:00:18. > :00:21.Hello and welcome to Politics Scotland. Coming up on the
:00:21. > :00:25.programme: The Finance Secretary is busy balancing the books ahead of
:00:25. > :00:28.his draft budget tomorrow - we'll be speaking to him live. There's
:00:28. > :00:32.concern the Scottish government is going back on a commitment to
:00:32. > :00:34.invest in the railways. As the UK government claims an independent
:00:34. > :00:44.Scotland couldn't pay its welfare bill, one blind claimant tells
:00:44. > :00:49.Holyrood how new assessments make him feel the victim of a witch hunt.
:00:49. > :00:55.I'm not a criminal. I am a human being that needs additional support,
:00:55. > :00:59.but here I'm facing a criminal panel who is making the decision on
:00:59. > :01:07.my life. And after talks with David Cameron, the First Minister Alex
:01:07. > :01:09.Salmond enters the row over welfare payments. Hear what he has to say.
:01:10. > :01:12.But first the Finance Secretary will outline his draft budget for
:01:12. > :01:17.2013/14 tomorrow. John Swinney has pledged the budget will be one
:01:17. > :01:23.focused on boosting the economy. I'm joined now by our political
:01:23. > :01:28.commentator for the afternoon, Alf Young. John Swinney says he wants
:01:28. > :01:34.to boost the economy, what can he do do you think? He is constrained
:01:34. > :01:39.as he himself has indicated. He has got a budget within the framework
:01:39. > :01:45.of UK spending settlements. So what he is going to try and do is what
:01:45. > :01:49.they have been trying to do for years now, to shift more money into
:01:49. > :01:56.capital investment. Because you can then get shovel ready as they say,
:01:56. > :02:03.project under way. It Willem ploy people and give a sense of activity.
:02:03. > :02:08.What he can't do is to address the fundamental question in the British
:02:08. > :02:11.economy. And the Scottish economy. That is about demand. There is not
:02:11. > :02:16.enough demand. Because there is not enough demand and people are
:02:16. > :02:23.anxious and constraining, what they're doing, then the consequence
:02:23. > :02:29.of that is people are still out of work, companies are frightened to
:02:29. > :02:33.invest and so the old circle goes on. Until someone unlocks the key
:02:33. > :02:39.labelled demand and does something about that, not a lot will happen.
:02:39. > :02:45.The UK Chancellor of course is facing a tight financial settlement,
:02:45. > :02:50.but he can pull a rabbit out of the hat, John Swinney can't do that.
:02:50. > :02:54.and there may be some rabbits later in the year in December when George
:02:54. > :02:59.Osborne produces his autumn statement. But until then, there is
:02:59. > :03:04.not much sign that the UK Government will do skrr much. There
:03:04. > :03:08.will be continued debates about more money for capital spending.
:03:08. > :03:12.But given how much budgets have been slashed, it is only repairing
:03:12. > :03:19.some of the damage that has been done. Looking at this politically,
:03:19. > :03:22.in the terms of independence referendum, how important is this
:03:22. > :03:27.budget? Well it is critical, because the budget that John
:03:27. > :03:35.Swinney is going to announce tomorrow kicks in next April and
:03:35. > :03:39.runs through to March of 2014. That is roughly six months before the
:03:39. > :03:45.planned timing of the referendum. So it is the last year of spending
:03:45. > :03:50.before that referendum takes place. And in terms of the pitch that the
:03:50. > :03:55.current Scottish Government has in terms of its competence and the way
:03:55. > :04:00.it is delivered, that is the last snapshot that the people will have
:04:00. > :04:06.of how well they have performed as an administration. Alf is back
:04:06. > :04:14.later thank you for that now. Well I am now joined by the Finance
:04:15. > :04:21.Secretary, John Swinney. Good afternoon. I know you're a busy man,
:04:21. > :04:28.you want a further phases of support for the economy. What are
:04:28. > :04:32.your key target and which areas have been targeted. Labour say the
:04:32. > :04:37.housing buplgt has been slashed, will you address that? You will
:04:37. > :04:42.forgive me if I don't set out the details. I will leave that for
:04:42. > :04:49.Parliament tomorrow. But let me talk about the general situation. I
:04:49. > :04:54.agree with what a will the of what Alf Young has said, capital budgets
:04:54. > :04:58.b -- have been cut too dramatically by the UK Government. If your
:04:58. > :05:03.budget is reduced by a third, there are difficult decisions that have
:05:03. > :05:09.tab taken. We have had to take those decisions. What I have been
:05:10. > :05:12.trying to do for the last five years is ensure we put enough
:05:12. > :05:20.effort and investment into capital investment in our country, because
:05:20. > :05:25.that is the real foundation of growth. Labour say that that
:05:25. > :05:28.Scotland's jobless rate is higher than rest of the UK and they want
:05:28. > :05:35.an ambitious government-led employment programme. You complain
:05:35. > :05:39.you don't have the levers of power, but you have the power to do that?
:05:39. > :05:43.The Labour Party is good at setting out spending commitments and bad at
:05:43. > :05:47.sending out how you might pay for them. I have got to set out how we
:05:48. > :05:53.pay for everything and I will do that tomorrow. It what is I have
:05:53. > :05:57.been doing for five years. But what can I assure the viewers is the
:05:57. > :06:03.Scottish Government will take decisions focused on encouraging
:06:03. > :06:08.economic recovery and that we can continue our drive tone sure that
:06:08. > :06:12.Scotland leads the low carbon economy debate and we secure the
:06:12. > :06:18.investment in our public services upon which many people depend. Now,
:06:18. > :06:21.we have managed to do that for five years and we have been re-elected
:06:21. > :06:26.taking these difficult decision. What I have to wrestle with this
:06:26. > :06:32.year is not just a real terms reduction in the Scottish budget,
:06:32. > :06:36.but a cash reduction. That is a challenging set of financial
:06:36. > :06:41.numbers. That have to be dealt with. It sounds challenging and difficult.
:06:41. > :06:45.Which sectors will be disappointed tomorrow? Well I think people in
:06:45. > :06:50.Scotland will be able to see tomorrow is a Government using all
:06:50. > :06:54.the levers that it has at its disposal to maximise the
:06:54. > :06:57.effectiveness of our investment in the economy and to support recovery.
:06:57. > :07:02.What they will also see is a government making the point to the
:07:02. > :07:07.people that if we want to break out of straight jacket where we are
:07:07. > :07:12.limited by the budgets decided by the UK Government, is we have got
:07:12. > :07:16.to have the full range of fisxal and economic powers which within
:07:16. > :07:22.vand that will enable us to take the right decision. That is the
:07:22. > :07:26.choice that people will make. tricky situation, but Labour say
:07:26. > :07:32.that when you do have procurement process, they say the Scottish
:07:32. > :07:36.Government has messed up and the taxes money has been sent to China
:07:36. > :07:43.and not Scottish companies? Labour Party's idea is all over the
:07:43. > :07:48.place. If we need to get steel for the forth replacement crossing and
:07:48. > :07:52.cannot procure it from here, we have got to procure it from
:07:52. > :07:56.somewhere. If you look at the forth replacement crossing, you have
:07:56. > :08:01.thousands of people from Scotland working on that contract. The huge
:08:01. > :08:03.numbers of contracts are being undertaken by Scottish companies
:08:03. > :08:09.involved in the activities around the construction of the bidge and
:08:09. > :08:15.of course that is contributing also to the training and educational
:08:15. > :08:19.opportunities for many young people on modern apprentice ships. So it
:08:19. > :08:22.is easy for the Labour Party to snipe from the sidelines, but what
:08:22. > :08:27.you will hear from the Scottish Government is a budget that is
:08:27. > :08:34.about economic recovery, about maximising the effectiveness of the
:08:34. > :08:39.use of money and that our services are delivering for the people.
:08:40. > :08:46.looked like last time there would be a modest pay increase, when
:08:46. > :08:51.Labour at Westminster support a pay freeze, how can you afford a pay
:08:51. > :08:56.like? What we will set out is our approach on pay policy. I made
:08:56. > :09:00.clear that I hoped that 2012 would be the last year of the pay freeze
:09:00. > :09:06.and we could afford some increases and clearly I will set out the
:09:06. > :09:12.position that we take forward on pay. What I accept and is one of
:09:12. > :09:16.the points that Alf Young made a moment ago, is that when there is
:09:16. > :09:21.pay restraint and price inflation and precious on peep's incomes,
:09:21. > :09:25.Government has to do its bit to help people. So that is why we have
:09:25. > :09:30.delivered the Council Tax freeze and access to higher education and
:09:30. > :09:36.support the travel scheme and put in place free prescriptions. These
:09:36. > :09:41.are issues that we have to manage sensitively within the pressures on
:09:41. > :09:50.the finances that I referred to. Your sounding very responsible
:09:50. > :09:56.there for the giveaways, but COSLA say there will be a �3 billion gap
:09:56. > :10:02.by 2016, is it now to cut things like free prescription and bus
:10:02. > :10:05.fairs? Last year I set out a significant agenda for reform that
:10:05. > :10:12.involved some structural change, such as the creation of a single
:10:12. > :10:18.police and fire service that will save about �130 million each year.
:10:18. > :10:21.And we have set out a consulting - eand are consulting on the
:10:21. > :10:25.integration of adult health and social care services in which there
:10:25. > :10:29.are better ways in which we can deliver services that better meet
:10:29. > :10:33.the needs of individuals by drawing together the work of our health
:10:33. > :10:37.authorities and local authorities. So there is a reform agenda about
:10:37. > :10:42.making sure that we deliver public services in an effective way. And
:10:42. > :10:46.that is the way we manage the pressures of change, of rising
:10:46. > :10:52.demand that will take place in the years to m co-. But the approaches
:10:52. > :10:57.that we set out in the review last year which are being implemented by
:10:57. > :11:05.health boards and local authorities, involved in the voluntary sector,
:11:05. > :11:10.is the route to ensure we deliver a better approach to public services.
:11:10. > :11:14.And we have had Iain Duncan Smith, the Work and Pensions Secretary,
:11:14. > :11:19.saying that an independent Scotland could not afford its welfare
:11:19. > :11:26.payments as spending is 6% higher north of the border and he said
:11:26. > :11:30.that North Sea oil and gas revenues could not meet that cost. It is
:11:30. > :11:34.rich from Iain Duncan Smith yesterday we had a gentleman, Henry
:11:34. > :11:41.Sherlock, in front of Scottish Parliament, and a gentleman who is
:11:42. > :11:45.blinds, recounting the more ror of being subjected to some of the
:11:45. > :11:49.welfare assault that Iain Duncan Smith has unleashed on vulnerable
:11:49. > :11:54.people. So shifplt has got -- Iain Duncan Smith has got a brass neck
:11:54. > :11:58.talking about cuts in welfare, when he is inflicting such misery on
:11:58. > :12:03.decent members of the public like sherlslerl what we heard about. As
:12:03. > :12:09.a matter of fact, Scotland's social protection costs are 40% of
:12:09. > :12:14.revenues in Scotland, and the rest of the UK they are 42%. So Scotland
:12:14. > :12:17.is already able to pay for our social protection and will take no
:12:17. > :12:22.lessons from Iain Duncan Smith, who is coming to Scotland to
:12:22. > :12:26.scaremonger about the future of independence, when he is axing
:12:26. > :12:30.welfare benefits. And causing his Troy innocent and decent members of
:12:30. > :12:35.the country. On the issue of transport, in the budget we will
:12:35. > :12:40.hear what happens with Edinburgh to Glasgow rail improvement programmes.
:12:40. > :12:45.It was a press release went out in the summer saying there would be a
:12:45. > :12:49.cut of �350 million in that programme. And that cancellation
:12:49. > :12:55.and reduction of some of the electrification of the network. So
:12:55. > :12:59.people may be disappointed to hear that? What commuters will hear
:12:59. > :13:05.about is a Government that is delivering significant investment
:13:05. > :13:09.in the rail network. Doubling the investment per capita that is
:13:09. > :13:14.happening south of the border. A Government this a opening new lines,
:13:14. > :13:18.we have completed the Airdrie to Bathgate link linking west lorsian
:13:18. > :13:24.with Glasgow and the East End of Glasgow with Edinburgh on a new
:13:24. > :13:32.link that is very popular. And they will see a Government keeping rail
:13:32. > :13:36.fares down. What comauters will -- commuter will see is a government
:13:36. > :13:42.determined to ensure we maximise the effectiveness of the rail
:13:42. > :13:47.network. We said how important this budget is for you in the run up to
:13:47. > :13:52.the independence referendum, and it run up until just six month before
:13:53. > :13:57.the referendum, how difficult is it for you to try to make people keep
:13:57. > :14:04.the faith that an independent Scotland could survive and
:14:04. > :14:10.programmes per under these tight I think if you forgive me Andrew I
:14:10. > :14:12.feel as if I have been here before. People told me before the 2011
:14:12. > :14:19.election the Government could never win the election by taking the type
:14:19. > :14:23.of decisions I had to take on public expenditure. But we got our
:14:23. > :14:27.priorities right. We invested in the economy, in public services. We
:14:27. > :14:33.told people straight how we were going to be able to to do that. And
:14:33. > :14:37.people gave us a majority in this Scottish Parliament. So if you will
:14:37. > :14:42.forgive me the SNP Government has taken responsible decisions about
:14:42. > :14:48.the public finances. We've done that that for the last five years
:14:48. > :14:51.and will continue to do that in the last years of this parliamentary
:14:51. > :14:56.term. John Swinney, thank you very much for speaking to us this
:14:56. > :15:01.afternoon. You can see Mr Swinney deliver his
:15:01. > :15:03.draft budget live on BBC Two tomorrow afternoon at 2.30pm. We'll
:15:03. > :15:06.have a special programme with full reaction.
:15:06. > :15:11.Labour have secured a debate on the Scottish Government's intentions to
:15:11. > :15:15.cut by a third of a billion pounds the required investment planned for
:15:15. > :15:19.the Edinburgh to Glasgow rail improvement programme. Let's cross
:15:19. > :15:24.to Holyrood and watch the debate live in the company of our
:15:24. > :15:26.political editor Brian Taylor. Andrew, thank you. The motion from
:15:26. > :15:31.Labour saying that businesses, passengers and areas will lose out.
:15:31. > :15:36.There'll be an amendment from Keith Brown, the Minister, saying the
:15:36. > :15:43.opposite, that business, passengers and areas will benefit. The
:15:43. > :15:47.difference in the emphasis is that Mr Brown is talking up a �5 billion
:15:47. > :15:57.future programme in rail, but Labour are saying they reckon it
:15:57. > :16:01.
:16:01. > :16:07.has been pegged back by some �350 million. Here is Labour's MSP...
:16:07. > :16:16.Order! My constituents in Cumbernauld are delighted that it
:16:16. > :16:21.will be electryified. Why is it the case that we see such rail
:16:21. > :16:25.connections across Europe. They don't exist, but why would the
:16:26. > :16:29.Government Government invest in a rail service which benefited
:16:29. > :16:33.another country? According to written answers senior officers in
:16:33. > :16:36.both organisations were aware that Transport Scotland was undertaking
:16:37. > :16:42.a review. However, there seems to have been no consultation with
:16:42. > :16:46.other partners, such as sterling council, cha has invested
:16:46. > :16:48.significantly in planning for the infrastructure. Officers from
:16:48. > :16:52.sterling council met Network Rail only the day before the
:16:52. > :16:57.announcement of the reduced programme. Clearly neither
:16:57. > :17:01.organisation had been advised they were wasting their time. If the
:17:02. > :17:05.chief executive of Network Rail had been, as he says, aware of
:17:05. > :17:08.Transport Scotland's review and had been involved in reviewing their
:17:08. > :17:14.findings he didn't seem to have passed this information on to
:17:14. > :17:19.others in that organisation. And now the Jacob Report has not been
:17:19. > :17:23.published. I have been published it will be published in due course.
:17:23. > :17:28.Another said the report was in draft form. And yet this important
:17:28. > :17:32.decision was made, apparently on the basis of a draft report which
:17:32. > :17:36.cannot yet be published. Questions I have asked about how the savings
:17:36. > :17:39.were calculated were not answered, on the basis that the information
:17:39. > :17:45.was commercially sensitive. So we can't even know how cutting the
:17:45. > :17:50.programme in half is saved only one third of the budget. I wonder if
:17:50. > :17:53.the resides programme has been subject to an appraisal. The
:17:53. > :18:01.Government Government will doubtless blame Westminster cuts.
:18:01. > :18:04.However, the financing of this was to have been a via a 30-year low
:18:04. > :18:12.interest rate loan from Network Rail against its asset base. If the
:18:12. > :18:18.schemes not included at this phase are to go ahead later, presumably
:18:18. > :18:23.another will have to be made later. Ian Macmillan of the CBI has stated
:18:23. > :18:27.that as the original project would have improved journey times and the
:18:27. > :18:31.environmental performance, he would have expected the CBI to be
:18:31. > :18:34.consulted if major changes were planned. They were not. The
:18:35. > :18:44.Scottish Chamber of Commerce expressed concern that the
:18:44. > :18:51.potential to the transform arable may fail to be realised. S --
:18:52. > :18:55.transformational may fail to be realised. She seems to have
:18:55. > :19:01.neglected two statements, one by the leader of Glasgow City Council,
:19:01. > :19:06.who said this announcement is good for the city. And another which
:19:06. > :19:10.said we welcome this and that it will (Inaudible) I did check with
:19:10. > :19:16.my colleagues. They did provide the statement but nobody showed them
:19:16. > :19:23.the entire press release or explain to do so them that the budget was
:19:23. > :19:26.being cut. A number of questions need to be answered. Transport
:19:26. > :19:30.Scotland published the specification on the 1st June. At
:19:30. > :19:37.that time you had a statement of funds available, on 21st June. Did
:19:37. > :19:41.you know that it was going to be cut, and if you did, why was no
:19:41. > :19:49.statement made to Parliament? What's the Government's timescale
:19:49. > :19:55.now for the sterling Alloa and Dunblane programme and north to
:19:55. > :19:59.Aberdeenshire? And is there any connection between the Office of
:19:59. > :20:04.the Rail Regulator turning down a request, and did the Government
:20:04. > :20:14.overpromise on the programme? Perhaps the Minister will enlighten
:20:14. > :20:15.
:20:15. > :20:22.us. APPLAUSE Thank you. Can I ask you to move your motion? Very sorry
:20:22. > :20:26.Presiding Officer. I move the motion in my name. I call on Keith
:20:26. > :20:30.Brown to speak to the amendment. Thank you Presiding Officer. Since
:20:30. > :20:34.the funding of rail was devolved to Scottish Ministers in 2006 we have
:20:34. > :20:37.seen major investment in the rail network and its services. The
:20:37. > :20:43.Government, this Government alone has presided over the opening of
:20:43. > :20:46.two new lines, seven new stations and the procurement of 38 new
:20:46. > :20:50.trains. New powers have brought new investment and people across
:20:50. > :20:56.Scotland have seen the benefit with new rail services providing access
:20:56. > :21:03.to jobs, education and leisure. Performance has increased to record
:21:03. > :21:11.levels. The last four weeks have seen the best reliability since
:21:11. > :21:15.2005. Journey times are improving across the network.
:21:15. > :21:18.Good performance and record investment since 2007 has
:21:18. > :21:22.stimulated a resurgence in rail travel in Scotland over the last
:21:22. > :21:26.few years. Indeed passenger numbers have increased by 30% since the
:21:26. > :21:30.start of the ScotRail franchise. This is good news for the economy,
:21:30. > :21:34.the environment and travelling public. However, sustained
:21:34. > :21:39.improvement and growth needs sustained investment in future as I
:21:39. > :21:43.announced in June we'll be investing to support the franchise
:21:44. > :21:48.passenger services and enable Network Rail to operate, maintain
:21:48. > :21:54.and enhance the network. In that statement to the chamber I
:21:54. > :21:59.committed to continue the delivery and ensuring that it and other
:21:59. > :22:06.network improvements are compatible and said further progress would be
:22:06. > :22:16.announced shortly I has delivered further improvements at the
:22:16. > :22:21.Haymarket tunnel and the Glasgow to Schotts line.
:22:21. > :22:26.In December 2012 new Edinburgh to Glasgow I havia Carstairs services
:22:26. > :22:31.will be delivered. This responds to local demand for new links
:22:31. > :22:38.between... Order! These will deliver a step change in passenger
:22:38. > :22:47.capacity on this important route between our two major cities, with
:22:47. > :22:51.improved connectivity. I announced on 4th July we will electrify the
:22:51. > :22:54.new line and the electrification of the Cumbernauld lines in time for
:22:54. > :22:58.the Commonwealth Games. This represents a �650 million package
:22:58. > :23:01.of investment in Scotland's railway infrastructure, rolling stock and
:23:01. > :23:05.service provision, which will enable hundreds of new jobs and
:23:05. > :23:09.provide a major boost to the wealth of Scotland and its long term
:23:09. > :23:17.economic sustainability. Before I give way, perhaps I could say how
:23:17. > :23:22.if it is intended by the Labour Party they would reinstate that
:23:22. > :23:30.�250 million. The Minister knows of my long-standing interest in this
:23:30. > :23:34.project. I wrote to Network Rail. First in the summer and the autumn.
:23:34. > :23:38.Neither of which have happened. The letter I've received from them
:23:38. > :23:41.tells me that as a result of the announcements by the Minister, in
:23:41. > :23:45.partnership with transport Scotland we, Network Rail, are working
:23:45. > :23:49.through the detail of what this would mean too the scope of works
:23:49. > :23:54.and timescales we had consulted on this. Work will take a number of
:23:54. > :23:59.months to conclude. Can the Minister tell us what the up to
:23:59. > :24:05.date timescale for these works is? There is no answer to the question
:24:06. > :24:12.about where if �250 million would come from. I note the previous
:24:12. > :24:18.intervention... Order! I think the last contribution was to propagate
:24:18. > :24:22.scare stories about Glasgow station closures which never happened in
:24:22. > :24:27.the first place. On the point I mentioned, we've already started
:24:27. > :24:36.The Minister is not taking an intervention. We will continue the
:24:36. > :24:44.progress according to the previous timetable by 2016. The Jacobs
:24:44. > :24:47.Review identified an opportunity to deliver extra capacity by
:24:47. > :24:51.lengthening platforms. The City Council is working to make this a
:24:51. > :24:55.reality, as Welbeck as delivers faster and better electrified
:24:55. > :24:59.services to passenger this, brings considerable savings, which we do
:24:59. > :25:02.have to identify and will meet passenger demand into the next
:25:02. > :25:07.decade. We were determined to ensure the rail programme is
:25:07. > :25:13.affordable and we drive the best value out of every pound we invest.
:25:13. > :25:18.Twre have to take advantage of every opportunity to maximise value.
:25:18. > :25:21.I committed the Government to sustained increases in rail
:25:21. > :25:24.investment until the end of the decade. Any savings made will
:25:24. > :25:27.increase opportunities for investment elsewhere in the rail
:25:27. > :25:32.network. That was the Transport Minister, Keith Brown there. It is
:25:32. > :25:40.a busy day at Westminster for scish politics too. The First Minister
:25:40. > :25:43.has been -- Scottish politics too. The First Minister has been
:25:43. > :25:48.speaking. We had the joint ministerial committee taking place.
:25:48. > :25:51.Can you remind us what it is and what was discussed there? The joint
:25:51. > :25:56.ministerial committee is made up of representatives from the UK
:25:56. > :26:02.Government and the devolved administrations. Scotland, Wales
:26:02. > :26:05.and Northern Ireland. They are meetings to discuss issues of
:26:05. > :26:08.common interest. Today they were discussing the economy and calls
:26:08. > :26:12.from the devolved administrations from TUC Government and the
:26:12. > :26:15.Treasury particularly to do more to stimulate the economy, to go ahead
:26:15. > :26:19.with infrastructure projects, to try to kick-start the economy. Also
:26:19. > :26:24.they were concerned with something called connect itself, a posh word
:26:24. > :26:30.for better road, rail and airport links. Alex Salmond in particular
:26:30. > :26:36.was concerned he feels that scored doesn't have the links it needs to
:26:36. > :26:45.airports like Heathrow Airport. That was discussed at the meeting.
:26:45. > :26:48.And a brief chat between David Cameron and Alex Salmond, Michael
:26:48. > :26:52.Moore and Nicola Sturgeon on the referendum question. Basically
:26:52. > :26:56.deciding when and where it will take place and who will be able to
:26:56. > :27:00.vote, and, crucially, whether it will be one or more questions.
:27:00. > :27:05.We'll talk about that in more detail later. Taff talks in Downing
:27:05. > :27:10.Street, which lasted over an hour, all the various Ministers came out.
:27:10. > :27:15.I caught up with Alex Salmond as he came out of Downing Street. All of
:27:15. > :27:19.the devolved administrations have made the point very clearly that in
:27:19. > :27:23.addition to the other efforts being made on monetary policy, on long
:27:23. > :27:27.term infrastructure investment, there's a dramatic need for an
:27:27. > :27:31.immediate injection of capital investment into the economy. All
:27:31. > :27:38.the administrations made the ninety the construction sector is one of
:27:38. > :27:44.the key sectors which is dragging back economic recovery, which has
:27:44. > :27:51.been the reason for the double dip, possiblyly treble dip recession.
:27:51. > :27:55.And therefore demand the urgent requirement for immediate capital
:27:55. > :27:59.injection has been made by the administrations across these
:27:59. > :28:05.islands. Wales, Northern Ireland and Scotland had specific examples
:28:05. > :28:11.of the difficulties of the sector, of the decline in capital budgets
:28:11. > :28:14.by over 30%, and a strong request for the UK Government to recognise
:28:14. > :28:18.that. The constitutional dimension of course to that a I would prefer
:28:18. > :28:25.to be in a circumstances where the Scottish Parliament could decide
:28:25. > :28:31.directly to do something about that right now, as opposed to making the
:28:31. > :28:35.case to the Treasury to do it in due course. It is an ought
:28:35. > :28:37.requirement in terms of economic recovery that's required now.
:28:37. > :28:42.do you make of the Iain Duncan Smith that an independent Scotland
:28:42. > :28:47.wouldn't be able to afford the welfare system as present? It is
:28:47. > :28:50.nonsensical. Yesterday at the Scottish Parliament we had a very
:28:50. > :28:57.emotional presentation from somebody with a blind disability
:28:57. > :29:00.who had been, as he argued, reduced to begging in penury as a result of
:29:00. > :29:06.the welfare changes introduced by Iain Duncan Smith. So I think Iain
:29:06. > :29:11.Duncan Smith is the very last person to aid the save the
:29:11. > :29:17.political union campaign, because his department are responsible for
:29:17. > :29:18.fairly significant suffering among sections of Scottish population, as
:29:18. > :29:28.dramatically illustrated at the Scottish Parliament committee
:29:28. > :29:31.
:29:31. > :29:38.In fact as a percentage of GDP the welfare budget in Scotland is less
:29:38. > :29:42.than the UK as a whole and on the last figures that we have available,
:29:42. > :29:46.there is a substantial surplus. So Scotland would be in a position to
:29:46. > :29:50.invest more across a range of things. Certainly, I cannot
:29:50. > :29:56.conceive of any administration of any political colour in an
:29:56. > :30:00.independent Scottish Parliament who would be pursuing the policies of
:30:00. > :30:05.harshness that Iain Duncan Smith has in Scotland now. That was the
:30:05. > :30:09.First Minister speaking to David Porter. It was a strong response
:30:09. > :30:13.from the First Minister about Iain Duncan Smith's comments about
:30:13. > :30:17.welfare in Scotland wasn't it? Iain Duncan Smith is making the
:30:17. > :30:21.comments in Scotland today and essentially his argument is that at
:30:21. > :30:26.the moment he would argue that something like Scotland receives
:30:26. > :30:31.something like 6% more welfare spending than other parts of the
:30:31. > :30:34.United Kingdom and his argument is under independence he is not sure
:30:34. > :30:38.whether Scotland would be able to continue paying benefits at the
:30:39. > :30:43.present Rangers he said they would have to put up taxes or cut
:30:43. > :30:49.benefits. The Scottish Government has said tt figures that they have
:30:49. > :30:54.show that they would be capable of doing that 5 they say they put more
:30:54. > :30:57.into the UK Treasury than they get out. It is developing into an
:30:57. > :31:02.argument over figures and I would expect both sides to put out more
:31:03. > :31:07.figures to try and back up that are case. But it was interesting in
:31:07. > :31:13.comments that Alex Salmond made later, he floated idea, only
:31:13. > :31:17.floated the idea, that perhaps rows like this could cause a road block
:31:17. > :31:23.and perhaps cause problems for the referendum negotiations which are
:31:23. > :31:27.going on. He didn't go as far as saying yes, this would be a
:31:27. > :31:33.definite block, but he raised the possibilities, if there were rows
:31:33. > :31:37.it could slow it down. He said these things could be blown off
:31:37. > :31:43.course if these things continued. It was an interesting threat that
:31:43. > :31:47.he was almost taking out there. Did that kind of talk fit in with what
:31:47. > :31:51.had been discussed earlier between Nicola Sturgeon and Michael Moore,
:31:51. > :31:55.the Secretary of State for Scotland. Was there that atmosphere at those
:31:55. > :31:59.talks? No the mood music and the negotiations which took place
:31:59. > :32:03.between David Cameron, Alex Salmond, Nicola Sturgeon and Michael Moore
:32:03. > :32:10.specifically in Downing Street on referendum and later at the
:32:10. > :32:13.headquarters of Scotland office. I think after that they feel they are
:32:13. > :32:18.making progress. Nicola Sturgeon said she was optimistic a deal
:32:18. > :32:23.could be achieved. They will be holding more talks on the issue
:32:23. > :32:29.next week. But both sides in this seem to be indicating they making
:32:29. > :32:34.progress. Now there seems to be, although it may not be at the stage
:32:34. > :32:37.where there are definite dates in the diary for when Alex Salmond and
:32:37. > :32:42.David Cameron will sign off an agreement. That appears to be the
:32:42. > :32:46.course of action, the way they are going. But it was noticeable that
:32:46. > :32:52.Alex Salmond did raise this idea that if you have will the of rows,
:32:52. > :32:58.it could in his words blow things off course. And now some of the
:32:58. > :33:03.economic fing things that were discussed, Alex Salmond said they
:33:03. > :33:10.needed a capital injection. John Swinney has his draft budget
:33:10. > :33:14.tomorrow. Less facing a tough financial settlement. Lower in cash
:33:14. > :33:19.terms than the previous years. So these devolved administrations are
:33:19. > :33:23.going there asking for more money. Yes, everyone is desperate to do
:33:23. > :33:29.all they can and to spend whoever money they have to the best effect
:33:29. > :33:35.to try and get the economy moving again. And as we heard,
:33:35. > :33:43.construction is an industry which gets people back to work. You're
:33:43. > :33:46.using materials sourced locally and it all those in the devolved
:33:46. > :33:51.administrations had infrastructure projects they would like
:33:51. > :33:56.Westminster to pay for or help pay for or allow them to borrow to put
:33:56. > :34:01.into place. All sides agree that more has to be done to reflate the
:34:01. > :34:06.economy and get people back to work, to get more out put from the
:34:06. > :34:11.economy. The devolved administrations see it as a case
:34:11. > :34:16.that the UK Government could do more. The UK Goth said it is
:34:16. > :34:22.priority is to bear down on the deficit and they say if you Max
:34:22. > :34:27.United on the credit card, you can't -- max out on the cedid card,
:34:27. > :34:31.you can't continue do that. They are not singing from the same hymn
:34:31. > :34:39.sheet as the UK Government on this and they have different priorities.
:34:39. > :34:44.Thank you. Welfare is at the top of the political agenda this week. The
:34:44. > :34:50.First Minister made reference to blind man who told MSPs he was made
:34:50. > :34:53.to feel like criminal while being assessed over benefits. Holyrood's
:34:53. > :35:03.Welfare Reform Committee was taking evidence about changes to benefits
:35:03. > :35:10.yesterday. Henry Sherlock claimed the reforms reduced him begging A
:35:10. > :35:16.clerk read his testimony. I thought the day of a blind man begging on
:35:16. > :35:22.street corners has gone. But that is not the case. ESA and PIP will
:35:22. > :35:25.never pleat the cost of disability. If disabled people were provided
:35:25. > :35:29.with help, the true cost to the Treasury and the local authority
:35:29. > :35:33.would be lier than the current benefits. To be honest I have got
:35:33. > :35:37.to the stage where I think I don't want to apply for it. Because at
:35:37. > :35:44.the moment I don't apply for any other support. I don't want to go
:35:44. > :35:50.through it again. It is such an infringement on my personal life
:35:50. > :35:56.and who I am as a disabled person. I'm not sure if I will go forward.
:35:56. > :36:00.I couldn't face an appeal. You are being judged. It is like doing a
:36:00. > :36:04.crime. That is what it feels like. I'm not a criminal. I am a human
:36:04. > :36:08.being that needs additional support that here I'm facing a criminal
:36:08. > :36:15.panel, who is making the decision on my life for the future. So I'm
:36:15. > :36:22.not sure whether I will appeal against any decision made. I think
:36:23. > :36:28.anybody in their person would say yes there is a lot of misuse of
:36:28. > :36:34.benefit system. I agree with closing loopholes, but the proposal
:36:34. > :36:37.to change DLA to PIP are too rigid and don't take account of the needs
:36:37. > :36:45.of individual and it is a blanket effect and the individual is more
:36:45. > :36:55.important. In our case it doesn't recognise complexity of Asperger's
:36:55. > :37:05.syndrome and other AHDA sufferers. They all unique and the regulation
:37:05. > :37:06.
:37:06. > :37:12.don't Iraq niez -- don't recognise this unique bs. -- uniqueness. The
:37:12. > :37:18.propose arls I think would make a short-term saving for a long-term
:37:18. > :37:21.additional cost. I can't understand why people are getting ESA, apart
:37:21. > :37:25.from the support group that, don't pay contribution rate, they get it
:37:25. > :37:28.on their income, they have never woorked day in their lives lot of
:37:28. > :37:32.them and never contributed to national insurance. Neither will a
:37:32. > :37:38.lot of their partners, but Nair income won't change. They have
:37:38. > :37:45.never made into the system. Not like my husband has, and they
:37:45. > :37:51.continue to get employment support allowance, because it is not done
:37:51. > :37:57.on contribution rate. It is done on their actual income. But it is the
:37:57. > :38:01.people that have paid into the system that this is hurting. They
:38:01. > :38:08.have paid contributions and maybe got a partner who worbgs and I feel
:38:08. > :38:13.the whole situation is unfair. Since this new law started about
:38:13. > :38:17.the one year on the people who pay the contribution rate to ESA there
:38:17. > :38:25.is, it as affected thousands of people who have had a massive
:38:25. > :38:28.change in their circumstances. This I understand is may possibly lead
:38:28. > :38:32.to people lying about whether they have a partner and whether they
:38:32. > :38:39.work 24 hours and lying about their circumstances, just so they can get
:38:39. > :38:46.some income. Which is wrong I know, but some people may be desperate.
:38:46. > :38:51.Now let's cross to Holyrood to speak to some MSPs with your - o'
:38:51. > :38:58.our political editor, Brian Taylor. Two McDonald's, Mark and Lewis and
:38:58. > :39:03.Willie Rennie. The welfare points being made by witnesses in evidence
:39:03. > :39:07.yesterday and Iain Duncan Smith saying today in slond there is
:39:07. > :39:13.money available for those in genuine need, but it must be
:39:13. > :39:18.targeted and people were being neglected. I think Iain Duncan
:39:18. > :39:22.Smith has a nerve, yesterday we heard testimony at the welfare
:39:22. > :39:32.reform commit tee from a blind gentleman who is saying he is being
:39:32. > :39:35.forced out to beg as a result of the same time yesterday we heard
:39:35. > :39:38.that the Remploy factory in Aberdeen will close and Iain Duncan
:39:38. > :39:42.Smith has the clique to come to Scotland and try and lecture us
:39:42. > :39:49.about welfare. He should be looking at gets his own house in order.
:39:49. > :39:54.Vulnerable people are losing out. Make no mistake, these are in the
:39:54. > :40:00.isolated cases. He said the money is being targeted and those in
:40:00. > :40:06.genuine need are getting the cash. I would invite Iain Duncan Smith to
:40:06. > :40:10.speak to people here. He says that an independent Scotland could not
:40:10. > :40:15.afford the welfare provision that is now available. That is the
:40:15. > :40:20.greatest brass neck of them all, when you look at the amount the
:40:20. > :40:26.amount Scotland puts in. We are capable of funding our fell ware
:40:26. > :40:31.state. Two points there about the Iain Duncan Smith and independence?
:40:31. > :40:36.Iain Duncan Smith is talking about people on incapacity benefit. Those
:40:36. > :40:42.of whrous remember the introduction of the benefit will know who
:40:42. > :40:48.brought them in, and that was the Tory party. It was never thought
:40:48. > :40:53.that it would deal with so many people? It demonstrates the Tory
:40:53. > :40:57.Government we have now is worse than the one we had then. What we
:40:57. > :41:01.see is the... They say the economy is worse as a result of Labour?
:41:01. > :41:11.They would make a political argument. I'm look at it from the
:41:11. > :41:16.point of view of my constituents. What they're facing is a more
:41:16. > :41:22.heartless Government. You would rather have that than an
:41:22. > :41:28.independent Scotland. Mark Macdonald claims the benefits
:41:28. > :41:32.system would be kpwhror glorious about - glorious under independence.
:41:32. > :41:38.One of the consequences of Iain Duncan Smith's changes is that John
:41:38. > :41:43.Swinney has control of many of the things. You prefer a Conservative-
:41:43. > :41:47.led UK Government dealing with welfare. What I prefer is a social
:41:48. > :41:53.democratic Britain. That is what gave us a welfare state and a
:41:53. > :41:57.National Health Service. Things that would be put at risk by the
:41:57. > :42:03.SNP policy. A tough gig for you, leader of the Scottish Liberal
:42:03. > :42:09.Democrats. Your party is in quolgs with the Conservatives and do you
:42:09. > :42:11.defends these changes. Both my colleagues favour reform, but what
:42:11. > :42:16.they don't say is what they will change. They just protest about
:42:16. > :42:20.what is happening. We're dealing with a huge deficit and we need to
:42:20. > :42:25.get it under control and we need to change the system o' we enable
:42:25. > :42:29.people to get out of benefits. There is a trap. I have men hundred
:42:29. > :42:33.of people who spend their whole life in benefits. They want to get
:42:34. > :42:37.out, but they're trapped in the system. That needs to change.
:42:37. > :42:45.is a difference between addressing the system to make sure people are
:42:45. > :42:48.can get into work and removing from people Ben pipt fits - benefits to
:42:49. > :42:54.which they are entitled. The people making assessments are making them
:42:54. > :42:58.in a way that disadvantages the claimant. Don't you have to assess
:42:58. > :43:03.people? Yes. But when I see the evidence of people who clearly are
:43:03. > :43:08.incapable of holding down a job, being told the op sit, by assessor
:43:08. > :43:14.s who have met them once and force them into this impossible position.
:43:14. > :43:21.What about that? This is a system that Lewis's Government set up. It
:43:21. > :43:25.was set up by Labour. And by Mark's Government. These issues are
:43:25. > :43:34.important. If we don't get the welfare system right we will leave
:43:34. > :43:37.people on benefits for another generation. There is a point about
:43:38. > :43:42.opportunity. If we look at the Remploy closure and what happens
:43:42. > :43:46.when factories were closed in 2008 and the number of people still
:43:47. > :43:55.looking for work, can they say there is more opportunities. Will
:43:55. > :44:01.the Scottish Government do We are getting the budget tomorrow
:44:01. > :44:06.from John Swinney, a spending statement for 2013-14. What are you
:44:06. > :44:12.hoping for? The Scottish Government continuing to pursue its priority,
:44:12. > :44:15.moving money to capital investment to stimulate the economy to create
:44:15. > :44:20.jobs in Scotland. We are always going to be in a position where we
:44:20. > :44:23.have to deal with cuts being brought to bear at Westminster. We
:44:23. > :44:29.are seeing real term cuts in the Scottish Government going forward.
:44:29. > :44:33.We have to mitigate against that. hope we see a different set of
:44:33. > :44:39.priorities from the last two Scottish budgets. We saw serious
:44:39. > :44:44.cuts now amounting to half the budget for housing has been removed.
:44:44. > :44:49.But not from capital. John Swinney is talking about assisting the
:44:49. > :44:53.construction industry, possibly not the day-to-day budget in housing.
:44:54. > :44:58.It will have to go a long way. Within the limits, he said he will
:44:58. > :45:04.try. A 50% cut over the last two years. It will take a lot to make
:45:04. > :45:07.up for that. We want a budget to create jobs and growth, and
:45:07. > :45:11.fairness. The Scottish Government takes responsibility for some of
:45:11. > :45:16.these welfare benefits cut from Westminster. There's two things.
:45:16. > :45:20.One, to protect some of the improvements we made last year with
:45:20. > :45:24.funding for colleges, early intervention and housing. We worked
:45:24. > :45:28.with the SNP to develop those improvements. The second thing is
:45:28. > :45:34.the �1.5 billion locked up in Scottish Water. They've got to
:45:34. > :45:44.power to do it. You would invest in broadband, jobs, early intervention
:45:44. > :45:48.insulation. �1.5 billion. If they started discussions with the
:45:48. > :45:53.Treasury we could see if we could get that money locked up in
:45:53. > :46:00.Scottish Water. There's got to be a liberation on pay tomorrow. A pay
:46:00. > :46:04.freeze ends in 2003 for the 20,000 employees under direct control of
:46:04. > :46:08.John Swinney. Would you like to see that pay freeze ended and by how
:46:08. > :46:12.much? If there is to be any change, it won't be substantial. We do need
:46:12. > :46:16.to see movement. We need to see particularly movement on pay for
:46:16. > :46:20.the low paid. They've been protected, those are the 21,000.
:46:20. > :46:25.The definition of low pay on my mind is a bit wider. I certainly
:46:25. > :46:31.don't think the pay increase we need to see on �20,000 is the same
:46:31. > :46:34.for people on �100,000. You have to look at this as a policy in terms
:46:34. > :46:38.of people, the living wage, in terms of protections like the
:46:38. > :46:44.council tax freeze, which impact on the low paifpltd you have to view
:46:44. > :46:49.it as an overall package. I think the Scottish -- the low paid. You
:46:49. > :46:54.have to view it as an overall package. Thank you all three of you.
:46:54. > :46:59.We'll get that statement from you from John Swinney. Will it be
:46:59. > :47:03.covered from the BBC live at 2.30pm. We are expecting possibly after
:47:03. > :47:07.2013 a modest pay increase with the emphasis on modest. Brian Taylor,
:47:07. > :47:13.thank you. Apologies for some of the sound
:47:13. > :47:17.quality during that interview. Let's speak to Alf Young once again.
:47:17. > :47:22.Lots of discussion there about welfare reform. It has hit Holyrood
:47:22. > :47:26.quite hard today, talking about the gentleman who appeared at the
:47:26. > :47:29.committee who said he'd been reduced to beg. And Iain Duncan
:47:29. > :47:34.Smith's comments saying Scotland couldn't afford to go its own way,
:47:34. > :47:37.an independent Scotland to pay for the welfare bill. It's a tricky
:47:37. > :47:42.situation for the Scottish Government when Iain Duncan Smith
:47:42. > :47:46.makes comments like that. There are two big issues that really were
:47:47. > :47:49.getting conflated in the responses from politicians. One is about the
:47:49. > :47:54.reforms that Iain Duncan Smith is implementing in the UK welfare
:47:54. > :47:58.system, where there are people who are being assessed as capable of
:47:59. > :48:04.work and losing benefits as a result of that. And whether that's
:48:04. > :48:08.fair. You can hear a testimony like Mr Sherlock's and feel great
:48:08. > :48:12.sympathy for him, but it doesn't answer the other big question that
:48:12. > :48:16.Iain Duncan Smith was raising, which was really about can an
:48:17. > :48:21.independent Scotland take on the responsibility of all the welfare
:48:21. > :48:25.benefit, all the state pensions and the other benefits that are
:48:25. > :48:33.included in the welfare bill, by far the biggest part of public
:48:33. > :48:37.spend chur, and nans as well as -- public expenditure, and fans that
:48:37. > :48:41.as well. That's going to be a central question in the whole
:48:41. > :48:45.debate about the referendum, but it is not resolvable by pointing to a
:48:45. > :48:49.particular individual and saying this individual is having a hard
:48:49. > :48:54.time because of Iain Duncan Smith's reforms. There are people who are
:48:54. > :48:58.losing out as a result of these reforms, but the bigger question is
:48:58. > :49:02.about numbers, and how big that bill is, how big it is in Scotland
:49:02. > :49:06.compared to the rest of the UK, whether the Scottish Government
:49:07. > :49:13.independently could afford that. We'll have the same ramy I suspect
:49:13. > :49:20.about that in items of numbers as we've been having for years about
:49:20. > :49:26.the report on overall spending and revenues in Scotland, vis-a-vis the
:49:26. > :49:30.rest of the UK. We are hearing from the finance secretary about the pay
:49:30. > :49:34.freeze. Do you think Mr Swinney will have a modest increase for
:49:35. > :49:39.Government employees? I thought the tone of what John Swinney said when
:49:39. > :49:43.he answered that part of your question was it what be very modest
:49:43. > :49:48.indeed, if it is going to be anything at all. He talked about
:49:48. > :49:52.the council tax freeze, free prescription charges and all the
:49:52. > :49:57.other things that we are helping to moderate what's happening, but I
:49:57. > :50:03.don't think he was giving us story that he's got a big present in
:50:03. > :50:08.terms of public sector pay increases from 2013. Alf, thank you.
:50:08. > :50:15.A further bid to legalise assisted suicide in Scotland is under way
:50:15. > :50:20.after MSPs backed the preparation of a new bill. The independent MSB,
:50:20. > :50:24.Margo MacDonald, has launched a second proposal after receiving
:50:24. > :50:28.support. Good afternoon to you. Thank you for joining me. Hi Andrew.
:50:28. > :50:33.Hello there. This was defeated in the last session why. Again? Have
:50:33. > :50:37.you got some improved new proposals to put before Parliament? It's a
:50:37. > :50:42.better bill. That's the first thing. The politics of it I think are more
:50:42. > :50:48.conducive to it passing, because we don't have a general election
:50:48. > :50:51.looming. MSPs always feel a bit more relaxed when it gets close to
:50:51. > :50:56.an election they batten down the hatches. I'm glad we have a chance
:50:56. > :51:00.to take a trial run with it. What we've got after our consultation
:51:00. > :51:04.with this one, having learned the lessons from the first one sing a
:51:04. > :51:09.very much better bill. Why sit better? What changes are you
:51:09. > :51:14.proposing that will make it better? One of the things we've done is
:51:14. > :51:23.tried to make people realise this is a question of right. It's not a
:51:23. > :51:28.health question at all. Parallel to living wills, we suggest that
:51:28. > :51:33.people who've terminal conditions, while they are still hale and
:51:33. > :51:36.healthy, in good spirits and of sound mind, inform their doctor
:51:36. > :51:40.that they are of the mind that if things change as they approach
:51:40. > :51:43.death and it looks as if they are going to have a bad death, they
:51:43. > :51:47.would like assistance to end it before nature would. Now, that
:51:47. > :51:52.should mean that the answer is there for the people who are
:51:52. > :51:57.concerned that vulnerable people will be roped into this. When you
:51:57. > :52:01.are of sound mind and healthy you can inform your doctor, so that he
:52:01. > :52:07.knows nearer the time if you really do want to use it that you have
:52:07. > :52:11.felt that way for years. Right. That's an pool. I think. OK, the
:52:11. > :52:15.Church of Scotland says the bill undermines the inherent value of
:52:15. > :52:20.life. The Scottish Catholic Church echo those comments, and say
:52:20. > :52:23.Parliament has give an lot of time to this issue already. I think you
:52:23. > :52:29.were saying this was because of the case of Tony lick Lynn son-in-law
:52:29. > :52:36.England. It has raised the profile of this. Is it right to keep
:52:36. > :52:39.bringing this before Parliament? think so, because opinion polls
:52:39. > :52:43.outwith the Parliament show that roughly two thirds to three
:52:43. > :52:46.quarters of people consistently support this being made a change in
:52:46. > :52:51.the law. Therefore I think the public would like to see this
:52:51. > :52:56.happen. The MSPs wouldn't. I wouldn't expect the churchs to drop
:52:56. > :53:00.their moral faith-based objections. They are perfectly entitled to
:53:00. > :53:05.organise behind these, but they month imagine that the people of
:53:05. > :53:09.faith have any more rights, any more legal and civil rights than
:53:09. > :53:12.people who don't go to church. Margo MacDonald, thank you very
:53:13. > :53:18.much for taking the time to speak to us this afternoon.
:53:18. > :53:23.Let's go back to the chamber at Holyrood and dip back in to the
:53:23. > :53:30.live debate. Labour have secured debating time to criticise the
:53:30. > :53:34.Scottish Government for cutting �350 from the Edinburgh to Glasgow
:53:34. > :53:40.rail improvement programme. Allowing the public sector to
:53:41. > :53:49.purchase around 270 low-carbon vehicles. The �50 million future
:53:49. > :53:52.transport fund which will support cycling infrastructure, electric
:53:52. > :53:58.vehicle infrastructure, concessionary bus travel has been
:53:58. > :54:03.extended to disabled veterans. Can I say emphatically the rumours of
:54:03. > :54:13.its abolition are nonsense and cause worry unnecessarily among our
:54:13. > :54:17.
:54:17. > :54:23.senior citizens 2011 five bus operators purchased vehicles. And
:54:23. > :54:29.the purchase of a further 26 new vehicles. There's new projects
:54:29. > :54:35.coming as part of rail 2014, an investment fund to build new and
:54:35. > :54:41.existing station. �100 million to secure and develop the sleeper
:54:41. > :54:47.service. �250,000 for WiFi on trains, between Glasgow and
:54:47. > :54:51.Edinburgh. Briefly please. member mentioned many projects, but
:54:51. > :54:55.would the member give his view on the project and the fact that it
:54:55. > :55:01.has been changed so drastically. Briefly please. I don't recognise
:55:01. > :55:05.the changes that the member seems to think has occurred to the
:55:05. > :55:10.project. Clearly it is being delivered in phases that. Seems to
:55:10. > :55:16.be what's happening. In short, Presiding Officer, there is every
:55:16. > :55:23.proof to the Government's commitment to rail travel and
:55:23. > :55:29.public transport in particular. Richardson. Thank you. The
:55:29. > :55:35.cancellation of the electrification beyond the Central Line is very
:55:35. > :55:42.unwelcome, both sterling and Alloa had plans to include this as one of
:55:43. > :55:49.its pillars. Electrification would have led to new facilities between
:55:49. > :55:54.Alloa, Dunblane and Glasgow. The economic aspect of this was really
:55:54. > :56:01.very important. Not wonder that the Minister announced this important
:56:01. > :56:06.matter during the recess. I'm talking about sterling and Alloa
:56:06. > :56:09.which have been seriously affected by this cancellation and which the
:56:09. > :56:12.Minister's own constituents didn't hear about until the are assess. It
:56:12. > :56:17.did not give us any opportunity to question him. At Westminster, that
:56:17. > :56:22.would have been treated by the Speaker as complete disrespect for
:56:22. > :56:28.this Parliament. And that is what it was. We learned that it is on
:56:28. > :56:33.the basis of a highly partial report. Where sterling Council even
:56:33. > :56:38.consulted about the proposed doubts this programme? O'clock man
:56:38. > :56:42.manshire, were they consulted? There's been in consultation about
:56:42. > :56:46.this important report, which has led to what some are calling
:56:46. > :56:51.phasing but I'm calling cuts. What are the consequences of this
:56:51. > :56:55.disinvestment citizen? It is not the Minister's press release, which
:56:55. > :57:01.as usual from the SNP overstated with the headline, "Full steam
:57:01. > :57:06.ahead for the rail project." It is not even quarter steam head. He
:57:06. > :57:11.might have announced Ministers announcement... A lively debate
:57:11. > :57:15.there at Holyrood. Let's speak to a couple of members of the press
:57:15. > :57:19.following developments over in Edinburgh. We've got Campbell Gunn
:57:19. > :57:22.from the Sunday Post and Alan Cochrane from the Daily Telegraph.
:57:22. > :57:25.Thank you gentlemen for moneying me. Campbell Gunn, we've got to draft
:57:25. > :57:30.budget tomorrow. We've been speaking to John Swinney. He's
:57:30. > :57:34.facing a tough financial settlement isn't he? Yes, he's got a reduced
:57:35. > :57:40.budget to deal with in real terms understand cash terms, another we
:57:40. > :57:44.have been told there'll be a 1% pay increase for public sector workers
:57:44. > :57:49.across the board, which is a brave move considering it hasn't been
:57:49. > :57:54.done in England after two years of a freeze in Scotland. Alan Cochrane,
:57:54. > :57:58.looking at the IDS, Iain Duncan Smith, the challenge he's laid down
:57:58. > :58:01.the gaunt to the the Scottish Government saying an independent
:58:02. > :58:05.Scotland couldn't afford its welfare bills. It is another
:58:05. > :58:09.example of people at the sharp end of policy challenging the narblss
:58:09. > :58:14.to come up with the truth. The facts -- nationalists to come up
:58:14. > :58:17.with the truth. All we get from the SNP Government is allegations of
:58:17. > :58:24.scaremongering. They do it all the time. They did it with boroughs o
:58:24. > :58:30.on the EU membership. They do it with Osborne on the Treasury. We've
:58:30. > :58:33.got to start -- they've got to start answering the questions.
:58:34. > :58:39.General Secretary of Labour has resigned. The communications chief
:58:39. > :58:45.has been suspended apparently. What's going on there do you think?
:58:45. > :58:55.This is the result of the inquiry into Labour after the disaster last
:58:55. > :59:09.
:59:09. > :59:13.It is a bit of both. Labour should have moved their headquarters to
:59:13. > :59:18.Edinburgh at the start of devolution. They thought about it,
:59:18. > :59:25.but couldn't get the money. So there has been two power centres in
:59:25. > :59:31.ebb and Glasgow. It has been nuts. And at long last Johann Lamont as
:59:31. > :59:38.leader of the party, is cracking the whip and cementing power here.
:59:38. > :59:44.The SNP have criticised Labour, saying that their MPs and service
:59:44. > :59:50.can't even get on with each other. -- MSPs can't even get on with each
:59:50. > :59:56.other. The SNP claim sovereignty lies with the Scottish people and
:59:56. > :59:58.Johann Lamont has agreed with that. And today a Labour MP said
:59:58. > :00:04.sovereignty lies with the Westminster Government wirbgs I
:00:04. > :00:08.guess technically is true. Alan Cochrane we have the big yes rally
:00:08. > :00:12.in Edinburgh this weekend, a lot of speakers, the First Minister will
:00:12. > :00:17.be speaking a big turn out expected, I suppose you will be covering
:00:17. > :00:21.that? I hope for their stake they make it better than last one. The
:00:22. > :00:25.launch was abysmal and it took off, well it hasn't taken off yet. I
:00:25. > :00:30.hope for their sake we get an argument, because I do like an
:00:30. > :00:34.argument and we're not getting one from the yes campaign.
:00:34. > :00:40.important is this rally? They have to get the campaign going, because
:00:40. > :00:47.after the launch and after both launches, things fell flat and
:00:47. > :00:55.hopefully this will kick start the argument. We all enjoy a good
:00:55. > :01:00.argument. Campbell Gunn and Alan Cochrane thank you. Now a final
:01:00. > :01:04.word from Alf Young. There will be a hearing at the Court of Session
:01:04. > :01:08.tomorrow about the Scottish Government's destoigs mount a legal
:01:08. > :01:11.challenge against whether it should reveal the advice that it has
:01:11. > :01:18.received on the status of an independent Scotland in the EU.
:01:18. > :01:23.This is going to be an interesting one? Yes, the information
:01:23. > :01:29.commissioner has described her need to go to court over this as
:01:29. > :01:34.unfortunate. You know, Alex Salmond said it is about preserving the
:01:34. > :01:39.ministerial code and can't reveal the information. This is a central
:01:39. > :01:43.to the debate about welcome becoming independent, whether we
:01:43. > :01:47.can assume we will still be a member of the EU or have to go
:01:47. > :01:52.through an accession process. I would have thought in the interests
:01:52. > :01:56.of openness and when we look back to something like Hillsborough and
:01:56. > :02:00.what that has taught us about secrecy in the state, then in the
:02:00. > :02:05.interests of openness with the Scottish people, why can't we know
:02:06. > :02:10.what the opinions are? It is critical to the whole process. I
:02:11. > :02:15.think it is just a game that is being played. But it is a game that
:02:15. > :02:20.if they keep on playing it won't go down well with the people who have
:02:20. > :02:24.to decide whether they want to stick with the UK or become an
:02:24. > :02:29.independent state. The freedom of information commissioner has been
:02:29. > :02:34.concerned about the public not getting access to the document?
:02:34. > :02:39.is saying because of changes in Government and there are more ad
:02:39. > :02:44.hoc bodies being set up and bodies that don't necessarily fall within
:02:44. > :02:47.the rules as they apply, that it is getting harder for people to get at
:02:48. > :02:52.information that the freedom of information legislation was
:02:52. > :02:57.supposed to make possible. So she is saying that it is getting harder
:02:57. > :03:02.and she is getting more complaint and having to adjudicate on more
:03:02. > :03:07.complaints. The system was set up to become a more transparent and
:03:07. > :03:12.open system with the public who, at the end of the day Fay taxes and
:03:12. > :03:16.elect the representatives and have a rights to know. I would have
:03:16. > :03:23.thought it is in the interests of all politicians to translates out
:03:23. > :03:29.of being economical with the actualty as one civil servant said,
:03:29. > :03:38.and come up with more of the goods, particularly on big issues like
:03:38. > :03:43.welfare and Europe. Thank you. That is all we have time for. We have