:00:00. > :00:00.Tactics and tough talk - the Secretary of State warns
:00:00. > :00:00.the health service here will be in danger if devolution isn't
:00:07. > :00:10.restored, while Sinn Fein hits back saying he has a "brass neck".
:00:11. > :00:12.Tonight on The View - with new deadlines looming
:00:13. > :00:37.and Easter round the corner, where are the negotiations?
:00:38. > :00:39.With Sinn Fein saying little progress has been made,
:00:40. > :00:43.what consequences of the deadlock are now starting to be felt?
:00:44. > :00:46.I'll be asking our Political Editor, Mark Devenport, for his take
:00:47. > :00:50.on events, and hearing from the health and business sectors
:00:51. > :00:56.Also tonight, cultural identity has been a disputed
:00:57. > :00:58.issue in Northern Ireland since the creation of the state,
:00:59. > :01:06.but we're not the only place where language can pose problems.
:01:07. > :01:12.I be reporting from Cardiff. Could measures in place here for the Welsh
:01:13. > :01:15.language assist those who want to see an Irish act?
:01:16. > :01:23.Plus, meet the Sinn Fein MLA whose sweet tooth drives him nuts.
:01:24. > :01:27.It's like East Germany and West Germany, but that's where I have to
:01:28. > :01:31.go to get my Snickers! And the fearless pair
:01:32. > :01:33.in Commentators' Corner are Fionnuala O Connor
:01:34. > :01:36.and Alex Kane. So, four days into a new round of
:01:37. > :01:39.talks to save the Stormont institutions, it appears the chances
:01:40. > :01:42.of a deal look as far away as ever. Tonight Michelle O'Neill told
:01:43. > :01:46.a public meeting in Londonderry the next week is critical,
:01:47. > :01:49.and there's been little Her comments come after
:01:50. > :01:53.the Secretary of State suggested the health service is just one
:01:54. > :01:56.of the public services that could But the remarks drew
:01:57. > :02:00.a scathing response from Sinn Fein's
:02:01. > :02:14.Mairtin O Muilleoir. I'm here at a hospital underlining
:02:15. > :02:16.of the public services that are looking for certainty, looking for
:02:17. > :02:22.an executive being in place to be able to make decisions. Whilst, yes,
:02:23. > :02:25.we've got the money continuing to flow through, we've got public
:02:26. > :02:29.services that are looking for political certainty on
:02:30. > :02:33.decision-making. The last time I saw James
:02:34. > :02:37.Brokenshire up close, I was sure he had a brass neck. Because the Main
:02:38. > :02:42.pressure on our public services is the austerity agenda of the Tory
:02:43. > :02:46.government. He has removed 10% from our budgets over the period of the
:02:47. > :02:52.last assembly, and he anticipates and predicts and intends to impose
:02:53. > :02:55.another 10% decrease. The issue of public services, particularly the
:02:56. > :02:59.health service, and this is true of the Tories and the austerity agenda
:03:00. > :03:01.in Britain, is not enough money is being provided.
:03:02. > :03:05.Our Political Editor, Mark Devenport, is with me now.
:03:06. > :03:10.We saw the Secretary of State at Antrim Area Hospital - a pretty
:03:11. > :03:20.transparent tactic. Mairtin O Muilleoir says he has a brass neck.
:03:21. > :03:25.It was maybe a little bit heavy-handed, but obviously there
:03:26. > :03:29.are starting to be some real-world consequences in relation to the
:03:30. > :03:32.Stormont crisis. We've yet to see how it may pan out in terms of
:03:33. > :03:35.health we have certainly seen complaints of budgets being cut by
:03:36. > :03:40.the education authority in pre-emptive action of what is going
:03:41. > :03:47.to be missing if they get a reduced budget. We've also heard about a
:03:48. > :03:50.housing executive budget relying on supporting people, which is
:03:51. > :03:55.important for people such as victims of domestic violence. That has also
:03:56. > :04:01.taken a 5% cut apparently equivalent to ?3 million. The Rockies
:04:02. > :04:04.consequences, but the question is -- so there are these consequences, but
:04:05. > :04:09.the question is would produce results? I'm told that in the talks
:04:10. > :04:13.ruined the main parties still have horns locked in a couple of
:04:14. > :04:16.essential point is, whether it be the Irish language or legacy, and
:04:17. > :04:19.there have been very little sign of movement. Then we had a significant
:04:20. > :04:24.contribution from Michelle O'Neill in Derry tonight. What did you make
:04:25. > :04:29.of what she's had to say? It's similar to what she was saying in
:04:30. > :04:33.the great Hall of Stormont during the week when she said very little
:04:34. > :04:36.progress had been made. She was essentially warning the that unless
:04:37. > :04:40.Sinn Fein gets the movement is looking for, like the Irish language
:04:41. > :04:49.Bill of Rights and the legacy of the troubles, the institutions have the
:04:50. > :04:54.-- the institutions cannot be restored. The benign view will be
:04:55. > :04:58.maybe things will be more real next week. The less benign view is that
:04:59. > :05:04.this isn't just shadow-boxing before they do a deal, it is a process that
:05:05. > :05:08.lacks momentum. We've had comments from the DUP to this programme
:05:09. > :05:11.tonight will stop we want to see devolution up and running again as
:05:12. > :05:15.soon as possible. No preconditions, no list of red lines, keen to
:05:16. > :05:20.deliver on issues like the health service as soon as we can. They have
:05:21. > :05:24.always said we have no red lines, we're not holding off. We would have
:05:25. > :05:29.nominated Arlene Foster if that wasn't a problem long before now.
:05:30. > :05:33.There are a number of issues here on which the raw great difficulties on
:05:34. > :05:39.legacy. We know that there is difficulty about national security
:05:40. > :05:43.and what can be disclosed to the families, and what the families want
:05:44. > :05:47.in relation to that. On the Irish language I'm told that the DUP is
:05:48. > :05:50.still looking for an omnibus language act which would include
:05:51. > :05:57.Ulster, Scots and the Irish language. Whereas Sinn Fein, they
:05:58. > :06:01.say we need a bespoke Irish Language Act. If I was to borrow this down,
:06:02. > :06:07.what could be a deal? You could imagine that if Sinn Fein was to
:06:08. > :06:11.give up its line in terms of not sharing power with Arlene Foster,
:06:12. > :06:16.and on the other hand the DUP was to say, you can have your Irish
:06:17. > :06:19.Language Act, that might be the big compromise. Back amid very quickly,
:06:20. > :06:22.but is there any sign that they want to do that? -- that can be done very
:06:23. > :06:23.quickly. I'm joined now by John Compton,
:06:24. > :06:26.the former Chief Executive of the Health and Social Care Board,
:06:27. > :06:29.and from our Foyle Studio by Sinead McLaughlin,
:06:30. > :06:36.Chief Executive of Londonderry John, you read this week in the
:06:37. > :06:39.Belfast Telegraph that the political impasse prose is a very real threat
:06:40. > :06:44.to the functioning of our health and social care service will stop --
:06:45. > :06:47.poses a very real threat. How worried are you? There are three big
:06:48. > :06:54.problems in the health service. Their performance, waiting times,
:06:55. > :06:58.and money. You can't make much progress in any of those if you
:06:59. > :07:01.don't have political leadership and political decision-making around to
:07:02. > :07:06.effect the changes that need to be made. And I think we could well be
:07:07. > :07:10.sleepwalking into quite a serious crisis, as far as the health service
:07:11. > :07:14.is concerned, if we don't actually have that sort of leadership and
:07:15. > :07:17.decision-making in the future. No one dispute that the stakes are
:07:18. > :07:20.high, but it has to be said there were problems before this political
:07:21. > :07:25.impasse. So it is not all down to the current deadlock. It is not, and
:07:26. > :07:31.I'm not a politician here about the politics of the thing. I just look
:07:32. > :07:37.at it, and what I see is for example on the money side, after the
:07:38. > :07:43.organisation made their ?60-80 million, they are still going to be
:07:44. > :07:49.much short. That means there will be longer rationing is of waiting
:07:50. > :07:51.times. In the absence of a political system and a political
:07:52. > :07:55.decision-making, that can only be more difficult for us all. You've
:07:56. > :07:59.talked about a potential health overspend of something in the region
:08:00. > :08:06.of ?300 million this year. That's a big figure. I think what'll happen
:08:07. > :08:10.if it may well not reach that full overspend. What that will be as
:08:11. > :08:13.rationing and curtailment of services. If you like, that they
:08:14. > :08:17.pass the decision not to do things, but it's a decision we will all
:08:18. > :08:21.experience. Sinead, you are due to meet Michelle O'Neill in Derry
:08:22. > :08:27.tonight. What were the concerns that you wanted to put to her during a
:08:28. > :08:31.conversation? Well, the business community, from our point of view,
:08:32. > :08:38.the big concern is Brexit. Article 50 was triggered last Wednesday. The
:08:39. > :08:42.negotiations have started and we do not have a voice at the table. We
:08:43. > :08:47.have outsourced our voice to Dublin, to London and indeed to Brussels.
:08:48. > :08:50.Really, that's just not good enough. That was the concern that I put to
:08:51. > :09:01.her. I realise political parties don't want to forsake their
:09:02. > :09:03.ideology. That is as it is. But we are in a precedent Challenger as a
:09:04. > :09:10.result of Brexit in Northern Ireland, and in the Republic of
:09:11. > :09:13.Ireland, and many a political voice within the exec -- and we need a
:09:14. > :09:18.political voice within the executive to articulate the needs of the
:09:19. > :09:20.electorate. As the business community, we don't want to
:09:21. > :09:24.metaphorically beat our politicians up. We want to support them and
:09:25. > :09:29.ensure that they do the right thing for the people and for the business
:09:30. > :09:34.community within this island, and within Northern Ireland. Just to be
:09:35. > :09:36.clear, are you saying that the restoration of the devolved
:09:37. > :09:41.institutions is the only way that you think these issues are going to
:09:42. > :09:45.be dealt with? And what was Michelle O'Neill's response to that
:09:46. > :09:51.suggestion when you put it to her? Brexit is a political problem. It is
:09:52. > :09:56.not a problem that can be solved by the business community. We can
:09:57. > :09:59.support, but there needs to be an articulation on paper put forward by
:10:00. > :10:04.the Northern Ireland executive. They need to have a unity of purpose.
:10:05. > :10:09.This affects everybody's life. This is not a party political situation,
:10:10. > :10:16.this is a situation that we have never experienced in our lifetime.
:10:17. > :10:23.To have no voice in the middle of all this is just a dereliction of
:10:24. > :10:30.duty. But, of course... At this point in time we need an budget as
:10:31. > :10:33.the first issue and Brexit at the second. The world is moving on, but
:10:34. > :10:38.we feel left behind. You have said you don't want to regard Brexit as
:10:39. > :10:41.party political, but the reality is that Michelle O'Neill with so Brexit
:10:42. > :10:49.is a big issue and she thinks that a major threat to the island. But the
:10:50. > :10:56.other main party for the biggest party in Northern Ireland -- of the
:10:57. > :11:01.other main party in Northern Ireland sees Brexit as an opportunity. There
:11:02. > :11:04.are challenges around Northern Ireland and there needs to be a
:11:05. > :11:11.voice and a position set. Because we are asking Brussels to look upon
:11:12. > :11:13.Northern Ireland as a unique set of circumstances. Yet there is no
:11:14. > :11:19.articulation to the Dublin government, and even to a unified
:11:20. > :11:24.voice to London to negotiate on our behalf. And it's just unacceptable.
:11:25. > :11:29.It's a political situation that needs to be resolved by politicians
:11:30. > :11:32.with the help of civic society. John, you whether to the idea of a
:11:33. > :11:36.return to devolution, or is it possible that under direct rule, the
:11:37. > :11:42.difficult decisions and accountable politicians are frankly reluctant or
:11:43. > :11:45.unable to make might be pushed through and Westminster? I suppose
:11:46. > :11:50.that's a possibility, but it would be such a disappointment if that is
:11:51. > :11:53.the case that we have a society couldn't take decision is
:11:54. > :11:56.fundamental for ourselves. As she later said, this is not about
:11:57. > :12:03.hunting the big politicians up. It is about recognising that there are
:12:04. > :12:08.serious issues in the Business Secretary Hull sex and health
:12:09. > :12:15.sector. In the health sector, we spend -- in the business sector and
:12:16. > :12:18.health sector. Or 1.8 million people use the service. It is a very
:12:19. > :12:21.compelling argument to sit down around the table and come to a
:12:22. > :12:25.conclusion where we can have a government that looks after that and
:12:26. > :12:29.take the necessary decisions for the future. The chances are, of course,
:12:30. > :12:32.that you wouldn't find a politician in Northern Ireland who didn't agree
:12:33. > :12:35.with what you've just that. But the point would be they would say that
:12:36. > :12:37.the reason we are in the predicament that we are in is somebody else's
:12:38. > :12:49.fault and not their fault? Yes, but you are in the political
:12:50. > :12:53.game to take leadership and demonstrate ownership. I would
:12:54. > :12:59.encourage people to accept that and move on words. Otherwise we will
:13:00. > :13:03.face considerable difficulties. I can talk about some of the
:13:04. > :13:07.difficulties we might face in the health sector but it is not
:13:08. > :13:11.exclusive to the health sector, it applies to the business sector,
:13:12. > :13:22.community sector, voluntary sector. We have big issues to deal with.
:13:23. > :13:29.Where do you think this period of deadlock leaves us as far as these
:13:30. > :13:35.big decisions are? There will be work going on in the background but
:13:36. > :13:38.in the end it needs to be politically driven and politically
:13:39. > :13:43.led. You can't do it without political drive and the political
:13:44. > :13:50.elite. It will run into a cul-de-sac without political support. That is
:13:51. > :13:54.important because we need to reform our health and social care system.
:13:55. > :14:00.There is no point about people complaining about rising costs in
:14:01. > :14:08.the health system when we are not making the change that could prevent
:14:09. > :14:13.and limit that. Sinead, McLaughlin, there are economists who think this
:14:14. > :14:18.could work itself out in the wash, overplaying the fear of instability.
:14:19. > :14:25.Do you sympathise with this customer that lack of an executive is hurting
:14:26. > :14:31.businesses at the moment. Some Government contracts can't be
:14:32. > :14:34.executed because of lack of money. Some in the community and voluntary
:14:35. > :14:40.sector have had their jobs put on hold. This is hurting peoples
:14:41. > :14:44.pockets. We need to address this sooner rather than later. Just
:14:45. > :14:49.letting things just on is not a solution. I know our politicians
:14:50. > :14:53.don't want to do that either. I think people need to come out of the
:14:54. > :14:57.corners, move towards the centre, and deal with the big issues that
:14:58. > :15:02.are facing the people of Northern Ireland today, not tomorrow, today.
:15:03. > :15:05.Were you reassured at all on any of the issues that you have touched
:15:06. > :15:11.upon tonight from what you heard from Michelle O'Neill? I believe
:15:12. > :15:17.that there is a desire to move back into Government. They want
:15:18. > :15:20.everything fixed before they do so and I don't think that that can
:15:21. > :15:27.happen as easily as they would wish for. We need to make some sacrifices
:15:28. > :15:29.and moved towards the centre and start delivering for the people of
:15:30. > :15:41.Northern Ireland that voted for them. Thank you both very much.
:15:42. > :15:44.Well, one of the sticking points in those talks, we're told,
:15:45. > :15:45.is the establishment of an Irish Language Act.
:15:46. > :15:48.So are there lessons our politicians could learn from how the issue's
:15:49. > :16:01.We sent Stephen Walker to Cardiff to examine the Welsh model.
:16:02. > :16:08.Six years ago Assembly members in Cardiff introduced new measures for
:16:09. > :16:11.the Welsh language. It's meant for the first time that Wales could be
:16:12. > :16:15.treated less favourably than English. The measures also
:16:16. > :16:19.introduced the new position of Welsh language commissioner whose job was
:16:20. > :16:28.to promote the language and penalise those who failed to comply with the
:16:29. > :16:31.changes. Mary Hughes has been the
:16:32. > :16:36.Commissioner for five years and she has to sanction those who failed to
:16:37. > :16:42.comply with the regulations. We have two be tough but it is tough with an
:16:43. > :16:49.explanation, a smile, and a way forward. That is the important
:16:50. > :16:53.message. Where are we going? It's a road some Irish campaigners want to
:16:54. > :16:57.travel. They would like a Commissioner. But in Cardiff there
:16:58. > :17:03.are words of caution from this Northern Ireland born academic. It
:17:04. > :17:11.can have certain benefits but the office has to be treated, design,
:17:12. > :17:16.with the particular tasks in mind. Clarity on that is essential. I'm
:17:17. > :17:20.not sure that the different actors that are engaged with the Irish
:17:21. > :17:27.language agenda in Northern Ireland at present have got that clarity as
:17:28. > :17:32.yet. The signs of change are everywhere to see in Wales. Welsh is
:17:33. > :17:36.now on an equal footing with endless.
:17:37. > :17:41.What can we learn from the Welsh experience? Can the plans here act
:17:42. > :17:46.as a guide for those who want an Irish Language Act? After six years
:17:47. > :17:49.in operation the proposals are being reviewed and straightforward
:17:50. > :17:55.questions are being asked? What works and what doesn't? Susie Davis
:17:56. > :18:00.is a Conservative Assembly Member who speaks English and Wales, she
:18:01. > :18:06.says those campaigning for an Irish Language Act Commission need to
:18:07. > :18:10.think carefully. If you are going to have an Irish language Commissioner
:18:11. > :18:15.focus on the promotion and benefits of being bilingual, rather than the
:18:16. > :18:19.insistence on certain rules and regulations. If you wanted to be
:18:20. > :18:26.something that people look at in a positive way and our Boly -- and see
:18:27. > :18:33.a value, and economic value as well, explain that, rather than being told
:18:34. > :18:36.it is good for you. The context of another ties language such that you
:18:37. > :18:41.need legislation to guarantee rates for those people. Without that
:18:42. > :18:49.legislation, that body to protect those rights, it is like many other
:18:50. > :18:54.qualities, you need basic fundamental rights guaranteed by
:18:55. > :18:58.law. The difference between the debate in Wales about languages, and
:18:59. > :19:04.a discussion in Northern Ireland is stark. In Cardiff is a political
:19:05. > :19:07.consensus. In Belfast there is a stalemate. It is different in
:19:08. > :19:14.Northern Ireland because you have got two distinct cultures there. But
:19:15. > :19:22.it is a matter of showing respect, respect to each other, mutual
:19:23. > :19:26.respect. Because the Irish community respect the Unionist tradition and
:19:27. > :19:34.vice versa, that should be a way of communicating. What advice does the
:19:35. > :19:39.Welsh language minister have for those opposed to an Irish language
:19:40. > :19:44.act? I would say embrace the language, embrace the culture,
:19:45. > :19:48.embrace it as part of your identity. We have taken politics out of the
:19:49. > :19:53.language and we have all benefited, Welsh speakers and non-Welsh
:19:54. > :19:57.speakers alike. How does he his politics and his identity with the
:19:58. > :20:02.Welsh language? I'm a Unionist and I speak Welsh. My children speak Welsh
:20:03. > :20:07.and go to Welsh language schools. I speak Welsh when I am at home as
:20:08. > :20:11.well as at work. It is part of my identity, my cultural experience,
:20:12. > :20:14.part of my future, part of my British future, I don't need to
:20:15. > :20:19.choose between being British and Welsh, I can have both. It's clear
:20:20. > :20:26.that those thoughts are sheared and other parties. I don't like either
:20:27. > :20:30.language being used as a weapon. I accept my identity might have
:20:31. > :20:34.changed now I have this new skill but it does not affect me as a
:20:35. > :20:39.Unionist, I am as British as I once was. What could change the debate
:20:40. > :20:42.about an Irish language act? Mythology creates fear. One of the
:20:43. > :20:50.important thing is to get rid of any meths. Look at what you are trying
:20:51. > :20:53.to do, you are trying to create an energetic bilingual community. In
:20:54. > :20:58.order to do that you need to be able to talk to each other. She
:20:59. > :21:13.experiences. Pull down fences and stop the Welsh experience shows that
:21:14. > :21:14.dialogue -- pull down fences. The Welsh experience shows that dialogue
:21:15. > :21:21.can work. Stephen Walker reporting -
:21:22. > :21:23.and with me now are the former Culture Minister, Nelson McCausland,
:21:24. > :21:34.and Ian Malcolm who's an Irish Nelson McAusland, we heard from the
:21:35. > :21:38.man responsible for the Welsh language, someone who describes
:21:39. > :21:42.himself as a Unionist, saying he has no issue with an act that safeguards
:21:43. > :21:47.and indigenous language, but there are problems with that in Northern
:21:48. > :21:54.Ireland. Why is that the case? The Irish language has been used, abused
:21:55. > :21:59.in many ways, by some of its advocates, for political ends. We
:22:00. > :22:04.need to step back from the current confrontation that there is, where
:22:05. > :22:09.one group says we want an Irish language, the other says you cannot
:22:10. > :22:15.have it. We need to reframe the conversation because ultimately,
:22:16. > :22:19.this is about cultural identity, and we need to look at the issue of
:22:20. > :22:23.cultural identity in Northern Ireland, how it is affirmed and
:22:24. > :22:29.validated, all cultural identities, not just one, all the different
:22:30. > :22:39.cultural identities that we have. But the Irish language is not
:22:40. > :22:44.necessarily monocultural. It is interesting that Alun Davies linked
:22:45. > :22:51.the Welsh language of his Welsh identity, and this comes through
:22:52. > :22:55.with Sinn Fein. It affirms my identity, validates, part of what
:22:56. > :23:01.that person is. Identity is the real issue. You don't think that an Irish
:23:02. > :23:06.Language Act, the right kind of Irish Language Act, could make it
:23:07. > :23:10.attractive to Protestants, Unionists, who are perhaps not very
:23:11. > :23:14.knowledgeable about it, or downright hostile towards it? There are many
:23:15. > :23:18.people who have different cultural expressions. He needs to look at all
:23:19. > :23:24.the different cultural expressions, all linguistic diversity, and see
:23:25. > :23:30.how we treat all of these based on a word that Sinn Fein used, equality.
:23:31. > :23:34.You are not a politician, but you broadcast in Irish, you teach the
:23:35. > :23:38.language to a lot of people in Belfast. You have seen the language
:23:39. > :23:42.could all over the years. Can you see fight Nelson McAusland sees the
:23:43. > :23:46.language is there, people who want to learn it can learn it, we don't
:23:47. > :23:51.beat an Irish Language Act to protect and promote it? It is
:23:52. > :23:55.important to acknowledge that all of the political parties have their own
:23:56. > :24:00.positions on the Irish language and indeed on many other matters. Those
:24:01. > :24:04.decisions are -- those positions are strongly held and parties may feel
:24:05. > :24:09.they are representing the wishes and views of the electorate. But we have
:24:10. > :24:13.to seek another review of the Irish Language Act stop it is not
:24:14. > :24:17.something that has always been political. There was a time when
:24:18. > :24:21.there were people from both traditions and backgrounds in this
:24:22. > :24:25.part of the world spoke Irish. We could go through a history lesson,
:24:26. > :24:33.which I don't propose to do now, but Irish came to this island by the
:24:34. > :24:38.Celts, and at that stage there were no Protestants, nor Catholics,
:24:39. > :24:44.Unionists, nationalists, so language predates that. When it is said that
:24:45. > :24:48.the Irish Language Act is an issue primarily to do with identity what
:24:49. > :24:51.do you see? You are open about the fact that you are an Irish Language
:24:52. > :24:57.Act is yes but you are also a Protestant and a Unionist. Yes, and
:24:58. > :25:02.I am proud of my background. Do you see it as your Irishness and your
:25:03. > :25:05.ability to speak and promote the Irish Language Act is also part of
:25:06. > :25:09.your Protestant and Unionist tradition? I do very much because
:25:10. > :25:13.during the 19th century, Presbyterians wear to the fore in
:25:14. > :25:17.the preservation and promotion of the Irish language at a time when it
:25:18. > :25:22.was in severe difficulty and in danger of dying out. On at least one
:25:23. > :25:30.occasion Queen Victoria was welcomed to Belfast with slogans in Irish. It
:25:31. > :25:37.was a very warm welcome from the Protestant people of Belfast to
:25:38. > :25:42.Queen Victoria. Nelson McAusland might see that was then, this is no,
:25:43. > :25:45.there has been a lot of water under the bridge since Queen Victoria was
:25:46. > :25:48.last in Belfast. Indeed the House but I think we are moving back to a
:25:49. > :25:51.position when people on both sides of the community are recognising
:25:52. > :25:58.that the Irish Language Act something the interfaces on a daily
:25:59. > :26:05.basis, and teams of surnames, place names, in terms of the way we use
:26:06. > :26:11.the Irish language through English, words like Smithereens, derived from
:26:12. > :26:15.Irish. Do you accept that as the case? There are people in this part
:26:16. > :26:19.of the world to perhaps didn't grow up and running Irish, people from
:26:20. > :26:22.the Protestant and Unionist tradition, who now do want to engage
:26:23. > :26:28.with that in no way they maybe did not 20, 30 years ago? One of the
:26:29. > :26:34.disappointments with a lot of the discussion is that it focuses on one
:26:35. > :26:41.cultural expression, to the exclusion -- to the exclusion of all
:26:42. > :26:47.others. I read the document issued by the Gaelic league critic put
:26:48. > :26:51.forward a proposal for the Irish language act. The figure was
:26:52. > :26:56.rejected by another Irish language activists who said it was
:26:57. > :27:01.unrealistically low. But at least we are talking about figures.
:27:02. > :27:10.Previously a proposal was published, and then we were told they did not
:27:11. > :27:14.know what it was cost. 8.5 million, then 2 million per year for five
:27:15. > :27:23.years, you toss about 100 million. I am probably an Agreement with the
:27:24. > :27:25.statement that that figure was unrealistically low. It suits your
:27:26. > :27:32.purpose is to agree with Janice Miller on that. We happen to agree.
:27:33. > :27:36.That there's a reason for you not to want it. She said that as our
:27:37. > :27:41.assessment, it is not for you to put interpretation on my motivation.
:27:42. > :27:51.What I wanted to see about a leaked document is this, -- the Gaelic
:27:52. > :27:56.league documents, it is not a separate issue, it is significant,
:27:57. > :28:01.when the document that uses nationalist Republican language of
:28:02. > :28:10.the north, they would not even use the term Northern Ireland, and that
:28:11. > :28:16.is not the only document. How serious a point it is? I think it is
:28:17. > :28:26.significantly. Your primary concern is about the
:28:27. > :28:30.cost .dll you may not want to face the fact that is a national issue.
:28:31. > :28:40.Is the issue of cost a major issue for you? Cost of a factor. If they
:28:41. > :28:43.didn't cost anything, would support an Irish Language Act? There is no
:28:44. > :28:48.point in having a discussion about something that is hypothetical. But
:28:49. > :28:52.I will say this to you - I want legislation that accommodates all be
:28:53. > :28:59.cultural traditions and linguistic traditions equally. No preferential
:29:00. > :29:06.treatment from the Irish language or the Irish language community.
:29:07. > :29:10.Everybody's culture. You will also unionist and interested in Orange
:29:11. > :29:16.culture. Can you see where Nelson is coming from on that? As I said, I
:29:17. > :29:20.understand that people have strongly held positions about the Irish
:29:21. > :29:25.language. People feel as though some people do feel that it may be part
:29:26. > :29:29.of a broader cultural issue. But I think really we have to cut through
:29:30. > :29:33.some of the myths out there about the Irish language. I honestly think
:29:34. > :29:38.they are put out there to scare people about a language act, in
:29:39. > :29:42.terms of number one cause. I've spoken to many people from my
:29:43. > :29:47.background recently about an Irish Language Act. And two fears are
:29:48. > :29:50.reiterated and stated to me time and time again. One is that every child
:29:51. > :29:54.in Northern Ireland would be forced to learn the Irish language in
:29:55. > :29:58.school. That's not going to happen. The other fear that people have
:29:59. > :30:02.expressed to me on many occasions is that every single document must be
:30:03. > :30:07.translated into Irish as well as English. You don't think that would
:30:08. > :30:11.happen? I do not think that would happen. What would you say to
:30:12. > :30:17.Nelson, who has expressed in the way that he has done many times before
:30:18. > :30:23.his severe reservations about an Irish Language Act? You think she's
:30:24. > :30:26.got it wrong, why? I think we will have to move together. Obviously
:30:27. > :30:31.talks are going on on the Irish language is one of many issues up
:30:32. > :30:35.for discussion. The way to move forward is to try and garner a
:30:36. > :30:40.consensus. First of all by looking at those areas in which an Irish
:30:41. > :30:43.Language Act or progression of the Irish language could be made on
:30:44. > :30:50.non-contentious issues. And there are many of those. Anyway towards
:30:51. > :30:53.persuading new? I have no issue with the Irish language. I do have an
:30:54. > :30:57.issue with the Irish Language Act and I have an issue with the way in
:30:58. > :31:00.which the Irish language has been used by Sinn Fein and other
:31:01. > :31:02.nationalists to further political agenda. Interesting to hear your
:31:03. > :31:03.thoughts. And let's hear what our commentators
:31:04. > :31:06.make of where we are. Fionnuala O Connor and Alex Kane
:31:07. > :31:13.are with me tonight. Good evening to you both. That's
:31:14. > :31:20.pick-up on that issue of language, first of all. We heard the
:31:21. > :31:24.experience from Stephen Walker of Wales, and how language is dealt
:31:25. > :31:28.with there. Do you think there is any way, Alex, of us learning
:31:29. > :31:31.lessons from that experience in Cardiff? I would be cautious because
:31:32. > :31:36.I think it's easy enough to say you are equally Welsh and British
:31:37. > :31:40.because there is no chance of Wales becoming an independent country. My
:31:41. > :31:43.own gut instinct is that there will be an Irish Language Act, not in the
:31:44. > :31:48.next few weeks or months, but at some point. I just wish a debate
:31:49. > :31:53.about it, which is important for both sides, had been held in the
:31:54. > :31:57.circumstances. It has become a much more political debate than it should
:31:58. > :32:00.be. The culture and history have been forgotten. The joint history
:32:01. > :32:05.has been forgotten and Sinn Fein are using this for their own agenda. You
:32:06. > :32:09.were unionist. Does the prospect of an Irish Language Act in Northern
:32:10. > :32:13.Ireland were you? He doesn't worry me because I am confident in safe in
:32:14. > :32:16.Unionism. There are lots of other cultures and traditions which need
:32:17. > :32:20.to be respected. I can deal with all of that, but I am worried that we
:32:21. > :32:25.have any of these debates where it seems to belong to one side or the
:32:26. > :32:29.other. Fionnuala, what did you make of that? It seems that Nelson is not
:32:30. > :32:35.persuadable, and that is someone who is a unionist and Protestant sat
:32:36. > :32:42.alongside him who is an advocate for the Irish language. But Nelson isn't
:32:43. > :32:47.biting. I'm reminded to rise above this. Two proverbs come to me, one
:32:48. > :32:56.from the African-American tradition, when they go low, we go high. And
:32:57. > :33:03.the other one, more knowledge unless wisdom. It seems to me that -- more
:33:04. > :33:08.knowledge and less wisdom. It seems to me that this argument is all
:33:09. > :33:12.about identity and we must have all cultures recognise. I don't think
:33:13. > :33:15.Nelson means that for a minute. I do think he wants Bengali culture
:33:16. > :33:24.recognised equally with Irish culture. -- I don't think he wants
:33:25. > :33:30.Bengali culture. I would disagree completely with Alex, nobody has
:33:31. > :33:34.mentioned the DUP's attitude to the Irish. It surprises me that in the
:33:35. > :33:39.middle of talks after a very hard-fought and nasty election
:33:40. > :33:45.campaign, after an awkward outcome for the DUP and for the union's
:33:46. > :33:48.majority, that a leading unionist Vicar, albeit not an MLA any more,
:33:49. > :33:53.should go out and maybe make things difficult for people who are trying
:33:54. > :34:04.to negotiate. -- leading unionist figure. Gregory Campbell,
:34:05. > :34:07.disparaging Irish in the crudest and very unattractive ways for years, is
:34:08. > :34:13.nothing to do with cost or argument about recognising cultures. It is
:34:14. > :34:17.just contempt for Irish. The DUP have suffered from that attitude
:34:18. > :34:22.from Arlene Foster in the election outcome. Alex, let's briefly have a
:34:23. > :34:27.word about the wider talks process and where we are, do you think, with
:34:28. > :34:30.that? The Irish Language Act is apparently a sticking point. What
:34:31. > :34:34.prospects for resolution by the end of next week? I don't see any
:34:35. > :34:39.prospect that all. Given what is coming out and the lack of clarity
:34:40. > :34:41.and progress. They may as well have been talking in Welsh for the past
:34:42. > :34:47.week because they clearly don't understand what each other once. And
:34:48. > :34:50.there is a third-party - James Brokenshire, he is not impartial by
:34:51. > :34:53.any means. The British government has to compromise as well. Thank you
:34:54. > :34:55.both very much. That's it from The View for this
:34:56. > :34:58.and the next few weeks. We'll be back after Easter -
:34:59. > :35:01.and we leave you with one intrepid MLA who was so hungry this week
:35:02. > :35:04.that he stepped outside his comfort And obviously other
:35:05. > :35:20.chocolate bars are available. So I'm on the third floor of
:35:21. > :35:26.Stormont. This is the Sinn Fein side, and way down there is DUP
:35:27. > :35:29.territory. It's a bit like East territory and West Germany, but
:35:30. > :35:37.that's where I had to go to get my Snickers! -- East Germany and West
:35:38. > :35:50.Germany. I am in no man's land now between the two areas. We are moving
:35:51. > :35:58.into DUP territory. I had just passed Peter's office and I am
:35:59. > :36:08.nearly there. I'm getting there. There is my Snickers, there!