. You were standing up in the chamber last night telling us
:14:19. > :14:22.all how Irish you are, how proud you were of the Irish rugby team and win
:14:23. > :14:28.you were good but valid DUP you to get your British passport and said
:14:29. > :14:34.you were absolutely an Irishman. You have no difficulty seeing that. I am
:14:35. > :14:41.as good an Irishman as anyone in that chamber, and Northern Irish and
:14:42. > :14:44.British identity is more complex. My difficulty with other's comment is
:14:45. > :14:51.that to suggest Northern Ireland is an artificial state gives away from
:14:52. > :14:55.the original settlement in 1998 and at the moment I feel NI21 is the
:14:56. > :15:03.only party standing up or the Good Friday Agreement. The DUP and UUP,
:15:04. > :15:08.Sinn Fein are moving away from it, all wanting to reinforce us and them
:15:09. > :15:13.politics. Alliance cannot be the halfway point between two extremes
:15:14. > :15:20.and call that the centre ground. Ian Paisley, you were laughing but that
:15:21. > :15:22.needed to you you were being a bit mischievous with this because you
:15:23. > :15:27.yourself have said you are Irish and your father has also said he would
:15:28. > :15:32.never deny he was Irish. You were talking about identity, and that is
:15:33. > :15:37.separate from policy, which is where we are and what we want to cheap in
:15:38. > :15:43.politics. The issue for people today is, do they have strong Unionist
:15:44. > :15:47.representation will be have representation that will take away
:15:48. > :15:51.their union? The union represents all the things and says she is
:15:52. > :15:58.trying to achieve in her beaded Ireland policy, a strong economy,
:15:59. > :16:01.strong social background, and thinks Northern Ireland citizens would be
:16:02. > :16:07.better off in the Republic of Ireland, which we yelled out. That
:16:08. > :16:15.is the critical point, she is not talking about next year. There are
:16:16. > :16:20.all those things which she says she is supporting for a state which
:16:21. > :16:24.frankly she does not hold a candle to in terms of the policies endorsed
:16:25. > :16:30.by that state. People out there want to know if they have strong positive
:16:31. > :16:35.Unionists representing them or a mishmash of nationalism,
:16:36. > :16:42.republicanism and something we do not know what it means is a halfway
:16:43. > :16:46.house. That is the point, you have made a problem or there was not a
:16:47. > :16:51.problem and Anna Lo has made life difficult, especially for Naomi Long
:16:52. > :16:56.in East Belfast because people don't know who you are or what we would --
:16:57. > :17:03.or what you represent. People know what we represent. John said we were
:17:04. > :17:09.a halfway house. That is not what the Alliance Party is. It is a party
:17:10. > :17:12.with commit and to its principles. We did set ourselves halfway between
:17:13. > :17:18.other people but by what we believe is right to develop this economy
:17:19. > :17:22.come to develop a shared future and provide a better chance for all our
:17:23. > :17:27.people, and that often puts us in disagreement with both of them. If
:17:28. > :17:31.someone happens to make a remark about a long-term issue that doesn't
:17:32. > :17:39.over it from where the party is united and what we are seeking to do
:17:40. > :17:44.to build up immunity. Ian Paisley. It is a 2-page interview and a play
:17:45. > :17:52.a politician I think to become representative. She talks about
:17:53. > :17:54.other issues as well. You are hopping mad tonight, we have seen
:17:55. > :17:59.statements from other members of your party. You've been very quick
:18:00. > :18:04.to condemn Anna Lo. You have not been so quick, and a lot of people
:18:05. > :18:08.have pointed this out on social media, you've not been so quick to
:18:09. > :18:12.condemn the PUP leader Billy Hutchinson's comments, where he said
:18:13. > :18:14.he had no regrets in terms of his past because he believed he
:18:15. > :18:20.contributed to preventing a united Ireland. Let's not forget, that in
:18:21. > :18:26.the context of the fact that he pleaded guilty to killing two
:18:27. > :18:31.Catholic men in 1974. Murdering in a disgraceful and evil way. Why isn't
:18:32. > :18:39.the DUP demanding an apology from him? I was asked to come on to talk
:18:40. > :18:43.about Anna Lo. The Lee Hutchinson comment is disgraceful and it shows
:18:44. > :18:49.the Lee Hutchinson thinks killing Catholics is the best way to
:18:50. > :18:54.preserve the union, it is the way to destroy the union and I am happy to
:18:55. > :19:02.condemn it. Members of my party in South Antrim issued statements to
:19:03. > :19:08.the local press. Hard to find. I don't think you will find any water
:19:09. > :19:16.in that argument with me. Billy Hutchinson's remarks were a pulse
:19:17. > :19:21.of, appalling remarks to make -- reports of -- propulsive and they
:19:22. > :19:27.should not be in any form of political thinking. There was never
:19:28. > :19:30.a place for that type of thinking in Northern Ireland and there is none
:19:31. > :19:35.in the future. We need to leave it there. I suspect it is a subject we
:19:36. > :19:42.will return to in the future. Interesting to see if it covers your
:19:43. > :19:47.party conference on Saturday. I'm sure it will be raised. Thank you
:19:48. > :19:50.all very much. RPA, the Reform of Public
:19:51. > :19:53.Administration, was meant to save ratepayers money. Yesterday MLAs
:19:54. > :19:56.approved a large increase in the money paid to councillors elected to
:19:57. > :19:59.the 11 new "super councils". Now a former boundary commissioner has
:20:00. > :20:02.told The View that ratepayers could be paying for several opulent new
:20:03. > :20:04.council headquarters for generations, buildings erected
:20:05. > :20:08.before members of the new bodies have even decided where they'll sit.
:20:09. > :20:14.Maurice Hayes says he fears some of them could become white elephants,
:20:15. > :20:18.as Gareth Gordon now reports. This is mostly male in Newtownabbey.
:20:19. > :20:25.Council officers don't come more opulent nonetheless I smack Mossley
:20:26. > :20:33.mill. This is the equally opulent Antrim Civic Centre, opened in 2006
:20:34. > :20:37.at a cost of almost ?10 million. These two gleaming examples of civic
:20:38. > :20:43.pride are no more than 15 miles apart. Metaphorically they are about
:20:44. > :20:47.to get even closer. And from an Newtownabbey will join to become one
:20:48. > :20:54.super council which means one of these buildings will be surplus to
:20:55. > :20:57.requirements. Right? Wrong. Both buildings are community buildings
:20:58. > :21:03.that are used for front line services and for that unity to come
:21:04. > :21:08.in and see. They will have to be a decision on where meetings are held.
:21:09. > :21:12.We are fortunate that we are only a few miles apart and travelling
:21:13. > :21:15.distance is not significant but for others there are significant
:21:16. > :21:20.travelling distances, so I would say with buildings will be maintained.
:21:21. > :21:27.It is important for ratepayers to note these are significant to
:21:28. > :21:31.military assets. But for two Antrim. Impressive not on the scale of its
:21:32. > :21:40.Big Brother, so do councillors fear for its future? This building is
:21:41. > :21:44.used daily. Even today you would have space getting a room inside
:21:45. > :21:53.this building because it is being used by all kinds of organisations,
:21:54. > :22:00.it is well used. But it was used as a council headquarters. But the sign
:22:01. > :22:04.says Civic Centre. Do you think the Civic Centre is built recently
:22:05. > :22:11.should not have been built given we knew the RPA was coming and the
:22:12. > :22:18.councils were becoming 11. In some cases maybe not. It is not just
:22:19. > :22:23.ratepayers in Newtownabbey and Antrim who have new council offices.
:22:24. > :22:31.Lisburn's was the costliest at ?22 million, Coleraine's cost nearly 7
:22:32. > :22:38.million, and Castlereagh's was opened with a ?7 million by stag and
:22:39. > :22:44.the newest at Downpatrick at a cost of ?11 million. This Downpatrick
:22:45. > :22:48.resident, a former boundary commission for Northern Ireland, is
:22:49. > :22:56.suspicious of the motives for building such opulent headquarters.
:22:57. > :23:01.A lot of this, and we sort in 1973, was people making a pre-emptive bid
:23:02. > :23:05.for a headquarters and thinking if they put up a great building someone
:23:06. > :23:12.would have to fill it, but that is not a universal rail -- rule. There
:23:13. > :23:16.are white elephants around the country. These things will saddle
:23:17. > :23:24.the rate fears for generations if they are not required. This area
:23:25. > :23:30.stretching from Kevin she across two South Armagh, one would say
:23:31. > :23:36.logically, the centre of that is Newry, and still there is no
:23:37. > :23:42.commonality of interest. People around here do not look towards
:23:43. > :23:49.Newry for anything, so maybe they are right to think in terms of a two
:23:50. > :23:56.headed organisation, but these are questions I think should have been
:23:57. > :24:02.settled by consensus between the parties who will actually be running
:24:03. > :24:06.the place. Down is not done yet. It is about to spend more money,
:24:07. > :24:10.although less than ?30,000 getting its council chamber ready for
:24:11. > :24:17.meetings of the new shadow body. Newry and more fans to spent almost
:24:18. > :24:23.?350,000 on its new headquarters so it can hold meetings of the same
:24:24. > :24:26.super council. The minister responsible for local government
:24:27. > :24:30.reform says he is not concerned about the numbers of new
:24:31. > :24:34.headquarters which have been built. This will be in a season for the new
:24:35. > :24:39.councils, how they use their assets or how they choose to dispose of
:24:40. > :24:43.their assets. What I do have to do is make sure they do so in a way
:24:44. > :24:51.that represents best value for ratepayers. Others believe it could
:24:52. > :24:55.have been handled differently. Perhaps there could have been
:24:56. > :24:59.oversight of what was proposed and expenditure a bar of after configure
:25:00. > :25:05.should have been cleared by a minister looking at a more holistic
:25:06. > :25:11.view. Starting in May, councils will have less than a year to decide how
:25:12. > :25:16.they operate. The last thing they will want to do is give the
:25:17. > :25:20.impression that the new system is in danger of being milked.
:25:21. > :25:23.Gareth Gordon reporting. But what about that announcement of an
:25:24. > :25:26.increase of almost 50% in allowances for local government councillors?
:25:27. > :25:29.That's a rise of almost ?4500. So are they worth it? I'm joined now by
:25:30. > :25:32.the independent North Down councillor, Brian Wilson, and
:25:33. > :25:43.Belfast SDLP councillor, Claire Hanna. You are both welcome. Brent
:25:44. > :25:47.Wilson, why is this increase wrong? I can see no justification for the
:25:48. > :25:55.increase. At the moment, councillors here are paying -- paid just over
:25:56. > :26:03.?9,000. They will get just over 14,000. That is ?280 per week. What
:26:04. > :26:11.do councillors do for a ?280 a week? You tell me. When I listen to
:26:12. > :26:16.the rest of them on the radio, they say they do a 60 are weak. It is
:26:17. > :26:23.only a part-time job. Most councillors, a large number have
:26:24. > :26:30.other jobs, so it is only part-time, a supplement to their normal income.
:26:31. > :26:35.Secondly, the actual work they do is attending on council meeting a week
:26:36. > :26:41.and answering two or three queries. You have a situation now since the
:26:42. > :26:47.Assembly was set up that each constituency, each assembly person
:26:48. > :26:52.has their own office. That office was manned by professional workers
:26:53. > :26:56.who have actually much more experience than councillors and they
:26:57. > :27:06.have taken all the work away from the local councillors. Claire
:27:07. > :27:12.Hanna, you haven't got a job there, according to Brian. I might try
:27:13. > :27:18.running North Down. I can understand that this is -- the cynicism, but
:27:19. > :27:20.the people who team up with this report, having plucked this figure
:27:21. > :27:26.from nowhere, they benchmarked against other councillors, it is
:27:27. > :27:33.effectively an on-call job and you work anti-social hours. Brian says
:27:34. > :27:42.it is part-time. It is, like others I have a job outside politics but I
:27:43. > :27:47.work-out time -- I heard other councillors saying it is at least 60
:27:48. > :27:54.hours a week, seven days a week, a full-time job and is underpaid. It
:27:55. > :28:02.is a very intense job. But it cannot be both full-time and part-time.
:28:03. > :28:04.People have a passion for it and are doing it in the voluntary capacity.
:28:05. > :28:10.If you went into local government to make money you would be disappointed
:28:11. > :28:13.but we need to attract more people into local government and most
:28:14. > :28:16.people are either retired or work for their parties or have an
:28:17. > :28:21.independent income. They all have something to give but if you want to
:28:22. > :28:25.bring more people into local politics we need to make it viable.
:28:26. > :28:30.People will go win with a passion for their area but there needs to be
:28:31. > :28:35.some remuneration. They have established it is 50% of a full-time
:28:36. > :28:41.job and 50% of the median wage and I think that is fair.
:28:42. > :28:47.What about the idea that we will get a better quality of councillor in
:28:48. > :28:53.future? I would say 90% of the councillors we are getting will be
:28:54. > :28:58.old councillors with the same habits and the same background as the old
:28:59. > :29:01.councils. There is no improvement because basically there is no
:29:02. > :29:05.improvement in the services they are providing. We talked about the new
:29:06. > :29:11.service is coming to the council but they never came. If you look at
:29:12. > :29:16.England, Harrogate, for example. That is a council which is bigger
:29:17. > :29:25.than most of our local councils. It is a second tier council that has
:29:26. > :29:35.more powers. 4100 is the allowance. It is going to be 14,000 plus in
:29:36. > :29:43.Belfast. If your cancer is answering two queries and attending one, take
:29:44. > :29:51.them out at the next election. Plenty to talk about this week in
:29:52. > :29:54.their first foray into Commentators' Corner, we say a big, warm welcome
:29:55. > :30:00.to Newton Emerson and Cathy Gormley Heenan. Let's talk about Anna Lo
:30:01. > :30:08.first of all. The discussion we had in the defence of her position.
:30:09. > :30:17.Comments? Accidental or deliberate? She made too many remarks of a
:30:18. > :30:21.pointed nature. This is a party whose voters, even though they have
:30:22. > :30:26.a broad mix of backgrounds, are almost all in Unionist majority
:30:27. > :30:32.constituencies so they will see a hitch to their votes. They will lose
:30:33. > :30:37.soft Unionist and they won't gain enough nationalists to make up for
:30:38. > :30:43.it. The Euros are a single constituency election so any vote
:30:44. > :30:46.will count towards her total. She might have a solo run and go for
:30:47. > :30:52.broke at the end because this is her last election and she is stepping
:30:53. > :30:56.down. A beaded news for her as far as the Euro elections are concerned
:30:57. > :31:04.but not good news for Naomi Long in the Westminster election? I think
:31:05. > :31:08.today was a storm in a teacup. David was right, in the heart of her
:31:09. > :31:13.remarks was the principle of consent at at the heart of that is
:31:14. > :31:18.everything enshrined in the Good Friday agreement and what it does is
:31:19. > :31:22.allow people to be aspirational. You can be British, Irish, both. You can
:31:23. > :31:29.have aspirations for other things. But it is hard for voters to know
:31:30. > :31:39.what you are full top The Alliance party will want to grow beyond this
:31:40. > :31:46.soft perspective. Possibly but I think the remarks are a point well
:31:47. > :31:49.made. I'm not sure why Ian Paisley Jr was incensed because they are not
:31:50. > :31:55.going to lose anything as a consequence. They might pick up soft
:31:56. > :32:00.votes as a result of this and the diversity of the party is in
:32:01. > :32:05.important thing for new voters and who don't necessarily want to go
:32:06. > :32:08.Unionist or nationalist and are looking for something more diverse.
:32:09. > :32:13.The possibility of white elephants in the terms of these new buildings
:32:14. > :32:21.thrown up all over southern Ireland and this 50% or thereabouts
:32:22. > :32:26.allowance increase. The 50% increase looks bad but it is missing the
:32:27. > :32:33.point. The councillors are on 15,000 but the Chief Executive is on
:32:34. > :32:39.150,000 plus. I would rather people we elect paid a substantial wage and
:32:40. > :32:44.their bureaucrats paid less. I would pay them more and make this a proper
:32:45. > :32:48.job for them and I would make the people running the council behind
:32:49. > :32:57.the scenes less important and certainly less well rewarded. I'm
:32:58. > :33:00.with him. Pay them more. It probably shouldn't be a part-time job and the
:33:01. > :33:02.responsibilities the councillors will have with the establishment of
:33:03. > :33:07.the new councils will be increased with community planning and so on so
:33:08. > :33:12.I think in order to get the right people into those jobs, you have to
:33:13. > :33:20.pay a fair wage. These are bureaucrats who want to maintain
:33:21. > :33:24.their well-paid jobs. They would say that this is a civic centre and it
:33:25. > :33:28.is for the whole community. It will be used by the whole community
:33:29. > :33:34.wherever the council meets for top We have too many amateur councillors
:33:35. > :33:42.rubber-stamping. We need councillors who are engaged. Can I ask you to
:33:43. > :33:50.comment on the comments in the newspaper about no regrets about
:33:51. > :33:50.comment on the comments in the murder of two Catholic men. Yes. I
:33:51. > :33:58.against that. The comments were an acceptable. Why should it be any
:33:59. > :34:04.different coming from wireless? Billy Hutchinson said he wouldn't
:34:05. > :34:09.expect middle-class Unionist to understand that I would like to tell
:34:10. > :34:15.him not to patronise me. Don't tell me we should accept that murder is
:34:16. > :34:19.right. The DUP condemned it in the chamber. Thanks. That's it from The
:34:20. > :34:22.View for this week. I'll have live coverage of David Ford's speech to
:34:23. > :34:26.the Alliance Party faithful on Saturday at 12 noon on BBC Two. For
:34:27. > :34:29.now, though, I'll leave you with a few familiar faces from Fermanagh -
:34:30. > :34:34.with thanks to the Impartial Reporter. Bye-bye.