:00:16. > :00:24.I want to talk about controversial area of this election, which is
:00:25. > :00:28.protecting older people. The Conservative plan to confiscate
:00:29. > :00:33.assets pound for pound from elderly people to pay for their social care,
:00:34. > :00:40.is the worst and stupid public policy proposal of recent years. And
:00:41. > :00:47.the nastiest too. It cannot be allowed to be implemented in its
:00:48. > :00:53.current form. The Prime Minister is effectively proposing a 100%
:00:54. > :00:58.inheritance tax, on assets over ?100,000, for those unlucky enough
:00:59. > :01:03.to develop a debilitating long-term condition, that requires domiciliary
:01:04. > :01:08.care, such as dementia or acute arthritis for instance. Every pound
:01:09. > :01:14.spent on care for these unfortunate people will be claimed back from
:01:15. > :01:19.either at the time they receive it, or from their estate when they die.
:01:20. > :01:24.Now most policies that intrude on personal finances concern tens of
:01:25. > :01:28.pounds, such as insurance tax rises for instance on hundreds of pounds
:01:29. > :01:35.at most. Such as Ukip's excellent proposals to cut the cost of living,
:01:36. > :01:40.saving house holes ?4400 a year, by taking taxes off domestic energy. --
:01:41. > :01:47.?400 a year. This Tory death tax is in another league. It could involve
:01:48. > :01:51.taking tens of thousands or even hundreds of thousands of pounds, out
:01:52. > :01:55.of someone's estate. If they have been unlucky enough to suffer an
:01:56. > :02:00.extended debilitating condition late in life. Damian Green seems to feel
:02:01. > :02:06.he is qualified to tell people how much is reasonable for them to pass
:02:07. > :02:09.on to their children. But the financial exposure the Tories are
:02:10. > :02:15.leaving millions of elderly people is not reasonable at all.
:02:16. > :02:21.In fact, this is a Russian roulette approach to paying for social care,
:02:22. > :02:24.and the investigation of Government responsibility, it makes a mum
:02:25. > :02:28.mockery of the claims of Mrs May and her key advisers to be running a
:02:29. > :02:32.communetarian Conservative administration.
:02:33. > :02:37.Just consider for a moment typical house prices in parts of the
:02:38. > :02:43.country, particular but not exclusively in southern England. In
:02:44. > :02:52.Dagenham for example average house prices are ?295,000. In Thurrock
:02:53. > :02:56.338,000. In Ramsgate 210,000. In Epping more than 500,000. Homeowners
:02:57. > :03:00.requiring domiciliary social care are typically people who have paid
:03:01. > :03:05.off their mortgages, and therefore own all or nearly all of the value
:03:06. > :03:10.of their house. So, in these ordinary English towns I have
:03:11. > :03:15.listed, anything from 110,000 to 400,00 pounds will be exposed to the
:03:16. > :03:19.Tory death tax. The Prime Minister seems to wish to avoid scrutiny on
:03:20. > :03:26.heavyweight political programmes in this election. She went on The One
:03:27. > :03:29.Show recently, if she sticks to this policy her next appearance should be
:03:30. > :03:34.on Total wipe-out that is what she is planning to do to the estates of
:03:35. > :03:39.many elderly people. The Conservatives have created a cult of
:03:40. > :03:43.the leader under Mrs May but if they persist with this policy in its
:03:44. > :03:47.current form they will soon find out this isn't North Korea. The British
:03:48. > :03:52.public are free thinkers who do not take kindly to being treated like
:03:53. > :04:00.fools. Older voters in particular are not going to be brainwashed into
:04:01. > :04:04.voting for Kim Young May and against their own financial interests on
:04:05. > :04:07.such a huge scale. It is often said when there is weak opposition the
:04:08. > :04:12.danger of bad Government escalates. And that is what we are seeing with
:04:13. > :04:18.a Tory death tax. Mrs May's Tories think they can do what they like.
:04:19. > :04:24.This policy is not just a dementia tax, it is a tax on all forms of
:04:25. > :04:29.debilitating disease and infirmity that lead and elderly person to need
:04:30. > :04:33.social care. Every extra week that they live, will lead to a further
:04:34. > :04:40.loss of equity and what they can hand on to their children. This fact
:04:41. > :04:44.will undoubtedly lead to an extra psychological toll on people already
:04:45. > :04:50.struggling with disease. At the extreme end of the spectrum it is
:04:51. > :04:57.likely even to make some elderly people feel regrettable to still be
:04:58. > :05:01.alive. The Tory policy will cause specific anomalies and perverse
:05:02. > :05:05.consequences I want to set out, and then hear answered by its advocates
:05:06. > :05:10.if any can be found to field questions by the end of the day.
:05:11. > :05:16.What happens for instance in a grown up child is sharing the house but
:05:17. > :05:21.working full-time too? Does the house ged sold immediately on the
:05:22. > :05:25.death of the elderly person? If so, that would render someone homeless
:05:26. > :05:29.just as they have lost a parent, or if not, won't it leads to huge
:05:30. > :05:34.anomalies and scope for fee avoidance? In fact this scheme, if
:05:35. > :05:39.implemented in its present form, will create a whole new tax
:05:40. > :05:42.avoidance industry, with elderly people piling into equity release
:05:43. > :05:48.schemes and being given incentives to go on spending spree, to get the
:05:49. > :05:53.remaining value of their assets down under ?100,000. The message from
:05:54. > :05:58.government would be don't be successful, and don't be financially
:05:59. > :06:02.responsible either. Another even more serious perverse
:06:03. > :06:07.outcome could be that people who need social care refuse to accept
:06:08. > :06:13.it, and try and muddle through in order to preserve their estate. With
:06:14. > :06:17.the inever tab result they suffer far more falls and other accidents
:06:18. > :06:22.round the home, which then necessitate long and expensive
:06:23. > :06:27.hospital stays, or even bring about their premature death. This is a
:06:28. > :06:32.devastating death tax, dreamed up on the back of an envelope, and
:06:33. > :06:36.apparently winging its way into the Tory manifesto, without consultation
:06:37. > :06:41.with expert opinion, the Cabinet, or even the ministers in charge of the
:06:42. > :06:46.policy area in Government. It doesn't have to be this way, were
:06:47. > :06:49.Governments to make better and deaf representative choices on public
:06:50. > :06:53.spending. -- different. What is needed first is an immediate and
:06:54. > :07:00.substantial injection of money into the social care system. Because Ukip
:07:01. > :07:06.is prepared to cut unjustified public spending on the Barnett
:07:07. > :07:10.Formula, HS2 and overseas end, we -- aid, we are able to offer such a
:07:11. > :07:15.financial boost and will do so when we set out our manifesto on
:07:16. > :07:20.Wednesday. But longer term, we also need an agreed way forward for
:07:21. > :07:25.social care to ensure that risk is fairly pooled and bills are fairly
:07:26. > :07:31.paid. Possibly solutions range from a national care service, as set out
:07:32. > :07:35.by Andy Burnham some years ago, to insurance policies and products that
:07:36. > :07:39.people could be encouraged to invest in. The Burnham route might have
:07:40. > :07:43.something to commend it if the public could be assured the
:07:44. > :07:47.resources of a national care service, funded out of tax revenue
:07:48. > :07:51.could be protected against free loading, for instance by new
:07:52. > :07:56.arrivals from other country, I am afraid that hurdle would not be
:07:57. > :07:59.cleared if Labour were in Government because Labour has a reputation for
:08:00. > :08:04.being generous to a fault with other people's money.
:08:05. > :08:09.Were I in the shoes of the Tory today, the first thing I would do,
:08:10. > :08:14.would be to recognise that Denis Healey's law of holes is now in
:08:15. > :08:18.play, and for the uninitiated I should ex peninsula in this law is
:08:19. > :08:23.very concise and simply states in regard to a hole, when you are in
:08:24. > :08:28.one, stop digging. Declaring financial war on millions
:08:29. > :08:33.of retired people, who spent a working life being responsible and
:08:34. > :08:38.building up assets, does not amount to compassionate conservatism. It
:08:39. > :08:43.amounts to retrail. So I offer this advice to team Teresa. Why don't you
:08:44. > :08:48.at least offer people a meaningful choice. That is, after all, what
:08:49. > :08:55.conservatism used to be about. So why not give people an option of
:08:56. > :08:59.chipping in to a voluntary social care costs insurance system run by
:09:00. > :09:03.Government from say the age of 50. If people pay in, and then need
:09:04. > :09:08.care, they are covered and should not be charged a penny. If however,
:09:09. > :09:13.they have chosen not to pay in, then at least you would have the
:09:14. > :09:16.semblance of an argument for reclaiming the costs from a state --
:09:17. > :09:21.estates after death. If you did this you could claim to be adding to your
:09:22. > :09:25.manifesto proposal, rather than abandoning it all together.
:09:26. > :09:32.Therefore sparing the blusheses of which ever young tar Quinn or
:09:33. > :09:36.Jocasta stuck it in without proper stress testing or scrutiny. One
:09:37. > :09:39.could tell from the Dee mean nor of Tory ministers set century out to
:09:40. > :09:40.bat for this policy on the political programmes yesterday, that they knew
:09:41. > :09:48.they were on a loser. So far the Conservative newspapers
:09:49. > :09:54.have not really got stuck into the policy with full vigour. The ones
:09:55. > :09:58.that care about their readers will do so this week, because it is an
:09:59. > :10:04.unforgiveable attack on responsible and hard working people. My message
:10:05. > :10:09.to all those who may be hit by the Tory policy, but would never vote
:10:10. > :10:16.for Jeremy Corbyn's Labour is simple: Ask yourself what has been
:10:17. > :10:20.the best way to influence the Conservative Party's behaviour and
:10:21. > :10:25.policies in the recent past and the answer is obvious - by voting Ukip
:10:26. > :10:30.or at least threatening to vote Ukip. Look how it worked on Brexit.
:10:31. > :10:35.Look how it's working on grammar schools. So if I were in your shoes,
:10:36. > :10:40.I'd tell Tory campaigners on the doorstep that you're going to vote
:10:41. > :10:44.Ukip for a common sense and fair approach, if you do that, there's a
:10:45. > :10:49.strong possibility this policy will be ditched all together. Or at least
:10:50. > :10:54.greatly modified by the end of the week. Now I want to turn briefly to
:10:55. > :10:58.the second leg of the Tory attack on the elderly and that's on the issue
:10:59. > :11:03.of winter fuel allowance. The Conservatives tell us they will mean
:11:04. > :11:08.test it, but will not say at what income level people will lose it.
:11:09. > :11:12.Pensioners can be forgiven for suspecting the vast majority of them
:11:13. > :11:18.will no longer be eligible. The Tories have claimed to be making a
:11:19. > :11:23.principled case against universalism in this area and replacing it with
:11:24. > :11:28.an assessment of need. So how come the very next day, after unveiling
:11:29. > :11:32.the plan, the Prime Minister was helping Ruth Davidson to launch a
:11:33. > :11:36.Scottish Tory manifesto that pledged to keep the allowance for all
:11:37. > :11:41.pensioners north of the border? This is yet another example of the
:11:42. > :11:46.English and indeed the Welsh being treated as second-class citizens
:11:47. > :11:49.within the UK. There is simply no good reason why a millionaire
:11:50. > :11:56.pensioner in Edinburgh should receive an allowance of up to ?300
:11:57. > :12:02.to pay for winter fuel while pensioners on modest incomes in
:12:03. > :12:07.Essex get nothing. It is the Barnett formula which leads to public
:12:08. > :12:13.spending in Scotland being ?1700 per head higher than it is in England
:12:14. > :12:17.that is behind this. So it's another vindication of Ukip's policy of
:12:18. > :12:23.dumping that formula and replacing it with a needs-based funding system
:12:24. > :12:28.instead. So Mrs May's social care plan is not conservative and her
:12:29. > :12:32.winter fuel plan is not Unionist. Apart from that, I'm sure everything
:12:33. > :12:40.is going fine on the Conservative and Unionist campaign. Thank you,
:12:41. > :12:44.any questions? Yes. REPORTER: Does it mat foreyou win
:12:45. > :12:47.your seat that you're contesting in this election or your party wins
:12:48. > :12:53.anything at all? You might be referring to the point Paul Nuttal
:12:54. > :12:59.made yesterday, which was simply that Ukip has shown it's able to
:13:00. > :13:05.influence the course of politics in Britain without MPs and under the
:13:06. > :13:09.current first-past-the-post system, it's propped, to date, easier for
:13:10. > :13:13.Ukip to get the United Kingdom out of the European Union than it has to
:13:14. > :13:18.get MPs elected into the House of Commons, but we hope to change that
:13:19. > :13:22.in this election. We're not expecting an across the board level
:13:23. > :13:28.of voting to match that of 2015, but we do believe we are very much more
:13:29. > :13:32.successfully targeting the areas where we're very strong without
:13:33. > :13:35.actually specifying the ranking of our target seats.
:13:36. > :13:41.REPORTER: Do you think comments like that are helpful in terms of getting
:13:42. > :13:43.the vote out? Comments like? REPORTER: It doesn't matter
:13:44. > :13:48.necessarily if you don't have any MPs after this? I don't think we
:13:49. > :13:51.would say it doesn't matter. It's better for Ukip to be represented in
:13:52. > :13:53.the House of Commons as well as command the support of hundreds of
:13:54. > :13:58.thousands or millions of people as well. But I think we're making the
:13:59. > :14:02.point that one of the key ways that we've worked in recent years has
:14:03. > :14:05.been frankly to scare the Conservative Party, in particular,
:14:06. > :14:12.when they step out of line too badly. That's why I'm inviting older
:14:13. > :14:16.people who get knocked up this week by Conservative campaigners if
:14:17. > :14:20.enough of you say, we're thinking of voting Ukip because of this policy,
:14:21. > :14:26.I don't see that it would last through next weekend. Harry you seem
:14:27. > :14:31.amused. REPORTER: I'm always amused. Thank
:14:32. > :14:35.you. Do you have reaction to the news that the Commonwealth feel the
:14:36. > :14:39.need to send election monitors from Ghana, Australia and Mauritius to
:14:40. > :14:43.oversee UK elections particularly in Birmingham. Is that something Ukip
:14:44. > :14:48.welcome or do you think it makes a farce of our electoral system? I
:14:49. > :14:53.think our electoral system has a lot of problems around postal voting on
:14:54. > :14:57.demand, in some areas, in some inner city areas, there have been problems
:14:58. > :15:01.in the past with intimidation of voters. I think people at the
:15:02. > :15:06.Electoral Commission have recognised that certain features of the way
:15:07. > :15:10.elections are run particularly in inner city areas are probably
:15:11. > :15:15.disgraceful. I think there's no room for complacency at all. If we have
:15:16. > :15:20.visitors from other countries to have a look and monitor, I think
:15:21. > :15:23.that's quite welcome. It doesn't necessarily mean that their own
:15:24. > :15:29.democratic systems are above criticism. I think it's perfectly
:15:30. > :15:39.welcome. Let's have as many eyes on how things are done as possible.
:15:40. > :15:45.Yeah. Go on. REPORTER: That ex-leader of the Lib
:15:46. > :15:52.Dems, whatever his name is, he was on the radio this morning, waffling
:15:53. > :15:56.on for about half an hour. They give him so much space (inaudible) He
:15:57. > :16:06.really cut his own throat in the end. Even talking about (inaudible)
:16:07. > :16:12.he kept talking so much and just was waffling. The more space they gave
:16:13. > :16:16.him, the more he came out with nothing very good. It's typical of
:16:17. > :16:21.the BBC. They keep pushing the Lib Dems all the time. Actually no, I've
:16:22. > :16:29.had some criticisms of the BBC over recent years. We've got a policy of
:16:30. > :16:33.scrapping the BBC License Fee. But I think during an election they're
:16:34. > :16:38.quite entitled to put on politicians of lots of different parties. I
:16:39. > :16:42.don't particularly see that increased exposure of Nick Clegg to
:16:43. > :16:48.the masses is going to harm the prospects of Ukip or indeed any
:16:49. > :16:50.other party at all. I think it's a great democratic festival, a general
:16:51. > :16:56.election, so the more Clegg the better. Anyone else? Thank you very
:16:57. > :17:07.much.