:00:00. > :00:00.why eight quiet and studious family were the subject of an arson attack.
:00:00. > :00:05.It is 2:33am. Time for the week in It is 2:33am. Time for the week in
:00:05. > :00:22.Parliament. Welcome to the show. Getting in the
:00:22. > :00:27.mood for the conference season. Party leaders enjoy it pre—
:00:27. > :00:34.conference baiting. They need to look at the Trading Standards, I
:00:34. > :00:39.have to say, he folded very fast. For the few, not the many, he is a
:00:39. > :00:41.two nation Prime Minister. The Deputy Speaker of the commons
:00:41. > :00:44.two nation Prime Minister. The resigned after being charged with
:00:44. > :00:48.personally in the chamber. Winston personally in the chamber.
:00:48. > :00:53.through hell, keep going. Sage Churchill said, when you are
:00:53. > :00:58.advice. I will see this through to advice. I will see this through to
:00:58. > :01:02.the end. Caught between the rock and a hard place, we put the latest row
:01:02. > :01:08.and counter claim poverty league BBC and
:01:08. > :01:18.agreements made. He walked away with payoffs. I was not party to the
:01:18. > :01:19.agreements made. He walked away with £1 million. First, the party
:01:19. > :01:21.conference season is here. The conference season is here. The
:01:21. > :01:30.political parties events, this week saw the annual
:01:30. > :01:34.conference of the treaty union Congress. Going along to talk to the
:01:34. > :01:37.union leaders of the area, was none other than the lead of —— Labour
:01:37. > :01:40.leader, Ed Miliband. His party leader, Ed Miliband. His party 's
:01:40. > :01:45.relationship with the unions is currently going through what may be
:01:45. > :01:47.termed as difficult times. He was heard respectfully. The opinions of
:01:47. > :01:51.the commentators differed about the commentators differed about the
:01:51. > :01:55.com —— quality of his speech. David Cameron was keen to taunt the Labour
:01:55. > :02:01.leader about his performance. Ed Miliband welcome to the league just
:02:01. > :02:06.fall in the job figures, but he noted under point was still rising
:02:06. > :02:11.in half of the UK. Unemployment is rising in half of the country. In
:02:11. > :02:15.the east of the England, the north—east, Yorkshire and Humber,
:02:15. > :02:20.the West Midlands, Scotland. Can you confirm that the only month when
:02:20. > :02:29.wages rose faster than prices, was when he handed out the millionaires
:02:29. > :02:35.tax cut and city bonuses went up... When city bonuses went up 82%. His
:02:35. > :02:40.speech was so poor as we said speech was so poor as we said
:02:40. > :02:45.yesterday, it is difficult to know when he's finished. He went to the
:02:45. > :02:47.area, he screwed it up. The fact is, in this economy,
:02:47. > :02:53.confidence is up, consumer confidence is up, exports are up.
:02:53. > :02:57.They want to give the maximum support to millionaires who are
:02:57. > :03:04.giving bonuses. It is a different story for those who go to food
:03:04. > :03:06.banks. We know what this government thinks about those who go to food
:03:06. > :03:08.banks. The children's secretary said banks. The children's secretary said
:03:08. > :03:12.that the people who go to food banks only have themselves. One of the
:03:12. > :03:14.honourable members is groaning. It honourable members is groaning. It
:03:14. > :03:24.shows how out of touch Conservative party is. Now we would
:03:24. > :03:24.all like to hear... Does the Prime Minister agree with his children's
:03:24. > :03:32.times under labour. We would only secretary?
:03:32. > :03:36.times under labour. We would only have to take —— we don't have to
:03:36. > :03:40.take it lectures from them. On the issue of complacency, real
:03:41. > :03:48.and borrowing through the roof. The and borrowing through the roof. The
:03:48. > :03:51.children's secretary comments, nor distance himself from them. Let me
:03:51. > :03:58.tell him, the children's secretary is an absolute disgrace. Mr Speaker,
:03:58. > :04:03.let us see any of them try to live on £150 a week. Then we would see
:04:03. > :04:07.would happens. 1 million young people are out of work. Unemployment
:04:07. > :04:09.up in half the country. Millions of people worse off, while millionaires
:04:09. > :04:13.get a tax cut. For the few, not the get a tax cut. For the few, not the
:04:13. > :04:20.many. He is a two nation Prime Minister. I tell him what a disgrace
:04:20. > :04:26.is. That is going down to the trade unions, and caving in. We were
:04:26. > :04:29.promised this great big tough fight, this tough speech, he told us it
:04:29. > :04:35.would be raging Bull. He gave us chicken run. Apparently yesterday, a
:04:36. > :04:42.man in Bournemouth advertised, only to collapse in seconds. My friend
:04:42. > :04:45.makes a good point. makes a good point. I admire
:04:45. > :04:49.everything that happens in Dorset, but they need to look at the Trading
:04:49. > :04:57.Standards. He folded faster than a Bournemouth deckchair. David
:04:57. > :05:02.Cameron. The MP Nigel Evans resigned this week as Deputy Speaker of the
:05:02. > :05:04.commons. He had been charged with serious sexual offences. At the
:05:04. > :05:08.start of Wednesday 's business in the house, the empty that his seat
:05:08. > :05:11.on the backbenches, and in a speech confirming his resignation, Mr Evans
:05:11. > :05:13.said he would said he would be robust the
:05:13. > :05:19.defending his innocence, and seeking acquittal. I have therefore decided
:05:19. > :05:23.that the best course of action is for me to return to the backbenches,
:05:23. > :05:24.and this is a decision that I have made myself after careful
:05:24. > :05:31.consideration. I did not have the consideration. I did not have the
:05:31. > :05:36.and I am not seeking to return after and I
:05:36. > :05:40.the conclusion of the fence —— until after the conclusion of events.
:05:40. > :05:46.had been put in limbo by recent had been put in limbo by recent
:05:46. > :05:48.events, he said. I am so grateful to the Speaker, and to the two other
:05:48. > :06:01.deputy speakers, the honourable they have given me over the three
:06:01. > :06:08.years. Particularly, since May for. —— made a fourth. When I told the
:06:08. > :06:15.member for Bristol south on Saturday my decision, I even got a hug from
:06:15. > :06:20.her. Thank you. I have had so many hugs, prayers and good wishes since
:06:20. > :06:23.thank everyone who has shown me such thank everyone who has shown me such
:06:23. > :06:26.compassionate consideration. This is the most painful thing I have
:06:26. > :06:30.endured in my life, alongside the loss of my mother in 2009, and the
:06:30. > :06:35.loss of my brother earlier this year. Winston Churchill said, when
:06:35. > :06:42.you are going through hell, keep going. Sage advice. I will see this
:06:42. > :06:51.through to the end. With the support of the people that mean so much to
:06:52. > :06:55.me. Nigel Evans. The verdict of the culture Secretary on, not the Queen,
:06:55. > :06:59.but the BBC. The last 12 months have but the BBC. The last 12 months have
:07:00. > :07:09.not been the BBC's finest time, after the Jimmy Sable revelations a
:07:09. > :07:13.year ago, the size of payoffs given to departing BBC executives has
:07:14. > :07:18.caused controversy. MPs on the commons Public Accounts Committee
:07:18. > :07:20.had before them seven past and present corporation bosses. MPs
:07:20. > :07:24.wanted to know how the BBC trust could not have known the details of
:07:24. > :07:29.the payment given to the BBC's former deputy director—general when
:07:29. > :07:34.he left in 2011. The former director—general claim to the trust
:07:34. > :07:38.did know. I do not understand why those
:07:38. > :07:44.made. I think it is... I do not want made. I think it
:07:44. > :07:46.unfair misleading made specifically believe there were
:07:46. > :07:53.unfair misleading made specifically on this point of how much, how much
:07:53. > :08:00.information had been shared. Under the terms of the contract, one—year
:08:00. > :08:07.salary, give or take a bit, is half £1 million. He walked away with,
:08:07. > :08:18.half £1 million, which for most half £1 million, which for most
:08:18. > :08:23.people, is megabuck is —— megabucks, given to someone no longer needed in
:08:23. > :08:24.the organisation. We lost a quarter of the senior management, and a
:08:25. > :08:29.massive reorganisation. We were, massive reorganisation. We were, as
:08:29. > :08:33.you know from other hearings, in the middle of a series of gigantic
:08:33. > :08:38.broadcasting house, also the broadcasting house, also the
:08:38. > :08:42.preparation of the Royal wedding and the Olympic Games. We took the
:08:42. > :08:46.decision, and it was my judgement, which I put to the executive board
:08:46. > :08:51.and discussed with the BBC trust, that we wanted him through the
:08:51. > :08:55.difficult transition fully focused on the enormous task we had. All I
:08:55. > :08:57.said to the committee, and I am in said to the committee, and I am
:08:57. > :09:02.difficulty about this, I repeat, I difficulty about this, I repeat, I
:09:02. > :09:06.was not party to the agreements made about him. I am in the position
:09:06. > :09:07.where I have been accused of where I have been accused of
:09:07. > :09:10.misleading the committee on misleading the committee on
:09:10. > :09:17.something I never knew. A million quid. I would have questioned it.
:09:17. > :09:22.That is having been on a lot of executive —— nonexecutive member of
:09:22. > :09:26.many public bodies. I take it you did not. I think it should have been
:09:27. > :09:28.in your welcome back. I cannot understand why you did not put it in
:09:28. > :09:34.there. The reason for that is there. The reason for that is
:09:34. > :09:38.because my interpretation, and my staff 's interpretation of what Mr
:09:38. > :09:40.Thompson has included in his brief is different. We were not aware of
:09:40. > :09:41.the details of Mark Byford 's the details of Mark Byford 's
:09:41. > :09:47.arrangement. Neither in writing arrangement. Neither in writing or
:09:47. > :09:49.from any oral contact. That is the fact of the matter. I cannot believe
:09:49. > :09:58.that. If you want me to explain, I fact of the matter. I cannot believe
:09:58. > :10:02.would be happy to. A final summary from the chair. Have we got in any
:10:02. > :10:08.wiser. I do not know. We will have to see when we look at the details
:10:08. > :10:19.control. A failure to communicate incompetence.
:10:19. > :10:29.have seen people covering their for an organisation whose business
:10:29. > :10:36.of people who work for the BBC, who of people who work for the BBC, who
:10:36. > :10:43.produce the fantastic content which enriches our lives. The sell—off of
:10:43. > :10:47.the Royal mail is finally here. There will be a stock market
:10:47. > :10:50.flotation in a matter of weeks. Privatisation of the service has
:10:50. > :10:53.been on the cards for years. The management and the government say
:10:53. > :10:58.the service needs access to private capital to grow and compete. Under
:10:58. > :11:02.the plans, 10% of shares will be given to Royal mail employees. The
:11:02. > :11:07.public will also be able to buy shares. The business minister
:11:07. > :11:15.happy that —— with the sell—off. I happy that —— with the sell—off. I
:11:16. > :11:17.am Royal mail management, fully recognised and understand the
:11:17. > :11:19.natural apprehensions of the natural apprehensions of the
:11:19. > :11:23.workforce about this. I workforce about this. I have
:11:23. > :11:27.continued to meet with the union on regular meetings of the last year,
:11:27. > :11:31.to discuss these concerns. I also want to reassure the house once
:11:31. > :11:36.again that a change in Royal mail ownership does not and cannot
:11:36. > :11:43.trigger any change in the provision of the universal postal service. Has
:11:43. > :11:48.universal service provider, Royal mail will continue to be obliged to
:11:48. > :11:54.deliver six days a week to urban and rural areas alike at the same
:11:54. > :11:55.affordable prices. The Royal mail is a much cherished national
:11:56. > :12:00.institution, but the case for institution, but the case for
:12:00. > :12:04.recent annual profits of over £400 recent annual profits of over £400
:12:04. > :12:08.million, we should be allowing it to flourish in the public sector. But
:12:08. > :12:11.the minister the minister today has told the
:12:11. > :12:15.stock exchange that he will sell a majority stake in the company on a
:12:15. > :12:17.with this politically motivated fire with this politically motivated fire
:12:17. > :12:23.sale to fill the sale to fill the hole in the
:12:23. > :12:27.Treasury created by George Osborne. This is a decision that will have
:12:27. > :12:33.businesses, and communities up and significant
:12:33. > :12:44.that we started this process in the down the country. A
:12:44. > :12:47.21 years ago, this must be the longest fire sale in history. Was it
:12:47. > :12:51.apparent then, as is apparent now, that if the Post Office is going to
:12:51. > :12:56.grow it must have commercial freedom. And at the same time,
:12:56. > :13:01.through primary legislation... Royal Mail, sorry, must have commercial
:13:01. > :13:05.freedom, and at the same time is possible through primary legislation
:13:05. > :13:09.to protect the universal service, the stamp costs the same in rural
:13:09. > :13:11.Lincolnshire as it did in London. We've said that 21 years ago, we
:13:11. > :13:12.have been saying it since, when have been saying it since, when will
:13:13. > :13:17.people start listening people start listening on the
:13:17. > :13:22.benches opposite? The Minister continues to refuse the activation
:13:22. > :13:25.that this is a fire sale, but as so many people are opposed to
:13:25. > :13:30.privatisation, will be flotation not occur in an atmosphere where the
:13:30. > :13:35.basic share price will automatically be reduced, therefore the taxpayer
:13:35. > :13:40.will have been cheated? The sale of the Royal Mail. Some international
:13:40. > :13:44.one that has shown particular one that has shown particular
:13:44. > :13:48.durability, lasting exactly 300 years, the Treaty of Utrecht in 1713
:13:48. > :13:52.that granted Gibraltar to the that granted Gibraltar to the
:13:52. > :13:56.British. And the Spanish have been unhappy ever since. The Ra
:13:56. > :14:03.long—running row over the place called the Rock has just gone
:14:03. > :14:07.through its latest turbulence —— the long—running row. The border delays
:14:07. > :14:09.stemmed, apparently, from the stemmed, apparently, from the
:14:09. > :14:14.frustrations of Spanish politicians at the dropping of concrete blocks
:14:14. > :14:18.earlier this year into the waters around the Rock. It was done to
:14:18. > :14:22.create a reef to encourage sea life to flourish. But Spain says the
:14:22. > :14:33.where the sympathies of MPs at where the sympathies of MPs at
:14:33. > :14:34.Westminster lay on the matter. Can I make it abundantly clear to the
:14:34. > :14:40.Spanish, hostility towards the British people
:14:40. > :14:45.of Gibraltar, that he will tell the hostility towards the British people
:14:45. > :14:46.his sombrero, straw donkey and his sombrero, straw
:14:47. > :14:49.sangria, and go. There have been sangria, and go. There
:14:49. > :14:53.have some under the Spanish occasions in recent weeks when
:14:53. > :14:59.diplomatic language in doing so than ambassador, but I think if
:14:59. > :14:59.diplomatic language in doing so than he is recommending onto Her Majesty
:14:59. > :15:06.'s government. $$CYAN Gibraltar is 's government. $$CYAN Gibraltar is
:15:06. > :15:09.British, end of story. But it's certainly true that the Spanish
:15:09. > :15:14.Foreign Secretary seems determined to get himself good headlines in the
:15:14. > :15:20.right wing press. But can I urge the Foreign Secretary not to rise to the
:15:20. > :15:26.Spanish bait. Keep calm and carry on. Well, I'm glad to hear... I'm
:15:26. > :15:32.glad to hear the endorsement that Gibraltar is unequivocally British,
:15:32. > :15:36.years ago from the Labour Party. So, years ago from the Labour Party. So,
:15:36. > :15:40.some thoughts in the Commons on Gibraltar. Tuesday this week was
:15:40. > :15:44.Gibraltar Day, marking the holding of the referendum on the Rock back
:15:44. > :15:47.in 1967 when they voted in 1967 when they voted
:15:47. > :15:51.overwhelmingly in favour of staying British. So, to shine a light on
:15:51. > :15:58.this peculiarly British issue, I'm joined in the studio by Doctor
:15:58. > :16:01.Chris, a in economic history and has co—authored a detailed book all
:16:01. > :16:07.about Gibraltar. Thanks very much. Am I right in saying that during
:16:07. > :16:12.this 300 year period the Spanish have always had a strong claim, or
:16:12. > :16:16.has it ever been the case that they haven't been too bothered about
:16:16. > :16:20.Gibraltar? The Spanish claim has always been held very strongly,
:16:20. > :16:25.in power. So, some of them have been in power. So, some of them have been
:16:25. > :16:28.able to get more leveraged out of the Gibraltar situation and others.
:16:28. > :16:32.The Franco government was distinctly The Franco government was distinctly
:16:32. > :16:32.more belligerent and closed the frontier between the end of the
:16:32. > :16:38.1960s and the mid—19 80s. Whereas in 1960s and the mid—19 80s. Whereas in
:16:38. > :16:40.the 19th—century Spanish governments knew pretty well they didn't have
:16:40. > :16:44.much leveraged over Britain, it was much leveraged over Britain, it was
:16:44. > :16:51.a dominant power. Has there ever been a chance of Gibraltar being
:16:51. > :17:00.military force in the 18th—century. going to
:17:01. > :17:01.military force in the 18th—century. But there was a very large siege
:17:01. > :17:05.then that captured the and since then it has not been
:17:05. > :17:13.imagination, and since then it has not been
:17:13. > :17:18.likely that that would be acceptable to pre—poll in Britain. Onto the
:17:18. > :17:22.political arrangements, how exactly is Gibraltar government? —— people
:17:23. > :17:25.in Britain. It is governed separately to the United Kingdom, it
:17:25. > :17:28.works slightly differently than say works slightly differently than say
:17:28. > :17:33.the Isle of Man or the Channel Islands. It does have that legacy of
:17:33. > :17:35.being a colonial territory. After the Second World War, like a lot of
:17:35. > :17:39.territories, it was moved to territories, it was moved to
:17:39. > :17:46.internal self—government. It has a parliament with elected members. It
:17:46. > :17:51.is run in the style of the British Parliamentary democracy. There is a
:17:51. > :17:56.governor? There's a governor who holds reserve powers for policing
:17:56. > :17:58.and security, who also deals with any diplomatic issues and crucially
:17:58. > :18:05.is commander—in—chief of the armed forces, and represents, in theory,
:18:05. > :18:10.the interests of the monarch. But in reality, of course, in the 21st
:18:10. > :18:12.century it is more the interests of the government. Is the Gibraltar
:18:12. > :18:16.government at the moment a government at the moment a
:18:17. > :18:21.Labour/Liberal Democrat Coalition? It is a Labour Liberal Coalition,
:18:21. > :18:24.although the Labour part of that styles itself as a socialist
:18:25. > :18:29.government, so slightly different in that sense to certainly new Labour.
:18:30. > :18:33.And the Liberal Party there does have strong links with the Liberal
:18:33. > :18:34.Party in Britain through what's called the Liberal International,
:18:34. > :18:40.there was a visit by the president there was a visit by the president
:18:40. > :18:44.of that organisation to Gibraltar recently, and on behalf of the 100
:18:44. > :18:47.Liberal Party members gave their support to the Gibraltar government.
:18:47. > :18:50.I'm not sure whether there's any truth in this, but
:18:50. > :18:56.course Spanish. I detected this hostility towards the UK
:18:56. > :19:01.but in such a small place recently, it never
:19:01. > :19:05.but in such a small place personalities matter. With her being
:19:05. > :19:08.Spanish there is suspicion on the part of the people of Gibraltar
:19:09. > :19:14.an aspect there. Gibraltarians have behind closed doors there could
:19:14. > :19:17.an aspect there. Gibraltarians have an MEP, not their own, but one that
:19:17. > :19:20.is tacked onto a part of the UK? Part of the south—west constituency.
:19:20. > :19:27.the EU in 1973 alongside Britain, This came about
:19:27. > :19:29.the EU in 1973 alongside Britain, and was required to follow all the
:19:29. > :19:35.EU's directors, but didn't have vote until a legal challenge in the
:19:35. > :19:40.late 90s that led to elections as part of the south—west
:19:40. > :19:45.constituency. But no Westminster MP of course, any desire to have an MP
:19:45. > :19:48.at Westminster? No, but there has been talk about this in the past, in
:19:48. > :19:50.the 1970s for example, and that was the 1970s for example, and that was
:19:50. > :19:53.on the back of similar attempts on the back of similar attempts to
:19:53. > :19:57.get something in Malta, but that fell down. Very recently a new
:19:57. > :20:03.movement asking for a Gibraltar movement asking for a Gibraltar MP
:20:03. > :20:06.has started, but I think that the vast majority of people would see
:20:06. > :20:12.that as being a retrograde step. that as being a retrograde step. Why
:20:12. > :20:15.is that? Most people in Gibraltar's preference for a solution to the
:20:15. > :20:19.Gibraltar problem would be something more like independence with close
:20:19. > :20:25.association to Britain, rather than integration into the UK state. Spain
:20:25. > :20:28.is a little less keen to talk about its own areas off the North African
:20:28. > :20:31.coast that come under Spanish coast that come under Spanish
:20:31. > :20:34.jurisdiction. A bit of double standards? Certainly that's the
:20:34. > :20:41.accusation that has been thrown at Spain. There are those two
:20:41. > :20:46.territories. Even when Spain was arguing at the UN in the 1960s that
:20:46. > :20:51.Gibraltar should be the colonised, it had its own colonial territories
:20:51. > :20:57.aspect of hypocrisy. And the aspect of hypocrisy. And the
:20:57. > :20:59.future? One really can't see any solution to this problem, the
:20:59. > :21:04.Spanish will always have a claim. Spanish will always have a claim.
:21:04. > :21:09.This is it, the Treaty of Utrecht which regulates all this only allows
:21:09. > :21:13.for two options, either retention by Britain or return to Spain. No
:21:13. > :21:23.matter how much people in Gibraltar may prefer a third option of some
:21:23. > :21:25.kind of this independence, that won't happen. And on the creation of
:21:25. > :21:31.the reef, how is that going to the reef, how is that going to
:21:31. > :21:33.resolve itself? That's an interesting one. The region itself
:21:33. > :21:35.was used as an excuse to ratchet up was used as an excuse to ratchet up
:21:35. > :21:43.the disruption at tried to distract attention from
:21:43. > :21:48.Spanish politics. It was used as a wider bargaining chip. What happens
:21:48. > :21:52.normally is when the trouble in Madrid passes over the trouble at
:21:52. > :21:56.the frontier passes over. But this has been a more sustained attempt at
:21:56. > :22:03.disrupting the frontier relationship than has been done for quite some
:22:03. > :22:06.time. Chris, thanks very much. Now, it was, if you can remember it, a
:22:06. > :22:11.time. Chris, thanks very much. Now, memorable little summer. And
:22:11. > :22:17.alongside the sunnier than usual when —— usual weather and Andy
:22:17. > :22:20.Murray winning Wimbledon there was extra reason for contentment. The
:22:20. > :22:28.Duchess of Cambridge gave birth to a baby boy on July the 22nd, and there
:22:28. > :22:29.out of the hospital. He will be king out of the hospital. He will be king
:22:29. > :22:36.one day, but not in my lifetime. one day, but not in my lifetime. On
:22:36. > :22:40.Monday the Commons got the chance to send their best wishes. We must
:22:40. > :22:43.remember, Mr Speaker, that this birth has not just been a national
:22:43. > :22:46.event but first and foremost a very private and family event. It is
:22:46. > :22:51.right that the Duke and Duchess right that the Duke and Duchess of
:22:51. > :22:56.Cambridge privacy to get their new son, and in the coming years they
:22:56. > :23:00.must be allowed to have that space. Any parent will have recognised the
:23:01. > :23:04.emotions of excitement and indeed a bit of trepidation about the new
:23:04. > :23:09.world of parenthood into which they are arriving. In their case with the
:23:09. > :23:10.eyes of the world on them they carry a heavy sense of responsibility.
:23:10. > :23:16.sure I speak for people across the sure I speak for people across the
:23:16. > :23:20.house that they carried it off absolutely beautifully, as did
:23:20. > :23:23.Prince George, with what was generally interpreted as a first
:23:23. > :23:28.royal wave when he appeared in front royal wave when he appeared in front
:23:28. > :23:33.of the cameras. I want to put on the record very good wishes, and for the
:23:33. > :23:39.for those of the other parties to for those of the other parties to
:23:39. > :23:43.send our congratulations to the wonderful wonderful green, and her
:23:43. > :23:47.wonderful husband, and the parents of Prince George, we are delighted
:23:47. > :23:49.with the safe arrival of Prince George in this world. MPs reflecting
:23:49. > :23:53.on seven