20/05/2016

:00:12. > :00:14.I'm Joanna Gosling, welcome to the programme.

:00:15. > :00:17.More than 24 hours after it disappeared from radar

:00:18. > :00:18.over the Mediterranean, there's still no sign

:00:19. > :00:22.As the international rescue effort is stepped up, we'll

:00:23. > :00:27.have the latest on efforts to find out what happened.

:00:28. > :00:30.Handshake across the years - the moment two elderly men,

:00:31. > :00:36.former child refugees in Europe, meet a new generation in peril.

:00:37. > :00:43.If you can tell the people of the English government that, imagine if

:00:44. > :00:49.these were your kids? Everyone has some form of trouble, we were forced

:00:50. > :00:53.out. Think of your children, if they were in our position, how would you

:00:54. > :00:57.feel? I'm more determined than ever, and you should be more determined

:00:58. > :00:59.than ever, to do our best to help you.

:01:00. > :01:01.And forced to travel hundreds of miles for care.

:01:02. > :01:04.We'll be asking why some mental health trusts are failing to treat

:01:05. > :01:25.Welcome to the programme. We are live until 11am.

:01:26. > :01:27.Also Olympic gold medalists Tessa Sanderson on adoption

:01:28. > :01:30.She's now 60, and her twins are only toddlers.

:01:31. > :01:33.We'll be talking to her later and we'd love to hear

:01:34. > :01:35.from you if you've adopted or fostered children later in life.

:01:36. > :01:39.Do get in touch on all the stories we're talking about this morning -

:01:40. > :01:42.use the hashtag Victoria Live and if you text, you will be charged

:01:43. > :01:55.The international search for a missing EgyptAir plane is

:01:56. > :01:56.intensifying, more than 24 hours after it disappeared from radar over

:01:57. > :02:05.the Mediterranean. There had been reports that wreckage

:02:06. > :02:08.had been found but the Greek authorities now say they don't

:02:09. > :02:10.think its anything 66 people were on board Flight MS804

:02:11. > :02:14.from Paris to Cairo. Trawling the Mediterranean

:02:15. > :02:16.for clues. An international search of the area

:02:17. > :02:18.where the aeroplane is believed There was one British man on board,

:02:19. > :02:24.40-year-old Richard Osman from Camarthen, a father

:02:25. > :02:26.of a two-year-old daughter and a new baby girl less

:02:27. > :02:28.than a month old. Richard was a very kind person,

:02:29. > :02:30.loving person, very focused. He never deviated

:02:31. > :02:33.from the straight path. A very admirable person and I think

:02:34. > :02:48.a lot of people admired him The Airbus A320 had

:02:49. > :02:54.left Paris for Cairo. Its red tail speeding

:02:55. > :02:58.across the Mediterranean and then It's believed this was more

:02:59. > :03:04.likely to be a terror attack than an accident,

:03:05. > :03:07.leading to concerns for the security After last year's Paris attacks,

:03:08. > :03:12.70 employees at the airport had their security

:03:13. > :03:17.clearance taken off them. A lawyer representing ten of them,

:03:18. > :03:20.all Muslims, said his clients have been treated unfairly but accept

:03:21. > :03:47.there's a problem. And key to the mystery may not

:03:48. > :03:52.lie in Paris. On Wednesday, the same plane had

:03:53. > :03:54.flown from Eritrea to Egypt, then on to Tunisia

:03:55. > :03:56.and then back to Cairo. And from there to Paris on Wednesday

:03:57. > :03:59.afternoon before taking From the airport in France,

:04:00. > :04:07.many of those who had said goodbye to their loved ones have now flown

:04:08. > :04:10.to Cairo to join relatives and investigators gathered

:04:11. > :04:12.there as they all search for answers With us now is Jonathan Blake,

:04:13. > :04:33.who joins us from Paris 24 hours on, are we any further on

:04:34. > :04:42.in our understanding of what happened to the plane? In short, no.

:04:43. > :04:47.There has been very little, if any, information overnight. It shed any

:04:48. > :04:50.light on what happened to flight MS804, the French Foreign Minister

:04:51. > :04:55.has spoken this morning, saying they are still keeping an open mind and

:04:56. > :04:58.not pursuing one particular Ave. Suspicions are that it is some sort

:04:59. > :05:03.of terror attack but that has not been confirmed in any way, French

:05:04. > :05:07.authorities are doing what they can to assist Egypt who are leading the

:05:08. > :05:11.investigation into what happened to the flight. Three members of the

:05:12. > :05:15.investigation bureau have gone to Cairo to help, as well as a

:05:16. > :05:19.technical advisor from Airbus, the maker of the plane involved. In

:05:20. > :05:23.Paris, the focus is F Port Security and what may have happened at

:05:24. > :05:28.Charles de Gaulle airport when the plane took off late on Wednesday

:05:29. > :05:34.night -- airport security. With 66 people on board. There have been

:05:35. > :05:39.concerns in recent months about the number of people with access to

:05:40. > :05:43.their aeroplanes, some have had their security clearances revoked,

:05:44. > :05:47.that will be in the minds of what happened today is investigating what

:05:48. > :05:50.happened in Paris. At a device was smuggled on board the flight but 24

:05:51. > :05:55.hours on, and more from the first reports of the plane going missing,

:05:56. > :05:59.there is no information to suggest it was a terror attack, we are no

:06:00. > :06:02.clearer, neither are the families of the 15 French people on board of the

:06:03. > :06:04.flight here in France, to knowing what happened on flight MS804. Thank

:06:05. > :06:07.you. To the BBC Newsroom

:06:08. > :06:09.now for a summary of Figures due out later this morning

:06:10. > :06:15.are expected to show an unprecedented deficit among

:06:16. > :06:17.hospitals, and other It's thought it could be

:06:18. > :06:23.more than ?2 billion Experts are warning

:06:24. > :06:26.that the financial strain is putting pressure on care -

:06:27. > :06:36.and economists have warned Tonka Bassi from the Institute of

:06:37. > :06:41.Public policy research says that it is getting worse. It's a serious

:06:42. > :06:46.position, with financial deficits getting worse. That is because it

:06:47. > :06:52.impairs the NHS's ability to see and treat patients, waiting times are

:06:53. > :06:56.going up, whether it is to go to accident and emergency, for planned

:06:57. > :06:58.operations, to see a GP, across the NHS, waiting times are on the way up

:06:59. > :07:02.which is bad news for patients. Psychiatric patients in England

:07:03. > :07:05.are having to travel up to 300 miles because of a shortage

:07:06. > :07:07.of hospital beds. Figures obtained by BBC News

:07:08. > :07:09.and the online journal Community Care, show nearly 5,500

:07:10. > :07:11.patients had to travel out of their local area

:07:12. > :07:13.to get the nearest bed. Our Social Affairs Correspondent

:07:14. > :07:18.Michael Buchanan reports. Jessica Wilson finds colouring

:07:19. > :07:22.relaxing and settling. The 21-year-old has a range

:07:23. > :07:24.of mental health conditions, including depression

:07:25. > :07:32.and post-traumatic stress disorder. In December she fell ill

:07:33. > :07:35.but there were no hospital beds available in her home

:07:36. > :07:37.in Lincolnshire, so she was forced Roehampton was the only place

:07:38. > :07:42.I could go so that made me feel even more scared,

:07:43. > :07:44.more vulnerable, more alone Jessica's experience

:07:45. > :07:49.is unfortunately Last year, nearly 5,500 psychiatric

:07:50. > :07:58.patients were forced to travel due to a lack of beds,

:07:59. > :08:00.that's a 13% increase Half of mental health Trusts

:08:01. > :08:11.say they've seen a 230% Some patients had to travel nearly

:08:12. > :08:15.300 miles last year. In January, this NHS Trust took

:08:16. > :08:17.the unprecedented decision to declare a major incident due

:08:18. > :08:20.to problems finding beds for more There's a lot of time spent focusing

:08:21. > :08:28.on A and the crisis with A We had to really draw everybody's

:08:29. > :08:31.attention to there's a crisis here within mental health and it

:08:32. > :08:45.needed everybody to And coming up later

:08:46. > :08:52.in the programme, we'll hear from all sides on this issues,

:08:53. > :08:55.including a mother and son who were both sent over 100

:08:56. > :08:57.miles from their home A second girl thought to be one

:08:58. > :09:06.of more than 200 schoolgirls kidnapped by Boko Haram has been

:09:07. > :09:17.rescued by Nigeria's military. Earlier this week, an activist group

:09:18. > :09:21.saved a 19-year-old girl who is known to be one of the abducted

:09:22. > :09:25.school pupils, and was found with a baby in north-eastern border a

:09:26. > :09:29.carrying out more operations in the carrying out more operations in the

:09:30. > :09:33.region against Boko Haram, rescuing 97 women and children and it is

:09:34. > :09:35.region against Boko Haram, rescuing thought that one of them is victim

:09:36. > :09:39.of the mass kidnapping which led to the bring back our girls campaign.

:09:40. > :09:43.Jewish refugees who fled the Nazis on the eve of the Second World War

:09:44. > :09:46.are calling on the government to do more to get children out

:09:47. > :09:49.of the migrant camp in Calais - and be reunited with their families

:09:50. > :09:52.Lord Dubs, the Labour peer who came to Britain as part

:09:53. > :09:54.of the Kindertransport project in the 1930s,

:09:55. > :09:57.is urging the government to speed up the processing of asylum claims

:09:58. > :10:02.for unaccompanied children living in the Calais jungle.

:10:03. > :10:04.And at 09:15, we will be talking to one of the people

:10:05. > :10:08.involved in that campaign - Lord Dubs.

:10:09. > :10:10.It's emerged that five prison officers were taken hostage

:10:11. > :10:13.by an inmate with a bladed weapon at Highpoint prison

:10:14. > :10:19.A report seen by the BBC shows the stand-off came a day

:10:20. > :10:21.after another hostage incident at the same prison which

:10:22. > :10:23.involved a prisoner taken hostage inside a cell.

:10:24. > :10:26.Both ended without injury and are now under investigation.

:10:27. > :10:28.Councillors in North Yorkshire will meet later to discuss

:10:29. > :10:31.whether or not to approve fracking in England for the first time

:10:32. > :10:34.since a ban on the technique was lifted in 2012.

:10:35. > :10:38.They will consider plans by Third Energy to frack at a site

:10:39. > :10:43.Many residents fear it will increase noise and pollution.

:10:44. > :10:45.The company says its operations poses no risks to people

:10:46. > :10:52.A man has been charged with trespassing at Buckingham Palace

:10:53. > :10:54.after allegedly scaling a perimeter wall.

:10:55. > :10:56.Dennis Hennessy, who's 41 and from Wembley in north west

:10:57. > :11:02.He was found by officers seven minutes after an alarm was activated

:11:03. > :11:18.There's a warning from the EU Remain campaign this morning that

:11:19. > :11:20.infrastructure projects could suffer if the UK votes to leave.

:11:21. > :11:23.It comes from the Manchester City council leader -

:11:24. > :11:25.who says they would lose out on funding from

:11:26. > :11:28.In Manchester the tram project there has had substantial

:11:29. > :11:33.It would mean, in future, if we needed to do something on the scale,

:11:34. > :11:36.we undoubtably will need to do more things on this kind of scale in

:11:37. > :11:40.greater Manchester and it will make it very difficult, if not

:11:41. > :11:44.impossible, to do so in a way that gives value to council taxpayers.

:11:45. > :11:46.Scientists in the United States have developed a tiny,

:11:47. > :11:49.flying robot that's about the size of a ten pence piece.

:11:50. > :11:51.These buzzing drones are thought to be the world's

:11:52. > :11:53.smallest winged robots - and they can be programmed to take

:11:54. > :11:55.an energy-saving rest perched on a ceiling,

:11:56. > :11:58.before detaching and continuing their flight.

:11:59. > :12:00.Developers say they could do life-saving work, for example

:12:01. > :12:05.by mapping out areas where natural disasters have hit.

:12:06. > :12:09.That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 9.30.

:12:10. > :12:19.Thank you. Coming up in a moment, two Jewish men who fled the Nazis on

:12:20. > :12:24.kindertransport to Britain, meets children in the so-called Jungle

:12:25. > :12:26.camp in Calais, we have an exclusive report. Get in touch with what we

:12:27. > :12:37.are talking about this morning... Let's catch up with the sport, the

:12:38. > :12:42.first tennis grand slam of the year starts at the weekend.

:12:43. > :12:46.We are a few days away. We are talking tennis.

:12:47. > :12:52.And while the news of Roger Federer's withdrawal

:12:53. > :12:54.through injury is disappointing for tennis fans, it no doubt boosts

:12:55. > :12:59.Let's talk live to fomer British Number One Greg Rusedski -

:13:00. > :13:02.talk about seedings in a moment, but Andy goes into tournament

:13:03. > :13:12.I'm shoring it comes to Andy Murray, he feels he can beat anyone on the

:13:13. > :13:16.court, but talking about him in particular, great form on clay going

:13:17. > :13:21.into the tournament now? Yes, he's been in brilliant form, getting into

:13:22. > :13:25.the finals of Madrid, he lost a tough three set match to Novak

:13:26. > :13:28.Djokovic and last week in Rome he was brilliant, beating Djokovic in

:13:29. > :13:32.straight sets in the final. In the French Open, he's probably playing

:13:33. > :13:45.his best ever tennis on this surface, I see a chance for him to

:13:46. > :13:49.possibly win the French Open and make his first finals as welcome his

:13:50. > :13:51.best he's done previously is the semifinals. The coach situation has

:13:52. > :13:53.been interesting, it could be disruptive, you might say, but it

:13:54. > :13:56.does not seem to have changed his play on the court, the fact that

:13:57. > :13:59.Amelie Mauresmo is in? I think that Jamie has done a great job, with

:14:00. > :14:02.him, he lives in the UK, when Andy wants a practice session he does not

:14:03. > :14:06.have to worry about his coach being in Sweden, France, America, he's

:14:07. > :14:09.always with him. He has a relaxed personality and the combination

:14:10. > :14:13.works well, and if you look at Andy Murray's game recently in the last

:14:14. > :14:16.few months, his second serve has got faster, he hits the ball from the

:14:17. > :14:24.back of the Court and his movement looks better. Jamie is doing great

:14:25. > :14:27.at the moment. What about the seedings? The fact there is no

:14:28. > :14:30.Federer means that Rafa or Nadal, who beat him in Monte Carlo, he

:14:31. > :14:33.moves up to number four. It means that he will not meet Rafa Nadal or

:14:34. > :14:38.Djokovic and all the semifinals, if he gets there. So he feels like he

:14:39. > :14:41.can beat anyone committee can build his momentum up to the semifinals

:14:42. > :14:47.and feel like he is in best neck before he needs the big guns? Let's

:14:48. > :14:52.not forget that Andy beat him in Madrid one-on-one, if he plays Rafer

:14:53. > :14:56.in the semis or the quarters, he is confident. We talk about Roger

:14:57. > :15:00.Federer missing a slam for the first time in 65 Grand Slams, an

:15:01. > :15:04.incredible record, he is not a threat at the French like he once

:15:05. > :15:09.was, she is not as strong physically. Andy Murray is playing

:15:10. > :15:12.great tennis, I expect him to get to the finals. Prieto, the defending

:15:13. > :15:20.champion, no one is talking about him at the moment. -- Stan Wawrinka.

:15:21. > :15:28.Norbert what about the women? We talked about Johanna Konta.

:15:29. > :15:36.She is world number 22. Her former little bit more indifferent. What

:15:37. > :15:42.are her chances? A good result would be to get to the second round of the

:15:43. > :15:48.French Open. She has got a great shot to do well. A great attitude.

:15:49. > :15:51.Her coach is from Spain. She is getting better every single week and

:15:52. > :15:56.likes the big occasion. I think she will have a great run. I know we

:15:57. > :16:04.will be seeing a lot of you on the television. We will also be covering

:16:05. > :16:10.the tennis on BBC Radio five Live. Great chances for the British

:16:11. > :16:13.contingent in France. The draw is on in an hour. We will bring it to you.

:16:14. > :16:16.On the eve of the Second World War, thousands of Jewish children escaped

:16:17. > :16:20.Nazi Europe thanks to a rescue effort known as Kindertransport.

:16:21. > :16:23.Two of those who benefited - Labour peer Lord Dubs

:16:24. > :16:26.and Rabbi Harry Jacobi - are urging the Government to help

:16:27. > :16:27.migrant children stranded in the Calais camp

:16:28. > :16:35.This programme had exclusive access they travelled to France to meet

:16:36. > :16:58.Dominic Casciani was there with them.

:16:59. > :17:01.refugee children. It is so dangerous. Some of this group is

:17:02. > :17:07.missing because they have been killed. There was a young Afghan boy

:17:08. > :17:16.called Massoud. He fell killed. There was a young Afghan boy

:17:17. > :17:25.and died. It is a shocking experience to see these people

:17:26. > :17:29.without any hope. The conditions are intolerable for children to be on

:17:30. > :17:30.their own. We should not as a civilised continent allow this to go

:17:31. > :17:44.A handshake on for one

:17:45. > :18:01.A handshake Separated by decades but connected

:18:02. > :18:07.the Second World War. I was rescued and came to England as a refugee.

:18:08. > :18:15.And like you, I was unaccompanied. And like you, I was unaccompanied.

:18:16. > :18:21.again. But I hope you will see some of your family again. Labour peer

:18:22. > :18:33.after orbs and Rabbi Harry of your family again. Labour peer

:18:34. > :18:37.so much for coming. The settlement is home to

:18:38. > :18:38.so much for coming. The settlement without family. More

:18:39. > :18:40.so much for coming. The settlement ago Harry and Alf made their own

:18:41. > :18:47.journey to safety. ago Harry and Alf made their own

:18:48. > :18:55.to England, land of the free. They are

:18:56. > :18:55.to England, land of the free. They As world War loomed, the British

:18:56. > :19:01.government saved 10,000 children from the Nazis. The Kindred the

:19:02. > :19:06.Department for Transport gave safe transport to Jewish children all

:19:07. > :19:10.over Europe. My mother at some

:19:11. > :19:16.over Europe. permission to leave. She got me onto

:19:17. > :19:20.the transport. I can still see her standing at the station, German

:19:21. > :19:24.soldiers with swastikas. When we crossed into Holland, the older ones

:19:25. > :19:29.cheered. I knew it was significant but I did not know why.

:19:30. > :19:36.Harry left his parents in Berlin and made it to Holland, only for the

:19:37. > :19:44.Nazis to invade in 1940. A non-Jewish woman took us by

:19:45. > :19:49.coaches to the Dutch border and prep -- persuaded a cargo boat captain to

:19:50. > :19:59.take us away. Five days later, after leaving Holland, we arrived in

:20:00. > :20:04.Liverpool. I have a picture here of the Liverpool paper to show you how

:20:05. > :20:12.we arrived in Liverpool on the 19th of May, 1940.

:20:13. > :20:17.So what has this got to do with Calais? This month Lord dubs led a

:20:18. > :20:23.successful campaign to force the government to welcoming more along

:20:24. > :20:27.children seeking asylum. It is stored there are 90,000

:20:28. > :20:33.unaccompanied kids across the EU. In Calais, there are more than 400.

:20:34. > :20:35.Citizens UK says 157 of them have a legal claim to come to Britain

:20:36. > :20:43.because they already have a relative weighting. -- waiting for them.

:20:44. > :20:49.Harry and Alf met two boys from Afghanistan.

:20:50. > :20:57.I am a refugee. I came to England at the age of six. With the help of a

:20:58. > :21:02.translator, the boys, ten and 12, explain what they have been through.

:21:03. > :21:06.He is complaining that it has been eight months now and he is very

:21:07. > :21:18.upset that no one has bothered are asked us how we are, if we are OK.

:21:19. > :21:22.It is very sad. Have you any family in Afghanistan? They said they never

:21:23. > :21:27.had contact with relatives, who paid smugglers to bring them to Europe.

:21:28. > :21:32.One of them told the visitors what happened to his dad.

:21:33. > :21:41.The Taliban killed his father. The bomb. Taliban. They made it to

:21:42. > :21:45.France in car boot, the back of lorries and by walking over

:21:46. > :21:49.mountains. Scared of older men, French police and tear gas, the boys

:21:50. > :21:55.said they would keep trying to get onto lorries bound for England.

:21:56. > :21:59.It is so dangerous. Right here we have had a couple of children killed

:22:00. > :22:05.by moving traffic when attempting to get in lorries. We try to encourage

:22:06. > :22:12.people to claim asylum in France because it is too dangerous to

:22:13. > :22:16.attempt the crossing. None of these children are willing to make this

:22:17. > :22:23.choice. They are too young. And they have been told by family at home to

:22:24. > :22:26.go to the UK. Nobody denies that the Jungle is a

:22:27. > :22:32.dangerous place. And the government has agreed to do more. Ministers

:22:33. > :22:36.insist they are working as quickly and safely as possible in the best

:22:37. > :22:39.interests of the children. But campaigners say it is not fast

:22:40. > :22:42.enough. The legal process is too slow. There

:22:43. > :22:46.is not enough happening and it is not happening fast enough. That

:22:47. > :22:51.means children, because they are so young and alone, have no option but

:22:52. > :22:58.to take their lives into their own hands. But is this really the UK's

:22:59. > :23:02.problem? Critics say taking children from here encourages more people

:23:03. > :23:06.smuggling. The local authorities cannot afford to pay for the huge

:23:07. > :23:11.cost of housing and educating these kids. I am far more determined than

:23:12. > :23:18.ever to push the British government to say these are young unaccompanied

:23:19. > :23:24.refugee children. And in 1938, 1939, Britain took 10,000 unaccompanied

:23:25. > :23:27.refugees from Germany, Austria and Czechoslovakia. It was not our

:23:28. > :23:32.problem them but we did it. We were the only European country to do it.

:23:33. > :23:38.I think in humanitarian terms we have a responsibility. Other human

:23:39. > :23:44.beings are vulnerable. To see it is to believe it. I could not believe

:23:45. > :23:55.it. It is a shocking experience to see these people without any hope. I

:23:56. > :24:01.feel so furious. France has not done anything for them. I am

:24:02. > :24:08.pro-European. What I am very much ashamed of the whole of Europe not

:24:09. > :24:12.doing enough for the refugees here. The tinder transport is not just a

:24:13. > :24:20.tale of her 10,000 children cheated the nasties. -- Nazis. 70 years on,

:24:21. > :24:24.the veterans say the fate of thousands more children now hangs in

:24:25. > :24:30.the balance. The circumstances are completely different. But they say

:24:31. > :24:37.the question is the same. How we prepared to do today what we did in

:24:38. > :24:40.the past? -- are we prepared? As the former refugees prepared to leave,

:24:41. > :24:45.the children had a message for them to take home. If you can tell the

:24:46. > :24:50.people of the England government, imagine if these were your kids.

:24:51. > :24:55.Everyone has some form of trouble and we were forced out. Think about

:24:56. > :25:02.your children. If they were in our position, how would you feel? I am

:25:03. > :25:06.more determined than ever to do my best, R Best, to help you. Thank you

:25:07. > :25:08.for your time. Good luck. We will do our best.

:25:09. > :25:17.Thank you. We now talk to Lord Dubs,

:25:18. > :25:21.who was in the so called Jungle, the refugee camp in Calais,

:25:22. > :25:34.this week, and has recently How did you feel? Did it take you

:25:35. > :25:39.back to being a little boy? In some ways it did. I talked to them and

:25:40. > :25:44.one of them is about the same age as I was when I came here. The answer

:25:45. > :25:51.is yes. I felt shocked. People are very resilient. They are determined

:25:52. > :25:56.to have a future. I hope we can help some of them to have such a future.

:25:57. > :25:57.The circumstances are different. They are in a safe European country

:25:58. > :26:05.already. Why do they want to They are in a safe European country

:26:06. > :26:09.the UK? Some have got family. Others do not but want to come. The

:26:10. > :26:10.the UK? Some have got family. Others that young children are sleeping

:26:11. > :26:16.wrath, sleeping in the Jungle in Calais, sleeping in railway

:26:17. > :26:20.stations, in the streets, that is pretty shocking. They are not

:26:21. > :26:23.escaping the gas chambers as happened in 1938. But it is still

:26:24. > :26:28.pretty shocking that young people are left there. Britain should take

:26:29. > :26:32.some. I think other countries should play their part as well, including

:26:33. > :26:37.France. We have a responsibility to take at least some of them and give

:26:38. > :26:42.them a decent life. Are you putting a number on how many you want to see

:26:43. > :26:43.coming here? The government says the way the process works, it will only

:26:44. > :26:46.take child refugees way the process works, it will only

:26:47. > :26:54.Europe before the 20th of March, in order not to create... Needs to

:26:55. > :26:58.speak to individual cup cancels around the

:26:59. > :27:03.speak to individual cup cancels people different areas can host. --

:27:04. > :27:12.different councils. We had an original number of 3000. Look, if

:27:13. > :27:14.the government are as good as their word, and the Minister

:27:15. > :27:15.the government are as good as their me the government will enter not

:27:16. > :27:18.only me the government will enter not

:27:19. > :27:27.of the amendment, they will be looking to local authorities to find

:27:28. > :27:30.foster parents. I have had people offer to become foster parents.

:27:31. > :27:35.There are plenty about, despite what some people say. Not in Kent, where

:27:36. > :27:35.there is more pressure. The government have said they are

:27:36. > :27:42.talking to government have said they are

:27:43. > :27:53.March is quite a good date. What it means is that there are plenty of

:27:54. > :27:57.children in the category. That is not a problem. The government says

:27:58. > :28:02.the process will take time, possibly up to seven months. Can it be done

:28:03. > :28:06.quicker? Yes it can. I have got details I'm going to send the Home

:28:07. > :28:09.Office of 67 young people fully documented by voluntary

:28:10. > :28:15.organisations working in Calais. So of course it can be done quicker. We

:28:16. > :28:20.want to get some of them Britain in time for the school term. They have

:28:21. > :28:22.missed a lot of education. Young people should be in school and start

:28:23. > :28:27.developing their lives. Some pressure on the government it is

:28:28. > :28:37.wanted. Why are you sure it can be done quicker? I talked to people in

:28:38. > :28:45.Calais. I have not talked to people in Greece or Italy. They have

:28:46. > :28:49.identified six or ten young people who would qualify by any standards.

:28:50. > :28:53.Some have relatives in Britain, some do not. I will send that information

:28:54. > :28:59.to the Home Office. With the political will it can be done. We

:29:00. > :29:02.are going to go there, talk to the people, identify them, check their

:29:03. > :29:06.background and make sure they qualify. You have written a letter

:29:07. > :29:10.to the Home Secretary talking about the importance of education. You say

:29:11. > :29:15.that enabled you to give something back to Britain. How passionately do

:29:16. > :29:19.you feel about that? I feel very sorry. If these young people are

:29:20. > :29:22.going to have any sort of life at all, it is important they get to

:29:23. > :29:27.school and start catching up on the time they have lost. After all, we

:29:28. > :29:30.are dealing with human beings who have got their lives ahead of the

:29:31. > :29:34.man they want to have decent lives and save lives. If you can help some

:29:35. > :29:39.of them, that is what you should be doing. I want to read you some of

:29:40. > :29:44.the things viewers upset. And has said it touched her heart. Let's get

:29:45. > :29:51.on with helping them now. Why the UK government? Should other governments

:29:52. > :29:56.not to more? Shelagh on Facebook says it is nothing like your

:29:57. > :30:00.situation. These kids have travelled through several countries to get to

:30:01. > :30:06.Calais. Why not stop at the first safe country? Why Britain? Sam says,

:30:07. > :30:10.these are at risk loan children. Why are we not swooping to help? Linda

:30:11. > :30:16.says the government has done enough. They travel through safe European

:30:17. > :30:17.countries just to get to us. Wrong people should come first. Why

:30:18. > :30:27.Britain? I'm saying not only Britain but

:30:28. > :30:33.others countries should play a part, and other countries in the Gulf,

:30:34. > :30:37.they could also do more. The French should be doing more, we should play

:30:38. > :30:41.our part, and if we set an example maybe we can persuade other

:30:42. > :30:46.countries to do likewise? What about public concerns about pressure on

:30:47. > :30:54.public resources? And generally increasing the population? When all

:30:55. > :30:57.is said and done, we can provide more resources, both to help local

:30:58. > :31:01.authorities in their day-to-day work, looking after other children,

:31:02. > :31:05.and find money to help deal with these children, it is not beyond us.

:31:06. > :31:09.We are one of the richest countries in the world, for heaven 's sake. We

:31:10. > :31:13.have a strong humanitarian tradition, and we can handle it.

:31:14. > :31:17.Thank you for coming in and talking to us, Lord Dubs.

:31:18. > :31:19.We contacted the Home Office for its response.

:31:20. > :31:20.Immigration Minister James Brokenshire said:

:31:21. > :31:22."The UK Government is committed to providing life-saving support

:31:23. > :31:24.and assistance to the vulnerable children who have been unjustly

:31:25. > :31:26.impacted by this ongoing humanitarian crisis.

:31:27. > :31:28.And we are targeting our efforts to assist

:31:29. > :31:31.Everyone wants this to happen as quickly and as safely

:31:32. > :31:34.as possible, but we must ensure it is in the best

:31:35. > :31:37.We are working with Local Authorities in the UK,

:31:38. > :31:39.the UNHCR as well as with counterparts in Greece,

:31:40. > :31:41.France and Italy to identify vulnerable children to bring

:31:42. > :31:44.to the UK and make sure the support systems are in place

:31:45. > :31:49.Thank you for your comments on that, keep them coming in and we will be

:31:50. > :31:50.talking about it later as well. Also coming up...

:31:51. > :31:52.More than 24 hours after the EgyptAir plane disappeared,

:31:53. > :31:55.and relatives still don't know what's happened to those on board.

:31:56. > :31:58.We'll talk to Barry Sweeney, whose son Liam died when the plane

:31:59. > :32:00.he was travelling on was shot down over Ukraine.

:32:01. > :32:02.More mental health patients are having to travel out

:32:03. > :32:05.of their area for treatment - some are being sent over

:32:06. > :32:07.100 miles away - we hear from a mother who had

:32:08. > :32:10.to make a 300 mile round trip to see her teenage son

:32:11. > :32:14.Here's Anita in the BBC Newsroom with a summary of today's news.

:32:15. > :32:21.The international search for a missing Egyptair

:32:22. > :32:23.plane is intensifying, more than 24 hours after it

:32:24. > :32:25.disappeared from radar over the Mediterranean.

:32:26. > :32:27.There had been reports that wreckage had been found but the Greek

:32:28. > :32:30.authorities now say they don't think its anything to do

:32:31. > :32:37.66 people were on board Flight MS804 from Paris to Cairo.

:32:38. > :32:39.Figures due out later this morning are expected to show

:32:40. > :32:43.an unprecedented deficit among hospitals, and other

:32:44. > :32:53.It's thought it could be more than ?2 billion

:32:54. > :32:56.Experts are warning that the financial strain is putting

:32:57. > :32:59.Tom Kibasi from the Institute of Public Policy research says

:33:00. > :33:04.Psychiatric patients in England are having to travel up to 300 miles

:33:05. > :33:05.because of a shortage of hospital beds.

:33:06. > :33:07.Figures obtained by BBC News and the online journal

:33:08. > :33:10.Community Care show nearly 5,500 patients had to travel

:33:11. > :33:12.out of their local area to get the nearest bed.

:33:13. > :33:19.Our Social Affairs Correspondent Michael Buchanan reports.

:33:20. > :33:22.Sorry, we don't have that report, let's move onto another story for

:33:23. > :33:25.you. Jewish refugees who fled the Nazis

:33:26. > :33:29.on the eve of the Second World War are calling on the government to do

:33:30. > :33:32.more to get children out of the migrant camp in Calais -

:33:33. > :33:35.and be reunited with their families Labour peer Lord Dubs

:33:36. > :33:38.and Rabbi Harry Jacobi who came to Britain as part of

:33:39. > :33:40.the Kindertransport project in the 1930s are urging

:33:41. > :33:42.the government to speed up the processing of asylum claims

:33:43. > :33:54.for unaccompanied children living Lord Dubs told this programme that

:33:55. > :33:58.Britain has a responsibility to help young refugees. Young children are

:33:59. > :34:02.sleeping rough, sleeping in the jungle in Calais, they are sleeping

:34:03. > :34:08.at railway stations, that is shocking. They aren't escaping the

:34:09. > :34:11.gas chambers, as happened in 1938, 39, but it is shocking with young

:34:12. > :34:16.people left their Mac. I argued that Britain should take some of them,

:34:17. > :34:20.there are quite a lot and other countries should play their part,

:34:21. > :34:21.including France. We have a responsibility to take some of them

:34:22. > :34:25.and give them a decent life. It's emerged that five prison

:34:26. > :34:27.officers were taken hostage by an inmate with a bladed

:34:28. > :34:30.weapon at Highpoint prison A report seen by the BBC shows

:34:31. > :34:33.the stand-off came a day after another hostage incident

:34:34. > :34:36.at the same prison which involved a prisoner taken

:34:37. > :34:38.hostage inside a cell. Both ended without injury

:34:39. > :34:46.and are now under investigation. Councillors in North Yorkshire will

:34:47. > :34:52.meet later to discuss whether or not to approve fracking in England for

:34:53. > :34:57.the first time since a ban on the technique was lifted in 2012. Third

:34:58. > :35:01.Energy wants to frack in Yorkshire with many residents fearing

:35:02. > :35:04.increased noise and pollution, but the company says its operations pose

:35:05. > :35:06.no risk to people or the environment.

:35:07. > :35:09.That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 10.

:35:10. > :35:20.England's cricketers will be hoping to continue their fightback

:35:21. > :35:23.when play resumes in their first test against Sri Lanka

:35:24. > :35:26.Thery were floundering on 83 for 5 yesterday before Alex Hales

:35:27. > :35:29.and Jonny Bairstow combined in an unbroken partnership of 88

:35:30. > :35:35.before the rain ended play early at Headingley.

:35:36. > :35:37.In golf, Rory McIlroy has urged Muirfield to "see

:35:38. > :35:40.voted against accepting women members yesterday.

:35:41. > :35:42.The decision means the club won't be allowed to host

:35:43. > :35:50.Meanwhile, McIlroy is is back out on course at the Irish Open -

:35:51. > :35:53.yesterday he carded a 5 under par round of 67 to put himself

:35:54. > :35:57.Former French Open champion Roger Federer has pulled out

:35:58. > :35:58.of this year's tournament with a back injury.

:35:59. > :36:01.He hasn't missed a Grand Slam this century, but has been

:36:02. > :36:06.The 17 time major winner says he hopes the rest will ensure

:36:07. > :36:10.he can complete the remainder of the season.

:36:11. > :36:13.Ross Murdoch's gold in the 200 metre breaststroke was one of five

:36:14. > :36:14.medals for Great Britain at London's Aquatics

:36:15. > :36:18.Murdoch won't be competing in the event at the Rio Olympics

:36:19. > :36:23.though after failing to qualify last month.

:36:24. > :36:31.Those other sport headlines, we are back later in the programme. --

:36:32. > :36:33.those are the sport headlines. Thank you.

:36:34. > :36:36.It's well over 24 hours since Egyptair flight MS804 vanished

:36:37. > :36:39.from the radar screens - and still no sign of it.

:36:40. > :36:41.Relatives of the French passengers on board have

:36:42. > :36:44.As the investigation by Egyptian aviation officials continues,

:36:45. > :36:46.we can get the latest from our correspondent

:36:47. > :36:54.What is happening? French families are staying in a nearby hotel, not

:36:55. > :36:58.far from where I am now, there are Egyptian families there as well, we

:36:59. > :37:03.understand they will meet with officials from Egypt era, and the

:37:04. > :37:06.French ambassador later today, to be briefed on the latest updates

:37:07. > :37:11.concerning the accident -- EgyptAir. We went to the hotel and spoke to an

:37:12. > :37:15.Egyptian man whose ex-wife was on the aeroplane, and he had the same

:37:16. > :37:18.complaint about a lack of information. He said the authorities

:37:19. > :37:28.were not telling them anything and they do not know what is happening

:37:29. > :37:30.or what the fate of their loved ones were. We happened to speak to some

:37:31. > :37:33.officials from EgyptAir who will be meeting with families later. They

:37:34. > :37:37.have said they do not know what happened yet, they do not have solid

:37:38. > :37:43.facts to give families, and we are trying to give them the latest that

:37:44. > :37:46.they have, investigations are ongoing, search operations are

:37:47. > :37:50.ongoing, we can't give them information that they do not really

:37:51. > :37:55.have. The president has been speaking to the Egyptian military

:37:56. > :37:59.units carrying out the rescue search operations in the Mediterranean, and

:38:00. > :38:05.is asking them to finish the job as soon as possible, so that everyone

:38:06. > :38:09.can have a clue about what exactly happened, and caused the plane to go

:38:10. > :38:14.missing. There is a sense of frustration among families. I've

:38:15. > :38:17.been speaking to them today and yesterday, they woke up to this

:38:18. > :38:21.horrifying news, they don't know what has happened to their loved

:38:22. > :38:22.ones, they say authorities aren't telling them anything. Sally, thank

:38:23. > :38:26.you. One man who knows only too

:38:27. > :38:29.tragically about the wait for news His 28-year-old son died in July

:38:30. > :38:33.2014, when the Malaysian Airlines Flight MH17 was shot down over

:38:34. > :38:36.Ukraine and all 298 Liam was simply heading

:38:37. > :38:52.to see his beloved Newcastle United Thank you for coming in. How did you

:38:53. > :38:57.feel when you heard this happened yesterday? Quite numb, when

:38:58. > :39:04.something happens in the air, and what happened with Liam, it always

:39:05. > :39:09.brings memories back. I woke up yesterday morning, I had a text on

:39:10. > :39:13.my phone saying I'm sorry, I'm sorry about what has happened. I went and

:39:14. > :39:20.put the telly on, and saw what happened. I went for a walk to

:39:21. > :39:25.think. Obviously, very difficult, bringing it all back, what did you

:39:26. > :39:29.think about it as you walked yesterday? The memories of what

:39:30. > :39:35.happened nearly two years ago, it's not a nice feeling. I know the

:39:36. > :39:38.families and friends of those on board, on MS804, they will be

:39:39. > :39:43.devastated, obviously, they do not know what to do. I'm sure there will

:39:44. > :39:47.be help for them, there was for me and my family. We were looked after

:39:48. > :39:51.for a long time. It sounds like people around you are very

:39:52. > :39:54.thoughtful, and know what you want is that connection, they got in

:39:55. > :39:59.touch with you even before you knew about it, to say they were thinking

:40:00. > :40:06.about you. Did it take time people to work out how to respond? No,

:40:07. > :40:14.after yesterday, I expected someone to call, whenever there's a tragedy

:40:15. > :40:20.I'm quite happy to speak about it. But, at the beginning, when the

:40:21. > :40:24.plane came down and Liam was on it, people knew that you were going

:40:25. > :40:31.through something unbearable. How difficult is it at that time for the

:40:32. > :40:36.people around you to respond in a way that's best for you? It is

:40:37. > :40:40.surreal at the time, it always happens to someone else, not you.

:40:41. > :40:45.When it happened, I was at a funeral when Liam died, that was not nice. I

:40:46. > :40:49.came home and said to my wife, I hope this is the last funeral we

:40:50. > :40:52.will go to for a long time. Unfortunately, Liam was already

:40:53. > :40:59.dead. It was the next morning when we found out. You just did not know

:41:00. > :41:04.what was happening. The whole world was turned upside down. It was not

:41:05. > :41:08.real. You are going to wake up, it is a nightmare, but everyone came to

:41:09. > :41:15.the 4-straight Way, friends and family. The police, Foreign Office

:41:16. > :41:20.-- came to the fore, straightaway. We had family liaison officers

:41:21. > :41:26.working with us who were lovely, and kept us going through all of the bad

:41:27. > :41:30.moments. Went over to Holland when we went to pick up Liam. They were

:41:31. > :41:34.with us when the first set of coffins came in, everyone was

:41:35. > :41:42.lovely. Do the same things always go through your mind? Do you manage to

:41:43. > :41:45.move forward a little bit as time goes on? I would like to think that

:41:46. > :41:47.I've been positive, I want to be positive and

:41:48. > :42:05.'s life. He had the chance to go to New Zealand to watch Newcastle

:42:06. > :42:12.United, it's another story. He was so excited. It is really unfortunate

:42:13. > :42:16.that it happened on the way there. I'm not saying it should have

:42:17. > :42:20.happened on the way back, but if you got to New Zealand and lived the

:42:21. > :42:28.dream, I would have been happier for him. You are wearing a colourful

:42:29. > :42:32.ribbon, that is for other relatives, it was a black ribbon initially, but

:42:33. > :42:36.that reflect what you are talking about now, it was changed to a

:42:37. > :42:45.colourful one to remember the life rather than the death? It was the

:42:46. > :42:49.Malaysia Airlines I got it from, I got it from a lovely man, Will

:42:50. > :42:56.create a committee was with me when we went over, whenever something

:42:57. > :43:01.happened, it was something to give out -- Will Kruger. I keep it on all

:43:02. > :43:07.the time to remember. You have written a few lines of a poem for

:43:08. > :43:12.the people who have tragically been caught up in the latest air

:43:13. > :43:18.disaster. Would you mind reading it? I do not mind. Let me get my respect

:43:19. > :43:22.and condolences for all of the family and friends, not just from

:43:23. > :43:26.me, but for MH17 and from every decent person in the world, I will

:43:27. > :43:33.read this. Another disaster in the sky. Another

:43:34. > :43:40.tragedy, will we ever know why? Condolences to family and friends

:43:41. > :43:45.from MH17, our love we send. It will mean a huge amount for people who

:43:46. > :43:52.are going through this, knowing that you understand. When something

:43:53. > :43:56.happens, and the loved one is far away, that is what happened to you

:43:57. > :44:00.and what is happening to these people, it must bring another

:44:01. > :44:05.dimension? Of the practical issues that must be dealt with? In Ukraine,

:44:06. > :44:09.it was impossible, there was a war going on and no one could get in.

:44:10. > :44:14.For the loved ones there, they were there for a few days before anything

:44:15. > :44:19.could happen. Hopefully, with this flight, we don't know what has

:44:20. > :44:24.happened. If it has disappeared, it is akin to MH370 and part of MH17 as

:44:25. > :44:27.welcome we do not know what happened. If it is a technical foot,

:44:28. > :44:36.don't get us wrong, I would rather it was that on a terror alerts -- if

:44:37. > :44:41.it was a technical fault. It is difficult, we had to wait and find

:44:42. > :44:47.out if and when. With Liam, it was not long before he was found, but it

:44:48. > :44:52.was long enough. He was probably one of the first ones to be found at the

:44:53. > :44:59.time. So we could begin to move on, whereas other families could not. It

:45:00. > :45:01.is a horrible thought. Thank you very much for coming and speaking to

:45:02. > :45:09.us. ! If you have got questions on the

:45:10. > :45:12.search operation currently under way, you can put them to an air

:45:13. > :45:28.crash investigator who will answer them live on newsroom live.

:45:29. > :45:30.are still having to travel long distances from their homes

:45:31. > :45:33.Figures obtained by BBC News and the online journal

:45:34. > :45:36.Community Care - show the number of mental health patients

:45:37. > :45:39.in England who had to travel outside their local area to get care

:45:40. > :45:51.in moments of crisis to get the nearest bed.

:45:52. > :45:54.Let's talk now to Laura Nuttall, who last year was sent

:45:55. > :45:56.over 100 miles from home for mental health treatment.

:45:57. > :45:58.And Sue Scarborough, whose son was sent more than 150

:45:59. > :46:04.Sue Moore is chief operating officer of Lancashire Care

:46:05. > :46:06.NHS Foundation Trust - the worst performing trust

:46:07. > :46:14.In Norwich, Norman Lamb, former Health Minister

:46:15. > :46:17.And Marjorie Wallace, Chief Executive of the mental

:46:18. > :46:22.health charity, Sane, is here in the studio.

:46:23. > :46:30.Thank you all for joining us. Sue, I will come to you first of all. Your

:46:31. > :46:38.trust was the worst performing trust. In 2014-15, you sent more

:46:39. > :46:45.than 2000 mental health patients trust. In 2014-15, you sent more

:46:46. > :46:51.following areas Centre 751. Why is the picture so bad for you are? That

:46:52. > :46:55.was the case in January. It was a terrible picture. We took really

:46:56. > :47:02.strong action to correct that position. We have 17 patients out of

:47:03. > :47:07.area today, which is not something we are proud of. We have opened

:47:08. > :47:12.additional capacity. We declared a major incident to raise the profile

:47:13. > :47:16.because we recognised it was not a satisfactory situation for our

:47:17. > :47:21.patients, their carers. Who would want to travel that distance at a

:47:22. > :47:25.time of crisis? The position in January was over

:47:26. > :47:30.time of crisis? The position in out of area, today it is 17. Who

:47:31. > :47:34.would want to travel far away when they are facing a mental health

:47:35. > :47:39.crisis? Over the last five years, the numbers have got incrementally

:47:40. > :47:43.worse in your area. I hear what you're saying about the fact you are

:47:44. > :47:52.dealing with it now, but why was it not prioritised until that

:47:53. > :47:56.cumulative annual statistic hit 751? It was being prioritised before the

:47:57. > :48:04.statistic. I need to assure you of that. 751 people over that year were

:48:05. > :48:10.sent out of your area? I am not trying to defend that. We have taken

:48:11. > :48:14.the action. We have seen unprecedented demand. The recent

:48:15. > :48:18.benchmarking for the whole of the NHS shows that Lancashire care have

:48:19. > :48:24.40% more than any other mental health trust in England for

:48:25. > :48:28.referrals. We are at the very highest end of referrals. We have

:48:29. > :48:34.had to work with commissioners, with NHS England, with social care, to

:48:35. > :48:38.build capacity within the system. We are seeing much more portly

:48:39. > :48:46.patients. We are seeing the impact of legal and illegal drugs

:48:47. > :48:50.permeating the system. A huge range of multifactorial issues that have

:48:51. > :48:55.combined together. Yes, it did all manifest in patients having to go

:48:56. > :49:01.out of area. It is an appalling situation and one that I do not wish

:49:02. > :49:04.to repeat those patients. How many mental health beds do you have in

:49:05. > :49:13.your county and how has the figure changed? In January, we had just

:49:14. > :49:19.short of 270 mental health beds. Since January, we have opened 24

:49:20. > :49:25.assessment beds. And six crisis support beds. And 12, what we

:49:26. > :49:31.describe as step-down beds to enable patients to step down to a less

:49:32. > :49:38.acute facility. We have also opened six additional psychiatric intensive

:49:39. > :49:42.care beds. One statistic I found the Lancashire evening Post was that

:49:43. > :49:49.there are 16 mental health beds for children across the county. Is that

:49:50. > :49:52.correct? That is correct. That is commissioned separately by NHS

:49:53. > :49:57.England. They have very recently agreed to commissioning additional

:49:58. > :50:03.two beds. That will take the number 218. Is that anywhere near enough to

:50:04. > :50:07.deal with the number of children you need to be dealing with in

:50:08. > :50:12.Lancashire when you talk about the issues you are facing and the great

:50:13. > :50:19.pressure on beds? With the exception of the very specialist type of beds,

:50:20. > :50:24.yes, that would be sufficient. Let's talk to sue, whose son was sent more

:50:25. > :50:31.than 150 miles for treatment. He was 15 when he was sent so far away.

:50:32. > :50:37.What was that like? It was terrible, really. He just thought that I had

:50:38. > :50:42.left him and I was not going to see him any more. He had never heard of

:50:43. > :50:45.the place Northumberland. He did not know why he was there and what he

:50:46. > :50:51.was being treated for, which was appalling, really. I could only

:50:52. > :50:58.visit on a weekend because of the distance. I don't drive. It was just

:50:59. > :51:02.disgusting. If I had lived in Newcastle, that would have been

:51:03. > :51:10.great but I live in Hull. It was not good enough for me or for him. It

:51:11. > :51:17.took five hours on a Friday morning to get to see him. It was only 12

:51:18. > :51:21.o'clock that I got there to see him. Laura, you are joining us from

:51:22. > :51:25.Lincoln. You had to travel more than 100 miles away from home for mental

:51:26. > :51:32.health treatment. Talk this through the practical reality of having to

:51:33. > :51:36.go so far away? As was just said, it makes the situation more scary and

:51:37. > :51:42.confusing if you are unwell anyway. Going into hospital is scary enough.

:51:43. > :51:46.But having to travel so far away is not good. In terms of

:51:47. > :51:53.practicalities, I was very lucky in the sense that my family were able

:51:54. > :51:57.to come and visit me, albeit inconvenient and difficult for them.

:51:58. > :52:01.There were people in hospital with me who had also travelled from other

:52:02. > :52:06.counties, were not able to get visitors, who were pretty much by

:52:07. > :52:13.themselves. People who are not able to utilise their home leave as well.

:52:14. > :52:20.They need to be able to go out in the community. They are sort of

:52:21. > :52:24.trapped there in a way. Norman Lamb, how do the figures add up? Local

:52:25. > :52:29.authorities do not have the beds because they do not have the

:52:30. > :52:38.re-sources. And yet they spend a lot of money, presumably, sending people

:52:39. > :52:45.further away for treatment? In Laura's case, she was sent off to a

:52:46. > :52:50.private centre far away. It is not cheap, is it? What is happening with

:52:51. > :52:55.the money? It is economic nonsense, as you rightly describe. It is an

:52:56. > :53:01.intolerable practice. We have just heard the point that if you are in

:53:02. > :53:04.that setting separated from your family, it actually prevents you

:53:05. > :53:08.from recovering properly. It is not a therapeutic environment in which

:53:09. > :53:15.people can properly recover and received treatment. I have made it

:53:16. > :53:21.very clear when I was minister that I think the practice should just be

:53:22. > :53:27.banned. We should set a time limit. I would say a year. The government

:53:28. > :53:32.has said it will end by 2020. That, for me, is far too long. This would

:53:33. > :53:38.never happen with a stroke patient or a patient with a heart problem.

:53:39. > :53:44.It is discrimination at the heart of the NHS against people with mental

:53:45. > :53:49.ill-health. We know also it is associated with an increased risk of

:53:50. > :53:53.suicide. Given that we know that, given that we know it is not

:53:54. > :53:58.therapeutic to do this to people, I have had a constituent taken off in

:53:59. > :54:01.the middle of the night to a private centre in south London from

:54:02. > :54:05.Norfolk... This is absolutely outrageous in this

:54:06. > :54:09.Norfolk... This is absolutely There is a gap between the rhetoric,

:54:10. > :54:15.pit the government is very clear about parity or equality for mental

:54:16. > :54:19.ill-health, and the reality, which is that we are a very long way away

:54:20. > :54:24.from treating people with mental ill-health with the same dignity and

:54:25. > :54:28.respect as we treat people with physical health problems. Seu, if

:54:29. > :54:36.you do not have the resources to have the beds in your area, how is

:54:37. > :54:38.the money found to send people away? Why is the money not just used to

:54:39. > :54:44.address the beds issued? That is Why is the money not just used to

:54:45. > :54:51.what we did, actually. We made a decision to proceed in the first

:54:52. > :54:53.instance as a trust to put the system in place,

:54:54. > :54:54.instance as a trust to put the commissioners that it would improve

:54:55. > :55:00.the situation. As a result commissioners that it would improve

:55:01. > :55:04.that we made in this year. commissioners that it would improve

:55:05. > :55:07.boiled down to actually just working out where the priorities lie. Mental

:55:08. > :55:13.health having not out where the priorities lie. Mental

:55:14. > :55:16.recently? That is part of it. It is about also testing new models

:55:17. > :55:21.recently? That is part of it. It is care, challenging ourselves, talking

:55:22. > :55:28.with our service users. I absolutely empathise with the issues that both

:55:29. > :55:28.families have raised. It is not acceptable to be

:55:29. > :55:32.families have raised. It is not somewhere in the middle of the night

:55:33. > :55:38.hundreds of miles away. And we need to stop it. And it has to stop. It

:55:39. > :55:42.is about much better community support. If you can protect and

:55:43. > :55:42.is about much better community support people better at home,

:55:43. > :55:48.prevent the admissions in the first support people better at home,

:55:49. > :55:54.while they are in hospital and get them home as quickly as possible,

:55:55. > :55:55.that is a better model of care than long-stays in institutions and

:55:56. > :56:03.shunting long-stays in institutions and

:56:04. > :56:08.everybody is united in long-stays in institutions and

:56:09. > :56:11.from their area. The government says more money is being put into mental

:56:12. > :56:15.from their area. The government says health, so this should be eliminated

:56:16. > :56:19.by 2020. Listening to what you're hearing today and what you know

:56:20. > :56:26.about what is going on and what the government is saying, is situation

:56:27. > :56:31.changing? No, it is not. This has been going on for a long time. This

:56:32. > :56:36.increase is not surprising. Patients are being literally shunted like

:56:37. > :56:43.unwanted parcels. People can go from Kent to Manchester, down to

:56:44. > :56:47.Weston-Super-Mare. And these unwanted parcels all depend on trust

:56:48. > :56:52.and who is going to pick of the Extra cost. We have heard from

:56:53. > :56:58.Norman Lamb. It is detrimental to a person's health. It is more costly

:56:59. > :57:01.and the suicide rate is rising. In terms of dealing with it, we have

:57:02. > :57:11.heard from Sue, whose trust came bottom in the table. She is talking

:57:12. > :57:15.about how they are dealing with it. If that is the worst of the trusts,

:57:16. > :57:21.does that give you heart? Not really. All this is because of a

:57:22. > :57:26.relentless agenda to close down psychiatric beds and units because

:57:27. > :57:33.they are the most expensive element of psychiatric care. To keep one

:57:34. > :57:41.person on inpatient care, you can treat 44 people in the community.

:57:42. > :57:44.Does that mean treatment? It often means home treatment teams are

:57:45. > :57:51.overstretched, people are neglected. We get a call upon coal from people

:57:52. > :57:56.say the crisis team has not visited them. When a crisis happens, then

:57:57. > :58:00.they are put into a car. They do not know where they are being driven to.

:58:01. > :58:03.The family are left with the financial burden of visiting and the

:58:04. > :58:07.emotional heartbreak of leaving somebody they love. It makes no

:58:08. > :58:13.sense. It is all to do with the government agenda close down

:58:14. > :58:16.psychiatric beds. The government does say it is putting in more money

:58:17. > :58:20.and this problem should be eliminated? They have not mentioned

:58:21. > :58:30.beds except for eating disorders. They say that they are not actually

:58:31. > :58:34.reopening the wards they closed. In areas like Cornwall there are

:58:35. > :58:38.sometimes no psychiatric beds whatsoever. You cannot fix this in a

:58:39. > :58:43.short time. You have to go back and look at the fact that in patient

:58:44. > :58:47.care is as important as community care. We are right out of time.

:58:48. > :58:49.Really good to talk to you all and hear your perspectives. I just want

:58:50. > :58:51.to read out a statement. In a statement, the Minister

:58:52. > :58:53.for Community and Social Care, Alistair Burt, said

:58:54. > :58:56.it was unacceptable that too many patients suffering from mental

:58:57. > :58:57.illness were receiving He added, "We have increased mental

:58:58. > :59:01.health funding to ?11.7 billion. There is new funding coming

:59:02. > :59:04.on stream, and we have already made ?400 million available

:59:05. > :59:05.for crisis resolution and home treatment teams

:59:06. > :59:08.which will help prevent people being admitted as inpatients

:59:09. > :59:26.when they can be better We will be speaking later to Olympic

:59:27. > :59:29.gold medallist Tessa Sanderson about life at 60 with adopted twins.

:59:30. > :59:36.First, let's ketchup with the weather.

:59:37. > :59:45.How is it looking? So far this month we have had a very warm weekend, we

:59:46. > :59:48.have had a cold weekend. And this weekend we're sitting in the middle.

:59:49. > :59:56.Average temperatures. Sunshine and some rain.

:59:57. > :00:01.Is this the lot that we have now? I was almost going to go through a!

:00:02. > :00:07.Are we going to have to get used to this ever-changing weather?

:00:08. > :00:11.It is spring. It is transition time. You see big peaks and troughs in the

:00:12. > :00:16.weather. Quite literally. You do get big variations in the weather from

:00:17. > :00:18.one week to the next. Sometimes one day to be next. This is quite

:00:19. > :00:28.normal. Before we get to the weekend, let's

:00:29. > :00:31.look at the weather today. We have a bright and breezy day across many

:00:32. > :00:34.parts of the country. But there is patches of rain coming into

:00:35. > :00:39.south-west Wales and Northern Ireland. It turns heavier here. One

:00:40. > :00:43.or two showers, chiefly in north-east England and Scotland,

:00:44. > :00:47.they become fewer, sunshine here and there, similar temperatures to

:00:48. > :00:49.yesterday. In the south-east and East Anglia, if you are lucky, 20

:00:50. > :00:54.degrees. Rain moves in overnight, away from

:00:55. > :00:58.Northern Ireland to Scotland, patches elsewhere in the UK, in mild

:00:59. > :01:03.night, but breezy. We begin the day cloudy tomorrow,

:01:04. > :01:05.with rain, coming up through Wales and Scotland, Northern Ireland and

:01:06. > :01:11.later Scotland brightening with showers. For most of the day, East

:01:12. > :01:24.England may be dry, then we find the highest temperatures, 18 or 19,

:01:25. > :01:27.uncertainty on Saturday night into Sunday, rain is not far away.

:01:28. > :01:29.Flirting with the south-east of the UK but for many parts, Sunday sees

:01:30. > :01:30.sunshine, pleasant in the sunshine but there will be showers, they

:01:31. > :01:32.could Hello, I'm Joanna Gosling,

:01:33. > :01:34.in for Victoria Derbyshire. Welcome to the programme if you've

:01:35. > :01:36.just joined us. 24 hours on and still no news

:01:37. > :01:46.on what happened to the EgyptAir plane which disappeared from radar

:01:47. > :01:53.screens early yesterday morning it's reported the Egyptian Navy has

:01:54. > :01:54.found some passenger belongings. There is no sign of the black box.

:01:55. > :01:58.We have the latest. Also on the programme,

:01:59. > :02:01.a handshake across the decades - two men who were once refugees

:02:02. > :02:03.fleeing the Nazis in the build up to World War Two,

:02:04. > :02:06.meet children who've fled in the Calais Jungle.

:02:07. > :02:09.and are now living on their own A non-Jewish woman persuaded a cargo

:02:10. > :02:12.boat to take us and five days later, Those surviving members

:02:13. > :02:30.of the kindertransport are now calling on the government do far

:02:31. > :02:32.more to help children living on their own

:02:33. > :02:41.in the Calais jungle. We'll speak to former unaccompanied

:02:42. > :02:42.refugees. Olympic gold medallist

:02:43. > :02:45.Tessa Sanderson tells us about the challenges

:02:46. > :02:49.of adopting two young children. Here is Anita in the BBC Newsroom

:02:50. > :03:11.with a summary of today's news. Three British air accident

:03:12. > :03:15.investigators have arrived in Cairo to join the hunt for the cause of

:03:16. > :03:20.the Egypt air crash over the Mediterranean. The search today Brea

:03:21. > :03:24.Paris to Cairo flight has entered a second day with authorities

:03:25. > :03:28.targeting a wide area south of the Greek island of Crete. Our Cairo

:03:29. > :03:33.correspondent Sally in a bill says relatives of the 66 people on board

:03:34. > :03:37.the plane want answers. The president has been speaking to the

:03:38. > :03:41.Egyptian military units carrying out the rescue and search operations in

:03:42. > :03:46.the Mediterranean. He's asking them to finish the job as soon as they

:03:47. > :03:52.can, so everyone can have a clue about what exactly happened, and

:03:53. > :03:58.caused the plane to go missing. There is a sense of frustration

:03:59. > :04:01.among the families I've spoken to yesterday and today, they woke up to

:04:02. > :04:04.this horrifying news and don't know what happened to their loved ones.

:04:05. > :04:08.They say the authorities aren't telling them anything.

:04:09. > :04:20.Egyptian military have found debris from the craft, including passenger

:04:21. > :04:22.belongings in the sea off the coast of Alexandria. If you have questions

:04:23. > :04:34.underway in the Mediterranean, on the search operation...

:04:35. > :04:38.crash investigator who will answer them live on Newsroom Live,

:04:39. > :04:41.here on BBC Two and the BBC News Channel, just use

:04:42. > :04:45.Figures due out later this morning are expected to show

:04:46. > :04:46.an unprecedented deficit among hospitals, and other

:04:47. > :04:54.It's thought it could be more than ?2 billion

:04:55. > :04:57.Experts are warning that the financial strain

:04:58. > :05:01.Psychiatric patients in England are having to travel up to 300 miles

:05:02. > :05:03.because of a shortage of hospital beds.

:05:04. > :05:05.Figures obtained by BBC News and the online journal

:05:06. > :05:07.Community Care show nearly 5,500 patients had to travel

:05:08. > :05:09.out of their local area to get the nearest bed.

:05:10. > :05:12.Our Social Affairs Correspondent Michael Buchanan reports.

:05:13. > :05:13.Jessica Wilson finds colouring relaxing and settling.

:05:14. > :05:15.The 21-year-old has a range of mental health conditions,

:05:16. > :05:20.including depression and post-traumatic stress disorder.

:05:21. > :05:23.In December she fell ill, but there were no hospital beds

:05:24. > :05:25.available in her home in Lincolnshire, so she was forced

:05:26. > :05:46.Roehampton was the only place I could go so that made me

:05:47. > :05:50.feel even more scared, more vulnerable, more alone

:05:51. > :05:53.Jessica's experience is unfortunately

:05:54. > :05:57.Last year, nearly 5,500 psychiatric patients were forced to travel

:05:58. > :05:59.due to a lack of beds, that's a 13% increase

:06:00. > :06:03.Half of mental health Trusts say they've seen a 230%

:06:04. > :06:07.Some patients had to travel nearly 300 miles last year.

:06:08. > :06:09.In January, this NHS Trust took the unprecedented decision

:06:10. > :06:12.to declare a major incident due to problems finding beds for more

:06:13. > :06:20.There's a lot of time spent focusing on A and the crisis with A

:06:21. > :06:24.We had to really draw everybody's attention to there's a crisis

:06:25. > :06:26.here within mental health and it needed everybody to

:06:27. > :06:36.Ministers say it's unacceptable that patients can't find beds

:06:37. > :06:39.and have promised to end the practice within five years.

:06:40. > :06:47.Jewish refugees who fled the Nazis on the eve of the Second World War

:06:48. > :06:50.are calling on the government to do more to get children out

:06:51. > :06:53.of the migrant camp in Calais - and be reunited with their families

:06:54. > :07:03.Labour peer Lord Dubs and Rabbi Harry Jacobi who came

:07:04. > :07:05.to Britain as part of the Kindertransport project

:07:06. > :07:08.in the 1930s are urging the government to speed up

:07:09. > :07:10.the processing of asylum claims for unaccompanied children living

:07:11. > :07:14.Lord Dubs told this programme that Britain has a responsibility to help

:07:15. > :07:24.Young children are sleeping rough and sleeping in the jungle in

:07:25. > :07:30.Calais, they are sleeping at railway stations, it is shocking. They

:07:31. > :07:35.aren't escaping the gas chambers as happened in 1938-39, it is shocking

:07:36. > :07:39.with young people left there. I argue that Britain should take some,

:07:40. > :07:43.quite a lot, and other countries like France should play a part. We

:07:44. > :07:46.have a responsibility to take some and give them a decent life.

:07:47. > :07:48.It's emerged that five prison officers were taken hostage

:07:49. > :07:51.by an inmate with a bladed weapon at Highpoint prison

:07:52. > :07:55.A report seen by the BBC shows the stand-off came a day

:07:56. > :07:57.after another hostage incident at the same prison which

:07:58. > :07:59.involved a prisoner taken hostage inside a cell.

:08:00. > :08:03.Both ended without injury and are now under investigation.

:08:04. > :08:05.Almost 300 actors, musicians, writers and artists have said

:08:06. > :08:09.they back the campaign to stay in the European Union.

:08:10. > :08:11.Benedict Cumberbatch, Bill Nighy, and Kiera Knightly are among stars

:08:12. > :08:13.who have signed a letter in the Guardian saying

:08:14. > :08:20.Brexit would "damage" the creative industry.

:08:21. > :08:23.But House of Cards author Lord Dobbs said British success in the industry

:08:24. > :08:32.Councillors in North Yorkshire will meet later to discuss

:08:33. > :08:35.whether or not to approve fracking in England for the first time

:08:36. > :08:39.since a ban on the technique was lifted in 2012.

:08:40. > :08:42.They will consider plans by Third Energy to frack at a site

:08:43. > :08:46.Many residents fear it will increase noise and pollution.

:08:47. > :08:48.The company says its operations poses no risks to people

:08:49. > :08:58.That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 10.30.

:08:59. > :09:07.I just wanted to pick up on some breaking news about Reckitt

:09:08. > :09:11.reportedly found as investigators search for the EgyptAir plane that

:09:12. > :09:15.disappeared off the radar yesterday en route from Paris to Cairo. An

:09:16. > :09:23.Egyptian army spokesman said plane wreckage was found 180 miles from

:09:24. > :09:28.Alexandria. In Egypt. It is reported that Egyptian aircraft and Navy

:09:29. > :09:31.vessels have found personal belongings of passengers and parts

:09:32. > :09:38.of the wreckage around 180 miles north of Alexandria. So, that is

:09:39. > :09:45.coming through, that is one of the boats in the area, that is involved

:09:46. > :09:48.in the search operation for the plane that came down with 66 people

:09:49. > :09:52.on board. We will keep you updated as we get more.

:09:53. > :09:55.Thanks for your comments on children stranded in the so-called Jungle

:09:56. > :10:01.Steph tweeted - It's sad that two survivors of Nazi Germany have

:10:02. > :10:06.to witness the UK government again ignoring genocide.

:10:07. > :10:09.But John emailed - We should not allow these child

:10:10. > :10:11.refugees into the UK, if we do then it will open

:10:12. > :10:19.Do get in touch with us throughout the morning -

:10:20. > :10:22.use the hashtag Victoria Live and if you text, you will be charged

:10:23. > :10:26.Let's have a look at the sport now with Ore.

:10:27. > :10:33.Thank you. We are rattling through the guests here at the BBC Sport

:10:34. > :10:34.Centre. Just four years ago -

:10:35. > :10:37.when other teams were preparing for the European Championship -

:10:38. > :10:39.Northern Ireland conceded six goals in a friendly

:10:40. > :10:41.against the Netherlands. Fast forward to today and they're

:10:42. > :10:43.now preparing for their first major tournament for 30 years

:10:44. > :10:47.after qualifying for Euro 2016. It's been some transformation

:10:48. > :10:52.and I delighted to say the man who's presided over it - manager

:10:53. > :11:01.Michael O'Neill - joins me now... It is great to see you. Great to see

:11:02. > :11:06.the smile still on your face. We will look forward in a moment, but

:11:07. > :11:10.take us back to October last year, and the realisation after the win

:11:11. > :11:16.over Greece, you and your boys heading to France? It was magical.

:11:17. > :11:19.We had two chances really in the tournament, with Greece and Finland

:11:20. > :11:29.play but it was great how we did on the night, 3-1, a great performance,

:11:30. > :11:32.two Steven Davis goals. It was great to see the euphoria in the stadium

:11:33. > :11:36.and what it meant to Northern Ireland. And that realisation of

:11:37. > :11:40.going to the finals, its comrade quickly. You took those games on,

:11:41. > :11:47.top of the group, three points ahead Finland as well. To know that you, I

:11:48. > :11:50.would not say breezed through, but you went through so convincingly, it

:11:51. > :11:54.gives you such momentum going through to the Tom Wood? That is the

:11:55. > :12:01.most pleasing aspect, we wanted to give a chance on qualification and

:12:02. > :12:04.when we got that, it changed and we wanted to win the group. We have

:12:05. > :12:07.been unbeaten since publication in the friendlies we've played, the

:12:08. > :12:11.momentum is up at this moment in time and it is nice to go through as

:12:12. > :12:14.group winners. We are one of the smaller nations as well and

:12:15. > :12:18.hopefully we can continue to surprise people when we get there.

:12:19. > :12:23.You mention the goal-scorers, including Mr Davies, not more than

:12:24. > :12:27.one-year-old when Northern Ireland were last in the major championship,

:12:28. > :12:32.it is a huge occasion for the team and the country, when you get there,

:12:33. > :12:36.is that going to play a part? Will that be something that you use as

:12:37. > :12:41.motivation or will you want to play it down? I think we can use it as

:12:42. > :12:46.motivation, this is a new experience for us, the players, and supporters,

:12:47. > :12:48.a whole generation of Northern Ireland supporters, it is their

:12:49. > :12:52.first experience in a major tournament. I think that it will

:12:53. > :12:55.work in our favour, there's freshness about it, perhaps on

:12:56. > :13:07.naivete, it could work in our favour. The big

:13:08. > :13:11.nations go in every two years, players are asked to play in these

:13:12. > :13:14.big tournaments but for our guys it is the biggest stage in their career

:13:15. > :13:17.and I think they will make the most of it. Unfortunately we've run out

:13:18. > :13:20.of time, we did not even get the chance to talk about Germany. We

:13:21. > :13:22.will be talking more in about 30 minutes. But for the meantime, we

:13:23. > :13:23.appreciate talking to you. Thank you. It is a

:13:24. > :13:29.very busy programme today! Refugees who fled the Nazis

:13:30. > :13:32.on the eve of the Second World War, are calling on the government to do

:13:33. > :13:35.more to get children out Hundreds of unaccompanied children

:13:36. > :13:39.are living in the Jungle, and charities say they are at

:13:40. > :13:42.serious risk of harm and death because the government isn't

:13:43. > :13:43.moving quickly enough This programme had exclusive access

:13:44. > :13:50.as two former Jewish refugees - Labour peer Lord Dubs

:13:51. > :13:52.and Rabbi Harry Jacobi - who came to Britain

:13:53. > :13:54.as children in the 1930s, travelled to France to meet

:13:55. > :14:05.the children stuck in the Jungle. A handshake across the years.

:14:06. > :14:10.Separated across decades, connected by history.

:14:11. > :14:14.The moment two elderly men, wants child refugees in Europe, met a new

:14:15. > :14:22.generation in peril. The Nazis came to Holland, in the Second World War.

:14:23. > :14:29.I was rescued and came to England. As a refugee. Like you, I was

:14:30. > :14:36.unaccompanied. Let me introduce you to some of the team... Labour peer

:14:37. > :14:43.Lord Dubs and Harry Jacobi have come here, the Calais jungle, home to 400

:14:44. > :14:50.children there without a family. More than 70 years ago, they both

:14:51. > :14:54.made their own journey to safety. As the world war loomed, the British

:14:55. > :14:57.government saved 10,000 children from the Nazis. The kindertransport

:14:58. > :15:02.gave safe passage to Jewish children from all over Europe, bringing them

:15:03. > :15:06.to our shores by the boatload. Harry left his parents in Berlin, and made

:15:07. > :15:15.it to Holland. Only for the Nazis to invade in 1940. After leaving

:15:16. > :15:20.Holland, we arrived at Liverpool, and I have a picture here in the

:15:21. > :15:27.Liverpool paper. That is the picture? To show how we arrived in

:15:28. > :15:31.Liverpool on the 19th of May, 1940. Earlier this month, Lord Dubs led a

:15:32. > :15:35.successful campaign to force a Gottman to welcoming more known

:15:36. > :15:39.children seeking asylum in Europe. It is thought there are almost

:15:40. > :15:45.90,000 unaccompanied kids across the EU. In Calais, there are more than

:15:46. > :15:49.400. Charity citizens UK says 457 of them have a legal claim to come to

:15:50. > :15:57.Britain because they have a relative waiting for them -- 157. Harry and

:15:58. > :16:01.Alf met two of those boys from Afghanistan, aged ten and 12. They

:16:02. > :16:05.wanted to remain anonymous will stop they walked over mountains and

:16:06. > :16:09.stayed in car boots. Scared of older men and French police and tear gas,

:16:10. > :16:15.they said they would keep trying to get onto lorries bound for England.

:16:16. > :16:19.Nobody denies that the jungle is a dangerous place, and the government

:16:20. > :16:22.has agreed to do more. Ministers insist they are working as quickly

:16:23. > :16:27.and safely as possible and in the best interests of the children. But

:16:28. > :16:30.campaigners say it is not fast enough.

:16:31. > :16:34.The kindertransport is not just a story of how 10,000 children cheated

:16:35. > :16:39.the Nazis, it is about how a nation responded to the great moral

:16:40. > :16:42.question of its time. 70 years on, those veterans say the question has

:16:43. > :16:48.come back. The circumstances are different but they are asking

:16:49. > :16:53.Britain, are we prepared to do today what we did in the past? In 1938,

:16:54. > :16:58.39, Britain took 10,000 unaccompanied child refugees from

:16:59. > :17:03.Germany and Czechoslovakia. It was not our problem then but we did it.

:17:04. > :17:07.As the former refugees prepared to leave, the children had a message

:17:08. > :17:12.for them to take home. Think about your children. If they were in our

:17:13. > :17:14.position, how would you feel? Thank you for your time. Good luck, and we

:17:15. > :17:27.will do our best. Thank you. In a moment we will talk to a

:17:28. > :17:32.humanitarian worker in Calais, and a man who came to the UK a few years

:17:33. > :17:40.ago as an unaccompanied child. First, we are going to speak to

:17:41. > :17:46.Roger Gale. You took in a refugee. Why did you do that? At the time I

:17:47. > :17:50.felt it was the right thing to do. My wife and I discussed it

:17:51. > :17:53.carefully. One thing we have to understand is that when we talk

:17:54. > :18:01.about the children we are talking about people under 18. A good number

:18:02. > :18:07.already are under 14. Taking on a teenager is not easy. It is not easy

:18:08. > :18:12.taking on a teenager if they speak your own language. If they don't,

:18:13. > :18:16.and they have been traumatised, it is not something anybody can do.

:18:17. > :18:22.This idea that there is an army of people waiting to take and foster

:18:23. > :18:28.children is a myth. I have a very high regard for Alf Dobbs. He is a

:18:29. > :18:33.close friend. But I'm afraid he is wrong on this respect. The Jewish

:18:34. > :18:37.community in the United Kingdom under talk and did, to take in

:18:38. > :18:43.children, to bring them up and to pay for them throughout their lives

:18:44. > :18:49.until they were adult. That is what they did. Alf had his own father

:18:50. > :18:53.here. The people we are talking about have no fathers here. The

:18:54. > :18:58.children who do have families here, we need to process them faster. But

:18:59. > :19:01.for the rest of them, you are comparing apples and pay is. Are you

:19:02. > :19:13.saying it is difficult because these kids have issues? That they should

:19:14. > :19:18.not come here at all? First I believe the PM are's policy remains

:19:19. > :19:26.right. That is to take refugees, approved and vetted, from the camps.

:19:27. > :19:31.That way we can control the process. We know they have been checked out.

:19:32. > :19:35.We can provide properly for them. But the second thing that we have to

:19:36. > :19:42.be very careful indeed, is that we make absolutely certain that any

:19:43. > :19:45.young people that do come from anywhere, actually, have the right

:19:46. > :19:51.and proper homes to go to. What we do not want to see our children, Inc

:19:52. > :19:54.from one danger zone to another danger zone in the form of, and I am

:19:55. > :19:59.sorry I have to say this, paedophilia or whatever. Not

:20:00. > :20:03.everybody wanting to take children in his doing it for the right

:20:04. > :20:11.motives. Checks and balances have to be in place. It is important we

:20:12. > :20:16.remember that. I know this sounds harsh, but I fear that as a result

:20:17. > :20:19.of what has been changed by pressure, and the fact the

:20:20. > :20:24.government has to some extent given way, it will encourage people

:20:25. > :20:30.traffickers to encourage children to make the very dangerous journey

:20:31. > :20:34.across the seas of Greece and across Europe. Some of those children will

:20:35. > :20:38.die because some of those boats will sink. The people promoting this

:20:39. > :20:40.course of action will have some of those -- that blood on their hands.

:20:41. > :20:42.Thank you very much. We talk to Iona Lawrence,

:20:43. > :20:53.who is a humanitarian worker She is sobbing children come to the

:20:54. > :21:04.UK. What is the situation as far as you're concerned? Hi, there. I just

:21:05. > :21:08.wanted to start by saying I am sorry to hear about the difficult

:21:09. > :21:15.situation that you find yourself in, Roger. I work for a Citizens UK in

:21:16. > :21:19.Calais and we have been working here offer in excess of seven months to

:21:20. > :21:25.reunite the children here will have a legal right to be in the UK, with

:21:26. > :21:30.their families. There are seven -- 150 or so here who have a legal

:21:31. > :21:34.right to be in the UK. As we heard from Roger and in the piece

:21:35. > :21:38.beforehand, these are children who currently, due to their not being an

:21:39. > :21:43.effective, efficient system for them to be reunited with their families,

:21:44. > :21:46.are left with no option but to take incredibly dangerous decisions every

:21:47. > :21:50.day to reach their families through their own means. Children have died

:21:51. > :21:55.doing this and they will continue to die until there is an effective

:21:56. > :21:59.system for them to be transferred safely. Ultimately what Citizens UK

:22:00. > :22:05.are calling for is for them to be transferred as soon as possible,

:22:06. > :22:12.safely and effectively, so that they can join school in September. It is

:22:13. > :22:16.only through joining school they can regain a semblance of the childhood

:22:17. > :22:20.they have lost through conflict and the dangerous journey to Calais.

:22:21. > :22:32.What are your thoughts as you see the children in the refugee camps

:22:33. > :22:38.but obviously hear the perspective of Roger Gale and others, who think

:22:39. > :22:48.the UK should not be doing more to help bring more people here? Good

:22:49. > :22:51.morning. It is dangerous when politicians like Roger make such

:22:52. > :22:56.statements. His statement is based on an assumption as though these

:22:57. > :23:01.children have a choice. I made this journey ten years ago and not by

:23:02. > :23:05.choice but out of desperation. In difficult circumstances. Those

:23:06. > :23:09.children who reached Europe last year are not doing it because they

:23:10. > :23:13.thought Europe was easy, they were risking their lives for their

:23:14. > :23:16.safety. We should be doing everything to show compassion and

:23:17. > :23:21.welcome those children with the dignity and respect they deserve.

:23:22. > :23:23.Citizens UK does an excellent job. The government should listen. Thank

:23:24. > :23:27.you very much. We contacted the Home

:23:28. > :23:29.Office for its response. Immigration Minister James

:23:30. > :23:33.Brokenshire said: "The UK Government is committed

:23:34. > :23:36.to providing life-saving support and assistance to the vulnerable

:23:37. > :23:38.children who have been unjustly impacted by this ongoing

:23:39. > :23:39.humanitarian crisis. And we are targeting

:23:40. > :23:41.our efforts to assist Everyone wants this to happen

:23:42. > :23:45.as quickly and as safely as possible, but we must ensure

:23:46. > :23:47.it is in the best We are working with Local

:23:48. > :23:50.Authorities in the UK, the UNHCR as well as with

:23:51. > :23:53.counterparts in Greece, France and Italy to identify

:23:54. > :23:55.vulnerable children to bring to the UK and make sure the support

:23:56. > :24:02.systems are in place There is confusion over whether a

:24:03. > :24:06.second Nigerian schoolgirl has been located. We will have the latest.

:24:07. > :24:15.Let's talk to Olympic gold medallist Tessa Sanderson. She has said age

:24:16. > :24:17.should be no barrier when it comes to adopting.

:24:18. > :24:19.The 60 year-old former javelin thrower and

:24:20. > :24:22.in six Olympic Games, has now adopted two young children

:24:23. > :24:24.with her 54 year-old husband, Densign White.

:24:25. > :24:32.Thank you both have seen a picture of your gorgeous

:24:33. > :24:35.children. It has come later in life, hasn't it? Before the children came

:24:36. > :24:43.into your life, had you given up hope of having kids? I had,

:24:44. > :24:49.actually. I had two IVFs and it did not really work. I was quite

:24:50. > :24:50.actually. I had two IVFs and it did it not happening. I thought,

:24:51. > :24:53.actually. I had two IVFs and it did I do? I more or less gave up hope.

:24:54. > :24:57.But then I thought, I really love I do? I more or less gave up hope.

:24:58. > :25:04.children, there are so many children in my family. My sister has kids, my

:25:05. > :25:10.brothers... Then I met my husband and had a chat with him again and we

:25:11. > :25:15.thought, fantastic, let's go forward and do this.

:25:16. > :25:18.thought, fantastic, let's go forward in your 50s. Obviously that is not

:25:19. > :25:21.an easy undertaking because that potentially means children coming

:25:22. > :25:28.into your life and having to move on again? Yes, but I think for us and

:25:29. > :25:33.for myself, the age did not come to mind because I thought we are fit

:25:34. > :25:40.enough. We are healthy enough. We have been active in our sporting

:25:41. > :25:44.career. Irony wanted to children. Why should that be a barrier? I knew

:25:45. > :25:47.there would be a lot of medical things we would have to go through

:25:48. > :25:54.but I did not let the age frightened me and it did not you either, did

:25:55. > :25:59.it? Not at all. I cannot believe you are 60. You look amazing. You'll are

:26:00. > :26:05.thank you. I tried to keep as healthy as possible. When the

:26:06. > :26:09.children came along, Cassius and Ruby May, you thought they were

:26:10. > :26:14.coming as foster children. That is how they came. But when they came

:26:15. > :26:18.into your house, how did you feel? What difference did they make? Made

:26:19. > :26:25.an enormous amount of difference. Even beforehand when we went to see

:26:26. > :26:30.the children, because they were born prematurely, they fitted on your

:26:31. > :26:39.hand. They were very tiny and very ill at the time. They were born

:26:40. > :26:55.premature. We have some video of you playing with them. Her recent is

:26:56. > :27:05.this? About two years ago. Cassius? I have put them in a little box in

:27:06. > :27:21.the park. Keep them quiet. Don't eat the box! They look adorable. They

:27:22. > :27:24.have grown a lot since then. Now we have introduced them to running and

:27:25. > :27:28.all that sort of this thing. When they came to was it made an enormous

:27:29. > :27:32.amount of difference because we knew they were very poorly and we knew

:27:33. > :27:40.they -- we had to undertake things with medication and all that.

:27:41. > :27:45.Hospital visits and all that. It did not deter us. How did the situation

:27:46. > :27:53.change? Obviously they were being fostered. You find yourselves able

:27:54. > :27:58.to adopt them. The local authority made it known to us the long-term

:27:59. > :28:04.plan for the children was for them to be adopted and not for them to

:28:05. > :28:09.stay in fostering. And then at that point, we had more or less decided

:28:10. > :28:16.that we could not let them go. We kind of bonded with them. And so we

:28:17. > :28:21.spoke to the social workers and said that we would like to be considered

:28:22. > :28:28.as adoptive parents. They were quite happy to let that go forward. There

:28:29. > :28:37.were so many rigorous tests we had to go through. Things like social

:28:38. > :28:40.workers calling ad hoc. I know people say things about social

:28:41. > :28:43.workers but they have a job to do and they were absolutely brilliant.

:28:44. > :28:49.It did not matter whenever they called. If you are not up to speed

:28:50. > :28:54.about recording daily things, you have to do all of that as well, to

:28:55. > :28:58.make sure that things are good. The background of families. Make sure

:28:59. > :29:05.you have a close-knit family. For me it was great because Denzel's mum,

:29:06. > :29:11.although she is in Wolverhampton, she is always here. My sister, my

:29:12. > :29:17.niece. You have to have that family bonding back-up in order. It does

:29:18. > :29:24.not just happen overnight. Those are things anybody goes through when

:29:25. > :29:30.fostering or adopting? Absolutely. Did you ever feel the age was a

:29:31. > :29:35.concern? Not for you what I mean for the social workers who were looking?

:29:36. > :29:42.I think at first they thought, is this going to be a problem? But once

:29:43. > :29:50.they sort of met us and were speaking on the terms of, this is

:29:51. > :29:54.what is required etc, how would you feel? They looked at us and saw that

:29:55. > :30:02.we were out with the kids a lot. They mentioned that the kids need to

:30:03. > :30:05.go out and be active. I don't think it became a factor really in the

:30:06. > :30:11.long run because they could see that we were on the ball. There are

:30:12. > :32:00.probably people You are both Olympians, do you hope

:32:01. > :32:03.the kids follow in your footprints? It would be great if they do that

:32:04. > :32:05.but we would support them in whatever career they choose to

:32:06. > :32:11.pursue. Whether it be sport, or something else professionally. It

:32:12. > :32:14.would be fantastic. Sport gave us something else professionally. It

:32:15. > :32:17.great pathway but the thing is, Cassius, he loves edgier and to

:32:18. > :32:27.death, Cassius, he loves edgier and to

:32:28. > :32:30.time, Ruby is into dancing and being active, -- Ed Sheeran. But I know

:32:31. > :32:33.the confidence that sport can give you, there are challenges but it is

:32:34. > :32:40.a great part. I would encourage them to do that. Is it rejuvenates in?

:32:41. > :32:44.Not that you need it! But talking about the music, I think of those

:32:45. > :32:49.activities you do with young kids, it takes a lot to do them but it

:32:50. > :32:51.gets you engaged? Yes, you learn about the things that they like to

:32:52. > :33:00.watch on the TV, Peppa Pig, Frozen! about the things that they like to

:33:01. > :33:04.It is fantastic. It's been about the things that they like to

:33:05. > :33:11.learning curve. It has kept me even about the things that they like to

:33:12. > :33:14.fitter, and you are the same, it is great. It's a new challenge every

:33:15. > :33:18.day, they are at nursery great. It's a new challenge every

:33:19. > :33:22.I'm thinking, OK, in the morning, they play all of these jokey thing

:33:23. > :33:28.is to get them ready in time! You don't have as much time for yourself

:33:29. > :33:34.to relax as we may have wanted to have at this age, you come home from

:33:35. > :33:41.work and you want to put your feet up... You had that time

:33:42. > :33:45.-- before though, didn't you? think that fostering is a great

:33:46. > :33:52.thing to do, it's an encouraging, if think that fostering is a great

:33:53. > :33:57.child as a whole something secure, it is good. Fostering is a very good

:33:58. > :34:03.thing, there are a lot out there who need that help. Kayla says that you

:34:04. > :34:12.are 60 and you look good, keep it up! I'm trying! I will be doing

:34:13. > :34:16.that! Someone else says how amazing you look at 60. They are by that you

:34:17. > :34:22.became parents. Jess has tweeted "Amazing".

:34:23. > :34:26.became parents. Jess has tweeted Thank you. Still to come...

:34:27. > :34:34.schoolgirls is found - of the 218 missing Nigerian

:34:35. > :34:43.making one in in every six albums sold worldwide.

:34:44. > :34:48.Let's go over to Anita in the BBC Newsroom.

:34:49. > :34:54.There are reports from the Egyptian military that wreckage and luggage

:34:55. > :34:56.has been found of the EgyptAir plane that disappeared

:34:57. > :34:59.Egyptian aircraft and navy vessels have found personal belongings

:35:00. > :35:02.and plane debris off the coast of Alexandria in Egypt,

:35:03. > :35:07.Flight 804 went missing en route from Paris to Cairo

:35:08. > :35:12.The Egyptians have said terror is more likely than technical

:35:13. > :35:14.failure but the French foreign minister has this morning pulled

:35:15. > :35:26.TRANSLATION: We are looking at all possibilities but none are being

:35:27. > :35:31.favoured over others because we have absolutely no indication on the

:35:32. > :35:35.causes. We continue to search for plane debris, and have already

:35:36. > :35:39.dispatched one search aircraft, another is on the way, as well as

:35:40. > :35:43.one ship. We had to look at the wreckage and black boxes and analyse

:35:44. > :35:46.them because we want to find the truth, the whole truth.

:35:47. > :35:49.Two Britons living abroad have lost their Court of Appeal battle

:35:50. > :35:51.over the right to vote in June's EU referendum.

:35:52. > :35:53.The legal challenge was brought by World War Two

:35:54. > :35:55.veteran Harry Shindler, 94, who lives in Italy,

:35:56. > :35:57.and lawyer and Belgian resident Jacquelyn MacLennan.

:35:58. > :35:59.Under law, UK citizens who have lived abroad for more

:36:00. > :36:14.Parliament has determined the scope of the referendum franchise in

:36:15. > :36:18.section two of the 2015 act. The common law right to vote does not

:36:19. > :36:22.take precedence over an act of Parliament. The order of this Court,

:36:23. > :36:30.therefore, is the appeal is dismissed, the appearance to pay the

:36:31. > :36:34.costs of the appeal, subject to a cap of ?15,000. The appearance

:36:35. > :36:38.application to appeal to the Supreme Court is refused.

:36:39. > :36:42.Figures due out later this morning are expected to show

:36:43. > :36:43.an unprecedented deficit among hospitals and other

:36:44. > :36:47.It's thought it could be more than two billion pounds

:36:48. > :36:50.Experts are warning that the financial strain

:36:51. > :36:54.Psychiatric patients in England are having to travel up to 300 miles

:36:55. > :36:56.because of a shortage of hospital beds.

:36:57. > :36:58.Figures obtained by BBC News and the online journal

:36:59. > :37:01.Community Care show nearly 5,500 patients had to travel

:37:02. > :37:09.out of their local area to get the nearest bed.

:37:10. > :37:12.There's a warning from the EU Remain campaign this morning that

:37:13. > :37:14.infrastructure projects could suffer if the UK votes to leave.

:37:15. > :37:16.It comes from the Manchester City council leader -

:37:17. > :37:19.who says they would lose out on funding from

:37:20. > :37:24.In Manchester, the tram project there has had substantial

:37:25. > :37:33.It would mean, in future, if we needed to do something on this

:37:34. > :37:37.scale, and undoubtably we will need to do more things on this sort of

:37:38. > :37:41.scale within greater Manchester, it would make it very difficult, if not

:37:42. > :37:44.impossible, to do so in a way that gives good value for council tax

:37:45. > :37:46.payers. That's a summary of the latest news,

:37:47. > :37:49.join me for BBC Newsroom Time for a look at

:37:50. > :37:53.the sport with Ore. England's cricketers will be hoping

:37:54. > :37:57.to continue their fightback when play resumes in the first test

:37:58. > :37:59.against Sri Lanka They were floundering on 83-5

:38:00. > :38:02.yesterday before Alex Hales and Jonny Bairstow combined

:38:03. > :38:05.in an unbroken partnership of 88 before the rain ended play

:38:06. > :38:11.early at Headingley. Rory McIlroy has urged Muirfield

:38:12. > :38:13.to "see sense" after the club voted against accepting

:38:14. > :38:16.female members yesterday. The decision means the club

:38:17. > :38:19.won't be allowed to host Meanwhile, McIlroy is is back out

:38:20. > :38:30.on course at the Irish Open - Former French Open champion

:38:31. > :38:36.Roger Federer, has pulled out of this year's tournament

:38:37. > :38:38.with a back injury. He hasn't missed a Grand Slam this

:38:39. > :38:41.century, but has been Ross Murdoch's gold in the 200 metre

:38:42. > :38:49.breaststroke, was one of five European medals for Great Britain

:38:50. > :38:50.at London's Aquatics Murdoch won't be competing

:38:51. > :38:54.in the event at the Rio Olympics though after failing

:38:55. > :38:59.to qualify last month. That's all the sport for now.

:39:00. > :39:08.Joanna, back to you. Thank you. There are conflicting reports

:39:09. > :39:10.as to whether a second schoolgirl - one of more than 200 seized

:39:11. > :39:13.in the Nigerian town of Chibok by Islamist group

:39:14. > :39:15.Boko Haram 2 years ago - An army spokesman said Serah Luka

:39:16. > :39:19.was among 97 women and children rescued by troops in operations

:39:20. > :39:21.in the north-eastern Borno State. This comes just two days

:39:22. > :39:25.after the rescue of the first Chibok schoolgirl Amina Ali Nkeki

:39:26. > :39:31.who spent Thursday meeting Amina and her four-month-old baby

:39:32. > :39:33.were found by an army-backed vigilante group in the huge

:39:34. > :39:35.Sambisa Forest, close She has since been

:39:36. > :39:43.reunited with her family. In all, more than 200 girls remain

:39:44. > :39:46.missing after their abduction by Boko Haram gunmen

:39:47. > :39:48.from a secondary school dormitory The abduction led to

:39:49. > :39:53.a world wide campaign - which was supported by US

:39:54. > :39:59.First Lady Michelle Obama and The last time the group of girls

:40:00. > :40:07.were seen was in April this year, when a video broadcast by CNN showed

:40:08. > :40:10.15 girls in black robes. They said they were being treated

:40:11. > :40:13.well, but wanted to be back Joining me is our correspondent,

:40:14. > :40:18.Tulip Mazumder, and Virginia Comolli, author of Boko Haram:

:40:19. > :40:31.Nigeria's Islamist Insurgency. Tulip, tell us why it is taking so

:40:32. > :40:35.long to be able to get these girls out? Well, this is a huge and

:40:36. > :40:40.difficult task that's been going on for many years now. I travelled to

:40:41. > :40:46.north-east Nigeria last summer, and met some of the girls who had been

:40:47. > :40:50.held alongside the Chibok schoolgirls, they described

:40:51. > :40:54.unimaginable situations inside of the Sambisa Forest. I spoke to a

:40:55. > :40:59.girl called Miriam, who was 16 years old when I met her. She was seven

:41:00. > :41:03.months pregnant and was forced to marry a Boko Haram fighter and is

:41:04. > :41:07.carrying his child. She managed to run away, she was not rescued, she

:41:08. > :41:13.ran away and found someone who helped her. But, there are hundreds,

:41:14. > :41:17.probably more than 2000 and missed you and say other girls like her, a

:41:18. > :41:24.minority of them are the Chibok schoolgirls. It is known where they

:41:25. > :41:29.are, it is just difficult... You got to them, what is the issue? Well, we

:41:30. > :41:33.got to a certain point but even we had to turn back because of security

:41:34. > :41:37.problems further up the road to Chibok. These are very difficult

:41:38. > :41:41.areas. A few years ago you could not get anywhere near them, because Boko

:41:42. > :41:45.Haram were in charge of the areas but now the Nigerian military has

:41:46. > :41:49.made some forward marches into these areas.

:41:50. > :41:54.They've rescued a few hundred girls, but these have been notoriously

:41:55. > :41:57.difficult militants to pin down and the Grubman has been heavily

:41:58. > :42:01.criticised as to why it is taking so long. -- the government. The girls

:42:02. > :42:08.are pregnant, one of the girls long. -- the government. The girls

:42:09. > :42:14.Boko Haram... Why they'd do this and take them, presumably to take them

:42:15. > :42:16.as wives? Yes, absolutely, the Chibok girls are a comparatively

:42:17. > :42:19.small group Chibok girls are a comparatively

:42:20. > :42:27.number of civilians, it can be men, children and women kidnapped

:42:28. > :42:35.number of civilians, it can be men, Haram in the insurgency. The girls

:42:36. > :42:41.number of civilians, it can be men, are forced to marry

:42:42. > :42:48.number of civilians, it can be men, Smuggling goods for insurgents. We

:42:49. > :42:51.fear the number of them have become pregnant, it raises an

:42:52. > :42:54.fear the number of them have become and difficult question that even if

:42:55. > :42:56.these girls are rescued and managed to escape, how easy is it for them

:42:57. > :43:00.to be integrated within to escape, how easy is it for them

:43:01. > :43:04.communities, given the stigma that they will have once they come back

:43:05. > :43:07.to their own communities. In all, how many have been taken? We had

:43:08. > :43:10.reports of over 2000 people how many have been taken? We had

:43:11. > :43:18.been kidnapped by Boko Haram. how many have been taken? We had

:43:19. > :43:23.this area, how much power do Boko Haram actually wield? Over the last

:43:24. > :43:25.several months, Nigerian forces have made significant

:43:26. > :43:29.several months, Nigerian forces have that nowadays Boko Haram only

:43:30. > :43:30.operate in the far north of the Borno State in the north-east of

:43:31. > :43:32.Nigeria. much smaller, nonetheless, it is a

:43:33. > :43:44.fairly large area. much smaller, nonetheless, it is a

:43:45. > :43:49.and it is hard for the military to penetrate this area. Even if the

:43:50. > :43:51.and it is hard for the military to exactly where the girls are,

:43:52. > :43:55.launching an operation to rescue them would be a very dangerous one

:43:56. > :43:57.because there would be a high risk that the girls would be killed

:43:58. > :44:01.because there would be a high risk during the operation. And actually,

:44:02. > :44:08.Boko Haram would kill them to show the Nigerian military, as a threat

:44:09. > :44:11.to the Nigerian military. Tulip, you said Amnesty International were

:44:12. > :44:16.working to help the girls, some had been rescued. The journey was

:44:17. > :44:18.talking about the difficulties of integrating the girls into normal

:44:19. > :44:23.society when they are rescued, what happens with the girls who have been

:44:24. > :44:28.taken out of these situations? The help seems to be very limited, from

:44:29. > :44:33.what we saw. We were walking along in a village that had been affected

:44:34. > :44:37.and had people taken. I met a 66-year-old woman under a tree with

:44:38. > :44:43.the clothes she escaped and, she escaped Boko Haram and from the

:44:44. > :44:47.forest, she had nothing. She had not been seen by psychologists, she wept

:44:48. > :44:54.in front of me. I think I was the first person she'd spoken to and she

:44:55. > :44:57.escaped months ago. When I went there, I did not see anyone

:44:58. > :45:03.receiving help from the government, people were still in displaced

:45:04. > :45:06.people camps, there was not enough food and no psychological support.

:45:07. > :45:10.In terms of how you integrate the women back into the community it is

:45:11. > :45:17.a huge question. The years or months of trauma that they have endured is

:45:18. > :45:21.unimaginable, and being released, or being rescued, that is the start of

:45:22. > :45:26.a very long journey for them. Tulip and the Junior, thank you very much.

:45:27. > :45:32.Two Britons living abroad have lost a battle for the right to vote in

:45:33. > :45:35.the EU referendum. 94 year-old Harry Schindler

:45:36. > :45:37.is a World War Two veteran living in Italy - he's fighting his case

:45:38. > :45:40.with Jacquelyn MacLennan, who moved to Belgium

:45:41. > :45:47.more than 25 years ago. We can listen to part of the

:45:48. > :45:54.judgment. Parliament has determined the scope of the referendum

:45:55. > :45:57.franchise in two of the 2015 act. The common-law right to vote does

:45:58. > :46:02.take precedence over an act of Parliament. The order of this court

:46:03. > :46:06.therefore is that the dismissal -- the appeal is dismissed. The

:46:07. > :46:12.appellants would play the cost subject to a capped at ?15,000. The

:46:13. > :46:22.application for permission to appeal to the Supreme Court is refused.

:46:23. > :46:28.They have lost their case. They have not been given permission to appeal.

:46:29. > :46:30.Well, we can speak to Jacquelyn MacLennan in Brussels.

:46:31. > :46:32.She's been fighting this case with Harry Schindler.

:46:33. > :46:34.John Little os an expat living near Palma in Majorca.

:46:35. > :46:36.He's been watching developments in the case closely.

:46:37. > :46:41.she's from the Netherlands and came to the UK,

:46:42. > :46:43.but she's not allowed to vote in the referendum either.

:46:44. > :46:48.Jacqueline, your reaction to the ruling? Obviously I am very

:46:49. > :46:52.disappointed. I would have hoped for a different judgment. However, we

:46:53. > :47:05.are able to go to the Supreme Court and ask the Supreme Court for

:47:06. > :47:09.permission to appeal. The argument is very specific to the EU

:47:10. > :47:18.referendum and the Brexit vote. That is, the refusal to allow me and

:47:19. > :47:21.others in my situation to vote, is an infringement of my EU rights. The

:47:22. > :47:25.part of the judgment that you listened to, and your listeners were

:47:26. > :47:32.able to hear, did not deal with that argument. That is a very important

:47:33. > :47:36.argument being brought. Why do you feel so strongly that you want to be

:47:37. > :47:42.able to vote in the referendum when you do not live in Britain? Because

:47:43. > :47:46.the vote would have a huge impact on my professional life and my

:47:47. > :47:56.professional -- personal life. I do not live in the UK. But I worked

:47:57. > :47:59.very closely. I visit the UK a great deal to visit my parents in the

:48:00. > :48:06.North of Scotland, and for holidays with my children, who are at

:48:07. > :48:13.university in the UK. For all of these reasons I feel very strongly

:48:14. > :48:18.that I should have the fundamental democratic right of a vote in my

:48:19. > :48:21.country of citizenship. Harry has not lived here for 34 years. How

:48:22. > :48:29.long is it since you have lived here? I have been living outside the

:48:30. > :48:35.UK since 1987. More than 25 years. But I am so often back in the UK, I

:48:36. > :48:40.do feel I am very closely connected. John Little, you have been living in

:48:41. > :48:49.Majorca for 41 years. Did you want to be able to have a chance to vote?

:48:50. > :48:53.I certainly did. Myself and many of my friends. The fact I have lived

:48:54. > :48:57.abroad for so long does not mean that I do not have British blood

:48:58. > :49:06.flowing through my veins. I feel very strongly that in a referendum

:49:07. > :49:10.vote which is going to so definitely affect the country for generations

:49:11. > :49:14.to come, that all British passport holders should have the right to

:49:15. > :49:21.have their opinion heard in a referendum vote. You have got the

:49:22. > :49:27.opposite situation because you live here but are from the Netherlands.

:49:28. > :49:32.You cannot vote. Why do you want to? I want to vote because, as someone

:49:33. > :49:37.who contributes to society and has been living here for 18 years and is

:49:38. > :49:40.from the Netherlands, and has children who are British, I think it

:49:41. > :49:48.is really important that I have a vote in their future. When it comes

:49:49. > :49:56.to how they are going to be living and how their freedom is in the

:49:57. > :49:59.future. When they are 18, they will be allowed to vote in government

:50:00. > :50:07.elections because they are British and I am not. However, today it is

:50:08. > :50:11.up to me. And I think it is really important that I should have a say

:50:12. > :50:17.seeing as I do contribute to society and I love living here. Jacqueline,

:50:18. > :50:21.you are running out of time. You say you can go to the Supreme Court but

:50:22. > :50:25.the government QC in the case previously has said that if your

:50:26. > :50:29.side won, it would make it impossible to hold the referendum on

:50:30. > :50:36.the 23rd of June, getting ever closer to that date now... I do not

:50:37. > :50:40.believe that is right. There is the possibility of making a change in

:50:41. > :50:41.the law very quickly. The technology that is there to enable citizens to

:50:42. > :50:46.go on to the registered to vote, that is there to enable citizens to

:50:47. > :50:51.for votes to be cast, there no reason at the moment to suggest this

:50:52. > :50:57.could not be done in time for the referendum. The government has drawn

:50:58. > :51:01.the line at 15 years as the time period in which someone can have not

:51:02. > :51:07.lived in the UK before they lose their right to have a say in what is

:51:08. > :51:11.going on here. Obviously you disagree with the 15 years. You have

:51:12. > :51:16.lost the legal argument every step of the way so far. Do you think

:51:17. > :51:20.there should be any time-limit? You have not lived here for a very long

:51:21. > :51:25.time and the same with Harry, who has brought the case with you. I do

:51:26. > :51:28.not think there should be a limited time. The government does not think

:51:29. > :51:31.there should be a limit. The government

:51:32. > :51:36.there should be a limit. The arbitrary and it is unfair. It

:51:37. > :51:41.the question of the government finding the time to have made the

:51:42. > :51:44.change in the law. It did not find that time. The time is still there

:51:45. > :51:44.change in the law. It did not find for that to happen. And I

:51:45. > :51:47.change in the law. It did not find much that will still be done. Thank

:51:48. > :51:54.you all very much for joining us. with British artists accounting

:51:55. > :51:56.for one in every six But the trade body -

:51:57. > :52:00.the British Phonographic Industry - says revenues failed to grow,

:52:01. > :52:02.and it's blaming the video Let's look at

:52:03. > :52:18.most successful artists. #

:52:19. > :52:46.times. # Want you stay with me?

:52:47. > :52:57.# All my life you stood by me when no one else was ever behind me.

:52:58. > :53:03.# I'm ready for this, there is no denying...

:53:04. > :53:14.# So darling, hold my hand. With me is Gennaro Chris Culliver

:53:15. > :53:21.from the British Phonographic Industry. And in West Sussex we are

:53:22. > :53:27.joined by Jake Isaacs, a British singer signed by Sir Elton John's

:53:28. > :53:33.label in 2014. It is good to hear British music -- music is thriving?

:53:34. > :53:37.Has been doing incredibly well for some years. Five of the top ten

:53:38. > :53:41.bestselling albums last year were British artists and they dominated

:53:42. > :53:47.at home as well. Seven out of the top ten. Consumption of music

:53:48. > :53:51.generally but by British artists particularly is rocketing. You are

:53:52. > :53:57.worried it is not translating into increases in revenue? Indeed. Around

:53:58. > :54:00.half of the revenue is going to developing and marketing artists.

:54:01. > :54:07.They do a great job supporting this British success, as do the BBC

:54:08. > :54:14.promoting it and so on. It is important to back British music. Is

:54:15. > :54:16.that a risk? Yes, because we need more revenues to keep that success

:54:17. > :54:29.story going. Last year various platforms

:54:30. > :54:36.considered -- contributed 146 million. Video streaming, they also

:54:37. > :54:44.account for about one fifth of all the consumption. Their revenues went

:54:45. > :54:46.up just 0.4%. It amounted to 24 million across these platforms. That

:54:47. > :54:54.is less than the amount of vinyl which has been coming back, vinyl

:54:55. > :54:58.did 25 million. Huge consumption through these sites, particularly

:54:59. > :55:02.you Tube, who are becoming massively successful, but not much of it

:55:03. > :55:06.coming back to labels and artists. If you want to keep this fantastic

:55:07. > :55:11.success story going, we need more money to keep the investment

:55:12. > :55:22.building. Jake, as an artist, are you finding it hard to make money?

:55:23. > :55:26.It comes with the job, doesn't it? I totally, totally agree there is a

:55:27. > :55:34.lot of money to be made. Recently there were 40 million views on

:55:35. > :55:40.YouTube. When you combine that with advertising opportunities, and just

:55:41. > :55:44.money to be made via YouTube, there is a sense of artists missing out. I

:55:45. > :55:48.really feel there is a lot of opportunity to be gained by artists

:55:49. > :55:54.continuing to use YouTube, whether that money is completely made or

:55:55. > :56:01.not. For example, Justin Bieber, 2007, he would have been found by

:56:02. > :56:05.Murray Povich -- not have been found, if he had not continued to

:56:06. > :56:11.utilise YouTube. At the same time, Victoria Kelly. Fundamentally for

:56:12. > :56:17.artists, the question needs to be asked, am I doing this to make as

:56:18. > :56:21.possible or to relate to people from different demographics and walks of

:56:22. > :56:25.life? I am not saying making money is bad. Priorities need to be put in

:56:26. > :56:29.place from an artist point -- from the point of view the artists. We

:56:30. > :56:33.are not in it for money. We are in it for the art fundamentally. You

:56:34. > :56:42.are assigned to Elton John's record label. He were also talking about

:56:43. > :56:45.the opportunities online. All of the big names you talked about were

:56:46. > :56:54.discovered online. Is it possible to have a career now without being

:56:55. > :57:00.signed to a label? Absolutely. I think that is completely evident.

:57:01. > :57:08.There are a number of artists. Scatter. A very well-known global

:57:09. > :57:15.wrapper from the UK. -- sceptre. He has just released his own album,

:57:16. > :57:20.which was top of the charts. There are various things that can be

:57:21. > :57:24.achieved, as long as you utilise completely various streams like

:57:25. > :57:30.Spotify and YouTube, understanding that in order to get something you

:57:31. > :57:34.have to give something. That is so important in matter what level of

:57:35. > :57:38.music career you are at. We are seeing again some of our most

:57:39. > :57:40.successful British artists. Something is being done very right

:57:41. > :57:47.in the British music industry. What is it? Incredible talent to begin

:57:48. > :57:53.with. Add Dell is an amazing global icon. We have a cheering, Sam Smith,

:57:54. > :57:59.such great depth of talent. It is not just about one Boro two big

:58:00. > :58:02.names. These artists keep the door open for the next generation. That

:58:03. > :58:07.is happening. Labels, publishers, they invest hugely in these artists

:58:08. > :58:12.and bringing the next generation through. There is a great deal of

:58:13. > :58:18.investment. Just to pick up on Jake's point, labels to need the

:58:19. > :58:21.revenues to carry on investing. Thank you very much.