:00:14. > :00:37.Hello, hello! Thank you! Thank you very much. Hello and welcome to the
:00:38. > :00:42.show. This is where the most exciting names from the world of
:00:43. > :00:48.sport come to talk. What a line-up we have tonight. He was the star of
:00:49. > :00:51.the 20 15th Rugby World Cup, known for his no-nonsense and witty
:00:52. > :00:56.rapport with the players, the world's best and certainly most
:00:57. > :01:01.popular rescue we, Nigel Owens is here -- referee.
:01:02. > :01:05.They are from one of the most successful families in sport, with a
:01:06. > :01:13.combined five World Championship to their names, siblings Rachel and Gee
:01:14. > :01:20.Atherton are here. And with victories at the Masters,
:01:21. > :01:24.the Championship and 147 break at the UK Championships, one of the
:01:25. > :01:33.most popular figures in British sport, White is here!
:01:34. > :01:37.Cavalier, thrilling, there are not enough superlatives to describe him.
:01:38. > :01:43.With his trademark flair he transformed the game of snooker to
:01:44. > :01:48.edge of your seat theatre. He blazed across the base with
:01:49. > :01:54.swaggering brilliance. He reached the World Championship final six
:01:55. > :01:58.times. He is the people's champion who has brought joy to millions.
:01:59. > :02:05.Please welcome, Jimmy the Whirlwind White!
:02:06. > :02:12.APPLAUSE Thanks for coming on the show.
:02:13. > :02:17.Welcome to Jimmy White. I am so excited to have you on the show. A
:02:18. > :02:24.big fan. How old were you when you first picked up a queue? I was 12
:02:25. > :02:29.when I first started. I started playing pool first. I used to wait
:02:30. > :02:36.for my dad in a pub and I played pool for a year before I played
:02:37. > :02:42.snooker. Howl long before you knew you were good at it? Pretty good.
:02:43. > :02:48.Before I was 13 I was winning money matches. Not the best upbringing, a
:02:49. > :02:53.bit of a misspent youth. When I was 13 or 14 we would be playing for 100
:02:54. > :02:59.quid a set. That was a lot of money, a lot of money now. Then we would go
:03:00. > :03:02.up and down the country. There was no Internet so no one would know who
:03:03. > :03:08.it was. We used to play the best players and everyone would back
:03:09. > :03:13.them. You look so innocent there. We travelled up and down the country
:03:14. > :03:18.for three years playing everybody for money. Presumably you are going
:03:19. > :03:22.to come up against pretty tough guys who will not like the fact you are
:03:23. > :03:26.taking their money. What happened then? A few times we were in
:03:27. > :03:29.situations where we were winning people's money and a few times we
:03:30. > :03:35.left by the exit, left or the money there because it was not safe. When
:03:36. > :03:41.did you make the decision that you could make money legitimately from
:03:42. > :03:44.it, you could turn professional? To be professional in those days you
:03:45. > :03:49.had to win the embassy Championships and I won that aged 16. I waited for
:03:50. > :03:53.three years to go to Australia to win the world amateur championships.
:03:54. > :04:00.I turned professional at 18 but by 16 I knew that is what I wanted to
:04:01. > :04:08.do. Who came up with the nickname the Whirlwind? You had Hurricane
:04:09. > :04:14.Higgins and Tornado Draco. Journalists made them up. You were
:04:15. > :04:18.fast, did anyone say you should try and be more conservative? All the
:04:19. > :04:22.time. People said you would win so much more if you can't it down a bit
:04:23. > :04:27.but that is the way I loved playing. I still play that way now. You did
:04:28. > :04:36.do something incredibly rare which is to score a 147 in a World
:04:37. > :04:38.Championship. They're in mind we are talking 1992, when the average
:04:39. > :04:46.salary was ?15,000 a year, and you could buy a house for 50,000.
:04:47. > :04:58.?1000 for Jimmy White if he cannot the pink and black in.
:04:59. > :05:06.Quite magnificent, Jimmy White! APPLAUSE
:05:07. > :05:14.Very, very impressive for its rarity. That was against Tony Draco,
:05:15. > :05:24.who wants to congratulate you along with everyone else. He gave me a big
:05:25. > :05:29.bear hug. It was 140,000. I got to the final and I got ?90,000 for
:05:30. > :05:33.getting to the final. Even though I lost the final I earned the most
:05:34. > :05:38.money. But I would swap it for the World Championships. The World
:05:39. > :05:42.Championships is obviously the most popular event, the biggest
:05:43. > :05:46.audiences, the most famous, and you reached the final six times. The
:05:47. > :05:50.last time you were in the final which was 1994, you were up against
:05:51. > :05:57.Stephen Hendry and that was incredibly close. That was 17 each.
:05:58. > :06:02.I had 20 odd, he got in the balls, he missed and he left me a perfect
:06:03. > :06:09.situation to win the match and win the title. I pottered about 14 and I
:06:10. > :06:18.just threw my cue at the Black and I missed it. He cleared up. How do you
:06:19. > :06:23.recover from that? It is a sport. Obviously, I'm disappointed. That
:06:24. > :06:27.one has always been hard to follow. I enjoy playing. I went on the next
:06:28. > :06:33.year and won the tournament. Just World Championships, I have not been
:06:34. > :06:39.able to get there yet. In between those two finals, in 1993, Hendry
:06:40. > :06:44.absolutely wiped the floor with you. What happened before that final? My
:06:45. > :06:49.preparation for that tournament was not the best. I don't actually know
:06:50. > :06:54.how I got to the final. To get five frames off there was quite a feat at
:06:55. > :06:59.the time. When you say your preparation was not the best, you
:07:00. > :07:04.mean almost the worst? I was in Jamaica a month before and I stayed
:07:05. > :07:10.on for an extra week, a bit selfish really. I did not prepare properly.
:07:11. > :07:18.What were you doing in Jamaica? ... Having fun! LAUGHTER What was your
:07:19. > :07:24.idea for having fun? It is well documented. I was always
:07:25. > :07:29.a big drinker. I dabbled in a bit of cocaine to carry on drinking. I sort
:07:30. > :07:36.of hit this for about 15 years from my close friends, my family. I am a
:07:37. > :07:47.bit ashamed that I have done that. I apologise to my supporters for doing
:07:48. > :07:51.that, because I would have one of the ten World Championships. Do you
:07:52. > :07:54.think so? I was that good, not being flash, but I was that good. I took
:07:55. > :07:58.that path, I'm not proud of it. If anyone is about to take cocaine,
:07:59. > :08:04.don't. That must have an effect on not just your career but on marriage
:08:05. > :08:09.and family life with the kids? I hid it really well. Coming from a
:08:10. > :08:15.snooker hall, it you tend to be quite tricky. I did not do it at
:08:16. > :08:21.home. When I was on the road, doing exhibitions, gambling, that is when
:08:22. > :08:25.I used to take it. Was their drug testing in snooker? There was, but
:08:26. > :08:30.with cocaine, I think in seven days it is out of your system. Snooker
:08:31. > :08:34.was always my first love, even though I had this terrible
:08:35. > :08:46.addiction. I used to make sure that I had two weeks clean before I
:08:47. > :08:48.played. It is interesting that you say I apologise to my fans, because
:08:49. > :08:51.it makes me think winning was not about winning for you, it was about
:08:52. > :08:57.winning for the fans? I had great support. I still did give 100%. I
:08:58. > :09:02.would spend 50 hours a week on the practice table and I would get
:09:03. > :09:06.myself ready, and I did win ten ranking tournaments and 46
:09:07. > :09:11.invitation tournaments, so I'd done my bit. I always had a good
:09:12. > :09:17.relationship with the fans because I always met the fans. Do you still
:09:18. > :09:21.think you're capable of winning the World Championships? Snooker, each
:09:22. > :09:25.frame is about ten minutes. I still beat these guys occasionally, but it
:09:26. > :09:29.is keeping it going for two weeks. While I have still got the game in
:09:30. > :09:35.the practice table and the odd time in the match, I keep going for it.
:09:36. > :09:38.You were in an era of incredibly well-known names. Snooker was
:09:39. > :09:44.massive and so were the people playing it. To get the likes of
:09:45. > :09:51.yourself in the same room as Steve Davis, Dennis Taylor, Cliff
:09:52. > :09:52.Thorburn, that has got to be something that you would never
:09:53. > :10:20.forget and indeed you wouldn't. # you can do the Romford wrap will
:10:21. > :10:32.stop. Look at Jimmy! Chas and Dave with
:10:33. > :10:40.the Romford Rap. I think my favourite part of that was that shot
:10:41. > :10:47.of you. Snooker Lupi was out before and it got to number six in the
:10:48. > :10:54.chart. Then this one only sold about ten singles! It is time to introduce
:10:55. > :11:02.our second guest. Popular referees are as rare as a New Year resolution
:11:03. > :11:07.that actually lasts. But this is an exception. Please welcome world
:11:08. > :11:07.rugby referee of the year, Nigel Owens!
:11:08. > :11:26.CHEERING Do you know, lots of people writing
:11:27. > :11:31.or they tweaked and they say you must get so and so on, you must get
:11:32. > :11:36.so and so on, but I had more requests to get you on the sofa, I
:11:37. > :11:41.cannot think of anyone else who is a match official who would create so
:11:42. > :11:46.much in trust. It is great! It is great but you are only as good as
:11:47. > :11:50.your last game. It can all change overnight, believe me. The
:11:51. > :11:54.interesting thing about use so many kids would want to grow up wanting
:11:55. > :12:04.to be a sports star, but they would want to do it on the field of play,
:12:05. > :12:07.what made you want to be a referee? I was playing football in the first
:12:08. > :12:10.15 at school and I wasn't very good. I didn't like tackling and that is
:12:11. > :12:13.not very good for playing rugby. It came down to the last game of the
:12:14. > :12:16.season, we had not won and my best mate scored a try right underneath
:12:17. > :12:20.the posts. I thought what I will take this winning conversion up to
:12:21. > :12:25.win the game and when I booted it it went closer to the corner flag than
:12:26. > :12:30.it did the post and the sports teacher said, will you go and
:12:31. > :12:36.referee or something? I went to help out with a couple of the under 12
:12:37. > :12:39.and under 14 games and I enjoyed it. You have become an Internet
:12:40. > :12:43.sensation because of the way you deal with players. Let's look at
:12:44. > :12:48.some of the highlights. I don't know if we have met before, but I am the
:12:49. > :12:51.referee, not you. Stick to your job and I will do mine. If I hear
:12:52. > :12:58.shouting again, I will penalise you. and I will do mine. If I hear
:12:59. > :13:05.Off you go before I change the colour of it! Nigel, there is no
:13:06. > :13:15.reason I cannot give you that you cannot award the tri-? That means I
:13:16. > :13:20.can award the tri-? That is it. I'm not going to make a big issue, but
:13:21. > :13:30.what happens here or what happened afterwards, I did not see it. It
:13:31. > :13:34.ends here, is that clear? You say I do want to make a big
:13:35. > :13:39.thing of it but you get all 30 players! New look up at these chaps
:13:40. > :13:43.and you put them in their place. If you are pretty good at your job and
:13:44. > :13:47.players respect you, you can keep the respect in the game and it is
:13:48. > :13:49.not that difficult telling somebody the respect in the game and it is
:13:50. > :13:53.who is six foot eight because the respect is there from players to
:13:54. > :13:59.officials and vice versa in rugby, and long may that continue as well.
:14:00. > :14:05.Jimmy, your brother offered to buy you a cue when you were young, but
:14:06. > :14:10.did he give you a choice of one thing or another? He gave me a
:14:11. > :14:14.choice, I will buy you a snooker cue or a racing bike. I said I would
:14:15. > :14:27.love a racing bike. I took it down the snooker club the next day and it
:14:28. > :14:32.got stolen. But you did get a cue? They said you can have a pool cue.
:14:33. > :14:38.They took me to town. I honestly wanted a Jimmy White Paul Q. The
:14:39. > :14:45.only one left was a John Parrott won, so I bought a John Parrott one.
:14:46. > :14:52.There were plenty of those left on the shelf! I've still got it at
:14:53. > :14:57.home, in a case. It's a bit surreal now, sitting here. You look at your
:14:58. > :15:02.heroes when you're growing up and wonder what kind of people they are
:15:03. > :15:07.and it was a real pleasure to meet Jimmy tonight. You're now having to
:15:08. > :15:12.adjust to being the star! I wouldn't go that far! Well, you were watched
:15:13. > :15:16.by millions, as you mentioned, the Rugby World Cup final. What was that
:15:17. > :15:23.experience like? Did it live up to expectations? Was it even better? It
:15:24. > :15:27.is the pinnacle of anybody's career. I was trying to think of it as just
:15:28. > :15:32.another game but of the day gets closer, you kind of realise, hang
:15:33. > :15:36.on, this is the biggest game in world rugby and it only happens once
:15:37. > :15:41.every four years and very few of us get the privilege and honour of
:15:42. > :15:44.refereeing it. So many finders disappoint but this Rugby World Cup
:15:45. > :15:49.didn't disappoint. It was a great Rugby World Cup. The credit for that
:15:50. > :15:53.has to go to the players. Your dad couldn't make it to Twickenham, so
:15:54. > :15:59.he watched the match in your local club and you gave him a call
:16:00. > :16:03.afterwards and what did he say? Probably quite a few people here
:16:04. > :16:07.would remind me that in the World Cup final it was a forward pass that
:16:08. > :16:11.I missed. How I missed it, I don't know. But thankfully it didn't have
:16:12. > :16:16.any outcome at the end of the game and Mike local working men 's club,
:16:17. > :16:22.they are great people there, the club was absolutely packed. A lot of
:16:23. > :16:26.them wearing Nigel Owens masks! I had not rung them for about 25 years
:16:27. > :16:34.and I remember the number like that. I rang the club and one of the guys
:16:35. > :16:39.answered and said Geraint, Nigel is on the phone. The club just cheered.
:16:40. > :16:43.I was pretty much in tears! My dad came on the phone and the first
:16:44. > :16:48.thing he said was, how the hell did you miss that forward pass?! It just
:16:49. > :16:54.brought me down to earth, how it should be, really. It's very rare in
:16:55. > :17:01.sport for people to be comfortable and happy being eight. When you
:17:02. > :17:06.decided to go public, there are ways of going out of -- coming out of the
:17:07. > :17:16.closet and there are ways of coming out of the closet. -- happy being
:17:17. > :17:26.gay. I came out in late 2005 and I pretty
:17:27. > :17:33.much had to because my life was a complete mess. I was depressed, I
:17:34. > :17:36.got hooked on steroids, I got bulimic. I think the biggest
:17:37. > :17:41.challenges that anybody comes across in their life is accepting who you
:17:42. > :17:45.are. I couldn't accept who I was. It was affecting my performances as a
:17:46. > :17:47.referee and I was pretty much going to get booted off the international
:17:48. > :17:53.panel because I wasn't refereeing well enough. You didn't want to be
:17:54. > :17:57.gay? I didn't, it was totally alien to meet them I was 19 years of age
:17:58. > :18:02.and having these feelings that were totally alien to me and I didn't
:18:03. > :18:05.know what it was all about. I was in a very dark place. I did something
:18:06. > :18:08.one night that I will regret for the rest of my life and something I will
:18:09. > :18:12.have to live with the rest of my life. I left a note for my mum and
:18:13. > :18:16.dad and said that I can't carry on in my life any more. Just to imagine
:18:17. > :18:20.what they must have been going through when they found that in the
:18:21. > :18:24.morning and there was a police helicopter out looking for me and
:18:25. > :18:28.they found me and airlifted me to the local hospital where the doctors
:18:29. > :18:31.pretty much said after a few days in intensive care, they said another 20
:18:32. > :18:37.minutes and it would have been too late to save you. When my mum came
:18:38. > :18:43.in to see me that night, and my dad, they said if you ever do anything
:18:44. > :18:47.like that again you will take me and your dad with you because we
:18:48. > :18:51.wouldn't be able to carry on our lives without you. I thought to
:18:52. > :18:56.myself I have to grow up here and accept who I am. With your mum know
:18:57. > :19:00.why you were unhappy? No, until I told her a few years later. That was
:19:01. > :19:07.the biggest challenge over with, accepting who I was. And then the
:19:08. > :19:11.challenge was, can I be who I am, in rugby? I was starting to become a
:19:12. > :19:15.more familiar face on TV. After about eight months of coming out I
:19:16. > :19:19.told family friends, there were still people who didn't actually
:19:20. > :19:24.know. The script writer said we can't do the next eight programmes
:19:25. > :19:26.in this series and nothing being mentioned about you being gay
:19:27. > :19:35.because something is going to come up. We put a closet on the stage and
:19:36. > :19:41.the next thing, the closet opens and I am who I am, and all the jokes
:19:42. > :19:44.came afterwards. This was going out on New Year's Eve and what I didn't
:19:45. > :19:50.want to do was put my mum and dad through all this again. So they told
:19:51. > :19:53.me look, we're going up the club tonight but we are recording the
:19:54. > :19:58.show and we will watch it tomorrow. I thought, I don't want them to see
:19:59. > :20:02.the show. I went to my mum and dad's house and I pulled the video
:20:03. > :20:06.recorder out of the wall, unplug it so it wouldn't work. I got home,
:20:07. > :20:12.Greg, rang them up and said happy New Year and everything. How did it
:20:13. > :20:18.go in the club last night? My mum said, bloody awful. I said, why is
:20:19. > :20:24.that? She said the entertainment didn't turn up. I said what did you
:20:25. > :20:29.do? She said we all watched your show on the big screen! Thankfully
:20:30. > :20:35.it just went straight over their heads! Time to welcome our final
:20:36. > :20:38.guests. They are two of the most successful British sports stars of
:20:39. > :20:42.their generation. Their World Championship victories have done
:20:43. > :20:43.much to raise the profile of downhill mountain biking. This is
:20:44. > :21:02.what they do. It's fast, it's exciting, it's
:21:03. > :21:09.downright crazy. Please welcome brother and sister downhill mountain
:21:10. > :21:24.bikers Rachel and Gee Atherton. APPLAUSE
:21:25. > :21:32.So, for those people who just saw that video and that is the first
:21:33. > :21:36.experience they have had of downhill mountain biking, Gee, how would you
:21:37. > :21:41.sum it up? I've been racing for ten or 15 years and I'm still trying to
:21:42. > :21:45.get my head around it! It's fast, it's aggressive, it's rough, it's
:21:46. > :21:49.intense. Four minutes of, well, personally I've never experienced
:21:50. > :21:55.anything more intense in my life. He uses the word intense. Scary! Are
:21:56. > :22:01.you standing at the top of a mountain going oh, hello! Yeah,
:22:02. > :22:05.basically, downhill mountain biking is a sport where on your push-bike
:22:06. > :22:08.you start at the top of a mountain and raced to the valley floor as
:22:09. > :22:12.fast as you possibly can and the fastest person is the winner. It's
:22:13. > :22:17.pretty terrifying when you're up there and in four minutes I'm going
:22:18. > :22:22.to be way down there. You think, all I've got is my bike and my common
:22:23. > :22:25.sense, to get down there! I don't understand how you do that without
:22:26. > :22:32.breaking your bike. It's breaking your body that is the worst part!
:22:33. > :22:36.That too! That is the hardest part, the obstacles don't move when he hit
:22:37. > :22:40.them, or sometimes on a racetrack you practice over and over again
:22:41. > :22:43.before the actual race and sometimes the only way you know you're on the
:22:44. > :22:49.right line is because you hit your little finger on tree every single
:22:50. > :22:53.time, so every run UR whizzing past the tree at 40 or 50 mph and you
:22:54. > :22:56.think you're on the right line because I just touched the trade!
:22:57. > :23:01.Sometimes you get it wrong and you get the tree in your face! It's
:23:02. > :23:04.millimetres of precision. Between the two of you, you have been
:23:05. > :23:12.incredibly successful. How many world titles or medals have you got?
:23:13. > :23:21.Rachel has... I've won two World Championship 's and Rachel has won
:23:22. > :23:29.three, I think... What do you mean, think! For you guys, it won't be so
:23:30. > :23:34.much fitness that gets the better of you, it will be injury. Just to get
:23:35. > :23:42.an idea of the sort of crashes we're talking about, have a look at this.
:23:43. > :23:56.Oh! That is just... You are the one on the bike. Talk us through why
:23:57. > :24:02.this happened. Well, it was a good one, I admit. That wasn't meant to
:24:03. > :24:06.happen. That was never the plan when I took off. I wasn't really nervous
:24:07. > :24:13.about this line, it was all set up, the take-off was marked out and I
:24:14. > :24:18.had the speed and I hit the lip and then... You didn't have the speed!
:24:19. > :24:24.Within seconds of taking off I realised I was maybe a degree to the
:24:25. > :24:28.right a fraction of the line will start I was actually fine, I mean...
:24:29. > :24:32.I already had a broken ankle at this point. I had broken my ankle two
:24:33. > :24:38.days before this. That's Mike skis for why I crashed, but I mean...
:24:39. > :24:41.It's a very groovy sport a very cool sport, they have their own language
:24:42. > :24:45.in mountain biking. For Nigel and Jimmy, this is a bit of a test. You
:24:46. > :24:52.need to tell me what the following mean in the context of mountain
:24:53. > :25:00.biking. Bonk. Well, I know what it means in West Wales! Would it the
:25:01. > :25:08.hitting and bouncing off? Rachel, give us a context, how would you use
:25:09. > :25:19.bonk? I would say on that road ride I totally bonked. Messed up? Yes,
:25:20. > :25:27.hit the wall, ran out of energy. Grinder. I would say Cliff Thorburn,
:25:28. > :25:34.fell off! I would say no comment! When someone is trying to block you?
:25:35. > :25:44.No, it's a training ride. On a very aggressive hill. A yard sale. Use it
:25:45. > :25:48.in context? That video of Gee crashing was a total yard sale. It's
:25:49. > :25:52.where everything is left around you after a crash, everything is
:25:53. > :25:56.scattered, like you're having a yard sale. I once had a crash and got
:25:57. > :26:05.kicked over the bars and landed and knocked myself out and rag doll and
:26:06. > :26:12.I don't remember but Rachel tells me my shorts were around my knees!
:26:13. > :26:16.Totally unconscious. That's the best example of a yard sale! Adds a
:26:17. > :26:21.different kind of yard sale, I think! You are all actively involved
:26:22. > :26:24.in trying to get more people involved in your sport, in men
:26:25. > :26:27.touring and motivating others. Jimmy, you've also been very
:26:28. > :26:40.supportive of some players, I'm speaking specifically of Reanne
:26:41. > :26:44.Evans, who is trying to come the first woman to compete in the World
:26:45. > :26:48.Championships. I watched her match online and she was that close to
:26:49. > :26:51.qualifying. If she had beaten Ken Doherty she would have gone to the
:26:52. > :26:54.Crucible and women's snooker would have taken off. She can compete with
:26:55. > :27:01.the men and that's what we need to see. That would change the sport
:27:02. > :27:04.dramatically. Absolutely, there are so many girls playing in clubs in
:27:05. > :27:08.the UK, because there are enough nightclubs now. She needs to break
:27:09. > :27:13.through. Are you trying to get young girls involved in downhill mountain
:27:14. > :27:21.biking? Yeah, as long as they don't beat me! No, definitely, yeah. Gee,
:27:22. > :27:23.in a different way you are raising the profile of downhill mountain
:27:24. > :27:30.biking, because you're certainly going to get noticed! With a photo
:27:31. > :27:35.shoot like that! You've got very big hands! That was for charity. In my
:27:36. > :27:47.defence! Anything goes! You know, you obviously all get
:27:48. > :27:53.offered things that people might want you to promote and you
:27:54. > :27:56.certainly will be now, Gee. It's difficult sometimes to make those
:27:57. > :28:00.choices of what you're going to agree to put your name to and what
:28:01. > :28:07.you're going to agree to advertise. Jimmy, I'm really fascinated to know
:28:08. > :28:09.what made you say yes to this? Sitting around in airports and
:28:10. > :28:19.driving long distances isn't the most exciting pastime, especially
:28:20. > :28:25.when you suffer from nobby Stiles, that is piles to my non-cockney
:28:26. > :28:31.friends. If you suffer from Nobby Stiles, don't suffer, get Ultra
:28:32. > :28:34.Clear Plus. LAUGHTER
:28:35. > :28:41.APPLAUSE Did the cream work? It works, and I
:28:42. > :28:48.own 5% of the company! Good for you. Are you sitting country? I'm fine,
:28:49. > :28:52.comfortable, yeah! Thank you all so much. We've run out of time but you
:28:53. > :28:56.have all been brilliant guests. Huge thanks to my studio audience but
:28:57. > :29:01.most of all to Rachel and Gee Atherton, to Jimmy White and denied
:29:02. > :29:02.11 does well. Thank you all for watching. We will see