18/09/2016

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:00:42. > :00:46.Welcome to Match of the Day 2 Extra on BBC Two and

:00:47. > :00:54.Joining me today are the former England players Matthew Upson

:00:55. > :00:56.and Trevor Sinclair, along with football writer

:00:57. > :01:02.Use the hashtag #bbcfootball on social media, or text 85058

:01:03. > :01:14.And these are the subjects under discussion. Manchester City, five

:01:15. > :01:16.from five under Pep Guardiola. Unbeaten Everton are second

:01:17. > :01:18.with their best start The pressure eases on Pulis

:01:19. > :01:21.as West Ham concede four Spurs will look to set aside

:01:22. > :01:25.Champions League disappointment when they take on struggling

:01:26. > :01:28.Sunderland this afternoon. And we'll have updates

:01:29. > :01:39.from Vicarage Road where Watford It's currently goalless but in my

:01:40. > :01:40.view, Watford should already be ahead.

:01:41. > :01:43.We'll also be at Selhurst Park ahead of Palace's match with Stoke.

:01:44. > :01:45.Here's what's making the back pages today.

:01:46. > :01:47.The Sun on Sunday has Pep Guardiola drawing comparisons between

:01:48. > :01:50.The Sunday Mirror goes with "Rash Hour".

:01:51. > :01:55.Manchester United are ready to hand Marcus Rashford a new contract just

:01:56. > :01:57.four months after he signed a four-year ?20,000 a week one.

:01:58. > :02:00.And the Sunday Times says that a meeting with manager

:02:01. > :02:02.Mark Warburton tomorrow is likely to see Joey Barton's controversial

:02:03. > :02:04.spell at Rangers come to a premature end.

:02:05. > :02:08.We'll start at the Etihad where the home side beat Bournemouth 4-0.

:02:09. > :02:11.It's City's best ever start to a season - 8 wins from 8

:02:12. > :02:16.It's also Guardiola's best ever start at any club.

:02:17. > :02:24.Does that last statistic surprise you, Trevor Sinclair? Very much so.

:02:25. > :02:27.The players at Manchester City, we acknowledge that they have had the

:02:28. > :02:31.best squad for the last two or three years but they have not quite had

:02:32. > :02:34.the stewardship to run properly. I think Pep Guardiola has gone in

:02:35. > :02:37.there and we expected him to do well but we thought there would be

:02:38. > :02:43.problems to start with with the players being able to process his

:02:44. > :02:46.way of playing the game. But credit to the players and the coaching

:02:47. > :02:49.staff, they have done really well and they have taken it on board

:02:50. > :02:53.quickly and the results have been stunning. And if you wander

:02:54. > :02:57.throughout the course of the show why none of my guests are making eye

:02:58. > :03:01.contact with me it is because there is a monitor just off screen where

:03:02. > :03:07.the Watford Manchester United game is on. If they appear rude, that is

:03:08. > :03:11.what is happening. Only five league games into the season, and to a

:03:12. > :03:14.certain extent it feels like we might already be running out of

:03:15. > :03:16.subjects to talk about with Manchester City because the

:03:17. > :03:22.superlatives have already been covered. The biggest test they had

:03:23. > :03:24.was Manchester United. Three of the teams they have played are fighting

:03:25. > :03:27.for relegation, including Bournemouth but the first half

:03:28. > :03:30.against Manchester United, some people would say that was the best

:03:31. > :03:36.that they have seen from a Premier League team and certainly yesterday,

:03:37. > :03:40.I had the fortune of being able to take my children to see it because I

:03:41. > :03:46.wanted them to see this team in action. My daughter is more into

:03:47. > :03:51.football than my son. When we left the ground, he said, when can we go

:03:52. > :03:55.again? United fans, they go after City fans when they see the empty

:03:56. > :04:00.blue seats but they are planning to extend the ground so they have a

:04:01. > :04:04.third tier. This is going to bring people into the ground, this

:04:05. > :04:09.football will bring a new generation of fans. Just like Louis Van Gaal's

:04:10. > :04:12.football was going to lose a generation of Man United fans. This

:04:13. > :04:17.football is something to go and watch. It is a wonderful spectacle

:04:18. > :04:22.and the fact that he has been able to put together in such a short of

:04:23. > :04:26.time, with the intensity on the sidelines, the way he is berating

:04:27. > :04:31.players if things go wrong, even at 4-0, that is because he is looking

:04:32. > :04:35.ahead to Champions League nights where they are going to have to do

:04:36. > :04:39.it for 90 minutes. The energy of the team, pressing, you do not have a

:04:40. > :04:43.second. Yesterday, although the opposition was different, it

:04:44. > :04:46.reminded me of his 2011 Barcelona team against Manchester United in

:04:47. > :04:50.the Champions League final. They did not have a second on the ball,

:04:51. > :04:54.including players like Ryan Giggs, who could do nothing with it. I

:04:55. > :05:02.interviewed John Stones on Friday last week and the energy, forget

:05:03. > :05:07.about John Stones, the interview was fine but I met... I am sure the

:05:08. > :05:13.interview was better than fine! He is a lovely lad, by the way. I met

:05:14. > :05:20.Les Chapman, the old man involved with this website. I met the

:05:21. > :05:26.security, and everybody speaks very highly about Pep Guardiola. They

:05:27. > :05:30.needed waking up because they were falling asleep under Pellegrini. It

:05:31. > :05:35.reflected the character, like everyone had downed tools for six

:05:36. > :05:38.months. Which is wrong anyway. With big wages, they should be energetic

:05:39. > :05:44.anyway. You talk about everyone from the tea lady to the Manchester City

:05:45. > :05:48.and England centre-half being affected by it, isn't that just good

:05:49. > :05:54.man management? And argue not surprised that more managers don't

:05:55. > :05:58.do that? Maybe they did? Have you been in teams, in squads were

:05:59. > :06:02.managers do not do that? Of course, because there is doubt. Certain

:06:03. > :06:06.managers, if they do not win the players over, they will not win the

:06:07. > :06:10.staff over, and I think it is a vicious circle. It ends up where

:06:11. > :06:14.people look like they are downing tools and they are not interested

:06:15. > :06:18.but with Pep Guardiola, I believe he gets there at six o'clock and leaves

:06:19. > :06:21.at nine o'clock in the evening. He sees everyone. He gets there before

:06:22. > :06:27.everyone and he leaves after everyone. It is like the Apprentice,

:06:28. > :06:32.he gets there early and Leeds last. First man on the pitch, last one to

:06:33. > :06:38.leave. And they go on to do something. He is not there to earn

:06:39. > :06:42.his wages, he is there to do something serious. Hard work and

:06:43. > :06:47.common sense. And again, this is not a soft touch. As we saw in his

:06:48. > :06:53.dealings with Joe Hart and Yaya Toure, the backbone of the title

:06:54. > :06:57.winning side. A lot of people were shocked with his treatment of Joe

:06:58. > :07:04.Hart, which was pretty beautiful. It shook everyone saying, this is it.

:07:05. > :07:07.-- pretty brutal. He is saying, if we want to do something special,

:07:08. > :07:11.don't get on the wrong side of the sky. And for a variety of reasons,

:07:12. > :07:15.including his distribution of the ball, Joe Hart is gone. Yaya Toure

:07:16. > :07:21.is virtually gone, another big character. I don't know if it's an

:07:22. > :07:27.company will last longer because he has Otamendi. This is the power that

:07:28. > :07:30.managers used to have. If you are going into a club and you are going

:07:31. > :07:33.to be judged on the players you have got, especially in an important

:07:34. > :07:37.position like the goalkeeper, surely you can pick your own goalkeeper?

:07:38. > :07:42.Especially in Pep Guardiola's position. Although Joe Hart was a

:07:43. > :07:45.good goalkeeper, he did not serve him well, the way he wants to play

:07:46. > :07:49.football. I do not think it was harsh, but it could have been done

:07:50. > :07:52.earlier. So that Joe Hart would have had a chance to meet his new

:07:53. > :07:59.team-mates and have preseason and it would've been easier the fans.

:08:00. > :08:03.Plenty of comments on the Match of the Day Facebook page. One says, I

:08:04. > :08:07.am an Manchester United fan but Kevin de Bruyne is a joy to watch,

:08:08. > :08:11.controlling the game on his own. One of the top five players in the

:08:12. > :08:15.world. Jesse says, he is the most electrifying player I have seen

:08:16. > :08:22.since Gerard and Lampard. Mark says, it is mad to think that Chelsea have

:08:23. > :08:25.let Kevin de Bruyne go. Just a word on Jack Wilshere, brought on by

:08:26. > :08:32.Eddie Howe. Probably not the best game to judge him. If you look at

:08:33. > :08:36.the possession of Manchester City had, Bournemouth did not get a kick

:08:37. > :08:41.of the ball. A tough game for Jack to come back for his debut but they

:08:42. > :08:44.will get stronger. Eddie Howe will get him fit, which is a big deal.

:08:45. > :08:49.Not just mechanically fit but fits to get up and down the pitch. I feel

:08:50. > :08:53.like there is a lot to come from him and hopefully he can show us what

:08:54. > :08:57.he's got. I did not realise he was on the pitch until his number was

:08:58. > :09:01.called up for him to come off, that is how ineffective he was. But there

:09:02. > :09:05.are plenty of good players who can be that anonymous against this

:09:06. > :09:08.Manchester City team. We put Everton in just a moment but let's go to

:09:09. > :09:15.Vicarage Road. Watford against Manchester United, around 20 or 25

:09:16. > :09:20.minutes in and both sides have had chances. We will go to fill shortly

:09:21. > :09:23.but it is still goalless at Vicarage Road. Moving on to Everton.

:09:24. > :09:26.Everton made it four wins from five with a 3-1 victory over

:09:27. > :09:37.It is a good start. In results, in points. But I think the most

:09:38. > :09:44.important is the way we get the points because you see the reaction

:09:45. > :09:51.of the fans. They like how we play. I think the team is more aggressive

:09:52. > :09:58.than it was and that is what we like to be in football it is not the

:09:59. > :10:04.discussion about the technical qualities of the players, but they

:10:05. > :10:09.like to... It makes it difficult for the opponent. Well, you can see

:10:10. > :10:13.Ronald Koeman at the end of that game. Trevor Sinclair, you were

:10:14. > :10:17.saying you think it is important that people like him and Guardiola

:10:18. > :10:21.are doing well at the top of the Premier League? Why? I think a lot

:10:22. > :10:27.of managers have done very well. They have come from non-food Bolling

:10:28. > :10:30.backgrounds, and I feel like that connection, with the dark arts of

:10:31. > :10:34.yesteryear, some of that has gone missing. If you have former players

:10:35. > :10:39.becoming successful managers, it keeps them going. Even if they are

:10:40. > :10:42.foreign? Even if they are foreign. It would be ideal if they were

:10:43. > :10:45.British but even if they are foreign, it keeps that connection

:10:46. > :10:49.and it keeps their belief that players can go into management when

:10:50. > :10:54.they have a chance. By the way, in the studio now we have to show you

:10:55. > :11:00.this, Matthew Upson, former England defender has arrived. As late as one

:11:01. > :11:04.of Trevor Sinclair's tackles towards the end of his career. A bit of a

:11:05. > :11:09.nightmare journey. I will give you time to settle in. Leighton Baines

:11:10. > :11:13.has spoken of improved fitness levels at Everton. That always seems

:11:14. > :11:17.to be spoken about when one manager takes over from another. It is more

:11:18. > :11:22.than that. I don't know a new manager who doesn't say quite

:11:23. > :11:28.quietly, I don't believe how unfit they are, which is the immediate

:11:29. > :11:32.excuse to lose two on the trot. I was not particularly impressed in

:11:33. > :11:35.them going behind yesterday on a hotly disputed goal although I do

:11:36. > :11:41.not blame the referee. You had to see the replay because it was not on

:11:42. > :11:45.the character. -- on the camera. But the character they showed in coming

:11:46. > :11:50.back, there is a real power and intensity about this Everton side.

:11:51. > :11:56.It was fabulous to see Gareth Barry scoring on his 600th game. I saw his

:11:57. > :12:06.debut when he was 17 at Aston Villa. You are really old! Their best start

:12:07. > :12:11.since 1978. Andrew on Facebook, best start for 38 years. Unbeaten in

:12:12. > :12:14.five. They had a very good transfer window, despite what it felt like on

:12:15. > :12:21.deadline day, with Moussa Sissoko not having come over, and that might

:12:22. > :12:25.turn out to be good or bad. But actually, Stekelenburg and Ashley

:12:26. > :12:30.Williams, they have got a bit of a spine there that has strengthened

:12:31. > :12:34.them, and Bolasie. I think Williams is a good addition, given they lost

:12:35. > :12:39.a John Stones. I think to replace him with somebody with that

:12:40. > :12:43.experience is a really good signing. He will play well with Jagielka and

:12:44. > :12:54.add stability which a new manager will look forward to. That seems to

:12:55. > :13:01.have rejuvenated Mirallas and handling Ross Barkley well. He has

:13:02. > :13:04.been rejuvenated. As a former player, explained why. I have had it

:13:05. > :13:09.as a player when you wake up when you think, I don't feel well today.

:13:10. > :13:13.You get out and you are creaking, more so at the end of your career.

:13:14. > :13:17.You are creaking and you are not operating properly. It is human

:13:18. > :13:20.error. You get on the pitch and you do not play well. You do not mean

:13:21. > :13:24.it. You had the same preparation, the same breakfast but it is not

:13:25. > :13:29.happening. Surely a manager can see that and say, bring him off, speak

:13:30. > :13:32.to him, get him out there next week. That is what I feel has happened

:13:33. > :13:36.with Ross Barkley. He got out of the wrong side of bed. For me, it is

:13:37. > :13:41.cruel to leave him out there and it is not conducive to winning

:13:42. > :13:44.football. You are a man short. Again, I don't think a manager that

:13:45. > :13:51.doesn't come from a plain background would know that. He just calmed

:13:52. > :13:54.everything down, didn't he? Every player will have a bad game and if

:13:55. > :13:58.they have a bad game, as Trevor says, sometimes it might be crueller

:13:59. > :14:04.to leave them out. Look, you had a bad game, move on. It is brave

:14:05. > :14:09.management. A player of that age, how important he is to the team as

:14:10. > :14:13.well, to analyse that and see it, take him off, and get a reaction

:14:14. > :14:17.like he did yesterday, good reaction, it shows that it was the

:14:18. > :14:20.right decision. It has to be something, listen, it is not

:14:21. > :14:25.happening, we are better than this. You are human and it happens. We had

:14:26. > :14:30.this argument with Manchester United in the week saying among colleagues

:14:31. > :14:36.that Jose Mourinho has come out now and named two players who he is

:14:37. > :14:39.wanting to put into the Derby, and saying that they were not right for

:14:40. > :14:44.the challenge. He has questioned their ambition. As a player, surely

:14:45. > :14:48.if you look at that, your motivation should be, I am going to go out next

:14:49. > :14:55.week and prove you wrong. Can you tell me, is that how you react? Or

:14:56. > :15:02.do players go, this is an outrage! It depends if the manager is right!

:15:03. > :15:07.I think more to the point, it is stepping back and simple fine

:15:08. > :15:11.things. When things are not going quite right, it is good to go and

:15:12. > :15:16.think, let's simple fine my game. Let's do the basics really well and

:15:17. > :15:20.forget about anything else. Attitude, technical basics, all the

:15:21. > :15:23.simple things, do them at a high level and you will get your game

:15:24. > :15:27.back. It looks like he did that yesterday. If the manager is being

:15:28. > :15:31.honest and you are being honest, you will say, listen, have I played

:15:32. > :15:35.well? And you have to be harsh with yourself. I think if you are harsh

:15:36. > :15:38.with yourself and you are honest, you can come to a good conclusion.

:15:39. > :15:40.If the manager is still wrong, there is a problem because you obviously

:15:41. > :15:49.have different points of view. Is there a difference between being

:15:50. > :15:57.publicly criticised and it happening behind closed doors? With the media

:15:58. > :16:01.and transparency that goes on today, it is a lot more difficult to take

:16:02. > :16:08.it on the chin in the public eye. But you will know if you have had a

:16:09. > :16:12.bad game. Exactly. Players today are a lot more sensible than we were.

:16:13. > :16:18.With the analysis they've been brought up on, they can accept it a

:16:19. > :16:23.lot easier. The thing is, if the manager isn't honest in those

:16:24. > :16:27.post-match interviews and press conferences, fans can see through

:16:28. > :16:32.it. If you look at Everton in particular, that was one of the

:16:33. > :16:38.birth of an is's big downfalls. He would do his post-match interviews

:16:39. > :16:47.and not say... He would defend things. -- Roberto Martinez's. It is

:16:48. > :16:54.the balance between respecting and keeping a player onside, and losing

:16:55. > :16:59.credibility with supporters. That is a hard balance for a manager. Arsene

:17:00. > :17:04.Wenger does that sometimes, where he will not quite say what needs to be

:17:05. > :17:09.said. That is his management style. He might want to keep that in house

:17:10. > :17:17.and get a better reaction from the players. But isn't that the same in

:17:18. > :17:23.your job, our job. Fans are a darn sight more critical than I will ever

:17:24. > :17:30.be in a newspaper. But if I am critical in a newspaper, I get

:17:31. > :17:37.criticised. But if we lose -- if we don't point things out, we lose

:17:38. > :17:42.face. Let's go to Vicarage Road now. Watford against Manchester United.

:17:43. > :17:48.One of four Premier League games today. Phil Wye can update us on

:17:49. > :17:55.what is going on. It is goalless. It should be about 3-2 to Watford. A

:17:56. > :18:00.bizarre game. Not the highest quality, mistakes everywhere. Gone

:18:01. > :18:09.low should have scored three minutes later, -- Ighalo, after De Gea.

:18:10. > :18:16.Heaney had a header well saved by De Gea. Ibrahimovic has missed a strike

:18:17. > :18:21.into the side netting. And Pogba, in the last 30 seconds, has just

:18:22. > :18:27.rattled the crossbar from 25 yards. One of those days, really. Still

:18:28. > :18:32.0-0. That explains why your eyes have been fixated on it, because

:18:33. > :18:34.there have been lots of chances. The defenders have not been doing a good

:18:35. > :18:39.job. The attackers are on top of it. On to West Brom, and going

:18:40. > :18:41.into yesterday's match all of the talk at The Hawthorns

:18:42. > :18:45.concerned the future of Tony Pulis - his team responded by scoring four

:18:46. > :18:56.goals in a Premier League match I think they had only scored six in

:18:57. > :19:01.their previous 13 Premier League games. The West Ham defence has been

:19:02. > :19:08.criticised. We will come on to them in a bit. Do we have two? First, we

:19:09. > :19:18.have two praise West Brom, and Salomon Rondon. Absolutely. And

:19:19. > :19:22.Chadli... Pieces we saw yesterday had so much energy, which may be

:19:23. > :19:28.something they had been lacking. He got forward, around the box. Efforts

:19:29. > :19:34.on goal, and his second goal, his desire to run past and get in a

:19:35. > :19:41.position to score at 3-0 up, just shows the mindset that West Brom

:19:42. > :19:46.were in yesterday. That shows why they scored four, not just West

:19:47. > :19:52.Ham's shortcomings. We've seen him play at Spurs, where he has a nice

:19:53. > :19:59.touch, but does he really wanted? Yesterday, he looked hungry. He

:20:00. > :20:04.looked like he had desire. It was a fantastic performance from him. Very

:20:05. > :20:08.difficult for West Ham to deal with. You did well to keep your

:20:09. > :20:13.concentration there, Trevor Sinclair, because Watford have taken

:20:14. > :20:19.the lead at the courage road. Etienne Capoue celebrating. We will

:20:20. > :20:25.go very shortly to Vicarage Road and get the details. Just on Nasa

:20:26. > :20:31.Chadli. Eight goals and three assists over the last two seasons at

:20:32. > :20:36.Spurs. He has delivered for Spurs. So the fact that West Brom managed

:20:37. > :20:41.to get him for that price was a snip. Let's go to the voc -- to the

:20:42. > :20:49.goal. Dreadful defending from Manchester United. Anthony Martial

:20:50. > :20:54.getting treatment now. The ball went to Etienne Capoue and his fourth

:20:55. > :21:00.goal in five games. Poor defending from United, but Watford have

:21:01. > :21:09.merited the lead. Trevor, you were saying? Another one let go by Spurs

:21:10. > :21:15.for ?5 million. Found his feet at Watford. Feels wanted, the manager

:21:16. > :21:23.makes him feel imported. And Nasa Chadli? I was extremely impressed by

:21:24. > :21:27.him. Going forward on the break, it was not dissimilar to what Man City

:21:28. > :21:31.did yesterday on the break. It was just what they needed. The spotlight

:21:32. > :21:36.was on the game yesterday. Will this be the end of someone who is a very

:21:37. > :21:41.good manager? I think things are still spilling over from the end of

:21:42. > :21:45.last season at West Brom. Sadly, no patience at the moment, but that was

:21:46. > :21:52.a cracking result. It shows that even if the team is struggling, if

:21:53. > :21:55.the opposition are of their game in this Premier League, because the

:21:56. > :22:01.strength and depth is so great... And West Brom were all over them.

:22:02. > :22:05.Since Tony Pulis has been there, trying to get a combination that

:22:06. > :22:12.works up front has been a real struggle. And what to do with

:22:13. > :22:17.Berahino, who always appears to be something for the times he has been

:22:18. > :22:21.at West Brom. That may be a combination that works, because

:22:22. > :22:27.Chadli will go through the lines. Absolutely. You mentioned Berahino.

:22:28. > :22:32.It has been a bit of a thorn in his side. They haven't resolved the

:22:33. > :22:37.situation by him either stepping up and playing, or letting him go. That

:22:38. > :22:42.will always be a disruption. He needs to find a solution to that

:22:43. > :22:51.number ten role, and people running beyond a striker. He seems to have

:22:52. > :22:54.done that. The fourth goal, from a ridiculously poor West Ham corner.

:22:55. > :23:01.Rondon was through. The support from Chadli was great. Going back to

:23:02. > :23:05.Berahino. All parties are not covering themselves in glory in this

:23:06. > :23:09.situation. The player isn't playing football. The club are not getting

:23:10. > :23:16.any work -- any word from the player. Tony Pulis hasn't been in

:23:17. > :23:23.this situation before, and they haven't dealt with it well. It has

:23:24. > :23:27.dragged on. West Ham's fourth defeat in four matches. Conceded four goals

:23:28. > :23:36.for the second time in a week. Ilitch spoke to us after the game.

:23:37. > :23:42.-- Slaven Bilic. You can talk, we will be all right. But it is not a

:23:43. > :23:51.good situation for us. At the moment, we have a problem. A problem

:23:52. > :23:59.that we have too sold. We can solve it, but we have a problem. Starting

:24:00. > :24:05.with me. You look at yourself right now? Of course. I know we have a

:24:06. > :24:10.problem. I am the manager and I have to do everything to solve that

:24:11. > :24:15.problem and turn this round. I totally understand how football

:24:16. > :24:21.works. He is not shirking responsibility. You wouldn't expect

:24:22. > :24:27.him to. He is a very honest manager. He did a fantastic job last year,

:24:28. > :24:32.although towards the end of the season, they did concede a lot of

:24:33. > :24:37.goals. This season is different to last. Last season it was new

:24:38. > :24:43.manager, some new players, they were away at Anfield, then the Emirates,

:24:44. > :24:48.then the Etihad. They always went with that sphere, and that feeling

:24:49. > :24:55.of, don't concede, don't concede. They did so well last season it has

:24:56. > :25:01.been there an doing this year. They did so well, they don't have the

:25:02. > :25:07.fear. They are not being followed at the back and they are getting torn

:25:08. > :25:12.apart. They need to start by giving other team's opposition respect, and

:25:13. > :25:17.if they do that, and start keeping clean sheets, they will do well.

:25:18. > :25:25.That is an interesting theory. I heard a fan on 606 last night saying

:25:26. > :25:32.that what was built under Sam Allardyce has disappeared, and Bilic

:25:33. > :25:38.has inherited that defensive platform. Do you think that is

:25:39. > :25:42.something to do with it? Gradually, he has imposed his own philosophy on

:25:43. > :25:46.the team, which will bring more openness and freedom to the way they

:25:47. > :25:51.play, which will mean they are more exposed at the back. He is juggling

:25:52. > :25:56.different things. They have moved to a new stadium. They were in Europa

:25:57. > :26:01.League qualification, so that is another thing. He has lost Andy

:26:02. > :26:07.Carroll, a person who can be difficult to fit into your team if

:26:08. > :26:13.you do not play to his strengths. He has lost Cresswell. He hasn't got a

:26:14. > :26:20.Central right back. Yes. So there has been a lot of unsettling things

:26:21. > :26:25.happening. The left-back who played yesterday, it was a bit of a

:26:26. > :26:29.disastrous performance overall. It is a shame, because he has been one

:26:30. > :26:34.of the better players for West Ham this season. I agree, especially

:26:35. > :26:40.about Andy Carroll. Talking about the players they have defensively.

:26:41. > :26:46.Andy Carroll understands that that is where defending starts from. He

:26:47. > :26:51.did not go half-heartedly. He tried to win the ball, which is the

:26:52. > :26:57.trigger for everyone to go behind you. Other teams have more time on

:26:58. > :27:00.the ball now to build their attacks. There is this bizarre pressure and

:27:01. > :27:08.West Ham about having to play in a certain way. They constantly go on

:27:09. > :27:15.about it. The best way to play football is to win the game. Troy

:27:16. > :27:22.Deeney alluded to it after the game. When you are having the MIC taken

:27:23. > :27:26.out a view on the pitch, that can... And it inspired Watford to come

:27:27. > :27:33.back. If that is the West Ham way, good luck to them. That is not a

:27:34. > :27:39.West Ham way. It is like an un-written rule. You don't take the

:27:40. > :27:45.MIC. 4-0 up, you don't start throwing nutmegs in there. You are

:27:46. > :27:56.starting to see it in the Premier League there. Back in the day!

:27:57. > :28:01.Wouldn't even get a red card! Have the Euros had an effect? A lot of

:28:02. > :28:10.the team have had a successful Euros in the summer. It happened to me

:28:11. > :28:14.when I came back from a competition like that. You come back physically

:28:15. > :28:20.fine, but mentally, it is really hard to get yourself back to a level

:28:21. > :28:31.where you are 100% concentrated for games. Get in touch with us at

:28:32. > :28:37.#bbcfootball and 85058. Dave says that Chadli was excellent yesterday.

:28:38. > :28:42.Looks likely we have found a real foil for Rondon at last. Now

:28:43. > :28:48.Sunderland going to Spurs today. Beaten Monday night by Everton. This

:28:49. > :28:57.time of the year, you have two choices. You get new players, or you

:28:58. > :29:01.get out on the grass with your players. We cannot get new players.

:29:02. > :29:06.We have to improve the ones we have. The players have to lift their level

:29:07. > :29:14.as well. They have to show they are good enough to play at this level.

:29:15. > :29:18.You know, it is always the manager. I've got to take responsibility for

:29:19. > :29:22.the job. But you have to think, come on, new players need a lot of

:29:23. > :29:27.managers here. You are better than what you show. You've got to be able

:29:28. > :29:31.to do it for the full 90 minutes. Does that go back to be honesty you

:29:32. > :29:37.are talking about, that fans want to hear? Saying, listen, you are

:29:38. > :29:44.players who have had an awful lot of managers here. You are in the same

:29:45. > :29:49.situation. He will probably openly be very honest, David Moyes, and

:29:50. > :29:53.critical of his team. That is kind of firing a warning. You've been in

:29:54. > :29:58.this position before. If you don't do something about it, we will stay

:29:59. > :30:04.in this position. Let's work hard, be organised and pull some results

:30:05. > :30:09.together. If you take Jermain Defoe out of their setup at the moment,

:30:10. > :30:14.who is in great form at the moment, they would be in real trouble. They

:30:15. > :30:21.have some young players around Defoe. Januzaj, Duncan Watmore... On

:30:22. > :30:24.Monday night, they looked like they had substituted their centre halves

:30:25. > :30:33.at half-time, because they just went missing. Moyes put the cards on the

:30:34. > :30:37.table early doors, saying to the Sunderland fans, we could be

:30:38. > :30:42.relegated... Going back to managerial honesty, was that the

:30:43. > :30:46.right thing to say? I think that has protected himself. I thought the

:30:47. > :30:50.squad was better. He's saying, we don't have a squad where we can

:30:51. > :30:56.compete for a middle of the table performance in May, and we are going

:30:57. > :31:01.to be in it. He is being very honest.

:31:02. > :31:08.A manager says, it really resonates with the players. The most important

:31:09. > :31:13.thing is that it affects the players. That kind of comment will

:31:14. > :31:17.just send negativity out. Sure, he does not have the belief that the

:31:18. > :31:20.players are going to... And when he made that comment about the

:31:21. > :31:23.relegation battle, if you were in that squad and you had gone into

:31:24. > :31:27.training the following day, you would've thought, great, that is a

:31:28. > :31:30.bit defeatist? I would have thought it was defeatist but the main job

:31:31. > :31:34.for me as a player is to remove them from my mind and focus on myself

:31:35. > :31:41.being the best I can be. Not everyone have that will or the

:31:42. > :31:45.capability. You cannot count on people to take it in the right way.

:31:46. > :31:49.If they don't where does that leave you? If you had been looking to move

:31:50. > :31:53.in that transfer window and you had heard the manager says that we were

:31:54. > :32:00.in a relegation battle, would it have made you think twice about

:32:01. > :32:04.joining the club? Of course you would think, maybe give that one a

:32:05. > :32:09.mess. It's only natural. It depends what you have got on the table but

:32:10. > :32:13.if you feel that the manager does not have confidence in the players,

:32:14. > :32:17.the writing is on the wall. If you fancy a relegation battle, it is not

:32:18. > :32:21.much fun. It is interesting, Trevor said, why would you make that

:32:22. > :32:28.comment? Would you be preparing people to think it was not your

:32:29. > :32:31.fault if something did not go well? That was a comment in one of the

:32:32. > :32:36.papers saying they should stick with David Moyes because even if they do

:32:37. > :32:39.get relegated, he is the man that can consolidate, get the right

:32:40. > :32:43.players in, get them to the point where they can compete and get back

:32:44. > :32:47.to the Premier League. I think that is what Kevin was suggesting. If

:32:48. > :32:51.England had not come crawling for Sam Allardyce, he would not be there

:32:52. > :32:58.right now. Hang on, Allardyce would not be there? Because he wanted to

:32:59. > :33:03.build on what they achieved last season. And move the club forward.

:33:04. > :33:08.And as far as I know in meetings with the hierarchy am a he was not

:33:09. > :33:12.going to be able to do that. And I am aware that David Moyes was aware

:33:13. > :33:18.of this. But Sunderland, despite their problems, it is still a big

:33:19. > :33:22.job. I can understand him taking it but that squad is very weak and the

:33:23. > :33:26.team he has to play early in the season was weak as well. No matter

:33:27. > :33:30.what you say off the pitch, the team is just not good enough. It shows

:33:31. > :33:34.how well sanded last year. Absolutely. As far as Spurs are

:33:35. > :33:38.concerned, what do you make of the start to the season and how much

:33:39. > :33:43.will their first three or four months be judged on what they do in

:33:44. > :33:49.the Champions League? No. It has been a bit of a mixed bag from what

:33:50. > :33:53.I have seen. You see flashes of good stuff and then probably not enough

:33:54. > :34:03.productivity to justify how well they have played at times. We just

:34:04. > :34:07.discussed what the philosophy was. At the moment, they are not getting

:34:08. > :34:10.the final products to justify the possession and their dominance. I

:34:11. > :34:16.think it is what the other teams have done, really. Six or seven in

:34:17. > :34:21.the Premier League. As in the transfer window or how they have

:34:22. > :34:24.started? In the transfer window and then subsequently, the way they have

:34:25. > :34:28.performed since then. I think that Spurs did not do as much business as

:34:29. > :34:32.Manchester City. They finished below them. A few other clubs as well. I

:34:33. > :34:37.feel like they have lost ground and if they had got some momentum, it

:34:38. > :34:40.could've been different, they could have been second or champions. I

:34:41. > :34:47.feel it was an important time for them but they have the new stadium

:34:48. > :34:56.so maybe they are concentrating on getting that finished. Maybe they

:34:57. > :34:59.are focused on putting the finances into that and the fans have to be

:35:00. > :35:02.patient. What happened last year, I do not think that will happen again.

:35:03. > :35:05.It was interesting, everyone was going on about potential but then he

:35:06. > :35:07.said that they have to do it now. Because tomorrow never comes. They

:35:08. > :35:11.have been saying it with England. They have at St George is every four

:35:12. > :35:21.years. What are we planning for at the moment? Hong Kong 2090, I think

:35:22. > :35:25.it is. But that gives you time, if you keep saying that this team will

:35:26. > :35:31.develop, give it time, give it time, well, why not do it now? When you

:35:32. > :35:35.made your debut, I remember at the start, did it take you that long to

:35:36. > :35:40.get up and running? It was different for us. I am not sure about yourself

:35:41. > :35:48.but I played 100 games in the fourth division. So you have that

:35:49. > :35:52.experience of being 4-0 down and being able to find a performance

:35:53. > :35:56.from there. I think some of the players now, they play a lot of U21

:35:57. > :35:59.games and they do not have the depth of experience for the Premier

:36:00. > :36:07.League. The half-time whistle has gone at Vicarage Road. All the

:36:08. > :36:12.details. It was 1-0 at half-time. Watford are good value for this.

:36:13. > :36:18.They went in front on the 34th minute when Anthony Martial was

:36:19. > :36:21.dismissed. United cried foul and Jose Mourinho has already spoken to

:36:22. > :36:26.the referee about it. But it looked perfectly legal. Kakuta drove the

:36:27. > :36:31.ball home. Anthony Martial went on a mission after that. Jung Kim on and

:36:32. > :36:35.earlier in the game there was an aerial collision. Anthony Martial in

:36:36. > :36:39.the words today and now off the pitch. Great chances for Watford

:36:40. > :36:48.early in the game through Ighalo and Troy Deeney. A pulsating first half.

:36:49. > :36:54.United, strewn with errors in the defence of part of the game. 1-0.

:36:55. > :36:58.The first of four games today. Let's go to one of the others at Crystal

:36:59. > :37:07.Palace. You will be able to see all of this on Match of the Day 2 later.

:37:08. > :37:10.Welcome to Selhurst Park. I am pleased to say that Steve Parish has

:37:11. > :37:17.joined me here on the touchline. First of all, how is Pape Souare

:37:18. > :37:22.getting on after that awful accident last weekend? Is doing OK. He has

:37:23. > :37:28.been discharged from hospital with a fair amount of metal inside him. His

:37:29. > :37:33.cheek, his job on. And his thigh bone. Everything points to a full

:37:34. > :37:37.recovery and he will be playing again maybe as early as February. It

:37:38. > :37:42.is really good news. He is very lucky to be in the situation he is

:37:43. > :37:45.in. Other than that, better week at Crystal Palace after the first win

:37:46. > :37:49.of the season last weekend. An element of relief about that? For

:37:50. > :37:54.sure. There is nothing like getting a win under your belt. Especially

:37:55. > :37:59.with the first three games, when we had just one point. It very tight

:38:00. > :38:06.game. I'm sure it will be the same today. Stoke, in the situation we

:38:07. > :38:10.are in, they need the points. It is always dangerous to play teams, good

:38:11. > :38:15.sides like Stoke, who are desperate for points. It will be just as tight

:38:16. > :38:18.today, I imagine. You had a great run in the first half of the season

:38:19. > :38:26.but league results were difficult after Christmas. What can you, as

:38:27. > :38:29.chairman, do to your manager? I think togetherness. We have the

:38:30. > :38:33.supporters here, along with me and the rest of the owners of the club.

:38:34. > :38:37.We really believe in what we are doing with Alan. I think you have

:38:38. > :38:41.got to make the manager feel secure. You don't want to get into that

:38:42. > :38:44.situation where the manager's mind becomes muddled is trying to please

:38:45. > :38:50.everybody instead of being on the path that we are on. We need to

:38:51. > :38:53.change the way we play football. We need to consistently challenge for

:38:54. > :38:57.the top ten in this division and we have a manager that we believe can

:38:58. > :39:02.do that. Any transition comes with pain. Last year we had a bad injury

:39:03. > :39:05.list as well. You have to understand what they are trying to achieve

:39:06. > :39:08.long-term and understand what is going on on the pitch and the

:39:09. > :39:11.problems the manager faces that are outside his control, and just make

:39:12. > :39:16.sure you are supportive and you help as much as you can. Hopefully we

:39:17. > :39:22.will see things turn around. Every game is difficult. And at the top

:39:23. > :39:29.ten, is that your aim, is that you see Crystal Palace being? You have

:39:30. > :39:35.spelt some -- spent some money this year, quite a lot of it unchristian

:39:36. > :39:39.Benteke. If you are our ten downside, you run the risk of being

:39:40. > :39:46.relegated. Weight most of the signs in the bottom ten, you could find

:39:47. > :39:51.yourself in it. We want to be better than that. But we have 14 other

:39:52. > :39:55.teams trying to do exactly the same thing. And you cannot do it

:39:56. > :39:59.overnight. So hopefully we have a plan to do that. It does not come

:40:00. > :40:03.without risk. We will have to see how it pans out over the season.

:40:04. > :40:09.Thank you for your time. Looking forward to a good game today. Take

:40:10. > :40:13.off at 2:15pm. I always find it really interesting to listen to

:40:14. > :40:16.Steve Parish. A couple of things there, first of all talking about

:40:17. > :40:20.them being in transition. Is that dangerous for a fan to hear? No,

:40:21. > :40:25.because I think the way that Simon spoke was very good. There, we would

:40:26. > :40:29.talking as he was making that comment. If you are manager and you

:40:30. > :40:34.hear him like that, it is just common sense. He knows the game, he

:40:35. > :40:38.is looking at what is happening on the pitch and what is happening

:40:39. > :40:41.outside the manager's authority and control. You have to be

:40:42. > :40:46.understanding. If he is like that as a chairman, he is a fantastic

:40:47. > :40:49.chairman to work for. They are not always as they come across in the

:40:50. > :40:54.media but if he is, he would be a great person to work for. The other

:40:55. > :40:58.interesting thing, teams from ten down are likely to be in the

:40:59. > :41:01.relegation battle. Southampton fans might say, hang on, we qualified for

:41:02. > :41:05.the Europa League so we're not likely to be that far down. Stoke

:41:06. > :41:09.are bottom at the moment. You could argue that all four clubs involved

:41:10. > :41:15.today, if they were to go on a bad run, would be very worried about

:41:16. > :41:20.their position. Yes. It is an interesting term, ten down. Have you

:41:21. > :41:29.heard that before? That is new for me. You could go eight down, I don't

:41:30. > :41:33.know. If they go on a losing streak, if. Anything could happen. But you

:41:34. > :41:36.would have to say, looking at the start of the season, this game today

:41:37. > :41:41.is a big game for those two clubs and Palace Pier at home, I think

:41:42. > :41:48.they will really look to want to get some good points on the board. And

:41:49. > :41:54.that is good to have that interview. Not enough people run football clubs

:41:55. > :41:57.and do that, have the communication. Newcastle is a classic example. The

:41:58. > :42:01.fans have no idea what is going on and they treat the media with this

:42:02. > :42:06.then. I think it is changing. The mood is changing and the owner is

:42:07. > :42:11.really trying to change. Although he will never say anything, it will be

:42:12. > :42:14.through other people. It might be a good thing. Possibly. But it is

:42:15. > :42:19.important to communicate with the fans because the blazers have been

:42:20. > :42:23.in charge of Manchester United for however many years, 15 years, and

:42:24. > :42:27.they have done one interview about what was happening with the club.

:42:28. > :42:32.David Gill never did an interview after they took over. And the fans

:42:33. > :42:39.feel left out a bit of what is going on at the club. It is not a secret

:42:40. > :42:45.sect. He really seems in touch, that is how I would describe it. He

:42:46. > :42:51.realises what is going on. He is a football man. Going back to ten

:42:52. > :42:56.down, very briefly, do you think that when we see Crystal Palace

:42:57. > :42:59.against Stoke or Southampton against Swansea, that actually for all four

:43:00. > :43:04.of them the most important thing, when they go head to head, is not to

:43:05. > :43:09.lose? Could that bring up their defensive game? I think with the

:43:10. > :43:13.position they are in, it is not to lose. But you have to be fearless at

:43:14. > :43:16.times and tried to take the spoils. I feel that what Southampton

:43:17. > :43:19.achieved last season, they will want to do that more than the other

:43:20. > :43:23.teams. But you have to have a realistic look at the season and the

:43:24. > :43:27.way it has started, you do not want to get beaten. Stop the rot, start

:43:28. > :43:34.getting the moment and then you can start gambling. Thank you for your

:43:35. > :43:38.texts and tweets. John Blake said you cannot accuse managers of

:43:39. > :43:42.defeatism if it is realistic. For Sunderland to be chasing European

:43:43. > :43:45.football, it is delusional. Daniel says that Everton have been the dark

:43:46. > :43:48.horses of the Premier League. That's all for this week -

:43:49. > :43:50.thanks very much to Tune in to 5Live now

:43:51. > :43:54.for commentary of the second half from Vicarage Road, and there's full

:43:55. > :43:56.coverage of Tottenham of all 4 of today's games on Match

:43:57. > :44:03.of the Day 2 at 10.30pm on BBC1.