14/11/2017

0:00:11 > 0:00:13Hello it's Tuesday, it's nine o'clock, I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

0:00:13 > 0:00:14welcome to the programme.

0:00:14 > 0:00:16Our top story this morning: it's another crucial day

0:00:16 > 0:00:22in the Brexit countdown.

0:00:22 > 0:00:28Battle lines over Brexit as Mrs May seeks to push through crucial

0:00:28 > 0:00:34legislation to take us out of the EU and Tory rebels are warned that if

0:00:34 > 0:00:37they oppose Mrs May they could pave the way forward Jeremy Corbyn

0:00:37 > 0:00:47government. -- for a Jeremy Corbyn government.

0:00:47 > 0:00:48We'll bring you all the details.

0:00:48 > 0:00:51Also on the programme - in her first British TV interview

0:00:51 > 0:00:54we speak to a surrogate mother from California, who gave birth

0:00:54 > 0:00:56to two babies and then found out one of the children

0:00:56 > 0:00:58was biologically hers.

0:00:58 > 0:00:59I was already pregnant through in vitro

0:00:59 > 0:01:01with the IVF centre, and when

0:01:01 > 0:01:03I was about six, seven weeks pregnant, they found another embryo.

0:01:03 > 0:01:05The doctor, they just did that.

0:01:05 > 0:01:06The embryo that they transferred split

0:01:06 > 0:01:08into two and turned into twins.

0:01:08 > 0:01:11My body still ovulated while already pregnant.

0:01:11 > 0:01:19And then the obvious happened with your husband.

0:01:19 > 0:01:22Of course.

0:01:22 > 0:01:25That full interview in around 15 minutes' time.

0:01:25 > 0:01:27And the television producer and writer, Daisy Goodwin -

0:01:27 > 0:01:33who created the ITV drama, "Victoria" - has claimed

0:01:33 > 0:01:35she was assaulted by a government official during

0:01:35 > 0:01:41a visit to Number Ten.

0:01:41 > 0:01:43Hello.

0:01:43 > 0:01:49Welcome to the programme, we're live until 11am.

0:01:49 > 0:01:55We won an award last night, I hope you don't mind me mentioning it. It

0:01:55 > 0:02:05is courtesy of the Mind mental health charity. Thank you to Mind

0:02:05 > 0:02:15and the judges who gave us this award. And really it's a massive

0:02:15 > 0:02:20thank you to you, people who trusted us to come on the programme and talk

0:02:20 > 0:02:36in Frank weighs about their mental health issues. This is for you.

0:02:37 > 0:02:38A little later we'll hear how

0:02:38 > 0:02:40councils are using bailiffs to collect unpaid debt.

0:02:40 > 0:02:42It's been described as "deeply troubling"

0:02:42 > 0:02:45by the money advice trust - really keen to hear from you.

0:02:45 > 0:02:47Has a council used a bailff on you?

0:02:47 > 0:02:50Do get in touch and share your experiences this morning -

0:02:50 > 0:02:51use the hashtag Victoria live.

0:02:51 > 0:02:52Our top story...

0:02:52 > 0:02:55MPs will begin going through a key piece of Brexit legislation today -

0:02:55 > 0:02:57the EU Withdrawal Bill, which will help turn

0:02:57 > 0:03:01European laws into UK ones.

0:03:01 > 0:03:03They'll be scrutinising the bill line by line and have already

0:03:03 > 0:03:05suggested hundreds of changes, some of them coming

0:03:05 > 0:03:08from Conservative rebels.

0:03:08 > 0:03:12Yesterday, the Brexit Secretary, David Davis, made a surprise

0:03:12 > 0:03:14concession, promising Parliament would get a vote on

0:03:14 > 0:03:17the final Brexit deal.

0:03:17 > 0:03:21Our political correspondent Leila Nathoo reports.

0:03:21 > 0:03:25The Prime Minister.

0:03:25 > 0:03:28Still the one in charge, Theresa May last night at the glittering

0:03:28 > 0:03:30Lord Mayor's Banquet in London, a break from Brexit

0:03:30 > 0:03:35and potential trouble ahead.

0:03:35 > 0:03:37A key piece of the government's Brexit legislation returns

0:03:37 > 0:03:39to the Commons today, and MPs are trying

0:03:39 > 0:03:42to tinker with it.

0:03:42 > 0:03:45They are proposing hundreds of changes to try to influence

0:03:45 > 0:03:46ministers' approach, and so yesterday an apparent

0:03:46 > 0:03:52concession to one of their key demands.

0:03:52 > 0:03:55I can now confirm that once we have reached an agreement we will bring

0:03:55 > 0:03:57forward a specific piece of primary legislation to implement

0:03:57 > 0:04:01that agreement.

0:04:01 > 0:04:03Parliament will be given time to debate, scrutinise and vote

0:04:03 > 0:04:07on the final agreement we strike with the European Union.

0:04:07 > 0:04:09This agreement will only hold if parliament approves it.

0:04:09 > 0:04:13But with such a fragile majority, just a handful of Tory backbenchers

0:04:13 > 0:04:17siding with the opposition would lead to a government defeat.

0:04:17 > 0:04:20And those minded to rebel seem unsatisfied with the

0:04:20 > 0:04:24take it or leave it vote the government has offered.

0:04:24 > 0:04:29I have to say, a lot of us were insulted by this.

0:04:29 > 0:04:32I mean, because it sounded so good and then when you dug

0:04:32 > 0:04:34into the detail you realise this so-called meaningful vote

0:04:34 > 0:04:36was completely meaningless.

0:04:36 > 0:04:39There will be more contentious votes here in the coming weeks as MPs

0:04:39 > 0:04:45test the government's fragile working majority.

0:04:50 > 0:04:55Norman Smith is at Westminster.

0:04:55 > 0:05:01It is another big day. That concession, which some have put in

0:05:01 > 0:05:08inverted commas from David Davis, is it a meaningful vote in the end?Mrs

0:05:08 > 0:05:12May's critics don't think so because the problem is, although there will

0:05:12 > 0:05:18be a bill, it won't be like a normal bill. Usually with bills, MPs can

0:05:18 > 0:05:24amend them, change them, they can say to ministers you need to go away

0:05:24 > 0:05:29and think again and recast this legislation. With this bill it is

0:05:29 > 0:05:37take it or leave it time and if they don't like it, tough. We will leave

0:05:37 > 0:05:43the EU without any sort of deal and that is nightmare land for many

0:05:43 > 0:05:49Remainers. However, they are under massive, massive pressure to back

0:05:49 > 0:05:56off because some Tories are saying, if you rebels defeat Mrs May, that

0:05:56 > 0:06:00is such a big moment that it could possibly amount to a vote of

0:06:00 > 0:06:05confidence in the Government, that might mean a general election, it

0:06:05 > 0:06:11could mean a Jeremy Corbyn government. They are under colossal

0:06:11 > 0:06:18pressure to back off.And tell us more about Mrs May's accusations of

0:06:18 > 0:06:24Russian meddling.Very striking because although Mrs May said last

0:06:24 > 0:06:30night it is not a return to the Cold War, you get a sense relations with

0:06:30 > 0:06:35Russia are in the deep freezer big-time. Last night Mrs May accused

0:06:35 > 0:06:41Russia of annex in Crimea, the first time she said that had happened in

0:06:41 > 0:06:47Europe since the Nazis and Second World War. She accused them of

0:06:47 > 0:06:52fermenting conflict in the Ukraine, engaging in cyber warfare and

0:06:52 > 0:06:59meddling in elections. Have a listen to some of her language last night.

0:06:59 > 0:07:03It is seeking to weaponise information, deploying its state-run

0:07:03 > 0:07:08media organisations to plant fake stories and photoshopped images in

0:07:08 > 0:07:12an attempt to sow discord in the west and undermine our institutions.

0:07:12 > 0:07:18So I have a very simple message for Russia. We know what you are doing

0:07:18 > 0:07:27and you will not succeed.Now, just imagine that Boris Johnson has to go

0:07:27 > 0:07:32to Russia next month. How difficult is it going to be for the Foreign

0:07:32 > 0:07:36Secretary to go there and try to foster better relations with

0:07:36 > 0:07:41President Putin in the wake of those attacks from Mrs May.For now, thank

0:07:41 > 0:07:46you.

0:07:46 > 0:07:48Ben Brown is in the BBC Newsroom with a summary

0:07:48 > 0:07:51of the rest of the day's news.

0:07:51 > 0:07:53Human Rights Watch says the Burmese security forces have

0:07:53 > 0:07:55committed widespread abuses during what they call 'a campaign

0:07:55 > 0:07:57of ethnic cleansing' against the Rohingya Muslim population.

0:07:57 > 0:07:59The organisation said Government forces have

0:07:59 > 0:08:00committed mass killings, rape, arbitrary

0:08:00 > 0:08:01detention, and arson.

0:08:01 > 0:08:04More than half a million Rohingya have fled a military offensive

0:08:04 > 0:08:05in the north of the country.

0:08:05 > 0:08:08We'll have a film including testimony from the refugees

0:08:08 > 0:08:12just after ten o'clock.

0:08:12 > 0:08:14A Tory activist who says she was raped has told this

0:08:14 > 0:08:17programme that she feels fobbed off, despite receiving a phone call

0:08:17 > 0:08:22from the Leader of the House.

0:08:22 > 0:08:27Andrea Leadsom called Lisa Wade, who's waived her right

0:08:27 > 0:08:29to anonymity, last night, several months after the incident

0:08:29 > 0:08:30was first reported to her.

0:08:30 > 0:08:33Ms Leadsom said she could not have acted on the report at the time

0:08:33 > 0:08:35because of an ongoing legal case.

0:08:35 > 0:08:38We'll hear from Lisa at 9.30am.

0:08:38 > 0:08:39The television producer and writer, Daisy Goodwin -

0:08:39 > 0:08:42who created the ITV drama, "Victoria" - has claimed

0:08:42 > 0:08:45she was groped by a government official during a visit

0:08:45 > 0:08:46to Number Ten.

0:08:46 > 0:08:49She told the Radio Times the man put his hand on her breast

0:08:49 > 0:08:51after a meeting to discuss a proposed TV show when David

0:08:51 > 0:08:54Cameron was Prime Minister.

0:08:54 > 0:08:56She said she wasn't traumatised, but was cross -

0:08:56 > 0:09:00adding she didn't report it at the time.

0:09:00 > 0:09:02Downing Street said they take all allegations very seriously

0:09:02 > 0:09:08and would look into any formal complaint, should one be made.

0:09:08 > 0:09:10Thousands of people are spending a second night without shelter

0:09:10 > 0:09:12in near freezing conditions after an earthquake

0:09:12 > 0:09:16caused devastation in parts of Iran and Iraq.

0:09:16 > 0:09:18More than 450 people were killed and around 7,000 injured.

0:09:18 > 0:09:25Sarah Corker reports.

0:09:25 > 0:09:29This is the deadliest earthquake in the world this year.

0:09:29 > 0:09:31The border town of Pol-e Zahab here in western Iran

0:09:31 > 0:09:36bore the brunt of it.

0:09:36 > 0:09:41Homes were flattened in seconds, crushing everyone inside.

0:09:41 > 0:09:43The search for survivors has been frantic.

0:09:43 > 0:09:45But early this morning, Iranian officials called off

0:09:45 > 0:09:48the rescue operation.

0:09:48 > 0:09:51At this local hospital, many of the injured had

0:09:51 > 0:09:56stories of narrow escapes.

0:09:56 > 0:09:57TRANSLATION: I fell from the balcony down.

0:09:57 > 0:09:59The earthquake was very strong.

0:09:59 > 0:10:02This mountainous area is prone to earthquakes.

0:10:02 > 0:10:04Power cuts and landslides have made it difficult

0:10:04 > 0:10:08for rescue teams to get in.

0:10:08 > 0:10:10The most severely hurt have been airlifted out,

0:10:10 > 0:10:15some taken to hospital in the Iranian capital, Tehran.

0:10:15 > 0:10:17But, overwhelmed by the sheer number of injured, the authorities

0:10:17 > 0:10:23are appealing for people to donate blood.

0:10:23 > 0:10:25And this is the moment this 7.3-magnitude quake hit

0:10:25 > 0:10:29in neighbouring Iraq.

0:10:29 > 0:10:32A man runs for his life from the control room of this dam.

0:10:32 > 0:10:35Boulders were tossed around like pebbles.

0:10:35 > 0:10:37A picture of widespread devastation is emerging -

0:10:37 > 0:10:44hundreds dead, thousands injured, many missing.

0:10:44 > 0:10:48Turkey has sent a convoy of aid trucks, medication,

0:10:48 > 0:10:50tents and blankets, and many have spent a second night outdoors,

0:10:50 > 0:10:54terrified by the after-shocks.

0:10:54 > 0:11:02So far, there have been more than 190 of them.

0:11:02 > 0:11:05A man and woman have been arrested on suspicion of murdering a teenager

0:11:05 > 0:11:13who has not been seen for nearly a week.

0:11:13 > 0:11:1819-year-old Gaia Pope, who has severe epilepsy, was last seen

0:11:18 > 0:11:19on the 7th November.

0:11:19 > 0:11:22Dorset Police say a 19-year-old man and a 71-year-old woman

0:11:22 > 0:11:25were arrested after searches took place at two addresses in Swanage.

0:11:25 > 0:11:30Officers say they were both known to Gaia.

0:11:30 > 0:11:32Head teachers representing more than 5,000 schools

0:11:32 > 0:11:34across England have sent a joint letter to the Chancellor,

0:11:34 > 0:11:36Philip Hammond, warning of inadequate funding.

0:11:36 > 0:11:40They say they are increasingly having to ask parents for donations.

0:11:40 > 0:11:43The government has already promised to move £1.3 billion

0:11:43 > 0:11:48of education funding into schools, but

0:11:48 > 0:11:52heads say they need another £1.7 billion

0:11:52 > 0:11:54of new money.

0:11:54 > 0:11:58One of the victims of an acid attack in a London nightclub has told

0:11:58 > 0:12:00the BBC that she hopes the conviction of the man

0:12:00 > 0:12:03who assalted her will put others off committing similar crimes.

0:12:03 > 0:12:05Arthur Collins - the ex-boyfriend of reality TV star Ferne McCann -

0:12:05 > 0:12:08was found guilty of throwing acid across a crowded nightclub,

0:12:08 > 0:12:09injuring 22 people.

0:12:09 > 0:12:11He will be sentenced in December.

0:12:11 > 0:12:13Lauren Trent told us she still struggles with anxiety

0:12:13 > 0:12:16more than six months after the attack.

0:12:16 > 0:12:23Being in busy places, I'm extremely anxious.

0:12:23 > 0:12:26If I can't see the dance floor, or if I can't see what's

0:12:26 > 0:12:30going on, or if a fight breaks out, you know, the first thing that goes

0:12:30 > 0:12:32through my head nowadays is, what are they going to do?

0:12:32 > 0:12:34What are they going to pull out?

0:12:34 > 0:12:36It's only up until now that we can talk about

0:12:36 > 0:12:38things and hear how everyone went through the trial

0:12:38 > 0:12:39and things like that.

0:12:39 > 0:12:42I think, a massive sense of relief, but it doesn't change what

0:12:42 > 0:12:45happened whatsoever, but I think it's more of, you know,

0:12:45 > 0:12:47OK, well, something's been done that's setting

0:12:47 > 0:12:49the standard now for anyone, you know, that's thinking

0:12:49 > 0:12:50about doing something like this.

0:12:50 > 0:12:54It's putting them off doing something like that.

0:12:54 > 0:12:57Britain's biggest supermarket - Tesco - has been given the green

0:12:57 > 0:13:00light to buy out our biggest food wholesaler Booker.

0:13:00 > 0:13:02The Competition and Markets Authority says the deal does

0:13:02 > 0:13:06not raise competition nor pricing concerns.

0:13:06 > 0:13:08Booker has a retail arm - including brands Premier,

0:13:08 > 0:13:10Londis and Budgens - but also makes money

0:13:10 > 0:13:12in the catering industry.

0:13:12 > 0:13:14Tesco said the tie up would bring benefits

0:13:14 > 0:13:24for small retailers, suppliers, consumers and staff.

0:13:28 > 0:13:29A leading debt charity says it's deeply troubled

0:13:29 > 0:13:32by the increasing use of bailiffs by local authorities in England

0:13:32 > 0:13:34and Wales to recover money they are owed.

0:13:34 > 0:13:44The Money Advice Trust found the number of cases had risen

0:13:44 > 0:13:53by 14% over two years to 2.3 million.

0:13:53 > 0:13:54The Local Government Association said bailiffs are only

0:13:54 > 0:13:56used as a last resort.

0:13:56 > 0:13:59The largest diamond of its kind every to be put up for auction

0:13:59 > 0:14:01will go under the hammer in Geneva today.

0:14:01 > 0:14:02The 163-carat stone, which was discovered

0:14:02 > 0:14:05in Angola last year, is set into a necklace of almost

0:14:05 > 0:14:076,000 emeralds, and over 800 smaller diamonds.

0:14:07 > 0:14:10It took ten months to cut and is expected to fetch

0:14:10 > 0:14:1930 million dollars, which is almost 23 million pounds.

0:14:19 > 0:14:23That's a summary of the latest BBC News, more at 9.30.

0:14:23 > 0:14:28We have had an e-mail from Megan about bailiffs. Figures suggesting

0:14:28 > 0:14:32councils are using them more and more to collect unpaid parking

0:14:32 > 0:14:37fines. Megan had a stressful experience during a parking fine

0:14:37 > 0:14:42that had been sent to a previous address so I wasn't aware though of

0:14:42 > 0:14:46it. I attempted to discuss this with the council who refused and said

0:14:46 > 0:14:51communication should be made with the bailiffs. Having a baby and

0:14:51 > 0:14:55being on maternity pay, I was fearful these bullies would turn up

0:14:55 > 0:15:03on my doorstep.

0:15:03 > 0:15:09Do get in touch with us throughout the morning.

0:15:09 > 0:15:11If you text, you will be charged.

0:15:11 > 0:15:13Let's get some sport from Catherine Downs.

0:15:13 > 0:15:18We are going to have a World Cup without Italy.

0:15:18 > 0:15:24Yes, Italy will not be at the World Cup for the first time in 60 years.

0:15:24 > 0:15:28Four time World Cup winners and they will not be going after they were

0:15:28 > 0:15:35beaten by Sweden in the end. What went wrong perhaps for Italy? The

0:15:35 > 0:15:39coach is blamed for relying on a group of experienced veterans, not

0:15:39 > 0:15:46playing his young talent.

0:15:46 > 0:15:52All kinds of despair in the Italian Italian papers. They are calling it

0:15:52 > 0:15:57the end of the world. The legendary Italian goalkeeper announced his

0:15:57 > 0:16:01retirement from football. This will be his last game seeing his country

0:16:01 > 0:16:06fail to make it to the World Cup in Russia next year. Why are we making

0:16:06 > 0:16:12a big deal of it? Well, I went to Rome a couple of years ago after

0:16:12 > 0:16:15Claudio Ranieri won the Premier League with Leicester City. Everyone

0:16:15 > 0:16:22I spoke to had heard about Claudio Ranieri. Knew exactly everything

0:16:22 > 0:16:27that they could about Italian football and the division of loyalty

0:16:27 > 0:16:35as well between Roma fans and Lazio fans was like nothing I had seen,

0:16:35 > 0:16:39that was just in one city in Rome and for a nation to fail to make to

0:16:39 > 0:16:43the World Cup next year, it will be a national sense of despair to go

0:16:43 > 0:16:50along with that. Let's talk about gymnastics t Dan Keating agreed

0:16:50 > 0:16:55there was a culture of fear at British gymnastics. What else had he

0:16:55 > 0:17:01had to say?There has been a rumbling of discontent in British

0:17:01 > 0:17:07gymnastics, a culture of fear of discontent amongst the elite

0:17:07 > 0:17:15gymnastics and now Dan Keating, he is Commonwealth champion. He has

0:17:15 > 0:17:20agreed there is a culture of fear in British gymnastics. He said that he

0:17:20 > 0:17:23was repeatedly called fat in training. He was often depressed and

0:17:23 > 0:17:28unwilling to leave the house at some points. He said athletes like him

0:17:28 > 0:17:32were scared of speaking out for fear of losing their place in the team

0:17:32 > 0:17:36and losing the funding that comes with that. He said when he retired

0:17:36 > 0:17:40in January, it was a massive relief, a weight off his shoulders, he said.

0:17:40 > 0:17:44Talking about the fact that there is success in British gymnastics, but

0:17:44 > 0:17:51it comes at a cost. The Chief Executive of British gymnastics Jane

0:17:51 > 0:17:54Allen said, "Our safeguarding processes are robust." They are

0:17:54 > 0:17:59aware of the complaints. Athletes should be encouraged to come

0:17:59 > 0:18:07forward. But this is another British sport, as well as British swimming,

0:18:07 > 0:18:11British bobsleigh, British canoeing coming under the spotlight now

0:18:11 > 0:18:16Victoria.There are some top gymnasts that are yet to sign new

0:18:16 > 0:18:21contracts?There is a lot of tooing and froing about the new contracts

0:18:21 > 0:18:28that come from the governing body. Some gymnasts we understand have not

0:18:28 > 0:18:33yet agreed to sign their contract at the moment. They are unhappy with

0:18:33 > 0:18:37the clauses that stop them, according to Dan Keating from

0:18:37 > 0:18:40finding their own sponsors and raising their own money from outside

0:18:40 > 0:18:46the sport and Dan Keating says that British gymnastics are looking to

0:18:46 > 0:18:49control everything that athletes like Max Whitlock, who we are seeing

0:18:49 > 0:18:53right now, are able to earn outside the sport. There is a meeting, we

0:18:53 > 0:18:56understand, between the governing body and top athletes like Max

0:18:56 > 0:18:59Whitlock happening over the next couple of days and they are hoping

0:18:59 > 0:19:04to pin down the contracts and get them signed, but at a point where

0:19:04 > 0:19:09British gymnastics is enjoying this success, Max Whitlock won two

0:19:09 > 0:19:14Olympic titles in Rio and seven medals at the Rio Games, the

0:19:14 > 0:19:17question now for British gymnastics as in so many British sports at the

0:19:17 > 0:19:28moment is at what cost success? Cheers, Catherine, thank you.

0:19:28 > 0:19:31This morning, in her first British TV interview we speak to a surrogate

0:19:31 > 0:19:35mother from California, who gave birth to two

0:19:35 > 0:19:38babies and then found out that one of the children

0:19:38 > 0:19:39was biologically hers.

0:19:39 > 0:19:42Jessica Allen became pregnant with her own biological child whilst

0:19:42 > 0:19:46she was carrying another baby as a surrogate for a Chinese couple.

0:19:46 > 0:19:52She only realised after she'd handed over the babies

0:19:52 > 0:19:55to their intended parents and then she faced a lengthy custody

0:19:55 > 0:19:57battle to get her son back.

0:19:57 > 0:20:00Jessica and her son Malachi spoke to us from their home in California.

0:20:00 > 0:20:06She told me about the birth of what everybody thought was twins.

0:20:07 > 0:20:10It was a scheduled C-section, my first surgery.

0:20:10 > 0:20:12Luckily, everything went well, there were no

0:20:12 > 0:20:13complications or problems.

0:20:13 > 0:20:14And I was able to...

0:20:14 > 0:20:18BABY SHOUTS.

0:20:18 > 0:20:20Able to heal and everything, it was good.

0:20:20 > 0:20:21It was a good labour.

0:20:21 > 0:20:24Did you get to see the boys?

0:20:24 > 0:20:26No, I did not see them.

0:20:26 > 0:20:34How did you feel about that?

0:20:34 > 0:20:41I was very hurt by it.

0:20:41 > 0:20:45I was very hurt by it, it was in my contract that I

0:20:45 > 0:20:49was going to have an hour visit with the babies.

0:20:49 > 0:20:52And when I asked her if they were going to stop by before

0:20:52 > 0:20:56they left the hospital, she stated probably not.

0:20:56 > 0:21:02That instantly brought me to tears, and you know, broke my heart.

0:21:02 > 0:21:05You did see a photograph of the two boys, what did they look

0:21:05 > 0:21:13like, what did you say when you saw that picture?

0:21:13 > 0:21:19It was a picture of them side by side with beanies out,

0:21:19 > 0:21:22their faces turn towards each other with their eyes closed.

0:21:22 > 0:21:26So it wasn't a perfect face shot, but it was

0:21:26 > 0:21:29definitely obvious that they weren't identical.

0:21:29 > 0:21:32And I stated after looking at the picture and I was

0:21:32 > 0:21:39handing it back, I stated that they looked different.

0:21:39 > 0:21:44My caseworker, through the agency was in the room

0:21:44 > 0:21:47with me and she stated also that she gave birth to identical

0:21:47 > 0:21:49twins that didn't look identical at birth, but

0:21:49 > 0:21:57as they got older, they started looking identical.

0:21:57 > 0:22:00So I took that as maybe that was the case of my twins also.

0:22:00 > 0:22:03I didn't even know identical twins could come out not identical

0:22:03 > 0:22:07and then as getting older, being identical.

0:22:07 > 0:22:11So that's what she said and that is how I took it.

0:22:11 > 0:22:15And then you got a text from the other mum, the

0:22:15 > 0:22:18intended mum a month or so later with a photograph of the boys.

0:22:18 > 0:22:25What did she ask you?

0:22:25 > 0:22:31She just stated that she is getting a DNA test for

0:22:31 > 0:22:35her embassy so she could go back home to her country and that she is

0:22:35 > 0:22:38also having doubts that one doesn't belong to her.

0:22:38 > 0:22:41She stated that she was waiting for me to be well to let me know.

0:22:41 > 0:22:46It was already a month later.

0:22:46 > 0:22:52She basically was just letting me know that she was having doubts.

0:22:52 > 0:22:54Right, and she asked you if you'd considered why they were

0:22:54 > 0:22:58different, how did you respond to that?

0:22:58 > 0:23:02I responded with exactly what my caseworker told me, you know,

0:23:02 > 0:23:06they were probably just not looking identical at birth.

0:23:06 > 0:23:09And lso, I knew they were in separate sacs, and you

0:23:09 > 0:23:12know, we all know if you are carrying twins in two different

0:23:12 > 0:23:18sacs, they are not identical.

0:23:18 > 0:23:24So tell our British audience about what happened

0:23:24 > 0:23:26eventually you found out that Malachy

0:23:26 > 0:23:27was in fact your son and not from the sorrow that embryo.

0:23:34 > 0:23:37was in fact your son and not from the surrogate embryo.

0:23:37 > 0:23:40After I got the text with with the picture of the test

0:23:40 > 0:23:43results stating that the intended father was not his genetic father,

0:23:43 > 0:23:46you know, I was freaking out.

0:23:46 > 0:23:49I called my caseworker asking her what is going on.

0:23:49 > 0:23:55And she didn't have answers.

0:23:55 > 0:24:02The only thing she knew what to say was, I have two get

0:24:02 > 0:24:05myself into the DNA lab and get tested for my results to see if I

0:24:05 > 0:24:06was the mother of the baby.

0:24:06 > 0:24:10So we went and did that.

0:24:10 > 0:24:13And about a week and a half later, I got the test results

0:24:13 > 0:24:15saying I am his genetic mother.

0:24:15 > 0:24:18My caseworker immediately went and picked him up and put him under

0:24:18 > 0:24:22her care.

0:24:22 > 0:24:27So you were the biological mother of one of the babies and the

0:24:27 > 0:24:29other mum was the biological mother of the other baby?

0:24:29 > 0:24:33Yes.

0:24:33 > 0:24:40Which is absolutely extraordinary! How does that happen?

0:24:40 > 0:24:47Well, I was already pregnant through in vitro

0:24:47 > 0:24:50with the IVF centre.

0:24:50 > 0:24:52And when I was six, seven weeks pregnant they found

0:24:52 > 0:24:54another embryo.

0:24:54 > 0:24:56The doctor just stated that the embryo be transferred was

0:24:56 > 0:24:58split into two and turned into twins.

0:24:58 > 0:25:04My body still ovulated while already pregnant.

0:25:04 > 0:25:08And then the obvious happened with your husband?

0:25:08 > 0:25:13Of course!

0:25:13 > 0:25:22So, tell us how your little boy was eventually returned to you?

0:25:22 > 0:25:29Well, after communicating back and forth with the surrogate

0:25:29 > 0:25:35agency for almost a month, and the process of trying to find an

0:25:35 > 0:25:40attorney, they just kept giving us excuses as to why they weren't

0:25:40 > 0:25:42handing him over to me and after we finally found

0:25:42 > 0:25:45an attorney, all it took was an e-mail from her stating

0:25:45 > 0:25:48that they better hand over my child or they will create more damages

0:25:48 > 0:25:49than what they already have.

0:25:49 > 0:25:52So we got a phone call and we were told we

0:25:52 > 0:25:59could go and meet the caseworker at Starbucks and pick up our baby.

0:25:59 > 0:26:02So you went to the car park of Starbucks, tell us what happened

0:26:02 > 0:26:08and how you were feeling?

0:26:12 > 0:26:19Are you OK, Jessica?

0:26:20 > 0:26:25Sorry, this part just gets hard.

0:26:25 > 0:26:29It's no problem.

0:26:29 > 0:26:32I went and met her at the Starbucks parking lot

0:26:32 > 0:26:36and she was late.

0:26:36 > 0:26:38So I was freaking out already that this was just going

0:26:38 > 0:26:44to be another time that I was supposed to get him and didn't.

0:26:44 > 0:26:47When she finally arrived, I started walking and she grabbed him out of

0:26:47 > 0:26:52the car in his car seat and walked towards me.

0:26:52 > 0:26:55We kind of met in the middle and she just took him out of

0:26:55 > 0:26:57his car seat...

0:26:57 > 0:27:07It's OK, take your time.

0:27:07 > 0:27:10And I just snatched him from her and said, "Give me my baby".

0:27:10 > 0:27:12And that was clearly a very, very emotional

0:27:12 > 0:27:13time for you?

0:27:13 > 0:27:14Yeah.

0:27:14 > 0:27:17What did it feel like to hold your son?

0:27:17 > 0:27:19I was heartbroken because I missed two

0:27:19 > 0:27:25months of his life because of them.

0:27:25 > 0:27:30But I was also relieved because it was my first time finally

0:27:30 > 0:27:32seeing him and I knew that he was finally in our

0:27:32 > 0:27:36arms where he is safe and where he belongs.

0:27:36 > 0:27:43And when did you first hear this word, superfertation?

0:27:43 > 0:27:46We started finding this word and their term

0:27:46 > 0:27:49for it when we started doing our research

0:27:49 > 0:27:54if this has happened to anyone before.

0:27:54 > 0:27:58Obviously it has because there is an actual term for it.

0:27:58 > 0:28:01But it's so rare, I think there are only like a dozen cases across

0:28:01 > 0:28:02the world?

0:28:02 > 0:28:12Yes.

0:28:14 > 0:28:17It has happened and there's only so many recorded, but

0:28:17 > 0:28:20it has happened more than that and I wish more

0:28:20 > 0:28:24women would come forward, other women that it has happened to,

0:28:24 > 0:28:27so we know how common it actually is.

0:28:27 > 0:28:37How would you describe what it means?

0:28:38 > 0:28:40I mean it means that when a woman is pregnant

0:28:40 > 0:28:42she still naturally ovulate and concedes another child.

0:28:42 > 0:28:44You know, they are not twins and they

0:28:44 > 0:28:47are not even the same exact age, but she ends up having two different

0:28:47 > 0:28:52babies at the same time.

0:28:52 > 0:28:57We saw Malachy at the beginning of the interview.

0:28:57 > 0:29:02He looks happy, he's bonnie, he looks healthy, how is he?

0:29:02 > 0:29:05He's a handful.

0:29:05 > 0:29:09He's beautiful, he's hyper, he's happy, healthy.

0:29:09 > 0:29:12He keeps us busy and his brothers love him.

0:29:12 > 0:29:18Daddy and I love him.

0:29:18 > 0:29:20We are very grateful he is here where he belongs.

0:29:20 > 0:29:22What do you think your little boy will

0:29:22 > 0:29:23make of this when he's older?

0:29:23 > 0:29:26You've obviously got a bit of time before you

0:29:26 > 0:29:29think about whether you are going to tell him everything, what do you

0:29:29 > 0:29:34think he's going to say?

0:29:34 > 0:29:38When the time comes, we'll cross that bridge.

0:29:38 > 0:29:42But I know there is going to be a day when he's going to know his

0:29:42 > 0:29:47life made an impact all around the world.

0:29:47 > 0:29:51That is certainly true and here he is.

0:29:51 > 0:29:57How old is he now, Jessica?

0:29:57 > 0:30:00He's 11 months now.

0:30:00 > 0:30:02He just turned 11 months yesterday.

0:30:02 > 0:30:08He's absolutely adorable.

0:30:08 > 0:30:10Astonishing to think that this little boy has made

0:30:10 > 0:30:13headlines around the world, isn't it?

0:30:13 > 0:30:16Oh yes, it's kind of...

0:30:16 > 0:30:19Unreal.

0:30:19 > 0:30:29It doesn't seem real, but it's our reality

0:30:29 > 0:30:32and it's kind of hard to wrap our heads around it.

0:30:32 > 0:30:34We are just taking it one day at a time.

0:30:34 > 0:30:37We are very grateful you have been speaking to us and our

0:30:37 > 0:30:38British viewers.

0:30:38 > 0:30:40Thank you so much, Jessica.

0:30:40 > 0:30:41Thank you Malachy.

0:30:41 > 0:30:42Thank you.

0:30:42 > 0:30:43BABY SNEEZES.

0:30:43 > 0:30:44Bless you.

0:30:44 > 0:30:45Bless you.

0:30:45 > 0:30:46Goodbye.

0:30:46 > 0:30:47Bye.

0:30:47 > 0:30:48Thank you.

0:30:48 > 0:30:52Thank you, Jessica, what a sweetheart he is.

0:30:52 > 0:30:56Still to come, an alleged rape victim tells us exclusively why

0:30:56 > 0:30:59she feels "fobbed off" by authorities in the Commons

0:30:59 > 0:31:01despite receiving a phone call from the leader

0:31:01 > 0:31:06of the House last night.

0:31:06 > 0:31:10Plus we'll be live Myanmar where deeply disturbing claims

0:31:10 > 0:31:15of mass rape and other crimes against the Rohingya

0:31:15 > 0:31:20Muslims are being reported.

0:31:20 > 0:31:31Time for the latest news.

0:31:43 > 0:31:46MPs will today begin debating a key piece of Brexit legislation -

0:31:46 > 0:31:47the EU withdrawal bill.

0:31:47 > 0:31:50It will help turn European laws into UK ones but opponents including

0:31:50 > 0:31:52Tory rebels have tabled scores of amendments.

0:31:52 > 0:31:54Meanwhile a Parliamentary report is warning a failure to complete

0:31:54 > 0:31:58the introduction of a new customs system by the date of Brexit in 2019

0:31:58 > 0:32:08would be "catastrophic".

0:32:09 > 0:32:11Theresa May has launched her strongest attack on Russia yet,

0:32:11 > 0:32:13accusing Moscow of meddling in elections and carrying

0:32:13 > 0:32:14out cyber espionage.

0:32:14 > 0:32:17Speaking at the Lord Mayor's banquet in London, the Prime Minister said

0:32:17 > 0:32:19Vladimir Putin's government was trying to "undermine free

0:32:19 > 0:32:23societies" by planting fake information.

0:32:23 > 0:32:25A Tory activist who says she was raped has told this

0:32:25 > 0:32:27programme that she feels disappointed, despite

0:32:27 > 0:32:29receiving a phone call from the Leader of the House.

0:32:29 > 0:32:32Andrea Leadsom called Lisa Wade - who's waived her right

0:32:32 > 0:32:34to anonymity - last night, several months after the incident

0:32:34 > 0:32:35was first reported to her.

0:32:35 > 0:32:39Ms Leadsom said she could not have acted on the report at the time

0:32:39 > 0:32:40because of an ongoing legal case.

0:32:40 > 0:32:41We'll hear from Lisa shortly.

0:32:41 > 0:32:43Human Rights Watch says the Burmese security forces have

0:32:43 > 0:32:46committed widespread abuses during what they call 'a campaign

0:32:46 > 0:32:47of ethnic cleansing' against the Rohingya Muslim population.

0:32:47 > 0:32:49The organisation said Government forces have

0:32:49 > 0:32:50committed mass killings, rape, arbitrary

0:32:50 > 0:32:51detention, and arson.

0:32:51 > 0:32:54More than half a million Rohingya have fled a military offensive

0:32:54 > 0:32:55in the north of the country.

0:32:55 > 0:32:57We'll have a film including testimony from the refugees

0:32:57 > 0:32:58just after ten o'clock.

0:32:58 > 0:33:05That's a summary of our latest news, back to you. On the story of

0:33:05 > 0:33:09bailiffs, I was hounded because council tax had lost my benefit

0:33:09 > 0:33:14form. I don't pay it because I'm university student but after

0:33:14 > 0:33:23constant calls they wouldn't let it go. I am terrified I'm going to you

0:33:23 > 0:33:31lose everything. This e-mail from Tyrone. ... This from the shell, my

0:33:31 > 0:33:39sister owed her previous council tax. Bailiffs were sent to my

0:33:39 > 0:33:43sister, who on benefits had little to offer. The bailiff said he needed

0:33:43 > 0:33:51half of what was owed that day and in panic she gave the bailiff my

0:33:51 > 0:33:55mother's number who was 70 and has health conditions. He pressured her

0:33:55 > 0:34:00to pay half over the phone and told her my sister could go to prison,

0:34:00 > 0:34:08and she paid up. It is disgusting behaviour. They have a job to do but

0:34:08 > 0:34:13they have to play fair. Thank you for those. We are going to talk

0:34:13 > 0:34:17about bailiffs after 10:30am.

0:34:17 > 0:34:24Breaking news now.

0:34:24 > 0:34:26And the latest inflation figures are out now -

0:34:26 > 0:34:29what do they tell us?

0:34:29 > 0:34:34It is slightly less than was expected. The consensus among

0:34:34 > 0:34:38economists had been to 3.1% and the Bank of England said these figures

0:34:38 > 0:34:43for October would be the peak of inflation or likely to be. That's

0:34:43 > 0:34:48what they were forecasting. The fact the peak was slightly below what

0:34:48 > 0:34:51some people expected means there's less of an urgent need to make a

0:34:51 > 0:34:56second rise in interest rates any time soon. A few interesting

0:34:56 > 0:35:02details, unfortunately the inflation rate for food and nonalcoholic

0:35:02 > 0:35:08beverages was its highest in four years, 4.1%.What's driving that? A

0:35:08 > 0:35:15lot of it is to do with the fact we import our food.It is still

0:35:15 > 0:35:18substantially down from where it was a couple of years ago and it means

0:35:18 > 0:35:24when people import they have to pay in Euros or dollars and that

0:35:24 > 0:35:29requires more pounds to get the same amounts of food. You see that

0:35:29 > 0:35:33feeding through to supermarket shelves. There's been a theory they

0:35:33 > 0:35:36have been protecting us to some extent from the impact of the weaker

0:35:36 > 0:35:41pound but they cannot do that forever and we are seeing some of

0:35:41 > 0:35:46that feeding through.OK, what does it mean for people in the run-up to

0:35:46 > 0:35:50Christmas?It is the same as last month and the month before. Their

0:35:50 > 0:35:57wages are not growing as fast as prices are. Although credit is very

0:35:57 > 0:36:02cheap, think about how much you should rely on cheap credit for the

0:36:02 > 0:36:06sustainable future. You can have a nice Christmas now but in ten months

0:36:06 > 0:36:14it could be harder.Have a nice Christmas to you as well.Sorry!

0:36:14 > 0:36:23It's OK, it is only your job!

0:36:23 > 0:36:30Now, the sport. Italy will not be in the World Cup, and the Italian press

0:36:30 > 0:36:33have described the result as Apocalypse.

0:36:33 > 0:36:38Moeen Ali will play his first game of England's Ashes tour, he has

0:36:38 > 0:36:45recovered from a side strain and makes the team.

0:36:45 > 0:36:49World number one Rafael Nadal has withdrawn from end of season tour

0:36:49 > 0:36:58finals with a knee injury. He was beaten last night by David Goffin.

0:36:58 > 0:37:01And the Commonwealth champion Dan Keatings has said there is a culture

0:37:01 > 0:37:07of fear in British gymnastics as a row about contracts rumbles on. He

0:37:07 > 0:37:11said his experience in the sport left him depressed and I will be

0:37:11 > 0:37:15talking more about that in about half an hour.

0:37:15 > 0:37:19Thank you. It is 9:37am, good morning.

0:37:19 > 0:37:21Every European Country is in the midst of growing

0:37:21 > 0:37:24homelessness crisis, with one exception - Finland.

0:37:24 > 0:37:26There, they've almost eradicated homelessness in the capital

0:37:26 > 0:37:29by giving people a permanent home as soon as they become homeless.

0:37:29 > 0:37:31That scheme is now being looked at in the UK,

0:37:31 > 0:37:35and the West Midlands could be one of the first areas to adopt it.

0:37:35 > 0:37:39Their Mayor, Andy Street, has been to Finland to find out more.

0:37:39 > 0:37:43We'll hear from him shortly, but first, let's speak

0:37:43 > 0:37:46to Thomas Salmi, one of the homeless people in Finland this

0:37:46 > 0:37:53scheme has helped.

0:37:53 > 0:37:57I was homeless three years, and I was in the streets, like, almost two

0:37:57 > 0:38:07winters, Alberta, cold.

0:38:09 > 0:38:12-- out there, cold.

0:38:12 > 0:38:13I had no place to go.

0:38:13 > 0:38:15One year and one day ago, I moved here.

0:38:15 > 0:38:18If you want an apartment, a house to live in, you

0:38:18 > 0:38:20don't have to give anything, like, for exchange.

0:38:20 > 0:38:22It's your human right to live somewhere, and then you can

0:38:22 > 0:38:26build your life.

0:38:26 > 0:38:32And I came here just a year ago, and when I look

0:38:32 > 0:38:40back to those days when I was in the streets,

0:38:40 > 0:38:43I kind of lost hope of anything getting better.

0:38:43 > 0:38:49But now, when I'm sitting here, thinking

0:38:49 > 0:38:54about it, I've got an apartment, I have a job here,

0:38:54 > 0:39:04I'm finally capable of being social with humans.

0:39:04 > 0:39:10I have no health problems, but if I never

0:39:10 > 0:39:17had that apartment, it wouldn't be possible.

0:39:17 > 0:39:23I tried to get an apartment from Helsinki's renting.

0:39:23 > 0:39:28They told me, you have to work to rent

0:39:28 > 0:39:30the house, but how can I work without the house?

0:39:30 > 0:39:31So, it's like a circle.

0:39:31 > 0:39:36It doesn't work.

0:39:36 > 0:39:39And when I come to work, and I go after

0:39:39 > 0:39:48work, I know that my house is there for me.

0:39:48 > 0:39:51I can sleep, I can be there in my own peace.

0:39:51 > 0:39:52It's like my house.

0:39:52 > 0:39:54Nobody comes and tells me, you have to do this.

0:39:54 > 0:39:55You cannot drink here.

0:39:55 > 0:39:57It's like a rule for this house.

0:39:57 > 0:40:00I can drink if I want.

0:40:00 > 0:40:03And I really drank a lot, and I mean a lot, when

0:40:03 > 0:40:06I was homeless, but now I have a house, I have work,

0:40:06 > 0:40:11I'm not feeling like drinking so much any more.

0:40:11 > 0:40:13Let's talk to Andy Street, the West Midlands Mayor who visited

0:40:13 > 0:40:20Helsinki and is hoping to introduce the scheme in his area.

0:40:20 > 0:40:22And Peter Fredriksson, a senior advisor on housing

0:40:22 > 0:40:30in Finland who has implemented the Housing First scheme.

0:40:30 > 0:40:34Andy Street, explain how it works because it seems pretty simple.You

0:40:34 > 0:40:39could say that. I was lucky enough to go to Helsinki and the simple

0:40:39 > 0:40:45idea is that the city provides accommodation, in shared blocks, for

0:40:45 > 0:40:51people who have been rough sleeping, to move into. As you heard Thomas

0:40:51 > 0:40:56say, that means he has some work he calls his home and can rebuild his

0:40:56 > 0:41:01life from a place of safety.From a council's point of view, you have to

0:41:01 > 0:41:12have that accommodation freely available and that

0:41:23 > 0:41:25might be the problem here.The issue is having the money to secure the

0:41:25 > 0:41:28places in accommodation that I think we could make available across the

0:41:28 > 0:41:30West Midlands but actually what we are playing for is the funding to

0:41:30 > 0:41:33pay for it. That's why we have put our application into government to

0:41:33 > 0:41:36be the pilot in the UK of this scheme.And it will cost the West

0:41:36 > 0:41:38Midlands £15 million, is that right? Over three years, yes.And would

0:41:38 > 0:41:43that be money well spent to get that?Yes, because this is the pilot

0:41:43 > 0:41:46to test this and we are saying it would be a good investment because

0:41:46 > 0:41:51there are many hidden costs of the rough sleeping challenge we have.

0:41:51 > 0:41:55Particularly the services provided to people on the streets, they have

0:41:55 > 0:41:59very significant costs so we can say if we do this we help people rebuild

0:41:59 > 0:42:05their lives as you heard on the clip, that is a good investment.And

0:42:05 > 0:42:11do you know yet how many people that might help over three years?Yes, we

0:42:11 > 0:42:15have looked at the number of people who are rough sleeping on the

0:42:15 > 0:42:19streets in the West Midlands. Last year the number officially counted

0:42:19 > 0:42:23was about 132 so we have said let's look over three years at the total

0:42:23 > 0:42:29number of people likely we will need to accommodate and that is to meet

0:42:29 > 0:42:34the current level.So if you are homeless, whether that is sleeping

0:42:34 > 0:42:43rough or sleeping on friends' sofas or even in temporary accommodation,

0:42:43 > 0:42:47might you be helped?This is for people who are rough sleeping with

0:42:47 > 0:42:51absolutely nowhere to go because there are other issues that lead to

0:42:51 > 0:42:57people, as you say, sofa surfing or in temporary accommodation and as

0:42:57 > 0:43:02part of our general attack on homelessness we have to look at the

0:43:02 > 0:43:05causes there as well but this is about a particular tip of the

0:43:05 > 0:43:10iceberg issue and I'm sure it's the same in other areas of the country.

0:43:10 > 0:43:14It is that where members of the public say we have got to do

0:43:14 > 0:43:20something about this, it cannot be right.Let me bring in Peter

0:43:20 > 0:43:27Fredriksson, thank you for talking to us. Your scheme has cost 240

0:43:27 > 0:43:30million euros over eight years, how many rough sleepers has that helped

0:43:30 > 0:43:41in that period of time?It has been managed to put it down with 1500

0:43:41 > 0:43:49long-term home rough sleepers, so it is a reduction of 37% of the

0:43:49 > 0:43:58situation we started in 2008. So it has been very successful from our

0:43:58 > 0:44:03point of view and especially the rough sleeping has been put down by

0:44:03 > 0:44:07half. Also you have to take account also of the other long-term

0:44:07 > 0:44:14homeless, the people living in institution is without a place to go

0:44:14 > 0:44:18for example.And it is as straightforward as anybody sleeping

0:44:18 > 0:44:22on the street, you put them straight into permanent accommodation, that

0:44:22 > 0:44:29is it? No bed and breakfast, no temporary hostels, it is a home for

0:44:29 > 0:44:35them for ever?That is the point. Direct accesses the most important

0:44:35 > 0:44:39thing. You have to stress, it is not only a question of the housing here

0:44:39 > 0:44:51because they are in real problems, many of them, addicted people,

0:44:51 > 0:44:57unemployed etc and untrained. We need specialised, tailored support

0:44:57 > 0:45:02service, intensive support for the people who manage because otherwise

0:45:02 > 0:45:05they are back on the street again and it's a combination of a very

0:45:05 > 0:45:11good support and a very good permanent house.So when they are in

0:45:11 > 0:45:19that house, you do what to help them?It starts from housing advice,

0:45:19 > 0:45:23how we live in this house, then we make a very personal plan for

0:45:23 > 0:45:30everybody, going through their background and history and their

0:45:30 > 0:45:33present situation, and then their own goals. It is very important they

0:45:33 > 0:45:40have the choice to make together with the personal support person or

0:45:40 > 0:45:45their personal plan. Otherwise it is not motivated and they are not

0:45:45 > 0:45:51engaged with it.Have you been able to work out, Peter, that in terms of

0:45:51 > 0:45:55the maths and money spent whether more would have been spent if these

0:45:55 > 0:46:06people have been left sleeping rough in terms of the cost to society?

0:46:06 > 0:46:11We build units, over 20 in the country, in the biggest cities. So

0:46:11 > 0:46:22we took three of them for research and it showed that the average

0:46:22 > 0:46:27saving for one person accommodated, if you compare it with the homeless

0:46:27 > 0:46:35situation was 15,000 euros yearly for one person.OK.15,000. It's

0:46:35 > 0:46:39really logical because you understand that the persons which

0:46:39 > 0:46:44are living outside, you also use very much of the services. We

0:46:44 > 0:46:49compared for example the hospital services in Helsinki, it was 16

0:46:49 > 0:46:56times more than the average person using hospital services.Really

0:46:56 > 0:47:01interesting figures. Really stark figures as well. Are there any down

0:47:01 > 0:47:11sides.Yes. Absolutely. But you can manage them and you have to develop

0:47:11 > 0:47:18the contact and the real terms where we are going forward and it is a

0:47:18 > 0:47:22question that how, which kind of population can it be extended and I

0:47:22 > 0:47:31don't think at the moment it's very easy and it is unnecessary to go to

0:47:31 > 0:47:37a larger broader population than the ones which have the complex, most

0:47:37 > 0:47:43high need of support services.OK. Back in the West Midlands Andy

0:47:43 > 0:47:46Street, what more do you think the Government should be doing when it

0:47:46 > 0:47:49comes to helping people who are homeless?Well, what we are asking

0:47:49 > 0:47:52the Government to do is to support this brave initiative is the first

0:47:52 > 0:47:56thing and we are hoping for an outcome of that shortly, but the

0:47:56 > 0:48:01Government has said and I say this is a cross party piece, there has

0:48:01 > 0:48:03been the homeless reduction Act passed before the last general

0:48:03 > 0:48:07election which comes into force next year and it puts more requirements

0:48:07 > 0:48:11on local authorities to respond to this and they have just announced

0:48:11 > 0:48:15additional funding for local authorities to reach it the

0:48:15 > 0:48:17commitments under the homeless reduction Act.

0:48:17 > 0:48:24Thank you very much. Andy Street, West Midlands mayor and

0:48:24 > 0:48:33Peter Frederick son, thank you.

0:48:33 > 0:48:39Take it or leave it, that's what the Government's critics say they are

0:48:39 > 0:48:44being offered when it comes to the Brexit negotiations. Our political

0:48:44 > 0:48:50guru Norman Smith can fill us and tell us more. It can be quite

0:48:50 > 0:48:55technical this stuff on a day-to-day basis. Give us the broad outline,

0:48:55 > 0:49:02the big picture?The EU withdrawal Bill is a bumper Bill, more than 60

0:49:02 > 0:49:07pages long. It is the legislative equivalent of the Yellow Pages. The

0:49:07 > 0:49:12Government say it is just a bit of technical tidying up, designed to

0:49:12 > 0:49:17bring all the thousands of EU rules and regulations covering well

0:49:17 > 0:49:23everything from the water we drink, to the power of our vacuum cleaners

0:49:23 > 0:49:29to our workplace rights into British law. That's what it is designed to

0:49:29 > 0:49:35do because otherwise, the fear is we would disappear down the legal plug

0:49:35 > 0:49:40hole because there would be no rules and regulations to cover vast areas

0:49:40 > 0:49:45of our every day life. When it comes to Brexit nothing is simple and

0:49:45 > 0:49:51already, there have been something like 168 pages of amendments tabled

0:49:51 > 0:49:58to this Bill and they include things like making sure MPs have a

0:49:58 > 0:50:02meaningful vote before Mrs May signs on the dotted line for any

0:50:02 > 0:50:08agreement. Also, guaranteeing that there is a transition period of two

0:50:08 > 0:50:15years or more before we quit the EU and there could be enough Tory

0:50:15 > 0:50:19rebels working with the opposition to inflict potentially damaging

0:50:19 > 0:50:27defeats on Mrs May. The stakes are frankly of a Himalayan height and

0:50:27 > 0:50:34Mrs May has in effect accused her opponents of using the Bill to try

0:50:34 > 0:50:39and thwart Brexit itself. The question is - will they be able to

0:50:39 > 0:50:47do it? I think all we know with absolute certainty is we are facing

0:50:47 > 0:50:52fraught votes, late night debates, and a right old Parliamentary

0:50:52 > 0:50:59ding-dong dragging on for weeks.Can I just chat with you, Norman, about

0:50:59 > 0:51:03what the Brexit secretary offered yesterday? This idea that MPs will

0:51:03 > 0:51:09get a vote on the final Brexit deal, but then when questioned by a

0:51:09 > 0:51:14Brexiteer, look if we vote against it, does that mean we don't leave on

0:51:14 > 0:51:1929th March 2019, David Davis said yes, we're still leaving. So what on

0:51:19 > 0:51:24planet is that a meaningful vote? Well, the Government would say, it's

0:51:24 > 0:51:29a meaningful vote in the sense that there is going to be a piece of

0:51:29 > 0:51:34government legislation to mark this historic moment of leaving the EU.

0:51:34 > 0:51:41MPs will be able to scrutinise it line by line in minute detail and if

0:51:41 > 0:51:48they don't like it, they can reject it, here is the almighty big BUT,

0:51:48 > 0:51:52but if they do reject it, well tough. We're leaving anyway and that

0:51:52 > 0:51:56is why many of Mrs May's critics say it is in effect putting a gun to

0:51:56 > 0:52:01their head and say, "You vote for this or we're going to leave without

0:52:01 > 0:52:05any deal at all." Which they view as a nightmare scenario. That is their

0:52:05 > 0:52:10worst option. One other thing worth pointing out Vic is the timing of

0:52:10 > 0:52:14this. Normally to get a Bill through Parliament, can take months, but if

0:52:14 > 0:52:19this gets very difficult, and the negotiations go right down to the

0:52:19 > 0:52:24wire of the 30th March 2019, there will be no time to debate and vote

0:52:24 > 0:52:28on this Bill before we leave. In other words we could end up in a

0:52:28 > 0:52:32situation of leaving, and then having a debate about leaving and

0:52:32 > 0:52:37that too Mrs May's critics are unhappy about.Right. OK. So what

0:52:37 > 0:52:42can MPs do now if they are not happy?Well, I think the likelihood

0:52:42 > 0:52:47we are going to face what Sir Alex Ferguson called squeaky bum time!

0:52:47 > 0:52:53Because it is clear that there are probably around a dozen Tories who

0:52:53 > 0:52:59are deeply unhappy with Mrs May's plans and if they join with the

0:52:59 > 0:53:04opposition parties, it's possible that on some of the key votes, Mrs

0:53:04 > 0:53:08May could be defeated. Now, that raises the stakes even further

0:53:08 > 0:53:15because some Tory MPs are saying look, if the Government is defeated

0:53:15 > 0:53:20on these absolutely key votes, that amounts really to a vote of no

0:53:20 > 0:53:25confidence in the Government because Brexit is so central to what Mrs May

0:53:25 > 0:53:29is trying to do. So if Tory rebels help to defeat the Government it

0:53:29 > 0:53:33could bring down the Government, pave the way for a general election,

0:53:33 > 0:53:36and who knows, possibly a Jeremy Corbyn government. Now, in a I wa,

0:53:36 > 0:53:39that's just sort of strong arm tactics to try and crank up the

0:53:39 > 0:53:43pressure on Tory rebels, but it gives you a sense of how this could

0:53:43 > 0:53:47escalate and as I say, just how high the stakes are.

0:53:47 > 0:53:52Thank you very much, Norman. Let's talk to a Labour MP who voted

0:53:52 > 0:53:57Remain. His name is Pat McFadden. Would you like that scenario, the

0:53:57 > 0:54:00defeat for Theresa May precipitating a vote of no confidence and then a

0:54:00 > 0:54:06general election?I think listening to Norman, he has got his finger on

0:54:06 > 0:54:09the pulse probably more than any other journalist, but you get the

0:54:09 > 0:54:14impression that this is all a sort of Parliamentary tussle, you know,

0:54:14 > 0:54:19the image I had in my mind ten people involved, it is a big bun

0:54:19 > 0:54:25fight and actually we need to take a step back from all of that. All of

0:54:25 > 0:54:28that that Norman just summarised reflects the new Parliamentary

0:54:28 > 0:54:30arithmetic after the general election. To me the more important

0:54:30 > 0:54:34question is what happens to us in the future economically when we

0:54:34 > 0:54:40leave the EU? And what this is really all about is Parliament

0:54:40 > 0:54:46trying to ensure it has a meaningful say on those big questions.If the

0:54:46 > 0:54:53by-product that Theresa May ends up being defeated on various

0:54:53 > 0:54:55amendments, and it precipitating a general election, you would be

0:54:55 > 0:54:58happy?I would rather than a Labour Government rather than a

0:54:58 > 0:55:03Conservative Government. This is about we were told during the

0:55:03 > 0:55:07referendum we would be leaving the EU to take back control to our own

0:55:07 > 0:55:11Parliament and the Government has been pretty reluctant to give

0:55:11 > 0:55:14Parliament any meaningful say and that's what...You have got it now,

0:55:14 > 0:55:20haven't you?Well...Or are you not reassured by what David Davis said?

0:55:20 > 0:55:24What defines a meaningful say, to me it is the ability to say to the

0:55:24 > 0:55:27government, we don't like everything in this deal. We don't like the term

0:55:27 > 0:55:30of this deal. We would like you to try and change this part or that

0:55:30 > 0:55:35part, so you need to have it in good enough time to have a meaningful

0:55:35 > 0:55:39input. If it is between here is what we managed to negotiate, or no deal

0:55:39 > 0:55:44at all, which we all know would be a Dayser for our economy, that isn't

0:55:44 > 0:55:49really a meaningful say, that is a gun to people's heads really. So, I

0:55:49 > 0:55:57think this issue of how Parliament gets a meaningful say over this will

0:55:57 > 0:55:59continue even after the Secretary of State's announcement yesterday.

0:55:59 > 0:56:05Right, OK. I mean, do you really see this going to the wire?Well...In

0:56:05 > 0:56:11the final days and hours up to 29th March at 11pm?Let's begin with what

0:56:11 > 0:56:15the Government have said they want to achieve. I'm on the Brexit Select

0:56:15 > 0:56:19Committee that looks at all this week in and week out in Parliament

0:56:19 > 0:56:25and the Secretary of State has told us that his ambition is to have the

0:56:25 > 0:56:28withdrawal deal, and transitional arrangement which is basically the

0:56:28 > 0:56:32status quo without a say over the rules...You hope.Well, that's the

0:56:32 > 0:56:38only transition we will be offered by the EU.Right.And the basically

0:56:38 > 0:56:41the outline of the future arrangements all wrapped up by next

0:56:41 > 0:56:46year. That's the Government's policy aim. So I want to see if they manage

0:56:46 > 0:56:50to achieve all that. We went to Brussels last week, the Brexit

0:56:50 > 0:56:56committee and we met with the key negotiators on the EU side and two

0:56:56 > 0:57:02things struck me. One was I expect the Government to offer more money

0:57:02 > 0:57:06between now and this crunch December meeting in a few weeks' time. I

0:57:06 > 0:57:12think...How much more? £20 billion is on the table at the minute?It is

0:57:12 > 0:57:16hard for me to put a figure on it, but I think if the Government wants

0:57:16 > 0:57:20to get to the next phase which I want to get to, they are probably

0:57:20 > 0:57:24likely to offer more money, but that's not actually the most

0:57:24 > 0:57:27difficult part, even though it is a big sum of money. The most difficult

0:57:27 > 0:57:31part is what is our future relationship with the EU going to

0:57:31 > 0:57:35be? And the impression I got last week was, that's less of a

0:57:35 > 0:57:41negotiation and more of a pretty simple decision for us. We can

0:57:41 > 0:57:44either remain part of the whole single market system with all the

0:57:44 > 0:57:52market access that gives us or we can be outside that and there isn't

0:57:52 > 0:57:56really, the Government, I think, is trying to give the impression that

0:57:56 > 0:57:59there is a half-way house between those two and I think we should

0:57:59 > 0:58:02think of phase two as this, there is might be some details to negotiate,

0:58:02 > 0:58:05but in the main, it's not so much a negotiation, as a choice for the

0:58:05 > 0:58:10country.Can I just check with you as a Labour MP as a Remainer, once

0:58:10 > 0:58:18we move to the transitional period, which implies a bridge to a final

0:58:18 > 0:58:23Brexit deal...Yes.Would you be happy to remain in that transition,

0:58:23 > 0:58:26ie with the current arrangements we've got now?It's the only

0:58:26 > 0:58:31transition deal we will be offered. No, no, I mean forever?Oh forever.

0:58:31 > 0:58:36Well, the disadvantage of...No, no, yes or no? Do you want to stay in

0:58:36 > 0:58:39transition permanently?No, I don't want to stay in transition

0:58:39 > 0:58:44permanently, because it is supposed to be a bridge from A to B.But as a

0:58:44 > 0:58:47Remainor that would suit you surely? You have got to calculate what the

0:58:47 > 0:58:52economic damage is here. The disadvantage of the transition over

0:58:52 > 0:58:57the current status is we don't have a say over the rules. And that was

0:58:57 > 0:59:01also made clear to us when we went last week.But you would be in the

0:59:01 > 0:59:04single market which you really want? We would be in the single market

0:59:04 > 0:59:07which is something that I think is very important. We would still have

0:59:07 > 0:59:11access to all the rights that that gives us. We would still be in the

0:59:11 > 0:59:17customs union. Basically everything would be the same except we wouldn't

0:59:17 > 0:59:21have a seat at the table deciding the rules. That's the only

0:59:21 > 0:59:26transition deal that the EU will offer us.OK. Thank you. Thank you

0:59:26 > 0:59:30very much, Pat McFadden who is a Labour MP and a Remainor. We will

0:59:30 > 0:59:34talk to a Conservative MP obviously in the next hour. Right, the

0:59:34 > 0:59:37weather. Here is Lucy.

0:59:38 > 0:59:42Good morning. A less cool day on the way after a

0:59:42 > 0:59:45chilly start to the week. We have milder temperatures, but more in the

0:59:45 > 0:59:50way of cloud. There have been some exceptions to that though. The best

0:59:50 > 0:59:53of the brightness certainly in the south and the east of Scotland and a

0:59:53 > 0:59:57few breaks in that cloud like this photo sent in by a Weather Watcher

0:59:57 > 1:00:01in Cheshire. Some blue skies just poking through there. But further

1:00:01 > 1:00:05south, this has been more the order of the day. A little bit more in the

1:00:05 > 1:00:09way of cloud. This photo sent in from Twickenham in Greater London.

1:00:09 > 1:00:12Through the day today then the best of the brightness certainly across

1:00:12 > 1:00:16Scotland. Just feeding into the north-east of England and the far

1:00:16 > 1:00:23north of Northern Ireland as well. A scattering of heavy showers in the

1:00:23 > 1:00:27far north that and there could be hail in there. For much of central,

1:00:27 > 1:00:31southern England and Wales, there will be plenty of cloud. Mostly dry.

1:00:31 > 1:00:34A few outbreaks of cloud and drizzle where the cloud becomes thick enough

1:00:34 > 1:00:38and a few breaks in the cloud here and there. Temperatures just in the

1:00:38 > 1:00:43double figures. Cloudy for Northern Ireland. Any brightness in the north

1:00:43 > 1:00:48and the clearer skies means that it is a little bit cooler for Scotland

1:00:48 > 1:00:52and some breeze, the wind picking up with the fairly heavy showers.

1:00:52 > 1:00:56Through tonight then, the showers in the north will ease. We will hold on

1:00:56 > 1:01:00to the clearer skies across Scotland and into Northern Ireland and

1:01:00 > 1:01:03northern England. Clouder in the south with rain and drizzle. The

1:01:03 > 1:01:09potential to see a few dense patches of fog developing through tonight.

1:01:09 > 1:01:13How quickly they will lift tomorrow, a bit of uncertainty, but it looks

1:01:13 > 1:01:18like we will still see the best of the brightness in the north.

1:01:18 > 1:01:20Northern Ireland into Scotland and northern England and perhaps just

1:01:20 > 1:01:24into the far North of Wales seeing the brighter conditions tomorrow. It

1:01:24 > 1:01:28will turn cloudier into the afternoon later for north and west

1:01:28 > 1:01:31Scotland and some rain pushing in as well.

1:01:31 > 1:01:35For much of central southern England and Wales, it will be cloudy with

1:01:35 > 1:01:40rain and drizzle. Again temperatures in the double figures. We could see

1:01:40 > 1:01:44a few brighter intervals developing like we have seen today.

1:01:44 > 1:01:47Thursday, this cold front sinks south and east ward. Behind it, it

1:01:47 > 1:01:52is starting to see something brighter. Temperatures again on

1:01:52 > 1:01:56Thursday staying in the double figures in the south and that takes

1:01:56 > 1:02:00us into Friday where we will see the return to something cooler. More in

1:02:00 > 1:02:04the way of brightness. The chance of one or two showers in the north.

1:02:04 > 1:02:12Turning breezier as well. And feeling noticeably fresher.

1:02:12 > 1:02:16Thanks, Lucy.

1:02:18 > 1:02:20Hello it's Tuesday, it's ten o'clock, I'm Victoria Derbyshire.

1:02:20 > 1:02:22Our top story this morning: it's another crucial day

1:02:22 > 1:02:27in the Brexit countdown.

1:02:27 > 1:02:33With this bill, it is take it or leave it time because if they don't

1:02:33 > 1:02:42like it, tough. We will still leave the EU without any sort of deal and

1:02:42 > 1:02:47that is nightmare land for Remainers.

1:02:47 > 1:02:48We'll bring you all the details.

1:02:48 > 1:02:51A chef has told this programme she was suspended from work

1:02:51 > 1:02:53at a Premier Inn the day after she complained

1:02:53 > 1:02:54of sexual harassment.

1:02:54 > 1:02:56We'll hear from woman concerned and an employment

1:02:56 > 1:02:57lawyer later this hour.

1:02:57 > 1:02:59And local councils are using to bailiffs to recover

1:02:59 > 1:03:06money they are owed.

1:03:06 > 1:03:15Let me know your own experiences this morning.

1:03:15 > 1:03:18Here's Ben in the BBC Newsroom with a summary of today's news.

1:03:18 > 1:03:21Inflation - the rate of increase in prices for goods and services -

1:03:21 > 1:03:22remained unchanged at 3% in October.

1:03:22 > 1:03:25The rate remains at a five-year high with rising food prices offset

1:03:25 > 1:03:28by a fall in the cost of fuel, according to the Office

1:03:28 > 1:03:33for National Statistics.

1:03:33 > 1:03:35MPs will today begin debating a key piece of Brexit legislation,

1:03:35 > 1:03:36the EU withdrawal bill.

1:03:36 > 1:03:39It will help turn European laws into UK ones but opponents including

1:03:39 > 1:03:43Tory rebels have tabled scores of amendments.

1:03:43 > 1:03:45Meanwhile a Parliamentary report is warning a failure to complete

1:03:45 > 1:03:49the introduction of a new customs system by the date of Brexit in 2019

1:03:49 > 1:03:54would be "catastrophic".

1:03:54 > 1:03:57A Tory activist who says she was raped has told this

1:03:57 > 1:03:58programme that she feels disappointed, despite

1:03:58 > 1:04:01receiving a phone call from the Leader of the House.

1:04:01 > 1:04:04Andrea Leadsom called Lisa Wade - who's waived her right

1:04:04 > 1:04:06to anonymity - last night, several months after the incident

1:04:06 > 1:04:11was first reported to her.

1:04:11 > 1:04:14Ms Leadsom said she could not have acted on the report at the time

1:04:14 > 1:04:19because of an ongoing legal case.

1:04:19 > 1:04:22Human Rights Watch says the Burmese security forces have

1:04:22 > 1:04:24committed widespread abuses during what they call 'a campaign

1:04:24 > 1:04:26of ethnic cleansing' against the Rohingya Muslim population.

1:04:26 > 1:04:28The organisation said Government forces have

1:04:28 > 1:04:29committed mass killings, rape, arbitrary

1:04:29 > 1:04:33detention, and arson.

1:04:33 > 1:04:35More than half a million Rohingya have fled a military offensive

1:04:35 > 1:04:42in the north of the country.

1:04:42 > 1:04:47That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 10.30.

1:04:47 > 1:04:52A couple of messages about the homeless scheme in Finland. With

1:04:52 > 1:04:57rough sleepers they are immediately placing them in permanent

1:04:57 > 1:05:03accommodation, so a flat permanently for ever. No hostels, bed and

1:05:03 > 1:05:07breakfast, nothing like that, and they said it is saving them money.

1:05:07 > 1:05:16It is a big outlay but in the end it saves money society. "Don't Think

1:05:16 > 1:05:19this Government would do the same here, they are callously making the

1:05:19 > 1:05:28public worse off with Universal Credit" says Mike. David, "It goes

1:05:28 > 1:05:34to show a more caring socialist outlook actually saves the Treasury

1:05:34 > 1:05:39money in the long and helps individuals rebuild their lives who

1:05:39 > 1:05:45in turn provide more income to the Treasury. Take note please,

1:05:45 > 1:05:51government".

1:05:51 > 1:05:56Do get in touch with us throughout the morning.

1:05:56 > 1:06:01Now the sport. Italy have failed to qualify for the World Cup for the

1:06:01 > 1:06:11first time since 1958. Even the veteran keeper was sent into the

1:06:11 > 1:06:14attack in injury time. One newspaper described the result as an

1:06:14 > 1:06:20apocalypse. Others want to replace the manager who hasn't officially

1:06:20 > 1:06:28resigned yet. Wales centre Jonathan Davies will

1:06:28 > 1:06:34miss the Six Nations due to a foot injury. He needs surgery and that

1:06:34 > 1:06:38means his domestic season for Scarlets may also be over. It's a

1:06:38 > 1:06:43real blow, he was the Lions player of the series this year. Jamie

1:06:43 > 1:06:48Roberts has been added to the Wales squad along with Scott Andrews as

1:06:48 > 1:06:51cover. Moeen Ali has recovered from side

1:06:51 > 1:06:55strain so will play against Australia, after getting to know

1:06:55 > 1:07:01some of the local wildlife. Ali was named in the team for the final warm

1:07:01 > 1:07:05up match which starts tomorrow. Commonwealth champion Dan Keatings

1:07:05 > 1:07:09says there is a very real culture of fear within British gymnastics after

1:07:09 > 1:07:13some coaches claimed there was appalling leadership at the

1:07:13 > 1:07:17governing body. He said he experienced bullying and

1:07:17 > 1:07:22manipulation during his career as an athlete. British gymnastics have

1:07:22 > 1:07:25encouraged anyone with concerns to come forward.

1:07:25 > 1:07:30And Rafael Nadal has pulled out of the world tour finals with a knee

1:07:30 > 1:07:39injury after losing to David Goffin. He is the latest player to say that

1:07:39 > 1:07:48is it for 2017, I will be back next year.

1:07:48 > 1:08:00Thank you. Let's get more on our latest story. Let's speak to a

1:08:00 > 1:08:09Conservative MP who voted to leave the European Union, Suella

1:08:09 > 1:08:13Fernandes.

1:08:13 > 1:08:15Pat McFadden, a Labour MP who voted to Remain.

1:08:15 > 1:08:17And the Belgian MEP Philippe Lamberts, who is a key

1:08:17 > 1:08:19member of the European Parliament Brexit Steering Group.

1:08:19 > 1:08:24How do you view this?I find the British government is conducting the

1:08:24 > 1:08:31negotiation in a reckless way. The clock is ticking. Already

1:08:31 > 1:08:36negotiating a deal within two years is a considerable challenge but we

1:08:36 > 1:08:40have lost time. You might say she delivered a grand speech in Florence

1:08:40 > 1:08:48but we did not see any of the intention that she declared

1:08:48 > 1:08:52translated into proposition. It is like delaying tactics, I don't know

1:08:52 > 1:08:57how to call that but the things that worry me the most is the situation

1:08:57 > 1:09:01in Ireland. There is an inherent contradiction by the Government

1:09:01 > 1:09:04saying on the one hand we want to respect the Good Friday Agreement

1:09:04 > 1:09:10and on the other hand take the UK out of the customs union, the single

1:09:10 > 1:09:15market and jurisdiction of the ECJ. That creates a border and on the

1:09:15 > 1:09:20other hand you say you don't want a border. That contradiction is

1:09:20 > 1:09:25nowhere near being resolved by the British government so we have yet to

1:09:25 > 1:09:30see a proposal that could fly. I don't think there is one so we need

1:09:30 > 1:09:34to solve that contradiction. I would say the money is the least difficult

1:09:34 > 1:09:41of all the issues and we are inching towards a deal on citizens rights.

1:09:41 > 1:09:46There are number of points there. Just briefly on the money, how much

1:09:46 > 1:09:51is it you want?You know what, I don't have any clue as to the

1:09:51 > 1:09:57amount. What I want is that the financial obligations that have been

1:09:57 > 1:10:01subscribed by the UK be honoured. We don't know how much at the moment

1:10:01 > 1:10:06because part of it is contingent. If you provide guarantees and they are

1:10:06 > 1:10:11not needed, the money is not needed. Also we have to be honest, we want

1:10:11 > 1:10:19the UK to honour its liabilities but we have to deduct the amount of

1:10:19 > 1:10:24assets. As long as we agree on the baseline of the principles, I would

1:10:24 > 1:10:29go as far as saying let the Nordic company do the reckoning and say how

1:10:29 > 1:10:35much is due by when.You do have an idea about the figure because you

1:10:35 > 1:10:38know 20 billion is not enough, but anyway let me bring in a

1:10:38 > 1:10:46Conservative MP, Suella Fernandes. Conservative government is being

1:10:46 > 1:10:51reckless because the clock is ticking, and two the contradiction

1:10:51 > 1:10:56from Mrs May on the border. Start with the reckless point, how do you

1:10:56 > 1:11:04plead?Not guilty. Since the Florence speech, the negotiating

1:11:04 > 1:11:10team have made a lot of progress on EU citizens. We are now very close

1:11:10 > 1:11:18to an agreement. The Prime Minister has made it very clear.And Philippe

1:11:18 > 1:11:24Lamberts has acknowledged that, what about the rest of it?On Northern

1:11:24 > 1:11:27Ireland I think again there has been considerable agreement on the

1:11:27 > 1:11:32principles, for example that we want cooperation between the north and

1:11:32 > 1:11:37south, that the Common travel area should continue to operate, and the

1:11:37 > 1:11:41principles of the Belfast agreement remains sound. I think that's all

1:11:41 > 1:11:47considerable progress and we need to make sure there is that soft border

1:11:47 > 1:11:50between Northern Ireland...But you cannot have that, we have just

1:11:50 > 1:12:01heard, with all of the other things you want.I disagree.It is

1:12:01 > 1:12:11either/or.I don't think a solution is impossible.

1:12:11 > 1:12:17I don't think a solution is impossible.

1:12:17 > 1:12:28Philippe Lamberts?Nice words, but everybody wants those things, the

1:12:28 > 1:12:30problem is you cannot have the Good Friday Agreement together with the

1:12:30 > 1:12:38border. It is either/or. Or we have to place the border elsewhere. Is

1:12:38 > 1:12:46there preparedness to consider that? I don't know but we need more than

1:12:46 > 1:12:50words, we need concrete proposals as to how to make this work and that

1:12:50 > 1:12:59contradiction I believe cannot be resolved.Suella Fernandes?I think

1:12:59 > 1:13:07that is a very pessimistic view. What is the concrete proposal?How

1:13:07 > 1:13:15do we do this?It has to be the case because our position and

1:13:15 > 1:13:17relationship with Ireland and Northern Ireland is very important,

1:13:17 > 1:13:25we need to make sure that continues. Sure, we know all of that, sorry,

1:13:25 > 1:13:31what are the practical things that you would implement that would make

1:13:31 > 1:13:36that work?It is all there. The Common travel area sets out how this

1:13:36 > 1:13:41works already and it's about moving forward...For people but not for

1:13:41 > 1:13:49goods.The ball is in the EU's court to agree to those principles so we

1:13:49 > 1:13:54can move on and get on to talking about trade. We want a free trade

1:13:54 > 1:13:59agreement with the EU so we can carry on frictionless trade.Let me

1:13:59 > 1:14:08go back to Philippe Lamberts. On the border, let's just have the Common

1:14:08 > 1:14:12travel area?Sorry but this is not the issue, the Common travel area is

1:14:12 > 1:14:17for people. If you are getting out of the single market, goods will

1:14:17 > 1:14:22need to be controlled so there will be a physical border and you need to

1:14:22 > 1:14:27place it somewhere, so your choice, say where it will be placed. The

1:14:27 > 1:14:32Good Friday Agreement says no border between the two parts of the island,

1:14:32 > 1:14:42period.Suella Fernandes?No hard border, that is what we want to

1:14:42 > 1:14:46agree with the EU and it is up to the EU to come back and agree those

1:14:46 > 1:14:55terms.Come on! You need to control goods, right?We can talk about

1:14:55 > 1:14:59trading agreement which is really what both parties are there for.

1:14:59 > 1:15:03Millions of people in Germany, France and Belgium depend on British

1:15:03 > 1:15:08custom when it comes to trading. We are one of the biggest customers in

1:15:08 > 1:15:15the EU and therefore I think it's a mutually beneficial thing for both

1:15:15 > 1:15:19parties to work positively to reach an agreement. That's what I want,

1:15:19 > 1:15:24having campaigned to leave the EU, that is what Theresa May and the

1:15:24 > 1:15:29British people want.I think there is a slight contradiction, by

1:15:29 > 1:15:33wishing to a very close relationship with the 27 member states and saying

1:15:33 > 1:15:38we want to wave goodbye to them. There is again a discrepancy here

1:15:38 > 1:15:43but again I believe that to the MPs. I feel like we may be going round in

1:15:43 > 1:15:52circles, but thank you.

1:15:52 > 1:15:57Did I really say the tick is clocking? Did I really say that? You

1:15:57 > 1:16:02know what I mean so it doesn't really matter!

1:16:03 > 1:16:05A chef has told this programme she was suspended from work

1:16:05 > 1:16:08at a Premier Inn the day after she complained

1:16:08 > 1:16:16of sexual harassment.

1:16:16 > 1:16:18Martha Hammock was the only female chef at her branch

1:16:18 > 1:16:20of the budget hotel, says her colleague sent her messages

1:16:20 > 1:16:22with sexual content and innuendo.

1:16:22 > 1:16:28Premier Inn deny that's why she was suspended.

1:16:28 > 1:16:30Let's talk with Martha Hammock and also Harini Iyengar

1:16:30 > 1:16:32who is an employment barrister.

1:16:32 > 1:16:38Thank you very much for coming on the programme. I wonder that Martha

1:16:38 > 1:16:42Hammock if you could tell us the nature of the messages that you were

1:16:42 > 1:16:51sent.It started off with a conversation in a kitchen about his

1:16:51 > 1:16:54penis and the size of it and then he would send me a picture of a bottle

1:16:54 > 1:16:59which was in the shape of a penis and said this is what it looks like.

1:16:59 > 1:17:04I just ignored it and I didn't want to engage in and encourage that kind

1:17:04 > 1:17:11of conversation. I also got a whatsapp message of two scantily

1:17:11 > 1:17:20clad women and then he asked me who should I F first? Of these women.

1:17:20 > 1:17:23Again I just didn't respond. That's the type of messages I was getting

1:17:23 > 1:17:33from him.How did they make you feel those messages?It is humiliating

1:17:33 > 1:17:37and it's shocking and the person I am speaking about is younger than me

1:17:37 > 1:17:43so I felt it quite disrespectful as well.You were the only female chef

1:17:43 > 1:17:46working alongside five male chefs. Generally, how was the working

1:17:46 > 1:17:55environment?When we're all together, it's OK. But if you look

1:17:55 > 1:18:01at how the shift pattern is set-up, there is a lot of unfairness. I

1:18:01 > 1:18:07often would work on my own and also when I do work, I'm only given an

1:18:07 > 1:18:11hour to prep for dinner. When it's the men working together, it's very

1:18:11 > 1:18:16much a friendship type thing and they come in and they have got two

1:18:16 > 1:18:21hours to prep. It is so unfair. I raised those issues and I seemed to

1:18:21 > 1:18:25be getting nowhere.Two weeks later you say you got a whatsapp message

1:18:25 > 1:18:29which told you couldn't be part of the work whatsapp group because you

1:18:29 > 1:18:37were a woman. You say that that whatsapp group messaging system was

1:18:37 > 1:18:45used to send out work notices and key info. What do you think was

1:18:45 > 1:18:48going on?I was discussed as a person and they didn't want to

1:18:48 > 1:18:52include me, but that's just me suspecting, but it's also very

1:18:52 > 1:18:55unprofessional. There was no reason why I shouldn't be part of the team.

1:18:55 > 1:19:01I am part of the team.In the end you filed a grievance about

1:19:01 > 1:19:07harassment...Yes.And discrimination.Yes.But the

1:19:07 > 1:19:13organisation decided not to pursue the discrimination side of things.

1:19:13 > 1:19:17And you wrote to head office in November, at the start of November,

1:19:17 > 1:19:24didn't you?I did, yes.You raised again because everything was

1:19:24 > 1:19:28emerging sexual har hasment issues from Hollywood and you thought I am

1:19:28 > 1:19:32going to raise this? What happened the next day.I came in and did

1:19:32 > 1:19:37breakfast and finished breakfast and I was called into the office. I went

1:19:37 > 1:19:41to the office and there was a strange person and a team of people

1:19:41 > 1:19:46ready to interview. I was accused of four things. I was in the meeting

1:19:46 > 1:19:52for five hours and at the end of the five hours he dismissed three of the

1:19:52 > 1:19:55things that I was supposed to have done and suspended me and the

1:19:55 > 1:19:59language I was suspended for my own safety and to protect me.You say

1:19:59 > 1:20:02those words were actually used? Absolutely and also, put in the

1:20:02 > 1:20:11report. So I mean it was just, I was so shocked. I was just so emotional.

1:20:11 > 1:20:17Premier Inn say that that suspension had nothing to do with your

1:20:17 > 1:20:21reporting of the harassment, that it was to do with conduct at work. They

1:20:21 > 1:20:25gave examples, you left work early one night. You failed to sign your

1:20:25 > 1:20:29hotel keys on one occasion, sign them in, failed to fill in a time

1:20:29 > 1:20:34sheet one evening and they say that they had planned to suspend you

1:20:34 > 1:20:37before they got your complaint at head office about harassment this

1:20:37 > 1:20:42month. They do say they are investigating the sexual harassment.

1:20:42 > 1:20:50What effect is it having on you being suspended on full pay?I mean,

1:20:50 > 1:20:57it's very hurtful. I feel very alone. I feel ostracised from my

1:20:57 > 1:21:02team. I feel like I have been told I'm guilty even though I'm not, it's

1:21:02 > 1:21:09not been concluded. It's just very hurtful to me. I was employee of the

1:21:09 > 1:21:19quarter the first time the hotel was opened. So my performance has never

1:21:19 > 1:21:24been in question. The thing about pumpking in, the vast majority of

1:21:24 > 1:21:29people don't punch in because they don't have punch in keys.The hotel

1:21:29 > 1:21:33say the two things are unrelated, that's possible?It is possible, but

1:21:33 > 1:21:40as an employment lawyer I would say, based on that account of what Martha

1:21:40 > 1:21:45is supposed to have done, it is hard to see why you need to suspend

1:21:45 > 1:21:49someone for that, if it is clocking-in offences, it is hard to

1:21:49 > 1:21:52understand why you can't investigate that if someone is at work and if

1:21:52 > 1:21:55someone complained to head office of sexual harassment of this type, it

1:21:55 > 1:22:00is an odd way of dealing with things and just, it's, you know, without

1:22:00 > 1:22:03knowing the other side of the story, you can say it's not good practise

1:22:03 > 1:22:07to upset the staff member by dealing with the disciplinary allegation

1:22:07 > 1:22:12before you have dealt with the prior sexual harassment allegation.What

1:22:12 > 1:22:16is the law around what needs to happen when someone reports

1:22:16 > 1:22:20harassment at work?Well, if you don't deal with harassment reports

1:22:20 > 1:22:26properly, that can be an act of sex discrimination which is subjecting

1:22:26 > 1:22:30sub ch someone to a detriment if they are a woman. If it is a woman

1:22:30 > 1:22:34complaining about sexual harassment and it is not taken seriously that

1:22:34 > 1:22:38can be unfavourable treatment for her for being a woman. If there is a

1:22:38 > 1:22:41disciplinary policy and a grievance policy then that ought to be

1:22:41 > 1:22:45followed and I think Premier Inn is a big business and I am assuming

1:22:45 > 1:22:52they have got a policy on it and the time scales ought to be kept to and

1:22:52 > 1:22:55if there are delays you ought to be keeping in touch with the person

1:22:55 > 1:22:59that complained and reassuring them that action is being taken and their

1:22:59 > 1:23:02concerns are being looked into.Have you ever come across claims that

1:23:02 > 1:23:06somebody who has complained about sexual harassment has subsequently

1:23:06 > 1:23:12been suspended?Unfortunately, yes. I think there is some research by

1:23:12 > 1:23:16the TUC last year showing that a lot of women have reported to the TUC

1:23:16 > 1:23:21when they tried to complain about sexual harassment they have been

1:23:21 > 1:23:25treated worse. Unfortunately Martha's experience isn't unique,

1:23:25 > 1:23:29but if you were advising a business who say we are concerned about

1:23:29 > 1:23:33disciplinary allegations and they mention to you that that person had

1:23:33 > 1:23:37previously complained of sexual harassment, as a lawyer you would be

1:23:37 > 1:23:42wanting to say think twice do you really need to suspend this person

1:23:42 > 1:23:47and what have you been doing about the allegations.Rachel on Facebook

1:23:47 > 1:23:52says, "My daughter was sacked after her boss sent her body photos. They

1:23:52 > 1:23:56came to our house demanding she deleted all evidence." Thank you

1:23:56 > 1:24:01very much for talking to us.

1:24:01 > 1:24:03We invited Premier Inn to come onto the programme today,

1:24:03 > 1:24:06but they weren't available and instead told us,

1:24:06 > 1:24:08"The decision to suspend Martha is entirely unrelated

1:24:08 > 1:24:10to the sexual harassment complaint.

1:24:10 > 1:24:13We took the decision to suspend Martha on full pay as part

1:24:13 > 1:24:15of an ongoing investigation into her own conduct at work

1:24:15 > 1:24:18and an apparent breakdown in the working relationship

1:24:18 > 1:24:28between her and the company.

1:24:29 > 1:24:32Rohingya Muslim women and have been subjected to widespread rape as part

1:24:32 > 1:24:35of a campaign of ethnic cleansing by Myanmar's security forces -

1:24:35 > 1:24:38that's what a Human Rights Watch report will warn later this week.

1:24:38 > 1:24:41Many women also described witnessing the murders

1:24:41 > 1:24:48of their young children, spouses, and parents.

1:24:48 > 1:24:51Rohingya Muslims make up a minority in Myanmar, or Burma,

1:24:51 > 1:24:52which is a predominantly Muslim country.

1:24:52 > 1:25:01Since unrest in the Rakhine province where they live

1:25:01 > 1:25:04in the north of the country, more than 500,000 have fled

1:25:04 > 1:25:05a military offensive.

1:25:05 > 1:25:07Theresa May says the actions of the military "looked

1:25:07 > 1:25:08like ethnic cleansing".

1:25:08 > 1:25:12Newsnight's Gabriel Gatehouse has made a deeply disturbing film

1:25:12 > 1:25:20on some of the testimony of the refugees.

1:25:20 > 1:25:25Following discussion - will refer to extreme violence,

1:25:25 > 1:25:30some of it sexual which you may not want children to watch.

1:25:49 > 1:25:51Anourha showed us where she and others swam across the river,

1:25:51 > 1:25:56at a point downstream where it was narrow enough to cross.

1:25:56 > 1:26:06From a hill on the opposite bank, they watched the horror unfold.

1:26:44 > 1:26:48The violence began five days before the massacre at Tula Toli,

1:26:48 > 1:26:57on 25th August, when members of a Rohingya

1:26:57 > 1:26:58militant group attacked the number of police posts

1:26:58 > 1:27:00inside Myanmar, killing 12.

1:27:00 > 1:27:02In response, the Burmese military began what they call

1:27:02 > 1:27:03clearance operations.

1:27:03 > 1:27:09Boats filled with refugees have been coming ever since.

1:27:09 > 1:27:11By late morning on 30th August, on the river bank

1:27:11 > 1:27:14at Tula Toli, dozens of people had already been murdered,

1:27:14 > 1:27:17but it wasn't over yet.

1:27:17 > 1:27:23Some villagers had escaped by swimming across the river,

1:27:23 > 1:27:25but many remained behind, especially younger women

1:27:25 > 1:27:29who had been separated from the rest by the soldiers.

1:27:29 > 1:27:35Those who survived endured an ordeal of almost unimaginable horror.

1:28:10 > 1:28:12The Burmese government doesn't regard the Rohingya Muslims

1:28:12 > 1:28:18as citizens of Myanmar.

1:28:18 > 1:28:20Stuck in the camps in Bangladesh, without official status,

1:28:20 > 1:28:23it will be hard for them to return home, even if they felt

1:28:23 > 1:28:33it was safe to do so.

1:28:33 > 1:28:39Let's talk to Anita who has family in roe hind ga and she fled the

1:28:39 > 1:28:47country as a child. And Sky Wheeler from Human Rights Watch. They have

1:28:47 > 1:28:56been investigating rapes. Francis from the Red Cross. Anita, we have

1:28:56 > 1:29:03just heard some really, really upsetting testimony from women in

1:29:03 > 1:29:07particular who are being abused, raped, tortured, can you tell us

1:29:07 > 1:29:15about the current situation with your own family?I still have family

1:29:15 > 1:29:22in Rakhine state. I have my aunt, four cousins from my maternal side.

1:29:22 > 1:29:28One of my entire family, from the paternal side, the aunt, including

1:29:28 > 1:29:33her children, they were trying to flee Rakhine state. They were in the

1:29:33 > 1:29:39boat. The boat was hit by the Navy or the military and the entire

1:29:39 > 1:29:44family side and the situation with my maternal aunts and cousins is

1:29:44 > 1:29:49that they are living under constant fear. They are under fear that they

1:29:49 > 1:29:55might not live in the coming hours, coming days. The situation is so

1:29:55 > 1:30:01dire that they even cannot go out. If they are trying to go out, have

1:30:01 > 1:30:09access to food, people beat them up and they don't have proper access to

1:30:09 > 1:30:12like food etcetera because the price has gone also very high. So they

1:30:12 > 1:30:19could not manage to buy even food and if the Rakhine people are being

1:30:19 > 1:30:22business with them, business means buying and selling food, these are

1:30:22 > 1:30:26the kind of people that are selling the food are being harassed by their

1:30:26 > 1:30:31own community. So literally people who are staying there in, the roe

1:30:31 > 1:30:36hind gas are being either they are being killed or harassed or starved

1:30:36 > 1:30:57to death.Skye Wheeler, you have spoken to a number of Rohingya

1:30:57 > 1:31:03women, what did they tell you?Two main findings, first of all

1:31:03 > 1:31:09widespread rape is so not just in the massacres like the one discussed

1:31:09 > 1:31:13earlier in this segment, but in many different villages widespread rape

1:31:13 > 1:31:18was used as a tool of ethnic cleansing. It was one of the ways

1:31:18 > 1:31:23the Burmese military forced people to flee and have traumatised women

1:31:23 > 1:31:28and girls so they are too afraid to go back home. Something else we

1:31:28 > 1:31:35found was how absolutely horrible, brutal and humiliating the rapes

1:31:35 > 1:31:43were. Almost all of the rape we documented work gang rapes, often as

1:31:43 > 1:31:48many as ten perpetrators, often children still in the room. Many of

1:31:48 > 1:31:56the women and girls we have spoken to work a on their breasts, hit or

1:31:56 > 1:32:01kicked during the rapes. They took place as women were trying to flee

1:32:01 > 1:32:08and in some cases women and girls were gathered together by security

1:32:08 > 1:32:13forces and raped in gangs. Truly horrific and deeply traumatising and

1:32:13 > 1:32:19painful. Not only the immediate pain of the rape but then having to walk

1:32:19 > 1:32:23for days on very serious genital injuries. Then of course the

1:32:23 > 1:32:32emotional pain. The women and girls I interviewed were victims of ethnic

1:32:32 > 1:32:37cleansing, not just rape. Many had seen husbands taken away,

1:32:37 > 1:32:43excruciating sadness and despair. What you have described is

1:32:43 > 1:32:48grotesque, absolutely horrific. When you say rape is being used as a tool

1:32:48 > 1:32:56for ethnic cleansing, what do you mean?Rape is terrifying, right? It

1:32:56 > 1:33:00terrifies whole communities, it attacks the individual but it's also

1:33:00 > 1:33:06a way of attacking a whole community and humiliating a whole community.

1:33:06 > 1:33:10Rape also... It is important to understand it doesn't just happen in

1:33:10 > 1:33:17the moment of the rape. A woman is raped, she is terrified and fleas,

1:33:17 > 1:33:23others hear about it, they are terrified and they flee. It also

1:33:23 > 1:33:27rape as a long-term traumatising effect, so women and girls not only

1:33:27 > 1:33:32have been attacked but they have been psychologically and mentally

1:33:32 > 1:33:38traumatised. The thought of going back is terrifying. It is a highly

1:33:38 > 1:33:43effective way of conducting ethnic cleansing.Getting people out of an

1:33:43 > 1:33:50area, yes. Francis, I wonder if you could explain to our audience the

1:33:50 > 1:33:57conditions in some of the refugee camps right now.Victoria, the

1:33:57 > 1:34:00conditions are very harsh for these hundreds of thousands of people who

1:34:00 > 1:34:09have fled to Bangladesh from Myanmar. It is one of the most

1:34:09 > 1:34:14complex humanitarian crises we have dealt with in recent times. People

1:34:14 > 1:34:18are in desperate need of proper shelter. They are living really

1:34:18 > 1:34:24under nothing more than plastic sheeting and bamboo in many cases.

1:34:24 > 1:34:30We have huge challenges with providing clean drinking water to

1:34:30 > 1:34:35avoid the spread of disease and sanitation facilities, you can

1:34:35 > 1:34:42imagine, for so many people. And also doing whatever we can to help

1:34:42 > 1:34:46alleviate the emotional distress and trauma that people have been going

1:34:46 > 1:34:54through, to which your last speaker alluded so eloquently.Right. So you

1:34:54 > 1:34:58have the challenge of providing those basic essentials but trying to

1:34:58 > 1:35:04provide some kind of help for incredibly traumatised people.Yes,

1:35:04 > 1:35:12that's right. Our psychosocial programmes are obviously, a lot of

1:35:12 > 1:35:19them are directed towards children who are in very large numbers and

1:35:19 > 1:35:24need help to become children again after all they have gone through.

1:35:24 > 1:35:29The women obviously who have been affected by these traumatic ordeal

1:35:29 > 1:35:35is. But all some men, who somehow also need to open up about the

1:35:35 > 1:35:41experiences they have been through. I want to ask you all if I may,

1:35:41 > 1:35:47starting with you Anita, why you think the international community

1:35:47 > 1:35:52isn't doing more, why you think the civilian leader isn't doing them

1:35:52 > 1:36:11all, isn't doing anything.Let me start with Aung San Suu Kyi, she is

1:36:11 > 1:36:15doing something but it is for political gain. The international

1:36:15 > 1:36:20community does not have any appetite to help the Rohingya community, they

1:36:20 > 1:36:28have their own interests. Everybody wants to have a piece of cake in the

1:36:28 > 1:36:34open Society or open democratic country Myanmar. And also the

1:36:34 > 1:36:42international community has not labelled with the correct term which

1:36:42 > 1:36:51will provide protection. Ethnic cleansing does not bind the

1:36:51 > 1:36:54international community to act. Even the Security Council has failed to

1:36:54 > 1:37:00come up with any resolution so the best thing is to first put the

1:37:00 > 1:37:07correct diagnosis, and that is genocide. I say this because years

1:37:07 > 1:37:19ago we were 3 million, and now more than 623,000 Rohingyas have fled to

1:37:19 > 1:37:31Bangladesh. Out of the remaining people, 1020 are still kept in

1:37:31 > 1:37:40camps, and there are also people dying. There is a hybrid government,

1:37:40 > 1:37:46including the civilian government, Aung San Suu Kyi has been

1:37:46 > 1:37:54responsible for the man-made tragedy what we are facing now.Skye Wheeler

1:37:54 > 1:37:58from the human rights watch, why isn't someone from outside trying to

1:37:58 > 1:38:05intervene?It's an amazing question, it is unbelievable. Yesterday the

1:38:05 > 1:38:09Burmese military put out a report in which they said their army had not

1:38:09 > 1:38:13raped a single woman and hadn't killed a single civilian and that

1:38:13 > 1:38:18the rules of engagement were scrupulously followed. It is

1:38:18 > 1:38:22absolutely astounding that they can come out and say something like that

1:38:22 > 1:38:27in the face of hundreds and hundreds of documented stories. People

1:38:27 > 1:38:34turning up in Bangladesh, 600,000 of them with burns, some of them with

1:38:34 > 1:38:39bullet wounds, rape victims. And the army can get away with saying this

1:38:39 > 1:38:43and the international community is not calling them out. Clearly they

1:38:43 > 1:38:48are not willing or able to investigate and prosecute the crimes

1:38:48 > 1:38:51that have happened, which we consider to be crimes against

1:38:51 > 1:38:56humanity. Whatever you call what has happened, international crimes have

1:38:56 > 1:39:01been committed. They need to be acted upon. We need an ICC

1:39:01 > 1:39:06investigation but even before then we need an arms embargo on Burma and

1:39:06 > 1:39:10we need individual sanctions to be put in place on those most

1:39:10 > 1:39:15responsible. They shouldn't be able to fly and they should have their

1:39:15 > 1:39:19assets frozen. The United Nations Security Council have not been

1:39:19 > 1:39:28strong enough, must be stronger. Thank you very much, Skye Wheeler,

1:39:28 > 1:39:34and Francis Markus who is on the ground working in refugee camps, and

1:39:34 > 1:39:41Anita Schug, thank you, describing very eloquently what has happened to

1:39:41 > 1:39:49her family in the area of Myanmar where the Rohingyas are fleeing

1:39:49 > 1:39:55from. A couple of comments from you, Joe says shocking amounts of mass

1:39:55 > 1:40:01rape of the Rohingya women. Yes, Myanmar's military crimes are their

1:40:01 > 1:40:09own but their arms suppliers are also responsible. Another comment, a

1:40:09 > 1:40:12question that needs asking, why aren't other Muslim countries and

1:40:12 > 1:40:18communities speaking out against the violence and helping these poor

1:40:18 > 1:40:35people, from Dee. Just before 11 o'clock and the trick -- tick is

1:40:35 > 1:40:37clocking as you know.

1:40:37 > 1:40:39Local councils are increasingly resorting to bailiffs to recover

1:40:39 > 1:40:40money they are owed.

1:40:40 > 1:40:43We'll look at the numbers released by a leading debt charity

1:40:43 > 1:40:44and hear from a victim.

1:40:44 > 1:40:47And the incredible story of a British man who says he punched

1:40:47 > 1:40:50a shark in the face after it injured him in Australia.

1:40:50 > 1:40:52He'll tell us the details.

1:40:52 > 1:40:57Apologies, we are really late to the news.

1:40:57 > 1:41:00Here's Ben.

1:41:00 > 1:41:01This is BBC News - our main stories...

1:41:01 > 1:41:04Inflation the rate of increase in prices for goods and services

1:41:04 > 1:41:06remained unchanged at 3% in October.

1:41:06 > 1:41:08The rate remains at a five-year high with rising food prices offset

1:41:08 > 1:41:11by a fall in the cost of fuel, according to the Office

1:41:11 > 1:41:12for National Statistics.

1:41:12 > 1:41:15MPs will begin debating a key piece of Brexit legislation -

1:41:15 > 1:41:16the EU withdrawal bill.

1:41:16 > 1:41:19It will help turn European laws into UK ones but opponents including

1:41:19 > 1:41:22Tory rebels have tabled scores of amendments.

1:41:22 > 1:41:24Meanwhile, a Parliamentary report is warning a failure to complete

1:41:24 > 1:41:28the introduction of a new customs system by the date of Brexit in 2019

1:41:28 > 1:41:33would be "catastrophic".

1:41:33 > 1:41:35A Tory activist who says she was raped has told this

1:41:35 > 1:41:37programme that she feels disappointed, despite

1:41:37 > 1:41:42receiving a phone call from the Leader of the House.

1:41:42 > 1:41:45Last night Andrea Leadsom called Lisa Wade -

1:41:45 > 1:41:48who's waived her right to anonymity - several months after the incident

1:41:48 > 1:41:49was first reported to her.

1:41:49 > 1:41:53Ms Leadsom said she could not have acted on the report at the time

1:41:53 > 1:41:56because of an ongoing legal case.

1:41:56 > 1:42:00Human Rights Watch says the Burmese security forces have

1:42:00 > 1:42:03committed widespread abuses during what they call a campaign

1:42:03 > 1:42:06of ethnic cleansing against the Rohingya Muslim population.

1:42:06 > 1:42:07The organisation said Government forces have

1:42:07 > 1:42:08committed mass killings, rape, arbitrary

1:42:08 > 1:42:11detention, and arson.

1:42:11 > 1:42:13More than half a million Rohingya have fled a military offensive

1:42:13 > 1:42:16in the north of the country.

1:42:16 > 1:42:19Camps are being set up for tens of thousands of people made homeless

1:42:19 > 1:42:22by the powerful earthquake which struck the mountainous border

1:42:22 > 1:42:24region between Iran and Iraq.

1:42:24 > 1:42:28Iran is observing a day of national mourning for the more than 450

1:42:28 > 1:42:30people who were killed.

1:42:30 > 1:42:35Around 7,000 were injured.

1:42:35 > 1:42:38A man and woman have been arrested on suspicion of murdering a teenager

1:42:38 > 1:42:44who has not been seen for nearly a week.

1:42:44 > 1:42:4819-year-old Gaia Pope, who has severe epilepsy, was last seen

1:42:48 > 1:42:49on the seventh of November.

1:42:49 > 1:42:52Dorset Police say a 19-year-old man and a 71-year-old woman

1:42:52 > 1:42:55were arrested after searches took place at two addresses in Swanage.

1:42:55 > 1:42:57Officers say they were both known to Gaia.

1:42:57 > 1:43:01That's a summary of the latest BBC News.

1:43:01 > 1:43:06Here's some sport now with Katherine Downes.

1:43:06 > 1:43:12For the first time in 60 years Italy will not be at the World Cup. The

1:43:12 > 1:43:15champions lost on aggregate to Sweden. A raft of experienced

1:43:15 > 1:43:19players have retired following the loss and the Italian press have

1:43:19 > 1:43:29described the result as Apocalypse.

1:43:29 > 1:43:32Wales centre Jonathan Davies will miss the Six Nations due to

1:43:32 > 1:43:33a foot injury.

1:43:33 > 1:43:35He needs surgery and that means his domestic season for

1:43:35 > 1:43:37Scarlets may also be over.

1:43:37 > 1:43:40Moeen Ali has recovered from side strain so will play against

1:43:40 > 1:43:42Australia, after getting to know some of the local wildlife.

1:43:42 > 1:43:44Ali was named in the team for the final warm

1:43:44 > 1:43:46up match which starts tomorrow.

1:43:46 > 1:43:52Commonwealth champion Dan Keatings says there

1:43:52 > 1:43:53is a culture of

1:43:53 > 1:43:54fear within British gymnastics after some

1:43:54 > 1:43:55coaches claimed there was

1:43:55 > 1:44:05appalling leadership at the governing body.

1:44:11 > 1:44:12Thank you.

1:44:12 > 1:44:15A British doctor says he escaped a shark by punching it in the face,

1:44:15 > 1:44:18while he was surfing in Australia.

1:44:18 > 1:44:20Charlie Fry, who is 25, said the 6-foot long animal

1:44:20 > 1:44:23"jumped out of the water and hit him in the right shoulder".

1:44:23 > 1:44:27He punched it while in the water - north of Sydney - and then

1:44:27 > 1:44:28climbed back on his board.

1:44:28 > 1:44:31It felt like a hand grabbing me, like shaking me and it was

1:44:31 > 1:44:32just pure adrenalin.

1:44:32 > 1:44:34I genuinely thought I was going to die.

1:44:34 > 1:44:40You are about to be eaten alive by a shark.

1:44:40 > 1:44:44It just went from my shoulder, I got a big thud and then I turned

1:44:44 > 1:44:47to the right and I saw a shark's head come out of the water

1:44:47 > 1:44:49with its teeth and I just punched it in the face.

1:44:49 > 1:44:52The mouth was in one bite doing that up to there.

1:44:52 > 1:44:54But in terms of the size, I would probably put

1:44:54 > 1:45:04it at, I don't know, five, six foot, maybe a bit less.

1:45:06 > 1:45:20Dude! What a dude! Charlie Fry, he is all right, thank goodness.

1:45:20 > 1:45:23Bailiffs were called in to collect debts by councils in England

1:45:23 > 1:45:25and Wales on more than two million occasions last year,

1:45:25 > 1:45:26a charity has discovered.

1:45:26 > 1:45:28The Money Advice Trust says more could be done

1:45:28 > 1:45:31for the vulnerable in debt.

1:45:31 > 1:45:36That speak to someone who was confronted by bailiffs after failing

1:45:36 > 1:45:45to pay a parking fine. Daniel, thanks for talking to us. What

1:45:45 > 1:45:51happened?It was for a parking fine, I was in a virtually empty car park.

1:45:51 > 1:45:57I got back to my car, I thought I'm not paying this, I have not caused a

1:45:57 > 1:46:04hazard or interrupted anybody's rights of access, interrupted the

1:46:04 > 1:46:07flow of commerce and I didn't think it was justified so I thought I

1:46:07 > 1:46:13would see it through to the end. Which meant what?Eventually

1:46:13 > 1:46:18bailiffs were knocking at my door, I was given plenty of notice that they

1:46:18 > 1:46:26were coming round.Why? Because they write to you first?Yes, they give

1:46:26 > 1:46:34you seven days' notice, and I just said look I'm not playing this --

1:46:34 > 1:46:39paying this, I don't feel it's justified.So they knocked at the

1:46:39 > 1:46:49door and did you open it?

1:46:49 > 1:46:53I said one minutes guys and I came in the house and got my camera and

1:46:53 > 1:46:58started filming them and that caused an argument about filming and then I

1:46:58 > 1:47:04told them, I says look, there is no one making a claim against me that I

1:47:04 > 1:47:07have caused them some sort of loss in anyway, I'm not going to be

1:47:07 > 1:47:12paying this and I told them about my other experiences I have with the

1:47:12 > 1:47:17bailiffs before when you just ignore it or don't pay, it goes away. The

1:47:17 > 1:47:21only thing they can really do is clamp your car because the private

1:47:21 > 1:47:28bailiff firms haven't go the power to force entry.OK. I'm going to

1:47:28 > 1:47:32bring in Mike. Daniel says eventually they go away. That's not

1:47:32 > 1:47:37always the case, is it?No, it's not. If you owe money, they are

1:47:37 > 1:47:40powered -- there are powers the bailiffs have and the money research

1:47:40 > 1:47:43trust shows that two-thirds of councils are making more use of

1:47:43 > 1:47:47bailiffs and generally, there is a role for bailiffs, but I don't think

1:47:47 > 1:47:58it is the right way with people who are struggling.What sort of abuses

1:47:58 > 1:48:05are you talking about?At Step Change we carried out of a survey of

1:48:05 > 1:48:10clients and one in six had received a visit from the bailiff and about a

1:48:10 > 1:48:15quarter had tried to settle the bill over the phone, but the bailiff

1:48:15 > 1:48:18insisted on visiting because the bailiff makes money out of visiting

1:48:18 > 1:48:24which is paid by the person in debt. We need a change in the rules how

1:48:24 > 1:48:29bailiffs are paid because they are incentivised to do the wrong thing.

1:48:29 > 1:48:32It is frightening for the kids and embarrassing in front of your

1:48:32 > 1:48:36neighbours so we want to see this industry regulated. I'm never saying

1:48:36 > 1:48:39the bailiffs are never needed, but they should be the last resort, not

1:48:39 > 1:48:43adds it sometimes appears with local authorities, the people who are most

1:48:43 > 1:48:50likely to send the bailiff round, not the banks. It appears too many

1:48:50 > 1:48:54are using as easy first resort.That must be costing them money?No, it

1:48:54 > 1:48:59is costing the person in debt money because it is the people in debt who

1:48:59 > 1:49:02have have to pay the fees for the bailiffs so it gets added to the

1:49:02 > 1:49:07debt. It puts them further in difficulties.And that's maybe one

1:49:07 > 1:49:12explanation why the councils are using them more?I think banks are

1:49:12 > 1:49:17smarter about collecting debts. They come and talk to you and arrange an

1:49:17 > 1:49:21affordable repayment plan and they get more money back than local

1:49:21 > 1:49:26authorities. The local authorities aren't doing us council tax payers

1:49:26 > 1:49:30any favours by using bailiffs. They need to be much smarter about

1:49:30 > 1:49:37helping people in the can't pay territory.

1:49:37 > 1:49:44We've received a statement from the Local Government Association,

1:49:44 > 1:49:46It says, "No council wants to ask low income

1:49:46 > 1:49:47people for more money.

1:49:47 > 1:49:48However, councils have a duty

1:49:48 > 1:49:50to their residents to collect taxes these fund crucial services,

1:49:50 > 1:49:53such as caring for the elderly, protecting vulnerable children,

1:49:53 > 1:49:54keeping roads maintained and collecting bins.

1:49:54 > 1:49:57The statement went on to say with councils facing a £5.8 billion

1:49:57 > 1:49:59funding shortfall by 2020, it's essential that these

1:49:59 > 1:50:00funds are collected".

1:50:00 > 1:50:03That's fair enough, isn't it Daniel? I would like to make a point. I

1:50:03 > 1:50:08think after 12 months from when the council apply for the County Court

1:50:08 > 1:50:11judgment, it becomes null and void or it did when I was fighting

1:50:11 > 1:50:15parking tickets. After 12 months it becomes null and void and then they

1:50:15 > 1:50:20have to apply for another one and in my experience they have never

1:50:20 > 1:50:27renewed the CCJ afterwards. For parking fines it gets to £450 or

1:50:27 > 1:50:34£500 and then they stop calling. They make two visits face-to-face

1:50:34 > 1:50:39visits the bailiffs. That's been my experience.OK.I would urge people

1:50:39 > 1:50:44not to follow that example. You must not ignore the bill because it gets

1:50:44 > 1:50:50worse and worse. Yes, we want councils to collect the money that's

1:50:50 > 1:50:54owing to them. You get more money back if you negotiate and talk with

1:50:54 > 1:50:57people. Sending the bailiffs round does not bring in the money.All

1:50:57 > 1:51:01right, I will leave it there, thank you.

1:51:01 > 1:51:07Mike and Daniel who had a number of parking tickets as you heard.

1:51:07 > 1:51:10An alleged rape victim who reported the attack to the Commons

1:51:10 > 1:51:14authorities tells us exclusively she feels "disappointed"

1:51:14 > 1:51:17after receiving a phone call from the Leader of the House,

1:51:17 > 1:51:21Andrea Leadsom, last night.

1:51:21 > 1:51:24Lisa Wade, a Tory activist who's now waived her right to anonymity,

1:51:24 > 1:51:26says she only believes she was called at all

1:51:26 > 1:51:29as a result of us breaking the story and that she got

1:51:29 > 1:51:30a "politician's answers".

1:51:30 > 1:51:33Last week we revealed the woman, who at that stage we were calling

1:51:33 > 1:51:36"Amanda" went to the Commons Clerk several months ago to complain about

1:51:36 > 1:51:38the "toxic" culture of Westminster.

1:51:38 > 1:51:40She said she felt it contributed to her alleged rape outside

1:51:40 > 1:51:47of Parliament by a man who worked for a Tory MP.

1:51:47 > 1:51:50The clerk reported those concerns and the attack to Andrea Leadsom,

1:51:50 > 1:51:52who didn't contact Ms Wade until our coverage

1:51:52 > 1:51:53on this programme.

1:51:53 > 1:51:55The man Lisa Wade accused of rape strongly denied the allegation

1:51:55 > 1:51:58and the case was eventually dropped after a review of the evidence.

1:51:58 > 1:52:01Here Ms Wade tells us about the phone call

1:52:01 > 1:52:05from Andrea Leadsom.

1:52:05 > 1:52:10She really wanted to change things in Westminster so that the behaviour

1:52:10 > 1:52:18that I had witnessed could no longer occur. She wanted to take action by

1:52:18 > 1:52:21creating an independent grievance body for activists and workers in

1:52:21 > 1:52:29the future to go to. It was what I expected her to say really. Nothing

1:52:29 > 1:52:33more, nothing less.What do you think about the length of time it

1:52:33 > 1:52:38has taken the Leader of the House of Commons, Andrea Leadsom to contact

1:52:38 > 1:52:41you when you initially reported this back in August?

1:52:41 > 1:52:46I think it was far too long, but the Conservative Party certainly have a

1:52:46 > 1:52:50history of taking time to act on complaints made to them. So I wasn't

1:52:50 > 1:52:53surprised by the amount of time that it took, however I was disappointed

1:52:53 > 1:52:58by it because at the time I made the complaint I was expecting for, you

1:52:58 > 1:53:03know, to go to a court case, to go and see my attacker brought to

1:53:03 > 1:53:07trial. And I would have thought that when a case reaches that stage it

1:53:07 > 1:53:13should be fairly obvious that the allegation is incredibly serious and

1:53:13 > 1:53:17that it's, you know, if it's passed the police threshold test, that it's

1:53:17 > 1:53:21credible. I expected her to apologise and I appreciate that she

1:53:21 > 1:53:30did so, but at the end of the day, I don't know what, you know, ideally I

1:53:30 > 1:53:35would have appreciated some reassurance that it wouldn't happen

1:53:35 > 1:53:40again. That women such as myself don't ever get put in that position

1:53:40 > 1:53:45again and I think that's always been my objective.How can any politician

1:53:45 > 1:53:50make sure that that happens?For one, listening, these allegations,

1:53:50 > 1:53:54it is not just me, they have been around for years regarding staffers

1:53:54 > 1:54:00and MPs etcetera. It's, up until, you know, relatively recently you

1:54:00 > 1:54:06couldn't speak out and you would get verbally and reputationly abused for

1:54:06 > 1:54:11doing so.Are they listening now?I don't know. I don't know.But you

1:54:11 > 1:54:15are still not sure that they are taking this seriously?No. No. I

1:54:15 > 1:54:21think in the absence of an independent ombudsman or similar,

1:54:21 > 1:54:26it's very difficult to sort of take that complaint process away from the

1:54:26 > 1:54:30individual parties and away interest those who are concerned about

1:54:30 > 1:54:35protecting reputations.Do you think you would have received a call at

1:54:35 > 1:54:39all from Andrea Leadsom if it wasn't for our intrir with you on this

1:54:39 > 1:54:45programme last week?No. No, I don't think so. In my experience,

1:54:45 > 1:54:49particularly with the issues that came out in 2015, it is only when

1:54:49 > 1:54:53the media draws attention to the nature of the concerns and applies

1:54:53 > 1:54:59due pressure on to them, that they start to respond and I think that

1:54:59 > 1:55:03response is, it's not the right kind of response. They should be

1:55:03 > 1:55:05responding out of a genuine concern rather than the concern for bad

1:55:05 > 1:55:09press. We first reported your story last

1:55:09 > 1:55:14week. Initially, Andrea Leadsom's office denied they had been told

1:55:14 > 1:55:18about your alleged rape which happened away from the Parliamentary

1:55:18 > 1:55:22estate. Later that day, they admitted she had been told, but said

1:55:22 > 1:55:26because of a police case was under way, there was nothing they could

1:55:26 > 1:55:28do. What do you think about the statement changing like that?

1:55:28 > 1:55:34Covering their backs. You know, I think had it been necessary

1:55:34 > 1:55:41significant evidence to, you know, perform the FOI request to show she

1:55:41 > 1:55:46was told. I think it was concern that that would come out through

1:55:46 > 1:55:52other means if it wasn't changed. How do you think generally they've

1:55:52 > 1:56:02handled your complaint to them?I respect the fact that as I say

1:56:02 > 1:56:10politicians don't feel they are gaining, but they have a duty to

1:56:10 > 1:56:15take care when it involves individuals who work within

1:56:15 > 1:56:18Parliament and particularly in youth groups and young people.You don't

1:56:18 > 1:56:23think that's happened in your case? No.How would you describe that?I

1:56:23 > 1:56:28think, you know, there have been a number of allegations of rape and

1:56:28 > 1:56:32serious sexual assaults in and around Parliament. And I certainly

1:56:32 > 1:56:39think that because my complaint and my case didn't attract the media

1:56:39 > 1:56:43attention in that it occurred off the estate and it occurred in my own

1:56:43 > 1:56:48home I think that was used an an excuse to reject responsibility for

1:56:48 > 1:56:53anything to do with it. And you know, if I had of been given a

1:56:53 > 1:56:56proper chance to explain why I thought it was so important that

1:56:56 > 1:57:01they knew about this and were able to act accordingly I think they

1:57:01 > 1:57:05would have realised, you know, it was very much part and parcel of

1:57:05 > 1:57:09that environment.Daisy Goodwin revealed that a government official

1:57:09 > 1:57:13touched her breast when she went for a meeting, she says, inside Number

1:57:13 > 1:57:19Ten. How do you react to that?I'm not surprised.

1:57:19 > 1:57:23I've had, you know, I have been groped in bars in Westminster.

1:57:23 > 1:57:26This is in Number Ten, a government official, she says?It's that

1:57:26 > 1:57:33environment again. It's not the location. It's the bubble. It's a

1:57:33 > 1:57:37culture of permissiveness, it's just nobody objects. Therefore, they

1:57:37 > 1:57:41think they can get away with what they like and it is very much women

1:57:41 > 1:57:45are very much sort of particularly when they're young and they're not

1:57:45 > 1:57:49necessarily as politically savvy as others or they're from outside, you

1:57:49 > 1:57:53know, young students who have not been, you know, involved in politics

1:57:53 > 1:57:57for very long and they don't know how things are. They don't have the

1:57:57 > 1:58:00self-confidence to say, hang on, no, this isn't right. And I think you

1:58:00 > 1:58:06know they take advantage of the fact that people are new and they are

1:58:06 > 1:58:11not, they're scared, you know. If somebody attacked me in Number Ten I

1:58:11 > 1:58:15would probably do much the same as she did. I wouldn't necessarily have

1:58:15 > 1:58:18complained and I think, that's very much the same in other circles as

1:58:18 > 1:58:22well. People don't feel they can complain because it's just

1:58:22 > 1:58:27normalised. I'm sure the gentleman that attacked her didn't show any

1:58:27 > 1:58:32concern for her reaction or similar. Lisa Wade.

1:58:32 > 1:58:36Andrea Leadsom's office chose not to comment on the phone call and the

1:58:36 > 1:58:42man Lisa Wade accused denies the allegation.

1:58:42 > 1:58:46On the programme tomorrow - we go behind the scenes of the type

1:58:46 > 1:58:48of rap videos that are accused of glorifying knife crime.

1:58:48 > 1:58:52Thank you very much for watching today. See you tomorrow.