21/03/2017

:00:00. > :00:00.Hello, this is Breakfast, with Dan Walker and Sally Nugent.

:00:07. > :00:09.A significant rise in the number of young children needing

:00:10. > :00:20.Hello, this is Breakfast, with Dan Walker and Sally Nugent.

:00:21. > :00:23.A significant rise in the number of young children needing

:00:24. > :00:26.New figures show more under-fives are needing extractions

:00:27. > :00:38.The Government says the statistics are worrying.

:00:39. > :00:40.Good morning, it is Tuesday 21 March.

:00:41. > :00:43.Also this morning: A call for unity in Labour from leader Jeremy Corbyn,

:00:44. > :00:47.after angry exchanges over claims of a takeover by the left wing.

:00:48. > :00:49.Meteorologists confirm 2016 was the hottest year on record,

:00:50. > :00:52.with the lowest level of ice at the poles,

:00:53. > :00:58.More companies pull their adverts from Google over concerns

:00:59. > :01:00.they are being shown next to extremist videos.

:01:01. > :01:02.Google says sorry, and promises to investigate.

:01:03. > :01:12.In sport: Leicester striker Jamie Vardy says he has been sent

:01:13. > :01:14.death threats, after some fans held him responsible for the sacking

:01:15. > :01:19.Also this morning: Calls for better protection for our ancient trees.

:01:20. > :01:22.We will be live at one of the country's oldest oaks.

:01:23. > :01:34.Good morning. It is a cold start to the day. Watch out for ice in the

:01:35. > :01:38.north. There are also a lot of showers around today, some of them

:01:39. > :01:42.wintry, even at low levels and parts of the East could escape them. And

:01:43. > :01:44.of course, in between them they will be some sunshine. I will have more

:01:45. > :01:45.in 15 minutes. First, our main story: The number

:01:46. > :01:49.of children under the age of five in England who have had teeth

:01:50. > :01:52.removed has risen by almost The figures have been obtained

:01:53. > :01:57.by the Royal College of Surgeons, which says most of the tooth decay

:01:58. > :02:00.could have been prevented. Here is our health

:02:01. > :02:12.correspondent Jane Dreaper. Tooth decay is painful

:02:13. > :02:16.but it can be prevented. Regular brushing, seeing the dentist

:02:17. > :02:19.and cutting back on a sugary But new figures show more children

:02:20. > :02:23.in England are needing Just over 84,000 extractions

:02:24. > :02:27.were carried out on under-fives The number went up by almost

:02:28. > :02:32.a quarter in that time, much bigger than the overall

:02:33. > :02:34.increase in this age group. Last year alone, there were more

:02:35. > :02:37.than 9,000 extractions involving They've probably had

:02:38. > :02:42.many sleepless nights, may have had time away

:02:43. > :02:48.from school, may have been prescribed antibiotics

:02:49. > :02:52.in the meantime, and it's really the only the way we can deal

:02:53. > :02:56.with the problem is to admit them, and to have a full-blown general

:02:57. > :02:58.anaesthetic. Dentists want proceeds from the UK's

:02:59. > :03:03.forthcoming sugar tax to be spent on educating people

:03:04. > :03:06.about the importance of looking The Department of Health said

:03:07. > :03:10.it was taking action to tackle the worrying statistics, and parents

:03:11. > :03:13.could help their children to avoid sugary drinks and brush

:03:14. > :03:15.teeth regularly. We will be speaking to paediatric

:03:16. > :03:23.dental surgeon about this The Labour leader, Jeremy Corbyn,

:03:24. > :03:31.has called for calm after his deputy, Tom Watson, warned

:03:32. > :03:33.of a takeover plot yesterday. Let's talk now to our political

:03:34. > :03:36.correspondent Chris Mason, Chris, where did this

:03:37. > :03:48.takeover story come from? am aware people might be turning on

:03:49. > :03:54.the television and wondering where this is coming from? It is tricky

:03:55. > :03:57.when you get into the detail, but essentially the reason that matters

:03:58. > :04:01.is because Labour is tearing itself to shreds at the moment. In the

:04:02. > :04:07.weekend, in the Observer, there was a recording from a group called

:04:08. > :04:11.Momentum, a grassroots group of loyal supporters to Jeremy Corbyn

:04:12. > :04:15.who helped him get the job as Labour leader on the two occasions when he

:04:16. > :04:18.won those elections and in that secret recording there was talk that

:04:19. > :04:24.this Momentum group wanted to try and get hold of funding from the

:04:25. > :04:28.Unite trade union, the biggest one in the country. Upper Sturt Labour's

:04:29. > :04:33.Deputy Leader, Tom Watson, who said that this was a nightmare for Labour

:04:34. > :04:38.and could end Labour's future as an electoral force. Then the Shadow

:04:39. > :04:42.Chancellor, John McDonnell, publicly suggested that Mr Watson should not

:04:43. > :04:46.have been saying what he was saying. Then last night there was a meeting

:04:47. > :04:50.of Labour MPs which was described as explosive, one MP suggesting that

:04:51. > :04:55.Jeremy Corbyn was our so-called leader, to use the phrase that was

:04:56. > :04:58.used. What is striking is that political parties normally don't

:04:59. > :05:04.even like admitting to having dirty laundry, let alone putting it out in

:05:05. > :05:08.public, hanging from lampposts and dangling from Windows. Little

:05:09. > :05:12.wonder, late last night, Jeremy Corbyn thought it was time of the

:05:13. > :05:15.video to reflect on the day. Sometimes spirits in the Labour

:05:16. > :05:20.Party can run high. Today has been one of those days. That is because

:05:21. > :05:26.we a passionate party. So I want to send a message to all party members.

:05:27. > :05:31.I want to make it absolutely clear. Members are an asset. As a party, we

:05:32. > :05:37.must do more to involve and empower them. Jeremy Corbyn sees it as

:05:38. > :05:41.absolutely essential to his future and the future of the Labour Party

:05:42. > :05:44.being led by people on the left that Labour's members are given more

:05:45. > :05:50.power. But there was a healthy dose of of British understatement in that

:05:51. > :05:54.suggestion about spirits running high. The context of all of this is

:05:55. > :05:59.that when you look at the opinion polls, those attempts to measure

:06:00. > :06:03.voters' views on political parties, Labour are a gazillion miles behind

:06:04. > :06:07.the Conservatives, 19 points behind according to OnePoll yesterday.

:06:08. > :06:11.Little wonder some of the Conservatives are rather keen on a

:06:12. > :06:16.snap election, something the Prime Minister has consistently ruled out.

:06:17. > :06:20.Thank you very much, and an excellent use of the number a

:06:21. > :06:22.gazillion. We need to use that number more on Breakfast.

:06:23. > :06:25.The Scottish Parliament will today begin debating whether to call

:06:26. > :06:26.for a second independence referendum.

:06:27. > :06:29.First Minister Nicola Sturgeon will seek Holyrood's backing to ask

:06:30. > :06:31.Westminster for the power to hold another vote,

:06:32. > :06:34.but Theresa May has said that now is not the time.

:06:35. > :06:36.Our Scotland correspondent Lorna Gordon reports.

:06:37. > :06:42.Who decides if there is to be another referendum on Scottish

:06:43. > :06:46.independence, and who sets the date on which it could be held? The

:06:47. > :06:49.government in Edinburgh believes they have the moral authority to

:06:50. > :06:55.call another vote. It was, they point out, a SNP manifesto

:06:56. > :06:59.commitment if circumstances changed, such as Scotland being taken out of

:07:00. > :07:03.the EU against its will. But the Scotland act sets out how the legal

:07:04. > :07:07.authority to decide on whether or not there should be a referendum

:07:08. > :07:15.lies with Westminster, and the Prime Minister, Theresa May, has said

:07:16. > :07:19.there will be no vote on Scottish independence before the UK leads the

:07:20. > :07:22.EU, say now is not the time. The opposition unionist parties at

:07:23. > :07:26.Hollywood agree. They will oppose the vote in the Scottish Parliament,

:07:27. > :07:29.arguing the will of the Scottish people was expressed in the first

:07:30. > :07:33.independence referendum. But another vote would be divisive, and is not

:07:34. > :07:39.what Scots want or need at this time. The SNP are in a minority at

:07:40. > :07:43.Holyrood, but with the support of the Scottish Greens, the vote will

:07:44. > :07:47.likely pass. Scotland's First Minister, Nicola Sturgeon, has said

:07:48. > :07:49.any move by the UK government to block an independence referendum

:07:50. > :07:56.will be democratically indefensible if she wins the backing of MSPs this

:07:57. > :07:57.week. We will be hearing the latest

:07:58. > :08:00.from Lorna later in the programme. The US is banning large electronic

:08:01. > :08:04.devices such as laptops and tablets from cabin baggage on flights

:08:05. > :08:07.from eight Middle Eastern A government source told the BBC

:08:08. > :08:11.that the measure would affect nine airlines operating

:08:12. > :08:13.out of ten airports. Passengers will still be allowed

:08:14. > :08:15.to carry their phones, but will need to check

:08:16. > :08:17.in larger devices. The carriers reportedly have four

:08:18. > :08:25.days to implement the ban. Learning to survive in a world

:08:26. > :08:28.dominated by the internet should be as important for children

:08:29. > :08:30.as reading and writing, according to a House

:08:31. > :08:32.of Lords report. It should be compulsory for all UK

:08:33. > :08:36.schools to teach about online risks, responsibilities and

:08:37. > :08:37.acceptable behaviour, says the Lords

:08:38. > :08:46.Communications Committee. The harm that can be done to

:08:47. > :08:51.children is immense, and lots of different ways. And at the same

:08:52. > :08:54.time, there are so many good opportunities, being able to be

:08:55. > :08:58.connected to anyone in the world, being able to have access to all the

:08:59. > :09:00.knowledge in the world, and we want industry to face up to that.

:09:01. > :09:03.From record-breaking droughts to the melting of sea ice,

:09:04. > :09:05.the astonishing change in weather made history in 2016,

:09:06. > :09:09.The findings were released in a new report, which was conducted

:09:10. > :09:11.by the World Meteorological Organisation.

:09:12. > :09:13.This comes amid fears that Donald Trump will withdraw

:09:14. > :09:16.the United States from the Paris Agreement on Climate

:09:17. > :09:18.Our environment analyst Roger Harrabin reports.

:09:19. > :09:24.This should be a carnival of colour, Australia's Great Barrier Reef.

:09:25. > :09:28.These corals were bleached in warming water.

:09:29. > :09:41.This graphic catalogues our heating planet.

:09:42. > :09:45.And this - scientists taking the sea's temperature with these

:09:46. > :09:51.They are monitoring buoys in the Pacific.

:09:52. > :09:53.The Arctic is warming faster than anywhere,

:09:54. > :09:56.and melting glaciers there are increasing sea level.

:09:57. > :10:00.The weather in the Arctic changes from year to year,

:10:01. > :10:04.and even from decade to decade,

:10:05. > :10:08.but it is very clear that a lot of the change that we're seeing

:10:09. > :10:11.is due to our emissions of carbon dioxide, and other greenhouse gases,

:10:12. > :10:15.People are at risk of climate change, scientists say.

:10:16. > :10:17.Dozens of homes here swept away in China,

:10:18. > :10:19.which had its wettest year on record.

:10:20. > :10:21.India sweltered with its hottest-ever temperature,

:10:22. > :10:26.51 degrees Celsius.

:10:27. > :10:29.The heat partly produced by nature, and partly by us.

:10:30. > :10:42.When is a pie not apply? We do not agree on this, do we? I will tell

:10:43. > :10:47.you what. I will follow one person on pies, and that is Mary Berry.

:10:48. > :10:51.It is not often we hear a bad word said about Mary Berry,

:10:52. > :10:53.but her recipes have been stirring up some culinary

:10:54. > :10:57.Last night on her new BBC One series, Mary Berry Everyday,

:10:58. > :11:00.the former Great British Bake Off judge made a potato,

:11:01. > :11:03.Nothing controversial about that, you might think.

:11:04. > :11:06.But the issue came when she only used pastry for a lid,

:11:07. > :11:12.It cooked up quite a storm on social media.

:11:13. > :11:28.Matt Flye was also concerned, exclaiming...

:11:29. > :11:38.Carole Beattie urged people to leave Mary Berry alone.

:11:39. > :11:41.It is not the first time Mary Berry's recipes have become

:11:42. > :11:44.Just last week we had "bolognaise-gate," when she

:11:45. > :11:48.surprised viewers by adding double cream and white wine to spag bol.

:11:49. > :12:00.I do... I mean, Megan on our team says it is just not a pie, it is a

:12:01. > :12:05.casserole with a lid. But it is a healthy option because you reduce

:12:06. > :12:10.pastry. At what Mary is avoiding is the soggy bottom. That is part of

:12:11. > :12:15.the magic of a pie. You like a soggy bottom? I like the fact that there

:12:16. > :12:22.is pastry holding it altogether. I less pastry, the better. That is

:12:23. > :12:29.fine, but it is not apply. What should we call it, then? Alliance. I

:12:30. > :12:33.am all for the all-around pastry. I make one with a lid because it is

:12:34. > :12:40.easier, but I don't know if I could actually call it a pie in its purest

:12:41. > :12:46.sense. Pie purists need all-around pastry. The ultimate test, you

:12:47. > :12:49.should be able to eat a pie with your hands. If it hasn't got a

:12:50. > :12:54.bottom you will be like this. What about in the pub when they do many

:12:55. > :13:00.pie dishes with a lid on the top, they call it a pie! That is fine,

:13:01. > :13:14.but I don't think it is a pie! Hashtag it is not a pie. We are

:13:15. > :13:17.talking about Jamie Vardy, in the dark side of being a professional

:13:18. > :13:20.footballer is people hold you responsible and feel they can take

:13:21. > :13:22.out retribution against you if they feel you have acted badly, and that

:13:23. > :13:24.is what has happened to Jamie Vardy. Jamie Vardy says he has received

:13:25. > :13:27.death threats from fans who hold him responsible for the sacking

:13:28. > :13:30.of former manager Claudio Ranieri. The striker says life

:13:31. > :13:32.has been terrifying, and his family has been targeted,

:13:33. > :13:35.after reports he was one of the players who influenced

:13:36. > :13:39.the decision to let Ranieri go. Jermain Defoe is back in the England

:13:40. > :13:41.squad for tomorrow's But he says, if he wants

:13:42. > :13:45.to retain his place, he will need to be playing

:13:46. > :13:47.Premier League football. His club, Sunderland,

:13:48. > :13:50.are currently bottom of the table. Despite recent fan protests,

:13:51. > :13:51.Olivier Giroud says that he and the rest of the Arsenal

:13:52. > :13:55.players want Arsene Wenger to stay Wenger is reported to be ready

:13:56. > :14:01.to sign a new two-year deal, after revealing at the weekend

:14:02. > :14:04.he had made a decision Tiger Woods says he is trying

:14:05. > :14:11.everything to be ready for The US He has not played since withdrawing

:14:12. > :14:15.from the Dubai Desert Classic tournament in February

:14:16. > :14:26.with a back spasm. He says the Masters was the first

:14:27. > :14:31.major he played in and that is why he wants to put so much effort into

:14:32. > :14:35.being back and fit again. And we are only a few weeks away, as well.

:14:36. > :14:39.Danny Willett the defending champion, wouldn't it be amazing if

:14:40. > :14:44.he could do back-to-back surprise Masters wins? He has had a patch of

:14:45. > :14:48.good form. He was named English golfer of the year the other week,

:14:49. > :14:50.so I think he has been doing good work behind the scenes.

:14:51. > :14:58.According to the International Day of happiness,

:14:59. > :15:11.(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE) You happy. OK, I look at the daily.

:15:12. > :15:16.Russia's Ultra yobs infiltrator. These were well seen at the last

:15:17. > :15:24.euros. -- happiness, sharing makes you happy. We had a Russian

:15:25. > :15:28.journalist on very recently that said he felt the problem was being

:15:29. > :15:33.held very well by the Russian authorities. -- helped. But seeing

:15:34. > :15:37.this is distressing. On the front page of the Times, they took about

:15:38. > :15:42.the companies that are suspending advertising now over the row over

:15:43. > :15:46.extremist content using the search engine Google. But if you just go

:15:47. > :15:50.down here, Theresa May, this is a shot of the Prime Minister that has

:15:51. > :15:57.been taken for Vogue. And something of a team. When the same

:15:58. > :16:05.photographer took a photo of the Queen, she took a photo of her next

:16:06. > :16:12.to a roaring fight the fire. So a bit of similarity. The Daily

:16:13. > :16:19.Telegraph warns of press bias. It said that the BBC has been warned by

:16:20. > :16:29.providing pessimistic and skewed coverage of the Brexit situation.

:16:30. > :16:35.And this marks the 29th of March, 2019, this is the set date for this

:16:36. > :16:41.country to leave the EU. Those are the front pages of the newspapers at

:16:42. > :16:46.the moment. We will talk to Kat and then in a moment, but we have some

:16:47. > :16:50.breaking news. Yes, we're hearing that the death of Martin McGuinness

:16:51. > :16:56.has been confirmed this morning. He was 66 and died earlier this morning

:16:57. > :17:01.at a hospital in Derry. -- Kat and Ben. His family were at his bedside.

:17:02. > :17:04.You might have heard in recent months that he was diagnosed with a

:17:05. > :17:10.rare heart disease, back in December. He became the chief

:17:11. > :17:16.negotiator in the peace process for Sinn Fein. We are announcing the

:17:17. > :17:23.news of the death of Martin McGuinness. With his family at his

:17:24. > :17:28.bedside. He died last night. He was 66. His family were at his bedside

:17:29. > :17:32.at the hospital in Derry. A little bit more information we are getting

:17:33. > :17:35.through, here, is that in recent weeks, he had made no appearances

:17:36. > :17:40.during Sinn Fein's successful assembly election, and did not

:17:41. > :17:44.attend the polling station with his wife, to vote. That was when it

:17:45. > :17:48.became clear that he was quite seriously ill. Sinn Fein, at the

:17:49. > :17:54.time, said that his health was a private matter, and did not want to

:17:55. > :17:59.discuss it. But just as Dan has said, we can confirm the death of

:18:00. > :18:04.Martin McGuinness, which was announced this morning. He was the

:18:05. > :18:12.former Deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland. He was 66. Of

:18:13. > :18:16.course, a key figure in Irish politics, Northern Irishman or text,

:18:17. > :18:19.over the last several decades. We will have more on that and a

:18:20. > :18:21.reflection on his life and career throughout the programme.

:18:22. > :18:25.It's 6:18 and you're watching Breakfast from BBC News.

:18:26. > :18:31.Here's Carol with a look at this morning's weather.

:18:32. > :18:37.Today it is a cold start. Colder than yesterday. We are looking at a

:18:38. > :18:40.mixture of sunshine and showers. Some of the showers a wintry, even

:18:41. > :18:44.at lower levels, this morning. What is happening as we had yesterday's

:18:45. > :18:49.waterfront go through, allowing this cold are to filter in. It originated

:18:50. > :18:54.in Canada. So you can appreciate how cold it is. And that has had an

:18:55. > :18:58.adverse impact on our coverage is. It also means that the showers we

:18:59. > :19:02.have been getting in from the west have been wintry. So there is the

:19:03. > :19:09.risk of ice first thing this morning in Northern Ireland, and in

:19:10. > :19:14.Scotland, none treated surfaces. In western parts of Scotland, this is

:19:15. > :19:22.where it we're seeing snow at lower levels. -- untreated. Some snow

:19:23. > :19:25.across parts of northern England, and what you will find through the

:19:26. > :19:30.days that that will retreat reveals. A second south into East Anglia and

:19:31. > :19:33.southern counties, it is dry, cold, and bright. Across south-west

:19:34. > :19:38.England, simpler the showers, some of which are wintry over the moors.

:19:39. > :19:42.As we move into Wales again, there is a little bit of a wintry mix in

:19:43. > :19:45.some of those showers. But between all the showers, there will be

:19:46. > :19:48.sunshine. There is a good reason blowing coming in from the west.

:19:49. > :19:52.Through the course of the day, we will hang on to those wintry

:19:53. > :19:55.showers. It is alleged, most of the wintry flavour will be on higher

:19:56. > :20:01.ground throughout the day. At lower levels, in some of the heavier

:20:02. > :20:08.bursts, we could system sleek, hail, and thunder. We are looking at seven

:20:09. > :20:16.or eight, and warmer in the south-east. But even then, colder

:20:17. > :20:20.than we have seen. -- sleet. The next weather system will bring in

:20:21. > :20:24.somewhat windy weather, and it will deposit some snow over the hills of

:20:25. > :20:28.Wales. It might affect some of the higher routes if you are travelling.

:20:29. > :20:33.I did, there is a risk of ice and frost. It will be windy, too, and as

:20:34. > :20:37.the system moves northwards, once again, we will see some snow. Not

:20:38. > :20:41.just on higher ground, but there is a possibility that we could see it

:20:42. > :20:44.at lower levels, as well. Mid north about through Scotland and Northern

:20:45. > :20:49.Ireland, it will be cold. And there will still be some wintry showers.

:20:50. > :20:54.Talking of cold, in some of the glands in Scotland, it could be as

:20:55. > :20:57.low as -8 or - ten. As a comfort the south, we will get loads of between

:20:58. > :21:07.four degrees and vice degrees Celsius. -- lows. -- five degrees.

:21:08. > :21:17.Like today, the clouds will lift into the hills. The more persistent

:21:18. > :21:22.rain will not bring sleet for most of us. Cold coming from the North

:21:23. > :21:24.Sea, so feeling cold in Scotland and Northern Ireland. Temperatures

:21:25. > :21:29.between four degrees and seven degrees. Even though we had tens in

:21:30. > :21:33.the south-east, will not feel particularly brilliant. Sunshine

:21:34. > :21:36.will be around, however. A cluster of weather fronts on Sunday. --

:21:37. > :21:42.Thursday. That is could produce some rain. Further north, drier and

:21:43. > :21:46.brighter. Temperatures by then will be seven or 11 degrees. As we head

:21:47. > :21:50.into the weekend, this is what is happening on Thursday. Azaz Singh

:21:51. > :21:53.south, it will bring race in the southern counties on Friday. But

:21:54. > :21:57.then high pressure takes hold and things settle down. The weekend,

:21:58. > :22:01.with current thinking, is looking pleasant. It will look Corbynite

:22:02. > :22:03.with frost, but some sunshine by day. Temperatures will start to

:22:04. > :22:15.recover. Thank you very much indeed. We bring

:22:16. > :22:20.in the news that is just reaching us now on BBC Breakfast. News that Sinn

:22:21. > :22:24.Fein's Martin McGuinness, the former Deputy First Minister of Northern

:22:25. > :22:27.Ireland has died at the air of 66. You might remember the news we

:22:28. > :22:31.brought you recently on BBC Breakfast back in December. We knew

:22:32. > :22:35.that he had been suffering from a rare heart condition. He has been in

:22:36. > :22:38.a hospital in Derry in recent weeks. And it was announced this morning

:22:39. > :22:44.that he has passed away with this family all around him this morning.

:22:45. > :22:50.So news just once again that Martin McGuinness, the former Deputy First

:22:51. > :22:55.Minister has died at the age of 66. And we just heard in the last

:22:56. > :23:00.moments from RTE, saying that Gerry Adams has said that Martin

:23:01. > :23:05.McGuinness showed credit emendation, humility, and dignity through his

:23:06. > :23:08.life. And it was no different in his illness. He was a passionate

:23:09. > :23:12.republican who worked tirelessly for peace and receive the addition. --

:23:13. > :23:16.reconciliation. And for the unification of his country. But

:23:17. > :23:20.above all, he loved his family and the people of Gary. And he was

:23:21. > :23:29.immensely proud of both. He goes on to offer his condolences to all of

:23:30. > :23:45.his family. -- Derry. He stood down from his post as Jeopardy First

:23:46. > :23:49.Minister in January. -- deputy. He was radicalised by dissemination and

:23:50. > :23:53.what was going on on the streets of the city, but just confirmation

:23:54. > :23:57.again, if you are turning on your television this morning, that Sinn

:23:58. > :24:02.Fein's Martin McGuinness has died at the age of 66. That has been

:24:03. > :24:06.confirmed in the last few minutes. We go to Chris Mason, who is in

:24:07. > :24:09.Westminster for us. And Chris, just give us an idea of what type of

:24:10. > :24:13.political figure he will be remembered as. A huge political

:24:14. > :24:18.figure in Northern Ireland. Martin McGuinness. There is no doubt about.

:24:19. > :24:23.And there will be lots of reflections in the coming hours of

:24:24. > :24:26.the journey that he went on politically. As you are saying, here

:24:27. > :24:31.is someone who was a lifelong republican. His political aim was to

:24:32. > :24:36.remove the power of this place, Westminster, from Northern Ireland.

:24:37. > :24:41.And to secure a united Ireland. But what was so striking, for somebody

:24:42. > :24:46.with those connections to the IRA, he was a former IRA commander, was

:24:47. > :24:50.how pivotal he became as a personification, if you like, of the

:24:51. > :24:55.peace process. He became Northern Ireland's Deputy First Minister,

:24:56. > :24:59.alongside Ian Paisley, from the Democratic Unionist, to people from

:25:00. > :25:04.two parties that had been opposed to each other for so long, and yet got

:25:05. > :25:10.on so well in those leadership roles in the Northern Ireland assembly.

:25:11. > :25:13.They were dubbed the Chuckle Brothers. Martin McGuinness stood

:25:14. > :25:18.down from politics because of the illness that he was battling. Some

:25:19. > :25:21.of the trip is that came from the unionist side, from the others are

:25:22. > :25:26.to the political divide, described by Ian Paisley Junior as someone who

:25:27. > :25:30.was a statesman. The ultimate conflict, it really, that you can

:25:31. > :25:34.pay to a politician. A by someone on the other side of the political

:25:35. > :25:37.divide. Such was the respect, despite the vast political

:25:38. > :25:54.differences. Such was the respect for what he had achieved in trying

:25:55. > :25:57.to bring Northern Ireland together as part of a peaceful future, given

:25:58. > :26:01.the violence of its past. You mentioned the journey that he went

:26:02. > :26:04.on there. We are seeing on our screen at the moment images from

:26:05. > :26:08.many years ago. We also see Martin McGuinness as a young man. We are

:26:09. > :26:12.also seeing him as a young man with the Queen. -- seeing him they with

:26:13. > :26:15.the Queen. The Queen, the British moniker, the head of the British

:26:16. > :26:19.Armed Forces that for so many years had such a huge role to play in

:26:20. > :26:23.Northern Ireland, they were seen as the enemy army, in so far as the IRA

:26:24. > :26:26.and the republican movement were concerned. To see those images of

:26:27. > :26:30.Martin McGuinness with the Queen, shaking the Queen by the hand, the

:26:31. > :26:33.whole thing having gone through intense discussions within the Sinn

:26:34. > :26:36.Fein leadership, as to whether or not this was something that they

:26:37. > :26:40.wanted to do. He will have been aware, they will have been aware, of

:26:41. > :26:45.the massive symbolic significance of that kind of moment, to try and

:26:46. > :26:49.project an image that the troubles of the past were over. That the

:26:50. > :26:54.future of Northern Ireland in terms of its governance was via the

:26:55. > :26:59.devolved administrations that Martin McGuinness was a part of. Yes, it

:27:00. > :27:05.Sinn Fein and Martin McGuinness remained committed to that long-term

:27:06. > :27:13.aim, as they saw it, of a united Ireland. Eddie Leie, removing the UK

:27:14. > :27:17.entirely. -- if you like. But their argument was that as time went on,

:27:18. > :27:21.right now, in the medium term, while they were still the majority of

:27:22. > :27:25.supported Northern Ireland for Northern Ireland to remain part of

:27:26. > :27:31.the UK, that it had to be governed by a peaceful means, by the assembly

:27:32. > :27:38.at Stormont. So that was absolute area. Martin McGuinness, as

:27:39. > :27:45.reflected a moment ago, was vital to the movement. It was his decision to

:27:46. > :27:51.pull down if you like, the things which led to the elections, a

:27:52. > :27:56.conclusion of which we have not yet reached. That is Chris Mason

:27:57. > :28:01.Westminster for us. We'll be talking to Chris Muchmore throughout the

:28:02. > :28:05.programme. Just to let you know, if you are Justin Leonard televisions,

:28:06. > :28:09.the breaking news is coming in the last 20 minutes or so that Northern

:28:10. > :28:13.Ireland's former Deputy First Minister, Martin McGuinness, has

:28:14. > :28:17.died at the age of 66. He was around by his family in hospital in Derry.

:28:18. > :28:21.We will have more reflection on his life of the programme this morning.

:28:22. > :31:43.from wherever you are. We will be from wherever you are. We will be

:31:44. > :31:46.Plenty more on our website at the usual address.

:31:47. > :31:49.Now though it's back to Sally and Dan.

:31:50. > :31:52.Hello, this is Breakfast with Dan Walker and Sally Nugent.

:31:53. > :32:05.Our main story: the former Deputy Minister of Northern Ireland, Martin

:32:06. > :32:07.McGuiness, has died at the age of 66. He had been diagnosed with a

:32:08. > :32:10.rare heart disease in December. A former member of the IRA's

:32:11. > :32:13.Army Council, Mr McGuiness became the chief negotiator in the Irish

:32:14. > :32:16.peace process for the republican Our Ireland correspondent

:32:17. > :32:27.Chris Buckler looks back To paint a true picture of Martin

:32:28. > :32:30.McGuiness, you have to accept contradictions. He was a

:32:31. > :32:35.paramilitary who once embraced violence, but also a peacemaker who

:32:36. > :32:40.reached out to rivals, a man who could be seen in very different

:32:41. > :32:46.lights. Born in Londonderry into a large Catholic family, Martin

:32:47. > :32:51.McGuiness came of age as Northern Ireland's divides became Troubles.

:32:52. > :32:55.In that time of violence, he joined the IRA, quickly rising through its

:32:56. > :32:58.ranks. Can you say whether the bombing is likely to stop in the

:32:59. > :33:06.near future, in response to any public demand? Well, we always take

:33:07. > :33:11.into consideration the interests of the people of Derry. The 1970s saw

:33:12. > :33:14.him become one of the faces of ruthless Irish republicanism and he

:33:15. > :33:19.was jailed terrorist offences in Dublin McGenniss has changed

:33:20. > :33:24.considerably from the young man who used to swagger around the no go

:33:25. > :33:28.areas of Londonderry, as leader of the Provisional IRA there. What had

:33:29. > :33:32.started as a fight for Civil Rights had become a vicious battle. Yet,

:33:33. > :33:36.alongside the many bombings and shootings, Martin McGuiness saw

:33:37. > :33:40.opportunities at the ballot box for Sinn Fein, the political party

:33:41. > :33:45.linked to the IRA. Even then, the language of threat remained. We

:33:46. > :33:49.don't believe that winning elections or winning any amount of votes will

:33:50. > :33:53.bring freedom to Ireland. At the end of the day it will be the cutting

:33:54. > :33:57.edge of IRA which will bring freedom. But, after years of

:33:58. > :34:02.killings in chaos, in the nineteen nineties, IRA ceasefires offered the

:34:03. > :34:10.opportunity is fought talks between Unionists and Republicans. Would you

:34:11. > :34:14.like to shake hands? Would you? When there is no guns. Not only would

:34:15. > :34:17.they shake hands, after the signing of the Good Friday Agreement they

:34:18. > :34:20.joined each other in government. Eventually at its head was the

:34:21. > :34:26.unlikely partnership of two former enemies, Ian Paisley and Martin

:34:27. > :34:29.McGuinness. The firebrand unionist and radical republican became so

:34:30. > :34:36.close that they were neck and the Chuckle Are others. There were

:34:37. > :34:41.republicans who continued to threaten that vertical progress.

:34:42. > :34:45.But, when a police officer was killed, the then Deputy First

:34:46. > :34:51.Minister stood side by side with the chief constable to condemned those

:34:52. > :34:56.dissident groups. They are traitors to the island of Ireland. Alongside

:34:57. > :35:00.the words they were actions on all sides. The Queen's cousin Lord

:35:01. > :35:05.Mountbatten was killed by the IRA, yet after the troubles, royals and

:35:06. > :35:11.republicans were able to put the difference aside. Thank you very

:35:12. > :35:15.much, I am still alive! However, relationships at Stormont always

:35:16. > :35:20.seemed strained. After Ian Paisley stepped down as First Minister to

:35:21. > :35:24.review replaced by a Peter Robinson and then Arlene Foster. Earlier this

:35:25. > :35:27.year, with his ill-health by then obvious, Martin McGuiness walked out

:35:28. > :35:34.of government amid a row between Sinn Fein and that EU P. The boy

:35:35. > :35:41.from Derrey's northside retiring as First Minister after years in the

:35:42. > :35:47.IRA. My career has been long, I have been over 25 years working. The past

:35:48. > :35:51.actions of the IRA will colour many people's views of Martin McGuiness,

:35:52. > :35:54.but as a Republican who works towards reconciliation he will be

:35:55. > :36:00.remembered as a key figure in changing Northern Ireland.

:36:01. > :36:06.So if you are just joining us, to remind you of the news we have had

:36:07. > :36:10.confirmed in the last half-hour or so, the death of Martin McGuiness,

:36:11. > :36:14.the ex- deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland. It has been

:36:15. > :36:18.announced this morning that he died at the age of 66, after a short

:36:19. > :36:22.illness. He was diagnosed with an illness back in December, and that

:36:23. > :36:26.news confirmed this morning, that he has died. Tributes coming in from

:36:27. > :36:31.lots of different sources. Gerry Adams, saying throughout his life

:36:32. > :36:35.Martin showed great determination, dignity and humility. It was no

:36:36. > :36:39.different during his short illness. He was a passionate Republican who

:36:40. > :36:40.worked tirelessly for peace and reconciliation and for the

:36:41. > :36:47.reunification of his country. Lets get more on this from Chris

:36:48. > :36:50.Buchler, our Northern Ireland correspondent who joins us on the

:36:51. > :36:54.telephone. Good morning to you. The first thing to say about Martin

:36:55. > :37:04.McGuiness, he was a pivotal figure in Irish politics. Their journeys

:37:05. > :37:07.are very much connected, Ian Paisley and Martin McGuiness, the unionist

:37:08. > :37:10.and the Republican who came together and went into government together.

:37:11. > :37:16.And beyond that, also became friends. And in a way, if you look

:37:17. > :37:20.back in the 1970s and 1980s, if you look at the words that were

:37:21. > :37:23.exchanged between those men, between Unionists and Republicans during

:37:24. > :37:28.that era, an era when Northern Ireland was simply in a totally

:37:29. > :37:32.different place, when there was complete chaos on these streets, and

:37:33. > :37:36.compare it to the relationship that they developed in government

:37:37. > :37:41.together, you see the change in Northern Ireland that we have seen

:37:42. > :37:46.over the past number of decades. And that was a real relationship. You

:37:47. > :37:49.spoke to Martin McGuiness and you spoke to Ian Paisley and they were

:37:50. > :37:53.in each other's company, they would laugh with each other, they would

:37:54. > :37:58.smile with each other. And I think what was testament to that is the

:37:59. > :38:01.warm words that have come from the Paisley family, even during the

:38:02. > :38:08.Stormont crisis that we have at the moment. Power-sharing in a very

:38:09. > :38:12.difficult position, power-sharing has collapsed in the difficult

:38:13. > :38:20.attempt to form government. Even in that, he has talked warmly about

:38:21. > :38:24.Martin McGuinness and how important it is to reach up from one side to

:38:25. > :38:28.the other, even during this crisis. It gives you an idea of the bond

:38:29. > :38:33.that was formed, but also just how that has been reflected in society.

:38:34. > :38:38.And it was also... We saw your piece about Martin McGuinness's life and

:38:39. > :38:40.career just a few moments ago but it was this extraordinaire

:38:41. > :38:45.transformation from the man who was the commander of the Provisional IRA

:38:46. > :38:47.and you say in that piece of that for many people watching this

:38:48. > :38:51.morning, their view of Martin McGuinness will always be coloured

:38:52. > :39:00.by his past as a commander in the Provisional IRA. The truth is, there

:39:01. > :39:04.are still people who are suffering, who are feeling the effects of the

:39:05. > :39:11.hurt of having someone killed, or having been a victim themselves of a

:39:12. > :39:15.IRA attack, and that is never going to change, and there are people in

:39:16. > :39:19.society and many will feel that Martin McGuinness contributed to

:39:20. > :39:23.those words. It is worth reflecting, of course, that whenever Martin

:39:24. > :39:26.McGuinness a few years ago ran for the Irish presidency they were

:39:27. > :39:30.victims who approached in during that, and they're worth it comes to

:39:31. > :39:33.who went through and said you have information, you could tell us what

:39:34. > :39:37.happened to your loved ones, you could give us details about what the

:39:38. > :39:41.IRA was responsible for, and much of that was true. He was a senior

:39:42. > :39:45.figure within the IRA. He admitted on the day of Bloody Sunday he was a

:39:46. > :39:50.deputy commander in Londonderry on that day. But you also need that

:39:51. > :39:55.context, the idea of Martin McGuinness as both paramilitary and

:39:56. > :39:59.a peacemaker. He was a man who was involved in violence, and that was

:40:00. > :40:03.never going to change. That will be in his history. At what will also be

:40:04. > :40:06.in his history of the fact that he reached out, he made a difference in

:40:07. > :40:10.terms of changing Northern Ireland, as I said before, and ultimately, if

:40:11. > :40:13.you look at the progress that there is in practical terms, on the

:40:14. > :40:17.streets here, Martin McGuinness takes a great deal of credit for

:40:18. > :40:21.that as well. Stay there, if you could, we will come back to you in a

:40:22. > :40:27.few moments' time. You are watching BBC Breakfast. Just to remind you of

:40:28. > :40:32.that news that we have been bringing to you since we have been a Nad this

:40:33. > :40:34.morning, the death of Martin McGuinness, ex- deputy First

:40:35. > :40:38.Minister of Northern Ireland and former IRA commander. His death has

:40:39. > :40:43.been announced this morning. He died at the age of 66 at a hospital in

:40:44. > :40:50.Bury with his family at his bedside. -- Derrey. We heard he was ill back

:40:51. > :40:54.in December, and his death has been announced this morning. We return to

:40:55. > :40:58.our Northern Ireland correspondent who is still on the phone for us. I

:40:59. > :41:01.wonder if you could give us a bit more detail about the illness. As

:41:02. > :41:05.Sally was saying, he was diagnosed with this rare heart disease in

:41:06. > :41:08.December. He resigned from his role in January. And I take it he had

:41:09. > :41:14.been quite ill back December and again we had seen footage of him

:41:15. > :41:19.recently where he certainly had lost a lot of colour from his face,

:41:20. > :41:23.hadn't he? Yes, we haven't talked an awful lot about his illness, mainly

:41:24. > :41:28.at the request of his family, but it was a red genetic condition, and it

:41:29. > :41:33.caused a remarkable amount of ill health in a short period of time.

:41:34. > :41:40.The last time I had a conversation with Martin McGuinness was after a

:41:41. > :41:43.northside ministerial Council, at press conferences and that kind of

:41:44. > :41:47.thing. The last time action we sat down and had a conversation with him

:41:48. > :41:51.was towards the end of last year, and that was before the illness had

:41:52. > :41:54.been announced. And even then I could see that there was something

:41:55. > :42:00.wrong with him, and I could see the deterioration in him. And since

:42:01. > :42:05.then, his rapid growth of kind of ill health has been really quite

:42:06. > :42:12.astonishing. And it became very clear whenever he was stepping down

:42:13. > :42:16.as Deputy First Minister, that he was a man who was struggling to keep

:42:17. > :42:22.up with the daily demands, effectively, of politics. And he

:42:23. > :42:25.himself said that he would have wanted to continue, but simply it

:42:26. > :42:30.was becoming physically impossible for him. Saying that, having spoken

:42:31. > :42:34.to the senior members of Sinn Fein within the last week or so, they

:42:35. > :42:39.were telling me that although he had deteriorated physically, there was

:42:40. > :42:43.still an incredibly sharp mind in there. When they were having

:42:44. > :42:47.conversations with him, it was very clear that he was an individual

:42:48. > :42:51.that, inside that body that was failing, was still very much

:42:52. > :42:57.thinking about politics, talking about politics, and still in a

:42:58. > :43:02.position where he was very, very bright and wanting to talk about

:43:03. > :43:07.these kinds of issues. He ultimately stepped down because of ill-health,

:43:08. > :43:13.but were political issues obviously surrounding that as well in terms of

:43:14. > :43:17.the relationship between the DUP and Sinn Fein. At the same time, I don't

:43:18. > :43:21.think he would have set down unless he felt he had no choice in that

:43:22. > :43:25.matter. And whenever you talk to Martin McGuinness, in the last few

:43:26. > :43:32.months of his life, you could see the impact that the illness was

:43:33. > :43:36.having on him. And you do... It is very difficult to not feel anything

:43:37. > :43:42.but sorry for the man who has been in the position where he has fought

:43:43. > :43:48.his entire political career, being a very physical person, going out and

:43:49. > :43:51.really... His sort of charisma, frankly, whichever side you were on

:43:52. > :43:55.you couldn't deny that in what has been interesting is that unionists

:43:56. > :44:00.have really responded to Martin McGuinness in a way that they

:44:01. > :44:03.haven't responded to a number of other Republican politicians. He was

:44:04. > :44:08.somebody who managed to galvanise a certain amount of support for the

:44:09. > :44:11.peace process, through that relationship with Ian Paisley, but

:44:12. > :44:15.also through a certain amount of character within himself. He was an

:44:16. > :44:18.individual who just had a certain amount of political charisma, if

:44:19. > :44:24.that is an appropriate word. And in that he did make a difference as a

:44:25. > :44:28.personal individual, as well as as a senior figure of Sinn Fein. We have

:44:29. > :44:32.talked a little bit already this morning with Chris Mason, our

:44:33. > :44:36.political correspondent, about the personal journey that Martin

:44:37. > :44:43.McGuinness went on. At what point in his life, do you feel, did he ever

:44:44. > :44:47.really make that most significant adjustment to his views? At what

:44:48. > :44:52.point do you think he realised that he had to lead the way and change

:44:53. > :44:56.things for other people to follow? I think there is no doubt the 1990s

:44:57. > :45:02.made a huge difference to Republicans. The IRA ceasefires that

:45:03. > :45:07.took place in those years, in 1994 and 1997, they allowed the weight to

:45:08. > :45:14.have a conversation about changing things -- the way. Storm as it

:45:15. > :45:17.stands now, as I mentioned before, is in a difficult place because

:45:18. > :45:23.power-sharing has collapsed -- Stormont. But you had a decade where

:45:24. > :45:28.there had been stability, and Martin McGuinness was an individual who saw

:45:29. > :45:32.the advantages in developing that peace process, in making that

:45:33. > :45:35.progress. Saying that, you have also got to remember the different words

:45:36. > :45:41.of Martin McGuinness during earlier years. I mean, he talked about the

:45:42. > :45:45.IRA as being a way of bringing freedom to Ireland, in his words. He

:45:46. > :45:49.kept on talking about the IRA as being an organisation that would

:45:50. > :45:55.make a difference. The language changed in the 1990s, and the

:45:56. > :46:00.language continued to change. It is difficult to just appreciate how

:46:01. > :46:07.much of a step that was four Martin McGuinness to stand up and to talk

:46:08. > :46:10.about dissident republicans as being threatening to Ireland, but that is

:46:11. > :46:16.what he did. He talked about people who continued to believe the idea of

:46:17. > :46:21.violent as changing why the place exists, as being traitors. People

:46:22. > :46:26.who were ultimately attacking the foundation not just of society here,

:46:27. > :46:30.but also attacking democracy itself. Therefore you have somebody who has

:46:31. > :46:35.really made the journey from one state to another. And I don't know

:46:36. > :46:39.whether Martin McGuinness himself, what the earlier Martin McGuinness

:46:40. > :46:47.of the 1970s would have thought of the Martin McGuinness who ultimately

:46:48. > :46:58.existed in 2016, 2015, years when he was prepared to address in formal

:46:59. > :47:02.wear and go to the palace and shake hands with the British monarch, who

:47:03. > :47:06.would stand alongside unionists and ultimately that is a political

:47:07. > :47:10.difference that Martin McGuinness himself might not have seen in

:47:11. > :47:14.earlier years, but it is testament to how much he believed in the peace

:47:15. > :47:18.process, and the idea of political progress, making a difference to

:47:19. > :47:20.Northern Ireland. Thank you very much indeed for talking us through

:47:21. > :47:29.all that this morning. Plenty more reflection on the death

:47:30. > :47:33.of Martin McGuinness this morning. If just turning on your television,

:47:34. > :47:41.the breaking news is that the former get the fourth -- Deputy First

:47:42. > :47:47.Minister of Northern Ireland has died at the air of 66. He died with

:47:48. > :47:51.this family at a hospital in Derry. We have known for some time that he

:47:52. > :47:54.was suffering from a rare heart condition that first became known in

:47:55. > :47:57.December last year. We have been given a statement from Sinn Fein

:47:58. > :48:27.this morning. Gerry Adams has said...

:48:28. > :48:35.We will hear from -- we were hearing from Chris Buckler there. It is

:48:36. > :48:39.worthy of mention that he was a choosy divisive character. Many

:48:40. > :48:43.people found it hard to come to terms with the mandate he became at

:48:44. > :48:49.the centre of the Northern Irish peace process. There were people

:48:50. > :48:54.alive today that live with the effects that things that he was

:48:55. > :49:00.involved in a still having. Let's get the weather from Carol. This

:49:01. > :49:02.morning we has known the forecast. Our Weather Watchers have been

:49:03. > :49:09.setting into bitches. This is Edinburgh. There is heavy snow

:49:10. > :49:13.showers there. We've also seen snow in Bathgate. It is lying across some

:49:14. > :49:17.parts as morning. And what we are looking today's forecast for us all

:49:18. > :49:22.with a day so Shannon showers. Some of us will have a wintry mix, some

:49:23. > :49:25.other some rain. This is what has been happening through the last six

:49:26. > :49:32.hours. They mix of rain, sleet, and snow, coming across all these areas.

:49:33. > :49:35.With the debt is falling on very cold services, there is the risk of

:49:36. > :49:44.ice across Northern Ireland Scotland this as the snows showers can sit --

:49:45. > :49:48.cold showers persist. You could hear the odd rumble of thunder, but in

:49:49. > :49:51.between, when the sun gets out, there will be sunshine. Wintry

:49:52. > :49:56.showers coming across northern England, too. And as we see further

:49:57. > :49:59.south, it is largely dry. But it is a cold start today than it was

:50:00. > :50:04.yesterday. Yesterday we were in double figures at this time. Single

:50:05. > :50:09.figures at this time. As we drift to the south-west, there will be

:50:10. > :50:13.showers, some wintry. Legally over the moors. The moors. This M2 across

:50:14. > :50:18.Wales. A wee bit of a wintry flavour with a showers. Because of the day,

:50:19. > :50:24.most of the winteriness will recede into the hills. At lower levels, it

:50:25. > :50:27.will largely be rain, sleet, hail, and some lighting. It will also be

:50:28. > :50:31.windy. Down the east of the country, you could well stay dry. But the

:50:32. > :50:36.temperatures. They are nothing to write home about. The Maxima and

:50:37. > :50:42.Glasto is five. Tell degrees in London looks good, but compared to

:50:43. > :50:48.the 18 from last week, it has come down. -- the maximum in Glasgow.

:50:49. > :50:53.Through the evening, this rain and so will move northwards. It will

:50:54. > :50:57.deposits and sofas at -- deposits and suffer a time on the hills. And

:50:58. > :51:01.with it, so my Sam frost. As it moves northwards and engages with

:51:02. > :51:04.the cold air across northern England, we will see snow, and

:51:05. > :51:08.possibly even at lower levels. That could affect you first thing in the

:51:09. > :51:12.morning for the rush hour. It will be a cold night, which is not so

:51:13. > :51:16.surprising. Optically so across Scotland and Northern Ireland. In

:51:17. > :51:21.fact, in some parts of Scotland, rural parts, we could hit -10

:51:22. > :51:24.Celsius. Tomorrow we start of the snow for the rush hour during the

:51:25. > :51:27.morning across northern England, but rather like today, as temperatures

:51:28. > :51:31.rise, that will recede into the hills. But it will still be rain

:51:32. > :51:35.pumping along the weather fronts, across England and Wales. Southern

:51:36. > :51:40.England might skip some of the rain and stay dry. And to Scotland and

:51:41. > :51:43.Northern Ireland, again largely dry with some showers. But this cold

:51:44. > :51:49.wind coming in from the north-east off a cold sea. As we head into

:51:50. > :51:54.Thursday, we do have weather fronts across the south. That will produce

:51:55. > :51:59.a rain of the times. Further north, drier and brighter. Cambridges still

:52:00. > :52:03.seven or eight in the north. Eight to 11 in the south. As we head into

:52:04. > :52:09.the weekend, what happens is this a's front. Into Friday. High

:52:10. > :52:13.pressure that's such a bill. It settles the weather down to the

:52:14. > :52:16.weekend, and something else that you will notice is that the temperatures

:52:17. > :52:18.will start to recover as well. Most of us will get back into double

:52:19. > :52:28.figures. Back to you. Thank you for joining us. We are

:52:29. > :52:32.reacting this morning to the news of the death of Martin McGuinness.

:52:33. > :52:39.Let's and a bit more reaction. We will be speaking to Chris Mason very

:52:40. > :52:44.shortly as well. And also we will be speaking to Colin Parry, whose sun,

:52:45. > :52:51.Tim, was killed in Warrington by an IRA bomb. And he spoke to Martin

:52:52. > :52:57.McGuinness, will be getting some response from them B programme.

:52:58. > :53:01.Let's go to Chris Mason. Just pick out what then was saying, the theme

:53:02. > :53:06.of this career was reconciliation and forgiveness. There was a lot to

:53:07. > :53:11.forgive, was in a? A mist amount to forgive. And that is why he became

:53:12. > :53:15.this personification of somebody who had moved a huge amount in terms of

:53:16. > :53:22.his past as an IRA commander in Londonderry, in Derry, and it is

:53:23. > :53:26.quite interesting reflecting on some of the obituaries that are already

:53:27. > :53:30.appearing online. For instance, back in the 1970s, when there was a

:53:31. > :53:40.jubilee celebration for the Queen, there was graffiti in Derry talking

:53:41. > :53:44.about " Stuff the Jubilee" and a generation later, he was willing to

:53:45. > :53:55.meet the Queen, the head of the British Armed Forces. As you say, a

:53:56. > :54:02.far sleet controversial figure. Agassi essence of severe reflections

:54:03. > :54:06.on his career today is this: There was a sense of course that for many

:54:07. > :54:10.people the IRA was hugely controversial and something that was

:54:11. > :54:15.hated. Of course, on the other side of the divide, something that was

:54:16. > :54:20.seen for the right for Northern Ireland to be part of a united

:54:21. > :54:25.Ireland. Because he was on this path towards becoming a politician, and

:54:26. > :54:29.being an articulate of a peaceful future, such articulate, by the way,

:54:30. > :54:36.that he went to Baghdad to try and share his own reflections on forging

:54:37. > :54:41.peace in Northern Ireland to Iraq, and what they might yell to learn

:54:42. > :54:47.from him. -- articulator. -- might be able to learn from him. He was

:54:48. > :54:52.someone who wanted to be seen as the articulator of a peaceful future of

:54:53. > :54:57.Northern Ireland and to therefore personify that kind of change in

:54:58. > :55:01.that awkwardness that has been at the heart of Northern Irishman said.

:55:02. > :55:05.But on the one hand, there was a desire to secure peace, but on the

:55:06. > :55:11.other hand, of course, people would be attending to reach that piece by

:55:12. > :55:15.a reflection on both sides. There were some anger at what had happened

:55:16. > :55:18.in the past. Thank you for joining us Chris. We will come back to you

:55:19. > :55:24.shortly. That is Chris Mason Westminster. We are reflecting this

:55:25. > :55:26.morning on the death of Martin McGuinness from a rare heart

:55:27. > :55:35.diseases morning, with his family around him, at a hospital in Derry.

:55:36. > :55:42.We speak now to Colin Parry. His son was killed in the bomb attacks by

:55:43. > :55:52.the IRA in 1983. IWonder, first of all, how you reflect on the news of

:55:53. > :55:58.Martin McGuinness' death. Excuse me. I'm not surprised, because I knew he

:55:59. > :56:03.was very ill. When he stepped up from office, I spoken, and he said

:56:04. > :56:08.that he was not well. He did not disclose what exactly, but he looked

:56:09. > :56:13.and sounded ill, and was quite frail. One of the slightly odd fact

:56:14. > :56:20.is, of course, is that he has died on the anniversary of the Warrington

:56:21. > :56:24.bombing. It is this that is more bizarre than if he had died

:56:25. > :56:28.yesterday. Can ask you what that meeting was like in 2013? Was a

:56:29. > :56:34.devil you? Was difficult to him? What was said? Can you tell us? That

:56:35. > :56:41.came about because I was doing a documentary for Radio 5 live in

:56:42. > :56:44.Northern Ireland. I met Martin Storm want. At the end of our

:56:45. > :56:49.conversation, I asked if he would deliver our annual peace lecture at

:56:50. > :56:59.the Peace Centre in Warrington. Said yes. Another thing that surprised me

:57:00. > :57:03.was that it was not the act of a cow to come over to Warrington town, a

:57:04. > :57:07.town which has no feeling for the man, and speak to people about his

:57:08. > :57:11.life and actions and the reasons for what he did. And yet the audience

:57:12. > :57:15.were left with a feeling that this is a man who had changed. And I

:57:16. > :57:18.accept that too. He was very brave in his own way for taking the

:57:19. > :57:23.decisions he did. If you think back to the time when he sat with Ian

:57:24. > :57:28.Paisley and they were referred to as the Chuckle Brothers. If Ian Paisley

:57:29. > :57:37.of all people could sit down with him, then of course, known us could

:57:38. > :57:44.say otherwise. As someone who, as we said, you lost your 12-year-old son,

:57:45. > :57:50.Tim, to this man. A lot of people cannot review sites -- reconciled

:57:51. > :57:54.the man he was in the man he became. But you have managed come to terms

:57:55. > :58:00.with that. We were able to forgive me and forgiveness -- forgive Martin

:58:01. > :58:05.McGuinness? I don't think that figures comes into it. Certain

:58:06. > :58:11.things are forgiven. I found Martin McGuinness an easy and pleasant man

:58:12. > :58:15.to talk to. I think he was sincerely devoted to peace and maintaining the

:58:16. > :58:20.peace process at all cost. He deserves more credit for his recent

:58:21. > :58:24.life, more than his previous life. I don't think anything in his recent

:58:25. > :58:28.life can atone for that. That said, he was still a brave man who put

:58:29. > :58:32.himself at some risk with some elements of his own community in

:58:33. > :58:36.Northern Ireland. :, thank you very time this morning. That is Colin

:58:37. > :58:39.Parry talking about the death of Martin McGuinness. His son Tim was

:58:40. > :58:41.killed in the Warrington bombs in 1983. Much more destructive

:58:42. > :02:04.programme this morning. -- much more I'm back with the latest

:02:05. > :02:08.from the BBC London newsroom Plenty more on our website

:02:09. > :02:11.at the usual address. Now though it's back

:02:12. > :02:13.to Sally and Dan. Hello, this is Breakfast,

:02:14. > :02:16.with Dan Walker and Sally Nugent. Sinn Fein's Martin McGuinness

:02:17. > :02:18.dies at the age of 66. It is understood the former deputy

:02:19. > :02:21.First Minister of Northern Ireland had been suffering from

:02:22. > :02:25.a rare heart condition. The former IRA

:02:26. > :02:27.leader-turned-peacemaker worked at the heart of the power-sharing

:02:28. > :02:43.government following the 1998 In a statement, the Sinn Fein

:02:44. > :02:45.President Gerry Adams called him a passionate Republican who showed

:02:46. > :02:57.great determination throughout his life.

:02:58. > :03:02.Good morning, it is Tuesday 21 March.

:03:03. > :03:05.The former deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland,

:03:06. > :03:09.He had been diagnosed with a rare heart disease in December.

:03:10. > :03:12.A former member of the IRA's Army Council, Mr McGuiness became

:03:13. > :03:15.the chief negotiator in the Irish peace process for the republican

:03:16. > :03:18.Our Ireland correspondent Chris Buckler looks back

:03:19. > :03:31.To paint a true picture of Martin McGuinness,

:03:32. > :03:39.He was a paramilitary who once embraced violence,

:03:40. > :03:43.but also a peacemaker who reached out to rivals,

:03:44. > :03:47.a man who could be seen in very different lights.

:03:48. > :03:49.Born in Londonderry, into a large Catholic family,

:03:50. > :03:52.Martin McGuinness came of age as Northern Ireland's divides became

:03:53. > :04:00.In that time of violence, he joined the IRA, quickly rising

:04:01. > :04:06.Can you say whether the bombing is likely to stop in the near future,

:04:07. > :04:18.Well, I always take into consideration the appeals

:04:19. > :04:22.The 1970s saw him become one of the faces of ruthless Irish

:04:23. > :04:25.republicanism, and he was jailed for terrorist offences in Dublin.

:04:26. > :04:28.McGuinness has changed considerably from the young man who used

:04:29. > :04:31.to swagger around the no-go areas of Londonderry,

:04:32. > :04:38.as commander of the Provisional IRA there.

:04:39. > :04:41.What had started as a fight for civil rights had become

:04:42. > :04:44.Yet, alongside the many bombings and shootings,

:04:45. > :04:47.Martin McGuinness saw opportunities at the ballot box for Sinn Fein,

:04:48. > :04:49.the political party linked to the IRA.

:04:50. > :04:55.Even then, the language of threat remained.

:04:56. > :04:58.We don't believe that winning elections, and winning any amount

:04:59. > :05:00.of votes, will bring freedom in Ireland.

:05:01. > :05:04.At the end of the day, it will be the cutting edge of IRA

:05:05. > :05:08.But, after years of killings and chaos, in the 1990s,

:05:09. > :05:09.IRA ceasefires offered the opportunity for talks

:05:10. > :05:23.Not only would they shake hands, after the signing

:05:24. > :05:25.of the Good Friday Agreement, they joined each other

:05:26. > :05:30.Eventually, at its head was the unlikely partnership of two

:05:31. > :05:33.former enemies, Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness.

:05:34. > :05:36.The firebrand unionist and radical republican became so close

:05:37. > :05:42.that they were nicknamed the Chuckle Brothers.

:05:43. > :05:47.There were republicans who continued to threaten that political progress.

:05:48. > :05:51.But, when a police officer was killed, the then-deputy first

:05:52. > :05:54.minister stood side-by-side with the chief constable to condemn

:05:55. > :05:59.They are traitors to the island of Ireland.

:06:00. > :06:03.Alongside the words, there were actions on all sides.

:06:04. > :06:10.The Queen's cousin Lord Mountbatten was killed by the IRA.

:06:11. > :06:13.Yet, after the Troubles, royal and republican were able

:06:14. > :06:27.However, relationships at Stormont always seemed strained

:06:28. > :06:29.after Ian Paisley stepped down as First Minister,

:06:30. > :06:32.to be replaced by Peter Robinson, and then Arlene Foster.

:06:33. > :06:34.Earlier this year, with his ill-health by then obvious,

:06:35. > :06:37.Martin McGuinness walked out of government, amid a row

:06:38. > :06:39.between Sinn Fein and the DUP, the boy from Derry's northside

:06:40. > :06:53.retiring as first minister after years in the IRA.

:06:54. > :07:01.I've been over 25 years working, building the peace.

:07:02. > :07:04.The past actions of the IRA will colour many people's views

:07:05. > :07:07.But, as a republican who worked towards reconciliation,

:07:08. > :07:10.he will be remembered as a key figure in changing Northern Ireland.

:07:11. > :07:17.If you are just joining us this morning, the news that Martin

:07:18. > :07:21.McGuinness has died at the age of 66. We have been reflecting that

:07:22. > :07:27.news in the last hour or so here on reckless. We will speak to our

:07:28. > :07:31.political correspondent Chris Mason in a moment. Peter Hain has said Mr

:07:32. > :07:35.McGuinness was such a pivotal, essential figure in the Northern

:07:36. > :07:41.Ireland peace process, condolences to his family. Alistair Campbell, so

:07:42. > :07:45.sad Martin McGuinness has died. Some will never forgive his past, but

:07:46. > :07:49.without him there will be no peace. The man I knew was a great guy.

:07:50. > :07:54.Interesting you mention the tone of this. Former First Minister Arlene

:07:55. > :07:58.Foster has paid a glowing tribute, saying that history will record

:07:59. > :08:01.differing political opinions on the role Martin McGuinness played

:08:02. > :08:05.throughout the recent and not so recent past but history will also

:08:06. > :08:10.show that his contribution to the political and peace process was

:08:11. > :08:15.significant. Lots of people getting in contact with us this morning, we

:08:16. > :08:19.understand some strong political opinions, as he was a man who led

:08:20. > :08:27.the Provisional IRA and committed so many atrocities, we are speaking to

:08:28. > :08:32.Colin Parry, whose son was killed in 1993, and Kim gave a really powerful

:08:33. > :08:36.account of meeting him in 2013. We asked him whether he would be able

:08:37. > :08:41.to forgive Martin McGuinness for what happened to his son Tim. We

:08:42. > :08:45.asked if he could ever forgive him, he said we can never forgive him,

:08:46. > :08:50.for the man that he was and for the things that he did when he was in

:08:51. > :08:54.charge of the IRA, but he said we can respect the man he became. As

:08:55. > :08:59.Sally was saying, the man who was essential to the peace process and a

:09:00. > :09:03.key negotiator in the peace process as well. Sally was saying he would

:09:04. > :09:10.never forget that Martin McGuinness was a leader of the IRA back in his

:09:11. > :09:14.time in the late 1970s. Returning to Westminster, and a political

:09:15. > :09:18.correspondent Chris Mason, that is a theme. There is a lot to forgive but

:09:19. > :09:22.also a lot to remember that he achieved. Yes, and I think the

:09:23. > :09:26.essence of why there will be so many reflections on the life of Martin

:09:27. > :09:30.McGuinness today and in the coming days is this. Right at the heart of

:09:31. > :09:35.the attempt to bring peace to Northern Ireland and the Good Friday

:09:36. > :09:38.Agreement of 19 years ago now was that this fundamental challenge, and

:09:39. > :09:41.the fundamental challenge was a desire from a good number of people

:09:42. > :09:47.from Northern Ireland, for the trouble is the end and the violence

:09:48. > :09:52.to stop, for the murders to finish -- for the Troubles to end. And yet

:09:53. > :09:56.perfectly understandably, on both sides of the divide in Northern

:09:57. > :10:02.Ireland, an acute sense of the hatred and the animosity as a result

:10:03. > :10:06.of those deaths and those murders. So how on earth was Northern Ireland

:10:07. > :10:10.going to try and come through that? There had to be some sort of attempt

:10:11. > :10:13.to build trust between the communities, and there was the

:10:14. > :10:19.attempt with the Good Friday Agreement to set up power sharing,

:10:20. > :10:23.an arrangement in Stormont which would recognise the divide within

:10:24. > :10:27.Northern Ireland, which would have a First Minister from one side of the

:10:28. > :10:30.divide and the Deputy First Minister from the other. I guess in essence

:10:31. > :10:35.what was needed to bind together those political institutions were

:10:36. > :10:39.some characters that were associated incredibly strongly with one side of

:10:40. > :10:42.the divide or another, and Martin McGuinness most certainly associated

:10:43. > :10:46.with the Republican side, who were willing to step across that

:10:47. > :10:51.threshold, who were willing to say, yes, there is the past, yes, there

:10:52. > :10:55.is a highly contentious and controversial past Tom and yes,

:10:56. > :10:59.there are bigger, longer term political aspirations. Martin

:11:00. > :11:03.McGuinness was a lifelong Republican who wanted to see the North of

:11:04. > :11:10.Ireland, as he always described it, join the south, the republic, as

:11:11. > :11:14.part of a united Ireland but the reason he will command the column

:11:15. > :11:19.inches and airtime in the next few days and those reflections on his

:11:20. > :11:23.life is because he was that personification of someone who came

:11:24. > :11:27.from a violent past from Londonderry, his time as an IRA

:11:28. > :11:33.commander, and yet became that person who could become the Deputy

:11:34. > :11:37.First Minister, one of the Chuckle Brothers, someone who is even

:11:38. > :11:40.willing to meet the Queen, the ultimate commander of the British

:11:41. > :11:45.Armed Forces that he had fought against in Northern Ireland in the

:11:46. > :11:50.years before. So as I say, that is why he will command the column

:11:51. > :11:53.inches and discussions in the coming days, because he was that

:11:54. > :11:57.personification of somebody who was willing to step across the divide,

:11:58. > :12:00.to try and build a future for Northern Ireland, so different from

:12:01. > :12:04.its past. Thank you very much indeed. That is Chris Mason in

:12:05. > :12:09.Westminster. Stay with us, we will be back to you soon. You are

:12:10. > :12:13.watching BBC Breakfast. Aware that many of you are turning on your

:12:14. > :12:17.television for the first time this morning. We will bring you some of

:12:18. > :12:26.the news very shortly but we are reflecting on the breaking news that

:12:27. > :12:31.Northern Ireland 's former Deputy First Minister Martin McGuinness has

:12:32. > :12:35.died. A lot of reflections on the man who was a divisive figure,

:12:36. > :12:41.opinions coming on all sides of the political spectrum this morning but

:12:42. > :12:44.what we can't deny is that he was a hugely pivotal figure in Irish

:12:45. > :12:49.politics. That's right. More than anyone else Martin McGuinness

:12:50. > :12:52.embodied the journey of Irish Republicans from guns to government.

:12:53. > :12:57.As Chris Mason were saying he did have a past which was steeped in the

:12:58. > :13:02.IRA. He was second-in-command of the IRA in his home city of Londonderry,

:13:03. > :13:07.when the troubles were at their height. Then began the peace process

:13:08. > :13:11.a couple of decades later and Martin McGuinness played an important role

:13:12. > :13:17.in that, respected by rank-and-file members, uniquely placed to take the

:13:18. > :13:22.IRA away from violence and into the political arena. He ended up sharing

:13:23. > :13:26.power with, of all people, the Reverend Ian Paisley, the leader of

:13:27. > :13:30.the Democratic Unionist party. So today in Northern Ireland as people

:13:31. > :13:34.are waking up to this news there will certainly be a mixed reaction

:13:35. > :13:37.to his death, a sense of shock I think among Martin McGuinness's

:13:38. > :13:41.friends and enemies. Just a matter of a few weeks ago he was still the

:13:42. > :13:45.Deputy First Minister at Stormont. We have just had a statement through

:13:46. > :13:56.from his former partner in the power-sharing executive at Stormont,

:13:57. > :13:59.Arlene Foster, the present leader of the DUP, she has acknowledged that

:14:00. > :14:02.history will record different opinions on the role he played in

:14:03. > :14:06.the recent and not so recent past, but she did say he was pivotal in

:14:07. > :14:09.bringing the Republican movement towards a position of using peaceful

:14:10. > :14:12.and democratic means. So I think from people within the Unionist

:14:13. > :14:20.community in particular you will get a look at the two sides of Martin

:14:21. > :14:23.McGuinness's life, his past in the IRA, and the other his role in

:14:24. > :14:27.bringing peace to this very troubled part of the United Kingdom. I think

:14:28. > :14:32.that is an important part as well. We were speaking to Colin Parry,

:14:33. > :14:35.whose son was killed in the Warrington bombing, and he was

:14:36. > :14:38.speaking on behalf of his family saying he will never be able to

:14:39. > :14:42.forgive Martin McGuinness, but he can respect the man he became. I

:14:43. > :14:45.think the same can be said for many people watching BBC Breakfast and

:14:46. > :14:50.waking up to this news this morning as they will never be able to

:14:51. > :14:53.forgive him for what he did but they will see him as having a crucial

:14:54. > :14:56.role in bringing peace eventually. That's right. I think what

:14:57. > :15:00.Republicans will be saying this morning is there wouldn't have been

:15:01. > :15:03.a peace process without Martin McGuinness, they will be focusing

:15:04. > :15:07.very much on his role as a peacemaker. Gerry Adams, the Sinn

:15:08. > :15:10.Fein president, was the first to pay tribute to Martin McGuinness, saying

:15:11. > :15:15.he worked diligently for peace. Martin McGuinness's last major

:15:16. > :15:19.political act was to resign from the power-sharing executive at Stormont,

:15:20. > :15:25.he said he was calling time on what he described as the DUP's arrogance.

:15:26. > :15:29.It was never an easy relationship between Unionist and former IRA men

:15:30. > :15:33.in government, that is for sure. But whenever Mr McGenniss did bring the

:15:34. > :15:37.curtain down on that power-sharing arrangement after ten years, the

:15:38. > :15:42.election which was treated as a result resulted in Sinn Fein's best

:15:43. > :15:47.ever result in an election to the Stormont assembly, so those close to

:15:48. > :15:50.the party will regard that as one of his finest legacies, though his

:15:51. > :15:54.passing does come at a time when the future of the devolved government is

:15:55. > :15:58.still very, very uncertain. In terms of what has happened this morning,

:15:59. > :16:01.we know there was news back in December that he was suffering from

:16:02. > :16:04.this rare heart condition. In January he stood down from his

:16:05. > :16:08.position. We understand he died last night in the early hours of this

:16:09. > :16:13.morning with his family surrounding him, as well. That's right. He died

:16:14. > :16:16.in Derry, in hospital, just after midnight, we understand. It is

:16:17. > :16:22.understood he had been suffering from a rare heart condition, though

:16:23. > :16:25.he and his party had regarded his privacy, understandably, very

:16:26. > :16:28.closely in his final weeks. His illness first came to public

:16:29. > :16:32.knowledge back in December, when he was still Deputy First Minister at

:16:33. > :16:37.Stormont, and he had to pull an overseas trip to China with the

:16:38. > :16:41.First Minister, and he said his health was the reason for that. When

:16:42. > :16:44.he made his resignation statement in January he was very visibly ill and

:16:45. > :16:48.that is when people realised that his illness was very serious indeed.

:16:49. > :16:56.He had spent the last number of weeks in hospital and the focus of

:16:57. > :16:59.the morning among members of the party and others, a respected his

:17:00. > :17:04.work in the peace process, the centre will be his home city of

:17:05. > :17:09.Derry, and particularly the stroke stronger strongly republican area

:17:10. > :17:22.where he grew up. Much more on the life and career of

:17:23. > :17:26.Martin McGuinness coming on throughout the programme. And the

:17:27. > :17:29.rest of the news, but let's go to Carol, who has all of the weather

:17:30. > :17:38.. They s so of us have seen snow this morning. You can see this in

:17:39. > :17:43.the Weather Watchers pitches here. This one is from the Highlands. And

:17:44. > :17:48.another one here as well. So that makes no not deep, but there are in

:17:49. > :17:51.Falkirk. Sunshine and showers, and some of the showers will be wintry.

:17:52. > :17:55.Go through the day, the winteriness will be confined largely to the

:17:56. > :17:59.hills. But this is where we have been having some snow as we have

:18:00. > :18:02.gone through the night. Northern Ireland in Scotland in particular.

:18:03. > :18:06.We have seen some across northern England, Wales, and south-west

:18:07. > :18:09.England. Where the showers are falling on cold ground, there is the

:18:10. > :18:19.risk of ice. In Northern Ireland Scotland. The heavy snow showers at

:18:20. > :18:22.the moment are in the west of Scotland, north a sharp. If you're

:18:23. > :18:25.travelling, better than mine. In between, some such. Wheels that some

:18:26. > :18:30.showers across northern England. But as is the way with showers, not all

:18:31. > :18:33.is conceivable is the -- not all of us can see them. But it is colder

:18:34. > :18:37.than was yesterday. Yesterday were in double figures. We are very much

:18:38. > :18:40.in low single figures as morning. Pushing into the south-west of

:18:41. > :18:43.England over the more centaurs, we could see some so showers. Also

:18:44. > :18:51.across parts of Wales, some so showers. This will tend to lift into

:18:52. > :18:58.the hills, but in some of the showers, we should see a mixture of

:18:59. > :19:01.rain, hail, and sleet. And also is thunder. Those exposed to the

:19:02. > :19:08.elements will feel cold. Temperatures five to eight. Two

:19:09. > :19:13.ridges in the south ten to 12. That looks good on the face, but it has

:19:14. > :19:17.come down. Through the course of it evening and overnight, our next band

:19:18. > :19:22.of rain and wind comes in from the south-west. It, too, will deposit

:19:23. > :19:26.some snow across Wales in the high risk. As it moves away, it behind

:19:27. > :19:30.it, there will be the risk of ice and frost. But as this renegade is

:19:31. > :19:33.the vehicle they are already ensconced across northern England,

:19:34. > :19:37.it will readily turned to snow, possibly even at lower levels. And

:19:38. > :19:40.that will be with you first to get the morning for the morning's

:19:41. > :19:44.rush-hour. Neither is to say, it will be a cold but where you are,

:19:45. > :19:53.but particularly under clear skies. And some of the Glens of Scotland,

:19:54. > :19:58.it could be as low as - ten. Through the day, late today, the snow level

:19:59. > :20:02.rise. It will be cloudy and quite wet across the bulk of England and

:20:03. > :20:05.Wales, but some of us in the south will start to season sunshine. But

:20:06. > :20:09.there will be more sunshine across Scotland and also Northern Ireland.

:20:10. > :20:12.You can see the direction of the wind. It is coming from the

:20:13. > :20:18.north-east, which is a cold direction. Then it refers to a

:20:19. > :20:21.northerly direction. As a move into Thursday, we still do have our

:20:22. > :20:24.weather fronts producing some rain. But as we push further north, it

:20:25. > :20:29.will be drier and brighter. But still a bit on the chilly side.

:20:30. > :20:33.Moving from Thursday to Friday, here is the system rather around the low

:20:34. > :20:37.pressure. It sinks south on Friday, taking the red with it, but

:20:38. > :20:41.high-pressure dominate the weekend, and temperatures will improve.

:20:42. > :20:48.We will talk you get enough now. It is to give us seven. A reminder of

:20:49. > :20:53.our main story and Martin McGuinness, the former Deputy First

:20:54. > :20:56.Minister has died. He was 66. He had been diagnosed with a rare heart

:20:57. > :21:04.disease back in December of last yet. A former member of the IRA's

:21:05. > :21:10.Ameet Council, he became the chief negotiator in the peace process for

:21:11. > :21:15.Sinn Fein. We will have more reflections on this life and career

:21:16. > :21:19.throughout the programme for you. -- Army Council. Jeremy Corbyn made a

:21:20. > :21:26.plea for unity last night added meeting of MPs. The allegations were

:21:27. > :21:32.made by this deputy, Tom Watson, who is accused of trade to interfere in

:21:33. > :21:56.the Unite union's leadership contest. That the hail say they are

:21:57. > :22:01.introducing a soft drink levy to encourage food and drink companies

:22:02. > :22:05.to reduce sugar in their products. Later today, Nicola Sturgeon will

:22:06. > :22:08.begin the task of gathering support any Scottish Parliament. For another

:22:09. > :22:12.evidence referendum. -- Later today, Nicola Sturgeon

:22:13. > :22:15.will begin the task of gathering support in the Scottish Parliament

:22:16. > :22:17.to seek another independence The First Minister will

:22:18. > :22:20.address MPs as part of a two-day debate

:22:21. > :22:22.into the proposed vote, which the Scottish National Party

:22:23. > :22:25.wants to take place as early Our Scotland Correspondent Lorna

:22:26. > :22:28.Gordon is at Holyrood for us. What's the mood there

:22:29. > :22:35.ahead of today's debate, Yes it is a big day for Scottish

:22:36. > :22:39.politics. But I think before we look a little more closely at that, it is

:22:40. > :22:42.worth reflecting on what has happened across the Irish Sea this

:22:43. > :22:48.morning. David Clegg is here with me. David, Martin McGuinness did

:22:49. > :22:51.visit Parliament here. Yes, I was that a few press conferences with

:22:52. > :22:57.them, and it came spoken this journey. It was odd for someone who

:22:58. > :23:02.Kroppy Northern Ireland to be seen all these men laughing and jerky

:23:03. > :23:08.round. That showed the journey that they had gone on. The event is in

:23:09. > :23:12.Paisley Jr and some of his remarks previously that Martin McGuinness,

:23:13. > :23:16.and how that was so important for the peace process and also reflected

:23:17. > :23:21.in Scotland and the dynamic of the politicians, here. Joyce, Martin

:23:22. > :23:27.McGuinness has strong views on Brexit, didn't he? Oh yes. And I

:23:28. > :23:31.suppose the death of Martin McGuinness just reinforces the

:23:32. > :23:35.feeling that in a kind of changing moment now. Obviously, the peace

:23:36. > :23:39.process in Northern Ireland has been a very major event in these islands

:23:40. > :23:45.over the last 20 years. Although one that is not enough covered from a

:23:46. > :23:51.English or even Scottish perspective. And I think what impact

:23:52. > :23:56.could -- I think what impact it will have on Irish politics I don't know.

:23:57. > :23:59.But the memory of Martin McGuinness are still quite divisive. There are

:24:00. > :24:05.some people who could never be reconciled to him as a Sinn Fein and

:24:06. > :24:11.politician and former IRA supporter. But I think that the overall effect

:24:12. > :24:19.should be makers think about the peace process. -- should be to make

:24:20. > :24:25.us think. It is too should think of the impact that the peace process

:24:26. > :24:32.had there. I feel terrible about how little bit Brexit -- how little

:24:33. > :24:38.Northern Ireland was considered in the Brexit process. And the hope is

:24:39. > :24:43.with all the events going on, this could put on the agenda. Talk about

:24:44. > :24:46.the peace process and everything going here. A big debate starts

:24:47. > :24:52.today. Opposition parties, the unionist opposition parties, so that

:24:53. > :24:57.the SNP are fixated on independence to the detriment of their day job.

:24:58. > :25:03.Is that a fair point? Obviously, the SNP are a party of independence. And

:25:04. > :25:07.the Unionist Party are always good clapboard and have the right to be

:25:08. > :25:11.that. But that is what they are. And with that mandate, they want a very

:25:12. > :25:17.high proportion of the votes here in a general election less than a year

:25:18. > :25:22.ago. So I think is wrong to the SNP to push independence. It is a fairly

:25:23. > :25:27.futile line of argument. What do you figure that, David? They do have a

:25:28. > :25:32.mandate and were voted in? Yes, they were voted in. They did not have a

:25:33. > :25:37.majority. It is hard to get a majority. In proportional

:25:38. > :25:43.representation, that is difficult. I think that the Greens will have to

:25:44. > :25:47.vote for this as well if there is a request another referendum. There

:25:48. > :25:51.commitment is not sold in any way. They have said they would have to be

:25:52. > :25:56.public demand for it and clearly they do not have that. This is about

:25:57. > :26:02.Brexit and Scotland being dragged out of the EU against as well. So

:26:03. > :26:06.the SNP and more solid ground. It is interesting that Nicola Sturgeon is

:26:07. > :26:11.reframing the argument as the days go on, but less about the EU, but

:26:12. > :26:18.more about the sovereign will of the people? It is just becomes a contest

:26:19. > :26:21.between the EU and the UK, I think the UK will probably come out the

:26:22. > :26:25.winner. So she has to make Brexit not so much about the European

:26:26. > :26:31.Union, but about Scotland's which is being overruled by votes elsewhere

:26:32. > :26:34.in the UK. It has clear that that more Exocet or, democratic deficit,

:26:35. > :26:37.rather than just Brussels as an institution. Because of the contest

:26:38. > :26:44.here because we should leave the United Kingdom to remain in the EU,

:26:45. > :26:50.that will not work. She is in a position to make difficult position.

:26:51. > :26:58.-- she is in a difficult position. I could vote in another independence

:26:59. > :27:02.referendum because I couldn't support live in EU? I think Nick

:27:03. > :27:05.Lester just rented two things. I think she's front to lead a

:27:06. > :27:08.political grounds that we can have a referendum at the time when the

:27:09. > :27:12.Brexit deal is finished, which should be within two years. And

:27:13. > :27:15.secondly, I think she is trained to influence the negotiations that is

:27:16. > :27:19.May cannot ignore and cannot sideline Scottish interests during

:27:20. > :27:24.Brexit negotiations. Thank you both very much for joining us. This

:27:25. > :27:29.debate will last two days. It will take place at around about 5pm

:27:30. > :27:32.tomorrow afternoon. It is likely to pass, at which point Nicola Sturgeon

:27:33. > :27:37.will, despite Theresa May's refusal at this point, she will go back to

:27:38. > :27:42.me she will go to Westminster and asked for the right to hold another

:27:43. > :27:46.referendum. Thank you for joining us from Holyrood.

:27:47. > :31:14.Time now to get the news, travel and weather where you are.

:31:15. > :31:18.Now though it's back to Sally and Dan.

:31:19. > :31:24.Hello, this is Breakfast with Dan Walker and Sally Nugent.

:31:25. > :31:27.Our main story this morning: The former deputy First Minister

:31:28. > :31:29.of Northern Ireland, Martin McGuiness, has died aged 66.

:31:30. > :31:32.He had been diagnosed with a rare heart disease in December.

:31:33. > :31:35.A former member of the IRA's Army Council, Mr McGuiness became

:31:36. > :31:38.the chief negotiator in the Irish peace process for the republican

:31:39. > :31:57.To paint a true picture of Martin McGuinness,

:31:58. > :32:01.He was a paramilitary who once embraced violence,

:32:02. > :32:03.but also a peacemaker who reached out to rivals,

:32:04. > :32:06.a man who could be seen in very different lights.

:32:07. > :32:08.Born in Londonderry, into a large Catholic family,

:32:09. > :32:11.Martin McGuinness came of age as Northern Ireland's divides became

:32:12. > :32:17.In that time of violence, he joined the IRA, quickly rising

:32:18. > :32:22.Can you say whether the bombing is likely to stop in the near future,

:32:23. > :32:28.Well, I always take into consideration the appeals

:32:29. > :32:35.The 1970s saw him become one of the faces of ruthless Irish

:32:36. > :32:40.republicanism, and he was jailed for terrorist offences in Dublin.

:32:41. > :32:43.McGuinness has changed considerably from the young man who used

:32:44. > :32:45.to swagger around the no-go areas in Londonderry,

:32:46. > :32:50.as commander of the Provisional IRA there.

:32:51. > :32:53.What had started as a fight for civil rights had become

:32:54. > :33:00.Yet, alongside the many bombings and shootings,

:33:01. > :33:03.Martin McGuinness saw opportunities at the ballot box for Sinn Fein,

:33:04. > :33:05.the political party linked to the IRA.

:33:06. > :33:10.Even then, the language of threat remained.

:33:11. > :33:13.We don't believe that winning elections, and winning any amount

:33:14. > :33:15.of votes, will bring freedom in Ireland.

:33:16. > :33:19.At the end of the day, it will be the cutting edge of IRA

:33:20. > :33:22.But, after years of killings and chaos, in the 1990s,

:33:23. > :33:24.IRA ceasefires offered the opportunity for talks

:33:25. > :33:37.Not only would they shake hands, after the signing

:33:38. > :33:39.of the Good Friday Agreement, they joined each other

:33:40. > :33:49.Eventually, at its head was the unlikely partnership of two

:33:50. > :33:51.former enemies, Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness.

:33:52. > :33:54.The firebrand unionist and radical republican became so close

:33:55. > :34:00.that they were nicknamed the Chuckle Brothers.

:34:01. > :34:03.There were republicans who continued to threaten that political progress.

:34:04. > :34:05.But, when a police officer was killed, the then-deputy first

:34:06. > :34:08.minister stood side-by-side with the chief constable to condemn

:34:09. > :34:17.They are traitors to the island of Ireland.

:34:18. > :34:19.Alongside the words, there were actions on all sides.

:34:20. > :34:22.The Queen's cousin Lord Mountbatten was killed by the IRA.

:34:23. > :34:24.Yet, after the Troubles, royal and republican were able

:34:25. > :34:35.Thank you very much, I am still alive!

:34:36. > :34:41.However, relationships at Stormont always seemed strained

:34:42. > :34:43.after Ian Paisley stepped down as First Minister,

:34:44. > :34:46.to be replaced by Peter Robinson, and then Arlene Foster.

:34:47. > :34:48.Earlier this year, with his ill-health by then obvious,

:34:49. > :34:50.Martin McGuinness walked out of government, amid a row

:34:51. > :34:53.between Sinn Fein and the DUP, the boy from Derry's Bogside

:34:54. > :35:05.retiring as deputy first minister after years in the IRA.

:35:06. > :35:09.I've been over 25 years working, building the peace.

:35:10. > :35:13.The past actions of the IRA will colour many people's views

:35:14. > :35:22.But, as a republican who worked towards reconciliation,

:35:23. > :35:30.he will be remembered as a key figure in changing Northern Ireland.

:35:31. > :35:36.We have been getting an reaction to the death of Martin McGuinness

:35:37. > :35:37.throughout the morning. We can talk now to Naomi Long,

:35:38. > :35:45.the leader of the Alliance Party I know it was only yesterday that

:35:46. > :35:47.you yourself sent out your very best wishes, talking about Martin

:35:48. > :35:54.McGuinness's health, and talking about how frail he had been in

:35:55. > :35:58.recent times. Yes, and obviously I wanted to send my condolences to his

:35:59. > :36:02.wife and to the family, because today is a very sad and very

:36:03. > :36:05.difficult day for them, and our thoughts and prayers are with them

:36:06. > :36:09.this morning. He was indeed very frail. The last time I saw him was

:36:10. > :36:17.when he was leaving the assembly in December, and he had deteriorated

:36:18. > :36:20.greatly in the last few weeks so I knew that he was very seriously ill,

:36:21. > :36:25.and that was something that was of concern. This morning I suppose we

:36:26. > :36:30.are all reflecting on a very mixed career. I think this was reflected

:36:31. > :36:40.in the interview that he did with Chris. Also, Naomi, I don't want to

:36:41. > :36:44.interrupt, but also, you have been... We have heard you in the

:36:45. > :36:49.past say that you have struggled to come to terms with some of the

:36:50. > :36:52.things that he had done in the past, like many people who have been

:36:53. > :36:55.watching this morning, you have struggled to reconcile the man we

:36:56. > :37:01.saw from decades ago with the man you had in dealing with in recent

:37:02. > :37:06.years. Absolutely, and I think that today there are lots of victims of

:37:07. > :37:10.violence who will find today and the next few days difficult as people

:37:11. > :37:14.pay tribute to Martin McGuinness, and that will be a painful

:37:15. > :37:21.experience for them if they lost families as a result of the

:37:22. > :37:24.Troubles. At the end of the day, however, we have to recognise that

:37:25. > :37:28.without people like them who showed courage and dedication in terms of

:37:29. > :37:36.moving the peace process forward, and in terms of keeping devolution

:37:37. > :37:42.and standing in Northern Ireland, we will not be where we are today. His

:37:43. > :37:47.past is well documented, but I think it would be wrong not to reflect on

:37:48. > :37:52.the transformation that we saw in Martin McGuinness and in his

:37:53. > :37:57.commitment to the peace process. We are obviously in a very difficult

:37:58. > :38:02.period in terms of devolution at this point in time, and I think our

:38:03. > :38:07.best tribute to him would be to ensure that the assembly which he

:38:08. > :38:11.spent the last ten years of his life serving as Deputy First Minister is

:38:12. > :38:17.restored and able to continue with the work that he started. So it is a

:38:18. > :38:21.very conflicted figure, but the one that I worked with was one that

:38:22. > :38:26.always treated me with courtesy, that always treated me with respect.

:38:27. > :38:29.And as someone who was clearly deeply and profoundly committed to

:38:30. > :38:35.moving the peace process forward, and I think for that we should be

:38:36. > :38:37.grateful. I am interested to know, I know you worked with him

:38:38. > :38:41.extensively, I'm interested to know whether you ever spoke to him about

:38:42. > :38:46.forgiveness and reconciliation. We had Colin Parry on this morning, who

:38:47. > :38:56.lost his son Tim, and he said quite simply, he would never even be able

:38:57. > :39:00.to the began to forgive him, but he would respect him for the man he

:39:01. > :39:03.became. Did you ever have that conversation with him about

:39:04. > :39:09.forgiveness, and about how aware he was of the level of distress, upset,

:39:10. > :39:17.devastation, that had been caused during those years? Well, Martin

:39:18. > :39:22.McGuinness never denied his past. He also never apologised for his past.

:39:23. > :39:26.And I think that that was reflective of the fact that, regardless of his

:39:27. > :39:29.latter years, he believed that at that time his actions were

:39:30. > :39:33.justified, and that is something that I will never accept, because I

:39:34. > :39:37.do not believe that violence was of a part of the solution to our

:39:38. > :39:41.problems here in Northern Ireland. However, I do think that we have got

:39:42. > :39:45.to recognise that, when you make peace, you do it with your enemies.

:39:46. > :39:50.And that requires us to be able to reconcile ourselves to the fact that

:39:51. > :39:54.there will be those who committed some awful crime, there will be

:39:55. > :39:58.those who took actions which we cannot comprehend. There will be

:39:59. > :40:02.those who said and did things which contributed to that, you will also

:40:03. > :40:05.be absolutely critical to moving the process forward. Martin McGuinness

:40:06. > :40:10.was one of those people who showed courage in being able to move from

:40:11. > :40:14.where he was at that time to where he was at the end of his life.

:40:15. > :40:19.Someone who had dedicated the latter part of his life to building peace

:40:20. > :40:22.in Northern Ireland, and to bringing stability through the devolved

:40:23. > :40:29.institutions. That doesn't in any way absolve responsibility for past

:40:30. > :40:32.deeds, but it does, I think, suggest that there is an opportunity for

:40:33. > :40:38.people who want to make real change in life to be able to do that at any

:40:39. > :40:41.stage, and be able to make a positive contribution, and it is

:40:42. > :40:45.something that is part of our peace process, I think we all struggle

:40:46. > :40:49.with that at times but it is very important if we are to have the kind

:40:50. > :40:53.of success in terms of building peace that we are able to accept,

:40:54. > :40:57.that there is more than one facet to the people that we meet and work

:40:58. > :41:00.with, and that we have to be willing to stretch our constituencies, and

:41:01. > :41:05.perhaps Martin McGuinness would not have been able to do the things he

:41:06. > :41:09.did, such as meeting with the Queen and stretching his constituency, had

:41:10. > :41:12.he not also have that passed with him that gave him credibility within

:41:13. > :41:17.his own community to be able to do that. And those I guess our debates

:41:18. > :41:21.which will happen over the years and months to come. But I think for

:41:22. > :41:26.today my primary thoughts are with his family, because above all he was

:41:27. > :41:31.dedicated to his family. One of my memories is actually seeing him in a

:41:32. > :41:34.restaurant in his home city, with his family, around the table, and

:41:35. > :41:39.how open and friendly and welcoming he was when we just casually bumped

:41:40. > :41:44.into each other. And that reminds me all the time that, for every

:41:45. > :41:48.politician that we see in the public eye, there is a human and a family

:41:49. > :41:54.person in the background that often gets overlooked. And I suppose today

:41:55. > :41:57.my thoughts are really with his family, with his close friends,

:41:58. > :42:02.because they will be grieving has lost today. Thank you very much

:42:03. > :42:08.indeed for your time this morning. That is Naomi Long, leader of the

:42:09. > :42:12.Alliance party. We are reflecting on our main story this morning, the

:42:13. > :42:14.announcement of the death of the former Deputy First Minister of

:42:15. > :42:19.Northern Ireland, Martin McGuinness. We are reflecting on the fact that

:42:20. > :42:22.he was a hugely divisive but also pivotal figure in northern Irish

:42:23. > :42:26.politics. Loads of comments coming in from our viewers this morning,

:42:27. > :42:29.thank you very much for those as well. I will just read you some

:42:30. > :42:32.reaction from various political figures which we are getting this

:42:33. > :42:38.morning via social media as well. Peter Hain says condolences to

:42:39. > :42:41.Martin McGuinness's family, such a pivotal, a central figure in the

:42:42. > :42:47.Northern Ireland peace process. And from Tony Blair's former director of

:42:48. > :42:52.communications, so sad he has died. Some will never forgive his past,

:42:53. > :42:57.but without him, there would be no peace. The man I knew was a great

:42:58. > :43:03.guy. And the STL leader says history will record his career as a journey,

:43:04. > :43:10.one born in a traditional violence but in a testament to his character,

:43:11. > :43:14.he arrived in politics and the art of persuasion. Those who knew him

:43:15. > :43:18.will know that his warm and affable nature undoubtedly made it easier

:43:19. > :43:20.for him to move beyond his own political base.

:43:21. > :43:22.Let's speak now to Chris Paige, our Ireland correspondent,

:43:23. > :43:24.who is in our Belfast newsroom for us.

:43:25. > :43:34.Thank you very much for your time this morning. : In his comment

:43:35. > :43:39.Torquay about history, how do you think history will judge Martin

:43:40. > :43:41.McGuinness? Well, is life was undoubtedly controversial, his

:43:42. > :43:46.legacy will be conflicts in many ways. What no one can doubt this he

:43:47. > :43:50.was one of the most influential politicians of modern times. Many

:43:51. > :43:53.Republicans will say they wouldn't have been a peace process without

:43:54. > :43:59.Martin McGuinness. He joined the IRA in the early 1970s in his home city

:44:00. > :44:03.of Derry, when the Troubles were at their height. Derry was in many ways

:44:04. > :44:06.the crucible of the conflict, and immensely divided city, perhaps more

:44:07. > :44:12.so than any other place in Northern Ireland. His reputation in the IRA,

:44:13. > :44:15.if you like, was forged under those circumstances. He remains a senior

:44:16. > :44:19.figure in the Republican movement throughout the years of violence but

:44:20. > :44:24.in the late 1980s and the early 1990s the peace process to place and

:44:25. > :44:27.he was one of, if not the key figures in the Republican movement

:44:28. > :44:32.as negotiations began. With the government first of all in secret,

:44:33. > :44:36.and then more publicly. It was a remarkable journey by any standards.

:44:37. > :44:40.Ultimately it ended up with him sharing power with a man who would

:44:41. > :44:45.have been regarded as perhaps his foremost enemy, the Reverend Ian

:44:46. > :44:49.Paisley, the founder of the Democratic Unionist party, the most

:44:50. > :44:53.hardline of all Unionist leaders. It took a long road of negotiations to

:44:54. > :44:57.get there. That happen in 2007 when Mr McGenniss and Mr Paisley finally

:44:58. > :45:00.went into government together but the remarkable thing was they got

:45:01. > :45:05.along so well -- Martin McGuinness. They were nicknamed the Chuckle

:45:06. > :45:10.Brothers and it is that relationship recently which has been made into a

:45:11. > :45:15.film, which I think will sum up the two sides, if you like, of Martin

:45:16. > :45:18.McGuinness's life. Some unionists could never reconcile themselves to

:45:19. > :45:21.the idea that someone like Martin McGuinness could end up running

:45:22. > :45:25.Northern Ireland but the fact that he did, after taking on a journey

:45:26. > :45:29.from guns to government, he was able to strike up not a working

:45:30. > :45:33.relationship with Mr Paisley, but a warm one, and that relationship with

:45:34. > :45:37.the Democratic Unionist party continued for ten years, up until

:45:38. > :45:40.very recently. When you look at the remarkable turnaround, if you like,

:45:41. > :45:44.from tons of violence in Northern Ireland the times of peace, it is a

:45:45. > :45:49.very, very fascinating story, and I think those two sides of Martin

:45:50. > :45:54.McGuinness's life will be reflected on in the days and years ahead. You

:45:55. > :45:58.are right, it is a fascinating, extraordinary story, isn't it? What

:45:59. > :46:01.you are saying about the two sides of him has been reflected in what

:46:02. > :46:04.people are saying to us this morning. Some people are watching

:46:05. > :46:08.this and will probably switch the television off because of the past

:46:09. > :46:11.of Martin McGuinness, and others will look at the man and politician

:46:12. > :46:16.he became, who was essential to securing that peace in Northern

:46:17. > :46:21.Ireland. That's right, the IRA was responsible for hundreds of killings

:46:22. > :46:25.during the Troubles, it was a deadly paramilitary group, and in what was

:46:26. > :46:28.a conflict that it many times over the years people thought could never

:46:29. > :46:33.ends. In the end it did, Martin McGuinness played such a significant

:46:34. > :46:36.role in that process. It is interesting to look down at the

:46:37. > :46:41.tribute from Arlene Foster, the present leader of the Democratic

:46:42. > :46:46.Unionist party. Until very recently she was Martin McGuinness's partner

:46:47. > :46:49.in government, First Minister at Stormont, Martin McGuinness was

:46:50. > :46:52.Deputy First Minister and that power-sharing executive collapsed in

:46:53. > :46:55.January when on one of his last political acts he resigned as First

:46:56. > :47:05.Minister sang the relationship between the two parties had broken

:47:06. > :47:10.down. But Mrs Foster herself saw first-hand the Troubles, her father

:47:11. > :47:15.was shot during the violence, and she says that history will also show

:47:16. > :47:16.that his contribution to the political and peace process was

:47:17. > :47:24.significant. Thank you for your time this

:47:25. > :47:29.morning, Chris. Those opinions are being reflected at home. A lot of

:47:30. > :47:33.people are saying that he was to buy seven controversial, but also a

:47:34. > :47:38.significant figure in the history of this country, of Ireland, of the

:47:39. > :47:43.last seven decades. Exactly. Thank you feel cross borders as morning.

:47:44. > :47:50.We will bring you an update on some other news across the UK, but first

:47:51. > :47:58.The weather. So the showers are falling at the moment is no, that it

:47:59. > :48:02.across Scotland and Northern Ireland. You can see what is been

:48:03. > :48:06.happening in the last six hours. This is where we have had the most

:48:07. > :48:09.prolific sours. We've also has snow showers across northern England, but

:48:10. > :48:14.was, in south-west England. We'll hold on to those showers in some

:48:15. > :48:18.parts, especially across western Scotland, but increasingly, you will

:48:19. > :48:21.find that this is no element will be largely confined to the hills and at

:48:22. > :48:25.lower levels any showers will be mostly of rain. But you could also

:48:26. > :48:29.see some sleet and hail and a little bit of thunder as well. Quite a

:48:30. > :48:33.windy day in prospect. By the Ptarmigan to the afternoon, a new

:48:34. > :48:37.system will come from the south-west, bringing strong winds

:48:38. > :48:41.and so rain with Summer Hill snow. North Wales still holding on to

:48:42. > :48:44.skies was a red showers. Still some showers across Northern Ireland.

:48:45. > :48:49.Some of those on the hills will be wintry. You might see sleet and some

:48:50. > :48:52.showers at lower levels. It is the same across Scotland. There will

:48:53. > :48:56.still be some showers, sunshine, with the snow largely by then on the

:48:57. > :49:00.hills. For the Pennines, snowmobiles, and rain a lower

:49:01. > :49:04.levels. You do get a shower. But the much a central, and eastern England,

:49:05. > :49:09.it will be dry with sunshine. The top average in London is 11. This

:49:10. > :49:13.time last week, we were looking way up in the teens. As we head through

:49:14. > :49:16.the evening and into overnight, that system will continue to move

:49:17. > :49:22.northwards, depositing snow in Wales. There could be the risk of

:49:23. > :49:26.ice behind it. The risk of frost in south-west England possible. As that

:49:27. > :49:30.engages with the cold air already ensconced in Scotland, we will see

:49:31. > :49:35.that turn to snow, even at lower levels. Dry across the south-east,

:49:36. > :49:38.Scotland and Northern Ireland, that he will be particular cold, with

:49:39. > :49:45.temperatures in some of the clans down to - ten. For much of England

:49:46. > :49:48.and Wales, where looking at between four and five. Eccles suffered

:49:49. > :49:52.tomorrow. Still some stir showers around, and then by the time we get

:49:53. > :49:58.to Thursday, while we have also this band of rain, connected with this

:49:59. > :50:02.air of low pressure. To the north, brighter and drier. Still feeling

:50:03. > :50:05.chilly. But as we had from Thursday to Friday, this system, which is

:50:06. > :50:08.connected to a Nehra of low pressure, will continue to drift

:50:09. > :50:12.away onto the near continent, allowing high pressure to build and

:50:13. > :50:16.buy that. All of us, that means the weather is could be more settled as

:50:17. > :50:19.we head into the weekend. The other thing that you will notice is the

:50:20. > :50:23.temperatures will start to recover, with much of the UK seeing a return

:50:24. > :50:28.to double figures. Current thinking is that this air of higher pressure

:50:29. > :50:32.is set to stay with us for quite a while. But if you are heading off to

:50:33. > :50:33.the Mediterranean, where you can see it is looking pretty unsettled, they

:50:34. > :50:36.are. Over to you guys. The number of children under the age

:50:37. > :50:44.of five in England who have had teeth removed has risen by almost

:50:45. > :50:48.a quarter in the last decade. The figures have been obtained

:50:49. > :50:50.by the Royal College of Surgeons which says

:50:51. > :50:52.most of the tooth decay Here's our Health

:50:53. > :50:55.Correspondent, Jane Dreaper. Tooth decay is painful

:50:56. > :50:58.but it can be prevented. Regular brushing, seeing the dentist

:50:59. > :51:01.and cutting back on sugary But new figures show more children

:51:02. > :51:04.in England are needing Just over 84,000 extractions

:51:05. > :51:09.were carried out on under-fives The number went up by almost

:51:10. > :51:19.a quarter in that time, much bigger than the overall

:51:20. > :51:22.increase in this age group. Last year alone, there were more

:51:23. > :51:25.than 9,000 extractions involving They've probably had

:51:26. > :51:39.many sleepless nights, may have had time away from school,

:51:40. > :51:42.may have been prescribed antibiotics in the meantime, and it's really

:51:43. > :51:46.the only the way we can deal with the problem is to admit them,

:51:47. > :51:49.and to have a full-blown general Dentists want proceeds from the UK's

:51:50. > :51:54.forthcoming sugar tax to be spent on educating people

:51:55. > :51:57.about the importance of looking The Department of Health said

:51:58. > :52:05.it was taking action to tackle the worrying statistics, and parents

:52:06. > :52:08.could help their children to avoid sugary drinks and brush

:52:09. > :52:09.teeth regularly. Let's speak now to Ingrid Perry

:52:10. > :52:21.who is a volunteer from a programme Good morning. It is a little

:52:22. > :52:24.shocking. You think that people are getting a little wiser about looking

:52:25. > :52:27.after their children's teeth, cutting back on sugar, why are these

:52:28. > :52:33.figures going in the wrong direction do you think? I think there are a

:52:34. > :52:37.lot of mixed messages out there. There been various campaigns over

:52:38. > :52:40.the years, and these have encouraged parents to have more fruit and

:52:41. > :52:45.vegetables in the children's diet, and Odyssey, one of those things as

:52:46. > :52:49.things like smoothies, as well. But an pusher, the other message that

:52:50. > :52:54.does not go with that is to only have the things that mealtimes, and

:52:55. > :52:58.it is the in between meal snacks and there is a cause most of the damage.

:52:59. > :53:01.Psychic a lot of it is down to education and making sure that

:53:02. > :53:05.health professionals, and people involved with the families, actually

:53:06. > :53:11.give the correct information out in the correct context. -- so I think a

:53:12. > :53:16.lot of it. Said these questions would come out anyway, when they? So

:53:17. > :53:24.is it so a problem to say they being... I know it is unusual, but

:53:25. > :53:28.is that owned problem. -- that is that a problem? Judy McEvoy the

:53:29. > :53:33.people pick the baby did not important. But they are. They keep

:53:34. > :53:37.the space for the permanent teeth. We know that if children have had

:53:38. > :53:44.teeth extracted early, earlier than they'd naturally would come out,

:53:45. > :53:48.there is often delayed eruption. And the second to follow. An offer come

:53:49. > :53:54.through the through the wrong place. Where can leads to orthodontic

:53:55. > :53:57.issues. A lot of people have been getting in touch about this. This

:53:58. > :54:03.was that her daughter needed three teeth extracted. She is five. They

:54:04. > :54:09.are devastated. The dentist was stumped. She had been fought regular

:54:10. > :54:13.checkups, but it was notice after only three weeks from a dental one.

:54:14. > :54:18.So it is not always neglect? Not always. There are some errors we

:54:19. > :54:21.find a higher level of tooth decay. This is usually in areas of

:54:22. > :54:24.deprivation. But again, a lot of that is sent to education. And

:54:25. > :54:28.making sure the parents have the correct messages. And that is part

:54:29. > :54:32.of what you do with the Teeth Team, is that? What you tell children when

:54:33. > :54:36.you go to schools? A lot of things. We work closely with the schools and

:54:37. > :54:39.any supporting agencies within the school, such as nursing teams, and

:54:40. > :54:44.with the younger children in nurseries are we go to the Cannes we

:54:45. > :54:49.also work with the nursery kids as well. So we always try to make sure

:54:50. > :54:52.a run as the correct information. We also said the children that is the

:54:53. > :54:56.key dates which, but not at the between meals. Try to keep them for

:54:57. > :55:00.special times, and it all at once. And Odyssey radio toothbrush is very

:55:01. > :55:04.important. So we also find us a lot of children rush when they brush, so

:55:05. > :55:10.the lesson is two minutes, twice a day. There is a brilliant up which

:55:11. > :55:18.encourages children to brush for the correct amount of time, and that is

:55:19. > :55:23.called Brush DJ. Very sorry to get you so long with the breaking news.

:55:24. > :55:28.We go back to that story now. Martin McGuinness has just been announced

:55:29. > :55:35.as dead. He had been diagnosed with a rare heart disease back in

:55:36. > :55:38.December. We go to Chris Page. There has already been a significant

:55:39. > :55:44.matter response from people across the political landscape? Yes. A huge

:55:45. > :55:48.number of tributes coming in here to the man who undoubtedly had a very

:55:49. > :55:52.controversial life, a very divisive life, but had a huge impact on the

:55:53. > :55:59.place that Northern Ireland became as it moves from fathers to be. One

:56:00. > :56:03.beginners, the former IRA commander, ended up sharing power at Stormont.

:56:04. > :56:07.One of the relationships that defined the jetty was the one he had

:56:08. > :56:14.with the form you years later, Ian Paisley. We had a tweet from Ian

:56:15. > :56:18.Paisley's son, and he said he is very sorry to hear about the death

:56:19. > :56:26.of Martin McGuinness, and looks back on pleasure -- with pleasure on the

:56:27. > :56:29.year that his father spent with Martin McGuinness working of these.

:56:30. > :56:33.That is the first response we have heard from the family of Ian

:56:34. > :56:37.Paisley. The woman who took over from Martin McGuinness as Sinn

:56:38. > :56:43.Fein's leader has set her heart is broken. She says we have lost a

:56:44. > :56:49.giant at a legend. Chris, thank you. That is Chris Page for us reflecting

:56:50. > :56:53.on the tributes follow the death of Martin McGuinness was and is just a

:56:54. > :56:56.couple of hours ago. And that has been the main story this morning.

:56:57. > :57:06.Will try to bring you other news, and we are on till 915 this morning.

:57:07. > :00:29.756 and we will get some news or travel. Wilshere are just a few

:00:30. > :00:31.Now though it's back to Sally and Dan.

:00:32. > :00:38.Hello, this is Breakfast, with Dan Walker and Sally Nugent.

:00:39. > :00:42.Sinn Fein's Martin McGuinness dies at the age of 66.

:00:43. > :00:47.His death was announced early this morning.

:00:48. > :00:48.It is understood the former Deputy First Minister

:00:49. > :00:50.of Northern Ireland had been suffering from a rare

:00:51. > :00:54.The former IRA leader turned peacemaker worked at the heart

:00:55. > :00:56.of the power-sharing government following the 1998

:00:57. > :01:09.Tributes paid to him from across the political spectrum.

:01:10. > :01:12.In a statement the Sinn Fein President Gerry Adam has called

:01:13. > :01:14.called him a passionate Republican who showed great determination

:01:15. > :01:35.The former deputy first minister of Northern Ireland,

:01:36. > :01:41.He had been diagnosed with a rare heart disease in December.

:01:42. > :01:43.A former member of the IRA's Army Council, Mr McGuiness became

:01:44. > :01:47.the chief negotiator in the Irish peace process for the republican

:01:48. > :01:57.To paint a true picture of Martin McGuinness,

:01:58. > :02:03.He was a paramilitary who once embraced violence,

:02:04. > :02:07.but also a peacemaker who reached out to rivals,

:02:08. > :02:11.a man who could be seen in very different lights.

:02:12. > :02:16.Born in Londonderry, into a large Catholic family,

:02:17. > :02:21.Martin McGuinness came of age as Northern Ireland's divides became

:02:22. > :02:25.In that time of violence, he joined the IRA, quickly rising

:02:26. > :02:30.Can you say whether the bombing is likely to stop in the near future,

:02:31. > :02:36.Well, I always take into consideration the appeals

:02:37. > :02:43.The 1970s saw him become one of the faces of ruthless Irish

:02:44. > :02:47.republicanism, and he was jailed for terrorist offences in Dublin.

:02:48. > :02:50.McGuinness has changed considerably from the young man who used

:02:51. > :02:52.to swagger around the no-go areas in Londonderry,

:02:53. > :02:55.as commander of the Provisional IRA there.

:02:56. > :02:58.What had started as a fight for civil rights had become

:02:59. > :03:04.Yet, alongside the many bombings and shootings,

:03:05. > :03:07.Martin McGuinness saw opportunities at the ballot box for Sinn Fein,

:03:08. > :03:12.the political party linked to the IRA.

:03:13. > :03:16.Even then, the language of threat remained.

:03:17. > :03:18.We don't believe that winning elections, and winning any amount

:03:19. > :03:20.of votes, will bring freedom in Ireland.

:03:21. > :03:24.At the end of the day, it will be the cutting edge of IRA

:03:25. > :03:30.But, after years of killings and chaos, in the 1990s,

:03:31. > :03:31.IRA ceasefires offered the opportunity for talks

:03:32. > :03:44.Not only would they shake hands, after the signing

:03:45. > :03:47.of the Good Friday Agreement, they joined each other

:03:48. > :03:53.Eventually, at its head was the unlikely partnership of two

:03:54. > :03:55.former enemies, Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness.

:03:56. > :04:00.The firebrand unionist and radical republican became so close

:04:01. > :04:08.that they were nicknamed the Chuckle Brothers.

:04:09. > :04:12.There were republicans who continued to threaten that political progress.

:04:13. > :04:15.But, when a police officer was killed, the then-deputy first

:04:16. > :04:17.minister stood side-by-side with the chief constable to condemn

:04:18. > :04:24.They are traitors to the island of Ireland.

:04:25. > :04:27.Alongside the words, there were actions on all sides.

:04:28. > :04:33.The Queen's cousin Lord Mountbatten was killed by the IRA.

:04:34. > :04:36.Yet, after the Troubles, royal and republican were able

:04:37. > :04:40.Thank you very much, I am still alive!

:04:41. > :04:47.However, relationships at Stormont always seemed strained

:04:48. > :04:49.after Ian Paisley stepped down as First Minister,

:04:50. > :04:54.to be replaced by Peter Robinson, and then Arlene Foster.

:04:55. > :04:57.Earlier this year, with his ill-health by then obvious,

:04:58. > :05:02.Martin McGuinness walked out of government, amid a row

:05:03. > :05:05.between Sinn Fein and the DUP, the boy from Derry's Bogside

:05:06. > :05:08.retiring as deputy first minister after years in the IRA.

:05:09. > :05:15.I've been over 25 years working, building the peace.

:05:16. > :05:17.The past actions of the IRA will colour many people's views

:05:18. > :05:23.But, as a republican who worked towards reconciliation,

:05:24. > :05:36.he will be remembered as a key figure in changing Northern Ireland.

:05:37. > :05:42.Reflections on the death of Martin McGuinness. We have a statement from

:05:43. > :05:46.Theresa May. She says first and foremost my thoughts are with the

:05:47. > :05:50.family of Martin McGuinness at this sad time. While I can never condone

:05:51. > :05:55.the party talk in the early part of his life, he has ultimately played a

:05:56. > :05:59.defining role in leading the republican movement away from

:06:00. > :06:03.violence and in doing so she said he made an essential contribution to

:06:04. > :06:07.the extraordinary journey of Northern Ireland from conflict to

:06:08. > :06:15.peace. While we certainly did not always CI Terai, as Deputy First

:06:16. > :06:18.Minister for almost a decade he was a pioneer of implementing cross

:06:19. > :06:20.community power-sharing and understood its fragility and

:06:21. > :06:25.significance and played a vital role in helping to find a way through

:06:26. > :06:29.many difficult moments. The Prime Minister finish the statement by

:06:30. > :06:33.saying at the heart of it all was his optimism for the future of

:06:34. > :06:40.Northern Ireland and said we should hold fast to that optimism today.

:06:41. > :06:45.And Tony Blair said, I am very sorry to learn of Martin's death and send

:06:46. > :06:50.his family my condolences and sympathy. I grew up hearing about

:06:51. > :06:55.the Martin McGuinness a leading member of the IRA, and I came to

:06:56. > :06:59.know the Martin McGuinness who set aside that armed struggle in favour

:07:00. > :07:07.of making peace. Whatever the past, the Martin I knew was a thoughtful,

:07:08. > :07:11.reflective and committed individual. Once he became the Peacemaker,

:07:12. > :07:17.wholeheartedly and with no shortage of opposition to those who wanted to

:07:18. > :07:25.carry on with more. Arlene Foster issued a statement, saying, I want

:07:26. > :07:27.to express my condolences personally and on behalf of our party to the

:07:28. > :07:52.McGuinness family... For more reaction to the death

:07:53. > :07:55.of Martin McGuinness we can now speak to the Former Northern Ireland

:07:56. > :08:03.secretary Lord Hain. I appreciate it is a busy morning.

:08:04. > :08:06.Thank you for your time. In statements from politicians, they

:08:07. > :08:10.are long statements and most of them qualified the band he was turning

:08:11. > :08:16.into the man he became. I wonder what your reflections are. First, my

:08:17. > :08:23.condolences and sympathies to his family. He was first and foremost a

:08:24. > :08:29.family man and that is reflected in the fact he travelled back from

:08:30. > :08:34.Belfast to his home city of Derry, Londonderry, every evening after a

:08:35. > :08:40.day's work. He played a crucial role in the peace process. A former IRA

:08:41. > :08:44.commander, responsible with colleagues for terrible events,

:08:45. > :08:50.nevertheless, was able to see the only hope for his republican cause

:08:51. > :08:55.and his aim of the united Ireland and only hope for his own people and

:08:56. > :08:59.supporters as well as Northern Ireland society was to take the

:09:00. > :09:08.Democratic path and in that sense he was a figure who was able to carry

:09:09. > :09:11.with him grassroots Republicans, former IRA competence, into a

:09:12. > :09:26.democratic peaceful political path and that was his importance. He

:09:27. > :09:35.carried the weight of history, -- combatant. People would say they

:09:36. > :09:40.cannot forgive him. I can understand that looked at historically and as a

:09:41. > :09:43.former Secretary of State who negotiated with Martin McGuinness

:09:44. > :09:47.and was in the room with him and his colleague Gerry Adams, he was

:09:48. > :09:58.crucial in taking Northern Ireland its horror and its terror into a

:09:59. > :10:01.peaceful situation it now is. Martin McGuinness was a crucial and

:10:02. > :10:06.indispensable figure in that. Often you see in conflicts around the

:10:07. > :10:12.world, the former hard men are vital in becoming soft men and women in

:10:13. > :10:21.taking their people forward and embracing their old enemies. As he

:10:22. > :10:26.did. Forgive me for jumping across you. I wanted to talk to you about

:10:27. > :10:36.the fact his life and career, it is extraordinary to consider the man he

:10:37. > :10:39.was and the man he became. He was pivotal to peace negotiations in

:10:40. > :10:43.Northern Ireland and if you go back 20, 30, 40 years from the man he was

:10:44. > :10:48.growing up, you would never have thought he would be so crucial in

:10:49. > :10:54.those negotiations. He would never have considered it. Because he was a

:10:55. > :10:58.hard man. As an IRA commander. And we know the terrible things the IRA

:10:59. > :11:02.did, but when you look at history, you find in conflicts around the

:11:03. > :11:07.world, the former hard men often become the peace leaders and they

:11:08. > :11:12.cannot get to a non-violent situation without that transition

:11:13. > :11:19.themselves. When it became clear to the IRA they could not bomb their

:11:20. > :11:22.way to a united Ireland and Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness realise

:11:23. > :11:27.that and the British Government realise they could not defeat the

:11:28. > :11:30.IRA it opened up the opportunity for real leaders to fill the vacuum and

:11:31. > :11:40.Martin McGuinness proved himself to be that. We appreciate your time.

:11:41. > :11:44.Thank you very much. We can speak to Ian Paisley Jr from

:11:45. > :11:50.the Democratic Unionist Party. Good morning. Much of this morning we

:11:51. > :11:52.have spent talking not just about Martin McGuinness but also about

:11:53. > :12:00.your father and the relationship they had. Good morning. For most

:12:01. > :12:06.people, the death of Martin McGuinness will be one which

:12:07. > :12:10.engenders mixed feelings, as we have just heard. It is clear. Martin

:12:11. > :12:15.McGuinness, when I was growing up, he was the godfather of the

:12:16. > :12:21.Provisional IRA and a man who struck terror literally into the hearts and

:12:22. > :12:26.lives of many people. That moved from being the godfather to the man

:12:27. > :12:32.in government. That remarkable journey is incredibly important. As

:12:33. > :12:36.a Christian, a person who reflects on life, it is not how you start

:12:37. > :12:41.your life is important but how you finish your life. I think a lot of

:12:42. > :12:46.people will be thankful Martin McGuinness finished his life a lot

:12:47. > :12:51.better than it could have been. The journey was remarkable and I think

:12:52. > :12:55.that is significant. It is one of mixed feelings because there will be

:12:56. > :13:01.people who were hurt and hurt for ever by the actions of the

:13:02. > :13:06.godfather, but there are people who have benefited for ever by the

:13:07. > :13:10.actions of the man in government. How important was that the

:13:11. > :13:14.relationship between your father and Martin McGuinness was so public and

:13:15. > :13:19.visible and did it reflect the change they hoped to see through the

:13:20. > :13:26.community? I think it was significant. Without the big beasts

:13:27. > :13:34.in the political field is doing the leadership, we would still be

:13:35. > :13:42.quarrelling over what Churchill described as these steeples of

:13:43. > :13:51.Fermanagh and Tyrone will -- Tyrone. That is what happened. It is laying

:13:52. > :13:56.the foundation stones. It is how we build upon that and make sure the

:13:57. > :14:01.legacy of peace and stability continues to allow prosperity for

:14:02. > :14:05.all the people of Northern Ireland. I suppose that is the hoping all of

:14:06. > :14:11.this. We have had an overwhelming response. Lots of people this

:14:12. > :14:17.morning are not able to forgive him and not able to forget his past.

:14:18. > :14:22.What would you say to them? I do not ask anybody to forget anything but I

:14:23. > :14:28.ask people and I think the entire community to look at the entire

:14:29. > :14:35.picture. I do not preach a message forget. I preach a message of let's

:14:36. > :14:40.look to the future and build and go forward and going forward is more

:14:41. > :14:46.important than being forgetful. What legacy has he left for Northern

:14:47. > :14:53.Ireland? It is a mixed bag. I hope at one end the journey of becoming

:14:54. > :14:57.the Peacemaker and the person who was pivotal to creating that

:14:58. > :15:05.political settlement, that has laid a sound foundation. He was, as Lord

:15:06. > :15:10.Hain said, the hard man of the Provisionals and was able to bring

:15:11. > :15:16.the hard men of that organisation over the Rubicon frankly they cannot

:15:17. > :15:20.walk back over. They accepted the rule of the crown and a state

:15:21. > :15:25.governed by the people of Northern Ireland through Westminster. Let's

:15:26. > :15:28.build on that and let's build a better and more prosperous Northern

:15:29. > :15:33.Ireland. I hope that is the legacy and we can look back and say that

:15:34. > :15:38.was a troubled past, but the journey has ended well instead of the

:15:39. > :15:43.journey continuing in trouble, it will hopefully continue in a more

:15:44. > :15:47.peaceful way. I would express my total condolences to the family. I

:15:48. > :15:55.know something of the loss of a loved one. Nothing will ever fill

:15:56. > :15:58.that void on a personal level. I think the family deserve the

:15:59. > :16:00.quietness and respect they are entitled to at this time. Ian

:16:01. > :16:07.Paisley Jr, thanks. Continued reaction this morning to

:16:08. > :16:11.the news of the death of Martin McGuinness. We've got the Liberal

:16:12. > :16:16.Democrat leader Tim Farron who sent us a statement on this. We'll speak

:16:17. > :16:21.to Chris Page in a moment. Chris, if you could hold on. Tim Farron says

:16:22. > :16:25.Martin McGuinness became a statesman. One moment sticks with

:16:26. > :16:29.me, the remarkable and unlikely images of McGuinness when he shook

:16:30. > :16:35.the hand of the Queen on her visit to Belfast in 2012. This single

:16:36. > :16:39.picture epitomized the changes in Northern Ireland. The historic

:16:40. > :16:41.handshake with the Queen. This something that I and millions of

:16:42. > :16:45.other are thankful. Peace in Northern Ireland is down in part to

:16:46. > :16:50.his leadership of the republican community. Let's bring in Chris Page

:16:51. > :16:53.on that issue. Tim Farron is right on that, isn't he, Chris, that was a

:16:54. > :16:56.hugely significant moment and many of our viewers will remember that,

:16:57. > :17:00.the build up to that, the moment itself and the reaction to that

:17:01. > :17:04.handshake, considering all that had happened in the past? Well, that's

:17:05. > :17:09.absolutely right and it was one of those iconic images which came to

:17:10. > :17:13.define the later part of Martin McGuinness' life and he met the

:17:14. > :17:18.Queen several times. They seemed to strike up quite a warm rapport and

:17:19. > :17:22.on one of the last occasions they met, they even shared a joke. I

:17:23. > :17:25.think the word that's come up again and again this morning when people

:17:26. > :17:28.have been reflecting on Martin McGuinness' life is journey. He was

:17:29. > :17:32.the paramilitary who turned peacemaker. He was the man who more

:17:33. > :17:36.than any other figure perhaps personified the move of Irish

:17:37. > :17:41.republicans from guns to Government. When he first came to public

:17:42. > :17:45.prominence he was a leader in the IRA, an organisation who killed

:17:46. > :17:49.hundreds of people in one of the world's most bitter conflicts. But

:17:50. > :17:53.in later life some people would have described him as a statesman, as a

:17:54. > :17:57.politician who took risks for peace and delivered Northern Ireland into

:17:58. > :18:03.an era where violence was just a memory and not a political reality.

:18:04. > :18:06.It's interesting speaking to Ian Paisley junior whose father, of

:18:07. > :18:10.course, became in the end a respected colleague of Martin

:18:11. > :18:15.McGuinness. He was saying that, yes, things has gone on in Martin

:18:16. > :18:18.McGuinness' past, he called him the godfather of the IRA but for him and

:18:19. > :18:20.many others, it is about how he finished his life which is the

:18:21. > :18:24.important thing and you can appreciate and understand that point

:18:25. > :18:28.of view, but I suppose also you can understand many people watching and

:18:29. > :18:33.listening and hearing the news of his death this morning, they will

:18:34. > :18:37.never be able to forgive him for his role in those deaths and those

:18:38. > :18:41.atrocities. Yes, there remain people in Northern Ireland who were never

:18:42. > :18:46.able to forgive Martin McGuinness for his role in the violent past of

:18:47. > :18:49.the republican movement. There are some unionists who could never

:18:50. > :18:52.accept that he would be in Government running Northern Ireland

:18:53. > :18:55.in the joint office which was the highest political office in the

:18:56. > :18:59.land, the office of the first and Deputy First Minister. The statement

:19:00. > :19:04.from the mainstream unionist leaders though today, if you like, have

:19:05. > :19:08.acknowledged Martin McGuinness' past in the IRa and have acknowledged the

:19:09. > :19:13.IRA's violence and acknowledged the hurt and harm that the IRA did, but

:19:14. > :19:20.they have also noted that he has played a pivotal role in the peace

:19:21. > :19:24.process an IRA victim has said this morning, Alan McBride whose wife was

:19:25. > :19:28.killed in the Shankill Road bombing in 1993, that Martin McGuinness'

:19:29. > :19:33.fingers were all over the trouble, but also all over the peace process.

:19:34. > :19:36.It is that complexity, those two sides of Martin McGuinness' life

:19:37. > :19:42.that will be reflecting on and remembering in the days ahead. Chris

:19:43. > :19:45.Page, thank you very much. It is 8.19am. I think it is time we

:19:46. > :19:58.went to Carol who has the weather. We've got some snow, but sunshine in

:19:59. > :20:02.Balerno and you can see in Northern Ireland that we've got the same.

:20:03. > :20:05.Snow on the hills, but lovely blue skiesment what we are looking at

:20:06. > :20:10.today is a day of sunshine and showers, but it is a cold start.

:20:11. > :20:13.Northern Ireland, in Edinburgh, in Leeds, it is only two Celsius. Come

:20:14. > :20:17.further south, it is not as cold, but compared to the double figure

:20:18. > :20:20.temperatures we had at this stage yesterday, it certainly does feel

:20:21. > :20:23.colder than it was this time yesterday. Now we have been watching

:20:24. > :20:26.the rain and the snow falling as we have gone through the course of the

:20:27. > :20:29.night. Most of it has been in Northern Ireland and Scotland, but

:20:30. > :20:33.we have seen some across Northern England and Wales and south-west

:20:34. > :20:38.England, but it's snow showers. Some are heavy, so not all of us are

:20:39. > :20:42.seeing them. They're being blown in on the wind, but in between the

:20:43. > :20:44.showers, you will find there will be quite a bit of sunshine around. Most

:20:45. > :20:48.of the snow will be on higher ground. At lower levels, it could be

:20:49. > :20:52.wintry so you could have a mix, sleet, rain and also some hail and

:20:53. > :20:57.maybe the odd rumble of thunder. But by the time we get to the afternoon,

:20:58. > :21:00.another system is going to be coming into the south-west, introducing

:21:01. > :21:03.thicker cloud and rain, a little bit of wintriness as well and

:21:04. > :21:06.strengthening winds. It will extend in through Pembrokeshire and North

:21:07. > :21:10.Wales, sunshine and showers. For Northern Ireland, you hang on to

:21:11. > :21:14.sunshine and showers. Again, there could be a wintry element at lower

:21:15. > :21:18.levels, but we're talking rain, sleet and hail. For Scotland, it's

:21:19. > :21:22.the same. In between the showers, there will be sunshine, but it will

:21:23. > :21:27.feel cold in the windment for Northern England, you could see some

:21:28. > :21:30.of those showers. For the rest of England and the Midlands, Essex and

:21:31. > :21:34.Can?t and down to the Isle of Wight, most of us will stay dry. It will

:21:35. > :21:38.feel chilly, but there will be quite a bit of sunshine around. Through

:21:39. > :21:42.the evening and overnight this rain will continue to drift northwards,

:21:43. > :21:45.it won't stagger like my graphics are doing! We're looking at snow on

:21:46. > :21:48.the higher routes in Wales. There will be the risk of ice here in

:21:49. > :21:52.Wales and south-west England, possibly a touch of frost. Move out

:21:53. > :21:56.towards the east a bit, it will be windy, but as all this engages with

:21:57. > :22:01.the cold air across Northern England, it will fall as snow and

:22:02. > :22:05.not necessarily just on high ground. It could affect you on your morning

:22:06. > :22:08.rush hour tomorrow. For Scotland and Northern Ireland, a cold night, a

:22:09. > :22:11.clear night and clear skies across the South East, but wherever you

:22:12. > :22:15.are, it will feel cold. The coldest place will be in the Highlands where

:22:16. > :22:19.we could see lows of minus ten Celsius. As we head on into

:22:20. > :22:22.tomorrow, we start off with that snow across Northern England, but

:22:23. > :22:27.through the course of the day, that snow level will rise into the hills.

:22:28. > :22:30.It is going to be wet across England and Wales at times. The driest

:22:31. > :22:33.conditions in Scotland and Northern Ireland, but here there will be a

:22:34. > :22:42.cold wind, Dan and Sal. It is 8.22am and you're watching BBC

:22:43. > :22:47.Breakfast. A two day debate at

:22:48. > :22:49.the Scottish Parliament will get underway later,

:22:50. > :22:52.as First Minister Nicola Sturgeon makes her case for a second

:22:53. > :22:53.independence referendum. The Scottish National Party leader

:22:54. > :22:56.will seek Holyrood's backing to ask Westminster for the power to hold

:22:57. > :22:58.another referendum, but the Prime Minister has

:22:59. > :23:01.said she will not agree And Lorna joins us

:23:02. > :23:15.now from Holyrood. It is bitterly cold in Edinburgh,

:23:16. > :23:19.but there will be a very heated debate in the Parliament. That

:23:20. > :23:23.debate gets underway later. It lasts two days. Nicola Sturgeon wants the

:23:24. > :23:27.Parliament here to back her request for a section 30 order to go forward

:23:28. > :23:32.to ask Westminster for this order which will give, which is what is

:23:33. > :23:39.needed to make a referendum legally binding. She wants Holyrood to have

:23:40. > :23:42.have the right to set the date and the franchise on any referendum, but

:23:43. > :23:47.theisticing point is the date. Theresa May, the Prime Minister,

:23:48. > :23:51.says not at this time. Opposition unionist parties also oppose the

:23:52. > :23:56.motion being put forward. They say a second independence referendum would

:23:57. > :24:01.be divisive and is not what the Scottish people want or need. The

:24:02. > :24:07.SNP are in a minority here at Holyrood, but with the Greens, this

:24:08. > :24:13.motion will likely pass and Nicola Sturgeon says that any move by the

:24:14. > :24:16.UK Government to block another independence referendum will be

:24:17. > :24:21.democratically indefensible if she wins the backing of MSPs this week.

:24:22. > :24:23.It is hard to see where this constitutional stand-off goes next.

:24:24. > :24:29.Lorna, thank you very much indeed. Many music fans know only too well

:24:30. > :24:34.the frustration of missing out Only to see them for sale online

:24:35. > :24:46.for several times more Today, the touts and websites blamed

:24:47. > :24:50.for so-called ticket abuse will come under scrutiny at the Culture,

:24:51. > :24:53.Media and Sport Committee. It comes a month after tickets

:24:54. > :24:55.for an Ed Sheeran charity gig Ed Sheeran's manager

:24:56. > :25:01.Stuart Camp joins us now Stewart good morning to you. That

:25:02. > :25:04.?5,000, that's the mark up from the top ticket was ?110? That's correct.

:25:05. > :25:11.That's mainly the reason I'm sitting here today. It was the outpouring of

:25:12. > :25:16.anger about that in particular which is seen as people taking money from

:25:17. > :25:19.dying kids hands. That's a charity show to raise funds and people are

:25:20. > :25:25.just taking advantage and it's something that needs to be

:25:26. > :25:29.controlled. How big an issue is this of the ticket selling market and

:25:30. > :25:35.what will you be telling the Select Committee today? We need to have

:25:36. > :25:39.greater transparency. We need there to be, the secondary market needs to

:25:40. > :25:42.make it clear it is the secondary market so people don't think they

:25:43. > :25:45.are buying the ticket from the original seller so they are aware

:25:46. > :25:49.there is a mark-up. Those tickets may not be genuine. At the moment

:25:50. > :25:52.they can hide behind certain things and it's not great and that's why

:25:53. > :25:58.there is confusion and anger. Don't they provide a service though these

:25:59. > :26:01.sites? The genuine Ed Sheeran fans who want to go and see a gig, if

:26:02. > :26:05.they're willing to pay that amount of money for a ticket, surely, it's

:26:06. > :26:10.supply and demand, isn't it? There is a case of supply and demand and

:26:11. > :26:13.I'm lucky as Ed Sheeran's manager I'm lucky with the demand is

:26:14. > :26:17.outstripping supply at the moment, however, the people that do this

:26:18. > :26:20.need to know that they are buying a genuine ticket. They need to know

:26:21. > :26:24.where the ticket is seated and feel safe in that transaction. But it is

:26:25. > :26:27.just too much money. It is just people making extreme profits from,

:26:28. > :26:32.it is coming out of our control which is not great. We have been

:26:33. > :26:35.squeezed for time today because of stories elsewhere, I'm sure you

:26:36. > :26:38.appreciate that. I want to ask you a question about Ed Sheeran being at

:26:39. > :26:44.Glastonbury this year. Can fans expect anything special from that

:26:45. > :26:47.set closing? Yes. I think they can. We're going to, it will be a

:26:48. > :26:50.different show to what we're doing on the tour and we're excited so

:26:51. > :26:54.there is lots of plans so it will be a good one. It will be a good one.

:26:55. > :27:00.Lots of plans. Thank you very much, Stewart. Thank you for your time.

:27:01. > :27:03.That was Ed Sheeran's manager talking about tickets being resold

:27:04. > :27:07.for huge amounts of money. You are watching Breakfast:

:27:08. > :27:09.We are reporting this morning the death of the former Deputy First

:27:10. > :27:12.Minister of Northern Ireland, Martin McGuinness. He died in the early

:27:13. > :27:15.hours of this morning at the age of 66. Much more on that coming up, but

:27:16. > :30:36.now, it Now though it's back

:30:37. > :30:39.to Sally and Dan. Hello, this is Breakfast

:30:40. > :30:50.with Dan Walker and Sally Nugent. The former Deputy First Minister

:30:51. > :30:56.of Northern Ireland Martin He had been diagnosed with a rare

:30:57. > :31:01.heart disease in December. A former member of the IRA's

:31:02. > :31:04.Army Council, Mr McGuiness became the chief negotiator in the Irish

:31:05. > :31:07.peace process for the Republican To paint a true picture

:31:08. > :31:15.of Martin McGuinness, He was a paramilitary

:31:16. > :31:22.who once embraced violence, but also a peacemaker who reached

:31:23. > :31:39.out to rivals, a man who could be Born in Londonderry,

:31:40. > :31:42.into a large Catholic family, Martin McGuinness came of age

:31:43. > :31:45.as Northern Ireland's In that time of violence,

:31:46. > :31:48.he joined the IRA, quickly Can you say whether the bombing is

:31:49. > :31:52.likely to stop in the near future, Well, I always take

:31:53. > :31:56.into consideration the appeals The 1970s saw him become one

:31:57. > :32:00.of the faces of ruthless Irish republicanism,

:32:01. > :32:02.and he was jailed for terrorist McGuinness has changed considerably

:32:03. > :32:09.from the young man who used to swagger around the no-go areas

:32:10. > :32:11.in Londonderry, as commander What had started as a fight

:32:12. > :32:21.for civil rights had Yet, alongside the many

:32:22. > :32:27.bombings and shootings, Martin McGuinness saw opportunities

:32:28. > :32:30.at the ballot box for Sinn Fein, the political

:32:31. > :32:32.party linked to the IRA. Even then, the language

:32:33. > :32:34.of threat remained. We don't believe that winning

:32:35. > :32:36.elections, and winning any amount of votes,

:32:37. > :32:38.will bring freedom in Ireland. At the end of the day,

:32:39. > :32:41.it will be the cutting edge of IRA But, after years of killings

:32:42. > :32:47.and chaos, in the 1990s, IRA ceasefires offered

:32:48. > :32:55.the opportunity for talks Not only would they shake

:32:56. > :33:03.hands, after the signing of the Good Friday Agreement,

:33:04. > :33:05.they joined each Eventually, at its head

:33:06. > :33:11.was the unlikely partnership of two former enemies,

:33:12. > :33:16.Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness. The firebrand unionist and radical

:33:17. > :33:21.republican became so close that they were nicknamed the Chuckle

:33:22. > :33:28.Brothers. There were republicans who continued

:33:29. > :33:31.to threaten that political progress. But, when a police officer

:33:32. > :33:34.was killed, the then-deputy first minister stood side-by-side

:33:35. > :33:36.with the chief constable to condemn They are traitors to

:33:37. > :33:42.the island of Ireland. Alongside the words,

:33:43. > :33:48.there were actions on all sides. The Queen's cousin Lord Mountbatten

:33:49. > :33:52.was killed by the IRA. Yet, after the Troubles,

:33:53. > :33:55.royal and republican were able Thank you very much,

:33:56. > :33:59.I am still alive! However, relationships at Stormont

:34:00. > :34:05.always seemed strained after Ian Paisley stepped down

:34:06. > :34:08.as First Minister, to be replaced by Peter Robinson,

:34:09. > :34:11.and then Arlene Foster. Earlier this year, with his

:34:12. > :34:15.ill-health by then obvious, Martin McGuinness walked out

:34:16. > :34:18.of government, amid a row between Sinn Fein and the DUP,

:34:19. > :34:23.the boy from Derry's Bogside retiring as deputy first minister

:34:24. > :34:25.after years in the IRA. I've been over 25 years working,

:34:26. > :34:34.building the peace. The past actions of the IRA

:34:35. > :34:42.will colour many people's views But, as a republican who worked

:34:43. > :34:45.towards reconciliation, he will be remembered as a key

:34:46. > :34:57.figure in changing Northern Ireland. A short time ago we had a statement

:34:58. > :35:00.from the Prime Minister, Theresa May. She has issued the following

:35:01. > :35:04.words after the death of Martin McGuinness. She says, first and

:35:05. > :35:09.foremost my thoughts are with the family of Martin McGuinness at this

:35:10. > :35:13.sad time. While I can never condone the path he took in the earlier part

:35:14. > :35:17.of his life Martin McGuinness ultimately played it defining role

:35:18. > :35:23.in leading the republican movement away from violence. In doing so, he

:35:24. > :35:26.made an essential and historic contribution to the extraordinary

:35:27. > :35:29.journey of Northern Ireland from conflict to peace. She went on to

:35:30. > :35:33.say that they certainly didn't always see eye to eye even in later

:35:34. > :35:38.years, as typically First Minister for many a decade he was one of the

:35:39. > :35:42.pioneers in implementing cross community power-sharing in Northern

:35:43. > :35:44.Ireland. He understood both its fragility and its precious

:35:45. > :35:48.significance and played a vital part in helping to find a way through

:35:49. > :35:52.many difficult moments. At the heart of it was his profound optimism for

:35:53. > :35:56.the future of Northern Ireland and, she says, I believe we should all

:35:57. > :36:02.hold fast to that optimism today. The words of Prime Minister Theresa

:36:03. > :36:06.May. We have spoken to several politicians this morning. Barely

:36:07. > :36:09.whispered to Ian Paisley Junior of the Democratic Unionist party, who

:36:10. > :36:15.said how he thinks Martin McGuinness will be remembered.

:36:16. > :36:22.When I was growing up he could literally struck terror into the

:36:23. > :36:25.hearts of many people. That moved from being the Godfather to the man

:36:26. > :36:29.in government. But remarkable journey is something which is

:36:30. > :36:33.incredibly important but must say, as a Christian, as a person who

:36:34. > :36:37.reflects on life, it is not how you start your life, what is important

:36:38. > :36:41.is how you finish your life. And I think that a lot of people, as I

:36:42. > :36:44.said before, a lot of people will be thankful that Martin McGuinness

:36:45. > :37:06.finished his life a lot better than it could have been.

:37:07. > :37:13.Professor Jon Tonge joins us now. I thought we had a generous tribute

:37:14. > :37:18.from Theresa May, highlighting much more his peacemaking role than his

:37:19. > :37:22.former paramilitary role. Martin McGuinness is one of the few people,

:37:23. > :37:26.along with Gerry Adams, who could have taken the IRA away from

:37:27. > :37:31.violence. Critics will of course say that he led them into violence at

:37:32. > :37:35.the start of the 70s but he worked hard with an almost fanatical

:37:36. > :37:38.commitment to peace at considerable risk to himself because many

:37:39. > :37:45.hard-core Republicans did not like the route he was going down with

:37:46. > :37:49.them. He believed in what he had done. He said he was very proud to

:37:50. > :37:54.have been a member of the IRA, he claimed at one point to have left in

:37:55. > :37:59.1974 although no one really believed in. He had a lot of military strikes

:38:00. > :38:03.within the IRA that never allowed him to move them to a position of

:38:04. > :38:07.peace. From the strategic point of view he did not want their campaign

:38:08. > :38:10.to end in failure, getting nothing so there was a logic to it, you

:38:11. > :38:13.wanted to build Sinn Fein as an electoral force a lovely generally

:38:14. > :38:17.also wanted peace in Northern Ireland. The fact is that Northern

:38:18. > :38:21.Ireland is a much better place today partly because of what Martin

:38:22. > :38:25.McGuinness did. He was so committed to peace he was ready to face down

:38:26. > :38:31.dissidents who didn't want to sign the Good Friday agreement. They were

:38:32. > :38:37.considerable achievements, where he took the movement politically. We

:38:38. > :38:40.had earlier from one contributor that it was incredible to think that

:38:41. > :38:44.a man with blood on his hands would be so pivotal to the peace process.

:38:45. > :38:47.We have seen pictures or morning of him meeting the Queen and talked

:38:48. > :38:53.about the significance of that moment. -- all morning. There are

:38:54. > :38:59.political figures who are as divisive, yet so pivotal as he.

:39:00. > :39:02.INAUDIBLE Elements to that, one com he was

:39:03. > :39:07.politically shrewd, you knew the movement needed to move towards

:39:08. > :39:10.peace and also he had huge personal charisma and given the problems

:39:11. > :39:14.since he stepped down we may come to look back on that period of the

:39:15. > :39:19.chuckle Brothers, Martin McGuinness and Ian Paisley Senior as a golden

:39:20. > :39:22.age of devolved power-sharing there. People would have thought you were

:39:23. > :39:26.mad if you had said that Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness would govern

:39:27. > :39:30.Northern Ireland. Proper height of the troubles that seemed ridiculous

:39:31. > :39:35.prospect. Not only did they govern, they did it well, it a good period

:39:36. > :39:41.for Northern Ireland because of his commitment to peace. Some words from

:39:42. > :39:47.North Norman Tebbit was wife was paralysed by a bomb after that hotel

:39:48. > :39:57.bombing, he said that he was a coward who posed as a man of peace

:39:58. > :40:01.once bitten. We have victims of the bombing who are extremely unhappy

:40:02. > :40:04.with Martin McGuinness, who never apologised for that, and the other

:40:05. > :40:09.hand you have people like the father of Colin Parry, the young boy who

:40:10. > :40:14.was killed in a bombing who are much more conciliatory. His legacy is

:40:15. > :40:18.divisive, some regard him as an unreconstructed paramilitary who

:40:19. > :40:22.never apologised for the IRA did and others recognised the role that you

:40:23. > :40:26.need the men of violence to steer movements towards peace. And both

:40:27. > :40:29.are correct in their own interpretations of what Martin

:40:30. > :40:33.McGuinness was about. Thank you for the moment. Maybe we will speak to

:40:34. > :40:37.you later on as well. Let's speak now to Colum Eastwood,

:40:38. > :40:40.the leader of the Social Democratic and Labour Party, who joins us

:40:41. > :40:50.on the phone from Derry That morning. Your memories of

:40:51. > :40:56.Martin McGuinness? Of course, Martin was on a journey. A very mixed one.

:40:57. > :41:00.It started in violence and ended as a real peacemaker. His legacy from

:41:01. > :41:05.the last 20 years of his life will be the most important, and the most

:41:06. > :41:10.remembered. He was able to move beyond the past, to move beyond the

:41:11. > :41:16.violence, and bring his people with him, and I think that is a legacy

:41:17. > :41:20.that is very important. He very much cared about the institutions of the

:41:21. > :41:26.peace process and struggled hard to ensure that they survived.

:41:27. > :41:31.Obviously, he was also involved in violence and I think that is a very

:41:32. > :41:35.real and difficult part of his past but he was capable of moving

:41:36. > :41:42.forward, of speaking beyond his base, and I think that is what will

:41:43. > :41:46.be remembered. Many people this morning are not able to move

:41:47. > :41:50.forward, not able to forget the images that we are seeing now of

:41:51. > :41:53.Martin McGuinness as a young man, living a very different life to the

:41:54. > :41:58.one that we saw many years later. What would you say to them about the

:41:59. > :42:04.journey that he took? I absolutely understand that. I come from a

:42:05. > :42:08.political party that is based on the principles of peace and partnership

:42:09. > :42:11.and Martin came from a different tradition but Martin did embrace

:42:12. > :42:15.those principles later in life and was able to drag people with him. He

:42:16. > :42:20.did not just embrace them, he fully embraced them in his life, and all

:42:21. > :42:30.of us who have difficulty with Martin's past have to try to

:42:31. > :42:34.remember that. I would not expect people who suffered very heavily

:42:35. > :42:38.from Ireland's past to do that but at this moment we must remember what

:42:39. > :42:44.Martin was and also where he ended up. And when he ended up was in a

:42:45. > :42:51.very positive place. I think that we have to view him in that way. We

:42:52. > :42:55.have seen many images of him in his later life, images of him shaking

:42:56. > :42:59.hands with the Queen. In later years what was his view on the

:43:00. > :43:03.establishment? In those famous moments that we have seen, Private

:43:04. > :43:08.moments with the Queen, how do you think that he viewed being a part of

:43:09. > :43:12.that establishment? Well, it's hard to tell. He was obviously an Irish

:43:13. > :43:17.republican, someone who believed very much in that. He and I were

:43:18. > :43:23.political opponents. Very ferocious political opponents at times! But we

:43:24. > :43:27.always had a very warm relationship. He was able to understand that

:43:28. > :43:33.Unionism cared very deeply about the royal family and things like that.

:43:34. > :43:37.He understood that as somebody who wanted to make peace and partner

:43:38. > :43:40.with Unionism, you had to reach out and meet people like the Queen. I

:43:41. > :43:47.think that was a very good thing to do. It was a very important thing to

:43:48. > :43:51.do. All of us in politics in Northern Ireland need to understand

:43:52. > :43:54.that the symbolism was important and maybe embracing symbols that we do

:43:55. > :43:58.not agree with his important as well, and we all have to make moves

:43:59. > :44:00.to reconcile with our neighbours, and Martin, in his later years, was

:44:01. > :44:21.very good at that. Colum Eastwood SDLP leader, thank

:44:22. > :44:26.you. Let's find out what's happening with the weather. Good morning.

:44:27. > :44:31.Today, simply, sunshine and showers, some of the show was a wintry, some

:44:32. > :44:35.places will see snow at lower levels, especially across Northern

:44:36. > :44:40.Ireland and Scotland. No surprise that we have temperatures of two

:44:41. > :44:46.Celsius. Northern England, a little snow, but further south we have five

:44:47. > :44:50.and six Celsius, less cold, although compared to yesterday it will feel

:44:51. > :44:54.cold. Yesterday we reached double digits. We have been watching the

:44:55. > :44:58.snow falling through the course of the night across Northern Ireland

:44:59. > :45:01.and Scotland. We've also had some across northern England, parts of

:45:02. > :45:05.Wales and south-west England, as we go through today, we will find that

:45:06. > :45:09.increasingly the snow will retreat to the hills, at lower levels we

:45:10. > :45:16.could see wintry showers, that means a mixture of rain, sleet and maybe a

:45:17. > :45:21.rumble of thunder. Gusty winds, away from all of that, some sunshine

:45:22. > :45:24.although it will feel nippy. By the afternoon and that the system coming

:45:25. > :45:27.in across the south-west will bring thicker cloud, stronger winds and

:45:28. > :45:31.some rain with a gain a wintry flavour on the hills. That will

:45:32. > :45:36.extend through Pembrokeshire, the rest of Wales at this stage still

:45:37. > :45:40.mostly dry, club starting to build. For Northern Ireland a mixture of

:45:41. > :45:48.sunshine and showers, a wintry mix in there, and across Scotland, in

:45:49. > :45:51.between there will be sunshine, if you are in the wind it will feel

:45:52. > :45:54.cold, and as we come across northern England still some winter and is in

:45:55. > :45:58.those showers although for we miss that and it should stay dry. Through

:45:59. > :46:02.East Anglia and the Midlands and towards Kent and the London area and

:46:03. > :46:06.Hampshire, largely dry with just a few showers. Through the evening and

:46:07. > :46:10.overnight, rain with some snow on the higher rates of Wales. That

:46:11. > :46:13.might affect journeys in the morning. This risk of ice means we

:46:14. > :46:19.could see frost across South East England. Windy around this area as

:46:20. > :46:23.it moves north and as it does so engages with the cold air, snow

:46:24. > :46:27.should readily follow on higher ground, although by no means

:46:28. > :46:32.exclusively, it could well affect the rush hour tomorrow. Scotland and

:46:33. > :46:37.Northern Ireland under clearer skies, cool, temperatures could fall

:46:38. > :46:41.to -10 in parts of the Highlands and in the south-east we are looking at

:46:42. > :46:45.a chilly five Celsius in London to start tomorrow. We start tomorrow

:46:46. > :46:49.with snow in a possible than England, like today that will

:46:50. > :46:54.retreat into the hills and you might in some of the heavy bursts see a

:46:55. > :46:58.wintry mix but for most of England and also Wales it will be rain and

:46:59. > :47:02.there should be brighter spells in the south. For Scotland and Northern

:47:03. > :47:07.Ireland largely dry, the odd shower again, look at this wind, coming in

:47:08. > :47:11.from the north-east and the North, the cold North Sea is that will

:47:12. > :47:16.exacerbate the cold feel. As we head into Thursday, more rain at times

:47:17. > :47:20.across England and Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland, some drier and

:47:21. > :47:24.brighter, that leads to a more settled weekend with the recovery in

:47:25. > :47:31.the temperatures in the south. That is good to hear, thank you, Carol.

:47:32. > :47:36.We have had to change our programme around to reflect the breaking news

:47:37. > :47:40.of the death of Martin McGuinness at 66.

:47:41. > :47:46.There were a number of stories we wanted to bring do, and we will

:47:47. > :47:50.bring you one of them now, because it is important to quite a few of

:47:51. > :47:54.our viewers. But we talk about autism, so many people get in touch

:47:55. > :47:59.to thank us, and they say it is important to them, and we would like

:48:00. > :48:05.to reflect that. Around one in a hundred people are

:48:06. > :48:10.on the autistic spectrum, included an estimated 140,000 children in the

:48:11. > :48:14.UK alone. It is not always easy to explain.

:48:15. > :48:17.It is something the programme makers at Sesame Street are helping with,

:48:18. > :48:24.they are introducing a new character, a shy four-year-old. She

:48:25. > :48:32.also has autism. Let's take a look at her in action.

:48:33. > :48:42.Hello, Julia! You seem excited! Play, play! Watch Albee play?

:48:43. > :48:48.Kickball? Maybe not. How about hide and seek? It is OK! Sometimes

:48:49. > :48:57.friends like different things, so it can be hard to figure out what to

:48:58. > :49:02.play together. Play, play! It helps to find something you both like to

:49:03. > :49:15.do. Julio, you like to slap your arms! And I like to flat my wings!

:49:16. > :49:24.Fly! Butterfly! We both like butterflies! Butterfly, butterfly,

:49:25. > :49:31.play butterfly! That is a good idea, we can pretend to be butterflies!

:49:32. > :49:40.This is a great way to play! I agree! Her property adjoins us

:49:41. > :49:50.from New York. And the control of CBBC is here.

:49:51. > :49:57.I am up for a midnight snack! How did you first hear from Sesame

:49:58. > :50:04.Street that they might want you to be involved? I first got an e-mail a

:50:05. > :50:08.little bit more than a year ago, saying that they were seeking a

:50:09. > :50:14.puppeteer who had experience with autism, and they asked me to submit

:50:15. > :50:22.a video. You have particular experience, if you could share with

:50:23. > :50:27.us what that is? I started off as a habit for kids with autism, and I

:50:28. > :50:33.left that job to have my own child, who was later diagnosed with autism.

:50:34. > :50:37.You bring your own experience to this, what have you been able to

:50:38. > :50:40.share with the makers of Sesame Street about the special things you

:50:41. > :50:50.might need to bring to this character? The Sesame Street team

:50:51. > :50:57.has so many people who know so much already. They had 14 different

:50:58. > :51:06.autism organisations that they consulted with, which was fabulous.

:51:07. > :51:14.I really brought to them my heart, and I bring to Julia my experiences

:51:15. > :51:18.with my son and the kids I have worked with. We cannot get the

:51:19. > :51:27.current series in the UK, but many children watch CBeebies. Is this an

:51:28. > :51:29.important step forward for showing children who are having conditions

:51:30. > :51:35.like this in a programme like Sesame Street? It is brilliant, it is all

:51:36. > :51:43.about being inclusive. She is bringing her experience, and that it

:51:44. > :51:49.what it needs. CBeebies are planning a series called Pablo, can you

:51:50. > :51:53.explain about that? Pablo is a five and a half year old boy on the

:51:54. > :51:58.autistic spectrum, the show starts with him live-action, a challenging

:51:59. > :52:03.situation which makes him anxious, because that is a challenge for

:52:04. > :52:07.children on the autistic spectrum, and he draws himself into his own

:52:08. > :52:16.animated world, where he creates characters and friends, and together

:52:17. > :52:21.they face the challenge and get through this situation. They go on

:52:22. > :52:27.an adventure, and the characters exhibit traits across the spectrum.

:52:28. > :52:29.You cannot cover everything, but it is about reflecting their

:52:30. > :52:34.experiences back to themselves, so they see themselves and the

:52:35. > :52:39.audience, I hope, will be more understanding and supportive. That

:52:40. > :52:44.is coming up later in the year. We do have a clip of it. A snippet from

:52:45. > :52:56.the forthcoming series of Pablo. Mouse. Where is the list? Mouse

:52:57. > :53:04.cannot find the list. We do not need a list, we can just choose. No, no,

:53:05. > :53:11.no. We need a list. We have to have a list. There are too many things!

:53:12. > :53:18.There is not enough space in the trolley or the cupboards! Too many

:53:19. > :53:24.things, too many things! I still do not think we need a list. We do, we

:53:25. > :53:31.have defined the list of mouse. I hope you could hear some of that,

:53:32. > :53:35.that is our own version. How would a series like Pablo or the character

:53:36. > :53:43.like the one you are working with in Sesame Street, how would that have

:53:44. > :53:48.helped you and your family? I keep saying that I really wish this had

:53:49. > :53:54.been on when my son was little. If for nothing else, the kids that he

:53:55. > :54:03.goes to school with would have been able to see what his characteristics

:54:04. > :54:07.were like, so that if he had had a difficult time that day, they might

:54:08. > :54:16.not be worried that he was angry with them, or scared of him crying.

:54:17. > :54:26.The great thing about the Sesame Street episode is they are modelling

:54:27. > :54:32.inclusion. It is beautiful. How exciting is it to work on Sesame

:54:33. > :54:44.Street? The most exciting thing I have ever done! Legends, all of

:54:45. > :54:46.them. It is essential, not only for

:54:47. > :54:51.children and Families Bill suffering with autism, but also for those who

:54:52. > :54:54.are not, to get a better understanding of what it is like,

:54:55. > :54:59.and how they can interact with children who are on the spectrum.

:55:00. > :55:05.All of the things you see, they have come from children in the community.

:55:06. > :55:09.The head writer worked with a lot of the children and young people, they

:55:10. > :55:16.contributed to the storylines. Some of the older members of the cast,

:55:17. > :55:20.every member of the cast is children on the spectrum, which is wonderful

:55:21. > :55:24.and authentic, and empowering, because they see themselves

:55:25. > :55:28.reflected back. It is also about making sure that people gain a

:55:29. > :55:31.greater understanding, so that people can be less judgmental than

:55:32. > :55:38.they might be. What they have done on Sesame Street and on Pablo is

:55:39. > :55:48.marvellously inclusive, and that is what we want to be.

:55:49. > :55:55.The main story. The former Deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland

:55:56. > :55:58.Martin McGuinness has died at the age of 66. He had been diagnosed

:55:59. > :56:04.with a heart disease in December. Earlier, we spoke to Colin Parry,

:56:05. > :56:11.who has met him a number of times. His son was killed in the IRA bomb

:56:12. > :56:14.in Warrington in 1993. Since then he set up a peace centre but says the

:56:15. > :56:27.giving Martin McGuinness' called. I do not forgive him or the IRA. But

:56:28. > :56:33.something that aside, I found him and easy and pleasant man to talk

:56:34. > :56:36.to. I believe he was sincere in his desire for maintaining the peace

:56:37. > :56:42.process. He deserves great credit for his most recent life, rather

:56:43. > :56:47.than his earlier life. Nothing in his recent life can atone for that.

:56:48. > :56:53.But he was brave and he put himself at some risk in Northern Ireland.

:56:54. > :57:04.He said forgiveness was not possible for him.

:57:05. > :57:11.Some really strong opinions coming out on the life and career of Martin

:57:12. > :57:15.McGuinness, as I am sure you can appreciate. Norman Tebbit called him

:57:16. > :57:21.a coward, I read out your earlier response, saying that the Martin

:57:22. > :57:26.McGuinness you knew was a great guy. People will struggle with what he

:57:27. > :57:31.did in his past, but also will see him for the man was at the centre of

:57:32. > :57:35.those peace negotiations. If you are Norman Tebbit and you were there

:57:36. > :57:40.when the IRA bomb ripped through the grand Hotel and left your wife in a

:57:41. > :57:47.wheelchair for the rest of her life, I can see it would be very hard. I

:57:48. > :57:52.did not know him as the terrorist, I knew him as the guy who came into

:57:53. > :57:58.Downing Street and led the Sinn Fein negotiating team that took us to a

:57:59. > :58:05.very different place. Along the way I saw some body who was very warm,

:58:06. > :58:08.human and likeable. It is extraordinary, speaking to Ian

:58:09. > :58:13.Paisley Jr, he said, here is a man who was the godfather of the IRA and

:58:14. > :58:18.went into Government, from pal and military to Parliament. There are

:58:19. > :58:23.very few figures who could do that and be so crucial to the peace that

:58:24. > :58:28.we now see in Northern Ireland. And he was very worried about peace,

:58:29. > :58:32.because of the implications of what is happening in politics now. What

:58:33. > :58:37.was extraordinary about the journey, it was not just him, it was the fact

:58:38. > :58:44.that he and Gerry Adams were leading a movement. Often, during those

:58:45. > :58:48.negotiations, you might think you know what is going on, but we did

:58:49. > :58:54.not know what was going on in the background. They would disappear for

:58:55. > :58:57.days without their phones and vanish and go and talk to the people they

:58:58. > :59:02.needed to talk to, and we would get exasperated, and Tony Blair once

:59:03. > :59:07.said, this is all difficult and risky politically for us, but for

:59:08. > :59:10.those guys, they are operating on the not inconsiderable risk that

:59:11. > :59:18.somebody will take them out just for talking to us. I understand why

:59:19. > :59:21.politicians call terrorists coward, but when they take the different

:59:22. > :59:29.path that Martin McGuinness decided to take, you have to salute their

:59:30. > :59:34.courage in doing that as well. In ten, 15, 20 years, when we are

:59:35. > :59:37.judging his political legacy, it is safe to say that people will

:59:38. > :59:43.disagree on what that legacy is, because of the fact that he has been

:59:44. > :59:50.such a divisive figure. Of course. But I think his legacy depends on

:59:51. > :59:55.what happens now. I know this from talking to him, he was really

:59:56. > :00:00.worried about the implications of Brexit, and if the peace process.

:00:01. > :00:05.Art, and if we go back to the sort of trouble that we grew up with and

:00:06. > :00:13.our generation remembers vividly, the legacy clearly becomes weakened.

:00:14. > :00:15.This is a day to reflect on the progress that has been made and make

:00:16. > :00:19.sure that we do not do the things that push it back into a very

:00:20. > :00:33.dangerous scenario. Alistair Campbell reflects on the

:00:34. > :00:36.news, Martin McGuinness passed away this morning aged 66 surrounded by

:00:37. > :02:13.his family in hospital. It is this morning aged 66 surrounded by

:02:14. > :02:18.yesterday with a top temperature of 12 Celsius. That's it for this

:02:19. > :02:28.morning, I will be back at 1:30pm with the lunchtime news. Goodbye.

:02:29. > :02:30.Good morning. Our next guest is an Iraqi Kurd

:02:31. > :02:40.who had to flee her home aged five She was able to develop a passion

:02:41. > :02:46.for performing carving out a career as a singer and TV presenter. Her

:02:47. > :02:50.experience has never left. She has set up her own charity to help other

:02:51. > :02:53.children affected by conflict. We will talk to her in a moment, let's

:02:54. > :03:11.take a look at her new single. # Don't you know love, love wins

:03:12. > :03:15.# Yeah every time # Don't you know, love wins

:03:16. > :03:43.# Yeah, every time #. # Every time

:03:44. > :03:49.# Yeah, every time #. We are delighted to say that Dashni

:03:50. > :03:55.is with us in the studio. First of all, you look amazing. Beautiful.

:03:56. > :04:00.Explain this outfit? It is Kurdish traditional wear. And today is the

:04:01. > :04:06.first day of spring but it's also the Kurdish New Year. So happy

:04:07. > :04:10.Kurdish New Year to you. And we were very colourful dresses and we go to

:04:11. > :04:17.the mountains and we have a picnic and we dance and eat,... Sounds

:04:18. > :04:20.perfect! What I love about your story is that you are proud of your

:04:21. > :04:24.past even though it was a difficult journey through your early life.

:04:25. > :04:30.Just explain what it was like for you growing up in Kurdistan, what

:04:31. > :04:34.did you go through in your early years? I think that, my earliest

:04:35. > :04:41.memories are of war and you don't want that for any child. I remember

:04:42. > :04:47.when I was five and we had to flee towards the border with Iran, it was

:04:48. > :04:52.not like now we'll have refugee camps, and you have a whole base

:04:53. > :04:56.were you even have schools and child friendly places. It was a mountain

:04:57. > :05:02.scattered with people. It was pretty scary. And you had to leave in a

:05:03. > :05:06.rush. I forgot my dolls and I was very sad about that. I remember I

:05:07. > :05:12.was running behind helicopters to catch food. That was my task is a

:05:13. > :05:15.little girl. One of the reasons that I was able to survive because

:05:16. > :05:23.thousands of people died from cold and hunger, because there was this

:05:24. > :05:28.peace concert in the UK. And because people believed in giving and caring

:05:29. > :05:35.and that humanitarian spirit, I am able to city and tell my story that

:05:36. > :05:38.I am not just someone who was fed and clothed. But my teacher in

:05:39. > :05:43.Holland who looked exactly like the dolls I had forgotten at home, she

:05:44. > :05:46.gave me hopes and dreams and she fed my ambitions and that's what I want

:05:47. > :05:52.to do with the kids, what if we fed their ambitions, they might turn out

:05:53. > :05:57.to be the next person who comes up with a great idea. How are you

:05:58. > :06:07.giving back? With my foundation that we founded in 2012, particularly

:06:08. > :06:12.working with schools, we changed our focus to work in the camps by

:06:13. > :06:25.setting up libraries. So these kids can escape the horror and trauma.

:06:26. > :06:31.They might be nerds or just enjoy books! You are busy with TV work and

:06:32. > :06:37.presenting. I have not done TV work in six years! Still a presenter. How

:06:38. > :06:40.do you maintain that positive outlook and determination to make a

:06:41. > :06:44.difference when many people watching might think, with what you have been

:06:45. > :06:47.through, and your family, and the history of your country, you might

:06:48. > :06:53.just want to sit down and bury your head in the sand and complain about

:06:54. > :06:58.the life you've had. I think that growing up in a small village in the

:06:59. > :07:01.Netherlands affected me. I was embraced by Dutch society and

:07:02. > :07:10.culture in the village. I truly believe that if we all unite and our

:07:11. > :07:16.voices are together we can have an impact, today, I am calling upon

:07:17. > :07:18.everyone at home to unite together so hopefully the international

:07:19. > :07:25.community can put an end to this misery, this six-year ongoing war in

:07:26. > :07:28.Syria and Iraq and Kurdistan, as we speak, there are children at the

:07:29. > :07:35.moment who might be injured or bombed, what if that child was your

:07:36. > :07:40.child, or your neighbour's child, would we then be more active? I am

:07:41. > :07:44.not here to blame, but to say that, I always say that I'm not a strong

:07:45. > :07:51.vocalist but one I put my friends voices on I feel so powerful. If we

:07:52. > :07:55.all believe in our voices together and come together, maybe the

:07:56. > :07:59.international community will get together around a table instead of

:08:00. > :08:04.just blaming one another for what is happening. It is the worst

:08:05. > :08:10.humanitarian crisis at the moment, and we can no longer ignore the

:08:11. > :08:14.situation or distance ourselves. No matter how big we build walls, the

:08:15. > :08:23.people were run. Do you ever look back on the journey that Dan just

:08:24. > :08:27.talked about, how your dad had to leave you and find a place, do you

:08:28. > :08:31.ever think, I was one of the incredibly lucky ones? I was. My

:08:32. > :08:35.father went through the same journey that people are doing now. They risk

:08:36. > :08:41.their lives to cross waters from Turkey to Greece. He did that seven

:08:42. > :08:46.times. To look back, I know that my father would not harm anyone. He

:08:47. > :08:51.just wanted a safe, Sequoia Place for is children and to give me a

:08:52. > :08:56.chance for education. It is -- safe, secure place for his children. It is

:08:57. > :09:00.so sad what families go through. I am not here to say, let's have

:09:01. > :09:05.everyone over to the west. It is about how, we need to fix things. We

:09:06. > :09:12.are all connected. If we are sitting here and someone is suffering we can

:09:13. > :09:15.be not 100% happy. I feel that I was lucky, I was given hope and

:09:16. > :09:24.ambitions and dreams and I hope today that I can pass on a bit of

:09:25. > :09:30.that positive life. Too much! Nothing wrong with too much yellow.

:09:31. > :09:33.How will you celebrate the festival? My aunt lives in Manchester so I

:09:34. > :09:40.will go there and have a massive meal and there will be fire and

:09:41. > :09:45.jumping around via! Enjoy your day and be careful with those long

:09:46. > :09:53.sleeves in the fire. Towel as how you would say happy New Year again?

:09:54. > :09:55.Thank you so much for coming in. Thank you for having me.

:09:56. > :10:06.It's just coming up to ten minutes past nine o'clock. A reminder of the

:10:07. > :10:10.breaking news who brought you a couple of hours ago. The main story

:10:11. > :10:12.this morning, the death of the former dignity First Minister of

:10:13. > :10:17.Northern Ireland, Martin McGuinness. He died in the early hours of this

:10:18. > :10:21.morning at a hospital in Derry with his family by his bedside -- the

:10:22. > :10:29.former Deputy First Minister. We have had many opinions from

:10:30. > :10:33.ministers and from our viewers, he was very much a polarising

:10:34. > :10:38.individual but a pivotal politician in Northern Ireland. Let's get a

:10:39. > :10:48.summary of his life and career and his legacy from Jon Tonge, professor

:10:49. > :10:53.of politics at Liverpool University. Jon, we talked to Alistair Campbell,

:10:54. > :10:58.who says that the legacy is what happens from this point. Quite a

:10:59. > :11:01.powerful argument. Think the legacy will be positive, Northern Ireland

:11:02. > :11:05.is a better place now, and he was instrumental in helping deliver that

:11:06. > :11:08.piece. Of course some families will say that he was involved in the

:11:09. > :11:13.violence much about have happened. The second part of his career was

:11:14. > :11:17.more positive in leading the IRA towards peace. And the simple fact

:11:18. > :11:22.is that you need a hard man in an organisation to deliver peace. Many

:11:23. > :11:26.people have got hard man, what kind of a politician was he? Quite astute

:11:27. > :11:30.because he recognised that Sinn Fein could achieve much more through the

:11:31. > :11:36.ballot box than through the bullet. It took the IRA a long time to

:11:37. > :11:39.recognise that lesson but it was clear. And there were great personal

:11:40. > :11:44.risks to Martin McGuinness in leading the IRA in this direction,

:11:45. > :11:48.when there were cities like Manchester being bombed the IRA was

:11:49. > :11:51.almost evenly divided as to whether they should move towards peace and

:11:52. > :11:55.it was probably he who led them to peace and he was a tough negotiator

:11:56. > :11:59.with people like Alistair Campbell and Tony Blair and Jonathan Powell.

:12:00. > :12:04.He was astute politically and Sinn Fein has risen as a force because of

:12:05. > :12:08.what Martin McGuinness did. Huge range of opinions this morning. Many

:12:09. > :12:11.reflect on the politician that he became the centre of the peace

:12:12. > :12:16.process, others said that they can and never will forget the leader of

:12:17. > :12:20.the IRA that he was when he was younger. Or no one believed Martin

:12:21. > :12:26.McGuinness when he said he had left the IRA in 1974. It was a reasonable

:12:27. > :12:30.claim and didn't hold water. He may not have been in charge but was

:12:31. > :12:35.clearly a senior figure. He learned from the African National Congress

:12:36. > :12:38.and Nelson Mandela. He learned the value of negotiation. He realised

:12:39. > :12:43.the IRA needed to move away from a fixation with violence, however many

:12:44. > :12:47.English cities you blew up, however many bombs you planted, you're never

:12:48. > :12:52.going to achieve the aims of the movement through violence alone. So

:12:53. > :12:56.he learned lessons and it was a remarkable transformation, one of

:12:57. > :13:00.the most jaw-dropping moments in UK politics was the relationship with

:13:01. > :13:05.Ian Paisley and meeting the Queen. Remarkable scenes. Images we have

:13:06. > :13:08.played several times on the programme today. Jon Tonge, thank

:13:09. > :13:14.you for joining us to reflect on the death of Martin McGuinness.

:13:15. > :13:19.That's just about it from us today. Much more reaction to the death of

:13:20. > :13:25.Martin McGuinness on the BBC News Channel. We believe you with the

:13:26. > :13:30.words of someone whose wife was killed by a bombing on the Shankill

:13:31. > :13:33.Road, he contacted us to say that Martin McGuinness's finger prints

:13:34. > :13:35.were all over the troubles but also all over the peace process. We will

:13:36. > :13:51.see you tomorrow. Goodbye. He believes himself to be

:13:52. > :13:54.your equal. We would have no quarrel

:13:55. > :13:56.with Aelfric. I need 200 Christian men

:13:57. > :14:00.of Bebbanburg.