0:00:18 > 0:00:21Hello there and welcome to Wednesday in Parliament.
0:00:21 > 0:00:23On this programme, the government's accused of still not knowing
0:00:23 > 0:00:24how to handle Brexit.
0:00:24 > 0:00:26We have a government that cannot tell us the plan,
0:00:27 > 0:00:30because they do not have a plan!
0:00:30 > 0:00:33But the Leader of the Commons says it's Labour that's in disarray.
0:00:33 > 0:00:36It's quarrelling, like Mutiny on the Bounty
0:00:36 > 0:00:41as reshot by the Carry On team!
0:00:41 > 0:00:43The government's defeated in the Lords over calls
0:00:43 > 0:00:48for funding for some bereaved families at inquests.
0:00:48 > 0:00:50And there's a demand for the government
0:00:50 > 0:00:52to create more woodlands.
0:00:52 > 0:00:55It can create habitats for wildlife and wonderful places
0:00:55 > 0:00:58for people to enjoy, and it can provide the raw material
0:00:58 > 0:01:03to build the new homes that this country needs.
0:01:03 > 0:01:06But first, before the day got underway, there was something
0:01:06 > 0:01:09of a tussle before the government agreed to publish some
0:01:09 > 0:01:11sort of plan for Brexit, before triggering Article 50 -
0:01:11 > 0:01:16the formal process for leaving the EU.
0:01:16 > 0:01:20Some Tory MPs were set to gang up with Labour in a vote to force
0:01:20 > 0:01:22the Prime Minister's hand and, eventually, the government put
0:01:22 > 0:01:24forward its own amendment to Labour's motion for debate
0:01:24 > 0:01:28agreeing that it would publish its plans on negotiating the exit deal.
0:01:28 > 0:01:30But before all that got underway, there was the small matter
0:01:30 > 0:01:35of Prime Minister's Questions.
0:01:35 > 0:01:38With Theresa May out of the country, it was down to
0:01:38 > 0:01:40the Leader of the Commons to field the questions and
0:01:40 > 0:01:43Labour's Shadow Foreign Secretary to try to put him on the spot.
0:01:43 > 0:01:46She began by accepting that the government had given ground.
0:01:46 > 0:01:50We welcome the government's decision to accept our motion today
0:01:50 > 0:01:52that they will show Parliament their plan for Brexit
0:01:53 > 0:01:56before Article 50 is triggered.
0:01:56 > 0:01:59So, can I ask the Leader of the House one
0:01:59 > 0:02:00central question about this plan?
0:02:00 > 0:02:04Does the government want the UK to remain part of the customs union?
0:02:04 > 0:02:07The government has always made it clear that we would seek
0:02:07 > 0:02:09to give additional clarity about our position at
0:02:09 > 0:02:13the earliest opportunity.
0:02:13 > 0:02:16But it's been the case, as my right honourable friend,
0:02:16 > 0:02:21the Prime Minister, has said many times that one of our core
0:02:21 > 0:02:23objectives is going to be to secure the maximum freedom
0:02:23 > 0:02:25for British companies both to have access to and operate
0:02:25 > 0:02:27within the single European market.
0:02:27 > 0:02:32I thank the Leader of the House for that answer,
0:02:32 > 0:02:35but I would respectfully say to him that surely, on this
0:02:35 > 0:02:37issue, the answer should be straightforward.
0:02:37 > 0:02:40We all know that it would be a disaster for British business
0:02:40 > 0:02:44if we do not remain part of the customs union.
0:02:44 > 0:02:47As the Leader of the House himself said in February,
0:02:47 > 0:02:50everything we take for granted -
0:02:50 > 0:02:54trade without customs checks or paperwork at national frontiers -
0:02:54 > 0:02:57would all be up in the air. It is massive what is at risk.
0:02:57 > 0:03:00Now, on this side of the House, we would agree with him.
0:03:00 > 0:03:03We couldn't agree with him more!
0:03:03 > 0:03:06So can he put it beyond doubt right now, today, tell us -
0:03:06 > 0:03:12does the government want the UK to stay in the customs union?
0:03:13 > 0:03:16The honourable lady and I...
0:03:16 > 0:03:18She's right, Mr Speaker.
0:03:18 > 0:03:21The honourable lady and I both argued passionately for the Remain
0:03:21 > 0:03:24cause during the referendum.
0:03:24 > 0:03:28What separates us now is that I am part of a Conservative government
0:03:28 > 0:03:31which is working together to respect the democratic verdict
0:03:31 > 0:03:36of the British people and to secure the best possible outcome
0:03:36 > 0:03:40for the prosperity and security of the entire United Kingdom
0:03:40 > 0:03:45from those negotiations.
0:03:45 > 0:03:47Whereas the honourable lady, even just two months ago,
0:03:47 > 0:03:50was telling us that she wanted to go back to the
0:03:50 > 0:03:53British people in some way.
0:03:53 > 0:03:55She needs to decide whether she accepts
0:03:55 > 0:03:56the democratic verdict or not.
0:03:56 > 0:03:59The Leader of the House has made the familiar arguments
0:03:59 > 0:04:00that he can't give answers,
0:04:00 > 0:04:02that it's all to be resolved through negotiations,
0:04:02 > 0:04:04Brexit means Brexit, Brexit means breakfast,
0:04:04 > 0:04:08but that is not what the Secretary of State for Brexit himself said
0:04:08 > 0:04:12when he was asked about the customs union in September.
0:04:12 > 0:04:15Because he said, and I quote, "We have looked at this matter
0:04:15 > 0:04:18carefully and that is exactly the sort of decision
0:04:18 > 0:04:23that we will resolve before we trigger Article 50."
0:04:23 > 0:04:26So, if the government is going to decide the position
0:04:26 > 0:04:31on this issue before March the 31st, can the Leader of the House confirm
0:04:31 > 0:04:34that the British people and the British Parliament will be
0:04:34 > 0:04:40told some answers to my questions before they tell the rest of Europe?
0:04:40 > 0:04:43Mr Speaker, if the answers sound familiar, it may be because we need
0:04:43 > 0:04:47some repetition before the honourable lady will understand
0:04:47 > 0:04:50and appreciate the, um...
0:04:50 > 0:04:56The government is, at the moment, engaged in a consultation with more
0:04:56 > 0:05:03than 50 sectors of United Kingdom business to ascertain precisely
0:05:03 > 0:05:08which aspects of European Union membership work well for them,
0:05:08 > 0:05:11which they see as harmful, where the opportunities
0:05:11 > 0:05:16beyond EU membership live.
0:05:16 > 0:05:17beyond EU membership lie.
0:05:17 > 0:05:20We will come to a decision and we will go into negotiations
0:05:20 > 0:05:23on behalf of the full 100% of the United Kingdom population
0:05:23 > 0:05:25and all four nations of the United Kingdom.
0:05:25 > 0:05:28We have a government that cannot tell us the plan,
0:05:28 > 0:05:32because they do not have a plan! They do not have a plan!
0:05:32 > 0:05:35In February, in February, the Leader of the House said,
0:05:35 > 0:05:38when he was hearing about the... what he was hearing about from
0:05:38 > 0:05:43the Leave campaign was confusing, contradictory nonsense!
0:05:43 > 0:05:45My final question is this...
0:05:45 > 0:05:51Are we hearing anything different from this government today?
0:05:51 > 0:05:58Mr Speaker, we will publish before Article 50 is triggered a statement
0:05:58 > 0:06:02about our negotiating strategy and objectives, as the Prime
0:06:02 > 0:06:07Minister has said yesterday.
0:06:07 > 0:06:11But the honourable lady seems again to be in a state of utter denial
0:06:11 > 0:06:17about the consequences that flow from the referendum decision.
0:06:17 > 0:06:19And he accused Labour of being in disarray.
0:06:19 > 0:06:24It's like, um...
0:06:24 > 0:06:26It's quarrelling like Mutiny on the Bounty as reshot
0:06:26 > 0:06:30by the Carry On team! LAUGHTER
0:06:30 > 0:06:33They are... Order!
0:06:33 > 0:06:36There's far too much noise! I want to hear the words flowing!
0:06:36 > 0:06:40They are rudderless, they are drifting on Europe,
0:06:40 > 0:06:44as on so many other aspects of policy!
0:06:44 > 0:06:47It's little wonder that so many decent working people,
0:06:47 > 0:06:52who for generations looked to Labour to be champion, have given up
0:06:52 > 0:06:55who for generations looked to Labour to be their champion, have given up
0:06:55 > 0:06:58in despair and are turning to this party as the authentic voice
0:06:58 > 0:06:59of working families.
0:06:59 > 0:07:02A DUP MP looked ahead to the debate on Brexit that was due
0:07:02 > 0:07:04to begin immediately after Prime minister's questions.
0:07:04 > 0:07:07Does the Leader of the House agree that tonight's vote
0:07:07 > 0:07:10on the Prime Minister's amendment, which we fully support,
0:07:10 > 0:07:14is a vote of the highest significance and great importance,
0:07:14 > 0:07:17because, for the first time, honourable and right honourable
0:07:17 > 0:07:20members of this House will have the opportunity to vote
0:07:20 > 0:07:22on whether they respect the will of the people
0:07:22 > 0:07:24of the United Kingdom and whether they will get
0:07:24 > 0:07:27on in implementing it.
0:07:27 > 0:07:31The people will be able to read in Hansard tomorrow who stands
0:07:31 > 0:07:33by respecting the will of the people of the United Kingdom.
0:07:33 > 0:07:37And would he also agree that the more...
0:07:37 > 0:07:40And I'm sure that he will!
0:07:40 > 0:07:43..the more red, white and blue he makes it, the better for us
0:07:43 > 0:07:47on the Unionist benches?
0:07:47 > 0:07:51The, um, the right honourable gentleman, as so often,
0:07:51 > 0:07:57makes a very powerful and important point.
0:07:57 > 0:08:01The vote tonight will be the first opportunity for members of this
0:08:01 > 0:08:04House to decide whether or not they support the government's
0:08:04 > 0:08:10timetable of triggering Article 50 by the end of March 2017 and any
0:08:10 > 0:08:15right honourable member who votes against that motion will,
0:08:15 > 0:08:18in my view, be seeking to thwart the outcome of the referendum
0:08:18 > 0:08:22in the most profoundly undemocratic fashion.
0:08:22 > 0:08:25David Lidington.
0:08:25 > 0:08:28And soon after Prime Minister's Questions came the six hour
0:08:28 > 0:08:30Commons debate on Brexit.
0:08:30 > 0:08:35Much of the heat had been taken out of the debate by the government's
0:08:35 > 0:08:38decision on Tuesday night to agree to publish its plan
0:08:38 > 0:08:41on how it intends negotiating Britain's exit deal.
0:08:41 > 0:08:43Nonetheless, there was still room for plenty of argument
0:08:43 > 0:08:44on how events might unfold.
0:08:44 > 0:08:48First, Labour explained why it wanted a plan.
0:08:48 > 0:08:52The purpose of this motion, calling for a plan, is not
0:08:52 > 0:08:55to frustrate or delay the process.
0:08:55 > 0:08:59That is not the purpose, that is not why we're calling for a plan.
0:08:59 > 0:09:03It does present a challenge for the government.
0:09:03 > 0:09:06Because it now means the government has got to produce a plan in good
0:09:06 > 0:09:09time to allow the proper formalities and processes to be gone through.
0:09:09 > 0:09:11It's a challenge...
0:09:11 > 0:09:13The timetable actually is more of a challenge for the government
0:09:13 > 0:09:15than it is for the opposition.
0:09:15 > 0:09:17I can understand him pressing the government for its plans
0:09:17 > 0:09:19and him setting down his red lines.
0:09:19 > 0:09:22I can't understand him wanting to enshrine it in legislation.
0:09:22 > 0:09:25The only reason for doing that is so that the Labour Party can
0:09:25 > 0:09:27set the government up to be sued later.
0:09:27 > 0:09:28Isn't that the truth? Will he come clean?
0:09:28 > 0:09:34It's wrecking tactics by any other name.
0:09:34 > 0:09:37The answer to the question is no.
0:09:37 > 0:09:41Mr Speaker, when he talks about a plan, could he explain
0:09:41 > 0:09:44to the House does he mean that should be a series of hints?
0:09:44 > 0:09:48Is it an explanation of principle? Or is it specific priorities?
0:09:48 > 0:09:51I understand the point that is made about not producing a plan
0:09:51 > 0:09:55on the basis that saying anything might undermine the negotiations.
0:09:56 > 0:09:57I don't accept that.
0:09:57 > 0:10:02He does understand that no plan survives engagement with the enemy.
0:10:02 > 0:10:04And whilst I do not characterise...
0:10:04 > 0:10:09That is a military metaphor from a soldier.
0:10:09 > 0:10:11WOMAN: The enemy?!
0:10:11 > 0:10:16And what I would say to the honourable gentleman
0:10:16 > 0:10:20is that it is plain that our negotiating hand is clear,
0:10:20 > 0:10:23and it's clear it is not compatible with the position being taken
0:10:23 > 0:10:27by our 27 partners.
0:10:27 > 0:10:29I think, on reflection, the honourable member may think
0:10:29 > 0:10:31that he didn't use the right word in describing
0:10:31 > 0:10:37our partners as the enemy.
0:10:37 > 0:10:40It's widely accepted that the negotiation of our
0:10:40 > 0:10:43departure from the European Union is the most important and most
0:10:43 > 0:10:46complex negotiation in modern times, and it's overwhelmingly important
0:10:46 > 0:10:50that we get it right. I think that is common ground.
0:10:50 > 0:10:53It's normal even for basic trade negotiations to be carried out
0:10:53 > 0:10:55with a degree of secrecy, a degree of secrecy.
0:10:55 > 0:10:58We will need to find a way through a vast number of competing
0:10:58 > 0:11:03interests to manager exit from the union,
0:11:03 > 0:11:05interests to manage our exit from the union,
0:11:05 > 0:11:07so that our people benefit from it.
0:11:07 > 0:11:10That's the aim of this exercise, so that our people benefit from it.
0:11:10 > 0:11:12To do this, the government must have the flexibility to adjust
0:11:12 > 0:11:13during negotiations.
0:11:13 > 0:11:15It's like threading the eye of a needle.
0:11:15 > 0:11:18If you've got a good eye and a steady hand, it's easy enough.
0:11:18 > 0:11:20If somebody jogs your elbow, it's harder.
0:11:20 > 0:11:22If 650 people jog your elbow, it's very much harder.
0:11:22 > 0:11:25Will he not accept that, given the French election is in May,
0:11:25 > 0:11:27the German election is in October,
0:11:27 > 0:11:29nothing will be achieved in that timeframe?
0:11:29 > 0:11:33And if we trigger in March, there will be lost negotiating time
0:11:33 > 0:11:34within a two-year window, therefore the Article 50
0:11:34 > 0:11:40should be triggered in the autumn, in November?
0:11:40 > 0:11:43The language used is the rather vague one of a plan.
0:11:43 > 0:11:46Well, we'll probably be told the plan is to have
0:11:46 > 0:11:49a red, white and blue Brexit and that we are believers
0:11:49 > 0:11:52in free trade whilst giving up all the conditions that govern
0:11:52 > 0:11:55free trade in the single market!
0:11:55 > 0:11:57Can I say...?
0:11:57 > 0:12:00The honourable member is no longer in his place,
0:12:00 > 0:12:03but to say that it might consist of hints, I would merely
0:12:03 > 0:12:06remind the House that, when Moses came down
0:12:06 > 0:12:08from the mountain bearing the tablet, it did not
0:12:08 > 0:12:09contain the ten hints! LAUGHTER
0:12:10 > 0:12:10He was pretty clear!
0:12:10 > 0:12:14He was pretty clear about what he was telling people what to do!
0:12:14 > 0:12:18All of a sudden, we see the issue of parliamentary oversight
0:12:18 > 0:12:21being used in effect as a break, a break against taking back control,
0:12:21 > 0:12:24against bringing our democracy home.
0:12:24 > 0:12:28Once again, the Labour front bench sides with the supranational elites.
0:12:28 > 0:12:31They're out to try to frustrate and overturn the way
0:12:31 > 0:12:35people voted in June.
0:12:35 > 0:12:41It is 167 days, almost six months, since the referendum,
0:12:41 > 0:12:44and we have 113 days to go until the 31st of March deadline
0:12:44 > 0:12:48that the government has set itself.
0:12:48 > 0:12:52We are almost two thirds of the way there.
0:12:52 > 0:12:54To talk about a glacial pace of progress might be something
0:12:54 > 0:12:57of an overstatement in this case.
0:12:57 > 0:13:00How we conduct, as a government, the next two years says much
0:13:00 > 0:13:05about our constitution and values as a country.
0:13:05 > 0:13:09And I think the Parliament has to rise to the occasion.
0:13:09 > 0:13:12And I have to say I don't think either front bench speech
0:13:12 > 0:13:15quite got there today.
0:13:15 > 0:13:18I think that contributions from other members of the House
0:13:18 > 0:13:21have got closer to appreciating the magnitude of what we are doing.
0:13:21 > 0:13:23This parliament has the opportunity to shape...
0:13:23 > 0:13:25No, thank you!
0:13:25 > 0:13:28..to shape an economic policy and an immigration policy
0:13:28 > 0:13:32and a knowledge policy which can make us once again a world beater.
0:13:32 > 0:13:35But if we do not take that opportunity, if instead
0:13:35 > 0:13:39we concentrate on seeking to dilute the result of the referendum,
0:13:39 > 0:13:42then I'm afraid we will fail the people of this country
0:13:42 > 0:13:45at this historic moment.
0:13:45 > 0:13:48Michael Gove.
0:13:48 > 0:13:50And at the end of that debate, MPs backed a motion calling
0:13:50 > 0:13:53on the Prime Minister to commit to publish the government's plan
0:13:53 > 0:13:56for leaving the EU before Article 50 is invoked,
0:13:56 > 0:14:00and that that should happen by the end of March next year.
0:14:00 > 0:14:03You're watching Wednesday in Parliament, with me Alicia McCarthy.
0:14:09 > 0:14:10The Government's been defeated in the Lords when peers demanded
0:14:11 > 0:14:13The Government's been defeated in the Lords when peers demanded
0:14:13 > 0:14:16families involved in inquests have access to the same public
0:14:16 > 0:14:17funding as the police.
0:14:17 > 0:14:20The subject came up during detailed debate
0:14:20 > 0:14:22on the Policing and Crime Bill.
0:14:22 > 0:14:25For Labour, Lord Rosser explained it was an issue that had come
0:14:25 > 0:14:27to light during the Hillsborough inquests, but was not confined
0:14:27 > 0:14:30to major tragedies.
0:14:30 > 0:14:33It was something more likely to affect individual families
0:14:33 > 0:14:37after a single death.
0:14:37 > 0:14:39Many bereaved families can find themselves in an adversarial
0:14:39 > 0:14:43and aggressive environment when they go to an inquest.
0:14:43 > 0:14:46They are not in a position to match the spending of the police or other
0:14:46 > 0:14:49parts of the public sector when it comes to their own
0:14:49 > 0:14:50legal representation.
0:14:50 > 0:14:53Bereaved families have to try, if possible,
0:14:53 > 0:14:57to find their own money to have any sort of legal representation.
0:14:57 > 0:15:01Public money should pay to establish the truth.
0:15:01 > 0:15:08It is surely not right, and surely not justice,
0:15:08 > 0:15:14when bereaved families trying to find out the truth, and who have
0:15:14 > 0:15:16done nothing wrong, find that taxpayers money is used
0:15:16 > 0:15:21by the other side, sometimes to paint a very different
0:15:21 > 0:15:24picture of events in a bid to destroy their credibility.
0:15:24 > 0:15:31After Hillsborough, the Government asked the Bishop of Liverpool,
0:15:31 > 0:15:34the Rt Rev James Jones, to report on the Hillsborough
0:15:34 > 0:15:36families experience and says it's waiting for his report,
0:15:36 > 0:15:38but Lord Rosser feared it could be a long way off.
0:15:38 > 0:15:41We surely do not need further delay for the outcome of an inquiry
0:15:41 > 0:15:44where the terms of reference have apparently not even been finalised,
0:15:44 > 0:15:50where there is little likelihood of a speedy report
0:15:50 > 0:15:52and where the Government's commitment is only to consider
0:15:52 > 0:15:53the review in due course.
0:15:53 > 0:15:56A former policeman said he'd been a witness for the family
0:15:56 > 0:15:59in the inquest into the death of John Charles de Menezes,
0:15:59 > 0:16:03who was shot at Stockwell tube station after being wrongly
0:16:03 > 0:16:07identified as a terrorist suspect.
0:16:07 > 0:16:14I experienced first-hand the tactics deployed by some police counsel
0:16:14 > 0:16:17at inquests, that a search for the truth turns into a bruising
0:16:17 > 0:16:18adversarial encounter.
0:16:18 > 0:16:21As I said in Committee, the coroner had to warn the police
0:16:21 > 0:16:30counsel over the aggressive tactics he was using in cross-examination.
0:16:30 > 0:16:32As far as the family of the deceased is concerned,
0:16:32 > 0:16:34I do not believe there can be any argument.
0:16:34 > 0:16:38It cannot be right that the police can employ as large and as eminent
0:16:38 > 0:16:41a legal team as their considerable budgets will allow to represent them
0:16:41 > 0:16:45while the families of those who die at the hands of the police struggle
0:16:45 > 0:16:47to raise the funds to be represented at all.
0:16:47 > 0:16:48a legal team as their considerable budgets will allow to represent them
0:16:51 > 0:16:54But the minister said there'd be cost implications of the change.
0:16:54 > 0:16:56In the last financial year, 200 persons died
0:16:56 > 0:16:58following contact with the police.
0:16:58 > 0:17:02All of those deaths would have been subject to an inquest.
0:17:02 > 0:17:06Of course, the financial implications of this amendment
0:17:06 > 0:17:09are but one of the matters noble Lords will wish to take
0:17:09 > 0:17:11into consideration, but we cannot be blind to the impact
0:17:11 > 0:17:16on the public purse.
0:17:16 > 0:17:19However, I come back to my core objection to this amendment:
0:17:19 > 0:17:23that this is neither the time nor the place to pursue this matter.
0:17:23 > 0:17:26As I have said, the Government are firmly of the view
0:17:26 > 0:17:28that we should wait for Bishop Jones s report and then
0:17:28 > 0:17:33determine, in the light of that, the most appropriate way forward.
0:17:33 > 0:17:36But when it came to the vote the Government was defeated
0:17:36 > 0:17:41by 243 votes to 208.
0:17:41 > 0:17:44Ministers will now seek to overturn the amendment at a later stage.
0:17:44 > 0:17:46Now back to Brexit.
0:17:46 > 0:17:47And business and union leaders
0:17:47 > 0:17:50were asked what should be in that plan promised by Theresa May?
0:17:50 > 0:17:55They were appearing before the Commons Exiting the EU Committee.
0:17:55 > 0:17:59The Director-General of the Confederation
0:17:59 > 0:18:03of British Industry, the CBI, said five principles should
0:18:03 > 0:18:05underpin the negotiations for withdrawal from the EU.
0:18:05 > 0:18:08The first is barrier-free access to the single market,
0:18:08 > 0:18:10both tariff and nontariff barriers.
0:18:10 > 0:18:15Second is the access to skills and talents
0:18:15 > 0:18:18that our businesses need.
0:18:18 > 0:18:23Thirdly is a regulatory equivalence, the ability to trade
0:18:23 > 0:18:29under known and certain regulatory principles and rules within the EU.
0:18:29 > 0:18:36The fourth is the best possible trade deals around the
0:18:36 > 0:18:39world, and we will talk more about any of these.
0:18:39 > 0:18:42Finally, protecting the economic and social benefits
0:18:42 > 0:18:44that we currently enjoy from European funding.
0:18:44 > 0:18:48Our concern is that we should see a plan that
0:18:48 > 0:18:52prioritises people's jobs, their wages and their rights at work.
0:18:52 > 0:18:56We are conscious that since the financial crash
0:18:56 > 0:18:59workers wages in Britain
0:18:59 > 0:19:04have dropped further than any other country except Greece.
0:19:04 > 0:19:08As unions have exposed in companies like Sports
0:19:08 > 0:19:13Direct and Asos and Uber, there are many workers who feel deeply
0:19:13 > 0:19:17insecure and exploited at work and worried
0:19:17 > 0:19:21about the future of their children.
0:19:21 > 0:19:28That there are parts of Britain
0:19:28 > 0:19:33who have suffered from the absence of an active and intelligent
0:19:33 > 0:19:38industrial strategy that puts a decent jobs at its heart.
0:19:38 > 0:19:41So there is lots of work to be done and
0:19:41 > 0:19:43whatever deal is negotiated we want to see jobs,
0:19:43 > 0:19:44wages and rights at the
0:19:44 > 0:19:47heart of that deal.
0:19:47 > 0:19:52I don't want to see the plan because if you are a
0:19:52 > 0:19:57business person going into negotiations I would actually be
0:19:57 > 0:20:02very keen to make sure I keep my cards close to my chest.
0:20:02 > 0:20:05I do think the Government ought to declare a
0:20:05 > 0:20:08direction of travel so businesses can prepare and plan
0:20:08 > 0:20:09for Brexit day.
0:20:09 > 0:20:11So I think it is important the Prime Minister
0:20:11 > 0:20:19declares the Government is minded to leave the internal market and
0:20:19 > 0:20:23customs union, so businesses can plan for that and that will also
0:20:23 > 0:20:26substantially strengthen their negotiating position because it will
0:20:26 > 0:20:27become very quickly apparent to the EU
0:20:27 > 0:20:29that they do not hold all the
0:20:29 > 0:20:34cards.
0:20:34 > 0:20:36A Conservative and Leave campaigner asked the witnesses
0:20:36 > 0:20:41about the "burden" of EU regulation.
0:20:41 > 0:20:44I quite understand the TUC is going to fight to protect employment
0:20:44 > 0:20:48protection rights, and you've made that very clear, but to what extent
0:20:48 > 0:20:53do you see there are regulations imposed from Europe which are
0:20:53 > 0:20:58increasing costs and therefore potentially destroying jobs in this
0:20:58 > 0:21:03country which are have nothing to do with employment
0:21:03 > 0:21:06rights, are in other areas for which it is very difficult
0:21:06 > 0:21:08to see any justification at all, and I wonder if
0:21:08 > 0:21:10the TUC have looked at that?
0:21:10 > 0:21:12John Longworth spoke first - giving an example of what was
0:21:12 > 0:21:19wrong with the rules:
0:21:19 > 0:21:22We had a manufacturer of smoked salmon, who
0:21:22 > 0:21:25had to relabel the smoked salmon that they were producing because the
0:21:25 > 0:21:28European Union required that manufacturer to put on the label,
0:21:28 > 0:21:31"May contain fish."
0:21:31 > 0:21:40Now that is actually a cost to that business, a
0:21:40 > 0:21:43considerable cost, because they have to produce new artwork, employ
0:21:43 > 0:21:47people to make sure it is in the right
0:21:47 > 0:21:50place on the packets and in
0:21:50 > 0:21:54the right format and then they have to produce the actual packaging.
0:21:54 > 0:22:01That sort of stuff happens all the time
0:22:01 > 0:22:04in European legislation and
0:22:04 > 0:22:09when we have control of our own affairs we can choose what we want
0:22:09 > 0:22:11to do and it will be a considerable saving
0:22:11 > 0:22:12of cost to business by
0:22:12 > 0:22:14removing some of the silliest of the regulations.
0:22:14 > 0:22:17We can easily find 10% of the regulations to remove and
0:22:17 > 0:22:19reduce the cost on a business without attacking major part of
0:22:19 > 0:22:20employment law.
0:22:20 > 0:22:23We have to be very careful not to be anecdotal, I
0:22:23 > 0:22:26think and just putting the silly, funny examples, because there will
0:22:26 > 0:22:27always be some.
0:22:27 > 0:22:30What common labelling allows you to do if you are a small
0:22:30 > 0:22:31business,
0:22:31 > 0:22:32we have a fantastic small-business cheese manufacturer
0:22:32 > 0:22:35in Somerset and they are hugely concerned at divergences in
0:22:35 > 0:22:37labelling because labelling is one of their biggest
0:22:37 > 0:22:38costs and they value
0:22:38 > 0:22:40greatly the fact they have got a level playing field within Europe.
0:22:40 > 0:22:43I am a little sceptical about the volume of noise on
0:22:43 > 0:22:44some of these issues.
0:22:44 > 0:22:47When you dig a bit deeper, as the TUC has, for example, on
0:22:47 > 0:22:50health and safety, which came under sustained criticism as being
0:22:50 > 0:22:54bureaucratic and red tape, very often those stories
0:22:54 > 0:22:57proved to be untrue.
0:22:57 > 0:23:02The TUC General Secretary - making the case FOR regulations.
0:23:02 > 0:23:05Finally - in Westminster Hall there was a call for action
0:23:05 > 0:23:07on an altogether different policy - trees.
0:23:07 > 0:23:11According to one MP just 10% of England
0:23:12 > 0:23:13is given over to woodland.
0:23:13 > 0:23:16That compares to 18% percent in Scotland,
0:23:16 > 0:23:20whilst the European average is 37%.
0:23:20 > 0:23:24Germany, France, Italy and Spain all have more than 30%
0:23:24 > 0:23:26of their land covered by trees.
0:23:26 > 0:23:28Chris Davies said that meant the UK was towards the top
0:23:28 > 0:23:32of a different table.
0:23:32 > 0:23:35It surprises most people when they are told the UK is the
0:23:35 > 0:23:37third largest net importer of wood products in the world.
0:23:37 > 0:23:47China, with a population of 1.35 billion, topped
0:23:48 > 0:23:56the league table, and Japan, with a population
0:23:56 > 0:23:58double that of the UK, in
0:23:58 > 0:23:59second place.
0:23:59 > 0:24:02The Worldwide Fund for Nature has calculated global demand
0:24:02 > 0:24:09for timber, paper and energy from forests is set to triple by 2050.
0:24:09 > 0:24:11If we do not plant more trees now and
0:24:11 > 0:24:15if we continue to rely on imports the UK will be competing against
0:24:15 > 0:24:18other growing economies for a natural resource that we can and
0:24:18 > 0:24:21indeed perhaps should grow more of at home.
0:24:21 > 0:24:23Significant new tree-planting can provide solutions
0:24:23 > 0:24:25to a whole range of 21st-century problems.
0:24:25 > 0:24:29It can deliver jobs and investment to our rural areas, it
0:24:29 > 0:24:31can help reduce the impact of climate change and flooding, it can
0:24:31 > 0:24:34create habitat for wildlife and wonderful places for people
0:24:34 > 0:24:36to enjoy and they can provide the raw
0:24:36 > 0:24:39materials to build new homes this country needs.
0:24:39 > 0:24:42The minister said the Government was commited to planting 11m
0:24:42 > 0:24:44trees this parliament.
0:24:44 > 0:24:47Trees deliver many benefits, whether recreation
0:24:47 > 0:24:49opportunities, wildlife, biodiversity,
0:24:49 > 0:24:52but the benefits go far
0:24:52 > 0:24:56further than that.
0:24:56 > 0:24:58The roots of trees can provide a greater land
0:24:58 > 0:25:01stability on slopes and help reduce flooding by allowing water to
0:25:01 > 0:25:03penetrate more rapidly into the soil, rather
0:25:03 > 0:25:04than running into rivers and
0:25:04 > 0:25:06can help improve water quality by reducing soil erosion.
0:25:06 > 0:25:08There are other benefits as well in terms of
0:25:08 > 0:25:13trees are very important to us in absorbing carbon from the
0:25:13 > 0:25:15atmosphere, providing a valuable and relatively inexpensive carbon
0:25:15 > 0:25:16sink which can contribute towards meeting
0:25:16 > 0:25:21our ambitious carbon targets and tackling climate change.
0:25:21 > 0:25:23We recognise there are also potential
0:25:23 > 0:25:25benefits with air quality and also regulating
0:25:25 > 0:25:27the flow of rain into the
0:25:27 > 0:25:30sewers or whether as a canopy for shade from the sun, but it all
0:25:30 > 0:25:32comes back to the right tree in the right place.
0:25:32 > 0:25:34The environment minister, Therese Coffey, who added
0:25:34 > 0:25:38her favourite tree was the horse chestnut!
0:25:38 > 0:25:41And that's it from us for now, but do join me at the same time
0:25:41 > 0:25:44tomorrow for another round up of the best of the day
0:25:44 > 0:25:45here at Westminster.
0:25:45 > 0:25:52But until then from me, goodbye.