:00:22. > :00:27.On tonight's Late Kick Off, an exclusive interview with
:00:27. > :00:32.Sunderland's Fraizer Campbell. was a hard 18 months for me, quite
:00:32. > :00:37.emotional. Just how important is the role of
:00:38. > :00:46.skipper? And tie inverses we're from jested year - we look forward
:00:46. > :00:48.to Sunday's big derby. Hello, welcome to Late Kick Off.
:00:48. > :00:52.We'll be hearing from England's newest striker tonight, and Danny
:00:52. > :00:55.Mills and I are joined by a man who managed Fraizer Campbell in his
:00:55. > :01:03.most productive season. It's South Shields' favourite son - well,
:01:03. > :01:08.apart from Joe McElderry - Phil Brown is with us.
:01:08. > :01:15.We did a top-five of dodgy North East moustache is last week, how do
:01:15. > :01:20.you plead? And the hairstyle as well! Happy
:01:20. > :01:25.days are at Hartlepool? Fantastic days. Your first football club, you
:01:25. > :01:30.cut your teeth in professional football. From electrician to that,
:01:30. > :01:37.is miles apart. And it started off at the Red
:01:37. > :01:40.Duster pub in South Shields. Last week, Sunderland's Fraizer
:01:40. > :01:42.Campbell received his first call up to the England squad. Stuart
:01:42. > :01:46.Pearce's selection for Wednesday's friendly against Holland, topped
:01:46. > :01:49.off an incredible few weeks for the young striker. It's less than a
:01:49. > :01:52.month since Campbell made a goal scoring return, after two cruciate
:01:52. > :02:02.ligament injuries, kept him out of the game for a year and a half.
:02:02. > :02:16.
:02:16. > :02:20.Simon Pryde has been to meet It was a shock and really, be it
:02:20. > :02:26.was nothing really, I changed direction a little bit and then
:02:26. > :02:30.just felt pain in my knee. I remember trying to walk, and I was
:02:30. > :02:35.thinking, that is definitely not right. It was a strange feeling at
:02:35. > :02:45.first, because I have never been out for more than a couple of weeks,
:02:45. > :02:52.until I went for the scan and they said you are out for six months.
:02:52. > :03:02.You have got your leg up all the time, machines attached to you,
:03:02. > :03:02.
:03:02. > :03:07.every half an hour, watching TV all the time, it is boring as hell.
:03:07. > :03:13.It was in the warm-up against Man City ironically you had a relapse?
:03:13. > :03:18.I put my neck out and it went again. It was not as painful the second
:03:18. > :03:26.time, but I was hopeful I had not done it again but deep down I knew
:03:26. > :03:31.it was bad. I was so close, and had been through all that hard work for
:03:31. > :03:37.six months and knowing I had to start all over again...
:03:37. > :03:41.How did you keep going during those times? It was tough. I have my
:03:41. > :03:51.family and friends who were always rhyme me. The guys at the training
:03:51. > :03:58.
:03:58. > :04:05.I have been chatting to a lot of the fans on Twitter and they always
:04:05. > :04:09.give me encouragement about my injuries. Things like that help you
:04:09. > :04:15.get through it sometimes, when you have a bad day and you are thinking,
:04:15. > :04:17.it has been forever, comments like that cheer you up.
:04:17. > :04:26.During the time out he went to games with the supporters didn't
:04:26. > :04:31.you? Yes, a rubbish disguise! us about it. My dad and his mates
:04:31. > :04:35.go to every home game and some of the away games. One time they were
:04:35. > :04:40.going to Blackpool and asked me to come. Presumably got recognised
:04:40. > :04:45.immediately. No, people were looking thinking, what is he doing
:04:45. > :04:50.here? Is that really him? But because people did not expect me to
:04:50. > :04:58.be sure that people do not question it until the end of the game when I
:04:58. > :05:03.took my hat off and people started recognising me then. Going out to
:05:03. > :05:08.train I was more nervous - waiting for 18 months it was more pure
:05:08. > :05:13.excitement and I was just ready to go out there and play. No fear,
:05:13. > :05:17.just get me out there, please, because it has been for too long!
:05:17. > :05:20.You on the bench against Middlesbrough and you got your
:05:20. > :05:23.chance earlier in the match then you expected? I was happy to be
:05:23. > :05:29.sitting there soaking in the atmosphere, and then they said, get
:05:29. > :05:36.ready to come on at half-time. I was ecstatic. It was a mixed bunch
:05:36. > :05:43.of emotions - when you score a goal you are ecstatic, but it was a hard
:05:43. > :05:47.18 months for me so it was quite emotional as well. It graced -- it
:05:47. > :05:57.embraced all those doubts in my mind, would I be back and be able
:05:57. > :05:58.
:05:58. > :06:05.to score, it proved to myself that I can do it.
:06:06. > :06:14.Phil Brown is our studio guest. A very successful time you had at
:06:14. > :06:22.Hull city. It paid off. People don't really watch the Belgian
:06:22. > :06:26.League, but it was a great platform for myself. Been a remarkable
:06:26. > :06:33.turnaround Fraizer Campbell has been handed his first call-up to if
:06:33. > :06:38.England's senior squad... Surprised as well - I am really delighted to
:06:39. > :06:43.be part of it, just honoured. It is hard to think long term, especially
:06:43. > :06:53.when you have been out for so long. I just want to be fit and happy,
:06:53. > :06:55.
:06:55. > :07:00.but's it! That will do me nicely. You heard his tribute to you - 15
:07:00. > :07:05.goals in that promotion season. He is clearly there -- very cheerful
:07:05. > :07:09.there, but what he is he like on a day-to-day basis? He is one of the
:07:10. > :07:15.best characters I worked with in management. He was such a bubbly
:07:15. > :07:19.character to be a rhyme, and to see him going through that, it there
:07:19. > :07:23.was torment in his face when he talked about the time he spent on
:07:23. > :07:29.the sidelines. But his family and friends are his greatest allies.
:07:29. > :07:36.His father was his agent, and I spent a lot of time talking to his
:07:36. > :07:41.dad about how he saw his career. We got a Manchester United player and
:07:41. > :07:45.he was, he was that quality. To get us to where he got us, and you sort
:07:45. > :07:50.Nicky Barmby playing the ball through, Campbell doing his bit and
:07:50. > :07:54.then playing back to Dean Windass - that was the magic circle if you
:07:54. > :08:00.like, they were the better players, and they migrated towards each
:08:00. > :08:07.other, and Fraizer drifted towards Bombay so clever and so often. But
:08:07. > :08:11.he wants to be out there, he is a boy at heart. Danny, when you have
:08:11. > :08:15.done double cruciate, I am trying to imagine what it feels like when
:08:15. > :08:22.you go into your first really competitive challenge. Your mind
:08:22. > :08:27.must play havoc, but a piece of your body has snapped twice. Well,
:08:27. > :08:30.I broke my leg and came back from a fracture after that, but you have
:08:30. > :08:35.done your training, and it is bizarre - it is not something you
:08:35. > :08:39.actually think about. If you do, you almost have to call it a day.
:08:39. > :08:44.So all the stuff he would have done, he would have been ready and
:08:44. > :08:51.desperate to get back again. What does Stuart Pearce see that may be
:08:51. > :08:57.Sir Alex Ferguson does not? It is fantastic for him, he has done
:08:58. > :09:01.really well, come back, had a big impact, but you have to worry. We
:09:01. > :09:08.are going into the euro championships and penning our hopes
:09:08. > :09:14.on strikers that have played two or three games this season. Phil, we
:09:14. > :09:18.saw your finest hour in management, there have been dark moments before,
:09:18. > :09:21.we did a radio programme together before Christmas, and your answer
:09:21. > :09:26.was very evocative and has stuck with me. We talked about what it
:09:26. > :09:29.felt like as a manager to be sacked for the first time. It is in very
:09:29. > :09:35.public forum, and I will never forget your answer. Are you going
:09:35. > :09:41.to give me the same one night? have just looked at, we have been
:09:41. > :09:45.talking about Lee Clark, he is in his first job as a manager. Having
:09:45. > :09:51.had a better football career than mine, he played the highest level,
:09:51. > :09:56.and then he has gone into management and got the sack, third
:09:56. > :10:04.in the table. But he cannot wait to get back in, once it is in your
:10:04. > :10:08.blood... But it is such a public forum, and it is almost a
:10:08. > :10:11.humiliation because most of us can make our mistakes and get our
:10:11. > :10:16.marching orders quite quietly, but as a football manager everyone is
:10:16. > :10:21.talking about it. You said you felt you had let your family down.
:10:21. > :10:27.feel as though you have let everybody down, but you are in
:10:27. > :10:34.charge of the football club, you are the holders of the key to the
:10:34. > :10:38.future, hopefully. Hopefully it is bright, and with Preston North End
:10:39. > :10:43.and Derby County it was not so good. But I served my time under some
:10:43. > :10:48.Allardyce, under all we said to him I want to become number 11 day. He
:10:48. > :10:53.let me have my wings and a few away one day. I don't think I will go
:10:53. > :10:58.back to being a number two. Such a topsy-turvy world, that most of us
:10:58. > :11:03.would aspire to acquit -- career trajectory that would leave us when
:11:03. > :11:08.we retire at the very top. But in your game, one minute you are the
:11:08. > :11:14.Premier League 1 minute you are in League 1... You have to keep your
:11:14. > :11:19.cool family in your site. My goal is up there, unfortunately it
:11:19. > :11:22.deviate. At Hull city I was well on my way to achieving my goal, but
:11:22. > :11:26.when you get the sack from Preston you wonder where your next move is.
:11:26. > :11:31.Sometimes you have to take a step backward before you step forward
:11:31. > :11:37.again. I cannot wait for the next challenge, to get my teeth into a
:11:37. > :11:44.project that has a chance, a chance of giving me chance more to the
:11:44. > :11:47.point. We weren't actually serious last
:11:47. > :11:50.week when we asked you to share your sports injury photos. But
:11:50. > :11:53.thanks anyway to Richard Kippin, Chris Embleton, David Douglas, Neil
:11:53. > :11:56.Wanless and Rob Oliver. Although we aren't showing your photos, some of
:11:56. > :12:06.them were quite frankly horrific. On your screen now is all the
:12:06. > :12:29.
:12:30. > :12:33.information you need to talk to us Yes, Sport Relief is on the 23rd
:12:33. > :12:42.March, and will hopefully will raise lots of money for people who
:12:42. > :12:47.really need it, in the UK and in the world's poorest countries. I
:12:47. > :12:55.suspect Hartlepool fans may be hanging on to their pennies. They
:12:55. > :12:59.might need to buy a few new defenders. 5-0 down. The best bit
:12:59. > :13:02.about it was the warm-up, they got about it was the warm-up, they got
:13:02. > :13:08.that right. What a disaster. Sometimes you get days like that,
:13:08. > :13:13.but he has had some good days so far. He has arrested the situation
:13:13. > :13:20.at home. This is the one, what is that about? What can a manager do
:13:20. > :13:25.about that? Nothing, apart from appeal for offside. As a manager,
:13:25. > :13:32.you can practise all week, put your preparation into wit, and then you
:13:32. > :13:38.go out and your players let you down. Er y a collectively? White is
:13:38. > :13:46.it that you do that training, everything is perfect and then it
:13:46. > :13:52.goes wrong? -- but why? You watch the five goals and every one of
:13:52. > :13:54.them is a mistake by an individual. You put it together and you go 5-0.
:13:54. > :13:59.You put it together and you go 5-0. The manager has to carry the can.
:13:59. > :14:05.He will be is doing on that all week in the same way Greg Abbott
:14:05. > :14:11.was stewing about 4-0 defeat. Look at that, he is watching the warm-up
:14:11. > :14:12.there. Into the top six, they have responded the right way. You take
:14:12. > :14:22.responded the right way. You take the two differences in terms of
:14:22. > :14:24.
:14:24. > :14:33.last week's result and it was an 83rd minute winner. Greg was at the
:14:33. > :14:43.north-west a sports writers' dinner. Was he? He questioned was it harder
:14:43. > :14:53.to win the John since Payne Trophy than Mancini to win the FA Cup? --
:14:53. > :14:57.Johnson Payne Trophy. Winning in that division, it is a tough job.
:14:57. > :15:01.What about the emotion he is showing it? Can you relate about
:15:01. > :15:07.relief after the heavy defeat last week? Question marks have been
:15:07. > :15:11.raised behind the scenes about Greg. He is a fighter, a feisty character.
:15:11. > :15:14.Last week's defeat took its toll on him. He has gone back to training
:15:14. > :15:18.and would have demanded a and would have demanded a
:15:18. > :15:23.performance prompt -- from his players. Regardless of what do you
:15:23. > :15:28.think, whether it was a great performance, he gets a win in the
:15:28. > :15:35.93rd minute and it is great. I feel the him, it was a great job.
:15:35. > :15:38.Fantastic feeling. Second anniversary, E better explain that,
:15:38. > :15:41.the greatest ever achievement, because it left me wondering what
:15:41. > :15:48.you were talking about. The second you were talking about. The second
:15:48. > :15:53.anniversary of the Cup this week. Reading are third in the table,
:15:53. > :15:58.they are pushing for automatic promotion. An ex colleague of mine,
:15:58. > :16:02.a spectacular free-kick taker, had a hand in both goals. It is no
:16:02. > :16:07.disgrace to get beaten by Reading. They have had a tough time lately,
:16:07. > :16:11.but if they can bounce back after this... Losing to Reading, there is
:16:11. > :16:15.no shame in now. They need to go on no shame in now. They need to go on
:16:15. > :16:17.towards the end of the season and try and get in the play-offs.
:16:18. > :16:20.Bounce back! England's clash with Holland on
:16:20. > :16:23.Wednesday will be the national team's first outing since John
:16:23. > :16:25.Terry was stripped of the captaincy and the fallout led to Fabio
:16:26. > :16:28.Capello's dramatic resignation. But why did the Italian feel so
:16:29. > :16:31.strongly about losing his on field leader? Well, believe it or not,
:16:31. > :16:41.they've been examining the role of the football captain at Northumbria
:16:41. > :16:57.
:16:57. > :17:07.University. So we thought we'd get It is a real credit to be captain
:17:07. > :17:20.
:17:20. > :17:30.It is a cold Tuesday night in Gateshead and it is time for Ben
:17:30. > :17:32.
:17:33. > :17:39.Clarke to step up. To be captain of the football club, whatever
:17:39. > :17:47.football club, the manager should respective. You have got to lead by
:17:47. > :17:51.example and do the right things. is a good talker in the dressing
:17:51. > :17:56.room. He leads by example on the pitch. If he does good things, the
:17:56. > :18:00.rest of the boys look up to him as well. The former Hartlepool and
:18:00. > :18:08.Sunderland defender has been a leader on the pitch all his life.
:18:08. > :18:13.He has even captain the England Under 20s. A manager can only do so
:18:13. > :18:23.much. He gives instructions from the sidelines, but he looks after
:18:23. > :18:26.
:18:26. > :18:32.his captain to get the point across It takes guts to be captain, to be
:18:33. > :18:42.the right man to lead your side to glory. And there's the occasional
:18:43. > :18:44.
:18:44. > :18:49.perk to the job: Do well and you It has been the high point,
:18:49. > :18:55.obviously. It is a dream to play at Wembley and lift the winning trophy,
:18:56. > :19:00.it is unbelievable. Reward for five years of wearing the armband
:19:00. > :19:07.through thick and thin. We would love to lead by example, every one
:19:07. > :19:14.of us, but there will be games where it you're not yourself. If
:19:14. > :19:23.your attitude is right, they will respect you for that. It is about
:19:23. > :19:27.your demeanour. So captains play an important role, but why did Capello
:19:27. > :19:31.feel so strongly about the loss of his skipper that he was prepared to
:19:32. > :19:35.walk away so close to a major championships? Our research
:19:35. > :19:39.suggested that managers saw the role of the captain as being an
:19:39. > :19:44.extension of themselves on the pitch. Although managers were able
:19:44. > :19:49.to get on the pitch themselves, they saw the captains as being
:19:49. > :19:54.their extended arm in influencing the game. Potentially, Capello
:19:54. > :19:57.could have seen the FA as cutting off his arm when he selected Don
:19:57. > :20:04.Terry and they decided his selection was not appropriate at
:20:04. > :20:12.that time. I've heard that it is like losing an arm, I can see that
:20:12. > :20:22.point. He must see something in me that resembles himself. I took his
:20:22. > :20:23.
:20:23. > :20:29.I was hoping we would have an adult talk, but you have been whispering
:20:29. > :20:35.in my ear. What is it? I think we make far too much of the captaincy
:20:35. > :20:38.at times. It is just a glorified coin toss, effectively. Senior
:20:38. > :20:42.players are more important than me. It does not matter who the captain
:20:42. > :20:49.is out of that. You did captain England for a little while, didn't
:20:49. > :20:54.you? Yes. You can see the evidence here. Did you lead by example they?
:20:54. > :20:59.Of course, it is all about winning, it does not matter how you win!
:21:00. > :21:09.That is your approach! As captain, you would show example, Real True
:21:10. > :21:10.
:21:10. > :21:13.grit? For me, it is more about the senior players. I came in as
:21:13. > :21:17.probably the most experienced player, but I was not captain, but
:21:17. > :21:22.I still did exactly what the captain would do. I saw my role and
:21:23. > :21:27.that was it, to lead the team, talked to other players. Because of
:21:27. > :21:32.the David Beckham industry, around the England captaincy, the captains
:21:32. > :21:41.become a media spectacle. Most countries hit to the player with
:21:41. > :21:44.the highest caps. What do you want as a manager at? You have got a
:21:44. > :21:49.senior management group and team in your changing room. If you have
:21:49. > :21:53.four or five professionals you can grab individually than collectively
:21:53. > :22:03.and get your word across, you can take a step back as a manager. As a
:22:03. > :22:09.captain, since the days when others 21 all the way through, my manager
:22:09. > :22:15.was the biggest influence on me. He gave me privilege and information
:22:15. > :22:22.at times and I passed that information on. Sometimes, you have
:22:22. > :22:28.to be careful in the changing rooms. In this culture, can you afford to
:22:28. > :22:34.put your camp in into your inner sanctum and give him the sinker --
:22:35. > :22:38.pour your captain into your inner sanctum? Captains, we have looked
:22:38. > :22:43.at various examples, you have got your people like John Terry and
:22:43. > :22:48.those guys who lead by example with the armband and where their arm --
:22:48. > :22:53.a badge with pride, and then you have the captains like Keegan who
:22:53. > :22:57.play on the front line and lead by example. Pure respect from the
:22:57. > :23:04.other players? Absolutely forced off Steven Gerrard is a big laugh -
:23:04. > :23:08.- a bit like that. He is not a big talker. There is a bigger role to
:23:08. > :23:12.be played in the team. There are a lot of great players with a lot of
:23:12. > :23:18.experience that have not been captains that are just as important.
:23:18. > :23:20.Fraizer Campbell... When Fraizer Campbell landed his
:23:20. > :23:23.place in the England squad, Newcastle defender Danny Simpson
:23:23. > :23:26.tweeted these words: "@Fraizer Campbell is my mate and I'm happy
:23:26. > :23:29.for him. But everyone knows next weekend, for 90 minutes, it's a
:23:29. > :23:32.different story, ha ha ha ha." It is of course the Tyne-Wear derby on
:23:32. > :23:35.Sunday, a local rivalry that dates back to the English Civil War. Well
:23:35. > :23:45.we're not going back to Roundheads and Cavaliers. But to whet your
:23:45. > :23:45.
:23:45. > :25:47.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 121 seconds
:25:47. > :25:57.appetite, we've had a dip into the I would like to bring you up to
:25:57. > :25:57.
:25:57. > :26:05.speed up with your music. That was Frankie Goes to Hollywood and New
:26:05. > :26:09.Order. Where is this game going to be played at the weekend? The fans
:26:09. > :26:19.have laid the St James's Park to wreck -- to rest. We have had a
:26:19. > :26:19.
:26:19. > :26:25.mock funeral. A lot of all video -- all people in this video! What do
:26:25. > :26:34.you think about this? It is always going to be sent James's Park for
:26:34. > :26:42.me. Some are even crying here! have moved site. It is absolutely
:26:42. > :26:49.crazy. It is phenomenal, isn't it? It is, but have -- that is how
:26:49. > :26:57.strong the feelings are. New stadiums, long and they get
:26:57. > :27:04.sponsored. I wasn't a fan of that. Yet again he has done it, he has
:27:04. > :27:11.been nailed it. If you move to a new stadium, like Phil did, you can
:27:11. > :27:16.get away with that, all the Emirates. But to remain such an
:27:16. > :27:21.iconic part of football, I think it is ridiculous. Did we ever put you
:27:21. > :27:29.on the spot and ask you if you were a Newcastle or a Sunderland fan? He
:27:29. > :27:39.probably sat on the fence. I am red and white. I went to my first game
:27:39. > :27:43.
:27:43. > :27:49.at Newcastle. You found it a softer environment elsewhere. Absolutely.
:27:49. > :27:54.Defensive frailties this week. Sunderland, a bit of a bubble burst
:27:54. > :27:58.at the weekend about bashing out West Brom. But they did incredibly
:27:58. > :28:02.well. Martin O'Neill has turned things around. They are in the top
:28:02. > :28:09.half of the table. Form almost goes out the window in these sort of
:28:09. > :28:15.games. There has been a lot of talk from Newcastle fans about the
:28:15. > :28:21.combination of players. People have been looking at goals. Squad comes
:28:21. > :28:27.in, and we should not forget that some players have been missing.
:28:27. > :28:35.can read into the stats too much. He has been missing a couple of top
:28:35. > :28:40.players. But I agree with Dannie Martin a. 10 goals in two games,