09/11/2017

0:00:06 > 0:00:08Hello, it's Thursday, it's 9 o'clock.

0:00:08 > 0:00:10I'm Victoria Derbyshire, welcome to the programme.

0:00:10 > 0:00:13As Theresa May loses her second minister in a week, her opponents

0:00:13 > 0:00:15claim her government is in chaos.

0:00:15 > 0:00:17Priti Patel resigned as International Development Secretary

0:00:17 > 0:00:19last night after all those unauthorised meetings

0:00:19 > 0:00:27with Israeli politicians.

0:00:27 > 0:00:31The Prime Minister's colleagues say that Mrs May has it under control.

0:00:31 > 0:00:35Theresa May is in full charge of this cabinet, and I have no doubt

0:00:35 > 0:00:37at all her appointment today will reflect the nature of that,

0:00:37 > 0:00:40and we'll be able to get on with our business.

0:00:40 > 0:00:42As Theresa May works on another reshuffle of her top team,

0:00:42 > 0:00:45do you think she can withstand this latest crisis?

0:00:45 > 0:00:49Could virtual reality be used to treat mental health conditions?

0:00:49 > 0:00:52Tests are under way to see whether VR can heal our minds

0:00:52 > 0:00:56and help conquer anxieties like fear of heights.

0:00:56 > 0:00:59After that session I did go out and put myself into some positions

0:00:59 > 0:01:01where you are sort of facing heights, and

0:01:01 > 0:01:05I was really really surprised at how differently I felt about it.

0:01:05 > 0:01:10We will bring you that film at about 9:45am.

0:01:10 > 0:01:12Plus, is the Government's anti-radicalisation

0:01:12 > 0:01:13programme worked?

0:01:13 > 0:01:16Figures out later will show how many far right and Islamist extremists

0:01:16 > 0:01:21have been referred to the scheme.

0:01:27 > 0:01:28Hello.

0:01:28 > 0:01:31Welcome to the programme, we're live until 11am this morning.

0:01:31 > 0:01:36If you're a Conservative voter, are you worried about the latest

0:01:36 > 0:01:39crisis to hit the Government or are you confident Theresa May

0:01:39 > 0:01:42has it under control.

0:01:42 > 0:01:46What is your advice to Theresa May? What would you suggest to her this

0:01:46 > 0:01:49morning?

0:01:49 > 0:01:51Also this morning, has owning a pet changed your life?

0:01:51 > 0:01:54A little later we'll be talking to a group of people

0:01:54 > 0:01:57who say their animals have made a huge difference to them,

0:01:57 > 0:02:03but we want to hear from you too - and send us a picture!

0:02:03 > 0:02:07You know I am partial to those!

0:02:07 > 0:02:11Do get in touch on all the stories we're talking about this morning -

0:02:11 > 0:02:13use the hashtag #VictoriaLive and if you text, you will be charged

0:02:13 > 0:02:15at the standard network rate.

0:02:15 > 0:02:16Our top story today.

0:02:16 > 0:02:18The Prime Minister will announce her new International Development

0:02:18 > 0:02:20Secretary today as she tries to restore stability

0:02:20 > 0:02:22to the Government after the second resignation from her Cabinet

0:02:22 > 0:02:23in a week.

0:02:23 > 0:02:26Priti Patel stepped down last night after more questions were raised

0:02:26 > 0:02:28about meetings she held during a personal trip to Israel.

0:02:28 > 0:02:31Theresa May is facing calls to replace her with someone

0:02:31 > 0:02:33who backs Brexit to maintain the delicate political

0:02:33 > 0:02:34balance of the cabinet.

0:02:34 > 0:02:38Our political correspondent Alex Forsyth reports.

0:02:38 > 0:02:41Arriving in London, Priti Patel could have guessed her fate.

0:02:41 > 0:02:44She had been summoned back from Kenya by Number Ten,

0:02:44 > 0:02:48an official trip to Africa cut short.

0:02:48 > 0:02:53She entered Downing Street by the back door and left

0:02:53 > 0:02:55having lost her job, resigning after failing to disclose

0:02:55 > 0:03:04details of unauthorised meetings with Israeli politicians.

0:03:04 > 0:03:12In her letter to the Prime Minister, she said.

0:03:12 > 0:03:15"I accept my actions fell below the high standards that are expected

0:03:15 > 0:03:16of a Secretary of State."

0:03:16 > 0:03:20For the second time in just over a week, Theresa May must now decide

0:03:20 > 0:03:22how to fill a gap around the top table.

0:03:22 > 0:03:24Michael Fallon quit as defence secretary last week over

0:03:24 > 0:03:25his personal conduct.

0:03:25 > 0:03:27This team was carefully chosen to represent different

0:03:27 > 0:03:29Tory views over Brexit, and some are keen

0:03:29 > 0:03:30that is maintained.

0:03:30 > 0:03:33There is a divide between people who want Brexit to mean

0:03:33 > 0:03:35we are basically staying within the EU.

0:03:35 > 0:03:37They are essentially the Remainers who are unchanged.

0:03:37 > 0:03:41And they give a veneer of acceptance but haven't truly accepted.

0:03:41 > 0:03:45There are quite a lot of people who were quite balanced

0:03:45 > 0:03:48when they made the decision as to which side to support,

0:03:48 > 0:03:50who are now really rather enthusiastic about Brexit

0:03:50 > 0:03:53and want to get on with it properly.

0:03:53 > 0:03:55Whatever the Prime Minister's decision about who should

0:03:55 > 0:03:57now sit in her Cabinet, she will face intense

0:03:57 > 0:04:05scrutiny over her choice.

0:04:05 > 0:04:11Our political correspondent Leila Nathoo is in Westminster.

0:04:11 > 0:04:16How bad is this for Theresa May?On one hand Theresa May has managed to

0:04:16 > 0:04:19stand some authority on the situation. There were a couple of

0:04:19 > 0:04:23days when it looked like Priti Patel was going to walk away from these

0:04:23 > 0:04:27claims with just a reprimand from Downing Street. It was only after

0:04:27 > 0:04:30these other allegations came to light that she finally felt she had

0:04:30 > 0:04:36to resign. In one sense Theresa May is trying to get control of the

0:04:36 > 0:04:40situation. She has the opportunity now to make joints in the

0:04:40 > 0:04:46replacement of Priti Patel, to try and steadied the ship -- to make a

0:04:46 > 0:04:50choice in the replacement of Priti Patel. Her key ally Gavin Williamson

0:04:50 > 0:04:56came into Michael Fallon's role. There is no doubt this whole episode

0:04:56 > 0:05:00gives ammunition to the opposition, who are suggesting this looks like a

0:05:00 > 0:05:04government in chaos and the wheels are coming off this operation. We've

0:05:04 > 0:05:08got two more Cabinet ministers under pressure. Boris Johnson over

0:05:08 > 0:05:13comments concerning a British Iranian woman held in Teheran and

0:05:13 > 0:05:19Damian Green who is also under investigation over his conduct. This

0:05:19 > 0:05:22is a very tricky political territory for Theresa May and I think

0:05:22 > 0:05:29reshuffles are difficult at the best of times, let alone when this

0:05:29 > 0:05:33government is so fragile.If you are a Conservative voter what is your

0:05:33 > 0:05:38advice to Theresa May? If you vote for other parties you are welcome to

0:05:38 > 0:05:40give your advice as well.

0:05:40 > 0:05:43Annita McVeigh is in the BBC Newsroom with a summary

0:05:43 > 0:05:45of the rest of the day's news.

0:05:45 > 0:05:47Police forces in England and Wales are struggling to meet demand,

0:05:47 > 0:05:50due to a surge in the number of calls from members of the public.

0:05:50 > 0:05:53A survey by the policing watchdog says the service is under

0:05:53 > 0:05:55"significant stress" because of budget cuts,

0:05:55 > 0:05:59although it says forces could help by making further efficiencies.

0:05:59 > 0:06:02Our home affairs correspondent Danny Shaw reports.

0:06:02 > 0:06:06If you report a crime this is where your call is dealt with.

0:06:06 > 0:06:07The control room.

0:06:07 > 0:06:10It is the nerve centre of police operations.

0:06:10 > 0:06:14There are more than 8 million 999 calls every year,

0:06:14 > 0:06:17with millions of others on the non-emergency number, 101.

0:06:17 > 0:06:24The inspector of constabulary says that police are struggling to cope.

0:06:24 > 0:06:25He says that problems retaining control room staff

0:06:25 > 0:06:28and an overreliance on outdated technology are to blame.

0:06:28 > 0:06:30Some requests for police to deal with crimes,

0:06:30 > 0:06:34including criminal damage and assault, go unanswered.

0:06:34 > 0:06:36In Devon and Cornwall, many callers hang up

0:06:36 > 0:06:41because they have to wait so long.

0:06:41 > 0:06:45The control rooms are right at the heart of what our police forces do.

0:06:45 > 0:06:47The focus on getting that right is really important

0:06:47 > 0:06:48for chief constables, and we encourage them

0:06:48 > 0:06:55to continue with this.

0:06:55 > 0:06:57The report into police efficiency says the service

0:06:57 > 0:06:58is under significant stress.

0:06:58 > 0:07:01It says forces will spend 6% less on policing in the next three years

0:07:01 > 0:07:03and will lose more than 4,000 officers and staff from

0:07:03 > 0:07:06the police workforce.

0:07:06 > 0:07:08That is why many chief constables say they need extra resources

0:07:08 > 0:07:12to deal with the increased demand.

0:07:12 > 0:07:14Mike Cunningham says it would be a good thing

0:07:14 > 0:07:17for police to have more money, but he says the service needs

0:07:17 > 0:07:20to show the benefits extra funding will bring,

0:07:20 > 0:07:23and he says there is scope for forces to use their existing

0:07:23 > 0:07:31resources more efficiently.

0:07:31 > 0:07:34The First Minister of Wales, Carwyn Jones, is to issue

0:07:34 > 0:07:36a statement today amid criticism of the way he handled

0:07:36 > 0:07:38misconduct allegations against a Welsh cabinet member,

0:07:38 > 0:07:40who is believed to have taken his own life.

0:07:40 > 0:07:43The family of Carl Sargeant - who'd been accused of

0:07:43 > 0:07:45inappropriate touching - says he was denied natural justice

0:07:45 > 0:07:47because he wasn't given details of the allegations which led

0:07:47 > 0:07:50to his sacking.

0:07:50 > 0:07:52Our reporter Tomos Morgan is at the Welsh Assembly

0:07:52 > 0:08:00for us this morning.

0:08:00 > 0:08:06Do you have any idea what we are expecting to hear from Carwyn Jones?

0:08:06 > 0:08:12Sorry, I'm told we don't have Tomos at the moment but will bring you

0:08:12 > 0:08:17more on that story later.

0:08:17 > 0:08:19British officials will travel to Brussels for further

0:08:19 > 0:08:20Brexit talks today.

0:08:20 > 0:08:23It's the first set of negotiations since EU leaders agreed to begin

0:08:23 > 0:08:25preparing for discussions about the future

0:08:25 > 0:08:26relationship with Britain.

0:08:26 > 0:08:28The Brexit secretary, David Davis and the EU's chief

0:08:28 > 0:08:30negotiator Michel Barnier will join the talks tomorrow, which are likely

0:08:30 > 0:08:33to centre around the UK's financial obligations and the rights

0:08:33 > 0:08:35of British people living in the EU.

0:08:35 > 0:08:38US President Donald Trump has urged Chinese leader Xi Jinping to "work

0:08:38 > 0:08:43very hard" on persuading North Korea to give up its nuclear weapons.

0:08:43 > 0:08:46Discussions on how to deal with North Korea's threats

0:08:46 > 0:08:48to the region have dominated the agenda during Mr

0:08:48 > 0:08:51Trump's tour of Asia.

0:08:51 > 0:08:52This morning he warned that "time is quickly

0:08:52 > 0:08:54running out" to deal with the North Korean

0:08:54 > 0:09:02nuclear threat.

0:09:02 > 0:09:09The United States is committed to the complete and permanent

0:09:09 > 0:09:13denuclearisation of North Korea. China can fix this problem easily

0:09:13 > 0:09:20and quickly, and I am calling on China and your great president to

0:09:20 > 0:09:23hopefully work on it very hard. I know one thing about your president,

0:09:23 > 0:09:32if he works on it hard, it will happen. There's no doubt about it.

0:09:32 > 0:09:34Reports from Hollywood say Kevin Spacey is to be edited out

0:09:34 > 0:09:37of a new film six weeks before its release -

0:09:37 > 0:09:38following the recent allegations of sexual assault.

0:09:38 > 0:09:41Spacey, who plays Jean Paul Getty in the thriller,

0:09:41 > 0:09:43"All The Money In The World", will be replaced by

0:09:43 > 0:09:44the Oscar-winning Canadian actor, Christopher Plummer.

0:09:44 > 0:09:50The release will still go ahead as planned on December the 22nd.

0:09:50 > 0:09:52House prices are now falling in four areas of the country,

0:09:52 > 0:09:55according to the latest report from chartered surveyors.

0:09:55 > 0:09:58The Royal Institution of Chartered Surveyors has said that

0:09:58 > 0:10:01prices are declining in London, the South East, East Anglia

0:10:01 > 0:10:03and north-east England.

0:10:03 > 0:10:08Across the country as a whole, it said prices were flat.

0:10:08 > 0:10:10The survey though appears to contrast with data

0:10:10 > 0:10:12from the Halifax, which said earlier this week that house price

0:10:12 > 0:10:17growth had risen to 4.5% in the year to October.

0:10:17 > 0:10:20Scientists say skin injuries - such as cuts - heal quicker

0:10:20 > 0:10:23if they happen during the day.

0:10:23 > 0:10:25Researchers found that people who suffered burns after 8pm took

0:10:25 > 0:10:28an average of 28 days to get better - compared with 17 for

0:10:28 > 0:10:32the daytime injuries.

0:10:32 > 0:10:39They think the human body clock is reason why.

0:10:39 > 0:10:42A self-driving shuttle bus in Las Vegas was involved in a crash

0:10:42 > 0:10:44on its first day of service.

0:10:44 > 0:10:46The vehicle - which was carrying several passengers -

0:10:46 > 0:10:48collided with a lorry driving at slow speed.

0:10:48 > 0:10:51Nobody was injured in the incident which officials say was the fault

0:10:51 > 0:10:51of the lorry driver.

0:10:51 > 0:10:55The shuttle is the first of its kind to be used on public roads

0:10:55 > 0:10:58in the United States.

0:10:58 > 0:11:06That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 9.30.

0:11:06 > 0:11:08Do get in touch with us throughout the morning -

0:11:08 > 0:11:11use the hashtag #VictoriaLive and if you text, you will be charged

0:11:11 > 0:11:12at the standard network rate.

0:11:12 > 0:11:14Let's get some sport.

0:11:14 > 0:11:20The Ashes are at stake for England's women. They've been out in Australia

0:11:20 > 0:11:24for a couple of weeks already.

0:11:24 > 0:11:26They trail 4-2 after the one-dayers.

0:11:26 > 0:11:30There are four points for the winners of the one-day Test.

0:11:30 > 0:11:33England cannot afford to lose, because a tied series would be

0:11:33 > 0:11:41the best that England could then hope for.

0:11:41 > 0:11:45Australia would retain those precious Ashes.

0:11:45 > 0:11:49Our sports correspondent Andy Swiss is in Sydney.

0:11:49 > 0:11:58Good evening and E. Has it been a good day for England's women so far?

0:11:58 > 0:12:02Yes, as you can see the floodlights are on here. Instead of the tea

0:12:02 > 0:12:06break we've just had the dinner break. England with a bit of

0:12:06 > 0:12:13rebuilding, they are currently 188-4. England won the toss, they

0:12:13 > 0:12:18chose to bat. It was Australia's bowlers but got off to the best art.

0:12:18 > 0:12:24England losing the early wickets of Lauren Winfield, outfit just four.

0:12:24 > 0:12:28Australia on top in the early stages. Then a century partnership

0:12:28 > 0:12:34between Tammy Beaumont and Heather Knight. Tammy Beaumont particularly

0:12:34 > 0:12:39impressive. You can see why she was England's player of the tournament

0:12:39 > 0:12:45at the World Cup in the summer. Beaumont was eventually out for 70.

0:12:45 > 0:12:49Heather Knight followed the 62. They've also lost Natalie Sciver 18.

0:12:49 > 0:12:54England with a bit of work to do. This is a much with so much riding

0:12:54 > 0:13:00on it. If Australia wind, they will retain the Ashes. So England need to

0:13:00 > 0:13:08post a big first innings total. They are currently 188-4.

0:13:08 > 0:13:10A quick update on the England men - their Ashes Series starts

0:13:10 > 0:13:12at the end of the month.

0:13:12 > 0:13:15They are in Adelaide, on the second day of a four-day tour match.

0:13:15 > 0:13:18Jake Ball went over on his ankle and had to leave the field

0:13:18 > 0:13:23and is a doubt for the rest of the match.

0:13:23 > 0:13:33Australia are 152-6, 141 runs behind England.

0:13:34 > 0:13:37We've heard from Eni Aluko for the first time since she gave that

0:13:37 > 0:13:46devastating testimony about racism within the England camp.This was an

0:13:46 > 0:13:49interview she gave to the BBC.

0:13:49 > 0:13:51The FA came out of the DCMS committee hearing very badly.

0:13:51 > 0:13:54They were looking at the circimstances around the England

0:13:54 > 0:13:56coach Mark Sampson's dismissal and how they handled it.

0:13:56 > 0:13:59He lost his job for his conduct at a previous job, but he was found

0:13:59 > 0:14:01to have used racially disciminatory language

0:14:01 > 0:14:05towards Eniola Aluko and another player.

0:14:05 > 0:14:07Aluko was essentially ostracised and she feels very let

0:14:07 > 0:14:11down by some of her team-mates at the time.

0:14:11 > 0:14:14It's been very divisive and very adversarial,

0:14:14 > 0:14:17and I think the players have been dragged into that.

0:14:17 > 0:14:20But the players have their own mind and they should be able to say,

0:14:20 > 0:14:28actually, let me step back from this and see how this may benefit.

0:14:28 > 0:14:32If I have a problem, if they have a problem,

0:14:32 > 0:14:40they have a process that is going to protect them.

0:14:40 > 0:14:43Aluko was an unused substitute last night for Chelsea as they beat

0:14:43 > 0:14:45Rosengard in the first leg of their last 16

0:14:45 > 0:14:52Champions League tie.

0:14:52 > 0:14:57It is the second consecutive Thursday that the Prime Minister

0:14:57 > 0:15:04wakes up needing to replace one of her Cabinet ministers.

0:15:04 > 0:15:06This comes, as we've been hearing, after a series of unauthorised

0:15:06 > 0:15:11meetings with Israeli officials and politicians.

0:15:11 > 0:15:21In a letter to Theresa May issued after they met last night she says:

0:15:29 > 0:15:31So it's left Theresa May's government under fire

0:15:31 > 0:15:34from critics and commentators.

0:15:34 > 0:15:38And this is how the front pages view her predicament this morning -

0:15:38 > 0:15:47obviously with considerable speculation about what happens next.

0:15:47 > 0:15:49In a moment we'll be discussing where the Prime

0:15:49 > 0:15:50Minister goes from here.

0:15:50 > 0:15:52But first, our political expert James Landale explains how exactly

0:15:52 > 0:16:01it went so badly wrong for Priti Patel.

0:16:01 > 0:16:04This story is all about a family holiday to Israel by Priti Patel,

0:16:04 > 0:16:07the International Development Secretary, that went terribly wrong.

0:16:07 > 0:16:09A holiday where the lines between her public life

0:16:09 > 0:16:13and her private life became blurred.

0:16:13 > 0:16:20The correct way of doing business within government didn't happen,

0:16:20 > 0:16:22and had extraordinary consequences for the British government.

0:16:22 > 0:16:26So what happened was this.

0:16:26 > 0:16:28In August, Priti Patel went on holiday to Israel.

0:16:28 > 0:16:34It was a 12, 13-day holiday.

0:16:34 > 0:16:37For around two days, Priti Patel decided to do a bit of work.

0:16:37 > 0:16:39And she had a very busy schedule packed in for her.

0:16:39 > 0:16:42No fewer than 12 separate engagements over those two days.

0:16:42 > 0:16:51Now, the International Development Secretary, Priti Patel,

0:16:51 > 0:16:53has apologised after admitting meeting the Israeli prime

0:16:53 > 0:16:54minister, Binyamin Netanyahu.

0:16:54 > 0:16:57It is quite extraordinary that Priti Patel, a cabinet minister,

0:16:57 > 0:16:59met Binyamin Netanyahu, the head of the government

0:16:59 > 0:17:01for another country, secretly, without telling anybody.

0:17:01 > 0:17:05Relationships between governments are incredibly fine-tuned,

0:17:05 > 0:17:07and meetings are calibrated and they're prepared

0:17:07 > 0:17:10for, and ministers know what messages they want to get

0:17:10 > 0:17:13across and what they're going to receive.

0:17:13 > 0:17:19If you have a sort of rogue elephant storming through this process

0:17:19 > 0:17:26having secret meetings, then the potential for errors,

0:17:26 > 0:17:29for mixed messages, for the Israeli government doing one thing

0:17:29 > 0:17:35and the British government doing another thing,

0:17:35 > 0:17:37or even the Israeli government and another Government minister

0:17:37 > 0:17:39deciding to do one thing to try and influence

0:17:39 > 0:17:40the British Government.

0:17:40 > 0:17:43I mean, this is a really, really complicated place to be,

0:17:43 > 0:17:46and it's why, I think, that there were so many eyes raised

0:17:46 > 0:17:53when it emerged that Priti Patel had met Binyamin Netanyahu.

0:17:53 > 0:17:58Let's talk to

0:17:58 > 0:18:00Henry Mance, political correspondent for the Financial Times,

0:18:00 > 0:18:02and Ian Birrell, a freelance journalist and former speech

0:18:02 > 0:18:05writer for David Cameron.

0:18:05 > 0:18:11We may also be joined by Jo-Anne Nadler, who is stuck in traffic at

0:18:11 > 0:18:15the moment. The Times reporting that an EU leader is reporting the

0:18:15 > 0:18:18British Government will collapse by the end of the year. What do you

0:18:18 > 0:18:23think of that story?It sounds reasonable. From the other side of

0:18:23 > 0:18:28the Channel, you're thinking, what is going on? One candidate member

0:18:28 > 0:18:31gone, being looked into for sexual harassment, another one gone here.

0:18:31 > 0:18:36This does not look like a government that will be around for long. Other

0:18:36 > 0:18:39symptoms have the former Chancellor George Osborne saying in June it

0:18:39 > 0:18:43would fall apart within a week. Colin Theresa May a dead woman

0:18:43 > 0:18:58walking, and she is still there.-- he wascalling Theresa May. How

0:18:58 > 0:19:05embarrassing is this for Theresa May?Very embarrassing. She looks

0:19:05 > 0:19:10weak. We have a Foreign Minister who may have inadvertently led to a

0:19:10 > 0:19:16longer jail sentence for a British citizen in Iran as well, and he is

0:19:16 > 0:19:19still in his job despite all the special Ops he has been engaged on

0:19:19 > 0:19:24to further his own ambitions. So we have a very weak Prime Minister,

0:19:24 > 0:19:27still very divided country and party, and I think it is very

0:19:27 > 0:19:31justified for European leaders to wonder whether this is a government

0:19:31 > 0:19:34they can do business with, particularly when it is hard to see

0:19:34 > 0:19:37how they can get any form of Brexit through.It would be simple if

0:19:37 > 0:19:44Britain offered more for the divorce bill, then things would start

0:19:44 > 0:19:49moving?Yes, but she has a hard line who may not accept that. She has

0:19:49 > 0:19:51this terrible balancing act and she does not have the authority or power

0:19:51 > 0:19:55to get it through, and I think European leaders are just looking at

0:19:55 > 0:19:59this mess and saying, can they get anything through? It is also

0:19:59 > 0:20:07significant, we have had some German economists advising the Government

0:20:07 > 0:20:12that they should give an extension...Advising the German

0:20:12 > 0:20:17Government? Joest, to get an extension.We are coming up for a

0:20:17 > 0:20:20year after triggering Article 50 and we still don't know the shape of the

0:20:20 > 0:20:24arrangement.The Germans would not want an extension to a deadline?

0:20:24 > 0:20:29There is a hard date, perhaps marks the 30th 2019, then she has done her

0:20:29 > 0:20:34job. She has fulfilled the role, and I think she is actually in a

0:20:34 > 0:20:36stronger position than perhaps she even realises. They have decided

0:20:36 > 0:20:41they are not going to try to get rid of her, not going to try a coup,

0:20:41 > 0:20:45they don't have enough rebellious MPs in the Conservative Party.She

0:20:45 > 0:20:49is their best shot at making breaks that happened the way they want?

0:20:49 > 0:20:52Yes, so why doesn't she sure that authority and sack people, rather

0:20:52 > 0:20:57than letting them resign. And it is clear policies on the things she

0:20:57 > 0:21:01cares about, but instead we have this bit by bit approach, and she is

0:21:01 > 0:21:05making it all seem rather laborious. I think if you are a Brexiter, you

0:21:05 > 0:21:09would say, yes, she is delivering the date, but making it look like

0:21:09 > 0:21:13really hard work, not very tasty gruel that the country has to eat

0:21:13 > 0:21:20up.Ian, it is such a the bridal time for the Conservative Party. Are

0:21:20 > 0:21:23there parallels with previous administrations for you, not?The

0:21:23 > 0:21:28one that is being drawn is with the John Major..., government that had

0:21:28 > 0:21:31economic issues coming out of the European monetary system, then was

0:21:31 > 0:21:36beset by problems with a declining majority and a series of scandals

0:21:36 > 0:21:41after John Major's Back To Basics speech. That was the comparison and

0:21:41 > 0:21:44I wrote last week in the Guardian that it is actual and much worse,

0:21:44 > 0:21:48and don't be fooled by thinking it is only that bad, it is much worse.

0:21:48 > 0:21:52Not only other sex scandals more profound in what is happening the

0:21:52 > 0:21:56for in that it is about societal problems and how women are treated,

0:21:56 > 0:21:59but it goes much deeper in terms of economic issues, the chaos in the

0:21:59 > 0:22:05Government, and you know John Major at least began with a majority, but

0:22:05 > 0:22:08Theresa May has blundered away her majority. Overshadowing everything

0:22:08 > 0:22:12is one big issue, Brexit, and still we have not begun to resolve how we

0:22:12 > 0:22:16will get out of Europe if indeed that is to happen.What sort of

0:22:16 > 0:22:20trouble if any good Priti Patel make for Theresa May on the backbenches?

0:22:20 > 0:22:27She spoke in her resignation letter about speaking up for a sovereign

0:22:27 > 0:22:30independent Britain.Yes, you mentioned the divorce bill, billions

0:22:30 > 0:22:36of pounds of taxpayers' money, and she's a big advocate for taxpayer

0:22:36 > 0:22:39money on the aid budget, so she could come around and say, I don't

0:22:39 > 0:22:42quite agree with this, and she has particular views on foreign policy.

0:22:42 > 0:22:47She could just be a nuisance.This was the woman commissioning work on

0:22:47 > 0:22:55her own department to see if money could be given to the Israeli army,

0:22:55 > 0:22:58from British taxpayers?Yes, it was a bit of a paradox that, a bit

0:22:58 > 0:23:02strange. I think she could be very awkward and with a working majority

0:23:02 > 0:23:07of just 12 it is very problematic. But remember the polls are still

0:23:07 > 0:23:10neck and neck. The Conservatives are not in complete freefall like they

0:23:10 > 0:23:15were in the 1990s. If Theresa May was overthrown and the new leader of

0:23:15 > 0:23:18the Conservative Party decided to have an election, there is every

0:23:18 > 0:23:22possibility the Conservatives might actually wind a majority.I saw

0:23:22 > 0:23:27someone the other day saying if you want to know how bad it is for the

0:23:27 > 0:23:31Tories, just think, if Ed Miliband was the leader of the Labour Party

0:23:31 > 0:23:35the Tories would be 15 points behind. And everything is about

0:23:35 > 0:23:38Jeremy Corbyn being leader of the Labour Party and then being

0:23:38 > 0:23:44terrified about handing power to our left Government, bolstering their

0:23:44 > 0:23:48rags of power. Priti Patel, we should think, she was overpromoted,

0:23:48 > 0:23:51a very poor aid minister, and she does not have a huge amount of

0:23:51 > 0:23:55allies. Unlike some of the Keith Brexiteers who are very key figures

0:23:55 > 0:24:03and respected on the backbenches -- unlike many of the key Brexiteers.

0:24:03 > 0:24:06And asking viewers about Theresa May this morning, how does she get a

0:24:06 > 0:24:10grip?The budget in a couple of weeks would be a good place to start

0:24:10 > 0:24:14but the problem is there is not a lot of money around.A lot of

0:24:14 > 0:24:17unravelling after a budget usually? You could see the last three have

0:24:17 > 0:24:29gone pretty poorly. When Philip Hammond tried to put up taxes on

0:24:29 > 0:24:33some workers, there was an outcry. I think they have to respond to the

0:24:33 > 0:24:36election, saying that we feel the NHS is Greece, housing is not there

0:24:36 > 0:24:40for young people, too expensive for everyone, and those kinds of things

0:24:40 > 0:24:45about aspirations -- we feel that the NHS is squeezed.Again I think

0:24:45 > 0:24:48they have to show they are about something beyond meandering through

0:24:48 > 0:24:53Brexit. They have to show they have some ambition, things to say to the

0:24:53 > 0:24:57public on what they are concerned about, whether it is social care,

0:24:57 > 0:25:00and embarrassing thing to bring up for Theresa May, whether it is

0:25:00 > 0:25:03housing, the health service, or perhaps they should look beyond

0:25:03 > 0:25:07that, to issues like drug reform something, where they can reach out

0:25:07 > 0:25:12to voters who are not necessarily engaged with politics. Let's not

0:25:12 > 0:25:15forget the Priti Patel resignation probably does not impact people's

0:25:15 > 0:25:19lives a jot, but there are issues where they can reach out and grab

0:25:19 > 0:25:23people, but as of yet all we see is a government blundering from chaos

0:25:23 > 0:25:29to disaster the chaos the disaster, and that is not a good luck.Thank

0:25:29 > 0:25:40you, Ian Birrell, and Henry Mance, thank you for coming on the

0:25:40 > 0:25:47programme. We can talk to Jo-Anne Nadler later when she makes it in.

0:25:47 > 0:25:50Some police control rooms in England and Wales are struggling to cope

0:25:50 > 0:25:52with the number of calls theyr'e getting - according

0:25:52 > 0:25:53to the official police watchdog.

0:25:53 > 0:25:55The report was carried out by Her Majesty's Inspector

0:25:55 > 0:25:56of Constabulary Mike Cunningham.

0:25:56 > 0:26:00We're more calls to 999 and 101 which means some calls don't get a

0:26:00 > 0:26:05response. That is not good. We are looking at how police use the money

0:26:05 > 0:26:08and staff that they have, how well they understand the demand for their

0:26:08 > 0:26:15services, and we found that overall police forces are performing pretty

0:26:15 > 0:26:19well in terms of efficiency, but in this area of control rooms where the

0:26:19 > 0:26:24calls coming, we found in some cases forces are struggling. And that is

0:26:24 > 0:26:29two areas, firstly the sheer volume of calls coming in and how they

0:26:29 > 0:26:34prioritise those, and secondly around staff who work in those

0:26:34 > 0:26:37control rooms, retaining them, giving them the skills they need to

0:26:37 > 0:26:42make an assessment of the calls, so a couple of issues are going on here

0:26:42 > 0:26:45that we are urging constables to have a closer look at. White

0:26:52 > 0:26:55the outcome of that, what they're complaining about, it often goes

0:26:55 > 0:27:00unresolved. That is not good?Issues remain unresolved is clearly is not

0:27:00 > 0:27:06good and we have seen examples of where that happens. We absolutely

0:27:06 > 0:27:09accept police forces have to prioritise, they have to see which

0:27:09 > 0:27:14calls are important, which calls need a response, which ones don't.

0:27:14 > 0:27:17And, encouragingly, police forces now are doing that, not based on the

0:27:17 > 0:27:22type of crime reported, but on the needs of the person who is calling,

0:27:22 > 0:27:28so if my shed was broken in two in the middle of the night, I'm not a

0:27:28 > 0:27:32vulnerable person and might not expect the police to attend. If my

0:27:32 > 0:27:35neighbour who is elderly and lives on their own might have their shed

0:27:35 > 0:27:38broken in the middle of the night, it might terrify them, so they might

0:27:38 > 0:27:41expect reasonably for the police to attend and give them that

0:27:41 > 0:27:45reassurance, so there is much more sophisticated prioritising going on

0:27:45 > 0:27:48based on the needs of the person making the call.Final thought, how

0:27:48 > 0:27:54much stress our police forces under, and particularly over the next few

0:27:54 > 0:27:58years in terms of budget constraints?Yes, we have said in

0:27:58 > 0:28:02this report police forces are under significant stress, and two things

0:28:02 > 0:28:09fall out of that. Firstly, there is clearly less money around now than

0:28:09 > 0:28:14there was, and budgets have been affected, but secondly we are urging

0:28:14 > 0:28:17Chief constables to think very differently about how they can

0:28:17 > 0:28:21provide services in the future, how they provide services to people who

0:28:21 > 0:28:26are vulnerable, who need the police. A lot of people do business now

0:28:26 > 0:28:32online. How do the police forces think about that in terms of how

0:28:32 > 0:28:36people communicate with them. Lots of things are changing in policing,

0:28:36 > 0:28:42and police forces need to really embrace that change and step up.OK,

0:28:42 > 0:29:02thank you very much, thank you, Mike cunning ham. -- Cunningham.

0:29:07 > 0:29:19Some tweets coming and about people's pets. This one, Patch, kept

0:29:19 > 0:29:25happy when she was at her worst. And this is the most delicious dog. And

0:29:25 > 0:29:31Linda says Beazer two most gorgeous dogs, pixie is built Westie and your

0:29:31 > 0:30:01Kate Cross. They are our world -- pixie is a Westie and Yorkie cross.

0:30:06 > 0:30:07Still to come:

0:30:07 > 0:30:08Prevent is the Government's anti-radicalisation scheme.

0:30:08 > 0:30:09But is it working?

0:30:09 > 0:30:12We'll be asking people who work on the programme and a former

0:30:12 > 0:30:13far right extremist.

0:30:13 > 0:30:16And we have a special report on how virtual reality can help people

0:30:16 > 0:30:19tackle a range of phobias, as well as treating other

0:30:19 > 0:30:20mental health conditions.

0:30:20 > 0:30:23Time for the latest news - here's Annita.

0:30:23 > 0:30:23And

0:30:23 > 0:30:25Theresa May is under pressure to restore stability

0:30:25 > 0:30:27to the Government after the second resignation from her

0:30:27 > 0:30:28Cabinet in a week.

0:30:28 > 0:30:30The International Development Secretary, Priti Patel,

0:30:30 > 0:30:32stepped down last night after more questions were raised

0:30:32 > 0:30:34about her unauthorised meetings with Israeli politicians.

0:30:34 > 0:30:36Ms Patel was a prominent Brexit supporter, and the Prime Minister

0:30:36 > 0:30:39is facing calls to replace her with someone who also

0:30:39 > 0:30:40backs leaving the EU.

0:30:40 > 0:30:42Police forces in England and Wales are struggling to meet demand,

0:30:42 > 0:30:46due to a surge in the number of calls from members of the public.

0:30:46 > 0:30:48A survey by the policing watchdog says the service is under

0:30:48 > 0:30:50"significant stress" because of budget cuts,

0:30:50 > 0:30:54although it says forces could help by making further efficiencies.

0:30:54 > 0:30:57The First Minister of Wales, Carwyn Jones, is to issue

0:30:57 > 0:30:59a statement today amid criticism of the way he handled

0:30:59 > 0:31:01misconduct allegations against a Welsh cabinet member,

0:31:01 > 0:31:07who is believed to have taken his own life.

0:31:07 > 0:31:09The family of Carl Sargeant - who'd been accused of

0:31:09 > 0:31:11inappropriate touching - says he was denied natural justice

0:31:11 > 0:31:14because he wasn't given details of the allegations which led

0:31:14 > 0:31:16to his sacking.

0:31:16 > 0:31:19US President Donald Trump has urged Chinese leader Xi Jinping to "work

0:31:19 > 0:31:25very hard" on persuading North Korea to give up its nuclear weapons.

0:31:25 > 0:31:27Discussions on how to deal with North Korea's threats

0:31:27 > 0:31:29to the region have dominated the agenda during Mr

0:31:29 > 0:31:32Trump's tour of Asia.

0:31:32 > 0:31:34This morning he warned that "time is quickly

0:31:34 > 0:31:36running out" to deal with the North Korean

0:31:36 > 0:31:39nuclear threat.

0:31:39 > 0:31:42Reports from Hollywood say Kevin Spacey is to be edited out

0:31:42 > 0:31:44of a new film six weeks before its release -

0:31:44 > 0:31:46following the recent allegations of sexual assault.

0:31:46 > 0:31:49Spacey, who plays Jean Paul Getty in the thriller,

0:31:49 > 0:31:51"All The Money In The World", will be replaced by

0:31:51 > 0:31:55the Oscar-winning Canadian actor, Christopher Plummer.

0:31:55 > 0:32:00The release will still go ahead as planned on December 22nd.

0:32:00 > 0:32:03Scientists say skin injuries - such as cuts - heal quicker

0:32:03 > 0:32:07if they happen during the day.

0:32:07 > 0:32:09Researchers found that people who suffered burns after 8pm took

0:32:09 > 0:32:12an average of 28 days to get better - compared with 17 for

0:32:12 > 0:32:13the daytime injuries.

0:32:13 > 0:32:19They think the human body clock is reason why.

0:32:19 > 0:32:23That's a summary of the latest BBC News.

0:32:23 > 0:32:25Here's some sport now.

0:32:25 > 0:32:26These are our headlines this morning.

0:32:26 > 0:32:29England Women are playing the one-off test against Australia

0:32:29 > 0:32:31in their Ashes Series.

0:32:31 > 0:32:33They won the toss in Sydney and chose to bat.

0:32:33 > 0:32:40Heather Knight and Tammy Beaumont scored half centuries.

0:32:40 > 0:32:41England are 206-4.

0:32:41 > 0:32:45Eni Aluko says she is disappointed by the lack of support she has had

0:32:45 > 0:32:46from England teamates.

0:32:46 > 0:32:48The FA has apologised to her after an inquiry found

0:32:48 > 0:32:50that the former coach Mark sampson used racially dicriminatory

0:32:50 > 0:32:55language towards her.

0:32:55 > 0:32:57Aluko was an unused substitute last night, as Chelsea beat Rosengard 3-0

0:32:57 > 0:32:59in the Champions' League.

0:32:59 > 0:33:02Fran Kirkby scored the pick of their goals in the first leg

0:33:02 > 0:33:05of their last 16 tie.

0:33:05 > 0:33:08And Northern Ireland are preparing for the first leg of their World Cup

0:33:08 > 0:33:12play-off against Switzerland.

0:33:12 > 0:33:14They play at Winsdor Park tonight before the second

0:33:14 > 0:33:15leg in Basel on Sunday.

0:33:15 > 0:33:19That's all your sport.

0:33:19 > 0:33:22We'll learn more this morning - very shortly - about how many

0:33:22 > 0:33:24people are being referred to the government's anti

0:33:24 > 0:33:30radicalisation programme - Prevent.

0:33:30 > 0:33:37I've just got the figures right now, and it is telling me that thousands

0:33:37 > 0:33:42of children and teenagers have been flagged up to the government to's

0:33:42 > 0:33:46anti-radicalisation programme. These are official figures just in from

0:33:46 > 0:33:54the Home Office. The first detailed figures of Prevent revealed that

0:33:54 > 0:34:012127 of those referred in 2015-16 were under 15, including more than

0:34:01 > 0:34:12500 girls. Another 2000 were aged between 15-20. The first detailed

0:34:12 > 0:34:18Home Office analysis of Prevent revealed 2000 of those referred in

0:34:18 > 0:34:242015-16 were under 15, including 500 girls.

0:34:24 > 0:34:26The scheme is part of the counter-terror strategy

0:34:26 > 0:34:29created by the Labour government in 2003 to support those at risk

0:34:29 > 0:34:30of joining extremist groups including far-right

0:34:30 > 0:34:31and radical islamist groups.

0:34:31 > 0:34:33It tries to strengthen relationships between the police

0:34:33 > 0:34:34and other organisations, and requires senior

0:34:34 > 0:34:36community figures - from faith leaders to teachers

0:34:36 > 0:34:40to doctors - to report any suspicions.

0:34:40 > 0:34:43Those in favour say it helps people who might be drawn

0:34:43 > 0:34:45into that radicalised world - but critics claim it creates

0:34:45 > 0:34:47distrust which can leave those who are at risk,

0:34:47 > 0:34:52even more isolated.

0:34:52 > 0:34:55Let's now speak to two people who work at the more extreme end

0:34:55 > 0:34:58of the Prevent strategy - known as Channel.

0:34:58 > 0:35:00Nigel Bromage is a former far right extremist, and Rashad Ali

0:35:00 > 0:35:04is a counter-extremism specialist.

0:35:04 > 0:35:08Both provide support to individuals who are seriously

0:35:08 > 0:35:18at risk of radicalisation.

0:35:18 > 0:35:22Just over 2000 of those referred to Prevent were under the age of 15

0:35:22 > 0:35:28including more than 500 girls in 2015-16.Those other referrals, they

0:35:28 > 0:35:32are considered to be a concern by front line staff. The number of

0:35:32 > 0:35:37people who go on to an engaged Channel intervention is probably

0:35:37 > 0:35:41around a quarter of that.What do you think of that number of

0:35:41 > 0:35:45referrals?I'm not sure to what extent is that picking up all the

0:35:45 > 0:35:50issues we are dealing with. We are talking about individuals who are

0:35:50 > 0:35:53expressing an interest towards extremist ideologies which have a

0:35:53 > 0:35:57tendency towards violence. Those on the far right and Islamist side. And

0:35:57 > 0:36:03to some extent what you are seeing is some who have concerns, which the

0:36:03 > 0:36:06majority of those concerns are laid at the initial stage by saying there

0:36:06 > 0:36:10is nothing here to be concerned about, and any small number of

0:36:10 > 0:36:17people who think when you break it down its not a large problem. But it

0:36:17 > 0:36:20is significant enough to understand why it's necessary to have some type

0:36:20 > 0:36:24of engagement for them.Thank you for the context because it is

0:36:24 > 0:36:29important. How do you react the figures?For me it's about the more

0:36:29 > 0:36:34people that are reported, the more people we can engage with.You see

0:36:34 > 0:36:39these figures as a good thing, the fact that so many under 15 is being

0:36:39 > 0:36:43referred?Obviously I'd like it to be a lot less than that but for me

0:36:43 > 0:36:46if there are people who need support, then I would rather be

0:36:46 > 0:36:50aware of them so we can get involved and try and support these people.

0:36:50 > 0:36:58You spent nearly 20 years as a far right extremist, including joining

0:36:58 > 0:37:03Combat 18 who are openly racist and pro-Nazi. You groomed to join such

0:37:03 > 0:37:10groups?Very much so. I joined the far right because I was anti-IRA and

0:37:10 > 0:37:15anti-terrorist. It wasn't because I was racist. I had black and Asian

0:37:15 > 0:37:23friends, I used to listen to reggae music.It evolved from there?It

0:37:23 > 0:37:26evolved from there. I was groomed through a slow process where they

0:37:26 > 0:37:32listened to my home concerns, my home issues...Would you have

0:37:32 > 0:37:37described yourself as a vulnerable teenager?Yes, at the time my mother

0:37:37 > 0:37:41was dying of cancer. The far right moved in, they took at a hospital,

0:37:41 > 0:37:44they bought the shopping when we needed it, it was a very gradual

0:37:44 > 0:37:49process. They are very good at what they do and we've got to try and

0:37:49 > 0:37:54counter that.Is it fair to say the threat of radicalisation in this

0:37:54 > 0:38:00country is as much about far right extremism as Islamist extremism?I

0:38:00 > 0:38:04wouldn't say it's as much but it is a growing problem. As more people

0:38:04 > 0:38:09get angry about various issues... Like what? What would attract you to

0:38:09 > 0:38:14Combat 18 now?People who have been upset about things like the

0:38:14 > 0:38:19Manchester bomb attack. The far right wasted no time, they tried to

0:38:19 > 0:38:22manipulate that. Thankfully the people of Manchester sent them

0:38:22 > 0:38:26packing. There was no room for extremism at that time. But the far

0:38:26 > 0:38:33right try and manipulate issues and concerns that people have.Your

0:38:33 > 0:38:36official title is a Channel intervention provider, what does

0:38:36 > 0:38:42that mean in practical terms? Give us an insight into how you engage

0:38:42 > 0:38:46with radicalised individuals and tried to the radical them.There are

0:38:46 > 0:38:52a number of people who are expressing understandable sentiments

0:38:52 > 0:38:55which is anger towards what is happening in the world they see

0:38:55 > 0:38:59around them. Some of them have personal, negative experiences. Some

0:38:59 > 0:39:06of them may well have a world view which tells there is a global war

0:39:06 > 0:39:10against Muslims and therefore they are fighting at the edge of that

0:39:10 > 0:39:16war. Many of these young people or slightly older people will be taken

0:39:16 > 0:39:20on board by extremist groups. Some of them will try to go and join

0:39:20 > 0:39:25Isis, some of them returned from conflicts, some of them may have

0:39:25 > 0:39:29been arrested for minor offences. Those individuals, it's easier to

0:39:29 > 0:39:33engage with them so that they can understand their anger is normal but

0:39:33 > 0:39:37also understand how they are being manipulated by these ideas and by

0:39:37 > 0:39:42these groups. And then allow them a means by which they can reconcile

0:39:42 > 0:39:46with themselves.Do you talk to them?One of the ways obviously is

0:39:46 > 0:39:51to be able to get them to talk and explain their perspective, and

0:39:51 > 0:39:56getting them to reflect on what they are thinking about. Often they have

0:39:56 > 0:40:00a certain set of assumptions which are quite dangerous. Getting them to

0:40:00 > 0:40:05realise their political worldview is quite immature but also that that

0:40:05 > 0:40:09emotions are in conflict with their religious sensibilities.As you

0:40:09 > 0:40:16know, some people feel it unfairly targets Muslims, this programme.

0:40:16 > 0:40:21Here are some students we spoke to last year.There is a real sense of

0:40:21 > 0:40:29fear and suspicion, and questioning of where the academic freedoms come

0:40:29 > 0:40:32in.

0:40:32 > 0:40:35So on campuses we've got people self censoring in classrooms.

0:40:35 > 0:40:37We've got, you know, students worried about what websites

0:40:37 > 0:40:40they can go on, students worried about what they can study, cutting

0:40:40 > 0:40:42things out of their dissertations because they're scared.

0:40:42 > 0:40:44And it's really curtailing the freedom of someone who wants

0:40:44 > 0:40:47to come to university and wants to study things, and that's

0:40:47 > 0:40:48the whole point, right?

0:40:48 > 0:40:50There have been occasions where I have been sort of afraid

0:40:50 > 0:40:53to put my head above the parapet and sort of give my opinions

0:40:53 > 0:40:56on certain things at the risk of sort of being treated

0:40:56 > 0:40:57as an outcast.

0:40:57 > 0:41:00Or treated as you know someone that may be suspected

0:41:00 > 0:41:04of being at risk of radicalisation.

0:41:04 > 0:41:06You know, I mean, when I've been searching for certain things,

0:41:06 > 0:41:09some of my friends have been saying to me, be careful.

0:41:09 > 0:41:11Use Incognito, because if the university wonders what you're

0:41:11 > 0:41:16doing, then that puts you in a very precarious, vulnerable

0:41:16 > 0:41:20position where your freedoms may be curtailed, and,

0:41:20 > 0:41:26you know, basically be like the thought police.

0:41:26 > 0:41:28Do you think there's a sense of paranoia,

0:41:28 > 0:41:31oversensitivity, on this issue?

0:41:31 > 0:41:33I don't think there is a paranoia, oversensitivity,

0:41:33 > 0:41:38because I personally know of people who have been referred to Prevent

0:41:38 > 0:41:42over a simple aspect of they were in a debate based

0:41:42 > 0:41:45on theology and religion, and this was organised by the sixth

0:41:45 > 0:41:48form debating society.

0:41:48 > 0:41:51And because they had their own religious beliefs,

0:41:51 > 0:41:56which I personally believe I share similar practices of Islam to them,

0:41:56 > 0:41:59and for them to be referred to the Prevent officer,

0:41:59 > 0:42:01and then get searched, the whole house, his computer,

0:42:01 > 0:42:06his phones, everything.

0:42:06 > 0:42:08I don't think there is oversensitivity.

0:42:08 > 0:42:10I should be cautious, because this has happened to my friend.

0:42:10 > 0:42:17So it could happen to me.

0:42:17 > 0:42:20The students I met at Brunel were all familiar with this man's

0:42:20 > 0:42:23story and used it as an example of why they were on edge

0:42:23 > 0:42:24with the Prevent strategy on campus.

0:42:24 > 0:42:25Mohammed is 33.

0:42:25 > 0:42:28Until last year, he was studying a mast at Staffordshire

0:42:28 > 0:42:30University in terrorism.

0:42:30 > 0:42:32He was reading this book on terrorism studies

0:42:32 > 0:42:34in the campus library, part of the course reading list,

0:42:34 > 0:42:38when he was questioned by a member of staff.

0:42:38 > 0:42:39Do you support Isis?

0:42:39 > 0:42:43Do you dislike homosexuality?

0:42:43 > 0:42:46Do you think that the three girls who left Bethnal Green

0:42:46 > 0:42:49in order to join Isis, what you think of this?

0:42:49 > 0:42:52And the questions became progressively intrusive.

0:42:52 > 0:42:54I was reading this very page of the book,

0:42:54 > 0:42:56which is about the definition.

0:42:56 > 0:42:58The staff never was concerned after the conversation,

0:42:58 > 0:43:00and under the Prevent duty wanted to flag it up.

0:43:00 > 0:43:03Security on campus were asked for Mohammed's details.

0:43:03 > 0:43:06Once he found out what was going on, he launched his own complaint

0:43:06 > 0:43:08against the university, hired a lawyer.

0:43:08 > 0:43:13Do you think that there was anything that you said that gave the member

0:43:13 > 0:43:15of staff reason for concern, and rightly so she went

0:43:15 > 0:43:18and investigated further?

0:43:18 > 0:43:21No, there was no I think or I believe, it was surely

0:43:21 > 0:43:24so-and-so said or it's been said or narrated in such-a-such a work.

0:43:24 > 0:43:27So I followed the academic code to the exact level.

0:43:27 > 0:43:31But unfortunately that did me no favours.

0:43:31 > 0:43:33Mohammed's studies were put on hold while the University

0:43:33 > 0:43:35launched an investigation.

0:43:35 > 0:43:43They apologised, but he's decided not to go back.

0:43:43 > 0:43:49Is that an example of the strategy working or not working?I don't

0:43:49 > 0:43:53think any of those are examples of the strategy at all. The first

0:43:53 > 0:43:56incident weather girl is complaining about somebody being searched and

0:43:56 > 0:44:02their property being looked at has nothing to do with Prevent. It's an

0:44:02 > 0:44:06investigation that has taken place which is a different part of the

0:44:06 > 0:44:09counterterrorism strategy, so obviously there's been some kind of

0:44:09 > 0:44:12terrorism connection there. I don't know the details but that's got

0:44:12 > 0:44:16nothing to do with Prevent. The second case with the individual, we

0:44:16 > 0:44:20can't comment on the details, but has nothing to do with a Prevent

0:44:20 > 0:44:29prefer -- Prevent referral. I don't think it's to do with the referral

0:44:29 > 0:44:32process or prevention. I think a lot of the time some of the issues that

0:44:32 > 0:44:37are raised genuine issues but a lot of the time they come into a

0:44:37 > 0:44:41political context, where people have a view regarding what Prevent is or

0:44:41 > 0:44:48are part of the ideological battle. Whether it's on the hard left or the

0:44:48 > 0:44:52Islamist Wright, who see Prevent as being curtailing their ideological

0:44:52 > 0:45:00belief system.I've got a comment from the National police Chief's

0:45:00 > 0:45:05Council, their lead for Prevent. This is what he says about the

0:45:05 > 0:45:08figures. These figures out this morning demonstrate trust and

0:45:08 > 0:45:14support in Prevent is growing. Each of the 7631 referrals for someone

0:45:14 > 0:45:18trying to guide a person they had concerns about a way from harm and

0:45:18 > 0:45:23towards the help they may have needed. That's his very positive

0:45:23 > 0:45:28spin on these figures. You can see that some might say, hang on, this

0:45:28 > 0:45:33is people overreacting.The thing is, the more people that are aware,

0:45:33 > 0:45:40Prevent is simply about protecting honourable adults and children. That

0:45:40 > 0:45:43is the baseline. We've got to deal with that. The more reports there is

0:45:43 > 0:45:46for me, the more people it's being helped.Thank you very much for

0:45:46 > 0:45:52coming on the programme. Still to come, more reaction to Priti Patel's

0:45:52 > 0:45:55resignation and what Theresa May needs to do to get a grip of the

0:45:55 > 0:45:58situation.

0:45:58 > 0:46:00Virtual reality is capturing the imaginations of gamers everywhere.

0:46:00 > 0:46:02It transports players into worlds that are so immersive

0:46:02 > 0:46:03they seem almost real.

0:46:03 > 0:46:06But its potential goes far beyond computer games.Psychologists

0:46:06 > 0:46:08and computer scientists are testing to see whether the technology

0:46:08 > 0:46:10could be used to treat mental health conditions.They believe that

0:46:10 > 0:46:13because the virtual scenarios are so realistic, they could be used

0:46:13 > 0:46:22to train and heal our minds.

0:46:22 > 0:46:23With mental health services under so much pressure,

0:46:23 > 0:46:25could virtual therapy be the solution?

0:46:25 > 0:46:34We sent our reporter Jean Mackenzie to test it out.

0:46:34 > 0:46:40For some, a phobia of heights can be an almost paralysing experience.

0:46:40 > 0:46:45Simply standing too close to an edge can create intense fear.

0:46:45 > 0:46:49Floor ten.

0:46:49 > 0:46:52This is a virtual reality simulator, designed not only to induce a fear

0:46:52 > 0:46:55of heights, but also to help conquer it.

0:46:55 > 0:46:59The view from here is amazing, isn't it?

0:46:59 > 0:47:02So I'm now right up at the top of the building, and I can see

0:47:02 > 0:47:03the roof just above me.

0:47:03 > 0:47:05And it is very high up.

0:47:05 > 0:47:06How's your anxiety now?

0:47:06 > 0:47:09I still feel OK.

0:47:09 > 0:47:11Quite high up to be this close to the edge

0:47:11 > 0:47:13with very little barrier.

0:47:13 > 0:47:15But OK.

0:47:15 > 0:47:18What I'd like you to do is pick eight apples.

0:47:18 > 0:47:19To reach them, use the platform.

0:47:19 > 0:47:22You push the lever forwards, and it will take you out.

0:47:22 > 0:47:25Let's give it a go.

0:47:25 > 0:47:27OK, I'm moving forward.

0:47:27 > 0:47:29Very good.

0:47:29 > 0:47:30Right, that's one.

0:47:30 > 0:47:38I need to get eight, right?

0:47:38 > 0:47:39Yeah.

0:47:39 > 0:47:41Where shall I put them?

0:47:41 > 0:47:42Oh, you can throw it.

0:47:42 > 0:47:43Oh, OK.

0:47:43 > 0:47:44That's fun.

0:47:44 > 0:47:45This one's quite far away.

0:47:45 > 0:47:48I've got to lean quite far over to get this one.

0:47:48 > 0:47:50I don't think I'd normally do this in real life.

0:47:50 > 0:47:53I would not have leant that far forward if this was for real.

0:47:53 > 0:47:54I can tell you that.

0:47:54 > 0:47:55Take the headphones off.

0:47:55 > 0:47:59So that was quite challenging in some areas.

0:47:59 > 0:48:01Now, I'm not scared of heights myself, but you do

0:48:01 > 0:48:04get a sense of feeling like you are in this space

0:48:04 > 0:48:06that is recreated quite well, and the sense of movement, as well.

0:48:06 > 0:48:11In the lift, you feel like you're moving up.

0:48:11 > 0:48:12You feel like you're moving out.

0:48:12 > 0:48:15And they contribute to making you feel a little bit uneasy,

0:48:15 > 0:48:17a little bit uncertain on your feet.

0:48:17 > 0:48:19But what will it evoked in someone with a real phobia?

0:48:19 > 0:48:20This is Liz.

0:48:20 > 0:48:23And her fear of heights was starting to take over her life.

0:48:23 > 0:48:24Great.

0:48:24 > 0:48:26Let's get started.

0:48:26 > 0:48:29If I had to be in a situation where I was confronted

0:48:29 > 0:48:31with a height, I would feel very, very tense.

0:48:31 > 0:48:41Um... Sort of jumpy.

0:48:43 > 0:48:45And certain height situations made me feel not just that

0:48:45 > 0:48:48I might fall over the edge, but that I actually might

0:48:48 > 0:48:50voluntarily go over the edge, which is a really,

0:48:50 > 0:48:51really unnerving feeling.

0:48:51 > 0:48:54I didn't trust myself with heights any more.

0:48:54 > 0:48:57I felt anxious as to how I might react.

0:48:57 > 0:49:00You're doing marvellously.

0:49:00 > 0:49:02Would you like to try the next floor up?

0:49:02 > 0:49:05Yes.

0:49:05 > 0:49:08Even though you're...

0:49:08 > 0:49:18You know it's not a real world, you do feel the symptoms

0:49:19 > 0:49:21of fear that you would do, but you're braver because you

0:49:21 > 0:49:22know that you're safe.

0:49:22 > 0:49:24Liz has completed this course, and to her amazement,

0:49:24 > 0:49:34it's had a powerful effect.

0:49:34 > 0:49:37How did this feel, Liz, when you were doing it

0:49:37 > 0:49:38for the first time?

0:49:38 > 0:49:39Oh, I was very nervous.

0:49:39 > 0:49:40Um...

0:49:40 > 0:49:42My hands were sweating on a few of the occasions,

0:49:42 > 0:49:44which is not normal for me.

0:49:44 > 0:49:46And I felt very jumpy, at any sort of sound change.

0:49:46 > 0:49:49I mean, I could do it, but I didn't feel very stable.

0:49:49 > 0:49:51But now I feel hugely more confident.

0:49:51 > 0:49:54I thought that it had perhaps changed, but I wasn't really sure

0:49:54 > 0:49:57to what extent until I tried it, so after that session,

0:49:57 > 0:49:59I did go out and put myself into some positions

0:49:59 > 0:50:02where you are sort of facing heights, and I was really,

0:50:02 > 0:50:07really surprised at how differently I felt about it.

0:50:07 > 0:50:10So exposure therapy is when a person is exposed

0:50:10 > 0:50:12to the situation that they're fearful of, that they

0:50:12 > 0:50:16might be avoiding.

0:50:16 > 0:50:18Dr Nihara Krause is a clinical psychologist who's been treating

0:50:18 > 0:50:21mental health problems for more than 20 years.

0:50:21 > 0:50:27Exposure therapy is something that is seen as helping people learn

0:50:27 > 0:50:30to manage their automatic fear response, their physiological

0:50:30 > 0:50:40response, and become desensitised to that response.

0:50:43 > 0:50:46It doesn't fill threatening, and so I don't feel anxious.

0:50:46 > 0:50:47And I feel comfortable with it.

0:50:47 > 0:50:50Would you actually go as far as to say you feel comfortable?

0:50:50 > 0:50:51Yes, I would.

0:50:51 > 0:50:52Which is quite remarkable, really.

0:50:52 > 0:50:55There's something beautiful about VR in the fact that people know it's

0:50:55 > 0:51:01not real and they can try things that they've not done before,

0:51:01 > 0:51:04not done for a long time, yet mind and body does behave

0:51:04 > 0:51:07as if it's in the real world.

0:51:07 > 0:51:11And what they're basically doing, like Liz, is learning a new memory,

0:51:11 > 0:51:15in her instance about safety around heights, and that memory of safety

0:51:15 > 0:51:21is replacing and helping diminish the fear memory that she had.

0:51:21 > 0:51:24One in four of us will have some sort of mental

0:51:24 > 0:51:25health problem this year.

0:51:25 > 0:51:28And with the number of people seeking treatment rising,

0:51:28 > 0:51:33a new approach could be needed.

0:51:33 > 0:51:35Specific phobias are one thing, but what about

0:51:35 > 0:51:45anxiety or depression?

0:51:45 > 0:51:47These are more complex conditions, more nuanced.

0:51:47 > 0:51:49Can a machine ever really replace a human when it

0:51:49 > 0:51:50comes to treating these?

0:51:50 > 0:51:52Mel Slater certainly hopes so.

0:51:52 > 0:51:53His latest programme simulates a therapist's office,

0:51:53 > 0:52:03and uses a popular psychological technique called body swapping.

0:52:03 > 0:52:05So this is a kind of virtual self-help therapy,

0:52:05 > 0:52:08where you can talk to yourself as if you were a friend,

0:52:08 > 0:52:12because we know we are better at solving friends' problems

0:52:12 > 0:52:14than we are our own problems.

0:52:14 > 0:52:17So it gives you a way to get a better perspective on your issues.

0:52:17 > 0:52:23This is Emily, who has severe social anxiety.

0:52:23 > 0:52:25I have this constant voice in my head telling me that

0:52:25 > 0:52:28I'm not good enough, and people will sort of notice

0:52:28 > 0:52:32and judge me for that.

0:52:32 > 0:52:35Daily interactions, like ordering a coffee or taking a book out

0:52:35 > 0:52:37of the library, I get really hot and quite flushed and flustered.

0:52:37 > 0:52:38My breathing gets quicker.

0:52:38 > 0:52:40And then you're just suddenly, everything spills over.

0:52:40 > 0:52:43Can this treatment help?

0:52:43 > 0:52:48To begin, Emily must explain her problem to a virtual therapist.

0:52:48 > 0:52:50I experience a lot of anxiety at university,

0:52:50 > 0:52:58especially social anxiety, which affects me in lectures.

0:52:58 > 0:53:00Now she swaps chairs in the virtual reality,

0:53:00 > 0:53:02and gets to hear her avatar relay her problem.

0:53:02 > 0:53:05I experience a lot of anxiety at university,

0:53:05 > 0:53:09especially social anxiety, which affects me in lectures.

0:53:09 > 0:53:12And going out, sporting events.

0:53:12 > 0:53:16Now it's her job as the therapist to counsel herself.

0:53:16 > 0:53:18Have you thought of using any methods to try to

0:53:18 > 0:53:21calm yourself down?

0:53:21 > 0:53:24Focusing on your breathing, trying to find the cause of your anxiety

0:53:24 > 0:53:29and managing your thoughts?

0:53:29 > 0:53:32And she's now back in her own body, ready to hear that advice.

0:53:32 > 0:53:35Have you thought of using any methods to try to

0:53:35 > 0:53:36calm yourself down?

0:53:36 > 0:53:39Focusing on your breathing, trying to find the cause of your anxiety

0:53:39 > 0:53:44and managing your thoughts?

0:53:44 > 0:53:46I think it's quite difficult when you are experiencing a moment

0:53:46 > 0:53:49of heightened anxiety to remember necessarily some of the techniques

0:53:49 > 0:53:52that you've been taught.

0:53:52 > 0:53:55I think knowing that it was me maybe made it less helpful,

0:53:55 > 0:53:57because it was still kind of my voice.

0:53:57 > 0:54:07But it is, I guess, reassuring, like a bit of a self mantra,

0:54:07 > 0:54:10so something that you were saying to somebody else could

0:54:10 > 0:54:12actually be useful and you could take it on board.

0:54:12 > 0:54:15Body swapping is something that can be used again as a tool that

0:54:15 > 0:54:18accompanies your treatment.

0:54:18 > 0:54:21However, it assumes that a person has first of all got the ability

0:54:21 > 0:54:23to put themselves in someone else's position, which isn't always

0:54:23 > 0:54:27very easy for people.

0:54:27 > 0:54:32The second assumption is that people have the verbal ability to be able

0:54:32 > 0:54:34to express something objectively, which again for some

0:54:34 > 0:54:36people isn't very easy.

0:54:36 > 0:54:40So I would have concerns about somebody doing it on their own.

0:54:40 > 0:54:43So we know there's a crisis of mental health in the UK

0:54:43 > 0:54:49and other countries.

0:54:49 > 0:54:53We know that people often have to wait a long time for appointments

0:54:53 > 0:54:55where issues that are fairly mild over time can become

0:54:55 > 0:54:57much, much worse.

0:54:57 > 0:55:00And maybe this can be a stopgap before they see the real therapist.

0:55:00 > 0:55:02So it's very early days.

0:55:02 > 0:55:05We don't really know yet.

0:55:05 > 0:55:08But these are the kind of ideas that we are investigating right now.

0:55:08 > 0:55:10And you've had conventional talking therapy.

0:55:10 > 0:55:11How does this compare?

0:55:11 > 0:55:15Can it compare?

0:55:15 > 0:55:18Um... I think it's difficult to compare

0:55:18 > 0:55:20it, because there's somebody physically in front of you who's

0:55:20 > 0:55:23trained to offer advice.

0:55:23 > 0:55:25Whereas if you're talking to yourself, you know,

0:55:25 > 0:55:28I'm not a trained mental health professional.

0:55:28 > 0:55:31I don't know maybe the best techniques that you could use.

0:55:31 > 0:55:35I'm really excited.

0:55:35 > 0:55:37I think we can make a fun, interactive and effective treatment

0:55:37 > 0:55:39for people that will change how mental health problems

0:55:39 > 0:55:42are dealt with.

0:55:42 > 0:55:45Some people I think are nervous, perhaps worried about therapists

0:55:45 > 0:55:50being replaced, but we don't see it like that.

0:55:50 > 0:55:53We think VR can aid therapists, but more importantly,

0:55:53 > 0:55:55aid so many more people getting the psychological

0:55:55 > 0:55:57advice that they need.

0:55:57 > 0:56:00If we going to radically increase the provision

0:56:00 > 0:56:01of psychological treatments, then we're going to need

0:56:01 > 0:56:08technologies like VR.

0:56:08 > 0:56:11This therapy will now be trialled on 100 people.

0:56:11 > 0:56:14The aim is to get it into clinics and even people's homes.

0:56:14 > 0:56:16My son asked me, I'd like to go and do Go Ape.

0:56:16 > 0:56:19He has mentioned it before.

0:56:19 > 0:56:21I have managed to move the conversation on,

0:56:21 > 0:56:24and we've not done it.

0:56:24 > 0:56:27I wouldn't even have really liked to see him doing it.

0:56:27 > 0:56:29But I thought, OK, I've done this course.

0:56:29 > 0:56:30I'm going to try it.

0:56:30 > 0:56:31We did it.

0:56:31 > 0:56:34And it was amazing.

0:56:34 > 0:56:36You're crossing sort of bridges where there's

0:56:36 > 0:56:39great gaps in the steps, or walking across a sort

0:56:39 > 0:56:41of tightrope walk, and I was able to look down.

0:56:41 > 0:56:46It's liberating.

0:56:46 > 0:56:49I feel it's given me a lot of confidence as well, actually,

0:56:49 > 0:56:55because part of this reason to do this course as well as conquer my

0:56:55 > 0:56:59fear was I feel like it's good to show my son that a fear that

0:56:59 > 0:57:01you already have, or something that you're frightened of,

0:57:01 > 0:57:05you can get over it if you really put your mind to it.

0:57:14 > 0:57:20And thank you for your e-mails on how your pets have transformed your

0:57:20 > 0:57:27lights. Christine collected her Yorkshire Terrier Rosti --

0:57:27 > 0:57:36transformed your lives. She was rescued by the RSPCA along with 40

0:57:36 > 0:57:39other yorkies and was kept in kennels just for breeding. As you

0:57:39 > 0:57:42can imagine she was traumatised and traumatised when I took her home and

0:57:42 > 0:57:47forced. When I brought her home I was at a very low ebb, feeling life

0:57:47 > 0:57:51had no purpose for me, but Rosti and I bonded from the first moment and

0:57:51 > 0:57:59we have been inseparable since. -- Rusty. I tell everyone she is a

0:57:59 > 0:58:04rescue dog who actually rescued me. Christine from the Isle of Wight,

0:58:04 > 0:58:06thank you.

0:58:06 > 0:58:11Let's get the latest weather update with Carol.

0:58:11 > 0:58:15Turning colder, especially this weekend. At the moment it is chilly

0:58:15 > 0:58:16for summer us, but

0:58:16 > 0:58:17weekend. At the moment it is chilly for summer us, but then for others.

0:58:17 > 0:58:2114 Celsius in Yorkshire at the moment, 12 in Cardiff and further

0:58:21 > 0:58:27south into London, the temperature no picking up, at eight. We have

0:58:27 > 0:58:31this weather front which is cascading southwards taking the

0:58:31 > 0:58:35cloud and rain with it as it does so and behind it allowing the sunshine

0:58:35 > 0:58:37already in the North to spread that bit further south. Through the

0:58:37 > 0:58:43course of this morning you can see the patchy rain and drizzle they

0:58:43 > 0:58:47are, the sunshine coming out behind it, in the North Midlands into Wales

0:58:47 > 0:58:51and south-west England, but we do have a rash of showers coming in on

0:58:51 > 0:58:54a blustery wind across the North of Scotland. Into the afternoon, we

0:58:54 > 0:58:59still have the remnants of that front across the Isle of Wight,

0:58:59 > 0:59:02Southern counties, Kent, Essex, parts of East Anglia as well and

0:59:02 > 0:59:06this is Midlands. Moving north, back into the sunny skies. A pleasant

0:59:06 > 0:59:12day. The same across most of Scotland with the exception of the

0:59:12 > 0:59:17North and the north-west where we hang on to all those showers. For

0:59:17 > 0:59:20Northern Ireland for most of the day you will have a fine day with some

0:59:20 > 0:59:24sunshine, and later we will see the cloud build in the West and for

0:59:24 > 0:59:31Wales when we lose this morning's load the sun will come out. In South

0:59:31 > 0:59:35Wales and south-west England as well, in the sunshine, 13 or 14

0:59:35 > 0:59:39Celsius. Through this evening and overnight, there goes the front,

0:59:39 > 0:59:43taking the rain with it, clear skies following behind. You can also see a

0:59:43 > 0:59:47new system coming in from the West, introducing thicker cloud, breezy

0:59:47 > 0:59:52conditions and some rain. North of that, it will be a cold night,

0:59:52 > 0:59:55widespread frost in Scotland, and we will also still have those showers,

0:59:55 > 1:00:03wintry on the hills, and that holds true tomorrow. Tomorrow will again

1:00:03 > 1:00:05be a blustery day. But tomorrow the weather front sinking south will

1:00:05 > 1:00:07clear more readily from Southern counties and the channel islands

1:00:07 > 1:00:11that we are expecting today, and there will be a lot of sunshine

1:00:11 > 1:00:16around and those showers, then later we have more rain across Northern

1:00:16 > 1:00:22Ireland and into south-west England. Into Saturday, Armistice Day, Varane

1:00:22 > 1:00:25will pull away from the south and then we're looking at today operates

1:00:25 > 1:00:32bells, sunshine and showers but it will feel much cooler -- the rain

1:00:32 > 1:00:38will pull away. Standing around outside it will feel cold. Showers

1:00:38 > 1:00:46in the north, the West and east, but in between a fair bit of sunshine.

1:00:46 > 1:00:52Cheers, Carol.

1:00:52 > 1:00:54Hello, it's 10 o'clock, I'm Victoria Derbyshire.

1:00:54 > 1:00:57Another headache for Theresa May as she loses her second

1:00:57 > 1:00:58senior minister in a week.

1:00:58 > 1:01:00So as Priti Patel resigns, what's next for the government?

1:01:00 > 1:01:03We've got a very weak Prime Minister, are still divided

1:01:03 > 1:01:03We've got a very weak Prime Minister, are still divided country

1:01:03 > 1:01:07and party, and I think it is very justified for European leaders to

1:01:07 > 1:01:11wonder whether this is a government they can do business with.More

1:01:11 > 1:01:14reaction in the next half-hour.

1:01:14 > 1:01:16Thousands of children and teenagers have been referred

1:01:16 > 1:01:18to the government's Prevent anti-terror scheme due to fears

1:01:18 > 1:01:20they were being drawn into radicalisation,

1:01:20 > 1:01:26including more than 500 girls.

1:01:26 > 1:01:33If there are people who need support I'd rather we were aware of them.

1:01:33 > 1:01:36We'll talk to some of those behind the schemes to stop

1:01:36 > 1:01:42radicalisation in schools.

1:01:42 > 1:01:45And fewer of us are owning pets apparently, but we'll be talking

1:01:45 > 1:01:48to a group of animal lovers who say owning a pet has

1:01:48 > 1:01:50changed their lives.

1:02:00 > 1:02:02Annita McVeigh is in the BBC Newsroom with a summary

1:02:02 > 1:02:04of the rest of the day's news.

1:02:04 > 1:02:06Theresa May is under pressure to restore stability

1:02:06 > 1:02:08to the Government after the second resignation

1:02:08 > 1:02:09from her Cabinet in a week.

1:02:09 > 1:02:10The International Development Secretary, Priti Patel,

1:02:10 > 1:02:13stepped down last night after more questions were raised

1:02:13 > 1:02:14about her unauthorised meetings with Israeli politicians.

1:02:14 > 1:02:17Ms Patel was a prominent Brexit supporter, and the Prime Minister

1:02:17 > 1:02:19is facing calls to replace her with someone who also

1:02:19 > 1:02:23backs leaving the EU.

1:02:23 > 1:02:25Police forces in England and Wales are struggling to meet demand,

1:02:25 > 1:02:29due to a surge in the number of calls from members of the public.

1:02:29 > 1:02:31A survey by the policing watchdog says the service is under

1:02:31 > 1:02:34significant stress because of budget cuts although it says forces

1:02:34 > 1:02:44could help by making further efficiencies.

1:02:51 > 1:02:53Thousands of children and teenagers have been flagged up to the

1:02:53 > 1:03:05governance anti-terrorist scheme. That included more than 500 girls.

1:03:05 > 1:03:07British officials will travel to Brussels for further

1:03:07 > 1:03:08Brexit talks today.

1:03:08 > 1:03:11It's the first set of negotiations since EU leaders agreed to begin

1:03:11 > 1:03:12preparing for discussions about the future

1:03:12 > 1:03:13relationship with Britain.

1:03:13 > 1:03:15The Brexit secretary, David Davis and the EU's chief

1:03:15 > 1:03:18negotiator Michel Barnier will join the talks tomorrow, which are likely

1:03:18 > 1:03:20to centre around the UK's financial obligations and the rights

1:03:20 > 1:03:26of British people living in the EU.

1:03:26 > 1:03:29US President Donald Trump has urged Chinese leader Xi Jinping to work

1:03:29 > 1:03:32very hard on persuading North Korea to give up its nuclear weapons.

1:03:32 > 1:03:35Discussions on how to deal with North Korea's threats

1:03:35 > 1:03:38to the region have dominated the agenda during Mr

1:03:38 > 1:03:40Trump's Asian tour.

1:03:40 > 1:03:42This morning he warned that "time is quickly

1:03:42 > 1:03:44running out" to deal with the North Korean

1:03:44 > 1:03:52nuclear threat.

1:03:52 > 1:04:01The United States is committed to the complete and permanent

1:04:01 > 1:04:05denuclearisation of North Korea. China can fix this problem quickly

1:04:05 > 1:04:10and I'm calling on China and your great president to hopefully work on

1:04:10 > 1:04:17it very hard. I know one thing about your president, if he works on it

1:04:17 > 1:04:20hard, it will happen. There's no doubt about it.

1:04:20 > 1:04:23Reports from Hollywood say Kevin Spacey is to be edited out

1:04:23 > 1:04:25of a new film six weeks before its release

1:04:25 > 1:04:27following the recent allegations of sexual assault.

1:04:27 > 1:04:29Spacey, who plays Jean Paul Getty in the thriller,

1:04:29 > 1:04:32All The Money In The World" will be replaced by the Oscar-winning

1:04:32 > 1:04:33Canadian actor, Christopher Plummer.

1:04:33 > 1:04:40The release will still go ahead as planned on December the 22nd.

1:04:40 > 1:04:42Scientists say skin injuries such as cuts heal quicker

1:04:42 > 1:04:44if they happen during the day.

1:04:44 > 1:04:46Researchers found that people who suffered burns after 8pm took

1:04:46 > 1:04:49an average of 28 days to get better compared with 17 for

1:04:49 > 1:04:52the daytime injuries.

1:04:52 > 1:05:00They think the human body clock is reason why.

1:05:00 > 1:05:07That's a summary of the latest BBC News, more at 10.30.

1:05:07 > 1:05:11Allen wants to say, I've been a supporter of the Conservative Party

1:05:11 > 1:05:15for more than 15 years but like so many other supporters I'm so

1:05:15 > 1:05:19disillusioned with the infighting and disarray. It is a failure of

1:05:19 > 1:05:24this government to listen to and act on the concerns of the public. If

1:05:24 > 1:05:29you have advice for Theresa May, let me know. Send me an e-mail, tweet,

1:05:29 > 1:05:31etc.

1:05:31 > 1:05:32Here's some sport now.

1:05:32 > 1:05:35The one-off Test in the Women's Ashes Series is under way in Sydney.

1:05:35 > 1:05:39England won the toss and chose to bat.

1:05:39 > 1:05:45England cannot afford to lose this or Australia will retain the Ashes.

1:05:45 > 1:05:47It's actually the first day-night Ashes Test.

1:05:47 > 1:05:51England lost Lauren Winfield cheaply, but a century partenrshiup

1:05:51 > 1:05:53bewteen Captain Heather Knight who made 62 and Tammy Beaumont, 70,

1:05:53 > 1:05:56put them in control.

1:05:56 > 1:05:59England lost their momentum when they fell, Knight was one

1:05:59 > 1:06:06of two wickets for Jess Jonassen.

1:06:06 > 1:06:16England have lost a couple more in the last hour. Sarah Taylor caught

1:06:16 > 1:06:28and bowled. Sharp fielding their from Belize Perry. -- Elysse Perry.

1:06:28 > 1:06:30Quick update on the England men, their Ashes Series starts

1:06:30 > 1:06:32at the end of the month.

1:06:32 > 1:06:35They are in Adelaide for the second day of a four day tour match.

1:06:35 > 1:06:38Jake Ball went over on his ankle and had to leave the field

1:06:38 > 1:06:41and is a doubt for the rest of the match.

1:06:41 > 1:06:50Australia are 198-7, 95 runs behind England.

1:06:52 > 1:06:56Eni Aluko say she feels let down by some of her team-mates are not

1:06:56 > 1:07:02supporting her following her accusations against Mark Sampson.

1:07:02 > 1:07:07The FA have apologised to her often an enquiry found he had used

1:07:07 > 1:07:12racially discriminatory language towards her and another player.

1:07:12 > 1:07:15It's been very divisive and very adversarial and I think the players

1:07:15 > 1:07:16have been dragged into that.

1:07:16 > 1:07:19But the players have their own mind and they should be able to say,

1:07:19 > 1:07:22actually, let me step back from this and see how this may benefit.

1:07:22 > 1:07:26If I have a problem, if they have a problem,

1:07:26 > 1:07:30they have a process that is going to protect them.

1:07:30 > 1:07:32Aluko was an unused substitute last night for Chelsea,

1:07:32 > 1:07:35as they beat Rosengard in the first leg of their last 16

1:07:35 > 1:07:39Champions' League tie.

1:07:39 > 1:07:43They won 3-0, so will be odds-on to reach the quarterfinals.

1:07:43 > 1:07:51Fran Kirkby scored the pick of their goals.

1:07:51 > 1:07:58A massive night for Northern Ireland in Belfast. The first leg of their

1:07:58 > 1:08:02play-off match against Switzerland.

1:08:02 > 1:08:04They haven't appeared in a World Cup for 32 years,

1:08:04 > 1:08:06and they haven't appeared in back-to-back major tournaments

1:08:06 > 1:08:08ever, but following last year's appearance at Euro 2016,

1:08:08 > 1:08:12where they reached the last 16, they now have the chance to qualify

1:08:12 > 1:08:13for Russia next year.

1:08:13 > 1:08:15The first leg is in Belfast this evening, before the second

1:08:15 > 1:08:17leg in Basel on Sunday.

1:08:17 > 1:08:19A massive few days from Northern Ireland.

1:08:19 > 1:08:22The players have done fantastically so far to get to this point.

1:08:22 > 1:08:24At the end of the day, there's eight countries left

1:08:24 > 1:08:27in Europe and we're the smallest one going into this situation.

1:08:27 > 1:08:30I see in the squad an opportunity that they don't want to waste

1:08:30 > 1:08:33but equally, they have done everything so far and anticipated

1:08:33 > 1:08:36they will do everything over the next two games to try and make

1:08:36 > 1:08:44it a reality.

1:08:44 > 1:08:49Commentary on that match on Radio 5 live this evening. Follow it across

1:08:49 > 1:08:57the BBC sport website as well. In Sydney England creeping up to 227-6

1:08:57 > 1:09:01in that must not lose test.

1:09:01 > 1:09:03The Prime Minister is facing a tricky political balancing act,

1:09:03 > 1:09:05as she decides who should replace Brexit supporter Priti

1:09:05 > 1:09:09Patel in her top team.

1:09:09 > 1:09:11Ms Patel resigned as International Development Secretary last night

1:09:11 > 1:09:12over unauthorised meetings with senior Israeli figures,

1:09:12 > 1:09:14and her departure has fuelled opposition accusations

1:09:14 > 1:09:17that the government is in chaos, and Mrs May is getting

1:09:17 > 1:09:23weaker by the day.

1:09:23 > 1:09:25Let's speak to our political correspondent Eleanor Garnier,

1:09:25 > 1:09:30who is at Downing Street.

1:09:30 > 1:09:36How serious is this?Put it like this, Victoria. Theresa May has just

1:09:36 > 1:09:40lost two cabinet ministers in a week. Her Deputy in all but name

1:09:40 > 1:09:46Damian Green is facing allegations and an investigation. Allegations he

1:09:46 > 1:09:48strenuously denies, but an investigation over those. Her

1:09:48 > 1:09:54Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson is facing calls to be sacked or resign

1:09:54 > 1:09:59over what many say was an extremely serious diplomatic gaffe. Then she's

1:09:59 > 1:10:03got the battle with Brussels and the Brexit negotiations. Added together

1:10:03 > 1:10:07it doesn't make for a comfortable background in which to do a

1:10:07 > 1:10:10reshuffle. They aren't easy at the best of times but now Theresa May

1:10:10 > 1:10:18has Priti Patel, an ardent Brexiteer campaigner, potentially pretty angry

1:10:18 > 1:10:22on the backbenches, and she has got to find someone to replace her. The

1:10:22 > 1:10:26question is, thus Theresa May put someone in who has the right skills

1:10:26 > 1:10:30and experience and choose them based on those circumstances, or does she

1:10:30 > 1:10:36tried to maintain the extremely carefully balanced perspective there

1:10:36 > 1:10:39is in Cabinet over Brexit? She carefully balanced those who

1:10:39 > 1:10:43campaign for Brexit and those who campaign for remain and does she

1:10:43 > 1:10:50find someone to replace Priti Patel who is a Brexiteer? That is the

1:10:50 > 1:10:53challenge Theresa May faces and of course the challenge to look like

1:10:53 > 1:10:57she now has a steady hand, but she can get control of the situation

1:10:57 > 1:11:02over what many say has been an extremely chaotic week. We expect

1:11:02 > 1:11:07the appointment sometime today, but that in itself won't necessarily be

1:11:07 > 1:11:12straightforward. Just last week when Michael Fallon had to go, he was

1:11:12 > 1:11:16replaced by a key ally of Theresa May Gavin Williamson. There was a

1:11:16 > 1:11:21lot of criticism and howls of anger from some in the Conservative Party

1:11:21 > 1:11:27about his meteoric rise from Chief Whip to Secretary of State for

1:11:27 > 1:11:31Defence. Certainly Theresa May is not out of the woods.

1:11:31 > 1:11:34Let's speak to Jo-Anne Nadler, a political commentator and former

1:11:34 > 1:11:35Conservative Party staffer.

1:11:35 > 1:11:40How can Mrs May get a grip of things?In the short term she needs

1:11:40 > 1:11:44to report somebody to replace Priti Patel who has experience and who

1:11:44 > 1:11:47knows something about international development. She did come a cropper

1:11:47 > 1:11:52last week with this extraordinary appointment of Gavin Williamson to

1:11:52 > 1:11:56Defence Secretary, someone who had no ministerial experience and who as

1:11:56 > 1:12:01far as we know doesn't have any particular expertise in defence.

1:12:01 > 1:12:08That was a mistake it would appear but certainly she took a lot of

1:12:08 > 1:12:13criticism for that. Now, as she is deliberating over who should take

1:12:13 > 1:12:16over from Priti Patel, I think she needs to concentrate on the best

1:12:16 > 1:12:23person for the job.Rather than whether they are a Brexiteer or a

1:12:23 > 1:12:28Remainer?Yasser.Can you think of some names?The obvious person would

1:12:28 > 1:12:33be Alistair Burt is extremely well respected, who has a long experience

1:12:33 > 1:12:40of working in this kind of field. But he is very much a Remainer. Even

1:12:40 > 1:12:44as somebody who voted Brexit I think it's important she focuses on the

1:12:44 > 1:12:48job and getting the right person into place.You'll have seen some of

1:12:48 > 1:12:53the headlines today on news websites on the front of the papers

1:12:53 > 1:12:56suggesting the government could collapse in the short term, are

1:12:56 > 1:13:01those over the top or is there a realistic fear?There is a bit of a

1:13:01 > 1:13:05feeding frenzy at the moment. I worked for the Conservative Party

1:13:05 > 1:13:10during quite a lot of the Major government and there were issues,

1:13:10 > 1:13:14crises that happened week on week almost. And yet that government

1:13:14 > 1:13:21served 4-5 years and was only deposed at a general election in

1:13:21 > 1:13:251997, the first rumblings that things were wrong were very soon

1:13:25 > 1:13:30after John Major was elected back in 1992. Whilst I don't think this is a

1:13:30 > 1:13:36great prognosis, the reality is that this could carry on for some time.

1:13:36 > 1:13:41The thinking seems to be from those in the Conservative Party who voted

1:13:41 > 1:13:46for Brexit that Theresa May is their best shot at getting the kind of

1:13:46 > 1:13:52Brexit they want, which is why there has been no move to depose her. Is

1:13:52 > 1:13:56that accurate?That is accurate. There is also the other issue which

1:13:56 > 1:14:01is there is no obvious person to replace Theresa May. She is a sort

1:14:01 > 1:14:05of composite figure. She's served some purposes for the people who

1:14:05 > 1:14:09voted to leave, some for those who voted remain. Both sides are

1:14:09 > 1:14:13probably concerned that whoever takes over might have a stronger

1:14:13 > 1:14:19view in either camp. She somehow manages to straddle both. But the

1:14:19 > 1:14:25reality is that Mrs May didn't go through an election process, she

1:14:25 > 1:14:30emerged a couple of years ago as the leader, and I think most people will

1:14:30 > 1:14:33feel that probably hasn't been to her advantage or to the advantage of

1:14:33 > 1:14:38the party. In looking to replace the party would have to go through a

1:14:38 > 1:14:43lengthy selection process and hardly a position to do that at the moment.

1:14:43 > 1:14:55She is being held in place by external forces.Thank you.

1:14:55 > 1:14:58Labour's Deputy leader Tom Watson told me he believes the full truth

1:14:58 > 1:15:03about Priti Patel's meetings and exactly who she met in Israel is yet

1:15:03 > 1:15:06to emerge. He suspects some in the Foreign Office did know about the

1:15:06 > 1:15:11meetings in Israel.On one level this story is minister does

1:15:11 > 1:15:14something bad, Minister forced to resign. But I think there are more

1:15:14 > 1:15:19questions that need answering today. I was told that Priti Patel had

1:15:19 > 1:15:24meetings with Foreign Office officials from east Jerusalem in the

1:15:24 > 1:15:27consulate, or from the consulate there. That suggests to me that

1:15:27 > 1:15:31there was knowledge of her visit that hasn't been admitted by the

1:15:31 > 1:15:36Foreign Office Downing Street. Also, I was told that the Foreign Office

1:15:36 > 1:15:43has Downing Street -- asked Downing Street to remove details of the

1:15:43 > 1:15:49meeting. If that was the case I honestly think Priti Patel deserves

1:15:49 > 1:15:53some recognition that her argument that there was knowledge of the

1:15:53 > 1:15:57visit, that the Foreign Office understood it, and be Prime Minister

1:15:57 > 1:16:02in some way felt she had to sack her only because the revelations were

1:16:02 > 1:16:08made public not because...The significance of what you're saying

1:16:08 > 1:16:13if it's true, are you saying Number 10 is saying one thing to

1:16:13 > 1:16:16journalists and the rest of the world, when knowing something else

1:16:16 > 1:16:20privately?That could be the case and that's why I've written to

1:16:20 > 1:16:24Theresa May to ask some detailed questions. Principally I would like

1:16:24 > 1:16:27to know, did Priti Patel meet Foreign Office officials on her

1:16:27 > 1:16:31visit to Israel and to the Foreign Office asked Downing Street not to

1:16:31 > 1:16:35publish the details of those meetings? Then I think the record

1:16:35 > 1:16:42can be set straight.

1:16:42 > 1:16:47If those meetings did happen in East Jerusalem and if Number Ten did do

1:16:47 > 1:16:53as you say, what will be the result of that?It will show you the public

1:16:53 > 1:16:56report from number ten is not accurate and it further shows there

1:16:56 > 1:17:00is some attempt to withhold knowledge of Priti Patel's actions.

1:17:00 > 1:17:05We are very concerned about that because obviously if Priti Patel bid

1:17:05 > 1:17:09meet Foreign Office officials from the consulate in East Jerusalem, it

1:17:09 > 1:17:14shows there was knowledge at the Foreign Office -- if Priti Patel did

1:17:14 > 1:17:17meet. And it shows they have not been accurate about their knowledge

1:17:17 > 1:17:23of her conduct when she was out there.The Times are reporting that

1:17:23 > 1:17:25Brussels, and EU Leader, is preparing for the British government

1:17:25 > 1:17:29to collapse by the end of the year. Do you think that is realistic or

1:17:29 > 1:17:36over the top?I have been in politics for 30 odd years, an MP for

1:17:36 > 1:17:3916 years, and I have never seen a weaker administration. I have also

1:17:39 > 1:17:42been a minister at the tail end of a Labour Government. It does seem to

1:17:42 > 1:17:46me there is very little trust between very senior people at the

1:17:46 > 1:17:52heart of government, and this Government is therefore not off

1:17:52 > 1:17:55caused by events, so I think it is possible that a random event could

1:17:55 > 1:17:59bring the Government down.That would mean a general election and

1:17:59 > 1:18:02potentially you and Jeremy Corbyn taking over the running of the

1:18:02 > 1:18:07country. Are you ready for that, are you ready with Brexit, which has

1:18:07 > 1:18:12been overshadowed in recent weeks because of various events?Yes, but

1:18:12 > 1:18:14obviously if there is a general election it will be down to voters

1:18:14 > 1:18:18to decide...Sure, which is why potentially you could find yourself

1:18:18 > 1:18:27running the country.Elections can change governments, yes, and kick a

1:18:27 > 1:18:31government out of office. All I can say is our Brexit negotiating team

1:18:31 > 1:18:34is led by Keir Starmer who has been very effective both at outlining the

1:18:34 > 1:18:38big picture, but he can also do detail. He will put a negotiating

1:18:38 > 1:18:42team in place and make sure we try to get an outcome from those

1:18:42 > 1:18:46negotiations that benefits British workers. We've been very clear that

1:18:46 > 1:18:51we want a workers' first Brexit and that requires us to get tariff free

1:18:51 > 1:18:55access to the Single Market, so I think it would be a very different

1:18:55 > 1:19:00negotiation. It would still be one that removes us from the European

1:19:00 > 1:19:04Union and respect the views of the people in the referendum.Would

1:19:04 > 1:19:08Labour be minded to ask for an extension to this deadline of March

1:19:08 > 1:19:122019 in order to be able to achieve what you've just described there

1:19:12 > 1:19:16are?Look, if you want to know the detail about negotiating strategy

1:19:16 > 1:19:20can I suggest you talk to Keir Starmer?I would love to, but do you

1:19:20 > 1:19:27think that would be a idea?We would have to take over the negotiations,

1:19:27 > 1:19:30when they take place, and we would have to take a realistic view of

1:19:30 > 1:19:34whether we can get a negotiated settlement in time. I'm not going to

1:19:34 > 1:19:39say yes or no on that, but all I can say to you is from opposition we

1:19:39 > 1:19:43have made our negotiating strategy very clear, our priorities, and that

1:19:43 > 1:19:48that would obviously be our priority in government but, is the Government

1:19:48 > 1:19:52going to feel? Who knows. What I am asking today is for the Government

1:19:52 > 1:19:57to be very clear about the circumstances of the meetings behind

1:19:57 > 1:20:02Priti Patel's visit in Israel.I want to ask you about your

1:20:02 > 1:20:06colleague, the Labour leader in the Welsh assembler, Carwyn Jones, who

1:20:06 > 1:20:09sacked his cabinet member and friend Carl Sargeant who it is believed

1:20:09 > 1:20:11took his own life earlier this week over claims of inappropriate

1:20:11 > 1:20:20behaviour. Why was he sacked instead of being suspended?Well, Victoria,

1:20:20 > 1:20:24Carl was a friend of mine, and all I can say to you on that is that many

1:20:24 > 1:20:28of us are still in grief and we are still in shock at his loss, so I'm

1:20:28 > 1:20:34not sure about the details of who said what, when and why, and I'm not

1:20:34 > 1:20:37sure it's appropriate for me to comment on that now. All I would say

1:20:37 > 1:20:41to you is that if there are lessons to be learned about how we apply our

1:20:41 > 1:20:48procedures, we will learn them. Carwyn is speaking to assembly

1:20:48 > 1:20:51members today, and I think I should leave it there at this difficult

1:20:51 > 1:20:58time for everyone.I want to ask you finally about Grenfell, residents

1:20:58 > 1:21:01and survivors of Grenfell. On this programme we regularly report on how

1:21:01 > 1:21:06they are getting on. What are you asking for today?We think that five

1:21:06 > 1:21:08months on from Grenfell the Government needs to make its pledge

1:21:08 > 1:21:12to people who live in flats, high-rise apartments, that they will

1:21:12 > 1:21:18be made safe. Only one in 50 flats has sprinkler systems, and yet we

1:21:18 > 1:21:25know from previous reports in the fires in flats that 99% of fires are

1:21:25 > 1:21:31extinguished when sprinklers are present, so we are saying to the

1:21:31 > 1:21:35Government, make a financial pledge to retrofit every tower block in

1:21:35 > 1:21:42Britain to make sure that we can look to those Grenfell survivors and

1:21:42 > 1:21:45say to them, no one else will have to put up with what you have put up

1:21:45 > 1:21:51with, the fear and the misery, and we are asking the Government to make

1:21:51 > 1:21:54a budget pledge today and my colleague John Healey is leading on

1:21:54 > 1:21:57this, we are determined to make sure that it will be the number one

1:21:57 > 1:22:01negotiating position when it comes to the Finance Bill later in month.

1:22:01 > 1:22:07Tom Watson, Labour's deputy leader. A couple of e-mails from you. Paul

1:22:07 > 1:22:13says I am a Labour supporter and even I wish Mrs would take a tough

1:22:13 > 1:22:17line and get a grip when it comes to the running of our country. Be the

1:22:17 > 1:22:25boss, he says. Katie says Mrs should retire now and retire to a tax

1:22:25 > 1:22:25haven.

1:22:25 > 1:22:29Still to come:

1:22:29 > 1:22:32We'll be talking about why the number of pet owners in the UK is

1:22:32 > 1:22:38declining. A small decline, but at the cry nevertheless, and that was

1:22:38 > 1:22:42obviously an excuse for you to send in pictures of your own pets. Here

1:22:42 > 1:22:46is one. This little monkey has changed my life for the better. My

1:22:46 > 1:22:51dog Harvey makes me laugh every day. Kuyt years, chilling out. And this

1:22:51 > 1:22:58one. A Turkish angora I rescued almost a year ago. It has taught me

1:22:58 > 1:23:05a lot because I have had to learn how to communicate with him in

1:23:05 > 1:23:10different ways and learn perseverance. And this one, yes, I'm

1:23:10 > 1:23:15dog mad and I have five of my own. Clear, you let them go on the bed!

1:23:15 > 1:23:24Is at the bed? The sofa? -- Claire. She runs a small dog rescue centre

1:23:24 > 1:23:33in Dorset. No, no, that is my dog! That is Gracie, and obviously I am

1:23:33 > 1:23:37abusing my position as television presenter to show my own dog. But

1:23:37 > 1:23:42she is cute, come on! If you want to get in touch to send an e-mail. You

1:23:42 > 1:23:46can send us a message on Twitter, or you can use what's up or message us

1:23:46 > 1:23:52on Facebook.

1:23:52 > 1:23:55-- WhatsApp.

1:23:55 > 1:23:57Thousands of children and teenagers have been flagged up

1:23:57 > 1:23:58to the Government's anti-terror programme, Prevent,

1:23:58 > 1:24:00according to official figures released this morning.

1:24:00 > 1:24:032127 of those referred to the scheme in 2015-16 were under

1:24:03 > 1:24:1215, including more than 500 girls.

1:24:12 > 1:24:15Another 2000 more were reported for potential intervention over

1:24:15 > 1:24:16extremism concerns were aged between 15 and 20.

1:24:16 > 1:24:19Prevent aims to reduce the threat to the UK by stopping people

1:24:19 > 1:24:21being drawn into terrorism.

1:24:21 > 1:24:25It has sometimes been controversial, as you know.

1:24:25 > 1:24:31Let's now talk to the West Midlands regional Prevent lead for further

1:24:31 > 1:24:32and higher education Hifsa Haroon-Iqbal.

1:24:32 > 1:24:34Head of Islamic Studies at the counter-extremism

1:24:34 > 1:24:35organisation Quilliam, Usama Hasan.

1:24:35 > 1:24:38And Labour MP Naz Shah, who is a member of the Home

1:24:38 > 1:24:40Affairs Select Committee.

1:24:40 > 1:24:44Welcome to. Firstly, reaction to the figures. Naz Shah, why don't you

1:24:44 > 1:24:50give a reaction to your figure -- these figures?I am quite alarmed at

1:24:50 > 1:24:53these figures and it reinforces a lot of my concerns around Prevent,

1:24:53 > 1:25:02especially when you look at the details of the figures, talking

1:25:02 > 1:25:06about those with vulnerabilities but it does not give us the details.

1:25:06 > 1:25:09More than 75% were referred with no further action, so what that tells

1:25:09 > 1:25:19me is we have a real issue, and certainly the teachers who told us

1:25:19 > 1:25:22in the first select committee, they need the right support to implement

1:25:22 > 1:25:26the Prevent duties, so this reinforces my concerns and raises

1:25:26 > 1:25:30more, really.You mean because teachers, faith leaders, doctors,

1:25:30 > 1:25:33however, senior figures in the community, are ferrying kids and

1:25:33 > 1:25:35they shouldn't be? Because they don't really know what they are

1:25:35 > 1:25:44supposed to be doing. -- they are repairing kits.75% of the referrals

1:25:44 > 1:25:53-- they are referring kids. Looking at the Muslim community, and if you

1:25:53 > 1:25:58look at the Islamic referrals, it is really worrying. If you have

1:25:58 > 1:26:03referred a child, a young person, and it turns out that it is nothing

1:26:03 > 1:26:06they are doing is wrong, it really is worrying for me and is very

1:26:06 > 1:26:12alarming.Jane Foley, how do you respond to these figures?They are

1:26:12 > 1:26:22shocking. -- Usama Hasan, how do you respond to these figures? A quarter

1:26:22 > 1:26:29of these figures are actually far right referrals.Yes, we reflect

1:26:29 > 1:26:34that...Hundreds of Muslims work for project back and I know hundreds of

1:26:34 > 1:26:38Muslim mums and dads who are grateful for Prevent, who called

1:26:38 > 1:26:43Prevent to stop their children joining Isis in Syria, for example.

1:26:43 > 1:26:49But the 75%, it actually shows there is a high bar, so referrals go to a

1:26:49 > 1:26:53local channel, and only serious cases are actually taken on as

1:26:53 > 1:26:58cases, so 75% are weeded out. What is happening here is there is a new

1:26:58 > 1:27:00duty on schools, and a lot of teachers are worried if they miss

1:27:00 > 1:27:04somebody they could lose their job for missing a potential terrorist,

1:27:04 > 1:27:07so in the initial one or two years I think it is to be expected that

1:27:07 > 1:27:11there will be a lot of false referrals, if you like.What effect

1:27:11 > 1:27:25will that have? If you were 16, I was

1:27:28 > 1:27:3116, and we were referred knowing we had done nothing but because the

1:27:31 > 1:27:33teacher wasn't quite sure, or perhaps had suspicions that were

1:27:33 > 1:27:35inaccurate, it would have a real impact on you, wouldn't it?It could

1:27:35 > 1:27:37do depending on the individual circumstances. I'm quite shocked by

1:27:37 > 1:27:40the figures.Because you think they are high.But there is also of me,

1:27:40 > 1:27:43yes, they are high, but also I think I need to see more of them. On why

1:27:43 > 1:27:46people were referred, and they may not necessarily have gone on to be

1:27:46 > 1:27:49referred for further interventions but they may have needed support in

1:27:49 > 1:27:53other areas. For me the important factor is we need to understand that

1:27:53 > 1:27:57Prevent is very much about safeguarding, very much about trying

1:27:57 > 1:28:01to stop people from getting involved in things that could potentially end

1:28:01 > 1:28:05up with them supporting terrorism, or committing terrorist atrocities

1:28:05 > 1:28:09themselves.Naz Shah, do you accept that, safeguarding of young people

1:28:09 > 1:28:14issue?If it took the safeguarding approach it would be very effective,

1:28:14 > 1:28:20but it doesn't. What it does, and I absolutely disagree with Doctor

1:28:20 > 1:28:24Usama 's take on whether it is toxic or not, because talk to the vast

1:28:24 > 1:28:28majority, and I have a very large Muslim large Muslim constituency,

1:28:28 > 1:28:30Muslim community within that, telling me very loudly and clearly,

1:28:30 > 1:28:34and in Bradford and must admit we don't have the kind of narrative

1:28:34 > 1:28:40around Prevent which is nationally amongst the Muslim community, simply

1:28:40 > 1:28:43because we work with the community, and this top-down approach, and we

1:28:43 > 1:28:47have heard in the select committee academics and teachers coming to us

1:28:47 > 1:28:51and saying they just don't have the right training to implement their

1:28:51 > 1:28:54Prevent duty, they don't feel confident enough, and these figures,

1:28:54 > 1:28:57actually with foresight, if you have the confidence to talk to a young

1:28:57 > 1:29:01person to address their issues, and when we talk about these young

1:29:01 > 1:29:07people who have no further action, who are stopped from being exploited

1:29:07 > 1:29:12or being radicalised, then what happens if they have mental health

1:29:12 > 1:29:15issues? If we took a real safeguarding approach I would be

1:29:15 > 1:29:18very confident we would be addressing issues of alienation, of

1:29:18 > 1:29:23poverty. When young people are vulnerable they are vulnerable for

1:29:23 > 1:29:28reasons, and those reasons are what we need to be addressing. Those

1:29:28 > 1:29:30reasons of poverty, disenfranchisement except, and that

1:29:30 > 1:29:33is not what we are getting here so it is not a safeguarding approach

1:29:33 > 1:29:38being taken by the Government. I would like it to be but I am not

1:29:38 > 1:29:43convinced it is.Usama Hasan, what is the difference between the far

1:29:43 > 1:29:47right extremists and Islamist extremists try to groom and

1:29:47 > 1:29:51radicalise young people?Actually they are very similar, the two

1:29:51 > 1:29:57approaches, they are like mirror images of each other, based on false

1:29:57 > 1:30:00grievances, victim narrative, protecting your own tribe and

1:30:00 > 1:30:04accusing the others, the other side, or Jews or anybody else, of trying

1:30:04 > 1:30:11to wake you up, so you get people who are basically -- trying to wipe

1:30:11 > 1:30:15you out, sold one side saying people are trying to target Muslims and

1:30:15 > 1:30:19Islam, and others saying people are out to target the white race, and it

1:30:19 > 1:30:22is the radicalise is saying we need to team up and get violent, for

1:30:22 > 1:30:26example. So that is why you see children reflecting that, sometimes,

1:30:26 > 1:30:31in their essays and comets in class. Again, the 75% no further action is

1:30:31 > 1:30:35actually the right approach because all you need in cases is for the

1:30:35 > 1:30:39teacher to talk to the young person, in a gentle way, and if needed speak

1:30:39 > 1:30:44to the parents as well, a channel referral of Prevent is an absolute

1:30:44 > 1:30:47last resort. So I would encourage teachers to use their common sense,

1:30:47 > 1:30:51and deal with this like safeguarding. A Durham academic

1:30:51 > 1:30:54study showed recently that despite criticisms the vast majority of

1:30:54 > 1:30:57school heads and managers were quite happy with how Prevent was working

1:30:57 > 1:31:04and they were using it on the safeguarding.

1:31:04 > 1:31:08What about the influence of Monsanto ads on their children? What about

1:31:08 > 1:31:14the influence of what kids can see on you Tube? -- the influence of

1:31:14 > 1:31:19mums and dads.We need to try and stop people getting involved in this

1:31:19 > 1:31:24type of activity. It's not just the work of government or Prevent

1:31:24 > 1:31:29strategies. This needs to be a community approach. Young people,

1:31:29 > 1:31:33older people are being radicalised through all sorts of means. It may

1:31:33 > 1:31:36be happening in their homes but I think there's a lot that's going on

1:31:36 > 1:31:41on social media, on the internet. We know for example that from 2010 to

1:31:41 > 1:31:47the present day, 300,000 items of terrorist related material has been

1:31:47 > 1:31:52taken down from the inter-net. That includes websites, social media.

1:31:52 > 1:31:57There is a real need for us to get on top of the agenda. It is very

1:31:57 > 1:32:02much about safeguarding, in the same way we look at trying to protect

1:32:02 > 1:32:05young people from being involved in gang culture, from child sexual

1:32:05 > 1:32:10exploitation. This is another form of grooming and that creaming is

1:32:10 > 1:32:14taking place in all sorts of settings. It's important the work we

1:32:14 > 1:32:19do recognise that.The figures today, when you analyse them a bit

1:32:19 > 1:32:28more, show that 63 people withdrew from the scheme, from Channel the

1:32:28 > 1:32:34more extreme end of the Prevent strategy. Explain, Prevent, Channel.

1:32:34 > 1:32:38Prevent is the government strategy that tries to stop people becoming

1:32:38 > 1:32:41involved in something that could radicalise them and take them down

1:32:41 > 1:32:46the avenue of supporting or committing a terrorist offence. If

1:32:46 > 1:32:50someone is deemed to be at risk, they would then be referred to

1:32:50 > 1:32:56Channel.63 people withdrew from Channel because they didn't want to

1:32:56 > 1:33:03cooperate. What will happen to those people? Brew Channel is voluntary,

1:33:03 > 1:33:09it is not criminal, it is pre-criminal if you like.Hundreds

1:33:09 > 1:33:13of people, thousands actually have been through Channel and have

1:33:13 > 1:33:21benefited from that. They are grateful for that, especially young

1:33:21 > 1:33:25people who with good mentoring have been encouraged to seek education,

1:33:25 > 1:33:30employment and have a fulfilling career. This is by people who could

1:33:30 > 1:33:34have become Muslim extremists, far right extremists or far left

1:33:34 > 1:33:39extremists. We had a conviction of a far left extremist recently for

1:33:39 > 1:33:43example. A lot of people have benefited from this. The approaches

1:33:43 > 1:33:47and perfect of course, there are always mistakes in any sensitive

1:33:47 > 1:33:52issue like this. We have to take stock of these figures and analyse

1:33:52 > 1:33:58them carefully and see how we can improve things stop.

1:33:59 > 1:34:03As well as the work done by intervention providers we also have

1:34:03 > 1:34:07some fantastic projects that take place within local communities that

1:34:07 > 1:34:10are run by the communities themselves who can also support

1:34:10 > 1:34:16these individuals.Thank you.

1:34:16 > 1:34:18Time for the latest news - here's Annita.

1:34:18 > 1:34:19The BBC News headlines.

1:34:19 > 1:34:21Theresa May is under pressure to restore stability

1:34:21 > 1:34:23to the Government after the second resignation from her

1:34:23 > 1:34:25Cabinet in a week.

1:34:25 > 1:34:28The International Development Secretary, Priti Patel,

1:34:28 > 1:34:30stepped down last night after more questions were raised

1:34:30 > 1:34:35about her unauthorised meetings with Israeli politicians.

1:34:35 > 1:34:37Ms Patel was a prominent Brexit supporter, and the Prime Minister

1:34:37 > 1:34:40is facing calls to replace her with someone who also

1:34:40 > 1:34:44backs leaving the EU.

1:34:44 > 1:34:46British officials will travel to Brussels for further

1:34:46 > 1:34:47Brexit talks today.

1:34:47 > 1:34:50It's the first set of negotiations since EU leaders agreed to begin

1:34:50 > 1:34:51preparing for discussions about the future

1:34:51 > 1:34:54relationship with Britain.

1:34:54 > 1:34:56The Brexit secretary, David Davis and the EU's chief

1:34:56 > 1:35:00negotiator Michel Barnier will join the talks tomorrow, which are likely

1:35:00 > 1:35:05to centre around the UK's financial obligations and the rights

1:35:05 > 1:35:08of British people living in the EU.

1:35:08 > 1:35:10Thousands of children and teenagers have been flagged up

1:35:10 > 1:35:12to the Government's anti-terror programme, according to new figures

1:35:12 > 1:35:15released this morning.

1:35:15 > 1:35:17The first detailed Home Office analysis of Prevent reveals that

1:35:17 > 1:35:23over 2000 of those referred to the scheme in 2015-16

1:35:23 > 1:35:30were under the age of 15, and included more than 500 girls.

1:35:30 > 1:35:32Police forces in England and Wales are struggling to meet demand,

1:35:32 > 1:35:36due to a surge in the number of calls from members of the public.

1:35:36 > 1:35:39A survey by the policing watchdog says the service is under

1:35:39 > 1:35:42"significant stress" because of budget cuts,

1:35:42 > 1:35:49although it says forces could help by making further efficiencies.

1:35:49 > 1:35:52US President Donald Trump has urged Chinese leader Xi Jinping to "work

1:35:52 > 1:35:56very hard" on persuading North Korea to give up its nuclear weapons.

1:35:56 > 1:35:58Discussions on how to deal with North Korea's threats

1:35:58 > 1:36:00to the region have dominated the agenda during Mr

1:36:00 > 1:36:03Trump's tour of Asia.

1:36:03 > 1:36:05This morning he warned that "time is quickly

1:36:05 > 1:36:07running out" to deal with the North Korean

1:36:07 > 1:36:11nuclear threat.

1:36:11 > 1:36:15That's a summary of the latest BBC News.

1:36:15 > 1:36:24Here's some sport now.

1:36:24 > 1:36:27England's women had a late collapse in the first of their one-off Ashes

1:36:27 > 1:36:33Test against Australia in Sydney. They closed on 235-7. Australia will

1:36:33 > 1:36:38retain the Ashes if they win that match.

1:36:38 > 1:36:41Eni Aluko says she is disappointed by the lack of support she has had

1:36:41 > 1:36:42from England teamates.

1:36:42 > 1:36:44The FA apologised to her after an inquiry found

1:36:44 > 1:36:46that the former coach Mark sampson used racially dicriminatory

1:36:46 > 1:36:48language towards her.

1:36:48 > 1:36:51Aluko was an unused substitute last night as Chelsea beat Rosengard 3-0

1:36:51 > 1:36:51in the Champions League.

1:36:51 > 1:36:54Fran Kirkby scored the pick of their goals in the first leg

1:36:54 > 1:36:56of their last 16 tie.

1:36:56 > 1:36:59And Northern Ireland are preparing for the first leg of their World Cup

1:36:59 > 1:37:00play-off against Switzerland.

1:37:00 > 1:37:02They play at Winsdor Park tonight before the second

1:37:02 > 1:37:03leg in Basel on Sunday.

1:37:03 > 1:37:10That's all your sport.

1:37:10 > 1:37:14I'll be back with more on BBC News after 11am.

1:37:14 > 1:37:17Liam Albert died in July 2009 after the stolen car he was driving

1:37:17 > 1:37:19crashed during a police pursuit.

1:37:19 > 1:37:22His family demanded to know exactly why he died and when the Independent

1:37:22 > 1:37:24Police Complaints Commission investigated, they raised concerns

1:37:24 > 1:37:26over the behaviour of some of the officers including

1:37:26 > 1:37:29the destruction of photo evidence and a failure to put

1:37:29 > 1:37:35a tape in the dash cam.

1:37:35 > 1:37:37What followed was years of delay before the officers were finally

1:37:37 > 1:37:43called to a gross misconduct hearing last month.

1:37:43 > 1:37:46However, the hearing was thrown out because the length of time that had

1:37:46 > 1:37:52passed meant a fair hearing was "not possible".

1:37:52 > 1:37:55Liam's parents have received an apology but say they're "hurt

1:37:55 > 1:38:01and frustrated" that they'll never get answers.

1:38:01 > 1:38:03Talking to us now for the first time is Liam's mother,

1:38:03 > 1:38:05Sharla John, Liam's father, Delroy Albert, and their

1:38:05 > 1:38:11solicitor, Andre Clovis from Tuckers Solicitors.

1:38:11 > 1:38:18Thank you very much for talking to us. You have been waiting a number

1:38:18 > 1:38:21of years to find out the circumstances of this accident and

1:38:21 > 1:38:26you still don't have the answers. Explain what that is like to use.

1:38:26 > 1:38:36Disappointing, angry, disillusioned a little bit by the IPC C. If you've

1:38:36 > 1:38:40never had any dealings with the IPC C or the police, you believe that

1:38:40 > 1:38:48they will do an independent enquiry and the truth will come out.

1:38:48 > 1:38:53Unfortunately that hasn't happened. What has it been like for you?The

1:38:53 > 1:38:58same. Frustrating, I'm disappointed as well at the outcome. We just want

1:38:58 > 1:39:04to know the truth and the answers for our son. It's been very

1:39:04 > 1:39:11frustrating and disappointing for us.Tell us about your son.Liam...

1:39:11 > 1:39:16He was very loving, very, very loving. He had a passion for cars

1:39:16 > 1:39:20from when he was very young. Not necessarily driving. Any family

1:39:20 > 1:39:24member could come to the house and he would offer to wash, clean the

1:39:24 > 1:39:31car, that was from a very, very young age. He thought of others

1:39:31 > 1:39:39always, and he wore his heart on his sleeve at all times. He wasn't a bad

1:39:39 > 1:39:46tempered child. Yes, he would do some things at 17 and 16 that you

1:39:46 > 1:39:51should not have been doing. We don't condone anything that happened.

1:39:51 > 1:39:59However, he would not go out of his way to hurt anyone at all.How do

1:39:59 > 1:40:04you deal with hearing the news that your son has been killed in an

1:40:04 > 1:40:11accident driving a stolen car after a police pursuit?At the time, the

1:40:11 > 1:40:23car wasn't reported stolen. The fact is the police should have called it

1:40:23 > 1:40:28off a mile and a half before the accident happened. Which is sad to

1:40:28 > 1:40:33know the fact that these officers didn't go buy the book. Lessons

1:40:33 > 1:40:43should be learnt and they still haven't.After this IPCC, three

1:40:43 > 1:40:46police officers faced gross misconduct hearings for things like

1:40:46 > 1:40:54failing to seek authority from the control room for the pursuit.

1:40:54 > 1:40:58Providing an inconsistent account of what happened. Failing to hand over

1:40:58 > 1:41:02a mobile phone. Deleted photos at the scene. When you knew there was a

1:41:02 > 1:41:08hearing coming, did you think finally we'll get the truth?Yes.

1:41:08 > 1:41:15One of the officers was allowed to retire before the hearing, and then

1:41:15 > 1:41:22the hearing came. What happened? Certainly my recollection of how we

1:41:22 > 1:41:27found out was that it was six months after he had retired, and it was in

1:41:27 > 1:41:31the process of normal communications with the IPCC. They had discovered

1:41:31 > 1:41:35that this officer had been allowed to retire by the Metropolitan Police

1:41:35 > 1:41:40and we had no inkling. We were told by that point it was too late to go

1:41:40 > 1:41:45back and bring that offers into the misconduct proceedings.Eventually

1:41:45 > 1:41:53the hearing was set for last month, but?It proceeded in the sense that

1:41:53 > 1:41:58there were submissions made by the officers that their prosecution for

1:41:58 > 1:42:02misconduct shouldn't proceed from the basis that there had been a

1:42:02 > 1:42:11delay. What was interesting about the delay was we first found out

1:42:11 > 1:42:15about some of the things that had gone wrong almost a year after the

1:42:15 > 1:42:20collision. When they were disclosed to us, the family immediately made

1:42:20 > 1:42:24complaints. The next working day, complaints went in. What would

1:42:24 > 1:42:29normally happen is the officers would be notified. It appears the

1:42:29 > 1:42:32Metropolitan Police force who had conduct of this for the first three

1:42:32 > 1:42:42years didn't notify them. If that situation is correct. When the IPCC

1:42:42 > 1:42:49took over the investigation they still didn't notify them. More than

1:42:49 > 1:42:53that, the Metropolitan Police Service at various stages actively

1:42:53 > 1:42:57delayed the investigation from starting. First by arguing that

1:42:57 > 1:43:04there had to be the inquest first, and then by seeking a discontinuance

1:43:04 > 1:43:09from the requirement to investigate the complaint. When that failed,

1:43:09 > 1:43:12seeking a discontinuance. We then had to go to the High Court to

1:43:12 > 1:43:16challenge that decision to get proceedings reinvestigated.The

1:43:16 > 1:43:22outcome is that the hearing didn't go ahead because they said too much

1:43:22 > 1:43:26time had passed and so the officers couldn't get a fair hearing. The Met

1:43:26 > 1:43:30police say our thoughts and sympathies remain with Liam's family

1:43:30 > 1:43:34for their tragic loss. It is crucially important for public

1:43:34 > 1:43:37confidence that officers are held to account and the sad death of Liam

1:43:37 > 1:43:42has been investigated twice through a managed and then independent IPCC

1:43:42 > 1:43:46enquiry and fully scrutinised. It's also important officers are treated

1:43:46 > 1:43:50fairly and in the exceptional circumstances this case the panel

1:43:50 > 1:43:55determined that could not happen. The IPCC sake, we'd very much regret

1:43:55 > 1:43:59our part in any delay and want to apologise to the family for the

1:43:59 > 1:44:02frustration and upset this has caused as well as to the officers

1:44:02 > 1:44:09involved. How do you rationalise now, finally, the fact you won't get

1:44:09 > 1:44:15the answers you're looking for, and you have two adjust to that?We have

1:44:15 > 1:44:22to grieve now. It's been eight years, eight years of fighting for

1:44:22 > 1:44:27him. Eight years for me personally of keeping him alive in some way.

1:44:27 > 1:44:32Now it's come to an end, not the result we wanted, but the end is the

1:44:32 > 1:44:39scary part for me because now I have to grieve for my son. Basically

1:44:39 > 1:44:42accept the decision that's been made. There's nowhere we can go

1:44:42 > 1:44:52after this.A brief point that you want to make about police pursuits,

1:44:52 > 1:44:57particularly high-speed police pursuits.They seem to be on the

1:44:57 > 1:45:06increase, particularly in urban areas. In 1999 for instance, Sheena

1:45:06 > 1:45:09McDonald the news presenter was knocked over and seriously injured.

1:45:09 > 1:45:19In that year there were nine, sorry six deaths. That spiked and dipped

1:45:19 > 1:45:24since then. But in 2016, there were 13 deaths. In the first four months

1:45:24 > 1:45:34of this year, there were 28 deaths. There are 28 families like this.You

1:45:34 > 1:45:41believe that requires some scrutiny? What is worse than that is that the

1:45:41 > 1:45:46macro 25% of those people wholly unconnected to the pursuit. People

1:45:46 > 1:45:50going about their lawful business. We need to think about whether these

1:45:50 > 1:45:54pursuits are a proportionate way to resolve whatever the issue is the

1:45:54 > 1:46:05police are confronted with.Thank you.

1:46:05 > 1:46:07The First Minister of Wales, Carwyn Jones, is due to make

1:46:07 > 1:46:10a statement later today amid criticism of the way he handled

1:46:10 > 1:46:12misconduct allegations against a Welsh cabinet member,

1:46:12 > 1:46:15who's believed to have killed himself.

1:46:15 > 1:46:17The family of Carl Sargeant says he was denied justice

1:46:17 > 1:46:20because he wasn't given details of the claims before he was sacked.

1:46:20 > 1:46:29Our Wales correspondent Tomos Morgan is in Cardiff for us this morning.

1:46:29 > 1:46:37Do you know what Carwyn Jones is likely to see later?-- see later.

1:46:37 > 1:46:44What we do know is that Carwyn Jones will come here to the Senedd to

1:46:44 > 1:46:52discuss with other Labour assembly members, and he will then issue a

1:46:52 > 1:46:57statement. This is undoubtedly one of the biggest challenges the First

1:46:57 > 1:47:00Minister has faced during his eight year tenure as First Minister of

1:47:00 > 1:47:05Wales. There has been criticism from within his own party about the way

1:47:05 > 1:47:13that the First Minister has handled the process of the allegations of

1:47:13 > 1:47:16improper conduct against Carl Sargeant, and other parties in Wales

1:47:16 > 1:47:23have called on him to resign. The family of Carl Sargeant want an

1:47:23 > 1:47:27independent review into the process that took place, and just last night

1:47:27 > 1:47:33some more scathing criticism from former cabinet secretary, and a

1:47:33 > 1:47:37former close ally of Carwyn Jones, Leighton Andrews, who said he was

1:47:37 > 1:47:42very angry with the way the situation had been dealt with, and

1:47:42 > 1:47:47angry with the fact that Carwyn Jones had been conducting interviews

1:47:47 > 1:47:56on the TV and radio on the Monday, before Carl Sargeant, it is

1:47:56 > 1:48:01understood, took his life. The family, as you just mentioned there,

1:48:01 > 1:48:06have released some of the details of the information that was in their

1:48:06 > 1:48:12lawyer's statement to the Labour Party. They have said that Carl was

1:48:12 > 1:48:14accused of unwanted attention and inappropriate groping are touching,

1:48:14 > 1:48:18but that he was deprived of natural justice. He wanted to know more

1:48:18 > 1:48:23details of the allegations against him, and he was distressed at not

1:48:23 > 1:48:29being able to defend himself because he didn't have those full details,

1:48:29 > 1:48:33they say, and his mental well-being had been affected, they said. The

1:48:33 > 1:48:38Labour Party have said that in line with agreed procedure, the nature of

1:48:38 > 1:48:45the allegations were explained to Carl Sargeant, and as I see later

1:48:45 > 1:48:48today Carwyn Jones who will come here to the Senedd to discuss the

1:48:48 > 1:48:56situation with Labour AMs. Business has been suspended this week in

1:48:56 > 1:49:00light of what has happened and Labour's Carwyn Jones will release a

1:49:00 > 1:49:03statement but at the moment we do not know what will be in that

1:49:03 > 1:49:09statement.Tomos reporting live from Cardiff, many thanks.

1:49:09 > 1:49:12We're a nation of animal lovers, with millions of us

1:49:12 > 1:49:13across the country owning pets.

1:49:13 > 1:49:16Aside from the care they provide, they can also help people

1:49:16 > 1:49:17deal with loneliness, disability and teach important

1:49:17 > 1:49:18lessons to children.

1:49:18 > 1:49:20But new research today shows the number of us

1:49:20 > 1:49:24owning pets is declining.

1:49:24 > 1:49:26Let's talk to Teresa Jones, who got her dogs after her

1:49:26 > 1:49:28children left home.

1:49:28 > 1:49:30She's disabled and spends a lot of time at home,

1:49:30 > 1:49:37so felt she was in need of the company.

1:49:37 > 1:49:48And those are her two dogs. Who is a?Roscoe and karma. -- who are

1:49:48 > 1:49:56these two.He has been in a car for ages so he is a bit excited. Thank

1:49:56 > 1:49:57you for coming in.

1:49:57 > 1:50:00Jo Botting bought two cats to give her children

1:50:00 > 1:50:05responsibility and teach them different experiences.

1:50:05 > 1:50:07Alec and Connor are here as well. Hello.

1:50:07 > 1:50:11Nathalie Ingham is Battersea Cats and Dogs Home's canine behaviorist

1:50:11 > 1:50:13and training manager, and thinks there are many

1:50:13 > 1:50:17benefits to owning a pet.

1:50:17 > 1:50:25What a fantastic job!. Also Wilma is here.Yes, little Jack Russell and

1:50:25 > 1:50:34Chihuahua cross.That is mad breeding! Oh, my gosh! OK, so karma

1:50:34 > 1:50:39and Roscoe, how have they changed your life, Teresa?Tremendously. I

1:50:39 > 1:50:43am a little bit agoraphobic as well, so I find it difficult to get out.

1:50:43 > 1:50:47Without them, I don't go out at all. I do most of my shopping and things

1:50:47 > 1:50:57at all. I do have Blue Cross who walk them for me, because there are

1:50:57 > 1:51:03times when I really can't go, but there are times when I can.Why get