:00:42. > :00:42.Good afternoon and welcome to the programme.
:00:43. > :00:44.The SNP's deputy leader, Angus Robertson, has branded
:00:45. > :00:46.the Prime Ministers plans as "a little Britain Brexit".
:00:47. > :00:49.And unemployment rises in Scotland as it drops across the UK.
:00:50. > :00:51.And here at Westminster, away from the public rhetoric,
:00:52. > :00:54.just how useful can the talks between the UK and Scottish
:00:55. > :00:56.governments be on the process of leaving the EU?
:00:57. > :00:58.MSPs will today debate calls for the government
:00:59. > :01:01.the board of Highlands and Islands Enterprise.
:01:02. > :01:03.Ministers want to create a Scotland-wide board
:01:04. > :01:04.for enterprise and skills, prompting fears
:01:05. > :01:07.Our Political Correspondent, Andrew Kerr, has more on the story.
:01:08. > :01:12.We will be having a debate in a short time in a chamber. They want
:01:13. > :01:18.to scrap the enterprise and have won overall Scottish board. I suppose
:01:19. > :01:22.the aim is very clear, to try to improve growth here in Scotland, to
:01:23. > :01:27.try and have one overarching board that can oversee that and really
:01:28. > :01:34.boost growth instead of having this separate body. The new boards would
:01:35. > :01:38.oversee Scottish enterprise, Highlands enterprise, the Scottish
:01:39. > :01:42.funding Council and skills development in Scotland. But the
:01:43. > :01:48.great concern in the Highlands is that this is a centralisation and
:01:49. > :01:53.that decisions will be made down here in the central belt, it would
:01:54. > :01:56.take away that local accountability and, of course, the Scottish
:01:57. > :02:01.Government has been accused of centralising services with Police
:02:02. > :02:08.Scotland and one central Fire Service too. We are probably looking
:02:09. > :02:15.at a defeat may be on the government today inflicted by the opposition,
:02:16. > :02:19.maybe by just one MSP. The Conservatives say it will be close
:02:20. > :02:22.but it does look like a defeat. The government will have to listen to
:02:23. > :02:27.Parliament and it will be interesting to hear what they might
:02:28. > :02:33.be coming up with after that. Defeat is something we haven't been used to
:02:34. > :02:38.for a long time. We have had a few defeats in Holyrood. The SNP is now
:02:39. > :02:46.a minority government, since the May election. They were in when --
:02:47. > :02:53.majority. We are getting a bit more used that here but you are right, it
:02:54. > :03:01.is a very different scenario from the all-powerful government of
:03:02. > :03:07.2011-2016. But they are still very powerful in terms of the party. And
:03:08. > :03:19.it is quite complicated today because there are a number of MSPs
:03:20. > :03:23.off sick. Some are unable to give evidence on the rural connectivity
:03:24. > :03:29.committee. So it is a little bit tricky to work out the numbers. It
:03:30. > :03:33.is very tight but we may be looking at a defeat by one, perhaps. That is
:03:34. > :03:47.the thinking at Holyrood this afternoon. Thank you.
:03:48. > :03:49.Well, to discuss the day's stories, I'm joined by Andy Maciver,
:03:50. > :03:51.director of the PR agency Message Matters
:03:52. > :03:53.and former head of communications for the Scottish Conservatives.
:03:54. > :04:00.There is no rebellion ever on the SNP benches so all 63 SNP 's are
:04:01. > :04:08.always assured to vote with the government. But Andrew is right, it
:04:09. > :04:13.has been a bit closer in recent times. You remember the occasion a
:04:14. > :04:18.couple of weeks ago when a couple voted the wrong way and that would
:04:19. > :04:22.have been a defeat as well. It is a problem but not something they are
:04:23. > :04:27.accustomed to. Brexit will dominate everything this afternoon and for
:04:28. > :04:32.the next two years, four years. What did you make of Theresa May's
:04:33. > :04:37.speech? I think there was an overreaction on both sides. It was
:04:38. > :04:39.entirely predictable. There was never any signal that we were going
:04:40. > :04:46.to retain membership of the single market. I don't think anyone in
:04:47. > :04:50.Europe wanted that. That entails free movement of Labour and it was
:04:51. > :04:53.quite clear that was never going to happen. I think the reaction to it
:04:54. > :04:58.has been quite informative because we see the tones being set for
:04:59. > :05:03.different campaigns. It is unhelpful for Theresa May that the hard Brexit
:05:04. > :05:07.faction has adopted this beach and received it very well so you get
:05:08. > :05:11.Nadine Dorries and people like that standing up in Parliament and saying
:05:12. > :05:16.how wonderful it was. That is not helpful because it allows those on
:05:17. > :05:22.the other side to put -- painted as a hard Brexit. I thought it was very
:05:23. > :05:26.predictable. So she could have done without people saying they were
:05:27. > :05:33.disappointed? Yes, or on the other side. I think it was predictable. I
:05:34. > :05:35.think everybody on the conservative side will be pretty satisfied
:05:36. > :05:44.because it was always going to happen. Do you think that what you
:05:45. > :05:49.see says was as black and white as it has been portrayed? She did seem
:05:50. > :05:56.to leave various options, we will be out of the single market but various
:05:57. > :06:01.options on access. The problem with this debate has always been that
:06:02. > :06:04.people have sometimes accidentally and sometimes deliberately skewed
:06:05. > :06:08.the meaning of membership and access and they are completely different
:06:09. > :06:12.things. I don't think membership was ever on the table. Government
:06:13. > :06:16.ministers have said many times in the past that we will not be members
:06:17. > :06:21.of the single market. It was always about access and that is the thing
:06:22. > :06:25.that remains unknown until the negotiations start. It is what level
:06:26. > :06:30.of access and on what terms we will have it. But I don't think yesterday
:06:31. > :06:36.was quite the change that everybody today is portraying it as. I suspect
:06:37. > :06:44.the Scottish Government would disagree. Absolutely. But will they
:06:45. > :06:47.succeed in doing that? It doesn't make a difference to them because
:06:48. > :06:50.the Scottish Government knew this was happening. They knew we were not
:06:51. > :06:56.going to be members of the single market. On the Brexit paper, option
:06:57. > :07:00.one was keeping the UK in the single market and option two was keeping
:07:01. > :07:06.Scotland in the single market in the UK state. We might talk about that
:07:07. > :07:08.later. I think it is very difficult to see how that can possibly happen
:07:09. > :07:15.politically both on the continent and here. That then gets us to the
:07:16. > :07:18.point that there is a very big decision to make. We will discuss
:07:19. > :07:29.that more later. Our Westminster correspondent,
:07:30. > :07:44.David Porter, is outside We are starting 2017 as we finished
:07:45. > :07:50.2016, everything dominated by Brexit. In that place behind me and
:07:51. > :07:54.also a couple of hundred yards over there, the Supreme Court. As far as
:07:55. > :08:00.the legal action is concerned, some of the mist is now starting to lift.
:08:01. > :08:05.We know that the Supreme Court will give its decision, its judgment on
:08:06. > :08:08.the 24th of January, that is next Tuesday, on whether Theresa May is
:08:09. > :08:11.going to have to introduce legislation into the House of
:08:12. > :08:17.Commons and the House of Lords before she can go ahead and trigger
:08:18. > :08:24.article 50 or whether they will agree with the UK Government and
:08:25. > :08:28.say, no, that is not needed. So it is an important decision for the
:08:29. > :08:32.House of Commons behind me. The Scottish Government were party to
:08:33. > :08:34.that legal action and they are hoping that Holyrood will have a say
:08:35. > :08:40.in whether article 50 will be triggered. Next week will not just
:08:41. > :08:43.be a dry judgment, it will be very important in legal terms and it will
:08:44. > :08:49.be very, very important in political terms. We have just been talking
:08:50. > :08:56.about Theresa May's speech yesterday. What is the reaction to
:08:57. > :09:01.it there? Just over 24 hours on since Theresa May delivered her
:09:02. > :09:06.speech, as you would expect, because it is about Brexit and because what
:09:07. > :09:10.she said about the single market and essentially saying to Europe, either
:09:11. > :09:13.give us a good deal or we could walk away, the reverberations are still
:09:14. > :09:17.being felt in this place and I suspect they are being felt in
:09:18. > :09:22.Holyrood as well. All the proceedings in the House of Commons
:09:23. > :09:25.today, Scottish questions and then later by ministers questions, were
:09:26. > :09:30.dominated by that issue of Brexit and leaving the single market. In
:09:31. > :09:33.response to Theresa May's speech yesterday, Nicola Sturgeon said she
:09:34. > :09:39.now believes that a second Scottish independence referendum is closer
:09:40. > :09:42.and at Prime Minister's Questions I'm today, the SNP went on the
:09:43. > :09:50.attack and they accused Theresa May and the UK Government of wanting a
:09:51. > :09:54.little Britain Brexit. It is thousands of people who may
:09:55. > :09:59.lose their jobs in Scotland as a result of the hard Tory Brexit plan
:10:00. > :10:05.of the Prime Minister. Does the Prime Minister believe that this is
:10:06. > :10:12.a price worth paying for her little Britain Brexit? I repeat what I said
:10:13. > :10:16.earlier, we will be working to ensure that we get the best possible
:10:17. > :10:19.deal in terms of access to the single market and continuing to
:10:20. > :10:24.cooperate in partnership with the member states of the remaining 27
:10:25. > :10:27.member states of the European Union but the Right honourable gentleman
:10:28. > :10:33.once again talks about the possibility of negative impact on
:10:34. > :10:36.Scotland if Scotland were not part of the single market. His party is
:10:37. > :10:44.dedicated to taking Scotland out of the single market by taking it out
:10:45. > :10:49.of the United Kingdom. Amidst all the rhetoric, can I ask
:10:50. > :10:55.you a boring question? What happens next? Nothing until the negotiations
:10:56. > :11:00.start? What happens next is that the talking continues, particularly in a
:11:01. > :11:04.Scottish and UK Government context, despite all the public rhetoric. We
:11:05. > :11:08.know in politics that as far as public rhetoric is concerned, it is
:11:09. > :11:12.not always what is being said in private. There is a meeting tomorrow
:11:13. > :11:16.of the Joint Ministerial Committee, which is made up of the UK
:11:17. > :11:21.Government and the devolved administrations. Whitehall have set
:11:22. > :11:24.it a specific committee to look at exiting the European Union. There is
:11:25. > :11:32.a meeting of that tomorrow down here in which the Scottish Government and
:11:33. > :11:34.the other devolved administrations will be present, but crucially they
:11:35. > :11:38.will be discussing the Scottish Government's plan for Brexit. How
:11:39. > :11:42.those discussions will go, we don't know. They will be in private so
:11:43. > :11:47.they can probably be a bit more candid. But whatever is going to
:11:48. > :11:50.happen, these negotiations at an intergovernment level and the
:11:51. > :11:55.negotiations when they finally happen on the triggering of article
:11:56. > :11:59.50 are probably going to be pretty long, tortuous, and at times pretty
:12:00. > :12:04.bumpy. What I thought was quite interesting from Theresa May at
:12:05. > :12:08.Prime Minister's Questions was the way that she seemed very confident.
:12:09. > :12:11.She has in effect thrown the gauntlet down not only to Nicola
:12:12. > :12:15.Sturgeon and the Scottish Government by saying we are going to be leaving
:12:16. > :12:20.the single market but also to Europe as well by basically saying to
:12:21. > :12:25.Europe, the other 27 countries, if you don't give us a deal, and we do
:12:26. > :12:29.want some kind of trade deal, we are willing to walk away, we are willing
:12:30. > :12:35.to play hardball. It is going to be very interesting in the days, weeks
:12:36. > :12:40.and months ahead to see what Europe says to that. Thank you. You will be
:12:41. > :12:44.back later. I am not even going to mention the beautiful sunshine
:12:45. > :12:45.bathing the houses of parliament. That would be tempting fate. Say no
:12:46. > :12:48.more. This The Health Secretary is due to make
:12:49. > :12:51.a statement to parliament on the delay to plans for a network
:12:52. > :12:53.of trauma centres It was announced last week
:12:54. > :12:57.that the centres will not be up and running for at least three
:12:58. > :13:00.years, because of the scale Let's hear from Shona Robison
:13:01. > :13:11.in the chamber now. it has a dedicated trauma ward which
:13:12. > :13:15.is led by specialist trauma consultant is supported by doctors,
:13:16. > :13:19.nurses, physiotherapists, occupational therapists and other
:13:20. > :13:25.health professionals on a 24-7 basis. The last vital component of
:13:26. > :13:29.trauma units. They deal with the vast majority of trauma, those who
:13:30. > :13:35.are not as seriously injured as trauma patients. A trauma centre
:13:36. > :13:39.cannot succeed without these vital components in place. It should
:13:40. > :13:44.therefore come as no surprise that trauma networks require significant
:13:45. > :13:46.planning and investment in order to resource them appropriately and give
:13:47. > :13:52.seriously injured patients the best care possible. There has been a
:13:53. > :13:57.rigorous debate in the clinical community as to what the optimum
:13:58. > :14:00.model for Scotland would be. I am grateful to them and the Chief
:14:01. > :14:05.Medical Officer for shaping the plans that we are now taking
:14:06. > :14:08.forward. In September 2013, the National planning forum's major
:14:09. > :14:18.trauma subgroup released a report with a number of recommendations for
:14:19. > :14:22.the development of a network. They said it should be a four Centre
:14:23. > :14:26.model. But they also recognise that there was no clear consensus among
:14:27. > :14:33.clinicians of what the optimum number of centres was. In April
:14:34. > :14:37.2014, my predecessor asked for the suggested four centre model to be
:14:38. > :14:42.taken forward as a practical first step but in line with the 2013
:14:43. > :14:48.National planning forum report, we knew that the findings of the
:14:49. > :14:51.evaluation of systems of trauma care should be taken into account when
:14:52. > :14:56.considering future configurations of a trauma network in Scotland.
:14:57. > :14:57.Including whether the number of trauma centres can and should be
:14:58. > :15:08.reduced further. The field work of the study was
:15:09. > :15:13.conducted in 2014 and the report was compiled thereafter. The study was
:15:14. > :15:17.noted on a number of occasions by the national planning forum major
:15:18. > :15:23.trauma oversight group as they took forward their work. In 2015 the
:15:24. > :15:27.study cast doubt on the four centre model and instead suggested two
:15:28. > :15:32.trauma centres was the optimal configuration for Scotland. I had a
:15:33. > :15:35.choice whether to ignore the report, accept it or ask that further work
:15:36. > :15:40.was done to assess the relative benefits and risks of this
:15:41. > :15:44.alternative model. I judged this report had to be fully considered to
:15:45. > :15:49.ensure the right model for Scotland was being developed and to try to
:15:50. > :15:52.address clinical concerns. Clinicians and other NHS staff
:15:53. > :15:58.worked tirelessly then with the study group to assess the risks of
:15:59. > :16:03.having just two centres and in The Spring of last year it became clear
:16:04. > :16:08.from that further work that those risks outweighed the notional
:16:09. > :16:11.benefits. The views and concerns of clinicians and the Scottish
:16:12. > :16:15.ambulance service on a two-centre model were critical at this stage.
:16:16. > :16:19.As a result, I asked the Chief Medical Officer to lead an
:16:20. > :16:24.implementation group that would look at how a new trauma network based
:16:25. > :16:28.around the original model of four centres in Aberdeen, Dundee,
:16:29. > :16:33.Edinburgh and Glasgow could be made to work in practice, taking note of
:16:34. > :16:36.the lessons learned from the report, the concerns of the Scottish
:16:37. > :16:40.ambulance service and Scotland's unique geography. In June last year
:16:41. > :16:46.the Scottish Government announced they would have the necessary
:16:47. > :16:47.preparatory work for an enhanced trauma network completed by December
:16:48. > :16:53.2016. A commitment... The number of people in Scotland
:16:54. > :16:55.seeking work rose over the autumn by 11,000,
:16:56. > :16:57.according to the latest figures. It means the Scottish
:16:58. > :17:07.unemployment rate is 5.1% - It is still an uncertain time for
:17:08. > :17:12.the economy in Scotland. This latest data shows the job market lagging
:17:13. > :17:16.behind the rest of the UK. The Office for National Statistics says
:17:17. > :17:21.11,000 more people were seeking work between September and November. That
:17:22. > :17:26.means a total of 139,000 people were unemployed. The overall rate of
:17:27. > :17:33.unemployment is 5. 1%, compared to 4. 8% for the whole of the UK. A
:17:34. > :17:37.number of factors could be at play. The down turn in oil and gas and
:17:38. > :17:44.Brexit fears. Some parts of the economy are trying
:17:45. > :17:47.to manage that uncertainty. This Paisley company is thriving,
:17:48. > :17:51.offering flexible storages for business and even office space. We
:17:52. > :17:54.try to take away that uncertainty surrounding it so we hope the
:17:55. > :17:57.business come in, can take the space for a month, they can grow the
:17:58. > :18:02.business, bring it back down in size again. We try to make it work for
:18:03. > :18:06.them. There is other good news, the
:18:07. > :18:10.Scottish Government says youth unemployment dropped last year. But
:18:11. > :18:13.it is also published data today showing very slow growth in economic
:18:14. > :18:19.output in the year to last September.
:18:20. > :18:25.Our business editor is here. There are also, just to cheer us up even
:18:26. > :18:28.more, awful figures for GDP growth. Just mentioned there at the end, the
:18:29. > :18:32.figure come out every three months and take a while to compile so the
:18:33. > :18:36.figures we are looking at today cover the third quarter last year,
:18:37. > :18:42.July to September. We already knew the UK figures for that period. That
:18:43. > :18:47.was growth of 0. 6%, it's kind of on trend, it's what you can expect with
:18:48. > :18:51.the economy functioning as typically, for both the UK and for
:18:52. > :18:59.Scotland. Not a bad rate. The Scottish rate is a third of that.
:19:00. > :19:02.That is really two years of very low rates, particularly the last four
:19:03. > :19:08.quart they'res we have seen have been very low indeed. Growth of only
:19:09. > :19:13.0. 7% growth, with 2. 2% across the UK as a whole. The point about this,
:19:14. > :19:17.they're not awful in an absolute sense, neither are the unemployment
:19:18. > :19:20.figures, it's the fact there seems to be a gap growing between the
:19:21. > :19:24.performance in Scotland and the rest of the UK. They're certainly not
:19:25. > :19:30.good either. You are right the divergence is worrying. Even if the
:19:31. > :19:36.UK figures came way down, we should still be worrying about growth rates
:19:37. > :19:40.of only 0. 2%, a fifth of 1% in one quarter and the previous quarter
:19:41. > :19:43.revised downwards so that's the same, 0. 2%. The quarter before
:19:44. > :19:48.that, at the start of last year, no growth in the economy at all. So
:19:49. > :19:54.last year was a very poor year in terms of output from the economy. In
:19:55. > :19:59.terms of that divergence it matters particularly with these new income
:20:00. > :20:03.tax powers because if your growth is heading off in a different direction
:20:04. > :20:08.or at least is growing far less... And you are relying on revenues. It
:20:09. > :20:11.feeds through income tax and revenues will fall below, over time
:20:12. > :20:15.this will take place, you can handle a year or two of it, there may be
:20:16. > :20:18.mechanisms for the Treasury, block grants to make up some of the
:20:19. > :20:23.difference through the agreement they've got, but if you look forward
:20:24. > :20:26.ten years, 15 years, you could see a significant gap between what would
:20:27. > :20:29.happen if Holyrood did not have these income tax powers and what we
:20:30. > :20:35.may face unless we can get the growth rate up again. OK. What's
:20:36. > :20:39.going on, Brexit is as an explanation doesn't because that
:20:40. > :20:41.doesn't explain the difference. The Scottish Government says
:20:42. > :20:46.independence is a possibility of a another referendum has nothing to do
:20:47. > :20:53.with it. Is it entirely oil? A lot has to do with oil and gas. The
:20:54. > :20:56.slump in growth follows the point at which oil and gas sector really
:20:57. > :21:01.began to suffer from much lower price of oil. But that doesn't look
:21:02. > :21:07.like the only explanation that there can be. One of the things which has
:21:08. > :21:11.helped the numbers stay up for quite a while, particularly 2014-2015, was
:21:12. > :21:16.construction. That's partly because of public spending on big projects,
:21:17. > :21:20.that is coming to an end, we are running out of money, big projects
:21:21. > :21:24.are coming to an end, there is less spending on them. That has an
:21:25. > :21:28.impact. When you take construction out and it's been contracting in the
:21:29. > :21:33.past year, after a really substantial growth in the previous
:21:34. > :21:36.couple of years, then the rest of the economy, you see what's really
:21:37. > :21:41.happening underlining in the main part of the economy. The services
:21:42. > :21:46.sector, three-quarters of the economy, has been on a growth path.
:21:47. > :21:50.It is a very slow growth path, it's consistent recently. Manufacturing
:21:51. > :21:54.has been much more volatile and over the past few quarters it's been very
:21:55. > :21:58.weak. Some figures suggest that manufacturing will be helped by a
:21:59. > :22:02.weaker pound, exports will be helped, also you substitute imports
:22:03. > :22:06.because of course imported goods become more expensive and local
:22:07. > :22:13.producers are able to fill the gap there. So, a weaker pound may bake a
:22:14. > :22:18.difference, there could be a positive Brexit effect. We can't
:22:19. > :22:21.really see it's down to uncertainty about Brexit, because it really has
:22:22. > :22:27.the same effect across the whole of the UK. But there is this question
:22:28. > :22:30.in the background that you mentioned there, if Brexit and constitutional
:22:31. > :22:37.uncertainty around Britain's place in Europe as a trading regime is one
:22:38. > :22:42.of the reasons for business investment being down, then like
:22:43. > :22:46.wise uncertainty about Scotland's position within its major market,
:22:47. > :22:50.far bigger than the EU and the rest of the UK, that may be weighing on
:22:51. > :22:56.business investment and confidence, as well. When it turns around next
:22:57. > :23:01.month and we are doing wonderfully you can tell us about it! And a few
:23:02. > :23:10.politicians will be here, as well! MSPs have backed a Scottish
:23:11. > :23:11.Government motion, amended by Labour, welcoming the options
:23:12. > :23:13.for Scotland's future relationship with Europe,
:23:14. > :23:16.as set out in the Government paper A Conservative amendment calling
:23:17. > :23:19.on ministers to stop using the EU Referendum result as a reason
:23:20. > :23:25.to campaign for Scottish Almost seven months since the EU
:23:26. > :23:27.referendum in which Scotland voted emphatically to remain in the
:23:28. > :23:29.European Union, whilst England and Wales voted to leave, the Prime
:23:30. > :23:34.Minister has today announced as ending the UK involvement in the
:23:35. > :23:38.European project in the hardest and most complete way possible. We think
:23:39. > :23:42.this is the wrong decision for the UK as a whole and indicates that the
:23:43. > :23:47.type of country the Conservatives want is a race to the bottom,
:23:48. > :23:51.sacrificing consumer, environmental and workers' rights for the price of
:23:52. > :23:55.deregulation, low wages and low taxes. But the Scottish Government
:23:56. > :23:59.and the Scottish people as indicated in poll after poll have a different
:24:00. > :24:04.view. We have to find a way forward, that honours the democratic demand
:24:05. > :24:06.of the nation to maintain our relationship with our European
:24:07. > :24:09.friends and neighbours. Scotland's place in Europe was published on
:24:10. > :24:12.20th December t delivered the mandate that we were required to do
:24:13. > :24:16.by this parliament. It is the first detailed plan to be published by any
:24:17. > :24:20.Government in any part of the UK to deal with the implications of the UK
:24:21. > :24:24.leaving the European Union. Today's debate gives us as a parliament
:24:25. > :24:28.speaking for our nation to take those plans a step further. On
:24:29. > :24:32.Thursday the Scottish Government will make a presentation about these
:24:33. > :24:35.plans to the JMC European negotiating committee and it is of
:24:36. > :24:39.course proper that this parliament should give its view to them in
:24:40. > :24:43.advance of that discussion in London. The Prime Minister was
:24:44. > :24:47.explicit today in stressing this paper is still to be considered by
:24:48. > :24:50.the UK Government. We have also highlighted ways we can keep
:24:51. > :24:53.Scotland in the single market while continuing to protect free trade
:24:54. > :24:58.from across the rest of the UK as well as safeguarding the existing
:24:59. > :25:00.powers of this parliament and significantly ex-pappeding
:25:01. > :25:03.revolution in order to mitigate the damage that will be done by Brexit.
:25:04. > :25:06.Our amendment to the Government motion today calls on the SNP to act
:25:07. > :25:13.in the best interests of the people of Scotland as a whole and to stop
:25:14. > :25:17.using the outcome of the EU referendum to campaign for
:25:18. > :25:20.independence. In the foreword to this paper, supposedly about Europe,
:25:21. > :25:25.there are 11 separate references to independence. As well as the First
:25:26. > :25:28.Minister repeated reference to Scotland being independent within
:25:29. > :25:33.Europe as being the preferred option. Yet again the SNP continues
:25:34. > :25:38.to defy economic logic by constantly campaigning to leave our domestic UK
:25:39. > :25:43.trading market represented 65% of our business, to maintain membership
:25:44. > :25:48.of a European single market that accounts for only 15%. She appeared
:25:49. > :25:52.to say three things. No to the single market, yes to transitional
:25:53. > :25:56.arrangements, and on the customs union, don't know. Her Government
:25:57. > :26:00.has still not reached a clear position on that critical matter.
:26:01. > :26:03.There was little evidence of a willingness to consider different
:26:04. > :26:07.outcomes on the single market for different parts of the UK but the
:26:08. > :26:10.Prime Minister has given undertakings to consider proposals
:26:11. > :26:14.from the Scottish Government and that pledge should be honoured. Our
:26:15. > :26:18.place in future as we argued last time we debated the single market
:26:19. > :26:22.has to mean the most unfetterred access to that market that can be
:26:23. > :26:28.achieved in the context of the decisions of the United Kingdom as a
:26:29. > :26:33.whole. But in that context ministers can and should continue to seek ways
:26:34. > :26:36.to protect Scotland's vital interests, working with others
:26:37. > :26:41.across the United Kingdom who are also seeking to make the best of the
:26:42. > :26:45.current circumstances. This afternoon's speech from the Prime
:26:46. > :26:50.Minister I think confirms that the Conservatives are hellbent on a hard
:26:51. > :26:57.Brexit, regardless of what the impact will be on millions of people
:26:58. > :27:00.through higher prices, greater instability, hitting jobs and
:27:01. > :27:04.hurting our economy, withdrawing from the single market and the
:27:05. > :27:11.customs union is not in our country's interests, nor was it what
:27:12. > :27:16.people voted for on the 23rd June. The Tories are turning Brexit into a
:27:17. > :27:20.democratic stitch-up and it shows how vital it is that the public be
:27:21. > :27:24.given a say in a Brexit deal referendum. This is exactly the hard
:27:25. > :27:27.Brexit we had feared and despite the single line acknowledging the
:27:28. > :27:30.Scottish Government's proposals the plans set out today are entirely
:27:31. > :27:35.incompatible with the Scotland's place in Europe paper. The
:27:36. > :27:38.previously mentioned report estimates that a Norway-style deal,
:27:39. > :27:42.all continue for all the UK, would in the best scenario see Scottish
:27:43. > :27:47.GDP drop by three million, wages drop by an average of ?800 per
:27:48. > :27:50.person and still lose over 30,000 jobs. This is quite a compromise.
:27:51. > :27:54.It's probably the Westminster Government's last chance to ensure
:27:55. > :27:58.Scotland continues to be part of the UK. Yet for all Theresa May spoke
:27:59. > :28:03.about wanting the UK to be more united than ever before, she has
:28:04. > :28:08.refused to compromise. I believe now that a vote on our own future is all
:28:09. > :28:10.but impossible to avoid. Let's speak to some MSPs at
:28:11. > :28:25.Holyrood. Dan jel Johnson, let's start with
:28:26. > :28:32.you. Working out Labour policy these days is like doing a tricky
:28:33. > :28:36.crossword. Can we judge from what Lewis McDonald was saying there that
:28:37. > :28:41.Labour supports Nicola Sturgeon's ambitions to keep Scotland in the
:28:42. > :28:45.single market and within the UK and supports what was said in the paper
:28:46. > :28:48.that the Scottish Government produced? What Labour are saying is
:28:49. > :28:52.that the Scottish Government is right to the extent that it is
:28:53. > :28:55.absolutely right to look at what options are available to protect
:28:56. > :28:58.Scotland's interests in access to the single market. But what I have
:28:59. > :29:03.to say and what Scottish Labour are saying is that if you are starting
:29:04. > :29:08.point of the issues around Brexit are about uncertainty, about the
:29:09. > :29:12.economic consequences and your solution is independence, we have to
:29:13. > :29:13.absolutely reject that because independence will compound those, if
:29:14. > :29:25.not by a factor of When you say you support the
:29:26. > :29:29.proposals, what is it you support? Are you saying you would back
:29:30. > :29:34.Scotland staying in the single market and the UK, even if the UK
:29:35. > :29:37.leaves the single market? We are saying that we were look at options
:29:38. > :29:44.that are realistic that are brought forward. But the options have been
:29:45. > :29:49.brought forward. You still haven't answered my question. Are you saying
:29:50. > :29:52.that Labour in Scotland supports the contents of the paper that the
:29:53. > :29:56.Scottish Government produced, which suggested they should be some way
:29:57. > :30:04.found to allow Scotland to say in the single market even when Britain
:30:05. > :30:07.exits the European Union? There are lots of things in that paper worthy
:30:08. > :30:11.of consideration and given that we are only at the start of the Brexit
:30:12. > :30:15.process, I think it is important that we explore all of those
:30:16. > :30:21.options, but above all else we have to recognise, and the government's
:30:22. > :30:25.own paper recognises that we have to protect the UK single market, but we
:30:26. > :30:31.also need to engage properly, fully and adequately with this process. To
:30:32. > :30:34.be straightforward question, would you support the Scottish
:30:35. > :30:39.Government's efforts to keep Scotland in the single market, your
:30:40. > :30:45.answer would be yes? As long as that doesn't jeopardise the UK. Liam
:30:46. > :30:55.McArthur, the big problem for your line on Europe is that, admittedly
:30:56. > :30:59.almost to everyone's surprise, all the economic evidence is running
:31:00. > :31:04.against you. It was supposed to be a disaster if we left the EU. I think
:31:05. > :31:09.the pound went up by the biggest amount since 2008 after Theresa
:31:10. > :31:13.May's speech yesterday. The Bank of England has said Brexit is no longer
:31:14. > :31:21.the main economic issue facing the UK. And even business investment is
:31:22. > :31:27.going up. I think your point about the jump in the pound, what we have
:31:28. > :31:30.seen is the pound plummeting and yesterday we saw it recovering some
:31:31. > :31:36.of the lost value over recent months. At the same time, the FTSE
:31:37. > :31:39.was going in the other direction. Let's not lose sight of the fact
:31:40. > :31:43.that Brexit hasn't happened yet. Yesterday we had more of the detail
:31:44. > :31:48.of what the UK Government are proposing but still a wide range of
:31:49. > :31:55.uncertainty that will need to be filled. But if you are right, why
:31:56. > :31:59.does the governor of the Bank of England say Brexit is no longer the
:32:00. > :32:02.main economic issue facing the UK? You would have too asked the
:32:03. > :32:07.governor of the Bank of England. Explain to me why you think he is
:32:08. > :32:10.wrong. What we are looking at in terms of access to markets is a
:32:11. > :32:14.complete departure of what we were told throughout the referendum
:32:15. > :32:18.campaign from the leadership of Leave, when we were assured by
:32:19. > :32:23.senior representatives and by Ruth Davidson in this Parliament is that
:32:24. > :32:29.the maintenance of our full access to the single market, and that has
:32:30. > :32:34.been cast aside yesterday. I can't see how that is in the interest of
:32:35. > :32:39.any business sector across not just Scotland but the UK. How that will
:32:40. > :32:43.play out in the months and years to come, I think is going to be
:32:44. > :32:47.difficult to predict, but anyone who suggests it is going to be easier,
:32:48. > :32:51.it is going to be a business advantage to have access to the
:32:52. > :32:53.single market unless favourable terms than we have at the moment is
:32:54. > :33:13.I think naive. It's Adam Tomkins, a single market deal is in
:33:14. > :33:17.the bin now, isn't it? Absolutely not. The Prime Minister said
:33:18. > :33:22.yesterday she wants the freest possible trade with the EU, she
:33:23. > :33:26.wants a new, bold, Conrad Smith free-trade agreement between the UK
:33:27. > :33:31.and the rest of the EU, she wants the greatest possible access to the
:33:32. > :33:34.single market. I'm sure China or India would tell you the same thing,
:33:35. > :33:39.that's not the same thing as being part of the single market. Having
:33:40. > :33:44.the fullest possible access to the single market is not the same as
:33:45. > :33:49.Canada, India and China. Do tell us what the difference is. China has no
:33:50. > :33:55.free-trade agreement with the European Union. You said it is
:33:56. > :34:00.different from Canada. There is no free-trade agreement between Canada
:34:01. > :34:06.and the EU. You know there is one on the table. We can't play games with
:34:07. > :34:11.this, it is far too important. What the Prime Minister said yesterday
:34:12. > :34:15.was that we will be members of the European Union. We want a full,
:34:16. > :34:19.compressive free-trade agreement with the European Union that will
:34:20. > :34:23.give us the greatest possible access to the single market. I first argued
:34:24. > :34:26.for that in this Parliament in September. It is perfectly
:34:27. > :34:31.consistent with what the Scottish Conservatives have been saying for
:34:32. > :34:37.five months. Has anything changed? The SNP knew perfectly well that
:34:38. > :34:40.Theresa May wasn't going to say that Britain would stay in the single
:34:41. > :34:47.market and she wasn't going to say Britain would stay in the customs
:34:48. > :34:51.union. The indications over the last three months have been that that is
:34:52. > :35:01.the direction the Conservatives have been heading in. I'm actually having
:35:02. > :35:05.-- the fact we have produced this compressive paper outlining the
:35:06. > :35:09.various options available to Scotland and the UK Government and
:35:10. > :35:14.asking for them to consider them is the right way forward. We have been
:35:15. > :35:20.the first partly, the only party to have a consistent message since the
:35:21. > :35:26.day after the EU referendum. Consistently wrong. Wales are
:35:27. > :35:29.following suit as well. They are putting something together which is
:35:30. > :35:33.going to outline their position as well. What is wrong with the British
:35:34. > :35:37.government saying, we have had a look at that, we don't think it is
:35:38. > :35:42.realistic. They have got a right to do that but we were told we were an
:35:43. > :35:49.equal partner in this United Kingdom and they have to look at our
:35:50. > :35:52.document and take it seriously. Gordon, there seems to be a bit of a
:35:53. > :36:00.disconnect between what Theresa May... They have got to do
:36:01. > :36:03.everything you say? No, we have got to work together. But there is a
:36:04. > :36:09.disconnect between what Theresa May said yesterday and the rhetoric of
:36:10. > :36:13.the Scottish Conservatives. Theresa May says she was going to look at
:36:14. > :36:18.that paper and we are looking for her to do that. They has to be a
:36:19. > :36:24.negotiation. But there doesn't seem to be any evidence of that
:36:25. > :36:29.happening. So what do you do now? The people of Scotland's voices are
:36:30. > :36:33.not being heard at all. We continue to engage with the UK Government as
:36:34. > :36:38.we have done all along. But you are saying they are not engaging with
:36:39. > :36:42.you. No, we are engaging with the UK Government. You were just saying
:36:43. > :36:51.they weren't paying any attention to you. We are meeting tomorrow. But
:36:52. > :36:57.certainly, when you look at things like the length of time it took
:36:58. > :37:01.David Davies to get back to Michael Russell, when he said he had a
:37:02. > :37:07.hotline to David Davies, it doesn't give me much cause for comfort. So
:37:08. > :37:10.what do you do? Just saying we will have another independence referendum
:37:11. > :37:15.unless you do something else, you can't just keep saying that for
:37:16. > :37:18.years. Are you going to come up with another set of proposals? Have you
:37:19. > :37:23.got a plan for encouraging the UK Government to listen to you? We have
:37:24. > :37:27.always got plans for the UK Government and the fact you have had
:37:28. > :37:31.to say that to me is indicative of the way this is viewed. We shouldn't
:37:32. > :37:35.have to be pressing the UK Government to listen to the Scottish
:37:36. > :37:38.Government, we are government in our own right and this should be an
:37:39. > :37:44.equal partnership. I genuinely hope I will be proved... That the UK
:37:45. > :37:47.Government will take on board what is in that paper and we can have a
:37:48. > :37:53.constructive dialogue. Theresa May seems to be acting on the whims of
:37:54. > :37:59.the centre-right part of her party, the Brexiteers. One of the things I
:38:00. > :38:03.find really bizarre is that they were impassioned speeches from the
:38:04. > :38:08.Conservative members before the EU referendum about staying in the
:38:09. > :38:13.single market have evaporated. Because we respect the result of the
:38:14. > :38:14.referendum. Let's have a lovely shot of all of you standing there saying
:38:15. > :38:16.cheese. Now, two former First Ministers have
:38:17. > :38:19.suggested major changes to the Scottish Parliament,
:38:20. > :38:20.including an increase Both men suggested the electoral
:38:21. > :38:28.list system currently used in Holyrood elections
:38:29. > :38:30.should be re-evaluated. And, as Holyrood assumes more powers
:38:31. > :38:32.and responsibilities for Scotland, Mr McLeish said the current total
:38:33. > :38:45.of 129 of MSPs was The massive changes that have taken
:38:46. > :38:52.place in politics everywhere and the massive change in politics in the UK
:38:53. > :38:56.with the distribution of powers, I think we do need to look at the size
:38:57. > :39:01.of the parliament in the future, we do need to look at the question of
:39:02. > :39:10.capacity and how these members are elected. Jack McConnell was saying
:39:11. > :39:12.he saw no need. Well, Professor Greg
:39:13. > :39:13.Philo Research Director of the Glasgow University Media Unit
:39:14. > :39:16.and Andy Maciver is here to discuss how the public might be convinced
:39:17. > :39:30.that more politicians Greg, just on this issue of reform,
:39:31. > :39:33.it is a tough one, because he argued for reforms and the way things were
:39:34. > :39:38.done when he was First Minister and got nowhere. Tricia Marwick, when
:39:39. > :39:45.she was Presiding Officer, said she was banging her head against a brick
:39:46. > :39:51.wall. Why do you think MSPs are so resistant to making any changes?
:39:52. > :39:57.There is always resistance because people have their own ways of doing
:39:58. > :40:06.things. But if there is a fundamental change going on in the
:40:07. > :40:12.sense of new powers being allocated and real work is moving from one,
:40:13. > :40:15.from Westminster to Holyrood, there is busy a case to say that things
:40:16. > :40:19.have to be done differently and you are going to need more personnel. If
:40:20. > :40:25.you want to sell that to people, that is the way to do it, to the
:40:26. > :40:28.population as a whole. One of the issues is whether people will accept
:40:29. > :40:32.the need for more politicians or for more money on politics. But that
:40:33. > :40:39.seems to me to be the clearest way of explaining it. If there is more
:40:40. > :40:43.work, you need more people. On the other hand, just imagine going to
:40:44. > :40:48.the streets of Glasgow and saying, we need more politicians. Imagine
:40:49. > :40:52.the reaction you would get. If you expressed it in those woods, that is
:40:53. > :40:55.the reaction you would get, but if you said there is a lot more work
:40:56. > :40:59.happening now because of the devolved powers because all sort of
:41:00. > :41:02.work is being moved from Westminster up to here so we need more people to
:41:03. > :41:08.do it, nobody would think twice about it. The other point that they
:41:09. > :41:13.seem to be getting on about was that they feel that the Holyrood
:41:14. > :41:16.committees, which were advertised before devolution as being a great
:41:17. > :41:20.new thing, so much better than London, they are not actually
:41:21. > :41:23.holding ministers to account even in the way parliamentary committees in
:41:24. > :41:30.London do to politicians at Westminster. If that's the case, you
:41:31. > :41:33.need to argue about who is on those committees and what their capacity
:41:34. > :41:39.is. That is really down to the quality of the people asking the
:41:40. > :41:47.questions. I'm not being rude but realistically there is no reason...
:41:48. > :41:51.You are being rude. If people aren't asking the right questions, you need
:41:52. > :41:54.to ask why is that so. Look at the problems in Northern Ireland where
:41:55. > :42:00.you have got the collapse of the whole Executive because of
:42:01. > :42:05.effectively a scandal where huge amounts of public money was spent
:42:06. > :42:10.without being held to account. You need to say, what was the oversight
:42:11. > :42:16.procedure, who was supposed to be asking the questions and why would
:42:17. > :42:20.they ask? Andy, what do you make of this? When Tricia Marwick left, I
:42:21. > :42:24.did at least two interviews wishy talked about how frustrated she was.
:42:25. > :42:34.She made all sorts of proposals. They got nowhere. Why is there such
:42:35. > :42:39.resistance? Big political change is difficult in this country because it
:42:40. > :42:44.is not generally received very well by the public. I think in this
:42:45. > :42:48.instance, if you were to look at the proposal to have more MSPs because
:42:49. > :42:51.of more work, I think that is completely reasonable, not least
:42:52. > :42:56.because the committee system really struggles with the number of MSPs.
:42:57. > :43:00.You can have two or three committees per MSP sometime and they can't do a
:43:01. > :43:07.good job on a committee when you are that spread out. Tricia Marwick said
:43:08. > :43:11.in London you have got select committees and then committees
:43:12. > :43:18.overseeing, line by line, the government legislation. Yet they
:43:19. > :43:23.have to do the functions of both. Our politicians are actually very
:43:24. > :43:26.busy. Very hard-working. They are not all brilliant but they are very
:43:27. > :43:32.busy. There is an easy way of getting around the public issue of
:43:33. > :43:35.having more MSPs, you have the equivalent number of MPs reduced.
:43:36. > :43:44.You reduce the number of Scottish MPs by the number of MSPs. From a
:43:45. > :43:47.public perspective, that is a much easier sell. It doesn't answer the
:43:48. > :43:53.question why politicians aren't popular. But in this instance, you
:43:54. > :44:02.could quite easily have more MSPs. What do you think of that? To reduce
:44:03. > :44:13.the number of MSPs? No, it includes MSPs, reduce MSPs -- reduce MPs. I
:44:14. > :44:17.would say what will probably happen is that people in Westminster will
:44:18. > :44:22.say they are overloaded to and if you reduce the MPs you will get less
:44:23. > :44:25.oversight there. Given the costs to the nation, if you actually costed
:44:26. > :44:31.this up and worked out how much it costs to have a few more MSPs, it's
:44:32. > :44:37.really not a lot in terms of the vast sums. You have been doing focus
:44:38. > :44:42.groups. What reaction to politicians are you getting less
:44:43. > :44:47.There is a sense politicians aren't trustworthy because of the long
:44:48. > :44:52.history of things like cash for questions. I didn't catch that, did
:44:53. > :44:57.you say the sense is that politicians are not trustworthy?
:44:58. > :45:01.That's right. It's a very, very deep distrust of politicians and
:45:02. > :45:07.politics, which is not just in this country. That is I think in many
:45:08. > :45:12.ways misplaced because I think very many MPs do work hard and are very
:45:13. > :45:16.dedicated to what they do. But the sense that they are constantly under
:45:17. > :45:21.attack does really wear them down and I advise them on issues like
:45:22. > :45:24.climate change and a range of issues and how to get these sorts of
:45:25. > :45:29.arguments across to the public. I go and talk to the committees. What are
:45:30. > :45:35.people saying to you in the focus groups, is it that they trust MPs or
:45:36. > :45:38.MSPs of their party they vote for but don't trust the others or do
:45:39. > :45:43.they just not trust politicians in general? I think it's a general
:45:44. > :45:48.distrust of politicians. But at the same time there is a sense that they
:45:49. > :45:52.have a very important job to do and also I think there is a terrible
:45:53. > :45:56.nervousness at the moment about what's going to happen next. People
:45:57. > :46:01.are genuinely scared about the society they're in, in a way that
:46:02. > :46:05.they weren't I think probably 50 years ago. There is much more fear
:46:06. > :46:11.now about jobs, pensions, the future, health. There was a kind of
:46:12. > :46:15.optimism 50 years ago that things were going to get better, I think.
:46:16. > :46:20.Now I think people are generally scared. They're very worried that
:46:21. > :46:25.politicians are not going to really protect them and I think that is I
:46:26. > :46:29.think the biggest issue that we face, a sense that the political
:46:30. > :46:35.structures that we have are not going to protect people and I think
:46:36. > :46:38.politicians add to that by not being very clear on what is at stake or
:46:39. > :46:43.what the offers are. There is a sense people are being lied to all
:46:44. > :46:47.the time. You can see that over Brexit, you know, people just don't
:46:48. > :46:51.believe the information they're being given half the time. Thank you
:46:52. > :46:53.very much. Don't go away, Andy. You are back
:46:54. > :46:55.later. And now it's time for this week's
:46:56. > :46:57.Prime Minister's questions. The issue of Brexit dominated
:46:58. > :47:00.proceedings, with the Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn devoting
:47:01. > :47:02.all of his six questions to it. He began by asking Theresa May,
:47:03. > :47:22.why she was not allowing parliament Yesterday the Prime Minister snubbed
:47:23. > :47:26.parliament and snubbed the Brexit committee's recommendations to bring
:47:27. > :47:32.forward a White Paper whilst at the same time describing the referendum
:47:33. > :47:39.as a vote to restore our parliamentary democracy. This is
:47:40. > :47:47.about our jobs, living standards and future prosperity. Why will it not
:47:48. > :47:51.be scrutinised by this House? Can I say to the right honourable
:47:52. > :48:01.gentleman that what I did yesterday was set out a plan for a global
:48:02. > :48:07.Britain. I set out a plan that will put the divisions of last year
:48:08. > :48:18.behind us, that will show a vision... That shows a vision for a
:48:19. > :48:22.stronger, fairer, more united, more outward looking, prosperous,
:48:23. > :48:26.tolerant and independent truly global Britain. It was a vision
:48:27. > :48:30.which will shape a stronger future and build a better Britain. Shortly
:48:31. > :48:36.after the Prime Minister confirmed that she wants to take the UK out of
:48:37. > :48:42.the single European market, the Scottish parliament voted by a large
:48:43. > :48:48.cross-party majority to remain in the single European market, just as
:48:49. > :48:53.a large majority of people in Scotland voted to remain in the
:48:54. > :48:58.European Union. The Prime Minister has said that Scotland is an equal
:48:59. > :49:04.partner in the United Kingdom. Does she still believe this is true or is
:49:05. > :49:09.she just stringing the people of Scotland along? I gave - I might
:49:10. > :49:12.refer the right honourable gentleman to my speech yesterday where I
:49:13. > :49:15.reiterated my commitment to be working with the devolved
:49:16. > :49:18.administrations to ensure their voice is heard, their interests are
:49:19. > :49:24.taken into account as we proceed along this path of negotiating our
:49:25. > :49:27.exit from the European Union. Also I specifically referenced the Scotland
:49:28. > :49:30.plan, I understand the Welsh Government will be producing a plan
:49:31. > :49:35.for Wales for to us look at too. That Scotland plan will be being
:49:36. > :49:38.considered by the JMC on European negotiations tomorrow, I believe. We
:49:39. > :49:41.will looking at is seriously and working with the Scottish Government
:49:42. > :49:46.on the proes they bring forward. In the United Kingdom we have 14
:49:47. > :49:49.regional markets for electricity distribution and high landers and
:49:50. > :49:52.islanders are facing higher prices because of where we live.
:49:53. > :49:57.Electricity distribution charges for the north of Scotland are an
:49:58. > :50:01.eyewatering 84% high are than distribution charges for London. The
:50:02. > :50:07.Prime Minister talks about fairness. Will she introduce a universal
:50:08. > :50:10.market for electricity pricing and stop penalising Highlanders and
:50:11. > :50:13.Islanders? Those of us that live in the coaliest windiest places are
:50:14. > :50:17.discriminated against by her Government and it must end --
:50:18. > :50:21.coldiest. Well, the honourable gentleman draws
:50:22. > :50:26.attention to the fact that of course geography does have an impact on
:50:27. > :50:29.these matters. He talks about living in the coldest and windiest place.
:50:30. > :50:33.Obviously, one of the issues that's interesting to look at in relation
:50:34. > :50:40.to Scotland is the whole question of renewables and the opportunities for
:50:41. > :50:48.renewables that appear in Scotland. But I can tell him that we are
:50:49. > :50:51.looking at the impact... We are looking at making sure that energy
:50:52. > :50:56.markets in the UK are indeed working properly.
:50:57. > :51:00.I didn't succeed in cursing the weather for David Porter! Here he is
:51:01. > :51:04.with lots of MPs. Thank you very much, Gordon. Yes a
:51:05. > :51:09.lot to talk about this afternoon. Without any further ado, let me
:51:10. > :51:15.introduce you to my guests this afternoon, deer dree Rock for the
:51:16. > :51:18.SNP, George Folks for Labour, Alistair Carmichael and Ian Stuart
:51:19. > :51:25.for the Conservatives. Let's talk first of all and a brief answer from
:51:26. > :51:29.all of us, Supreme Court will now report on Tuesday in its decision
:51:30. > :51:34.about Article 50. This is a big one, isn't it? It is but we will see on
:51:35. > :51:37.Tuesday whether the Supreme Court has agreed with the Government's
:51:38. > :51:42.appeal. If it chooses not to, I don't think it will be that
:51:43. > :51:46.significant in terms of what we do. The Government has a simple bill
:51:47. > :51:49.ready to introduce to parliament which I hope will quickly get past
:51:50. > :51:52.so we can get on with what the country wants to see and that is
:51:53. > :51:57.start the negotiations with the EU. You are a former lawyer, what's your
:51:58. > :52:01.take on this? I mean, you always know not to prejudge the judgment of
:52:02. > :52:06.a court until you see it. We will know the significance when we see
:52:07. > :52:11.it. In fact, I would say that it's already had a significant impact. It
:52:12. > :52:13.has already taken Theresa May from a position where she was saying the
:52:14. > :52:18.Government and only the Government will have a say on this, to one
:52:19. > :52:21.where they seek to involve parliament. They've not yet gone as
:52:22. > :52:25.far as they need to but have made a significant concession already.
:52:26. > :52:30.George? Yes, the Government knows that the High Court was right that's
:52:31. > :52:33.why the bill is ready to bring in straightaway. The Supreme Court will
:52:34. > :52:38.certainly uphold the High Court's decision. The other good thing is in
:52:39. > :52:42.the statement yesterday Theresa May has said that parliament will now
:52:43. > :52:49.have a say on the final deal and that was the only good thing in it,
:52:50. > :52:54.that is certainly a step forward. Of course spokespeople have said
:52:55. > :52:58.quickly after that there will not be a vote on whether they stay or not.
:52:59. > :53:00.We will get to hear whether the Scottish parliament has a say in
:53:01. > :53:06.being dragged out of Europe against its will or not. That might be legal
:53:07. > :53:11.Brexit, political Brexit very much in evidence. Your Government has
:53:12. > :53:14.been accused today of wanting a Little Britain Brexit as far as
:53:15. > :53:18.Scotland is concerned. No, the Prime Minister was very clear yesterday.
:53:19. > :53:23.We want Britain post-Brexit to be outward facing, liberal, open to the
:53:24. > :53:27.world, trading around the world. That's far from a Little Britain
:53:28. > :53:33.mentality. What is important now, there is an opportunity, both to get
:53:34. > :53:38.a good deal with the EU, and to open up our trading opportunities around
:53:39. > :53:43.the globe. I work in international trade department, there is an
:53:44. > :53:46.enormous appetite for the product of Scottish companies and UK companies
:53:47. > :53:51.to sell more. That's the opportunity we have now got to seize. Should we
:53:52. > :53:55.have been surprised when the Prime Minister actually ruled out we leave
:53:56. > :54:00.Europe, we leave the single market, surely one follows the other? She
:54:01. > :54:03.had given signals of that sort. In fact, it was remarkable that it has
:54:04. > :54:08.taken us seven months to get to a position as simple and as
:54:09. > :54:13.straightforward as that. But, yesterday's speech was a classic
:54:14. > :54:17.example of the way she handles this. She talks the internationalist talk
:54:18. > :54:21.but does not walk the walk. All the rest of the mood music in that
:54:22. > :54:24.speech yesterday was about a country that was turning inwards, that was
:54:25. > :54:29.drawing in from the rest of the world and ultimately that is going
:54:30. > :54:33.to be bad for us and specifically bad for our economy. It was
:54:34. > :54:37.noticeable that the Prime Minister said in her speech actually no deal
:54:38. > :54:40.could be better than a bad deal. Implicitly saying to Europe if you
:54:41. > :54:44.don't give us a good deal we will walk away. Yeah, well that's the
:54:45. > :54:49.kind of irresponsible talk we have heard. You know, with the country
:54:50. > :54:54.the way it is at the moment, the economy, we have just seen an
:54:55. > :55:01.ambulance go by, the health service in disarray, all of these things,
:55:02. > :55:07.the last thing we want is the kind of tax haven economy that is
:55:08. > :55:11.foreseen by what Theresa May is suggesting at the moment. The only
:55:12. > :55:16.thing that would make it worse would make the uncertainty worse, is the
:55:17. > :55:20.prospect of a second independence referendum. To have this uncertainty
:55:21. > :55:26.at the moment, for Scotland to have a second referendum would make it
:55:27. > :55:30.really ten times worse because we would be out of Europe, we would
:55:31. > :55:34.also be out of the United Kingdom. No country in Europe is going to
:55:35. > :55:38.accept Scotland, an independent Scotland as a separate member of the
:55:39. > :55:41.European Union. Total catastrophe. Your Government wants to make it ten
:55:42. > :55:46.times worse. That's nonsense, George. We have put a plan through
:55:47. > :55:49.to Theresa May and her Government proposing that - making a proposal
:55:50. > :55:53.regarding Scotland staying in the single market and retaining free
:55:54. > :55:55.movement of people. That gets discussed by a joint Ministerial
:55:56. > :56:01.council tomorrow and we will wait and see what she has to say. We are
:56:02. > :56:04.about protecting the people of Scotland's interests. 74% within my
:56:05. > :56:08.constituency voted to stay within Europe. This is a very clear message
:56:09. > :56:11.from the Scottish people and we will continue to protect their interests.
:56:12. > :56:14.Sticking with the idea of independence and a second
:56:15. > :56:18.referendum, a brief final question to you all, because of what we heard
:56:19. > :56:22.yesterday and Nicola Sturgeon's response to that, do you think we
:56:23. > :56:27.are now closer to a second Scottish independence referendum? No, I
:56:28. > :56:31.don't. My message to the Scottish Government is to work with the UK
:56:32. > :56:34.Government to get that best possible deal, that's what is in Scotland's
:56:35. > :56:38.interests, take this idea off the table so we can have that certainty.
:56:39. > :56:44.I feel we might be but we shouldn't be. You know, England is the biggest
:56:45. > :56:48.export market for Scottish manufacturers, over two-thirds of
:56:49. > :56:52.our goods are exported into England. 15% exported into the single market.
:56:53. > :56:58.George, briefly. I don't think we will. Nicola Sturgeon is no fool,
:56:59. > :57:02.she knows if she had one she would lose it, that would be the ind of
:57:03. > :57:05.independents completely and the end of her leadership. Unfortunately we
:57:06. > :57:09.would probably have Alex Salmond back again. Certainly Nicola
:57:10. > :57:13.indicated yesterday it would be likely if Theresa May is not
:57:14. > :57:16.prepared to look seriously at the proposals on the table and come back
:57:17. > :57:21.to us with flexible, some flexibility regarding our proposals.
:57:22. > :57:24.To aguests, thank you all very much. The clock has beaten us this
:57:25. > :57:28.afternoon. Gordon, one prediction I will make, two in fact, the weather
:57:29. > :57:31.won't remain as good here forever. Next week we are going to be talking
:57:32. > :57:37.about Brexit. Thanks, David. Let's get final
:57:38. > :57:40.thoughts from Andy. Do you think an independence referendum is any
:57:41. > :57:45.closer? It's a little bit closer because one of the apparent options
:57:46. > :57:49.has been ruled out. But we are always going to be getting to this
:57:50. > :57:52.point of the journey, a referendum is always going to happen and George
:57:53. > :57:55.is right about this, it's only going to happen when the Scottish
:57:56. > :58:00.Government feel they've a good chance of winning it. Way back they
:58:01. > :58:03.thought 60-40 was what they wanted the polls to look like before they
:58:04. > :58:07.called one. They're in a little bit of a corner harks time might
:58:08. > :58:11.evaporate and they might have to call one if they want to keep to
:58:12. > :58:14.previous assurances and the big decision then from Nicola Sturgeon
:58:15. > :58:18.is does she back down and come up with an excuse not to call one or
:58:19. > :58:21.take a risk? She is not a gambler, not like her predecessor, so it's a
:58:22. > :58:27.big decision, I am not sure he will go for it. Or hope there is a change
:58:28. > :58:29.in opinion polls. It's not just the increase in yes, they need an
:58:30. > :58:32.increase in people who want a referendum. There could be a big
:58:33. > :58:38.change but they said that after the Brexit vote and it didn't happen. So
:58:39. > :58:41.it's not certain. All right. Thank you, Andy: Join us tomorrow on BBC
:58:42. > :58:57.Two Scotland at 12 noon. That's all from us for now, goodbye.
:58:58. > :59:00.Robert Burns never travelled to America.
:59:01. > :59:05.In America, Burns was the 19th century Elvis.
:59:06. > :59:10.Many, from Lincoln to Dylan, have identified with his works.