:00:24. > :00:26.Hello and welcome to Stormont Today on the day that the Alliance leader,
:00:27. > :00:28.David Ford, made his final appearance at the despatch box
:00:29. > :00:33.And Welfare Reform - it hasn't gone away, you know.
:00:34. > :00:35.So, tonight, the wide-ranging Justice Number 2 Bill
:00:36. > :00:47.completes its passage through the House.
:00:48. > :00:52.We have increased the maximum offences and ensure that Northern
:00:53. > :00:54.Ireland actually has the toughest penalties for these reprehensible
:00:55. > :00:57.crimes. MLAs finally pass the Welfare Reform
:00:58. > :01:09.regulations agreed in It is appropriate that we go back to
:01:10. > :01:13.an issue that has in some ways defined this mandate, the issue of
:01:14. > :01:15.need. And joining me with his thought's
:01:16. > :01:17.on today's developments When he got the job in 2010,
:01:18. > :01:25.David Ford was Northern Ireland's first Justice Minister since 1972,
:01:26. > :01:27.when Westminster took policing powers away from the old
:01:28. > :01:29.Stormont government. Today was his last day
:01:30. > :01:33.at the despatch box in the role. Not only did he have a final
:01:34. > :01:36.question time to get through, he also brought the final stage
:01:37. > :01:38.of the Justice Number 2 bill Mr Ford said the bill contains some
:01:39. > :01:42.of the most significant reforms to the justice system,
:01:43. > :01:58.not only during his time First and foremost, the bill creates
:01:59. > :02:02.a radically reformed approach to the enforcement of financial penalties.
:02:03. > :02:12.It increases options for offenders to pay their fines. As one as
:02:13. > :02:16.providing better options for debtors who cannot pay their fine, the Bill
:02:17. > :02:18.provides cover sanctions for wilful default is worried is clear they
:02:19. > :02:25.will not pay. These include incidents Agassiz provision to
:02:26. > :02:31.access a debtor 's bank account and seize vehicles. We have improved
:02:32. > :02:35.animal welfare in this bill by including and ensuring that Northern
:02:36. > :02:39.Ireland has actually the toughest penalties for these reprehensible
:02:40. > :02:44.crimes of any region in the silence. But of course we should not just be
:02:45. > :02:50.concerned about and welfare. A big reduction is enhanced by extreme
:02:51. > :02:53.pornographic images, new arrangements of Lay visitors to all
:02:54. > :02:58.police stations, the committee 's provisions and introduced by Mr Ross
:02:59. > :03:02.on revenge pornography and Mr freeze amendments on tax and Ambler 's
:03:03. > :03:08.workers. We have undertaken an impressive workload which might
:03:09. > :03:12.criminal justice system in Northern Ireland, not least by the recent
:03:13. > :03:17.report which concluded on the just and digital airy age which is a
:03:18. > :03:20.series of recommendations regarding innovative approaches that could be
:03:21. > :03:24.up. Did in Northern Ireland was about it we have made a constructive
:03:25. > :03:29.role in the constructive could in Northern Ireland. We have come up
:03:30. > :03:32.with a number of absolutely achievable recommendations that we
:03:33. > :03:35.believe should be part of an export of them and the figures are doubly
:03:36. > :03:42.pleasing that we have managed to get the level of consensus on those
:03:43. > :03:45.areas as well. People outside the bubbly don't realise the
:03:46. > :03:56.significance of the justice in the two Bill but it is significant and
:03:57. > :04:00.the reason why it is significant is that if the new fines collection
:04:01. > :04:07.system is properly and fully implemented it will mean thousands
:04:08. > :04:10.of people will not go to prison. It will mean that space will be freed
:04:11. > :04:19.up. It will mean that the pressure in the prison system which is
:04:20. > :04:22.suffering from very considerable pressures, Mr Deputy Speaker, that
:04:23. > :04:30.pressure will in fact the East. We have to find better ways of dealing
:04:31. > :04:36.with the nonpayment of fines for cases such as TV licensing and other
:04:37. > :04:42.incidences rather than the present option of sending people to jail and
:04:43. > :04:49.the Coral records that ensue and also the considerable cost involved
:04:50. > :04:52.but that will be clearly a matter for the new mandate and progress I
:04:53. > :04:55.know has already been made per degree in respect of TV licensing.
:04:56. > :04:59.Given the a good wishes that refer to make I'd be going somewhere I
:05:00. > :05:07.should like to lick it clear that the Taoiseach has not nominated me,
:05:08. > :05:10.the last off right to have a seat in the House of Lords came through the
:05:11. > :05:16.then leader of the Ulster Unionist Party in 2005 and I have not had one
:05:17. > :05:19.since and as far as I am concerned, subject to the wishes of the good
:05:20. > :05:22.people of South Antrim, I have every intention of going nowhere at all
:05:23. > :05:23.but coming back year after the election.
:05:24. > :05:26.So while David Ford is determined to return to the Assembly,
:05:27. > :05:28.he has already announced he won't be seeking the Justice job
:05:29. > :05:31.Unsurprisingly, following the dissident republican attack
:05:32. > :05:34.in East Belfast earlier this month, the safety and recruitment of prison
:05:35. > :05:39.officers featured during his final question time.
:05:40. > :05:46.What work can be done to get recruits from areas such as North
:05:47. > :05:50.Belfast but I represent, these people these evil people must never
:05:51. > :05:53.be allowed to win and they cannot be seen to win. All I can be done to
:05:54. > :05:57.attract representatives from across the community must be done by the
:05:58. > :06:02.Northern Ireland prison service to ensure that the prison service is
:06:03. > :06:06.indeed reflective of society. Can I thank Mr Humphrey for his
:06:07. > :06:12.condemnation of the attack on Friday week ago. I met the prison officers
:06:13. > :06:16.family that day. I have since had the opportunity to meet him, I am
:06:17. > :06:19.pleased to say he's making a reasonable recovery from his
:06:20. > :06:21.injuries but that attack must be condemned and I welcome the
:06:22. > :06:26.condemnation which I know would come from the part of this house. One
:06:27. > :06:30.does need to be ever in terms of how we talk about recruitment to insure
:06:31. > :06:34.that we do not get away from the basic principle of recruitment on
:06:35. > :06:37.merit. The key issue is to ensure that people are encouraged to apply
:06:38. > :06:41.from every part of the community and that is what I believe has been
:06:42. > :06:45.carried out. I shall the Minister will agree it is important that the
:06:46. > :06:50.prison service reflects the entire community in its workforce. Can I
:06:51. > :06:54.ask the Mr Watt percentage of Catholic and female recruits, what
:06:55. > :07:03.the percentage is? The last figures I saw at the point in June of 2012,
:07:04. > :07:07.80% of staff were seen as Protestant and 79% were male. There has been a
:07:08. > :07:13.significant turnaround but I cannot give the most recent recruitments
:07:14. > :07:19.but by March of 2016, the overall numbers who were Protestant was
:07:20. > :07:22.simply at 78%, so still a very high proportion of all been as of
:07:23. > :07:29.recruits has changed slightly and at that stage the numbers of males was
:07:30. > :07:35.down to 72% from 79%, so modest progress certainly. The intakes have
:07:36. > :07:38.been more representative but overall, given the limited and this
:07:39. > :07:45.will have been recruited, it is not made a huge difference. The threat
:07:46. > :07:48.to prison officers stand at severe, as it has since the point of
:07:49. > :07:52.devolution but in my time as Minister I have attended the funeral
:07:53. > :07:59.of David Black, a murdered prison officer, I have attended the funeral
:08:00. > :08:03.of Roland Kirk, a murdered prison officer, as well as others who have
:08:04. > :08:08.died in the course of duty. And to members of God as were murdered by
:08:09. > :08:15.terrorist operating on across border bases. We should acknowledge that
:08:16. > :08:18.there is a cigarette can problem with those of not accept this
:08:19. > :08:23.society ruled on that we should ensure we provide support for those
:08:24. > :08:27.who are leading the fight to ensure that we become a normal society most
:08:28. > :08:29.bitterly those who wear prison and police uniforms.
:08:30. > :08:31.David Ford, and Chris Donnelly is with me now.
:08:32. > :08:34.Members are dealing with important legislation right up to the wire
:08:35. > :08:46.Yes, and we saw today. David Ford getting the second Justice Bill
:08:47. > :08:52.through. It is a wide-ranging bill. Increasing sanctions as well is
:08:53. > :08:57.making a specific offence attacking Ambler 's work in the line of duty.
:08:58. > :09:03.I think there is another area in terms of trying to reduce pressures
:09:04. > :09:06.on police and prison services in terms of nonpayment of fines and
:09:07. > :09:09.that is now being transferred to civilian agency and there is an egg
:09:10. > :09:14.and of reading flexible at year-round arranging repayments of
:09:15. > :09:18.the less people got on the custodial route, sentencing, so I think you
:09:19. > :09:20.should see that they have responded to pressures that exist within the
:09:21. > :09:25.system and we will seal that Arafat does prove to be effective. Some
:09:26. > :09:29.people are very supportive of our progressive approach to the justice
:09:30. > :09:35.system but there are the people who regard that frankly as going soft on
:09:36. > :09:38.cruel justice. Yes, that certainly does exist out there but
:09:39. > :09:42.unfortunately when the pressures do come to bear on both the police and
:09:43. > :09:45.prison services and we know that both have been in the public eye
:09:46. > :09:49.over issues in the last period of time and therefore I think that
:09:50. > :09:52.there are does seem to be a consensus both within the Justice
:09:53. > :09:56.committee and to the Department of the executive that this is a way to
:09:57. > :09:59.go at the moment. It was David Ford 's last day as a minister in the
:10:00. > :10:05.chamber. How do you think he has a mini job over the last five, nearly
:10:06. > :10:09.six years? The report made reference to he's the first Justice Minister
:10:10. > :10:12.for quite a period of time. I think history is gone to record that he
:10:13. > :10:15.stepped up to the plate at the time. It was not the first time that David
:10:16. > :10:21.Ford 's leadership made an intervention that kept the wheels in
:10:22. > :10:26.motion. We know that from 2001 money executive could have collapsed, he
:10:27. > :10:30.led the party in a number of figures to give it another year and at that
:10:31. > :10:35.time, I do think it is more unlikely the David Ford is going to take the
:10:36. > :10:39.role May but it will more be another alliance member. I think history
:10:40. > :10:42.will record that he did do a confident job. It is interesting
:10:43. > :10:48.that you think that alliance will take the role. The party has been
:10:49. > :10:50.quite cagey about that so far. I was asking my only long bedevilled the
:10:51. > :10:56.leader about it on Sunday politics last week. She was not prepared to
:10:57. > :10:59.be drawn. I think the party, no one is good show their hand at this time
:11:00. > :11:05.but I think the have benefited in the last 15 years from being seen to
:11:06. > :11:09.play a certain role that has allowed the institutions to stay alive, I
:11:10. > :11:15.think in our electoral sense, no more than Naomi Long, herself,
:11:16. > :11:19.staying playing a constructive role. Alliance will more likely least
:11:20. > :11:22.ever. If not, Naomi Long crabs Stephen Ferry, someone also has been
:11:23. > :11:27.tried and tested as a minister in a has mended. Arguably much.
:11:28. > :11:30.Thanks, Chris - we'll hear more from you later in the programme.
:11:31. > :11:32.The Enterprise Minister also faced question time today and,
:11:33. > :11:35.in what's become something of a trend of late, he was asked
:11:36. > :11:36.for his views on June's EU referendum.
:11:37. > :11:39.Jonathan Bell was asked if his party's position in favour
:11:40. > :11:41.of a Brexit runs contrary to the views of many figures
:11:42. > :11:51.Can the Minister provide an update on what discussions he has held with
:11:52. > :11:57.local stakeholders such as the CBI, FSB and manufacturing and I saw that
:11:58. > :12:02.as economy Minister he remains able to represent the views of local
:12:03. > :12:06.business leaders? I have met on a number of occasions with the
:12:07. > :12:11.Federation of small business, I have met Mr Gover than of the CBI and
:12:12. > :12:16.most recently I was in Bushmills with the chamber of, as and Anne
:12:17. > :12:21.McGregor and interesting about particular function, and McGregor
:12:22. > :12:28.said in her conversations with members most members, the majority
:12:29. > :12:32.of members, were full vote leave. How many potential investors have
:12:33. > :12:34.actually said to you Minister that they would like to see Northern
:12:35. > :12:43.Ireland outside of the European Union? This question was asked
:12:44. > :12:45.actually of our law just single investor in Northern Ireland and the
:12:46. > :12:51.United States consulate in Belfast and they asked Andrew O'Brien the
:12:52. > :12:58.question and he answered it very clearly that he had nobody saying,
:12:59. > :13:02.no knowledge that people from the United States would stop investing
:13:03. > :13:08.in Northern Ireland Bewley on the basis of the situation within the
:13:09. > :13:13.European Union. I think in all of my trips that we have done, the three
:13:14. > :13:18.things that have come across very clearly is that Northern Ireland is
:13:19. > :13:23.one of the best talent pools in the world, that the costs of doing
:13:24. > :13:29.business in Northern Ireland is our somewhat 84% of doing business in
:13:30. > :13:35.the rest of the UK and the fact that from the 1st of April 2018, we will
:13:36. > :13:39.have a corporation tax rate of 12.5%, the most competitive rate of
:13:40. > :13:45.corporation tax in Western Europe. Those are the three factors that
:13:46. > :13:50.seem to be taken hold of from Asia to America right throughout the
:13:51. > :13:58.Middle East and it is on that basis that I think Northern Ireland will
:13:59. > :14:02.continue to grow its economy. It would in fact be liberating for our
:14:03. > :14:08.trade and for enterprise to be free of the shackles of the European
:14:09. > :14:11.Union. Instantly we would be liberated from EU regulation which
:14:12. > :14:17.even the commission has admonished cost 4% of GDP and of course we
:14:18. > :14:24.would be freed to form our own trade deals with the growth parts of the
:14:25. > :14:28.world rather than tied to the declining EU. With the Minister
:14:29. > :14:33.agree go to mark people know my own parties could position but I think
:14:34. > :14:38.that mole and put more into is not standard to scrutiny. If Wittig
:14:39. > :14:42.regional funds, out of which we get dedicated peace money at known as
:14:43. > :14:48.cat, we are still operating at a loss. Open Europe is estimating that
:14:49. > :14:54.for this pot that we get ?1 back for every pounds 58 we put in. And for
:14:55. > :14:58.2016, the Office for Budget Responsibility estimates a net UK
:14:59. > :15:06.contribution of nine and a half billion pounds overall it's
:15:07. > :15:10.forecasting an increase of 3.1% billion pounds in total
:15:11. > :15:13.contributions in the next five years. I imagine hard-working
:15:14. > :15:15.families will not be any better off financially than they were before
:15:16. > :15:18.the reform process started. Jonathan Bell making the case
:15:19. > :15:21.for the UK leaving the EU. David Ford may have been dealing
:15:22. > :15:24.with business in the House for the final time today,
:15:25. > :15:26.but he certainly wasn't slacking as he presented a report on children
:15:27. > :15:28.in the justice system The outgoing Justice Minister wants
:15:29. > :15:44.the treatment of children to be less Lee Probert a proposal put forward
:15:45. > :15:49.under this echoes the calls for the committee on the rates of the child
:15:50. > :15:54.and the youth Justice review. It is to raise the minimum age of criminal
:15:55. > :15:57.responsibility. I am fully aware not all parties yet agree with the need
:15:58. > :16:02.to do this but we should not ignore the fact that this change is
:16:03. > :16:07.strongly advocated unsupported by experts in the youth justice across
:16:08. > :16:10.Northern Ireland, these islands and internationally. It would take
:16:11. > :16:13.vulnerable young children entirely out of the game out of criminal
:16:14. > :16:19.Justice and offending behaviour would be addressed in a different
:16:20. > :16:22.way, as in most countries in Europe. I am very proud of the strides
:16:23. > :16:27.forward made in youth justice primarily as part of the youth
:16:28. > :16:31.Justice reviewed. However, it is clear there is more to do and
:16:32. > :16:35.fundamental questions remain about how we react to the worst behaved
:16:36. > :16:38.and most troubled children that caused the greatest harm within
:16:39. > :16:43.communities and whether the punitive approach we have traditionally taken
:16:44. > :16:46.as the best way to encourage them to change their behaviour. While
:16:47. > :16:52.supporting the general thrust of what the Minister has said
:16:53. > :16:55.particularly the problems, can I seek an assurance that we are
:16:56. > :16:59.principally talking about young people accused of non-violent,
:17:00. > :17:02.low-level offending, and if that young person poses a threat to the
:17:03. > :17:07.community they will be detained in the traditional way. The intention
:17:08. > :17:13.of having two separate custodial orders as to ensure we can deal with
:17:14. > :17:17.more difficult and even violent offences and a different way, and
:17:18. > :17:22.that clearly will have an effect on the issue of Beale, but the no
:17:23. > :17:26.reasonable prospect test is a key issue as to how we address this, and
:17:27. > :17:31.if there are concerns about violence, that will not be the same
:17:32. > :17:33.case as many of the issues which currently result in young people
:17:34. > :17:39.going into custody. The Minister will be well aware of the Green
:17:40. > :17:42.party support for an increase in the minimum age of criminal
:17:43. > :17:45.responsibility. Can he outlined far as the harm that is being done to
:17:46. > :17:54.both the children themselves and the wider society by those who resist a
:17:55. > :17:58.change in what is one of the lower stages of criminal responsibility in
:17:59. > :18:02.Europe? There a danger that the small numbers of young people,
:18:03. > :18:06.particularly with the couple of years above the minimum age, who
:18:07. > :18:10.come into contact with the criminal justice system in Northern Ireland,
:18:11. > :18:15.and we're talking about something like 20-30 young people in any year,
:18:16. > :18:20.who are in real danger because of the way we currently operate, of
:18:21. > :18:25.getting swept into a circumstance that leads them to further difficult
:18:26. > :18:29.offending behaviour, and by raising the minimum age and ensuring we
:18:30. > :18:35.moved to an appropriate care method which deals with what is almost
:18:36. > :18:38.certainly in the case of ten and 11-year-olds, an underlying family
:18:39. > :18:42.problem, we are much more likely to address it than by treating children
:18:43. > :18:46.who have been left in some sort of state of dysfunctional family or
:18:47. > :18:51.difficult relationships, or mental health problems. They are much more
:18:52. > :18:53.danger than if we treat them with purely criminal sanctions.
:18:54. > :18:55.David Ford, making his final Ministerial appearance in the House.
:18:56. > :18:58.It's very possibly been the issue that's defined this mandate -
:18:59. > :19:00.the reform of the welfare system in Northern Ireland.
:19:01. > :19:02.Today, the Social Development Minister brought the draft welfare
:19:03. > :19:04.regulations to the floor of the Assembly.
:19:05. > :19:06.Lord Morrow explained how the changes to the system agreed
:19:07. > :19:13.in the Fresh Start Agreement will be implemented.
:19:14. > :19:20.These regulations will enable the Department to instigate payments are
:19:21. > :19:27.affected by the benefit gap and employment and support allowance,
:19:28. > :19:31.the benefit cap will restrict the total amount of benefits paid to a
:19:32. > :19:43.household to 26,000, and the cap will be applied through a claimant's
:19:44. > :19:49.housing benefit. Out of work and child related benefits will be
:19:50. > :19:53.included when calculating. Except we have the support component has been
:19:54. > :19:58.awarded. A household is exempt from the benefit cap if they are entitled
:19:59. > :20:03.to working tax credits or a range of disability benefits. The people
:20:04. > :20:07.involved in the fresh start agreement have deliver the package
:20:08. > :20:14.which I believe is quite clearly second to none. I think that is
:20:15. > :20:19.important to state. We would have loved to have been able to do more
:20:20. > :20:24.but I have heard a lot of other commentary and empty rhetoric makes
:20:25. > :20:27.for a empty purses and this puts money in the peoples pockets and I
:20:28. > :20:35.am pleased we can stand over that today. Some have been receiving very
:20:36. > :20:40.large amounts of benefits and the information given to the committee
:20:41. > :20:46.shows that some have been earning over ?47,000 per year to a
:20:47. > :20:51.household, and this legislation will give that a degree of protection but
:20:52. > :20:58.what everyone needs to recognise going forward is that there are no
:20:59. > :21:04.certainties. In one way, Mr Speaker, it is appropriate that at the very
:21:05. > :21:10.last hours of this mandate, that we go back to an issue that has in some
:21:11. > :21:21.ways define this mandate. The issue of meat, of welfare of dogma. --
:21:22. > :21:26.need. The authority of this assembly in those matters, and the outcomes
:21:27. > :21:34.we have now reached. It is one of the most obnoxious proposals that
:21:35. > :21:41.there should be special points Kevin to perpetrators of terrorism, to V
:21:42. > :21:46.makers, who in order to protect the benefits, they should be gifted an
:21:47. > :21:55.extra four points when they are transferring across to PIP, to make
:21:56. > :21:59.sure they do not suffer. And obnoxious proposals. These measures
:22:00. > :22:03.are unique to Northern Ireland and demonstrate our dedication to
:22:04. > :22:07.protecting the most vulnerable in our society putting is ahead of the
:22:08. > :22:15.rest of the UK and efforts to do so. For the measures to mitigate will
:22:16. > :22:20.form are being prepared and will be presented to the executive following
:22:21. > :22:23.the election because there is no time to do it before and I have
:22:24. > :22:26.already outlined why that is the case, and I would take this
:22:27. > :22:31.opportunity despite members for their interest in the regulations
:22:32. > :22:36.and I hope they would support them to a low mitigation payments to be
:22:37. > :22:39.made to those affected by the benefit cap and unemployment and
:22:40. > :22:41.support allowance measures. I commend the motion to the house.
:22:42. > :22:43.The Social Development Minister, Lord Morrow, who also delivered
:22:44. > :22:46.the stark message to the House that ?6.5 billion is needed to bring
:22:47. > :22:48.Housing Executive homes up to an acceptable standard
:22:49. > :22:52.He told his fellow MLAs that if the Assembly fails to meet
:22:53. > :22:54.the challenge, future Ministers could very well oversee
:22:55. > :22:55.the deterioration of the Housing Executive's stock
:22:56. > :23:05.and the long-term decline of the organisation itself.
:23:06. > :23:13.Over the next 30 years the Housing executive should invest 6.7 billion
:23:14. > :23:19.to bring all its forms up to an acceptable standard than keep them
:23:20. > :23:25.in that condition. Because a backlog of maintenance work has been built
:23:26. > :23:33.up, 1.5 billion should be spent in the five years from 2015-16. This
:23:34. > :23:38.backlog has grown because we should be spending what is available rather
:23:39. > :23:45.than what is needed. These are huge sums of money, only part of this can
:23:46. > :23:50.be covered from the rental income collected by the Housing executive.
:23:51. > :23:55.It will also need a massive injection of extra capital,
:23:56. > :23:59.somewhere between 470 and ?700 million, to address the backlog. The
:24:00. > :24:04.Housing challenge in the next mandate will be finding and agreeing
:24:05. > :24:08.a way of giving the Housing executive the ability to borrow for
:24:09. > :24:12.the future of the Housing executive as a major social landlord for the
:24:13. > :24:18.sustainable long-term future of the 88,000 homes that it provides. This
:24:19. > :24:23.is the Minister will be away and all, we're in the next week or so
:24:24. > :24:27.that there has been a clear focus on the need for the provision of social
:24:28. > :24:32.housing throughout the course of this entire mandate just passed. It
:24:33. > :24:35.has also included in our legacy report a call to the incoming
:24:36. > :24:40.Department of the communities to address this matter as a matter of
:24:41. > :24:43.urgency and speaking on behalf of my own party, I think it is important
:24:44. > :24:48.to recognise that the essence of this statement is the recognition of
:24:49. > :24:52.the need to reclaim the Housing executive as a provider for social
:24:53. > :24:56.housing and I very much welcome that in the statement, although I do want
:24:57. > :25:02.to see the situation moving forward from hope to intent. Borrowing has
:25:03. > :25:05.to be paid for and the Northern Ireland executive has already
:25:06. > :25:10.borrowed considerably more per head of population than other regions and
:25:11. > :25:16.my question to the Minister is, how is the borrowing to be paid for?
:25:17. > :25:21.There has to be what I would call some blue sky thinking in relation
:25:22. > :25:27.to how housing is done in future and how it is financed. I am sure the
:25:28. > :25:34.member is well aware that in fact what has gone before, while it did
:25:35. > :25:40.do its job up to a point, it will not do it in the future. The depth
:25:41. > :25:48.of the problem is quite staggering and that we are told that the Next
:25:49. > :25:54.Generation, ?6.7 billion requires to be spent on housing executive
:25:55. > :25:57.properties. It prompts the question, who has been in charge for the last
:25:58. > :26:03.five years that we have got to this point? I don't think it has been
:26:04. > :26:06.neglect on the part of the ministers of the past but rather it has maybe
:26:07. > :26:09.been something to do with the lack of funding which is not going to get
:26:10. > :26:10.any better than the days ahead. Lord Morrow on the harsh realities
:26:11. > :26:13.of his departmental budget, and Chris Donnelly joins
:26:14. > :26:25.me for a final word. I know you're watching proceedings
:26:26. > :26:29.with interest. How do you think you dead in his capacity as leader for
:26:30. > :26:37.the first time? It was a good decision to have the confidence. I
:26:38. > :26:40.could see him trying to define the party around himself at the moment
:26:41. > :26:44.with a couple of key phrases he is building the party around and we
:26:45. > :26:49.have had the progressive nationalism which fell a little better than the
:26:50. > :26:53.positioning of fatal abnormality and he seems to be outmanoeuvred by some
:26:54. > :26:58.of the more traditional elements, but he is making Northern Ireland
:26:59. > :27:03.work and I think he has found that, trying to suggest that Sinn Fein and
:27:04. > :27:07.a bit light on policy and the SDLP might want to come in with the
:27:08. > :27:14.number of strategic positions and they might seek to expose Sinn Fein
:27:15. > :27:18.on them. As we seek to move towards the election the intriguing thing to
:27:19. > :27:21.look out for is the battle with them nationalism for seats. Can you
:27:22. > :27:28.really put a blade of grass between Sinn Fein and the SDLP only a lot of
:27:29. > :27:32.key policy areas? The two parties, since Sinn Fein move towards a more
:27:33. > :27:37.constitutional position, they are close together, and Sinn Fein will
:27:38. > :27:40.play they are an all Ireland party, and the problem here is finding as
:27:41. > :27:46.he needs to find a space to define the SDLP. One of the interesting
:27:47. > :27:49.things he said was that if he didn't get what he wanted out of the
:27:50. > :27:52.programme for government he might lead the party in opposition. That
:27:53. > :27:57.would then start to define where they stood. And it is going to be
:27:58. > :28:06.intriguing and a number of key constituencies that battle, not
:28:07. > :28:10.least, in his home city of Derry, because Martin McGuinness is trying
:28:11. > :28:17.to move back the from mid-Ulster. The main thing he needs is some kind
:28:18. > :28:22.of victory, and trying to make the next battle ground for this
:28:23. > :28:25.election, they have offered an opportunity to get a win, and that
:28:26. > :28:30.is why I thought it was quite strange when Sinn Fein decided to
:28:31. > :28:37.move Martin McGuinness. It is a win- lose if Martin McGuinness doesn't
:28:38. > :28:42.secure the site feet, seat, and that would be a tremendous statement to
:28:43. > :28:47.launch on, the counter narrative. The point is somebody else could
:28:48. > :28:52.lose the seat? Martin McGuinness is winning, it is whether Sinn Fein
:28:53. > :28:57.return three. If they went three, that would condemn eastward to the
:28:58. > :29:01.fate of former SDLP leaders. That is it for tonight but join me tomorrow
:29:02. > :29:04.for the final show of this run, goodbye.