:00:00. > :00:09.Tonight on This Week, as the world's most powerful media mogul,
:00:10. > :00:13.Rupert Murdoch, flies into town we take a look at What the Papers Say.
:00:14. > :00:15.Former News of the World editor and David Cameron right-hand man
:00:16. > :00:18.Andy Coulson is found guilty of conspiracy to hack phones,
:00:19. > :00:22.but what will be the political damage for the Prime Minister?
:00:23. > :00:31.Writing the headlines, Radio 5 Live's, Victoria Derbyshire.
:00:32. > :00:36.Lots of coverage of that trial on the front pages of the newspapers,
:00:37. > :00:38.but how much notice will voters take?
:00:39. > :00:41.Live's, Victoria Derbyshire. Still on the front page,
:00:42. > :00:48.chaos in Iraq. Roberts is playing the blame game.
:00:49. > :00:53.President Obama is so worried about getting the kind of headlines George
:00:54. > :00:57.W Bush did that he is failing to show leadership in the Middle East.
:00:58. > :00:59.Roberts is playing the blame game. And the wrong sort of headlines
:01:00. > :01:02.at the World Cup, as Luis Suarez loses it and is
:01:03. > :01:04.banned for biting an opponent. Sports presenter and journalist
:01:05. > :01:09.Charlie Webster is here to talk about coping with pressure.
:01:10. > :01:12.Watch out, I hear that Michael is a bit of a biter.
:01:13. > :01:16.about coping with pressure. This Week - tomorrow's fish
:01:17. > :01:19.and chip paper, if we're lucky! Evenin' all. Welcome to This Week,
:01:20. > :01:22.as we sink our teeth into another week of political foul play. "Dog
:01:23. > :01:25.bites man" is the classic non-news story, but so, these days, thanks to
:01:26. > :01:29.Luis Suarez, is "man bites footballer". He did it for the third
:01:30. > :01:33.time this week and has been ordered to park his fangs on the sidelines
:01:34. > :01:37.for the rest of the World Cup. But He did it for the third time this
:01:38. > :01:42.week and has been ordered to park Coulson being found guilty of
:01:43. > :01:45.conspiring to hack phones was a verdict that came back to bite the
:01:46. > :01:49.Prime Minister on the bum, forcing Call-Me-Dave to apologise for being,
:01:50. > :02:01.as he put it, just a Good Samaritan who gave the disgraced editor of a
:02:02. > :02:05.sleazy red-top tabloid a second an open goal at PMQs but in the end
:02:06. > :02:06.drew less blood than Luis Suarez, largely because the PM wrapped
:02:07. > :02:16.himself in the Leveson report, a Report he has no intention of
:02:17. > :02:18.implementing. At least he has something back from the 5 million
:02:19. > :02:26.quid of our money he spent on it. himself in the Leveson report, a
:02:27. > :02:31.Glastonbury. Think of them as the free festival and the free love of
:02:32. > :02:32."AJ" Johnson, and #sadmanonatrain Michael "getting off at the next
:02:33. > :02:51.stop" Portillo. The Queen visited a jail in Belfast
:02:52. > :02:54.with two format inmates, the First Minister and Deputy First Minister
:02:55. > :03:01.of Northern Ireland. It was, I thought, another extraordinary move
:03:02. > :03:03.by the Queen. She has, I think, 88 years old and making political
:03:04. > :03:10.history, making strides with the peace process. It is remarkable that
:03:11. > :03:14.she is playing an important political role, not an inappropriate
:03:15. > :03:17.party political role, but nonetheless a political role. I
:03:18. > :03:22.think when we look back on her reign, we will regard her as one of
:03:23. > :03:27.the great monarchs. I am only sorry that what she did this week, with
:03:28. > :03:31.all its magnanimity and integrity, was perhaps overshadowed because we
:03:32. > :03:36.were concentrating on the lack of integrity and competence of
:03:37. > :03:40.politicians. The Home Secretary made a speech on Tuesday, a very good
:03:41. > :03:44.speech. It is the first time I have heard are make a strong defence
:03:45. > :03:50.against the more extreme rubbish that has come out since the Ed
:03:51. > :03:52.Snowden revelations. She said the danger is not mass surveillance, but
:03:53. > :03:58.that the internet would be impossible to govern and a haven for
:03:59. > :04:02.terrorists and serious criminals. That is why the government published
:04:03. > :04:07.almost two years ago a draft bill, the Communications Data Bill, the
:04:08. > :04:12.absence of which in the Queen 's speech was noted by virtually no
:04:13. > :04:15.one. The government's main aim is to protect the population and I don't
:04:16. > :04:19.care what problems they are having in the coalition. If they could get
:04:20. > :04:23.agreement to get a draft bill out, they should get a bill out, because
:04:24. > :04:24.this is a serious problem, even more serious when we see what is
:04:25. > :04:32.happening in the Middle East. Now, while the British political
:04:33. > :04:35.and media classes have been obsessing about hacking
:04:36. > :04:37.and the next president of the European Commission, matters have
:04:38. > :04:39.continued to deteriorate in Iraq. The alliance of hardline Islamists
:04:40. > :04:41.and Saddam revanchists is holding what it's gained
:04:42. > :04:44.and is still making progress, while Prime Minister Maliki has
:04:45. > :04:47.rejected an Iraqi government of "national salvation", despite
:04:48. > :04:50.American demands that he do so. Washington cynics say
:04:51. > :04:54.President Obama knew that's what he'd do all along, which is why he
:04:55. > :05:02.made it a condition of US action. Now he need do next to nothing.
:05:03. > :05:04.So where now for Mr Obama's "no, we can't" foreign policy?
:05:05. > :05:07.The appetite for further foreign wars is close to
:05:08. > :05:10.zero on both sides of the Atlantic. But does inaction make the world
:05:11. > :05:11.a more dangerous place? We turned to historian
:05:12. > :05:38.Andrew Roberts. This is his take of the week.
:05:39. > :05:44.I am a British historian who has been living in America for the last
:05:45. > :05:49.four years, and a great believer in the special relationship. I have
:05:50. > :05:53.become convinced that Barack Obama is now so obsessed with his legacy
:05:54. > :05:55.that he has decided that America effectively should not have a
:05:56. > :06:06.foreign policy, at least one worthy of the name. As a result, President
:06:07. > :06:09.Obama has turned out to be a worse president than anyone since Jimmy
:06:10. > :06:13.Carter. It is precisely because he is obsessed with his place in
:06:14. > :06:16.history that history will, in fact, judge him as being a much more
:06:17. > :06:24.dangerous president than George W Bush. In 2011, Iraq was a sovereign,
:06:25. > :06:29.stable and self-reliant country. President Obama's words, not mine.
:06:30. > :06:33.Then he pulled out US troops, and now, only three years later,
:06:34. > :06:39.genocidal offshoot of Al-Qaeda called ISIS has captured Tikrit,
:06:40. > :06:55.Mosul and Fallujah, and is marching on Baghdad itself. Because defence
:06:56. > :07:02.cuts have sliced back the RAF from 20 strike and fighter squadrons in
:07:03. > :07:07.2003 down to just seven today, Britain cannot act alone. We need
:07:08. > :07:16.leadership, and President Obama is not giving it. Although America was
:07:17. > :07:20.not popular when George W Bush was president, it was at least feared
:07:21. > :07:24.and respected. Now, because President Obama is so desperate for
:07:25. > :07:30.America to be popular, it is neither feared nor respected, nor,
:07:31. > :07:33.ironically enough, popular. This is the one I'm getting.
:07:34. > :07:38.And from the brand-spanking new Foyles book shop on Charing Cross
:07:39. > :07:39.Road to our own little book shop here in the heart of Westminster,
:07:40. > :07:50.Andrew Roberts joins us now. Michael, President Obama, is he the
:07:51. > :07:55.worst president since Jimmy Carter? Yes, I think he probably years.
:07:56. > :08:00.Where I disagree, I don't disagree that he has no foreign policy worth
:08:01. > :08:03.a name, but where I disagree is that I don't think the contrast with
:08:04. > :08:09.other presidents is as stark as it might appear. Although George W Bush
:08:10. > :08:14.was feared, and the United States was taken more seriously in those
:08:15. > :08:18.days, clearly the interventions in Iraq and Afghanistan were
:08:19. > :08:24.ineffective and counter-productive. Also, broadening this out to Ukraine
:08:25. > :08:28.and Russia, it has never been the case that the United States has been
:08:29. > :08:32.able to control what Russia does. The big contrast is that what Russia
:08:33. > :08:38.now does is a lot further away from the West than what it used to do in
:08:39. > :08:41.the days of stronger presidents. Russia are used to intervene in
:08:42. > :08:44.Czechoslovakia and Hungary and the West could do nothing about it, but
:08:45. > :08:50.now it intervenes in Crimea and the West can do nothing about it. In
:08:51. > :08:54.summary, we have never been able to do anything about Russia and as far
:08:55. > :08:57.as the Middle East is concerned we used to intervene but our
:08:58. > :09:02.interventions were destructive and counter-productive. I think that is
:09:03. > :09:09.very fair. We could also take into account the South China Sea and the
:09:10. > :09:15.Syrian civil war to see a much weaker America, a hobbled America.
:09:16. > :09:19.And I wonder whether or not the attack on the Crimea would have
:09:20. > :09:26.taken place if Ronald Reagan had been president. I think you could
:09:27. > :09:30.have assumed the Russians were at several times, in Kennedy's
:09:31. > :09:35.presidency and Ronald Reagan's presidency, for example, scared of
:09:36. > :09:38.what America might do, that they might act irrationally, something
:09:39. > :09:44.might go horribly wrong. Vladimir Putin has none of that fear. Will
:09:45. > :09:49.President Obama be judged as more dangerous than George Bush? He
:09:50. > :09:54.won't, because there is no doubt America has the person they voted
:09:55. > :10:00.for. It is the same over here. We have the same issues in terms of the
:10:01. > :10:05.unpopularity, for whatever reason, it is no doubt it was not a stunning
:10:06. > :10:09.success going into Iraq. The further America gets from 9/11 and the less
:10:10. > :10:15.familiar those memories are, when Obama came in, it was clearly the
:10:16. > :10:18.case, and it still is, I saw a poll that said 16% of Americans thought
:10:19. > :10:24.troops should go in in response to ISIS in Iraq. The fact is that
:10:25. > :10:29.President Obama has a foreign policy, just not one you agree with.
:10:30. > :10:34.He actually hasn't worked out what should happen next. That is the
:10:35. > :10:37.point of a foreign policy. I am not talking about boots on the ground
:10:38. > :10:43.and fighting ISIS, but the same things he is doing in Afghanistan,
:10:44. > :10:48.drones. You could use proper tax from planes in the Gulf. None of
:10:49. > :10:52.this is happening. You think drones would stop the Taliban and taking
:10:53. > :10:57.over Afghanistan? So far, they have done a lot better than nothing. At
:10:58. > :11:02.the moment, all he is saying he is going to do is nothing against ISIS.
:11:03. > :11:05.We are genuinely thinking about losing the capital of Iraq because
:11:06. > :11:10.he is not willing to do the same thing in Iraq as he has been doing
:11:11. > :11:15.in Afghanistan. Let me just point this out. By the time he leaves the
:11:16. > :11:23.White House America will import almost 0% of its oil and gas. It
:11:24. > :11:30.imports no gas from the Middle East. Hallelujah. That is not a foreign
:11:31. > :11:32.policy, it is an energy policy. It has geopolitical consequences
:11:33. > :11:37.because he has decided he does not need the Middle East any more. The
:11:38. > :11:40.Pacific is more important to him than the Middle East, so why put
:11:41. > :11:45.boots on the ground and men and material there? Because you will
:11:46. > :11:51.have the same situation as you had in Afghanistan when the Taliban were
:11:52. > :11:55.protecting Al-Qaeda. It is not to do with 9/11 any more. He does not
:11:56. > :12:02.think the region matters so much to America any more. The last time they
:12:03. > :12:07.went into Iraq it was not a great success. It was not a great success.
:12:08. > :12:14.The reasons the government went into Iraq in 2003 were, on their own
:12:15. > :12:19.merits, at the time, correct. It was the right thing to have done. Excuse
:12:20. > :12:24.me, there were no weapons of mass to structure and we had no plan to make
:12:25. > :12:26.it a better place. Nobody knew there were no weapons of mass
:12:27. > :12:32.destruction. Everybody assumed that there were. The appendices to the
:12:33. > :12:38.Butler report show clearly that the Joint Intelligence Committee was not
:12:39. > :12:43.sure if there was any WMD. MI6 thought there was, and that is the
:12:44. > :12:48.key thing. The first outing was a failure, the place is a mess, there
:12:49. > :12:53.is no appetite to go in for a second time. Of course. And Obama's foreign
:12:54. > :12:57.policy might be different if there had not been invasions of Iraq and
:12:58. > :13:01.Afghanistan before. That has exhausted the political capital and
:13:02. > :13:09.the public will. I think Andrew's view is extreme. Even with George
:13:10. > :13:14.Bush, gun toting George W Bush, the Russians went into Georgia. I don't
:13:15. > :13:19.think anything would have stopped the Russians going so far. Actually,
:13:20. > :13:23.they pulled back in eastern Ukraine. If you look back to Clinton, it was
:13:24. > :13:27.not a brilliant success. Roux and happened on his watch and nobody did
:13:28. > :13:31.anything. He was late going into Bosnia. On foreign policy, I don't
:13:32. > :13:39.think Obama is the worst president since Carter. From the point you are
:13:40. > :13:44.making earlier, the reason to go into Iraq was not just weapons of
:13:45. > :13:47.mass destruction. In fact, that was quite a small thing in the big
:13:48. > :13:54.debate that was taking place. Not in this country. Mr Blair said, if he
:13:55. > :14:02.gives up his WMD tomorrow, then we don't go in. That was the British
:14:03. > :14:10.government line. We were both there and we voted for it. I go to this
:14:11. > :14:14.region a lot. From the Mediterranean shores of the Levant, all the way
:14:15. > :14:19.through that region to the Gulf, to the borders of Saudi Arabia and
:14:20. > :14:24.Iran, the region is engulfed in a Sunni Shia sectarian war. That is
:14:25. > :14:32.what this is about and why would you want to get in the middle of that?
:14:33. > :14:37.In order to stop, basically, the most genocidal, vicious of all of
:14:38. > :14:43.these offshoots of Al-Qaeda taking over a country that we went to war
:14:44. > :14:46.to try to protect. You think drones will do that? I also talked about
:14:47. > :14:56.actual planes coming off aircraft carriers. You asked Alan whether
:14:57. > :15:01.Obama could be adjudged to be the worst President. It all depends what
:15:02. > :15:05.happened next. If the Middle East degenerates into a continuing
:15:06. > :15:09.melting pot of war and of exporting of terrorism to Europe and to the
:15:10. > :15:13.United States, then very probably that is exactly how he will appear,
:15:14. > :15:16.then people will struggle to remember the dilemma with which he
:15:17. > :15:20.was struggling at the time, in other words that people were exhausted,
:15:21. > :15:24.that his previous campaigns had been unsuccessful. But it's certainly I
:15:25. > :15:31.think possible that Obama will go down in history as a very bad
:15:32. > :15:35.President because this will cause a great deal of bad history in the
:15:36. > :15:40.future. I took issue with David Cameron last week when he was saying
:15:41. > :15:44.it's a matter of great interest. But we don't know whether bombing them
:15:45. > :15:47.would make it more dangerous. We haven't even mentioned Iran. In the
:15:48. > :15:52.way it's going at the momenthe, by the time he leaves the presidency or
:15:53. > :15:58.soon afterwards, he's going to face a nuclearised Iran which again he's
:15:59. > :16:02.done nothing about. Iran will control most of eastern Iraq thanks
:16:03. > :16:08.to the invasion of 2003. I want to put a final point to you. When we
:16:09. > :16:12.were in in 2003, he'd never thought through what the potential
:16:13. > :16:16.consequences were and they were largely disastrous, as we can now
:16:17. > :16:21.see today. Have you thought through the consequences of intervening
:16:22. > :16:27.again? Yes, I don't think the Isis taking over of Baghdad is anything
:16:28. > :16:37.like the same as overthrowing Saddam Hussein. Saddam Hussein is less bad
:16:38. > :16:42.than the present threat to Iraq. Even more vicious and more
:16:43. > :16:47.totalitarian. You are the historian. Fair enough.
:16:48. > :16:53.I'm not talking about the past. 20130, the debates over this, you
:16:54. > :16:56.know, WMD was not the key factor. All right. We'll leave it there,
:16:57. > :17:01.Andrew robbers, thank you for being back with us. It's late, Jeremy
:17:02. > :17:07.Clarkson leaving Rebekah Brooks' house party with a brunette late. If
:17:08. > :17:12.you are doing something you shouldn't be, sfop it now or put him
:17:13. > :17:17.or her down, stay focussed because waiting in the wings, qualified
:17:18. > :17:21.football coach Charlie Webster is here to talk about how you handle
:17:22. > :17:27.the pressure. If you can't handle the pressure, the truth or the
:17:28. > :17:31.drink, feel free to vent on the Twitter, Fleecebook or interweb.
:17:32. > :17:37.We'll pay to attention whatsoever. Always keen to find new ways to
:17:38. > :17:39.balance the books, the Queen had the people from the Antiques Roadshow
:17:40. > :17:44.around her house in Northern Ireland the other day. They had a poke about
:17:45. > :17:49.to see what valuables they were hiding. Maybe they found a fewite
:17:50. > :17:56.ens that could be flogged down the car-boot sale. Who knows. Victoria
:17:57. > :18:10.Derbyshire has the round-up of the political week.
:18:11. > :18:19.Working out how much an antique is worth can depend on many things, its
:18:20. > :18:24.beauty, authenticity, rarity, age and condition. Working out whether
:18:25. > :18:27.it's fake or real can be an even trickier thing to judge. It was the
:18:28. > :18:43.Prime Minister's judgment which was called into question this week.
:18:44. > :18:53.If you are spending a lot of money on something valuable, as any expert
:18:54. > :18:57.will tell you, it's history, where it's been, find out as much as you
:18:58. > :19:02.can about its past. David Cameron was accused of not doing any
:19:03. > :19:05.background checks when he recruited Andy Coulson, former Murdoch man, as
:19:06. > :19:09.Head of Communications, at Number Ten. With Coulson found guilty of
:19:10. > :19:14.conspireing to hack phones, Mr Cameron was forced to say he was
:19:15. > :19:21.sorry. I take full responsibility for employing Andy Coulson. I did so
:19:22. > :19:25.on the basis of undertakings I was given from him on phone hacking and
:19:26. > :19:30.they turned out not to be the case. I said if they turned out to be
:19:31. > :19:34.wrong I would make a full and frank apology and I do that today. With
:19:35. > :19:38.his judgment being questioned, debate quickly turned to why Mr
:19:39. > :19:41.Cameron hired Andy Coulson in the first place, particularly when so
:19:42. > :19:45.many people had apparently warned him not to. It was an opportunity
:19:46. > :19:49.for the Labour Leader, Ed Miliband, who's had his own judgment issues
:19:50. > :19:52.lately, to pile on the pressure at Prime Minister's Questions, accusing
:19:53. > :19:56.David Cameron of bringing disgrace to Downing Street.
:19:57. > :20:00.The truth about this is the charge against the Prime Minister is not
:20:01. > :20:04.one of ignorance, it's wilful negligence.
:20:05. > :20:06.At the heart of this scandal are thousands of innocent victims of
:20:07. > :20:11.phone hacking he didn't stand up for. The Prime Minister will always
:20:12. > :20:16.be remembered as being the first ever occupant of his office who
:20:17. > :20:22.brought a criminal into the heart of Downing Street.
:20:23. > :20:28.He brought up the issue of the warning from the Guardian, I totally
:20:29. > :20:31.disproved him using the evidence. He brought up the idea of direct
:20:32. > :20:35.vetting, I've totally disproved him by using the evidence. He cannot
:20:36. > :20:40.bear the fact that an eight-month inquiry that he hoped was going to
:20:41. > :20:43.pin the blame on me found that I had behaved correctly throughout. That
:20:44. > :20:46.is the case. It's clear that questions will conto
:20:47. > :20:51.be asked over the Prime Minister's decisions. What is unclear yet is
:20:52. > :21:00.how this will play out with voters and whether it will dent their trust
:21:01. > :21:05.in David Cameron. There's little chance of finding a
:21:06. > :21:11.long lost portrait by an old master. But the portrait of European master
:21:12. > :21:16.in waiting, Jean-Claude Juncker, is still haunting the Prime Minister.
:21:17. > :21:19.Trying to do the right thing for your country can get very lonely
:21:20. > :21:23.sometimes. # All by myself
:21:24. > :21:33.# Don't wanna be # All by myself... #
:21:34. > :21:41.David Cameron's lone some campaign to try to stop Mr Juncker becoming
:21:42. > :21:45.the next President of the European Commission was and truly pole axed
:21:46. > :21:49.this week. He was blasted in a series of ex-pleat it laden secret
:21:50. > :21:52.recordings of the Polish Foreign Minister who laid into Dave and his
:21:53. > :21:56.policies on Europe. Any chance of some late support from the Prime
:21:57. > :21:59.Minister slipped away faster than you could say European referendum.
:22:00. > :22:04.It leaves him even more isolated in Europe than he was before.
:22:05. > :22:11.Mr Juncker taking the crown anyway...
:22:12. > :22:18.The boss of the Bank of England was under the MP's hammer too this week.
:22:19. > :22:23.Once the golden boy of banking, are we seeing the worth of Mark Carney
:22:24. > :22:31.beginning to fall? It strikes me that the banks are
:22:32. > :22:36.relying on their unreliable boyfriend. One day hot, one day
:22:37. > :22:40.cold. The people on the other side don't know where they stand. The
:22:41. > :22:45.Bank of England chief boyfriend wasn't having any criticism of his
:22:46. > :22:48.interest rates policy. As far as he's concerned, relationships are
:22:49. > :22:53.still going strong. What we really wants is a nice big, durable
:22:54. > :22:56.expansion. Oh, Mark, you tease. We are looking to manage monetary
:22:57. > :23:01.policy to achieve the inflation target in a way that supports a due
:23:02. > :23:07.rabble expansion. In the doing so, we are looking to use up, make sure
:23:08. > :23:12.the economy absorbs is a better way of putting it, wasteful capacities.
:23:13. > :23:17.He's playing hard to get. Now, where's David Dickinson when you
:23:18. > :23:23.need him? I need to find out how much an England kit's worth. Hardly
:23:24. > :23:32.worn, unlikely to be worn again, seriously good condition.
:23:33. > :23:36.Victoria in the Chiswick Auction House there. Back to our collection
:23:37. > :23:41.of antiques in Westminster. Mir an that joins us.
:23:42. > :23:46.Michael, even Mr Cameron's had to admit it was a huge error of
:23:47. > :23:55.judgment to take Andy Coulson into Government as director of
:23:56. > :23:59.communications. S. He was warned not to do it. Does it do political
:24:00. > :24:04.damage to the Prime Minister in the broader context? Well, it does. For
:24:05. > :24:07.instance, if there's a vicious article in the Daily Telegraph this
:24:08. > :24:11.morning by Peter Oborne, describing him as a shallow careerist, it
:24:12. > :24:15.liberates journalists to write that sort of stuff which I suppose
:24:16. > :24:19.percolates down. But the statement you won't hear David Cameron making
:24:20. > :24:24.this week is, look, I as Prime Minister have had to make an apology
:24:25. > :24:29.which is rather humiliating. Had I not hired Andy Coulson, I would
:24:30. > :24:35.probably not be Prime Minister. So how bad has my judgment really been?
:24:36. > :24:39.Yes, but the argument, Alan, is not that he originally hired Andy soup
:24:40. > :24:44.son, that that in itself, I was going to say in retrospect, but he
:24:45. > :24:49.was told not to do it, but the bigger damage was when he took him
:24:50. > :24:53.into Government and he became on the Government payroll? I find that
:24:54. > :24:59.extraordinary because it's true there is an argument that the Head
:25:00. > :25:02.of Communications doesn't have to have controlled vetting which
:25:03. > :25:05.happened to one of my special advisers when I became Home
:25:06. > :25:10.Secretary. They had to go through that, it's quite a process, takes a
:25:11. > :25:15.month and you have to see really sensitive documents. There is an
:25:16. > :25:19.argument Head of Communications doesn't have to do that, but the
:25:20. > :25:24.predecessors have and when the Prime Minister knows there was at least a
:25:25. > :25:28.furore around this guy, you would have thought the sensible thing to
:25:29. > :25:32.do would be to ask him to go through that. Then he had some defence, he
:25:33. > :25:36.didn't know what was going to happen with the hacking trial. Even that
:25:37. > :25:40.developed vetting, probably wouldn't have gotten to the bottom of it
:25:41. > :25:44.Higham not saying that. I'm saying if you are the Prime Minister and
:25:45. > :25:49.you have done something controversial by taking on Andy
:25:50. > :25:56.Coulson -- I'm not saying that. When you go into Downing Street, you
:25:57. > :26:04.would insist, his predecessors were vetted. So you would think he'd do
:26:05. > :26:06.that. It's about whether you are blackmailed, whether there's
:26:07. > :26:10.anything that might have come out. The Rebekah Brooks thing might have
:26:11. > :26:13.come out. Is it politically damaging? Is this an issue for the
:26:14. > :26:18.Westminster village with the politicians and the media all
:26:19. > :26:23.obsessed with this or is it having cut-through? Does it undermine Mr
:26:24. > :26:27.Cameron in the eyes of the voter? I think the reputation of politicians
:26:28. > :26:31.generally can't get much lower in the public's eyes and indeed the
:26:32. > :26:38.reputation of journalists also. So I fear actually... Hold on! Well, I'm
:26:39. > :26:45.an NUJ member, I count myself amongst the despised profession, so
:26:46. > :26:48.I think in a sense one of the things that happens is that the worst
:26:49. > :26:55.prejudices will be confirmed about both sides in this Leveson battle
:26:56. > :27:00.that's ongoing. I think in terms of David Cameron personally, I think
:27:01. > :27:05.that he will probably escapend also I do tend to agree with Michael
:27:06. > :27:07.because when he originally hired Andy Coulson, the Conservative Party
:27:08. > :27:12.in opposition was failing to make any impact at all and that was the
:27:13. > :27:17.point at which Gordon Brown was riding high in the polls, they badly
:27:18. > :27:25.needed to do something and hiring a man who was in charge in a tabloid
:27:26. > :27:30.newspaper who took interest in politics as much as the average
:27:31. > :27:36.voter... Well... ALL SPEAK AT ONCE
:27:37. > :27:38.That is why he did it. That is why they appointed him into Government
:27:39. > :27:43.too. They thought he was very good and thought he needed to go on and
:27:44. > :27:46.thought this was not going to come to trial and they thought that even
:27:47. > :27:52.if it did, he might be found not guilty. After all, it's taken 11 men
:27:53. > :27:57.and women eight months to decide that some people knew a lot and some
:27:58. > :28:03.people knew nothing at all. Do you think that Mr Cameron was so unaware
:28:04. > :28:06.of what tabloids get up to, particularly the News of the World,
:28:07. > :28:12.which was the sleaziest of all the red tops, he was so unaware, that he
:28:13. > :28:17.could hire an editor from a red top tabloid? ? Hang on, it's just been
:28:18. > :28:23.established that Rebekah Brooks knew nothing at all about what was going
:28:24. > :28:26.on. No, no, no. There were 500 people hacked at least and Rebekah
:28:27. > :28:31.Brooks didn't know about it so of course he could believe that Coulson
:28:32. > :28:36.knew nothing about it. Not the editor of the News of the World.
:28:37. > :28:40.Andy Coulson had a working class background. I don't believe he's the
:28:41. > :28:43.only one who could have been appointed. He wanted to cosy up to
:28:44. > :28:49.News International. He'd gone down the route of hug a hoodie and all
:28:50. > :28:54.that, that wasn't working, that little guy who used to advise him
:28:55. > :28:59.wasn't... The Tory press was attacking at the time. At the time,
:29:00. > :29:06.we were 15 points ahead in the polls, so it was to cosy up to News
:29:07. > :29:12.International. Also David Cameron today at PMKQs has been using the
:29:13. > :29:19.Leveson Report as his shield. He's not going to implement it, by the
:29:20. > :29:24.way. That's the one. Before we move on to the issue of Mr Jean-Claude
:29:25. > :29:28.Juncker, which everybody is talking about, how does the Crown
:29:29. > :29:38.Prosecution Service come out of all this? In July 2009, when the
:29:39. > :29:43.Guardian printed the story, the Director of Public Prosecutions was
:29:44. > :29:47.having a review at the time. That was one of the reasons why we
:29:48. > :29:52.thought, let's see what comes out of that review. I would love to know
:29:53. > :30:00.from the vendor rector of public prosecutions, his event -- his
:30:01. > :30:07.version. It got an important conviction. There were five others
:30:08. > :30:10.who did plead guilty. The Metropolitan Police, from the time
:30:11. > :30:14.of the conviction of the first journalist, had 11,000 pages of
:30:15. > :30:17.evidence which they believed was not worth pursuing further, most of
:30:18. > :30:23.which evidence form the backbone of the case that brought about this
:30:24. > :30:29.conviction. Parte two Lord Leveson, if it ever takes place, is crucial
:30:30. > :30:36.here. I received a letter from John Yates after this blew up in 2011,
:30:37. > :30:40.saying that the reason why he was, Operation Weeting was taking place
:30:41. > :30:43.and his operation could not get anywhere, was because News
:30:44. > :30:49.International only started to cooperate in January 2011. That is
:30:50. > :30:54.exactly when Andy Coulson left Downing Street. There is something
:30:55. > :30:56.to tie up here about what the relationship is with the
:30:57. > :31:01.Metropolitan in an News International. The Leveson report
:31:02. > :31:04.also says that for more than 35 years there has been inappropriate
:31:05. > :31:10.closeness between the occupants of Downing Street of both parties and
:31:11. > :31:16.Fleet Street. That goes all the way back to Mr Blair, Mr Brown and Mr
:31:17. > :31:21.Cameron. He Jean-Claude Juncker, a household name, even in Scunthorpe.
:31:22. > :31:26.Does it matter if Mr Cameron is isolated on this to the British
:31:27. > :31:35.public, do they care? It matters very much. It is superb and ideal.
:31:36. > :31:39.That is what his backbenchers think, you are right. It demonstrates where
:31:40. > :31:42.Britain is. Britain has most of the day with the European project and
:31:43. > :31:46.our European partners have most of the with us. The idea that David
:31:47. > :31:49.Cameron could negotiate a couple of tweaks and come back with something
:31:50. > :31:54.which was better which he could put to the referendum is blown out of
:31:55. > :31:59.the water. Either he has to abandon the project of pretending to do
:32:00. > :32:05.that, or he has to offer a referendum in which he will campaign
:32:06. > :32:12.for us to leave. Are you a fan of Mr Juncker? No. I agree that nobody in
:32:13. > :32:16.Britain of any party once Juncker in charge, but that is what we have
:32:17. > :32:19.got. Pro-Europeans are in a fix because we have the least attractive
:32:20. > :32:24.head of Europe at the time when we are supposed to be hoping for some
:32:25. > :32:31.sort of respectable renegotiation that we can campaign on. Are you not
:32:32. > :32:42.attracted to a man who has cognac for breakfast? A bit early for me.
:32:43. > :32:46.Cameron's judgement, he writes letters supporting MPs who are
:32:47. > :32:51.deselected, talks up Maria Miller and then she goes, talks up Juncker
:32:52. > :32:55.and seems to unite all of the people who are against him, as I am and all
:32:56. > :33:02.three of us are, in favour of him. There is an issue here. This may be
:33:03. > :33:06.right or wrong, but his backbenchers love it at the moment. He is always
:33:07. > :33:11.in trouble with his backbenchers on Europe. David Blunkett, stepping out
:33:12. > :33:16.of politics, said Ed Miliband should bring back some old is from his
:33:17. > :33:22.Shadow Cabinet, naming one Alan Johnson at the top of the list. What
:33:23. > :33:27.do you say? Thank you, David. I was in the Shadow Cabinet and I
:33:28. > :33:32.resigned. It is very nice of him. I wrote him a little note thanking him
:33:33. > :33:37.for that. Was it in red or green ink? I am sorry to see David go.
:33:38. > :33:41.Now, unlike Downing Street special advisers, everyone who joins
:33:42. > :33:43.This Week must undergo a rigorous process of Developed Vetting.
:33:44. > :33:46.All our team are quizzed by BBC security about anything that may
:33:47. > :33:49.leave them open to prosecution, blackmail, or ridicule.
:33:50. > :33:55.Alan was probed about his tendency to go sock-less
:33:56. > :33:57.in the summer months. Michael about all those trips to
:33:58. > :34:03.Rio, "researching" the Brazilian railway system, and Miranda about
:34:04. > :34:08.the vicious rumour that she was once a member of the Liberal Democrats.
:34:09. > :34:12.But none of them cracked, and that's why we've decided to put handling
:34:13. > :34:34.pressure in this week's Spotlight. For the first time in nearly 80
:34:35. > :34:41.years, a male British player walked out into Centre Court as reigning
:34:42. > :34:45.Wimbledon champion. Pressure of expectation is-Andy Murray but the
:34:46. > :34:49.top Scot seems to enjoy top spot, and he strolled through his opening
:34:50. > :34:52.matches in straight sets. Not everyone deals with pressure as
:34:53. > :34:57.well. Footballers must be feeling the heat in the zeal, and if you are
:34:58. > :35:03.Luis Suarez, the only way to deal with high-pressure situations is to
:35:04. > :35:06.bite your opponents. Sadly, the England team are lacking bite and
:35:07. > :35:10.have jetted home early from the World Cup. And if England's
:35:11. > :35:15.cricketers, beaten by Sri Lanka on the penultimate ball of the second
:35:16. > :35:22.test, this was a week when English sportsmen crumbled under pressure.
:35:23. > :35:25.The House of Commons turned into a pressure cooker for the Prime
:35:26. > :35:29.Minister this week. One day after Andy Coulson was found guilty of
:35:30. > :35:34.conspiracy to hack phones, questions were fired at the Prime Minister for
:35:35. > :35:38.his judgement. I know you don't agree with it. I know he is so
:35:39. > :35:42.desperate not to talk about the economy, not to talk about
:35:43. > :35:48.unemployment, not to talk about the deficit, but you can't rerun an
:35:49. > :35:54.enquiry that has taken place. In sport, politics and beyond, is their
:35:55. > :35:58.pressure in every profession. How do you keep cool when the heat is on?
:35:59. > :36:10.And when the pressure bites, how do you bite back? Charlie Webster joins
:36:11. > :36:14.us again. Good to have you back. This Suarez biting incident, is it
:36:15. > :36:20.an example of a sports person cracking under pressure, or is he
:36:21. > :36:24.just mad? I am not going to say he is mad, you said that. I am talking
:36:25. > :36:29.about this and we have been speaking about it for days, about why he did
:36:30. > :36:36.it, and pressure. I don't think it is pressure. We should not be asking
:36:37. > :36:41.why. He bit somebody. We are not allowed to bite at school. I am not
:36:42. > :36:46.allowed to sit here and bite you. I would probably be arrested and taken
:36:47. > :36:50.off the show and never come back. There would be repercussions. Why
:36:51. > :36:58.are we saying, is it pressure? You should not bite. Point taken, but is
:36:59. > :37:02.it possible to understand the pressure these sports stars are
:37:03. > :37:08.under? I think pressure is in different contexts. I am under
:37:09. > :37:12.pressure in certain ways, and so are you doing live television. In
:37:13. > :37:16.politics. Surgeons, that is incredible pressure I could never
:37:17. > :37:21.understand, saving somebody's life. However, a footballer also has
:37:22. > :37:24.pressure we can never understand. I am not a professional footballer but
:37:25. > :37:27.I work with a lot of them and see that pressure that we don't
:37:28. > :37:32.appreciate, especially when you can go into the World Cup and in 90
:37:33. > :37:38.minutes you can be hero or villain. Remember David Beckham when he was
:37:39. > :37:42.pictured as a dartboard. He said in 2012 that he still has nightmares
:37:43. > :37:46.about what happened. These are real people. Just because they earn a lot
:37:47. > :37:50.of money and they are footballers, and I'm sure there will be people
:37:51. > :37:53.saying, they earn all this money and they should come good. But they are
:37:54. > :37:59.still human beings and they feel pressure that we don't understand.
:38:00. > :38:02.Andy Murray was someone who was thought not good enough to cope with
:38:03. > :38:06.pressure at one stage and therefore was not going to win one of the
:38:07. > :38:11.great titles, but he proved the critics wrong and was able to cope
:38:12. > :38:15.in the end. He did, but with Andy Murray we have a different
:38:16. > :38:20.expectation than with England. Footballers national sport. With
:38:21. > :38:24.England, every time there is a World Cup, or European Championships, no
:38:25. > :38:29.matter what, even though we say we will not put on the expectation, we
:38:30. > :38:33.sit there saying, come on, this might be the time. With Andy Murray,
:38:34. > :38:39.he has worked really hard and he has done a lot of marginal little things
:38:40. > :38:43.that have made his game better, made his head better. He has worked to
:38:44. > :38:46.win a Wimbledon title. He did not get it first time because maybe he
:38:47. > :38:51.did not have the mental capacity, the poise to cope with the
:38:52. > :38:56.pressure. It is those marginal gains that top athlete make you
:38:57. > :39:01.exceptional, or just a top athlete. Some people will be saying, I will
:39:02. > :39:04.tell you what pressure is, it is putting food on the table for my
:39:05. > :39:07.kids on the minimum wage, it is having enough money to pay the rent
:39:08. > :39:12.at the end of the week, hoping I will still have a job at the end of
:39:13. > :39:15.the week. All of these gilded sports stars that get paid a fortune, they
:39:16. > :39:22.have no idea about real pressure. What would you say to that? I could
:39:23. > :39:26.not agree more. I am not from a moneyed background either so I
:39:27. > :39:30.understand those pressures. We all have different pressure and
:39:31. > :39:34.expectations. I put a lot of pressure on myself. The thing that
:39:35. > :39:40.is different is that Wayne Rooney will be on the front and back of the
:39:41. > :39:44.newspapers and publicly pressurised. Publicly idolised, or made into
:39:45. > :39:53.somebody we hate and that let us all down. You cannot just sit there and
:39:54. > :40:01.relax about that. Politicians come under huge pressure. When did you
:40:02. > :40:05.feel on the most pressure? I suppose it was when a man was flying into
:40:06. > :40:11.Chicago airport and was going to blow himself up on Christmas Day,
:40:12. > :40:15.and there was a link back to him being radicalised in the Yemen but
:40:16. > :40:18.was studying in this country. There was the pressure of thinking that
:40:19. > :40:24.there could be loads of men on planes doing this. He had found a
:40:25. > :40:31.way through the system. That was a lot of pressure. It is different in
:40:32. > :40:34.a team sport. I don't think there is pressure on the team. There is
:40:35. > :40:39.pressure on Andy Murray in the singles. The same way as the primer
:40:40. > :40:42.stand the leader of the at Prime Minister's Questions, it is a
:40:43. > :40:50.pressure that even a government minister is more in a team game.
:40:51. > :40:54.What about you, Michael? I have just thought of it, a similar thing. I
:40:55. > :40:58.was the Ministry of transport on duty over Christmas and New Year
:40:59. > :41:01.immediately after Lockerbie, when a lot of journalists were dressing up
:41:02. > :41:06.as maintenance staff and getting onto aircraft in order to
:41:07. > :41:12.demonstrate that security was lax. I was on television day and night,
:41:13. > :41:16.facing very difficult questions. I would say the ability to face
:41:17. > :41:20.pressure is what marks the very few top politicians out from the rest.
:41:21. > :41:25.It is not only the ability to cope with it, but to thrive on it. Blair
:41:26. > :41:29.and Cameron are two very rare creatures who cope with it, are able
:41:30. > :41:36.to relax with it, and indeed enjoy it. It was also true of Margaret
:41:37. > :41:41.Thatcher. For instance, following the West and allegations, she went
:41:42. > :41:45.to the House of Commons and said, I may not be Prime Minister this
:41:46. > :41:51.evening if this debate goes badly. But it went well. That is the same
:41:52. > :41:55.as sport. It is that tiny margin that sets those people apart,
:41:56. > :41:59.otherwise we would all be winning Wimbledon and would-be Jessica
:42:00. > :42:05.Ennis. She thrived under the pressure. Pressure gets the best out
:42:06. > :42:09.of people. What marks a great sports person and a strong politician is
:42:10. > :42:15.the ability to take proper decisions under pressure, rather than just
:42:16. > :42:20.crack up. Definitely. You are a football coach as well. Under
:42:21. > :42:24.pressure to get a winning team. I am a qualified football coach and I do
:42:25. > :42:29.a lot of competition myself. At the end of January I ran 250 miles down
:42:30. > :42:35.the country, campaigning against an issue I am passionate about, sexual
:42:36. > :42:37.and domestic abuse. I found that the pressure was really hard on me
:42:38. > :42:40.because I didn't want to let anybody down. I felt I had a duty to do it,
:42:41. > :42:48.to finish it. I did, just about. That's your lot for tonight, folks,
:42:49. > :42:51.but not for us because it's Northern powerhouse night at Lou Lou's, and
:42:52. > :42:53.George Osborne will be unveiling his meat-pie-in-the-sky plans to build
:42:54. > :42:56.High Speed Rail 3 between Manchester and Leeds, reform the Smiths
:42:57. > :42:59.and rebuild the Hacienda. But we leave you tonight with
:43:00. > :43:05.exclusive footage from the latest Shadow Cabinet meeting, which proves
:43:06. > :43:08.that, despite his denials, Alan Johnson has been helping Labour's
:43:09. > :43:11.young and inexperienced front bench team prepare for political battle.
:43:12. > :43:47.Nighty-night, don't let the boogie man bite.
:43:48. > :43:56.# Yes, I am # Yes, I am
:43:57. > :44:01.# I am a guitarist # Watch me strum. #