:00:00. > :00:00.Thank you for your company here in Rio - it's time now to hand
:00:00. > :00:12.you over to Rhos near Wrexham and to Bethan Rhys Roberts
:00:13. > :00:18.All this week, we are putting top politicians on the spot. We start
:00:19. > :00:22.with the Conservatives. In 30 minutes, this audience has the
:00:23. > :00:26.questions for the man who represents Wales at Theresa May's top table.
:00:27. > :00:31.First, let's hear from the Prime Minister, who has been speaking to
:00:32. > :00:43.Andrew Neil. Welcome to Ask The Leader.
:00:44. > :00:45.Prime Minister, you started this campaign with a huge,
:00:46. > :00:48.It's now down to single digits in some polls.
:00:49. > :00:53.Well, Andrew, there's only one poll that counts
:00:54. > :00:55.in any election campaign, as I'm sure you know
:00:56. > :00:57.from your long experience, and that's the one that takes place
:00:58. > :01:03.on the 8th of June when people have actually cast their votes.
:01:04. > :01:06.When they have made that choice, which is a crucial choice -
:01:07. > :01:09.I think this genuinely is the most crucial election I have seen
:01:10. > :01:11.in my lifetime because it's about getting Brexit negotiations
:01:12. > :01:13.right, getting the right deal for Britain from Europe,
:01:14. > :01:15.and, going beyond that, a plan for a stronger
:01:16. > :01:20.And I believe that I've set out my vision for that strength
:01:21. > :01:23.in negotiations and that stronger plan and the choice is,
:01:24. > :01:25.who's going to be doing those negotiations, me or Jeremy Corbyn?
:01:26. > :01:28.So why do you think your lead is narrowing?
:01:29. > :01:31.As I say, the only poll that counts is the one that takes
:01:32. > :01:40.What I'm doing, what I and my team are doing, is going out around
:01:41. > :01:43.the country talking to people, hearing from them, and talking
:01:44. > :01:45.to them about this crucial choice that the country will face
:01:46. > :01:51.Because, you know, so much depends on us getting those
:01:52. > :01:56.It's not just the next five years but it's beyond the next five years.
:01:57. > :01:58.Our standard of living, our place in the world.
:01:59. > :02:04.And you need a strong hand in those negotiations and you need strength
:02:05. > :02:06.in those negotiations, and, as I say, there's only
:02:07. > :02:10.going to be a choice between two people as to who is sitting opposite
:02:11. > :02:13.those 27 European countries, me or Jeremy Corbyn.
:02:14. > :02:15.But could you be in a little bit of trouble now?
:02:16. > :02:19.You were so sure of winning that you thought you could get away
:02:20. > :02:21.with a load of uncosted and half-baked policies.
:02:22. > :02:23.No, I've never taken anything for granted about this election.
:02:24. > :02:26.I called this election because I think it is important
:02:27. > :02:28.that the country has certainty over the next five years,
:02:29. > :02:31.has the strong and stable leadership that I think it needs,
:02:32. > :02:32.as I've just explained, particularly for those
:02:33. > :02:39.And what I saw was that other parties were trying to frustrate,
:02:40. > :02:41.promising to try to frustrate those Brexit negotiations,
:02:42. > :02:44.so I thought it was right to call an election and ask people
:02:45. > :02:49.But your policies are uncosted and half-baked, aren't they?
:02:50. > :02:56.What we have set out in the manifesto is a series
:02:57. > :02:59.of policies which address what I see and what I think are
:03:00. > :03:04.the five great challenges that we face as a country.
:03:05. > :03:07.What I have tried to be is to show people that actually
:03:08. > :03:10.if we are going to build that stronger Britain, we have got to be
:03:11. > :03:12.willing to face up to these challenges and fix them.
:03:13. > :03:15.Well, let's look at social care for the elderly.
:03:16. > :03:19.Four days ago, your manifesto rejected a cap on social care costs.
:03:20. > :03:26.Nothing has changed from the principles on social care
:03:27. > :03:32.policy that we set out in our manifesto.
:03:33. > :03:34.Let me just explain, if I may, why I think it's important,
:03:35. > :03:37.why this is one of the great challenges we face,
:03:38. > :03:41.In ten years' time there will be 2 million more
:03:42. > :03:46.Our social care system will collapse unless we do something about it.
:03:47. > :03:49.We could try and pretend the problem isn't there and hope
:03:50. > :03:51.that it will go away, but it won't.
:03:52. > :03:59.We could play politics with it, as the Labour Party is doing.
:04:00. > :04:03.Or we could show how we can fix it and that's what I've done.
:04:04. > :04:06.Jeremy Hunt, on the day you launched your manifesto,
:04:07. > :04:09.last Thursday, the Health Secretary, he said, yes, we are dropping
:04:10. > :04:11.the cap and we are being completely explicit in our manifesto,
:04:12. > :04:21.Of course Andrew Dilnot had brought forward previous
:04:22. > :04:29.proposals for a cap, but Jeremy also went on to say
:04:30. > :04:31.that what we wanted to have was a system
:04:32. > :04:35.that was fair to all generations, and that's what we're doing.
:04:36. > :04:39.Your manifesto rejects a cap, it gives a reason why
:04:40. > :04:42.you don't want a cap, now you're going to have a cap.
:04:43. > :04:45.You need to be honest, I would suggest, and tell
:04:46. > :04:46.the British people you've changed your mind.
:04:47. > :04:49.First of all, Andrew, I'm being absolutely honest
:04:50. > :04:53.with the British people about the big challenge that we face
:04:54. > :04:56.and absolutely honest with them about the need for us to deal
:04:57. > :04:59.with this now, to start fixing it now.
:05:00. > :05:02.Now what I've put forward is a social care policy which means
:05:03. > :05:07.that people won't have to worry if they are sitting there month
:05:08. > :05:10.after month, worrying about money coming out of their bank account
:05:11. > :05:13.to pay for their care, worrying about how long that will last.
:05:14. > :05:15.They won't have to worry because they won't have to be paying
:05:16. > :05:19.They won't have to worry that they're going to have to sell
:05:20. > :05:24.And they'll be able to pass ?100,000 onto their families when they die,
:05:25. > :05:31.What I've done today is I've seen the scaremongering, frankly,
:05:32. > :05:34.that we've seen over the weekend, I've seen the way that Jeremy Corbyn
:05:35. > :05:37.wants to sneak into Number Ten by playing on the fears
:05:38. > :05:40.of old and vulnerable people and I've clarified what we will be
:05:41. > :05:46.putting in the green paper which I set out in the manifesto.
:05:47. > :05:49.So Jeremy Corbyn is now rewriting your manifesto?
:05:50. > :05:53.That's what it sounds like, you've reacted to him.
:05:54. > :05:59.Andrew, we have not rewritten the manifesto.
:06:00. > :06:02.The principles on which we have based our social care policy remain
:06:03. > :06:05.We need to ensure that we have long-term
:06:06. > :06:12.We need to be able to ensure we can fund social care for the future.
:06:13. > :06:15.We're doing the honest thing about putting a proposal
:06:16. > :06:17.to the British people and they will make
:06:18. > :06:21.How can it be honest, Prime Minister, to reject a cap
:06:22. > :06:24.in your manifesto and four days later say, we're
:06:25. > :06:32.What we set out in our manifesto was a series of principles.
:06:33. > :06:35.It was to say to people, first of all, this is a big issue,
:06:36. > :06:38.we need to address it, and we are being honest that we must
:06:39. > :06:43.I'm not going to bury my head in the sand, I'm not
:06:44. > :06:46.going to play politics with it, which is what Jeremy
:06:47. > :06:48.You're just going to change your mind.
:06:49. > :06:53.What I've seen is that people have been worried by some of the things
:06:54. > :06:55.that the Labour Party has been claiming, and others indeed,
:06:56. > :06:57.the Liberal Democrats too, about what our policy means.
:06:58. > :07:00.In some cases the complete opposite of what our policy is.
:07:01. > :07:02.But when Labour said you were against a cap,
:07:03. > :07:06.they were right until today, you were against the cap.
:07:07. > :07:09.What we have done is clarified what will be in this green paper.
:07:10. > :07:13.Here is our social care policy, here is what we're doing.
:07:14. > :07:17.We want to protect people, we want people not to have the worry,
:07:18. > :07:20.day to day, about being able to pay for their social care.
:07:21. > :07:22.That's why we are fixing this problem, that's why we're
:07:23. > :07:29.What I have said today is I've heard the scaremongering,
:07:30. > :07:31.I've seen how Labour want to try to sneak
:07:32. > :07:35.into Number Ten, Jeremy Corbyn wants to try to get into Number Ten
:07:36. > :07:40.by playing on fears, by misrepresenting our policy.
:07:41. > :07:43.What we're doing is ensuring people will not have to sell their house
:07:44. > :07:49.They won't have to worry about those monthly bills for their care,
:07:50. > :07:51.and they'll be able to protect more money than they have been
:07:52. > :07:57.But it's a cap on lifetime social costs which worry people as well.
:07:58. > :08:00.I mean, this must be the first time in modern history that a party has
:08:01. > :08:02.actually broken a manifesto policy before the election!
:08:03. > :08:07.What we have done, Andrew, I set out in my manifesto
:08:08. > :08:10.the challenges that we need to address as a government.
:08:11. > :08:12.And I've been very clear with people.
:08:13. > :08:14.There are two ways you can approach this issue.
:08:15. > :08:18.You can say to people, we have an ageing society,
:08:19. > :08:20.our system will collapse unless we do something about it,
:08:21. > :08:25.You can ignore it, put your head in the sand, or you can try
:08:26. > :08:31.I think it's only fair to people to say, this is a problem
:08:32. > :08:34.and we need to fix it now, that's what I want to do.
:08:35. > :08:37.I want to fix it so people don't have the worry
:08:38. > :08:41.Now that you're in favour of a cap, can you give us an idea
:08:42. > :08:44.of what the cap might be, the amount we'll have
:08:45. > :08:47.What we're going to do, as we said in our manifesto,
:08:48. > :08:51.is publish, we referred to the green paper, of course a green paper,
:08:52. > :08:55.many people may not realise a green paper is a consultation.
:08:56. > :08:58.So we want to take people's views, the views of charities,
:08:59. > :09:00.the views of others, on how the system
:09:01. > :09:04.What I've said today is that we will have in that
:09:05. > :09:07.consultation that concept of an absolute limit on the costs
:09:08. > :09:13.So we're protecting people for the future, we're providing
:09:14. > :09:15.a system that provides sustainability in our social
:09:16. > :09:17.care for the future, and we got an ageing population
:09:18. > :09:20.and we need to do this otherwise our system will collapse.
:09:21. > :09:25.Why did you not put the consultation on a cap in your manifesto?
:09:26. > :09:28.Instead, your manifesto rejects a cap.
:09:29. > :09:31.No, what we've put in the manifesto is that we will have a consultation
:09:32. > :09:39.and the principles on which our social care policy will be based.
:09:40. > :09:42.That, I think, was the right thing to do.
:09:43. > :09:44.Now, if we are re-elected, we will have that consultation.
:09:45. > :09:47.But I think the key issue is that there's a choice
:09:48. > :09:49.here between parties, a choice between Jeremy Corbyn,
:09:50. > :09:52.who is playing politics with this, doesn't want to address this issue
:09:53. > :09:55.You're not playing politics with this, Prime Minister?
:09:56. > :10:00.You're now in favour of a cap because of a backlash,
:10:01. > :10:04.No, Andrew, what I'm worried about is the way in which there have
:10:05. > :10:07.been fake claims about our policy which are deliberately trying
:10:08. > :10:18.What I've done is addressed that issue today and I'm very clear that
:10:19. > :10:19.whoever is in government, whoever is Prime Minister,
:10:20. > :10:23.whether it is me or Jeremy Corbyn, we need to address this issue,
:10:24. > :10:25.we need to fix it and that's what I'm going to do.
:10:26. > :10:31.Because many people have said your manifesto is quite vague
:10:32. > :10:33.when it comes to how you're going to pay for your spending
:10:34. > :10:36.pledges so let's see if we can get some clarity tonight.
:10:37. > :10:39.How are you going to pay for the extra ?8 billion for the NHS?
:10:40. > :10:43.Andrew, when I go around the country and talk to people about what we're
:10:44. > :10:45.going to do in government, what people want to know is,
:10:46. > :10:48.are we actually going to have the strong economy that
:10:49. > :10:51.enables us to pay for the NHS and pay for the public
:10:52. > :10:59.In our manifesto we have put some examples of how we're
:11:00. > :11:02.going to change the way money is used, on winter fuel
:11:03. > :11:05.payments, for example, we will means test that.
:11:06. > :11:08.I asked about the extra money for the NHS, where will the extra
:11:09. > :11:13.Andrew, what we have done, if you look at our record,
:11:14. > :11:16.is shown that we can put record sums of money into the National
:11:17. > :11:19.Health Service at the same time as we are ensuring
:11:20. > :11:21.that we are building that strong economy.
:11:22. > :11:23.And that's what we'll do for the future.
:11:24. > :11:26.Our economic credibility is not in doubt.
:11:27. > :11:30.It is the Labour Party who is in the dock when it comes
:11:31. > :11:33.No, but the ability to answer this question may be
:11:34. > :11:38.Where will the extra 8 billion for the NHS come from?
:11:39. > :11:41.What we have done over the last six years, six, seven years,
:11:42. > :11:45.and what we will do in the future is ensure that we have the strong
:11:46. > :11:47.economy, the growing economy that enables us to generate the funds
:11:48. > :11:51.I've identified in the manifesto some specific areas where we will
:11:52. > :11:54.change the way in which money is being used and I've just
:11:55. > :11:58.But that's not extra money, that's moving money around.
:11:59. > :11:59.That's what I'm saying, I've identified...
:12:00. > :12:04.It is an extra 8 billion that is going to go
:12:05. > :12:07.into the National Health Service but I've identified some areas
:12:08. > :12:13.where we will be changing the way money is used.
:12:14. > :12:17.But, crucially, what you need to be able to ensure that you can fund
:12:18. > :12:19.the NHS is the strong and growing economy.
:12:20. > :12:21.As I say, our economic credibility is not on the line,
:12:22. > :12:24.it is the Labour Party that is in the dock on that.
:12:25. > :12:27.Well, the Labour Party have given us costings and given us revenues.
:12:28. > :12:30.Let me ask another way, is it all new money?
:12:31. > :12:32.The Labour Party have given you costings which
:12:33. > :12:36.There's a ?58 billion black hole in the Labour Party manifesto.
:12:37. > :12:38.That's the equivalent of half the sum we spend
:12:39. > :12:47.What we will do is ensure that we generate, by ensuring
:12:48. > :12:50.we have a strong economy and growth in the economy, we generate
:12:51. > :12:52.the funds and just look at our track record.
:12:53. > :12:54.It's what we've done over the last few years.
:12:55. > :13:00.There will be 8 billion more money going into
:13:01. > :13:02.the National Health Service at the end of the parliament.
:13:03. > :13:09.That's a real terms increase per head every year.
:13:10. > :13:12.The manifesto pledges "the most ambitious programme of investment
:13:13. > :13:14.and buildings and technology the NHS has ever seen."
:13:15. > :13:20.No, that's separate, because it's the money you spend,
:13:21. > :13:22.as I'm sure you know, Andrew, but the money you spend
:13:23. > :13:25.on buildings and capital is separate from the money you spend
:13:26. > :13:32.That money will be following, there's a report that was done
:13:33. > :13:35.on the NHS, the Naylor Report, which set out what was needed
:13:36. > :13:37.and we are backing the proposals in the Naylor Report.
:13:38. > :13:43.That will come from a variety of sources.
:13:44. > :13:46.It's capital money, it's separate from the 8 billion that's
:13:47. > :13:50.going into the National Health Service.
:13:51. > :13:53.But any of this money can only be provided if we've got the strong
:13:54. > :13:56.economy to fund it and that's where one of the crucial differences
:13:57. > :13:58.between what I'm proposing and what the Labour Party
:13:59. > :14:00.is proposing comes, because what I'm setting out in my manifesto
:14:01. > :14:04.is the ways in which we can deal with the economy in the future
:14:05. > :14:06.and crucial to that, crucial to that is getting
:14:07. > :14:15.That's why who is sitting around that negotiating table 11 days
:14:16. > :14:20.That's a point you've made, Prime Minister.
:14:21. > :14:22.I make it again because it's important and crucial
:14:23. > :14:27.Our hospitals have just endured their worst 12
:14:28. > :14:30.A record number of urgent operations were cancelled.
:14:31. > :14:33.A string of targets, from emergency care to routine
:14:34. > :14:35.care to cancer care, have been missed.
:14:36. > :14:37.What you're promising is too little, too late.
:14:38. > :14:41.I accept that the NHS has missed some of its targets,
:14:42. > :14:45.but targets aren't the be all and end all.
:14:46. > :14:47.What matters, actually, is the quality of patient care.
:14:48. > :14:51.You mentioned accident and emergency targets.
:14:52. > :14:56.Yes, we did see pressure on A over the winter.
:14:57. > :14:59.What matters is not that you tick a box on a target.
:15:00. > :15:01.What matters is that you say, what does that tell us
:15:02. > :15:06.That is why we've already announced that we're
:15:07. > :15:10.We're putting some extra money already into accident and emergency
:15:11. > :15:12.and hospitals around the country, because sometimes people turn up
:15:13. > :15:16.at A who don't need to go into hospital.
:15:17. > :15:23.we can ensure that the patient gets the care that they need
:15:24. > :15:30.and we see hospitals relieved from some of that pressure.
:15:31. > :15:32.That's about ensuring that patient care is what comes first.
:15:33. > :15:37.You've ruled out a rise in VAT,
:15:38. > :15:39.but not national insurance or income tax.
:15:40. > :15:44.Because I want to be clear that as a Conservative Party
:15:45. > :15:47.in government, as we always have been, we're a party
:15:48. > :15:51.I have every intention of reducing taxes on businesses
:15:52. > :15:57.But I want to ensure that when we do that,
:15:58. > :16:01.So national insurance and income tax could go up?
:16:02. > :16:04.I'm very clear that it's our intention to reduce taxes.
:16:05. > :16:06.But you haven't ruled out rises in these two taxes.
:16:07. > :16:09.When people come to make their choice on June 8th,
:16:10. > :16:13.they will see a choice between a Conservative Party that's
:16:14. > :16:16.always been a party of lower tax, that's believed in lower tax...
:16:17. > :16:18.Except that the tax burden is now the highest for 30 years
:16:19. > :16:23.And under the Conservative government since 2010,
:16:24. > :16:25.we've seen 4 million people taken out of paying income tax
:16:26. > :16:28.altogether and a tax cut for 31 million taxpayers.
:16:29. > :16:36.But we also believe in ensuring that we're developing
:16:37. > :16:40.the strong economy that enables us to fund our public services.
:16:41. > :16:42.But you tried to raise national insurance for the self-employed
:16:43. > :16:44.in the Budget a couple of months ago.
:16:45. > :16:48.Can you rule out that you would try that again?
:16:49. > :16:51.We said we were taking those plans off the table.
:16:52. > :16:54.We have asked Matthew Taylor to do a report on the new forms
:16:55. > :16:58.of employment, and we will look at the results of that
:16:59. > :17:05.But we've removed the proposals we put in the Budget.
:17:06. > :17:11.We need to look at how the employment market
:17:12. > :17:16.That's why I'm clear that I want to put in extra
:17:17. > :17:19.Things are changing in the way people are being employed,
:17:20. > :17:21.and we need to ensure that we recognise that
:17:22. > :17:26.But in all of these issues, we can only do these things,
:17:27. > :17:29.we can only make sure we're able to lower taxes
:17:30. > :17:35.Fundamental to that, of course, is getting the Brexit deal right
:17:36. > :17:38.and getting those negotiations right and having both a strong hand
:17:39. > :17:42.in those negotiations, but also the strength of leadership.
:17:43. > :17:45.That's a point you've made several times.
:17:46. > :17:47.I want to come to the people who are just about managing.
:17:48. > :17:49.They're not the poorest of the poor,
:17:50. > :17:50.but they are not affluent either.
:17:51. > :17:55.You say you're on their side, but inflation is now rising
:17:56. > :17:58.faster than average pay, so living standards are being squeezed
:17:59. > :18:01.and you've frozen the in work benefits
:18:02. > :18:10.If you look at the issues around people who are...
:18:11. > :18:13.As you say, I talked about people who were just about managing
:18:14. > :18:18.when I came into Downing Street last year.
:18:19. > :18:21.There are a number of ways in which I want to support those people.
:18:22. > :18:25.On the cost of living, I want to build a strong economy
:18:26. > :18:30.I also want to help with things like energy bills.
:18:31. > :18:33.That's why we're going to cap rip-off energy price rises.
:18:34. > :18:37.But in what way are you on their side?
:18:38. > :18:41.You've taken away ?280 a year from their in work benefits
:18:42. > :18:48.Being on their side is about a variety of actions.
:18:49. > :18:54.These are people who want to ensure that their children
:18:55. > :18:58.That's why we have plans to increase the number of good school places.
:18:59. > :19:02.They do want to ensure that their NHS is being funded.
:19:03. > :19:05.That's why we have plans to ensure that we're putting those
:19:06. > :19:07.record amounts of money into the National Health Service.
:19:08. > :19:14.They'd like their living standards to be rising.
:19:15. > :19:17.I want to see higher paid jobs in this country.
:19:18. > :19:19.Doing that is about building a stronger economy.
:19:20. > :19:21.It's about having a vision for the future.
:19:22. > :19:25.We've set out a draft industrial strategy,
:19:26. > :19:28.a modern industrial strategy to really develop the economy
:19:29. > :19:32.across all parts of the country so that we don't see prosperity
:19:33. > :19:34.concentrated in certain areas, but prosperity across
:19:35. > :19:40.How many pensioners will lose their winter fuel allowance?
:19:41. > :19:41.We will means-test the winter fuel allowance,
:19:42. > :19:46.We will ask charities and organisations
:19:47. > :19:54.Pensioners watching tonight won't know.
:19:55. > :19:57.The very rich will lose, that's clear.
:19:58. > :20:02.But the vast in between, you cannot tell them tonight
:20:03. > :20:06.whether they will get up to ?300 or not this coming winter?
:20:07. > :20:09.What we're doing will ensure that the least well-off pensioners
:20:10. > :20:12.will have their winter fuel payments protected.
:20:13. > :20:17.I think it's right that we take those views of charities
:20:18. > :20:21.and organisations working with older people and others to look
:20:22. > :20:27.But overall in the changes we're making and the policies
:20:28. > :20:31.we're adopting, I am going to be protecting pensioners
:20:32. > :20:35.But you can't tell them whether they would get
:20:36. > :20:43.We will means-test winter fuel payments.
:20:44. > :20:49.I have also added that we will be talking to people about this,
:20:50. > :20:52.asking their views on where this should be set, not just setting it
:20:53. > :20:57.here in the Andrew Neil interview, but talking to charities
:20:58. > :21:00.and organisations and consulting on it.
:21:01. > :21:03.Wouldn't you have done that before you came up with the policy?
:21:04. > :21:08.You have promised twice to reduce immigration
:21:09. > :21:11.to the tens of thousands, and twice you've failed.
:21:12. > :21:15.Why should we believe you a third time?
:21:16. > :21:18.We have ensured that we are working to reduce immigration.
:21:19. > :21:23.Crucially, of course, we will, when we leave the European Union,
:21:24. > :21:28.have the opportunity and the ability to deal with the figures to bring
:21:29. > :21:30.in rules who are coming from the European Union countries
:21:31. > :21:37.You've always had that power with non-EU migration,
:21:38. > :21:40.and you've never managed to get that down to the tens of thousands,
:21:41. > :21:49.There's a real choice here on 8th June.
:21:50. > :21:53.It's between me and my party, who believe that we should work
:21:54. > :21:56.and Jeremy Corbyn and the Labour Party,
:21:57. > :22:00.who believe you should have uncontrolled immigration.
:22:01. > :22:02.That's the choice that will be there before people.
:22:03. > :22:05.We will continue to work to bring net migration down
:22:06. > :22:08.because we believe it does have an impact on people.
:22:09. > :22:14.Net migration is higher now than it was when he came to power in 2010.
:22:15. > :22:19.You're right, we haven't got down to the tens of thousands.
:22:20. > :22:21.We will be able to introduce rules for people coming
:22:22. > :22:26.from inside the European Union when we leave the European Union.
:22:27. > :22:29.But this is an area of immigration, as I've said many times before,
:22:30. > :22:32.where you have to be consistently working at it.
:22:33. > :22:35.That includes looking at non-EU migration as well as EU
:22:36. > :22:39.Doesn't this go to the heart of why people have lost
:22:40. > :22:43.You make promises, you fail to keep them,
:22:44. > :22:46.but you make the same promise again.
:22:47. > :22:49.Andrew, I called an election several weeks ago.
:22:50. > :22:52.I called an election on this whole issue of trust,
:22:53. > :22:55.because the question that people face is, who do they trust
:22:56. > :23:00.to take this country through the Brexit negotiations?
:23:01. > :23:02.Who do they trust to face up to the presidents,
:23:03. > :23:04.the prime ministers, the chancellors of Europe
:23:05. > :23:08.Who do they trust to get the best deal for the UK?
:23:09. > :23:13.The question for everybody on 8th June is,
:23:14. > :23:18.who do they trust to get the deal for the UK?
:23:19. > :23:24.The Conservatives promised to end the budget deficit by 2015.
:23:25. > :23:28.It's now going to be 2025 at the earliest.
:23:29. > :23:31.You promised to reduce migration to the tens of thousands.
:23:32. > :23:39.On these two big issues, you failed to meet your promises.
:23:40. > :23:42.Why would we trust the Tories on anything else?
:23:43. > :23:44.As I say, the election will be about trust.
:23:45. > :23:47.Yes, we are still the party that wants to ensure
:23:48. > :23:53.We've brought it down by three quarters, so we have been doing that
:23:54. > :23:57.work and we will continue to work on that in sharp contrast
:23:58. > :23:59.to the Labour Party, that wants to increase borrowing
:24:00. > :24:05.and with a leader who says he doesn't mind about debt and deficit.
:24:06. > :24:12.The Budget deficit, how we spend and borrow and tax, immigration,
:24:13. > :24:16.which was a huge issue with the Brexit campaign and so on,
:24:17. > :24:21.on these two major issues, you have failed to keep your promises.
:24:22. > :24:25.And on these two major issues, we are in sharp contrast
:24:26. > :24:30.We are continuing to work to deliver what I believe ordinary people want.
:24:31. > :24:34.Immigration was one of the issues that underpinned that Brexit vote.
:24:35. > :24:38.That is why I come back to the point I made earlier about the election
:24:39. > :24:44.Who do people trust to sit around a table in those Brexit negotiations
:24:45. > :24:48.and bring home the best deal for the UK?
:24:49. > :24:50.George Osborne says not a single senior member of your Cabinet
:24:51. > :24:59.Look, this immigration target is one that we've had
:25:00. > :25:05.It was developed under David Cameron's leadership in opposition.
:25:06. > :25:12.People do support the immigration target.
:25:13. > :25:15.They support the view of the British people.
:25:16. > :25:18.That's what we're supporting, because the British people want
:25:19. > :25:27.We have ruled out a lot of abuse that was taking place in the system.
:25:28. > :25:30.But you have consistently to work at that.
:25:31. > :25:33.We will get the ability to work at it in relation to the numbers
:25:34. > :25:40.But it is me and my party, me and my team, that are committed
:25:41. > :25:42.to saying we want to control migration, whereas Labour want
:25:43. > :25:48.You said last week that Britain faces "dire consequences" if we fail
:25:49. > :25:50.to get a good deal in the Brexit talks
:25:51. > :25:58.If you look at what is being said around the whole question
:25:59. > :26:02.of Brexit negotiations, you've got people in
:26:03. > :26:06.the European Union talking about punishing the United Kingdom.
:26:07. > :26:09.You've got some people here in the UK who are saying it
:26:10. > :26:14.doesn't really matter what we do, we're just going to get any deal,
:26:15. > :26:23.If we don't get a deal, what will the dire consequences be?
:26:24. > :26:26.I've said that no deal is better than a bad deal,
:26:27. > :26:29.because as I've just said, there are some people
:26:30. > :26:34.here who are willing to sign up to any deal.
:26:35. > :26:38.The reason I said what you've quoted and the reason I think this is such
:26:39. > :26:43.a crucial part of the question that underpins this election
:26:44. > :26:49.is that we need to get Brexit right in setting the tone for the next,
:26:50. > :26:57.It's about all the things that we want to do in terms
:26:58. > :26:59.of ensuring that we work with our European partners.
:27:00. > :27:04.I don't understand why no deal can be better than a bad deal
:27:05. > :27:07.but no deal would also mean dire consequences.
:27:08. > :27:10.You haven't told us what the consequences would be.
:27:11. > :27:13.We want to make sure that we get a good deal which ensures
:27:14. > :27:17.I've explained why no deal is better than a bad deal,
:27:18. > :27:20.because a bad deal is because there are those in Europe
:27:21. > :27:25.And there are politicians in the United Kingdom
:27:26. > :27:27.who are willing to sign up to anything.
:27:28. > :27:29.I understand that, but you're now saying no deal
:27:30. > :27:38.I'm trying to find out how dire the consequences will be.
:27:39. > :27:41.I have every confidence that we will be able to negotiate
:27:42. > :27:44.a good deal with the right negotiating hand, with the strength
:27:45. > :27:47.of mandate behind us to take into those negotiations.
:27:48. > :27:54.That's why the choice on 8th June is so important for people.
:27:55. > :27:57.If you win on June 8th, Prime Minister, if you win,
:27:58. > :27:59.how long will you stay Prime Minister?
:28:00. > :28:03.Well, I'm Prime Minister until 8th June.
:28:04. > :28:06.I hope people will feel that they can support me to be
:28:07. > :28:11.I will definitely stay for the next Parliament.
:28:12. > :28:15.Beyond that, Andrew, I haven't got through this election yet.
:28:16. > :28:21.It's the most crucial in my lifetime.
:28:22. > :28:25.It's about the future of our country and who people trust to take us
:28:26. > :28:50.That was the Prime Minister talking to Andrew Neil in London. Here in
:28:51. > :28:51.Rhos it is our man in Wales, Welsh Secretary Alun Cairns.
:28:52. > :29:07.APPLAUSE Our audience tonight, a mix of
:29:08. > :29:13.undecided voters and supporters of the main parties. Straight to our
:29:14. > :29:19.first question which comes from Donna. Like me, you wanted to remain
:29:20. > :29:23.in the EU so can you explain to me with consequences such as the
:29:24. > :29:28.devalued pound, what the benefits of Brexit can be? Thank you for the
:29:29. > :29:33.question. You have highlighted some of the turbulence that has been in
:29:34. > :29:36.the economy since the referendum outcome where the fall in the pound
:29:37. > :29:40.lead to inflation which means the cost of things rises. That by and
:29:41. > :29:48.large the economy has held strong and employment has continued to fall
:29:49. > :29:55.butter and implement -- unemployment has continued to fall and investment
:29:56. > :30:01.has continued to rise. Your question I think is absolutely at the heart
:30:02. > :30:05.of the challenges that we face. The Brexit negotiations are pretty
:30:06. > :30:09.fundamental to everything and I will probably come back to this many
:30:10. > :30:13.times in terms of questions on a whole range of issues because
:30:14. > :30:17.growing the economy, creating jobs, attracting investment to create
:30:18. > :30:22.better paid jobs in Wales and across the UK, even paying for public
:30:23. > :30:26.services like health and education, hospitals and schools, really depend
:30:27. > :30:33.on a good Brexit deal. So there could be 11 countries, sorry, 27
:30:34. > :30:37.countries lining up to oppose off and there needs to be someone to
:30:38. > :30:41.negotiate with those. The question we have got to ultimately ask
:30:42. > :30:46.ourselves, who is best placed to negotiate that Brexit deal? As you
:30:47. > :30:49.have rightly highlighted, the turbulence we saw following the
:30:50. > :30:55.referendum, but that is nothing to do with the challenges if we get the
:30:56. > :30:59.Brexit deal wrong. And therefore, I believe Theresa May is absolutely
:31:00. > :31:03.the right person to get the Brexit deal and the opportunities it
:31:04. > :31:10.provides. The second part of your question related to opportunities.
:31:11. > :31:13.We have announced in our manifesto, for example, nine trade
:31:14. > :31:17.commissioners who would be based around the world, looking to create
:31:18. > :31:22.new deals, looking to create support businesses in Wales, and across the
:31:23. > :31:26.rest of the UK. That demonstrates that we not only want a deep and
:31:27. > :31:30.special partnership with the European Union, because we want
:31:31. > :31:34.Europe to succeed, it is important that Europe succeeds because it is
:31:35. > :31:39.important to our economy and our security. But we can also renew
:31:40. > :31:43.friendships with some old allies and create new friendships around the
:31:44. > :31:48.world as well. We are all familiar with the Commonwealth countries. The
:31:49. > :31:51.trade that we do with some of the fastest-growing countries in the
:31:52. > :31:54.world, some of them are Commonwealth countries and we have not built on
:31:55. > :31:58.that historical relationship that we could have and I think that some of
:31:59. > :32:02.the opportunity to grow our exports, to use the policies that we
:32:03. > :32:07.announced in the manifesto earlier this week, in order to support Welsh
:32:08. > :32:11.businesses and UK businesses be they small or large.
:32:12. > :32:17.You know that Wales export a lot more to the EU than the rest of the
:32:18. > :32:22.UK. A good deal for the UK might not be a good deal for Wales. How can
:32:23. > :32:26.you guarantee a good deal for Wales? I'm glad you asked, it allows me to
:32:27. > :32:30.put this statement right. It depends how you measure the exports from
:32:31. > :32:34.Wales. Let me take an automotive component manufacturer in Wales. If
:32:35. > :32:38.they make something that goes through Jaguar Land Rover, that is
:32:39. > :32:45.made in Wolverhampton, that Jaguar Land Rover could well go to North
:32:46. > :32:47.America. But that is not included as an international exporter outside of
:32:48. > :32:50.the European Union from Wales. The debate is so much more complicated
:32:51. > :32:54.than just thinking of Wales as one economy and the rest of the UK as a
:32:55. > :33:01.different economy. This is important, ultimately, we need to
:33:02. > :33:06.get the right Brexit deal for the whole of the UK. The Welsh economy
:33:07. > :33:11.depends on the successful UK economy. We are so interchanged, the
:33:12. > :33:15.relationship is so strong. Finally, I will say on this that if we look
:33:16. > :33:21.to Deeside, the advanced manufacturing sector there is a
:33:22. > :33:24.fantastic jewel in the Welsh and UK crown. But that depends on a
:33:25. > :33:31.successful UK economy, rather than just a successful Welsh economy. The
:33:32. > :33:35.gentleman with his hands up? From a manufacturing base, there are
:33:36. > :33:41.numerous crimes that are coming from the EU. Coming out of Brexit, how
:33:42. > :33:47.does the Conservative Government look to fill the gap? OK, we will
:33:48. > :33:52.take a couple of points. First, I would like to thank you very much
:33:53. > :33:54.for coming. I have heard you had numerous difficulties getting a
:33:55. > :33:58.representative of the Tory government to come on TV debate.
:33:59. > :34:04.Thank you very much for coming. You referred to 27 countries in
:34:05. > :34:08.opposition, I think you mentioned, opposed, that you were in opposition
:34:09. > :34:15.against. Is that really how you see the Brexit negotiating panning out
:34:16. > :34:21.for Wales? A third point? The lady in the black jumper? The point about
:34:22. > :34:27.the manufacturing, exactly the same for our farming communities. It was
:34:28. > :34:33.stated shortly after the result, that we could not expect to get
:34:34. > :34:42.equal funding from Westminster as we did under the EU. If you could take
:34:43. > :34:46.those together? The second question goes back to my first answer. I said
:34:47. > :34:50.quite carefully that there could be 27 nations lining up to oppose us.
:34:51. > :34:54.That is how tough the negotiations could be. We have seen, from some
:34:55. > :34:57.representatives of the European Commission, the sort of approach
:34:58. > :35:02.that they are taking and that led to the Prime Minister standing on the
:35:03. > :35:07.door of Downing Street, effectively stating her position in terms of
:35:08. > :35:17.responding to that. That is how tough they could be. Clearly,
:35:18. > :35:22.working hard since the referendum... In opposition to the UK
:35:23. > :35:25.establishment? But I also said that I want a deep and special
:35:26. > :35:30.partnership with the European Union. That is important to our success, as
:35:31. > :35:33.well as to their success. We want Europe to succeed and we want them
:35:34. > :35:39.to develop the relationship that they might argue sometimes Britain
:35:40. > :35:42.was dragging its feet on. They can become a much deeper, integrated
:35:43. > :35:46.partnership, and we can be content to see that. We will not be part of
:35:47. > :35:51.it. But, ultimately, there will be tough negotiations. There could be
:35:52. > :35:56.27 nations lining up to oppose us. On that basis, we need a strong
:35:57. > :35:59.leader in order to be challenging. Can I just ask, on strong
:36:00. > :36:03.leadership, strong and stable leadership, we have seen a U-turn on
:36:04. > :36:06.this general election. There was not going to be won. We have seen a
:36:07. > :36:11.U-turn on national insurance, that was going to go down. We have seen a
:36:12. > :36:14.U-turn today on the cap in social care, which applies in England but
:36:15. > :36:15.might have consequences in Wales. Is that really a strong and stable
:36:16. > :36:33.leader going to Brexit? I think you have got to look at the
:36:34. > :36:39.record of the Prime Minister. LAUGHTER. We talked about the
:36:40. > :36:44.economy, people predicted it would go to sharp decline. When she became
:36:45. > :36:48.Prime Minister, the stability that she brought, the markets reacted
:36:49. > :36:54.immediately. The outcome we have seen since the referendum outcome,
:36:55. > :36:58.and I will come to the question about manufacturing. There is Aston
:36:59. > :37:03.Martin in South Wales, Toyota in Derbyshire, extremely important for
:37:04. > :37:07.the engine part manufacturers in Wales. But Brexit hasn't happened?
:37:08. > :37:10.Guillermo Roan Nissan, in Sunderland, there are component
:37:11. > :37:16.industries, 100 automotive component industries based on Wales that
:37:17. > :37:24.depends on the large investments that come. Look at the facts, the
:37:25. > :37:30.wealth that they are creating, the jobs they are providing. That
:37:31. > :37:34.represents the strength and leadership to attract that of
:37:35. > :37:39.investment and the confidence it has instilled in leaders and nations
:37:40. > :37:42.around the world. I am absolutely content. If you compare that with
:37:43. > :37:49.the leadership of Jeremy Corbyn, that is ultimately what we have to
:37:50. > :37:55.come down to. 11 days. 11 days after the general election would be the
:37:56. > :37:58.first fat bear formal negotiations with the European Commission. -- the
:37:59. > :38:01.first formal negotiations with the European Commission. Who do you want
:38:02. > :38:06.to be sitting around that table in that discussion chamber? Do you want
:38:07. > :38:13.Theresa May and her experience, and her background? The No! I beg to
:38:14. > :38:18.differ. Do you want Jeremy Corbyn sitting there?
:38:19. > :38:24.The Conservative Party only has to lose six seats out of MPs in order
:38:25. > :38:29.to allow Jeremy Corbyn and the coalition of chaos, because he would
:38:30. > :38:34.have to work with nationalists in Scotland, in Wales, and with the Lib
:38:35. > :38:37.Dems, as well as with some MPs from Northern Ireland in order to strike
:38:38. > :38:41.that coalition. That really is the threat that our economy would face
:38:42. > :38:48.from the Brexit, from a bad Brexit deal. There is an issue with the
:38:49. > :38:52.question... We have to move on, we have a lot of ground to cover. Our
:38:53. > :38:59.second question comes from Adam Samuels. With record amounts of
:39:00. > :39:00.people using food banks and austerity failing everywhere else,
:39:01. > :39:12.why on earth would Wales vote Tory? I think there are lots of
:39:13. > :39:17.complicated reasons why people use food banks.
:39:18. > :39:28.There is one in my constituency, there is more than one, and they
:39:29. > :39:31.offer a very good way of bringing people back into the state level
:39:32. > :39:36.support. With each Russell trust, you need to have that voucher from
:39:37. > :39:41.the GP, from the citizens advice bureau, in order to get back into,
:39:42. > :39:46.in order to get the food bank support, and that assists part of
:39:47. > :39:51.the state level support. I think food banks can play a part in
:39:52. > :39:56.bringing people back into the level of support. The level of support
:39:57. > :40:10.they should rightly expect from the state. You mentioned the Trussle
:40:11. > :40:20.Trust, they handed out many food parcels in Wales, why is that,? The
:40:21. > :40:25.best way out of poverty is getting a job. Well, in reality, it is. I am
:40:26. > :40:29.proud of the record of 109,000 new jobs that have been created in the
:40:30. > :40:35.Welsh economy since 2010. When you ally that with Universal Credit,
:40:36. > :40:39.that means you are always better off in a job. It does not have those
:40:40. > :40:46.cliff edges that people used to have previously, when they had to compare
:40:47. > :40:50.the difference between housing benefit, and different kinds of
:40:51. > :40:53.benefits. People can easily cut late how much better off they would be.
:40:54. > :41:00.The calculation of Universal Credit has led to record low unemployment
:41:01. > :41:03.in Wales, since records began. We have had unemployment significantly
:41:04. > :41:07.lower than that across the whole of the UK. I think that demonstrates
:41:08. > :41:11.the investment that we have managed to attract, the jobs we have managed
:41:12. > :41:15.to create, in spite of the threats that we were told by some of our
:41:16. > :41:19.political opponents. Thank you. Let's take a few points from the
:41:20. > :41:23.audience. The lady in the back, and then the gentleman in front. The You
:41:24. > :41:27.say the best way out of poverty is getting a job. What you are not
:41:28. > :41:30.considering is the fact that some people are not well enough to get a
:41:31. > :41:36.job and still are on the poverty line. People that have had benefits
:41:37. > :41:44.cut, just because of the arbitrary assessment system, which is an
:41:45. > :41:47.assessor, not your GP, not the expert in your health. And then they
:41:48. > :41:55.have to go to a food back because they have decided no more money,
:41:56. > :41:59.just like that. A person who creates jobs, a recent company that I
:42:00. > :42:04.started three years ago in Wrexham employs 58 people. I'm very
:42:05. > :42:09.fortunate to work on the new prison infrastructure. I find it difficult
:42:10. > :42:15.to be able to communicate with government, and I am the creator, it
:42:16. > :42:19.is my money, my risk. But I am held down by bureaucracy, red tape,
:42:20. > :42:23.health and safety, employment legislation, is this going to
:42:24. > :42:27.continue? If it does, it will stifle people like me. We are investing
:42:28. > :42:32.abroad now. I travelled throughout the world. That needs to be
:42:33. > :42:40.addressed. Food banks, and maybe austerity? The lady in the front? I
:42:41. > :42:48.did raise my hand for different things. We'll Theresa May have a
:42:49. > :42:54.passport to heart Brexit if she becomes Prime Minister?
:42:55. > :43:02.-- We'll Theresa May have a passport to heart Brexit if she becomes Prime
:43:03. > :43:07.Minister? This is the reality, the people using food banks are in work.
:43:08. > :43:13.A lot of people are using food banks in work. They have not been helped
:43:14. > :43:18.out of poverty by getting a job. They are in work. People on the
:43:19. > :43:20.poverty line are in work and there in work benefits have been cut by
:43:21. > :43:25.your government in the last couple of months. You have got people
:43:26. > :43:29.sleeping in doorways. You've got people dying in hospital corridors.
:43:30. > :43:39.You've got queues of ambulances outside casualty. Those are not the
:43:40. > :43:41.unintended, but the undisclosed consequences of an austerity
:43:42. > :43:43.programme imposed for seven years by your government.
:43:44. > :43:57.Well, there are two issues here. I will come to the last issue
:43:58. > :44:01.secondly. The first issue is when you talk about disabled people. I
:44:02. > :44:03.think it is wrong to simply assess somebody as being disabled and then
:44:04. > :44:07.forget about them. We do need to bring them back into the workplace
:44:08. > :44:10.through modern technology, appropriate changes, legislative
:44:11. > :44:14.changes, to give them stronger rights. There is more we need to do
:44:15. > :44:17.to support disabled people, to bring them back into work. There are some
:44:18. > :44:22.employers that are fantastic in doing that. We need to share best
:44:23. > :44:26.practice, but we also need to legislate, where it is right, when
:44:27. > :44:31.people are not giving respect to disabled people that they should.
:44:32. > :44:34.The issue that was raised about poverty, well, I still stand by the
:44:35. > :44:42.statement that the best way out of poverty is to get a job. If you let
:44:43. > :44:46.me finish... I will take you to meet friends of mine that are using food
:44:47. > :44:50.banks, self-employed people that cannot afford to live because of
:44:51. > :44:59.austerity cuts imposed by your government. Come with me, I will
:45:00. > :45:03.take you. I have a girl that lives next door to me, I will introduce
:45:04. > :45:06.you to her. She can tell you all about what it is like to live under
:45:07. > :45:11.this Tory government and try to make ends meet. Getting a job is
:45:12. > :45:15.absolutely the best way out of poverty. But also, I recognise that
:45:16. > :45:21.people need better paid jobs. The National Living Wage gave close to a
:45:22. > :45:25.7% increase to the lowest paid over the last year. That is a positive
:45:26. > :45:30.step. Hang on, if you let me finish. I hope you would recognise, I hope
:45:31. > :45:34.you agree that is a positive step. The second element that I would say
:45:35. > :45:40.is the increase in the personal tax allowance, our commitment to take it
:45:41. > :45:48.to ?12,500, would take millions of the poorest people, the lowest
:45:49. > :45:54.earners, out of pay -- paying tax altogether. There are the policies I
:45:55. > :45:59.have mentioned already, but we also need to focus on training, skills,
:46:00. > :46:00.giving support to people that might have complicated backgrounds,
:46:01. > :46:07.sometimes mental health is an issue for some people who end up in a
:46:08. > :46:11.difficult situation. Our commitment, in order to support some of the most
:46:12. > :46:15.vulnerable people, I believe it is a strong package. We have had to move
:46:16. > :46:21.on. The next question comes from Derek.
:46:22. > :46:28.How are you planning to reduce the number of immigrants while still
:46:29. > :46:32.attracting those with skills who are essential for the Welsh economy? I
:46:33. > :46:35.think that is a really good question. Immigration is an issue
:46:36. > :46:42.which absolutely needs to be tackled. We have a policy to reduce
:46:43. > :46:48.it to tens of thousands since 2010. Clearly, that hasn't been met. There
:46:49. > :46:51.are lots of technical and complicated reasons for that but
:46:52. > :46:57.there is one fundamental reason I can point to, and that is because
:46:58. > :47:02.there are two parts of the equation, if you like. One is uncontrolled.
:47:03. > :47:05.That is because of the free movement of people that comes from the
:47:06. > :47:10.European Union. It is difficult to achieve the tens of thousands while
:47:11. > :47:18.at the same time we cannot control numbers which come from the European
:47:19. > :47:23.Union. On non-EU immigration... Can I finish? No, non-EU migration which
:47:24. > :47:29.you can control, that is not down to the tens of thousands. That is why I
:47:30. > :47:33.said at the beginning it is a very complicated issue that needs to be
:47:34. > :47:38.tackled at a whole range of levels, because at the same time we are
:47:39. > :47:43.conscious of employers, we heard about people who need the skills
:47:44. > :47:47.here. There is a balance in the economy that takes me back to an
:47:48. > :47:54.earlier point about upscaling, to make sure we provide the skills that
:47:55. > :47:59.our agriculture and manufacturing sector needs. There is no magic
:48:00. > :48:02.bullet. One part of the debate is controlling our borders as a result
:48:03. > :48:09.of exiting the European Union. We will build built to do that as a
:48:10. > :48:12.result of the Brexit negotiations if we get that right and I'm confident
:48:13. > :48:20.Theresa May will be able to get it down to the tens of thousands. Lots
:48:21. > :48:24.of hands up. This lady, thank you. You have been at this for seven
:48:25. > :48:28.years. We have people sleeping in the street. Tell me, why should I
:48:29. > :48:34.believe that things will be any better if you carry on? Thank you.
:48:35. > :48:40.And the gentleman in the blue? What we have seen is you have made this
:48:41. > :48:45.promise of under 100,020 ten and 2015, you have failed on the bit you
:48:46. > :48:49.can control like non-EU migration. If you take international students
:48:50. > :48:54.out of that, I think it is absolutely despicable. Your policy
:48:55. > :48:57.is to deport international students after they finish their course when
:48:58. > :49:06.they have contributed to our society. It is despicable. Any other
:49:07. > :49:16.points on immigration, please? We will get the microphone to you. I
:49:17. > :49:21.have graduated 12 years ago. I have a good humanities degree. Since
:49:22. > :49:25.2002, the problem is getting into work, there is immigration but
:49:26. > :49:29.they're all so these agencies, all these zero-hour contracts. I worked
:49:30. > :49:32.for nine months in the Welsh Assembly doing IT support. I worked
:49:33. > :49:38.in the local council doing this. In the last three months I have spent
:49:39. > :49:43.two months looking for another job. Do you know why people will take
:49:44. > :49:52.jobs for people working from abroad? It is because they will accept lower
:49:53. > :49:57.wages and insecure contracts. And another question -- and on those
:49:58. > :50:03.questions? There is the drag down on public services and also the drag
:50:04. > :50:06.down on potential wages. They would rather it was someone on a lower
:50:07. > :50:11.level rather than upscale. We are increasing the charge an employee
:50:12. > :50:15.would have to pay if they employ an immigrant rather than a local. That
:50:16. > :50:23.is about upscaling people in this country in order to meet the skills.
:50:24. > :50:29.-- up skilling. It cannot happen overnight. I have been working six
:50:30. > :50:36.years as a cleaner because it is the most secure employment I could find.
:50:37. > :50:41.I would like to ask about the student numbers. There are even
:50:42. > :50:45.Welsh colleges which have bases in London and some bogus colleges in
:50:46. > :50:49.London, more than 100 of them had to be closed because they were claiming
:50:50. > :50:53.to be colleges and they weren't. As a result, those are the sorts of
:50:54. > :50:57.measures we have had to pursue in order to reduce the numbers, so that
:50:58. > :51:01.is part of the reason why we do not exclude students. On the second
:51:02. > :51:05.issue about students, some will be leaving because they have finished
:51:06. > :51:16.their courses as others come in so the net number for students is
:51:17. > :51:18.broadly the same, but clearly, for all of our higher education
:51:19. > :51:21.institutions, it is an important source of income and we want to
:51:22. > :51:24.support students in coming here. Alun Cairns, thank you. They should
:51:25. > :51:30.come and follow their course but they should also leave as well.
:51:31. > :51:37.Thank you, time is flying. Our last question, thank you. Is the plan to
:51:38. > :51:41.reopen the debate on fox hunting a throwback to old conservative ways?
:51:42. > :51:46.The Prime Minister has said it will be a free vote so it will be up to
:51:47. > :51:50.each individual member of Parliament how they choose to vote on that bill
:51:51. > :51:56.when it comes. I am told it will be a one line bill. It will be a very
:51:57. > :52:01.short time in the House of Commons and it is up to individuals to vote
:52:02. > :52:04.for the member of Parliament, for the whole package of policies they
:52:05. > :52:10.propose, or whatever manifesto they stand behind, at the same time
:52:11. > :52:16.taking their views on things like animal welfare and other sorts of
:52:17. > :52:22.things that are there. How would you vote? I would vote to repeal the ban
:52:23. > :52:32.because it does not work as it is. Even Tony Blair who was the Prime
:52:33. > :52:36.Minister who committed to introducing it, says he regrets it
:52:37. > :52:40.and secondly says it doesn't work. I think there are a whole host of
:52:41. > :52:46.things we could do that would be far more effective in achieving what we
:52:47. > :52:51.want to achieve. A couple of points on fox hunting, very briefly,
:52:52. > :52:56.please. My question is, with the ban on ivory trade which Theresa May is
:52:57. > :53:03.also planning to repeal, what do you think about that? That is not on
:53:04. > :53:09.hunting but thank you. Theresa May came up to Wrexham, I think it is
:53:10. > :53:14.the first time she came up here, very briefly, I just wonder what was
:53:15. > :53:20.wrong with the guy's bugle and skills this afternoon? OK!
:53:21. > :53:24.Considering the polls say 80% of people are opposed to fox hunting,
:53:25. > :53:26.why don't we have a referendum on it?
:53:27. > :53:34.APPLAUSE Another one? There is another issue
:53:35. > :53:38.I have to highlight which is so important to do with European
:53:39. > :53:44.funding. I think that people should judge Theresa May and me on my
:53:45. > :53:47.record in terms of funding to Wales. We complained, people complained for
:53:48. > :53:51.decades about the amount of money and how the Barnett Formula didn't
:53:52. > :53:56.work for Wales. So last December I signed a deal readily signed by the
:53:57. > :54:04.Welsh Government, so Wales now gets ?120 for every ?100 which is spent
:54:05. > :54:07.in England. As a result of that, please judge us in terms of the
:54:08. > :54:12.support we give financially, based on what we have delivered, rather
:54:13. > :54:16.than the rhetoric. On that point, thank you to Alun Cairns. And thank
:54:17. > :54:22.you to the audience. We are off to bang and tomorrow night it is all
:54:23. > :54:26.about Ukip. Join us if you can at seven o'clock. Good night. --
:54:27. > :54:32.tomorrow night we are off to Bangor. All this week we're bringing you
:54:33. > :54:35.a party leader double feature.