0:00:00 > 0:00:07Now on BBC News, it is time for Politics Europe.
0:00:43 > 0:00:47Hello, welcome to Politics Europe, your regular guide the top stories
0:00:47 > 0:00:52in Brussels and Strasbourg. On the day's programme, the EU is preparing
0:00:52 > 0:00:56the ground work for a new trade deal. Not with Britain, but with
0:00:56 > 0:01:00Australia and New Zealand. So could the plans be a template for a future
0:01:00 > 0:01:04deal with the UK? The European Parliament has been debating what
0:01:04 > 0:01:08can be done to halt sexual harassment, with many staff in
0:01:08 > 0:01:13Brussels saying they have been victims themselves. And, as the EU
0:01:13 > 0:01:17votes to bring in tougher border controls, we will look at whether
0:01:17 > 0:01:26they will be enough to deter illegal emigration. So all that to come, and
0:01:26 > 0:01:31more, in the next half hour. And joining me for all of it, we have
0:01:31 > 0:01:36Jenni Murray from the Times, and the Telegraph's Tim Stanley. Thank you
0:01:36 > 0:01:40for coming. Here is our guide to the latest in Europe in just 60 seconds.
0:01:40 > 0:01:44The European Commission outlined plans that would reduce the veto
0:01:44 > 0:01:47power of member states in the number of sensitive areas like taxation,
0:01:47 > 0:01:51and replace it with qualified majority voting. No solution in the
0:01:51 > 0:01:56crisis in Catalonia this week. While the Central government decided
0:01:56 > 0:02:00whether to impose direct rule, the regional government said that would
0:02:00 > 0:02:08make declaring independence more likely. One of Europe's richest men
0:02:08 > 0:02:12is to become the next prime Minister of the Czech Republic. The tycoon
0:02:12 > 0:02:17turned populist, who has been compared with Donald Trump, must now
0:02:17 > 0:02:23form a coalition. MEPs debated sexual harassment, with several
0:02:23 > 0:02:28holding up metoo placards, in solidarity with the Thames, and
0:02:28 > 0:02:33saying they also have had negative experiences.This to make enough is
0:02:33 > 0:02:38enough, we refuse to be silent.And levels of fungicide in the Indian
0:02:38 > 0:02:45crop are argued to be too high. It stick to naan, then. And of course,
0:02:45 > 0:02:52the crisis in Catalonia, as we saw there, is coming to the EU. It is
0:02:52 > 0:02:55going to get worse before it gets better, isn't it?This is really
0:02:55 > 0:02:59disastrous. This is like two people in a pub who start insulting each
0:02:59 > 0:03:03other and they both get to the position where they have each
0:03:03 > 0:03:06threatened to throw their beer in one another's faces and no one can
0:03:06 > 0:03:09stop them. The central government says Catalonia must not declare
0:03:09 > 0:03:13independence and you have a weak leader in the Spanish president, who
0:03:13 > 0:03:18doesn't want Catalonia to leave. He doesn't, I think, what this crisis
0:03:18 > 0:03:21but he is quite weak politically, he has been accused of giving the
0:03:21 > 0:03:25Catalans too much of their own way, and equally you have a weak leader
0:03:25 > 0:03:28in Catalonia who has been saying he wants independence for years,
0:03:28 > 0:03:32clearly would like to pull back from the brink now, said he wants
0:03:32 > 0:03:36negotiations with Madrid, but the right internal pressures within
0:03:36 > 0:03:40Catalonia saying the go-ahead. And this cannot and well. If the
0:03:40 > 0:03:43Catalans declare their independence, which they are likely to do today,
0:03:43 > 0:03:47and the Spaniards declare that they are going to suspend the
0:03:47 > 0:03:51Constitution and they are going to suspend the powers of the Catalans,
0:03:51 > 0:03:54they are going to build such mutual hatred. There will be violence on
0:03:54 > 0:03:57the streets, the EU says it won't recognise Catalonia, businesses are
0:03:57 > 0:04:01already fleeing Catalonia, and you just think this is like two trains
0:04:01 > 0:04:04heading for one another, and they are going to smash. They need to
0:04:04 > 0:04:08talk.And the chances of it turning ugly were pretty high, weren't they?
0:04:08 > 0:04:12It was always a crisis waiting to happen, from the moment the Catalan
0:04:12 > 0:04:15government decided to have its unlawful referendum, which those in
0:04:15 > 0:04:20favour of unity with Spain boycotted that, but then we saw the violence.
0:04:20 > 0:04:25Unlawful, but Madrid's overreaction, in most people's opinion, has given
0:04:25 > 0:04:30moral impetus to the unlawful act. I see it as a contest between two
0:04:30 > 0:04:34different kinds of nationalism. You have the nationalism of Catalonia,
0:04:34 > 0:04:38which is struggling to become a new country, and on the other hand you
0:04:38 > 0:04:42have Spain, which says that if Catalonia lives in our nation state
0:04:42 > 0:04:46cannot hold together. All of that taking place in the context of a
0:04:46 > 0:04:49constitution which does empower Madrid to do something about it, but
0:04:49 > 0:04:53if Madrid does do what was the logical thing to do, it is obviously
0:04:53 > 0:04:56going to be so morally objectionable that Catalonia arguably has the
0:04:56 > 0:05:01right than to walk away.And all the while Brussels, the European Union,
0:05:01 > 0:05:04outside, looking in, letting them get on with it.It is difficult to
0:05:04 > 0:05:09know they will do, because on the one hand people that the EU lacks
0:05:09 > 0:05:13the idea of a Europe of regions it depends on strong nation states
0:05:13 > 0:05:20putting money into its budget, if nothing else, and Juncker has said
0:05:20 > 0:05:27Europe would be far harder to govern as a Europe of regions. On balance,
0:05:27 > 0:05:35they have more to lose.It is a developing story. Trade between --
0:05:35 > 0:05:39trade talks between Britain and the EU are not happening. It won't
0:05:39 > 0:05:43happen until the EU side backs down on theirs, or Britain on theirs. The
0:05:43 > 0:05:46EU has started to talk among themselves about trade with Britain.
0:05:46 > 0:05:50They are always the iMac also looking down under to forge closer
0:05:50 > 0:05:56ties with Australia and New Zealand. And EU trade deal with New Zealand
0:05:56 > 0:06:01and Australia will be in place by the end of his term in 2019, and
0:06:01 > 0:06:05this week, the EU side said talks are ready to move on to the next
0:06:05 > 0:06:09stage. The UK won't be able to open talks with Australia and New Zealand
0:06:09 > 0:06:12until it leaves the EU in March 2019, but the Prime Minister remains
0:06:12 > 0:06:15optimistic about reaching a deal, because these countries are part of
0:06:15 > 0:06:19the Commonwealth, and they have historic ties to Britain. The final
0:06:19 > 0:06:24EU trade deal with Australia and New Zealand will be carefully
0:06:24 > 0:06:27scrutinised by EU and UK representatives, because it could be
0:06:27 > 0:06:31viewed as a litmus test for the type of deal the EU could eventually
0:06:31 > 0:06:34signed with Britain. At such comparisons are perhaps unwise, as
0:06:34 > 0:06:38Theresa May has always maintained she is looking for a bespoke trade
0:06:38 > 0:06:43deal, and not an off-the-shelf model. Joining me now is the
0:06:43 > 0:06:49Conservative MEP and international trade spokesman David Campbell
0:06:49 > 0:06:52Bannerman. Thank you for coming in. A bit of context first about the
0:06:52 > 0:06:56importance of all this. Australia in the league table of countries are
0:06:56 > 0:07:02important trading partners with the UK, somewhere around 20.Or 19th,
0:07:02 > 0:07:06depending on how you measure it. Yes, but these are important
0:07:06 > 0:07:10markets. We should have done these trade deals way before this,
0:07:10 > 0:07:14actually. But yesterday we had a vote in the European Parliament. We
0:07:14 > 0:07:18have agreed negotiating guidelines of the Council, and negotiation will
0:07:18 > 0:07:22be the next stage. So I welcome that. I am off to New Zealand
0:07:22 > 0:07:27tonight, it is a long flight, but we are moving ahead. And as you rightly
0:07:27 > 0:07:34say, the New Zealand deal, 80% of it is based on Canada, the CETA deal,
0:07:34 > 0:07:41which is very relevant.We have done that deal, and it doesn't
0:07:41 > 0:07:44necessarily give encouragement to those who say we can do these deals
0:07:44 > 0:07:48in the blink of an eye, but Canada deal, it does nothing for trade in
0:07:48 > 0:07:55services.Well, it does have...Very little. And the economy depends very
0:07:55 > 0:08:00crucially on services.As does the EU economy.So again, we should keep
0:08:00 > 0:08:03these outside trade deals in perspective. They are not
0:08:03 > 0:08:08necessarily the pot of gold at the end of the Brexit rainbow. Well, the
0:08:08 > 0:08:13tariffs are important. New Zealand Lamb, for example, is subject to
0:08:13 > 0:08:17quotas, obviously half of that comes to Britain. These things are
0:08:17 > 0:08:21relevant, and we sell a lot of land Rovers and mechanical goods to New
0:08:21 > 0:08:24Zealand and Australia. It is worth getting rid of the tariffs, and that
0:08:24 > 0:08:28is very key, because they are still operating World Trade Organization
0:08:28 > 0:08:33rules. And so there are quite heavy tariffs on certain areas. So that is
0:08:33 > 0:08:37worth having, but you are right, services has to be a big bolt on. It
0:08:37 > 0:08:41is very important to New Zealand as well. And New Zealand is not just
0:08:41 > 0:08:44agriculture. A lot of it is now services and that is very relevant
0:08:44 > 0:08:49to the UK. And we want to protect the city of London, but that is very
0:08:49 > 0:08:53doable. I believe the super Canada deal, which is taking CETA and
0:08:53 > 0:08:58bolting on a lot more in services. You mentioned Lamb, if you want to
0:08:58 > 0:09:02talk about Lamb, you are an eastern England MEP, with a lot of farmers
0:09:02 > 0:09:07on your branch. How do they feel about agricultural produce,
0:09:07 > 0:09:11including lamb, flooding into the market cheap from countries like
0:09:11 > 0:09:14Australia?There will be some concern, and British lamb producers
0:09:14 > 0:09:19have shown concern about the New Zealand deal in particular.The
0:09:19 > 0:09:23Welsh First Minister says it will be the end of farming in Wales.Well,
0:09:23 > 0:09:27it depends what our agricultural regime is going to be post- wreck
0:09:27 > 0:09:35sits, to be honest. We signed up to the single farm payments and I think
0:09:35 > 0:09:38we can look after our farmers but open up our markets -- Brexit. The
0:09:38 > 0:09:44quota is pretty restrictive on New Zealand lamb, for example, and what
0:09:44 > 0:09:47about the consumer? We have to look after British consumers. We can
0:09:47 > 0:09:52drive down food prices post Brexit by being outside the customs union.
0:09:52 > 0:09:58You are a great Brexiteer who believes passionately in York cause,
0:09:58 > 0:10:03but there is a fair chance you will be dealing with angry farmers, I
0:10:03 > 0:10:08don't know if they will be burning tyres on the M20, but you could also
0:10:08 > 0:10:12be looking at prices in the supermarket going up and up and up.
0:10:12 > 0:10:16I think we can look at the whole area of driving a quality in shops
0:10:16 > 0:10:19and supermarkets, opening up markets for our farmers as well as New
0:10:19 > 0:10:23Zealand and Australian farmers. I don't think it is a zero-sum game,
0:10:23 > 0:10:27nor should it be looked at that weight. Hopefully not. That isn't
0:10:27 > 0:10:32the case. But you know, we do believe in free markets and
0:10:32 > 0:10:36liberalised trade. The EU is very resistant, by the way, because of
0:10:36 > 0:10:40particular French producers. They are already saying they will exclude
0:10:40 > 0:10:43sensitive products from Australia and New Zealand in that trade deal,
0:10:43 > 0:10:49but the British trade deal which follows Brexit may not do so, but we
0:10:49 > 0:10:53will look after our farmers, absolutely.When you look at the
0:10:53 > 0:10:57debate going on this week on the subject of trade policy, European
0:10:57 > 0:11:01Union and getting to Brexit day with a trade deal done and dusted, with
0:11:01 > 0:11:05every other deal done and dusted, not just in March 2019 but months
0:11:05 > 0:11:10and months before that, how much of that are you convinced by?This is
0:11:10 > 0:11:14like being asked to clap your hands if you believe in fairies, and I am
0:11:14 > 0:11:18sorry, I can't clap my hands. We know perfectly well we are not going
0:11:18 > 0:11:25to get...She does believe in fairies!Everytime you say that, one
0:11:25 > 0:11:31dies.Relatively simple Canada deal should have taken seven years, and
0:11:31 > 0:11:35it is not resolved. These trade deals will not happen and even if
0:11:35 > 0:11:39they were to happen, they will not be to our advantage. At the moment
0:11:39 > 0:11:43there has been research saying that we are going to lose a quarter of
0:11:43 > 0:11:47the value of our trade in services and one fifth of our trade in goods
0:11:47 > 0:11:51with the EU if we leave. And if we make fantastic trade deals with the
0:11:51 > 0:11:54ten other biggest economies in the world, including the United States,
0:11:54 > 0:11:58including India, we will make up one tenth of the value of what we are
0:11:58 > 0:12:02going to lose. And the other point is that that will take years, and at
0:12:02 > 0:12:05the moment we are entirely ignoring the thing which matters a great deal
0:12:05 > 0:12:09more than tariffs, which is whether we stick to EU regulations. It is at
0:12:09 > 0:12:13the moment the Canada deal has nothing to say to that, which means
0:12:13 > 0:12:17that if we say we are trying to export iron to France in the future
0:12:17 > 0:12:21and we are not sticking to the EU regulations on irons, they. Us at
0:12:21 > 0:12:25the border and search them, which is why our customs are not going to be
0:12:25 > 0:12:29able to keep up with all the demands that Brexit is going to be bringing
0:12:29 > 0:12:32in.Explain why she is wrong, why there is a Tinkerbell.I am
0:12:32 > 0:12:37open-minded. I am rather excited about this discussion about trade,
0:12:37 > 0:12:40because the us via Brexit has been talked about in political terms too
0:12:40 > 0:12:44much. It is about people punishing each other. Britain has done this
0:12:44 > 0:12:47terrible, silly thing, and you are going to get hurt for it. Trade
0:12:47 > 0:12:51doesn't work by those rules, does it? Beneath the politicians are
0:12:51 > 0:12:55spokesmen and businessmen who want trade, because it enriches everyone,
0:12:55 > 0:12:59and that is what the next stage is going to be. Once we leave the EU,
0:12:59 > 0:13:03that is what is going to be exciting. The fact we will be able
0:13:03 > 0:13:06to make money with other people. Among the great things we have
0:13:06 > 0:13:09working to advantage is EU regular to rate compliance. We have exactly
0:13:09 > 0:13:18the same regulations as the EU. -- regulatory.Those rules and
0:13:18 > 0:13:21standards could change over time, and we are going to have to change
0:13:21 > 0:13:26along with them or we lose the market.You can have flexibility.
0:13:26 > 0:13:31When Britain is in charge of its own regulations, when it is outside the
0:13:31 > 0:13:36EU, it has exactly that flexibility to adapt to developing markets.I
0:13:36 > 0:13:42will say the Canada deal took three years to negotiate. We start from a
0:13:42 > 0:13:46different place. We have no tariffs and quotas, we are starting from a
0:13:46 > 0:13:49different place, and all our laws are convergent. Hence the repeal
0:13:49 > 0:13:55act. You know, all the EU laws will be UK laws.
0:13:56 > 0:14:02The minute we...It is one of the benefits.The EU will have to check
0:14:02 > 0:14:06the imports of everything we send them in case we no longer stick to
0:14:06 > 0:14:12their regulations. It is all agreeable.No, it isn't. You are
0:14:12 > 0:14:16only talking about 20% of the economy as international trade. 80%
0:14:16 > 0:14:22is within the UK. The rest of the world, well, 90% of growth will come
0:14:22 > 0:14:28outside of Europe.Your confidence is infectious.Thank you.Maybe that
0:14:28 > 0:14:37is a good thing.Let's come back in two years.The most powerful debate
0:14:37 > 0:14:40in the EU parliament was sexual harassment and whether the EU should
0:14:40 > 0:14:45do more to combat it. During the discussion the focus shifted onto
0:14:45 > 0:14:50the parliament itself with many stories emerging of staff being the
0:14:50 > 0:14:54victims of harassment and abuse. Here is what the EU Commissioner had
0:14:54 > 0:14:59to say when she opened the debate. Women that have been in some form or
0:14:59 > 0:15:04another harassed by their boss, colleague, their teacher, their
0:15:04 > 0:15:12neighbour or a stranger in the street, these stories shocked us. It
0:15:12 > 0:15:16is a feminist outcry from across the world from women who have said
0:15:16 > 0:15:20enough, this is enough. We refuse to be silent, we refuse to accept it.
0:15:20 > 0:15:28We have set aside 6 million euros last year and 12.7 for this year,
0:15:28 > 0:15:32million, and projects across the EU has been a lifeline for many
0:15:32 > 0:15:35organisations who would otherwise not be able to do the work.There
0:15:35 > 0:15:39was concern about this wherever you look and joining me now is
0:15:39 > 0:15:49macro-labor MEP leader. -- Labour MEP leader. We know the problem,
0:15:49 > 0:15:55what can the EU do?Firstly we have to put our own house in order and
0:15:55 > 0:15:59that's what we have been trying to do. Clearly we need to make sure
0:15:59 > 0:16:03there is a safe place for victims to be able to come through and raise
0:16:03 > 0:16:09these issues. But beyond that we're looking at having a committee where
0:16:09 > 0:16:14MEPs who, like many people in this situation, have disproportionate
0:16:14 > 0:16:19power against very many let's say young women, because it is
0:16:19 > 0:16:23disproportionately women who are affected, so what we are doing is
0:16:23 > 0:16:28asking the bureau of parliament to make sure.OK. I want to come to the
0:16:28 > 0:16:32parliament.Beyond that.I want to come to that in a second. There is a
0:16:32 > 0:16:38lot to be said. The union, the commission, Brussels, what can they
0:16:38 > 0:16:44do about this problem across Europe? We need to make sure it is actually
0:16:44 > 0:16:48- it is already illegal. But all member states have to implement it,
0:16:48 > 0:16:56implement laws properly, that there is a legal let's say Polish meant or
0:16:56 > 0:16:59procedure in countries in member states.That is up to member states
0:16:59 > 0:17:07and national governments.The EU can pass regulation to that effect. And,
0:17:07 > 0:17:12also, we need to propose that there is a new regulation about violence
0:17:12 > 0:17:18against women. And there is something the EU can do. And the UN
0:17:18 > 0:17:24is talking about it. It is not just a problem that faces Europe. It is a
0:17:24 > 0:17:30global problem. The UN and the EU and other regional bodies which we
0:17:30 > 0:17:34are working with, we could make it unacceptable that it's not OK, like
0:17:34 > 0:17:38we've made smoking in this country, that it is not acceptable to
0:17:38 > 0:17:41trivialise sexual harassment. Smoking and sexual harassment are
0:17:41 > 0:17:45rather different things. But we take your point. You mentioned the
0:17:45 > 0:17:51parliament itself and what is said to have been going on there. With
0:17:51 > 0:17:55women not safe inside the parliament of the EU. What sort of examples are
0:17:55 > 0:18:00we talking about here?Well, we have, you know, majority of the
0:18:00 > 0:18:04people in power are still men, both in terms of the officials and
0:18:04 > 0:18:10parliamentarians. You have very many young women who come to work in
0:18:10 > 0:18:16parliament or can't for work experience and, of course, you have
0:18:16 > 0:18:24this imbalance of power and, often, somehow, there is a feeling a bit
0:18:24 > 0:18:29like in the film industry, in politics you as well, that its OK,
0:18:29 > 0:18:33young women are expected to do more than the job they are there to do.
0:18:33 > 0:18:36Someone has said there is a cultural silence around the parliament.
0:18:36 > 0:18:40People felt unable to raise concerns, or telling stories of what
0:18:40 > 0:18:45they have been through.Exactly. This is the same scenario, same
0:18:45 > 0:18:49situation elsewhere, in Westminster, if you are in a big corporation, you
0:18:49 > 0:18:55know that your job is at risk. And so that is the problem. The reason
0:18:55 > 0:18:59there is silence is because most people are too afraid and they don't
0:18:59 > 0:19:04know the mechanisms. Now, two years ago the parliament set up a body to
0:19:04 > 0:19:09say, we know some of this harassment exists and we want to set up an
0:19:09 > 0:19:15organisation where the assistants can go to. But really it is not well
0:19:15 > 0:19:19known and it hasn't operated as well as it should have been. But now with
0:19:19 > 0:19:23the Brussels-based paper setting up a confidential forum, more people
0:19:23 > 0:19:27have come out and more women have come out and made these allegations.
0:19:27 > 0:19:31And I think it is totally unacceptable that it's going on.
0:19:31 > 0:19:36What do you think, is there a role for politics on the European level
0:19:36 > 0:19:40to make a difference?The problem is, as someone who has lived through
0:19:40 > 0:19:4530 years of all of this, as every single woman I know has done, the
0:19:45 > 0:19:50sheer practicality of it. I know a young woman at the moment who is
0:19:50 > 0:19:52working in an organisation with Absolutely Fabulous will policies.
0:19:52 > 0:19:56Her married male bosses are not answering her queries during the
0:19:56 > 0:20:00day. They are hitting on her every night with text messages telling
0:20:00 > 0:20:06them how much they want to and I won't use colloquial language go to
0:20:06 > 0:20:10bed with her. What he/she to do in that situation? If she reports them
0:20:10 > 0:20:14they are not going to lose their jobs. They are going to hate her and
0:20:14 > 0:20:18she will get a reputation as a troublemaker and her career in the
0:20:18 > 0:20:22industry where she is just icing out - it will never go anywhere. If she
0:20:22 > 0:20:27goes public, other employers, other men, will think, I don't want her in
0:20:27 > 0:20:31my office and that is the problem. It is right down to the basic power
0:20:31 > 0:20:34in balance. And it doesn't matter how many confidential helplines you
0:20:34 > 0:20:38have. If that woman reports that abuse than those bosses know who is
0:20:38 > 0:20:42talking about them.We have to move on. Thank you for coming on the show
0:20:42 > 0:20:46this morning. Who is coming in, who is going out, this week MEPs voted
0:20:46 > 0:20:51to introduce entry and exit checks for people visiting the borderless
0:20:51 > 0:20:57Schengen area outside of Europe. It is to plug a gap in the EU border
0:20:57 > 0:21:01security and Europol will use a database to identify terrorist and
0:21:01 > 0:21:05track criminal suspects. Adam Fleming reports from Strasbourg.
0:21:05 > 0:21:09Comings and goings at the parliament, this is all about entry
0:21:09 > 0:21:15and exit to the EU by nationals from non-EU countries. In the analogue
0:21:15 > 0:21:19era all you needed was a passport with a visa and some stamps in it.
0:21:19 > 0:21:23Under the digital entry - exit system, there will be a joined-up
0:21:23 > 0:21:26database of biometric information which will tell border guards if
0:21:26 > 0:21:31someone has stayed in the EU for longer than the 90 days that they
0:21:31 > 0:21:36are allowed.It is essential that we effectively manage, protect and
0:21:36 > 0:21:46secure our external borders. That we have full knowledge of who comes in.
0:21:46 > 0:21:52It is in this spirit that we have proposed the entry - exit system.It
0:21:52 > 0:21:56is designed to help stop terrorists like the perpetrator of the Berlin
0:21:56 > 0:22:01attack last Christmas. He travelled using 15 different identities. But
0:22:01 > 0:22:06some MEPs have been formed between security and human rights.It is a
0:22:06 > 0:22:10balance compromise in the first place. I was against this might
0:22:10 > 0:22:15borders. The latest development shows us the Gill that European
0:22:15 > 0:22:19security is a problem and we have to strengthen our borders. On the other
0:22:19 > 0:22:23hand it has to go hand-in-hand with fundamental rights.The time that
0:22:23 > 0:22:26personal data will be held has been a big deal. It has been reduced
0:22:26 > 0:22:33during the passage of legislation but it has been too long.My main
0:22:33 > 0:22:38concern is that here there is a huge collection of travellers' data from
0:22:38 > 0:22:43all travellers coming to the European Union and going outside and
0:22:43 > 0:22:49the retention for up to three years of this date no matter if that
0:22:49 > 0:22:53person is suspicious or risky and that is something which I think is
0:22:53 > 0:22:59in proportionate. We need to focus on those persons who are risky and
0:22:59 > 0:23:05who are suspicious and collect more data on those rather than having a
0:23:05 > 0:23:08general suspicion towards travellers.Trust UKIP's Gerard
0:23:08 > 0:23:14Batten to find a Brexit angle. He has even written a book about it.We
0:23:14 > 0:23:17will be affected after we leave the EU because we will be a third
0:23:17 > 0:23:22country so biometric data will be shared with all countries of the EU.
0:23:22 > 0:23:25It is not unreasonable for European countries to want the system. The
0:23:25 > 0:23:31USA and UK has a system. They need a system. My concern is we are sharing
0:23:31 > 0:23:35this information across the board with the EU and this will be shared
0:23:35 > 0:23:38with countries cannot trust, they are deeply corrupted,
0:23:38 > 0:23:42institutionally corrupted.Another country that comes up is Canada.
0:23:42 > 0:23:48Yes, it is not in the EU. It has signed a deal with the EU to share
0:23:48 > 0:23:52airline passenger data which has been held up with a ruling in the
0:23:52 > 0:23:55European Court of Justice. Some MEPs think the same thing could happen
0:23:55 > 0:23:59with this legislation. If he did it might mean the entry and exit system
0:23:59 > 0:24:01isn't ready to go in 2020 as planned.
0:24:01 > 0:24:08Adam Fleming with that report. We are back again right in the middle
0:24:08 > 0:24:12of the argument about the balance between security and privacy.Yes.
0:24:12 > 0:24:16Has the balance shifted?It is perfectly reasonable for the EU to
0:24:16 > 0:24:20say it wants to better monitor who is coming in and out and the context
0:24:20 > 0:24:27of this after all is that huge march of refugees across the continent,
0:24:27 > 0:24:30the contents is that those setting borders within the Schengen area
0:24:30 > 0:24:34which they shouldn't have to do. The contest is terrorism. It is
0:24:34 > 0:24:40perfectly reasonable. Batten is right, as an emerging country
0:24:40 > 0:24:45outside the EU it is reasonable for the UK to say we don't want you
0:24:45 > 0:24:49holding our citizens' data for three years so what would want till might
0:24:49 > 0:24:53want to have been a EU discussion is between the EU and nationstate which
0:24:53 > 0:24:59seems inevitable. Let the EU deal with it and let Britain deal with
0:24:59 > 0:25:04its citizens' privacy.We heard in the report that the worry about
0:25:04 > 0:25:06information, background on individuals harvested and held, but
0:25:06 > 0:25:11when you look at the threat faced by the world, including countries in
0:25:11 > 0:25:15Europe, can we simply not be squeamish about this?I think you
0:25:15 > 0:25:21have to wonder what government powers have because not of us want
0:25:21 > 0:25:26to end up in a situation where some right-wing government, or some very
0:25:26 > 0:25:30left-wing government then starts to misuse information in a way we don't
0:25:30 > 0:25:33anticipate. It is important that we worry about what they do. Tim is
0:25:33 > 0:25:41right. The world's preoccupation has shifted. We don't know who is
0:25:41 > 0:25:44members of ISIS or Al-Qaeda among the million refugees who came into
0:25:44 > 0:25:49Europe last year. And it is absolutely right systems would
0:25:49 > 0:25:52demand that the EU should be intelligent about following this
0:25:52 > 0:25:56data.And there is an element of hypocrisy that on the one hand
0:25:56 > 0:26:00Britain wants open borders...It is a trade-off, isn't it. There is no
0:26:00 > 0:26:04way to get a position happy for everyone. That's all for now. Thank
0:26:04 > 0:26:09you to all of my guests, in particular Tim and Jenny through the
0:26:09 > 0:26:14programme. Goodbye.