08/12/2016

:00:09. > :00:12.I'm Victoria Derbyshire, welcome to the programme.

:00:13. > :00:15.It's been called the most serious form

:00:16. > :00:16.of corruption facing the police service.

:00:17. > :00:20.Hundreds of officers and staff stand accused of sexually exploiting

:00:21. > :00:23.people they're meant to be helping, including victims of crime.

:00:24. > :00:29.after they made him sign a gagging clause to keep quiet

:00:30. > :00:31.about the sexual abuse he suffered at the club.

:00:32. > :00:34.Gary Johnson, the player in question, joins us live.

:00:35. > :00:37.Plus more criticism of the FA from families who say their concerns

:00:38. > :00:44.Knife crime is on the rise across the UK, and police say most

:00:45. > :00:47.of those caught carrying blades have no links to gangs.

:00:48. > :00:49.We'll have a special report and hear how the problem

:00:50. > :00:56.It's really difficult to be a young person and see the victim

:00:57. > :01:04.and murderer and know them both and to not really know what to say

:01:05. > :01:06.because you're saying rest in peace to the person that died,

:01:07. > :01:09.but you also know the person that did it.

:01:10. > :01:13.of the Queen of Pop twerking the other day - now we've

:01:14. > :01:16.got her full Carpool Karaoke performance after it aired last

:01:17. > :01:32.# they had style, they had grace. Wheater Hayward gave good face.

:01:33. > :01:36.# Don't just stand there, let's get to it, strike a pose, there's

:01:37. > :01:44.nothing to it, Vogue! Welcome to the programme,

:01:45. > :01:50.we're live until 11 this morning. Do get in touch with us this morning

:01:51. > :01:53.if you've had a baby in a midwife-led unit

:01:54. > :01:56.or if you work in one. We're discussing them this morning

:01:57. > :01:58.because of a BBC investigation into the numbers of women who end up

:01:59. > :02:04.facing long transfers to hospital Do get in touch on all the stories

:02:05. > :02:13.we're talking about this morning - use the hashtag #VictoriaLIVE

:02:14. > :02:16.and if you text, you will be charged An inspection of police forces

:02:17. > :02:21.in England and Wales has revealed that more than 300 officers

:02:22. > :02:24.and staff have been accused - over a two year period -

:02:25. > :02:26.of using their position to sexually exploit people, including

:02:27. > :02:28.victims of crime. The Inspectorate of Constabulary

:02:29. > :02:30.said the abuse of authority for sexual advantage was now

:02:31. > :02:33.the "most serious" form of corruption facing

:02:34. > :02:36.the police service. Our Home Affairs Correspondent

:02:37. > :02:39.Danny Shaw has more. PC Stephen Mitchell,

:02:40. > :02:43.jailed in 2011 for raping and indecently assaulting

:02:44. > :02:46.vulnerable women he met But a report has found since then,

:02:47. > :02:53.hundreds of other police officers have been accused of abusing their

:02:54. > :02:58.power to sexually exploit people. The vulnerability of the victims

:02:59. > :03:00.is what makes this type You might have women who officers

:03:01. > :03:09.encounter as victims of domestic There might be women that police

:03:10. > :03:17.officers have arrested in the course of their duties, and in a few cases,

:03:18. > :03:20.there might be vulnerable The common factor, if you like,

:03:21. > :03:25.is a relationship of power They are there as the guardian

:03:26. > :03:34.and they become an abuser. In the two years to the end

:03:35. > :03:38.of March, 334 police officers and staff were accused

:03:39. > :03:40.of sexual offences. But the watchdog found

:03:41. > :03:47.fewer than half, 48%, were referred to the Independent

:03:48. > :03:48.Police Complaints Commission. The Constabulary says previous

:03:49. > :04:01.allegations should now be reviewed should now be reviewed

:04:02. > :04:03.and considered for referral. The report was commissioned

:04:04. > :04:05.by Theresa May when she was Home It acknowledges that most officers

:04:06. > :04:09.and staff work with integrity and honesty, but warns that some

:04:10. > :04:11.police forces are still failing to recognise the alleged abuse

:04:12. > :04:14.as a serious form of corruption. The National Police Chiefs' Council

:04:15. > :04:17.agrees police must be more proactive in rooting out such behaviour,

:04:18. > :04:20.and says it is developing a national strategy to help

:04:21. > :04:33.all forces to do so. Let's talk to our home affairs

:04:34. > :04:38.correspondent Danny Shaw. So the most significant issue in terms of

:04:39. > :04:42.police corruption facing the service in England and Wales? Yes, most of

:04:43. > :04:46.us have a view of corruption is something that involves money, Brown

:04:47. > :04:50.envelopes, bribing people and so on. But actually, this is a form of

:04:51. > :04:54.corruption because the police officers are abusing their position,

:04:55. > :04:59.their status and power. And they are undermining trust in the police

:05:00. > :05:04.service. And they are using it to sexually exploit people in a way

:05:05. > :05:09.that has a terrible effect on victims and a corrosive effect on

:05:10. > :05:13.public confidence in policing. How big is the issue? You have seen the

:05:14. > :05:17.figures in that report. We don't know whether that figure has gone up

:05:18. > :05:20.or down in recent years. The suggestion is that the problem is

:05:21. > :05:25.under reported. There is also a concern about what happens to police

:05:26. > :05:31.officers when they are accused of these offences. As we saw in the

:05:32. > :05:35.report, fewer than half of cases are referred to the independent police

:05:36. > :05:39.'s commission and over a one-year period, there were something like 60

:05:40. > :05:42.to 70 officers who left the service as a result of allegations

:05:43. > :05:47.concerning sexual conduct. So it looks like there are many who are

:05:48. > :05:51.perhaps not being dealt with through the disciplinary system. But you

:05:52. > :05:56.have to remember that in some cases, suspects will make allegations

:05:57. > :06:01.against police because they want to get off the charges or because they

:06:02. > :06:04.are facing serious consequences. So undoubtedly, some of the allegations

:06:05. > :06:06.may be false and we have to bear that in mind.

:06:07. > :06:08.Now a summary of the rest of the day's news.

:06:09. > :06:13.There's been more criticism of the Football Association over how

:06:14. > :06:16.it has responded to allegations of sexual abuse in the 1990s.

:06:17. > :06:19.Ian Ackley, who was abused by a man with links to Manchester City,

:06:20. > :06:22.has told this programme that his father's calls for better

:06:23. > :06:30.Letters seen by the BBC suggest the organisation,

:06:31. > :06:34.which runs football in England, was waiting for a change in the law

:06:35. > :06:39.before it updated its child protection policies.

:06:40. > :06:42.MPs have voted overwhelmingly in favour of the Government's plan

:06:43. > :06:45.to start formal talks on Brexit by the end of March next year.

:06:46. > :06:47.The majority of MPs also supported a Labour motion requiring

:06:48. > :06:50.the Government to reveal an outline of its plans for leaving the EU.

:06:51. > :06:57.Let's get more from our political guru Norman Smith.

:06:58. > :07:03.Iain Duncan Smith has been talking about Labour having given the

:07:04. > :07:07.government some sort of blank cheque now, but it is not as simple as

:07:08. > :07:11.that, is it? It is not as simple as that, but many Brexit supporting MPs

:07:12. > :07:15.are jubilant because they believe this is a historic moment, when

:07:16. > :07:24.Labour has agreed to Brexit and to Mrs May's timetable. If you look at

:07:25. > :07:28.some of the Brexit supporting papers, Downing Street have sought

:07:29. > :07:36.to play it down, saying last night's vote was not binding. If the Supreme

:07:37. > :07:39.Court decide they're still has to be legislation, that could Trump last

:07:40. > :07:49.night's motion. Inside Labour circles, there is anguish from some.

:07:50. > :07:54.Among them former Cabinet minister Ben Bradshaw. I was not prepared

:07:55. > :07:59.yesterday to commit myself to what I believed to be a rushed and ill

:08:00. > :08:02.thought through timetable, given the German and French elections. It

:08:03. > :08:08.would have been more sensible to invoke article 50 after the German

:08:09. > :08:11.elections. There can be no serious negotiations until after that, which

:08:12. > :08:15.gives us just a year to negotiate the biggest negotiation this country

:08:16. > :08:21.has ever had to achieve. So around one last night to Theresa May, but

:08:22. > :08:25.the big question is, what will the Supreme Court decides? They had

:08:26. > :08:28.their last day of the hearing today. If they say legislation is needed to

:08:29. > :08:33.trigger article 50, opposition MPs will pile into a that, which could

:08:34. > :08:38.delay or even thwart Mrs May's plans. Norman, thank you.

:08:39. > :08:41.New research suggests that some sufferers of psychotic illnesses -

:08:42. > :08:43.like schizophrenia - may in fact have a treatable

:08:44. > :08:46.In a nationwide study, scientists at the University

:08:47. > :08:55.of Oxford found up to one in 11 cases of psychosis may

:08:56. > :08:57.involve a condition where antibodies attack the brain.

:08:58. > :08:59.The team suggested that all patients displaying signs of psychosis

:09:00. > :09:02.for the first time should be screened for the antibodies

:09:03. > :09:04.to see if alternative treatments may be possible.

:09:05. > :09:06.This programme has learned that the number of people seriously

:09:07. > :09:09.injured or killed by knife crime has risen nearly 10% across the UK in

:09:10. > :09:21.Previously, much of the knife crime was believed to have been

:09:22. > :09:23.gang-related, but the Metropolitan Police say three quarters of

:09:24. > :09:25.incidents in London last year were carried out

:09:26. > :09:26.by people not associated with organised groups.

:09:27. > :09:29.One boy has told this programme some people carry knives just

:09:30. > :09:43.You are not always going to be with your friends, so you will not have

:09:44. > :09:46.someone to back you. And in those situations, that may seem like an

:09:47. > :09:49.alternative. That is why they carry it in the first place. They are

:09:50. > :09:51.thinking if there is a sign of danger, I will pull it out and do

:09:52. > :09:55.something and then get rid of it. Online adverts promoting food high

:09:56. > :09:58.in sugar and salt to children In a move to tackle obesity,

:09:59. > :10:02.brands will no longer be able to show their products on websites

:10:03. > :10:05.where under-16s make up But the Children's Food Campaign has

:10:06. > :10:09.warned that some of the most popular social media sites may not be

:10:10. > :10:11.covered by the rules as children make up less

:10:12. > :10:16.than 25% of their users. Donald Trump has chosen a climate

:10:17. > :10:19.change sceptic to run the US Scott Pruitt, the attorney-general

:10:20. > :10:22.of the oil-rich state of Oklahoma, is seen as a close ally

:10:23. > :10:30.of the fossil fuel industry. The number of giraffes has

:10:31. > :10:32.fallen so dramatically over the past 30 years,

:10:33. > :10:35.they are now vulnerable The International Union

:10:36. > :10:38.for the Conservation of Nature has included the animals on its latest

:10:39. > :10:41.Red List of the most threatened species -

:10:42. > :10:43.after seeing the population fall Habitat loss, poaching

:10:44. > :10:46.and civil unrest have been That's a summary of the latest BBC

:10:47. > :11:05.News - more at 9.30. We've got a film coming

:11:06. > :11:12.up on knife crime - really interested ot hear

:11:13. > :11:14.from you if you've been a vicitm of knife crime,

:11:15. > :11:17.if you've carried a knife, or you come across knives

:11:18. > :11:20.in the course of doing your job - Let me know what you would do to try

:11:21. > :11:33.and reduce the menace of knives The police are saying it is no

:11:34. > :11:36.longer about young people in gangs, it is about individuals thinking

:11:37. > :11:40.they need to carry a knife to keep them safe. Do what that after 9.30

:11:41. > :11:45.and let me know your experiences. Let's get some sport now

:11:46. > :11:47.with Hugh Woozencroft - and news this morning

:11:48. > :11:49.about the complaints made against British Cycling boss

:11:50. > :12:01.Shane Sutton by cyclist Yes, Jess Varnish says she is upset

:12:02. > :12:04.to find out the former technical director of British Cycling Shane

:12:05. > :12:08.Sutton was found guilty of using one offensive and derogatory term, but

:12:09. > :12:11.cleared of eight of the nine complaints she made against him.

:12:12. > :12:16.That included Jess Varnish's claimed that he told her to go and have a

:12:17. > :12:19.baby. Sutton was also cleared of bullying allegations and denies all

:12:20. > :12:24.of the claims made against him. Although he has left his job,

:12:25. > :12:26.Varnish said in a statement yesterday that it was heartbreaking

:12:27. > :12:30.that the majority of her claims were not upheld and that she had always

:12:31. > :12:34.told the truth. Here is our sports editor Dan Roan on what this could

:12:35. > :12:39.mean. Context is important, and we don't know about that yet, but it

:12:40. > :12:42.will surprise many that this transgression alone was deemed

:12:43. > :12:46.enough to have costs of them his career. Both sides are furious.

:12:47. > :12:50.Varnish said she was shocked by what she called a heartbreaking finding.

:12:51. > :12:54.Sutton has made no comment. His appeal will go ahead and she will

:12:55. > :12:58.now appeal as well, so both sides will take action. In the middle,

:12:59. > :13:06.British Cycling are seeing demands to produce more evidence and plunge

:13:07. > :13:13.both sides into turmoil. More now on the cricket. We would talk about

:13:14. > :13:17.Durham's Keaton Jennings. He's just 24 years old and was only called up

:13:18. > :13:22.last week because Haseeb Hameed broke and in the third test. Born in

:13:23. > :13:25.Johannesburg and the sun of former South Africa player and coach Ray

:13:26. > :13:29.Jennings, Keaton actually played his youth cricket representing South

:13:30. > :13:34.Africa's under 19s. The opening batsman had a little wobble, though.

:13:35. > :13:39.He was dropped before he had scored a single one and I am sure he was

:13:40. > :13:43.feeling the nerves then. But they settled well. He showed coolness and

:13:44. > :13:49.superb technique to make a test century in his first innings.

:13:50. > :13:54.England are now 209-2, having won the toss, but with serious work to

:13:55. > :13:58.do. They must win both remaining matches to level the series. And the

:13:59. > :14:04.highlights from last night's Champions League matches? There were

:14:05. > :14:08.contrasting fortunes for the Premier League sides who played last night.

:14:09. > :14:11.Spurs were already out of the competition but a 3-1 win over CSKA

:14:12. > :14:15.Moscow at Wembley did at least guarantee them a place in the

:14:16. > :14:18.second-tier Europa League. Premier League champions Leicester were

:14:19. > :14:21.already through to the knockout stages as group winners, but it was

:14:22. > :14:27.a disappointing night for them, beaten 5-0 by Portuguese giants

:14:28. > :14:32.Porto. Manager Claudio Ranieri blame himself after making five changes.

:14:33. > :14:36.The draw for the next round will be made on Monday. Thank you very much.

:14:37. > :14:41.Chelsea FC have apologised in person to one of their own ex-players

:14:42. > :14:46.who they subjected to a gagging clause after he told them

:14:47. > :14:52.he was sexually abused by a coach at the club.

:14:53. > :14:55.Just last year Gary Johnson was paid ?50,000 to keep his

:14:56. > :14:57.the assaults he suffered secret - but the club lifted

:14:58. > :14:59.the confidentialty agreement last week, apologising profusely.

:15:00. > :15:02.We'll talk to Gary Johnson in a moment about his meeting

:15:03. > :15:04.with members of the Chelsea board last night.

:15:05. > :15:06.But first - more criticism of the Football Association for how

:15:07. > :15:08.it responded back then to allegations of sexual abuse.

:15:09. > :15:11.We've been speaking to a former youth player who was abused

:15:12. > :15:16.in the 1980s by a coach linked to Manchester City.

:15:17. > :15:18.The player says the FA and the Government reacted

:15:19. > :15:25."dismissively and arrogantly" when his father raised serious

:15:26. > :15:26.concerns about child safety in the game.

:15:27. > :15:43.This is a man called Ian Ackley. He waived his right to anonymity in

:15:44. > :15:47.1997, as an abuse victim, to speak to a Channel 4 documentary about the

:15:48. > :15:51.abuse. He has waved it again to speak to us today. In 1997, the

:15:52. > :15:55.documentary was very important. It was the first substantial

:15:56. > :16:00.investigation into these allegations. In many ways, Ian

:16:01. > :16:03.Ackley was one of the first young players to come forward publicly and

:16:04. > :16:09.talk about this. It was after that programme was broadcast, act in

:16:10. > :16:12.January 1997, that his father started writing letters to anyone

:16:13. > :16:15.and everyone that could do something about this. We have copies of some

:16:16. > :16:21.of them here. There were literally dozens and dozens, to MPs,

:16:22. > :16:24.government departments and to the Football Association, raising

:16:25. > :16:29.concerns not just about his son's case, but about the wider state of

:16:30. > :16:35.child safety. And he was not impressed with the response? Not at

:16:36. > :16:39.all. Sadly, his dad passed away a couple of years ago. You get a sense

:16:40. > :16:44.of the frustration he was feeling. In this one, he is talking about the

:16:45. > :16:49.FA and he thought they would be most anxious to tackle this problem, but

:16:50. > :16:55.the organisation hardly bursts with concern for either matters past or

:16:56. > :17:01.future. We talked to his son, the man who was abused as a boy, about

:17:02. > :17:04.the response he felt his family received, not just from the Football

:17:05. > :17:07.Association, but from other associations, after the documentary

:17:08. > :17:16.went out and the letters were written.

:17:17. > :17:23.I could use the term flat. It was noncommittal some organisations

:17:24. > :17:27.admitted there were issues out there, but it was always somebody

:17:28. > :17:30.else's problem. The FA can't do it because they are waiting for

:17:31. > :17:35.government legislation, government legislation takes a long time to

:17:36. > :17:40.roll out and it is a complex matter. We recognise these problems...

:17:41. > :17:44.Pretty dismissive, at best. There is nothing that relates to any time

:17:45. > :17:53.frame, detail about actually what is going to be done. There is no

:17:54. > :17:57.collaboration, no insight as to what the thoughts are, where do you think

:17:58. > :18:04.we might be able to make changes? No approach, very much working in

:18:05. > :18:07.isolation, giving you snippets of information to appease you, so at

:18:08. > :18:13.least you have a response of some sort. I think they thought that was

:18:14. > :18:16.adequate, they were doing their job I just responding. When you look

:18:17. > :18:24.back at some of the letters, is it fair to say the tone feels like you

:18:25. > :18:28.are being brushed...? Very dismissive in that respect. Almost

:18:29. > :18:35.like we are dealing with it, it is not your business. We are who knows

:18:36. > :18:40.what they are doing, we will tell you where we are going, but that is

:18:41. > :18:43.it. I think it is very ignorant or organisations to take that

:18:44. > :18:48.standpoint. They are not expected to be experts in child safeguarding,

:18:49. > :18:52.they are sporting people. Surely you look to the experts for advice? To

:18:53. > :19:00.be dismissive of those showing concern, raising these points, it

:19:01. > :19:04.seems very ignorant and not appropriate to the situation. We are

:19:05. > :19:08.talking about children, you know? People that need us to protect them.

:19:09. > :19:12.I don't think you can get more serious than that.

:19:13. > :19:15.Not only was I affected when I was abused, but when I,

:19:16. > :19:17.my dad, Deborah Davis and the Dispatches programme tried

:19:18. > :19:22.to bang this drum extremely loudly, we were ignored for the second time.

:19:23. > :19:25.We are now in 2016, almost 20 years later,

:19:26. > :19:35.banging the same drum that we were banging back then.

:19:36. > :19:42.These are some of the letters we are talking about. This is just a small

:19:43. > :19:43.example. We were around his house yesterday and he has dozens and

:19:44. > :19:52.dozens of these, a huge pile. There is one to the Home Office,

:19:53. > :19:56.want to Michael Howard MP. There was a letter he had a copy of, from the

:19:57. > :20:03.then chief executive of the FA, Graham Kelly. He sent to Ian

:20:04. > :20:11.Ackley's father, various secretaries of clubs in the FA, dear sir, child

:20:12. > :20:15.protection of children is an issue that the Football Association sees

:20:16. > :20:21.as one of the utmost importance. This is the kind of information, the

:20:22. > :20:25.rhetoric that was coming out at the time. The argument that he and had

:20:26. > :20:29.was that they were saying the right things, but he felt they were

:20:30. > :20:32.getting brushed off. They were not take any complaints seriously, no

:20:33. > :20:37.dates were being given, not enough was being done. More claims about

:20:38. > :20:41.the FA, this time about criminal record checks? Goes to what he was

:20:42. > :20:45.just saying. That is a really interesting issue. We have been

:20:46. > :20:49.speaking to people who said that the FA was far too slow to bring these

:20:50. > :20:53.in four people working with children around this time, the end of the

:20:54. > :20:58.90s, the beginning of the 2000s. These checks do not just include

:20:59. > :21:02.information about convictions, it is called soft intelligence. If a local

:21:03. > :21:05.police force has a concern about somebody, but it might not have gone

:21:06. > :21:15.as far as going to court and getting a conviction. This is relatively

:21:16. > :21:17.new? In a way, before 2002, it was only schools, local authorities,

:21:18. > :21:22.statutory organisations that have put these in place. There was a way

:21:23. > :21:26.around it at the time. In 1994, there was a pilot project set up by

:21:27. > :21:30.the Home Office that did allow some children's charities to access the

:21:31. > :21:34.information. That was both for their own staff, to make sure they were

:21:35. > :21:38.compliant, but also on behalf of other people. We have been speaking

:21:39. > :21:42.to one of the charities involved in the pilot, a group called Fair Play

:21:43. > :21:47.For Children. They said the document you had gone out, they were being

:21:48. > :21:50.contacted by local youth leagues saying, look, can you check the

:21:51. > :21:58.coach, the referee, people like that which we have working for us? They

:21:59. > :22:02.checked 50 people, 49 were fine, one, the police had concerns. This

:22:03. > :22:07.person was barred from the club, removed. A year and a half later he

:22:08. > :22:10.was convicted of child sex offences. This charity was saying, we had a

:22:11. > :22:15.system that was working back then and proven to work. But it was not

:22:16. > :22:19.extended? This is the issue. The charity said they tried to extend

:22:20. > :22:25.it, they wrote to the FA. But they felt they were knocked back and

:22:26. > :22:28.knocked back. The person in charge of the charity even claims that the

:22:29. > :22:30.FA tried to block other youth clubs and leagues from taking part in the

:22:31. > :22:32.project. It was the FA and its principal

:22:33. > :22:35.person who I was warned had shut us down and was doing

:22:36. > :22:40.all they could to keep people away. My attitude was this,

:22:41. > :22:42.it was no reason other You can't do that

:22:43. > :22:49.with child protection. When I wrote to the chief executive,

:22:50. > :22:55.I got the bum's rush of an answer We should have had a relationship

:22:56. > :23:03.with the FA which would have done But more importantly, of course,

:23:04. > :23:08.it's the kids who come first, And this is what we learned

:23:09. > :23:14.from other scandals, particularly the sporting scandal

:23:15. > :23:16.in America, with the Penn State It was the reputation

:23:17. > :23:22.of the organisation, Too much jobsworth going on and not

:23:23. > :23:41.enough actual concern for the kids. What did the FA say? They say they

:23:42. > :23:44.don't feel it is right to comment on every allegation, because there is

:23:45. > :23:48.an independent investigation in place to deal with allegations of

:23:49. > :23:51.abuse and how the FA responded. They did eventually bring in compulsory

:23:52. > :23:57.checks for people working with children, but not until 2003. We

:23:58. > :24:01.think some of them were even going until 2007. That is ten years after

:24:02. > :24:04.Ian Ackley and his son were raising concerns. Thank you very much.

:24:05. > :24:07.Let's talk now to ex-Chelsea player Gary Johnson about the club paying

:24:08. > :24:09.him ?50,000 to keep his sexual abuse ordeal a secret.

:24:10. > :24:12.The 57-year-old went to the club to tell them about the abuse

:24:13. > :24:14.he suffered at the hands of chief scout Eddie Heath,

:24:15. > :24:17.who was the club's chief scout from 1968 to 1979,

:24:18. > :24:29.Chelsea paid Mr Johnson and included in the agreement

:24:30. > :24:31.a confidentialty clause, meaning Gary Johnson had to keep quiet

:24:32. > :24:39.Yesterday, Chelsea board memebers finally met Mr Johnson face to face.

:24:40. > :24:42.Gary Johnson, who says he was assaulted by Heath hundreds

:24:43. > :24:47.of times from the age of 13, is here now alongside

:24:48. > :24:56.Thank you for coming on the programme. What happened in the

:24:57. > :25:04.meeting with the chairman of Chelsea yesterday? Very humble. Basically,

:25:05. > :25:15.apologised for the way they have handled it. Admitted that we may be

:25:16. > :25:18.should have met 18 months ago. Apologising for the way they handled

:25:19. > :25:26.it, rather than the abuse? Also the abuse I have suffered with the club.

:25:27. > :25:33.I pointed out I have nothing against the new regime. What happened, I

:25:34. > :25:39.appreciate, was years ago. They were very profusely sorry to myself and

:25:40. > :25:47.my wife for the suffering we had gone through. They also admitted

:25:48. > :25:51.there were mistakes in the jargon between solicitors and insurance

:25:52. > :26:00.papers, and such. Leading to the gagging clause? They thought it was

:26:01. > :26:06.for my benefit. That is what they told you yesterday? Yes. They call

:26:07. > :26:16.this a mutual agreement. To me, it wasn't. I have not agreed to that.

:26:17. > :26:20.Was that apology enough? Is an apology enough? Probably too little,

:26:21. > :26:31.too late. We just have to see it as it is. An apology is an apology.

:26:32. > :26:34.Right now, I will take that. When you signed that confidentiality

:26:35. > :26:40.agreement, what were you thinking when they wanted you to keep quiet

:26:41. > :26:46.about the abuse you have suffered? With the document, I was basically

:26:47. > :26:50.pushed into a corner. The wording, from the solicitors and insurance

:26:51. > :26:55.companies, it was basically stating the fact that there is the money, to

:26:56. > :27:01.have the money you have to sign this. So I signed it. I agreed with

:27:02. > :27:09.my solicitor to say, OK, if that is what they want, that is what they

:27:10. > :27:16.can have. Do you think ?50,000 from a club worth billions, paying some

:27:17. > :27:22.of its players over ?100,000 a week, is enough? Nowhere near for the pain

:27:23. > :27:30.and suffering. No. Definitely not. What would have been a more

:27:31. > :27:33.appropriate some? Couldn't put a figure on it. Couldn't really put a

:27:34. > :27:42.figure on it. I wasn't looking that way anyway, at the beginning. It

:27:43. > :27:49.just happened. So, you know, you can't put noughts on anything. It is

:27:50. > :27:58.not going to bring anything back. Did the subject of money, yesterday?

:27:59. > :28:07.No. Do you think they should give you more? Yes, to build a better

:28:08. > :28:11.life for me and my wife, to get back to normality. Yes, personally, I do.

:28:12. > :28:21.Would make a difference to you, if they more? If it would make life a

:28:22. > :28:25.bit easier and give us some retirement, I suppose, a bit of

:28:26. > :28:30.peace. The help that he needs to get time to get the help we need. He has

:28:31. > :28:35.been too busy looking after me over the last 18 months, and previous to

:28:36. > :28:40.that, the children. Yes, it would make a huge difference to our life.

:28:41. > :28:47.But that is not what this is all about. It is the suffering that Gary

:28:48. > :28:52.has really suffered. And not just Gary, I should imagine many of the

:28:53. > :28:56.other families involved in this, they are suffering even as we speak.

:28:57. > :29:01.For as long as you have known Gary, he has been suffering the impact of

:29:02. > :29:06.what happened to him as a boy? Yes, without a doubt. Give us an insight

:29:07. > :29:15.into how he has been, over the decades. It started when he was 28.

:29:16. > :29:19.He actually told me. Then I noticed, early in the relationship, that his

:29:20. > :29:30.depression was quite dark. His anger was quite quick. I put it down to,

:29:31. > :29:36.he was still playing football, I put it down to the football. He was also

:29:37. > :29:42.doing The Knowledge. I put it down to pressure. As time went on, it got

:29:43. > :29:45.worse. It has got so worse over the last few years, in one year, when

:29:46. > :29:50.you added up the amount of time he did not speak to me, personally, it

:29:51. > :29:56.was about five months in one year, he never spoke to me. You know,

:29:57. > :30:00.three months, then another four weeks where he would turn on a

:30:01. > :30:04.sixpence, get angry and going to this deep, black depression. It was

:30:05. > :30:13.only when he was diagnosed that I fully understood what was causing

:30:14. > :30:21.it. I thought he had bipolar, he was manic depressive. I didn't connect,

:30:22. > :30:29.join the dots up, to see what was causing his behaviour. He is still

:30:30. > :30:32.prone to this, even this morning. When he knows he has two... When it

:30:33. > :30:42.is coming up, when he has to talk about things. How do you reflect on

:30:43. > :30:48.what happened to you as a boy? It took my youth away, it took my

:30:49. > :31:01.childhood, without a doubt. That is never going to come back. They label

:31:02. > :31:04.everything today, you don't understand, you can't understand

:31:05. > :31:10.what you are going through and why you are going through it. The tears,

:31:11. > :31:17.you wake up one day crying, on your own, and you can't understand why

:31:18. > :31:26.that is. You have been diagnosed with PTSD? Yes, that came as quite a

:31:27. > :31:35.shock. As I say, they put a label on why this was happening. Cutting to

:31:36. > :31:39.understand it a little bit better -- getting to understand it a bit

:31:40. > :31:45.better, it is not going to be overnight, it will need some

:31:46. > :31:51.counselling. Get the start period out of the way and move forward.

:31:52. > :31:56.Do you think other clubs could have paid other former players to keep

:31:57. > :31:59.quiet about the abuse they experienced? There could be some

:32:00. > :32:06.truth in them statements, without a doubt. And do you think there are

:32:07. > :32:11.yet more players still to come out and speak publicly? Most definitely,

:32:12. > :32:18.probably in the hundreds. Without a doubt. There is a lot now in the

:32:19. > :32:20.background that don't want to come forward, which I obviously can

:32:21. > :32:31.understand. But the guys that have come forward that open all this up,

:32:32. > :32:36.very brave guys, having to live with this. Definitely. I wonder what you

:32:37. > :32:41.think of our story yesterday, and yesterday, when we reported that a

:32:42. > :32:47.mum raised concerns decades ago. Today we are reporting that a dad of

:32:48. > :32:55.an abused player wrote to all sorts of people - the FA, government

:32:56. > :33:02.departments, local MPs, and he felt he was effectively dismissed. You

:33:03. > :33:06.was up against a brick wall. What Gary went through from 2013, even

:33:07. > :33:12.with the police involved, it was a brick wall. No one was taking any

:33:13. > :33:17.notice. They didn't want to believe that sexual abuse was going on in

:33:18. > :33:23.any club, not even just the football clubs. No one wanted to know. It was

:33:24. > :33:37.being brushed under the carpet. It was too big a thing to deal with. Is

:33:38. > :33:43.that what you think, Gary? Even now, I said to the three board members

:33:44. > :33:49.yesterday, it felt like, brush it under the carpet. Why do you feel

:33:50. > :33:52.that now? The FA said they are carrying out their own internal

:33:53. > :33:58.review. They say they are committed to publishing that, subject to legal

:33:59. > :34:01.restrictions. Chelsea are carrying out their own internal

:34:02. > :34:05.investigation. Other clubs are. Why do you still feel they don't really

:34:06. > :34:12.want to know? Because we have hit a brick wall. I have had it for 40

:34:13. > :34:21.years and hit a brick wall. And the last three years, again, people are

:34:22. > :34:30.disbelieving. The FA said they are investigating. They have changed

:34:31. > :34:34.their QC. But they need to start now, last week, the week before.

:34:35. > :34:41.They need to get to grips with it now. Do you trust the FA to get to

:34:42. > :34:45.the bottom of this? No. Why do you say that? Because they are not

:34:46. > :34:52.acting on it as we speak. The guys came out from Crewe last week. It

:34:53. > :34:55.just seems that they are maybe waiting for another story to break

:34:56. > :34:59.somewhere else in the country and they can brush it under the carpet

:35:00. > :35:06.and it will go away. We need help here. The guys that have come out on

:35:07. > :35:11.the guys that haven't come out and admitted that they have been abused,

:35:12. > :35:16.we need help from now, last week, the week before. It just doesn't

:35:17. > :35:23.seem to be coming forward. I have had no contact. From? The FA, the

:35:24. > :35:29.police. The police requested my details last week from Chelsea and I

:35:30. > :35:36.gave permission, because it is now all out in the open. I appreciate

:35:37. > :35:45.that these things take time, but it is now two weeks. As you heard,

:35:46. > :35:50.1997... Nothing changes. Until I see evidence that it does, maybe we can

:35:51. > :35:52.all start believing. Well, I am grateful for you coming on the

:35:53. > :35:54.programme. Thank you very much. If you've been affected by ay

:35:55. > :36:00.of the issues we've been talking about, you can find a list of

:36:01. > :36:04.helplines at the BBC action line - Despite the levels of knife

:36:05. > :36:15.crime falling since 2010, this programme has learned

:36:16. > :36:19.that the number of people seriously injured or killed by knife crime has

:36:20. > :36:22.risen 9% across the UK in the last Previously, much of the knife crime

:36:23. > :36:30.was believed to have been gang related, but the Metropolitan Police

:36:31. > :36:33.has told this programme that 75% of incidents in London last year

:36:34. > :36:36.were carried out by people not A 16-year-old boy has

:36:37. > :36:46.been stabbed to death... We carry knives around because it's

:36:47. > :36:48.just for protection, A lot of boys carry

:36:49. > :36:52.knives more frequently, Knife crime has become

:36:53. > :37:00.a perennial problem Despite repeated attempts

:37:01. > :37:07.by politicians, it won't go away. We've just got to send a signal

:37:08. > :37:09.that it's completely Before the election,

:37:10. > :37:13.his Prime Minister, our Prime Minister, promised

:37:14. > :37:15.there would be tougher It is simply not true that

:37:16. > :37:20.knife crime is rising because the police are no longer

:37:21. > :37:23.stopping and searching. London is one of the worst affected

:37:24. > :37:26.areas, and it is teenagers Of nearly 3,900 people injured

:37:27. > :37:34.by knives between August 2015-16, 17-year-old Shaquan Fearon

:37:35. > :37:43.was killed last September. He wasn't involved in gangs

:37:44. > :37:47.and didn't carry a knife. He was stabbed

:37:48. > :37:49.on the way to a youth club. His mother, Sharon,

:37:50. > :38:05.relives that day every day. I was so frightened the day

:38:06. > :38:08.when I got the call. Sharon, come quick,

:38:09. > :38:10.your son got stabbed. It was so scary to see

:38:11. > :38:35.my son lying down. I managed to talk to him, and I

:38:36. > :38:38.turned to him and said, Shaquan, Shaquan died from a catastrophic

:38:39. > :38:47.wound in his leg. Two boys under the age of 16

:38:48. > :38:54.were subsequently arrested. and the Crown Prosecution Service

:38:55. > :39:03.says only in exceptional circumstances will a third

:39:04. > :39:05.trial be approved. That could include new evidence,

:39:06. > :39:08.or evidence that a previous jury The CPS says there is no evidence

:39:09. > :39:16.of that kind in this case, Sharon says the system

:39:17. > :39:22.has let her down. Who killed my son and

:39:23. > :39:32.where is the killer? So, obviously, the police

:39:33. > :39:35.need to find his killer. I cannot move forward,

:39:36. > :39:37.I'm waiting and I really Her case has been taken up

:39:38. > :39:53.by a local Labour MP. It is actually deeply

:39:54. > :39:58.concerning and deeply upsetting for the family and the friends of

:39:59. > :40:01.Shaquan that actually, justice has I have had meetings

:40:02. > :40:07.with the Justice Minister, And I'm due to meet

:40:08. > :40:11.with the Attorney General. If justice isn't seen to be served,

:40:12. > :40:13.that has a knock-on effect to the local community

:40:14. > :40:15.and their faith So the judicial system, the police,

:40:16. > :40:22.we absolutely have to ensure that people are confident that the police

:40:23. > :40:26.are able to do their job, and that justice is served

:40:27. > :40:28.when there's such terrible crimes Knife crime has risen by 9%

:40:29. > :40:36.across England and Wales. In London, it's up by 16%

:40:37. > :40:39.over the last two years. Police in the capital attend 9,000

:40:40. > :40:43.incidents involving knives a year. 90% of those caught are boys,

:40:44. > :40:50.but the type of boy has changed. Several years ago,

:40:51. > :40:54.it was mainly a gang problem. Now the police think 75%

:40:55. > :40:56.of those who carry They're just doing it

:40:57. > :41:05.because they think everyone else is. We do seem to be seeing

:41:06. > :41:07.a shift in the way And yes, the police have been saying

:41:08. > :41:12.there is a shift away from gangs. It is still happening within gangs,

:41:13. > :41:15.but it does seem there are more young people carrying knives

:41:16. > :41:17.and willing to use them. It is hard to tell when it

:41:18. > :41:20.is a general problem, but when it was more related to gang

:41:21. > :41:28.crime, that was also difficult, but it didn't put us

:41:29. > :41:30.or the police off. We have to remember that tackling

:41:31. > :41:32.knife crime is difficult. No one solution will

:41:33. > :41:34.make a difference. There is no one reason why young

:41:35. > :41:37.people carry knives. We have to work with families,

:41:38. > :41:40.communities and the young people themselves to find the best way

:41:41. > :41:42.of reducing knife crime. 15 people under the age of 25 have

:41:43. > :41:45.been killed in London this year. Two of Malika's friends have

:41:46. > :42:11.been stabbed to death. She visits another

:42:12. > :42:14.in jail for murder. It's difficult to be a young

:42:15. > :42:16.person and see the victim and the murder and know them both,

:42:17. > :42:20.and to not know what to say because you're saying rest in peace

:42:21. > :42:22.to the person that died, but then you also know

:42:23. > :42:25.the person that did it. You don't exactly know what happened

:42:26. > :42:29.or how the argument started, but it was just a little argument

:42:30. > :42:32.and someone has died The trend is so worrying that

:42:33. > :42:39.Vicky Foxcroft has set up a cross-party youth violence

:42:40. > :42:41.commission, which will report It will look at the root causes

:42:42. > :42:47.as well as sentences for knife crime, and even the current stop

:42:48. > :42:50.and search policies. She is spending time

:42:51. > :42:53.consulting young people. Why do we feel that young people go

:42:54. > :43:00.and get involved in terms of knife crime and youth violence,

:43:01. > :43:05.and what can we do in advance It's a choice that they have to make

:43:06. > :43:11.when they resort to crime. It's not like a choice

:43:12. > :43:15.where they can say yes or no. What they fail to realise is once

:43:16. > :43:23.they start on the streets, they get chained to the streets

:43:24. > :43:27.and it is hard to get out of it. I've gone to school with people

:43:28. > :43:30.who are now in prison Understanding that situation,

:43:31. > :43:33.I know definitely that But what people are also not

:43:34. > :43:41.born with is a purpose. People where we live,

:43:42. > :43:43.we ain't got no... When you do get young

:43:44. > :43:55.teenagers watching the news, they'll just say, OK,

:43:56. > :43:59.he's stabbing someone, so I might as well just do that,

:44:00. > :44:03.because that's how they feel But when you're consistently shown

:44:04. > :44:12.one image, you are going to start to conform to that image

:44:13. > :44:15.and I feel as if a lot of the youth of the borough

:44:16. > :44:19.of Lewisham are conforming to this I know a people that,

:44:20. > :44:23.because of the area that they live in, they have to act a certain way

:44:24. > :44:27.and carry themselves a certain way. Sentences for knife crime

:44:28. > :44:29.offences have got tougher Now, if you're an adult

:44:30. > :44:34.and you are caught twice with a knife, you will probably

:44:35. > :44:37.go to jail. If you are under 16 and caught twice

:44:38. > :44:43.with a knife, you will either get a community sentence or a custodial

:44:44. > :44:47.one, averaging about six months. However, it doesn't appear

:44:48. > :44:55.that it is enough of a deterrent. This boy has never been in a gang,

:44:56. > :44:58.but admits he has carried He says boys do it simply because

:44:59. > :45:02.they are scared of each other. Every day, you are not always

:45:03. > :45:05.going to be with your friends, so you will not always have someone

:45:06. > :45:08.to back you. And there are situations

:45:09. > :45:11.where your fists ain't going to help you and that may seem

:45:12. > :45:13.like an alternative to other people. That's why they carry

:45:14. > :45:15.it in the first place. And they are thinking

:45:16. > :45:18.if there is a sign of danger, I will pull it out and do something

:45:19. > :45:21.and then get rid of it. If you're caught with a knife,

:45:22. > :45:24.you could go to jail if you're Well, there's people out

:45:25. > :45:29.there who would rather risk it instead of them getting physically

:45:30. > :45:32.hurt by the weapon instead. To them, going to jail would be

:45:33. > :45:36.a better alternative than them not I don't think it's about tougher

:45:37. > :45:44.sentences or being more harsh, it's more understanding,

:45:45. > :45:45.more opportunities, a deeper understanding of why the young

:45:46. > :45:50.person is actually committing crime. You need a sentence

:45:51. > :46:01.for the knife itself. If there is a murder or a knife

:46:02. > :46:06.cutting someone, it needs time. Very often now, more boys

:46:07. > :46:12.are going to bring out knives Even the little boys are going to be

:46:13. > :46:40.scared of the older ones, These was the latest statistics. --

:46:41. > :46:45.these are the latest statistics. 4397 knife possession offences were

:46:46. > :46:52.dealt with by the system. That is 9% more than in the same period last

:46:53. > :46:57.year. Your pertinent experiences of knife crime, as a victim, if you

:46:58. > :47:00.have carried a knife, if you are a police officer or teacher and come

:47:01. > :47:06.across knives in the course of your job, let me know. Send me an e-mail.

:47:07. > :47:08.What is the way to reduce knife crime?

:47:09. > :47:11.The Labour MP Luciana Berger says she's worried about the rise of far

:47:12. > :47:14.right extremists in the UK, after a 24 year old man was found

:47:15. > :47:17.guilty of the racially harassing her online.

:47:18. > :47:20.Joshua Bonehill-Paine posted anti-Semitic abuse

:47:21. > :47:24.in a series of blogs, calling her "an evil money-grabber"

:47:25. > :47:27.and posting offensive photo-shopped images of her.

:47:28. > :47:31.In her first broadcast interview after the conviction,

:47:32. > :47:34.Luciana Berger explained what it was like seeing the accused

:47:35. > :47:49.I recalled the reaction from some of my colleagues, copied into

:47:50. > :47:54.individual tweets, where they had seen how extreme they were. They

:47:55. > :47:57.were extreme will stop if anybody wants to look online, they can see

:47:58. > :48:06.this is not just somebody having a go, these are images of me that have

:48:07. > :48:10.been photoshopped using very anti-Semitic imagery, often violent,

:48:11. > :48:14.some pornographic, very extreme in nature. When you are subject to it,

:48:15. > :48:18.not just on Twitter but on other social platforms, it is quite

:48:19. > :48:22.difficult to explain how you feel. You are in the middle of it, I had

:48:23. > :48:26.to stop looking at my social media. For others outside, they are not

:48:27. > :48:30.aware what is going on. Just seeing one of them is enough for people to

:48:31. > :48:36.be absolutely outraged because it was so extreme. Did you feel unsafe?

:48:37. > :48:42.I felt unsafe because some of the people that got involved in that

:48:43. > :48:47.campaign, we can't say what the campaign was called, because it has

:48:48. > :48:52.language that we can't use on daytime television, it inspired

:48:53. > :48:57.others to post messages telling me to watch my back, told me they knew

:48:58. > :49:03.where I lived, made physical threats against me. A combination of all of

:49:04. > :49:06.those factors were incredibly difficult to contend with. Not just

:49:07. > :49:11.for me, but for those close to me, my family, I'm very lucky to have a

:49:12. > :49:16.fantastic team that I work with that were also exposed to it because it

:49:17. > :49:20.was coming from all directions, my Parliamentary inbox, my

:49:21. > :49:24.Parliamentary Facebook page, my personal Instagram. You name it, it

:49:25. > :49:27.was coming through. And in the post as well. Overwhelming. The man who

:49:28. > :49:32.will be sentenced after the conviction of yesterday, of racially

:49:33. > :49:40.aggravated harassment, his 24, Joshua Bonehill-Paine, his defence

:49:41. > :49:42.in court was that the posts were satire and pathetic, puerile

:49:43. > :49:46.rubbish, saying they fell within the right of freedom of speech. What do

:49:47. > :49:51.you think of the defence? That was the defence offered by the defence

:49:52. > :49:56.barrister. Joshua Bonehill-Paine himself did not give evidence. The

:49:57. > :50:01.judge asked the jury to take from that what they will. What did you

:50:02. > :50:05.take from that, that he would not stand? I think his evidence would

:50:06. > :50:08.have been so incriminating that it would have made it worse for him.

:50:09. > :50:15.The evidence was overwhelming, in terms of the conviction that was

:50:16. > :50:20.found, the verdict the jury came to. What about the defence that it came

:50:21. > :50:23.under freedom of speech? We have laws in place which determine what

:50:24. > :50:28.is free speech and where the line is crossed into hate speech. There are

:50:29. > :50:32.many examples of where people experience hate speech all the time,

:50:33. > :50:38.up and down the country, when they experience harassment. It went on

:50:39. > :50:43.for a long period. It was not just somebody expressing their political

:50:44. > :50:47.view. I was asked about individual elements of some of the posts. You

:50:48. > :50:52.could argue about individual elements. But if you look at it in

:50:53. > :50:57.the round, the headline, the photographs, the images, the text,

:50:58. > :51:03.all combined, it was clear it was racial harassment. What is your

:51:04. > :51:07.message to the far right racists? I am very concerned we are seeing an

:51:08. > :51:10.increase in the far right. We are seeing it across Europe, in our

:51:11. > :51:14.country as well. We know from official figures that there has been

:51:15. > :51:20.an increase in the number of people referred to the Prevent programme,

:51:21. > :51:27.from a right-wing extremist ideology. When that extremism

:51:28. > :51:33.crosses the line into terrorism, it also crosses the line into physical

:51:34. > :51:39.threats. What I hope people will take from the case, from the verdict

:51:40. > :51:42.yesterday, is that you will be taken seriously, whatever form of

:51:43. > :51:47.harassment or racial abuse you might be facing, that there is support out

:51:48. > :51:53.there and the courts will take it seriously. The British values that

:51:54. > :52:01.we hold dear, equality, tolerance, mutual respect, they apply as much

:52:02. > :52:07.online as they do off-line. We will wait for the sentence and the

:52:08. > :52:10.conviction, this is not tolerated in Britain and there are means and ways

:52:11. > :52:18.in which people will be held to account. The sentencing of a

:52:19. > :52:22.24-year-old is due today. We will bring that as soon as it comes in.

:52:23. > :52:24.A quarter of women who are admitted to give birth

:52:25. > :52:26.in midwife-led units end up being transferred to consultants.

:52:27. > :52:30.That's not necessarily a problem in itself,

:52:31. > :52:32.but an investigation by the BBC's data unit, which looked at hospital

:52:33. > :52:35.trusts across England, has found some women in labour

:52:36. > :52:37.are having to travel more than 30 miles by ambulance

:52:38. > :52:41.Campaigners say women need more information before deciding

:52:42. > :52:43.where to give birth - official guidelines recommend

:52:44. > :52:51.midwife units as the safest for low risk births.

:52:52. > :52:56.I know you will have your own experience of this. Let me know.

:52:57. > :52:59.Let's speak now to Cathy Warwick, chief executive of the Royal College

:53:00. > :53:01.of Midwives, Catherine Buckley, in our Shropshire studio,

:53:02. > :53:04.who had to be transferred during labour to another hospital

:53:05. > :53:08.and Kim Thomas from the Birth Trauma Association.

:53:09. > :53:16.Catherine, congratulations on the birth of Ralph. How old is he? Nine

:53:17. > :53:21.months. Tell us why you chose to give birth in a midwife led unit. I

:53:22. > :53:30.was low risk, there was no problems with me or the baby. You are

:53:31. > :53:34.encouraged to... Hello! To give birth in a midwife-led unit if there

:53:35. > :53:37.are not issues. It was close to my home, I felt comfortable and I knew

:53:38. > :53:42.that the midwives knew exactly what they were doing. There were some

:53:43. > :53:46.complications, what happened after that? The Labour went fine until I

:53:47. > :53:50.got to about ten centimetres and I was ready to start pushing. Then

:53:51. > :53:56.there was a publication that meant that I needed to be transferred by

:53:57. > :54:01.ambulance. -- a complication. The ambulance was called and it took

:54:02. > :54:08.about half an hour before it turned up. How was that for you, while you

:54:09. > :54:13.were waiting? It was really scary. I was shouting, where is the

:54:14. > :54:18.ambulance? The midwife kept going out and try to hurry it up. I really

:54:19. > :54:22.needed to try and have the baby, by that point. For any woman that has

:54:23. > :54:29.had a baby before, it is quite difficult to try to not have a baby.

:54:30. > :54:32.The advice was to try not to have it in the ambulance, because it is not

:54:33. > :54:38.a very nice environment and there would not be doctors present. What

:54:39. > :54:45.do you think about the way that it was handled? I think the midwife

:54:46. > :54:50.made exactly the right call to call the ambulance. You don't know if the

:54:51. > :54:57.baby is in distress. Obviously you need to get to the baby doctor. The

:54:58. > :55:01.difficulty with me was that it was such a crucial point in the labour

:55:02. > :55:06.that it was quite stressful and I was obviously in a lot of pain. I

:55:07. > :55:10.think I was a bit naive in thinking there would be an ambulance on

:55:11. > :55:14.stand-by, that it would only take 15 minutes to get there, hop in your

:55:15. > :55:20.car and drive to the consultant unit and that is how long it would take.

:55:21. > :55:24.I think an hour, which is how long it took from the ambulance being

:55:25. > :55:29.called, is too long, really, in an emergency. Absolutely. Let's bring

:55:30. > :55:32.in the chief Executive of the Royal College of midwives. Catherine was

:55:33. > :55:39.low risk, but things change, as they do, when women are giving birth.

:55:40. > :55:41.What do you think about how that was handled? I think midwives are

:55:42. > :55:45.working hard with local Ambulance Service is to make sure when they

:55:46. > :55:51.are needed they get there as quickly as possible. I think the important

:55:52. > :55:54.point is that the Nice guidelines and all of the evidence we have got

:55:55. > :56:01.shows that if women by Catherine chose to give birth in a midwife-led

:56:02. > :56:09.unit, even when they transfer, they do have better outcomes in the long

:56:10. > :56:12.run. What does that mean? They are happier with the outcome of their

:56:13. > :56:20.birth, the babies do just as well as if they choose to go to the

:56:21. > :56:24.obstetric unit in the first place. But we do need to get transfers

:56:25. > :56:30.right. A number of women will transfer, for a variety of reasons,

:56:31. > :56:33.usually not an emergency reason. It is important that women are given

:56:34. > :56:39.the right information about the possibilities. Of having to be

:56:40. > :56:47.transferred? Yes. Kim Thomas, do you have concerns about stand-alone

:56:48. > :56:54.midwife-led unit? Yes. The main one is to do with the distance from the

:56:55. > :56:59.consultant led unit. Quite a lot of women have to transfer. There are

:57:00. > :57:02.two issues. One is that it is quite psychologically distressing for

:57:03. > :57:05.women to have to transfer by ambulance, as Catherine's experience

:57:06. > :57:12.showed. The ambulance might turn up late. You have to be strapped into a

:57:13. > :57:16.stretcher, you arrive in hospital, you have to deal with a new team of

:57:17. > :57:21.people, it is all quite distressing. It might also slow down your labour.

:57:22. > :57:25.The other issue is that sometimes there will be an emergency that has

:57:26. > :57:29.to be dealt with straightaway. Having to spend 30 minutes

:57:30. > :57:33.transferring to another hospital really isn't acceptable. In some

:57:34. > :57:37.cases, you have not got 30 minutes, you need to deliver the baby

:57:38. > :57:42.immediately. What is the solution? Most of the women giving birth in a

:57:43. > :57:50.midwife-led unit will be low risk. Things change, what is the solution?

:57:51. > :57:54.Is it simply about transport? I think that is part of it. The main

:57:55. > :57:58.worry is that women are not necessarily making this choice

:57:59. > :58:05.really. We do know, as Cathy said, there are good outcomes for low risk

:58:06. > :58:12.women in second and subsequent labours in a midwifery unit. But a

:58:13. > :58:19.lot of consulting units are now closing. They are trying to

:58:20. > :58:25.consolidate maternity units, so there are longer distances for women

:58:26. > :58:29.to travel. Some women have to make the choice between going to a

:58:30. > :58:32.freestanding midwifery unit that is local, or to a consultant led unit

:58:33. > :58:38.that might be a long way away. That is really not a fair choice to ask

:58:39. > :58:43.women to make. Thank you very much. Catherine, thank you for coming on

:58:44. > :58:47.the programme and thank you to Ralph, very well-behaved. And thank

:58:48. > :58:57.you too came from the Birth Trauma Association. -- Kim.

:58:58. > :59:04.A Mild Start To The Day, We Have Rain Moving Across The Midlands. It

:59:05. > :59:08.Might Clip Southern Scotland Before It Clears. Behind It, A Lot Of

:59:09. > :59:11.Cloud, Drizzle, But Brighter Breaks. Northern Ireland And Scotland, After

:59:12. > :59:15.A Cloudy Start, It Will Brighten Up And There Will Be Sunny Spells.

:59:16. > :59:22.Temperature Is Not As High As Yesterday. 16 Or 17. This evening

:59:23. > :59:27.and overnight, cold enough for a touch of Frost. We have two weather

:59:28. > :59:33.fronts coming our way, both producing cloud and rain. It will

:59:34. > :59:38.remain mild overnight. As we head through tomorrow, the first weather

:59:39. > :59:42.front goes through. Then we have the second weather front coming in

:59:43. > :59:45.across southern Scotland, Northern Ireland, England, Wales and

:59:46. > :59:50.south-west England. Windy around this. Ahead of it, the cloud will

:59:51. > :59:55.build. Even so, some sunshine. Tomorrow's temperatures between ten

:59:56. > :59:58.and 13 Celsius. As we head on into Saturday, the weather front

:59:59. > :00:03.eventually makes it down into the south. It could be with us all day.

:00:04. > :00:04.A lot of cloud around, breezy with showers in the north. Sunday,

:00:05. > :00:12.looking dry EU for most of us. I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

:00:13. > :00:14.welcome to the programme It's the most serious form

:00:15. > :00:17.of corruption facing the police - says the force's watchdog -

:00:18. > :00:19.as more than 300 officers are accused of using their position

:00:20. > :00:22.to sexually exploit people We'll be speaking to

:00:23. > :00:26.the police just after 10.30. Former Chelsea player Gary Johnson

:00:27. > :00:38.says the scandal of football abuse is still being "brushed under

:00:39. > :00:41.the carpet"' by the authorities - and he told this programme that no

:00:42. > :00:43.compensation could make up You can't put Notts on anything. It

:00:44. > :00:53.is not going to bring anything back. Actress Sofia Vergara

:00:54. > :01:06.is reportedly being sued we'll tell you what that

:01:07. > :01:20.means just before 11. Betty Davies, we love you.

:01:21. > :01:25.# Ladies with an attitude, fellas that were in the mood.

:01:26. > :01:26.# Don't just stand there, let's get to it, strike a pose, there's

:01:27. > :01:32.nothing to it, overload! Now a summary of the rest

:01:33. > :01:43.of the day's news. And inspection of police forces in

:01:44. > :01:47.England and Wales has revealed that 300 forces have been accused of

:01:48. > :01:51.using their position to sexually exploit people.

:01:52. > :01:53.The Inspectorate of Constabulary said the abuse of authority

:01:54. > :01:55.for sexual advantage was now the "most serious" form

:01:56. > :02:07.of corruption facing the police service.

:02:08. > :02:13.Those killed or injured by knife crime rose 10% in the UK last year

:02:14. > :02:17.and by 16% in London. Previously, much of the knife crime was believed

:02:18. > :02:20.to have been gang-related, but the Metropolitan Police said three

:02:21. > :02:23.quarters of incidents in London last year were carried out by people not

:02:24. > :02:29.associated with organised groups. More on that in a moment in a

:02:30. > :02:32.special report for this programme. Chelsea football club have

:02:33. > :02:35.apologised in person to Gary Johnson for the abuse he suffered as a

:02:36. > :02:41.trainee in the 1970s at the hands of the club's former chief scout Eddie

:02:42. > :02:45.Heath. Mr Johnson was paid ?50,000 by the club as part of a

:02:46. > :02:50.confidentiality agreement. He told this programme nothing could make up

:02:51. > :02:54.for the suffering he was caused. Nowhere near for the pain and

:02:55. > :03:00.suffering, definitely not. What would have been a more appropriate

:03:01. > :03:04.sum, do you think? Could you put a figure on it? Couldn't really put a

:03:05. > :03:14.figure on it. I wasn't looking that way anyway at the beginning, it just

:03:15. > :03:16.happened. So, you know, you can't put noughts on anything. It's not

:03:17. > :03:19.going to bring anything back. New research suggests that some

:03:20. > :03:21.sufferers of psychotic illnesses - like schizophrenia -

:03:22. > :03:23.may in fact have a treatable In a nationwide study,

:03:24. > :03:27.scientists at the University of Oxford found up to one in 11

:03:28. > :03:30.cases of psychosis may involve a condition where

:03:31. > :03:33.antibodies attack the brain. The team suggested that all patients

:03:34. > :03:37.displaying signs of psychosis for the first time should be

:03:38. > :03:39.screened for the antibodies to see if alternative

:03:40. > :03:44.treatments may be possible. The number of giraffes has

:03:45. > :03:46.fallen so dramatically over the past 30 years,

:03:47. > :03:48.they are now vulnerable The International Union

:03:49. > :03:54.for the Conservation of Nature has included the animals on its latest

:03:55. > :03:57.Red List of the most threatened species after seeing

:03:58. > :03:58.the population fall Habitat loss, poaching

:03:59. > :04:03.and civil unrest have been That's a summary of the latest BBC

:04:04. > :04:26.News - more at 10.30. Thank you for your messages about

:04:27. > :04:31.knife crime. This text says, I am a paramedic and had to lose my

:04:32. > :04:33.livelihood due to PTSD and mouth crammed. Another text says the

:04:34. > :04:37.problem is the lack of punishment for not only carrying a knife, but

:04:38. > :04:41.also using one. My nephew was stabbed in the back in a pizza shop.

:04:42. > :04:47.The guy who did it got six months. That is wrong. Tom says, there is a

:04:48. > :04:51.charity that works with young people on substance abuse and mental

:04:52. > :04:54.health. From my experience, no one who commits a knife crime really

:04:55. > :04:58.sets out to do that. The issue is that when young people carrying

:04:59. > :05:02.knives, if they argue or fight, they use the knife out of instinct. The

:05:03. > :05:07.issue is how to stop young people carrying weapons. Prison sentences

:05:08. > :05:10.have no impact. No young adult stab someone because of the time they

:05:11. > :05:15.will spend in prison. They don't think about the consequences. I will

:05:16. > :05:18.read more of those later. We are going to talk about knife crime. If

:05:19. > :05:23.you are getting in touch, you are very welcome.

:05:24. > :05:33.It's been a day to remember for England's new opening batsman

:05:34. > :05:36.Keaton Jennings, who scored a century in his first Test innings

:05:37. > :05:39.on the first day of the Fourth Test against India in Mumbai.

:05:40. > :05:40.But it nearly was a day to forget

:05:41. > :05:48.when he offered a chance before he'd scored a run.

:05:49. > :06:04.as he closed in on his hundred and a reverse sweep took him

:06:05. > :06:06.past three figures - the first England player

:06:07. > :06:09.since Matt Prior nine years ago to score a century in his first Test

:06:10. > :06:13.Jennings knock came to an end on 112 when he became another

:06:14. > :06:22.Jess Varnish says she's "shocked and upset" to find out

:06:23. > :06:27.the former technical director of British Cycling, Shane Sutton,

:06:28. > :06:34.was found guilty of using one offensive and derogatory term

:06:35. > :06:35.but cleared of eight of the ninecomplaints

:06:36. > :06:39.That included Varnish's claim he'd told her to "go and have a baby".

:06:40. > :06:41.Sutton was also cleared of any bullying allegations,

:06:42. > :06:43.and denies all of the claims made against him.

:06:44. > :06:46.Here's our sports editor Dan Roan on what this

:06:47. > :06:50.Context is important and we don't know about that yet, but it will

:06:51. > :06:52.surprise many that this transgression alone was deemed

:06:53. > :06:56.enough to have costs at his career. Both sides are furious. Varnish said

:06:57. > :07:00.she was shocked by what she called a heartbreaking funding. Sutton has

:07:01. > :07:04.made no comment. His appeal will go ahead and I think she will appeal as

:07:05. > :07:07.well, so both sides could take legal action. In the middle of that is

:07:08. > :07:09.British Cycling, facing demands to see the full evidence and plunging

:07:10. > :07:12.them into turmoil. Fifa President Gianni Infantino says

:07:13. > :07:15.there must be zero tolerance The head of football's world

:07:16. > :07:18.governing body has also called for tough punishments for those

:07:19. > :07:29.found guilty of using the sport His words come amidst a series of

:07:30. > :07:34.accusations within British football, as we have been hearing on this

:07:35. > :07:41.programme. It is not only a football matter. It is a very serious matter.

:07:42. > :07:48.There are not many worse things in life generally than child abuse. So

:07:49. > :07:54.it has to be taken seriously. There must be zero tolerance from a

:07:55. > :07:56.football perspective, but also from a criminal perspective.

:07:57. > :07:58.Contrasting fortunes for the two Premier League sides

:07:59. > :08:02.Tottenham beat CSKA Moscow 3-1 to reach the Europa League

:08:03. > :08:13.were already through to the knockout stages as group winners,

:08:14. > :08:18.but it was a disappointing night for them, beaten 5-0

:08:19. > :08:29.Manager Claudio Ranieri "blamed himself" after making five changes.

:08:30. > :08:34.The draw for the first knockout round will be made on Monday.

:08:35. > :08:44.Latest figures suggest that a record number of people are in jail for

:08:45. > :08:45.knife possession. Despite the levels of knife

:08:46. > :08:47.crime falling since 2010, this programme has learned

:08:48. > :08:49.that the number of people seriously injured or killed by knife crime has

:08:50. > :08:53.risen by 20% in the last year. Previously, much of the knife crime

:08:54. > :08:56.was believed to have been gang related, but the Metropolitan Police

:08:57. > :08:58.has told this programme that 75% of incidents in London last year

:08:59. > :09:01.were carried out by people not Knife crime has increased by 9%

:09:02. > :09:16.across England and Wales. In London, it's risen by 16%

:09:17. > :09:18.over the last two years. Several years ago,

:09:19. > :09:28.it was mainly a gang problem. Now the police think 75%

:09:29. > :09:30.of those who carry They're just doing it

:09:31. > :09:34.because they think everyone else is. We do seem to be seeing

:09:35. > :09:36.a shift in the way And yes, the police have been saying

:09:37. > :09:41.there is a shift away from gangs. It is still happening within gangs,

:09:42. > :09:44.but it does seem there are more young people carrying knives

:09:45. > :09:46.and willing to use them. Two of Malika's friends have

:09:47. > :09:48.been stabbed to death. She visits another

:09:49. > :09:52.in jail for murder. It's difficult to be a young

:09:53. > :09:57.person and see the victim and the murderer and know them both,

:09:58. > :10:01.and to not know what to say because you're saying rest in peace

:10:02. > :10:03.to the person that died, but then you also know

:10:04. > :10:06.the person that did it. You don't exactly know what happened

:10:07. > :10:08.or how the argument started, but it was just a little argument

:10:09. > :10:11.and someone has died This boy has never been in a gang,

:10:12. > :10:15.but admits he has carried He says boys do it simply because

:10:16. > :10:20.they are scared of each other. Every day, you're not always

:10:21. > :10:23.going to be with your friends, so you will not always have someone

:10:24. > :10:33.to back you. And there are situations

:10:34. > :10:35.where your fists ain't going to help you and that may seem

:10:36. > :10:38.like an alternative to other people. That's why they carry

:10:39. > :10:40.it in the first place. And they're thinking

:10:41. > :10:43.if there is a sign of danger, I'll pull it out and do something

:10:44. > :10:46.and then get rid of it. you could go to jail if you're

:10:47. > :10:50.caught a couple of times. Well, there's people out

:10:51. > :10:54.there who would rather risk it instead of them getting physically

:10:55. > :10:56.hurt by the weapon instead. To them, going to jail would be

:10:57. > :10:59.a better alternative than them not seeing the next day,

:11:00. > :11:03.if that makes sense. Very often now, more boys

:11:04. > :11:07.are going to bring out knives Even the little boys are going to be

:11:08. > :11:11.scared of the older ones, Let's speak now to Vicky Foxcroft,

:11:12. > :11:20.Labour MP for Lewisham, Jonathon Toy, a youth violence

:11:21. > :11:27.expert and Orlando Miller and Tekisha Henry, who know people

:11:28. > :11:37.who have been affected Vicki, you have been an MP for just

:11:38. > :11:40.over a year. In that time, eight young people have been murdered in

:11:41. > :11:48.your constituency, all from knife crime and all under the age of 25.

:11:49. > :11:53.That is astonishing. Which is really worrying. After the first two young

:11:54. > :12:00.people were murdered, I was like, what do we do about this? That is

:12:01. > :12:04.why we had the first debate in Parliament, looking at the root

:12:05. > :12:09.causes of serious youth violence. It is one of the reasons why we have

:12:10. > :12:13.set up the commission, which is a cross-party commission, so there are

:12:14. > :12:18.politicians from all parties looking into how we deal with the causes of

:12:19. > :12:22.youth violence and making sure that as part of this review, we know

:12:23. > :12:26.there is lots of information already out there about what we need to do,

:12:27. > :12:36.but making sure we put this together to ensure that no stone goes

:12:37. > :12:39.unturned. Are you talking to people like Tekisha? Absolutely, and

:12:40. > :12:43.working with other youth groups across the country to make sure that

:12:44. > :12:48.young people's voices are at the heart of what the recommendations

:12:49. > :12:54.are. In terms of your own experiences of knife crime growing

:12:55. > :12:59.up, what would you say, Orlando? Personally, in life, you grow up in

:13:00. > :13:04.these areas and funding you notice is that you are going into a world

:13:05. > :13:09.where you are told to go to school, work. And people don't have a

:13:10. > :13:14.purpose of their own. What makes it worse is that you have a lot of

:13:15. > :13:20.people telling other people how they should be. I will give you an

:13:21. > :13:29.example. I was talking to someone, because I am into business, so I go

:13:30. > :13:33.straight to the CEOs to interview them. I am already done with

:13:34. > :13:40.workshops, because again, they give you a lot of waffle. And one thing

:13:41. > :13:43.he was telling me was that when his wife was walking around in Lewisham,

:13:44. > :13:48.she hides her money in her shoe because she is so scared. I was

:13:49. > :13:54.laughing at the facts, but can you imagine? We could have people

:13:55. > :13:59.walking around in Lewisham with opportunities for young people to do

:14:00. > :14:02.great things. Can I ask you why being told to go to school or work,

:14:03. > :14:09.as you described it, would lead someone to carry a knife? I find

:14:10. > :14:17.people in general, when there is loads of something, the value goes

:14:18. > :14:24.down. Meaning what? Everyone goes to school. But people don't know why,

:14:25. > :14:34.what is in it for them. And because people don't understand what it can

:14:35. > :14:39.do for them, people seem to stray. They get attracted to things like

:14:40. > :14:42.the media or music, that more attractive at that moment. Is

:14:43. > :14:48.carrying a knife more attractive than going to school? Definitely

:14:49. > :14:57.not. The knife the end result. No one wants to carry a knife, really

:14:58. > :15:01.and truly. Tekisha, this idea that carrying a knife is not necessarily

:15:02. > :15:05.related to being in a gang, individuals are carrying it because

:15:06. > :15:11.they want to, because they feel safe, what do you think of that? It

:15:12. > :15:16.is very sad. As a community, we have become very desensitised to carrying

:15:17. > :15:22.knives, to people dying on a consistent basis.

:15:23. > :15:29.Do you think we have? I see horror from people every time there is

:15:30. > :15:39.another fatal stabbing, people are thin arms. I know, I do see that as

:15:40. > :15:45.well. Who is desensitised? A large majority of society, when they hear

:15:46. > :15:49.somebody has been stabbed, they go, who? Another person has been

:15:50. > :15:57.stabbed? It is not much of a shock. That is what is really upsetting. We

:15:58. > :16:03.need some kind of young example. We need more success stories. We live

:16:04. > :16:08.in a time of crisis, we hear so many things from the media, this person

:16:09. > :16:11.has been stabbed, so many bad stories, when somebody here is

:16:12. > :16:15.another person got stabbed they think, again? They need to be

:16:16. > :16:23.thinking again to somebody who has been successful. People, young

:16:24. > :16:33.people, they follow young people. Having young examples. Jonathan, a

:16:34. > :16:37.gang and youth violence expert, is that a good description? It is a

:16:38. > :16:42.description, I have been doing it for a long time. Carrying a knife is

:16:43. > :16:48.no longer about being in a gang? I'm not sure that is entirely right.

:16:49. > :16:52.That is what the Met said. Indeed. But I think if you were talking to

:16:53. > :16:56.people over the last decade who were described as being involved in a

:16:57. > :17:03.gang, a lot of those that were involved in violence were still

:17:04. > :17:09.about this respect with each other, feuds with individuals. I think what

:17:10. > :17:12.you are seeing is a development that. I understand why they would

:17:13. > :17:17.make those comments and make those points, but it is not disconnected.

:17:18. > :17:21.I think what we have to recognise is the same issue we faced ten years

:17:22. > :17:27.ago, that this is a societal issue, not a single service or police

:17:28. > :17:31.issue, a criminal justice issue. Everybody has a role to play in

:17:32. > :17:38.this. If we genuinely believe that the young people have something

:17:39. > :17:43.positive to contribute, why are we allowing, as a society, knife crime

:17:44. > :17:49.to continue the way that we are? We should all be challenging it. Is

:17:50. > :17:52.society allowing knife crime to continue? I think there is a lot

:17:53. > :17:59.more we can do across society. I think the starting point has to be

:18:00. > :18:05.around opening up genuine opportunities, have a dialogue with

:18:06. > :18:13.people. About what? About going and talking to how can I get a career,

:18:14. > :18:18.what are my prospects, where is something in the area where I live?

:18:19. > :18:22.Where am I moving to? And that is not coming from schools? I think it

:18:23. > :18:27.is a much wider issue. It doesn't just happen in schools, in homes.

:18:28. > :18:37.Actually, if you look across the whole brat of society, business,

:18:38. > :18:39.voluntary organisations, whether it is statutory organisations, the

:18:40. > :18:44.dialogue has to be much more open and enable people to come in and

:18:45. > :18:48.genuinely have it so that they see we mean what we say around helping

:18:49. > :18:55.them progress their careers and opportunities. Exactly what Orlando

:18:56. > :19:00.was saying, around going to school, but what are we going to school for?

:19:01. > :19:03.What are the opportunities that are therefore us afterwards? One of the

:19:04. > :19:07.biggest things I have heard from young people when they speak to us,

:19:08. > :19:13.we want those career opportunities in the future. We don't want to go

:19:14. > :19:18.and get involved with drug dealing, carrying knives in terms of safety.

:19:19. > :19:24.We want those opportunities, but we also want to have positive images of

:19:25. > :19:29.young people have there. When a young person, and Orlando can do

:19:30. > :19:35.this, he sets up an app, makes money and get a professional business from

:19:36. > :19:39.it, why are we not promoting that? When the messages out there in terms

:19:40. > :19:46.of young people, it is stabbing each other. I hear what you are saying.

:19:47. > :19:50.Where does personal responsibility come into this? Somebody makes a

:19:51. > :19:53.choice to carry a knife, an offensive weapon. Potentially a

:19:54. > :20:03.murder weapon. Somebody makes that choice. To be honest, people do make

:20:04. > :20:09.that choice. But, again, it is only the end result. I find a lot of

:20:10. > :20:22.people are not trying. But they are not getting the support. Nobody is

:20:23. > :20:27.searching Orlando Miller, on LinkedIn, because they don't expect

:20:28. > :20:33.Orlando Miller from London to have a LinkedIn, they expect him to have a

:20:34. > :20:41.knife. Because I live in a certain postcode, for some reason there is

:20:42. > :20:47.more competition, people are trying. Everybody has a tolerance for

:20:48. > :20:52.something. , times have we gone over this topic? I totally agree. I have

:20:53. > :21:00.been asking questions like this for decades, it seems like. We don't

:21:01. > :21:06.have a solution. Maybe it is because it is complex and hard to get all of

:21:07. > :21:09.the different sectors to focus. If eight people have been murdered in

:21:10. > :21:18.your constituency in a year, what else do you need to focus? It is

:21:19. > :21:22.just absurd. Put it this way, if you have a young example, if you gave

:21:23. > :21:25.people an opportunity, responsibility, put them in a

:21:26. > :21:31.situation where they have time to think about things other than

:21:32. > :21:35.carrying a knife, say I had your job, for example, they would not be

:21:36. > :21:40.carrying a knife, they can't be seen to carry a knife, because they will

:21:41. > :21:48.lose their job. People can do things. Where are you on personal

:21:49. > :21:53.response politicos should not I feel we need to provide more

:21:54. > :22:06.opportunities. Are you talking about jobs? A lot of children do not see

:22:07. > :22:10.an alternative to knife crime. We need to provide it. But where

:22:11. > :22:13.personal responsibility comes in is the youth who want to resort to

:22:14. > :22:19.knife crime and look for opportunities, they want to gain

:22:20. > :22:24.these opportunities. Which is where everybody else comes in? Absolutely.

:22:25. > :22:29.This bit about personal responsibility, if we want people,

:22:30. > :22:32.young people, to take personal responsibility, we need to give them

:22:33. > :22:38.the environments which enables them to do that in a positive way. The

:22:39. > :22:42.criminal justice system, of course it has a part. I have worked with

:22:43. > :22:46.many families who have lost young people and they quite rightly cry

:22:47. > :22:50.out for the criminal justice system to take action and do something

:22:51. > :22:53.which deals with the person that committed this horrendous act. But

:22:54. > :22:58.the first bit about personal responsibility is, what is the

:22:59. > :23:03.standard we set, as adults, as a community, what is it that we go and

:23:04. > :23:09.do to show that we are committed to helping people on those pathways? In

:23:10. > :23:15.a number of areas across the capital and the country, young people do not

:23:16. > :23:19.feel they have a genuine stake within their environment. If we

:23:20. > :23:21.don't address them, we will see at perpetuating. I don't want to sit

:23:22. > :23:26.here in ten years' time having the same conversation. Thank you all

:23:27. > :23:32.very much. Really appreciate your time. Still to come, sexual

:23:33. > :23:38.exploitation by police officers has been called a disease by the police

:23:39. > :23:46.watchdog and senior police chiefs. We are looking at White is the most

:23:47. > :23:49.-- why it is the most serious form of corruption.

:23:50. > :23:51.Madonna, is the latest A list celebrity to feature

:23:52. > :23:53.on James Corden's hugely popular Carpool Kareoke.

:23:54. > :24:14.# Look around everywhere you turn is heartbreak

:24:15. > :24:25.Don't just stand there, let's get to it.

:24:26. > :24:48.Strike a pose, there's nothing to it.

:24:49. > :25:04.Do your kids like the new stuff? Yes, they like that very much. My

:25:05. > :25:08.kids are quite rebellious. My work is rebellious, but my lifestyle

:25:09. > :25:21.isn't. I don't smoke, I don't drink, I don't party. I am quite square.

:25:22. > :25:31.# I was always your little girl # You should know by now, I'm not a

:25:32. > :25:42.baby. Do you think you will get married again? Are you unconsciously

:25:43. > :25:49.proposing? I am already married. What is her name? Julia. She is

:25:50. > :25:54.great. She's lucky. You were friends with Michael Jackson. What was that

:25:55. > :26:00.like? What was a night out all night in with Michael Jackson like? You

:26:01. > :26:08.want me to kiss and tell? Did you kiss? Of course! You and Michael

:26:09. > :26:17.Jackson? Baby, I've been around. Full tone and mouth? I did not know

:26:18. > :26:25.that! Well, nobody ever asked me. Hang on, who makes the first move? I

:26:26. > :26:34.did. He is a bit shy. But he was a willing accomplice. I did get him to

:26:35. > :26:39.loosen up with a glass of Chardonnay. It did wonders. Wow.

:26:40. > :27:16.Here they go. Why is she trying to climb out of

:27:17. > :27:21.the car? Because she is Madonna. Exactly, that is why she should not

:27:22. > :27:26.be climbing out of the car! I want my pop stars doing that in 2016. She

:27:27. > :27:30.is 58, many pretenders to the throne, but she is still the Queen

:27:31. > :27:37.of pop. Interesting to see her talking openly about how she is a

:27:38. > :27:41.rebel onstage, not offstage. Although I think a lot of people

:27:42. > :27:46.disagree. In terms of her approach to diet, lifestyle and health, that

:27:47. > :27:54.is why she is doing so well. I don't want to say for a 58-year-old, it is

:27:55. > :27:58.not gold. But a lot of haters say she should not be doing this?

:27:59. > :28:03.Billboard magazine said she was woman of the year 2016. She said, if

:28:04. > :28:10.you were interviewing a male celebrity like Leonardo DiCaprio,

:28:11. > :28:15.you would not bring up his age. She has been doing this for nearly 35

:28:16. > :28:20.years, breaking that glass ceiling. She had complete autonomy with her

:28:21. > :28:23.career. A very male dominated industry. The bestselling female

:28:24. > :28:30.artist of all time. She knows how to make headlines. The timing is

:28:31. > :28:35.shrewd. She doesn't need to do it, but it is one of the most watched

:28:36. > :28:43.clips around the world. She also has a live DVD of her brilliant tour.

:28:44. > :28:50.She will be delighted you mentioned that. How do you react to the

:28:51. > :28:54.revelation that her and Michael Jackson snogged? Fascinating

:28:55. > :29:01.confession. She famously took him to the Oscars ceremony in 1981, but

:29:02. > :29:07.never alluded to what happened afterwards. The King and queen of

:29:08. > :29:13.pop shared a kiss. Thanked you for coming on the programme.

:29:14. > :29:16.Over 300 police officers and staff across England and Wales have been

:29:17. > :29:18.accused of using their position to sexually exploit people,

:29:19. > :29:20.including victims - we'll be joined by two campaigners

:29:21. > :29:22.calling for tougher action on cops that commit crimes.

:29:23. > :29:24.And could some sufferers of psychotic illnesses -

:29:25. > :29:27.such as schizophrenia - may in fact have a treatable

:29:28. > :29:32.We'll be speaking to someone who worked on a new study.

:29:33. > :29:41.An inspection of police forces in England and Wales has revealed

:29:42. > :29:44.that more than 300 officers and staff have been accused -

:29:45. > :29:47.over a two year period - of using their position to sexually

:29:48. > :29:50.exploit people, including victims of crime.

:29:51. > :29:52.The Inspectorate of Constabulary said the abuse of authority

:29:53. > :29:55.for sexual advantage was now the "most serious" form

:29:56. > :30:01.of corruption facing the police service.

:30:02. > :30:07.Latest figures show there are now a record number of people currently in

:30:08. > :30:11.jail for possessing knives. As of September this year, there were 917

:30:12. > :30:15.offenders serving knife crime sentences. Those seriously injured

:30:16. > :30:17.or killed by knife crime rose by nearly 10% across the UK in the last

:30:18. > :30:20.year and by 16% in London. The Foreign Secretary,

:30:21. > :30:22.Boris Johnson, has accused Britain's ally, Saudi Arabia,

:30:23. > :30:24.of engaging in "proxy In a speech at a conference in Italy

:30:25. > :30:29.a week ago, Mr Johnson said there was a lack of vision

:30:30. > :30:39.in the region: You have got the Saudis, Iran,

:30:40. > :30:44.everybody moving in and puppeteering, and playing proxy

:30:45. > :30:50.wars. And it is a tragedy to watch it. We need to have some way of

:30:51. > :30:54.encouraging visionary leadership in that area, people who can tell a

:30:55. > :31:00.story that brings people together from different factions and

:31:01. > :31:02.different religious groups into one-nation. That is what's missing.

:31:03. > :31:04.The number of giraffes has fallen so dramatically

:31:05. > :31:06.over the past 30 years, they are now vulnerable

:31:07. > :31:09.The International Union for the Conservation of Nature has

:31:10. > :31:11.included the animals on its latest Red List of the most

:31:12. > :31:13.threatened species after seeing the population fall

:31:14. > :31:19.Habitat loss, poaching and civil unrest have been

:31:20. > :31:33.That is a summary of the latest news. Join me for BBC Newsroom Live

:31:34. > :31:36.at 11 o'clock. Let me read you this e-mail about knife crime. My

:31:37. > :31:39.13-year-old son was attacked yesterday evening on his way home.

:31:40. > :31:44.He is not in a gang. A group of three boys at a bus stop attacked

:31:45. > :31:47.him for no reason. As a mother, my duties to protect my son. When he

:31:48. > :31:53.told me what happened, I was bitterly angry. Because of fear, I

:31:54. > :31:58.am now going to start carrying a screwdriver. I feel more protected

:31:59. > :32:02.having it on me. My son doesn't know that. I have had to start collecting

:32:03. > :32:07.him from school, and if the gang target him, I will not hesitate to

:32:08. > :32:13.use it. That is from a mum. Goodness me. Thank you for that. A couple

:32:14. > :32:16.more. Michael, if you carry a knife, you are a potential murderer. People

:32:17. > :32:19.don't carry knives because they are afraid of others but so they can

:32:20. > :32:24.intimidate and bully others. Barry says if the police would protect

:32:25. > :32:26.people, kids wouldn't feel so afraid that they have to carry knives.

:32:27. > :32:31.It's been a near perfect Test debut so far for

:32:32. > :32:40.The Durham opener has made 112 to help

:32:41. > :32:43.England to a good start to the fourth Test against India.

:32:44. > :32:49.Former British cycling technical director Shane Sutton has been found

:32:50. > :32:51.guilty of one of the nine allegations made

:32:52. > :32:58.Jess Varnish who says she's "shocked and upset" the majority

:32:59. > :33:02.Fifa President Gianni Infantino has called for "zero tolerance" of child

:33:03. > :33:04.abuse in football and promised to look into ways football's

:33:05. > :33:06.world governing body can do more to prevent it.

:33:07. > :33:09.His comments come in the midst of the abuse scandal in England.

:33:10. > :33:16.And Leicester City finished top of their Champions League group

:33:17. > :33:18.despite a 5-0 thrashing away at Porto.

:33:19. > :33:21.Spurs will go into the Europa League after a 3-1 win over

:33:22. > :33:28.That is all the sport for this morning, but I will have more on BBC

:33:29. > :33:30.News throughout the day. Sexual exploitation by police

:33:31. > :33:34.officers is the most serious corruption issue facing the service,

:33:35. > :33:37.according to Her Majesty's An inspection of police forces

:33:38. > :33:43.in England and Wales has revealed that more than 300 officers

:33:44. > :33:46.and staff have been accused, over a two year period,

:33:47. > :33:49.of using their position to sexually exploit people, including

:33:50. > :33:53.victims of crime. HM Inspector Mike Cunningham led

:33:54. > :33:56.the inspection, and says it's likely that the problem is more serious

:33:57. > :34:03.than the numbers show. The indications are,

:34:04. > :34:05.and we received information over a two-year period

:34:06. > :34:08.that there were 436 That is potentially

:34:09. > :34:15.the tip of the iceberg. Because the recording of these

:34:16. > :34:18.matters is not consistent, we believe that is not

:34:19. > :34:26.an accurate picture. What we're saying is,

:34:27. > :34:29.at the heart of our report, which is generally positive

:34:30. > :34:31.about policing and how they build the trust

:34:32. > :34:32.and confidence of communities, at the heart of our report is this

:34:33. > :34:36.corrosive issue of officers abusing their authority

:34:37. > :34:45.to exploit vulnerable women. A little earlier, I spoke

:34:46. > :34:48.to the National Police Chiefs' Council Lead for Counter-Corruption,

:34:49. > :34:50.Chief Constable Stephen Watson. I asked him whether he agreed

:34:51. > :34:53.with the police watchdog that this is the most significant corruption

:34:54. > :34:54.challenge currently We do confront a number

:34:55. > :35:04.of corrupting influences, but I think the quality of this sort

:35:05. > :35:08.of behaviour is so reprehensible and constitutes such a betrayal

:35:09. > :35:11.of what we stand for that it's quite right to describe it as the most

:35:12. > :35:14.serious form We treat it as serious corruption,

:35:15. > :35:18.and that is the spirit According to HMIC,

:35:19. > :35:22.the police watchdog, some forces are still failing

:35:23. > :35:28.to recognise it as corruption. I certainly accept that too

:35:29. > :35:31.many inconsistencies In fairness, I do think that HMIC

:35:32. > :35:42.are recognising that much progress has been made and there are pockets

:35:43. > :35:48.of good practice across the country in terms of both our approach

:35:49. > :35:52.proactively to targeting and pursuing offenders,

:35:53. > :35:57.and I use the word offender quite deliberately, as well as preventing

:35:58. > :36:04.this sort of behaviour. But where HMIC fairly made

:36:05. > :36:06.recommendations, which we accept, is that there are too many

:36:07. > :36:10.inconsistencies between forces. Especially when this

:36:11. > :36:12.was flagged four years ago, In fairness, I don't think HMIC

:36:13. > :36:20.are saying nothing has been done. And in respect of that,

:36:21. > :36:31.I absolutely accept it, as does the service,

:36:32. > :36:36.which is why we are urgently pursuing a piece of work,

:36:37. > :36:39.which is to capture those elements of good practice which occur in many

:36:40. > :36:47.local police forces, and binding all of that best

:36:48. > :36:51.practice into one place so that the whole service operates

:36:52. > :36:54.to the standard of the best. I want to talk to you

:36:55. > :37:02.about good practice. I'd like to give you some examples,

:37:03. > :37:07.all from this year, from A Wiltshire police constable had

:37:08. > :37:14.a sexual relationship A Met Police constable

:37:15. > :37:28.was convicted of voyeurism. A Devon and Cornwall constable

:37:29. > :37:30.was engaged in sexual relations with women he met in the course

:37:31. > :37:32.of his duties. A West Murcia constable contacted

:37:33. > :37:34.vulnerable female victims and engaged in texts

:37:35. > :37:36.of a sexual nature. A Thames Valley Police constable

:37:37. > :37:39.abused his position of a police officer in that he researched police

:37:40. > :37:41.systems to obtain personal data of a woman in order

:37:42. > :37:44.to identify her place of work He then went to her place

:37:45. > :37:48.of work whilst on duty, purporting to be there for a police

:37:49. > :37:50.purpose, gaining further personal I don't understand how it's not

:37:51. > :37:55.obvious to every single employee of police forces in England

:37:56. > :37:58.and Wales that that is It is absolutely clearly

:37:59. > :38:01.an abuse of trust and those examples that you give

:38:02. > :38:03.are absolutely reprehensible. There is no good news in this,

:38:04. > :38:08.but there are crumbs of comfort to be obtained by the fact

:38:09. > :38:11.that the College of Policing will tell you, if you look

:38:12. > :38:13.at their disapproval register, that over 75% of all

:38:14. > :38:19.of these cases have come through internal reporting

:38:20. > :38:20.and internal I don't know how that is

:38:21. > :38:24.a consolation to the victims. It isn't a consolation

:38:25. > :38:26.to the victims, because these things should be prevented

:38:27. > :38:28.in the first instance. But the point I'm making

:38:29. > :38:33.is that this is not something the service is approaching

:38:34. > :38:38.in a passive way. Those individuals rightly brought

:38:39. > :38:40.to book and thrown out of the service are being brought

:38:41. > :38:43.book in the main because officers and staff in the police service

:38:44. > :38:46.are as appalled as anyone by this This is reprehensible behaviour,

:38:47. > :39:00.and it comprises an absolute betrayal of the public

:39:01. > :39:03.and we will not stand for it. But we do recognise and absolutely

:39:04. > :39:05.accept HMIC's recommendations that too much inconsistency continues

:39:06. > :39:08.to persist between forces. Chief Constable Watson,

:39:09. > :39:13.what I don't understand is how a trained police officer cannot see

:39:14. > :39:16.that that kind of behaviour I mean, we're talking

:39:17. > :39:24.about grooming, stalking, abuse of people the police

:39:25. > :39:32.are supposed to be helping. With respect, I don't think there's

:39:33. > :39:35.any suggestion that any of those officers conducting

:39:36. > :39:37.themselves in that way necessarily thought that they weren't

:39:38. > :39:39.doing anything wrong. These people are offenders,

:39:40. > :39:43.and they are behaving The fact of the matter is,

:39:44. > :39:58.it's those who brought them to book who are the people who did see

:39:59. > :40:00.that this was Unfortunately, like any other walk

:40:01. > :40:04.of life, we do have individuals within the police service

:40:05. > :40:06.who will behave in this way, and we need to target them

:40:07. > :40:09.and we need to root them out and we need to kick them

:40:10. > :40:12.out of the service. That is precisely what we have been

:40:13. > :40:16.doing and what we intend to do. That is where we do welcome HMIC's

:40:17. > :40:18.recommendations because clearly, Let's speak now to Claire

:40:19. > :40:28.Phillipson, from Domestic Abuse charity Wearside Women in Need -

:40:29. > :40:31.she's had to make complaints to the police about inappropriate

:40:32. > :40:33.conduct of officers before, but says the situation

:40:34. > :40:35.is getting better now. for the English Collection

:40:36. > :40:39.of Prostitutes, a campaign group She says police officers

:40:40. > :40:55.using their status for Give us some examples? Well, we are

:40:56. > :40:58.seeing it in relation to sex workers, but we also work with women

:40:59. > :41:03.against rape, who are seeing it across the board. So there are many

:41:04. > :41:09.different types of women, women of colour, sex workers, drug users, and

:41:10. > :41:12.in this report, it also shows that rape and domestic violence survivors

:41:13. > :41:18.are being targeted as well, which we have experienced in our group. We

:41:19. > :41:24.are seeing a number of things from police using databases to stalk and

:41:25. > :41:28.harass and target sex workers and go into their home addresses, that kind

:41:29. > :41:34.of thing, but also demanding free sex and even rape in some cases.

:41:35. > :41:38.They are serious charges and we are seeing it increasingly. Claire

:41:39. > :41:44.Philipson, what do you think of these figures? Obviously, they are

:41:45. > :41:49.deeply concerning and they will be the tip of the iceberg. We need to

:41:50. > :41:53.reflect and have a wider analysis of this in that clearly, police

:41:54. > :41:58.officers are recruited from the general population. The general

:41:59. > :42:02.population has endemic sexism, has attitudes to within about their role

:42:03. > :42:08.and function in society. And the police are massively tendered. We

:42:09. > :42:13.are moving to a position slowly wear up and down the country, you have

:42:14. > :42:16.maybe 35% of police forces that are female, so you still have a very

:42:17. > :42:21.masculine culture. And where you have those masculine cultures, that

:42:22. > :42:28.will spread out into attitudes and behaviours towards women. What

:42:29. > :42:31.examples could you give our audience, without naming names,

:42:32. > :42:37.where you have had to go to the police to complain on behalf of

:42:38. > :42:41.women about inappropriate behaviour? I would emphasise first that this is

:42:42. > :42:45.very much in the past and things are changing and that we are potentially

:42:46. > :42:48.lucky in that we are in an area of high performing police forces in the

:42:49. > :42:53.north-east. But in the past, we have dealt with officers who were tasks

:42:54. > :42:59.specifically to visit victims of domestic violence who were clearly

:43:00. > :43:06.very vulnerable and in a very emotionally fragile state of the.

:43:07. > :43:12.And along came a man with power in a uniform, who acted as the saviour,

:43:13. > :43:16.but who was using it as an opportunity to have multiple sexual

:43:17. > :43:20.relationships with women. That is clearly a gross misuse of power. It

:43:21. > :43:32.might not be criminal, but on every level, it is wrong. Laura Watson, is

:43:33. > :43:36.part of your views that because people have a particular view of

:43:37. > :43:41.prostitutes, rightly or wrongly, that gives more protection to police

:43:42. > :43:45.officers to treat sex workers in any way they want? Yes, that is exactly

:43:46. > :43:50.why we think police target sex workers in particular, or many

:43:51. > :43:54.different sectors, because being part of a vulnerable group. We know

:43:55. > :43:58.police have said in court cases, for example, that they thought the sex

:43:59. > :44:02.workers wouldn't complain because of their lifestyle. We know that they

:44:03. > :44:06.target people in particular because they think the women will not be

:44:07. > :44:10.believed for whatever reason. We know that that is definitely the

:44:11. > :44:14.case. In the situation of sex workers, you are an illegal worker

:44:15. > :44:18.and therefore, the police always have the power of arrest over you.

:44:19. > :44:22.Even if you do complain, they always have the power to say OK, we are

:44:23. > :44:26.going to investigate you and prosecute you for prosecution

:44:27. > :44:30.offences. Obviously, we think that if the police are in a position

:44:31. > :44:36.where they do have a lot of power and discretion over women in that

:44:37. > :44:40.situation, they clearly can't be trusted and therefore, that builds

:44:41. > :44:45.our case for the abolition of the prostitution laws.

:44:46. > :44:52.Do you think the numbers are quite small, in relation to the 200,000

:44:53. > :45:01.police officers and staff in England and Wales? We're talking about 300

:45:02. > :45:05.here. Well, there are a number of things, women 's situation is worse

:45:06. > :45:09.and impoverishment means that they are increasingly more vulnerable. We

:45:10. > :45:13.don't think it is something that is going to stop. We have also been

:45:14. > :45:18.gathering information from the network all over the country and we

:45:19. > :45:27.have four recent examples where police officers have targeted sex

:45:28. > :45:33.workers in particular, through lease databases. -- police databases. We

:45:34. > :45:38.know it is still ongoing. The problem is, it is not getting dealt

:45:39. > :45:41.with. That is why it is ongoing. Well, that is not fair, there are

:45:42. > :45:50.some officers that are brought to justice, they appearing court. Some

:45:51. > :45:55.officers are allowed to retire without any action taken? Yes, we

:45:56. > :45:59.know of examples, there is a growing movement of sex workers saying we do

:46:00. > :46:04.not want this any more. Some of the examples we know from our network

:46:05. > :46:08.are where sex workers have said, no, we take you to court, and there have

:46:09. > :46:12.been convictions. We also know in many cases it is dealt with like an

:46:13. > :46:18.internal corruption issue, when it should be dealt with as a criminal

:46:19. > :46:20.issue. There should be prosecutions, increasingly. Thank you both very

:46:21. > :46:23.much. How can a set of frozen

:46:24. > :46:27.embryos sue their mother? It's what's happening to

:46:28. > :46:29.Modern Family star Sofia Vergara - we'll tell you what's

:46:30. > :46:35.going on in just a moment Scientists may have made a major

:46:36. > :46:39.breakthrough in finding a cure for mental illnesses

:46:40. > :46:41.like psychosis and schizophrenia. A study led by Oxford University,

:46:42. > :46:46.has found antibodies - they normally help fight infection -

:46:47. > :46:48.may actually cause And they now want to work out

:46:49. > :46:54.whether treating the immune system, by basically cleaning the blood,

:46:55. > :46:58.could provide a cure in those cases. Sarah Galloway's one person

:46:59. > :47:10.who's benefitted already. I really like playing

:47:11. > :47:13.the piano because it is Since I got ill, I haven't been

:47:14. > :47:18.able to play at all. I just haven't had

:47:19. > :47:20.the concentration or the mental Being able to play

:47:21. > :47:28.again is just amazing. It kind of reaffirms that I am

:47:29. > :47:32.responding to treatment. It reaffirms that there is stuff

:47:33. > :47:35.I can still save in my brain. My illness began just before

:47:36. > :47:41.I was due to go back I slept for three days straight,

:47:42. > :47:55.but didn't think much of it. Then that progressed

:47:56. > :47:57.to pacing about, refusing That progressed to losing

:47:58. > :48:07.all my inhibitions. I had this idea that my body

:48:08. > :48:12.is weird, I've have spiders legs, or rabbit ears, I've seen them

:48:13. > :48:15.there and felt them there. Been incredibly terrified

:48:16. > :48:19.during those times. I didn't quite fit

:48:20. > :48:23.into any of the boxes. They did diagnose me

:48:24. > :48:30.with acute psychosis. Following that, I was diagnosed

:48:31. > :48:32.with bipolar disorder. Though I have some physical

:48:33. > :48:34.symptoms, they were masked, or explained through other

:48:35. > :48:38.conditions. So, had it not been for a totally

:48:39. > :48:42.chance research trial, it may never have been picked up on,

:48:43. > :48:47.I might have stayed in the system under bipolar or acute psychosis

:48:48. > :48:50.for the rest of my life. I had a final blood test

:48:51. > :48:53.that was so strongly positive that they did a 180

:48:54. > :48:57.on the diagnosis. From then on, I was treated

:48:58. > :49:03.for the autoimmune disease. I've gone through several

:49:04. > :49:07.courses of treatment. I've gone through immunotherapy,

:49:08. > :49:09.with different drugs that I have had my blood filtered

:49:10. > :49:15.and I have had chemotherapy, Some things worked for a little

:49:16. > :49:28.while and then stopped working But the most recent treatment seems

:49:29. > :49:41.to have stuck quite well. Thinking about how things

:49:42. > :49:45.could have gone, and how different my life could have been,

:49:46. > :49:51.it terrifies me. There is that stark contrast

:49:52. > :49:53.between recovering nearly all of my function and living

:49:54. > :50:00.a fairly normal life, which is what we are hoping for,

:50:01. > :50:03.or being in and out of hospital, continuing to have these psychotic

:50:04. > :50:07.episodes where I am hallucinating, I am stripping naked,

:50:08. > :50:11.crying and screaming, One way or another, it

:50:12. > :50:26.would take my life completely. Tom Pollack is from King's College

:50:27. > :50:36.London and he worked on the study. You joined the team at Oxford

:50:37. > :50:40.University four years ago when the study was going on. Ten years of

:50:41. > :50:45.research, and this is really exciting? Absolutely, thank you for

:50:46. > :50:50.having me. We were interested in the relationship between problems with

:50:51. > :50:52.the immune system and psychotic disorders like schizophrenia,

:50:53. > :50:57.devastating psychiatric disorders. You can see from Sarah's story that

:50:58. > :51:01.it can be devastating. Although we have treatments, they are not

:51:02. > :51:06.successful for all people and their often side-effects. We recruited 230

:51:07. > :51:11.young people with a first episode of psychosis, previously fit and well.

:51:12. > :51:15.We looked at their blood for immune system molecules called antibodies.

:51:16. > :51:19.We know that they can attack the brain and cause severe brain

:51:20. > :51:27.dysfunction. We know this from another disorder, called Caffe like

:51:28. > :51:39.Quite a small percentage, but for those 9%, potentially a cure? I

:51:40. > :51:41.think it is probably too early to say that. But there is definitely

:51:42. > :51:45.something happening in the immune system with these people. I think

:51:46. > :51:49.the really exciting thing is that these antibodies might be a clue

:51:50. > :51:52.that people with them might respond to a different kind of treatment, a

:51:53. > :51:58.treatment that targets the immune system. In terms of this idea of

:51:59. > :52:03.cleaning the blood, you are just getting rid of the antibodies that

:52:04. > :52:07.are attacking the brain. There are a number of different immune therapies

:52:08. > :52:11.available. One is plasma exchange. It is a way of filtering the blood

:52:12. > :52:14.and you can remove the antibodies. We think in patients that have the

:52:15. > :52:20.antibodies, that might be therapeutic for them. Of course, it

:52:21. > :52:24.is not definite yet. As with everything in medicine, you need to

:52:25. > :52:27.have a trial where patients are randomised to one treatment or

:52:28. > :52:33.another. This is what we are planning to do, starting next year.

:52:34. > :52:36.We heard from Sarah. For those that want to learn more, psychosis, what

:52:37. > :52:43.is it? Why can it be so debilitating? It is a really

:52:44. > :52:46.devastating disease. Schizophrenia is the disorder that most

:52:47. > :52:50.prominently features psychotic symptoms. People with psychosis have

:52:51. > :52:55.problems with thinking, perceiving the world. Often they experience

:52:56. > :52:58.hallucinations, auditory hallucinations, and they can have

:52:59. > :53:02.problems understanding the world. They can end up believing things

:53:03. > :53:05.that are not true, and we call these delusions. They have huge effect on

:53:06. > :53:10.people's lives, particularly socially and in terms of education.

:53:11. > :53:15.It is probably worth saying, it is clear from how you describe the

:53:16. > :53:18.study, it is not going to work for all people with psychosis? It is

:53:19. > :53:22.important to be clear, it is not a blood test for psychosis or

:53:23. > :53:25.schizophrenia. But we think it might be the first steps towards

:53:26. > :53:28.identifying a small group of people with this disorder that might

:53:29. > :53:32.benefit from a different kind of treatment. The trial that you are

:53:33. > :53:39.going to work on from next year, involving how many people? We need

:53:40. > :53:41.to find about 80 people with these antibodies. Because they are rare,

:53:42. > :53:48.we probably have to test the blood of 2500. It is a challenge, but we

:53:49. > :53:51.think it can benefit patients. If somebody is watching and would like

:53:52. > :53:56.to be tested, because they are interested in taking part, can they

:53:57. > :53:59.get in touch? The important thing is first to get in touch with their

:54:00. > :54:04.doctor, their psychiatrist. They can get in touch with the team that are

:54:05. > :54:05.organising the trial, based in Oxford University. Thank you very

:54:06. > :54:08.much. Really interesting. And a reminder - it's the final day

:54:09. > :54:11.of the Supreme Court Brexit hearing on whether MPs have

:54:12. > :54:13.to give the go-ahead If you want to continue watching,

:54:14. > :54:24.there's more live coverage with Ben Brown on Newsroom Live

:54:25. > :54:27.after 11 or you can watch it on the BBC News website

:54:28. > :54:31.by going to bbc.co.uk/brexit. The world's highest paid actress

:54:32. > :54:35.is being sued by her frozen embryos. The right-to-live legal action

:54:36. > :54:39.was filed on Tuesday against Sofia Vergara by her two

:54:40. > :54:41.fertilised eggs, which have been Our entertainment reporter

:54:42. > :54:59.Chi Chi Izundu is here. How is this possible? Well, because

:55:00. > :55:03.her ex-boyfriend, Nick Lowe, has been trying to get her to allow him

:55:04. > :55:08.to have the embryos that they created when they were in a happy

:55:09. > :55:13.relationship in 2013, he has already tried to sue her once. We will come

:55:14. > :55:19.back to that in a bit. This lawsuit is based in Louisiana. Why it might

:55:20. > :55:23.be a potentially landmark case is that Louisiana already has special

:55:24. > :55:30.protection for frozen embryos. He says, basically, Emma and Isobella

:55:31. > :55:34.are being denied the right to a trust fund he set up for them for

:55:35. > :55:40.their life. If they are not brought to life, they cannot access the

:55:41. > :55:45.trust fund and live. Is this the first lawsuit between the two of

:55:46. > :55:50.them? No, he tried to sue her in California, where he also spends a

:55:51. > :55:54.lot of time. He basically said that he wanted the embryos, he wanted to

:55:55. > :56:06.bring up the two embryos that they made together through IVF. She is

:56:07. > :56:09.quite Catholic... Quite Catholic? Well, she is Catholic, and she does

:56:10. > :56:13.not want to bring the embryos into the world as it is set against them.

:56:14. > :56:17.She has got married again. She also has a son from a previous

:56:18. > :56:22.relationship. In her part of the court case, she wanted him to name

:56:23. > :56:26.the previous lovers he had that had to have an abortion. He is refusing

:56:27. > :56:34.to do that. The judge in the California case filed in favour of

:56:35. > :56:37.Sofia. That is why he has gone to Louisiana, which has special

:56:38. > :56:42.measures around frozen embryos, to try to get them impregnated in a

:56:43. > :56:47.Soviet. As far as we know, she is going to fight this issue? No word

:56:48. > :56:54.from either camp. It came in under the radar. The interesting part of

:56:55. > :57:00.the lawsuit is that he file this under a pseudonym. Now it is in the

:57:01. > :57:05.public domain, both parties are keeping very quiet.

:57:06. > :57:16.A quick tweet from the research being done in two psychosis. This

:57:17. > :57:20.immune psychosis thing is absolutely amazing. There is a long way to go,

:57:21. > :57:25.as Tom was telling us. On knife crime, so many comments from you.

:57:26. > :57:28.Thank you very much for those. An e-mail, I agree with the guest who

:57:29. > :57:31.held the view that the reason for the escalation of the knife culture

:57:32. > :57:35.is young people having a lack of opportunity and not feeling included

:57:36. > :57:40.in society. I would also cite these facts. Weapons have become prolific

:57:41. > :57:44.and films, they are easily obtainable online and allied with

:57:45. > :57:50.gang culture and the envisaged need for self protection. The political

:57:51. > :57:55.reaction will not address this issue unless and until people who

:57:56. > :57:57.understand the cause and are genuinely committed to work to end

:57:58. > :58:02.it are included with a national government drive to give practical

:58:03. > :58:08.help and open opportunities to those that need them. If not, it will

:58:09. > :58:15.simply fester, becoming the standard for present and future generations.

:58:16. > :58:19.Thank you for your discussions. Steve says, I would like to say I am

:58:20. > :58:26.sickened and angered every time I read about or hear about a fatal

:58:27. > :58:28.stabbing on the news. BBC newsroom live is next.