:00:00. > :00:00.Day one of the election campaign proper and already a major skirmish.
:00:07. > :00:18.One of the most senior legal figures in Northern Ireland takes
:00:19. > :00:20.on Conservative and Unionist criticism over his impartiality -
:00:21. > :00:40.Legacy is back in the headlines and in a big way -
:00:41. > :00:56.are prosecutions of soldiers a witch hunt or long delayed justice?
:00:57. > :00:59.Has this pushed back even further dealing with the past?
:01:00. > :01:02.Plus, it'll be just ten months from the last one -
:01:03. > :01:06.so who's in the market for a new election?
:01:07. > :01:10.I will not be voting again, they are not worth voting for.
:01:11. > :01:13.Also tonight, after Ian Paisley said many people were further down
:01:14. > :01:15.the road to reconciliation than the politicians,
:01:16. > :01:18.I'll be talking to two men who've been a witness to that
:01:19. > :01:21.And one week in office, we've Donald Trump as you've
:01:22. > :01:34.And in better voice - hopefully - our commentators
:01:35. > :01:42.Ex-soldiers will march on Westminster tomorrow
:01:43. > :01:50.in their continuing campaign against being prosecuted
:01:51. > :01:54.It's escalated to such an extent that one of the most
:01:55. > :01:56.senior legal figures here, the Director of Public Prosecutions,
:01:57. > :01:59.Barra McGrory, has hit back at critics who say
:02:00. > :02:02.Joining me now are the DUP's Sir Jeffrey Donaldson
:02:03. > :02:08.Barra McGrory has been defending himself against those charges
:02:09. > :02:10.made against him today - but tonight your party
:02:11. > :02:12.leader has again claimed the prosecution of soldiers
:02:13. > :02:20.It looks like the DPP has become collateral damage
:02:21. > :02:31.in the early stages of this brutal election campaign.
:02:32. > :02:46.This is an issue that is gathering momentum at Westminster. A
:02:47. > :02:49.across-the-board, not just for those interested in Northern Ireland
:02:50. > :02:53.politics. But it has dragged Barra McGrory into it, it has become
:02:54. > :02:57.toxic, the Director of Public Prosecutions has been pulled into
:02:58. > :03:02.the NT is not happy. It was the BBC who went to interview him, the
:03:03. > :03:07.political parties. In terms of the problem that we have, this is a
:03:08. > :03:11.symptom of the problem. I think we need to understand what the problem
:03:12. > :03:15.is. We have a system at the moment that is not fair. We have a system
:03:16. > :03:21.that is focused almost entirely on what the state does. Barra McGrory
:03:22. > :03:25.can only take decisions based on files presented to him and someone
:03:26. > :03:30.is preparing those files and it is not the Director of Public
:03:31. > :03:34.Prosecutions, it is the PSNI, they are legacy investigation unit, which
:03:35. > :03:39.is almost entirely dedicated, despite the fact there are 3000
:03:40. > :03:44.unsolved murders, over 90% of those killings were carried out by Carolus
:03:45. > :03:49.paramilitaries, despite that, over 90% of the resources available to
:03:50. > :03:53.the PSNI legacy investigation unit is going towards investigating what
:03:54. > :03:58.the States did. That is the problem. Last December we heard from the
:03:59. > :04:03.Assistant Chief Constable but on the prosecution of soldiers there is no
:04:04. > :04:07.witchhunt, nor specific human, he said he is simply fulfilling his
:04:08. > :04:10.stature to the rule to investigate all deaths duelling the Troubles. I
:04:11. > :04:17.have to challenge that. You do not believe him rich and Mark I have
:04:18. > :04:24.investigated this. We have asked questions at the Policing Board. Let
:04:25. > :04:28.us be clear. The moment most of the resources of the units that were
:04:29. > :04:31.referred to, the legacy investigation Branch, it is going
:04:32. > :04:40.towards investigating what's the state did. Let me ask the PSNI, who
:04:41. > :04:43.is investigating bloody Friday? None of their resources are investigating
:04:44. > :04:50.those atrocities. I am entitled to ask the question why. Why the focus
:04:51. > :04:53.on what the state did. I will bring Gerry Kelly in but stick with such
:04:54. > :05:01.you have moved the conversation away from Anna McCrory, are you
:05:02. > :05:08.suggesting that you are happy with the way he conducts himself? -- from
:05:09. > :05:15.Barra McGrory. Barra McGrory and his team, that file has been compiled
:05:16. > :05:21.after investigation, they are not responsible. But there has been
:05:22. > :05:23.criticism is directed against the Director of Public Prosecutions, he
:05:24. > :05:27.said his integrity has been questioned, it is not clear to him
:05:28. > :05:31.and his staff, are you saying you are no prepared to give your
:05:32. > :05:39.unequivocal support to Barra McGrory as DPP? My criticism is not elected
:05:40. > :05:45.towards the DPP. Does he have your complete support? I will answer the
:05:46. > :05:53.question the way I want to do. It is this. I am clear. The problem is
:05:54. > :05:57.that the cases against soldiers are not being investigated by Barra
:05:58. > :06:04.McGrory or the DPP. You have said that. We need to understand this. He
:06:05. > :06:06.has to take the decision based on an investigation, a police
:06:07. > :06:13.investigation, whether this to be a prosecution. He has two criteria. Is
:06:14. > :06:17.it in the public interest? Is there sufficient evidence? I do not see
:06:18. > :06:24.the file therefore I cannot second-guess what the public
:06:25. > :06:31.prosecutor does and does not know. The DUP and others have started an
:06:32. > :06:40.attack on the DPP. I am glad he is pulling away from that. These
:06:41. > :06:46.attacks work on the basis that he had defended Republicans. As he said
:06:47. > :06:49.he had defended Republicans, Unionists, loyalists, all types,
:06:50. > :06:55.which is the duty of any lawyer anyway. And should I take the
:06:56. > :07:02.position that because he defended loyalists, or Unionists members of
:07:03. > :07:10.the DUP and UUP that he is biased? That is ludicrous. They were in the
:07:11. > :07:16.wrong. Now they have shifted onto a different thing, they want to shift
:07:17. > :07:20.the blame someone else. Barra McGrory has your complete support of
:07:21. > :07:24.his role as Director of Public Prosecutions, do you accept that
:07:25. > :07:29.this looks to Unionists like another example of what they see as a
:07:30. > :07:35.one-sided process where the physical opponents are attempting to be right
:07:36. > :07:42.things? Nobody asked what was her view. Hiding behind other people's
:07:43. > :07:47.perception does not cut it. If you are a politician you must lead as
:07:48. > :07:50.well. Let me deal with proportionality, the proportionality
:07:51. > :07:55.that has been brought up many times, and I noticed that as soon as the
:07:56. > :08:08.election was caused -- calls, to try and move away from the scandal
:08:09. > :08:23.within RHI and, they went to this issue. Proportionality, let us deal
:08:24. > :08:26.with it. In terms of the number of British soldiers who have been
:08:27. > :08:35.convicted over the last 40 years, I can remember for. Only four. Lee
:08:36. > :08:48.Clegg was found guilty of murder, he did 22 months, sorry, Ian Clegg did
:08:49. > :09:00.37 months. Somebody else did 22 months. All were brought back into
:09:01. > :09:10.the British Army. Is that the way the British deal with justice? Does
:09:11. > :09:13.that look one-sided to you? He is complaining about soldiers being in
:09:14. > :09:19.for a limited amount of time. Let me remind you, the man who exploded a
:09:20. > :09:24.bomb on the Shankill Road and murdered I believe seven innocent
:09:25. > :09:28.people on that occasion, was convicted of seven life sentences,
:09:29. > :09:34.and he was released after a much less period, it was made lace, and
:09:35. > :09:42.he served seven years in prison, which is less than one year for each
:09:43. > :09:46.life that he destroyed. Why was he released? Because of a deal that was
:09:47. > :09:51.done and an Agreement that I post for that very reason. He was
:09:52. > :09:54.released as part of a political settlement which the majority of
:09:55. > :10:01.politicians and people in this country supported. People will be
:10:02. > :10:08.dismayed about the two of you trading insults and examples across
:10:09. > :10:16.the table. We are answering your questions. It was DUP that raise the
:10:17. > :10:21.issue of proportionality. Let us deal with that yet again. An
:10:22. > :10:26.estimate of 20,000 Republicans have gone through jail, they have done
:10:27. > :10:31.100,000 years in jail. If you want to talk about proportionality, talk
:10:32. > :10:36.about it. Unionists are concerned, I have heard this on the radio,
:10:37. > :10:39.Republicans are keen on getting 100% transparency in relation to the 10%
:10:40. > :10:44.of killings carried out by state forces, not so keen on complete
:10:45. > :10:47.transparency for the 60% of Republican related killings. There
:10:48. > :10:53.you go again with the 10%, if you deal with the over 300 deaths by
:10:54. > :10:57.state forces, add to that will prove collusion, which brings the number
:10:58. > :11:03.over 1000, even though 90% is a nonsense. Let us adjust the figures.
:11:04. > :11:07.If you are concerned about 100% chance and see in a mission to 40%
:11:08. > :11:15.of killings, the point remains the same, you are not so keen on the
:11:16. > :11:18.other percentage. We have been through a number of negotiations in
:11:19. > :11:23.the Stormont House Agreement and in fresh start. The architecture was
:11:24. > :11:32.set up to deal with this right across the board. Most victims and
:11:33. > :11:40.survivors want truth, -- want the truth, some want more. If you want
:11:41. > :11:45.to deal with legacy, proportionality, there is over 50
:11:46. > :11:48.legacy cases, some of them over 40 years old, the Lord Chief Justice,
:11:49. > :11:53.not a politician, maybe he will get attacked next, he said he could sort
:11:54. > :11:56.it out in five years, the DUP and the British Government will not hand
:11:57. > :12:01.out this small amount of money which will allow justice to be done. How
:12:02. > :12:07.did you respond? Let me be clear, I have never attacked the DPP or any
:12:08. > :12:17.of the judicial system. The problem is... A lot of politicians have. I
:12:18. > :12:21.am the person who reads the DUP team in dealing with legacy issues, we
:12:22. > :12:25.reached the Stormont House Agreement and we stand by that and the
:12:26. > :12:28.Stormont House Agreement made provision, and we want to implement
:12:29. > :12:32.that, but you will not allow it to be implemented, over issues related
:12:33. > :12:34.to national security. We are ready to implement this Agreement is
:12:35. > :12:39.tomorrow and that is the way forward. People out there want to
:12:40. > :12:45.hear about how we are going to resolve this issue. Let me speak.
:12:46. > :12:49.The legacy case set outside that, to allow the money to go ahead, at
:12:50. > :12:52.least get something that works. Address that point. I am sorry but
:12:53. > :12:59.we are not going to allow a one-sided process to continue to be
:13:00. > :13:13.even more one-sided. That is not on. Tell that to the actual victims and
:13:14. > :13:18.families. Tell that... You are on the other side of the fence to the
:13:19. > :13:22.Lord Chief Justice? He has set down his view of how this matter could be
:13:23. > :13:28.dealt with as expeditiously as possible and you disagree? No. You
:13:29. > :13:37.still blocked the proposal. You cannot create a hierarchy of
:13:38. > :13:42.victims, where a certain element gets priority. The rest of the
:13:43. > :13:48.victims are ignored. That is what has happened. He says you are trying
:13:49. > :13:53.to put members of the British Army above the law? No. There has to be a
:13:54. > :13:57.level playing field, the moment there isn't. You would be happy for
:13:58. > :14:01.the soldiers to be prosecuted if other people were prosecuted as
:14:02. > :14:09.well? I believe nobody is above the law. Would you be happy for them to
:14:10. > :14:13.be prosecuted in certain certain -- circumstances, or never at all?
:14:14. > :14:18.Should they ever be prosecuted? I'm going to deal with that. It is a
:14:19. > :14:26.simple question. Are there any circumstances in which there are
:14:27. > :14:29.soldiers should be prosecuted? Era nobody is above the law. If they are
:14:30. > :14:34.guilty of murder... You don't know unless they have been prosecuted? If
:14:35. > :14:41.they are being accused, the law has to take its course. Should they be
:14:42. > :14:49.prosecuted in those circumstances? I am coming to that. Please do. Well
:14:50. > :14:54.if you let me answer... I've had to ask you six times. We have had an
:14:55. > :14:58.anomaly in the agreement, if a soldier is convicted of murder, he
:14:59. > :15:03.does not benefit under the early release programme that is available
:15:04. > :15:08.to terrorist prisoners. I think that has to be dealt with. I think we
:15:09. > :15:11.have to look at all options here. That might include a statute of
:15:12. > :15:15.limitations. You can't apply the same criteria to soldiers as you do
:15:16. > :15:20.to terrorists because the criteria requires you to support an illegal
:15:21. > :15:26.organisation. There are circumstances which might meet your
:15:27. > :15:29.approval, where they could be prosecuted? And certain
:15:30. > :15:33.circumstances where they are not prosecuted. That is the point I'm
:15:34. > :15:36.trying to make. The problem at the moment is that soldiers are not
:15:37. > :15:43.covered by the provisions of the agreement. That is unfair. I
:15:44. > :15:52.remember this, I was in the house of Jean McBride, the mother of Peter
:15:53. > :15:56.McBride, killed by Fisher and Wright. Mo Mowlam gave a guaranteed
:15:57. > :16:03.it would be dealt with like anybody else. Within weeks, she released
:16:04. > :16:07.them on the basis that she did not want British troops connected to...
:16:08. > :16:13.A simple question, you have said that you support Barry McGrory and
:16:14. > :16:16.acted in a fair and evenhanded way. There were many Republican killings
:16:17. > :16:20.were those responsible were not brought towards the courts. Would
:16:21. > :16:28.you be happy to see IRA men brought to the courts if fresh evidence came
:16:29. > :16:31.to light to enable prosecutions? Under Section 32, the PMS I are
:16:32. > :16:44.still investigating all of those issues. -- PSNI. And if it came
:16:45. > :16:50.forward, they would be prosecuted. Do you agree with that? It would
:16:51. > :16:55.take its course. Will you answer that? Everybody under the law. I
:16:56. > :17:00.accept that. It would be uncomfortable for you? I am just
:17:01. > :17:04.clarifying. It would not be uncomfortable for me. Here is the
:17:05. > :17:07.issue, Sinn Fein's decision, from the start, has been the truth
:17:08. > :17:12.commission. It was the Unionists that refuse to go for that. The
:17:13. > :17:19.compromise was the architecture we are talking about. How would it be
:17:20. > :17:23.possible when the IRA doesn't technically exist? The people exist.
:17:24. > :17:32.The people that say they weren't in it! Former members of the IRA take
:17:33. > :17:36.part in truth recovery? Ask him if the UDR would come forward. Would
:17:37. > :17:42.you can forward? I have already said, if I am asked to come forward,
:17:43. > :17:48.I would come forward. Do you think that others in the IRA would? Those
:17:49. > :17:51.people have to deal with that. The point you made was that it does not
:17:52. > :17:59.exist, the people exist. I used to be in the IRA and I still exist.
:18:00. > :18:05.Very quickly. What has happened here is that they do not want any state
:18:06. > :18:12.forces to be prosecuted or even to come forward with the truth. That is
:18:13. > :18:14.what it's about. Not necessarily the case that people would agree with
:18:15. > :18:15.you, but thank you for that. The Assembly election campaign got
:18:16. > :18:17.under way formally today and it's The big question, though,
:18:18. > :18:21.is will voters be mobilised by the Renewable Heating scandal
:18:22. > :18:24.or will they be turned off by the political bickering and yet
:18:25. > :18:26.another Stormont shutdown? Enda McClafferty has been
:18:27. > :18:28.testing opinion in some of the constituencies
:18:29. > :18:47.with the lowest turnout last time, Make no mistake about it, politics
:18:48. > :18:57.right now in places like Kilroy is a hard sell. Just look at the response
:18:58. > :19:04.to this question. If anybody's going to vote in the next election, please
:19:05. > :19:07.raise your hand. No hands went up. Hardly surprising, in a constituency
:19:08. > :19:12.where half the electorate didn't bother to vote in the last assembly
:19:13. > :19:16.election. Eight months on, and there is clearly no appetite for another
:19:17. > :19:22.vote. I don't think I'll be voting again. They are not worth voting
:19:23. > :19:27.for. I think we are all worn down. How far are we from the last
:19:28. > :19:33.election, really? Did you vote last time? I did, but not this time. No
:19:34. > :19:39.more. Enough is enough. I don't think we need another election. It's
:19:40. > :19:44.not time for us not to have government in place. Agriculture is
:19:45. > :19:47.in crisis, education, health, everywhere we looked, problems and
:19:48. > :19:51.infrastructure across the board. This will be an assembly election
:19:52. > :19:57.like no other. The numbers will be very different. Of the 108 assembly
:19:58. > :20:02.members leaving Stormont this week, only 90 will be returning. 18 will
:20:03. > :20:07.be out of a job. But that is only part of the picture. A more
:20:08. > :20:10.important figure might be the percentage turnout. The figures show
:20:11. > :20:14.a growing number of voters here are slowly turning their back on
:20:15. > :20:19.politics. Over the past 19 years, the percentage turnout in assembly
:20:20. > :20:25.elections dropped by 15%. So, the parties have a lot to consider. Last
:20:26. > :20:30.time round, we had five constituencies which recorded 50% or
:20:31. > :20:34.less. Only one constituency recorded over 64%. There is a question
:20:35. > :20:37.whether or not the nonvoters will be galvanised, or whether the trend of
:20:38. > :20:41.a decreasing turnout will apply this time round as well. People that have
:20:42. > :20:45.been voting on having called the hard-core in each party. But the
:20:46. > :20:51.centre ground has just faded away from voting. Do you think we might
:20:52. > :20:55.lose some big hitters in this? You have one seat less, a number of
:20:56. > :21:00.large names might fall. It's a question of fighting, really, within
:21:01. > :21:09.parties, rather than between parties for seats. The heart of West Tyrone,
:21:10. > :21:16.59% of voters turned out here last time. But the mood is very different
:21:17. > :21:21.now. Stormont, on television, sometimes, it is going across the
:21:22. > :21:25.whole world, what we like? Fighting, squabbling and squabbling. Where is
:21:26. > :21:33.it going to end? I'm disgusted at politics, I really am. I think there
:21:34. > :21:41.will be a bigger turnout this time. Why? Because of the situation. There
:21:42. > :21:48.are some facts they still need to be letting on to people that was going
:21:49. > :21:53.on when they were in power. These students at the Northwest Institute
:21:54. > :21:59.were among the 56% who voted in the constituency last time. Our young
:22:00. > :22:03.people tuned in to what is happening at Stormont, or are they
:22:04. > :22:06.disillusioned with politics? It is frustrating that people seem to vote
:22:07. > :22:10.for the same people over and over again, and they keep doing the same
:22:11. > :22:16.thing. They can't seem to agree. I don't think young people realise
:22:17. > :22:21.there is an alternative. People are angry, already, people go and have
:22:22. > :22:29.their say, people that have never voted before I going to vote. Moobs
:22:30. > :22:34.people I know don't care. -- most people I know. Stormont does not do
:22:35. > :22:37.anything to help the youth. Education is always the first thing
:22:38. > :22:43.cut. Dislodging the old guard at Stormont will not be easy. Don't
:22:44. > :22:47.expect any fresh faces. What we can expect is lots of political wheeling
:22:48. > :22:49.and dealing, maybe the prospect of another election beyond March the
:22:50. > :22:50.2nd. Enda McClafferty there,
:22:51. > :22:52.listening to the views of people Now, we're not normally big
:22:53. > :22:56.on patting ourselves on the back, but last week's programme did
:22:57. > :22:58.get people talking. Ian Paisley's thank
:22:59. > :22:59.you to Martin McGuinness And here's something else that
:23:00. > :23:04.caught many people's attention too - when I asked Mr Paisley about how
:23:05. > :23:10.other unionists might thoughts on Mr McGuinness's
:23:11. > :23:22.contribution. Do you think other Unionists, some
:23:23. > :23:27.of them don't understand it? I don't think it is necessary for Ian
:23:28. > :23:34.Paisley or any Unionists to sit on a show like this and qualify every
:23:35. > :23:39.comment with the fact, I'm a Protestant, think something
:23:40. > :23:44.different to the cassock beside me, I am a Unionists I think something
:23:45. > :23:52.different to the Republican beside me. We have to Dennis Praet we are
:23:53. > :23:56.beyond that. Dashed to the Catholic but beside me.
:23:57. > :23:59.Well, the Reverend Steve Stockman and Father Martin Magill launched
:24:00. > :24:01.the Four Corners Festival five years ago to encourage people out
:24:02. > :24:08.of their comfort zones in the city of Belfast.
:24:09. > :24:14.The comments must have been like mana from heaven. But then it was
:24:15. > :24:20.like business as usual? That was remarkable. Tonight we have had
:24:21. > :24:27.white noise again. I am looking for the politician making me stop and
:24:28. > :24:31.think, did he really say that? Ian Paisley did that. Everybody has
:24:32. > :24:35.conspiracy theories about why he said it. It has been a conversation
:24:36. > :24:42.starter all week long. Everybody was talking about it. I don't know how
:24:43. > :24:46.many reviews and treats you have had, but it has been a remarkable
:24:47. > :24:50.change in tone, even in the conversations in the street. It was
:24:51. > :24:55.the biggest viewing audience ever in four and a half years. It caught
:24:56. > :25:00.public attention. The question is, does it make a difference, does it
:25:01. > :25:06.help reframe the political debate at the beginning of a brutal election
:25:07. > :25:10.campaign? I think it does. Taking the likes of social media, last
:25:11. > :25:16.week, following it on Facebook and Twitter, the enormous response. It
:25:17. > :25:25.is still a talking point. To some extent, it gives us an opportunity
:25:26. > :25:28.to build on that. The article on Grace, another talking point. I am
:25:29. > :25:39.detecting a real sea change. I am very much aware, that we would not
:25:40. > :25:43.be able to take the matter have some of the conversations we are having.
:25:44. > :25:46.I think things have changed. It seems there are two parallel
:25:47. > :25:49.conversations going on, what you have described as white noise, where
:25:50. > :25:56.politicians talk at each other, and the other one, perhaps not in front
:25:57. > :26:01.of television cameras quite so much, they do not come out with the
:26:02. > :26:07.chestnuts that we are used to seeing on television studios, on the radio.
:26:08. > :26:13.What do you think you can do about that? If there is a public appetite
:26:14. > :26:16.for change, how do you deliver that? I have talked to a lot of
:26:17. > :26:22.politicians. I am amazed when I talk to them, privately when we have
:26:23. > :26:27.spoken at Four Corners, these are people that want to bring change to
:26:28. > :26:32.society. They get in of cameras, they play their party line, and you
:26:33. > :26:42.go, what happened there? They say they have a mandate? That is the
:26:43. > :26:49.problem we all have. 45% didn't vote the last time. We are expecting
:26:50. > :26:54.peace and reconciliation to drip down from the hill, it has to creep
:26:55. > :26:58.up. We have to give collateral to the people on the hill. They are
:26:59. > :27:02.trying to find out how they can get the vote out for the election, what
:27:03. > :27:06.can they say to get people out of their seats to vote? If 45% are
:27:07. > :27:11.apathetic, they are not going to vote. If they say, this is what we
:27:12. > :27:16.are going to do for you, there is a change in the groundswell. A
:27:17. > :27:21.politician said to me, leaving an event, I have just got to be more
:27:22. > :27:23.courageous. I thought we could make him more courageous if we were
:27:24. > :27:30.prepared to change the conversation and maybe more people vote for the
:27:31. > :27:34.things we want to vote for. Reconciliation should be higher. We
:27:35. > :27:39.should be thinking about the future more than the past. The politicians
:27:40. > :27:46.on the Hill need to looking over their shoulder. Politicians at
:27:47. > :27:48.election time think they have to deliver a message that the public
:27:49. > :27:52.wants to hear. That is what they think will get them votes. They say
:27:53. > :27:56.if you don't vote for me, you will get the other fellow, and you don't
:27:57. > :28:00.want him, you want me, so you've got to just vote the ticket. You got to
:28:01. > :28:04.do what you got to do. Even if you might be tempted to do something
:28:05. > :28:15.different, you'd better not risk it? The likes of next week, and we will
:28:16. > :28:19.hear from a representative of the University later, I was talking to
:28:20. > :28:27.some young people from the students union, and I am hearing a sense of,
:28:28. > :28:32.we do not want an orange and Green approach this time around. We are
:28:33. > :28:35.tired of it. There is anger and frustration at it. If that was the
:28:36. > :28:42.case more people would thought for other parties, more people would go
:28:43. > :28:50.and vote, but they do not. One of the contributors docs about
:28:51. > :28:53.squabbling and squabbling. With all respect to the previous contributors
:28:54. > :28:59.who work life year, there were a few moments where I thought it was quite
:29:00. > :29:03.helpful conversation, but really it was a turn off. Some of the youngest
:29:04. > :29:06.members of the last Assembly were those who came out with the least
:29:07. > :29:16.reconstructed contributions, it is not as if that is... I listen to
:29:17. > :29:21.them every Monday and Tuesday, there was not much clear blue thinking
:29:22. > :29:26.going on. You said earlier, what they portray to the public, they are
:29:27. > :29:29.not going to the public, they are going to their constituency. Somehow
:29:30. > :29:34.this other groundswell that wants change has to say there is a
:29:35. > :29:36.constituency and you are not coming to our constituency, and if we
:29:37. > :29:44.decide to vote for other parties, there will have to be a change from
:29:45. > :29:48.the ground rather than the top. In terms of reconciliation we need to
:29:49. > :29:51.be saying that louder and making it clear to our politicians, enough of
:29:52. > :29:53.the beckoning of the past. Stay with us.
:29:54. > :29:55.Let's bring in our commentators at this stage -
:29:56. > :30:06.I suppose there is a disconnect between what you are saying and what
:30:07. > :30:10.happens on polling day when people decide they want to fall along
:30:11. > :30:16.tribal lines, they might be saying we are tired, we cannot stand the
:30:17. > :30:20.beckoning, and people dancing around issues, and what they were saying
:30:21. > :30:24.depended on their perspective, and it is hard to see a meeting of
:30:25. > :30:28.minds. The reality is, not what you are saying is wrong, but when people
:30:29. > :30:36.thought they still vote along tribal lines and they are still voting to
:30:37. > :30:42.keep people out. Tonight we heard a lot, and the warm glow that we heard
:30:43. > :30:47.last week 's forgotten about. So how do you shift away from the debates
:30:48. > :30:51.of the past and engage with the 45% of people who do not bother or
:30:52. > :30:59.cannot bring themselves to vote, how do you turn that around? We need to
:31:00. > :31:03.get away from this wishy-washy situation, people should not be
:31:04. > :31:07.afraid to see a side is in the wrong, and the missing element is
:31:08. > :31:11.that Unionism has a particular problem with giving that hardliners.
:31:12. > :31:17.That is not necessarily a harsh criticism of Unionism. It is less
:31:18. > :31:23.inextricably linked. Talking about looking over their shoulders. Maybe
:31:24. > :31:27.it has a harder time to control them but that spends more time looking
:31:28. > :31:30.over its shoulder even what it is looking at shrink state to small
:31:31. > :31:35.numbers like a caravan full of people. Even after years of that
:31:36. > :31:41.there was not a single Unionist leaders who was prepared to lead
:31:42. > :31:44.those people or just leave them, that is a fundamental problem and
:31:45. > :31:48.that keeps society unbalance and needs to be addressed. What you are
:31:49. > :31:54.saying is we are lacking bold leadership. People are who -- people
:31:55. > :31:59.who will see this is not the way we want to move forward. The focus is
:32:00. > :32:02.always on the past. The conversation earlier was legacy issues, and it is
:32:03. > :32:11.toxic, and if we cannot deal with the past, we were told in the fresh
:32:12. > :32:15.start that they were moving forward. The Secretary of State said he was
:32:16. > :32:18.biting his ideas out to consultation. The justice minister
:32:19. > :32:26.said she was hopeful. Nothing happened. Gerry Kelly can see, yes,
:32:27. > :32:29.and be part of truth and reconciliation, politicians know
:32:30. > :32:33.there will not be a truth and reconciliation Commission because
:32:34. > :32:37.there are things that neither Unionists, Republicans, nor
:32:38. > :32:41.Westminster wants to come out. We have talked about a lot of people
:32:42. > :32:45.engaged with last week's programme. People at the table tonight have
:32:46. > :32:48.said, you have said, people were coming up on the street talking
:32:49. > :32:53.about what Ian Paisley said last week. We struck a chord and people
:32:54. > :32:57.were pleased. They said that is what we need to hear. Jeffrey Donaldson
:32:58. > :33:00.Kemen tonight and it was as if he had not seen at interview because
:33:01. > :33:06.there was no sense whatsoever that he was bringing into his comments
:33:07. > :33:10.any elements of what Ian Paisley said, or the note that Ian Paisley
:33:11. > :33:22.tried to strike on the programme. Ironically, Jeffrey Donaldson and
:33:23. > :33:24.Gerry Kelly get on well having worked on reconciliation projects
:33:25. > :33:31.abroad, they just need to bring that home with them. And warmly welcomed
:33:32. > :33:34.in every constituency apart from the DUP who did not warmly welcome those
:33:35. > :33:45.comments. How would you deal with legacy? Giving people the power to
:33:46. > :33:48.tell the story. We have two great member a lot of people who are
:33:49. > :33:54.living with the past on a daily basis have not got justice or other
:33:55. > :33:55.things also. We need to leave it there.
:33:56. > :33:56.That's it from The View for this week.
:33:57. > :33:59.Join me for Sunday Politics at 11.25 here on BBC One.
:34:00. > :34:02.Donald Trump is a different US President in so many ways.
:34:03. > :34:05.To start with, he's one of the few US Presidents not
:34:06. > :34:30.Raise your right hand and repeat after me. I Donaldson Trump do
:34:31. > :34:36.solemnly swear. Back that I will faithfully execute. The office of
:34:37. > :34:43.President of the United States. And we'll do the best of my ability. And
:34:44. > :34:48.will to the best of my ability. Preserve, protect and defend.
:34:49. > :34:52.Preserve protect and defend. The Constitution of the United States.
:34:53. > :34:54.The Constitution of the United States. So help me God. So help me
:34:55. > :34:57.God. MUSIC: The Elements
:34:58. > :34:59.by Tom Lehrer # There's Attenborough, micro.bit,
:35:00. > :35:03.The Bottom Line and In Our Time # And Terrific Scientific
:35:04. > :35:05.and Ten Pieces and All In The Mind # Inside Porton Down, Black And
:35:06. > :35:09.British, Bitesize, City In The Sky