:00:26. > :00:31.Hello and welcome to the final Stormont Today of 2011. Christmas
:00:31. > :00:35.is in the air and winter has got a grip, with polar winds and ripping
:00:36. > :00:40.around Parliament Buildings, but it is business as usual in the chamber,
:00:40. > :00:48.and the Compton Report on health is published and the minister's
:00:48. > :00:52.message is clear. I say to them, read the review report. It paints a
:00:52. > :00:55.compelling picture of the need to reform. And the dark side of
:00:55. > :01:00.Christmas - members call for greater protection from pay-day
:01:00. > :01:08.loan companies. These rates represent extortion to say the
:01:08. > :01:14.least. Whether they are illegal or suffer from a lack of regulation,
:01:14. > :01:19.they are in scrupulous. With me tonight, Jo Black from the
:01:19. > :01:24.Citizens' Advice Bureau. Also tonight, what does an MLA one
:01:24. > :01:31.for Christmas? May be a couple of tickets for Westlife's farewell to
:01:31. > :01:35.a. And iPad. By at least start tonight with the
:01:35. > :01:39.publication of today's review into the health service, and the Compton
:01:39. > :01:42.review may not be the first of its kind but unlike some of its
:01:42. > :01:47.predecessors this one will not be left on the shelf, according to
:01:47. > :01:51.Edwin Poots, the Health Minister, who unveiled details of the review
:01:51. > :01:54.to the assembly today. The panel made 99 recommendations, and just
:01:54. > :01:59.before the Minister began his statement, the fact that members
:02:00. > :02:07.had only just received the document was raised in the chamber. Members
:02:07. > :02:11.only received this 150 page document at 5-ten this morning. How
:02:11. > :02:17.can this house have an intelligent, informed discussion about these
:02:17. > :02:23.important matters, given the paucity of notice? I am just
:02:23. > :02:27.dealing with that point. Because I have respect for this house, this
:02:27. > :02:31.has received its first as opposed to someone leaking it for the media.
:02:31. > :02:36.The purpose of the review was to examine the future provision of
:02:36. > :02:41.services including our acute hospital Configuration, the
:02:41. > :02:44.provision of primary social care, and there were very real concerns
:02:44. > :02:49.that on that system was not sustainable to continue to meet the
:02:49. > :02:53.priorities, with the consequences for patient care and safety. My
:02:53. > :02:57.intention was to set a new reform agenda, to give us more momentum
:02:57. > :03:01.towards my vision and priorities for social care services for
:03:01. > :03:06.Northern Ireland. If the need for change was not clear before the
:03:06. > :03:11.report, I say, read the review report. It paints a compelling
:03:11. > :03:14.picture of the need to reform. We have ten acute hospitals in
:03:15. > :03:24.Northern Ireland, serving a population of 1.8 million. This
:03:25. > :03:25.
:03:25. > :03:31.contrast with other areas of the UK with some of popular -- populations.
:03:31. > :03:36.Our in it must be the provision of resilient, sustainable and saved
:03:36. > :03:41.services. It is in that strategic context that the review envisages
:03:41. > :03:45.by 2016, 2017, the model of acute hospitals for Northern Ireland
:03:45. > :03:52.would reconfigured to a more appropriate scale. It is only
:03:52. > :03:56.likely to be possible to provide sustainable, resilient and acute
:03:56. > :04:02.services on 5-7 sides. But may well prove to be the case, I cannot say
:04:02. > :04:06.at this stage. Our services need to adapt to the ageing population, to
:04:06. > :04:10.ensure that we can provide an appropriate level of services in
:04:10. > :04:13.the future. It is not surprising that a significant section of the
:04:14. > :04:19.report is devoted to improving services for older people, and for
:04:19. > :04:24.those with long-term conditions. The report highlights that home
:04:24. > :04:30.should be the highlight -- harbour of care for older people. Can ask
:04:30. > :04:36.the Minister, he has mentioned the cost when you go to change anything,
:04:36. > :04:43.it is bought at 25 million. Does he have that money within his current
:04:43. > :04:49.budget to meet those extra costs, or will he be seeking money from to
:04:49. > :04:53.fund that? Is the first place I will be seeking funding from the
:04:53. > :04:57.DFB. It it is not forthcoming, we need to then find the money within
:04:57. > :05:06.the system. Could the Minister assure this assembly that funding
:05:06. > :05:12.will follow those most abominable in our society? Maybe it I had less
:05:12. > :05:16.noise and a bit more listening, it would help the member. We are
:05:16. > :05:20.looking at shifting �80 million from the hospital sector to the
:05:20. > :05:28.community sector, so how clear red can we be. It is all in the
:05:28. > :05:33.statement. I welcome the Minister's statement and my long awaited
:05:33. > :05:37.opportunity to ask a question on it. Let me assure the House of my
:05:37. > :05:43.party's unwavering commitment to the health service and our need to
:05:43. > :05:47.improve it. I would like to ask the Minister, what are the implications
:05:48. > :05:54.of this review for staff and staffing numbers, right across the
:05:54. > :05:58.sector, that is including those caring in the community? Let us not
:05:58. > :06:02.raised unnecessary concerns. We will manage those situations, and
:06:02. > :06:05.will not be introducing a vast array of compulsory redundancies in
:06:05. > :06:09.Northern Ireland as a consequence of this report.
:06:09. > :06:14.So is the writing on the wall for some of our acute hospitals? I am
:06:14. > :06:19.joined by the chair of Health Committee, Michelle Gildernew.
:06:19. > :06:23.Edwin Poots talked about this vast sum of money, �83 million being
:06:23. > :06:27.moved from the hospital sector into the community. Ali confident that
:06:27. > :06:31.if all that and sick people are cared for more often in their homes,
:06:31. > :06:36.but the services will be there to look after them properly? I hope
:06:36. > :06:42.they will, and we have heard during the day that people are willing to
:06:42. > :06:46.look at a better model of delivering care, and it is
:06:46. > :06:52.certainly very clear that GPs will have an enhanced role, and they
:06:52. > :06:56.need to have the resources to go with that. I would also welcome
:06:56. > :07:05.more of the focus on community and primary care, and the emphasis on
:07:06. > :07:11.prevention, and I welcome the North -- but I have concerns, and when we
:07:11. > :07:16.have got time to digest the document and maybe dig into the
:07:16. > :07:20.detail behind the document, for example we have the situation
:07:20. > :07:27.whereby Minister has told us about the road map for the future and
:07:27. > :07:32.about how at the 17 integrated care Partnerships will be able to
:07:32. > :07:42.achieve sign-off. What does that mean? That is what we will be
:07:42. > :07:42.
:07:42. > :07:47.asking the minister? If they can be a veto threat that process. So
:07:47. > :07:52.approval needs to be sought. But I will be asking the minister
:07:52. > :07:56.tomorrow who is going to be on the clinical Forum, and where others
:07:56. > :08:00.people going to be from, and what is their role and how much power do
:08:00. > :08:05.they have? We could have a situation whereby there is a local
:08:05. > :08:10.plan worked out, and as that goes further up the line, that is vetoed.
:08:10. > :08:14.So I would be concerned about the detail behind the document, probing
:08:14. > :08:20.into what is not in the document, and I suppose I am trying hard not
:08:20. > :08:26.to be cynical. Formal consultation - Mac no formal consultation - is
:08:26. > :08:30.that a concern at all viewers? did press on the need for
:08:30. > :08:37.consultation, and we thought that because there was so much Prix
:08:37. > :08:40.consultation done, I would encourage people to download the
:08:40. > :08:44.document if you have broadband provision at home. But to have a
:08:44. > :08:47.look at the document and to send your thoughts to the minister on it,
:08:47. > :08:52.because I think that when people get the chance to study it properly
:08:52. > :08:57.there will be things that concerned them. It is important that we as
:08:57. > :09:02.the health committee are able to scrutinise the department and John
:09:02. > :09:06.Compton in this document. Is there a role city divided, that will
:09:06. > :09:12.appear with the loss of any services and surgery in some of the
:09:12. > :09:16.acute hospitals? Again, nothing is named in the report, it is careful
:09:16. > :09:21.in that, that you have to be between the lines to see what is
:09:21. > :09:24.being said. So he has left that as a political decision, rather than
:09:24. > :09:29.the review team making the decision which hospitals have an X beside
:09:29. > :09:33.them? We know that some times the decision is taken out of the hands
:09:33. > :09:39.of the local minister, so there could be times when there will
:09:39. > :09:42.college says that that service is not sustainable. So there are ways
:09:42. > :09:46.and means of deciding that a hospital should close without
:09:46. > :09:51.actually taking the political decision yourself. Thank you for
:09:51. > :09:55.joining us tonight. Legalised extortion was how one MLA
:09:56. > :09:59.described so-called pay-day loans today. Customers can face extremely
:09:59. > :10:03.high interest rates if they do not repay the money within the time
:10:03. > :10:07.agreed, and the number of companies offering the loans appears to be
:10:07. > :10:11.increasing. MLAs are calling for the Government in London to
:10:11. > :10:18.introduce tighter regulations in the industry. Many of these loans
:10:18. > :10:24.on offer are lent with extraordinary rates of interest,
:10:24. > :10:29.sometimes ten times the amount initially borrowed. These rates
:10:29. > :10:37.represent extortion to say the least, a legal form of loan sharks.
:10:37. > :10:42.One could compare pay-day loans to a scheme on offer for cash for gold.
:10:42. > :10:52.These companies are preying on the vulnerable and disadvantaged, who
:10:52. > :10:54.
:10:54. > :10:59.in hard times are desperate. think that it is incumbent on
:10:59. > :11:04.people like the Financial Services Authority to look at the issue of
:11:04. > :11:08.proposing a cap on the rates. I am not surprised that the proposer of
:11:08. > :11:14.the motion said that the coalition Government have expressed
:11:14. > :11:19.opposition. Many of their policies by what are driving people to was
:11:19. > :11:26.unveiling themselves of these facilities. If you type pay-day
:11:26. > :11:31.known into Google you get 9,300,000 references. The issue I believe is
:11:31. > :11:38.very easily defined - for words would cover it. Rising costs,
:11:38. > :11:43.static wages. That is at the better it -- a better end of it. At the
:11:44. > :11:50.worst end it is no wages. As the unemployment figures goal north of
:11:50. > :11:55.60,000. The Government has agreed to investigate the impact of a cap.
:11:55. > :12:00.This to my mind is to be welcomed, but there is concern this is just a
:12:00. > :12:05.holding response. And that it will not get much towards the research
:12:05. > :12:15.stage. The only sensible option here is tighter regulation rather
:12:15. > :12:21.
:12:21. > :12:31.How big an issue is those poor people coming to ask for help?
:12:31. > :12:38.Citizens Advice dealt with �37 million of debt in the previous
:12:38. > :12:43.year and only a small amount were pay day loans. The majority was
:12:43. > :12:49.credit card loans. A report last week showed that millions of
:12:49. > :12:54.Britons over the Christmas period may use pay day loans and hence the
:12:54. > :13:04.publicity. I think pay day loans are beginning to cause problems
:13:04. > :13:04.
:13:04. > :13:14.where people are facing a wider debt picture. Are they easier to
:13:14. > :13:14.
:13:14. > :13:24.get up than a credit card? The OFT is currently looking at how it
:13:24. > :13:28.
:13:28. > :13:34.these pay day loans are regulated. The application process is
:13:34. > :13:38.different for each kind and section 5 of the Consumer Credit Act
:13:38. > :13:45.regulates how people are able to apply and if you apply online there
:13:45. > :13:49.are questions as to whether this constitutes a regulated agreement.
:13:49. > :13:58.And they would be questions as to whether a credit check has been
:13:58. > :14:04.established which is reliable and robust enough. So I think pay day
:14:04. > :14:10.loans are coming on line in terms of whether it they are a viable
:14:10. > :14:13.kind of credit. The Justice Minister may be glad to see the
:14:13. > :14:20.back of question time this year as he seems to bear the brunt of most
:14:20. > :14:25.ill-temper from other members. Today he tackled questions on a
:14:25. > :14:30.possible Police Museum. Up first was the Education Minister and have
:14:30. > :14:35.you ever wondered what marks a school lead for closure and what
:14:35. > :14:41.marks the definition of a rural school? Rural schools are the heart
:14:41. > :14:46.of their communities and it will leave a huge gap in that area it is
:14:46. > :14:53.closed. Can the minister advise as to what Lee weight is given to
:14:53. > :14:58.rural school that finds itself in an unsustainable position? In terms
:14:58. > :15:01.of choice of language, if we have from rural school in an
:15:02. > :15:07.unsustainable position but it begs the question as to why we should
:15:07. > :15:12.maintain that school. We have to ensure that we do not allow the
:15:12. > :15:18.majority of our rural schools to reach that condition. The
:15:18. > :15:24.sustainable schools policy does allow for pariah the and the needs
:15:24. > :15:32.of rural communities to be taken into consideration -- allows for
:15:32. > :15:37.plurality. A school is considered rural air It is outside Belfast
:15:37. > :15:45.City Council area or outside the urban area of Derry City Council,
:15:45. > :15:55.said the vast majority of schools are classified as rural. But then
:15:55. > :16:00.primary schools are based on 140, rural primary schools are based on
:16:00. > :16:08.105, taking into account the accessibility of the community is
:16:08. > :16:12.also important. Rural communities will be able to bring forward any
:16:12. > :16:16.relevant information to the needs and requirements of that community
:16:16. > :16:23.and why a specific school should remain. But all decisions will have
:16:23. > :16:30.to be based on the needs of the pupils in the school. We cannot
:16:30. > :16:34.plan our future education system on the needs of school buildings.
:16:34. > :16:41.up, academic selection, and to his pain for some schools to run their
:16:42. > :16:51.tests. Does the Department have concerns about the legality of
:16:52. > :16:55.
:16:55. > :16:59.schools charging pupils to sit tests? While the school is funded
:16:59. > :17:04.by it a private donor, and it appears that is the case in a
:17:04. > :17:09.number of circumstances, that a private donor is being used to fund
:17:09. > :17:15.the tests. Walid the school of parents are covering the cost
:17:15. > :17:22.themselves. The fact is that parents are being charged to excess
:17:22. > :17:26.a publicly-funded education. Even more worrying, parents are being
:17:26. > :17:31.charged to beat rejected and their children are being charged to be
:17:31. > :17:38.rejected from publicly funded education. That is a matter of
:17:38. > :17:42.concern for us all because we have held on to the right to education
:17:42. > :17:49.free at the point of delivery amicably have a case where a number
:17:49. > :17:53.of schools are charging or a private donor is covering the cost
:17:53. > :17:59.to allow a child into a school or to say that a child will not come
:17:59. > :18:04.into that school. It is a matter I intend to further investigate.
:18:04. > :18:11.up, David Ford was asked about progress on the planned policed
:18:11. > :18:15.Museum. I continue to fully support the creation of a police museum but
:18:15. > :18:21.there remain some issues to be resolved before the business case
:18:21. > :18:31.can be approved and submitted. There are outstanding questions in
:18:31. > :18:33.
:18:33. > :18:38.terms of running costs and planning issues. To say I am disappointed
:18:39. > :18:44.would be an understatement. I have to impress upon the minister that
:18:44. > :18:49.he needs to take personal control of this. There is a clear feeling
:18:50. > :18:57.that officials are procrastinating, delaying, some would suggest
:18:57. > :19:02.deliberately so... Question, please! I would ask the Minister to
:19:02. > :19:09.make this one of his priority schemes and have a moving forward.
:19:09. > :19:16.I did make it clear that I personally net in July and my
:19:16. > :19:23.officials have been following the matter up. The reality is that
:19:23. > :19:28.business cases do have to be met. The issues relating to matters like
:19:28. > :19:34.planning also have been met. That is my ambition but it is not
:19:34. > :19:38.something the department can deliver on its own. Finally, will
:19:38. > :19:47.the Minister be taking action against republican protesters who
:19:47. > :19:54.camped outside 28 Fred prison last month? The department became aware
:19:54. > :19:59.that there were plans for the protest. Following discussions, it
:19:59. > :20:05.was decided to facilitate a peaceful protest in the grounds of
:20:05. > :20:10.Maghaberry present in alliance with the Convention on Human Rights.
:20:10. > :20:14.Officials attempted to make contact with the organisers of the protest
:20:14. > :20:19.in order to establish boundaries which would facilitate the protest.
:20:19. > :20:24.No response was received. The government arrange for notices to
:20:24. > :20:29.be protest did -- to be posted making clear that the protest was
:20:29. > :20:33.be conducted peacefully, without Fred to any persons, and must not
:20:33. > :20:38.present a threat to the court order of the prison. During the protest
:20:38. > :20:47.there was a minor it damage to property but there were no injuries
:20:47. > :20:51.to police or prison officers. We are currently examining CCTV
:20:51. > :20:55.footage of the protest. Any evidence of criminal behaviour by
:20:55. > :21:00.individuals will be a matter to be followed up by the police service
:21:00. > :21:07.and the Prosecution Service. All prisoners were given �five phone
:21:07. > :21:12.credit in order to keep in contact with their families while visits
:21:12. > :21:19.were suspended. That phone credit was paid from the prisoners amenity
:21:19. > :21:24.Fund. During the debate on the pay day loans today, their boss some
:21:24. > :21:29.advice from various MLAs. One suggested it was better to go to a
:21:29. > :21:34.credit union, another suggested overdrafts. What would your advice
:21:35. > :21:38.be? Our advice would be that there are cheaper ways to borrow than pay
:21:38. > :21:43.day loans. There are complaints about the charges people are
:21:43. > :21:49.incurring from their banks. That makes them extremely unpopular. I
:21:49. > :21:54.was surprised to hear that appearing on the floor today.
:21:54. > :22:01.Currently, credit unions are not regulated, that is coming in in
:22:01. > :22:06.20th April 12. Our message would be due not overstretch yourself. It is
:22:06. > :22:09.a long time to the next pay-day from the middle of December to do
:22:09. > :22:16.middle of January. Where should people go, should they go and talk
:22:16. > :22:22.to their bank manager if they have a bank account? An independent
:22:22. > :22:27.financial adviser would be what we would recommend. We can refer them
:22:28. > :22:32.to do financial ombudsman's service if they had been taken advantage of.
:22:32. > :22:38.Complaints can be taken by a individuals if they feel they have
:22:38. > :22:42.been treated unfairly. We would say keep an eye on your finances. If
:22:42. > :22:48.you do have a number of debts, a pay day loans can put you in a
:22:48. > :22:53.position that you would not expect. It is the time of year to look back
:22:53. > :22:57.and reflect and who better to give us a sense of assembly business
:22:57. > :23:02.than a political correspondent? There are those who will tell you
:23:02. > :23:08.that nothing happens appear on the hill, but that is not quite true.
:23:08. > :23:14.He is my history of what has been happening. Since September there
:23:14. > :23:21.have been 27 plenary sittings of the assembly, a total of 72 motions
:23:21. > :23:26.have been debated, 64 of which were carried. 65,400 questions were
:23:26. > :23:31.tabled for written and oral answer. I am afraid not a single bill was
:23:32. > :23:38.passed. On the plus side, at the programme for government was agreed
:23:38. > :23:41.and is out for consultation. Not a single MLA managed to get himself
:23:41. > :23:48.suspended during this term there there was some bad behaviour in the
:23:48. > :23:52.public gallery last week. That is the first time such a thing has
:23:52. > :23:58.happened in the history of the assembly. He won name for your
:23:58. > :24:04.poetic genius in the political unit and you have penned a special one
:24:04. > :24:09.for Russ. Modestly, I have to agree with you! What better way to
:24:09. > :24:16.reflect what has been happening in the assembly than with some poetic
:24:16. > :24:25.justice, with a festive twist? It was that night before Christmas and
:24:25. > :24:31.all through the House not eight MLA stirred. Through the doors that
:24:31. > :24:37.Peter Martin and their festive crystal ball. First the not in
:24:37. > :24:45.Gwent -- inconsequential matter of the presidential election. Martin
:24:45. > :24:50.escaped to the land of Nana. Martin raised to farce. Come, come, said
:24:51. > :24:59.Peter, it is still them and us. Peter said, a little bit too loud,
:24:59. > :25:05.you are no Gerald date. Coming dangerously close to making a scene,
:25:05. > :25:13.Peter asked, would the minister meet the Queen? Never, and roared
:25:13. > :25:18.Martin. You know, said Peter, you sound just like the dock. Both men
:25:19. > :25:27.tested an absent friend. It is the season to be memory, Peter tasted
:25:27. > :25:34.gym, and Martin tasted Jerry. should rename him our poetic
:25:34. > :25:41.correspondent! Since it is the season of goodwill we decided to
:25:41. > :25:46.ask some of our MLAs to play Secret Santa, their task being to choose a
:25:46. > :25:55.present for a fellow MLA. He is what they said, company by the
:25:55. > :26:03.choir from Newtownards Model Primary School. One thing I would
:26:03. > :26:10.like for Christmas is a couple of tickets for Westlife's farewell
:26:10. > :26:20.tour. They are in Croke Park and other places in 2012. And they are
:26:20. > :26:23.
:26:23. > :26:27.a good group. I would laugh a brand new iPad2, thank you very much! I
:26:27. > :26:33.watch my colleague using this in the assembly, and I think it is an
:26:33. > :26:43.amazing device. So anybody out there thinking of buying me a
:26:43. > :26:44.
:26:44. > :26:48.present, and nice iPad2 would be very much appreciated! If you could
:26:48. > :26:55.be Secret Santa this year, he would you choose to buy a present form
:26:55. > :26:59.what would it be. I was thinking about this. At the end of the day,
:26:59. > :27:09.there are few people day you could buy presents for but definitely
:27:09. > :27:12.
:27:12. > :27:20.fake smile for Michael. It would do him no harm around Christmas.
:27:20. > :27:24.Obviously, I would have to buy a gym a high quality bottle of red
:27:24. > :27:30.wine, mainly in the hope that he would give it back to me, as he
:27:30. > :27:37.does not drink! It would be difficult but out of duty to my
:27:37. > :27:47.constituents who would have to produce 107 p 45 so because I do
:27:47. > :27:49.
:27:49. > :27:56.have to say that this place is a shambles. And, of course, other
:27:56. > :28:02.tablet devices are available. People do tend to spend a lot of
:28:02. > :28:12.money, particularly in the last few weeks. Any advice, without spoiling
:28:12. > :28:12.
:28:12. > :28:18.Christmas? Thought for a kiss. Time spent together. Consider how long