25/02/2017

:00:19. > :00:24.Hello and welcome to our live coverage of the Scottish Labour

:00:25. > :00:29.Party spring conference. The party leader, Kezia Dugdale, will make her

:00:30. > :00:35.speech in 20 minutes, we will bring you that live. And I'll be here in

:00:36. > :00:39.Perth at the concert hall to bring your analysis of that speech, all

:00:40. > :00:44.the news and views and who knows, perhaps a bit of malicious gossip as

:00:45. > :00:49.well. Delegates have given their backing calling for a motion for a

:00:50. > :00:56.new federal UK. The vote gives the green light to the people

:00:57. > :01:00.constitutional convention. People gathered in a fairly doleful mood.

:01:01. > :01:05.Kezia Dugdale will attempt to rally the troops, but the loss in Copeland

:01:06. > :01:09.crystallises their electoral woes. They are touting a new policy of

:01:10. > :01:14.federalism in a bid to carve out a place for themselves in a crowded

:01:15. > :01:18.political marketplace that is focused on the constitution. Her

:01:19. > :01:21.political editor Brian Taylor as you saw his life in Perth. What is your

:01:22. > :01:29.take on the atmosphere in the conference? It is intriguing. It is

:01:30. > :01:33.half optimistic. Glass half full, perhaps. But it is only half. They

:01:34. > :01:38.are in third place in politics in Scotland at Holyrood, and in terms

:01:39. > :01:42.of the impact in England, those by-elections were not wonderful.

:01:43. > :01:46.They held on in Stoke but got beaten substantially in Copeland by the

:01:47. > :01:51.Conservatives, the first time in 35 years that a governing party is

:01:52. > :01:53.taking the seat from the opposition. Kezia Dugdale stresses the

:01:54. > :01:58.autonomous nature of politics in Scotland, the autonomous nature of

:01:59. > :02:02.policy-making and structure, but of course they are part of the wider

:02:03. > :02:09.labour movement. The problems south of the border wash over Hadrian's

:02:10. > :02:13.Wall and affect her as well. Thank Brian, more from you later. With me

:02:14. > :02:15.in the studio for the duration is Professor John Curtice at

:02:16. > :02:20.Strathclyde University. We will get his analysis and thoughts for the

:02:21. > :02:25.next couple of hours here on the programme. Thanks for joining us.

:02:26. > :02:31.The Copeland loss could not have come at a worse time for the Labour

:02:32. > :02:33.Party, could it? Indeed. I think when the whips decided to hold the

:02:34. > :02:37.by-elections last Thursday the perhaps did not look at the calendar

:02:38. > :02:39.and realise it would be right in front of the Scottish Labour

:02:40. > :02:45.conference. Given what happened it was clearly not good news. But as

:02:46. > :02:49.far as the Scottish Labour Party is concerned it is not need bad news in

:02:50. > :02:52.England for it to appreciate that is in a dire position. If you look at

:02:53. > :02:56.the last couple of opinion polls, between them they have put the party

:02:57. > :03:02.at a record opinion poll Lowell, both for the Scottish parliament and

:03:03. > :03:08.for Westminster, at around 14-15 %. Well below even the 22% or so that

:03:09. > :03:11.the God in the Scottish election. Another poll of local Government

:03:12. > :03:16.voting intentions, the local council elections at the beginning of May,

:03:17. > :03:20.just 14%, less than half of what the party got in the last local

:03:21. > :03:25.elections back in 2012. The truth is the Scottish Labour Party all of its

:03:26. > :03:29.own has serious problems. It only has one MP at Westminster, or that

:03:30. > :03:35.representation wiped out 18 months ago. Third place in Holyrood, now

:03:36. > :03:38.potentially facing the loss of its remaining local Government bastions

:03:39. > :03:44.in Scotland, including not least Glasgow. This is a party with plenty

:03:45. > :03:49.of its own problems, it does not look to Jeremy Corbyn our country to

:03:50. > :03:53.find more. And turmoil to the party in press and social media by

:03:54. > :03:57.comments from the London Mayor Sadiq Khan, we will here from him later.

:03:58. > :04:02.Sadiq Khan somewhat bleakly has suggested that he wants a world in

:04:03. > :04:08.which there is not an attempt to divide people by nationalism. And of

:04:09. > :04:12.course therefore in a sense implies that maybe the Nationalists of the

:04:13. > :04:19.SNP share some characteristics with the nationalism of Ukip or the

:04:20. > :04:22.National front. The truth is when anybody suggests there is some kind

:04:23. > :04:27.of analogy between the nationalism of the SNP and that of Ukip, the SNP

:04:28. > :04:31.get very upset. The truth is of course the SNP is a party that wants

:04:32. > :04:36.to see more immigration into Scotland, is very different view

:04:37. > :04:38.from Ukip, it wants Scotland to stay inside the Open union, completely

:04:39. > :04:44.opposite to Ukip, but certainly Sadiq Khan has suggested that you do

:04:45. > :04:48.what a separate Scotland from England and to that extent you are

:04:49. > :04:52.somewhat similar, but don't be surprised, the SNP will push back on

:04:53. > :04:57.that suggestion very hard indeed. Yesterday delegates unanimously

:04:58. > :05:01.backed the new plans for a federal Britain, a federal United Kingdom.

:05:02. > :05:05.What are Labour trying to do here, and what kind of federalism are

:05:06. > :05:11.looking at? The Lib Dems have welcomed this. Is this a Lib Dem

:05:12. > :05:15.type federalism? The first half of that question is easier than the

:05:16. > :05:19.second half. What is trying to do is to say, we are against independence,

:05:20. > :05:23.but then trying to lay out its own distinctive vision of Scotland

:05:24. > :05:31.inside the union, a vision that will distinguish it from the Conservative

:05:32. > :05:34.Party. I think what Kezia Dugdale means by federalism as far as

:05:35. > :05:39.Scotland is concerned is that if we have a federal structure the place

:05:40. > :05:43.of the Scottish Parliament is guaranteed, in a federal system the

:05:44. > :05:47.centre can never get rid of the constituent parts. That is part one,

:05:48. > :05:50.and part two is trying to lay out the impression that indeed this

:05:51. > :05:54.would be an even work powerful Scottish Parliament that even the

:05:55. > :05:57.parliament we are going to get eventually in wake of the final

:05:58. > :06:01.implementation of the Scotland Act that came out of the Smith

:06:02. > :06:06.Commission. That is what she's trying to do she must be aware that

:06:07. > :06:10.of the Unionist parties hers is the party that has the largest

:06:11. > :06:13.proportion of people who say, actually, we still might vote for

:06:14. > :06:19.independence, so she has to keep our Coalition together. What she means

:06:20. > :06:22.by federalism, we know in principle what it means, it means you have a

:06:23. > :06:26.system where Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland and the regions of

:06:27. > :06:29.England all have very similar parliaments and assemblies and all

:06:30. > :06:34.have similar powers. The obvious difficulty is that while of course

:06:35. > :06:37.Wales is getting more devolution, Northern Ireland is having trouble,

:06:38. > :06:46.but it may get its devolution back again soon, but England still

:06:47. > :06:49.doesn't evince much interest. I pointed the difficulties the current

:06:50. > :06:54.Government are having and try to introduce city regions. There are

:06:55. > :07:01.going to be six new city regional Mayor 's enacted, but in other

:07:02. > :07:05.places, in Sheffield and Southampton in Hampshire, in Newcastle, these

:07:06. > :07:08.attempts to come up with city regions have fallen into the sand

:07:09. > :07:11.because of local disagreements. Getting England on board is

:07:12. > :07:15.difficult, and without England there is no prospect of a federal

:07:16. > :07:20.structure at all. John, thanks, more from you later. As the white Brian

:07:21. > :07:25.in Perth, he has been joined by a couple of politicians. A couple of

:07:26. > :07:30.politicians indeed, to very senior members of live's front bench team,

:07:31. > :07:34.welcomed both. Let's talk about Kezia Dugdale's speech coming up

:07:35. > :07:39.today. Federalism. We had John Curtice. What do you think it means?

:07:40. > :07:46.It is not a quality across Scotland and the English regions, what is the

:07:47. > :07:49.shape, what could it be? Within the UK and gives us still the

:07:50. > :07:55.opportunity to share resources, but what it does is bring our closer to

:07:56. > :07:58.the people it affects. We know in Scotland that you can make different

:07:59. > :08:03.choices to the rest of the UK, and that has worked really well for us.

:08:04. > :08:07.That will benefit the rest of the UK and will get rid of some of those

:08:08. > :08:12.arguments about who does what when, and people feel disenfranchised from

:08:13. > :08:15.politics, I think having a parliament in Scotland has changed

:08:16. > :08:19.that to a degree. We need to do an awful lot more, but I see that

:08:20. > :08:22.working. People having the same tender powers that we enjoy but also

:08:23. > :08:28.having the ability to share resources across the UK. Speaker

:08:29. > :08:31.after Speaker in the federalism debate said, not really our agenda

:08:32. > :08:34.we don't want to do this, but Speaker after Speaker then said, we

:08:35. > :08:40.have to, because the argument are still there. That sort of position

:08:41. > :08:43.may be arisen at moment? There is a recognition of politics has changed

:08:44. > :08:49.over recent years, and this is a response to that, and we have to be

:08:50. > :08:52.relevant to people in local communities. And the way we see to

:08:53. > :08:55.do that with the federalism debate as to bring forward a solution that

:08:56. > :09:00.brings the additional powers that will be created as a result of

:09:01. > :09:04.Brexit coming to Scotland, bringing those powers closer to local

:09:05. > :09:10.communities, giving local people a say and giving them a relevance. I

:09:11. > :09:12.get that from the Scottish Parliament, repatriating the powers

:09:13. > :09:16.comes from Europe, but I don't get what the ship is for England. Is it

:09:17. > :09:22.regional parliaments, and in which Parliament? What is at? That is why

:09:23. > :09:26.we are calling for a constitutional settlement so there is a discussion

:09:27. > :09:30.about these things. We don't want to impose a solution on local

:09:31. > :09:34.communities. Let's speak across the UK and see what people are looking

:09:35. > :09:38.for in terms of an ideal solution within each region. But ultimately

:09:39. > :09:45.it is about transferring power and giving local people a greater say.

:09:46. > :09:53.Rhonda Grant, we will hear sections of the speeches from earlier to the

:09:54. > :09:57.audience, but one, was that the party needs to change, that was a

:09:58. > :10:01.big message. I think you have to listen to what people are saying,

:10:02. > :10:05.and it goes back to the federalism debate because different parts of

:10:06. > :10:09.the country who want Brexit for very differently. We voted to stay in the

:10:10. > :10:12.EU as that London, as did other parts of the country, and if that

:10:13. > :10:17.does not tell you that there are different needs and wishes

:10:18. > :10:21.throughout the country that have to be in some way, B is there is a

:10:22. > :10:24.country we make a decision and have to go without, but we also have to

:10:25. > :10:28.meet the different aspirations from different parts of the country, and

:10:29. > :10:32.those are very geographical, so we have to make sure that we do that. I

:10:33. > :10:36.think what he is saying is that we need to find a way... Politics is a

:10:37. > :10:41.servant of the people. We have to find a way of delivering politics

:10:42. > :10:44.that resonates with people and that they feel they are being hurt, which

:10:45. > :10:48.at the moment does not seem to be happening. The message from James

:10:49. > :10:52.Kelly, he was saying, leave the laser alone, but he was also saying

:10:53. > :10:59.the party is way behind the Tories in the polls, and you're in Holyrood

:11:00. > :11:04.behind the Tories and the SNP. We were pleased to defeat Ukip in

:11:05. > :11:10.Stoke. We did not take enough. When in Copeland and to win elections and

:11:11. > :11:13.when are you had to win votes and you need to have credibility with

:11:14. > :11:17.the people. The way you think they need to do that which Tom Watson was

:11:18. > :11:20.talking about is the message that resonates with people. At this

:11:21. > :11:25.conference we are talking about a federal solution, but you also heal

:11:26. > :11:30.Neil Barry this morning talking about the failings of the Transport

:11:31. > :11:35.system. Bringing railways back into public ownership. Yes, Jackie

:11:36. > :11:39.Baillie talking about the importance of a stronger economy in Scotland.

:11:40. > :11:43.We saw last week the devastating impact of the budget, ?170 million

:11:44. > :11:49.of cuts to local councils. It is getting those messages across and

:11:50. > :11:51.being more relevant. People are voting on these policies, I accept

:11:52. > :11:56.that, but they are also voting on the character of the leader. Is it

:11:57. > :12:00.working for Jeremy Corbyn? I think is Tom Watson said, it is not time

:12:01. > :12:04.for another leadership election, it is not time for Labour to turn in on

:12:05. > :12:07.itself, it is time for Labour to turn out and get its message across,

:12:08. > :12:12.and it is incumbent on anyone whether it is Jeremy Corbyn, Kezia

:12:13. > :12:16.Dugdale or MSPs at this conference to speak out and speak to people,

:12:17. > :12:20.and be seen to be standing up for local communities. That is the way

:12:21. > :12:27.back to power. Thanks both for joining me and I will hand you back

:12:28. > :12:30.to Andrew. Brian, thank you. Live's deputy leader Tom Watson told

:12:31. > :12:34.delegates he was hugely disappointed after the Copeland by-election loss.

:12:35. > :12:37.He said it was not time for a leadership election, but warned that

:12:38. > :12:41.Labour in England cannot afford a wipe-out like the one in Scotland.

:12:42. > :12:48.Mr Watson said things have to change to reconnect with voters, and he

:12:49. > :12:54.made the argument for a federal UK. I want to be clear about this week's

:12:55. > :12:56.by-elections. I will not sit in court the results, you deserve

:12:57. > :13:02.better than that. I'm glad we won in Stoke. Gareth will be a great MP,

:13:03. > :13:12.and sending Paul Nuttall back home with his tail between his legs is

:13:13. > :13:18.exactly what he deserved. You know, I never thought I'd feel sorry for

:13:19. > :13:23.poor muscle, -- I never thought I would feel sorry for Paul Nuttall,

:13:24. > :13:26.and I was right. But I was hugely disappointed that Gillian would be

:13:27. > :13:31.joining him in Parliament as the MP for Copeland. That means that all of

:13:32. > :13:34.us with leadership roles in the Labour Party need to have a long,

:13:35. > :13:40.hard look at ourselves and what is not working. Here in Scotland you

:13:41. > :13:44.have seen what happens when Labour's long-term supporters stop voting

:13:45. > :13:48.Labour. We cannot afford to have that happen in England as well. I

:13:49. > :13:55.said it a lot recently, this is not the time for a leadership election.

:13:56. > :13:59.That issue was settled last year. But we have to do better. We cannot

:14:00. > :14:03.sustain this level of distance from our electorate, from our natural

:14:04. > :14:12.supporters. Things do have to change. Yesterday Scottish Labour

:14:13. > :14:17.delegates gave their backing to a motion calling for a new federal UK.

:14:18. > :14:22.The vote gives a green light to peopleconstitutional convention. The

:14:23. > :14:24.issues were raised against the proposals, Jeremy Corbyn would of

:14:25. > :14:30.course have to be Prime Minister for it to happen. I think in politics

:14:31. > :14:33.you need to understand how you get your victories but also how you get

:14:34. > :14:37.your defeats. For me I think it means we need to be talking to a

:14:38. > :14:40.wider group of voters. We need to convince people who are currently

:14:41. > :14:44.voting Conservative to come back to Labour. That means we need to talk

:14:45. > :14:47.about wealth creation, about prosperity about support for small

:14:48. > :14:52.businesses, the people that are going to make sure services are

:14:53. > :14:56.funded. Just not entirely about socialist distribution but about

:14:57. > :14:59.wealth creation as well? Yes, I think we have to broaden our reach,

:15:00. > :15:02.and so do most of the Shadow Cabinet. I think the lesson of

:15:03. > :15:06.Copeland for us is to reflect on what people were telling us on the

:15:07. > :15:11.doorstep, try to understand how that reflects nationally, and try to win

:15:12. > :15:14.back some of that support we have lost in the last couple of years.

:15:15. > :15:18.But isn't leadership a substantial part of that problem that he faced

:15:19. > :15:21.in Copeland and elsewhere? Can it be the case that Jeremy Corbyn must

:15:22. > :15:27.share responsibility at the very least for that defeat?

:15:28. > :15:35.I am not running away from that. I and the deputy leader and I take my

:15:36. > :15:40.responsibility seriously. Jeremy Corbyn knows the position of the

:15:41. > :15:47.polls. Once we have had time to sleep on this by-election we will

:15:48. > :15:52.try to remedy the situation by changing tack? Changing tactics,

:15:53. > :15:55.policy, but not by changing leader? Our members are solvent in the

:15:56. > :16:01.Labour Party, we have had to damaging leadership elections. Our

:16:02. > :16:06.number one duty is to deal with the specs at issue. It is our job to

:16:07. > :16:13.make sure to make sure Theresa May represents the interests of Scottish

:16:14. > :16:17.workers, voters, businesses. That should be our number one task. Do

:16:18. > :16:22.you agree with David Miliband that Labour is as far away from power as

:16:23. > :16:28.it has been for 50 years? I do not. That is because I grew up in the

:16:29. > :16:32.Labour Party in the 1980s. We had revolution socialists that will try

:16:33. > :16:37.to take control of the Labour Party. But I understand the point he is

:16:38. > :16:42.making, we are in a difficult time and we need to change tack to build

:16:43. > :16:45.a winning Coalition for the next general election. Would you welcome

:16:46. > :16:51.David Miliband back into the House of Commons? The traditions that are

:16:52. > :16:56.reflected in the Labour Party, we are always at our best when all

:16:57. > :17:00.those traditions can be heard, his contribution is always respected and

:17:01. > :17:04.welcome, he is a former successful Foreign Secretary. You made

:17:05. > :17:07.reference to the people's Constitutional Convention, how do

:17:08. > :17:12.you see that working in practice? What form of federalism could be. #

:17:13. > :17:17.I do not want to predict what that model could be, the key point I was

:17:18. > :17:22.trying to make to this conference, I do not think we will begin to make

:17:23. > :17:26.progress electorally in Scotland unless we convince people that we

:17:27. > :17:29.understand that too much power resides in Westminster. That is as

:17:30. > :17:33.big a challenge from Labour in the English regions as it is for people

:17:34. > :17:37.in Scotland and I hope that the Constitutional Convention will look

:17:38. > :17:44.at how we can take that power away from unelected bureaucrats in

:17:45. > :17:46.Brussels and not giving it to unelected bureaucrats and vital but

:17:47. > :17:51.making sure that the English regions and Scotland gets its fair share.

:17:52. > :17:56.Labour's deputy leader speaking to Brian Taylor. Kezia Dugdale will be

:17:57. > :17:59.addressing the conference delegates shortly. Professor John Curtice is

:18:00. > :18:03.still with me, let us pick up on what Tom Watson was saying, comments

:18:04. > :18:07.from David Miliband saying Labour is as far away from power as they have

:18:08. > :18:12.been in the past 50 years. Jeremy Corbyn appears to be a problem for

:18:13. > :18:16.them. Jeremy Corbyn is not doing any good for the party. You can find

:18:17. > :18:23.evidence to substantiate Steve Ed Miliband's statement. The party

:18:24. > :18:30.across the UK is running at 26%, 27% in the opinion polls, the last time

:18:31. > :18:35.Labour in opposition was that will was in 1982 during the Falklands

:18:36. > :18:42.War, and in 1983 during the general election, when the party got 28% of

:18:43. > :18:46.the vote. The truth is you can see the analogy between Labour's current

:18:47. > :18:53.position and its position back in the 1980s. Difficulty here is that

:18:54. > :18:57.Labour's problem is not simply Jeremy Corbyn. The first thing to

:18:58. > :19:01.ask yourself is, why was Jeremy Corbyn able to win the leadership of

:19:02. > :19:06.the Labour Party in the first place? Not least because none of his

:19:07. > :19:11.rivals, Andy Burnham, Liz Kendall, Yvette Cooper, were able to convince

:19:12. > :19:15.Labour members that they actually knew how to lead the party in such a

:19:16. > :19:21.way that it would be electorally successful. Indeed, it is not

:19:22. > :19:24.obvious that there is anybody as yet within the Parliamentary Labour

:19:25. > :19:28.Party who has demonstrated clearly that they have the ability to speak

:19:29. > :19:32.out to the electorate and come up with a vision as to what the Labour

:19:33. > :19:36.Party would be about, and thereby leading to put the Government under

:19:37. > :19:40.pressure. Labour's problem may be, even if it were to get rid of Jeremy

:19:41. > :19:45.Corbyn, and at the moment is not the membership want to do so, with whom

:19:46. > :19:50.we do replace? Is there anybody who could do the job better? The truth

:19:51. > :19:55.is, we do not know the answer to that question. Beyond the other

:19:56. > :20:01.clear problem Labour faces, is that basically it has to be able to see,

:20:02. > :20:06.how now would we as a centre left, social Democratic Party, run the

:20:07. > :20:10.economy in such a way that the so-called left behind, people in our

:20:11. > :20:13.society who do not do so well, who are normally regarded as Labour's

:20:14. > :20:19.core territory, that those people would feel that the tiger of global

:20:20. > :20:23.capitalism is being teamed in such a way that they are getting some of

:20:24. > :20:28.the proceeds of growth, as David Cameron used to call it. Labour have

:20:29. > :20:34.not come up, since 2010, with a revised vision of what it is about,

:20:35. > :20:37.that makes people begin to think that a Labour Government would do

:20:38. > :20:42.something about the inequality in our society, which is certainly not

:20:43. > :20:47.got any smaller in the last decade. UK problems they are trying to

:20:48. > :20:51.address, specifically, what other problems that Kezia Dugdale might

:20:52. > :20:56.try to address in her speech very shortly? She is in a crowded

:20:57. > :20:59.political marketplace, there is a dividing line around the

:21:00. > :21:04.constitution. It was the Labour Party above all that suffered from

:21:05. > :21:09.the Independence Referendum, one third of those who voted Labour in

:21:10. > :21:14.201040 GS, many of them have since gone on to vote for the SNP, that

:21:15. > :21:20.was the immediate source of Labour's difficulties. In the last couple of

:21:21. > :21:25.years the Scottish Labour Party has often given the impression of

:21:26. > :21:30.saying, can we talk about schools or hospitals, criminal justice? In

:21:31. > :21:33.other words, can we talk about anything else other than the

:21:34. > :21:39.constitutional question, because it is an issue that they do not feel

:21:40. > :21:43.any natural empathy for. The Liberal Democrats love talking about that,

:21:44. > :21:52.the SNP love to talk about that, the Conservatives are more than happy to

:21:53. > :21:57.defend the union, the Labour Party, they are not comfortable with this

:21:58. > :22:02.debate. Let us go to the Perth concert Hall mode where Kezia

:22:03. > :22:05.Dugdale is being treated by the London mayor Sadiq Khan. We will

:22:06. > :22:11.hear from him later in the programme. No case you're that deal

:22:12. > :22:12.takes the applause from the delegates, and here is her Spring

:22:13. > :22:29.Conference speech. Conference flames, thank you for

:22:30. > :22:42.that inflatable welcome. It is great to be back in Perth. -- conference

:22:43. > :22:46.friends. And thank you for that introduction from Sadiq Khan. He

:22:47. > :22:50.reminds us why we should be restless every single day that we are not in

:22:51. > :22:54.power. He shows us what we can achieve when the power of our Labour

:22:55. > :23:06.values are matched with the power of Government.

:23:07. > :23:12.He inspires us to work harder and to aim higher, not just because of the

:23:13. > :23:16.work he does, but because of what he represents. Conference, to those who

:23:17. > :23:21.see that politics in the United Kingdom cannot change, to those who

:23:22. > :23:24.see that in the days of Trump, hope and unity cannot win, I see, look to

:23:25. > :23:40.London. Not a dark Star, as Alex Salmond

:23:41. > :23:44.once called it, but a city, whose people elected the boy who grew up

:23:45. > :23:55.on a council estate and ended up in Parliament. In city which replaced

:23:56. > :24:01.Boris Johnson with the son of a bus driver, and a city which rejected a

:24:02. > :24:05.Tory smear campaign of racism, intolerance, bigotry and slammer

:24:06. > :24:16.phobia and elected YouTube's first Muslim mayor.

:24:17. > :24:26.-- bigotry and Islamophobia and elected the first Muslim mayor in

:24:27. > :24:35.Europe. He is the pride of London, he is the pride of Labour, thank

:24:36. > :24:40.you, Sadiq Khan. Just weeks from now people across Scotland will go to

:24:41. > :24:44.the polls for the sixth time in five years. Every time there has been an

:24:45. > :24:49.election referendum we have asked you to go into your communities and

:24:50. > :24:55.make Labour's case. It has not always been easy. But you have done

:24:56. > :24:59.it. And you have done it because you know that every door knocked, every

:25:00. > :25:03.telephone call made, every conversation had, makes a

:25:04. > :25:10.difference. This year I am asking you to do the same again. Because we

:25:11. > :25:16.have so much to fight for at these elections in May. In the places

:25:17. > :25:20.where we are in power we have built schools, community centres and

:25:21. > :25:23.libraries. We have invested in the education of our children, get their

:25:24. > :25:28.old people safe and warm, and got our young people into work. While

:25:29. > :25:35.the SNP Government has handed on Tory cuts over the last five years,

:25:36. > :25:41.?1.5 billion of cuts, Labour has shown that they are the last barrier

:25:42. > :25:51.between the people and austerity. -- that we are the last barrier. In

:25:52. > :25:55.Glasgow the Commonwealth Games delivered by Labour brought

:25:56. > :26:03.thousands of jobs to the city and helped to regenerate the East End.

:26:04. > :26:06.In Aberdeen, where budgets had been stretched, Labour councillors have

:26:07. > :26:18.looked for new sources of funding, and issued bonds to raise an extra

:26:19. > :26:22.?370 million. In Renfrewshire, Labour lead of the SNP Government

:26:23. > :26:32.followed by finding a way to abolish the bedroom tax. And in Starling, it

:26:33. > :26:37.was a Labour council but was the first to introduce 600 hours per

:26:38. > :26:48.year free childcare and early learning for two, three, and

:26:49. > :26:51.four-year-olds. When the SNP find times are tough they blame the UK

:26:52. > :26:53.Government. When Labour sees tough times we roll up our sleeves and get

:26:54. > :27:09.on with protecting people. In 2012 the SNP said Glasgow was a

:27:10. > :27:24.stepping stone to independence. How wrong they were. And when the say

:27:25. > :27:32.no, it is time for change, I say, communities have changed under

:27:33. > :27:36.Labour, they have been transformed. It is the SNP which has been in

:27:37. > :27:41.power for a decade in Scotland, it is the SNP which has failed to

:27:42. > :27:45.alleviate Tory austerity, which has failed the least well off in

:27:46. > :27:48.society, which has had our health and education systems in crisis.

:27:49. > :27:55.Conference, that is the change we need, that is the change we are

:27:56. > :27:59.fighting for. In May, let us get out and fight for Labour to elect our

:28:00. > :28:03.communities, not SNP councillors who only have one thing on their mind.

:28:04. > :28:09.Conference, our council campaign will be rooted in our communities.

:28:10. > :28:12.That is why I am proud that our local Government campaign manager

:28:13. > :28:18.and our Deputy Alex Rowley has been out there leading from the front. He

:28:19. > :28:24.has been racking up the miles across the country. Glasgow, Kilmarnock,

:28:25. > :28:32.Rosyth, Dundee, Edinburgh, Kinross, Aberdeen, Perth, Paisley, Balko --

:28:33. > :28:38.Falkirk, Inverness. His diary looks like a road map of Scotland. Between

:28:39. > :28:41.now and the 4th of May he will be at the forefront of our local

:28:42. > :28:53.Government campaign, thank you for all the work that you are doing.

:28:54. > :28:57.Conference, a little under 18 months ago you elected me as your leader

:28:58. > :29:00.with a mandate to change the way that we run this party and how we

:29:01. > :29:06.serve working people across Scotland. Before I took on this job,

:29:07. > :29:10.and after, I was honest with you about the challenge that we faced.

:29:11. > :29:15.The referendum changed Scottish politics for good. And I said that

:29:16. > :29:20.if we were to succeed again in the future of Scottish Labour had to

:29:21. > :29:24.change also. The last time I stood on this stage, and my first

:29:25. > :29:27.conference speech as leader, I said that decisions about what happens to

:29:28. > :29:33.the Scottish Labour Party would be made here in Scotland. And one and a

:29:34. > :29:45.half years after I said that would happen we have made that happen.

:29:46. > :29:49.Once and for all no one can question who makes our policy, who selects

:29:50. > :30:01.candidates, and who is in charge of this party. And for the first time

:30:02. > :30:05.we have secured permanent representation on Labour's in EC. I

:30:06. > :30:12.also promised you that under my leadership this would be an open and

:30:13. > :30:16.Democratic Party, one that puts our members and our most historic

:30:17. > :30:18.parties, the trade unions, at the centre of our movement, and that is

:30:19. > :30:37.exactly what we have done. Last year we had a manifesto I was

:30:38. > :30:41.proud of, based on something I believe in, and it told the truth,

:30:42. > :30:46.that if you want high quality public services, we have to talk about who

:30:47. > :30:57.pays for them. It was a tough message, but it was the right,

:30:58. > :31:01.honest and decent thing to do. And against attacks from both the SNP

:31:02. > :31:07.and the Tories, we have state true to our values. I take no joy in the

:31:08. > :31:10.fact that our prediction that millions would be cut from the

:31:11. > :31:14.budget for front line services has been proven right. So we will

:31:15. > :31:17.continue to make the argument that the richest should pay their fair

:31:18. > :31:25.share for the services that we all rely on. And friends, just

:31:26. > :31:30.yesterday, we passed another milestone in the history of our

:31:31. > :31:33.party. Labour, the party of devolution, the party that gave life

:31:34. > :31:37.to a Scottish parliament that many said was an impossible dream,

:31:38. > :31:43.started writing the next chapter of that story. With your backing we

:31:44. > :31:46.have set out a plan to deliver a stronger Scottish parliament and a

:31:47. > :31:50.vision for a reformed United Kingdom. We are a party that

:31:51. > :31:55.believes in being part of something bigger, that understands that

:31:56. > :32:02.decisions should be taken as close to the people as possible. That is

:32:03. > :32:07.why we have backed federalism. Friends, it is not Ruth Davidson and

:32:08. > :32:10.the Tories' status quo or the SNP's damaging plans for independence, it

:32:11. > :32:21.is a labour vision for Scotland's future.

:32:22. > :32:27.Conference, this is how I have delivered on the mandate you gave

:32:28. > :32:30.me. And only by working together over the months and years ahead can

:32:31. > :32:35.we complete that task of rebuilding our party. Together we have put in

:32:36. > :32:42.place a solid foundation for the future. Our party, no more open and

:32:43. > :32:46.democratic. Our voice, strongest as part of the UK movement. Our

:32:47. > :32:51.decisions, made here in Scotland with a plan for a Scottish

:32:52. > :32:57.parliament -- stronger Scottish parliament and reformed UK, the

:32:58. > :33:08.defence public services, and Labour's lasting legacy, our NHS.

:33:09. > :33:16.Conference, our world is changing. At a time when politics can seem

:33:17. > :33:20.more and more narrowly focused on taking us out of that you are

:33:21. > :33:25.breaking up the UK, the world around us is transforming at a pace that

:33:26. > :33:30.has never been seen before. The world is more open than it has ever

:33:31. > :33:34.been. And technology gives us boundless opportunities but also

:33:35. > :33:40.demands we think again about the way that we work on the way that we

:33:41. > :33:44.live. This time ten years ago, Facebook had only been open to

:33:45. > :33:49.everyone for five months. No one had heard of an iPhone. Today, more

:33:50. > :33:54.people use Facebook and there were alive 100 years ago. And every

:33:55. > :34:00.minute 300 hours of video are uploaded to you cheap. But it is not

:34:01. > :34:04.just technology that has changed the way that we live. In the past, war,

:34:05. > :34:09.famine and disease killed millions upon millions of people every single

:34:10. > :34:16.year. But today more people die as a result of violent crime than they do

:34:17. > :34:20.as a result of war. More and better knowledge means that killer diseases

:34:21. > :34:23.are declining. Humanity has succeeded in taming if not

:34:24. > :34:28.eradicating disasters that held us back throughout much of our history.

:34:29. > :34:33.I don't think our problems are solved. Far from it. But when you

:34:34. > :34:38.take a moment to stand back and look at what we have got to, you realise

:34:39. > :34:41.that if you give someone the choice of being born at any point in human

:34:42. > :34:48.history so far, they would choose today. We live longer, are more

:34:49. > :34:53.peaceful and more prosperous than ever before. But none of this has

:34:54. > :34:57.happened by chance. It happened out of choice and because of decisions

:34:58. > :35:04.that have been made over the past 50 years. Technology has improved

:35:05. > :35:06.because of the ingenuity and the skill of scientists and engineers,

:35:07. > :35:11.often funded by governments who back them with aliens of pounds. We have

:35:12. > :35:16.made this progress because people and politicians make choices that

:35:17. > :35:22.got us this far. Choices Labour made in power. Introducing a minimum

:35:23. > :35:26.wage, raising family incomes, creating civil partnerships,

:35:27. > :35:38.investing in our NHS, and letting millions out of poverty.

:35:39. > :35:45.And if we make the right choices, there is nothing to say we can't

:35:46. > :35:49.make the same progress again. But in too many places in Scotland, and

:35:50. > :35:56.indeed around the world, that is just not how it feels. Instead

:35:57. > :36:02.people look to the future and feel more vulnerable. Fragile. Uneasy

:36:03. > :36:07.about what is coming around the corner. Despite the opportunities on

:36:08. > :36:11.offer, our young people feel they have less chance to succeed and the

:36:12. > :36:15.parents did. People feel abandoned because the world around them is

:36:16. > :36:21.changing too fast and too many people are being left behind. Ten

:36:22. > :36:27.years ago we failed to anticipate a financial crash that began to change

:36:28. > :36:30.politics in this country. Too many people at the time could not see

:36:31. > :36:36.that business as usual just was not going to work anymore. After the

:36:37. > :36:39.financial crash, Gordon Brown and Alistair Darling focused on keeping

:36:40. > :36:44.people's life savings secure, as many people as possible in work and

:36:45. > :36:49.off the dole, that was the right thing to do. In 2010, however,

:36:50. > :36:54.politicians were taught a hard lesson. They stepped in to rescue

:36:55. > :37:00.the banks, but no one came in to rescue our politics. The way we did

:37:01. > :37:03.politics had to change. We had to work harder and taking people with

:37:04. > :37:07.us, hearing what they have to say, and making sure they knew that we

:37:08. > :37:12.were listening. This should have been our focus. Instead we were

:37:13. > :37:18.diverted by arguments about independence and Brexit, two sides

:37:19. > :37:22.of the same coin. And the truth is, they are ideas that risked turning

:37:23. > :37:29.the clock back on the progress that we have made. Progress built on

:37:30. > :37:32.labour and trade union values, solidarity, cooperation, mutual

:37:33. > :37:36.understanding and respect. They are the values that are under attack

:37:37. > :37:52.from independents and from Brexit, and I won't stand for it.

:37:53. > :37:58.Conference, the 2014 referendum shook me to the core. I know that

:37:59. > :38:04.for a lot of people it was exhilarating. But for many others it

:38:05. > :38:12.was both physically and emotionally exhausting. It divided our country.

:38:13. > :38:16.It said family members and friends against each other. It created

:38:17. > :38:22.arguments and rose that most people are pleased to know behind them. Our

:38:23. > :38:26.country now feels more divided and more fractured than ever before.

:38:27. > :38:30.Instead of focusing on what we can do to build our future, we are too

:38:31. > :38:38.busy labelling each other because of decisions we took in the past. Yes,

:38:39. > :38:43.no, leave, remain. Focusing on what makes us different rather than what

:38:44. > :38:46.we can do to bring us together. Conference, I am still so proud that

:38:47. > :38:50.I fought for our values in that referendum, and that so many of you

:38:51. > :38:55.here today made that argument alongside me. We put the national

:38:56. > :39:00.interest and the interests of working people at head of our own

:39:01. > :39:01.party interest. Let me tell you, conference, we made the right

:39:02. > :39:19.decision. When we warned about threats to our

:39:20. > :39:25.public services, we were told we were wrong. No Scotland's deficit is

:39:26. > :39:30.even bigger than it was then. But some people still say that we should

:39:31. > :39:38.back independence. Not because it is right but because they think it is

:39:39. > :39:43.popular. Let me say this to them. The Labour Party I lead will never

:39:44. > :39:50.betray its values so easily. It will never turn its back on the idea that

:39:51. > :39:56.together we are stronger. But we can achieve far more working in a

:39:57. > :39:59.partnership and we can alone. Conference, Labour's historic values

:40:00. > :40:06.will endure even under this greatest threat. We will never sacrifice the

:40:07. > :40:12.drops of workers at Rosyth and Govan and Faslane. The jobs of thousands

:40:13. > :40:15.of people in Edinburgh and Glasgow in science and technology and

:40:16. > :40:19.financial services, whose companies are already feeling the effects of

:40:20. > :40:21.Brexit. Or the oil workers in Aberdeen who need more support, not

:40:22. > :40:37.greater uncertainty. It will never caught off

:40:38. > :40:39.opportunities for our young people and tell them that their life

:40:40. > :40:45.chances should be curtailed by a border, or that our older people in

:40:46. > :40:49.the eye and say that we are willing to put their pensions at risk, or

:40:50. > :40:53.ask working families to face higher bills. And it will never turn its

:40:54. > :40:58.back on the millions of people who feel not just left behind but

:40:59. > :41:10.abandoned by the people in charge. It will always put the people of

:41:11. > :41:11.this country first. Conference, the Labour Party I lead will never

:41:12. > :41:39.support independence. Independence. It is not an escape

:41:40. > :41:44.from Tory rule. It is not an escape from Brexit. It is not an

:41:45. > :41:48.alternative. It is the same old song the SNP have been singing for

:41:49. > :42:00.decades. Conference, it is time Nicola Sturgeon changed her chin. --

:42:01. > :42:06.it is time she changed her tune. I want the First Minister of Scotland

:42:07. > :42:11.to focus on the Scottish NHS, on our economy, and on our schools. I don't

:42:12. > :42:17.want a First Minister whose priority is the constitution. It may serve up

:42:18. > :42:20.a convenient headline to divert attention but it does not put food

:42:21. > :42:26.on the table at each our kids how to read and write. I don't want any

:42:27. > :42:31.more uncertainty and upheaval. We need stability and we need focus.

:42:32. > :42:45.And that is what I will strive for each and every single day.

:42:46. > :42:52.Friends, yesterday you supported my plans for change for an even

:42:53. > :42:56.stronger Scottish parliament inside a federal United Kingdom. This is an

:42:57. > :42:59.historic milestone for our party which will protect the rights and

:43:00. > :43:06.benefits we get from being part of the UK. And with Brexit, more power

:43:07. > :43:10.is returning to the UK, and I want that to mean more powers for

:43:11. > :43:15.Scotland. It presents us with a significant opportunity. In the

:43:16. > :43:18.first instance, in areas that are already devolved like fishing and

:43:19. > :43:22.agriculture, power should return directly to the Scottish Parliament.

:43:23. > :43:27.But in a whole host of other areas where power currently sits with

:43:28. > :43:31.European Union, we should be asking, what should happen in the future?

:43:32. > :43:34.And I will be guided by where I think the rights and protections for

:43:35. > :43:42.working people will be best guaranteed. With the social chapter

:43:43. > :43:45.ceasing to apply in the UK, this is the right time to look at

:43:46. > :43:49.protections and work and the minimum wage, and ask whether power over

:43:50. > :43:59.those should sit in Holyrood. And I believe it should.

:44:00. > :44:06.The same is true over power over immigration. As we leave the single

:44:07. > :44:10.market, we will need to design and new immigration system for the UK.

:44:11. > :44:13.It needs to be better served Scotland's needs and consider the

:44:14. > :44:19.views of business and of people across the country. And we need to

:44:20. > :44:22.make sure we have a fair system. These decisions about the future of

:44:23. > :44:28.our country cannot just be taken by politicians. That is why we need a

:44:29. > :44:32.people's Constitutional Convention, made up of men and women from every

:44:33. > :44:44.corner of the United Kingdom to decide how this country should be

:44:45. > :44:47.run in the 21st century. With the Tory Government refusing to take

:44:48. > :44:51.this idea forward, it is now the job of the opposition to make it happen.

:44:52. > :44:56.Jeremy Corbyn has already given his support. Conference, let's thank him

:44:57. > :45:06.for everything he is doing to make this happen.

:45:07. > :45:13.And I can share with the conference today that in the coming months,

:45:14. > :45:16.together with Gordon Brown, I will join Labour representatives from

:45:17. > :45:18.Wales and the regions of England to begin to set out how we will take

:45:19. > :45:35.this agenda forward together. I do not want another referendum on

:45:36. > :45:39.breaking up the UK. Our country still bear is the scars of the last

:45:40. > :45:44.one and the one wants to go through that again any time soon. That is

:45:45. > :45:49.right Labour will never support one in the Scottish Parliament. But the

:45:50. > :45:53.unfortunate truth is this. With the SNP supported by the Green Party,

:45:54. > :45:57.they have a majority in the Scottish Parliament, therefore if this

:45:58. > :46:02.country faces another referendum at any point in the future, I will work

:46:03. > :46:03.tirelessly to make sure that our side of the argument as successful

:46:04. > :46:20.again. To ensure that we sure that our

:46:21. > :46:24.values of solidarity and cooperation can win out, and to protect the jobs

:46:25. > :46:32.and opportunities of everyone who lives and works in Scotland. That is

:46:33. > :46:41.why today I am announcing the launch of together stronger, and asking

:46:42. > :46:46.everyone who supports a United Kingdom to sign up, if you share our

:46:47. > :46:50.values, and if you believe the First Minister shelve plans for a second

:46:51. > :47:01.Independence Referendum, then join with us. Instead of exploiting

:47:02. > :47:06.division we want people across Scotland to share our vision of an

:47:07. > :47:12.open, tolerant and outward looking Scotland. Friends, this is our

:47:13. > :47:17.movement for a new Scotland, a fair, better, more equal Scotland, a

:47:18. > :47:21.Scotland that is strong and secure in its own identity, and where we

:47:22. > :47:34.think about what unites us rather than what divides us once again. Our

:47:35. > :47:38.argument against independence is built on our Labour values and our

:47:39. > :47:44.movement for a new Scotland has at its heart creating jobs and building

:47:45. > :47:50.our economy. Because without a strong economy we cannot put our

:47:51. > :47:53.values into practice. Government has a responsibility to the least well

:47:54. > :47:57.off but it also has to make sure that working families are protected

:47:58. > :48:03.and that we just keep up with places. Under the SNP Scottish

:48:04. > :48:09.growth is no less than one third of the UK's. Two of the largest sectors

:48:10. > :48:14.in our economy, oil industry and financial industry, are declining.

:48:15. > :48:18.The problem for the SNP is that its drive for independence means it

:48:19. > :48:21.cannot admit the weaknesses in our economy. And that means it cannot

:48:22. > :48:26.take advantage of the opportunities that may be around the corner.

:48:27. > :48:30.Because you cannot make the case for oil and gas decommissioning work to

:48:31. > :48:34.come to Scotland if your case for independence relies on an economy

:48:35. > :48:38.fuelled by never ending oil. You cannot admit how many jobs have

:48:39. > :48:42.already been lost in the financial sector if you still need to convince

:48:43. > :48:46.people that they will be there along into the future, and you cannot use

:48:47. > :48:49.Brexit to explain away all the problems, when you are calling for

:48:50. > :49:01.Scotland to withdraw from its biggest single market.

:49:02. > :49:08.For Labour, our priorities are equipping Scotland for a future of

:49:09. > :49:11.high skilled jobs, and doing what we have always done, protecting the

:49:12. > :49:18.incomes of working families across the country. In the 1980s and early

:49:19. > :49:22.1990s, at the outset of the first wave of automation, too many

:49:23. > :49:27.industrial jobs were replaced with low pay and low skilled jobs in the

:49:28. > :49:32.service sector, no other skilled jobs, long thought invincible to

:49:33. > :49:37.machines, are under threat. Some experts say that we will lose 20% of

:49:38. > :49:42.Scotland's jobs in the financial sector to machines in the next two

:49:43. > :49:45.years. No matter how you look at it, it is clear that our economy needs

:49:46. > :49:51.to radically change if it is going to succeed. We have to prepare

:49:52. > :49:55.people for the future with the best education, to give them the ability

:49:56. > :49:59.to compete for a high skilled jobs. This week we saw the SNP Government

:50:00. > :50:05.pushed through another budget film of measures that will cut right to

:50:06. > :50:09.the heart of our public services. It will seek millions lost from

:50:10. > :50:13.front-line local Government services, and will once again make

:50:14. > :50:19.the job of our school teachers even more difficult. I have always called

:50:20. > :50:25.spending on education and investment because that is exactly what it is.

:50:26. > :50:28.It is the payment we make as a society so that the next generation

:50:29. > :50:35.gets even better opportunities our own. But no matter how the SNP tries

:50:36. > :50:37.to dress it up, the budget the Government passed on Thursday,

:50:38. > :50:51.cannot make up for nearly one decade of neglect. The gap between the

:50:52. > :50:54.richest and the least well off children has persisted, while

:50:55. > :50:57.teachers have been lost, and literacy and numeracy rates have

:50:58. > :51:03.declined. Giving every child the best start in life means giving them

:51:04. > :51:06.a better chance to succeed, to get into university, a trade or

:51:07. > :51:12.training, and ultimately to get a job that will set them up for life.

:51:13. > :51:14.Our country has the potential to take advantage of opportunities in

:51:15. > :51:20.some great new innovative industries. But they need far more

:51:21. > :51:24.support. Edinburgh is no one of the country's centres for computer

:51:25. > :51:29.coding, designing the apps and programmes that we use on our

:51:30. > :51:34.forums, tablets and computers, but the SNP Government still does not

:51:35. > :51:38.have a published strategy for how we can grow our technology sector so

:51:39. > :51:44.that we can provide more jobs in the future. This is not the consequence

:51:45. > :51:47.of a lack of power, it is a lack of political will. As the Scottish

:51:48. > :51:52.Parliament takes on more tax powers, growing our economy through

:51:53. > :51:54.investing in the skills of ingenuity of our people and supporting new

:51:55. > :52:00.businesses, this is even more important. If we do not at home in a

:52:01. > :52:03.direct impact for our schools, hospitals and other public services.

:52:04. > :52:10.That is why I can announce today that in the coming months that we

:52:11. > :52:11.will launch Scottish Labour's industrial strategy and set out our

:52:12. > :52:30.thinking for the new economy. This will include specific work, as

:52:31. > :52:35.many including Dundee CLP have called for on the rise and

:52:36. > :52:39.automation, actions we can take to protect Scottish jobs and ideas on

:52:40. > :52:43.creating new opportunities in the technology and digital sectors. And

:52:44. > :52:47.as the other powers of the Scotland Act arrived in Holyrood we will set

:52:48. > :52:52.out plans to use them to grow our economy and to protect those who are

:52:53. > :52:57.hardest hit by hostility and by the consequences of Brexit. Scottish

:52:58. > :53:02.Labour, doing what it has always done, stepping up to the challenges

:53:03. > :53:06.of the future, focusing on the economy, creating jobs, improving

:53:07. > :53:19.lives, and building a better future together.

:53:20. > :53:26.Our second economic priority is protecting family incomes. As the

:53:27. > :53:29.effects of rising prices begin to take all over the coming months

:53:30. > :53:35.Scotland and the rest of the UK faces a renewed cost of living

:53:36. > :53:41.crisis. For the first time ever real wages are expected to decrease over

:53:42. > :53:47.the course of this Parliament. This is unprecedented and demands

:53:48. > :53:52.attention and action. In 1946 Labour introduced family allowance because

:53:53. > :53:55.we believe that everyone, regardless of their income, deserved support

:53:56. > :53:59.from the Government when they had children. As demonstrated Labour's

:54:00. > :54:03.commitment to giving every child the best start and giving every family

:54:04. > :54:07.something back from the money that they paid in. It was an idea that

:54:08. > :54:13.said very clearly that together we are stronger. Today, with the new

:54:14. > :54:17.welfare powers in the Scottish Parliament, we have a duty to look

:54:18. > :54:21.at what we can do to return to those principles. Conference, I have given

:54:22. > :54:26.Nicola Sturgeon a fair number of ideas over recent years that she has

:54:27. > :54:31.taken on as her own. Quite the few were made in the last conference

:54:32. > :54:35.speech I made here in Perth, guaranteeing a living wage for care

:54:36. > :54:40.workers, and attainment fund for every school, grants for every

:54:41. > :54:45.looked after child in Scotland who wants to go to university, every one

:54:46. > :54:49.of them Labour policies that I announce on this stage in 2015, and

:54:50. > :55:00.everyone of them a Government policy.

:55:01. > :55:14.Do not let anyone tell you that we cannot make a difference from

:55:15. > :55:25.opposition. Today I have got another idea for Nicola Sturgeon. 220,000

:55:26. > :55:31.Scottish children are still in poverty. Charities, anti-poverty

:55:32. > :55:36.organisations, and others across Scotland have called for an increase

:55:37. > :55:40.in child benefit to tackle this, and I agree. Today I can announce that

:55:41. > :55:44.Labour will respond to calls to support families by backing the

:55:45. > :56:05.campaign to top up child benefit in Scotland.

:56:06. > :56:10.Using the new welfare powers in the Scottish Parliament and we will

:56:11. > :56:15.campaign to create a new Scottish child benefit. Our plan would see

:56:16. > :56:20.child benefit increase by ?240 per year by the end of this Parliament,

:56:21. > :56:26.increasing by ?13 per month next year, before rising to ?20 per month

:56:27. > :56:29.in 2020. The Child poverty Bill now in the Scottish Parliament should

:56:30. > :56:34.take meaningful action to combat poverty as well as setting targets,

:56:35. > :56:37.and that is why in the coming weeks we will push the Government to

:56:38. > :56:41.include this action in the Child poverty Bill, and a stable not, we

:56:42. > :56:54.will seek to amend the law ourselves.

:56:55. > :57:02.Our plan routes mean help for the majority of families across Scotland

:57:03. > :57:08.and would mean 18,000 fewer children living in poverty in its first year,

:57:09. > :57:12.and up to 30,000 once these changes are completely implemented. It had

:57:13. > :57:15.been starting to reverse the fall in the value of child benefit is that

:57:16. > :57:20.families have seen over the past five years and it would send a

:57:21. > :57:21.strong message that Scotland will not allow hard-working families to

:57:22. > :57:37.bear the brunt of Brexit. Families across Scotland are sick

:57:38. > :57:44.and tired of living in a divided country. They want politicians they

:57:45. > :57:48.can trust. They want a plan to get us through Brexit. They do not want

:57:49. > :57:54.us to divide our country all over again. That should be Labour's

:57:55. > :57:59.priority. Throughout our history we always put working people first. The

:58:00. > :58:04.clue is in the name. Labour. And that should be our guide again as we

:58:05. > :58:11.begin to chart a new course for our party and our country. My promise to

:58:12. > :58:16.people across Scotland as this. I will always put your jobs first. I

:58:17. > :58:22.will fight for this port your family and your community needs. I will

:58:23. > :58:26.never shy away from the challenges that our country faces and that is

:58:27. > :58:42.why I say clearly today I will never support dividing our country.

:58:43. > :58:48.Our country has always succeeded when we have been united. Scotland

:58:49. > :58:52.was built by people who came together to create something bigger

:58:53. > :58:57.than themselves, whose ideas did not just shape our country, but shaped

:58:58. > :59:02.the world. And who realised that we have more in common, than that which

:59:03. > :59:08.divide us. Let us discover that spirit again. Let us reach out into

:59:09. > :59:13.our country and into the world. Let us tell Labour's story for a new

:59:14. > :59:15.town, let us go out and tell all of Scotland that together we are

:59:16. > :59:42.stronger. Thank you. 'S STUDIO:

:59:43. > :59:49.Scottish Labour leader taking the applause at Scottish Labour Spring

:59:50. > :59:55.Conference then Perth. Kezia Dugdale was saying, look to London as she

:59:56. > :00:00.introduced the London mayor, Sadiq Khan. She was focusing in this

:00:01. > :00:06.speech against independence. She said she would never support

:00:07. > :00:12.independence. She was setting out her plans for federalism, to devolve

:00:13. > :00:16.more powers to Scotland, then she switched back to independence,

:00:17. > :00:21.launching Labour's campaign against indyref2. She talked about a wave of

:00:22. > :00:25.automation that would hurt skilled jobs and talked about Labour's plans

:00:26. > :00:33.for an industrial strategy. She was concerned about workers wages and

:00:34. > :00:37.she was announcing plans to, and her view, create a new Scottish child

:00:38. > :00:40.benefit, topping up the existing benefit. It was her challenge to

:00:41. > :00:46.Nicola Sturgeon to try to create that.

:00:47. > :00:51.And John Curtice is with me watching these pictures in the studio. John,

:00:52. > :00:57.your initial reaction to that speech? I think we saw two things

:00:58. > :01:02.begin to emerge in the speech, though in both cases they still have

:01:03. > :01:05.a long way to go. The first as you suggested, perhaps sorbet the

:01:06. > :01:09.beginning of the Scottish Labour Party's campaign against

:01:10. > :01:14.independence. There was almost an implicit acknowledgement that there

:01:15. > :01:16.would indeed be a second independence referendum, and quite a

:01:17. > :01:22.lot of the speech was focused on that issue. And the announcement of

:01:23. > :01:25.a website suggesting this will be the beginnings of an organisation

:01:26. > :01:31.that might be able to fight that campaign. But the second thing,

:01:32. > :01:36.there was also the beginnings of an argument about the way in which she

:01:37. > :01:40.would expect a devolved Scottish parliament, a Scottish parliament

:01:41. > :01:44.with more powers in our view should use those powers in such a way to

:01:45. > :01:48.deal with what she thinks are some of the key issues. There were two

:01:49. > :01:52.parts, one of the announcement that she will come up with an industrial

:01:53. > :01:55.strategy, though no clue what it might contain, but suggesting it

:01:56. > :01:59.might use the powers of the Scottish Parliament to promote industry in

:02:00. > :02:04.Scotland, with a particular concern quite clearly about the implications

:02:05. > :02:06.of technology and automation for the possible structure of the labour

:02:07. > :02:11.market in the future in the way people might lose their jobs, and

:02:12. > :02:15.secondly losing the welfare powers -- using the welfare powers in order

:02:16. > :02:19.to pay increased child benefit, something that only recent Scottish

:02:20. > :02:24.parliament could do. One other thing in terms of her vision for an

:02:25. > :02:28.enhanced Scottish parliament, she left a somewhat hanging in the air.

:02:29. > :02:32.She seemed to be suggesting that she would favour amongst other things

:02:33. > :02:37.the devolution of immigration to the Scottish Parliament. It is one of

:02:38. > :02:43.the things the SNP have called for as one of the ways it might be

:02:44. > :02:46.possible to accommodate a closer relationship for Scotland with the

:02:47. > :02:50.EU even if Scotland were to remain inside the UK but outside the EU,

:02:51. > :02:55.but she did not quite make it clear whether she had the idea or not, and

:02:56. > :03:00.I suspect we might see an attempt to follow up with some clarity on that.

:03:01. > :03:03.Also saying she wants to devolve the labour market such as the minimum

:03:04. > :03:09.wage, that is moving Labour on quite a way, but also putting out a

:03:10. > :03:12.picture for the future of the devolved Scottish parliament which

:03:13. > :03:17.is quite close to that of the SNP. The old joke at First Minister's

:03:18. > :03:22.Questions as Nicola Sturgeon says, it is the prounion parties who bring

:03:23. > :03:26.up independence. And we did see a great portion of Kezia Dugdale's

:03:27. > :03:33.speech focusing on independence. Do you think it was right to do so? The

:03:34. > :03:37.truth is we know that over the course of the last 18 months or so

:03:38. > :03:41.Kezia Dugdale has made the odd comment that has been interpreted at

:03:42. > :03:46.least as a somewhat ambiguous position on independence, some

:03:47. > :03:50.people suggesting that perhaps at some point in time she might

:03:51. > :03:54.conceive of Scotland becoming an independent country. All such talk

:03:55. > :03:58.was dispensed with in the speech, she was trying to clarify things.

:03:59. > :04:01.She basically said under my leadership the Scottish Labour Party

:04:02. > :04:07.will never back independence. What she is then going on to do would buy

:04:08. > :04:12.this federalism thing is so crucial is to try to suggest that the Labour

:04:13. > :04:17.Party will have its own ideas on how to develop Scotland's Constitution,

:04:18. > :04:20.and of course quite interestingly jesting maybe Gordon Brown is going

:04:21. > :04:24.to come back into the Scottish political scene to help the Labour

:04:25. > :04:30.Party run its constitutional convention. That will be an

:04:31. > :04:35.interesting one to watch. Perhaps maybe it is an indication that given

:04:36. > :04:39.that Kezia Dugdale has said that Ruth Davidson should not run the

:04:40. > :04:45.anti-independence campaign in the event of a second referendum, was

:04:46. > :04:51.this perhaps is suggesting that the former premiers should do so? We

:04:52. > :04:54.will find out. Just briefly and specifically on topping up child

:04:55. > :04:58.benefit. Labour have campaigned in the past about a something for

:04:59. > :05:02.nothing culture, benefits that are spread out far and wide to everyone,

:05:03. > :05:08.middle-class families would of course benefit from a top one child

:05:09. > :05:11.benefit. What you make of that? It is interesting that the Labour Party

:05:12. > :05:16.is promoting something that for the most part most people benefit from,

:05:17. > :05:20.but you can tweak the tax system to take any increase away from people

:05:21. > :05:22.at the higher end of the spectrum, which the current Conservative

:05:23. > :05:27.Government has done across the UK as a whole. The interesting thing about

:05:28. > :05:32.it is in truth here we get an indication of how with the further

:05:33. > :05:35.devolution and Kim out of the Smith Commission, gradually the Scottish

:05:36. > :05:40.Labour Party is beginning to think of some ways of being able to use

:05:41. > :05:43.those powers. It isn't something that has grown to make Scotland a

:05:44. > :05:47.much more equal society, it is one of those popular welfare benefits,

:05:48. > :05:51.basically she was looking for something that was at least a

:05:52. > :05:55.potentially headline grabbing policy. It was really in truth the

:05:56. > :06:00.only specific detailed policy proposal that you came up with. But

:06:01. > :06:04.when a party is in opposition not long after an election, which is the

:06:05. > :06:09.case here, we don't really expect an awful great deal in terms of policy

:06:10. > :06:13.detail. John, thank you for now. Let's head back to the Perth concert

:06:14. > :06:22.Hall, Ryan Taylor is standing by with some guests. Thanks, Jackie

:06:23. > :06:26.Baillie Andy Gray join me. The speech, let's go through some of the

:06:27. > :06:30.detail. Something that struck me, Jackie, she says, don't want

:06:31. > :06:36.independence, don't want an independence referendum, doesn't the

:06:37. > :06:41.bread on tables, and yet the vast bulk of the speech was about

:06:42. > :06:43.constitutional reform. What we want is what the people of Scotland want,

:06:44. > :06:49.they want unity, not further division. And Kitty was very clear

:06:50. > :06:52.about setting and why we don't think a second referendum is the priority

:06:53. > :06:55.for Scotland. It is about jobs and the economy, making sure that

:06:56. > :07:04.families faced with the consequences of Brexit are able to cope. That is

:07:05. > :07:06.why her announcement today of additional money for child benefit,

:07:07. > :07:12.putting money into the pockets of those who need it most is just so

:07:13. > :07:15.welcome. I will come to that in a moment, but Iain Gray, stick with

:07:16. > :07:19.the constitution for now, what is the detail of the federal plan for

:07:20. > :07:22.England? I don't get it, I don't see whether it is region is running this

:07:23. > :07:27.Parliament, I am not sure what it is. That is largely for the

:07:28. > :07:31.convention that Kinsey has talked about to decide. And what it

:07:32. > :07:35.reflects is that 20 years after devolution there is a recognition in

:07:36. > :07:39.the United Kingdom, we have changed the way this country is constructed.

:07:40. > :07:44.We have tended to be focused on what that means for Scotland, and we have

:07:45. > :07:49.made real change, but there is a serious debate about the United

:07:50. > :07:54.Kingdom as a whole. How should it be organised as the four Nations relate

:07:55. > :07:57.to each other. There are people who he feel they have been left out of

:07:58. > :08:04.that debate in England, and that is why Kenzie has worked closely with

:08:05. > :08:07.Jeremy Corbyn, Sadiq Khan, we heard Ian Watson talking about it, and it

:08:08. > :08:10.is something Ed Miliband when he was leader had started to talk about. It

:08:11. > :08:18.is about modernising the whole country. We started at in 1999,

:08:19. > :08:24.1997, but in the 21st century we need to look at it as a whole. Kezia

:08:25. > :08:29.referred in the speech to perhaps immigration powers. Is that saying

:08:30. > :08:32.there will be a distinctive Scottish immigration policy, or that the

:08:33. > :08:38.immigration policy of the UK would reflect De Sanctis cottage needs? --

:08:39. > :08:44.would reflect distinctive Scottish needs? We're not going to close the

:08:45. > :08:49.door on any of this. The fact that more powers will be coming because

:08:50. > :08:54.of Brexit, to consider afresh the power is most appropriate to hold in

:08:55. > :08:57.Scotland. We have already heard from universities and businesses about

:08:58. > :09:00.the real skills shortage they will have as a consequence of Brexit,

:09:01. > :09:04.particularly people coming from Europe and further abroad. We

:09:05. > :09:09.absolutely need to address that if we care about Scotland's economy

:09:10. > :09:13.going into the future. Iain Gray, you accept Brexit will happen, you

:09:14. > :09:16.accept she talked in the speech about as we leave the single market.

:09:17. > :09:19.The idea that the Scottish Government has put forward of

:09:20. > :09:23.maintaining some connection with the single market, you don't think that

:09:24. > :09:27.as a starter? And other industrial, it is possible to be not in the

:09:28. > :09:29.signal market but still have some benefits of it. There is great

:09:30. > :09:35.complexity in the debate, but Kezia has said, and we said that in

:09:36. > :09:38.Holyrood, we voted against the recent triggering of article 50 in

:09:39. > :09:43.Holyrood because we do not agree with the route the Tories are

:09:44. > :09:47.taking, but it was made very clear that we did accept the result of the

:09:48. > :09:50.referendum. In the same way as we would like to see Nicola Sturgeon

:09:51. > :09:57.except the result of the referendum in Scotland in 2014. Let's turn to

:09:58. > :10:02.the child benefit announcement. It will be welcomed by many, others

:10:03. > :10:09.will say, is it really right to be a universal benefit, should not be a

:10:10. > :10:12.more targeted benefit? There are 220,000 children actually living in

:10:13. > :10:16.poverty today in Scotland. That is a scandalous number. Why not support

:10:17. > :10:23.them rather than paying universal child benefit? The whole idea is and

:10:24. > :10:25.is universal. There are many more targeted interventions we can and

:10:26. > :10:30.should make. The whole point of the policy on child benefit is that we

:10:31. > :10:34.now have the power to top up child benefit. We would use those new

:10:35. > :10:38.powers coming to the Scottish Parliament to make sure that we left

:10:39. > :10:42.at least 18,000 children out of poverty in the first year, and by

:10:43. > :10:47.the end of that policy, 30,000 children. Surely supporting

:10:48. > :10:55.low-income families by doing that is a price that is absolutely worth

:10:56. > :10:58.having. And I echo Kezia's calls. If Nicola Sturgeon wants to take this

:10:59. > :11:03.policy idea and make it real, we would be in a line welcoming that

:11:04. > :11:07.action. Is it affordable, would require additional taxation? It is

:11:08. > :11:13.affordable within Labour's tax proposals. This is the perfect

:11:14. > :11:18.combination of using the new tax powers in Holyrood to raise the

:11:19. > :11:23.resources and using the new welfare powers of Holyrood use those

:11:24. > :11:29.resources to left 30,000 children out of poverty. It would need a

:11:30. > :11:33.Scottish Government with the guts to use those tax powers and not just

:11:34. > :11:37.talk about letting families out of poverty but really doing something

:11:38. > :11:42.about it. Final question, how frustrating is it when you see the

:11:43. > :11:45.by-election results in England? I know you are an autonomous party and

:11:46. > :11:49.you will tell me that, but it washes across the border. How frustrating

:11:50. > :11:55.is that when you see your party held back in terms of making potential

:11:56. > :11:58.advances? That's not what I find frustrating, but I find frustrating

:11:59. > :12:01.about Copeland is a victory for a Tory Government that is doing so

:12:02. > :12:04.much damage to the lives of working people right across this United

:12:05. > :12:08.Kingdom. And we need to turn that around. That is the thing that I

:12:09. > :12:13.regret most deeply about the Copeland by-election. But I have to

:12:14. > :12:18.say I was delighted to see the failure of you get to make a

:12:19. > :12:23.breakthrough in stroke as well -- in still. We were told before this

:12:24. > :12:25.by-election this was the recalibration of politics in

:12:26. > :12:32.England, that certainly didn't materialise. Goblin very bad, still

:12:33. > :12:38.not so bad. Jackie Baillie, you don't about division. Sadiq Khan was

:12:39. > :12:41.also talking about that, remarks at of course some contention by saying

:12:42. > :12:47.that division between Scotland and England or Scottish and English

:12:48. > :12:49.people, by which he meant the SNP I presume, are tantamount to divisions

:12:50. > :12:54.based on someone's origins are religious belief. He qualified by

:12:55. > :12:58.saying he was not saying the SNP were racist and bigoted, but what do

:12:59. > :13:03.you make of those remarks? Helpful or unhelpful? The experience of

:13:04. > :13:07.anyone and went through the referendum was that it was divisive,

:13:08. > :13:11.there was no getting away from that. It divided families and communities.

:13:12. > :13:18.It was real deep divisions that have not yet gone away. Lots of people

:13:19. > :13:21.experienced it, people and families and committees experienced it. I

:13:22. > :13:25.don't want that kind of division for Scotland again. I want us to be

:13:26. > :13:28.united. There are real challenges ahead, and we don't actually begin

:13:29. > :13:33.to meet them if we are divided as a nation. Iain Gray and Jackie

:13:34. > :13:36.Baillie, thanks very much for joining me to discuss that speech by

:13:37. > :13:44.Kezia Dugdale. Activist to deal and Andrew. Brian, thank you. As Brian

:13:45. > :13:49.pointed out, Sadiq Khan did they give a speech to party members

:13:50. > :13:54.suggesting that nationalism was as divisive as racism. As comments have

:13:55. > :13:58.generated controversy. Let's hear what he had to say. We are living

:13:59. > :14:03.through extraordinary times, with the world becoming an increasingly

:14:04. > :14:07.divided lace. Brexit, President Trump, and the rise of populist and

:14:08. > :14:12.narrow Nationalist parties around the world. Now is not the time to

:14:13. > :14:17.fuel that division or seek separation or isolation. Now is not

:14:18. > :14:20.the time to play on people's fears are paid one part of our country or

:14:21. > :14:26.one section of our society against each other. In that respect there

:14:27. > :14:29.was no difference between those who try to divide us on the basis of

:14:30. > :14:34.whether we are English and Scottish and those who try to divide us on

:14:35. > :14:39.the basis of our background, race or religion. Of course, I am not saying

:14:40. > :14:44.that Nationalists are somehow racist or bigoted, but no more than ever,

:14:45. > :14:54.what we don't need is more division and separation. There was a hasty

:14:55. > :14:57.rewrite to that speech. Head of the speech the London Mayor spoke to our

:14:58. > :15:01.political editor and clarified whether he thought the SNP were

:15:02. > :15:06.tantamount to racists. Of course I'm not saying the SNP are racist or

:15:07. > :15:10.bigots, what I am saying is that in a world that is increasingly

:15:11. > :15:14.divided, with the Brexit results, with the election of President

:15:15. > :15:17.Trump, with the rise of populist and narrow Nationalist parties across

:15:18. > :15:25.the world, now is the time to come together. Now is a time for unity,

:15:26. > :15:28.not division or isolation. Nicola Sturgeon is saying she is generally

:15:29. > :15:31.a big fan of yours, a supporter of yours, she likes what you do, and

:15:32. > :15:35.says she is very disappointed with this, she says it is an insult to

:15:36. > :15:37.those who support independence on the grounds of social inclusion, the

:15:38. > :15:42.exact opposite of what you are saying. The antithesis of what you

:15:43. > :15:47.are saying. The antidote to Brexit, the antidote to President Trump is

:15:48. > :15:50.not division, it isn't breaking away, it is pulling together, being

:15:51. > :15:56.united, and recognising the fact that we can achieve far more

:15:57. > :15:58.together than we can apart. I am really proud of the special Russian

:15:59. > :16:04.jet between London and Scotland, and I will be talking about that today.

:16:05. > :16:08.The fact we are far more... I see the benefits culturally,

:16:09. > :16:12.economically and socially by us being a United Kingdom. What is

:16:13. > :16:15.clear to me as I see the rise of populist and narrow Nationalist

:16:16. > :16:16.parties across the world, as I see the results of Brexit and President

:16:17. > :16:29.Trump, hope does overcome fear. Are you saying the SNP are part of

:16:30. > :16:31.that narrow national spectrum that you are deriding? I am saying no

:16:32. > :16:37.more than ever we must come together. In the current context of

:16:38. > :16:41.Brexit, Trump and the rise of populist and nationalist parties we

:16:42. > :16:48.should pull together. Do you not understand why those results and bat

:16:49. > :16:57.why those remarks infuriated people in Scotland. Nicola Sturgeon said it

:16:58. > :17:03.was moral bankruptcy on behalf. She needs to recognise that post Brexit,

:17:04. > :17:05.post-Trump, Brenda is a rise of nationalists and populist parties

:17:06. > :17:11.across the world we have got to come together. We can achieve more

:17:12. > :17:15.together than separate. Are you saying the SNP are part of that

:17:16. > :17:26.trend? They would say they are the antithesis. I am a proud Londoner, a

:17:27. > :17:29.proud but, look at the special relationship between London and

:17:30. > :17:34.Scotland. I want that to continue. I am looking forward to meeting my

:17:35. > :17:39.speech today. I am I good friend of Scotland. I like every part of the

:17:40. > :17:42.United Kingdom. I am a proud Mayor of London. I have had a great

:17:43. > :17:46.response from the people of Scotland. I am looking forward to

:17:47. > :17:50.continuing a good relationship with Nicola Sturgeon and the Scottish

:17:51. > :17:54.Government. Do you accept the SNP are a civic, democratic and

:17:55. > :18:02.inclusive party, not the way you have perhaps said? The role that

:18:03. > :18:09.Michael has to play in the UK, I recognise the role of Scotland, it

:18:10. > :18:13.is important to recognise that in the current context of the rise of

:18:14. > :18:18.populist parties, the current context of post Brexit mood, the

:18:19. > :18:21.current context of election of President Trump we can achieve more

:18:22. > :18:27.like pulling together than by being separate. Brian Taylor is back in

:18:28. > :18:34.the Perth Concert Hall with some more guests.

:18:35. > :18:38.Thank you. Three guests joining me to talk about sundry matters. Let us

:18:39. > :18:43.talk about those remarks from Sadiq Khan, they caused a Ramey to say the

:18:44. > :18:53.least. He did qualify them when he actually delivered. He was not colic

:18:54. > :18:57.nationalistss Croesus, he was pointing out -- he was not seeing

:18:58. > :19:02.nationalists were racist, he was fighting out there can be divisions

:19:03. > :19:15.within society, he was clear and what he meant. What do you make of

:19:16. > :19:19.it? The point that Sadiq Khan was making was that there are so many

:19:20. > :19:25.divisions in society we should not be exploiting them but trying to

:19:26. > :19:30.heal them. Was it clever to put racism and religious bigotry in the

:19:31. > :19:35.same sentence as having a go at nationalism? Was that clever to put

:19:36. > :19:40.those together? They do come from the same strain of exploiting

:19:41. > :19:44.divisions within society. You are making the accusation again. I am

:19:45. > :19:48.not making the accusation. We have had such a divided country over the

:19:49. > :19:53.last few years it is neither as to come together, work together, to

:19:54. > :19:56.heal these differences, remain and leave, yes and no, work together.

:19:57. > :20:02.What did you make of it? I thought it was positive and inclusive

:20:03. > :20:07.speech. I came out of it feeling very positive and included. I

:20:08. > :20:11.enjoyed it. If you were a member of an SNP are a supporter of

:20:12. > :20:17.nationalism you would not feel sore included or positive. He made the

:20:18. > :20:22.case for inclusion from everybody for everybody, it was not excluding

:20:23. > :20:25.anybody, including SNP voters, it was trying to get everybody. Nicola

:20:26. > :20:35.Sturgeon begs to differ. Let us move on. Let us move on to the content of

:20:36. > :20:39.Kezia Dugdale's speech. As I said earlier, she said she did not want a

:20:40. > :20:44.second referendum, it does not put bread on tables, but then there is a

:20:45. > :20:49.long statement about constitutional issues, is that a conundrum? No, but

:20:50. > :20:53.what it does do is take a constitutional debate forward. You

:20:54. > :21:05.and I are long enough in the tooth to remember when the Scottish

:21:06. > :21:12.Parliament was established, the Welsh Assembly. Tom Watson mentioned

:21:13. > :21:15.there are no different areas of the United Kingdom looking for something

:21:16. > :21:20.different to what we have just now which is a high concentration of

:21:21. > :21:24.power, not just in Westminster, but also in Edinburgh. The patchwork of

:21:25. > :21:30.different powers across the UK and the regions of England, federalism

:21:31. > :21:34.does not make. That is why it is a conversation and a convention and

:21:35. > :21:37.not an agreed, this is what we want to do, because it is about

:21:38. > :21:43.developing the items to see how it would work. We are in a different

:21:44. > :21:45.constitutional position to where we were 20 years ago, with dramatic new

:21:46. > :21:50.powers for the Scottish Parliament, the Welsh Assembly wanting more

:21:51. > :21:54.powers, the Northern Ireland Assembly wanting greater powers,

:21:55. > :21:59.with areas of England now looking to see what they can do with the new

:22:00. > :22:04.powers in Manchester, Liverpool and the north-east. That is a difference

:22:05. > :22:09.debate than the one we had in the north-east said no. I was good to

:22:10. > :22:13.put that point to you, but there is not great evidence of a desire for

:22:14. > :22:17.this in England. There is talk about it. But it tends to be about more

:22:18. > :22:24.corporate powers, it is not federalism. No, but... It comes back

:22:25. > :22:29.to the point that Donald Dewar made that devolution is a process, not an

:22:30. > :22:32.event, it is about that conversation, bringing people in

:22:33. > :22:36.these communities with us. They feel that the country is not working for

:22:37. > :22:38.them so we need to have a conversation with them about where

:22:39. > :22:44.power supply, about the power they should have over their own

:22:45. > :22:47.communities. There may not necessarily be huge demand for

:22:48. > :22:50.regional Assembly in the north of England but that is a conversation

:22:51. > :22:54.we have got to have in the scores attritional convention. What do you

:22:55. > :22:58.make of this? We have shown that we are listening to people. Brexit

:22:59. > :23:02.shows that power is lying in the wrong places and they want change.

:23:03. > :23:08.We are looking at change and asking people what they think about that.

:23:09. > :23:12.She was talking about setting up a people's convention, with the

:23:13. > :23:18.support of Gordon Brown, he is back. He never went away, I know, but he

:23:19. > :23:22.is back. He did not. It is about inclusion today, we want everyone's

:23:23. > :23:26.opinions, to tell us what they want, and that is what the people's

:23:27. > :23:30.convention is about, hopefully we will get some ideas from people. Let

:23:31. > :23:36.us turn to the welfare section of the speech. Something that interests

:23:37. > :23:41.you very greatly, she is talking about deploying Social Security. Are

:23:42. > :23:49.we saying Labour beginning to build the idea of a differential treatment

:23:50. > :23:53.in Scotland using powers. She hinted that immigration as well. Certainly

:23:54. > :23:58.on welfare I thought Kezia Dugdale powerfully made the argument and the

:23:59. > :24:03.challenge, made the challenge to Nicola Sturgeon, to use the powers

:24:04. > :24:07.that they have, and one of the areas that has concentrated lots of mind

:24:08. > :24:12.over many years is the issue of child poverty. I remember Donald

:24:13. > :24:15.Dewar talking about the reason he came into politics was to deal with

:24:16. > :24:21.child poverty. The Scottish Parliament know has the powers to do

:24:22. > :24:25.something about that. I thought that was a very powerful challenge. We

:24:26. > :24:30.can talk about referendums until the cows come home but it will not but

:24:31. > :24:33.the single child out of poverty when there is actually powers therefore

:24:34. > :24:36.the Scottish Parliament and the Scottish Government to do so. I

:24:37. > :24:40.thought that was a great challenge. I thought the fact that she said

:24:41. > :24:45.they would push it through legislation if needs be, puts the

:24:46. > :24:54.ball park back in Nicola Sturgeon's court. The use, deployment of

:24:55. > :24:58.welfare powers? There is no use in this Parliament having these powers

:24:59. > :25:02.and not using them, there is clearly a huge problem in Scotland, 200,000

:25:03. > :25:06.children still living in poverty, we have got to do something, we have

:25:07. > :25:12.got to do something no, we cannot stand by him let it happen. Yes, we

:25:13. > :25:16.need to use the powers for welfare. I am a care worker so I know how it

:25:17. > :25:25.has hurt and we need to be doing something about it. You have seen

:25:26. > :25:30.evidence in the area where you work? Yes, all the time. We have got to

:25:31. > :25:33.use it. Could we afford it? You can always promise money on this and

:25:34. > :25:39.that that there is a limited budget and element that tolerance of tax

:25:40. > :25:44.increases as well. There is, yes. Again we need to be asking people,

:25:45. > :25:46.getting all the information from businesses and care workers and

:25:47. > :25:54.companies that are doing as to what they think he's doing. That is about

:25:55. > :25:58.increasing the size of the pie, increasing the basis of income tax,

:25:59. > :26:04.increasing the top rate of income tax. It is also about priorities.

:26:05. > :26:09.Even within the current budget that Scotland has access to, it is about

:26:10. > :26:17.making decisions about priorities. Do you try and lift children out of

:26:18. > :26:20.poverty or do you reduce the area traffic tax? Ministers would argue

:26:21. > :26:24.that could boost the economy and thereby release more bands. There is

:26:25. > :26:29.a big debate to be had about that. All I am saying is Kezia Dugdale

:26:30. > :26:38.laid out a set of priorities that she would enact. I thought she leads

:26:39. > :26:43.Bulls priorities out powerful. This would make a difference to the lives

:26:44. > :26:49.of many children in Scotland. Thank you for joining me here in Perth at

:26:50. > :26:52.Perth Concert Hall. It is very noisy.

:26:53. > :26:59.Back to the studio. STUDIO: Thank you. We have got Professor

:27:00. > :27:05.John Curtice, a final thought before we go, what have Scottish Labour

:27:06. > :27:07.achieved, if anything, at this conference? The Scottish Labour

:27:08. > :27:11.Party has come up with what it hopes is going to be a distinctive

:27:12. > :27:18.position on the constitutional question, federalism, and that

:27:19. > :27:25.there's an idea of devolving responsibility for the minimum wage

:27:26. > :27:29.30 years ago would have been anathema 30 years ago. The party has

:27:30. > :27:34.travelled a long way. At the moment it seems to be an idea whose

:27:35. > :27:39.substance is not certain. We have heard this afternoon that the Labour

:27:40. > :27:42.Party is still not sure whether this includes devolving immigration to

:27:43. > :27:45.the Scottish Parliament or not. That is a live debate. You would think

:27:46. > :27:50.the Labour Party would make their mind up. When it comes to what does

:27:51. > :27:53.this mean for England, the answer seems to be, we will ask people in

:27:54. > :27:55.England and see what they say, but there is no substance at the moment

:27:56. > :28:17.to this. But this is a policy position, designed

:28:18. > :28:19.to help convey Labour's case for keeping Scotland in the union, in

:28:20. > :28:22.the heat and jury of an independence campaign, it has got an awful lot of

:28:23. > :28:24.work to do rapidly, because as currently constituted, it is not

:28:25. > :28:27.enough to sustain such a campaign. Thank you for being with us this

:28:28. > :28:32.afternoon. More reaction to the Labour conference online and you can

:28:33. > :28:39.join as for Sunday Politics tomorrow morning. The UK show starts at 11

:28:40. > :28:43.o'clock. From all of us on the conference floor and in the studio

:28:44. > :28:44.thank you for being with us and enjoy the rest of the afternoon.

:28:45. > :29:00.Goodbye. The idea of having hot running water

:29:01. > :29:03.and inside toilets - I want to control the situation,

:29:04. > :29:17.show them they can trust you.