:00:14. > :00:24.Hello, and welcome. This is the 2013 General Assembly of the Church
:00:24. > :00:36.
:00:36. > :00:40.Like it or not, and some do not like it, much of the assembly's
:00:40. > :00:43.time over the last few years has been spent talking about sex. There
:00:43. > :00:48.has been considerable disagreement amongst the different assemblies of
:00:48. > :00:52.ministers and elders who gather here every year, particularly about
:00:52. > :00:56.the subject of same-sex relationships. That affects real
:00:56. > :01:00.life. We spoke to a couple of Church of Scotland members whose
:01:00. > :01:10.responses to their own sexuality illustrates the division within the
:01:10. > :01:18.
:01:18. > :01:23.Douglas Robertson is a church development worker in Glasgow. He
:01:23. > :01:31.is homosexual by orientation. But believes the Bible requires him to
:01:31. > :01:35.be severed it. -- beat celibate. The debate matters to me, because
:01:35. > :01:39.it concerns the authority of the word of God. The entire
:01:39. > :01:43.intellectual knowledge of our word of God is from scripture. The God
:01:43. > :01:47.we worship is revealed on the Bible, and the process of interpretation
:01:47. > :01:52.is about understanding this Bob -- this God. The Bible must be read
:01:52. > :01:57.and understood on its own terms. The problem is many people approach
:01:57. > :02:02.scripture with a preconceived notion of who God is. This informs
:02:02. > :02:05.their reading. So the parts that fit with their image of God are
:02:05. > :02:09.accepted and affirmed. The parts that do not fit, the parts that are
:02:09. > :02:17.more difficult to understand, or that on not palatable, get written
:02:17. > :02:21.off. This pick and choose approach makes a mockery of the thing that
:02:21. > :02:25.the Bible has any kind of meaningful authority. In the
:02:25. > :02:29.beginning was the word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was
:02:29. > :02:34.God. All things were made through him and without him was not
:02:34. > :02:38.anything made that was made. I have invested considerable time
:02:38. > :02:43.researching what the Bible have to say about, sexuality. It does not
:02:43. > :02:48.speak about orientation, only practice. It does not speak about
:02:48. > :02:53.it often but the teaching is clear. The Bible presents homosexual
:02:53. > :02:58.activity as a wrong choice. Now, I fully understand the challenge of
:02:58. > :03:05.this. I have a homosexual orientation myself. I have chosen
:03:05. > :03:08.to live a celibate, on a chord with my sexuality. To live with
:03:08. > :03:12.integrity according to the Word of God. It is difficult and there may
:03:12. > :03:19.not always get it right, but I know first-hand that got honours those
:03:19. > :03:22.that honour him. Doing hid -- doing it his way I can say that for the
:03:22. > :03:26.first time in my life I no genuine contentment. Having said that, I
:03:26. > :03:36.fully understand and would appreciate and never condemn those
:03:36. > :03:43.
:03:43. > :03:47.Troon, on the west coast, is home to Maureen, who is lesbian and
:03:47. > :03:50.Christian. She does not believe the Bible condemns the expression of
:03:50. > :03:55.her sexuality and is often angry when she hears the kind of language
:03:55. > :04:00.which are sometimes used against gay Christians. When you have words
:04:00. > :04:04.levelled at you like homosexuality is sinful and in the same breath,
:04:04. > :04:09.they mention Beeston reality and paedophilia and then they mention
:04:09. > :04:15.her the sector -- bestiality and then a mention homosexuality, these
:04:15. > :04:20.things very much had. I like the church at the national level to be
:04:20. > :04:26.very brave and face up to this and take a big step forward and say,
:04:26. > :04:29.this is not an issue that we should be spending time on. There are much
:04:29. > :04:38.more important things will the Church to be dealing with. I would
:04:38. > :04:42.like somebody to stand up, and say to assembly and say, look, let's
:04:42. > :04:47.stop this nonsense. Knock some heads together and let's move on.
:04:47. > :04:51.Let's get on with it. Your sexuality, what your sexuality is,
:04:51. > :04:56.if you are a minister in the pulpit, it does not matter if you are gay,
:04:56. > :04:59.straight, bisexual, it doesn't matter. It is what is in your hat -
:04:59. > :05:09.- part that counts. Does she believe that all securities will
:05:09. > :05:10.
:05:10. > :05:14.eventually be -- sexuality is will eventually be accepted? There are
:05:14. > :05:20.already churches who are very open, inclusive and affirming, and they
:05:20. > :05:24.have people of all the books in the congregation. Right across the
:05:24. > :05:28.social spectrum and sexualities. They are very quiet because they
:05:28. > :05:33.just get on with it, they are very dignified and respectful of human
:05:33. > :05:37.dignity and we get on with it. It would be great if their voices were
:05:37. > :05:43.heard in much the same manner as some of the more traditional voices
:05:43. > :05:47.that had been over the past year or so. The theological Commission on
:05:47. > :05:51.same-sex relationships and the ministry had taken two years to
:05:51. > :05:56.produce a report intended to help Commissioners decide on whether
:05:56. > :06:01.people in same-sex relationships could be ordained. We come out of
:06:01. > :06:06.the report of our theological Commission. I know I do not have to
:06:06. > :06:12.remind you that we listen and we here with love and grace and
:06:12. > :06:19.understanding, because I know that is evident in this general assembly.
:06:19. > :06:23.It comes to us today to discern the will of God for the Church of
:06:23. > :06:29.Scotland. The issues addressed today are those addressed not only
:06:29. > :06:38.in our small corner, rather they are ones that got right across the
:06:38. > :06:46.face of the church. That is why our decision-making today, within this
:06:46. > :06:56.General Assembly, truly matters. It matters for us, but not only for us.
:06:56. > :06:56.
:06:56. > :07:06.It matters for the whole church. Will it wisely and well. Mary never
:07:06. > :07:07.
:07:07. > :07:10.forget we are in the midst of much kill. We are -- or much ill. The
:07:10. > :07:15.meaning of human identity, our own it into the, what it means to be
:07:15. > :07:22.made in the image of God. What it means to be part of the Church, the
:07:22. > :07:26.Church of Scotland, it is now in the Providence of God. The report
:07:26. > :07:31.offered two opposite options. The Church could either vote to
:07:31. > :07:36.maintain the status quo and the Tote the ordination of anyone in a
:07:37. > :07:41.practising same-sex relation, -- veto the ordination, or it could
:07:41. > :07:43.accept gay ordination while allowing any conflict --
:07:43. > :07:50.confirmation which could not countenance a homosexual minister
:07:50. > :07:58.to opt out. A third option was now on the table. A few days ago, a
:07:58. > :08:06.counter motion was proposed saying a hall acceptance of gay ordination.
:08:06. > :08:10.In society at large, opinion polls show an ever-increasing majority
:08:10. > :08:16.view questions of sexuality as somewhat inconsequential in the
:08:16. > :08:22.modern day, in assessing people for employment, so expect to walk from
:08:22. > :08:27.cheque. -- 6 Thatcher or friendship. This is because we have new and
:08:27. > :08:32.greater knowledge about sexuality and how it arises, and we can
:08:32. > :08:37.rejoice in the gift that makes us the way we are. It is indeed, I
:08:37. > :08:41.believe, time for our church to lift this barrier. And allow those
:08:41. > :08:47.of single sex orientation in committed, proven relationships of
:08:47. > :08:51.civil partnership, into our Ministry. From Kent concluded his
:08:51. > :08:55.powerful contribution to the debate by surprisingly withdrawing his
:08:55. > :08:59.mission altogether and supporting the theological Commission's
:08:59. > :09:05.revisionist option. There was a further surprise to come. Last
:09:05. > :09:11.year's Moderator proposed a 4th option. It represented a compromise
:09:11. > :09:14.by the traditionalists. If the Church were to maintain its
:09:14. > :09:19.historic and current doctrine and practice in relation to human
:09:19. > :09:22.sexuality, that is that sexual activity should be confined to
:09:22. > :09:27.unmarried heterosexual couples, than any -- are then in the
:09:27. > :09:31.congregation which chose to ordain a gay minister could so do. I speak
:09:31. > :09:38.for people in this room who it is even painful to talk of these
:09:38. > :09:42.things. We might be wrong. So we need to be gracious and listened to
:09:42. > :09:50.be worked and listened to others, and be prepared to move a little.
:09:50. > :09:54.And so I ask that you take that step with me, and at a ask that you
:09:55. > :09:59.vote for my mission. Because it gives everyone what they want, but
:09:59. > :10:04.it will keep us together. It will not be what everybody designers,
:10:04. > :10:09.because we will all in some way be hurting. -- everybody desires, but
:10:09. > :10:13.we will have moved a little bit and confounded the critics that we
:10:13. > :10:20.cannot stay together as God's people. And so finally, late
:10:20. > :10:24.yesterday afternoon, the three options were debated. I believe
:10:24. > :10:31.this is the time for the Church, particularly traditionalists like
:10:31. > :10:35.me, to concede to allow others who disagree space to express that
:10:35. > :10:40.disagreement. In the life and witness of individual conned --
:10:40. > :10:47.congregation's and in the wider church. My reading of the Gospels
:10:47. > :10:50.is that Jesus did not regard all biblical text as being written in
:10:50. > :10:57.stone. Many major changes in the Church's thinking were brought
:10:57. > :11:01.about in the last 200 years by the interpretation again of scripture
:11:01. > :11:06.in the light of Christ's example and his teaching. I think of the
:11:06. > :11:13.abolition of slavery, the ordination of women. The acceptance
:11:13. > :11:19.of inter-racial marriages. In the debate that took place in all these
:11:19. > :11:24.instances, biblical texts were quoted by those who were opposed to
:11:24. > :11:29.change. I think I am correct when I say that today, only a very small
:11:29. > :11:35.minority would want to turn the clock back with regard to any of
:11:35. > :11:40.these matters. This is our opportunity as an assembly to send
:11:40. > :11:47.a clear message that everyone is welcome, but every one is loved by
:11:47. > :11:52.God. That everyone can be used and called by God in his service in
:11:52. > :11:56.this church. It is not that we will be out of step with everyone.
:11:56. > :12:01.Absolutely not. It is that we are standing up for principles that we
:12:01. > :12:09.have heard earlier on today of justice, justice for the people of
:12:09. > :12:12.God, for the ministers of God, for the ministers in this dumb --
:12:12. > :12:17.denomination, for all those involved in the ministry. This is
:12:17. > :12:24.our moment. Not next year, not the year after. It is a moment to start
:12:24. > :12:28.the ball rolling. Today, nobody, at least within this church for the
:12:28. > :12:32.least that slavery is acceptable or that women are second-class cysts -
:12:32. > :12:38.- citizens. And few people today still cling to the idea that
:12:38. > :12:47.homosexuality is a choice. If you do, ask yourself when you decided
:12:47. > :12:51.to be straight. Rather, gay and lesbian people, like all
:12:51. > :12:59.heterosexual, are made by God in the image of God and are loved by
:12:59. > :13:03.God. Equals, all of us. Equal in the eyes of God. So let us not put
:13:03. > :13:09.ourselves in the position where in 10 or 20 years' time people are
:13:09. > :13:13.saying of us, how on earth could anyone consider that gates or
:13:13. > :13:18.lesbians were somehow second class to citizens on not worthy to be
:13:19. > :13:22.treated as equals? All, why on earth did it take so long for
:13:22. > :13:27.enlightenment to come? There is a level of incredulity in many parts
:13:27. > :13:34.of the wider Christian church, as they wonder, what on earth we are
:13:34. > :13:40.thinking of. We have a theological Commission who had said to us that
:13:40. > :13:48.this is a lifestyle which does not honour God, which is not promoted
:13:48. > :13:55.in the Bible as being a good way to live. Not orientation, but activity.
:13:55. > :14:00.And yet, we are thinking of turning our backs on scripture and voting
:14:00. > :14:03.this way, of changing the tradition that this denomination has had for
:14:04. > :14:11.many, many years, and throwing it out because of what society is
:14:11. > :14:16.telling us. My father, my grandfather served as elders in the
:14:16. > :14:19.Church of Scotland before I did. I was converted to the Church of
:14:19. > :14:23.Scotland through a summer mission Cheam -- team. My children were
:14:23. > :14:31.brought up in the Church of Scotland. Both of my sons, I am
:14:31. > :14:35.thrilled to say, are active in their Crich -- Christian witness
:14:35. > :14:41.and work. Both of them now find that the only way to exercise their
:14:41. > :14:45.faith is out with the Church of Scotland, because they see the
:14:45. > :14:51.Church of Scotland as going down a path that turns its back on
:14:51. > :14:57.scripture. I would like to urge the assembly and commissioners present
:14:57. > :15:00.here to consider mission in their deliberations today, and mission to
:15:00. > :15:05.adults who were under 40, and I'd only just fit into that bracket
:15:05. > :15:12.myself. There are a number of people who worship regularly with
:15:12. > :15:15.us and we regularly offer inquirers courses to discuss issues of faith.
:15:15. > :15:19.I feel I need to make some views heard from those discussions but I
:15:19. > :15:23.have had. We have had one particular woman whose face was
:15:23. > :15:27.growing, who had come to a strong faith, but he felt she could not
:15:27. > :15:33.join the Church of Scotland because of the traditional view and
:15:33. > :15:35.perception on same-sex lectureships. To her it was a block and it did
:15:35. > :15:40.not match her experience of the compassionate and unconditional
:15:40. > :15:44.love of God and Christ. For her, she was not prepared to join the
:15:44. > :15:49.church and make her vows and grow further in her faith because of the
:15:49. > :15:54.position of the church on the subject. For me, it is personal. We
:15:54. > :15:59.have got bigger things to look at, but for me there is nothing bigger
:15:59. > :16:06.as to whether I am accepted in this cheque or not. From 1994, it has
:16:06. > :16:13.been debated and am I accepted in this church or not because I am a
:16:13. > :16:23.gay women? It undermines my very call, it undermines my place with
:16:23. > :16:23.
:16:23. > :16:33.good. It is now time to decide. So that those of us who are in this
:16:33. > :16:43.
:16:43. > :16:50.opportunity to be able to contribute to this the discussion when this
:16:50. > :17:00.discussion first emerged a number of years ago, our General Assembly
:17:00. > :17:01.
:17:01. > :17:08.received it with a great degree of sadness and also heart searching. As
:17:08. > :17:12.we spoke earlier about our relationship and the significance of
:17:13. > :17:21.that relationship, with sadness I do have to convey to this Assembly that
:17:21. > :17:27.if the Assembly follows a particular trajectory, has described in the
:17:27. > :17:32.revisionist approach, then that will cause serious tension between our
:17:32. > :17:39.two denominations, our churches. That is a hard and, perhaps, sad
:17:39. > :17:45.thing to say. But it will cause us great heart searching. And, I think,
:17:45. > :17:50.fundamentally, it causes us great heart searching because we find it
:17:50. > :17:58.hard to comprehend how the spirit of God would lead a church away from
:17:58. > :18:02.what we understand the clear teaching of scripture to be. This is
:18:02. > :18:07.a profoundly theological discussion and about the nature of ministry.
:18:07. > :18:12.Theological, it's about the nature of God. A God who made us, a God who
:18:12. > :18:20.loves us, a God who created us in miss own image, unique and precious
:18:20. > :18:27.in his eyes. How could we then believe that this God would call one
:18:27. > :18:32.and not another because one has one form of inherent sexuality and is in
:18:32. > :18:39.one form of a loving and committed relationship, and not call another
:18:39. > :18:43.who is in another kind of relationship because they have
:18:43. > :18:47.another God-created sexuality? During these four years, while
:18:47. > :18:52.controversy has been hanging over the Church of Scotland, as has been
:18:52. > :18:55.said already in this Assembly, we have lost many people, we have lost
:18:55. > :19:00.congregations, we have lost ministers, with he have lost members
:19:00. > :19:03.and we have lost a lot of money. While many other congregations and
:19:03. > :19:08.many more individual members of congregations have really been
:19:08. > :19:12.hanging on by the skin of their teeth, hoping against hope, and
:19:12. > :19:18.praying indeed, that the church will not only make up its mind, once and
:19:18. > :19:23.for all where it stands, but that we'll make up its mind to stand by
:19:23. > :19:28.that which it constantly professes to be it issual prepare rule of
:19:28. > :19:33.faith and life. Because, moderator, I want to suggest to the Assembly
:19:33. > :19:39.that is really what is at stake. Much of the discussion of course and
:19:39. > :19:44.media interest has focussed on issues relating to homosexual
:19:44. > :19:48.practice. That is the presenting issue, not the basic issue. The
:19:48. > :19:53.basic issue is whether this church stands by the teaching of scriptures
:19:53. > :19:59.or whether we think that we know better than the God who, as the
:19:59. > :20:03.church down the centuries has believed, inspired the writing of
:20:03. > :20:09.the scriptureses. I can't tell you how difficult it is for me to hear,
:20:09. > :20:12.as we heard just a few moments ago, somebody saying that those of us who
:20:12. > :20:16.are revisionist do have that view because we want to fit in with
:20:17. > :20:21.society. Give me a break, disagree with my position if you want, at
:20:21. > :20:26.least believe that I'm taking this seriously. I believe that God's
:20:26. > :20:31.doing a new thing and leading us to a new understanding. For all the
:20:31. > :20:35.people quoting of the Bible, I am remind of the story of Peter seeing
:20:35. > :20:40.the sheet come down with the unclean food and being asked to eat and
:20:40. > :20:45.Peter said - lord I can't eat this, this is unclean. Where was he
:20:45. > :20:51.getting it from? It was God's laws. Here is God tearing up the rule book
:20:51. > :20:54.and God saying - don't call unclean what I'm calling clean. God was
:20:54. > :20:58.bringing Peter to a new understanding. God is always
:20:58. > :21:04.bringing us to new understandings and inviting more people in.
:21:04. > :21:10.Scriptures says an eye for an eye and tooth for a tooth. Jesus says
:21:10. > :21:16.turn another cheek. That is both new and different. Sam 134 says we must
:21:16. > :21:20.be so angry with our enemies we must take our babies by the ankles and
:21:20. > :21:27.smash their brains against the rocks. Then Jesus says, love your
:21:27. > :21:31.enemy. Both new, and different. It's the love of Jesus that makes the
:21:31. > :21:35.difference. I conclude with something that happened with me in
:21:35. > :21:43.South Africa. I had an elder, probably a stronger believer than I
:21:43. > :21:47.can ever be, his son was gay and he was (inaudible) too. For weeks he
:21:47. > :21:54.couldn't sleep or eat. He came to me crying saying, I'm passionate about
:21:54. > :22:00.the work and I love my son. What should I do? If I follow the Bible
:22:00. > :22:06.it says I should put my son to death. Jesus says, maybe I should
:22:06. > :22:13.try to love. I feel if I just love my son I'm going to betray the word.
:22:13. > :22:19.I asked him a simple question. Does Jesus love your son? He said, yes. I
:22:19. > :22:24.said, there is your answer. Father and son were reunited. The father
:22:24. > :22:31.stayed straight and the son stayed gay. But they are still held
:22:31. > :22:37.together in the love of Jesus. ago, like many people, I thought I
:22:37. > :22:41.didn't know any gay people. I really believed that until I moved to the
:22:41. > :22:46.United States of America and suddenly I was in a church where
:22:46. > :22:50.there were gay people in many pews. I learned so much from that
:22:50. > :22:55.experience that year living there, came back and saw the world with
:22:55. > :22:59.different eyes. Some of the best ministers of the word, some of the
:22:59. > :23:05.best ministers of the Goss spell that I have met and worked with in
:23:05. > :23:12.the United States, in South Africa, in Ghana, in North India and here in
:23:12. > :23:18.Scotland and in these islands are gay people who happen, they are
:23:18. > :23:25.ministers of the Goss spell who happen tonne -- to be gay.
:23:25. > :23:32.compromise won the day. If the church maintains it's traditional
:23:32. > :23:36.opposition to gay ministers. The legislation to enable it to happen
:23:36. > :23:40.will be presented to next year's General Assembly. I think the way
:23:40. > :23:43.the church voted today meant that it affirmed again that the
:23:43. > :23:48.traditionalist point of view is the fall back position of the church.
:23:48. > :23:51.That is where we are. We recognise today that the church is broad in
:23:51. > :23:56.its understanding of this particular issue. People are passionate on both
:23:56. > :24:00.sides about this. Isn't this going to be seen by the wider world as yet
:24:00. > :24:04.another deferral? I don't think it's deferral of a decision. I think we
:24:04. > :24:08.have made a significant decision today to say that the traditionalist
:24:08. > :24:13.orthodox view that the church had all these years has been affirmed,
:24:13. > :24:18.but yet we recognise that some congregations may wish to opt-out of
:24:18. > :24:23.that. I suppose I was disappointed the church didn't take its chance to
:24:23. > :24:28.affirm once and for all ministers in same-sex partnerships I'm pragmatic
:24:28. > :24:33.enough to realise what the church voted for was a step forward and
:24:33. > :24:35.something for unity, which is really important of course. I think,
:24:36. > :24:40.hopefully, down-the-line it will take some time, but down-the-line it
:24:40. > :24:43.will start to make some changes and some steps forward. Pragmatic is a
:24:43. > :24:47.good word because the counter motions got a bit of everything in
:24:47. > :24:50.it. Can it work 1234 I think it can, as long as everyone is willing to
:24:50. > :24:55.make it work. I think that is the key thing now is we move forward
:24:55. > :24:59.there has to be a lot of understanding and a lot of trust and
:24:59. > :25:02.the ability to make it work and wanting to make it work. I think
:25:02. > :25:07.it's so important that the church does hold the unity. If this is the
:25:07. > :25:12.way to do it, then I think it just means that every side of the
:25:12. > :25:16.argument has to now work to make it happen and that is Assembly level as
:25:16. > :25:20.well as press per Tory and congregations level. We have work to
:25:20. > :25:24.do to ensure that proposal is workable around the principles that
:25:24. > :25:29.were set out and we will have to look very closely at the draft
:25:29. > :25:34.legislation next year. There is is still a long way to go. It will take
:25:34. > :25:38.another two years of careful drafting and discussion before we
:25:38. > :25:45.can get to a stage of implementing the proposal that was put forward
:25:45. > :25:51.yesterday. I think there are concerns about the equalities
:25:51. > :25:55.legislation and how we protect people from civil action and the
:25:55. > :25:58.legal experts will have to look at all of that again very carefully.
:25:58. > :26:05.Could you unwrap that a bit and explain what that means? Well, it
:26:05. > :26:09.was clear from the supplementary report this year that the church had
:26:09. > :26:14.entered into quite detailed discussions with the Equalities
:26:14. > :26:20.Commission and had obtained a letter of comfort, which explained how the
:26:20. > :26:25.church could set out a regime in which there might be a kind of dual
:26:25. > :26:30.practice or mixed economy with neither side vulnerable to
:26:30. > :26:34.litigation through the civil courts. That will remain an anxiety at the
:26:34. > :26:39.next stage when we have to produce further legislation according to the
:26:39. > :26:43.principles of this new version of the mixed economy. The vote for
:26:43. > :26:48.Albert Bogle's counter motion wasn't unanimous. Do you think it
:26:48. > :26:50.represented the settled will the of the Assembly? It represents the
:26:50. > :26:56.settled will of the commissioners this year. Another set of
:26:56. > :26:59.commissioners will require to vote on it next year and the press per
:26:59. > :27:02.tearies in the interim after which there will be a further General
:27:02. > :27:08.Assembly which will require to vote on it. I think what is significant
:27:08. > :27:14.is that the successful motion yesterday came from the more
:27:14. > :27:18.traditionalist wing of the church. That may actually result in it
:27:18. > :27:24.gathering broad support over the next couple of years. So, do you
:27:24. > :27:28.think the unity and peace of the Kirk is secure? I think for the
:27:28. > :27:34.moment it is. There will be some people who will remain unhappy and
:27:34. > :27:39.we may see some erosion of members and ministers. We have already
:27:39. > :27:45.witnessed that over the last year or two. I wouldn't like to predict that
:27:45. > :27:48.that will suddenly cease, but I don't think we are going to see
:27:48. > :27:51.widespread disaffection at this stage, at least I hope not. Do you
:27:51. > :27:56.think it will go anyway to addressing something I know you are
:27:56. > :28:01.very worried about, which is the recruitment or application of
:28:01. > :28:05.candidates for training for the Ministry? I hope that it might. We
:28:05. > :28:12.have seen a very sharp decline, almost a disappearance of candidates
:28:12. > :28:15.over the last two or three years. I know, talking to ministers of lead
:28:15. > :28:20.leading congregations, that is not unconnected with this particular
:28:20. > :28:28.issue. I would hope that if the church can find a way forward on
:28:28. > :28:33.this issue and can continue to embrace its important evangelical
:28:33. > :28:37.constituent we might see the return of evangelical candidates for
:28:37. > :28:40.ministerial training in the near future. There is a lot more being
:28:40. > :28:45.debated at the Assembly than sex, we will be reporting on some of the