:00:19. > :00:27.Welcome to the Scottish Parliament at Holyrood, a lot of happy on the
:00:28. > :00:30.independence referendum campaign, -- a lot of and in. Alistair Campbell
:00:31. > :00:37.making a pitch for the youth vote, Nicola Sturgeon setting up the case
:00:38. > :00:41.for independence, the back drop of Scottish politics at the moment and
:00:42. > :00:45.presumably for FMQs, the main substance of this programme. Let's
:00:46. > :00:50.cross to the chamber to see what is happening.
:00:51. > :00:55.Question Time is just about to get underway, missing -- ministers
:00:56. > :01:01.taking general questions and talking about the exams had of the first
:01:02. > :01:06.monster -- the First Minister being put to the test. One topic will be
:01:07. > :01:11.the issue of what would happen with tuition fees in the event of
:01:12. > :01:18.independence. Opponents say he would no longer be able to charge students
:01:19. > :01:22.from England, Wales and Northern Ireland to attend Scottish
:01:23. > :01:27.universities. The government says it would be possible by securing an
:01:28. > :01:32.exemption from the European Union. But we'll come up because a Labour
:01:33. > :01:37.backbencher has asked about it -- that will come up. It has been a big
:01:38. > :01:42.issue this week. The independence referendum campaign is dominating
:01:43. > :01:48.more and more the debate in Scottish politics. That is reflected on the
:01:49. > :01:55.airwaves and in newspapers. This is to run Lamont.
:01:56. > :02:01.-- JoAnn. What engagements has he planned for the rest of the day?
:02:02. > :02:07.Presiding officer, both the First Minister and John Swinney has said
:02:08. > :02:12.Scotland pays 9.9% of tax revenues in the UK and receives only 9.3% of
:02:13. > :02:18.public spending. That suggests Scotland pays in more to the UK and
:02:19. > :02:26.we get out, could he please tell me how much money is 9.9% of tax
:02:27. > :02:32.revenue? -- than we get out. And how much is 9.3% of spending?
:02:33. > :02:38.Surplus of revenue overspending that year was ?4 billion and that
:02:39. > :02:42.contributes to a surplus of five years, a relative surplus compared
:02:43. > :02:48.to Scotland and the UK, of ?8 billion. That is the point of doing
:02:49. > :02:52.the statistics because the unionist parties, Labour and Tory, have
:02:53. > :02:57.always wanted to say Scotland has higher public spending and that is
:02:58. > :03:02.true and for good reasons. Scotland also contributes more in terms of
:03:03. > :03:09.revenue and that is why taking the 9.9% of revenue compared to 9.3% of
:03:10. > :03:17.spending, that shows Scotland is in a stronger fiscal position on the
:03:18. > :03:21.rest of the UK. -- than. Classic First Minister, if you do
:03:22. > :03:26.not like the figures they give you, I have another set prepared! He did
:03:27. > :03:32.not answer the question I asked. About the way he misrepresents those
:03:33. > :03:47.figures. According to his own figures, 9.9% of revenue is 56.9
:03:48. > :03:54.billion pounds. At 9.3% of spending amounts to ?64.5 billion. So
:03:55. > :04:07.actually, Scotland gets ?7.6 billion more out of the UK than we put in.
:04:08. > :04:11.Is it not the case that if the Scottish government's own figures
:04:12. > :04:16.show that we get more money out of the UK than we put in it, it is
:04:17. > :04:26.deeply misleading to try to give the opposite impression?
:04:27. > :04:30.Order, First Minister. The vast majority of countries in the world
:04:31. > :04:36.have been running deficits. There have been exceptions, Norway is
:04:37. > :04:41.eight grand example -- a grand example. We have exactly the figures
:04:42. > :04:50.of deficit between Scotland and the UK. 2008, Scottish government --
:04:51. > :05:00.deficit was 2.6%, the UK was 6.9%. 2009, the UK deficit was 11.2%.
:05:01. > :05:09.2010, deficits down to 8.1% in Scotland, 9.5% in the UK. The last
:05:10. > :05:15.figures, a deficit of 5% in Scotland compared to 7.9% in the UK. So for
:05:16. > :05:22.each of the last four years, the Scottish deficit is my web than the
:05:23. > :05:28.UK deficit. -- lower. That is why we are in a stronger fiscal position.
:05:29. > :05:34.We do not get the benefit cuts the money is sucked into the London
:05:35. > :05:38.Treasury. I welcome this line of questioning because we can put the
:05:39. > :05:46.difference forward, the money that would be available in these years.
:05:47. > :05:58.?6 billion in 2008, 679 million in 2010, 1 billion in 2010, making a
:05:59. > :06:08.total of over 12 early in pounds. To put it in terms she will appreciate,
:06:09. > :06:14.?2000 for every man, woman and child in Scotland, they would be
:06:15. > :06:21.relatively out much better off if Scotland had been running its own
:06:22. > :06:26.finances. -- that much. In all of that, he did not respond to the
:06:27. > :06:34.question I asked! Which is, by his own figures... The First Minister
:06:35. > :06:43.should also recall that his own Finance Secretary in his private
:06:44. > :06:47.paper to his Cabinet confirmed that Scotland will have a larger deficit
:06:48. > :06:53.than the rest of the UK by 2016. But of course, that was for private
:06:54. > :06:58.consumption and not for the rest of us. Because if the First Minister
:06:59. > :07:04.could put down his statistical Tommy gun and randomly spray out figures
:07:05. > :07:08.for a question he was not asked, we might get somewhere. I have asked
:07:09. > :07:13.him about two specific figures, quite simple, what Scotland pays
:07:14. > :07:20.into the UK and what the UK pays out to Scotland. Can he confirm that
:07:21. > :07:30.Scotland puts ?56.9 billion into the UK in tax as it states on page 598
:07:31. > :07:38.of his own white paper? And can he confirm we get ?64.5 billion back,
:07:39. > :07:43.as on page 68? These are his own figures! Can he confirm his own
:07:44. > :07:53.figures are correct? And can he show that Scotland gets more back from
:07:54. > :08:02.the UK than we put in. --? I am glad she has cited the white paper, is --
:08:03. > :08:06.pages 72 to 76 shows Scotland 's fiscal position up to 2016, the
:08:07. > :08:11.first year of independence will be stronger than that of the UK. I have
:08:12. > :08:16.explained in the last four years, Scotland has run a deficit and that
:08:17. > :08:22.is much lower than the deficit being run either UK as a whole. That means
:08:23. > :08:29.we are in a stronger fiscal position -- by the UK. Our position has been
:08:30. > :08:34.stronger over four years and we did not get the benefit of that as we
:08:35. > :08:39.run from London. Some of the many remarkable statistics, Alistair
:08:40. > :08:44.Darling combined with George Osborne, a combination that is quite
:08:45. > :08:49.normal, between them, they borrowed more than every other UK Chancellor
:08:50. > :08:54.in history! The UK borrowing has more than doubled in the period of
:08:55. > :08:59.office of Alistair Darling and George Osborne, that is the extent
:09:00. > :09:03.of UK borrowing. We would have been ?12 billion better off and I do not
:09:04. > :09:08.say we could have spent all that money, although some of that would
:09:09. > :09:12.have been very useful in the capital infrastructure of Scotland, it would
:09:13. > :09:17.have been sensible to borrow less than the UK has done over four
:09:18. > :09:21.years. It would have been a combination of borrowing less and
:09:22. > :09:26.spending more, using that better position to power Scotland forward.
:09:27. > :09:31.We have a smaller deficit over four years than the UK, that is beyond
:09:32. > :09:34.doubt. Can she not see that translates to being in a stronger
:09:35. > :09:40.fiscal position? And for the people of Scotland, they would have been
:09:41. > :09:46.able to use Scotland 's massive resources to benefit the people and
:09:47. > :09:49.economy of this country. That is an interesting sideline the
:09:50. > :09:55.First Minister has now denied what John Swinney said in his own private
:09:56. > :09:59.paper than -- that we would have a greater deficit by 2016. We should
:10:00. > :10:10.not take lectures on economic is from a First Minister, -- economic
:10:11. > :10:17.so. Even a Royal Bank of Scotland economist who said in this chamber
:10:18. > :10:25.on November 20th, we get 9.3% of the spending but we raised 9.9% of the
:10:26. > :10:34.revenue, 9.9% is greater than 9.3%! Even a primary school child could
:10:35. > :10:38.tell you it depend on -- it depends on the percentage. Since the First
:10:39. > :10:41.Minister embarked on his referendum campaign, he has been making
:10:42. > :10:47.promises he claims he will deliver if Scotland votes yes. But his own
:10:48. > :10:53.figures show there would be even less money to spend if Scotland
:10:54. > :10:59.votes to go independent. In the real world, when we look at the figures,
:11:00. > :11:04.when we talk in private as we do in public, that is a fact. Is it not
:11:05. > :11:09.the truth that not only will the First Minister be unable to make
:11:10. > :11:17.good on those promises, he will not even be able to deliver on what we
:11:18. > :11:21.have right now? When she started this questioning, I
:11:22. > :11:25.thought she understood but was making a political point. Now I
:11:26. > :11:31.think she actually does not understand this point. 9.9%, as
:11:32. > :11:36.every school child and perhaps former English teacher should know,
:11:37. > :11:47.is greater than 9.3% and if you have 9.9% of the revenue... Order! If you
:11:48. > :11:52.have 9.9% of the revenue and 9.3 for the spending, you are better off. If
:11:53. > :11:59.it was the other way round, you would be worse off locally for
:12:00. > :12:04.Scotland, we have generated 9.9% of revenue for 9.3% of spending, that
:12:05. > :12:09.means we would have been running a smaller fiscal deficit than the rest
:12:10. > :12:16.of the UK or we would have been in a stronger fiscal position. Being in a
:12:17. > :12:20.stronger fiscal position than London is perhaps not too much, just about
:12:21. > :12:25.every country in the world is in a stronger fiscal position, but it
:12:26. > :12:28.does illustrate how we could have maintained spending as well as
:12:29. > :12:34.borrowing glass over these critical years. But we cannot do anything
:12:35. > :12:39.about the last four years. -- Aravind Glass. We can take the
:12:40. > :12:42.lesson for the future because in every single one of these years when
:12:43. > :12:47.we were in a better position than the UK and would have had freedom to
:12:48. > :12:53.invest in the economy or to borrow less, the Tory and Labour parties
:12:54. > :13:02.were telling people in Scotland have poorly. The figures demonstrate we
:13:03. > :13:08.are relatively better off. -- how poor we are. Is it not time we
:13:09. > :13:14.mobilised these resources to benefit the people of Scotland? Rita
:13:15. > :13:17.Davidson. When will the First Minister next
:13:18. > :13:25.meet the Secretary of State for Scotland?
:13:26. > :13:28.No plans. On 26th of November, the white paper revealed the plans of
:13:29. > :13:36.the SNP to jump the queue into Europe, it claims they can go
:13:37. > :13:44.primarily through Article 48. A route no other state has used. On
:13:45. > :13:49.December 12th, Nicola Sturgeon appeared before the European
:13:50. > :13:55.external affairs committee and said on five separate occasions that
:13:56. > :14:00.nobody had questions whether this was a valid legal route. Does the
:14:01. > :14:04.First Minister stand by that? I am delighted she is on to this
:14:05. > :14:12.point because it does allow me to cite what can only be described as
:14:13. > :14:17.an impeccable source. That is the Guru of the better together
:14:18. > :14:23.campaign. Their favourite academic Professor, Jim Gallagher. Looking in
:14:24. > :14:27.particular at this question of whether Scotland would have an
:14:28. > :14:34.accelerated position into the EU, maintaining its position, here is
:14:35. > :14:39.what he says. It seems pretty likely that Scotland would be an EU member
:14:40. > :14:44.state probably after an accelerated session of negotiations. Precisely
:14:45. > :14:48.what the conditions of membership would beat is not quite so clear
:14:49. > :14:53.though immediate requirements to join the euro can certainly be
:14:54. > :14:59.avoided. If the professor is saying that, the Guru of the campaign, can
:15:00. > :15:03.we not just accept that the burden of opinion favours the position
:15:04. > :15:12.adopted by the government, as opposed to the position adopted by
:15:13. > :15:16.the better together a Lions? I am glad he brings up European
:15:17. > :15:20.writings, I would like to enter some of my own. Nicola Sturgeon also
:15:21. > :15:26.said, if you want to quote people saying this is not a legal route, I
:15:27. > :15:29.am happy to engage in this debate. I have a copy of a new submission by
:15:30. > :15:35.the former director-general of the legal service of the UK Council tell
:15:36. > :15:39.-- telling the committee, it would not be legally correct to use
:15:40. > :15:44.Article 48 for the admission of Scotland as a member of the EU. I am
:15:45. > :15:49.happy to put the submission into the public domain today so everyone can
:15:50. > :15:53.see in black and white a leading European expert saying the SNP 's
:15:54. > :15:57.plan is not lawful. The First Minister misled the Scottish public
:15:58. > :16:12.on EU legal advice. Do That had been previously ruled on
:16:13. > :16:15.before Christmas. I will correct the record by saying their First
:16:16. > :16:21.Minister was an adjacent to the truth of what he said an EU legal
:16:22. > :16:25.advice and in what he said in a written to Europe. So I must ask,
:16:26. > :16:34.why should we believe anything he says on this subject? Well, let's
:16:35. > :16:38.just say that Ruth Davidson will cite other authorities and I will
:16:39. > :16:46.cite my authorities and we can have that argument. The significance of
:16:47. > :16:50.Jim Gallagher's comments is not that he has had an opinion about is that
:16:51. > :16:54.he is actually the star academic of the Better Together campaign. Just
:16:55. > :17:02.as the significance of Professor James Crofton's comments that it
:17:03. > :17:07.would be realistic that an 18 month timetable for Scotland to negotiate
:17:08. > :17:11.its position within the EU is appropriate. That is what he says.
:17:12. > :17:15.That has a particular significance not just because he is reported
:17:16. > :17:21.academic because he was paid by the UK Government. What I say to Ruth
:17:22. > :17:27.Davidson is the opinions I cite, and I know it is embarrassing for Jim
:17:28. > :17:33.Gallagher now and Professor James Clough Road, these are significant
:17:34. > :17:35.and important because I'm citing people in the Better Together
:17:36. > :17:43.campaign and who are paid by the UK Government. I know it is difficult
:17:44. > :17:45.for Jim Gallagher to be cots telling the truth because of his current
:17:46. > :17:56.position, but if you can they say that, the reasonable position people
:17:57. > :18:01.will adopt is that this is a profound and important contribution
:18:02. > :18:07.to the debate. What is use will be discussed at the next meeting of the
:18:08. > :18:12.Cabinet? Matters of importance to the people of Scotland. I want to
:18:13. > :18:16.praise the Justice Secretary for acknowledging arguments made for the
:18:17. > :18:25.abolition of corroboration and removing his position. The solution
:18:26. > :18:28.he proposes is crackers. Can he think of another occasion when the
:18:29. > :18:32.Government has said, pass this law and we will decide what to do later?
:18:33. > :18:37.It is safe to vote for this because people fix it afterwards. Is he
:18:38. > :18:43.expecting this Parliament to vote for this Bill now, a Bill that
:18:44. > :18:48.abolishes the great legal safeguard, a Bill that is incomplete
:18:49. > :18:56.and so bad that it will need fixed later? In the first half of that
:18:57. > :18:59.question, Willie Rennie was continuing his theme of sweetness
:19:00. > :19:04.and light and seeing the sense and accepting concessions when they are
:19:05. > :19:08.offered. I thought the Justice Secretary had made some very
:19:09. > :19:11.important points. Corroboration, we believe, and I think their support
:19:12. > :19:16.from other parts of the chamber as well, should not be a general
:19:17. > :19:21.principle. Why shouldn't it be? Because it prevents some cases
:19:22. > :19:24.getting to court. It prevents people getting the day in court because of
:19:25. > :19:28.the general rule of corroboration. That is an important thing to put
:19:29. > :19:30.forward. But then to say that many people are concerned about
:19:31. > :19:36.safeguards and the security of that change and therefore there could be
:19:37. > :19:41.a study of that, it seems to me a genuine attempt to bring everyone
:19:42. > :19:46.together. Perhaps Willie Rennie will get back to the first bit of his
:19:47. > :19:48.question and accept that the Justice Secretary was doing his best by
:19:49. > :19:55.putting forward the importance of not having that for the prosecution
:19:56. > :19:58.authorities of Scotland. Therefore, the people of Scotland will not
:19:59. > :20:02.getting justice from a general rule. It is a gesture to consider
:20:03. > :20:08.safeguards that will satisfy an even wider canvas. The First Minister
:20:09. > :20:14.knows I like to be reasonable when we agree. But for something so
:20:15. > :20:16.fundamental to be dealt with in such a cack-handed fashion is something I
:20:17. > :20:20.could never agree to. This has happened before. This Government
:20:21. > :20:24.force through the centralisation of the police only for the Chief
:20:25. > :20:28.Constable to recommend fresh legislation within months. The
:20:29. > :20:34.Government tried to rush through its sectarianism Bill only to backtrack
:20:35. > :20:39.within 20 minutes. Have we got to go through this again? A Justice
:20:40. > :20:44.Minister dancing in circles, begging for ways to fix as Bill in the full
:20:45. > :20:47.glare of the committee. Isn't that enough evidence to show the First
:20:48. > :20:53.Minister that he has got it wrong on corroboration? What else does he
:20:54. > :20:58.need? Let me make to serious points. Willie Rennie asks me if there were
:20:59. > :21:03.previous examples. He has now cited what he thinks are two previous
:21:04. > :21:06.examples. I am not sure how the first and second questions tie
:21:07. > :21:13.together. Let's get to the substance of the issue. I want to bring this
:21:14. > :21:17.chamber's attention to the case where some people, in this chamber,
:21:18. > :21:25.some members not sitting far from Willie crane -- Willie Rennie Adam
:21:26. > :21:29.on, wanted to know why an individual could not be prosecuted. That was
:21:30. > :21:33.because of the rule of corroboration. That person demanded
:21:34. > :21:38.to know why that was not possible and got an answer. That is the
:21:39. > :21:43.difficulty of a general rule of corroboration. It means cases do not
:21:44. > :21:46.get into court. That is the difficulty. It denies justice
:21:47. > :21:53.potentially for many, many people in Scotland. The girly sex crimes,
:21:54. > :22:01.women who cannot get access to justice. -- particularly sex crimes.
:22:02. > :22:06.The Justice Secretary is doing exactly the right thing. What I
:22:07. > :22:11.cannot take is people who demand to Nowak is cannot get to court and
:22:12. > :22:16.then refuse to support proposals being put forward to sort out that
:22:17. > :22:23.injustice. Being denied justice, as people are the present moment, is as
:22:24. > :22:28.much, I say as much, and important issue as the miscarriage of justice.
:22:29. > :22:32.If the Justice Secretary can bring forward proposals making sure people
:22:33. > :22:35.have access to justice and satisfy people the danger of miscarriage of
:22:36. > :22:41.justice can be alleviated and stopped, then surely that would be
:22:42. > :22:43.something any reasonable person particularly the victims of crime
:22:44. > :22:53.would want to this Parliament support. To ask the First Minister
:22:54. > :22:55.what the Scottish Government's responses to the Treasury
:22:56. > :23:01.announcement that it will honour all UK Government debt after the
:23:02. > :23:07.independents represent -- independence referendum. The dead
:23:08. > :23:13.parrot up by Alistair Darling and George Osborne, the legal
:23:14. > :23:24.responsibility about it. There has finally been responsible approach to
:23:25. > :23:29.this. Perhaps we have a trend here. We have this common-sense acceptance
:23:30. > :23:33.of the points we have been putting forward for the last year by the
:23:34. > :23:37.Treasury. Who knows, maybe that will spread to other areas of current
:23:38. > :23:45.dispute, like the EU or other matters. Let's see this outbreak of
:23:46. > :23:47.common sense and carry it forward. I thank you for his response and
:23:48. > :23:52.reiterating Scotland is willing to take it she of UK debt and
:23:53. > :23:57.liabilities. Will the First Minister join me in calling for the No
:23:58. > :24:03.campaign to focus more on this common-sense approach specifically
:24:04. > :24:10.regarding an optimal sterling currency area? Yes, I would. There
:24:11. > :24:17.are substantial reasons. The point we put forward in the white paper
:24:18. > :24:20.and reporters not to believe it is in the interest of Scotland, but it
:24:21. > :24:26.is in the interests of the United Kingdom as a whole. I saw an opinion
:24:27. > :24:30.poll in between Christmas and New Year which asked the people of the
:24:31. > :24:33.UK the opinion, and there was an overwhelming majority of the rest of
:24:34. > :24:37.the United Kingdom who believe that after Scotland was independent, it
:24:38. > :24:43.would be common-sense to she as telling as a currency. To Government
:24:44. > :24:46.debt. A new definition of pounds telling and Scottish Government
:24:47. > :24:48.contracts with business now reassures contractors they will be
:24:49. > :24:53.paid instilling in Scotland ends up with a different currency. The First
:24:54. > :24:57.Minister is prepared to be a show business that they will be paid in a
:24:58. > :25:03.stable currency, but will he give this same assurance to pensions
:25:04. > :25:06.instilling being paid in the event of independence? Why should people
:25:07. > :25:10.who have paid instilling into pensions over many years have their
:25:11. > :25:17.pension devalued by Alex Salmond's new currency. The answer is yes,
:25:18. > :25:26.because we're going to retain sterling as a currency. I would like
:25:27. > :25:30.to ask the First Minister what the Scottish Government's responses to
:25:31. > :25:35.advice given by academics on tuition fees for students from EU countries.
:25:36. > :25:41.I'm aware of course by claims being put forward. It should be noted they
:25:42. > :25:45.are campaigning for a no vote, so perhaps these views are of no great
:25:46. > :25:50.surprise. I am also aware crucially of the legal opinion provided to
:25:51. > :25:55.university Scotland, our body, let's agree, of impeccable neutrality on
:25:56. > :26:04.the concept of independence. It makes it clear that EU law makes
:26:05. > :26:08.room for justification with exceptional circumstances. That is a
:26:09. > :26:16.position we outline. Rather than side to side of the debate, if
:26:17. > :26:18.you're citing one side of the debate like Jim Gallagher, only site
:26:19. > :26:25.positions taken by neutral bodies, that must have some weight. I'm sure
:26:26. > :26:29.he will want to deflect the man. Can I thank the first master for his
:26:30. > :26:33.answer. I would ask him to clarify a more immediate and pressing
:26:34. > :26:36.question. For more than three years now, his Cabinet Secretary for
:26:37. > :26:44.Justice and has been trying to secure an arrangement whereby he can
:26:45. > :26:47.try EU students studying at Scottish universities and recoup some of the
:26:48. > :26:50.tens of millions of pounds this is cost the Scottish Government. Is he
:26:51. > :26:59.still actively pursuing such a policy? We are looking at the
:27:00. > :27:03.policy. The important aspect we recognise is that the policy we are
:27:04. > :27:08.outlining in the white paper and of course was supported by the legal
:27:09. > :27:13.advice given to University Scotland asks to set out a route whereby we
:27:14. > :27:17.can retain free education in Scotland. You see, our objectives is
:27:18. > :27:21.to maintain free education in Scotland. I know that is not the
:27:22. > :27:25.objective of the Tory party, the Liberals went along with it in
:27:26. > :27:28.England, and the Labour Party I think I'm now against free
:27:29. > :27:34.cherishing for Scottish students. I think Johann Lamont wants to
:27:35. > :27:42.introduce back door tuition fees. If Ken Mackintosh will accept, our
:27:43. > :27:45.overwhelming priority, success noted by the wreck of the world Scottish
:27:46. > :27:51.youngsters at Scottish universities last year, -- record number of
:27:52. > :27:55.Scottish youngsters at universities in Scotland last year, we want to
:27:56. > :28:00.make sure access to education is based on talent, not sure
:28:01. > :28:06.cheque-book. It will the three under the SNP. If legal experts tied to be
:28:07. > :28:12.correct and the Scottish Government would not be permitted to charge the
:28:13. > :28:17.rest of the UK for student fees, could the First Minister say what
:28:18. > :28:21.the annual Bill would be to Scottish taxpayers in light of the commitment
:28:22. > :28:36.made in paragraph 236 of the white paper, saying there will be no cost
:28:37. > :28:39.for tuition fees. They would continue with the present policy in
:28:40. > :28:43.Scotland. Interestingly enough, I have been copied into a letter from
:28:44. > :28:49.University Scotland to a newspaper saying they do not disagree with the
:28:50. > :28:54.Scottish Government. They welcome the information in the white paper.
:28:55. > :28:58.I would ask the member to cast her mind back to a couple of years ago
:28:59. > :29:01.when the Conservative Party were telling us that the policy we were
:29:02. > :29:07.pursuing of free education in Scotland would run into problems. I
:29:08. > :29:10.see the member nodding. Does she not recognise that the Conservative
:29:11. > :29:15.Party claimed universities in Scotland would be bankrupt and they
:29:16. > :29:18.have been proved wrong? We are now in a fundamentally better position
:29:19. > :29:25.than those south of the border. That policy that we pursued was said to
:29:26. > :29:29.be untenable and is now shown to be wrong. Free education in Scotland is
:29:30. > :29:32.what has taken place right now. If the Tory party were in control of
:29:33. > :29:40.the Scottish Parliament, well, that'll be so not happen, but if
:29:41. > :29:43.they were in power in Scotland, no doubt they would want to put an
:29:44. > :29:47.imposition of ?9,000 or more on every Scottish student. Thankfully,
:29:48. > :29:52.the SNP is in power in this Parliament, urges why tuition will
:29:53. > :30:01.remain free under the SNP. -- which is why. To ask why the Scottish
:30:02. > :30:07.Government will use the planning process for unconventional gas
:30:08. > :30:13.production. As with all energy pro set -- energy projects, they will be
:30:14. > :30:17.considered on merit is and in accordance with the jeans and
:30:18. > :30:24.planning registration. That is the proper and you process. As a country
:30:25. > :30:28.with enough oil to meet demand, many, many times over, it is
:30:29. > :30:31.reasonable to proceed carefully on the undoubted opportunities that
:30:32. > :30:37.there are four shale gas in Scotland. I thank him for his
:30:38. > :30:43.answer. However, he does have form in using the planning policy in
:30:44. > :30:46.controlling energy. He used it to prevent investment in new nuclear in
:30:47. > :30:54.Scotland by threatening to use planning policy. And he has used it
:30:55. > :30:58.to cover talks with wind turbines. As he mobilises resources, is he
:30:59. > :31:07.going to avoid a spectacular hat-trick of own goals? Two things.
:31:08. > :31:10.Firstly, as he should know, if he established an expert group last
:31:11. > :31:14.September in terms of looking at the science and evidence -based approach
:31:15. > :31:23.of fracking and unconventional gas, and October, we announced important
:31:24. > :31:25.guidelines. We are making preparations to get security and
:31:26. > :31:28.confidence to the people of Scotland about such resources will be
:31:29. > :31:32.environment is safe and and a satisfactory manner. I kill the
:31:33. > :31:41.contrast what is happening elsewhere. -- ie can only contrast.
:31:42. > :31:45.George Osborne's father-in-law claimed last year that fracking was
:31:46. > :31:50.OK for the desolate north-east of England. He then connected it by
:31:51. > :31:55.saying it was OK for the desolate north-west of England. If the member
:31:56. > :32:01.could manage on what that message conveyed to communities in the North
:32:02. > :32:05.West and north-east of England. That is why I believe there is a lack of
:32:06. > :32:08.confidence south of the border. If they are not careful, they will
:32:09. > :32:13.spend more time in planning enquiries that they will actually
:32:14. > :32:16.extracting gas. Far better to proceed on the scientific basis that
:32:17. > :32:20.the Scottish Government is proving with planning legislation try not to
:32:21. > :32:27.make sure any such development can be done in a responsible and safe
:32:28. > :32:32.manner. Given that there is no direct link between the sight of
:32:33. > :32:36.these developments and geological structures which give environmental
:32:37. > :32:41.risk, surely there can be no safe offers on for such developments? The
:32:42. > :32:48.only way to achieve environmental protection is for the first Minister
:32:49. > :32:54.to say fracking has no place in Scotland. He will have noted the
:32:55. > :32:57.comments of Friends of the Earth Scotland and WWF Scotland who give a
:32:58. > :33:00.welcome to the Scottish Government's announcement. It seems
:33:01. > :33:05.to me seldom that Patrick Harvie departs from these particular
:33:06. > :33:11.important pressure groups. The point we put forward is reasonable.
:33:12. > :33:20.Scientific analysis is important. I think that is an essential step. The
:33:21. > :33:29.guidelines make sure it is fit for purpose and another source of
:33:30. > :33:42.reassurance to people. It is a much, much better way to proceed. Or for
:33:43. > :33:45.that case did... To say there is no chances being developed in a safe
:33:46. > :33:50.and satisfactory way. Surely the approach taken by the Government is
:33:51. > :33:57.a profoundly good way to proceed? That ends First Minister 's
:33:58. > :34:05.questions. That is the close of boss Mister's questions. Substantial
:34:06. > :34:08.exchanges there. It was enlivened by a very, very gutsy attack from
:34:09. > :34:14.Willie Rennie of the Liberal Democrats on the subject of the
:34:15. > :34:20.abolition of automatic corroboration requirements. A gutsy response from
:34:21. > :34:22.the First Minister. It is time for me to say goodbye and to hand you
:34:23. > :34:35.over to the Daily Politics. marriage was the big mistake of this
:34:36. > :34:40.government, which I completely reject. Other people who do not seem
:34:41. > :34:43.to understand the importance of engaging in a civilised dialogue on
:34:44. > :34:48.immigration. I do not agree, I do not think it is possible for
:34:49. > :34:50.Conservatives to go back on modernisation. I don't think those
:34:51. > :34:54.Conservatives to go back on people committed to it have
:34:55. > :35:01.retreated. Let the welcome our viewers from Scotland. We've been
:35:02. > :35:08.joined by viewers in Scotland who have been watching First Minister's
:35:09. > :35:12.Questions from Holyrood. Not only is it over, that none of these issues
:35:13. > :35:19.are part of the modernisation agenda, partly the reason is it
:35:20. > :35:24.failed. It failed to get an overall Tory majority. Your modernisation
:35:25. > :35:27.agenda was essentially about appealing to the chattering classes
:35:28. > :35:28.within three square miles of here, and came up