0:00:25 > 0:00:26Hello and welcome to the programme.
0:00:26 > 0:00:28Coming up...
0:00:28 > 0:00:29Three social media giants face a grilling.
0:00:29 > 0:00:31We sat in this committee, in a public hearing,
0:00:31 > 0:00:34and raised a clearly vile anti-Semitic tweet with your
0:00:34 > 0:00:41organisation, it was discussed, and it is still there.
0:00:41 > 0:00:43'Ello, 'ello, 'ello, what's all this then?
0:00:43 > 0:00:46As someone who was Police Minister when we had 21,000 more
0:00:46 > 0:00:48police officers than now, the minister needs to go back
0:00:48 > 0:00:50to the drawing board.
0:00:50 > 0:00:51Hear, hear.
0:00:51 > 0:00:52And the Lords talk about...
0:00:52 > 0:00:54..the Lords.
0:00:54 > 0:00:56To put it mildly, my Lords, we are not loved.
0:00:56 > 0:00:58But first, Twitter has been strongly criticised for repeatedly failing
0:00:58 > 0:01:00to remove abusive tweets.
0:01:00 > 0:01:03The company was appearing before the Home Affairs Committee,
0:01:03 > 0:01:06alongside Facebook and Google.
0:01:06 > 0:01:08The MPs they faced were clearly angry and frustrated
0:01:08 > 0:01:11at what they saw as the failure of social media giants
0:01:11 > 0:01:16to deal with offensive and inflammatory content.
0:01:16 > 0:01:17The statistics are quite amazing.
0:01:17 > 0:01:19Half the world's population use these sites every day.
0:01:19 > 0:01:22It's thought that 400 hours of video are uploaded to YouTube every minute
0:01:22 > 0:01:30and every minute 6,000 tweets are sent.
0:01:30 > 0:01:32The committee chair began by asking about abuse sent
0:01:32 > 0:01:37to the Shadow Home Secretary, Diane Abbott.
0:01:37 > 0:01:40If I sat and did a search on Twitter with Diane,
0:01:40 > 0:01:43are you telling me I would not find a huge series of Twitter abuse
0:01:43 > 0:01:47at Diane because you have got these systems in place?
0:01:47 > 0:01:48No.
0:01:48 > 0:01:51Right now I can't say what you would find at this minute.
0:01:51 > 0:01:52It is like anything.
0:01:52 > 0:01:55If you are cleaning a street, you can clean a street every
0:01:55 > 0:01:57morning, you can't guarantee it is still going
0:01:57 > 0:02:00to be clean at 10am.
0:02:00 > 0:02:02Would I only find abuse, say, for the last 48 hours
0:02:02 > 0:02:03and nothing before that?
0:02:03 > 0:02:04No, I can't guarantee that.
0:02:04 > 0:02:07Yvette Cooper quoted some graphic anti-Semitic abuse posted in October
0:02:07 > 0:02:09last year which had been raised with another Twitter
0:02:09 > 0:02:12executive by the Committee.
0:02:12 > 0:02:14That tweet is still up on your platform.
0:02:14 > 0:02:15Why is it?
0:02:15 > 0:02:19I don't know the answer to that question.
0:02:19 > 0:02:22I'm kind of wondering what it is we have to do.
0:02:22 > 0:02:24So we sat in this committee, in a public hearing,
0:02:24 > 0:02:26and raised a clearly vile anti-Semitic tweet
0:02:26 > 0:02:30with your organisation.
0:02:30 > 0:02:33It was discussed, and it is still there.
0:02:33 > 0:02:37And everybody accepted, you have accepted, your predecessor accepted,
0:02:37 > 0:02:39that it was unacceptable, but it is still there
0:02:39 > 0:02:41on the platform.
0:02:41 > 0:02:45What is it that we have to do to get you to take it down?
0:02:45 > 0:02:49I think that all of these discussions, I have already laid out
0:02:49 > 0:02:54the number of measures that we have taken, fuelled by conversations
0:02:54 > 0:03:01around this table and in many other countries across Europe.
0:03:01 > 0:03:03We are constantly looking at these policies, looking
0:03:03 > 0:03:06at these processes.
0:03:06 > 0:03:09I will take that tweet away and I will come back
0:03:09 > 0:03:12to you with a definitive answer as to why it is still there.
0:03:12 > 0:03:15Part of the problem is it's like if, even when we raise it
0:03:15 > 0:03:18in a forum like this, nothing happens, it is very hard
0:03:18 > 0:03:22for us to believe that enough is being done when everybody else
0:03:22 > 0:03:25across the country raises concerns.
0:03:25 > 0:03:27There is another one that James also raised,
0:03:27 > 0:03:33from the 15th of November 2014, attacking Luciana Berger
0:03:33 > 0:03:36with the same phrase and that was the second time that
0:03:36 > 0:03:38one had been raised because it was also raised
0:03:38 > 0:03:40by the committee previously as well.
0:03:40 > 0:03:43And it is also still up on your platform.
0:03:43 > 0:03:45Again...
0:03:45 > 0:03:48I don't know how many times I have to ask you to come and put
0:03:49 > 0:03:50the same things to you.
0:03:50 > 0:03:53My reading of our policies, my reading of policies as we have
0:03:53 > 0:03:56changed them is that that tweet would be in violation
0:03:56 > 0:03:59of our policies so I will come back to you with an answer as to why
0:03:59 > 0:04:01it is still on the platform.
0:04:01 > 0:04:03The Committee also wanted to know about the recommendations made
0:04:03 > 0:04:09by the websites pointing people towards similar material.
0:04:09 > 0:04:11You are linking people once they go on one slightly dodgy thing,
0:04:11 > 0:04:16you are linking them to an awful lot of other similar things,
0:04:16 > 0:04:18whether that be racist extremism, Islamist extremism, your technology
0:04:18 > 0:04:23is doing that job and you are not stopping it from doing so.
0:04:23 > 0:04:26I am happy to take that, given what others have said.
0:04:26 > 0:04:30I disagree that that's what the technology
0:04:30 > 0:04:33is doing but I do recognise we have a problem, which is a shared
0:04:33 > 0:04:40problem with the police, yourselves, civil society organisations.
0:04:40 > 0:04:43How do we address that person who may be going down a channel
0:04:43 > 0:04:45which can lead to them being radicalised either
0:04:45 > 0:04:50on the left or right, and ultimately become extremists?
0:04:50 > 0:04:53That is one of the reasons we have established our online civil courage
0:04:53 > 0:04:55initiative in the UK to really understand that phenomenon
0:04:55 > 0:04:59and to see what we should be doing, using our technology and our people
0:04:59 > 0:05:01and our expertise, but also how we can support other organisations
0:05:02 > 0:05:03as they use our platforms.
0:05:03 > 0:05:06A Conservative MP quoted from Twitter posts under
0:05:06 > 0:05:09the hastag "kill a Tory".
0:05:09 > 0:05:11"Just think of the benefits of each family in the UK
0:05:11 > 0:05:14were to kill just one Tory."
0:05:14 > 0:05:18That is on Twitter.
0:05:18 > 0:05:21Your code says you will not tolerate violent threats,
0:05:21 > 0:05:24wishes for the physical harm, death or disease of
0:05:24 > 0:05:26individuals or groups.
0:05:26 > 0:05:31How does that comply with your code?
0:05:31 > 0:05:33Simple hashtag, simple search, simple takedown, or even better
0:05:33 > 0:05:41simply don't allow them there in the first place.
0:05:41 > 0:05:43I think there are a couple of elements to this.
0:05:43 > 0:05:46At its most practical level, we have 500 million tweets per day
0:05:46 > 0:05:48and 330 million users.
0:05:48 > 0:05:52Twitter is used in multiple, multiple languages.
0:05:52 > 0:05:55So we can sit here in London and talk about one hashtag relating
0:05:55 > 0:06:00to one political party, but if you are to proactively have
0:06:00 > 0:06:03technology that is proactively searching for the kind of words that
0:06:03 > 0:06:05you're talking about across all political parties
0:06:05 > 0:06:08in the world in all languages, that is a much more
0:06:08 > 0:06:11significant task.
0:06:11 > 0:06:14Tim Loughton then turned his attention to Facebook.
0:06:14 > 0:06:16You are now providing technology, very advanced technology,
0:06:16 > 0:06:19so when I walk into a shop, it will scan my face and then
0:06:19 > 0:06:23analyse what buying mood I am in and pass that information
0:06:23 > 0:06:27to the very helpful sales assistant to make sure I go
0:06:27 > 0:06:29and buy various things.
0:06:29 > 0:06:34That is quite advanced technology and yet you can't even collectively
0:06:34 > 0:06:38come up with technology for these now 10,000 reviewers who are not
0:06:38 > 0:06:41going to do anything proactive to stop the sort of blatant,
0:06:41 > 0:06:44clear abusive stuff which we have all quoted.
0:06:44 > 0:06:48Just to be clear, our reviewers, the 10,000 refers to YouTube,
0:06:48 > 0:06:54so our reviewers are involved in some proactive work.
0:06:54 > 0:06:57As we have explained extensively, I believe, there are certain types
0:06:57 > 0:06:58of content we focus on initially.
0:06:58 > 0:07:01The most extreme child abuse imagery is something which has been
0:07:01 > 0:07:04addressed for many years in a proactive way.
0:07:04 > 0:07:08We have all talked about terrorism and extremism.
0:07:08 > 0:07:10Some of the other areas you're talking about are more difficult.
0:07:10 > 0:07:14It doesn't mean we are going to stop - of course we are going
0:07:14 > 0:07:17to try to do more work on our own initiative but I think
0:07:17 > 0:07:19when it comes to political speech this is much more difficult
0:07:19 > 0:07:22and you as politicians I'm sure would also be concerned
0:07:22 > 0:07:25about the prospect of us restricting political speech in an automated way
0:07:25 > 0:07:26without anybody ever seeing it.
0:07:26 > 0:07:30That is a big step to take.
0:07:30 > 0:07:32A Labour MP didn't think Twitter could cope with
0:07:32 > 0:07:33the situation it faced.
0:07:33 > 0:07:36How many staff in Twitter are dealing with these issues?
0:07:36 > 0:07:41How many?
0:07:41 > 0:07:45I have already said that in terms of the figures that you have heard
0:07:45 > 0:07:48from the other companies that our whole population is 3,500.
0:07:48 > 0:07:51No figure I'm going to give you is going to sound like it's enough.
0:07:51 > 0:07:53What were your revenues in the last quarter?
0:07:53 > 0:07:55Pardon?
0:07:55 > 0:07:57What were your global revenues in the last quarter?
0:07:57 > 0:08:01I don't have that figure off the top of my head but I can tell you...
0:08:01 > 0:08:03It was 574 million in the last quarter and you say
0:08:03 > 0:08:08you only have 3,500 staff.
0:08:08 > 0:08:11Do you not think that you ought to be spending just a little bit
0:08:11 > 0:08:14more money on proactively searching for some of this content?
0:08:14 > 0:08:17I can tell you that there is a significant percentage of staff,
0:08:17 > 0:08:23not just the agents who review content, but the people who devise
0:08:23 > 0:08:28and implement our policies, and huge swathes currently
0:08:28 > 0:08:31of our product and engineering teams working on safety issues right now,
0:08:31 > 0:08:34and off other projects, they are working on safety issues.
0:08:35 > 0:08:38Sinead McSweeney of Twitter.
0:08:38 > 0:08:42A potential £450 million in extra funding for police in England
0:08:42 > 0:08:45and Wales in the next financial year has been announced
0:08:45 > 0:08:52by the Home Office.
0:08:52 > 0:08:55Police and Crime Commissioners are to be given the power to raise
0:08:55 > 0:08:57the portion of council tax which goes towards policing,
0:08:57 > 0:08:58by £12 per household annually.
0:08:58 > 0:09:00That would raise £270 million, while more than £100 million
0:09:00 > 0:09:02for national priorities, such as firearms, would come
0:09:02 > 0:09:06from central government.
0:09:06 > 0:09:11It is clear that there is a shifting pattern of demand on the police.
0:09:11 > 0:09:15There are more victims of high harm so-called hidden crimes
0:09:15 > 0:09:19such as domestic abuse, modern slavery, child
0:09:19 > 0:09:22sexual exploitation, as well as more victims of cyber
0:09:22 > 0:09:25crime coming forward.
0:09:25 > 0:09:29The willingness to come forward is to be welcomed but it does put
0:09:29 > 0:09:33pressure on policing, which we have to be sensitive to.
0:09:33 > 0:09:37Alongside this, Mr Speaker, terrorist attacks in London
0:09:37 > 0:09:41and Manchester have served as a reminder of the very real
0:09:41 > 0:09:47and changing threats that we face from terrorism.
0:09:47 > 0:09:51The public is increasingly conscious that austerity is as damaging
0:09:51 > 0:09:55to policing as it is to other public services because you cannot keep
0:09:55 > 0:10:01people safe on the cheap.
0:10:01 > 0:10:04A 35% increase in crime according to my Chief Constable,
0:10:04 > 0:10:08an 18% reduction in staff and £30 million worth
0:10:08 > 0:10:10of savings already met.
0:10:10 > 0:10:12This settlement is simply not good enough and from someone
0:10:12 > 0:10:15who was Police Minister when we had 21,000 more police officers
0:10:15 > 0:10:18than now, the minister needs to go back to the drawing board.
0:10:18 > 0:10:19Hear, hear.
0:10:19 > 0:10:23I suggest the former Police Minister goes and talks to his his PCC
0:10:23 > 0:10:26because they will explain why actually a flat cash grant
0:10:26 > 0:10:31from the centre is an improvement on what he or she was expecting.
0:10:31 > 0:10:33One former Police and Crime Commissioner said he wouldn't have
0:10:33 > 0:10:36been able to maintain the level of policing on this budget.
0:10:36 > 0:10:42The reality is, with inflationary pressures in general terms,
0:10:42 > 0:10:46with the need to fund a police pay rise, a legitimate police pay rise,
0:10:46 > 0:10:49with, on top of that, the increasing demand for policing
0:10:49 > 0:10:52services, it simply isn't possible to maintain public safety,
0:10:52 > 0:10:55and the minister really has got to stand up and tell
0:10:55 > 0:10:56the public the truth.
0:10:56 > 0:11:00This is not a fair settlement.
0:11:00 > 0:11:04Again, I hesitate to correct someone who knows what he's talking
0:11:04 > 0:11:08about but what I would refer to, he is talking as if this
0:11:08 > 0:11:13is something that is a settlement proposed in complete isolation.
0:11:13 > 0:11:16What he and the front bench are ignoring is that we work closely
0:11:16 > 0:11:22with police chiefs and the PCCs and their independent review
0:11:22 > 0:11:27that the PCCs and chiefs did independently of government,
0:11:27 > 0:11:29came to a very similar conclusion.
0:11:29 > 0:11:31What hasn't changed is the need for front-line policing.
0:11:31 > 0:11:34What can my honourable friend be doing to make sure that more
0:11:34 > 0:11:37of the money that he has talked about today gets to the front line
0:11:37 > 0:11:40to increase the sort front-line policing that constituents so badly
0:11:40 > 0:11:41want to see?
0:11:41 > 0:11:44The short answer to that question is, it is the local Police
0:11:44 > 0:11:45and Crime Commissioner who is accountable for how
0:11:45 > 0:11:47resources are allocated.
0:11:47 > 0:11:50If it is the local view that more resources need to go into front-line
0:11:50 > 0:11:52police officers then that is something that the Police
0:11:52 > 0:11:54and Crime Commissioner has to respond to.
0:11:54 > 0:11:58The Home Office Minister.
0:11:58 > 0:12:00Well, just before the police funding statement, another Secretary
0:12:00 > 0:12:02of State had news about council tax.
0:12:02 > 0:12:04The Communities Secretary revealed that councils in England would be
0:12:04 > 0:12:08allowed to increase council tax by an additional 1% from next year.
0:12:08 > 0:12:11At the moment councils must get the approval
0:12:11 > 0:12:13of residents in a referendum if they want to raise council
0:12:13 > 0:12:16tax by more than 2%.
0:12:16 > 0:12:19Ten councils would also be allowed to retain 100% of the business rate
0:12:19 > 0:12:23raised in their areas.
0:12:23 > 0:12:26While we all want to ease growing pressure on local
0:12:26 > 0:12:28government services, I'm sure none of us want to see
0:12:28 > 0:12:31hard-working taxpayers saddled with ever higher bills,
0:12:31 > 0:12:35so this settlement needs to strike a balance between those two aims -
0:12:35 > 0:12:39giving councils the ability to increase their core council tax
0:12:39 > 0:12:44requirement by an additional 1% without a local referendum,
0:12:44 > 0:12:47bringing the core principle in line with inflation.
0:12:47 > 0:12:51While today's announcement offers some additional support,
0:12:51 > 0:12:54it pays merely lip service to many of the problems
0:12:54 > 0:12:57facing our local councils.
0:12:57 > 0:13:01Mr Speaker, this Secretary of State has today presented himself
0:13:01 > 0:13:04as Santa, but the details of this announcement really shows
0:13:04 > 0:13:08him to be the Grinch.
0:13:08 > 0:13:10Will the Secretary of State confirm the figures given to me
0:13:10 > 0:13:13by the Local Government Association that, even if that flexibility
0:13:13 > 0:13:18is fully used, it will raise just £250 million next year?
0:13:18 > 0:13:20That compares with the LGA's estimate of the shortfall in funding
0:13:20 > 0:13:26for social care of over £2 billion, even after the measures previously
0:13:26 > 0:13:29announced by the Government are taken into account.
0:13:29 > 0:13:30Northamptonshire County Council might be the local highways
0:13:30 > 0:13:33authority, but I have to tell the Secretary of State
0:13:33 > 0:13:34it's run out of road.
0:13:34 > 0:13:39It will set a legal budget for 2018-19, but it's making it
0:13:39 > 0:13:42clear that it won't be able to finance its statutory functions
0:13:42 > 0:13:46in 19-20 unless something changes.
0:13:46 > 0:13:50Sajid Javid said his decision would allow councils to raise
0:13:50 > 0:13:52a further £1 billion.
0:13:52 > 0:13:55You are watching Tuesday In Parliament with me, Mandy Baker.
0:13:55 > 0:14:02The Government's been accused of stringing the steel industry
0:14:02 > 0:14:06along with warm words and no action.
0:14:06 > 0:14:10Ministers have asked various sectors to come up with ideas on how
0:14:10 > 0:14:13to work with government to boost productivity.
0:14:13 > 0:14:16The steel industry submitted its plan in September,
0:14:16 > 0:14:20suggesting state investment in research and measures
0:14:20 > 0:14:22to reduce energy costs.
0:14:22 > 0:14:24MPs were debating the future of the steel industry
0:14:24 > 0:14:26in Westminster Hall.
0:14:26 > 0:14:30Steel is too important a product for our economy and our security,
0:14:30 > 0:14:33for our communities and standing as a nation, for us to have
0:14:33 > 0:14:36to rely on others for it.
0:14:36 > 0:14:39He said that, after submitting a so-called sector deal,
0:14:39 > 0:14:42the steel industry didn't meet a minister until November.
0:14:42 > 0:14:45The sad reality is the trust between the Government and the steel
0:14:45 > 0:14:49industry has been shot to pieces.
0:14:49 > 0:14:51Warm words are no good to anyone if they are matched
0:14:52 > 0:14:54only by frozen actions.
0:14:54 > 0:14:55An industrial strategy...
0:14:55 > 0:14:57I will give way.
0:14:57 > 0:14:59I must correct him on a factual point.
0:14:59 > 0:15:02One of my very first acts as the Minister was to go and visit
0:15:02 > 0:15:05the steelworks in his constituency and close by.
0:15:05 > 0:15:09I have met with the council formally to announce the shape of the sector
0:15:09 > 0:15:11deal and subsequently after the presentation
0:15:11 > 0:15:15of the sector deal three times, plus I have met with and spoken
0:15:15 > 0:15:17to the companies on numerous occasions, so he must
0:15:17 > 0:15:18correct the record.
0:15:18 > 0:15:22That is simply not true to say that I have only engaged with them
0:15:22 > 0:15:24after the sector deal was submitted.
0:15:24 > 0:15:26I thank the Minister for giving way.
0:15:26 > 0:15:30I think conversations and visits and meetings are excellent,
0:15:30 > 0:15:34but the fact remains that the sector deal was submitted on the 7th
0:15:34 > 0:15:38of September and that no meeting was granted with the steel industry
0:15:38 > 0:15:42until the very end of November and, as the clock is ticking,
0:15:42 > 0:15:46the decisions about investment next year are drying up.
0:15:46 > 0:15:49He said steel workers knew how to take bad news on the chin.
0:15:49 > 0:15:54Steel communities are a hardy bunch, forged in the white heat
0:15:54 > 0:15:57of our industry, and from parts of the country that are well
0:15:57 > 0:16:01used to being forgotten, neglected and ignored by successive
0:16:01 > 0:16:02Tory governments.
0:16:02 > 0:16:05So they know how to take bad news on the chin.
0:16:05 > 0:16:08And they certainly prefer to be treated like adults,
0:16:08 > 0:16:12with honesty and clarity, as opposed to the obfuscation that
0:16:12 > 0:16:16has become the hallmark of this government.
0:16:16 > 0:16:20I would therefore urge the Minister today to stop taking us for a ride.
0:16:20 > 0:16:23All the indications are that the Government really
0:16:23 > 0:16:27could not care less about the future of the British steel industry.
0:16:27 > 0:16:30The constituency of one Conservative MP was affected by the closure
0:16:30 > 0:16:34of the SSI Redcar steelworks two years ago.
0:16:34 > 0:16:36We all know the consequences which were felt in Redcar
0:16:36 > 0:16:38and which obviously also had massive impacts in Middlesbrough South
0:16:38 > 0:16:40and East Cleveland, but there is real, constructive
0:16:40 > 0:16:45action, money and hope now flowing into our area.
0:16:45 > 0:16:47I think it's really important we get that part
0:16:47 > 0:16:49of the equation on record as well.
0:16:49 > 0:16:51He thought the cost of energy was a pressing issue.
0:16:51 > 0:16:54The simple fact is it is difficult for the industry to compete
0:16:54 > 0:16:58when its energy costs are 55% higher than Germany and 51% higher
0:16:58 > 0:17:02than France, so we are looking for bridging solutions,
0:17:02 > 0:17:06lower costs in the short to medium term while we wait for longer term
0:17:06 > 0:17:08solutions to take effect.
0:17:08 > 0:17:11A Labour MP said the steel workers had turned round their industry
0:17:11 > 0:17:14the last two years.
0:17:14 > 0:17:16It is now time for government to act with the industry
0:17:16 > 0:17:20to help create a strong, innovative business that is needed
0:17:20 > 0:17:24to help build Britain's future, as it moves into a world
0:17:24 > 0:17:26outside the EU.
0:17:26 > 0:17:29The sector steel deal bid from the industry shows
0:17:29 > 0:17:32the necessary commitment to deliver for the future.
0:17:32 > 0:17:34The Government has welcomed this.
0:17:34 > 0:17:38Both sides must now forge a future together.
0:17:38 > 0:17:45All I want for Christmas, Sir Henry, is a sector steel deal.
0:17:45 > 0:17:48The Minister said the Government was committed to solving
0:17:48 > 0:17:50the industry's challengers.
0:17:50 > 0:17:54And I have every intention and every expectation that we will bring
0:17:54 > 0:17:56forward an attractive sector deal - and, indeed, we have
0:17:56 > 0:17:59held many meetings - when the deal is in a good enough
0:17:59 > 0:18:02place, where we have commitments on both sides to actually
0:18:02 > 0:18:03drive the transformation.
0:18:03 > 0:18:06These deals are not, "Give us some money".
0:18:06 > 0:18:09These deals are, "What can we do together, government and industry
0:18:09 > 0:18:13and unions and apprenticeships and education institutions,
0:18:13 > 0:18:16and our brilliant academic institutions, to really create
0:18:16 > 0:18:18the industry of the future?"
0:18:18 > 0:18:21If I may have one Christmas wish, Sir Henry, it would be
0:18:21 > 0:18:24that we have an end to the outdated party politics around
0:18:24 > 0:18:29what is such a vital foundation industry for the UK,
0:18:29 > 0:18:32we build a cross-party partnership, we work with the industry,
0:18:32 > 0:18:36who are in a transformational place, to protect and grow these vital
0:18:36 > 0:18:39industries, not for the next 12 months or two years
0:18:39 > 0:18:42but for the generations to come.
0:18:42 > 0:18:44Claire Perry.
0:18:44 > 0:18:47Now, peers had to set their alarm clocks a little bit earlier
0:18:47 > 0:18:49than usual on Tuesday, because the main debate
0:18:49 > 0:18:53was scheduled to begin at the ungodly hour of 11am,
0:18:53 > 0:18:57a full three-and-a-half hours before their usual start time.
0:18:57 > 0:18:58Why?
0:18:58 > 0:19:01Well, one of their favourite subjects was up for discussion.
0:19:01 > 0:19:03Yes, themselves.
0:19:03 > 0:19:06Nearly 100 ennobled names were on the list of speakers.
0:19:06 > 0:19:11Fixed terms are the only solution which is going to provide a steady
0:19:11 > 0:19:14stream of vacancies in a way which is fair to all groups.
0:19:14 > 0:19:17Therefore, a key pillar of our recommendations is that
0:19:17 > 0:19:20all new members should serve a single, nonrenewable
0:19:20 > 0:19:23fixed term of 15 years.
0:19:23 > 0:19:26They would be offered a peerage on that basis and they would make
0:19:26 > 0:19:30an undertaking to retire after 15 years when joining the House.
0:19:30 > 0:19:35House of Lords reform is a complex, difficult and constitutionally
0:19:35 > 0:19:39significant area, into which anyone must be advised to tread
0:19:39 > 0:19:42with caution, having learned the lessons of history
0:19:42 > 0:19:46and unintended consequences.
0:19:46 > 0:19:49I believe that this is our best shot at reform for a generation,
0:19:49 > 0:19:53and we need to grasp this opportunity, despite it not
0:19:53 > 0:19:57being everyone's perfect vision.
0:19:57 > 0:20:01Until we do that, as Lord Burns has said, the Prime Minister,
0:20:01 > 0:20:04Number Ten, the Government, the leadership of the political
0:20:04 > 0:20:09parties in the country will not hear their prompt to step
0:20:09 > 0:20:13onto the stage with us and be part of our reform future.
0:20:13 > 0:20:17We should be proud of the detailed scrutiny we do in this House,
0:20:17 > 0:20:22yet that is often not as the public and the media see us.
0:20:22 > 0:20:26To put it mildly, my lords, we are not loved.
0:20:26 > 0:20:30They produced an elegant set of proposals which fulfil their remit,
0:20:30 > 0:20:35and have done so by proposing a very British way forward -
0:20:35 > 0:20:40constitutional form by informal agreement.
0:20:40 > 0:20:43They deserve our thanks.
0:20:43 > 0:20:46Weight Watchers has shown that the best way to tackle
0:20:46 > 0:20:50a problem of excess is to combine personal responsibility
0:20:50 > 0:20:53with collective resolve and mutual support.
0:20:53 > 0:20:59The alternative of drastic surgery involves unnecessary risk,
0:20:59 > 0:21:04no guarantee of success and an unpredictable outcome.
0:21:04 > 0:21:10I confess that I would like to see a cap on this house of about 400.
0:21:10 > 0:21:15I shall be content to go, my lords, when the time comes,
0:21:15 > 0:21:17but I shan't go alone.
0:21:17 > 0:21:20I intend to take others with me.
0:21:20 > 0:21:28And neither shall I go to make way for another tranche of prime
0:21:28 > 0:21:32ministerial appointments for services rendered to Number Ten
0:21:32 > 0:21:36or payments to party funds.
0:21:36 > 0:21:40I see no reason why we couldn't have an automatic clear-out
0:21:40 > 0:21:43at the end of every parliament of every member who is
0:21:43 > 0:21:45over 80 years of age.
0:21:45 > 0:21:47I see no difficulty about doing that.
0:21:47 > 0:21:50The House of Commons has a clear-out at a general election.
0:21:50 > 0:21:53Why shouldn't this House have a clear-out?
0:21:53 > 0:21:54While consensus dominated the House, not everyone
0:21:54 > 0:21:57supported the proposals.
0:21:57 > 0:22:01I fear, my lords, this is yet another piecemeal effort to tackle
0:22:01 > 0:22:05the fundamental issue of Lords reform as, following
0:22:05 > 0:22:09strictly their remit, they have reported on the size
0:22:09 > 0:22:13of the House, while ignoring its functions as a legislative
0:22:13 > 0:22:23assembly for the whole of the United Kingdom,
0:22:25 > 0:22:27and the points made by Lord Hope.
0:22:27 > 0:22:29The House is, of course, much too large, with 798 peers.
0:22:29 > 0:22:30How did this come about?
0:22:30 > 0:22:33It is substantially through the political incontinence
0:22:33 > 0:22:40of prime ministers Blair and Cameron in their exercise of patronage.
0:22:40 > 0:22:45I disagree that the problem is overcrowding in this House.
0:22:45 > 0:22:49At some key moment, particularly at question time,
0:22:49 > 0:22:51it feels overcrowded, but that has been true for most
0:22:51 > 0:22:53of the last 40 years.
0:22:53 > 0:22:57Our daily attendance is about 480.
0:22:57 > 0:23:01There have only been three divisions in the entire history of the Lords
0:23:01 > 0:23:05where over 600 members have voted.
0:23:05 > 0:23:08Lord Strathclyde.
0:23:08 > 0:23:11The Health Secretary, Jeremy Hunt, has admitted there is a very big
0:23:11 > 0:23:14problem with the number of GPs in England.
0:23:14 > 0:23:19The NHS has lost 1,300 full-time GP equivalents in the last two
0:23:19 > 0:23:22years and 200 GP partners during the same period.
0:23:22 > 0:23:26Given that 20% of the GP workforce is aged over 60,
0:23:26 > 0:23:30it is clear there is a retirement time bomb looming.
0:23:30 > 0:23:33What steps does the Secretary of State intend to take to address
0:23:33 > 0:23:36the growing workforce crisis in general practice,
0:23:36 > 0:23:39because his efforts so far have failed and patients are waiting
0:23:39 > 0:23:43longer than ever for a surgery appointment?
0:23:43 > 0:23:47Well, I would respectfully say I think the figures that she's
0:23:47 > 0:23:50pointed out don't actually take account of locum doctors,
0:23:50 > 0:23:53but there is nonetheless a very big problem and she is right to draw
0:23:53 > 0:23:55that the attention of the House.
0:23:55 > 0:23:58I think there are two things.
0:23:58 > 0:24:00First, we need to encourage more medical school graduates to go
0:24:00 > 0:24:03into general practice as a specialty, and our objective
0:24:03 > 0:24:07is that half of all medical school graduates should choose general
0:24:07 > 0:24:11practice as their specialty, and we are making good progress on that.
0:24:11 > 0:24:15But retention is also extremely important,
0:24:15 > 0:24:18and that's why we are putting in place a number of programmes that
0:24:18 > 0:24:23will make it easier for GPs who want to work a limited period
0:24:23 > 0:24:26of time to work flexibly, and make it easier for people
0:24:26 > 0:24:29who have family responsibilities to potentially work from home,
0:24:29 > 0:24:32and those programmes, we hope, will make a difference.
0:24:32 > 0:24:34Our research today has revealed there are vacancies for 100,000
0:24:34 > 0:24:36staff across the NHS.
0:24:36 > 0:24:40There is a national crisis in workforce.
0:24:40 > 0:24:43Not my words, but the words of the Royal Surrey Hospital trust
0:24:43 > 0:24:46in his own constituency.
0:24:46 > 0:24:49So, with bed occupancy at Royal Surrey hitting a peak
0:24:49 > 0:24:54of 98.7% this winter already, and across the NHS bed occupancy
0:24:54 > 0:24:59already at an average of 94.5%, can he tell us how he expects
0:24:59 > 0:25:02the NHS to cope this winter, when it's understaffed,
0:25:02 > 0:25:05overstretched and underfunded?
0:25:05 > 0:25:08Mr Speaker, if you decide you want more nurses,
0:25:08 > 0:25:11following Mid Staffs, that creates vacancies.
0:25:11 > 0:25:13If you want to transform mental health provision,
0:25:13 > 0:25:15that creates vacancies.
0:25:15 > 0:25:19That's why we announced a workforce plan, which I notice the Government
0:25:19 > 0:25:22in Wales hasn't had time to do yet, but I would like to finish
0:25:22 > 0:25:25by wishing you a Merry Christmas and, if he wants to take a bit
0:25:25 > 0:25:28longer off and stay away for January, we are
0:25:28 > 0:25:32happy to hold the fort.
0:25:32 > 0:25:33A lovely festive spirit there.
0:25:33 > 0:25:36And that's it from me for now, but do join me at the same time
0:25:36 > 0:25:39tomorrow for another round-up of the day here at Westminster,
0:25:39 > 0:25:41including highlights from the final Prime Minister's Questions
0:25:41 > 0:25:42of the year.
0:25:42 > 0:25:46But for now, from me, Mandy Baker, goodbye.