:00:10. > :00:15.Another food scare - after eggs, it's suspect sausages.
:00:16. > :00:17.Should we care more about where our food comes from?
:00:18. > :00:19.A health authority turns down a ?2500 donation
:00:20. > :00:22.because it was raised by men dressing up as female nurses.
:00:23. > :00:25.Are we becoming too politically correct?
:00:26. > :00:28.The Archbishop of Canterbury's daughter, Katharine Welby-Roberts,
:00:29. > :00:31.talks about her battle with depression and why she didn't
:00:32. > :00:39.seek her parents' help with her mental health problems.
:00:40. > :00:47.I think I felt I needed to protect them from it as well, and not
:00:48. > :00:52.burdened them, and that is a very common theme with mental health
:00:53. > :00:55.problems, that you are a burden to those you love.
:00:56. > :00:57.And actress and singer Martine McCutcheon tells us how
:00:58. > :00:59.she nearly gave up showbusiness until she received an unexpected
:01:00. > :01:11.I got a call from my agent saying, Martine, I know you told us not to
:01:12. > :01:15.call you ever again, but we got a phone call from Richard Curtis who
:01:16. > :01:22.wants you to read for a film with Hugh Grant. And I literally dropped
:01:23. > :01:24.the phone. All that coming up -
:01:25. > :01:27.and here with us today to sample your views
:01:28. > :01:28.is Samanthi Flanagan. We'll also be looking at how we care
:01:29. > :01:33.for our elderly. There's a warning that the care home
:01:34. > :01:36.system is facing a catastrophe. So should families play a bigger
:01:37. > :01:39.part in looking after relatives? We want you to get in touch
:01:40. > :01:41.on all our discussions. You can contact us by
:01:42. > :01:43.Facebook and Twitter - don't forget to use
:01:44. > :01:45.the hashtag #bbcsml. Or text SML followed
:01:46. > :01:47.by your message to 60011. Texts are charged at your
:01:48. > :01:51.standard message rate. Or email us at
:01:52. > :01:55.sundaymorninglive@bbc.co.uk. However you choose to get in touch,
:01:56. > :01:58.please don't forget to include your name so I can get you involved
:01:59. > :02:01.in the programme. First, just a fortnight after egg
:02:02. > :02:04.products from four supermarkets were found to contain
:02:05. > :02:07.an insecticide, now it's reported that pork products may have infected
:02:08. > :02:11.people with hepatitis E. That's a virus that can
:02:12. > :02:14.cause liver damage. The pork was not from
:02:15. > :02:16.the UK, but imported. Nevertheless, these
:02:17. > :02:19.latest scares have raised Should we care more
:02:20. > :02:24.about where our food comes from? Joining me now to discuss
:02:25. > :02:26.that are Matt Rymer, a cattle farmer and founder
:02:27. > :02:29.of an organization set up to improve Dr Megan Blake, a senior lecturer
:02:30. > :02:37.in Human Geological Studies. Emma Slawinski from
:02:38. > :02:40.Compassion In World Farming. And Sally Bee, a healthy
:02:41. > :03:03.eating campaigner. Mats, you are a farmer. How
:03:04. > :03:08.concerned should we be about where our food comes from? I think the
:03:09. > :03:13.consumer should ask more questions. The consumer can expect food to
:03:14. > :03:18.become cheaper, but in a way, with food, less is more, and the consumer
:03:19. > :03:27.needs to ask the questions to drive the change. White, though? Isn't
:03:28. > :03:30.cheap food good? If you look at the food industry, provenance should
:03:31. > :03:34.really begin on the farm at seed or birth, and follow through the chain
:03:35. > :03:41.so that the consumer is empowered to know where those ingredients are
:03:42. > :03:51.from. It's important because it's a global food industry. Millenials
:03:52. > :03:55.particularly, the generation now, they want and care about how food is
:03:56. > :03:59.reared and grown and the environmental impact, but they need
:04:00. > :04:05.to ask those questions. Megan, you get what you pay for. If consumers
:04:06. > :04:09.want to pay for cheap food, they get cheap food. Should we be thinking
:04:10. > :04:16.more carefully about what we buy and what we eat? There were 3000 last
:04:17. > :04:22.year in this country who died from food paralysis. There are over 1
:04:23. > :04:26.million people in this country now who are going hungry, going to food
:04:27. > :04:30.banks. So while I am very sympathetic to the idea of
:04:31. > :04:35.provenance, I think it is a really middle-class problem. The bigger
:04:36. > :04:40.issue is around things to do with diet and the fact that we have
:04:41. > :04:45.people who are hungry. So if I am poor, it doesn't really matter if I
:04:46. > :04:50.get hepatitis E through sausages because I'm getting food? Putting it
:04:51. > :04:57.into perspective, the chances of getting hepatitis E from sausages
:04:58. > :05:02.are very small, compared to, say, getting a diet related illness. That
:05:03. > :05:08.is a different issue. Shouldn't we be thinking about the contribution
:05:09. > :05:14.of cheap meat to those illnesses? If you are raising an animal in a very
:05:15. > :05:20.intensive system and you are using an antibiotic to keep that animal
:05:21. > :05:26.healthy, preventative antibiotics, those are the same antibiotics we
:05:27. > :05:31.used to treat human health. On that point, I would disagree with you
:05:32. > :05:36.that Providence should be a preoccupation exclusive to the
:05:37. > :05:42.middle-class. Should be entitled to know where their food comes from. I
:05:43. > :05:48.agree, but for the people I work with, that is so low on their list
:05:49. > :05:52.of issues. They are concerned about whether or not they are going to be
:05:53. > :05:57.able to feed their kids, whether they can do that in the time they
:05:58. > :06:03.have, in the context of where they live. But to be able to know the
:06:04. > :06:07.journey of your food, how it's been produced, is very relevant to your
:06:08. > :06:16.health, especially with these health scares. Well, it's 3000 people. We
:06:17. > :06:21.have traceability. It is about worrying about the guy who is
:06:22. > :06:29.driving along text Inc. Its things you can't control. There have been
:06:30. > :06:35.to food scares within a fortnight. It's important to put things into
:06:36. > :06:41.perspective. We now have rolling 24 hour news, which needs to be filled
:06:42. > :06:46.with something. 20 years ago, we went to watch the News at Ten, and
:06:47. > :06:51.if there was a story on the headlines we would take notice of
:06:52. > :06:58.it. Now there are constant news stories, on our phones, for example.
:06:59. > :07:05.It is a complete balanced story. I'm from the position of health. I'm
:07:06. > :07:10.about healthy eating, having as much transparency as possible, but also
:07:11. > :07:14.making sure you can feed your kids. My advice to anybody is follow your
:07:15. > :07:20.instincts and do the best you can. If you can afford to buy food that
:07:21. > :07:24.you know exactly where it's come from, that is locally sourced, that
:07:25. > :07:30.you know is doing your body and your children good, fantastic. If you
:07:31. > :07:34.can't, you just have to do the best you can. I don't believe you have to
:07:35. > :07:37.spend a lot of money to know where your food is coming from. Let's go
:07:38. > :07:40.to Samanthi. Who have you got? With me now is Tracy Worcester,
:07:41. > :07:43.a campaigner for better animal welfare in farming,
:07:44. > :07:45.who's currently making a series of films with chefs who only use
:07:46. > :07:56.meat from farms with high Thank you for joining us. We have
:07:57. > :08:01.been hearing that it's unrealistic for poorer families to afford higher
:08:02. > :08:08.welfare meat. How realistic and option is it? I spend a lot of time
:08:09. > :08:14.asking people, would you look for higher welfare labels on your pork.
:08:15. > :08:18.They say, yes, they would, but it's more expensive, and what difference
:08:19. > :08:26.does it make if they do it on their own. I have been making a series of
:08:27. > :08:33.films, starting with Pig Business, which has been shown around the
:08:34. > :08:41.world. Then when I came to England, I was trying to stop local -- help
:08:42. > :08:45.local people stop a pig farm, and they are very, very angry that this
:08:46. > :08:51.pig farm is being proposed near them where it is well-known that the
:08:52. > :08:54.people who live near these farms are getting antibiotic resistant
:08:55. > :08:58.diseases, diseases which are spread further than the locality. You are
:08:59. > :09:06.spreading the faeces of these factory farms on the films. We
:09:07. > :09:11.cannot speak about this case because we don't know much about it. But
:09:12. > :09:16.there's been so much controversy about different meat scares and some
:09:17. > :09:24.people give up meat altogether. Is that a viable option? It is if you
:09:25. > :09:29.are terrified about what you eat. You have a terribly powerful purse
:09:30. > :09:35.which can say that you will pay the farmer a fair price and then you
:09:36. > :09:40.look for the high welfare labels, like outdoor bred, free range and
:09:41. > :09:48.organic. Many of us are eating too much meat. To reduce our meat intake
:09:49. > :09:54.would avoid diseases like obesity, diabetes, heart disease and some
:09:55. > :09:58.forms of cancer. That way you can spread your money and enjoy more
:09:59. > :10:04.vegetables. But the production of vegetables also causes... We use
:10:05. > :10:08.insecticides and chemical fertilisers, which people are
:10:09. > :10:14.worried about as well. So a vegetable diet is not the answer
:10:15. > :10:19.necessarily. You don't necessarily have to just eat vegetables. It's
:10:20. > :10:25.just to reduce your meat intake to help spread the cost. If you look
:10:26. > :10:30.for the better welfare labels, it is fractionally more expensive, but on
:10:31. > :10:34.average, it's too sausages from a factory farm where the pigs are
:10:35. > :10:40.being treated diabolically, treated with antibiotics just to keep them
:10:41. > :10:45.alive, or it is one and a half sausages from a high welfare farm.
:10:46. > :10:53.Thank you. A lot of interesting comments. Do we need to our
:10:54. > :10:58.mentality? We need to eat less meat and eat better meet? I tried to eat
:10:59. > :11:06.the food that you are talking about, but I can afford that. But we make
:11:07. > :11:12.it cheaper. That's the point. We are sitting at home. Who is it that's
:11:13. > :11:16.going out and doing this? In the community in Doncaster it's the
:11:17. > :11:21.women who are trying to take home all these messages. There's a woman
:11:22. > :11:27.I spoke to who goes round every day round all the shops to get the deals
:11:28. > :11:33.so that she can feed her family. She cooks five meals a day, partly
:11:34. > :11:38.because she picks up the grandkids after school and feeds them, and
:11:39. > :11:48.then his son -- her son comes home and feeds them. The food that she is
:11:49. > :11:53.making is better than takeaway food. We need to get away from the idea
:11:54. > :11:59.that cheap meat is cheap. It's not cheap. It is cheap at the till, but
:12:00. > :12:04.that is only one of the times you pay for it. You pay for it again in
:12:05. > :12:11.your taxes through farm subsidies, and you pay for it again because
:12:12. > :12:16.cheap meat causes things like antibiotic resistance, contributes
:12:17. > :12:24.to some dietary diseases. So cheap meat is actually more expensive? For
:12:25. > :12:31.us as a society, yes. The cost has to be paid for somehow, and people
:12:32. > :12:38.are paying for that. Day to day, people don't think like that. I
:12:39. > :12:42.think they do. They tried to do the best they can. Parents with kids who
:12:43. > :12:47.are working all day, they come home and they have to feed the kids
:12:48. > :12:53.something they can afford, know how to make and that the children will
:12:54. > :12:59.eat. That is the day-to-day living with it. Matt, you are a farmer. It
:13:00. > :13:08.is your business, but you say we should eat less meat? I try to eat
:13:09. > :13:14.and drink only food that I know where the ingredients are from. You
:13:15. > :13:19.end up eating less processed food. It is a better diet. You look
:13:20. > :13:26.forward to your meals more. It's almost going back to the
:13:27. > :13:31.old-fashioned... Not everybody can afford that. You see people at the
:13:32. > :13:37.garage queueing up and buying processed sandwiches, pasties and
:13:38. > :13:43.sugary drinks. Lets see what people are saying at home and on social
:13:44. > :13:49.media. Johnny says that people want their mates to have as good a life
:13:50. > :13:54.as possible, but sometimes the cost and the morals do not add up. Peggy
:13:55. > :14:00.says she doesn't understand why some people don't care about where food
:14:01. > :14:03.comes from. It's your body and your life. Eating bad food is like
:14:04. > :14:10.filling up your car with water and wondering why it won't start. Rob
:14:11. > :14:15.says as long as the food tastes good, it doesn't matter where it
:14:16. > :14:19.comes from. What should people do if they are watching this and are
:14:20. > :14:24.worried about this? They should go to trusted sources to buy their food
:14:25. > :14:29.and think about what they are doing, but within the context of their
:14:30. > :14:32.lives. Money is important. Thank you very much indeed.
:14:33. > :14:34.Martine McCutcheon rose to fame at the age of 18
:14:35. > :14:38.But her character in the BBC soap met a dramatic end
:14:39. > :14:40.and she was written out of the series.
:14:41. > :14:43.Martine went on to forge a career as a singer before returning
:14:44. > :14:45.to acting big time in the film Love Actually.
:14:46. > :14:47.Now, after battling her way through illness, she is back
:14:48. > :15:05.Hello. Hallo! I'm going to ask you not to make a huge leap of
:15:06. > :15:08.imagination, but just imagine I am the 18-year-old Martine McCutcheon.
:15:09. > :15:14.Knowing what you know now, what would you say to her?
:15:15. > :15:22.Take what is said with a pinch of salt, believe yourself, and trust
:15:23. > :15:26.your instinct, and laugh along the way. The reason you would say that
:15:27. > :15:35.now is because you were not laughing it off? They criticise you when you
:15:36. > :15:37.were trying to find out who you are and you are so young, it is
:15:38. > :15:45.important to have good self-esteem and believe in yourself a genuinely
:15:46. > :15:52.believe in yourself. Something I would have loved to have done would
:15:53. > :15:58.be preserved myself. So when you came into East Enders and became
:15:59. > :16:03.this huge character, four years, is it strange to look back at say it
:16:04. > :16:11.was only four years? It felt like ten years but it was not, four
:16:12. > :16:19.years, that was it. Hello, Tiffany. What are you doing here? Nice
:16:20. > :16:29.surprise, is it? You shouldn't be here, you are not supposed to be
:16:30. > :16:32.anywhere near Courteney. It was unfortunately a sad demise and when
:16:33. > :16:39.you were not comfortable with, not how you wanted to leave Eastenders?
:16:40. > :16:43.No, there is a lot of press saying I am still upset to this day about it,
:16:44. > :16:49.of course I am not, it is just the way it was done, I heard it on the
:16:50. > :16:58.radio driving along, Tiffany is being killed off and I thought, they
:16:59. > :17:02.must be wrong, and I turned up and thereby paparazzi saying, how do you
:17:03. > :17:11.feel? I don't know, I don't know what is going gone. You must know,
:17:12. > :17:22.no, I don't know. I'm going to call the police! Mum, no.
:17:23. > :17:32.How intrusive has the press been in your life? Have they ever crossed a
:17:33. > :17:37.line? Yes, definitely, many things, things that you feel quite
:17:38. > :17:42.uncomfortable about it, they have gone way too far. The thing is, I am
:17:43. > :17:47.kind of old school, I believe when you do this job, of course people to
:17:48. > :17:51.a degree will want to know about you and your life but there should be a
:17:52. > :18:02.point, you should have your rights as a person and your privacy when
:18:03. > :18:05.you really need it. The small clan around me that I did have, I started
:18:06. > :18:11.to doubt them because there were stories and quotes and everything, I
:18:12. > :18:16.did say that, but the rest of it was wrong, and it was a bizarre,
:18:17. > :18:23.horrible time. Brilliant pounds, and then... Is it true that you want
:18:24. > :18:28.asked God to send you a sign as to whether you would carry on acting?
:18:29. > :18:38.After My Fair Lady, I had really awful press and it went on and on
:18:39. > :18:43.for months and months. I thought, I did not sign up for this, I just
:18:44. > :18:49.want to entertain people. I went to see some friends in Spain and
:18:50. > :18:53.thought, if you want me to be in this stinking business committee
:18:54. > :19:06.need to be one hell of a sign. Just let me know! Forgot about it.
:19:07. > :19:09.Amazing, isn't it?! Forgot about it! And literally within a day of being
:19:10. > :19:15.in Spain I got a phone call from my agent saying, Richard Curtis wants
:19:16. > :19:21.you to read for the lead in a film called Love Actually with Hugh
:19:22. > :19:25.Grant. I was looking up to God thinking, you don't muck about, do
:19:26. > :19:34.you?! Oh, hello. Hello. This is my mum and
:19:35. > :19:41.my dad and my uncle and my aunt. Very nice to meet you. And this is
:19:42. > :19:48.the Prime Minister. We can see that, darling. You are a bit of a
:19:49. > :19:53.religious person? I do believe in God, I believe in something else out
:19:54. > :19:59.there, I believe life is so much more than this. For someone who
:20:00. > :20:05.works as hard as you, while Cooper a decade away, what was the point when
:20:06. > :20:10.you thought, I need to go back into the studio? It was more, I need to
:20:11. > :20:18.write something, I need to be creative. It was so cathartic for
:20:19. > :20:26.me. # Stars around the consolation.
:20:27. > :20:31.# Say I'm not alone. # I can't believe it...
:20:32. > :20:44.It really is the full gamut of your emotions? Celebrity is a dirty word
:20:45. > :20:48.in the world today, and you forget what people are doing with their
:20:49. > :20:52.careers and their lives, you become a victim of your own name. Of course
:20:53. > :20:57.you have got Celebrity Big Brother, I'm A Celebrity, Get Me Out Of Here!
:20:58. > :21:06., you have been offered a few of these? Why have you always said no?
:21:07. > :21:11.I wanted to stay away from that. I think Strictly is the closest you
:21:12. > :21:18.could do but even then, because performing is what I do, can I stand
:21:19. > :21:22.up in front of millions of people and be told I am a two? Martine
:21:23. > :21:23.McCutcheon, thank you so much. Martine McCutcheon,
:21:24. > :21:25.concentrating on singing rather Still to come on Sunday
:21:26. > :21:27.Morning Live... Mehreen Baig acts as a pair of eyes
:21:28. > :21:39.on a holiday for blind people. When you are travelling with a
:21:40. > :21:44.visually impaired person, I guess a sighted person might become aware of
:21:45. > :21:50.the other senses, because we are not focused on site, we can hear things,
:21:51. > :21:51.small things. Oh, that is nice. That is nice.
:21:52. > :21:54.Now what do you think of this picture?
:21:55. > :21:57.It's a bunch of blokes who decided to dress up in drag as female nurses
:21:58. > :22:03.But Shropshire Health Authority refused the ?2500 donation
:22:04. > :22:06.to Ludlow Hospital because they said the stunt was highly sexualised,
:22:07. > :22:10.insulting, and demeaning to the nursing profession.
:22:11. > :22:17.The decision has left the fundraisers baffled.
:22:18. > :22:24.I don't think any of us set out to cause any offence. You only have to
:22:25. > :22:30.walk around the town to see the smiles on people's faces. I'm
:22:31. > :22:33.flabbergasted, I can't believe anybody would send 2500 back.
:22:34. > :22:35.Also this week, a recruitment campaign by police
:22:36. > :22:37.in Edinburgh suffered a social media backlash.
:22:38. > :22:41.It used a picture of three policewomen with the caption,
:22:42. > :22:43.That was criticised for being condescending
:22:44. > :22:47.The police say the image was designed to challenge
:22:48. > :22:51.stereotypes and show there are opportunities for all.
:22:52. > :22:54.So are people being too sensitive, or is there blatant sexism at work
:22:55. > :23:02.Joining me now are James Delingpole, who is a journalist.
:23:03. > :23:10.Andrea Trainer, who's a consultant on diversity for businesses.
:23:11. > :23:24.James, what do you make of it? Judging by your face, I think you
:23:25. > :23:31.are disgusted?! I think the hospital would have been quite grateful for
:23:32. > :23:36.that ?2500. I'm not sure the chief executive who made the decision was
:23:37. > :23:39.really thinking about the hospital. Most ordinary people I think would
:23:40. > :23:47.disagree quite strongly with what he did. ?2500, the NHS is short of
:23:48. > :23:56.cash, Poppy, are we being too sensitive here? I think that story
:23:57. > :24:01.is quite a bizarre story, it is obviously a strange thing that has
:24:02. > :24:06.gone on there. You can point out one story like that and say we are too
:24:07. > :24:12.politically correct. A number of stories recently, a Labour MP
:24:13. > :24:19.writing an article brandishing Pakistani men as being sexual
:24:20. > :24:22.deviants, the president of the United States talking about touching
:24:23. > :24:30.women inappropriately, the idea that we are all confined by political
:24:31. > :24:33.correctness and nobody can move... We will deal with those broader
:24:34. > :24:36.issues in a moment, let's get to the heart of the story. Samanthi, you
:24:37. > :24:38.have got an interesting guest. With me now is Mark Hiles,
:24:39. > :24:40.one of the fundraisers from Shropshire who dressed up
:24:41. > :24:46.as a female nurse. Thank you for joining us. What do
:24:47. > :24:52.you make of the response to your fundraising? It has gone absolutely
:24:53. > :25:00.crazy. Just a regular bunch of guys from Ludlow, we dressed as nurses to
:25:01. > :25:06.get as much awareness out there as we possibly could, the community had
:25:07. > :25:14.great fun, we raised a lot of money to go to the hospital. Unfortunately
:25:15. > :25:19.they said it was demeaning to the staff and sexualising the profession
:25:20. > :25:22.and they don't want our money. Was it a mistake to dress as a female
:25:23. > :25:29.nurse? You could have dressed as doctors? In the past, various
:25:30. > :25:35.outings have done doctors, other things, it is just one of those
:25:36. > :25:38.things where we have done it because it raises more awareness than people
:25:39. > :25:42.stand out from the crowd more. If we were just in regular scrubs, I don't
:25:43. > :25:47.think we would get that much attention. The more attention we
:25:48. > :25:50.get, the better, everyone was taking pictures with us, asking questions
:25:51. > :25:55.about the hospital that we were raising the money for, what was
:25:56. > :26:02.happening with the hospital. It was just great fun. Do you see any
:26:03. > :26:04.validity in the concerns that it sexualising and demeans the
:26:05. > :26:12.profession for female nurses who perhaps face sexual harassment at
:26:13. > :26:16.work? Absolutely not, no. There are lots of nurses out there who have
:26:17. > :26:20.done this in the past, I have not come across anybody that had a
:26:21. > :26:29.problem it. What has happened with the money? At present it is being
:26:30. > :26:37.held, it will get spent on Ludlow hospital in some way, the details of
:26:38. > :26:45.that and not with me but we are just raising the money, I guess. Sean,
:26:46. > :26:51.what do you think? I will put that to Poppy, lovely guy raising money
:26:52. > :26:56.for the local hospital? I suppose that is what I am saying, this is
:26:57. > :27:01.one scenario, a very strange scenario, and it emphasises this
:27:02. > :27:07.situation, raising money for the local hospital, I get it, but is it
:27:08. > :27:13.a sign that we are somehow madly at politically correct society? You
:27:14. > :27:18.don't have to look far to see how politically incorrect we are at any
:27:19. > :27:22.level in the public sphere. Andrea, you are a consultant on diversity,
:27:23. > :27:30.are you concerned when you see men dressing up as women like that? No,
:27:31. > :27:37.no. We have to bring it to the language and actions, the intent.
:27:38. > :27:40.The real issue is why a group of guys is having to push a trolley
:27:41. > :27:46.around a community to raise money for vital equipment. The real issue
:27:47. > :27:51.is why the Scottish police force is having to put a selfie on social
:27:52. > :27:54.media to promote policewomen. Those are the real issues. People are
:27:55. > :28:01.fearful of being labelled and those conversations are being shut down. I
:28:02. > :28:08.can see both sides. The idea of political correctness, what we're
:28:09. > :28:14.labelled, how we are discussed, how society views us, and each time we
:28:15. > :28:19.change the language of political correctness, as it were, it pushes
:28:20. > :28:24.society forward. 200 years ago I would have been a slave. 50 years
:28:25. > :28:32.ago I would have been called coloured. Look at sexism, I would
:28:33. > :28:39.have been my father's daughter, then my husband's wife, but now I can be
:28:40. > :28:42.called Miss, it is the idea that the language we use pushes society
:28:43. > :28:48.forward and reflects who we want to be and where we see ourselves. Mark,
:28:49. > :28:55.you have heard the comments, would you do anything differently next
:28:56. > :29:01.year? We would obviously be aware of people's feelings, I guess, if they
:29:02. > :29:06.are that strong, but we are going to carry on doing the service every
:29:07. > :29:09.year. Dressing up as nurses? Absolutely, yes, we will do exactly
:29:10. > :29:16.the same next year, we are not harming anybody. We have great
:29:17. > :29:20.respect for the nursing profession and everybody out there, we are just
:29:21. > :29:25.having a bit of fun. You going to stop people dressing up in the
:29:26. > :29:29.London Marathon to raise money? Do you feel you have a point to prove
:29:30. > :29:33.here? Definitely, yes, we are going to carry on doing we are doing. We
:29:34. > :29:38.should be able to dress how we want to dress. So we will be covering
:29:39. > :29:45.this story next year! Thank you very much. My pleasure. Let's move on to
:29:46. > :29:48.Edinburgh police force, three policewomen and a caption reading,
:29:49. > :29:55.more than just pretty faces. Some said it was a throwback to the
:29:56. > :29:59.1970s, haven't we moved on? The conversation shouldn't be about what
:30:00. > :30:06.language, we come back to the intent. The picture was taken to
:30:07. > :30:14.promote the force as a place for everyone. But it caused offence to
:30:15. > :30:18.some people? Again, you have to come back to intent. The intent was a
:30:19. > :30:22.valid and good one. There are issues of gender imbalance in the police
:30:23. > :30:26.force, this was done with positive intent. Sophia, political
:30:27. > :30:30.correctness helps to shift attitudes, you mention how you would
:30:31. > :30:35.have been referred to 50, 100 years ago, but are we in danger of going
:30:36. > :30:38.too far? A friend of mine would say someone was trying to describe me
:30:39. > :30:42.the other day and was scared to say that I am mixed race or black, they
:30:43. > :30:45.were talking about the colour of my eyes or the colour of my hair! The
:30:46. > :30:53.obvious thing to describe me is mixed race or black. It is whether
:30:54. > :30:59.we can self identify, the issue in Scotland, that is how they identify,
:31:00. > :31:05.yes, it goes back to those Juliet Bravo policing issues that we
:31:06. > :31:13.remember from the 70s, but the whole idea of a lot of people at the
:31:14. > :31:18.moment said, am I mixed race? Look at the Obama daughters... White that
:31:19. > :31:25.offensive? Look at what we have got at the moment with race, we have got
:31:26. > :31:32.this whole idea that you have to have your nation and your race
:31:33. > :31:35.side-by-side, you are black British, African-American, but if I use the
:31:36. > :31:40.word Anglo-Saxon I know that James will convulse in shock!
:31:41. > :31:48.I think we are hearing some elegant distractions from the issue. We are
:31:49. > :31:54.talking about two specific stories that people are looking at. What
:31:55. > :31:59.kind of world do we live in? Who are these offence Gestapo who go out
:32:00. > :32:03.there looking to be offended by stuff? The person who wrote the
:32:04. > :32:07.advert for Police Scotland was a woman. She wasn't aware that you
:32:08. > :32:15.can't talk about pretty faces any more. I think she was in the
:32:16. > :32:21.photograph herself. She was. There were three. Whatever. The women in
:32:22. > :32:26.the photograph and the person who wrote the copy were on board with
:32:27. > :32:31.the problem, and yet, other people on the Internet, which is a terrible
:32:32. > :32:36.place for this kind of nonsense, there is a hard-core of licensed,
:32:37. > :32:41.professional offence takers who go round seeking to make everyone else
:32:42. > :32:47.feel uncomfortable, and they are taking the normality away from our
:32:48. > :32:51.world. Samanthi, what have people said? Ryan said that people are
:32:52. > :33:01.getting fed up because we see how phoney the idea of political
:33:02. > :33:07.correctness is. Abdul says we have far right protest every month,
:33:08. > :33:13.incredible levels of hate crime, so no, we haven't gone far enough with
:33:14. > :33:17.political correctness. Peter says, far too much PC rubbish these days.
:33:18. > :33:22.People want the right to be offended whether something might have been
:33:23. > :33:29.said in jest or in humour. Chris says that teachers at school were
:33:30. > :33:33.happy to throw insults at black kids, and if being PC stops this,
:33:34. > :33:41.that is a good thing. What would you like to see going forward? It's
:33:42. > :33:45.important to keep on having an open discussion. The point of political
:33:46. > :33:51.correctness is not to stifle people, it's to be able to have a discussion
:33:52. > :33:55.about important issues in society and to move forward. This discussion
:33:56. > :34:01.isn't new. It was happening in the 90s when I was younger, and fully
:34:02. > :34:05.grown women attacked me in the streets and shouted racist slurs at
:34:06. > :34:11.me. It's important to remember that we are not in some kind of new age
:34:12. > :34:16.where we are suddenly very politically correct. It is an
:34:17. > :34:17.argument that comes up frequently to shut down progressive conversation.
:34:18. > :34:25.Thank you all very much indeed. Talking about mental health was once
:34:26. > :34:27.something of a taboo subject. But increasingly
:34:28. > :34:29.people are opening up. A new book is contributing
:34:30. > :34:31.to that change in mood. It's by Katharine Welby-Roberts,
:34:32. > :34:33.the daughter of the Archbishop She's suffered from severe
:34:34. > :34:36.depression and, despite her father's role as a church man,
:34:37. > :34:38.was reluctant to confide Wendy Robbins has been
:34:39. > :34:42.to meet Katharine, who, after marrying and having a baby,
:34:43. > :34:51.is in a much better place. Katherine Welby-Roberts and her
:34:52. > :34:58.husband Mike live in Reading with their baby son and dog. Katherine
:34:59. > :35:03.has struggled with depression, anxiety and chronic fatigue syndrome
:35:04. > :35:09.since adolescence. What were you like as a teenager? I was always
:35:10. > :35:14.very shy when I met new people, and then I became my normal boisterous
:35:15. > :35:21.self. I was the vicar's kid, and everyone knew it. That was when I
:35:22. > :35:27.was a teenager. What did that mean? People would judge my behaviour and
:35:28. > :35:32.report back here, or just judge me. Do you remember feeling sad when you
:35:33. > :35:39.were growing up? The depression took old when I was 15 or so. A group of
:35:40. > :35:45.friends that I had been very good friends with, one summer, I came
:35:46. > :35:52.back to school and they did the analog version of an friending me.
:35:53. > :36:01.Then I got a glandular fever. I was quite ill for some time. I had to
:36:02. > :36:07.give up a couple of GCSEs. You throw into society's expectations of you,
:36:08. > :36:13.always needing to be better. It was a kind of perfect recipe for
:36:14. > :36:19.depression and anxiety. Katherine's mental health got worse over the
:36:20. > :36:23.next few years, and at 22, she experienced suicidal thoughts. I've
:36:24. > :36:27.always been able to logically observe, to a degree, what is
:36:28. > :36:33.happening. I knew logically I didn't want to hurt myself, so I did as
:36:34. > :36:39.much as I had the energy for to try and prevent that. The worst I got
:36:40. > :36:43.was banging my head on the walls, and that's as bad as I got in terms
:36:44. > :36:48.of action. Were your parents aware at this stage of what was going on?
:36:49. > :36:54.I don't think I really communicated with them about it, or let them see
:36:55. > :36:57.how bad it was. Do you think they understood the depths of what you
:36:58. > :37:04.were going through all what mental health was? They were learning on
:37:05. > :37:09.the job, in a way. It is your dad's job to look after the sick and the
:37:10. > :37:15.vulnerable, so it is strange, looking back, that you didn't seek
:37:16. > :37:20.help. A lot of people, as teenagers, don't necessarily talk to their
:37:21. > :37:25.parents. I felt I wanted to protect them as well and not burden them,
:37:26. > :37:31.and that is a very common theme with mental health problems, that you are
:37:32. > :37:36.a burden to those you love. Today, Katherine faces a daily battle to
:37:37. > :37:40.manage those illnesses, which impacts on her life with her
:37:41. > :37:44.husband. He has to do a lot more than he probably would if I was
:37:45. > :37:49.healthy. I'm always worried that he's going to leave me, that he's
:37:50. > :37:54.going to fall out of love with me, that I've upset him. Last year,
:37:55. > :38:01.Katherine and Mike became parents for the first time. Has been
:38:02. > :38:08.responsible for another meant that you have been less inside your head?
:38:09. > :38:13.I think it definitely has, because you just don't have the time, do
:38:14. > :38:21.you? But it goes both ways. You could completely put off thinking
:38:22. > :38:27.about how you are doing mentally, and become significantly more ill.
:38:28. > :38:32.I've tried to try and get a balance between at least being aware of how
:38:33. > :38:38.I'm feeling and how I'm doing. The one thing I want to try and avoid,
:38:39. > :38:47.if at all possible, is having a breakdown. And being unable to get
:38:48. > :38:52.through it. What role has your faith played in all this? To have the
:38:53. > :38:59.knowledge that I am unconditionally loved by God, and that he is aware
:39:00. > :39:06.of this, that he is engaged with me, that he is walking with me, that
:39:07. > :39:10.Jesus died for me, that he sent the holy spirit to comfort me and
:39:11. > :39:16.counsel me. All of that enables me to keep going. Why did you write the
:39:17. > :39:21.book? Having written the blog and talked about my mental health,
:39:22. > :39:27.people responded really well to you not saying, this is how to make
:39:28. > :39:32.yourself better, but to say this is what has made me better. It's an
:39:33. > :39:37.invitation to explore yourself rather than instructions on how to
:39:38. > :39:43.pull yourself together. And just as a way to enable people and invite
:39:44. > :39:48.people to explore what it means to accept themselves as themselves. Has
:39:49. > :39:52.your dad read the book and what does he think? He likes it. That's my
:39:53. > :39:56.favourite thing. Katharine Welby-Roberts -
:39:57. > :39:58.and we wish her and her family well. The care home system
:39:59. > :40:02.is teetering "on the edge", and funding shortages risks
:40:03. > :40:03."catastrophic failure" Those strong words from
:40:04. > :40:07.the boss of one of the UK's With a growing elderly population,
:40:08. > :40:10.the demand for care But is it fair for the NHS to bear
:40:11. > :40:14.so much of the strain, or should families take more
:40:15. > :40:16.of the burden? To help answer that question,
:40:17. > :40:19.I'm now joined by Sonia Dave Clements, a writer and advisor
:40:20. > :40:23.on social care policy. And re-joining us is
:40:24. > :40:38.barrister Sophia Cannon. Sonia, we expect families to take
:40:39. > :40:43.care of children. No one would ever doubt that. Why is it different when
:40:44. > :40:50.it comes to older relatives? The first thing to say is that families
:40:51. > :40:54.already do do a lot of caring. The latest study showed that family
:40:55. > :41:00.members put in over 7 billion hours of caring for elderly relatives.
:41:01. > :41:04.There's a lot that does go on. Lots are in care homes, but when you are
:41:05. > :41:09.looking at people who have advanced dementia or very serious physical
:41:10. > :41:13.impairment, these are not conditions that family members without
:41:14. > :41:18.professional training can care for people round the clock. Some of
:41:19. > :41:22.these people need round-the-clock care, and family members can't do
:41:23. > :41:27.that. They cannot give up jobs altogether. What about those who
:41:28. > :41:33.don't need round-the-clock care, who are just elderly and frail? With the
:41:34. > :41:38.significant cuts in funding we are seeing, older people, even when they
:41:39. > :41:42.have quite significant levels of care need, are not always getting
:41:43. > :41:47.the support they need from the care system. AgeUK estimates that there
:41:48. > :41:51.are over 1 million older people who don't get the help they need with
:41:52. > :41:56.basic tasks like washing and dressing. It is a really sad state
:41:57. > :42:02.of affairs. Family members need to do their bit, but it cannot all be
:42:03. > :42:08.left to them. Sophia, you are working mum. Men and women have to
:42:09. > :42:12.work to pay the mortgage. How realistic is it to expect families
:42:13. > :42:17.to care for the elderly? We have a new situation in society, which has
:42:18. > :42:24.just come on in the last few years or so. I call it the grampa Joe
:42:25. > :42:28.scenario. We all remember watching Charlie and the chocolate factory,
:42:29. > :42:33.where there are four grandparents all tucked up in that double bed.
:42:34. > :42:40.Demographics is now suggesting that we are going to have one grandchild
:42:41. > :42:44.for four grandparents. We with families and houses have to adapt.
:42:45. > :42:50.If you have a teenage child in your house, in the next ten years or so,
:42:51. > :42:55.that child will move out. Why not think about a family plan and
:42:56. > :43:01.bringing back the grandparents into that household? Rebecca, the idea of
:43:02. > :43:06.families doing more, isn't that just the state getting out of its duties?
:43:07. > :43:12.Those people have paid lots of taxes. In my community it is the
:43:13. > :43:16.norm that you bring granny into live with you. You respect elderly
:43:17. > :43:21.relatives and see they have something to give. You say the
:43:22. > :43:29.elderly as if it is a demographic that's a problem. It's a resource of
:43:30. > :43:34.wonderful experience, and not least childcare, to be really pragmatic.
:43:35. > :43:38.Myself and my friends use grandparents to do childcare,
:43:39. > :43:42.because who better to look after your child than grandma? I do think
:43:43. > :43:46.there's a difference between a grandparent who is really healthy
:43:47. > :43:53.and doesn't have advanced care needs, who can help with the
:43:54. > :43:57.childcare. But we do tend to fetishise some cultures where we
:43:58. > :44:03.say, they tend to do more care within the family and that's great.
:44:04. > :44:07.Japan didn't have a system of care homes before 2000, and they had huge
:44:08. > :44:12.problems with abuse of older people in the home, because they had
:44:13. > :44:16.younger people who were not able to care for people who needed
:44:17. > :44:22.round-the-clock care. Family relationships were breaking down.
:44:23. > :44:23.The state has to provide a minimum level of support. Samanthi, who are
:44:24. > :44:27.you talking to? With me now is Dawinder Bansal,
:44:28. > :44:37.who cares for her mother at home. Your mother is in her late 70s and
:44:38. > :44:44.you are juggling caring for her with your job. How are you managing? I
:44:45. > :44:49.transitioned from being a young carer to an adult carer, so I have
:44:50. > :44:54.been caring for her for a number of years along with my sister and some
:44:55. > :44:59.siblings. One of the most difficult things is juggling, because even
:45:00. > :45:04.though I do work and I have a senior position, it is about holding down a
:45:05. > :45:09.senior position with a company, about well-being, but about having a
:45:10. > :45:19.full social life as well. There are challenges around being able to live
:45:20. > :45:23.a life whereby you are living a bit more of your own life and having to
:45:24. > :45:28.think about somebody else. Have you ever considered looking for a home
:45:29. > :45:34.to care for your mum? I would never ever consider putting my mother into
:45:35. > :45:40.a home, unless, like one of your guests has said, about advanced care
:45:41. > :45:45.needs. I'm second-generation Asian, and for me, that pioneering
:45:46. > :45:49.generation sacrificed so much, and I've seen how my parents sacrificed
:45:50. > :45:54.so much for me to have the life I've got, so it's not something I would
:45:55. > :46:01.ever consider. A lot of people my age who are also second generation
:46:02. > :46:05.would agree with me on that, I think. The philosophy of growing up
:46:06. > :46:10.and see our parents care for their parents is now ingrained within me,
:46:11. > :46:17.and with people who have seen the same thing. It's very much a case of
:46:18. > :46:23.families who have the capability and have that family structure whereby
:46:24. > :46:27.they can take more responsibility for looking after their elders, they
:46:28. > :46:32.should do that. I don't personally think it should be, just because
:46:33. > :46:38.you've paid into the tax system, you are going to get the care you need.
:46:39. > :46:44.I think it's a very complex and multilayered situation. Everybody's
:46:45. > :46:48.situation is different. You might have family members, elder people in
:46:49. > :46:53.the community, who don't have that structure around them, and they do
:46:54. > :46:57.need that support. But wherever there is a family structure to
:46:58. > :47:02.support an older person, regardless of your culture and background, I
:47:03. > :47:07.think 100% effort should be made by those families to look after their
:47:08. > :47:13.elders. Thank you. An interesting account there.
:47:14. > :47:19.So Dawinder feels it is her duty to look after that generation because
:47:20. > :47:24.they were the pioneers who came here, is it a poor reflection on our
:47:25. > :47:31.society that many other cultures do not feel that? When I think about my
:47:32. > :47:35.parents, I think I feel similarly to Dawinder, but not all adults, not
:47:36. > :47:42.all older adults will have that family they can rely on. They feel
:47:43. > :47:45.very isolated and lonely, there are also increasing numbers of older
:47:46. > :47:49.people who will not have children, they will not have that family
:47:50. > :47:55.structure, that is a really big social issue. The state needs to
:47:56. > :47:59.provide a basic safety net. Families absolutely have to do their bit but
:48:00. > :48:03.because of modern living some people are not able to have children, some
:48:04. > :48:08.people's children might live on the other side of the world, for
:48:09. > :48:14.example. Society is judged by how older people are looked after and I
:48:15. > :48:21.don't think it is just children but community, it is neighbours... I
:48:22. > :48:27.absolutely agree. When people cannot rely on that, they rely on social
:48:28. > :48:31.care. You have worked on ideas to improve social care. If we funded
:48:32. > :48:43.care homes better would the system be better? No. There is a funding
:48:44. > :48:50.crisis in social care, care workers should be paid the national living
:48:51. > :48:55.wage or more, but for me it is more about the crisis of care in which we
:48:56. > :49:01.hear of people being neglectful in care homes, conditions in care homes
:49:02. > :49:08.being poured... Is that not just money? Know, some of these things,
:49:09. > :49:13.sometimes it is peeling wallpaper, basic things. How can we change
:49:14. > :49:20.that? At the moment we have an audit culture, a focus on targets, meeting
:49:21. > :49:24.objectives external to care homes. That is not a helpful way to
:49:25. > :49:28.proceed. We need to involve the people who work in the care homes
:49:29. > :49:33.more in the decision-making, and the people who live there. I completely
:49:34. > :49:36.agree because if we look at the care home system, the philosophy that
:49:37. > :49:42.runs through it is, these are older people who are at the start of a
:49:43. > :49:50.physical and mental decline and our job is to manage that process, it is
:49:51. > :49:56.about how can we keep these people say for as long as possible? It is
:49:57. > :50:00.not about, how can we help them lead a flourishing and fulfilling life,
:50:01. > :50:02.and I feel in our culture we basically right older people off
:50:03. > :50:07.when they started to decline, just make sure they are physically safe
:50:08. > :50:13.until they fade away. I think there is a myth that older people are a
:50:14. > :50:21.burden on families. That is not the case. Around 3% of 65 plus older
:50:22. > :50:30.people use care homes. The majority of people have care in the home will
:50:31. > :50:36.stop I think we need to get beyond the notion that old people are
:50:37. > :50:41.blocking beds, etc, it is not helpful. Let's find out what people
:50:42. > :50:44.are saying at home. Some agreement with the panel, Susie is a fan of
:50:45. > :50:49.caring for a relative unless they have dementia, which can be tiring
:50:50. > :50:52.and frightening. We live in a meet society and it is time to go back to
:50:53. > :50:56.caring for our families. Catherine says there should be more
:50:57. > :51:00.emphasis on family ties and duties rather than just stuffing them in a
:51:01. > :51:04.home if they are a burden, unheard of in other parts of the world.
:51:05. > :51:10.Another says, if you love a person, you care for them, age does not
:51:11. > :51:12.matter. Natalie raises a question which
:51:13. > :51:21.comes up in these debates, she says, I feel increasing the that there is
:51:22. > :51:25.a moral question of people who do not care for older people when they
:51:26. > :51:28.are young, yet expect people will care for them when they reach that
:51:29. > :51:33.age. We need to change the mindset, do we
:51:34. > :51:39.not? When you bring up children you put time and energy into it, you get
:51:40. > :51:47.pleasure from seeing them walk and talk, should we not be seeing it in
:51:48. > :51:51.the same way with elderly people? We help a mother and father looked
:51:52. > :51:54.after a baby because we can see how vulnerable it is. The issue with
:51:55. > :51:59.older people is they are very vulnerable as well but we often
:52:00. > :52:06.don't see the charm that babies have, so you don't want to help and
:52:07. > :52:11.go round. When a new baby is born everybody goes round with food but
:52:12. > :52:14.with an older person, not many people are knocking on doors in the
:52:15. > :52:21.same way. Let's bring Dawinder back in. Children have a lot more charm
:52:22. > :52:25.than elderly people, do you ask yourself that question every date?!
:52:26. > :52:31.I look at it as an honour to look after my parents, actually, because
:52:32. > :52:35.they have cared for me to be who I am today so why should I not give
:52:36. > :52:40.that back to them? But I think there is this thing when you are looking
:52:41. > :52:43.after children, you always know that they will transition out of that,
:52:44. > :52:49.whereas with older people you know that it is going to be a decline,
:52:50. > :52:53.they will get progressively more difficult, so I think that is the
:52:54. > :52:58.difference. But the other things to add in here is about the
:52:59. > :53:04.understanding we have from our employers, and I was very lucky and
:53:05. > :53:08.fortunate to have managers who have always understood my personal
:53:09. > :53:14.situation and have given me the time off when I have needed it, they have
:53:15. > :53:19.been very understanding and I think while we are looking at care homes
:53:20. > :53:23.and talking about money being pumped in there, I think it needs to be...
:53:24. > :53:26.I'm afraid we are running out of time, Dawinder, but thank you very
:53:27. > :53:28.much for joining us, and thank you to the panel as well.
:53:29. > :53:31.Now, over the long Bank Holiday weekend many people will be taking
:53:32. > :53:35.And Mehreen Baig is off on a seaside trip for us, too.
:53:36. > :53:41.But it's not for relaxation - she's taking on a new job.
:53:42. > :53:47.Sightseeing is one of the most enjoyable things on any holiday but
:53:48. > :53:55.today I'm on the Isle of Wight with a group of travellers with a
:53:56. > :54:04.difference. Half of them are blind. The tour is led by this man who
:54:05. > :54:06.became blind at 18 as a result of a genetic condition and quickly
:54:07. > :54:13.realised that holidays had become more difficult. Every time I tried
:54:14. > :54:18.to travel, travel company said, you are blind, you cannot travel with
:54:19. > :54:20.us, and I realised that if you want something in this world that does
:54:21. > :54:25.not exist, you either do without all build it yourself. So he came up
:54:26. > :54:34.with the idea of a tour company for blind people called Travel Eyes,
:54:35. > :54:40.which matches visually impaired travellers with sighted travellers
:54:41. > :54:47.and today he is going to show me how it works. So I would take your arm
:54:48. > :54:55.officially the person takes the back of the elbow, a few steps behind
:54:56. > :55:00.you, so if you were to disappear off the edge of the cliff then I would
:55:01. > :55:05.know to stop! Crucially, I have to describe what I see. Down the
:55:06. > :55:13.right-hand side there is an endless of water. Silvery blue water. We had
:55:14. > :55:19.to the Needles, one of the Isle of Wight's most popular attractions.
:55:20. > :55:31.Maybe you can take my hand and brought them out as well? OK, so...
:55:32. > :55:36.Said this is the first one, and the second one, which looks like the
:55:37. > :55:42.longest one, then there is a stack of water, then the one closest to
:55:43. > :55:53.us. Today is all about senses other than site. Look what I got you! Oh,
:55:54. > :55:58.that is nice. When you are travelling with the
:55:59. > :56:02.visually impaired person, as a sighted person you might become more
:56:03. > :56:08.aware of the other senses because we are not focused on sight, we get a
:56:09. > :56:14.chance to touch things come, taste things. And we don't do that enough,
:56:15. > :56:17.I guess? I have learned a lot so far but I want to know how the
:56:18. > :56:21.experience has been for the rest of the group. To be able to come here
:56:22. > :56:26.by myself and have the independence to explore different places, to be
:56:27. > :56:30.able to sit and laugh with everyone else, I know that there are so many
:56:31. > :56:33.women and girls who will never get that opportunity. As the day goes on
:56:34. > :56:43.I feel I am getting the hang of this. I am old enough to take him
:56:44. > :56:50.down 180 steps to the beach. All in front of us now is the water. Is
:56:51. > :56:57.that pebbles I can hear? It is, it is all pebbles. Then a close-up view
:56:58. > :57:06.of the island's famous coloured sand rocks.
:57:07. > :57:11.It is literally flat, like someone just touched it.
:57:12. > :57:17.It is a popular souvenir, too. What have we got here? A bottle in the
:57:18. > :57:22.shape of the guitar and I filled it up at Beesands shop here in the bay.
:57:23. > :57:26.Why did you choose a bottle in the shape of the guitar? It is such an
:57:27. > :57:33.interesting shape and you can feel the strings as well. Can you? Oh, my
:57:34. > :57:36.goodness, you can! I have wanted to come to the Needles and do the
:57:37. > :57:42.coloured sand for years, it was on my to do list before I died. How
:57:43. > :57:47.lovely! We are firm travel buddies now and
:57:48. > :57:53.the friendship is about to be tested.
:57:54. > :58:00.And now we step onto the boat. OK. You might need to save me! I have
:58:01. > :58:09.got you. Cheese! This trip has been a learning curve for me. In a
:58:10. > :58:12.sighted Society you don't get to appreciate all the things about you
:58:13. > :58:16.but these people are taking their time to describe all of the little
:58:17. > :58:21.details and it teaches you to live in the moment and appreciate where
:58:22. > :58:23.you are, surrounded by beautiful things.
:58:24. > :58:24.That's nearly all from us for this week.
:58:25. > :58:28.But why don't you join Samanthi for live chat online after the show?
:58:29. > :58:29.Yes, I'll be talking to barrister Sophia Cannon
:58:30. > :58:33.Log on to facebook.com/bbcsundaymorninglive
:58:34. > :58:37.In the meantime, from everyone here in the studio and the whole