:00:20. > :00:26.Good afternoon. Welcome to our weekly coverage of questions to the
:00:27. > :00:33.First Minister. Carwyn Jones will be quizzed by the other party leaders
:00:34. > :00:35.and by fellow Assembly Members on a range of topics from poverty to
:00:36. > :00:41.immigration controls. You can see more details on our Twitter account.
:00:42. > :00:45.Business has started. Let's look at today's questions to the First
:00:46. > :00:50.Minister. TRANSLATION: I call members to order
:00:51. > :00:55.and the first item on the agenda is questions to the First Minister. The
:00:56. > :01:01.first question is withdrawn. Therefore, question two. How does
:01:02. > :01:07.the Welsh government ensure patient safety in Wales? Well, we hold all
:01:08. > :01:14.NHS organisations to account on a wide range of patient safety
:01:15. > :01:16.indicators and we encourage an opening reporting culture to enable
:01:17. > :01:22.full investigation of every case. Thank you, minister. In North Wales
:01:23. > :01:26.we were shocked to learn that of the 77 unintended or unexpected
:01:27. > :01:29.incidents resulting in patient deaths registered across Wales, in
:01:30. > :01:35.the past 12 months, more than half of these fell within the university
:01:36. > :01:40.health board. Every single unwith of the case will have been devastating
:01:41. > :01:45.to the family and loved ones of these patients. First Minister
:01:46. > :01:51.Questions, will be asked to how the special measures and indeed, your
:01:52. > :01:55.government's intervention in realising any improvement in now to
:01:56. > :02:01.the contrary. I am asking you now, will you please commit to an inquiry
:02:02. > :02:06.as to why the safety of patients under this board and your
:02:07. > :02:10.government's responsibility appears to be increasingly compromised.
:02:11. > :02:14.Well, the member doesn't fully understand the way the statistics
:02:15. > :02:18.are compiled. Rubbish. We encourage honesty and openness and that means
:02:19. > :02:23.we encourage people to report serious incidents. Now that means
:02:24. > :02:26.just like the crime statistics, for example, that where more people
:02:27. > :02:30.report serious incidents then more are recorded. It doesn't mean there
:02:31. > :02:33.are actually more serious incidents. That said, of course, we want it
:02:34. > :02:37.make sure the incidents are reported. Nothing should be said or
:02:38. > :02:40.done that will discourage reporting in the future because we want to
:02:41. > :02:48.make sure the incidents are reported and out in the open. I can say to
:02:49. > :02:52.the member in 2016/2017 the mortality rate was 1.79% which is
:02:53. > :02:56.less than the waste average of 1.81%. It is important that every
:02:57. > :02:59.case is investigated and it is important that people come forward
:03:00. > :03:02.and there is an open culture dealing with complaints and that is what I
:03:03. > :03:09.believe we are seeing here. More complaints coming forward rather
:03:10. > :03:20.than more cases coming forward. Question three. What work is the
:03:21. > :03:26.Welsh government undertaking to tackle fuel poverty. Since 2011 we
:03:27. > :03:33.have invested ?240 million to improve the energy efficiency of all
:03:34. > :03:38.45,000 homes and we have installed energy efficiency measures to low
:03:39. > :03:44.income households. Despite the progress being made to reduce fuel
:03:45. > :03:49.poverty through the Welsh government's suite of actions it
:03:50. > :03:54.seems unlikely that the target will be met. Does the Welsh government
:03:55. > :03:59.plan to review the fuel poverty strategy and what lessons will be
:04:00. > :04:02.drawn interest the successful and not so successful elements of the
:04:03. > :04:07.current plan? The survey is underway. It will provide important
:04:08. > :04:11.data help inform delivery of prosperity. It will provide us with
:04:12. > :04:15.information including updated national fuel poverty estimates and
:04:16. > :04:19.da to help with the targeting of delivery measures and help us to
:04:20. > :04:24.inform discussions with stakeholdest and it will mean, of course, that we
:04:25. > :04:27.can draw on the data the survey provides in order to help to
:04:28. > :04:32.strengthen the strategy in the future. First Minister, I agree with
:04:33. > :04:37.what you said about energy efficiency, but it is quite a
:04:38. > :04:42.startling fact according to Citizens Advice, only 12% of those on lowest
:04:43. > :04:49.incomes are on the lowest available tariffs and I think there is a jb to
:04:50. > :04:51.be done to inform people of the tariffs that available and Welsh
:04:52. > :04:54.government and local authorities and housing associations perhaps when
:04:55. > :04:59.they are doing the various schemes that you are referring to can remind
:05:00. > :05:03.people how important it is to seek out the lowest tariff. People tend
:05:04. > :05:07.to stick with the same provider through convenience and they fail to
:05:08. > :05:12.get the best deal. What will help, of course, is to see as the UK
:05:13. > :05:16.government has adopt add Labour Party policy, caps on variable
:05:17. > :05:19.energy tariffs. It will help many people who are not who have not
:05:20. > :05:24.taken the opportunity to change their tariffs or find they are not
:05:25. > :05:27.able to do to so to benefit from lower prices.
:05:28. > :05:35.TRANSLATION: Questions from the party leaders. First of all, Plaid
:05:36. > :05:41.Cymru lieder, Leanne Wood. I am aware of the public health arguments
:05:42. > :05:45.and the needs to reduce death from cancer in particular, but public
:05:46. > :05:49.health policy should be looking at all problematic substance use. What
:05:50. > :05:54.assessment has your government made of the impact of minimum pricing,
:05:55. > :05:59.alcohol pricing, on the use of other substances like illegal drugs? There
:06:00. > :06:04.will be some people, of course, who have an addiction. It maybe that
:06:05. > :06:08.there are some who then look at illegal drugs, but for the mast
:06:09. > :06:13.majority of people this will have two outcomes. Firstly, it will help
:06:14. > :06:17.reduce the health issues that surround over drinking and secondly,
:06:18. > :06:23.actually, it will help pubs because it's the pubs who suffer the most as
:06:24. > :06:27.a result of supermarket selling that under cuts pubs which we know are
:06:28. > :06:31.important for our communities. There is a commercial aspect to this as
:06:32. > :06:35.well. We make no apologies for wanting to ensure that we get rid of
:06:36. > :06:38.scenarios where very cheap alcohol is available to people in a way that
:06:39. > :06:43.causes them to drink too much and therefore affects their health. I
:06:44. > :06:45.have some sympathy with the arguments that you have just
:06:46. > :06:49.outlined but from your answer it doesn't appear as if any assessment
:06:50. > :06:53.has been made between that link, which I hope very much is an
:06:54. > :06:56.oversight, First Minister. We need to reduce drug related deaths as
:06:57. > :07:01.well as alcohol related deaths. Now, drug related deaths have reached a
:07:02. > :07:07.record high in Wales and in England according to latest figures, drug
:07:08. > :07:12.related deaths are up 44% compared to 2012. For Wales only figures,
:07:13. > :07:18.there was also an increase on the previous year. 168 people lost their
:07:19. > :07:24.lives in 2015. Hospital admissions are also up which means an increased
:07:25. > :07:28.could to public services and to the NHS and anecdotally we all know that
:07:29. > :07:32.some people are openly using drugs in public places, on our streets, in
:07:33. > :07:39.town centres, where it is less safe, both for them and for others. First
:07:40. > :07:44.Minister, can you explain how your substance misuse strategy is using
:07:45. > :07:50.devolved powers to reduce drug related hospital admissions and drug
:07:51. > :07:53.related deaths? One of the problems that we face is the Misuse of Drugs
:07:54. > :08:01.Act has found it difficult to keep up with new drugs as they asphere on
:08:02. > :08:07.to the market, drugs like Spice. The leader of Plaid Cymru is right,
:08:08. > :08:12.there is too much open use of drugs and dealers who seem not to be too
:08:13. > :08:16.concerned about being caught. The first thing to do is to target the
:08:17. > :08:20.dealers. They need to be convicted and jailed. That's where they
:08:21. > :08:23.belong, off the streets, yes, it is true to say others may come forward,
:08:24. > :08:29.but it is important to send that message. How do we deal with people
:08:30. > :08:34.who misuse drugs? Well, the substance misuse strategy is there
:08:35. > :08:38.to help do that. It is a combination to mined of medical intervngs, but
:08:39. > :08:43.also being strong in term of clamping done on people who supply
:08:44. > :08:46.the drugs. While locking up the dealers hasn't worked so far and the
:08:47. > :08:53.powers are out of your control, what you have control over, is health.
:08:54. > :08:59.Now, a harm reduction approach has been proven to be the most effective
:09:00. > :09:03.at reducing drug related deaths and you claim to be committed to article
:09:04. > :09:06.harm reduction approach. We won't know whether the actions you have
:09:07. > :09:10.taken are sufficient until the new Welsh statistics come out this
:09:11. > :09:15.winter, but of course, the Wales and England statistics that we've
:09:16. > :09:18.already seen don't bode well. If you are serious about reducing drug
:09:19. > :09:24.related deaths as well as reducing the wider social problems, you would
:09:25. > :09:33.be open to the solutions proposed by Plaid Cymru police and crime
:09:34. > :09:39.commissioner. Will you agree to meet and provide the police and others
:09:40. > :09:41.the support they need to enable a suitably located pilot safe
:09:42. > :09:46.injecting facility which would reduce harm to the public, as well
:09:47. > :09:50.as help to reduce unnecessary deaths from harmful drugs? Well, there are
:09:51. > :09:53.already regular meetings that take place between the police and crime
:09:54. > :09:59.commissioners and ministers in any eye vent. It is right to say, that
:10:00. > :10:03.there is very little point, nor would it be right to see substance
:10:04. > :10:06.misuse as something that would be a crime. There are people who have
:10:07. > :10:09.medical issues, the suppliers are different, but those people, of
:10:10. > :10:12.course, who are in the position where they misuse substances the
:10:13. > :10:16.intervention for them has to be medical and that means working with
:10:17. > :10:20.the police, that's true. It's what the substance misuse strategy is
:10:21. > :10:24.designed to do. She has said we are waiting for the Welsh figures. And
:10:25. > :10:29.we want to make sure the Welsh figures show that we are seeing a
:10:30. > :10:34.positive effect on substance misuse. But the challenge is always there,
:10:35. > :10:39.how do you deal with in new drugs that appear all the time from drugs
:10:40. > :10:47.that didn't economist in 1971? She is right to mention heroin. But it's
:10:48. > :10:50.hugely important that as we do, that we develop and give our substance
:10:51. > :10:56.misuse strategy the time to develop and in that way, I believe, we will
:10:57. > :11:02.help more and more people to get off the substances that they become
:11:03. > :11:04.addicted. TRANSLATION: Thank you, Presiding
:11:05. > :11:08.Officer. There are pressures across the United Kingdom when it comes to
:11:09. > :11:12.the Health Service. In June 2015, your government took into special
:11:13. > :11:16.measures the North Wales health board and in March this year, you
:11:17. > :11:19.said that actually where deficits run out of control and problems
:11:20. > :11:22.exist in other health boards across Wales, you might well have to
:11:23. > :11:27.consider intervening in those health boards. What we've learnt is that
:11:28. > :11:35.the deficit has doubled in the North Wales health board, waiting time
:11:36. > :11:39.have gone up by 79%, from 4858 to 8700 and the deficit is projected at
:11:40. > :11:48.the end of this year to be ?100 million. That's over the three
:11:49. > :11:54.years. ?50 million for thisunder financial year, the previous two was
:11:55. > :11:57.?25 million. How can people have confidence that your government is
:11:58. > :12:02.putting the health board on the road to cofr rye and the concerns that
:12:03. > :12:06.are raised by the member are being addressed when the statistics show
:12:07. > :12:11.on waiting time and recruitment and deficit control and reduction you
:12:12. > :12:15.are missing your own targets? First of all, to clarify his suggestion
:12:16. > :12:18.there will be a ?100 million deficit, we don't expect the health
:12:19. > :12:31.boards to come in with a deficit by the end of this financial year. With
:12:32. > :12:34.the greatest respect, your own board papers, they are projecting a
:12:35. > :12:39.deficit in this financial year of ?50 million. It's not my
:12:40. > :12:44.calculation, it's their cal lags and they talk of unless there are
:12:45. > :12:47.mitigating measures and actions implemented to bring that deficit
:12:48. > :12:51.down, that deficit will exist. Here in Cardiff, you were saying that
:12:52. > :12:54.isn't the case. Your own managers and directors in North Wales who are
:12:55. > :12:58.responsible for the day-to-day delivery of service are saying there
:12:59. > :13:02.is this deficit. You can't have the two working there. Perhaps that is a
:13:03. > :13:07.cause for concern that you're so disconnected from what is happening
:13:08. > :13:10.on the ground. I ask you again First Minister with waiting time going
:13:11. > :13:16.through the roof and the deficit not in control and the enable to recruit
:13:17. > :13:20.and retain staff, either GP level or in the hospitals, how after nearly
:13:21. > :13:26.three years under your direct supervision and control can the
:13:27. > :13:30.residents of North Wales can confidence that their health board
:13:31. > :13:34.is on the road to recovery. We don't expect the health board to be in
:13:35. > :13:37.deficit. If they identify an issue, they must deal with it. He talks
:13:38. > :13:42.about waiting lists going through the roof and offers no evidence. He
:13:43. > :13:46.says there are problems with recruitment and retention. We have
:13:47. > :13:49.been successful in filling training places in terms of nursing
:13:50. > :13:54.application, do you know what GPs say to us and I have had this from
:13:55. > :13:58.one consultant, he said the reason why I wanted to come to Wales was I
:13:59. > :14:03.like the recruitment campaign and two other words, Jeremy Hunt!
:14:04. > :14:11.Why are waiting times that much better in the UK than here? You say
:14:12. > :14:16.they are not, but the 12 hour wait in England is 78 people out of a
:14:17. > :14:21.population of 55 million. 12 hours or more in accident and emergency.
:14:22. > :14:26.In Wales, the figure was 2438 out of a population of 3 million. They are
:14:27. > :14:31.not my figures, they are yours. What I'm trying to seek is an ability to
:14:32. > :14:34.have confidence, and I'm using the waiting times that your government
:14:35. > :14:42.published last week that said they had doubled from 4858 up to 8000
:14:43. > :14:45.708. I use the deficit figures that the health board themselves have
:14:46. > :14:47.published in their board report. I use the example that the health
:14:48. > :14:52.board themselves say that the deficit will exist at the end of the
:14:53. > :14:55.financial year unless mitigating actions are taken. So everything I
:14:56. > :14:59.have quoted to you has come either from the health board or statistics
:15:00. > :15:04.from your own government. I really seek assurances from you, first
:15:05. > :15:09.ministers, after nearly two and a half years of your government being
:15:10. > :15:11.in direct control of the North Wales health board that the health board
:15:12. > :15:17.is progressing to a situation where waiting times will come down, Doctor
:15:18. > :15:21.vacancies will be filled, and above all, the deficit will come under
:15:22. > :15:25.control. On two occasions you have failed to give any assurances to
:15:26. > :15:29.date. That tells you more about sure grip on reality than it does about
:15:30. > :15:33.anything else. All I can say to him is there has been a complete
:15:34. > :15:37.abdication of responsibility towards the NHS in England. Every time the
:15:38. > :15:41.health boards underperforms, it's never the fault of the Conservatives
:15:42. > :15:46.or Jeremy and Karen is to let me give him a figure that is correct so
:15:47. > :15:52.he can mull over -- or Jeremy Vine. In England, the highest waiting list
:15:53. > :15:57.on record is there -- Jeremy Hunt. There were 409,342 patients over the
:15:58. > :16:04.English target, more than doubling over the last three years. We know
:16:05. > :16:14.in Wales, we have gone in the other direction. And he sits there and
:16:15. > :16:19.acquiesces, in a fund to Northern Ireland, he did nothing to represent
:16:20. > :16:23.his country. He did nothing to represent his country. What
:16:24. > :16:26.representation has he made to the UK Government, and his colleagues, dim
:16:27. > :16:35.demand that Wales should get the Barnett equivalent of his money --
:16:36. > :16:42.nothing. He is too scared of them. Returning to the theme mentioned
:16:43. > :16:46.Bailly of Plaid Cymru, the minimum pricing for alcohol, how can the
:16:47. > :16:49.First Minister support a measure which is so regressive in the way it
:16:50. > :16:53.works? This is a measure which is explicitly designed,
:16:54. > :16:58.disproportionally, to target those drinks which are consumed in
:16:59. > :17:02.disproportionate measures by people on low incomes. It is well-known
:17:03. > :17:08.that low-income households by fewer units of alcohol, but more of what
:17:09. > :17:12.they buy is priced at less than 40p per unit. Where is the equity in the
:17:13. > :17:15.measure that leaves the champagne socialist of the posh suburbs of
:17:16. > :17:22.Cardiff unaffected, but targets the beer drinkers? Is he seriously
:17:23. > :17:27.saying that people on low incomes are proportionally bigger drinkers?
:17:28. > :17:32.That is a snobbery I have never quite seen before. And the
:17:33. > :17:37.consequence of his argument is that, in that case, we should reduce the
:17:38. > :17:40.tax on tobacco, because that is disproportionately regressive as
:17:41. > :17:44.well, so let's reduce the tax on tobacco. It's exactly the same
:17:45. > :17:47.argument. What we want to do is make sure that alcohol does not get
:17:48. > :17:51.cheaper and cheaper, as it has done, so that people drink more and more
:17:52. > :17:56.because they see it as cheap. As I said early on, there is an issue
:17:57. > :18:01.here for the pubs. Pubs have been hammered year after year by cheap
:18:02. > :18:04.supermarket alcohol, and pubs are responsible places where people
:18:05. > :18:08.drink. They look after people and do not serve people who are drunk and
:18:09. > :18:12.pubs are being lost at a rate of knots in our community. You speak to
:18:13. > :18:18.any public, they will say part of the reason is that are buying cheap
:18:19. > :18:22.supermarket alcohol sold below cost price at some points. Of course
:18:23. > :18:27.there is a health aspect, but as a side issue, we know that one of the
:18:28. > :18:33.consequences is that it will provide a level play-off -- playing field
:18:34. > :18:36.for the pubs as well. I said the opposite actually, that people on
:18:37. > :18:42.low incomes by less alcohol overall than people on higher incomes, but
:18:43. > :18:45.more of the alcohol they drink is cheaper brands, not more expensive
:18:46. > :18:49.brands, so it will have a disproportionally tough effect on
:18:50. > :18:52.people on low incomes. The Centre for economic and business research
:18:53. > :18:55.said in 2009 that there is substantial evidence that heavier
:18:56. > :18:59.drinkers are least responsive to price changes. The problem alcohol
:19:00. > :19:04.drinkers are the ones least likely to respond to the measures which are
:19:05. > :19:07.now being proposed. What will happen here is that the real problem
:19:08. > :19:12.drinkers will carry on drinking but have less money to spend on things
:19:13. > :19:16.like food. So in other dietary respects, their health will suffer.
:19:17. > :19:21.This will have no positive impact whatsoever. The only people who will
:19:22. > :19:24.really benefit are the supermarkets, because this is not a tax being
:19:25. > :19:29.imposed, you can just raise the price of a cheap product and that
:19:30. > :19:37.will produce extra profits for the supermarket and certainly not for
:19:38. > :19:39.pubs. The same argument can be used for cigarettes. If you're saying the
:19:40. > :19:43.tax for cigarettes should be reduced, let's hear him say that. As
:19:44. > :19:47.far as arguments on alcohol are concerned, if it is cheaper, people
:19:48. > :19:50.will drink more. This is a way of ensuring the balance is right
:19:51. > :19:56.between the price of alcohol and people's Hell. I see nothing wrong
:19:57. > :19:59.with that and it's a hugely important thing that we have a
:20:00. > :20:04.responsible attitude to alcohol rather than buy one get one free, by
:20:05. > :20:09.two, get one free. These are not always the cheapest brands. They are
:20:10. > :20:12.often on brands proportionally quite expensive and that is the way that
:20:13. > :20:16.people are encouraged to buy more and drink more, which surely we
:20:17. > :20:20.don't want to encourage. There is a problem with a relatively small
:20:21. > :20:23.number of people who overindulge, and of course, we want to target
:20:24. > :20:28.them. But the problem with a measure of this kind is that it is so
:20:29. > :20:33.scatter gun in the approach that it penalises the many who are moderate
:20:34. > :20:38.drinkers, not having any measurable effect on those who we do want to
:20:39. > :20:43.help. I don't follow the logic. He could stand up and say that it
:20:44. > :20:47.penalises the occasional smoker, so the duty on tobacco should be
:20:48. > :20:52.reduced. The two things have the same kind of effect. For me, it's
:20:53. > :20:56.hugely important as a society that we don't have alcohol sold below
:20:57. > :20:59.cost price, as we see in supermarkets, and we don't have
:21:00. > :21:05.people being encouraged to buy more alcohol. That encourages people who
:21:06. > :21:08.might be moderate drinkers to drink more than is good for them and that
:21:09. > :21:13.is something we are keen to avoid. As it happens, as a side-effect, it
:21:14. > :21:17.also enables pubs to be able to compete on a level playing field
:21:18. > :21:21.with the supermarkets who have driven so many pubs out of business.
:21:22. > :21:27.Don't talk to me, talk to publicans and they will tell you this. The
:21:28. > :21:30.difference in price proportion between supermarket alcohol and pub
:21:31. > :21:35.alcohol is greater than ever before. We need to make sure that people
:21:36. > :21:39.have a place to go in villages where they live, through pubs, and that's
:21:40. > :21:42.not the intention of the legislation, it is to deal with
:21:43. > :21:52.health but there are wider effects we have identified. How is the Welsh
:21:53. > :21:56.government using public procurement to drive up horticultural production
:21:57. > :22:01.in Wales? The National procurement service develops Pearl -- Collabro
:22:02. > :22:05.trip approaches to apply this to the public sector -- collaborative
:22:06. > :22:08.approaches. I have just come from the vegetable summit being held in
:22:09. > :22:15.the pierhead at the same time as in London and Edinburgh. And we heard
:22:16. > :22:23.really important pledges from a wide variety of producers and promoters
:22:24. > :22:27.of four example, children's rights. The children's Commissioner
:22:28. > :22:31.highlighted the fact that nearly 80% of people aged five to ten are not
:22:32. > :22:35.eating enough vegetables and 95% of 11 to 16-year-olds are not eating
:22:36. > :22:39.enough vegetables to be able to learn and play effectively. This is
:22:40. > :22:46.a children's rights issue. We heard important pledges from the largest
:22:47. > :22:51.supermarket in the UK, Tesco, who have agreed to buy seasonal veg, as
:22:52. > :22:58.well as putting more vegetables in meal deals. And Cardiff University
:22:59. > :23:03.and Cardiff met and the health board in Cardiff, Cardiff Council, they
:23:04. > :23:07.are all pledging to serve and promote more vegetables in their
:23:08. > :23:11.pubs, canteens and dining rooms. What can we do to ensure that that
:23:12. > :23:16.increased purchase of vegetables comes from Welsh producers rather
:23:17. > :23:21.than other UK outlets, or indeed from abroad? Can I welcome the fact
:23:22. > :23:25.that the vegetable summit is taking place and as we speak it brings
:23:26. > :23:29.together farmers, retailers, processors and government looking at
:23:30. > :23:32.the supply chain and how we can raise vegetable production. We are
:23:33. > :23:37.committed through the food and drink action plan which we share with
:23:38. > :23:41.industry boards to not only grow the sector but use it sustainably to
:23:42. > :23:44.tackle the challenges of diet and the National procurement service has
:23:45. > :23:47.set up buying arrangements that allow public bodies to access a wide
:23:48. > :23:56.range of vegetable products to support healthy meal planning.
:23:57. > :23:59.Following on from Jenny Rathbone's question, can you tell us what
:24:00. > :24:05.discussions the Welsh government has had with local authorities on food
:24:06. > :24:11.procurement in the public sector to ensure that more local producers are
:24:12. > :24:16.used by local authorities, and also, can you tell us one thing that your
:24:17. > :24:20.government has done over the past 12 months to make a difference and to
:24:21. > :24:25.ensure that more and more local producers are being used in the
:24:26. > :24:31.public sector? A Co-operative Group has been established and that
:24:32. > :24:39.includes, from the public sector in Wales, and the aim of the group is
:24:40. > :24:44.to ensure that we get a good deal on procurement and that is in
:24:45. > :24:49.collaboration with local bodies and the producers in order to progress
:24:50. > :24:54.this project, so things are being done within the industry. And that
:24:55. > :25:01.is to ensure that more Welsh produced food is produced. At one
:25:02. > :25:08.time one of the problems that there was not a business or organisation
:25:09. > :25:14.large enough that they could get into the market. Or that there was
:25:15. > :25:20.sustainability of supply. Things have improved now and we are looking
:25:21. > :25:30.to support these companies in different ways. Thank you. I saw the
:25:31. > :25:37.First Minister isn't as Laugh Aloud and plums to be welcomed -- is
:25:38. > :25:42.allowing plums to be served as a desert tomorrow, so I hope everybody
:25:43. > :25:45.enjoys those. But as we see the CPA not giving any support to halt a
:25:46. > :25:51.culture in Wales, what steps will you take to make sure that there is
:25:52. > :25:55.a development of infrastructure and that farmers can invest in
:25:56. > :25:58.horticulture for these new markets? This is a thing under consideration
:25:59. > :26:02.with the industry at the moment, and the first thing I would like to
:26:03. > :26:07.emphasise is that the same amount of money should be available in future
:26:08. > :26:11.as it is currently available and that funding should be allocated or
:26:12. > :26:16.ring fenced in a way that nothing should affect that without an
:26:17. > :26:20.agreement between all of the governments. Having said that, it is
:26:21. > :26:26.now an opportunity to consider in which way we can use that funding
:26:27. > :26:30.for the benefit of Welsh farmers and look at alternate ways of working,
:26:31. > :26:35.because remember, 17 years ago when I was a member of the assembly's
:26:36. > :26:42.agriculture committee there was a review undertaken on diversification
:26:43. > :26:49.and what came right at the top of the list as regards the greater
:26:50. > :26:55.strength in the sector was the cultivation of organic vegetables.
:26:56. > :27:00.And of course, the subsidy payment scheme wasn't flexible enough in
:27:01. > :27:03.order to ensure that we could use that funding in the way we might
:27:04. > :27:08.wish to use it, but there might be an opportunity to do so now. Will
:27:09. > :27:11.the First Minister make a statement on patterns of self-employment in
:27:12. > :27:18.Wales? Self-employment is a cornerstone of the success of Wales,
:27:19. > :27:23.and businesses start and grow and of course improve their contribution to
:27:24. > :27:26.the economy of Wales. This afternoon I chaired the cross-party group on
:27:27. > :27:32.small and medium-sized enterprises and it was our pleasure to welcome
:27:33. > :27:37.the Federation of small business to launch their report written by
:27:38. > :27:40.Professor Andrew Henley and Doctor Mark Lang. There were
:27:41. > :27:44.recommendations for government there. One of the stark issues was
:27:45. > :27:48.that the largest levels of self-employment are in Powys at 23%
:27:49. > :27:54.on the lowest levels are in the northern valleys at 8.7%. What
:27:55. > :27:58.specifically can the Welsh government do to incentivise and
:27:59. > :28:00.increase self-employment in those Valley communities, and particularly
:28:01. > :28:08.among underrepresented groups and women? What is interesting about the
:28:09. > :28:11.report is that there is an assumption that the reason more
:28:12. > :28:15.people are solving void is because economic circumstances have dictated
:28:16. > :28:19.that, because they lost their job -- but it seems it is an entrepreneur
:28:20. > :28:24.or real push, a desire to beat entrepreneur Oriel which is
:28:25. > :28:30.something we saw in Wales -- an entrepreneurial push. I understand
:28:31. > :28:35.some of the challenges that that can cause. How do we take it forward in
:28:36. > :28:39.the valleys? Valleys task force has done a lot of work to see how we can
:28:40. > :28:43.encourage the self-employed. I don't think they lack the flair in the
:28:44. > :28:48.valleys, and it's being able to say to people that you can do this.
:28:49. > :28:51.There is no reason you cannot be successful and people need that
:28:52. > :28:53.encouragement. That is one of the things the task force is looking
:28:54. > :29:00.forward to moving forward in the future. First Minister, I also
:29:01. > :29:05.attended the event which Evan chaired earlier on and we heard how
:29:06. > :29:10.rural Wales is heavily reliant on the contribution of self-employment
:29:11. > :29:13.and the economy as it was pointed out, 23% in Powys are self-employed
:29:14. > :29:17.compared to the Welsh average of 13%. The FSB Wales report found that
:29:18. > :29:24.those who are self-employed tend to be older, and young people are not
:29:25. > :29:29.following in their footsteps. Can I ask what consideration has the Welsh
:29:30. > :29:33.government given to understanding the barriers to young people
:29:34. > :29:36.becoming self-employed in rural Wales in particular, and what
:29:37. > :29:39.potential could a mid Wales growth deal played to ensure there are
:29:40. > :29:44.local solutions which meet the demands of self-employment in Wales
:29:45. > :29:48.and opposed to a pan Wales solution that might not be appropriate? I
:29:49. > :29:52.think regional solutions are important and members are right to
:29:53. > :29:57.say they cannot be one size fits all across Wales. When it comes to
:29:58. > :30:01.younger people, much of this -- this starts at schools. I know work is
:30:02. > :30:06.done in schools to encourage entrepreneurial projects, and the
:30:07. > :30:09.Young entrepreneur scheme which we have and also providing that
:30:10. > :30:13.financial support. All people often have access to capital in the way
:30:14. > :30:18.younger people don't -- older people. How do we support people
:30:19. > :30:22.coming into business? Business Wales is one area and the development bank
:30:23. > :30:28.will be able to assist people to come into business as well,
:30:29. > :30:32.improving the access of finance. The banks in the UK have historically
:30:33. > :30:34.been resistant to providing capital for start-up enterprises which is
:30:35. > :30:39.where we fell behind for many years, which is white the development bank
:30:40. > :30:46.will be there -- which is why. You can encourage people but they need
:30:47. > :30:49.to access capital. If they have no other family capital behind them,
:30:50. > :30:54.that is where business Wales can comment.
:30:55. > :31:02.TRANSLATION: One of the most striking things in the report is
:31:03. > :31:09.this fact, namely that 38% of the total jobs growth in Wales over the
:31:10. > :31:16.past ten years can be attributed to the self-employed and over the same
:31:17. > :31:20.period there has been no net increase in the inward investment
:31:21. > :31:25.sector and again, and I quote from the report, the language of drawing
:31:26. > :31:30.up economic policies is skewed hugely towards the importance of
:31:31. > :31:35.securing inward investment and foreign ownership. Now, does the
:31:36. > :31:41.First Minister accept the figures provided by the SFB and if so, does
:31:42. > :31:45.he accept the need to change emphasis now to indigenous business
:31:46. > :31:51.and the self-employed? Well, I don't think that we need to choose or make
:31:52. > :31:56.a choice. At one time in the days of the WDA, the emphasis was completely
:31:57. > :32:00.on inward investment and it didn't care really about small businesses.
:32:01. > :32:06.I remember talking to an employee of the WDA so, the focus was on
:32:07. > :32:13.securing inward investment and after LG, nothing else came in. So it is
:32:14. > :32:17.extremely important that we build a foundation of self employment in the
:32:18. > :32:23.economy, but I don't think that we can do that by avoiding giving any
:32:24. > :32:33.support to businesses that do employ thousands of people such as Tata,
:32:34. > :32:39.Airbus, and so on and GE who employ thousands of people in Wales so we
:32:40. > :32:43.must have an emphasis on attracting foreign investment, but it shouldn't
:32:44. > :32:46.be solely our strategy and I would argue that we have,000 struck the
:32:47. > :32:51.right balance and we want to ensure that more and more businesses aren't
:32:52. > :32:55.only established in Wales, but grow in Wales because one of the problems
:32:56. > :33:00.we've always faced is that businesses grow up to a particular
:33:01. > :33:04.level and then the owners sell them. So, we must ensure that people
:33:05. > :33:09.should be able to feel that they can grow those businesses that they
:33:10. > :33:15.become larger and that to me, is the greatest challenge in the economy
:33:16. > :33:19.I'd say. Don't sell out, stay in Wales and we will assist you to
:33:20. > :33:23.grow. How is the Welsh government supporting the palliative care
:33:24. > :33:28.sector in Wales? Yes, the updated end of life care delivery plan
:33:29. > :33:32.published in March sets out the range of actions we are taking to
:33:33. > :33:39.improve end of life care throughout Wales and that includes ?6.4 million
:33:40. > :33:43.to provide specialist palliative care services. Thank you for your
:33:44. > :33:47.answer. The majority of end of life care in Wales is provided by Wales
:33:48. > :33:54.13 adults and two children's hospices. You indicate a figure of
:33:55. > :33:58.?64 million I think you said, but they spent ?32.5 million a year to
:33:59. > :34:04.deliver those services in people's homes and also day care and respite,
:34:05. > :34:09.so they are having to raise over ?2 million a month and they're keen to
:34:10. > :34:12.help you, the Welsh government and their Local Health Boards do very
:34:13. > :34:17.much more. How can you or will you engage with them and ask them how
:34:18. > :34:21.they can help you achieve more, where perhaps a little bit more
:34:22. > :34:24.funding from the health boards and the Government would save more for
:34:25. > :34:29.health boards and liberate services toe help tackle some of the other
:34:30. > :34:36.problems we've heard referred to today in different contexts. Well,
:34:37. > :34:40.if we look at the recent report by Hospice UK in Wales, that's
:34:41. > :34:45.something we welcome, what the report said, it recognise the
:34:46. > :34:51.positive steps in the palliative and end of life delivery plan. As part
:34:52. > :34:57.of the budget agreement with Plaid Cymru we made ?1 million available
:34:58. > :35:01.to further enhance end of life care provision. That's recurrent funding
:35:02. > :35:04.as well. But, of course in terms of engagement with the sector it is the
:35:05. > :35:09.care boards that provide that level of engagement and that's why, of
:35:10. > :35:12.course, we work with them in order to identify the resource that are
:35:13. > :35:18.needed. TRANSLATION: Thank you very much,
:35:19. > :35:22.and the cross party group on hospices and palliative care here in
:35:23. > :35:26.the Assembly is looking a the possibility of holding an inquiry
:35:27. > :35:32.into how to deal with inequalities in terms of access to hospice care
:35:33. > :35:35.in Wales. We referred to the funding secured in an agreement between
:35:36. > :35:40.ourselves and the Government, but isn't the truth of the matter that a
:35:41. > :35:45.series of Labour Governments has failed to tackle that fundamental
:35:46. > :35:49.element, that there is inequality in terms of access to this crucial care
:35:50. > :35:53.across Wales? TRANSLATION: No, I don't accept
:35:54. > :35:57.that. We have ensured that there is investment available to the health
:35:58. > :36:02.boards and it's a matter for them to ensure that the service is available
:36:03. > :36:05.and it's something we worked with to ensure that that is implemented. We
:36:06. > :36:09.know that the hospices themselves have taken a greater role over the
:36:10. > :36:15.past five years than previously. Not just with the care side, but with
:36:16. > :36:20.giving people advice and now we wish to work with the boards to ensure
:36:21. > :36:25.that we know what next needs to be done in order to ensure that there
:36:26. > :36:33.is a consistent and uniformed service available throughout Wales.
:36:34. > :36:35.Question seven. What assessment has the First Minister made of the
:36:36. > :36:41.impact to anymore gration controls following Brexit will have on the
:36:42. > :36:46.NHS in Wales? Yes, it's bad. Well, I thank the First Minister for his
:36:47. > :36:53.observation, but the latest figures show that immigrant workers from the
:36:54. > :37:02.EU amount to just 1.55% of employees in NHS Wales and given that the
:37:03. > :37:07.Welsh population of immigrants from the EU amounts to 3.3%, it would
:37:08. > :37:11.seem that controls on immigration may well have a positive effect on
:37:12. > :37:16.our Health Service. But I have previously brought to the attention
:37:17. > :37:22.of this chamber the fact that each year, 80,000 applicants to work in
:37:23. > :37:28.the UK NHS are turned down due to lack of training places. Firstly,
:37:29. > :37:33.surely, First Minister, it is time that we in Wales expanded training
:37:34. > :37:37.facilities. Reconsidered the practise of sending every nurse to
:37:38. > :37:43.university, and explored the possibility of reintroducing the
:37:44. > :37:51.distinction of SEN and SRN nurses and on the ward training,
:37:52. > :37:55.particularly for SEN staff. Incidentally, in 2015, discussions
:37:56. > :37:59.on the long-term future of the NHS in Wales should sit outside the
:38:00. > :38:05.knock about of day-to-day party politics. Perhaps, First Minister,
:38:06. > :38:09.we should once again examine that excellent suggestion.
:38:10. > :38:14.Could I say to the member I cannot care a less where doctors come when
:38:15. > :38:19.they work in the Welsh NHS as long as they deliver an excellent service
:38:20. > :38:24.to our patients. We have doctors from the EU and India. Many doctors
:38:25. > :38:29.have come from India, they are great additions to our NHS. The market for
:38:30. > :38:33.doctors and nurse is worldwide. It is worldwide, people will go to
:38:34. > :38:37.where they think they will get the best deal for them as an individual
:38:38. > :38:41.and for their families. We know, for example, it is true to say that EU
:38:42. > :38:45.nurses make up a very small percentage of the NHS workforce in
:38:46. > :38:49.Wales, but can we really afford to lose 360 nurses? Is that what he is
:38:50. > :38:52.saying? He seems to be saying that's fine as long as we train people to a
:38:53. > :38:55.lower standard in the future and that would be fine as far as the
:38:56. > :38:59.future is concerned. Is he really saying for example that we don't
:39:00. > :39:04.want doctors from the EU? Well, I have to say, I want to make sure
:39:05. > :39:06.that doctors and nurses come to work in Wales regardless of their
:39:07. > :39:11.nationality because they will add a lot more to the NHS than they take
:39:12. > :39:14.out. The myth that is pedalled by his party is that somehow
:39:15. > :39:19.immigration puts a strain on the NHS. Most of the people who come to
:39:20. > :39:24.Wales are young. They pay taxes. They pay far more in than they take
:39:25. > :39:29.out via the NHS. And we know that we pay tribute to those doctors from
:39:30. > :39:32.the EU and beyond who come to work in the Welsh NHS who contribute to
:39:33. > :39:36.treating our people, who save lives and for me, that's far more
:39:37. > :39:46.important than dhebging their passport.
:39:47. > :39:51.-- checking their passport. There was criticism that the economy
:39:52. > :39:54.secretary hadn't had direct conversations with his counterpart
:39:55. > :39:57.in Ireland, but I think that may have happened now. Do you know
:39:58. > :40:03.whether there were any discussions about whether existing technology
:40:04. > :40:05.could be rolled out to help maintain the invisible border between
:40:06. > :40:08.Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland and to reduce the delays in
:40:09. > :40:13.transit of people as well between Wales and the Republic of Ireland
:40:14. > :40:16.itself? Well, firstly the reason why the committee mentioned it is
:40:17. > :40:30.because I mentioned it to the committee. I raised T I discussed it
:40:31. > :40:34.months ago with Leo Varadkar when he became Taoiseach. Why 70% of trade
:40:35. > :40:42.between GB and Ireland goes through the Welsh ports. So there have been
:40:43. > :40:47.discussions with the Irish government on this. Frankingly, I
:40:48. > :40:51.know the members view on Brexit. I appreciate them. I have now seen
:40:52. > :40:57.many documents from the UK Government that say the issue of
:40:58. > :41:01.border control will be taken forward by way of innovative technology. It
:41:02. > :41:05.doesn't exist. The technology dhoutz exist. If it existed we would have
:41:06. > :41:08.sight of it by now. It talks about havelg innovative solutions and
:41:09. > :41:13.exploring solutions, that's code for we have no idea how to deal with
:41:14. > :41:17.this. Now, it is one thing, of course, to have border-free travel
:41:18. > :41:21.or passport-free travel between Wales and Ireland, custom free
:41:22. > :41:24.travel is another thing. There was always random checks in the years
:41:25. > :41:28.gone by, but not every vehicle was checked. There is a greater problem
:41:29. > :41:32.in Dover daus the UK doesn't have the capacity at moment to put in
:41:33. > :41:37.place border controls in Dover. There were enormous delays. The same
:41:38. > :41:43.I suspect applies on the French side in Calais. I do not believe that
:41:44. > :41:47.there is a technological solution to this. If there was one then by now
:41:48. > :41:51.we'd know from the UK Government what that solution is. One of the
:41:52. > :41:54.solutions that was put to me was that there would be cameras on the
:41:55. > :41:59.border between north and south in Ireland. You put cameras in Northern
:42:00. > :42:03.Ireland, and we could open a book as to how long they would stay there.
:42:04. > :42:10.They just wouldn't stay there of the it is a million man if hes tation of
:42:11. > :42:17.the border. People would see them as a breach of the peace process. The
:42:18. > :42:23.resolution is the UK stays in the customs union F the UK leaves the
:42:24. > :42:27.customs union you have to a border like the one that exists between
:42:28. > :42:32.Gibraltar and Spain. You cannot have a scenario where goods go to
:42:33. > :42:38.different kets in two different customs unions without any physical
:42:39. > :42:40.checks on crossing a land border. In the Brexit referendum, nobody
:42:41. > :42:45.thought about Ireland and nobody thought about that border. And it is
:42:46. > :42:52.still a problem. The solution, stay in the customs union. One of the
:42:53. > :42:56.greatest threats to staffing long-term in the Welsh NHS would be
:42:57. > :43:00.for us to have a one-size-fits-all immigration policy after separation
:43:01. > :43:08.with the European Union. The University of Edinburgh have
:43:09. > :43:11.published a paper, Scottish immigration policy after Brexit,
:43:12. > :43:15.evaluating options for a different approach. It looks at a number of
:43:16. > :43:21.ways of region aland national approaches to migration post Brexit.
:43:22. > :43:25.Knowing the intentions of the UK Government in terms of their
:43:26. > :43:30.aspirations. The options include looking at human capital,
:43:31. > :43:33.points-based system, employer-led schemes and occupational shortage
:43:34. > :43:39.which I would suggest are of particular importance here in Wales
:43:40. > :43:44.and in this paper, they are proposing ways in order to have
:43:45. > :43:49.minimal administration costs and burdens. Would the First Minister
:43:50. > :43:54.agree that this is now worth explore and taking forward seriously, that
:43:55. > :43:58.we need Wales to have its say on a regional or national post Brexit
:43:59. > :44:04.migration policy for the UK because at the moment there, is the only
:44:05. > :44:10.constituent part of the UK that said little about that prospect,
:44:11. > :44:15.otherwise we face having the UK net migration target being the big
:44:16. > :44:21.policy of the UK. That will be detrimental to the Welsh economy.
:44:22. > :44:27.First of all, I don't agree with an artificial cap. I don't see what
:44:28. > :44:30.sense it has. Surely an economy needs to recruit according to its
:44:31. > :44:34.needs, not a lot of -- an artificial cap. If there were a cap, there
:44:35. > :44:39.would be serious issues over sectoral caps. I have no doubt, that
:44:40. > :44:44.the thinking of the UK Government would be, to do as much for the City
:44:45. > :44:49.of London and the financial services and we will end up with a higher
:44:50. > :44:53.sectoral cap in proportion to the city and the NHS. That would clearly
:44:54. > :44:57.not be in the interest of Wales. He did not say it specifically but I
:44:58. > :45:01.know he is intimating the idea of regional quotas. It is done in
:45:02. > :45:04.Canada and Australia, although they are far bigger, but it's not
:45:05. > :45:08.impossible to do this. Personally, I would prefer them not to be a cap,
:45:09. > :45:11.but if there is one there is a case for looking carefully at where the
:45:12. > :45:23.regional crime -- quota will work. Will the First Minister make a
:45:24. > :45:28.statement on the Welsh government's location strategy. The location
:45:29. > :45:30.strategy will deliver an economically and environmentally
:45:31. > :45:36.sustainable state that is aligned with this government's future needs.
:45:37. > :45:40.The strategy maintains our commitment to being located across
:45:41. > :45:45.Wales and ensures that we are optimising the efficiency of Alan
:45:46. > :45:49.estate and reducing operating costs. While it is in Tiree a talent that
:45:50. > :45:55.the job location strategy -- entirely apparent that the job
:45:56. > :45:57.location strategy is not helping those in Wales, those in my
:45:58. > :46:02.constituency feel that we are being left behind, a feeling which is
:46:03. > :46:07.backed up by facts. The first fact that the government intends to close
:46:08. > :46:11.and sell the building in Carmarthen West out any intention to a wrecked
:46:12. > :46:17.a new building in its place, -- without any intention. And the
:46:18. > :46:23.number of government jobs located in Karnataka has reduced by 35% over
:46:24. > :46:28.the last -- in Karnataka and has reduced. The intention is that we
:46:29. > :46:31.have failed with a matter of delivering those objectives, so will
:46:32. > :46:37.you reconsider and look at the strategy again in order to set new
:46:38. > :46:43.criteria on specific targets in order to deliver growth and quality
:46:44. > :46:47.jobs in all parts of Wales. May I say to the member that the
:46:48. > :46:53.Carmarthen West office will be quitting -- not be quitting the
:46:54. > :46:56.area, just moving building. They are moving from the building on the top
:46:57. > :47:02.and are looking at more modern office space in order to stay in the
:47:03. > :47:08.town. There is no problem about leaving there. Is it true that jobs
:47:09. > :47:13.are being lost? That is true for the whole of Wales. A thousand jobs have
:47:14. > :47:19.been lost in every part of Wales, but having said that, if we look at
:47:20. > :47:24.North Wales we have the land of no junction office and there will be
:47:25. > :47:31.development bank headquarters in Wrexham, so we are committed to
:47:32. > :47:35.moving jobs out of Cardiff at the inception -- inception of the
:47:36. > :47:38.offices there. There is not very much in Aberystwyth and the
:47:39. > :47:41.commentary -- Forestry Commission was there but nothing else. We have
:47:42. > :47:47.demonstrated our commitment to moving jobs out of Cardiff and there
:47:48. > :47:52.is no problem whatsoever with regard to that office. I know how important
:47:53. > :48:00.it is in supporting and assisting farmers and also securing employment
:48:01. > :48:05.in the town. What guarantee has the First Minister obtained from the UK
:48:06. > :48:09.Government during Brexit discussions in relation to securing human
:48:10. > :48:14.rights? The UK Government has said it will not repeal all replaced the
:48:15. > :48:21.Human Rights Act in the process of leaving the EU. We also support
:48:22. > :48:25.efforts to amend the withdrawal bill to ensure the UK continues to
:48:26. > :48:31.respect the Charter of fundamental rights after we leave the EU. When
:48:32. > :48:35.Britain leaves the EU, the Charter of fundamental rights will no longer
:48:36. > :48:40.have any effect in UK law. That means that those rights, not covered
:48:41. > :48:43.by the Human Rights Act for example, the rights to the child, workers'
:48:44. > :48:49.rights and discrimination, they could be scrapped. The Great Repeal
:48:50. > :48:53.Bill White Paper does however promised to exist -- protect
:48:54. > :48:58.existing rights. I don't know about you, First Minister, but I am hugely
:48:59. > :49:03.sceptical about a Conservative Party that opposed many of those rights in
:49:04. > :49:08.the first place, in terms of trusting them to defend right post
:49:09. > :49:13.Brexit. And we only have to look very quickly across the way that
:49:14. > :49:19.they have been willing, so far, to gamble with EU citizens or residents
:49:20. > :49:24.rights. On another tangent, First Minister, can you reassure Welsh
:49:25. > :49:28.universities over their rights to academic freedom from government
:49:29. > :49:36.meddling. I am sure you will have read today, as I have, the reports
:49:37. > :49:40.and the sinister letter sent by the Tory MP to all vice chancellors
:49:41. > :49:47.asking for the names of anyone teaching European affairs or Brexit.
:49:48. > :49:52.First of all, the EU Charter of fundamental rights contains rights
:49:53. > :49:54.and freedom on on a dignity, freedom, equality, citizens rights
:49:55. > :49:58.and justice and justice and surely there is nobody who would argue that
:49:59. > :50:01.those thing should not apply when we leave the EU and that's why it makes
:50:02. > :50:05.sense for the Charter who remain. There are some in the Conservative
:50:06. > :50:09.Party who would love to get rid of so many of the protections built up
:50:10. > :50:14.over many years. They have a hard right of the Conservative Party and
:50:15. > :50:18.I'm sure they would delight in removing as many rights and
:50:19. > :50:24.protections as possible. I hope the sensible people within the party
:50:25. > :50:36.actually win out. I understand a letter was sent by Mr Heaton Harris,
:50:37. > :50:44.to all academics demanding to know who teaches courses on Brexit and
:50:45. > :50:48.the content of those syllabuses. That is as authoritarian --
:50:49. > :50:52.authoritarian request as could possibly be made. I don't say the
:50:53. > :50:55.entire Conservative Party agree with his actions, but if that is the case
:50:56. > :51:00.it is incumbent on government ministers to slap him down.
:51:01. > :51:05.Metaphorically. It is absolutely outrageous that somebody should look
:51:06. > :51:08.to create, in effect, a list of people who are there to be
:51:09. > :51:12.criticised because they do not follow the party line. I suspect
:51:13. > :51:16.this gentleman will have a lot to deal with.
:51:17. > :51:22.That was First Minister's Questions this afternoon. If you want more
:51:23. > :51:29.coverage of the National Assembly, go online to the BBC Wales newspage.
:51:30. > :51:34.That is it for First Minister's Questions this afternoon. We won't
:51:35. > :51:37.be here next week as the assembly is in recess but we hope to have your
:51:38. > :51:40.company when we return in a fortnight. Don't forget, all the
:51:41. > :51:48.latest political news is on Wales today this evening at 6:30pm. From
:51:49. > :51:49.all of us on the team, thanks for your company this afternoon.
:51:50. > :52:07.Goodbye. # Don't want to be... #
:52:08. > :52:10.EXPLOSION