0:00:16 > 0:00:20Hello and welcome to our look back at Thursday in Parliament.
0:00:20 > 0:00:22Coming up:
0:00:22 > 0:00:25Labour calls on the Brexit Secretary to promise Parliament a vote
0:00:25 > 0:00:27on the final EU deal.
0:00:27 > 0:00:32And passions run high.
0:00:32 > 0:00:35Stop fighting and be honest with the British people!
0:00:35 > 0:00:37And the Commons hears of the horrors of modern slavery.
0:00:37 > 0:00:42It is a blight on the conscience of this nation and whilst we have done
0:00:42 > 0:00:44a lot there is much more to do.
0:00:44 > 0:00:48The row about whether Parliament will get to vote on a deal to leave
0:00:48 > 0:00:51the EU before the UK's departure has entered a second day.
0:00:51 > 0:00:53You may remember that on Wednesday the Brexit Secretary suggested
0:00:53 > 0:00:56MPs may not get a vote until after the UK has left.
0:00:56 > 0:01:02But later there was a clarification saying ministers "expected
0:01:02 > 0:01:04and intended" that there would be a vote before.
0:01:04 > 0:01:07Labour put down an urgent question asking David Davis to explain
0:01:07 > 0:01:08what exactly the position was.
0:01:08 > 0:01:10His opposite number, Sir Keir Starmer, gave his
0:01:10 > 0:01:15version of events.
0:01:15 > 0:01:26What a mess. One thing one day another thing the next. Yesterday
0:01:26 > 0:01:30the secretary of state was asked could the vote in our parliament be
0:01:30 > 0:01:35after March 2019? The answer, yes, it could be. Later the Prime
0:01:35 > 0:01:40Minister had a go at collecting him, then his own spokesperson had to
0:01:40 > 0:01:45clarify his remarks. Today he said the vote will be before the deal is
0:01:45 > 0:01:49concluded. That is not good enough and it would be wholly unacceptable
0:01:49 > 0:01:53time was fun for the European Parliament to vote on the deal but
0:01:53 > 0:02:00time was not found for this house. Does the state might expect us to
0:02:00 > 0:02:03sit here watching the European Parliament proceedings whilst we are
0:02:03 > 0:02:08told we do not have time? We need a cast iron guarantees that will not
0:02:08 > 0:02:13happen. The Secretary of State has repeatedly asked them to accept his
0:02:13 > 0:02:17word. Given the events of the last 24 hours and will he now accept the
0:02:17 > 0:02:23amendments that are down to the withdrawal bill that the article 15
0:02:23 > 0:02:28meaningful vote should be put into law sought we all know where we
0:02:28 > 0:02:34stand?The issue I raised yesterday because I always planned to be as
0:02:34 > 0:02:37forthright and open as I can with the select committee is to go
0:02:37 > 0:02:41through what happened in the past in treaty negotiation with the EU.
0:02:41 > 0:02:47There is an expectation by the commission, there is an incentive on
0:02:47 > 0:02:52the part of the various countries to get this done as quickly as possible
0:02:52 > 0:02:56and there is expectation and intention by ourselves. None of the
0:02:56 > 0:03:01undertakings given at this dispatch box have been undermined. The issue
0:03:01 > 0:03:06is one of practicality in what the control. What we control we will run
0:03:06 > 0:03:09in order to give Parliament a proper and meaningful vote.
0:03:09 > 0:03:11One amendment to the EU Withdrawal Bill being
0:03:11 > 0:03:13proposed is from the former Attorney General Dominic Grieve
0:03:13 > 0:03:18to ensure the final deal is approved by Parliamentary statute.
0:03:18 > 0:03:22There is a way for the Government to put this beyond doubt that is to the
0:03:22 > 0:03:31amendment seven to the withdrawal bill. Reports have reached members
0:03:31 > 0:03:35on the side of the Secretary of State does not think those
0:03:35 > 0:03:38Conservative members who signed the amendment are serious about
0:03:38 > 0:03:43supporting it. Can I tell him we are deadly serious and it would be
0:03:43 > 0:03:47better for the Government to adopt a concession strategy on having a
0:03:47 > 0:03:51withdrawal agreement secured icecaps -- statutes sooner rather than
0:03:51 > 0:03:55later. I will not pre-empt the discussion
0:03:55 > 0:03:58in the build up those reports are not true.
0:03:58 > 0:04:02Does the state might not agree after the shambles of the past 24 hours
0:04:02 > 0:04:07when he had to be rebutted by his own spokesperson, the only way to
0:04:07 > 0:04:12guarantee Parliament a meaningful say and meaningful input into these
0:04:12 > 0:04:17most vital of the negotiations, is to amend the EU withdrawal bill
0:04:17 > 0:04:23accordingly? I do not agree with him on that. His
0:04:23 > 0:04:30description of the event is also wrong. There is one thing to give a
0:04:30 > 0:04:33binding undertaking, the other thing is to say these are the problems and
0:04:33 > 0:04:38difficulties we face to get there, which is what I did yesterday. I
0:04:38 > 0:04:42treated the committee was absolute respect and outlining what had
0:04:42 > 0:04:46happened previously, not what we inspect or in time, but what had
0:04:46 > 0:04:51happened previously and risk we have to take on board. We intend to meet
0:04:51 > 0:04:54all our undertakings and I do not take it very well he suggested we do
0:04:54 > 0:04:54not.
0:04:54 > 0:04:59One Conservative MP believed a vote on Brexit had already taken place.
0:04:59 > 0:05:06It was a meaningful vote in June 2016 and the 78% turnout, 61% of
0:05:06 > 0:05:11voters in Kettering voted to leave. In Kettering people are honest and
0:05:11 > 0:05:15straightforward and plain speaking. Can the Secretary of State reassure
0:05:15 > 0:05:19them we are leaving the EU in March 2019?
0:05:19 > 0:05:27The answer to my honourable friend is yes and my task is to respect
0:05:27 > 0:05:30that vote because it is the biggest mandate given to more than
0:05:30 > 0:05:35Government and deliver the best deal possible, which means a deal, not no
0:05:35 > 0:05:38deal,.
0:05:38 > 0:05:39David Davis.
0:05:39 > 0:05:43Now, many of the morning papers carried a story suggesting the NHS
0:05:43 > 0:05:45in Essex may discharge people from hospital into
0:05:45 > 0:05:46rooms rented locally.
0:05:46 > 0:05:48The service would be based on Airbnb -
0:05:48 > 0:05:51the popular website which helps people rent out their spare rooms
0:05:51 > 0:05:52on a temporary basis.
0:05:52 > 0:06:02In the Lords, peers were keen to get to the bottom of the story.
0:06:03 > 0:06:06Is it true the Government have given the go-ahead that vulnerable
0:06:06 > 0:06:13patients who are not fit to be discharged to
0:06:13 > 0:06:15their home will actually be discharged to third parties?
0:06:15 > 0:06:17Vulnerable patients will be allocated to homes
0:06:17 > 0:06:23where the hosts have no medical
0:06:23 > 0:06:26expertise and for which they will get paid £1000 a month.
0:06:26 > 0:06:27Will the Government not listen...?
0:06:27 > 0:06:28This is my final question.
0:06:28 > 0:06:32Will the Government not listen to the medical opinion
0:06:33 > 0:06:35and drop this preposterous scheme?
0:06:35 > 0:06:41That is, I should stress, a local pilot that is
0:06:41 > 0:06:42being explored.
0:06:42 > 0:06:43I don't think it is even underway.
0:06:43 > 0:06:48It has been proposed by a local doctor, an emergency registrar,
0:06:48 > 0:06:51and for it to go ahead it is clearly the case any such pilot
0:06:51 > 0:06:55would have to abide by the very strict rules that exist in terms of
0:06:55 > 0:06:57safety, safeguarding, quality and so on for any care
0:06:57 > 0:06:58setting.
0:06:58 > 0:07:01The head of Age UK said that any new
0:07:01 > 0:07:03innovation - and we want to encourage innovation -
0:07:03 > 0:07:07needs to pass the mum or grandma test.
0:07:07 > 0:07:10And I think that is a very reasonable test to apply to
0:07:10 > 0:07:11something like this.
0:07:11 > 0:07:14The case raised by my noble friend relating to Essex
0:07:14 > 0:07:19really goes to the heart of the issue of the problem of discharging
0:07:19 > 0:07:21patients from NHS hospitals and the lack
0:07:21 > 0:07:29of support either in the
0:07:29 > 0:07:31community from social care or in the reduction in places
0:07:31 > 0:07:34and nursing homes that has taken place in the
0:07:34 > 0:07:35last four years.
0:07:35 > 0:07:38My Lords, are the noble lords as surprised as I am that, despite
0:07:38 > 0:07:40this, up and down the country, the NHS, in sustainability and
0:07:40 > 0:07:45transformation programmes, are actually putting forward proposals
0:07:45 > 0:07:49to cut out community hospitals and community hospital beds?
0:07:49 > 0:07:52My Lords, will ministers issue an instruction
0:07:52 > 0:08:01to the NHS that this simply will not actually be allowed to happen?
0:08:01 > 0:08:03On the issue on social care, we have discussed the issue
0:08:03 > 0:08:04of nursing home beds.
0:08:04 > 0:08:09We also know there has been an increase in the amount of
0:08:09 > 0:08:12domiciliary care being provided so that reflects the changing needs
0:08:12 > 0:08:16of people who have care needs.
0:08:16 > 0:08:20There was also publication yesterday showing social care spending has
0:08:20 > 0:08:23risen by 500 million in 2016-17, which I'm sure is something that
0:08:23 > 0:08:30is warmly welcomed across the house.
0:08:30 > 0:08:32In terms of community beds, the noble lords should know
0:08:32 > 0:08:34that in addition to the usual four tests
0:08:34 > 0:08:35for reconfigurations, last
0:08:35 > 0:08:39year Simon Stephens, the head of NHS England said
0:08:39 > 0:08:42there was now a fifth test, the bed test, there must be
0:08:42 > 0:08:43absolutely very strong and robust evidence
0:08:43 > 0:08:44any proposed reduction in
0:08:44 > 0:08:52'beds is because of the reduction in demand and not the other way round.
0:08:52 > 0:08:56The exchanges came during a discussion about the possible when
0:08:56 > 0:09:01the crisis in the NHS. One was concerned about flu. The
0:09:01 > 0:09:07only way to increase staffing levels in anticipation of the flu epidemic
0:09:07 > 0:09:12is the flu agency staff which will cost a huge of money. Surely a
0:09:12 > 0:09:18better thing to do would be to ensure all health staff are
0:09:18 > 0:09:22vaccinated so they are at least healthy when the epidemic hits us,
0:09:22 > 0:09:26if it does? My noble friend talks with great
0:09:26 > 0:09:31authority on this issue and he is quite right, the NHS is offering all
0:09:31 > 0:09:36front line health staff free vaccinations and the NHS England has
0:09:36 > 0:09:39confirmed it will be paying for care workers in social care settings to
0:09:39 > 0:09:45also get free vaccinations. For the first time we are now inoculating
0:09:45 > 0:09:50between two and eight-year-old in school who are sometimes known as
0:09:50 > 0:09:53super spreader is to ensure that such an epidemic happens we will be
0:09:53 > 0:09:58as we're prepared -- well-prepared as ever.
0:09:58 > 0:10:00Lord O'Shaughnessy.
0:10:00 > 0:10:01You're watching Thursday in Parliament
0:10:01 > 0:10:02with me, Mandy Baker.
0:10:02 > 0:10:04Don't forget you can follow BBC Parliament on Twitter and catch
0:10:04 > 0:10:05previous editions of this programme on the bbc iPlayer.
0:10:07 > 0:10:11At questions to the Environment Secretary there was good news
0:10:11 > 0:10:18for campaigners against the ivory trade.
0:10:18 > 0:10:23We are consulting on proposals to introduce a total ban on UK ivory
0:10:23 > 0:10:28sales that we hope will contribute to eliminating elephant poaching. We
0:10:28 > 0:10:31will consult on certain narrowly defined and carefully targeted
0:10:31 > 0:10:35exceptions.
0:10:35 > 0:10:37I, along with students and residents across my constituency,
0:10:37 > 0:10:39welcome the Government s commitment to a near total ban
0:10:39 > 0:10:40on ivory sales in the UK.
0:10:40 > 0:10:43How will the Government work with our friends abroad,
0:10:43 > 0:10:45especially in south-east Asia, to ensure that together
0:10:45 > 0:10:50we bring an end to poaching by illegal armed gangs?
0:10:50 > 0:10:54I thank my honourable friend, as I know that she has been
0:10:54 > 0:10:57campaigning with young people across Wealden to ensure
0:10:57 > 0:11:06that there is heightened awareness of the direct link between the ivory
0:11:06 > 0:11:13trade and illegal poaching.
0:11:13 > 0:11:15We are hosting the illegal wildlife trade conference next year,
0:11:15 > 0:11:18and we will ensure that we work with countries, particularly in east
0:11:18 > 0:11:20and south-east Asia, to close down this evil trade.
0:11:20 > 0:11:23It was also Mr Gove's first chance to talk about the proposals
0:11:23 > 0:11:26he announced last month to increase the maximum penalty for animal
0:11:26 > 0:11:28cruelty from six months in prison to five years.
0:11:28 > 0:11:30The news was welcomed on the SNP benches.
0:11:30 > 0:11:32I welcome this proposal, having secured a debate on this
0:11:32 > 0:11:34issue in Westminster Hall in the last Parliament.
0:11:34 > 0:11:37This issue is extremely important, particularly in relation to dog
0:11:37 > 0:11:39fighting, which is an appalling act of animal cruelty.
0:11:39 > 0:11:41During last year s debate, it was said that the policing
0:11:41 > 0:11:44of such crimes and the funding for that need to be increased.
0:11:44 > 0:11:47What is the Minister planning to do in that regard?
0:11:47 > 0:11:49The honourable lady makes a very good point.
0:11:49 > 0:11:50Of course, sentencing decisions and, indeed,
0:11:50 > 0:11:52policing matters are devolved, but one thing we do
0:11:52 > 0:11:55at DEFRA is to work closely with the Home Office to ensure that
0:11:55 > 0:11:58examples of animal cruelty that need to focus the minds of police forces
0:11:58 > 0:12:00on more effective investigation are at the heart of
0:12:01 > 0:12:02our shared conversations.
0:12:02 > 0:12:03our shared conversations.
0:12:03 > 0:12:04The Environment Secretary.
0:12:04 > 0:12:07MPs have called on ministers to do more to ensure people
0:12:07 > 0:12:08traffickers face prosecution.
0:12:08 > 0:12:10The demand came during a debate on tackling modern slavery.
0:12:10 > 0:12:12Before becoming an MP, Jess Phillips ran a service
0:12:12 > 0:12:15which provided safe houses for victims of modern slavery.
0:12:15 > 0:12:23The vast majority of women now living in the safe accommodation
0:12:23 > 0:12:25through the national referral mechanism are there
0:12:25 > 0:12:27because they have been trafficked into this country
0:12:27 > 0:12:29for sexual slavery.
0:12:29 > 0:12:37It is not sex work - these people were slaves.
0:12:37 > 0:12:39I worked with women who were forced to have sex
0:12:39 > 0:12:44with over 50 men in a day.
0:12:44 > 0:12:51The idea, in a modern system of sex work, that we have an honest John
0:12:51 > 0:12:54who is saying, do you mind if I ask you where you come from?
0:12:54 > 0:12:57Are you here out of choice?
0:12:57 > 0:12:59is a total fallacy and something successive Governments have
0:12:59 > 0:13:01failed to tackle.
0:13:01 > 0:13:04We really, really need to be tackling it now,
0:13:04 > 0:13:08because the number of women from different countries
0:13:08 > 0:13:12and originally from the UK who are prostituted,
0:13:12 > 0:13:22exploited and trafficked around the country
0:13:24 > 0:13:26who are from the UK originally is absolutely phenomenal.
0:13:26 > 0:13:27Hundreds and hundreds and hundreds have gone
0:13:27 > 0:13:29through the service I used to work for.
0:13:29 > 0:13:32Another MP gave some distressing details of how a victim
0:13:32 > 0:13:35in her constituency had been treated.
0:13:35 > 0:13:37She was brought to London and taken to a woman's house,
0:13:37 > 0:13:40where she was told she would be staying and looking
0:13:40 > 0:13:41after the woman s children.
0:13:41 > 0:13:44She asked the woman when she would be going back to school.
0:13:44 > 0:13:47It was the first time the woman slapped her.
0:13:47 > 0:13:50She also asked about her mother, but she was told to speak
0:13:50 > 0:13:53only when she was spoken to and that she was not allowed
0:13:53 > 0:13:54to make any friends.
0:13:54 > 0:13:56Her daily routine involved getting up at 5am,
0:13:56 > 0:13:58getting the children ready for school, taking them to school
0:13:58 > 0:14:00and collecting them, and doing the shopping,
0:14:00 > 0:14:01cleaning and cooking.
0:14:01 > 0:14:04If she went out on an errand, the woman who was holding her
0:14:04 > 0:14:08would spit on the floor and tell her that she had to be back
0:14:08 > 0:14:10before the spit had dried or she would be beaten.
0:14:10 > 0:14:12She ran everywhere as she was frightened of being late.
0:14:12 > 0:14:16She was beaten on a daily basis, she had her head flushed down
0:14:16 > 0:14:21the toilet, and she was often privy to what we believe were drug deals.
0:14:21 > 0:14:23Labour's Vernon Coaker initiated the debate.
0:14:23 > 0:14:26He used to be a Home Office minister.
0:14:26 > 0:14:29I had much of the responsibility for dealing with modern
0:14:29 > 0:14:31slavery for four years between 2006 and 2017.
0:14:31 > 0:14:34When I challenge the Government, it is a challenge to all of us.
0:14:34 > 0:14:36It is a challenge to what I did.
0:14:36 > 0:14:39It is a challenge to every one of us, to every local authority
0:14:39 > 0:14:40and to every police force.
0:14:40 > 0:14:42We have to challenge ourselves to do better.
0:14:42 > 0:14:45It is not acceptable that modern slavery still exists.
0:14:45 > 0:14:50It is a blight on the conscience of this nation.
0:14:50 > 0:14:53Although we have done a lot, there is so much more to do.
0:14:53 > 0:14:55Those who are enslaved deserve our support and our help.
0:14:55 > 0:14:57A Conservative former victims' minister spoke
0:14:57 > 0:14:58of the scourge of modern slavery.
0:14:58 > 0:15:01It creates victims who are often some of the most vulnerable members
0:15:01 > 0:15:05of society, separated from their families
0:15:05 > 0:15:11and friends, with no access to financial help or support.
0:15:11 > 0:15:15As I speak today, I am reminded of a young man I met
0:15:15 > 0:15:19about three years ago, when I was the Victims Minister.
0:15:19 > 0:15:25He dispelled many of the myths surrounding human trafficking -
0:15:25 > 0:15:28he was a man, he was British, and he was trafficked
0:15:28 > 0:15:30for forced labour.
0:15:30 > 0:15:35He bravely shared with me his story of absolute misery and how
0:15:35 > 0:15:39he was dehumanised and degraded.
0:15:39 > 0:15:41The meeting drove home to me just how important
0:15:41 > 0:15:45it is for the Government, local authorities and all our
0:15:45 > 0:15:52partners to work more effectively together.
0:15:52 > 0:16:02The minister set out measures to support victims.
0:16:03 > 0:16:05In many cases, the existing 14-day move-on support period does not give
0:16:05 > 0:16:08enough time for support to be provided properly, so we will extend
0:16:08 > 0:16:10the period to 45 days, thereby guaranteeing that confirmed
0:16:10 > 0:16:16victims will receive a minimum of 90 days of Government-funded support.
0:16:16 > 0:16:19Further, we will extend by a week the period of support for those
0:16:19 > 0:16:23who are not confirmed as victims, making it nine days.
0:16:23 > 0:16:26For all confirmed victims who have left the NRM,
0:16:26 > 0:16:28we will run weekly drop-in centres in partnership with the Salvation
0:16:28 > 0:16:32Army, so that victims can continue to receive ongoing
0:16:32 > 0:16:35support and advice.
0:16:35 > 0:16:36Sarah Newton.
0:16:36 > 0:16:39The programme of restoration planned for Parliament may be delayed
0:16:39 > 0:16:42for another year to 18 months.
0:16:42 > 0:16:45It was in 2016 that a report was published setting
0:16:45 > 0:16:47out the options for the renewal of the building's
0:16:47 > 0:16:53crumbling infrastructure.
0:16:53 > 0:16:55They included MPs and peers decamping while the multi-billion
0:16:56 > 0:16:57-pound restoration was carried out.
0:16:57 > 0:17:01But now there are proposals to set up a new body to, in effect,
0:17:01 > 0:17:02review the possibilities.
0:17:02 > 0:17:05In the Commons MPs wanted to know how long it would all take.
0:17:05 > 0:17:08The Leader of the House is now appointing yet another Committee,
0:17:08 > 0:17:10delaying the repairs yet again, despite warnings that delays
0:17:10 > 0:17:12increase the risk of serious events such as fires.
0:17:12 > 0:17:15Has the Commission made any estimate of how much longer the deployment
0:17:15 > 0:17:25of a new body to consider costings will delay the timeline of work?
0:17:28 > 0:17:32Both houses were due to debate setting up the new bodies before the
0:17:32 > 0:17:34end of the year.
0:17:34 > 0:17:36The expectation is that once the shadow sponsor board
0:17:36 > 0:17:39and the delivery authority have been established, it might take them
0:17:39 > 0:17:41something of the order of 12 to 18 months to consider
0:17:41 > 0:17:42the options for decanting.
0:17:42 > 0:17:44That would therefore add to the timescales.
0:17:44 > 0:17:47I welcome the fact that we are going to have the debate
0:17:47 > 0:17:48by the end of this year.
0:17:48 > 0:17:50We really need that, because meanwhile the fabric
0:17:50 > 0:17:53of the building continues to deteriorate and the very high
0:17:53 > 0:17:58maintenance costs that we incur as a result also continue apace.
0:17:58 > 0:18:01Does my right honourable friend agree that the public might be
0:18:01 > 0:18:06somewhat puzzled at the thought
0:18:06 > 0:18:10of a further 12 to 18 month delay while options that have already been
0:18:10 > 0:18:12assessed are discussed yet again?
0:18:12 > 0:18:14When works are urgent for structural and safety reasons,
0:18:14 > 0:18:17surely we should choose the option that maximises the ability to carry
0:18:17 > 0:18:19out those works efficiently while minimising the cost
0:18:19 > 0:18:24to the public purse without any further delay.
0:18:24 > 0:18:26Tom Brake said since the original report,
0:18:26 > 0:18:29the picture had changed slightly -- but he hoped MPs would take up
0:18:29 > 0:18:32the chance to tour Parliament's basements to see how much work
0:18:32 > 0:18:33needed to be done.
0:18:33 > 0:18:35A Conservative wondered if there might be a financial
0:18:35 > 0:18:37motive for the delay.
0:18:37 > 0:18:40I might be wrong, but I get the impression that the Treasury
0:18:40 > 0:18:43would much rather spend money over a long period than over
0:18:43 > 0:18:44a shorter period.
0:18:44 > 0:18:46Does the right honourable gentleman know whether the Treasury
0:18:46 > 0:18:50would prefer to spend £5 billion or £6 billion over five or six years
0:18:50 > 0:18:54or much more over 20 to 30 years?
0:18:54 > 0:18:56As the spokesman of the House
0:18:56 > 0:19:00of Commons Commission, I am somewhat loth to express
0:19:00 > 0:19:03a Treasury view, the Treasury is better equipped to do that
0:19:03 > 0:19:08than I am.
0:19:08 > 0:19:10However, for the risk profile associated with doing
0:19:10 > 0:19:12these works over, say, a 30-year period as opposed
0:19:12 > 0:19:16to a much shorter period of time, the risk of some catastrophic
0:19:16 > 0:19:21failure is clearly much higher if the ?works take place over 30
0:19:21 > 0:19:23years while we are in situ debating in either Chamber and, indeed,
0:19:24 > 0:19:34our staff are here working.
0:19:38 > 0:19:42Does he agree consideration should be given to turning this place into
0:19:42 > 0:19:50a museum?When this matter has been looked at in the past by a
0:19:50 > 0:19:54commission and the laws are equivalent, there was no desire to
0:19:54 > 0:20:00turn this place into a museum that a desire to ensure this building could
0:20:00 > 0:20:06continue to operate, both for staff and members and visitors, and could
0:20:06 > 0:20:17remain a significant world heritage building.
0:20:23 > 0:20:26Well, the subject came up again later when an MP reminded the Leader
0:20:26 > 0:20:36of the Commons what one of her predecessors had said.
0:20:36 > 0:20:37There was a Joint Committee s report published
0:20:37 > 0:20:40on 8th September 2016, with the guarantee of a vote
0:20:40 > 0:20:41by Christmas last year.
0:20:41 > 0:20:44Now the Leader of the House is saying that we will have a debate
0:20:44 > 0:20:47by the end of this year, but we will not make a decision
0:20:47 > 0:20:50then, we are going to delay it for another 18 months.
0:20:50 > 0:20:51Honestly, this is downright irresponsible.
0:20:51 > 0:20:54Just let the House make a decision, if you understand the concept.
0:20:54 > 0:20:56We have to ensure value for taxpayers money.
0:20:56 > 0:20:58The Joint Committee made a recommendation without being
0:20:58 > 0:21:01in a position to pin down the entire costs of its proposed option.
0:21:01 > 0:21:04It is essential that that work is done, and it will be done
0:21:04 > 0:21:05as quickly as possible.
0:21:05 > 0:21:08Could she write to me to let me know how many
0:21:08 > 0:21:09consultants there have been?
0:21:09 > 0:21:11What are the costs of the people who have been employed
0:21:11 > 0:21:13while the Government have delayed making a decision?
0:21:13 > 0:21:16If we follow one of the options set out in her letter
0:21:16 > 0:21:19with regard to State Opening, will she really be asking
0:21:19 > 0:21:21our Gracious Sovereign to attend a building site?
0:21:21 > 0:21:23Will hard hats be available for all of us?
0:21:23 > 0:21:23Golden ones!
0:21:23 > 0:21:25This is not a blank cheque.
0:21:25 > 0:21:27We must get the best possible value for taxpayers money in restoring
0:21:27 > 0:21:29this Parliament for future generations, and Members
0:21:29 > 0:21:31right across this House should support that.
0:21:31 > 0:21:32Andrea Leadsom.
0:21:32 > 0:21:35Earlier this month, the Commons authorities approved plans
0:21:35 > 0:21:37for a replacement Commons chamber at Westminster, to be
0:21:37 > 0:21:39used if there was a fire or terrorist attack.
0:21:39 > 0:21:43MPs could also move there when restoration work finally began.
0:21:43 > 0:21:45One MP wondered if it might also present a good opportunity
0:21:46 > 0:21:50to introduce electronic voting.
0:21:50 > 0:21:53Before we spend astronomical sums on refurbishing this place,
0:21:53 > 0:21:55the Commission should at the very least build in the capacity
0:21:55 > 0:21:59for electronic voting in the future, should the House at some point
0:21:59 > 0:22:02decide to move itself into the 20th century before the rest
0:22:02 > 0:22:06of the world enters the 22nd?
0:22:06 > 0:22:08Tom Brake is a member of the committee that deals
0:22:08 > 0:22:09with housekeeping matters.
0:22:09 > 0:22:12There may well be an opportunity provided shortly by a contingency
0:22:12 > 0:22:15chamber, in which case it would have course be open to the House
0:22:15 > 0:22:20to decide to implement an electronic voting system if it considered that
0:22:20 > 0:22:26to be appropriate.
0:22:26 > 0:22:28Mr Patrick Grady.
0:22:28 > 0:22:30We do read reports about a contingency chamber.
0:22:30 > 0:22:35Have any assessments been made of the differing costs of installing
0:22:35 > 0:22:37voting lobbies, which I assume would have to include
0:22:37 > 0:22:40little toilets at the end, in which Members could hide
0:22:40 > 0:22:46if they accidentally made their way into the wrong
0:22:46 > 0:22:47lobby, versus simply installing an electronic voting system?
0:22:47 > 0:22:51Would the latter not be a more sensible use of public funds?
0:22:51 > 0:22:53I suspect that we have not yet reached the stage of deciding
0:22:53 > 0:22:57whether the provision of toilets will be needed for a contingency
0:22:57 > 0:22:58chamber, or, indeed, establishing whether any financial
0:22:58 > 0:23:01assessment has been made of the installation
0:23:01 > 0:23:03of electronic voting.
0:23:03 > 0:23:09According to figures produced in past debates, however,
0:23:09 > 0:23:16it appears that the cost might be up to £500,000.
0:23:16 > 0:23:18Hannah Barbell.
0:23:18 > 0:23:20In the Scottish Parliament, where there is a seat for every
0:23:20 > 0:23:24Member and voting takes two seconds rather than 20 minutes,
0:23:24 > 0:23:34electronic voting is very effective.
0:23:34 > 0:23:36Is he aware that in this Chamber
0:23:36 > 0:23:38there were more than 500 votes between 2012 and 2014,
0:23:38 > 0:23:40which took up more than seven days?
0:23:40 > 0:23:42Given what is coming down the line with Brexit,
0:23:42 > 0:23:45does he not think that this is a perfect time to install
0:23:45 > 0:23:47electronic voting in the House of Commons?
0:23:47 > 0:23:49I am aware that electronic voting takes place in
0:23:49 > 0:23:51the Scottish Parliament, and my personal view
0:23:51 > 0:23:56is that it is a more effective way of dealing with votes.
0:23:56 > 0:23:59Members who have not been here as long as I have may ?not
0:23:59 > 0:24:01remember that back in 1997 there was an attempt
0:24:01 > 0:24:04to reform a number of ways in which the House operated.
0:24:04 > 0:24:10I supported it, but it was blocked by the House.
0:24:10 > 0:24:15But is it not the case that there are advantages
0:24:15 > 0:24:18in going into the lobby?
0:24:18 > 0:24:24One can meet colleague and do things?
0:24:24 > 0:24:26If we listen to the SNP all together,
0:24:26 > 0:24:28why do we not go the whole hog?
0:24:28 > 0:24:31Why do we not just sit at home, watch proceedings on the Parliament
0:24:31 > 0:24:35channel, and vote on our iPhones?
0:24:35 > 0:24:42As a Minister in the previous coalition Government
0:24:42 > 0:24:45and now as a Back Bencher, the right honourable
0:24:45 > 0:24:47gentleman will appreciate that one of the advantages for Back Benchers
0:24:47 > 0:24:50of voting in person is that Ministers have no escape
0:24:50 > 0:24:52from Back Benchers who want to collar them to raise local
0:24:52 > 0:24:58and national issues.
0:24:58 > 0:25:00I am sure Ministers love meeting the honourable gentleman
0:25:00 > 0:25:02in the Division Lobby, and that they have good
0:25:02 > 0:25:04conversations although they are probably usually one-way.
0:25:04 > 0:25:07I have nothing to add to what Mr Speaker has said.
0:25:07 > 0:25:08Yes!
0:25:08 > 0:25:09The Speaker John Bercow.
0:25:09 > 0:25:12And finally, there's quite a strict code as to what honourable members
0:25:12 > 0:25:13can and can't say in the Commons.
0:25:13 > 0:25:16One Labour MP let his passion get the better of him
0:25:16 > 0:25:18during the question about the vote on Brexit.
0:25:18 > 0:25:21The nest of vipers behind him and in the Cabinet make him a fudger.
0:25:21 > 0:25:24Stop fudging and be honest with the British people!
0:25:24 > 0:25:26Was a "nest of vipers" unparliamentary language?
0:25:26 > 0:25:29The Speaker thought not, but that didn't stop MPs hissing
0:25:29 > 0:25:31in the manner of reptiles.
0:25:31 > 0:25:35Which apparently isn't unparliamentary at all.
0:25:35 > 0:25:39That's it for now, but do join me on Friday night
0:25:39 > 0:25:41at 11pm, for our round up of the week at Westminster.
0:25:41 > 0:25:50But for now from me, Mandy Baker, goodbye.