21/02/2018

0:00:09 > 0:00:09Hello.

0:00:09 > 0:00:10It's Wednesday, it's 9 o'clock.

0:00:10 > 0:00:11I'm Victoria Derbyshire.

0:00:11 > 0:00:12Welcome to the programme.

0:00:12 > 0:00:13Our top story today...

0:00:13 > 0:00:16The United Nations in Syria says it's deeply worried for hundreds

0:00:16 > 0:00:18of thousands of people trapped under a mounting government bombardment

0:00:18 > 0:00:28of the rebel-held enclave of Eastern Ghouta.

0:00:35 > 0:00:46We can hear the shouts and crying of women. And children.

0:00:46 > 0:00:51We'll hear more from people stuck on the ground.

0:00:52 > 0:01:04The Supreme Court will rule about John Worboys. We have been speaking

0:01:04 > 0:01:05exclusively to

0:01:05 > 0:01:10one of the victims.I am not worried about what he will do to me that I

0:01:10 > 0:01:15don't want to go back to 2003 and be watching the news again waiting for

0:01:15 > 0:01:20him to reoffend. I know he will reoffend full I don't want to be in

0:01:20 > 0:01:25that position where I will say, I was right because he will absolutely

0:01:25 > 0:01:27do it again.

0:01:27 > 0:01:32That full exclusive interview in the next 15 minutes.

0:01:32 > 0:01:37Security experts are warning the Government needs to tackle the

0:01:37 > 0:01:41misuse of artificial intelligence. They will tell us exactly what they

0:01:41 > 0:01:46think that risk is and we will introduce you to the robot who is

0:01:46 > 0:01:51designed to mimic facial expressions in order to teach autistic children

0:01:51 > 0:02:01about emotions.

0:02:01 > 0:02:03Hello.

0:02:03 > 0:02:04Welcome to the programme.

0:02:04 > 0:02:05We're live until 11 this morning.

0:02:05 > 0:02:07Throughout the morning, the latest breaking news

0:02:07 > 0:02:09and developing stories.

0:02:09 > 0:02:11A little later we'll hear about the devastating impact

0:02:11 > 0:02:12endometreosis has on women

0:02:12 > 0:02:15and hear claims that the NHS is failing in their care.

0:02:15 > 0:02:23If you have endometrosis, tell us your experience.

0:02:23 > 0:02:26Use the hashtag Victoria LIVE and, if you text, you will be charged

0:02:26 > 0:02:31at the standard network rate.

0:02:31 > 0:02:40Our top story. The bombardment of rebel-held eastern Ghouta has

0:02:40 > 0:02:47continued for a third day. There are warnings of a second Aleppo. Reports

0:02:47 > 0:02:52that 250 people have died following two days of attacks. According to

0:02:52 > 0:02:58activists it is the worst violence since 2013. Our middle east editor

0:02:58 > 0:03:08reports.

0:03:09 > 0:03:14This could be the beginning of the end of the rebellion.

0:03:14 > 0:03:16Smaller, rebel-held enclaves around Damascus

0:03:16 > 0:03:18have been starved and bombed into submission.

0:03:18 > 0:03:21Activists in eastern Ghouta say this is as bad as it has been.

0:03:21 > 0:03:24We can hear women and children crying through

0:03:24 > 0:03:34windows of their homes.

0:03:34 > 0:03:41The missiles and mortars dropping on us like rain.

0:03:41 > 0:03:44There is nowhere to hide from this nightmare in easter Ghouta.

0:03:44 > 0:03:46They have set up a network of underground hospitals.

0:03:46 > 0:03:49This girl, named in Arabic Angel, escaped the worst but will have

0:03:49 > 0:03:52to go back to the streets to get home.

0:03:52 > 0:03:59And this is her area.

0:03:59 > 0:04:09With the regime plane dropping what appears to be a barrel bomb.

0:04:09 > 0:04:10Unguided, an indiscriminate killer.

0:04:10 > 0:04:12The Syrian regime denies attacking civilians.

0:04:12 > 0:04:19It says it is trying to liberate eastern Ghouta from terrorists.

0:04:19 > 0:04:21How many times in the last seven years have Syrians dug

0:04:21 > 0:04:25through the rubble for survivors?

0:04:25 > 0:04:29There is talk of safe corridors out for civilians but,

0:04:29 > 0:04:32based on past form, the regime wants victory in eastern Ghouta

0:04:32 > 0:04:40and the surrender of the rebels.

0:04:40 > 0:04:46Let's talk to our BBC Arabic reporter, who is here. Presumably

0:04:46 > 0:04:54the authorities and aid agencies are expecting the civilian casualties to

0:04:54 > 0:05:02continue to rise.Yes. It is practically enclaves and pockets of

0:05:02 > 0:05:07high density, civilian population. It seems like the ones launching

0:05:07 > 0:05:12this attack has not taken into consideration any thing to basically

0:05:12 > 0:05:17minimise at least the number of civilian casualties. We know the

0:05:17 > 0:05:26gunman, they are basically civilians and live among civilians. It is not

0:05:26 > 0:05:31a way to do this was of your risking the lives of hundreds and thousands

0:05:31 > 0:05:35of people. That is why we believe the number will be huge if the

0:05:35 > 0:05:42Russians attempt a similar scenario in Ghouta as we saw in Aleppo over a

0:05:42 > 0:05:46year ago full it is completely out of proportion, the firepower the

0:05:46 > 0:05:51Russians are exerting on those pockets and enclaves. It is amazing

0:05:51 > 0:05:55and horrible. As if you are watching a movie on the back of the

0:05:55 > 0:05:59soundtrack. You hear people in panic, screaming for help. There is

0:05:59 > 0:06:09no help. Their attacks, you name it. The last 48 hours or few days, they

0:06:09 > 0:06:16have been days from hell for the population of East Ghouta.Thank you

0:06:16 > 0:06:20very much. Thank you for talking to us will stop

0:06:20 > 0:06:22Annita is in the BBC Newsroom with a summary

0:06:22 > 0:06:24of the rest of the day's news.

0:06:24 > 0:06:27The Supreme Court is due to rule on whether the Metropolitan

0:06:27 > 0:06:30Police failed two victims of the black cab rapist, John Worboys.

0:06:30 > 0:06:31The women claim that the failure to properly investigate

0:06:31 > 0:06:34their allegations amounted to inhuman and degrading treatment -

0:06:34 > 0:06:38a claim the police deny.

0:06:38 > 0:06:43Here's our legal correspondent, Clive Coleman.

0:06:43 > 0:06:47The two women were sexually assaulted by John Worboys in 2003

0:06:47 > 0:06:50and 2007, but when they reported the attacks to the police

0:06:50 > 0:06:53they weren't believed.

0:06:53 > 0:06:56As a result of the police failures, Worboys was able to continue

0:06:56 > 0:07:02to attack women until he was brought to justice in 2009.

0:07:02 > 0:07:05The High Court and Court of Appeal ruled the police had a duty under

0:07:05 > 0:07:09the Human Rights Act to investigate serious violence against women

0:07:09 > 0:07:12and could be held accountable in the courts if they

0:07:12 > 0:07:15failed in that duty.

0:07:15 > 0:07:17The women, who both suffered psychologically, were awarded

0:07:17 > 0:07:24£41,000 in total, which they'll keep in any event.

0:07:24 > 0:07:28But the Met supported the then Home Secretary Theresa May's

0:07:28 > 0:07:31appeal to the Supreme Court, arguing its duty was fulfilled

0:07:31 > 0:07:39simply by having practices and procedures to investigate in place.

0:07:39 > 0:07:41A victory for the women would be police forces could face human

0:07:41 > 0:07:45rights actions whenever they fail to properly investigate

0:07:45 > 0:07:55serious violent crime.

0:07:55 > 0:07:58and we will be speaking exclusively to one of the women involved in the

0:07:58 > 0:07:59case

0:07:59 > 0:08:04in a few minutes' time. It has emerged that a former chief

0:08:04 > 0:08:11Executive of Save the Children faced inappropriate behaviour complaints

0:08:11 > 0:08:16before leaving the charity. He was accused of sending inappropriate

0:08:16 > 0:08:21text and commenting on what young female staff were wearing. He said

0:08:21 > 0:08:25he apologised to the workers. It comes as Oxfam and Save the Children

0:08:25 > 0:08:33have been separate quizzed about sexual misconduct for workers.

0:08:33 > 0:08:37Brexit supporting MPs have written to the Prime Minister stating what

0:08:37 > 0:08:42they consider it should be achieved out of a deal with Brussels. They

0:08:42 > 0:08:46insist Britain should be free to negotiate deals with other countries

0:08:46 > 0:08:50as soon as it leaves the EU. Let's talk about this with Norman

0:08:50 > 0:08:56Smith at Westminster. Good morning to you. Tell us about the detail and

0:08:56 > 0:09:03the reaction.This letter has been sent as a clear warning ahead of the

0:09:03 > 0:09:09crucial meeting tomorrow when she will try to end the splits in the P

0:09:09 > 0:09:13net over Brexit and reach a final agreement. The letter is written in

0:09:13 > 0:09:21consider tree language and the signatories express support for Mrs

0:09:21 > 0:09:25May and be approachable Brexit. They list what they call six suggestions,

0:09:25 > 0:09:32things like not taking on any new EU rules during the so-called

0:09:32 > 0:09:37transition period, that we should be free to negotiate & our own trade

0:09:37 > 0:09:42deals, and they also suggest that Mrs May should go into these

0:09:42 > 0:09:46negotiations as an equal partner and should not accept the EU timeline

0:09:46 > 0:09:53and their mandate, and get the sense they are trying to make sure that

0:09:53 > 0:09:57Mrs May does not backslide on their preferred approach to Brexit. It has

0:09:57 > 0:10:03already provoked over backlash from Tory Brexit critics who described

0:10:03 > 0:10:08the signatories to this letter as ideological obsessives. As for

0:10:08 > 0:10:12Downing Street, they have said they welcome contributions from all

0:10:12 > 0:10:18sections of the party.Thank you very much.

0:10:18 > 0:10:19The majority of small and medium-sized companies

0:10:19 > 0:10:22are still paying male employees more than their female colleagues,

0:10:22 > 0:10:23according to the latest government figures.

0:10:23 > 0:10:26Just 15% of businesses have a higher wage bill for women.

0:10:26 > 0:10:29Companies have six weeks left to report their gender pay gap.

0:10:29 > 0:10:30So far almost 1,000 businesses have responded

0:10:30 > 0:10:39out of the 9,000 asked.

0:10:39 > 0:10:43Security experts have warned of the risk of artificial intelligence

0:10:43 > 0:10:49being exploited by rogue states were criminals and terrorists. The report

0:10:49 > 0:10:54warns of scenarios like drones using face recognition to attack

0:10:54 > 0:10:57individuals and hackers manipulating autonomous cars. The authors say

0:10:57 > 0:11:01designers need to do more to prevent possible misuse

0:11:01 > 0:11:06of the technology. The Brit Awards take place this evening at London's

0:11:06 > 0:11:20O2 Arena. Dua Lipa has the highest number of nominations ever given to

0:11:20 > 0:11:25a female artist. She is heading towards 200,000 sales with her self

0:11:25 > 0:11:28titled debut album.

0:11:28 > 0:11:30That's a summary of the latest BBC News.

0:11:30 > 0:11:36More at 9:30am.

0:11:36 > 0:11:45We will bring you an exclusive interview where buy a woman raped by

0:11:45 > 0:11:49John Worboys she'll be arguing the Metropolitan Police failed her

0:11:49 > 0:11:53because they did not investigate her case properly. She went to the

0:11:53 > 0:12:08police back in 2003. In fact, John ten -- John Worboys drove her then.

0:12:08 > 0:12:13Do get in touch with us throughout the morning.

0:12:13 > 0:12:14Let's get some sport with Hugh.

0:12:14 > 0:12:16Hugh, we start in South Korea.

0:12:16 > 0:12:18We always get entranced by the curling competition

0:12:18 > 0:12:23and there's some good news for Team GB.

0:12:23 > 0:12:29Yes, good morning. Some very good news for Team GB. The tournament

0:12:29 > 0:12:33lasts virtually the entire winter Olympics. The final round matches

0:12:33 > 0:12:38work today and victory for Team GB. The very good one indeed over the

0:12:38 > 0:12:41defending champions Canada means they have reached the semifinals.

0:12:41 > 0:12:46They were trailing by a couple of points going into the final few

0:12:46 > 0:12:52ends. They secured two points on the final end to snatch a 6-5 victory.

0:12:52 > 0:12:56It knocks the defending champions out of the competition, so we could

0:12:56 > 0:13:05be looking at a potential medal on the way for Eve Muirhead and the

0:13:05 > 0:13:08team.A very good win for them and their plans. Delighted. We knew it

0:13:08 > 0:13:12would be a really tough game against Canada. To book our spot in the

0:13:12 > 0:13:16semifinal, it is our first goal and we are delighted with that.How

0:13:16 > 0:13:20about the jump in the air question we saw you leaving the eyes.I

0:13:20 > 0:13:25cannot actually remember it. You are in that zone quickly forget about

0:13:25 > 0:13:31the small things. I am glad I learned safe on my feet.No laughing

0:13:31 > 0:13:36matter for the Team GB men. Unfortunately they were beaten,

0:13:36 > 0:13:40crashed 10-4 in the game against the United States. That means the

0:13:40 > 0:13:44captain and his team will have a play-off to see if they can reach

0:13:44 > 0:13:47the final four. That would be against Switzerland just after

0:13:47 > 0:13:49midnight.

0:13:49 > 0:13:52From the ice, to the snow.

0:13:52 > 0:13:55Billy Morgan must get a mention - it's the first time the Big Air

0:13:55 > 0:13:59competition has been held, and he is into the final -

0:13:59 > 0:14:00scoring 87.5 and then 90.5 on his second run.

0:14:00 > 0:14:04Seven points off the top score.

0:14:04 > 0:14:14He'll have to push his tricks a bit further.

0:14:17 > 0:14:28That final will be in the early hours of Saturday morning. And

0:14:28 > 0:14:30Lionel Messi finally got his header against Chelsea last night?Yes, he

0:14:30 > 0:14:34did.

0:14:34 > 0:14:36The five-time Ballon D'Or winner hadn't scored in nine

0:14:36 > 0:14:38Champions League games against Chelsea, but all of that

0:14:38 > 0:14:41changed in an intriguing last 16 first leg tie at Stamford Bridge.

0:14:41 > 0:14:44Messi and his teammates are top of the Spanish top division

0:14:44 > 0:14:45and largely controlled things.

0:14:45 > 0:14:48But the clearest chances on the night went to Chelsea -

0:14:48 > 0:14:50Willian had hit the post twice before making it third time lucky.

0:14:50 > 0:15:00But you can't give Messi this sort of opportunity -

0:15:01 > 0:15:02a misplaced pass allowing

0:15:02 > 0:15:03Andres Iniesta to play in the Argentine forward

0:15:03 > 0:15:05for a crucial away goal.

0:15:05 > 0:15:11The match ending 1-1.

0:15:11 > 0:15:13Despite having just 27% possession on the night -

0:15:13 > 0:15:15Chelsea boss Antonio Conte said it was almost "the perfect

0:15:15 > 0:15:17performance" and that they'll "try to do something incredible"

0:15:17 > 0:15:21by knocking out the Spanish giants in a few weeks at the Nou Camp.

0:15:21 > 0:15:25When two women were raped by the same man four years apart,

0:15:25 > 0:15:28the police didn't believe either of their stories.

0:15:28 > 0:15:34That man was John Worboys, the black cab rapist,

0:15:34 > 0:15:36who was later convicted on 19 charges, including rape

0:15:36 > 0:15:38and sexual assault.

0:15:38 > 0:15:42Police now believe he may have attacked over 100 people.

0:15:42 > 0:15:46This morning, the Supreme Court will rule on whether

0:15:46 > 0:15:49the Metropolitan Police is liable to those two victims

0:15:49 > 0:15:53because it failed to properly investigate their allegations.

0:15:53 > 0:15:59The two women were assaulted by Worboys in 2003 and 2007.

0:15:59 > 0:16:02As a result of the police failures, Worboys was able to continue

0:16:02 > 0:16:07to attack women until he was brought to justice in 2009.

0:16:07 > 0:16:12Two courts have already ruled in their favour,

0:16:12 > 0:16:15but the Metropolitan Police, backed by the Home

0:16:15 > 0:16:20Office, have appealed.

0:16:20 > 0:16:22A victory for the women today would mean police

0:16:22 > 0:16:23forces could face human

0:16:23 > 0:16:25rights actions whenever they fail to properly investigate

0:16:25 > 0:16:27serious violent crime.

0:16:27 > 0:16:30In a moment, we'll speak exclusively to one of those

0:16:30 > 0:16:33women and her solicitor - the conversation as you'd expect

0:16:33 > 0:16:36is graphic and frank in places, and you nay not want young

0:16:36 > 0:16:39children to watch.

0:16:39 > 0:16:44children to watch or listen.

0:16:44 > 0:16:47But first here's a look at why today's ruling is important -

0:16:47 > 0:16:50there are some flashing images coming up.

0:16:50 > 0:16:54He is one of Britain's worst serial sex attacker is. He has been found

0:16:54 > 0:17:01guilty of 19 offences against 12 women. -- attackers. But police say

0:17:01 > 0:17:05the number of women he attacked me run into the hundreds. His name is

0:17:05 > 0:17:10John Worboys. He would drive around London in his black late at night

0:17:10 > 0:17:14aching up winning. He would tell them lies about winning the lottery

0:17:14 > 0:17:20so that he had a reason to offer champagne. -- picking up women. He

0:17:20 > 0:17:25would then drug and sexually assault them. Occurs of the sedatives he

0:17:25 > 0:17:28used, many of the victims would have had no recollection of what

0:17:28 > 0:17:35happened. He was caught and jailed in 2009 but a parole board decided

0:17:35 > 0:17:39he could be eligible for release last month. It caused outrage, with

0:17:39 > 0:17:43many victims finding about his impending release in the press.The

0:17:43 > 0:17:48growing criticism of the Parole Board's decision to release serial

0:17:48 > 0:17:54sex attacker John Worboys...A few years previously two victims of John

0:17:54 > 0:17:57Worboys won a case against the Metropolitan Police about the way

0:17:57 > 0:18:04they investigated the case. The two women said that when they reported

0:18:04 > 0:18:11the case to the police in 2003 and 2007, officers did not believe them

0:18:11 > 0:18:15and so did not investigate properly. The Metropolitan Police had several

0:18:15 > 0:18:19opportunities to apprehend and stop him and didn't. In one case he was

0:18:19 > 0:18:22so confident of getting away with his crimes that he actually drove

0:18:22 > 0:18:26his victim to the police station and dropped her off there. Officers took

0:18:26 > 0:18:30neither his name nor his rigid racial details.The two women

0:18:30 > 0:18:35brought their case against the police. A Court of Appeal upheld the

0:18:35 > 0:18:39verdict but the Met has taken the case to the Supreme Court. The

0:18:39 > 0:18:42result will be important in deciding weather the police can be held to

0:18:42 > 0:18:53account for breaching victims' rights.

0:18:55 > 0:18:59And we can exclusively speak to one of those women you just heard about,

0:18:59 > 0:19:01who was driven to a police station by John Worboys after

0:19:01 > 0:19:02he'd attacked her.

0:19:02 > 0:19:08We are going to call her Fiona this morning -

0:19:08 > 0:19:10not her real name - and she's joined by her

0:19:10 > 0:19:14solicitor Harriet Wistritch.

0:19:14 > 0:19:19Thank you for talking to us. How did you come into contact with Worboys?

0:19:19 > 0:19:22In 2003I was out with some friends are celebrating a friend's birthday

0:19:22 > 0:19:27party. After the night out, I was with some groups of friends who

0:19:27 > 0:19:42hailed a cab for me. I got into the. -- in to the cab. There was nothing

0:19:42 > 0:19:46which made me feel uncomfortable or threatened by his manner, he was

0:19:46 > 0:19:49just a chatty, talking about the night out, asking where I lived, did

0:19:49 > 0:19:53I live on my own, asking about my family. I was expecting to him it

0:19:53 > 0:19:58was my friend's birthday party. And I had just had a baby so that was

0:19:58 > 0:20:01the first night out since having the baby, who was with my partner that

0:20:01 > 0:20:07night. And then he offered me a drink.What kind of a drink?Well,

0:20:07 > 0:20:12it was just... It was just a really... I Remoaner taking a sip

0:20:12 > 0:20:15out of it, it was a really strong orange liqueur, it wasn't very nice

0:20:15 > 0:20:19at all. I didn't particularly want it because at that point of the

0:20:19 > 0:20:23night I was going home because I had to be up early in the morning and I

0:20:23 > 0:20:26really didn't want to drink any more, I had stopped drinking some

0:20:26 > 0:20:32time before. And we went over a speed bump and I did spill

0:20:32 > 0:20:35practically all the drink over myself, apologised but he pulled me

0:20:35 > 0:20:38another one. And I really can't explain why I drank the drink but I

0:20:38 > 0:20:41think it was just one of those situations where you just feel, just

0:20:41 > 0:20:47print it. It's just a drink, it will be fine, he can take me home. --

0:20:47 > 0:20:51just drink it. And then there was some conversation about him is

0:20:51 > 0:20:56stopping for a cigarette or something. And did I want to have a

0:20:56 > 0:21:00cigarette? I might even have asked him, is it OK if I smoked ham and

0:21:00 > 0:21:06because I think in 2003 we did smoke in. And he pulled over and I

0:21:06 > 0:21:12remember him getting into the back of the cab with me. And I remember

0:21:12 > 0:21:16him putting his... I think he went to put his arm around me and I just

0:21:16 > 0:21:21remember, before I blacked out, just saying he was nice. Which are sort

0:21:21 > 0:21:24of creep me out a little bit because I just wondered if I had somehow

0:21:24 > 0:21:28encouraged him by saying that. I think I was just meaning, you're a

0:21:28 > 0:21:31nice guy because you've just given me a cigarette or something. It

0:21:31 > 0:21:37wasn't intended to be anything other than that. And the next memory I

0:21:37 > 0:21:43have is waking up in hospital. That's when you woke up and thought,

0:21:43 > 0:21:53what on earth happened?Yeah. I woke up and I was very confused, very

0:21:53 > 0:21:57disorientated and I had a drip in my almond I pulled the drip out and

0:21:57 > 0:22:03went to the toilet. I think I was having a bit of a meltdown. Looking

0:22:03 > 0:22:07back on it it was a bit embarrassing because I think I was running around

0:22:07 > 0:22:11shouting at the nurses, I don't know where I am, where am I? They didn't

0:22:11 > 0:22:15realise what I meant and they kept saying, you're in hospital. I was

0:22:15 > 0:22:19like I know I am in hospital but where? I didn't know which hospital

0:22:19 > 0:22:22I was in and I was really upset because I should have been home

0:22:22 > 0:22:26looking after my baby.Did you know you'd been raped?As soon as I sat

0:22:26 > 0:22:30on the toilet I knew I had been raped. I was a little bit sore

0:22:30 > 0:22:37and... And when I went to the toilet the tampon that I was wearing fell

0:22:37 > 0:22:43out, and I knew instantly because of the way I was. The nurse was trying

0:22:43 > 0:22:48to calm me down and I kept saying, I need... I need to speak to the

0:22:48 > 0:22:51police, I've been raped. And I do remember one of the nurses saying,

0:22:51 > 0:22:55it's fine, come and sit down, the police are on their way. I don't

0:22:55 > 0:23:00know to this day where she got this from, how she knew.But what you

0:23:00 > 0:23:03learned subsequently was that actually Worboys had driven you to a

0:23:03 > 0:23:11police nation after he had raped you.Yes.And when you arrived at

0:23:11 > 0:23:15the police station, according to to what has been heard in court

0:23:15 > 0:23:17previously, you were incapacitated, you were disorientated, you were

0:23:17 > 0:23:26vomiting. How did the police treat you?Well, they assumed that I was

0:23:26 > 0:23:32just some drunk that night. .And did they take his details?Well,

0:23:32 > 0:23:36this is the thing, I was given three different stories of what happened

0:23:36 > 0:23:41that night by the police. And that was all within the space of a couple

0:23:41 > 0:23:44of hours. First of all I was told they had his details, because when

0:23:44 > 0:23:50the police came to the hospital, I told them what had happened to me.

0:23:50 > 0:23:56And I think they told me that he taken me to the police station. And

0:23:56 > 0:24:01I said, well, did you get his details? They went, yes, of course,

0:24:01 > 0:24:05we've got his details, and I was relieved. Because I knew it was him.

0:24:05 > 0:24:09And they assured me they had all of his details, his name, cab number,

0:24:09 > 0:24:14everything. And then a little bit later, I was told that he had given

0:24:14 > 0:24:22false details, so I was... Well, that proves that he had something to

0:24:22 > 0:24:27hide, then. And then quite quickly after that it turned out that they

0:24:27 > 0:24:34had no details for him, nobody had bothered to ask, because hit told

0:24:34 > 0:24:39them that I was in that state when he had picked me up. Although I was

0:24:39 > 0:24:45told afterwards by the other person that had encouraged... That he was

0:24:45 > 0:24:50arguing with Worboys in front of the police, saying, that lady isn't just

0:24:50 > 0:24:55drunk, it's clear she's not just drunk, and a black cab driver does

0:24:55 > 0:24:58not pick up fares in that state. What do you think of the fact that

0:24:58 > 0:25:06after he attacked you in the back of his cab, he then had the arrogance,

0:25:06 > 0:25:09audacity, to take you to a police station?I don't think that was ever

0:25:09 > 0:25:12his choice of. I think that was because he took me to the wrong

0:25:12 > 0:25:20address, and the involvement of that other person. I think Howard... I do

0:25:20 > 0:25:23believe that had that other person not been in the property, I would

0:25:23 > 0:25:27have been dumped near the property in the alleyway at the back, because

0:25:27 > 0:25:34I don't think he ever would have taken me to the police station.Had

0:25:34 > 0:25:41the police taking his details, they might have realised... The way the

0:25:41 > 0:25:44police handled your complaint, you've already said they treated you

0:25:44 > 0:25:54as a drunk that night - after that? Well, I thought, when I was taken to

0:25:54 > 0:25:58Telford, it seemed to be ticking all the right boxes and I felt that

0:25:58 > 0:26:06things were being dealt with as they should be. -- Ilford. But when I

0:26:06 > 0:26:09came home from two big that afternoon, after being examined,

0:26:09 > 0:26:14which is actually quite a stressful situation, it is not a nice thing to

0:26:14 > 0:26:20have to happen to you, to be dropped off and left with a baby while they

0:26:20 > 0:26:26take your partner into the police station for, just to give a

0:26:26 > 0:26:31statement, and he's gone for two hours and you're left, still

0:26:31 > 0:26:33disorientated, still under the influence of whatever drugs he's

0:26:33 > 0:26:40given, extremely upset, and emotional, to look after a baby on

0:26:40 > 0:26:46your own, I did feel that was very inappropriate. I felt I should have

0:26:46 > 0:26:50had a little bit of of support there or the option of calling a friend or

0:26:50 > 0:26:55somebody to be with me, because I just remember phoning their partner

0:26:55 > 0:27:00constantly to say, how long are you going to be? Because the baby is

0:27:00 > 0:27:04crying. And at that point I felt I could not pick him up and comfort

0:27:04 > 0:27:07him, because I just felt I was not capable of doing that because I was

0:27:07 > 0:27:11very upset and I didn't want to be around him while I was that upset.

0:27:11 > 0:27:18Ultimately the police did not believe you had been attacked?No.

0:27:18 > 0:27:24You gave evidence on video, and one of the things which was said was

0:27:24 > 0:27:29that you weren't a credible witness - they didn't believe you?Yep. I

0:27:29 > 0:27:34was told two days later, when I was picked up, because I think you have

0:27:34 > 0:27:39to do the video evidence within 48 hours, and they picked me up from my

0:27:39 > 0:27:41partner Schiele is flat, and as we were driving down to the police

0:27:41 > 0:27:49station, I was told by the officers in the police car that this was

0:27:49 > 0:27:55really important book that it was as factual as possible, and to try and

0:27:55 > 0:27:59women are as much as I could. It would be shown in court if it went

0:27:59 > 0:28:05to prosecution. Therefore, emotions just confuse everybody, you've got

0:28:05 > 0:28:11to be as concise as you possibly can. So, the way I've always spoken

0:28:11 > 0:28:15about what happened that night is the way I am talking to you I detach

0:28:15 > 0:28:20myself, because otherwise I do get upset. So, I'm talking about it as

0:28:20 > 0:28:25if it's a story that happened to somebody else. And they were very

0:28:25 > 0:28:29clear in the police car that that's what they needed, so I thought, OK,

0:28:29 > 0:28:33I'll try my best here, put a brave face on it, so I went in and told

0:28:33 > 0:28:37them all the facts that I could remember, and tried to keep it

0:28:37 > 0:28:42together. And then halfway through the interview, the officer left the

0:28:42 > 0:28:46room, his colleagues were in the room next door filming. He was gone

0:28:46 > 0:28:52for a few minutes and he came back and sat down and he said, to be

0:28:52 > 0:28:55honest, I've interviewed quite a few raped victims and you're not

0:28:55 > 0:28:59believable. He said, most victims would be crying, shouting,

0:28:59 > 0:29:02screaming, even throwing things around, and you're sitting there as

0:29:02 > 0:29:07calm as anything. He said, you're not coming across as believable.

0:29:07 > 0:29:12What impact did that have on you then and over the subsequent years?

0:29:12 > 0:29:16Well, identity to explain to him what had happened on the way there,

0:29:16 > 0:29:19even though in the next room where the people that told me this. And

0:29:19 > 0:29:25they were watching via the cameras. I explained what had happened, but

0:29:25 > 0:29:31he said, no, they're not supposed to coach people, so he didn't believe

0:29:31 > 0:29:36me.And that had an impact on you over the years after that?Oh,

0:29:36 > 0:29:43absolutely. I felt then, that's when I really felt that the investigation

0:29:43 > 0:29:47was going downhill. Because then after that, I spoke to another

0:29:47 > 0:29:53officer, and they said that, I have noticed over the 48 hours since the

0:29:53 > 0:29:57attack, I had a lot of bruising come out, and could we have them

0:29:57 > 0:30:03photographed for evidence, because it was clear that they were

0:30:03 > 0:30:06handgrips on the? And to me it looked like somebody had been

0:30:06 > 0:30:11holding me down or something because they were on my arms and legs. And I

0:30:11 > 0:30:15was told, that's fine, somebody will be in touch. And I think there must

0:30:15 > 0:30:20be something inside me that made me realise, this is really important,

0:30:20 > 0:30:23because they're not going to do it. So the next day I actually went and

0:30:23 > 0:30:33saw my GP and had it recorded, the bruising.In 2008 Granollers a call

0:30:33 > 0:30:38for witnesses and victims of John Worboys which is when you went

0:30:38 > 0:30:48forward again. -- there was a call. I didn't want to go forward, to

0:30:48 > 0:30:52start with, if I am honest. When I had a call from my friends who was

0:30:52 > 0:30:59with me that night, he saw it on the news and said, I think that is him.

0:30:59 > 0:31:03I did the late because I thought I can't go through that I can't go

0:31:03 > 0:31:08through another five years of not being believed, being told he made

0:31:08 > 0:31:12it up, being told a black cab driver just would not do that, being told

0:31:12 > 0:31:17that you could not possibly have been raped because you are wearing a

0:31:17 > 0:31:23tampon. It was absolutely horrendous. For five years I was

0:31:23 > 0:31:28doubting my own sanity. Had I imagined it? Had I made it up? I

0:31:28 > 0:31:33couldn't confide in many people about what had happened because it

0:31:33 > 0:31:36was so difficult to say to somebody this is what happened but nobody

0:31:36 > 0:31:41believes me. And to go through all of that again, it did take me a

0:31:41 > 0:31:48little while. When I was seeing the numbers going up and up and up, I

0:31:48 > 0:31:51always said to the police when they closed the file he would reoffend,

0:31:51 > 0:31:58he would definitely reoffend because I refuse to pick up my clothes. They

0:31:58 > 0:32:02said he would definitely reoffend and I would need them as evidence.

0:32:02 > 0:32:06Seeing the numbers going up in terms of women coming forward, literally

0:32:06 > 0:32:10over days, it was horrendous. I never realised he was going to

0:32:10 > 0:32:15reoffend that many times and I had to go forward, I had to do

0:32:15 > 0:32:22everything I could.Your action today that is being heard in the

0:32:22 > 0:32:27Supreme Court, is all about whether the police failed to conduct an

0:32:27 > 0:32:31effective investigation. I'm going to bring in your solicitor, if I

0:32:31 > 0:32:38may. The Met, then backed by the then Home Secretary to reason me are

0:32:38 > 0:32:45fighting this ruling. What are the implications if you do win today?If

0:32:45 > 0:32:51we win, it will establish in law that the police do have a duty to

0:32:51 > 0:32:54undertake effective investigations into crimes that meet the threshold

0:32:54 > 0:33:00of article three, which is inhumane and degrading treatment, of which

0:33:00 > 0:33:05rape would qualify. It would be an historic judgment if it goes in that

0:33:05 > 0:33:14way because, so far, the courts have been tested a number of times about

0:33:14 > 0:33:19whether police are liable under the common-law of negligence. The courts

0:33:19 > 0:33:23have consistently said he cannot bring negligence claims against the

0:33:23 > 0:33:28police for failed investigations. What we have argued is, under the

0:33:28 > 0:33:34Human Rights Act, the state has a duty to ensure its citizens are not

0:33:34 > 0:33:39subject to inhumane and degrading treatment. We have argued that that

0:33:39 > 0:33:44duty extends to having an effective, not just effective laws, but

0:33:44 > 0:33:47actually operation of those laws. That is essentially what the

0:33:47 > 0:33:52argument is and what we're waiting to hear, what the court will decide.

0:33:52 > 0:34:00So it would be, if it goes the right way, it would be very good for rape

0:34:00 > 0:34:05victims and other victims of serious crime generally.And it would open

0:34:05 > 0:34:12the doors to potentially sue other forces for failing to carry out an

0:34:12 > 0:34:18investigation?Potentially. They are not saying every single case would

0:34:18 > 0:34:23lead to a civil claim. They have been careful to say it has been

0:34:23 > 0:34:27really serious failures. As we heard in this case, it is not just what

0:34:27 > 0:34:33happened to Fiona, it is what happened to my other clients. We

0:34:33 > 0:34:37know that ten women reported Worboys to the police before eventually they

0:34:37 > 0:34:44made the connection. Once the media appeal went out, 105 cases were

0:34:44 > 0:34:52linked. And so, very many women don't even report. Of course, where

0:34:52 > 0:34:59drugs are used, women aren't even sure what has happened to them. So,

0:34:59 > 0:35:04this is so important because we have to, we have to get confidence from

0:35:04 > 0:35:09women to report. I don't know why the Home Secretary took the decision

0:35:09 > 0:35:14to side with the police when she made statements about the importance

0:35:14 > 0:35:19of violence against women and initiatives.The police argument is,

0:35:19 > 0:35:24if the ruling goes your way if you win you are effectively imposing an

0:35:24 > 0:35:27investigative duty on the police was that they are saying we have

0:35:27 > 0:35:32procedures in place and practices in place and that is enough.That is

0:35:32 > 0:35:38precisely the point. What is so startling when Reid took this case

0:35:38 > 0:35:42to trial originally, that is right. They did have procedures and

0:35:42 > 0:35:45guidelines in place. There was a whole set of guidelines about how

0:35:45 > 0:35:52you assess drug assisted rape and they did not follow them. An

0:35:52 > 0:35:55inspector in court said that my council said but what do you think

0:35:55 > 0:35:59this guideline is here for question he said, I don't know. Is it to

0:35:59 > 0:36:03protect us from litigation or something? If that is the attitude

0:36:03 > 0:36:07you cannot just have laws and guidelines if they are not enforced

0:36:07 > 0:36:11properly.Let me bring the owner back in. There is a separate,

0:36:11 > 0:36:17judicial review which you are also bringing. -- Fiona. That is about

0:36:17 > 0:36:25the release of John Worboys and the decision made by the Independent

0:36:25 > 0:36:28parole board to release him after eight years. You want that stopped,

0:36:28 > 0:36:31reversed will stop it meant you faced John Worboys in court a few

0:36:31 > 0:36:38weeks ago.Tell us about that.I was already warned he could possibly

0:36:38 > 0:36:46have been there on video link. I was sort of prepared for him there. But

0:36:46 > 0:36:50when, obviously, I was told he would be there in person, it was a bit

0:36:50 > 0:36:54difficult walking through the doors and getting to court. I think I was

0:36:54 > 0:37:02a little bit late. I made it because I felt it was really important to

0:37:02 > 0:37:07show Worboys himself I was not scared anymore because I do believe

0:37:07 > 0:37:13that rape is not about sex, it is about control and power. I want to

0:37:13 > 0:37:18take back control and power back from him by showing him I was no

0:37:18 > 0:37:23longer afraid of him.What did you think when you saw him?When I saw

0:37:23 > 0:37:28him I was expecting a big, scary monster to come through the doors.

0:37:28 > 0:37:33Over this amount of time, 15 years, you build it up in your head of what

0:37:33 > 0:37:39he will be like. When he first walked through the doors I was just

0:37:39 > 0:37:45struck by, oh my God, he's pathetic. A pathetic old man. He was all

0:37:45 > 0:37:49hunched over and reading his hands were talking were talking. Talking

0:37:49 > 0:37:55just above a whisper. A couple of times he looked at me and I saw his

0:37:55 > 0:38:01eyes. Do you know what? He has not changed one bit. Every woman that

0:38:01 > 0:38:06got in a cab reported the reason they accepted that drink was because

0:38:06 > 0:38:11they felt sorry for him. It was pathetic. It was an act. I do

0:38:11 > 0:38:17believe going to court was an act. I saw his eyes. He is still capable of

0:38:17 > 0:38:23what he was doing ten years ago. Absolutely still capable. I will

0:38:23 > 0:38:27keep fighting. I will do whatever it takes to keep him behind bars for

0:38:27 > 0:38:31debate is the only way will be protected from him, if he is behind

0:38:31 > 0:38:37bars. No licensing conditions can watch in 24/ seven.You are adamant

0:38:37 > 0:38:43he is still a danger?As far as I'm concerned, he is a danger. I am not

0:38:43 > 0:38:47concerned about what you can do to me because is nothing more he can do

0:38:47 > 0:38:52to me that I don't want to go back to 2003 and be watching the news

0:38:52 > 0:38:55again, waiting for him to reoffend. I know he will reoffend and I don't

0:38:55 > 0:38:59want to be in a position where I said, I was right, I told you he

0:38:59 > 0:39:04would do this again. He will. He will absolutely do this again and we

0:39:04 > 0:39:14need to protect women from him.

0:39:14 > 0:39:17That was "Fiona" whose case is at the supreme court today

0:39:17 > 0:39:20and her solicitor Harriet Wistritch.

0:39:20 > 0:39:26We are expecting that ruling very soon. Andy says...

0:39:34 > 0:39:47That says... -- Bev. And from Sheena...

0:39:56 > 0:39:58This from Ian.

0:40:10 > 0:40:19These women have already been paid compensation, £40,000.

0:40:19 > 0:40:25This is the news to do with unemployment will do it increased by

0:40:25 > 0:40:2946,000 to 1.47 million according to the office for National Statistics.

0:40:29 > 0:40:32The unexpected rise from a record low was accompanied by an

0:40:32 > 0:40:38improvement in pay rises which averaged 2.5%, excluding bonuses.

0:40:38 > 0:40:39Next this morning...

0:40:39 > 0:40:41How hundreds of Britain's homeless are being trapped

0:40:41 > 0:40:43into modern slavery.

0:40:43 > 0:40:47An investigation by Buzzfeed News has found that hundreds of hundreds

0:40:47 > 0:40:50of homeless people have been captured over the past three years -

0:40:50 > 0:40:52approached at soup kitchens and while sleeping rough,

0:40:52 > 0:40:55and lured into slavery with the promise of drugs and alcohol.

0:40:55 > 0:40:59Some have been found locked in caravans, without heating,

0:40:59 > 0:41:09bedding, or running water; others chained up, or locked outside.

0:41:10 > 0:41:11Jane Bradley is Buzzfeed News' Investigations correspondent,

0:41:11 > 0:41:16who has uncovered this story.

0:41:16 > 0:41:17Jane, what did you learn

0:41:17 > 0:41:21about how homeless people are being 'enslaved'?

0:41:21 > 0:41:26We often hear the term hidden in plain sight. In this case it really

0:41:26 > 0:41:32was. We found evidence that traffickers were targeting homeless

0:41:32 > 0:41:36people are sick kitchens, shelters, and rough sleeping hotspots all over

0:41:36 > 0:41:41the UK. This was often incredibly brazen, in broad daylight. What is

0:41:41 > 0:41:44really shocking is just how calculated and organised the

0:41:44 > 0:41:50recruitment is. These are not just opportunistic pick-ups. This is the

0:41:50 > 0:41:54deliberate targeting people who are desperate, vulnerable, and often

0:41:54 > 0:41:59have some kind of addiction mental health issues that traffickers are

0:41:59 > 0:42:03ultimately preying on. Turning up at soup kitchens with the promise of

0:42:03 > 0:42:10cash or a bed. Sometimes even drugs or alcohol. Whatever that

0:42:10 > 0:42:13vulnerability is that these traffickers are playing on, some

0:42:13 > 0:42:19shelters even reported gang masters posing as volunteers or rough

0:42:19 > 0:42:23sleepers themselves in order to infiltrate the plays and recruit

0:42:23 > 0:42:28more homeless workers. That is what we are talking about here.You spent

0:42:28 > 0:42:32time doing secret filming on groups of homeless people and potential

0:42:32 > 0:42:37traffickers.Tell us about that. We wanted to find evidence for this

0:42:37 > 0:42:41ourselves and we spent weeks carrying out surveillance and

0:42:41 > 0:42:45secretly filming brands and cars as they picked up homeless and

0:42:45 > 0:42:50destitute workers on a street corner in Bradford and took them to local

0:42:50 > 0:42:56worksites. Every day, around 7am, up to 15 men would be standing on these

0:42:56 > 0:43:00corners waiting for work. Often four hours in the freezing cold or

0:43:00 > 0:43:05pouring rain and it really was like watching a red light district. A car

0:43:05 > 0:43:10or van would pull up, the window would go down and I homeless worker,

0:43:10 > 0:43:14a destitute worker with leaning, sometimes negotiate, get into the

0:43:14 > 0:43:20car, and drive off. We followed some of these workers to construction

0:43:20 > 0:43:26sites, a charity clothing bank, and even a law firm in Bradford. We

0:43:26 > 0:43:30found evidence of exploitation. One gang master admitted to paying less

0:43:30 > 0:43:34than the minimum wage. Another said he did employ a homeless worker for

0:43:34 > 0:43:40cash in hand Labour but he paid him fairly. A third guy simply said, no

0:43:40 > 0:43:44one is making them stand there.When the victims are recruited, how are

0:43:44 > 0:43:50they treated?I spoke to six victims for this investigation full debate

0:43:50 > 0:43:55all painted a picture of backbreaking 12 hour shifts in

0:43:55 > 0:43:58factories, hotels, construction sites all over the UK. This would

0:43:58 > 0:44:02often be working seven days a week for as little as £20 at the end of

0:44:02 > 0:44:09it. Sometimes nothing at all. They would be kept in the filthy, rat

0:44:09 > 0:44:14infested caravans, offer with no hot water, no running water, no

0:44:14 > 0:44:20electricity, no heating. Or it might be a terraced house where up to 50

0:44:20 > 0:44:25workers would be kept in while they worked for these slave masters. In

0:44:25 > 0:44:29one case actually a police officer told me she had come across 25

0:44:29 > 0:44:33people living in the garden of a house in what she described as

0:44:33 > 0:44:40rabbit hutch is. Of course, there is often threats or beatings at the

0:44:40 > 0:44:43hands of the traffickers in order to basically scare the victims into

0:44:43 > 0:44:50staying put. One of the victims I spoke to for this investigation told

0:44:50 > 0:44:58me he had witnessed a gang master pouring boiling hot Coffey over a

0:44:58 > 0:45:04victim. Another tried to strangle someone with his own shirt. It is

0:45:04 > 0:45:09not just physical assaults that they face. Traffickers will often steal

0:45:09 > 0:45:15ID documents of victims to keep them trapped, or run up imaginary debts

0:45:15 > 0:45:19for living costs so they can spend decades paying off this money. My

0:45:19 > 0:45:23mother did you get the sense in your investigation of how bad the problem

0:45:23 > 0:45:27is, how widespread it is? One thing that really struck me when I first

0:45:27 > 0:45:33started to look into this was how much of an open secret it seemed to

0:45:33 > 0:45:36be in the sector, amongst homeless charities in shelters and even the

0:45:36 > 0:45:40police force. That was in contrast to public awareness around the

0:45:40 > 0:45:45issue. We did some digging and found there have been hundreds of reports

0:45:45 > 0:45:48of homeless victims of modern slavery in the UK in the past three

0:45:48 > 0:45:54years. There were 278 in the last year alone. These figures are very

0:45:54 > 0:46:00likely to be the tip of the iceberg, simply because many of these cases

0:46:00 > 0:46:05are undocumented. The Government, the local authorities, and many

0:46:05 > 0:46:12police forces have failed to keep track of any data of homeless

0:46:12 > 0:46:15victims of modern slavery. Our analysis really is the first insight

0:46:15 > 0:46:20we have had into the scale of the problem and what it shows is these

0:46:20 > 0:46:23are not one-offs. This is a widespread crime targeting some of

0:46:23 > 0:46:44the most vulnerable people in our society.

0:46:44 > 0:46:46We've been speaking to a victim of the Rooney family,

0:46:46 > 0:46:49who were convicted last September of modern-day slavery offences

0:46:49 > 0:46:51after they illegally held 18 men at a caravan site in Lincoln.

0:46:51 > 0:46:54Fred, which isn't his real name, has learning difficulties

0:46:54 > 0:46:57and was picked up by the Rooneys at a soup kitchen in Reading before

0:46:57 > 0:46:59being driven to Lincoln, where he would live in squalor

0:46:59 > 0:47:01for the next 12 years.

0:47:01 > 0:47:02He's been speaking to our reporter Greg Dawson.

0:47:02 > 0:47:07Fred, just tell me about the day that you first met the Rooney

0:47:07 > 0:47:11family, what can you remember?A traveller came in and asked for some

0:47:11 > 0:47:15workers and I was the only one they asked. They said the work would be

0:47:15 > 0:47:20time making and block paving. I got into the van because they said they

0:47:20 > 0:47:26wanted another van pushed to get it started. I got into the van and I

0:47:26 > 0:47:29just wondered what was going to happen to me and I ended up in

0:47:29 > 0:47:33Lincoln.When you were in the van, did they tell you where they were

0:47:33 > 0:47:38taking you?No. When I got out of the van it was dark and I was shown

0:47:38 > 0:47:42a caravan, and I stayed in that caravan until the morning. There

0:47:42 > 0:47:48were no washing facilities or electric or nothing. I didn't sleep

0:47:48 > 0:47:52at all because I just wanted to get off that site and I didn't know

0:47:52 > 0:47:58where I was. They gave me breakfast and told me what duties I had to do

0:47:58 > 0:48:03there, and if I didn't do what I was told I would get slapped up from

0:48:03 > 0:48:08Martin. Martin was the boss of them. I got on friendly with him at first

0:48:08 > 0:48:14but after a while he started bullying be.What did they tell you

0:48:14 > 0:48:20that they would pay you when you were working for them?They said I

0:48:20 > 0:48:25would get £20 to £30 a day for just doing things like digging out a

0:48:25 > 0:48:29driveway and getting it ready for paving or tarmac.And did they ever

0:48:29 > 0:48:37give you that money?No. Never. All the time I was there I got nothing

0:48:37 > 0:48:40off them. They also took my benefits from me that I was paid every

0:48:40 > 0:48:49fortnight.If you refused to do the work they were asking, what would

0:48:49 > 0:48:55happen?If I didn't do the work, I'd get slapped by the dad. And if the

0:48:55 > 0:49:02dad wasn't there, I'd get slapped by the twins. I had no choice.How

0:49:02 > 0:49:08often would they beat you?Every day, if I didn't do what they

0:49:08 > 0:49:15wanted. He would either use his belt or his fist. I wanted to walk off

0:49:15 > 0:49:18there and then, but I didn't know where I was or where to go. I was

0:49:18 > 0:49:25frightened.What did you do for food when you were living there?There's

0:49:25 > 0:49:30a friend of mine who used to go to raid the bins at the local shops to

0:49:30 > 0:49:36feed himself. And when he went looking for food I went with him. We

0:49:36 > 0:49:41got into the bins, taking bread and whatever else was worth eating. I

0:49:41 > 0:49:47would also do a bit of hunting. I used to they're rabbits and did my

0:49:47 > 0:49:52own little rabbit stews and that. Tell me about the conditions in the

0:49:52 > 0:50:00caravan itself - were you able to have a shower, use the toilets?If I

0:50:00 > 0:50:05wanted the toilet I would have to go behind the nearest bush.So there

0:50:05 > 0:50:08were no toilets?There was no toilet there. I couldn't have a wash or

0:50:08 > 0:50:16shower.So, you lived for 12 years with no toilets, with no washing

0:50:16 > 0:50:26facilities?No. Access to a shower was a no-go, toilet was a no-go. If

0:50:26 > 0:50:29I wanted a wash I would have to walk down to the nearest rock and have a

0:50:29 > 0:50:34wash in there. Them days was hard, and I hope it doesn't happen to

0:50:34 > 0:50:41anybody else. -- the nearest brook. There's me and a few others that

0:50:41 > 0:50:45have been through it, and I wouldn't want it to happen to anybody else.

0:50:45 > 0:50:48Did you ever wonder when you were there, is anybody looking for me?

0:50:48 > 0:50:53Yeah, I wondered that, because I lost contact with all my friends and

0:50:53 > 0:51:00that. I'd given up hope until the police found me.

0:51:15 > 0:51:1912 years is such a long time to be trapped somewhere, to be exploited,

0:51:19 > 0:51:25and to be abused as you work - what effect has that had on your life?I

0:51:25 > 0:51:30don't like being out all day, because I know people could be out

0:51:30 > 0:51:36there wanting workers. It's hard. I do not want to see it happen to

0:51:36 > 0:51:41anybody. There's homeless people out there, and I don't want to see them

0:51:41 > 0:51:47in the same place I was. It's affected me a lot. Now, I'm away

0:51:47 > 0:51:53from them, I'm glad to be where I am now. If it hadn't been for the

0:51:53 > 0:51:58police rescuing me, I wouldn't be walking about, I'd probably be in a

0:51:58 > 0:52:01wooden box somewhere.

0:52:06 > 0:52:09Right now we're going straight to the Supreme Court in London live,

0:52:09 > 0:52:14where they're delivering a ruling on the cases wrought by two women

0:52:14 > 0:52:18against the Mike Pollitt police in the Worboys case...Those failures

0:52:18 > 0:52:23constituted a violation of their rights under article three of the

0:52:23 > 0:52:29European Convention on Human Rights and their freedoms. Article three

0:52:29 > 0:52:33provides that no-one shall be subjected to torture or inhuman or

0:52:33 > 0:52:40degrading treatment or punishment. The main issue on the appeal was to

0:52:40 > 0:52:46what extent Article three imposes a positive obligation on states

0:52:46 > 0:52:49effectively to investigate reported crimes perpetrated by private

0:52:49 > 0:52:56individuals. The High Court and the Court of Appeal held that a positive

0:52:56 > 0:53:00obligation to investigate did exist, and that in this case, that

0:53:00 > 0:53:09obligation had not been fulfilled. Compensation was awarded to DSD and

0:53:09 > 0:53:17NBV. Commissioner of the police appealed to the Supreme Court, and

0:53:17 > 0:53:22it was accepted that whatever the outcome of this appeal, recoupment

0:53:22 > 0:53:27of any compensation that had paid would not be sorted. The main area

0:53:27 > 0:53:30of dispute was the nature of the positive obligation imposed by

0:53:30 > 0:53:35article three of the Convention. In particular, the question arose as to

0:53:35 > 0:53:41weather that obligation relates only to systemic failures on the part of

0:53:41 > 0:53:44the police, or weather it also includes failures in the conduct of

0:53:44 > 0:53:54the investigation. The Supreme Court unanimously dismisses the

0:53:54 > 0:53:58commissioner's appeal. There was disagreement between us as to

0:53:58 > 0:54:02whether a liability under the Human Rights Act arose only due to

0:54:02 > 0:54:06systemic failures or whether efficiency is in the actual

0:54:06 > 0:54:13investigation of the offences would be enough to make the police libel.

0:54:13 > 0:54:17By a majority, we have held that failures in the investigation of the

0:54:17 > 0:54:21crimes, provided they are sufficiently serious, will give rise

0:54:21 > 0:54:26to liability on the part of the police. And we further found that

0:54:26 > 0:54:32there WERE such serious efficiencies in this case. There were, of course,

0:54:32 > 0:54:36both systemic and investigatory failures, a the important point to

0:54:36 > 0:54:40make is that if the investigation is seriously defective, even if no

0:54:40 > 0:54:45systemic failures are present, this would be enough to render the police

0:54:45 > 0:54:48libel. The court is now adjourned.

0:54:54 > 0:54:59So, the two women who argued that the Met Police breached their human

0:54:59 > 0:55:02rights for failing to investigate claims that they had been raped by

0:55:02 > 0:55:08John Worboys in 2003 and 2007 have won their case. The Metropolitan

0:55:08 > 0:55:12Police have lost. And indeed, the Home Office backed by the then Home

0:55:12 > 0:55:17Secretary Theresa May, have lost that case. We can go to June Kelly,

0:55:17 > 0:55:20our correspondent, outside the Supreme Court. We heard most of the

0:55:20 > 0:55:25ruling, but just fill us in with the significance of this?I think the

0:55:25 > 0:55:28first thing to say, Victoria, is that this is a significant victory

0:55:28 > 0:55:33for these women and a serious defeat for the Met Police, who had brought

0:55:33 > 0:55:37this challenge, having lost in the lower courts. They then came to the

0:55:37 > 0:55:40Supreme Court, the highest court in the land, in the hope that they

0:55:40 > 0:55:44would win here, the police, and obviously, an important defeat for

0:55:44 > 0:55:48them. As we were hearing from the justices, they said that they

0:55:48 > 0:55:52accepted the arguments from the women's lawyers that the police had

0:55:52 > 0:55:55breached these women's human rights over their failure to investigate

0:55:55 > 0:55:59John Worboys. As we know, John Worboys was roaming around the

0:55:59 > 0:56:02streets of London committing crimes against women for a number of years,

0:56:02 > 0:56:05and it has been acknowledged by the Met Police that he should have been

0:56:05 > 0:56:08brought to justice earlier. And the women brought this case on that

0:56:08 > 0:56:13basis, that he could have been stopped earlier. This case tells one

0:56:13 > 0:56:15of the most significant things about it is that it will have implications

0:56:15 > 0:56:19now for forces around the country over a possible failure to

0:56:19 > 0:56:26investigate.Meaning what, you mean other people might sue police forces

0:56:26 > 0:56:32for failures to investigate properly?Yes, and we're talking

0:56:32 > 0:56:35about serious crimes here, serious violent crimes, is what the women's

0:56:35 > 0:56:41lawyers had argued this case was about. And basically this is why the

0:56:41 > 0:56:46police fought this case all the way to this court, because they realised

0:56:46 > 0:56:49the implications if the judgment went against them. And of course

0:56:49 > 0:56:52now, it has done, as we have heard in the last few minutes. The women

0:56:52 > 0:56:57it should be said, in this case, the two women, are also the women who

0:56:57 > 0:57:02are bringing a challenge against the decision to release Worboys from

0:57:02 > 0:57:06prison on licence. That is a separate case going on through a

0:57:06 > 0:57:10separate judicial process. But coming back to what's going on here

0:57:10 > 0:57:14this morning, crucially, the judges have said, the justices have said,

0:57:14 > 0:57:21that the women's human rights were breached because the force was under

0:57:21 > 0:57:25an obligation to investigate John Worboys. It failed in that duty. It

0:57:25 > 0:57:29is a duty of the state, as it was put in the judgment, and therefore

0:57:29 > 0:57:33this is why the Met Police this morning have lost this case.Thank

0:57:33 > 0:57:39you, June Kelly, outside the Supreme Court. So, a significant ruling from

0:57:39 > 0:57:44the Supreme Court in the last few minutes. We spoke to one of the

0:57:44 > 0:57:48women who was taking that case, who has won that case, at the start of

0:57:48 > 0:57:52the programme this morning. Your reaction now as you were watching...

0:57:52 > 0:57:58This one says... A horrific experience, such a brave woman. The

0:57:58 > 0:58:00police should be ashamed of themselves in the way that they

0:58:00 > 0:58:05treated her when she was at her most vulnerable. I hope her bravery and

0:58:05 > 0:58:09other women who exposed their attacks encourage others to come

0:58:09 > 0:58:12forward and report these crimes. This one says... It is ridiculous

0:58:12 > 0:58:17that the police did not properly investigate and take the information

0:58:17 > 0:58:21of the person who dropped the woman off at the police station who was in

0:58:21 > 0:58:24such a state. It is beyond belief and completely unprofessional. This

0:58:24 > 0:58:29one says... On Twitter the Met Police do need to be held

0:58:29 > 0:58:35accountable for failing survivors of the black cab rapist. It is clear to

0:58:35 > 0:58:38see the emotional suffering caused by poor standards in investigations.

0:58:38 > 0:58:44And one more... To relive the events and the trauma to complete strangers

0:58:44 > 0:58:47in positions of authority and not to be believed, to be told that you

0:58:47 > 0:58:55aren't credible, nor behaving as a victim of sexual assault should, is

0:58:55 > 0:58:59inhumane. More reaction to come to the Supreme Court ruling in the next

0:58:59 > 0:59:02hour of the programme. We will bring you the latest news and sport in a

0:59:02 > 0:59:07moment. Before that, the weather with Nick.

0:59:11 > 0:59:19High pressure building in across the UK, so it is quiet weather. The fog

0:59:19 > 0:59:23is quite slow to clear in some areas but there will be some sunshine for

0:59:23 > 0:59:26most areas at some stage today. There are areas of cloud around,

0:59:26 > 0:59:29particularly in England and Wales. But even here I think the cloud will

0:59:29 > 0:59:33break at times and at least it will brighten up. There is the chance of

0:59:33 > 0:59:40the odd light shower in some areas but it is mainly dry story. Very few

0:59:40 > 0:59:43wind arose showing up, which indicates very light winds and

0:59:43 > 0:59:48temperatures topping out at about 659 Celsius. Next week is looking

0:59:48 > 0:59:52much colder. But going towards

0:59:52 > 0:59:54weekend temperatures will be dropping off a little bit. And

0:59:54 > 0:59:57tonight there will be a more widespread frost around. We've got

0:59:57 > 1:00:01plenty of clear spells, still some patchy cloud and patches of fault

1:00:01 > 1:00:04developing as well as we go through the night. Temperatures in two

1:00:04 > 1:00:09tomorrow morning close to freezing, a few degrees below in the coldest

1:00:09 > 1:00:14spots. More of us getting a frost tomorrow morning, and tomorrow, just

1:00:14 > 1:00:17like today, there will be areas of cloud around, there will be sunny

1:00:17 > 1:00:22spells, and whilst most places are looking dry, there will be enough

1:00:22 > 1:00:24cloud towards Northern Ireland and western Scotland to produce a few

1:00:24 > 1:00:31light showers here. Temperatures just dropping off a degree or so

1:00:31 > 1:00:35again, and that is the trend for the rest of the week and into the

1:00:35 > 1:00:38weekend, turning colder as lead at the weekend, as the winter starts to

1:00:38 > 1:00:43hit up and some really bitter, cold air expect it for a time next week

1:00:43 > 1:00:47and a few snow showers around as well. We will keep you updated.

1:00:50 > 1:00:51Hello.

1:00:51 > 1:00:52It's 10 o'clock.

1:00:52 > 1:00:53I'm Victoria Derbyshire.

1:00:53 > 1:00:55Breaking news in the last few minutes.

1:00:55 > 1:00:57The Metropolitan Police has lost its Supreme Court challenge

1:00:57 > 1:00:59over a ruling which led to two women who were sexually

1:00:59 > 1:01:01assaulted by London cabbie John Worboys winning compensation.

1:01:01 > 1:01:11We've been speaking exclusively to one of those women.

1:01:16 > 1:01:19I am not worried about what he will do to me but I

1:01:19 > 1:01:21don't want to go back to 2003 and be watching

1:01:21 > 1:01:22the news again waiting for

1:01:22 > 1:01:23him to reoffend.

1:01:23 > 1:01:26I know he will reoffend full I don't want to be in

1:01:26 > 1:01:29that position where I will say, I was right because he will absolutely

1:01:29 > 1:01:31do it again.

1:01:31 > 1:01:33We'll bring much more reaction to this throughout the programme.

1:01:33 > 1:01:36Also on the programme - The United Nations in Syria says

1:01:36 > 1:01:39it's deeply worried for hundreds of thousands of people trapped under

1:01:39 > 1:01:41a mounting government bombardment of the rebel-held enclave

1:01:41 > 1:01:50of Eastern Ghouta.

1:01:50 > 1:01:53We can hear the shouts and crying of women and children.

1:01:53 > 1:01:55The mortars are dropping on us like rain.

1:01:55 > 1:02:02There is nowhere to hide from this nightmare in Eastern Ghouta.

1:02:02 > 1:02:12Women who've had their ovaries or wombs removed to treat

1:02:16 > 1:02:24the painful condition of endometriosis say they are not

1:02:25 > 1:02:33receiving the right after care.

1:02:33 > 1:02:41The Supreme Court has made a ruling over the John Worboys case. The

1:02:41 > 1:02:44women claimed police failures amounted to inhuman and degrading

1:02:44 > 1:02:48treatment. The Metropolitan Police had argued it had practices and

1:02:48 > 1:02:53procedures in place that, in the last few minutes, the court ruled

1:02:53 > 1:03:00against them. Fiona is one of the women involved in today's's case.

1:03:00 > 1:03:06She was not one of the women that Worboys was convicted of raping that

1:03:06 > 1:03:10she has been recognised as a victim of rape since by the police was she

1:03:10 > 1:03:16told this programme exclusively about what happened to her in John

1:03:16 > 1:03:20Worboys cab. She is appearing alongside her lawyer.

1:03:20 > 1:03:21There

1:03:21 > 1:03:24was a conversation about him stopping for a cigarette or

1:03:24 > 1:03:28something and did I want a cigarette. I might even have asked

1:03:28 > 1:03:34him if it was OK to smoke. In 2003 you did smoke in cabs. People Dover

1:03:34 > 1:03:40and I render him getting into the back of the cab with me. -- he

1:03:40 > 1:03:46pulled over and I remember him. He went to put his arm around me.

1:03:46 > 1:03:53Before I lacked out I can remember thinking he was nice. I wonder if I

1:03:53 > 1:03:58encouraged him by saying that. I think I was meaning, you are a nice

1:03:58 > 1:04:03guy because you have given me a cigarette or something. It was not

1:04:03 > 1:04:08intended to be anything other than that. The next memory I have is

1:04:08 > 1:04:15waking up in hospital.That is when you woke up and thought, what on

1:04:15 > 1:04:22earth happened?Yes. I woke up and was very confused very

1:04:22 > 1:04:29disorientated. I had a drip in my arm and pulled the drip out and went

1:04:29 > 1:04:33to the toilets. I think I was having a bit of a meltdown for the looking

1:04:33 > 1:04:36back at it hit was a bit embarrassing because I was running

1:04:36 > 1:04:41around and shouting at the nurses, I don't know where I am, where am I?

1:04:41 > 1:04:46They did not realise what I meant. They kept saying I was in hospital.

1:04:46 > 1:04:50I didn't know which hospital I was in and I was really upset because I

1:04:50 > 1:05:00should have been home looking after my baby.Did you know you had been

1:05:00 > 1:05:03raped?As soon as I went to the toilet I knew I had been raped. I

1:05:03 > 1:05:06was a little bit sore. When I went to the toilet the tampon I was

1:05:06 > 1:05:13wearing fell out. I knew instantly because of the way I was.Let me

1:05:13 > 1:05:17read you some more messages. Delighted by the Supreme Court

1:05:17 > 1:05:20decision to dismiss the appeal by the Metropolitan Police. This is

1:05:20 > 1:05:32justice. This text, I totally feel the pain of having seen Worboys in

1:05:32 > 1:05:36court. I was a victim of sexual assault three years ago. I was a

1:05:36 > 1:05:41teenager at the time did not go to court I saw the person who did it in

1:05:41 > 1:05:46the supermarket a few months ago. By blood ran cold and I left

1:05:46 > 1:05:50immediately. What is not understood as the victim has a mental life

1:05:50 > 1:05:57sentence. Sue says, I sat down briefly this money to watch part of

1:05:57 > 1:06:02your programme and stayed with the interview with the John Worboys rape

1:06:02 > 1:06:07victim. I was stunned and mesmerised by her bravery and coherence telling

1:06:07 > 1:06:11her story. It must have taken so much to read tell the horrific

1:06:11 > 1:06:20events she has enjoyed. I cannot believe the police reaction. Let me

1:06:20 > 1:06:25introduce you to the people supporting the women's legal

1:06:25 > 1:06:33challenge. And also someone from the Metropolitan Police who investigated

1:06:33 > 1:06:40rapes during his time with the force. The women were arguing above

1:06:40 > 1:06:44a breach of human rights that police failed to investigate claims

1:06:44 > 1:06:48properly.What do you say? That judgment today is a huge victory for

1:06:48 > 1:07:00victims rights and huge step forward in an end of this.I am appalled by

1:07:00 > 1:07:05what I saw today. I already knew about it. This all happened as I was

1:07:05 > 1:07:11retiring. We had done so much about bringing on sexual investigations.

1:07:11 > 1:07:17For my part, it was about stalking and a lot has been achieved on that.

1:07:17 > 1:07:21I don't think the police has entirely got it right. The

1:07:21 > 1:07:25comeuppance has happened now. There are strings attached to it for the

1:07:25 > 1:07:30police with floodgates opening with claims from things like that. They

1:07:30 > 1:07:34will have to be careful on that.You say floodgates opening. The Justice

1:07:34 > 1:07:39has made clear that this will only apply to serious crimes. Simek yes.

1:07:39 > 1:07:45I'm happy you mean other people who feel the police has failed to

1:07:45 > 1:07:51investigate claims properly can soon. 's aye you are right. Anyone

1:07:51 > 1:07:58who has been involved in a car crash, you get calls from different

1:07:58 > 1:08:06companies wanting to represent them. We are in that sort of society.

1:08:06 > 1:08:11Police are bound to be concerned about that.Let me read to this

1:08:11 > 1:08:15statement from the major bulletin police, from the Deputy

1:08:15 > 1:08:19Commissioner. He says the metabolic and police that is fully accepts the

1:08:19 > 1:08:25decision of the court this morning. -- the Metropolitan Police Service.

1:08:25 > 1:08:28We have fully accepted the complaints and it was only the

1:08:28 > 1:08:35courage of the victims coming forward, including these two

1:08:35 > 1:08:42complainants today, who have come forward. Police force needed

1:08:42 > 1:08:46absolute clarity and the boundaries of police responsibility and

1:08:46 > 1:08:52liability for their investigations. We have always been clear that

1:08:52 > 1:08:59appeal to the supreme court was about interpretation of European

1:08:59 > 1:09:04human rights law.Do you accept that? It is good the police are

1:09:04 > 1:09:09accepting the decision. They had no choice. The real question is, why

1:09:09 > 1:09:13did they dragged the women through this? They lost in the High Court

1:09:13 > 1:09:18and Court of Appeal. They say it is about clarity for the bit is about

1:09:18 > 1:09:22the police then they did not want women like the victims of John

1:09:22 > 1:09:26Worboys to have a legal right to bring a case against the police

1:09:26 > 1:09:32where victims of serious violent crimes had faced serious

1:09:32 > 1:09:35investigative failures which had stopped people like John Worboys

1:09:35 > 1:09:41coming to justice. Instead of years of litigation funded by the

1:09:41 > 1:09:44taxpayers the police should have said, we will learn the lessons of

1:09:44 > 1:09:48the failures make sure the victims of violent, sexual offences are

1:09:48 > 1:09:52protected in future and not cite the legal niceties over a number of

1:09:52 > 1:09:57years as they have done. Back is deeply disappointing.Do you think

1:09:57 > 1:10:04if police failed to thoroughly investigate a serious crime they

1:10:04 > 1:10:08have breached an individual's human rights?I think the speed of the

1:10:08 > 1:10:15reaction from the Metropolitan Police suggests they were expecting

1:10:15 > 1:10:20that verdict. It is about subsequent liabilities and that is what they

1:10:20 > 1:10:24wanted to make perfectly clear. There is a huge amount...Now we are

1:10:24 > 1:10:29clear. They are liable. They have to carry out thorough investigations

1:10:29 > 1:10:34into people's lane is when it is a serious allegation.I think they

1:10:34 > 1:10:38knew that in the first place. It is penalties and sanctions that

1:10:38 > 1:10:43followed. I would say, notwithstanding what has happened

1:10:43 > 1:10:46today, it still has been huge progress made in the investigation

1:10:46 > 1:10:50of sexual matters and this has gone horribly wrong and no one will

1:10:50 > 1:10:54defend it, I hope. There are more and more people reporting these

1:10:54 > 1:10:58crimes. I would encourage people to continue doing that. Things have

1:10:58 > 1:11:05moved on. I can go back 30, 40 years went they were treated atrociously,

1:11:05 > 1:11:08which they may have been treated here was a marvellous moves have

1:11:08 > 1:11:14been taken forward but it is more of a multi-agency approach and medical

1:11:14 > 1:11:17examinations so police have confidence and report it.Would you

1:11:17 > 1:11:22accept that police have made progress when it comes to

1:11:22 > 1:11:25investigating serious sexual assaults?Some progress has been

1:11:25 > 1:11:29made and more progress needs to be made. We need better investigations

1:11:29 > 1:11:34and we need the women better looked after. We need to see more

1:11:34 > 1:11:41prosecutions and higher conviction rates.I read into the bottom of the

1:11:41 > 1:11:45judgment will have to consider how we balance resources against the

1:11:45 > 1:11:48need to effectively investigate certain crimes. Interesting. Thank

1:11:48 > 1:11:57you very much will coming onto the programme.

1:11:57 > 1:12:01250 people have been killed in Damascus in three days through

1:12:01 > 1:12:10intense bombing. The area is eastern Ghouta. It has been held by rebels.

1:12:10 > 1:12:14It has been under siege for the last five years. In 2013 its people were

1:12:14 > 1:12:18subject to a chemical attack, which the United Nations said constituted

1:12:18 > 1:12:23a war crime. Hundreds were killed and many more left seriously

1:12:23 > 1:12:28injured. Now the relentless bombing has been described as beyond

1:12:28 > 1:12:32imagination with the UN calling on world leaders to demand the Syrian

1:12:32 > 1:12:40government immediately stops the bombing. The UN has also issued a

1:12:40 > 1:12:45blank statement, mostly blank, hardly any words on it, because they

1:12:45 > 1:12:50say there are no words to talk about what is happening in eastern Ghouta.

1:12:50 > 1:12:54Syria itself has been in civil war for a total of seven years with no

1:12:54 > 1:13:07sign of ending. These eastern Ghouta residents describe life there.The

1:13:07 > 1:13:12missiles and the mortars are dropping on ours like rain. There is

1:13:12 > 1:13:31nowhere to hide from this nightmare in eastern Ghouta. -- on us.

1:14:27 > 1:14:33Those injured, taken to the underground hospitals are taken now

1:14:33 > 1:14:39by doctors.

1:14:39 > 1:14:42Joining us now via phone is Dr Bassam Bakri who is a doctor

1:14:42 > 1:14:46working in Eastern Ghouta.

1:14:46 > 1:14:49How do you help people's injured in the conditions we have been talking

1:14:49 > 1:14:56about?Hello everyone. You cannot measure the situation in eastern

1:14:56 > 1:15:02Ghouta now. Many of the injured people, civilian people, we can't

1:15:02 > 1:15:15treat all of them. Maybe you can hear the voice of the air strike

1:15:15 > 1:15:22now. The patients and injured people on the waiting list are more than

1:15:22 > 1:15:30that injured.We can deal with them. I am going to interrupt you. So, I

1:15:30 > 1:15:35can hear the occasional third. Is that the sound of bombs falling?

1:15:35 > 1:15:47Yes, yes. -- thud. Every minute we have three or four air strikes. This

1:15:47 > 1:15:55is the situation. It is catastrophic in eastern Ghouta.You cannot

1:15:55 > 1:16:08imagine that. How long have you been enduring this?It is about today,

1:16:08 > 1:16:13maybe today, we're in the three months in this attack. We have more

1:16:13 > 1:16:26than maybe 2000 killed people, more than ten times this number about

1:16:26 > 1:16:42killed people is injured people.

1:16:42 > 1:16:45You know we are under siege by Assad regime more than five years, no

1:16:45 > 1:16:49medicine...Sorry to interrupt again, you have no medicine, do you

1:16:49 > 1:16:57have food?No.Do you have water? No, no, we don't have. We have no

1:16:57 > 1:17:06medicine, not enough medicine, no anaesthetic medicine, no child

1:17:06 > 1:17:10medicine, a be no milk for the children. No morphine, no dialysis

1:17:10 > 1:17:23applies. -- maybe no milk. You know we are under besiegement. Most of

1:17:23 > 1:17:30these items, we have a shortage on this medicine, and maybe some of

1:17:30 > 1:17:39it...You know that your president says that this area is being

1:17:39 > 1:17:42targeted, because rebels are embedded amongst civilians, that

1:17:42 > 1:17:53they are deliberately living amongst the residents of Eastern Ghouta -

1:17:53 > 1:17:59what do you say to your president? You mean my president is a Cheryl

1:17:59 > 1:18:12Assad? Yes. No, Bashar al-Assad is a criminal, it is not our president.

1:18:12 > 1:18:19The Syrian people want to withdraw or overthrow this regime. It is not

1:18:19 > 1:18:28our president. It is a criminal. He killed people, he destroy

1:18:28 > 1:18:33everything, he destroyed people, destroyed our schools, destroyed our

1:18:33 > 1:18:39hospitals. It's not from this country, I think it's not... It's

1:18:39 > 1:18:47not our president, of course. So, we don't... We don't want this criminal

1:18:47 > 1:19:01president.He is a survivor, though, what can you do about him?You know,

1:19:01 > 1:19:13in this day, we are just dealing with emergency to make this innocent

1:19:13 > 1:19:21children and people and women stay alive, just surviving... So, another

1:19:21 > 1:19:26patient just we can take them on waiting list. That's what we can do

1:19:26 > 1:19:35now have. We don't have enough medicine.For British people who are

1:19:35 > 1:19:39watching you now, most of them will have absolutely no idea how you

1:19:39 > 1:19:45manage to live, to survive, for seven years now, this war has been

1:19:45 > 1:19:50going on - tell us about the pressures on you as you try to stay

1:19:50 > 1:19:59alive?Yes, I want to stay alive, I am people, I am human being, I have

1:19:59 > 1:20:07a hard, I am scared. But I have to stay here and help my people. We

1:20:07 > 1:20:14have to build our future, build our country, so we need your solidarity,

1:20:14 > 1:20:20we need people, free people in the world, to be solidarity with us, to

1:20:20 > 1:20:28know that we are struggle to have our freedom, our democracy. We have

1:20:28 > 1:20:37to stay here and help our people. So, we need to stay in our towns,

1:20:37 > 1:20:45and here, my childhood hero, why history here, my schools... I have

1:20:45 > 1:20:56rights, hike everyone in this world have rights. -- my childhood here.

1:20:56 > 1:21:03So, we are killed, friends of Syrian people maybe leave us to be killed

1:21:03 > 1:21:08people but I don't know where is friends of Syria people.That is a

1:21:08 > 1:21:15very good question, what do you say, about the fact that the

1:21:15 > 1:21:19international community has done little or nothing to help people

1:21:19 > 1:21:21like yourself?Yes, the international community just

1:21:21 > 1:21:25watching, just watching our children killed. Why? Why are you just

1:21:25 > 1:21:32watching, where are you? We are poor people. We are people need your

1:21:32 > 1:21:39solidarity. Just leave your interests one-time, one-time leave

1:21:39 > 1:21:44your interests and deal with this catastrophe. We are going by talk

1:21:44 > 1:21:54towards famine. People maybe just have a meal maybe in one-day.

1:21:54 > 1:22:03Believe me, children have a meal in one-day. And adults away in two days

1:22:03 > 1:22:12have a meal. -- and adults maybe in two days have a meal. I have only

1:22:12 > 1:22:17breakfast in a day. We don't have enough food. We don't have enough

1:22:17 > 1:22:20food for people in shelters. People in shelters in a bad way, bad

1:22:20 > 1:22:25situation.Thank you, we are grateful for your time, we

1:22:25 > 1:22:36appreciate you talking to us. A doctor there, trapped on the

1:22:36 > 1:22:39outskirts of Damascus in Eastern Ghouta. This is a statement I wanted

1:22:39 > 1:22:43to show you from Unicef, the aid agency which is there to care for

1:22:43 > 1:22:48children. It is mostly What have they have written on the top is, no

1:22:48 > 1:22:51words will do justice to the children killed, their mothers

1:22:51 > 1:22:56Huddlestone so far, their loved ones. In the last few days 250

1:22:56 > 1:23:01people have been killed in Eastern Ghouta in Syria, and dozens of those

1:23:01 > 1:23:04are children.

1:23:07 > 1:23:10Here...

1:23:10 > 1:23:13Women who've had their ovaries or wombs removed to treat

1:23:13 > 1:23:16endometriosis have been telling this programme they are not receiving

1:23:16 > 1:23:17appropriate aftercare.

1:23:17 > 1:23:19Endometriosis is a condition where the layer of tissue

1:23:19 > 1:23:21that normally covers the inside of the uterus

1:23:21 > 1:23:24grows outside of it - leaving women in debilitating pain.

1:23:24 > 1:23:27The NHS won't freeze the eggs of all women who have a hysterectomy

1:23:27 > 1:23:32to treat the condition, but does offer this to cancer

1:23:32 > 1:23:39patients who have to undergo the same operation.

1:23:39 > 1:23:43It's left people with the condition asking why they have less of a right

1:23:43 > 1:23:44to children and to proper aftercare.

1:23:44 > 1:23:47Last week actor Lena Dunham revealed that she'd had a hysterectomy

1:23:47 > 1:23:49to treat her endometriosis - the pain of which she

1:23:49 > 1:23:50said was unbearable.

1:23:50 > 1:23:55176 million women worldwide live with it.

1:23:55 > 1:24:05Let's talk now to Clair Scrimshaw, who had a hysterectomy but was not

1:24:05 > 1:24:16offered the chance to have her eggs frozen. Salina Akhtar has not had to

1:24:16 > 1:24:20have a hysterectomy but sees problems in the kind of care offered

1:24:20 > 1:24:28to women. And Emma Cox is the CEO of the charity Endometriosis UK. She

1:24:28 > 1:24:32says there is a huge inequality in care across the NHS. Welcome all of

1:24:32 > 1:24:40you. Can you describe what it is and how it affected you and from what

1:24:40 > 1:24:45age?For me, endometriosis was something I had never heard of until

1:24:45 > 1:24:51I got diagnosed. My problems started at 13 when I started my period to. I

1:24:51 > 1:24:55would have extremely heavy bleeding, extreme pain, so going up the stairs

1:24:55 > 1:24:59for instance I would collapse sometimes. Going to the toilet, just

1:24:59 > 1:25:02normal, everyday things you take for granted, I was in so much pain that

1:25:02 > 1:25:07it was just ridiculous, I was taking time off school. That followed

1:25:07 > 1:25:14through into college and university and work. However, it took me 11

1:25:14 > 1:25:19years to get diagnosed.Age to 24 by then?Yes, I was. And by that point,

1:25:19 > 1:25:24I mean, I was just so poorly with it, and at that point, when I was

1:25:24 > 1:25:29diagnosed, actually, firmly enough, they told me I had endometriosis,

1:25:29 > 1:25:34they said, we're going to give you a course of injections for six months.

1:25:34 > 1:25:40Off you go. They never explained what it was. In my mind I thought it

1:25:40 > 1:25:44was something similar to a cold, something I could get rid of in

1:25:44 > 1:25:48terms of having these injections. So, nobody talked about potentially

1:25:48 > 1:25:52a hysterectomy or it affecting your fertility?No, nothing. As far as I

1:25:52 > 1:25:59was concerned, it was just those six injections.But in the end it was a

1:25:59 > 1:26:02number of operations culminating in a hysterectomy?Yes. I had a total

1:26:02 > 1:26:05of four surgeries for the endometriosis, and breach was using

1:26:05 > 1:26:10a kind of laser for the endometriosis and the other two were

1:26:10 > 1:26:15excision which is a deeper tissue which they kind of cutaway. Which is

1:26:15 > 1:26:17now the most standard treatment because it actually gets further

1:26:17 > 1:26:22down rather than just the superficial endometriosis. But then

1:26:22 > 1:26:29after that, I had another operation, tubes removed, that was in October

1:26:29 > 1:26:3520 16th and that did not work for me and finally, July 2017, my 34th

1:26:35 > 1:26:40birthday pretty much, I had a hysterectomy.And you asked about

1:26:40 > 1:26:43harvesting expert or freezing eggs? I did, there was a window of about a

1:26:43 > 1:26:48month or so between me speaking to a consultant at at you having a

1:26:48 > 1:26:53hysterectomy, where they said, if you want children it will cost you

1:26:53 > 1:26:57£3500 to freeze your eggs. And I had one week to make the decision.So,

1:26:57 > 1:27:02for me... Why were they charging you?Because at the time it was only

1:27:02 > 1:27:09specifically cancer patient I think who can get a free... I get a free

1:27:09 > 1:27:14cycle of IVF for endometriosis but I can't freeze my eggs for free.

1:27:14 > 1:27:24Understood. And so... How do you respond to that?At the time, it was

1:27:24 > 1:27:29quite stressful for me because I had been on morphine for years by that

1:27:29 > 1:27:34point. I take morphine every day and codeine and seven other extreme

1:27:34 > 1:27:39painkillers. It has been difficult to work, so I have worked when I can

1:27:39 > 1:27:42and had two operations and come away from working. So, obviously,

1:27:42 > 1:27:48financially, you're not particularly stable.Did you have £3500 to pay

1:27:48 > 1:27:55for the harvesting and freezing of eggs?No, I didn't. At the time, it

1:27:55 > 1:27:59is more your primary kind of focus is to get rid of the pain. So,

1:27:59 > 1:28:03mentally I was not in the right state of mind I don't think to even

1:28:03 > 1:28:08consider the impact of not freezing eggs. Because since I have had my

1:28:08 > 1:28:12hysterectomy unfortunately my two sisters have children and I do now

1:28:12 > 1:28:17feel like I would like perhaps the opportunity to have that experience.

1:28:17 > 1:28:26But I don't...Salina Akhtar, this is why I think you want to make a

1:28:26 > 1:28:29point about the inequality when it comes to certain treatments, certain

1:28:29 > 1:28:34conditions?Yep. I probably went through a similar experience. After

1:28:34 > 1:28:38my first surgery I thought I was cured, I did not know it was a

1:28:38 > 1:28:40lifelong issue. And I think I did not even realise what was happening

1:28:40 > 1:28:44until I started to feel unwell again about two or three years later, and

1:28:44 > 1:28:49I had to go back to my doctor, a different GP because I had moved,

1:28:49 > 1:28:53fight again to get to a gynaecologist to get diagnosed

1:28:53 > 1:28:56almost from scratch even though they had my surgery on file. And at no

1:28:56 > 1:28:59point along the way had I really been told how it would affect my

1:28:59 > 1:29:06fertility.And how has it?I can't have children, basically. Initially,

1:29:06 > 1:29:11probably I had a bit of a nervous breakdown, I will be honest. But I

1:29:11 > 1:29:15am resolved to that now. But had I been told at 25 when I first got

1:29:15 > 1:29:18diagnosed that if you let this condition progressed it can have

1:29:18 > 1:29:23that effect, maybe at that age I would have made a decision to have

1:29:23 > 1:29:26babies earlier in life or whatever. But when I was 30 I had another

1:29:26 > 1:29:32surgery and then, I had to go... I was with a partner at the time and

1:29:32 > 1:29:36we went to have IVF and we found that I could not have it on the NHS

1:29:36 > 1:29:39because I was not old enough running having the condition. So, we went

1:29:39 > 1:29:44private. Only through doing that did I find out that my body had gone

1:29:44 > 1:29:47into premature menopause. So I basically could not have children

1:29:47 > 1:29:51without an egg donor anyway. But had I known at 25 that there was a

1:29:51 > 1:30:00possibility of any of this happening, you think, actually,

1:30:00 > 1:30:03maybe I would have had kids at 25, you don't know.You might have made

1:30:03 > 1:30:06different decisions had you had the

1:30:06 > 1:30:07full information.Yeah. Carol, how many gynaecologists did it take

1:30:07 > 1:30:12before...? Sorry, it sounds like the start of a bad joke. Before you were

1:30:12 > 1:30:15diagnosed? My first gynaecologist told me that my problems were due to

1:30:15 > 1:30:19with stress and moving house. I waited a year and saw another one,

1:30:19 > 1:30:23finally operated and diagnosed endometriosis and told me she had

1:30:23 > 1:30:28fixed it. Which... I had never heard of it before, either. When someone

1:30:28 > 1:30:32tells you that they have fixed it, you think they have. But my pain was

1:30:32 > 1:30:35so much worse, and then I saw a third gynaecologist and he found

1:30:35 > 1:30:40endometriosis in my bowel and bladder. Which, OK, it might be a

1:30:40 > 1:30:45bit less common, but that is how it was affecting me, I had

1:30:45 > 1:30:48constipation, diarrhoea, I was having pain all month not just with

1:30:48 > 1:30:53my period. Painful intercourse throughout my 20s, which was really

1:30:53 > 1:30:56difficult to come to terms with. So it really affected me very badly by

1:30:56 > 1:31:01that point.

1:31:01 > 1:31:09In terms of the practicalities of your life now? What does it mean?It

1:31:09 > 1:31:12is really complicated, difficult condition. I wish I had been

1:31:12 > 1:31:18diagnosed earlier. I was 31 when I was diagnosed. I have had the lower

1:31:18 > 1:31:22part of my bowel removed and eight bladder operations. I live with half

1:31:22 > 1:31:29blood and out. I have had endometriosis between my kidney and

1:31:29 > 1:31:34bladder. I lived with a condition called lymphoedema so my leg is

1:31:34 > 1:31:38permanently swollen. In terms of where I am now, I am 45 and probably

1:31:38 > 1:31:41in better health than I have been for a long time but I chose to have

1:31:41 > 1:31:50a hysterectomy. I have a condition which can occur alongside

1:31:50 > 1:31:54endometriosis where cells actually grow in the wall of the win. It is

1:31:54 > 1:32:01really difficult because a hysterectomy does not cure and

1:32:01 > 1:32:06Demetrius is but for this other condition it can make a really big

1:32:06 > 1:32:12difference to our lives. -- endometriosis.We have heard here

1:32:12 > 1:32:18where people have conditions where they have to self catheterised. They

1:32:18 > 1:32:25have had no follow-up. I know Selena was being seen by two different

1:32:25 > 1:32:28gynaecologist for two differing conditions saying, ignore what the

1:32:28 > 1:32:33other one is saying want you to take these drugs. I am paraphrasing. I

1:32:33 > 1:32:39think Claire, her first operation was to have her ovaries removed and

1:32:39 > 1:32:48a hysterectomy came a few months later. She was told she could not

1:32:48 > 1:32:53harvest eggs and in the NHS because it is only endometriosis. If you are

1:32:53 > 1:32:57having an operation if, whatever reason you are having, it should not

1:32:57 > 1:33:06matter the cause. There should be pathways. With lymphoedema, if you

1:33:06 > 1:33:08had the same operations as Carroll quickly would be seen by a whole

1:33:08 > 1:33:13range of consultants. We were talking earlier with Claire Caligula

1:33:13 > 1:33:18discharged straight on two hours and you have had no follow-up. Only

1:33:18 > 1:33:21found out that the months later you should have been referred to the

1:33:21 > 1:33:28menopause clinic and had HRT therapy. I think there is an

1:33:28 > 1:33:31inequality we need to make a difference for these women.A couple

1:33:31 > 1:33:39of messages. Lindsay saying, I have stayed four endometriosis. How many

1:33:39 > 1:33:44stages are their quest to do know there were stages at all.There are

1:33:44 > 1:33:48two different ways of classifying it. There are stages one to four. It

1:33:48 > 1:33:59depends on where and how deep it is. OK, thank you. I had many

1:33:59 > 1:34:04misdiagnoses between the ages of ten and 28 and it has completely ruined

1:34:04 > 1:34:10my life. I lost my job of eight years and have had to take morphine

1:34:10 > 1:34:13every day during the four years. It is a horrific illness which takes

1:34:13 > 1:34:17far too long to diagnose and doctors do not seem to know too much about

1:34:17 > 1:34:22it or believe us when they say how much pain they are in. There is no

1:34:22 > 1:34:33cure. Thank you for bringing this issue onto your programme. Jean

1:34:33 > 1:34:35said, I had endometrial softer suffering a really bad pain which

1:34:35 > 1:34:37included painful sex and bad bleeding. On occasions this

1:34:37 > 1:34:42prevented me from going to work. I visited my GP many times and decided

1:34:42 > 1:34:47I had my appendix removed, which happened. It was not until I had an

1:34:47 > 1:34:53early hysterectomy that endometriosis was diagnosed. Thank

1:34:53 > 1:34:58you very much. Thank you for talking. I really appreciate it.

1:34:58 > 1:35:04Hopefully it will make a difference.

1:35:04 > 1:35:10Still to come.

1:35:10 > 1:35:18We will hear a story about an honour killing. We will also discuss

1:35:18 > 1:35:21homeless people being trapped into modern day slavery and find out what

1:35:21 > 1:35:23we can do to stop it.

1:35:23 > 1:35:29Time for the latest news.

1:35:29 > 1:35:39The Metropolitan Police has lost its Supreme Court challenge over the

1:35:39 > 1:35:44victims of John Worboys. The women say the treatment by police calls

1:35:44 > 1:35:47the mental harm. The Supreme Court unanimously dismissed the appeal

1:35:47 > 1:35:54from the police. The women are also separately pursuing a judicial

1:35:54 > 1:36:00review of the parole board decision to release John Worboys. The United

1:36:00 > 1:36:04Nations has urged world leaders to push for an end to the bombardment

1:36:04 > 1:36:15of eastern Ghouta. The UN said 400,000 people were living in

1:36:15 > 1:36:18unimaginable conditions. UK unemployment has increased slightly

1:36:18 > 1:36:24for the first time in two nears. The number of unemployed people rose by

1:36:24 > 1:36:2836,000 to 1.47 million for the final quarter of Austria, compared to the

1:36:28 > 1:36:32previous three months. Despite the fighting crease in the rate of

1:36:32 > 1:36:37unemployment, the total number of people in work rose by 80 8000. --

1:36:37 > 1:36:50the increasing rate. Dua Lipa is leading the way to the highest

1:36:50 > 1:36:55number of nominations are given to a female artist. She had a number one,

1:36:55 > 1:37:03the 21-year-old, and is heading to 21,000 sales with her debut album.

1:37:03 > 1:37:08That is a summary of the BBC News. More messages from you regarding

1:37:08 > 1:37:10Fiona, the woman respect with beginning of the programme, one of

1:37:10 > 1:37:13two woman taking a case to the Supreme Court against the metabolic

1:37:13 > 1:37:23and police. The two women one. They argued their case. -- the

1:37:23 > 1:37:30Metropolitan Police. This just coming in.

1:37:37 > 1:37:40The person who attacked me had done it several times but nothing has

1:37:40 > 1:37:47ever been brought against them. I feel betrayed by the justice system.

1:37:47 > 1:37:50This text... Listening to Fiona, I totally feel her pain in having the

1:37:50 > 1:37:56shock of seeing John Worboys in court. As a victim of sexual assault

1:37:56 > 1:38:0314 years ago and where I did not go to the police I saw the person in a

1:38:03 > 1:38:07supermarket out of the blue. Mercedes said, and goodness the

1:38:07 > 1:38:10Supreme Court has made the right decision. As a former police officer

1:38:10 > 1:38:17I am ashamed of the way this case was handled by the Met. Fiona,

1:38:17 > 1:38:22outside the Supreme Court, known in court as DST, said, on reacting to

1:38:22 > 1:38:27the judgment, it has been an emotional day, 15 years. Referring

1:38:27 > 1:38:32to the police can she added, had you done your job properly, there would

1:38:32 > 1:38:37not have been 105 victims were there would have been won. I could have

1:38:37 > 1:38:45taken the one but not the 105.

1:38:45 > 1:38:51We are going to introduce you to this robot. We will show you how he

1:38:51 > 1:38:57mimics the facial expressions of people like me in order to help

1:38:57 > 1:39:02teach autistic children how to learn emotion. Absolutely fascinating. I

1:39:02 > 1:39:08was going to say we will talk to him before 11. We're not going to do

1:39:08 > 1:39:19that but we are going to talk about it before 11. Now the sport.

1:39:19 > 1:39:26Another busy day at the Winter Olympics.

1:39:26 > 1:39:33Team GB's Women's curling team has reach the semi finals.

1:39:33 > 1:39:35They came through a very difficult matchup

1:39:35 > 1:39:37against the defending champions Canada, snatching the win with two

1:39:37 > 1:39:39points on the final end.

1:39:39 > 1:39:42The 6-5 win for Team GB also means the Canadians are knocked out -

1:39:42 > 1:39:44failing to reach the semi-finals for the first time.

1:39:44 > 1:39:46Things were very very different for Team GB's men -

1:39:46 > 1:39:50as the United States scored 4 points in the eighth end to hand Britain

1:39:50 > 1:39:51a crushing 10-4 defeat.

1:39:51 > 1:39:53That means GB have a Play-off on the way against Switzerland,

1:39:53 > 1:39:57From the ice to the snow - Billy Morgan is into the final

1:39:57 > 1:40:03of the inaugural Big Air competition - scoring 90.5 on his second run.

1:40:03 > 1:40:10Lionel Messi's late strike denied Chelsea going into the next round

1:40:10 > 1:40:18against Barcelona. More sport after 11 o'clock.

1:40:18 > 1:40:22Drones turned into missiles. Fake videos manipulating public opinion

1:40:22 > 1:40:31and automated hacking. The malicious use of artificial intelligence

1:40:31 > 1:40:36report is warning that AI is ripe for exploitation by rogue states and

1:40:36 > 1:40:44terrorists. More is needed to be done to mitigate possible misuses of

1:40:44 > 1:40:48technology. Let's talk about the risks and the positives. One

1:40:48 > 1:40:56researcher behind

1:40:56 > 1:41:02today's port is a doctor who is here. Sarah Ben at is also here. On

1:41:02 > 1:41:11our table is the robot. We have a doctor from UCL's Institute of

1:41:11 > 1:41:22education. You study risk for a living. What are the long-term risks

1:41:22 > 1:41:33imposed by gases proposed by AI? -- proposed by AI? We could go as far

1:41:33 > 1:41:46as human extinction. That sounds apocalyptic.No human beings left.

1:41:46 > 1:41:49There have been various conversations about long-term with

1:41:49 > 1:41:55artificial intelligence and machines which can perform better than humans

1:41:55 > 1:41:59and the risks that they might pose this is not what this report is

1:41:59 > 1:42:06about what it looks at the that we have now in the next five years and

1:42:06 > 1:42:13how they might be misused by hackers with malicious intent to cause harm.

1:42:13 > 1:42:17That is something I have mentioned in the introduction. I am fascinated

1:42:17 > 1:42:26about how we go from that to human extinction.So... I must say I

1:42:26 > 1:42:29haven't prepared that this is something I do talk about quite a

1:42:29 > 1:42:37lot.Do me to come back to you.In principle, we are making machines

1:42:37 > 1:42:41that can think. It is proving extremely difficult. Five years ago

1:42:41 > 1:42:45you could not have a computer that tells apart a cat from a dog. The

1:42:45 > 1:42:50fact we can do so now brings about risks in the near Temple submitted

1:42:50 > 1:42:53how long will take until we have computers he can do everything that

1:42:53 > 1:43:00humans can do. -- in the near-term but we do not know how long it will

1:43:00 > 1:43:07take. If you can do everything a human can do, you can do much more

1:43:07 > 1:43:10than a human can do. If we make such systems were not shown we are in

1:43:10 > 1:43:16control of the more that they want what we want, we might end up in a

1:43:16 > 1:43:20world where are the kind of world we have wanted to create is not one we

1:43:20 > 1:43:24want to inhabit and we will not be in a position to stay there. They

1:43:24 > 1:43:29would kill us all? Create an environment in which we could not

1:43:29 > 1:43:35stay.How worried are you? To be honest, not as worried as perhaps

1:43:35 > 1:43:39the initial discussion might suggest. We certainly nowhere near

1:43:39 > 1:43:42having machines that can in any way think for themselves, we don't have

1:43:42 > 1:43:51sent a unique beings. One thing technology struggles with is past

1:43:51 > 1:43:55transfer. They are based on data we are feeding them. We are very much

1:43:55 > 1:44:01in control of this technology and it is not something we see making its

1:44:01 > 1:44:06completely its own decisions. Not yet. Not yet. For now, I feeling

1:44:06 > 1:44:13fairly calm about it and in control. You advise companies on robotics and

1:44:13 > 1:44:22AI. Can you give us some real-life examples?Certainly do if I can just

1:44:22 > 1:44:28respond. What we should not ignore is the fact that our protection

1:44:28 > 1:44:33systems, we also become cleverer. The same technology, artificial

1:44:33 > 1:44:35intelligence, that creates the potential for all the harm

1:44:35 > 1:44:39highlighted by the report will also enable us to have better protection

1:44:39 > 1:44:47systems. I just wanted to make sure and provide a balanced view...There

1:44:47 > 1:44:51are people working on developing protection systems right now.Let me

1:44:51 > 1:44:56give you an example. 10/20 years ago, we did not have a virus

1:44:56 > 1:45:03checkers. As viruses became unleashed on world companies propped

1:45:03 > 1:45:08up -- popped up to develop virus checkers and protection for computer

1:45:08 > 1:45:13systems. Cyber security will get a lot more enhanced because of

1:45:13 > 1:45:17artificial intelligence. To tell you about examples of where AI is being

1:45:17 > 1:45:20used effectively it is being used by businesses do is being used by

1:45:20 > 1:45:23businesses to speed up business processes. For example, you might

1:45:23 > 1:45:28hear of a train company here in the UK that is handling its customer

1:45:28 > 1:45:34complaints, using AI for that, and they are getting refunds for

1:45:34 > 1:45:38customers processed much more quickly.Is it like an enhanced

1:45:38 > 1:45:46computer?It literally mimics human processes where you need to make the

1:45:46 > 1:45:51judgment. It mimics that. Documents coming the claims come in.It looks

1:45:51 > 1:45:59for the important points.It being what? AI. What does it look like?A

1:45:59 > 1:46:12piece of software. She says disappointedly. Back enough. We also

1:46:12 > 1:46:17wanted to talk about some of the incredible things which robots are

1:46:17 > 1:46:25getting involved in, and AI. Dr Alyssa Alcorn, how are we using this

1:46:25 > 1:46:30robot?I am part of a project which is looking at using this robot as a

1:46:30 > 1:46:33teaching tool for young children on the autism spectrum to learn about

1:46:33 > 1:46:40emotions.So, we're going to show how it works. Let's hope this works.

1:46:40 > 1:46:47Never work with children, animals or robots! So, Zeno is going to mimic

1:46:47 > 1:46:50the expressions on my face, and I'm told they have to be rather a judge

1:46:50 > 1:46:56rated.So, as Victoria is making an expression, the camera here...That

1:46:56 > 1:47:03is my shocked face!I am very convinced! So, the camera here is

1:47:03 > 1:47:07tracking 49 facial landmarks on your face and effectively using them like

1:47:07 > 1:47:13instructions, telling the motors in the robots face what to do.Is he

1:47:13 > 1:47:17copying the?He is turning his head as you turn your head - try and

1:47:17 > 1:47:26angry face.I am never angry, this will be very hard!He's doing his

1:47:26 > 1:47:29best there. Maybe you just don't look angry enough!Life is good at

1:47:29 > 1:47:40the moment! So, really, really happy...He looks pretty happy, too,

1:47:40 > 1:47:44there. So, we're interested in using this very early on in teaching

1:47:44 > 1:47:49children on the autism spectrum about emotions, because they might

1:47:49 > 1:47:54not pay attention to faces.So, with all of those expressions, not that

1:47:54 > 1:47:58interesting, but seeing a robot would have an impact on a child on

1:47:58 > 1:48:01the autistic spectrum?Simply meeting the robot will probably not

1:48:01 > 1:48:05have an impact, we're talking about a teaching programme over a longer

1:48:05 > 1:48:09period. But it is thought that children on the spectrum might be

1:48:09 > 1:48:12more comfortable interacting with a robot, because it is a simpler than

1:48:12 > 1:48:17a person. We can programme the robot to only give a limited range of

1:48:17 > 1:48:21social cues at one time, and to make him be able to repeat those in

1:48:21 > 1:48:25exactly the same way over and over. People are a lot less consistent,

1:48:25 > 1:48:32they can be much more confusing. So it is thought that that might lower

1:48:32 > 1:48:35the demand of the interruption on the child, so they can maybe get

1:48:35 > 1:48:38more out of the learning experience - that's one of the things we want

1:48:38 > 1:48:41to test in this project, is if that seems to be true.Thank you very

1:48:41 > 1:48:47much. Really interesting. And thank you to Zeno. I cannot believe I am

1:48:47 > 1:48:51thanking a robot, but this is what the world is going to be about!

1:48:51 > 1:48:54Thank you all of you are coming on the programme. At 11 o'clock we're

1:48:54 > 1:48:57going to bring you more reaction to the Supreme Court ruling handed down

1:48:57 > 1:49:02today in the case of two women who were arguing that the Met Police

1:49:02 > 1:49:06failed to investigate their claims that they were raped by the black

1:49:06 > 1:49:11cab driver John Worboys. The cases weren't thoroughly investigated,

1:49:11 > 1:49:15that's what they were arguing. They have won is mourning. And the

1:49:15 > 1:49:18Metropolitan Police have lost just more reaction to that after 11. --

1:49:18 > 1:49:25they have won this morning.

1:49:25 > 1:49:28In July 2016, Samia Shahid was raped and murdered during a visit

1:49:28 > 1:49:31to see family in Pakistan.

1:49:31 > 1:49:33The 28-year-old from Bradford had been living in Dubai with her second

1:49:33 > 1:49:36husband after her first arranged marriage to her cousin broke down.

1:49:36 > 1:49:39Her decision to divorce and re-marry for love caused a huge

1:49:39 > 1:49:43rift with her family.

1:49:43 > 1:49:50As this actor, speaking the words of four I's best friend in the UK,

1:49:50 > 1:49:53explains.From her parents' point of view they were doing the right thing

1:49:53 > 1:50:02by her. My mum and dad are Pakistani but I'm not. I'm from the UK. How

1:50:02 > 1:50:08could I change all of a sudden? How can I be the villager from back

1:50:08 > 1:50:15home? He knew she didn't want to marry him so why couldn't he have

1:50:15 > 1:50:19been the bigger person and say, you know what, she doesn't want to spend

1:50:19 > 1:50:24the rest of her life with you, why should I marry you? He could have

1:50:24 > 1:50:30helped her, here's how cars in, he has known her since they were kids.

1:50:30 > 1:50:32-- he is her cars in.

1:50:32 > 1:50:34Desperate to try and resolve the fallout she flew out

1:50:34 > 1:50:36to Pakistan, despite fears for her safety.

1:50:36 > 1:50:38Six days into her trip, Samia's father called the police

1:50:38 > 1:50:41and said she'd had a heart attack and was lying dead at

1:50:41 > 1:50:42bottom of the stairs.

1:50:42 > 1:50:45She was buried within a day, but the story didn't stack up

1:50:45 > 1:50:47for Samia's second husband, and her friends in the UK.

1:50:47 > 1:50:52They became suspicious and began a quest for the truth,

1:50:52 > 1:50:54Now, for the first time, Samia's second husband,

1:50:54 > 1:50:57Mukhtar has spoken about her murder in a new BBC documentary.

1:50:57 > 1:51:07Here he talks about why his wife decided to make that fateful trip.

1:51:07 > 1:51:12I get a call from the cousin asking about Samia, and he told me that her

1:51:12 > 1:51:15aunt, which was her ex-mother-in-law, she passed away.

1:51:15 > 1:51:22She was really in shock.She really loved her auntie.There is no denial

1:51:22 > 1:51:31about that, she cried a lot when she died. She wanted to go to Pakistan

1:51:31 > 1:51:33after that and we had this discussion why she shouldn't go to

1:51:33 > 1:51:41Pakistan. And then, after a few weeks, she started getting these

1:51:41 > 1:51:46emotional dialogue! From the family, the father is not well, he is going

1:51:46 > 1:51:49to pass away any time, you need to come. Things might happen to the

1:51:49 > 1:51:55Father...

1:51:55 > 1:51:58We're going to talk now to Bradford MP Naz Shah, who wrote

1:51:58 > 1:52:02to the Prime Minister of Pakistan immediately after Samia's death,

1:52:02 > 1:52:04describing the case as an "honour killing" and calling

1:52:04 > 1:52:06for an investigation.

1:52:06 > 1:52:12How did you first hear about Samia? I had a lady calling the, a

1:52:12 > 1:52:15constituent who rang me on the Friday after her death and said to

1:52:15 > 1:52:21me, can you support me? And if you can't will you signpost me, I know

1:52:21 > 1:52:25this girl has been murdered, can you help us? That is how I got involved.

1:52:25 > 1:52:31And what did you learn about what could have happened to her?Well,

1:52:31 > 1:52:34originally, in the community, it was, she had an asthma attack, she

1:52:34 > 1:52:37had a heart attack. And as I started speaking to her friends, and people

1:52:37 > 1:52:42who knew her, they all said very, very clearly, this girl married out

1:52:42 > 1:52:46of her own choice and she was taken to Pakistan, there were lots of

1:52:46 > 1:52:51police involvement previously when she decided to marry the cousin out

1:52:51 > 1:52:57of her own choice and leave her first husband, and to me it had the

1:52:57 > 1:52:59hallmarks of a so-called "honour killing". That was the minute I

1:52:59 > 1:53:05heard about it.And she herself, we can see the messages, she was

1:53:05 > 1:53:10worried about going to Pakistan, she said she had not had reassurances

1:53:10 > 1:53:13but she desperately wanted to go to see her sick relative?She was told

1:53:13 > 1:53:18to go and see her father who was ill, her cousin who wanted her to

1:53:18 > 1:53:21go. I have read the messages I have seen the screenshots of him saying,

1:53:21 > 1:53:27come home if he was panicked every time he did not hear from her... And

1:53:27 > 1:53:30the last message was just after 12 o'clock and after that we did not

1:53:30 > 1:53:36hear from her. And the next thing we knew she had been murdered.What do

1:53:36 > 1:53:41we take from this horrific case? Well, there's a few things. For

1:53:41 > 1:53:44Samia's legacy we really, really need to get justice. Although her

1:53:44 > 1:53:49father passed away last month, I think it was, we still have an

1:53:49 > 1:53:52ex-husband who is charged with her rape and her murder who is in

1:53:52 > 1:53:58custody in Pakistan. The court case is going to be transferred, because

1:53:58 > 1:54:01a police officer was done for corruption in this case as well, so

1:54:01 > 1:54:05it was really, really important to get political and media pressure in

1:54:05 > 1:54:08Pakistan and the Guardian played a huge role in Britain to highlight

1:54:08 > 1:54:12its. But also legally speaking, we have got the new ample domestic

1:54:12 > 1:54:15violence abuse bill coming through an end that we hope there will be

1:54:15 > 1:54:20new powers which will mean that if we have another case, where a Samia

1:54:20 > 1:54:24is going to Pakistan and is murdered in India or Pakistan or wherever,

1:54:24 > 1:54:28then our police force can start asking questions, and that is really

1:54:28 > 1:54:31important, because it sends out the message, you cannot take one of our

1:54:31 > 1:54:34British children abroad and think you can kill them and get away with

1:54:34 > 1:54:37it.Thank you very much.

1:54:37 > 1:54:41You can watch Murdered for Love?

1:54:41 > 1:54:48Samia Shahid, tonight at 9pm on BBC Two.

1:54:48 > 1:54:50The epidemic of violent knife crime in London has claimed

1:54:50 > 1:54:52two more fatalities.

1:54:52 > 1:54:54Both were stabbed to death last night in Kentish Town,

1:54:54 > 1:54:56in the north of the city.

1:54:56 > 1:54:59It brings the number of people stabbed to death

1:54:59 > 1:55:02in the capital since the beginning of the year to 16.

1:55:02 > 1:55:08BBC London's reporter Greg McKenzie is on the scene of one

1:55:08 > 1:55:12of last night's incidents.

1:55:12 > 1:55:16Police were called to Malden Road just after ten o'clock last night,

1:55:16 > 1:55:20with reports of a man believed to be in his 20s who had suffered from

1:55:20 > 1:55:23staff wounds. When they arrived they pronounced him dead here at the

1:55:23 > 1:55:27scene. An hour and a half before that incident here on Malden Road

1:55:27 > 1:55:34just behind me, there was a separate stabbing, a teenager was stabbed on

1:55:34 > 1:55:38Bartholomew Road. That is about 15-20 minutes from this location

1:55:38 > 1:55:43by-footer. It is believed he was a teenager, and local residents have

1:55:43 > 1:55:47said -- on foot -- that they saw the mother of the teenager being

1:55:47 > 1:55:51comforted by the police. She was in an emotional state and taken to a

1:55:51 > 1:55:56local community centre. It was there where family members gathered and a

1:55:56 > 1:56:01number of police community officers were talking to the family and local

1:56:01 > 1:56:03residents on the estate, saying they're shocked and saddened about

1:56:03 > 1:56:08what has happened but say this is a reality of living in this area.

1:56:08 > 1:56:11Earlier in the programme, we brought you the story of how

1:56:11 > 1:56:13hundreds of Britain's homeless are being trapped

1:56:13 > 1:56:23into modern slavery.

1:56:23 > 1:56:37We can speak a bit about this now. There are many people trapped into

1:56:37 > 1:56:41modern slavery despite the act? There, we have been aware of this

1:56:41 > 1:56:46for some time, we have been commissioned to do some work on, we

1:56:46 > 1:56:50have found out, of the six D1 organisations that we surveyed,

1:56:50 > 1:56:54about 64% had had experience of this. So it is a huge issue on the

1:56:54 > 1:56:59ground and with the rise in rough sleeping, the latest figures show a

1:56:59 > 1:57:04159% rise in both sleeping on the streets since 2010. There is a huge

1:57:04 > 1:57:11amount of people there to be preyed on.Caroline Haughey, why is this

1:57:11 > 1:57:19happening run in the introduction of the legislation with the Modern

1:57:19 > 1:57:24Slavery Act?People have an expectation to go and get their car

1:57:24 > 1:57:27washed for £4, and we as a society are encouraging it because we want

1:57:27 > 1:57:33more for less. When people want more for less, people who are vulnerable,

1:57:33 > 1:57:36weather it the alcohol, mental health, financial, then they are the

1:57:36 > 1:57:41ones who are going to be exploited. If you don't have a home, and

1:57:41 > 1:57:44somebody offers you a roof over your head, even though you probably know

1:57:44 > 1:57:53it is not going to be on great Toms, it is the least worst alternative.I

1:57:53 > 1:57:57take your point about people wanting a car wash for £4, but who is

1:57:57 > 1:58:01supposed to enforce this legislation, us, the police?

1:58:01 > 1:58:05Actually it is not about enforcing the legislation, the legislation is

1:58:05 > 1:58:09being enforced, we're seeing raids happened, we are seeing a leasing

1:58:09 > 1:58:12attitude change and we are seeing prosecutions on the increase. I

1:58:12 > 1:58:18think it has got to be education, health care, social services, the

1:58:18 > 1:58:23police have to keep stepping up to the mark as well.But I think we all

1:58:23 > 1:58:26have to be involved in trying to help our fellow man for the better.

1:58:26 > 1:58:33Thank you. Mick Clarke and Caroline Haughey, thank you.