0:00:12 > 0:00:17Hello, and welcome to Thursday In Parliament,
0:00:17 > 0:00:19our look at the best of the day
0:00:19 > 0:00:21in the Commons and the Lords.
0:00:21 > 0:00:24On this programme, a minister annonces a pause in the
0:00:24 > 0:00:26introduction of controversial new contracts for junior doctors.
0:00:26 > 0:00:30Peers react positively.
0:00:30 > 0:00:32My Lords, I am surprised but delighted after the
0:00:32 > 0:00:36initial news this morning.
0:00:36 > 0:00:39The public will greatly welcome the magnanimity
0:00:39 > 0:00:41of Her Majesty's Government.
0:00:41 > 0:00:43Of course, I would make the point that most junior doctors
0:00:43 > 0:00:45work seven days a week anyway.
0:00:45 > 0:00:48There's condemnation of David Cameron's tactics
0:00:48 > 0:00:50at Prime Minister's Questions.
0:00:50 > 0:00:53Yesterday's Prime Minister's Questions showed to
0:00:53 > 0:00:56me, if to nobody else, that there ain't no gutter low
0:00:56 > 0:00:58enough for the Prime Minister to slop around in.
0:00:58 > 0:01:01And the moment the Farming Minister had
0:01:01 > 0:01:04to state a Government position he doesn't agree with.
0:01:04 > 0:01:06The Government position is that we should remain in
0:01:06 > 0:01:11the European Union.
0:01:11 > 0:01:14You will also be aware that I have exercised the option
0:01:14 > 0:01:16granted by the PM to disagree with the Government on this
0:01:16 > 0:01:17particular issue.
0:01:17 > 0:01:20But first, a breakthrough in the long-running
0:01:20 > 0:01:22junior doctors dispute in England has been
0:01:22 > 0:01:25signalled in the House of Lords.
0:01:25 > 0:01:29Many thousands of hospital operations have been postponed in
0:01:29 > 0:01:33the several days of strike action carried out by the junior doctors,
0:01:33 > 0:01:35who are unhappy about new working contracts.
0:01:35 > 0:01:38In particular, they are asking for improved rates of pay
0:01:38 > 0:01:40for weekend working.
0:01:40 > 0:01:43Two months ago, the Health Secretary, Jeremy Hunt, said
0:01:43 > 0:01:49he would impose the new contract if no agreement was reached.
0:01:49 > 0:01:51A health minister in the House of Lords has
0:01:51 > 0:01:53announced an important new development in the dispute.
0:01:53 > 0:01:58My Lords, my right honourable friend,
0:01:58 > 0:02:01the Secretary of State for Health, will write to the Academy of Medical
0:02:01 > 0:02:03Royal Colleges later this morning explaining that we are willing to
0:02:03 > 0:02:13pause introduction of the new contract for five days from Monday,
0:02:14 > 0:02:17should the Junior Doctors Committee agree to focus discussion on the
0:02:17 > 0:02:18outstanding contractual issues, namely unsocial hours
0:02:18 > 0:02:20and Saturday pay.
0:02:20 > 0:02:23My Lords, I am surprised but delighted after the initial news
0:02:23 > 0:02:26this morning that the Department of Health has agreed to enter into
0:02:26 > 0:02:31discussions with the junior doctors.
0:02:31 > 0:02:34I hope that both sides will enter this discussion in the spirit of
0:02:34 > 0:02:36finding a resolution, rather than finding faults
0:02:36 > 0:02:39in the discussions.
0:02:39 > 0:02:43I'm sure the talk will resolve the issue because, as far as I am
0:02:43 > 0:02:47concerned, striking is not the answer.
0:02:47 > 0:02:50Anything that prolongs that exercise is detrimental to patient care.
0:02:50 > 0:02:52Is my noble friend aware that the public
0:02:52 > 0:02:53will greatly welcome the
0:02:53 > 0:02:54magnanimity of Her Majesty's Government?
0:02:54 > 0:02:59LAUGHTER
0:02:59 > 0:03:01In willingly going forward to have further discussions
0:03:02 > 0:03:05over a short period.
0:03:05 > 0:03:08But at the same time, and I can only speak from
0:03:08 > 0:03:10having talked to some of my former constituents
0:03:10 > 0:03:14in Northampton, the public
0:03:14 > 0:03:16does want to know what is the benefit
0:03:16 > 0:03:17to both the public and the
0:03:17 > 0:03:23junior doctors from this new contract?
0:03:23 > 0:03:24The Government's approach has been cack-handed
0:03:24 > 0:03:27throughout the process.
0:03:27 > 0:03:30It would have been much better if, instead of
0:03:30 > 0:03:35initially rejecting this proposal, the Government had accepted it
0:03:35 > 0:03:38rather than actually now setting some new conditions.
0:03:38 > 0:03:40Obviously, we hope the outcome of this will be
0:03:40 > 0:03:44successful and it will be resolved.
0:03:44 > 0:03:46The question I put to the noble lord,
0:03:46 > 0:03:49the minister, is this, at the
0:03:49 > 0:03:54end of this process, we are left with thousands of junior doctors
0:03:54 > 0:03:59disengaged from the service because of the circumstances of the dispute
0:03:59 > 0:04:04and the alarmist statements issued by the Secretary of State.
0:04:04 > 0:04:06Will my lord's part of the discussions look
0:04:06 > 0:04:08at how the junior doctors
0:04:08 > 0:04:11are to be brought back into the fold and given the support they
0:04:11 > 0:04:14so richly deserve?
0:04:14 > 0:04:17My Lords, I think there is a general recognition that many of
0:04:17 > 0:04:21the issues that have lain behind the dispute over the contract
0:04:21 > 0:04:24are not actually involved in the contract
0:04:24 > 0:04:27itself, it is about how junior doctors are trained,
0:04:27 > 0:04:30how they are valued, how they are integrated into
0:04:30 > 0:04:36hospitals and into the workforce.
0:04:36 > 0:04:40While the whole house welcomes this pause,
0:04:40 > 0:04:44I hope whatever happens there will be an opportunity for an
0:04:44 > 0:04:45independent review to look at the very
0:04:45 > 0:04:48points that were made earlier on
0:04:48 > 0:04:51about the lack of value, lack of appreciation,
0:04:51 > 0:04:55lack of support for junior doctors.
0:04:55 > 0:04:59If there is one thing that this dispute last week
0:04:59 > 0:05:00has shown is that when consultants actually
0:05:00 > 0:05:02man the front door of the hospital,
0:05:02 > 0:05:07the services are very much better.
0:05:07 > 0:05:10Does the Minister accept that what he said this morning,
0:05:10 > 0:05:13welcome though it may be, is really rather too late?
0:05:13 > 0:05:15Trust is the most important element when it comes to
0:05:15 > 0:05:19provision of medical services.
0:05:19 > 0:05:21The Secretary of State has lost the trust
0:05:21 > 0:05:24already, not only of the junior doctors,
0:05:24 > 0:05:29but also of a very large percentage of the general
0:05:29 > 0:05:31public and it has to be said, actually,
0:05:31 > 0:05:33the BMA has also lost the trust
0:05:33 > 0:05:34of a certain percentage of the public.
0:05:34 > 0:05:36Of course, I would make the point
0:05:36 > 0:05:38that most junior doctors work seven days a week anyway.
0:05:38 > 0:05:41But will the Minister accept that the
0:05:41 > 0:05:45imposition of this contract, if it is done at the end of the pause
0:05:45 > 0:05:47period, is not the only way of achieving
0:05:47 > 0:05:50the Government's objective?
0:05:50 > 0:05:55And further discussions with those who actually provide those
0:05:55 > 0:05:58services may very well find an even better way of providing those
0:05:58 > 0:06:02seven-day services to the patients?
0:06:02 > 0:06:05All I would say today is that we have an opportunity over the next
0:06:05 > 0:06:07five days for the BMA and the Government
0:06:07 > 0:06:10to find a resolution to this
0:06:10 > 0:06:12and I think if we can find a resolution to this
0:06:12 > 0:06:15issue, it will make the implementation
0:06:15 > 0:06:19of seven-day working across the NHS much easier.
0:06:19 > 0:06:22Does the Minister remember the EU Working Time Directive,
0:06:22 > 0:06:25which was, a few years ago, touted as being disastrous for
0:06:25 > 0:06:31the training of junior doctors and would make it
0:06:31 > 0:06:38completely impossible for junior doctors to be trained?
0:06:38 > 0:06:41Now that the Government is trying to push our junior doctors to work
0:06:41 > 0:06:47longer hours over more days, does it mean all the fuss over the
0:06:47 > 0:06:47EU Working Time Directive was a myth?
0:06:47 > 0:06:48Or is this in an entirely different category?
0:06:48 > 0:06:53No, I think the noble lord has misunderstood the contract.
0:06:53 > 0:06:55The number of hours are actually coming
0:06:55 > 0:06:56down, not going up.
0:06:56 > 0:07:01Lord Prior.
0:07:01 > 0:07:05The ugliest Prime Minister's Questions in years, that was how one
0:07:05 > 0:07:07Westminster sketch writer summed up Wednesday's exchanges at
0:07:07 > 0:07:11the Dispatch Box between David Cameron and Jeremy Corbyn.
0:07:11 > 0:07:12The Prime Minister repeatedly accused Labour's
0:07:12 > 0:07:14candidate for London Mayor, Sadiq Khan,
0:07:14 > 0:07:15of sharing platforms with
0:07:15 > 0:07:19Islamist sympathisers.
0:07:19 > 0:07:22Jeremy Corbyn suggested the Conservatives had
0:07:22 > 0:07:27problems with racism and said they should set up an enquiry.
0:07:27 > 0:07:29One day on, the Shadow Commons Leader made
0:07:29 > 0:07:32plain his views about David Cameron's tactics.
0:07:32 > 0:07:36Yesterday's Prime Minister's Questions showed to me,
0:07:36 > 0:07:39if to nobody else, that there ain't no gutter low enough for the
0:07:39 > 0:07:41Prime Minister to slop around in.
0:07:41 > 0:07:44That kind of despicable smearing of one's
0:07:44 > 0:07:48opponents, I think, degrades the whole of politics.
0:07:48 > 0:07:51And I would just say gently to the Government that those
0:07:51 > 0:07:53who live by the gutter die in the gutter.
0:07:53 > 0:07:54I am absolutely certain that
0:07:54 > 0:07:57kind of politics is not welcome for the British voters.
0:07:57 > 0:07:59What a year it has been(!)
0:07:59 > 0:08:03Every single economic target missed!
0:08:03 > 0:08:07Growth forecast constantly downgraded, debt up,
0:08:07 > 0:08:09homelessness up, the use of food banks up by 19%.
0:08:09 > 0:08:12Absolute child poverty set to rise.
0:08:12 > 0:08:14NHS waiting lists up, libraries closed.
0:08:14 > 0:08:17Mr Speaker, what a load of twaddle we
0:08:17 > 0:08:21have just head from the Shadow Leader.
0:08:21 > 0:08:24Let's be clear, what we have spent the last 12 months doing is
0:08:24 > 0:08:27fulfilling the trust the public put in us at the general election
0:08:27 > 0:08:30last year when we defeated the Labour Party.
0:08:30 > 0:08:34Mr Speaker, if you look at the things this Government
0:08:34 > 0:08:36has actually done, we have introduced new powers to turn around
0:08:36 > 0:08:38failing schools, we have paved the way for
0:08:38 > 0:08:40the Northern Powerhouse, we have passed
0:08:40 > 0:08:43the EU Referendum Act, we have provided substantial new
0:08:43 > 0:08:45powers of devolution to Scotland.
0:08:45 > 0:08:47We have paved the way for
0:08:47 > 0:08:49the national living wage.
0:08:49 > 0:08:51We have passed English votes for English laws.
0:08:51 > 0:08:53We have passed a childcare act, which
0:08:53 > 0:08:55doubles the amount of free childcare each week.
0:08:55 > 0:08:57We have taken further important steps to consolidate peace
0:08:57 > 0:09:00in Northern Ireland.
0:09:00 > 0:09:03Mr Speaker, we need an urgent statement on what is
0:09:03 > 0:09:06going on with the investigation of the Conservative Party for breaking
0:09:06 > 0:09:09campaign spending rules in last year's general election.
0:09:09 > 0:09:15Mr Speaker, the claims are absolutely
0:09:15 > 0:09:17extraordinary and centres round Conservative candidates,
0:09:17 > 0:09:2028 Conservative candidates, failing to register the use
0:09:20 > 0:09:22of a battle bus for local campaigning and something
0:09:22 > 0:09:26like ?38,000 of accommodation for local campaigns.
0:09:26 > 0:09:30Mr Speaker, if anybody is found guilty of such a charge,
0:09:30 > 0:09:34it could result in one year imprisonment and an unlimited fine.
0:09:34 > 0:09:37Surely we must now hear what the Government's view on this
0:09:37 > 0:09:39is and there must be no whiff or suggestion
0:09:39 > 0:09:42that this Government cheated its way to power.
0:09:42 > 0:09:44It is for proper authorities to address issues
0:09:44 > 0:09:46whenever they arise and I have been very
0:09:46 > 0:09:48careful to say that that is the case
0:09:48 > 0:09:49where those issues affected
0:09:49 > 0:09:50the Scottish Nationalists as well,
0:09:50 > 0:09:51as we have seen in recent months.
0:09:51 > 0:09:55Chris Grayling.
0:09:55 > 0:10:00Now, is it the source of the vast majority of problems that British
0:10:00 > 0:10:03farmers face or is it a crucial market for meat exports?
0:10:03 > 0:10:06Both views of the European Union were on
0:10:06 > 0:10:08display at Environment Questions, coming from two different ministers
0:10:08 > 0:10:13in the same department.
0:10:13 > 0:10:15The exchanges began with a Conservative MP, who supports a
0:10:15 > 0:10:20British exit from the EU, asking about the contribution that
0:10:20 > 0:10:25technology could make to increasing the productivity of farming.
0:10:25 > 0:10:28Will he agree with me that the implementation burden of vast
0:10:28 > 0:10:30changes, like this year's common agricultural policy, make it
0:10:30 > 0:10:34difficult to realise all these benefits?
0:10:34 > 0:10:37And can he agree with me that there is a simple solution,
0:10:37 > 0:10:41which is to vote to leave the EU?
0:10:41 > 0:10:44Mr Speaker, as my honourable friend knows,
0:10:44 > 0:10:45the Government position is that we should remain
0:10:46 > 0:10:50in the European Union.
0:10:50 > 0:10:52He will also be aware that I have exercised
0:10:52 > 0:10:55the option granted by the PM
0:10:55 > 0:10:58to disagree with the Government on this particular issue.
0:10:58 > 0:11:01From a personal perspective, I would simply
0:11:01 > 0:11:04say that the vast majority of problems that farmers complain to me
0:11:04 > 0:11:09about are the consequence of dysfunctional EU legislation.
0:11:09 > 0:11:13But his boss, the Environment Secretary,
0:11:13 > 0:11:15took a rather different view when it was her turn
0:11:15 > 0:11:17to answer questions.
0:11:17 > 0:11:23The farming community of Lincolnshire will be gathered
0:11:23 > 0:11:25together on the 22nd and 23rd of June for the Lincolnshire Show.
0:11:25 > 0:11:28If my right honourable friend is not doing anything
0:11:28 > 0:11:31on those particular days, and if she will find time to come to
0:11:31 > 0:11:34Lincolnshire, I could introduce her to a group of farmers who oppose
0:11:34 > 0:11:37membership of the EU.
0:11:37 > 0:11:40Could she find time in her diary to do that?
0:11:40 > 0:11:45I thank my honourable friend for his question.
0:11:45 > 0:11:49I couldn't possibly imagine what anybody might be doing
0:11:49 > 0:11:52on the 23rd of June but what I would say,
0:11:52 > 0:11:54and this is for all farmers, is that the EU
0:11:54 > 0:11:56and the single market has brought massive benefits for
0:11:56 > 0:11:57food and farming.
0:11:57 > 0:12:00If you look at exports of beef and lamb, 97% of
0:12:00 > 0:12:06exports of lamb go into the European Union.
0:12:06 > 0:12:1092% of beef exports go to the European Union.
0:12:10 > 0:12:14There would be a real risk to the future
0:12:14 > 0:12:17livelihood of those industries if we were to leave as we weren't
0:12:17 > 0:12:19able to export our fine products to those
0:12:19 > 0:12:21European countries any more.
0:12:21 > 0:12:24A Labour MP was more concerned about the problems already facing
0:12:24 > 0:12:29a different group of farmers, those in the dairy industry.
0:12:29 > 0:12:31Food-secure Britain needs British farmers to be
0:12:31 > 0:12:33able to make a living and, with milk prices
0:12:33 > 0:12:34plummeting in March this year,
0:12:34 > 0:12:37we saw them at the lowest level they have been since 2009,
0:12:37 > 0:12:50with some farm-gate prices as low as 16p per litre.
0:12:50 > 0:12:50you
0:12:50 > 0:12:50and
0:12:50 > 0:12:51you and
0:12:51 > 0:12:54This is coming at a time when British dairy incomes
0:12:54 > 0:12:56are dropping and are forecase to drop by almost
0:12:56 > 0:12:57half for this year.
0:12:57 > 0:12:59I am disappointed that there was nothing for dairy farmers
0:12:59 > 0:13:00in this year's budget.
0:13:00 > 0:13:03What action will the Minister take now, working with supermarkets
0:13:03 > 0:13:05and retailers and farmers, to ensure a future for
0:13:05 > 0:13:06the British dairy industry?
0:13:06 > 0:13:09MPs on the other side of the Commons were worried as well.
0:13:09 > 0:13:12In North Yorkshire, for the last 15 years we have lost 15% of our dairy
0:13:12 > 0:13:15farmers and 90 cent of those still in business are losing money
0:13:15 > 0:13:19despite subsidies, does the Minister agree that now is the time
0:13:19 > 0:13:22for the supermarkets to start paying a fair price to British
0:13:22 > 0:13:27farmers for British milk?
0:13:28 > 0:13:33I understand the point that my honourable friend is making,
0:13:33 > 0:13:36these are very difficult times for farmers and I know that some
0:13:36 > 0:13:40people often lay the blame at supermarkets but we have
0:13:40 > 0:13:43to recognise that the root of this problem is a worldwide issue
0:13:43 > 0:13:48of low commodity prices.
0:13:48 > 0:13:51We are seeing very low prices in New Zealand, far lower
0:13:51 > 0:13:54than here and many people have been driven out of business
0:13:54 > 0:13:55there as well.
0:13:55 > 0:13:57This is a global challenge, some of the supermarkets have
0:13:57 > 0:14:00stepped up to the plate and offered aligned contracts and many of them
0:14:00 > 0:14:03are selling their milk at a loss and I think we should recognise
0:14:03 > 0:14:07and give credit where it is due, but we are always trying to improve
0:14:07 > 0:14:10the position for farmers.
0:14:10 > 0:14:12Another Conservative had a question about another part
0:14:12 > 0:14:15of the British breakfast.
0:14:15 > 0:14:18Weetabix which is based in my constituency is a great
0:14:18 > 0:14:20British breakfast cereal, she launched the great British Food
0:14:20 > 0:14:29Unit at its headquarters, will she ensure that
0:14:29 > 0:14:31at all the DEFRA breakfast meetings and international trade symposiums
0:14:31 > 0:14:34that her department organises around the world, that Weetabix is always
0:14:34 > 0:14:39served at these breakfast meetings?
0:14:39 > 0:14:41Well, my honourable friend is absolutely right that Weetabix
0:14:41 > 0:14:44is a fantastic product and not only is it exported around the world,
0:14:44 > 0:14:47all of the wheat grown is from 50 miles of the Weetabix factory
0:14:47 > 0:14:50so it is a real example of linking to farms.
0:14:50 > 0:14:52I proudly display my own box of Elizabeth Truss Weetabix
0:14:52 > 0:14:55on my desk at DEFRA for all visitors to see when they
0:14:55 > 0:15:05arrive in my office.
0:15:11 > 0:15:13Liz Truss telling us about her breakfast preferences.
0:15:13 > 0:15:15You're watching our round-up of the day in the Commons
0:15:15 > 0:15:16and the Lords.
0:15:16 > 0:15:17Still to come...
0:15:17 > 0:15:20Peers hear warnings that financial problems may force thousands of care
0:15:20 > 0:15:23homes to close.
0:15:23 > 0:15:25A former Education Secretary says that the digital revolution
0:15:25 > 0:15:29is going to destroy far more jobs than it creates.
0:15:29 > 0:15:31Lord Baker told peers that the government had
0:15:31 > 0:15:35to improve skills training dramatically if the UK
0:15:35 > 0:15:39was going to maintain its place in a rapidly changing world.
0:15:39 > 0:15:42He was contributing to a House of Lords debate on how to address
0:15:42 > 0:15:45the technical skills gap.
0:15:47 > 0:15:50The digital revolution is happening and I am one of those
0:15:50 > 0:15:52who believes that everything, artificial intelligence,
0:15:52 > 0:15:56data, driverless lorries, drones, all of that area
0:15:56 > 0:16:02is going to destroy many more jobs than they are creating.
0:16:02 > 0:16:07In the past industrial revolutions have always created more
0:16:07 > 0:16:12jobs, I made speeches, when I was a minister
0:16:12 > 0:16:13for information technology.
0:16:13 > 0:16:15I am now persuaded that the disruptive technologies
0:16:15 > 0:16:23of the digital revolution are going to destroy many others.
0:16:23 > 0:16:26There are reports from McKenzie and Davos saying that they will be
0:16:26 > 0:16:31absolutely larger than that.
0:16:31 > 0:16:34Faced with that, the government wants to improve skills training
0:16:34 > 0:16:37dramatically in our country.
0:16:37 > 0:16:40Another former Education Secretary referred to the ending of the era
0:16:40 > 0:16:43of the polytechnics.
0:16:43 > 0:16:46We lost out on that notion of the sandwich course
0:16:46 > 0:16:50which was very much a part of the polytechnic and we lost out
0:16:50 > 0:16:55I think on that emphasis on learning through doing.
0:16:55 > 0:16:58Because if you look at a lot of the older polytechnics now,
0:16:58 > 0:17:01what they have done is, new universities, they have
0:17:01 > 0:17:08expanded in what I call classroom bound courses.
0:17:08 > 0:17:11It was cheaper to put on a law course or a history course
0:17:11 > 0:17:13or a business course for a polytechnic that became
0:17:13 > 0:17:16a university and wanted to expand than it was to do a vocational
0:17:16 > 0:17:18course or skills course because they were more expensive
0:17:18 > 0:17:24by nature of the equipment.
0:17:24 > 0:17:26And that I think in some way accounts for the lack
0:17:26 > 0:17:32or the wrong skill sets that we are hearing of now.
0:17:32 > 0:17:35If we need to address our technical skills and we clearly do,
0:17:35 > 0:17:44please let's be wary of doing it in another Polytechnic experiment.
0:17:44 > 0:17:46Let us do it through encouraging the best technic departments
0:17:46 > 0:17:51to expand and not relocate elsewhere.
0:17:51 > 0:17:55If necessary, to set up new, just technical colleges,
0:17:55 > 0:17:58if we can find enough good teachers.
0:17:58 > 0:18:02I read somewhere that last year one third of all graduates were working
0:18:02 > 0:18:07in menial jobs after graduating.
0:18:07 > 0:18:09And at the same time, the Royal Academy of Engineering
0:18:09 > 0:18:15tells us that we are in need of 40,000 engineers each year.
0:18:15 > 0:18:18My Lords what we need is a technical education system in which businesses
0:18:18 > 0:18:20and colleges work closely together with political
0:18:20 > 0:18:24support from all sides.
0:18:24 > 0:18:26So when we publish our plans for education reform we will do
0:18:27 > 0:18:30so with the spirit of consensus.
0:18:30 > 0:18:33We want to seek the widest possible support and as we have heard today,
0:18:33 > 0:18:36I think everyone agrees on the challenges and the need
0:18:36 > 0:18:39to make sure we get this right and ensure that the worlds
0:18:39 > 0:18:43of business and education come together.
0:18:43 > 0:18:46The core theme of the debate today is the institutions for advanced
0:18:46 > 0:18:49technical education and broadly this government takes the view that
0:18:49 > 0:18:52at present we do not have the right pattern of institutions to teach
0:18:52 > 0:18:53high-level technical education programmes
0:18:53 > 0:18:59at the level we all want to see.
0:18:59 > 0:19:02Lady Evans.
0:19:02 > 0:19:04MPs have been told about the continuing grave concern held
0:19:04 > 0:19:06by faith groups over plans to subject out-of-school
0:19:06 > 0:19:12activities for young people to Ofsted inspections.
0:19:12 > 0:19:14The issue arose during a backbencher's debate
0:19:14 > 0:19:16in the Commons on the contribution of faith groups to
0:19:16 > 0:19:21the voluntary sector.
0:19:21 > 0:19:24Those proposals would mean that a Christian youth group which plays
0:19:24 > 0:19:27sport or games one day a week or meets one evening
0:19:27 > 0:19:30to discuss their faith plus perhaps on a Sunday could have Ofsted
0:19:30 > 0:19:32inspectors coming to see if their activities are compatible
0:19:32 > 0:19:35with a list of British values drawn up by the government and to check
0:19:35 > 0:19:38whether or not they are extremist.
0:19:38 > 0:19:41Mr Speaker, I submit to you that there is nothing less
0:19:41 > 0:19:43British than the government restricting the expression
0:19:43 > 0:19:52of religious faith based on a set of values drawn up in Whitehall.
0:19:52 > 0:19:54It is the very opposite of what I understand
0:19:54 > 0:19:56Conservatism to be.
0:19:56 > 0:19:58Ofsted inspectors will likely not be looking for illegal activities,
0:19:58 > 0:20:01they will be looking for activities which fit into a vaguely
0:20:01 > 0:20:09defined set of ideals, such as non-violent extremism.
0:20:09 > 0:20:11I agree with everything that she has just said,
0:20:11 > 0:20:20including her criticism of the government proposal,
0:20:20 > 0:20:23in effect to Ofsted being a regulator of religion,
0:20:23 > 0:20:26I think that would be dreadful and I hope the criticism will be
0:20:26 > 0:20:29heeded by the Minister and that in due course that proposal
0:20:29 > 0:20:34will be abandoned.
0:20:34 > 0:20:37My honourable friend also raised the issue of Ofsted and Ofsted
0:20:37 > 0:20:40inspections and I listened carefully to what she had to say.
0:20:40 > 0:20:43The Prime Minister and the Secretary of State for Education are clear
0:20:43 > 0:20:48that the registration will not apply to organisations and Sunday schools,
0:20:48 > 0:20:53we are not proposing to regulate institutions like Sunday schools.
0:20:53 > 0:20:55We have to ensure that organisations do the right thing,
0:20:55 > 0:20:58meet the standards we should expect but she raised legitimate concerns,
0:20:58 > 0:21:01the concerns to which I have listened and of which I am aware
0:21:01 > 0:21:04and I'm sure they will be drawn to the attention
0:21:04 > 0:21:09of the Education Secretary today.
0:21:09 > 0:21:11New research by the BBC indicates that one in four
0:21:11 > 0:21:16care homes in the UK, around 5000 institutions,
0:21:16 > 0:21:19may have to close because of financial hardship.
0:21:19 > 0:21:23Potential closures were raised at Question Time in the Lords.
0:21:23 > 0:21:25Lady Bakewell, a champion for older people under the previous Labour
0:21:25 > 0:21:28government, warned that a crash was on the way and urged
0:21:28 > 0:21:30the government to make contingency plans to protect frail
0:21:30 > 0:21:34and vulnerable residents.
0:21:37 > 0:21:40Is he not conversant with the BBC research published yesterday showing
0:21:40 > 0:21:45that 5000 care homes at risk of closure over the next three
0:21:45 > 0:21:51years, or the recent Stevens report showing a 34% increase in care home
0:21:51 > 0:21:53insolvencies over the past few years or indeed another estimate
0:21:53 > 0:22:00of ?2.9 billion funding gap in adult social care by the end of the decade
0:22:00 > 0:22:02and in the face of these figures, why does the government continue
0:22:02 > 0:22:05to assert the incredible proposition that it is possible to increase
0:22:05 > 0:22:07wages, increase regulatory burdens and not increase real
0:22:07 > 0:22:14terms per capita funding?
0:22:23 > 0:22:26When will they end this dangerous fantasy and actually start
0:22:26 > 0:22:32addressing the serious crisis in adult social care?
0:22:32 > 0:22:36I think the increase in the minimum wage from ?6.70 to a living wage
0:22:36 > 0:22:38of ?7.20 has been universally welcomed by most
0:22:38 > 0:22:43people in this house.
0:22:43 > 0:22:46I think care workers, people who work in care homes do
0:22:46 > 0:22:49an incredible difficult job and ?7.20 does not seem to me
0:22:49 > 0:22:55a small fortune to pay people like that.
0:22:55 > 0:22:58The cost of that, that will increase the cost of people in the care
0:22:58 > 0:23:01sector, and there is some evidence that some care homes are closing,
0:23:01 > 0:23:04the figures I have in the last two years, 2000 beds have
0:23:04 > 0:23:08closed in the care sector.
0:23:08 > 0:23:10600 domiciliary care agencies have opened in that time
0:23:10 > 0:23:14so there is going to be a switch in the way that care is delivered
0:23:14 > 0:23:20from residential care to domiciliary care.
0:23:20 > 0:23:22It is very difficult to know sometimes what land
0:23:22 > 0:23:24ministers live on.
0:23:24 > 0:23:28My Lords, that is an extraordinarily complacent answer.
0:23:28 > 0:23:30The survey yesterday showed a quarter of all care
0:23:30 > 0:23:37homes are facing closure because of the financial squeeze.
0:23:37 > 0:23:39A study into funding social care five years ago commissioned
0:23:39 > 0:23:46by the government opposed capping the cost of care in England.
0:23:46 > 0:23:48His government decided unilaterally to postpone probably forever
0:23:48 > 0:23:50but certainly by four years the introduction of the care cap
0:23:50 > 0:23:56which proved massively disappointing too many people.
0:23:56 > 0:23:59The government put into the forward programme spend plans of 6 billion,
0:23:59 > 0:24:01why not use some of that money to help the viability
0:24:01 > 0:24:07of the care home sector?
0:24:10 > 0:24:14My Lords, if I sounded complacent, I did not mean to.
0:24:14 > 0:24:17I recognise that there is a tremendous pressure on many
0:24:17 > 0:24:19providers of adult social care, particularly those funded by local
0:24:19 > 0:24:21authorities, it is for that reason, disappointingly,
0:24:21 > 0:24:29it has been postponed.
0:24:29 > 0:24:31We wanted to bring it it in but we decided the cost
0:24:31 > 0:24:34of bringing it in was too great for local authorities
0:24:34 > 0:24:36to finance in the short term.
0:24:38 > 0:24:41Given that this is a crisis and there is going to be a crash,
0:24:41 > 0:24:45we know that the care sector has warned us that it is coming,
0:24:45 > 0:24:46the government has made concessions of course,
0:24:46 > 0:24:49but can it have contingency plans in place so that when the crisis
0:24:49 > 0:24:52actually hits, old and vulnerable people are not suddenly thrust
0:24:52 > 0:25:02into a crisis that they do not know how to deal with.
0:25:04 > 0:25:06The noble lady is absolutely right, the whole focus must be
0:25:06 > 0:25:09on the residents of these homes, rather than the owners
0:25:09 > 0:25:13of the care homes.
0:25:13 > 0:25:16There are a number of very highly regarded providers in the sector
0:25:16 > 0:25:22who have high levels of debt and often very expensive debt.
0:25:22 > 0:25:25The CQC is keeping a close watch on them and when there are early
0:25:25 > 0:25:27warning signs of difficulties, then the CQC and the local
0:25:27 > 0:25:34authorities will put in place alternative plans.
0:25:34 > 0:25:35Lord Prior.
0:25:35 > 0:25:38That is it for this programme, do join me for The Week In Parliament
0:25:38 > 0:25:41when we will have the best of the last three days
0:25:41 > 0:25:42in the Commons and the Lords.
0:25:42 > 0:25:45Until then, from me, Keith McDougall, goodbye.