:00:31. > :00:34.Hello and welcome. They had been compared to the
:00:34. > :00:38.porters, leading them has been described as herding cats, but
:00:38. > :00:44.someone will have to take up the helm at the Ulster Unionist Party.
:00:44. > :00:47.Danny Kennedy is first out of the traps, but will anyone take on the
:00:47. > :00:52.popular minister? Or so should night, Martin
:00:52. > :00:55.McGuinness makes a solemn pledge to the Assembly. I would -- I have put
:00:55. > :00:59.my life on the line for the peace process on a number of occasions
:00:59. > :01:07.and I would do so again tomorrow. And with major benefit changes on
:01:07. > :01:12.the way, my guess is from the Housing Rights Service. -- my guest.
:01:12. > :01:16.Today's timetable was given over to debating the final programme for
:01:16. > :01:23.Government. The SDLP criticised what they say is a lack of action
:01:23. > :01:26.of social housing. Do you agree with that? Yes. I think we would
:01:26. > :01:32.echo that concern. We would like to have seen a greater commitment in
:01:32. > :01:36.the programme. Not only in providing more social homes but
:01:36. > :01:39.also to introducing a package of measures which would have helped to
:01:39. > :01:44.support homeowners who are struggling and who are faced with
:01:44. > :01:49.repossession and also that could have helped instil confidence back
:01:49. > :01:53.into what they consider is a fairly fragile housing market.
:01:53. > :02:01.programme talks about 8,000 new homes over the next four years, is
:02:01. > :02:06.that adequate? Not really. 8,000 is over four years. That puts 2000
:02:06. > :02:10.affordable homes and 6,000 social homes. There is a model which is
:02:10. > :02:19.used to forecast the number of homes needed and they estimate we
:02:19. > :02:24.will need to and have 1000 social homes -- 2.5000. That would
:02:24. > :02:28.translate into 10,000 social homes over four years. My understanding
:02:28. > :02:32.is that the programme is committed to 6,000. There has been some
:02:32. > :02:37.criticism recently that we do not have enough of the right sort of
:02:37. > :02:44.forms, not enough flats or a one- bedroom properties. Do you see that
:02:44. > :02:47.changing? Absolutely. There has been a criticism. I think that is
:02:47. > :02:51.one of the points that people locally have tried to make to the
:02:51. > :02:57.ministers in the UK, that we do have a different stock here of
:02:57. > :03:02.housing. We have many more family type homes. Space has never been at
:03:02. > :03:08.-- space has ever been at a premium here, so we have a lot of family
:03:08. > :03:12.homes and one of the concerns we have is, when we introduced the
:03:12. > :03:17.benefit changes, and the plan is to introduce what is referred to as
:03:17. > :03:21.the bed and tax, people will not receive if they do not have the
:03:21. > :03:26.family size that requires a three- bed home. They will only receive
:03:26. > :03:30.the benefit that they require. That may not be available in Northern
:03:30. > :03:34.Ireland. There is some work to do been trying to assess what the
:03:34. > :03:40.impact is going to be and match the size of accommodation we have
:03:40. > :03:43.available. As we had been earring, well-filled
:03:44. > :03:50.reform is a major issue hanging over the heads of tens of thousands
:03:50. > :03:54.of people. -- welfare reform. During questions today, the Social
:03:54. > :04:01.Development Minister was asked if there is any flexibility within the
:04:01. > :04:04.changes being introduced by London. Myself and my colleagues have
:04:04. > :04:11.recently started to explore a range of flexibilities, of which we
:04:11. > :04:16.believe could exist. This important work is at an early stage and we
:04:16. > :04:21.are trying to focus on maximising all flexibilities available to help
:04:21. > :04:25.mitigate against the negative impact of the wealth lot reform
:04:25. > :04:29.bill. I had a constructive meeting with the Secretary of State in
:04:29. > :04:34.which we discussed how we could work together on welfare reform,
:04:34. > :04:38.including exploring possible areas for flexibility. I will continue to
:04:38. > :04:43.have regular contact with not only the Secretary of State for Northern
:04:43. > :04:48.Ireland but also department for work and pensions ministers. As
:04:48. > :04:55.already mentioned, I will be in London tomorrow to meet Ian Duncan
:04:56. > :05:01.Smith and David Freud. Would the Minister acknowledge that due to
:05:01. > :05:04.the conflict that we have had over 40 years, there are a lot of people
:05:04. > :05:08.on disability benefits, particularly those with mental
:05:08. > :05:12.health related matters will stop there has to be a special case --
:05:12. > :05:17.special case made. We you assure the House of that message is taken
:05:17. > :05:21.to London? I can assure the member that point will be raised to
:05:21. > :05:26.tomorrow. It is one we have raced on a number of occasions and it is
:05:26. > :05:30.clear indeed that there is a difference in the profile between
:05:30. > :05:34.benefit in Northern Ireland as opposed to Great Britain. There is
:05:35. > :05:37.a higher level of people on that particular benefit as a result of
:05:37. > :05:46.mental health issues than in Great Britain. That is something we need
:05:46. > :05:52.to look that. The reasons for it are fairly... No doubt a legacy of
:05:52. > :05:56.the Troubles. That is very much in our thinking. They are aware of
:05:56. > :06:00.that difference as we move forward. With people on waiting lists for
:06:00. > :06:06.social housing, the Minister revealed plans to tackle the issue
:06:06. > :06:09.of an attack -- unoccupied house in. Empty housing is a waste of
:06:10. > :06:15.resource and can blight communities and attract anti-social behaviour.
:06:15. > :06:18.I have seen this all too often in my own constituency, so why am well
:06:19. > :06:23.aware of it. In the coming weeks, I will be bringing forward and new
:06:23. > :06:27.housing strategy which will include plans on how we will make better
:06:28. > :06:33.use of our existing stock. We also need to see what more we can do to
:06:33. > :06:36.make better use of empty homes in the private sector. Some time ago,
:06:36. > :06:40.the Housing Executive undertook the Housing Executive undertook
:06:40. > :06:42.research that estimated there could be up to 40,000 empty homes across
:06:42. > :06:46.be up to 40,000 empty homes across Northern Ireland. The Dat
:06:46. > :06:51.underpinning the Cessna was unreliable and despite some initial
:06:51. > :06:56.progress to tear down the owners of empty homes, this petered out and
:06:56. > :07:02.this -- results were disappointing. I have asked for a plan to tackle
:07:02. > :07:06.this wider issue and New work into specific Tiler - a pilot issues is
:07:06. > :07:15.currently underway. I see this as an important way in addressing
:07:15. > :07:19.housing need. Martin McGuinness was up next. The Alliance Party's
:07:19. > :07:23.member it wanted to make out -- wanted to hear what he made of the
:07:23. > :07:26.recent report. The report highlights the stability of
:07:26. > :07:33.political institutions and the decrease that there has been by
:07:33. > :07:37.violence. We are heartened by this finding. We want to see this
:07:37. > :07:41.enhanced as our community continues to move forward. We know that there
:07:41. > :07:45.is still work to do and the publication of this pop -- of this
:07:45. > :07:49.report underlines where there continue to the challenge is for us
:07:49. > :07:54.as a society. We're committed to addressing these issues, regardless
:07:54. > :07:58.of how complex and challenging they might be. The First Minister and I
:07:58. > :08:02.remain committed to building a united and shared Society for us to
:08:02. > :08:07.achieve this vision, we must address the division that continues
:08:07. > :08:13.to mar many areas of our community, tackle the segregation that has
:08:13. > :08:15.enabled our people to live often separate lives for too long, and
:08:15. > :08:20.nurture our environment for cultural diversity is celebrated
:08:20. > :08:23.and embraced. We believe that the finalised strategy will be an
:08:23. > :08:28.important building block for tackling these issues and this
:08:28. > :08:35.report will be a very valuable reference for the continued
:08:35. > :08:39.considerations of the cross-party working group. In the report, two
:08:39. > :08:44.of the points are linked. One is reference to the strategy for
:08:44. > :08:48.reconciliation and a solution to dealing with the past. Given that
:08:48. > :08:53.those two things are very key to the future, or will he agree with
:08:53. > :08:56.me that next time he or anyone else involved in terror or violence in
:08:56. > :09:01.the past is asked to own up to their part and that, they will
:09:01. > :09:07.actually do that rather than pleading the 5th and then read as
:09:07. > :09:12.he did? The Minister and mayor may not wish to answer that question.
:09:12. > :09:15.will answer the question. It has been a policy now for the
:09:15. > :09:19.particular member asking the question to be as negative as he
:09:19. > :09:23.possibly can be. That is something that I have come to terms with. I
:09:24. > :09:28.think it says more about time that is about myself. I have been very
:09:28. > :09:32.much involved in the work of peace and reconciliation. I would like to
:09:32. > :09:35.think that over the course of recent times I have put my life on
:09:35. > :09:40.the line for the peace process on a number of occasions and I would do
:09:40. > :09:45.so again tomorrow without any hesitation whatsoever. I ate well
:09:45. > :09:51.very positively and -- I work positively and constructively with
:09:51. > :09:55.the First Minister and many other people within society, both in the
:09:55. > :10:02.community and business sector and also with all the churches in
:10:02. > :10:06.ensuring that we continue to move forward. No solution has been found
:10:06. > :10:10.by anybody, a not least the member, in terms of how we deal with the
:10:10. > :10:13.past. Let us go back to a couple of
:10:13. > :10:17.points the Housing Minister made. He is going to have a housing
:10:17. > :10:21.strategy in the looking at these empty homes. That is something that
:10:21. > :10:26.has been on the agenda for a long time but nothing has been done.
:10:26. > :10:30.Absolutely, and something that we have been calling for is a housing
:10:30. > :10:34.strategy for Northern Ireland to. We are delighted to hear the
:10:34. > :10:38.Minister making that commitment. He has been talking about it for the
:10:38. > :10:42.last few weeks and we look forward to being involved in helping to
:10:42. > :10:47.influence the content of that strategy. Potentially, what
:10:47. > :10:52.difference could that may? It could make a huge difference. We have off
:10:52. > :10:56.for a while that there has not been a strategic approach to housing in
:10:56. > :10:59.Northern Ireland. We can go all the 10 years and the different
:10:59. > :11:03.contributions that we can make to meeting the housing need in
:11:03. > :11:08.Northern Ireland. We need that kind of comprehensive approach to their
:11:08. > :11:13.housing situation, where we are looking across all 10 years, the
:11:13. > :11:19.private-sector and the rented sector. Particularly at this time
:11:19. > :11:24.when the impact of welfare reform is pending and it is going to
:11:24. > :11:29.impact across this. Housing is one of the areas that we believe is
:11:29. > :11:37.going to be most significantly impacted by the implementation of
:11:37. > :11:40.this. This will be critical to address.
:11:40. > :11:44.Members got the chance to give their tuppence worth up on the
:11:44. > :11:49.final version of the Executive's programme for Government earlier.
:11:49. > :11:53.The SDLP and the TV are not impressed and at times the debate
:11:53. > :11:58.got personal. Here is the first Minister outlining the main targets
:11:58. > :12:03.to the House. A commitment to promote 25,000 new
:12:03. > :12:10.jobs remains at the top of the agenda, along with commitments in a
:12:10. > :12:16.supporting young people into employment. �300 million of
:12:16. > :12:20.investment by business is, with at least 25% coming from small and Jim
:12:21. > :12:26.sized enterprises. Press for the devolution of corporation tax.
:12:26. > :12:32.Includes social clauses in all of public procurement processes for
:12:32. > :12:37.suppliers and construction. Liquidity of small and made him --
:12:37. > :12:42.aid liquidity of small and medium- sized enterprises. Schemes to
:12:42. > :12:47.improve landscape in public areas and promote public sector in but --
:12:47. > :12:54.private sector investment in towns and city. A sure planning decisions
:12:54. > :12:58.are made within six months. -- insurer planning decisions.
:12:58. > :13:02.Introduce an extension of the small business rate relief scheme.
:13:02. > :13:07.Eliminate our passenger duty on direct long-haul flights. We have
:13:07. > :13:13.gone further. The final programme for Government includes enhanced
:13:13. > :13:18.commitments on the economy, including commitments to achieve a
:13:18. > :13:22.�375 million injection through foreign direct investment, and
:13:22. > :13:32.increased from 300 million in the draft programme as part of a �1
:13:32. > :13:33.
:13:33. > :13:40.It was disappointing To hear the Minister at suggest that another
:13:40. > :13:45.look might be taken at senior citizens and the card allowing free
:13:45. > :13:50.travel being possibly taken away from them, which would be to the
:13:50. > :13:57.detriment of the senior citizens. don't want to be negative all the
:13:57. > :14:01.time so we welcome the initiative. We should be welcoming it. Yes, a
:14:01. > :14:05.great deal of it seems to be mother great deal of it seems to be mother
:14:05. > :14:10.hard and apple pie, but there is much to praise. I am very pleased
:14:10. > :14:15.to see job targets in it, an extra spend on health and many, many
:14:15. > :14:23.other matters. But it is in many cases to vague with too few targets
:14:23. > :14:29.and too few turn lines. This document is a glossy, a nicely
:14:29. > :14:39.produced, it looks very well. If you flick through it, you would say,
:14:39. > :14:42.
:14:42. > :14:47.it looks good. But content is utterly vague and vacuous. I want
:14:47. > :14:51.to put on my record but I am surprised and disappointed that the
:14:51. > :14:54.SDLP minister could not find it within himself to attend last
:14:54. > :15:03.Thursday's crucial executive meeting which unanimously supported
:15:03. > :15:09.the programme for government. It also it saddens me to say that I
:15:09. > :15:17.find it equally surprising that the leader of the SDLP, Orston
:15:17. > :15:20.Macdonald... Order. Mr Speaker, it is disingenuous of the deputy first
:15:20. > :15:30.minister to criticise the Minister because he was in Brussels on
:15:30. > :15:31.
:15:31. > :15:37.official business. I thought that he said he was at a funeral, but he
:15:37. > :15:46.is in Brussels and now! Or! Allow the deputy first minister to
:15:46. > :15:50.continue. I reiterate the point, I also find it equally surprising
:15:50. > :15:55.that the leader of the SDLP, Alastair Macdonald, could not find
:15:55. > :15:59.the time it to come into this assembly today and contribute to
:15:59. > :16:05.our discussions on an issue his party say they feel very strongly
:16:05. > :16:10.about. I note the Ulster Unionists are about to decide he will be
:16:10. > :16:16.there next leader, but I think the SDLP are suffering from a
:16:16. > :16:23.leadership deficit. The SDLP Deputy Leader joins us for
:16:23. > :16:27.now. Clear that up for us, where was your leader today? He was here
:16:27. > :16:36.this morning meeting the group. He then rushed off to Westminster to
:16:36. > :16:43.take part in the delegation which is welcoming the Group Two Marks
:16:43. > :16:49.and Patrick's Day. Is the SDLP at in the cold now? It was a shin pain
:16:49. > :16:53.Das Sinn Fein and the DUP having a go today. We are used to them at
:16:53. > :16:57.taking turns to denigrate the SDLP, but the SDLP are standing in
:16:57. > :17:01.relation to the people. We have people coming into our offices who
:17:01. > :17:05.are very concerned about their job losses, the impact it has had on
:17:05. > :17:12.their ability to pay their mortgage and their rent, and indeed the very
:17:12. > :17:22.many young people who now have to leave in order to search of work.
:17:22. > :17:22.
:17:22. > :17:25.We are taking a stand to say that this programme does not measure up.
:17:25. > :17:29.They have looked at 400 public concentrations of people saying
:17:29. > :17:33.what things they want to see changed. Youth unemployment is one
:17:33. > :17:37.of the areas they will look at again. I welcome back, but we are
:17:37. > :17:42.10 months into this term. The programme for government normally
:17:42. > :17:46.comes before the Budget. There are now one in five of our young people
:17:46. > :17:50.unemployed. It is far too little. It is arguably too late or there
:17:50. > :17:58.are some action is better than none. Let's look at the consultation
:17:58. > :18:01.responses. It was less than three weeks when the closure... They had
:18:01. > :18:05.turn this around, published three new programme for government inside
:18:05. > :18:09.the three-week period and one has to ask what consideration did they
:18:09. > :18:16.give to those consultations bearing in mind that it has taken over a
:18:16. > :18:20.year to respond to the consultation? What would you have
:18:20. > :18:28.done differently? What would you have included in the programme?
:18:28. > :18:31.SDLP made a number of proposals and one of the things we believe is a
:18:31. > :18:37.much more determined action in response to the economic downturn
:18:37. > :18:40.and the welfare of of Tory cuts and reform. We need safety nets for
:18:40. > :18:44.people who are going into mortgage arrears, increase in the housing
:18:44. > :18:54.stock, but we have no definition yet but what an affordable home
:18:54. > :18:55.
:18:55. > :19:00.will be. The number of people on the UN and -- housing list is over
:19:00. > :19:10.10,000. The construction industry needs a boost and this would invest
:19:10. > :19:10.
:19:10. > :19:15.Thank you for joining us. An event to mark European day for
:19:15. > :19:19.victims of terrorism to place today in the Senate chamber. Three
:19:19. > :19:24.victims of the Troubles told them living stories at the event which
:19:25. > :19:31.was organised by Jim Allister. This year I was happy to host an
:19:31. > :19:37.event where we could hear the very moving accounts of instant victims
:19:37. > :19:47.of terrorism and reflect on how horrendous, unjustified glorified
:19:47. > :19:47.
:19:47. > :19:54.terrorism is. It takes says aquatic and a deprived mind to commit these
:19:54. > :20:00.acts. -- a psychotic. I'm one of many hundreds of problems -- people
:20:00. > :20:10.suffering from these problems. I want to see justice and the mother
:20:10. > :20:16.
:20:16. > :20:24.-- the murderer of my father It is part and parcel of trying to
:20:24. > :20:30.deliver a message that as we age, and me it's become greater. -- Alan
:20:30. > :20:34.needs. It is about being ensure that our needs will be met. This is
:20:34. > :20:39.the 25th anniversary of the Enniskillen Poppy Day bomb. A
:20:39. > :20:44.report is out soon, but whether it will disclose any answers for the
:20:44. > :20:48.family 25 years down the line, we will see.
:20:48. > :20:51.Pensioner poverty is a big concerns of the Public Accounts Committee
:20:51. > :20:54.has been looking at attempts to encourage pensioners to take up
:20:54. > :20:58.their full benefit entitlement. As we take our weekly look at the
:20:58. > :21:08.worker committees here, we find the PAC chair has a very pertinent
:21:08. > :21:10.
:21:10. > :21:20.question. If everyone took up the pension
:21:20. > :21:21.
:21:21. > :21:31.poverty, what that eradicate the problem? No. Is that a wider it --
:21:31. > :21:31.
:21:31. > :21:41.it is the white bishop of getting We have to get the wider issue of
:21:41. > :21:45.
:21:45. > :21:52.people investing. Many pensioners can receive the full entitlement,
:21:52. > :22:02.but they can still be in poverty. Poverty define 65 % of that level.
:22:02. > :22:02.
:22:02. > :22:07.The other key issue is the fuel poverty issue and the fact that we
:22:07. > :22:13.have here, and we know many pensioners are paying considerable
:22:13. > :22:18.amounts. We need to get the pensions into the right housing
:22:18. > :22:21.stock. I think we have done a good job in broad levels pushing up
:22:21. > :22:30.housing in some areas and we are very committed to doing up further,
:22:30. > :22:33.but the point is that unless we are getting better fixes so that a
:22:33. > :22:38.single pensioners are in better accommodation, unless we achieve
:22:38. > :22:42.that, we will not tackle anything. This issue requires more
:22:42. > :22:45.contributions from employers and people's own investments and
:22:45. > :22:55.pensions. It requires us to get the acts together as I have described
:22:55. > :22:56.
:22:56. > :23:03.here. It is a really big challenge. It is such a core issue. It is a
:23:03. > :23:11.growing population, 300,000, but the next 30 years it will be up on
:23:11. > :23:16.that. It is a big group far as. is rather unusual, but not unheard
:23:16. > :23:26.off. Although this is my first appearance of the justice can misty,
:23:26. > :23:30.
:23:30. > :23:40.The formal separation of our respective constitutional roles
:23:40. > :23:40.
:23:41. > :23:50.means that such roles -- appearances will be infrequent. But
:23:51. > :23:51.
:23:51. > :23:54.I have a particular interest in the There are areas where I can
:23:54. > :23:59.assisting your deliberations, but you will understand and welcome the
:23:59. > :24:02.fact that I have a firm policy of not straying into areas which are
:24:02. > :24:07.the responsibility of ministers of the assembly and unsure that
:24:07. > :24:11.committee members likewise would not wish to stray into areas which
:24:11. > :24:21.are the proper responsibility of the judiciary of legal knowledge
:24:21. > :24:25.through to diversity, the ability to manage situations, understand
:24:25. > :24:29.people who were in a highly emotionally charged situations,
:24:29. > :24:34.community, right material that people could actually understand,
:24:34. > :24:42.because a judgement is there for the benefit of the parties, the
:24:42. > :24:49.public, the press, as well as fork commentators. My understanding of
:24:49. > :24:57.the professions is that they are supportive of that approach and I
:24:57. > :25:02.think that it has benefited in ensuring that there is greater
:25:02. > :25:07.transparency. There is a much better opportunity for those no
:25:07. > :25:11.wish to take these posts up. The Ulster Unionist Party met
:25:11. > :25:17.tonight to discuss the leadership race. Candidates have until Friday
:25:17. > :25:24.to join their hats in the ring. -- throw their hats.
:25:24. > :25:27.We are aware that they are pressing ahead. This is as far as we are
:25:27. > :25:33.aware. The elections are going on at the end of the month. The big
:25:33. > :25:36.news today was that Danny Kennedy, the regional development minister,
:25:36. > :25:40.seemed to indicate that he will be standing. Apparently he took
:25:40. > :25:45.standings of the course of the weekend and felt he had the backing
:25:45. > :25:52.of the much charity of the party, also its apart from the party's
:25:52. > :25:56.peers and the MEP Jim Nicholson. He did not front up in front of the
:25:56. > :26:01.cameras to actually launched his campaign. But he would seem, at
:26:01. > :26:05.this stage, to be the front runner, although the current incumbent, Tom
:26:05. > :26:12.Elliott, is still there. Before heading to do but -- a Dublin for
:26:12. > :26:16.an engagement, he was asked whether Mr Kennedy would be the most
:26:16. > :26:26.credible candidate, something he did not want to give a view on.
:26:26. > :26:36.would be totally unfair as outgoing leader to recommend anyone. I just
:26:36. > :26:38.
:26:38. > :26:45.In a statement from the culture minister. This has been an ongoing
:26:45. > :26:49.saga to do with Alex Salmond -- salmon. Atlantic salmon is an
:26:49. > :26:53.Atlantic species in Northern Ireland and the culture minister is
:26:54. > :26:57.responsible for handing out licences. She was due to make a
:26:57. > :27:01.statement some time ago which she pulled because there were ongoing
:27:01. > :27:05.negotiations. Late this evening, she made a statement in which she
:27:05. > :27:09.said that she was going to issue licences to six commercial
:27:09. > :27:12.operators who catch salmon using nets here, but only on the
:27:12. > :27:16.condition that they had given a promise that they are not going to
:27:17. > :27:23.fish for the salmon during 2012 to try to conserve the species. She is
:27:23. > :27:28.also asking anglers to release any salmon a cat and to fly fish and
:27:28. > :27:32.use single barbless hooks up to catch the salmon in order not to
:27:32. > :27:36.damage the species. She sees this as a first step on the way to
:27:36. > :27:40.conserve the -- concerning an iconic species.
:27:40. > :27:45.A final thought, we have talked about different issues around
:27:45. > :27:48.housing, but we have not tackled the issue of homelessness and the
:27:48. > :27:52.figure of 10,000 is mentioned, but how many people do not have
:27:52. > :27:59.somewhere to live? That seems to be smaller in this part of the UK than
:27:59. > :28:03.elsewhere. I don't know whether that is true. In Northern Ireland
:28:03. > :28:09.our levels of homelessness are increasing. Last year there were
:28:09. > :28:19.over 21,000 households are presented as homeless. Just over
:28:19. > :28:22.10,000 of those were excepted -- accepted as the legal definition of
:28:22. > :28:29.homelessness. You are right to say that the number of people we have
:28:29. > :28:33.sleeping rough here is perhaps the most physical form of homelessness
:28:33. > :28:37.is smaller, but generally we have a fairly significant problem with
:28:37. > :28:41.homelessness and that is something which the Housing Executive are