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:00:23. > :00:28.I wanted to talk about protecting older people.

:00:29. > :00:33.The Conservative plan to confiscate assets pound for pound from elderly

:00:34. > :00:39.people to pay for their social care is the worst and stupid public

:00:40. > :00:43.policy proposal of recent years, and the nastiest too, in effect, if not

:00:44. > :00:48.in intention. It cannot be allowed to be implemented in its current

:00:49. > :00:55.form. The Prime Minister is effectively proposing a 100%

:00:56. > :00:59.inheritance tax on assets over ?100,000 for those unlucky enough to

:01:00. > :01:06.develop a debilitating, long-term condition that requires domiciliary

:01:07. > :01:11.care, such as dementia or acute arthritis, for instance. Every ?1

:01:12. > :01:15.spent on care for these and fortunate people will be claimed

:01:16. > :01:20.back from either, at the time they receive it, or from their estate

:01:21. > :01:26.when they die. Now, most policies that intrude on personal finances

:01:27. > :01:30.concern tens of pounds, such as insurance tax rises, for instance,

:01:31. > :01:35.or hundreds of pounds at most, such as Ukip's excellent proposals to cut

:01:36. > :01:40.the cost of living, saving households ?400 a year by taking

:01:41. > :01:45.taxes off domestic energy and other measures. But this Tory death tax is

:01:46. > :01:50.in an altogether different league. It could involve taking tens of

:01:51. > :01:55.thousands or even hundreds of thousands of pounds out of someone's

:01:56. > :02:00.estate, if they have been an lucky enough to suffer an extended,

:02:01. > :02:04.debilitating condition later life. Damian Green seems to feel he is

:02:05. > :02:09.qualified to tell people how much is reasonable for them to pass on to

:02:10. > :02:12.their children, but the financial exposure the Tories are leaving

:02:13. > :02:18.millions of elderly people is not reasonable at all. In fact, this is

:02:19. > :02:22.a Russian roulette approach to paying for social care, and the

:02:23. > :02:27.abrogation of government responsibility. It makes a mockery

:02:28. > :02:31.of the claims of Mrs May and Nick Ahad advisors to be running a

:02:32. > :02:37.communitarian Conservative administration. Just consider

:02:38. > :02:41.typical house prices in parts of the country, particularly but not

:02:42. > :02:48.exclusively in southern England. In Dagenham, for example, average house

:02:49. > :02:56.prices are too good ?95,000. In Thurrock, ?338,000. In Ramsgate,

:02:57. > :02:59.210,000. In Epping, more than ?500,000. Homeowners requiring

:03:00. > :03:04.domiciliary social care are typically people who have paid off

:03:05. > :03:07.their mortgages and therefore owed all or nearly all of the value of

:03:08. > :03:14.the house, so in these ordinary Ingolstadt was that I have listed,

:03:15. > :03:18.anything from 110,000-400,000 will be exposed to the Tory death tax.

:03:19. > :03:23.The Prime Minister seems to wish to avoid scrutiny on heavyweight

:03:24. > :03:28.political programmes in this election. She went on the One Show

:03:29. > :03:32.recently. If she sticks to this policy, her next appearance should

:03:33. > :03:36.be on Total Wipe-out, because that is what she is planning to do to the

:03:37. > :03:41.estates of many elderly people. The Conservatives have created a cult of

:03:42. > :03:45.the leader under Mrs May, but if they persist with this policy in its

:03:46. > :03:49.current form, they will soon find out that this is not North Korea.

:03:50. > :03:54.The British public free thinkers who do not take kindly to being treated

:03:55. > :04:06.like fools. Older voters in particular are not going to

:04:07. > :04:08.brainwashed into voting for Kim Yong-may and against their own

:04:09. > :04:12.interest in such a scale. It is often said that when there is weak

:04:13. > :04:15.opposition, the danger of bad government escalates, and that is

:04:16. > :04:19.what we are seeing with the Tory death tax. Mrs May's Tories think

:04:20. > :04:23.they can do what they like. This policy is not just a dementia tax,

:04:24. > :04:27.it is effectively a tax on all forms of debilitating disease and

:04:28. > :04:33.infirmity that need an elderly person to need social care.

:04:34. > :04:40.Every extra week they live will lead to a further loss of equity and what

:04:41. > :04:44.they can hang onto their children. This will undoubtedly lead to an

:04:45. > :04:50.extra psychological toll on people already with disease. At the extreme

:04:51. > :04:55.end of the spectrum it's likely to make some elderly people feel

:04:56. > :05:05.regretful to still be alive. The Tory policy will also pour some

:05:06. > :05:13.specific knowledge -- anomalies and consequences... What happens, for

:05:14. > :05:18.instance, if a grown-up child is sharing the house but working

:05:19. > :05:25.full-time? Does the house gets sold immediately on the death of the

:05:26. > :05:30.elderly person? If so, that would render someone homeless just as they

:05:31. > :05:36.have lost a parent, or if not, it will lead to anomalies and sculpture

:05:37. > :05:40.of the avoidance. If this scheme is implemented in its present form, it

:05:41. > :05:44.will create a whole new tax avoidance industry, with elderly

:05:45. > :05:49.people piling intellect to release schemes and being given incentives

:05:50. > :05:53.to go on spending sprees to get the remaining value of their assets down

:05:54. > :05:57.under ?100,000. The message from government would be, don't be

:05:58. > :06:03.successful, and don't be financially responsible either. Another even

:06:04. > :06:08.more serious perverse outcome could be that people who need social care

:06:09. > :06:14.refused to accept it and try and model through in order to preserve

:06:15. > :06:19.their estate. With the inevitable result they suffer far more falls

:06:20. > :06:22.and other accidents around the home, which then necessitate long and

:06:23. > :06:29.expensive hospital stays or even bring about their premature death.

:06:30. > :06:32.This is a devastating death tax dreamt up on the back of an envelope

:06:33. > :06:38.and apparently winging its way to the Tory manifesto without

:06:39. > :06:41.consultation with expert opinion, the Cabinet or even the ministers in

:06:42. > :06:48.charge of the policy area in government. It doesn't have to be

:06:49. > :06:52.this way, word governments to make better and different choices on

:06:53. > :06:55.public spending. What is needed first is an immediate and

:06:56. > :07:00.substantial injection of money into the social care system. Because Ukip

:07:01. > :07:08.is prepared to cut unjustified public spending on the Barnett

:07:09. > :07:13.formula, HS2 and overseas aid, we are able to offer just such a

:07:14. > :07:19.financial boost, and will do so when we set out our manifesto on

:07:20. > :07:22.Wednesday. But longer term, we also need an agreed way forward for

:07:23. > :07:28.social care to ensure that risk is fairly pooled and builds our fairly

:07:29. > :07:33.paid. Possible solutions range from a national care service, as set out

:07:34. > :07:36.by Andy Burnham some years ago, to insurance policies and products that

:07:37. > :07:42.people can be encouraged to invest in. The Andy Burnham route may have

:07:43. > :07:46.something to commend it if the public could be assured the

:07:47. > :07:50.resources of a national care service funded out of tax revenue could be

:07:51. > :07:54.protected against freeloading, for instance by new arrivals from other

:07:55. > :07:59.countries. I'm afraid that hurdle would not be cleared if Labour were

:08:00. > :08:03.in government, because Labour has a reputation for being generous to a

:08:04. > :08:09.fault with other people's money. Were I in the shoes of the Tories

:08:10. > :08:14.today, the first thing I would do would be to recognise that Denis

:08:15. > :08:19.Healey's law of holes is now in play. For the uninitiated, I should

:08:20. > :08:26.explain this law is very concise and simply state in regard to a hole,

:08:27. > :08:31.when you are in one, stop digging. Declaring financial war and millions

:08:32. > :08:36.of retired people who spent working life being responsible and building

:08:37. > :08:40.up assets does not amount to compassionate conservatism. It

:08:41. > :08:44.amounts betrayal. So I offer this advice to team Teresa Lu. Why don't

:08:45. > :08:51.you at least offer people a meaningful choice? That is after all

:08:52. > :08:57.what conservatism used to be about. So why not give people an option of

:08:58. > :09:02.chipping in to a voluntary social care costs insurance system run by

:09:03. > :09:07.government from say the age of 50? If people pay in and then need care,

:09:08. > :09:12.they are covered and should not be charged a penny. If, however, they

:09:13. > :09:16.have chosen not to pay in, then at least you would have the semblance

:09:17. > :09:20.of an argument for reclaim the costs from estates after death. If you did

:09:21. > :09:23.this, you could even claim to be adding to your manifesto proposal

:09:24. > :09:32.rather than abounding in it altogether. -- abandoning it.

:09:33. > :09:36.Therefore sparing the blushes of Tarquin without proper stress

:09:37. > :09:41.testing or scrutiny. One could tell from the demeanour of Tory ministers

:09:42. > :09:47.sent out to bat for this policy on the political programmes yesterday,

:09:48. > :09:50.that they knew they were on a loser. So far the conservative newspapers

:09:51. > :09:54.have not really got stuck into the policy with full figure. The ones

:09:55. > :10:01.that care about their readers will do so this week. Because it is an

:10:02. > :10:06.unforgivable attack on the -- responsible and hard-working people.

:10:07. > :10:12.My message to all those who may be hit by the Tory policy but would

:10:13. > :10:16.never eat vote for Jeremy Corbyn's Labour, is simple. Ask yourself what

:10:17. > :10:23.has been the best way to influence the Conservative Party's behaviour

:10:24. > :10:27.and policies in the recent past? And the answer is obvious. By voting

:10:28. > :10:32.Ukip, or at least threatening to vote Ukip, look how it worked on

:10:33. > :10:37.Brexit, look how it is working on grammar schools. So if I were in

:10:38. > :10:40.your shoes, I would tell Tory campaigners on the doorstep that you

:10:41. > :10:47.are going to vote Ukip for a common-sense and fairer approach.

:10:48. > :10:51.And if you do that, there is a strong possibility this policy will

:10:52. > :10:56.be ditched altogether, or at least greatly modified by the end of the

:10:57. > :11:00.week. I want to turn briefly to the second leg of the Tory attack on the

:11:01. > :11:05.elderly, on the issue of winter fuel allowance. The Conservatives tell us

:11:06. > :11:09.they will means tested but will not say at what income level people will

:11:10. > :11:14.lose it. Pensioners can be forgiven for suspecting that vast majority of

:11:15. > :11:19.them would no longer be eligible. The Tories have claimed to be making

:11:20. > :11:23.a principled case against Universalism in this area. And for

:11:24. > :11:31.replacing it with an assessment of need. So how come the very next day

:11:32. > :11:34.after unveiling the plan, the Prime Minister was helping Ruth Davidson

:11:35. > :11:39.to launch a Scottish Tory manifesto that placed to keep the allowance

:11:40. > :11:43.for all pensioners north of the border. --? This is yet another

:11:44. > :11:46.example of the English and indeed the wells being treated as

:11:47. > :11:52.second-class citizens within the UK. There is simply no good reason why a

:11:53. > :11:58.millionaire pensioner in Edinburgh should receive an allowance of up to

:11:59. > :12:04.?300 million -- three to pay full interview will, while pensioners on

:12:05. > :12:07.modest incomes in Essex get nothing. It is the Barnett formula which

:12:08. > :12:13.leads to public spending in Scotland being ?1700 per head higher than it

:12:14. > :12:17.is in England. That is what is behind this. It is another

:12:18. > :12:21.vindication of the Ukip policy of dumping that formula and replacing

:12:22. > :12:27.it with a needs -based funding system instead. So Mrs May's social

:12:28. > :12:33.care plan is not conservative and her winter fuel allowance is not a

:12:34. > :12:37.humanist. Apart from that, I'm sure everything is going fine on the

:12:38. > :12:44.Conservative and Unionist campaign. Thank you.

:12:45. > :12:51.Any questions. Does it matter if you win your seat or your party wins

:12:52. > :12:55.anything at all? I think you may be referring to the point Paul Nuttall

:12:56. > :12:58.made on the television yesterday, which was simply that Ukip has shown

:12:59. > :13:04.it is able to influence the course of politics in Britain without MPs.

:13:05. > :13:10.And indeed one could say that under the current first past the post

:13:11. > :13:13.system, it is proved to date easier for Ukip to get the United Kingdom

:13:14. > :13:18.out of the European Union than it has together MPs elected to the

:13:19. > :13:22.House of Commons. But we hope to change that in this election. We are

:13:23. > :13:27.not expecting an across the board level of voting to match that of

:13:28. > :13:32.2015, but we do believe we are very much more successfully targeting the

:13:33. > :13:38.areas where we are very strong without actually specifying the

:13:39. > :13:43.ranking of are target seats. Do you think comments like that are

:13:44. > :13:48.helpful in terms of getting the vote out? That it doesn't matter

:13:49. > :13:52.necessarily if you have no MPs? I wouldn't say it doesn't matter. It

:13:53. > :13:55.is this the better for Ukip to be represented in the House of Commons

:13:56. > :13:59.as well as to command the support of hundreds of thousands of millions of

:14:00. > :14:04.people as well. We're just making the point that one of the key ways

:14:05. > :14:07.that we have worked in recent years has been frankly to scare the

:14:08. > :14:12.Conservative Party in particular when they step out of line too

:14:13. > :14:18.badly. And that is why I am inviting older people who get knocked up this

:14:19. > :14:22.week by Conservative campaigners, if enough of you say, we are thinking

:14:23. > :14:28.of voting Ukip over this policy, I don't see it lasting beyond next

:14:29. > :14:35.weekend. Harry, you seem amused.

:14:36. > :14:41.Do you have any reaction to the news that the Commonwealth are sending

:14:42. > :14:49.election monitors from Australia and Mauritius to oversee the election?

:14:50. > :14:53.Is that something you welcome? I think our electoral system has a lot

:14:54. > :14:58.of problems around postal voting on demand in some areas. In some

:14:59. > :15:03.inner-city areas I think there have been problems in the past with

:15:04. > :15:06.intimidation of voters. And I think the Electoral Commission have

:15:07. > :15:11.recognised that certain features of the way elections are run,

:15:12. > :15:13.particularly in inner-city areas, are pretty disgraceful. I think

:15:14. > :15:20.there is no room for complacency at all. And if we have visitors from

:15:21. > :15:25.other countries to have a look and monitor, I think that is quite

:15:26. > :15:29.welcome. It doesn't necessarily mean that their own democratic systems

:15:30. > :15:34.are above criticism. I think it is perfectly welcome. Let's have as

:15:35. > :15:48.many eyes on how things are done as possible. Yeah. Go on.

:15:49. > :15:59.If former leader of the Lib Dems was on the radio this morning, waffling

:16:00. > :16:06.on for about half an hour and taking up so much space that he was even

:16:07. > :16:21.cutting his own throat in hand... It was waffle. It is typical of the

:16:22. > :16:25.BBC. They keep pushing the Lib Dems all the time.

:16:26. > :16:28.As you know, I have had some criticisms of the BBC over recent

:16:29. > :16:32.years. We have got a policy of scrapping the licence fee. But I

:16:33. > :16:37.think during an election, they are quite entitled to put on politicians

:16:38. > :16:43.of lots of different parties. And I don't particularly see that

:16:44. > :16:47.increased exposure of Nick Clegg to the masses is going to harm the

:16:48. > :16:53.prospects of Ukip or indeed any other party at all. I think it is a

:16:54. > :16:55.great democratic festival, a general election, so the more Nick Clegg,

:16:56. > :16:59.the better. Anyone else?

:17:00. > :17:32.Thank you very much then. Thanks. The 2017 general election is upon

:17:33. > :17:33.us. Everyday BBC Parliament will have the key speeches from the