0:00:00 > 0:00:00- Subtitles
0:00:00 > 0:00:02- Subtitles- - Subtitles
0:00:10 > 0:00:12- The race to the Senedd continues.
0:00:13 > 0:00:15- As the politicians - vie for your vote...
0:00:15 > 0:00:19- ..we've asked five people to cut - through the slogans and the spin...
0:00:20 > 0:00:23- ..to look closely - at the parties and their policies.
0:00:23 > 0:00:27- Last week, Beti George - challenged the Liberal Democrats.
0:00:31 > 0:00:36- Only a couple of words of Welsh - were heard from that stage.
0:00:36 > 0:00:38- It's unbelievable.
0:00:38 > 0:00:43- Tonight, a look - at one of Wales's main parties.
0:00:44 > 0:00:48- He's a right-wing historian, - a political writer...
0:00:48 > 0:00:52- ..and has been a columnist - for the Guardian and the Daily Mail.
0:00:52 > 0:00:56- In the 1990s, he was an adviser - to John Major's Cabinet.
0:00:57 > 0:00:59- But he says - he's now completely independent.
0:00:59 > 0:01:00- Hywel Williams.
0:01:00 > 0:01:01- Hywel Williams.- - Strangers on a train.
0:01:02 > 0:01:03- How are you?
0:01:03 > 0:01:05- How are you?- - Very well, thank you.
0:01:05 > 0:01:09- Are you ready to find out - which party you'll focus on?
0:01:09 > 0:01:12- I'm looking forward to find out.
0:01:13 > 0:01:14- It's...
0:01:18 > 0:01:19- ..Plaid!
0:01:19 > 0:01:20- Plaid, Hywel Williams.
0:01:20 > 0:01:22- Plaid, Hywel Williams.- - The one and only.
0:01:22 > 0:01:24- Plaid Cymru.
0:01:25 > 0:01:27- How do you feel about that?
0:01:28 > 0:01:29- It's a big honour.
0:01:30 > 0:01:34- I'm looking forward - to look at that party's policies.
0:01:39 > 0:01:43- Last year, Plaid Cymru - were given a golden opportunity...
0:01:43 > 0:01:47- ..as their leader took part in the - Westminster elections TV debates.
0:01:48 > 0:01:51- Despite the attention - from the British channels...
0:01:51 > 0:01:54- ..their vote - only marginally increased in 2015.
0:01:54 > 0:01:59- The nationalists have already - tasted power in Wales...
0:01:59 > 0:02:01- ..in a coalition with Labour.
0:02:01 > 0:02:05- Opinion polls suggest another one - will be needed to form a government.
0:02:06 > 0:02:09- Are Plaid Cymru ready - for another political marriage?
0:02:10 > 0:02:12- Here's Dylan Iorwerth.
0:02:12 > 0:02:14- # Mae 'Nghariad I'n Fenws #
0:02:38 > 0:02:40- That, and another folk song...
0:02:40 > 0:02:44- ..suits Plaid Cymru at present - down to the ground.
0:02:45 > 0:02:47- # Old Love Easy - having lost her lover
0:02:48 > 0:02:50- # Fol-dee-rol-dee-rol-lol - fol-dee-rol-dee-ro
0:02:51 > 0:02:53- # Soon decided she could get another
0:02:53 > 0:02:56- # Fol-dee-rol-dee-rol-lol - fol-dee-rol-dee-ro #
0:03:02 > 0:03:04- The Assembly's voting system...
0:03:05 > 0:03:08- ..means that politics - is some kind of speed dating.
0:03:08 > 0:03:12- It's hard for a single party - to govern without a friend.
0:03:12 > 0:03:15- Sometimes - there's talk of a marriage...
0:03:15 > 0:03:18- ..sometimes just a quick snog - and some how do you do.
0:03:26 > 0:03:30- Just like almost every folk song, - it's a sad tale.
0:03:30 > 0:03:33- Plaid were in a close relationship - for four years...
0:03:34 > 0:03:36- ..between 2007 and 2011.
0:03:43 > 0:03:46- It was a civil marriage...
0:03:48 > 0:03:50- ..with flowers and confetti.
0:03:51 > 0:03:55- But it was with an older, - slick and more experienced man.
0:03:58 > 0:04:00- But for a little while, - Plaid were happy.
0:04:16 > 0:04:22- Occasionally, Ieuan even thought - that he wore the trousers.
0:04:29 > 0:04:32- Since then, - Plaid Cymru's been on the shelf.
0:04:32 > 0:04:36- Nothing apart from a few wild nights - with the same old lover...
0:04:36 > 0:04:41- ..discussing sexy matters - like the Local Government Act...
0:04:41 > 0:04:45- ..or banning e-cigarettes - in public places.
0:04:51 > 0:04:55- The next round of speed dating - is about to begin.
0:04:56 > 0:04:57- Plaid are going for bling.
0:04:58 > 0:05:02- Little crystals with an - investment bank dangling from them.
0:05:02 > 0:05:06- Wearing more sometimes, a new - version of the Development Agency.
0:05:07 > 0:05:08- Wearing less another time...
0:05:09 > 0:05:12- ..less council tax here, - less student debt there.
0:05:13 > 0:05:19- Then, wearing a big ring - with a cluster of medical homes.
0:05:24 > 0:05:27- It's time to consider - the possibilities.
0:05:28 > 0:05:29- Do you fancy UKIP?
0:05:36 > 0:05:37- "Yuck," says Leanne.
0:05:38 > 0:05:39- The Liberal Democrats.
0:05:44 > 0:05:45- Much too small.
0:05:46 > 0:05:47- What about the Tories?
0:05:53 > 0:05:54- No way.
0:05:58 > 0:06:00- What a choice.
0:06:00 > 0:06:04- Flirting with all those and going - against the Welsh folk song...
0:06:05 > 0:06:09- ..which, translated, means "the one - who loves many can be without one."
0:06:09 > 0:06:14- Or the other choice is to end - the night with the same fellow.
0:06:14 > 0:06:17- The one who's still there...
0:06:17 > 0:06:19- ..despite the arguments.
0:06:30 > 0:06:35- The question is, as noted by - Labour minister Leighton Andrews...
0:06:35 > 0:06:39- ..in his own sensitive way - is how much does the date cost?
0:06:39 > 0:06:42- That's why Plaid Cymru - are trying to look good.
0:06:42 > 0:06:46- They want flowers, a slap-up - and to order anything they fancy.
0:06:47 > 0:06:50- There's one other possibility...
0:06:50 > 0:06:53- ..that the party of Leanne Wood - becomes a Leanne Sisterhood.
0:06:54 > 0:06:56- But you'd need a hymn for that.
0:07:02 > 0:07:05- But how will Plaid Cymru - try to persuade you?
0:07:05 > 0:07:08- Since the starting whistle - for the race to the Senedd...
0:07:09 > 0:07:13- ..Hywel Williams has been looking - at what they have to offer.
0:07:17 > 0:07:20- I think that establishing - Plaid Cymru in 1925...
0:07:20 > 0:07:23- ..was the only - truly interesting thing...
0:07:23 > 0:07:26- ..to happen in Welsh politics - in the 20th century.
0:07:27 > 0:07:30- The party is important - in our family history.
0:07:30 > 0:07:34- My father was a Plaid Cymru - parliamentary candidate in the '70s.
0:07:34 > 0:07:38- But I have a problem - with today's Plaid Cymru.
0:07:38 > 0:07:41- I want to know - what their identity is.
0:07:41 > 0:07:45- It's important to know - what they stand for.
0:07:50 > 0:07:55- For me, the economy is the most - important question in this election.
0:07:55 > 0:08:01- Almost 20 years since the start - of administrative devolution...
0:08:02 > 0:08:05- ..Wales is poorer - than it was in the early '90s.
0:08:05 > 0:08:08- So, for Plaid Cymru people...
0:08:08 > 0:08:14- ..what's the most important reason - for the poverty in Wales?
0:08:14 > 0:08:15- Second question.
0:08:16 > 0:08:19- Looking at Wales' national income...
0:08:20 > 0:08:23- ..two thirds of that money...
0:08:23 > 0:08:27- ..comes in the form of - government expenditure.
0:08:27 > 0:08:30- So, for every three pounds - in your pocket...
0:08:30 > 0:08:33- ..two comes from the government.
0:08:34 > 0:08:36- Is that a good idea?
0:08:38 > 0:08:41- Or is it a problem?
0:08:48 > 0:08:48- Where is this show?
0:08:48 > 0:08:50- Where is this show?- - In here.
0:08:55 > 0:08:58- I've made a sacrifice.
0:08:58 > 0:09:00- I'm here at eight in the morning...
0:09:00 > 0:09:04- ..to listen to a political speech - by Adam Price.
0:09:04 > 0:09:08- I want to find out - why Wales is so poor...
0:09:08 > 0:09:12- ..and how things can be changed.
0:09:13 > 0:09:17- We need a different model. - A Nordic model if you like.
0:09:18 > 0:09:23- We're going to slash the economic - gap between Wales and the UK.
0:09:24 > 0:09:27- These are ambitious goals, - they require radical reform...
0:09:28 > 0:09:31- ..which goes much deeper than - structural change or reorganization.
0:09:33 > 0:09:37- That was an essay, not a speech.
0:09:37 > 0:09:40- It was an essay - about the nature of government...
0:09:40 > 0:09:43- ..by a guy who thinks - that a government offers answers.
0:09:48 > 0:09:52- Your fifth gospel - a smart state.
0:09:52 > 0:09:57- A smart state is to do with size.
0:09:57 > 0:10:03- But I don't understand - why size is so important.
0:10:03 > 0:10:06- A government is one partner.
0:10:06 > 0:10:10- There are some things - that only governments can do.
0:10:11 > 0:10:14- A sensible government - is my version of a smart state.
0:10:14 > 0:10:16- A sensible government...
0:10:16 > 0:10:19- ..understands that there are things - I can do and I can change.
0:10:20 > 0:10:23- But there are also things - that I can only do...
0:10:23 > 0:10:25- ..in partnership with other people.
0:10:26 > 0:10:30- The type of behaviour - we've seen in the private sector.
0:10:36 > 0:10:38- I'm leaving Cardiff...
0:10:38 > 0:10:41- ..the headquarters - of the public sector in Wales...
0:10:41 > 0:10:43- ..and going to Carmarthenshire.
0:10:43 > 0:10:47- What do the people on the street - think about Plaid Cymru?
0:10:47 > 0:10:49- Plaid Cymru do good work.
0:10:49 > 0:10:55- I think that someone who speaks - Welsh should lead the party.
0:10:56 > 0:10:59- I don't think they'd do any worse - than what we've got.
0:11:00 > 0:11:03- I'm meeting Simon Thomas.
0:11:03 > 0:11:06- I want to ask him...
0:11:06 > 0:11:12- ..how the party intends to create - more jobs in the private sector.
0:11:12 > 0:11:15- Plaid's looked closely - at the private sector...
0:11:15 > 0:11:17- ..over the last five years...
0:11:17 > 0:11:21- ..and the way we can marry - our belief in social justice...
0:11:21 > 0:11:25- ..with the development - of the private sector in Wales.
0:11:25 > 0:11:28- We want to cut business rates...
0:11:28 > 0:11:32- ..and invest in - a new development agency for Wales.
0:11:32 > 0:11:36- I think it's very important that we - put skills at the top of the agenda.
0:11:36 > 0:11:40- We should be talking about the need - for young people in Wales...
0:11:40 > 0:11:43- ..to develop top-quality skills.
0:11:48 > 0:11:49- After the break...
0:11:49 > 0:11:52- ..Hywel Williams tells us - his conclusions about Plaid Cymru.
0:11:53 > 0:11:55- And I interview their leader, - Leanne Wood.
0:11:55 > 0:11:58- Are you First Minister material? - Are you tough enough?
0:11:59 > 0:12:03- I wouldn't have put myself forward - as candidate for First Minister...
0:12:03 > 0:12:05- ..if I didn't think - I was up to the job.
0:12:05 > 0:12:05- .
0:12:07 > 0:12:07- Subtitles
0:12:07 > 0:12:09- Subtitles- - Subtitles
0:12:12 > 0:12:16- Welcome back. Tonight, - we're looking at Plaid Cymru.
0:12:16 > 0:12:19- Shortly, I'll be speaking - to their leader, Leanne Wood.
0:12:19 > 0:12:24- Before that, how does the historian, - Hywel Williams see their chances?
0:12:32 > 0:12:36- I've been invited to join - two of Plaid Cymru's candidates...
0:12:36 > 0:12:39- ..while they're out canvasing - on the streets of Cardiff.
0:12:40 > 0:12:43- They are Neil McEvoy - and Helen Mary Jones.
0:12:47 > 0:12:51- There's one very important, basic - question about Welsh politics...
0:12:51 > 0:12:53- ..that's never asked.
0:12:53 > 0:12:59- Two thirds of our national income - is governmental spending.
0:12:59 > 0:13:01- Some form of public spending.
0:13:02 > 0:13:07- Is that healthy or unhealthy?
0:13:08 > 0:13:10- Should it be more - or should it be less?
0:13:10 > 0:13:12- Those jobs are, - of course, important.
0:13:12 > 0:13:16- We saw that moving jobs - because of devolution...
0:13:16 > 0:13:20- ..has been important - in keeping communities going.
0:13:20 > 0:13:25- In the long term, - we can't depend on them.
0:13:25 > 0:13:29- It's a cyclical situation.
0:13:29 > 0:13:33- If Plaid Cymru is ambitious and - want to see Wales look after itself.
0:13:34 > 0:13:35- That means financially.
0:13:35 > 0:13:38- To do that, we'll have to pay - for our public services.
0:13:39 > 0:13:41- That means we have to develop - our private sector.
0:13:42 > 0:13:45- Is it an integral part - of Wales's economic future...
0:13:45 > 0:13:48- ..to have more jobs - in the private sector?
0:13:48 > 0:13:50- Of course, naturally.
0:13:51 > 0:13:53- Helen Mary, - is Plaid Cymru left wing?
0:13:53 > 0:13:55- Yes.
0:13:55 > 0:13:58- A left wing party that wants - to develop the private sector?
0:13:58 > 0:14:02- A left wing party that wants - to work with the private sector.
0:14:02 > 0:14:05- A left wing party that wants - to cut the public sector?
0:14:05 > 0:14:07- No, I didn't say - we'd cut the public sector.
0:14:08 > 0:14:12- We need to ensure we don't depend on - jobs in the public sector.
0:14:12 > 0:14:17- We can keep the public sector going - through more private sector jobs.
0:14:21 > 0:14:25- I'm back here to find out - what Plaid Cymru's message is...
0:14:28 > 0:14:31- ..and what's in their manifesto - for the assembly election.
0:14:33 > 0:14:37- There are three things for me that - you need in a political message.
0:14:38 > 0:14:42- It needs to be original, - concise and believable.
0:14:44 > 0:14:48- Please welcome the leader - of Plaid Cymru, Leanne Wood.
0:14:51 > 0:14:54- Here's Leanne Wood to present - a political lecture...
0:14:56 > 0:14:58- ..or teach us a lesson.
0:14:58 > 0:15:00- Good morning everyone and welcome.
0:15:01 > 0:15:04- Today, we in Plaid Cymru - are unveiling our vision...
0:15:05 > 0:15:08- ..for building up this country.
0:15:08 > 0:15:11- The party of Wales - wants to build a well Wales.
0:15:12 > 0:15:14- Saving and securing our NHS.
0:15:16 > 0:15:20- Would you say that is - in fact concise?
0:15:22 > 0:15:25- I ask you to give Plaid Cymru - a mandate...
0:15:25 > 0:15:29- ..so that we can deliver - the change Wales needs, thank you.
0:15:35 > 0:15:41- Any manifesto needs to be clear, - concise and original...
0:15:41 > 0:15:44- ..if the party writing it - wants to be elected.
0:15:45 > 0:15:53- I want to ask what explains why - Wales is such a poor country?
0:15:53 > 0:15:55- How are you going to enrich Wales?
0:15:55 > 0:15:58- One of the most - important things I see...
0:15:58 > 0:16:01- ..is that we've had a brain drain - over decades and centuries.
0:16:02 > 0:16:06- Our best people have felt they need - to leave to realise their dreams.
0:16:06 > 0:16:10- I'd like to see more done to attract - those people back to Wales.
0:16:10 > 0:16:14- It'll turn our economy around, help - us reach our educational targets...
0:16:14 > 0:16:16- ..and strengthen the health service.
0:16:16 > 0:16:18- You haven't answered my question.
0:16:18 > 0:16:20- You haven't answered my question.- - It wasn't concise.
0:16:20 > 0:16:23- It was almost believable.
0:16:23 > 0:16:26- So here's the image - of the Paddington express...
0:16:26 > 0:16:31- ..leaving for Cardiff and Swansea - and from Euston to North Wales.
0:16:31 > 0:16:34- Thousands of Welsh people - return home.
0:16:34 > 0:16:39- What are Plaid Cymru going to do to - get them back in the first place?
0:16:39 > 0:16:42- We've already said that - we'll write off up to 18,000...
0:16:43 > 0:16:47- ..of the student loans of people - who return to work in Wales.
0:16:48 > 0:16:51- I think there are opportunities - for investment...
0:16:51 > 0:16:54- ..we're going to put into - research in our universities.
0:16:55 > 0:16:58- You'll have to create - a lot of wealth in Wales...
0:16:58 > 0:17:01- ..to start on this manifesto.
0:17:01 > 0:17:05- Yes, we understand the scale - of the challenge ahead of us.
0:17:05 > 0:17:08- That's why we can see - the ambition we're presenting...
0:17:09 > 0:17:12- ..and the ideas we're presenting - in the manifesto.
0:17:12 > 0:17:13- We need a change...
0:17:13 > 0:17:17- ..but it needs to be on a scale - we haven't seen for decades.
0:17:22 > 0:17:26- I asked on the way in, - let's find the answer.
0:17:27 > 0:17:31- Are the answers - in this manifesto concise?
0:17:31 > 0:17:33- There's no suggestion of that.
0:17:34 > 0:17:36- Is it believable?
0:17:36 > 0:17:40- I would think that some of these - people in Plaid Cymru...
0:17:40 > 0:17:43- ..would make very good ministers.
0:17:43 > 0:17:50- I think there will be a battle - for Plaid Cymru's leadership soon.
0:17:50 > 0:17:52- With the best will in the world...
0:17:52 > 0:17:56- ..it's difficult to see - Leanne Wood as First Minister.
0:17:56 > 0:18:00- Are the party offering - something original?
0:18:01 > 0:18:03- In my opinion, no.
0:18:03 > 0:18:05- They've got old answers here.
0:18:05 > 0:18:08- Answers about the nature - of government.
0:18:08 > 0:18:09- Create more jobs...
0:18:10 > 0:18:13- The answers about funding - were a bit foggy.
0:18:18 > 0:18:20- With the fifth of May nearing...
0:18:20 > 0:18:24- ..what is the message - for Plaid Cymru's leader?
0:18:24 > 0:18:26- How realistic are their hopes...
0:18:27 > 0:18:30- ..of playing a role - within Wales' next government?
0:18:31 > 0:18:35- Leanne Wood was elected as - the leader of Plaid Cymru in 2012.
0:18:35 > 0:18:39- She's the first woman - to lead the party at the Assembly...
0:18:40 > 0:18:42- ..and the first Welsh learner.
0:18:42 > 0:18:45- Now, the girl from the valleys...
0:18:45 > 0:18:50- ..wants to break the mould again by - becoming First Minister for Wales.
0:18:51 > 0:18:55- I've been looking at your pledges - for the election.
0:18:55 > 0:18:57- You promise a better Wales.
0:18:57 > 0:19:01- Why is the message not getting - through to people?
0:19:01 > 0:19:03- I don't accept that it's not.
0:19:03 > 0:19:07- We've spent an awful lot of time, - my team of excellent candidates...
0:19:07 > 0:19:10- ..going up and down the country - talking to people.
0:19:12 > 0:19:15- First of all asking them - what they're problems are...
0:19:15 > 0:19:18- ..so we can go away and come up - with solutions to those problems.
0:19:19 > 0:19:22- And then secondly, going around - and talking to people about them.
0:19:23 > 0:19:25- We've had a very positive response.
0:19:25 > 0:19:28- Are you trying to be - everything to everyone?
0:19:28 > 0:19:32- Well, wealthy, clever, liked - essentially but pleasing no one.
0:19:34 > 0:19:37- We're putting together - a programme of government...
0:19:37 > 0:19:40- ..that will tackle the major - problems facing this country.
0:19:41 > 0:19:45- They are chiefly in the areas of - health, education and the economy.
0:19:45 > 0:19:49- Those areas are covered by all - the parties. What sets you apart?
0:19:49 > 0:19:51- What's your unique selling point?
0:19:51 > 0:19:53- The only party in this election...
0:19:53 > 0:19:57- ..that puts Wales at the heart of - everything it does is Plaid Cymru.
0:19:57 > 0:19:59- That's what sets us apart.
0:19:59 > 0:20:02- The valleys have got - a strong Welsh identity...
0:20:02 > 0:20:06- ..why isn't Plaid Cymru managing - to tap into that identity?
0:20:06 > 0:20:09- More people are turning - to the UK Independence Party...
0:20:09 > 0:20:10- ..than the Party of Wales.
0:20:10 > 0:20:13- Why are you talking up UKIP - all the time?
0:20:13 > 0:20:17- I'm asking a question based on - facts from the general election.
0:20:17 > 0:20:20- We've heard a lot of people, - commentators in the media...
0:20:20 > 0:20:23- ..talking up UKIP's chances - in this election.
0:20:23 > 0:20:26- They are a party riddled - with in-fighting.
0:20:26 > 0:20:29- I've launched - a programme of government...
0:20:29 > 0:20:32- ..that will transform - this nation in a generation.
0:20:32 > 0:20:34- We've got 180 policies.
0:20:34 > 0:20:38- We've spoken to 700,000 people - to put that manifesto together.
0:20:38 > 0:20:40- I don't want to talk about UKIP.
0:20:40 > 0:20:44- I want to talk about Plaid Cymru - and our policies to transform Wales.
0:20:44 > 0:20:46- UKIP is an interesting one.
0:20:46 > 0:20:49- They've stuck Independence - in their name.
0:20:50 > 0:20:52- Why aren't you - taking that bold step?
0:20:53 > 0:20:55- You're shying away - from it publicly.
0:20:55 > 0:20:58- We've asked people - what their chief concerns are.
0:20:58 > 0:21:01- Whilst we recognise - that the constitution is key...
0:21:01 > 0:21:04- ..in terms of delivering - improvements in people's lives...
0:21:04 > 0:21:08- ..what people are telling us - is that the issues around health...
0:21:08 > 0:21:09- ..education and the economy...
0:21:10 > 0:21:12- ..are the ones they want us - to take action on.
0:21:13 > 0:21:17- The big slogan for this election - for you is The Change Wales Needs.
0:21:17 > 0:21:20- Ironically, it's similar - to the Tories' slogan.
0:21:20 > 0:21:22- If your ambitions are so similar...
0:21:22 > 0:21:25- ..why have you ruled out - working with them?
0:21:25 > 0:21:29- For people in many parts of Wales, - the Tories are a toxic brand.
0:21:29 > 0:21:33- If your core ambition - is changing things for Wales...
0:21:33 > 0:21:36- ..changing the course of things - and the government in Wales...
0:21:37 > 0:21:39- ..isn't it ridiculous to rule out...
0:21:39 > 0:21:42- ..the only realistic option you have - of booting Labour out?
0:21:43 > 0:21:46- We want to be in government - and implement our programme.
0:21:46 > 0:21:48- But not at any expense.
0:21:48 > 0:21:50- Putting Tories into government...
0:21:50 > 0:21:53- ..having them look after our health - service, our education system...
0:21:54 > 0:21:57- ..you only need to look over the - border to see why it's a bad idea.
0:21:59 > 0:22:03- Aren't you running the risk of being - another cheap date for Labour.
0:22:03 > 0:22:06- I'm not talking about coalitions - in this election.
0:22:07 > 0:22:09- We've put forward - a programme of government.
0:22:09 > 0:22:11- It's up to people to vote - on that programme.
0:22:12 > 0:22:15- The extent to which we get that - programme in to government...
0:22:15 > 0:22:16- ..depends on how people vote.
0:22:17 > 0:22:22- Leanne Wood, leader of Plaid Cymru, - are you First Minister material?
0:22:23 > 0:22:24- Are you tough enough?
0:22:24 > 0:22:28- Let's wait and see what the people - of Wales say about that.
0:22:28 > 0:22:30- Do you believe you're tough enough?
0:22:30 > 0:22:33- Of course I do, - I wouldn't be in this position...
0:22:33 > 0:22:35- ..I wouldn't have - put myself forward...
0:22:35 > 0:22:38- ..as a candidate - for the leader of Plaid Cymru...
0:22:38 > 0:22:42- ..and I certainly wouldn't put - myself forward for First Minister...
0:22:42 > 0:22:44- ..if I didn't think - I was up to the job.
0:22:44 > 0:22:47- Does it upset you - to hear people talk about...
0:22:47 > 0:22:49- ..potentially replacing you...
0:22:49 > 0:22:52- ..with people like - Rhun ap Iorwerth or Adam Price?
0:22:52 > 0:22:54- It makes me quite amused - to be honest.
0:22:54 > 0:22:58- Some people seem to be unable - to recognise how people...
0:22:58 > 0:23:01- ..can work collectively together - without competition...
0:23:01 > 0:23:04- ..in order to achieve - a certain set of goals and aims.
0:23:04 > 0:23:07- If you're not First Minister - after May 5th...
0:23:07 > 0:23:09- ..will you step down as leader?
0:23:10 > 0:23:11- My project is a long-term one.
0:23:11 > 0:23:15- It's about building a nation, - it's about transforming an economy.
0:23:16 > 0:23:18- It's a big job, - it's a long term project.
0:23:18 > 0:23:21- This election - is one step towards that project.
0:23:21 > 0:23:24- It certainly isn't - the be all and end all of it.
0:23:29 > 0:23:30- That's it for tonight.
0:23:31 > 0:23:35- Next week, former First Minister - Rhodri Morgan takes a look at UKIP.
0:23:36 > 0:23:40- Join us next Tuesday at 9.30pm.
0:23:53 > 0:23:53- .