Viggo Mortensen - Actor HARDtalk

Welcome to HARDtalk with me, Zeinab Badawi.

The award-winning film star Viggo Mortensen is here in London

for the release of his new film, the Two Faces of January.

He is not your average Hollywood leading man.

He is fluent in four languages, was raised in three continents and is of

So what does he say to critics who argue that the American movie

industry has contributed to the Hollywoodisation of global culture?

Viggo Mortensen, welcome to HARDtalk.

Thank you. It's nice to be here.

You've been pretty well known now for lots of fans as Aragorn in Lord

of the Rings, but you were a bit ambivalent about

It was sort of a last-minute decision.

I had to travel the next day or two days later

The other actors had been there for quite a while rehearsing.

It didn't seem like a practical thing.

I thought that they should find someone else who was

It was your son who said to you, please.

I was on the phone saying, I don't think I'm the man for the job.

And he said, what are you talking about?

And he said it was a very good idea, you should do this.

I might have decided to anyway, because it was an intriguing offer,

But since the Lord of the Rings, you have steered clear of the big

Hollywood blockbusters in favour of more gritty roles like History

Are you more comfortable in such movies?

I'm not really conscious of choosing big budget studio movies over

I felt that, as big an enterprise as it turned out to be, the Lord of

And as an actor, once you're there working on a set with a crew,

it doesn't matter if it's a crew of hundreds or a crew of nine.

Your relationship with the camera is the same.

You won the best actor Oscar nomination for your role in

Eastern Promises, which excited legions of female fans

because of the nude scene fighting that you had in a sauna, I think.

Is sex appeal an important part of your success?

I will leave that to others to decide.

There has to be some sort of attraction, I suppose.

Not always, but a certain kind of connection, anyway, that

the audience feels with the people on screen, I understand that.

I understand that movies are often sold to some degree or another

I'm probably not the right person to ask.

The role on the movie that is coming out now, the Two Faces of January,

is a man who seems very elegant, very put together, and then he

rapidly starts behaving in ways that are embarrassing to watch.

I'm not afraid of going to wherever the character asks me

and the director to go, which is sometimes unattractive, physically

I will ask you about your movie, two Faces of January, in a moment.

But just picking up this thing about sex appeal.

We often think that the pressure, or at least women are required to

perhaps take part sometimes in nude scenes as part

of a movie's appeal, but for good-looking men, is that also

I've never noticed it being the case.

The movie you are referring to, Eastern Promises, there was a scene

written where I am attacked by two men with knives and a bathhouse.

In a bathhouse you don't normally wear a suit and tie. So it seemed

I didn't really think about it that much, and it worked.

Your latest film, but two Faces of January, based on the novel

by Patricia Highsmith, you star opposite Kirsten Dunst, and it is a

director or debut for the acclaimed screenplay writer Hossein Amini.

Was that a bit of a risk, perhaps, taking part in a film where you

You know, looking back, I have worked with quite

a few first-time directors, men and women, and there is always

something that is exciting about it, because it is their first try.

There is something very pure about the connection

between their intentions and their dreams of what it would be

like to tell a particular story, and the way they go about it.

On the other hand, especially if it is a writer/director,

in this case Hoss had written the play and was also directing it,

they can be very defensive about making any changes to the script or

One of the reasons that the movie doesn't at all look

like a first-time director's job, it is very subtle, very poised, a very

intelligent because Hoss himself would be on the set and would say,

it is well-written, it works, but seeing guys reverse it, I think that

So he was very humble about it as a writer, which was also intelligent.

It is set in the early 1960s, and it starts off with you and your wife,

played by Kirsten Dunst, looking at the archaeological sites in Greece.

Has it turned out to be a good movie?

It is one of those movies that you sometimes see later night on TV on a

film retrospective, a thriller, film nor are tight movie from the 50s or

the early 60s that are beautiful, and you look at the people and the

way they are dressed, and the cleverness of the dialogue,

and the locations, and you think, it would be nice to be there.

But I also have to say that even reading the script,

in terms of the historical moment, I thought it was really

interesting, too, because 1962, you see the Gatsby-esque cover...

He plays the part of the local Greek guide.

He speaks Greek fluently, and it turns out he is American, he is very

And he is also as it turns out a bit of a con man himself.

Typical Highsmith characters, very tricky.

But what historically I liked is that in 1962, Americans travel in

Europe, there were still a certain amount of goodwill towards them.

There was that post-World War II glow.

They were forgiven, even if they were considered to be

They were sort of still considered sort of the good guys.

Because you are half Danish, half American.

Your father is Danish, your mother is American.

Do you see that now with Americans being unpopular with Europeans?

Yes, I think Americans, unless they are completely blinkered,

realise that things are not the same, if they think about it.

I am talking about Americans, not younger people, because they

may believe aren't aware of that historical change, but anybody who

is older than 30, 35, I don't know, probably has some awareness of how

different things are now in terms of their is still a fair amount

different things are now in terms of there is still a fair amount

of goodwill, but it is nothing like it used to be, and fair enough.

In conservative circles in the United States, you still have

politicians and commentaries talking about essentially that Americans are

the chosen people, or American exceptionalism, and that was

something that was not only Americans felt after World War II

and into the early 60s, but other people thought that about Americans,

Where do you think that comes from, though?

Would you describe it as an animosity between the Americans

I think it comes from being an empire.

The British did the same thing, the Spanish to the same thing,

The British did the same thing, the Spanish did the same thing,

It is a thing that any country that has that much power, they tend to

think that they are unique and better than other countries.

Yes, because you are half Danish, half American?

No. I like flags, the flag of my favourite football

Even on a movie shoot, I tend to have a flag of my favourite hockey

team, football team, the Danish flag, the British flag.

But I do think that in general, nationalism is a useless thing,

a vile, destructive thing, and it doesn't help.

I feel a certain amount of concern, let's say, if we go back to

the years when the problems that arose as a result of the cartoons

of the Danish newspapers, depicting the Prophet Muhammad.

I am all for freedom of expression, but it was something that on a

practical level, I was like, having a Danish passport is not a free pass

It is probably as dangerous to have one as it is to have an American one

Little things like that can change the fate of nations, you know?

Looking at the movie that has just come out, the two Faces of January,

you said you were happy with it, but I have to put it to you that some

Indie Wire described it as a complete disappointment.

Scotland on Sunday newspaper said the characters are too steeped

in quality to offer visceral thrills or sensual pleasures.

Just generally speaking, is it upsetting for an actor

like you to get a review that is ambivalent like that?

I will point out for the benefit of the audience members that

by far the vast majority of reviews we got have been outstanding.

I understand, just so you are clear, the point seems to be,

Not to paint the movie as getting bad reviews, because

I would rather they give only good reviews

But I don't think any movie, no matter how well it is,

ever gets across the board 100% excellent reviews.

But you have been associated with a lot of films

which might be described as Indy, more arty, ?90% of the time I'll

end up in low-budget movies that are difficult to finance and often

There's a good movie for you, something which isn't necessarily

going to be commercially successful, make lots of money?

No, there are big movies that are really well made.

But the more money that?s involved in a

movie, the less that the film-makers , the producers and financiers are

going to want to stray away from something that's tried and true

So, it's unusual to see a truly original movie that's expensive.

That doesn't mean all independent movies are better.

I think the same is true for independents, there are some

Every year most of the scripts I read and most

of the movies that have been made since the start of movies have been

Do you feel under pressure to take up roles that people judge in

the industry, judge will have huge commercial success and make money?

No maybe if I was cleverer about my career at a business level

, I might try to find a way to do bigger budget movies.

But honestly, I don't really have a plan to shy

away from any kind of movie, neither genre or size of budget.

If you?d asked me two years ago would I have done a movie

which we were speaking about before, where I speak French and Arabic.

I wouldn't have expected that I would have been interested

in doing it necessarily, or that anybody would want me to do it.

But things happen and it happens to be a great story.

And The Two Faces of January, when I read the script.

It was a really fine script and as I was saying before, this could be one

of those classic thriller movies, but it's going to be difficult.

Especially with a first-time director to get it

financed and when I said yes to him, it wasn't overnight, it took three

years before we were shooting, to get the money together.

I put these questions to you because you are quoted as saying, "sometimes

I look at a movie and I can see that the actor or actress said,

I'm taking this on board because I'm making a tonne of money and not

because it's going to be something special.? it sounds as

it's not a criticism to say that, it is a business choice you make.

If I was broke and had to pay for, I don't know , an expensive operation

in a hospital for myself or someone in my family and there was no other

way, I would take the first thing I could get that paid the most.

The money is important to you, isn't it? No, as long as I can afford to

wait and live a bit more carefully and economically for a story that I

really love and think it is a challenge, I will wait. But you have

made a lot of money. You have founded Perceval press in Los

Angeles which specialises in art books and poetry, you could not have

done that if you have not had the money from Lord Of The Rings. And

also, even if I had not done the three movies with David Cronenberg,

I wouldn't have had a producer who would say, we will let you do it.

Would you reconsider the comment you made about some people just doing it

for the money? Reconsider in what sense? That it's OK if money is a

motivator? No, I said it is not a criticism, it is a business choice.

I am not saying it is neither positive nor negative. I can see

what they did. It is not what I am inclined to do. But if I needed to

do it, I wouldn't have a problem doing it. My basic approach is,

let's say I have a choice and there is two movies, I want to do the

movie I want to see now, a year from now, 20 years from now. Do you feel

that you would like to make a movie which is because you are political,

about a political issue? We have just seen Tom Hanks star in Captain

Phillips and Matt Damon has just made a film about fracking. Is that

something you would consider? I think the best movies in a sense are

stories that are thought-provoking, that get people to think differently

about their empire and political system. All the way things are going

in the world. For example, the movie are referred to in which I speak

French and Arabic is a movie in which I play a professor in Algeria

who is born there. He is of Spanish descent, grew up speaking French and

Arabic. It is 1954, the war of independence of Algeria is just

starting. He has a prisoner who is interesting to him who is an Arab

and it is a story about these two men. It sounds in principle like it

is going to be yet another very political, ideological on why sat at

-- on one side or another. A movie about the Algerian war. It is

completely not ideological. It is a beautiful story between these two

men. But it makes you think about the situation, from point point of

view. Those are the stories, I don't like overtly ideological movies. I

find them boring and not useful politically. Because you are only

convincing the people who are already agreeing with you. What do

you say to Europeans who feel that Hollywood arts if I can use that

word, of global culture works against diversity in the arts? I

will give you this quote from the president of the Polish film Academy

producer, " the Americans wanted to do away with the European protection

system. Polish language cinema is part of our national identity and

culture and not a commercial commodity". It is a complex issue.

In the end people will make the movies they want to make anyway. You

stop them. For example, France is a country that traditionally supports

the film business. People that argue against state sponsoring of funding

of movie-makers and film productions so you get a uniformity, it is a

certain kind of movie. Whether it is the kitchen sink, working-class

drama that becomes a lack of variety. But you could certainly say

that about Hollywood and the lack of variety there as well. I think that

what ever deficit you have in terms of bureaucratic nature of

film-making, to some degree that happens when the government support

movie making. It is far outweighed by the benefits that is the culture

of movie-making from your country, in your language. Spain used to have

something, not quite on the level of France, but until several years ago

when the current government came in, the more conservative governments,

they completely wiped it out. There is practically no support for the

film business in Spain. When the French Minister of culture said last

year about wanting to keep French subsidies for film-making, he said

they don't want Hollywood supremacy. But the fact of the matter is the

market share of most films in Europe has gone up from 63 to 69%, the

highest market share in the past ten years. Is that something you regret?

No, if you make a good story, it will eventually be seen. The problem

is, as far as making money right off the bat in the movie theatres, it is

hard to get those movie theatres. It is easier to say Americans and the

American business, but who is that making money in France or in Spain

or in England by showing these big American movies? It is the local

distributors. It is the people in the country. Americans don't control

everything in your country. No, but this is more than just about market

share, it is about culture. The Danish has said American studios

give money to directors to educate them from their creative

fingerprint. He has avoided that fate by making movies in Denmark. He

said you have to fight the urge to do a big action movie. You avoid

Batman, the bigger it is the worst it is. There are all kinds of movies

made in North America and the United States every year. Most of them are

not big studio movies. So he's wrong, is he? No, he is not wrong.

Most of them are not big budget movies and to say a sweeping

statement about American directors being easily brainwashed does a

disservice to them. You are into political issues, would you follow

the path of actors who have gone into politics? Not interested. There

is other ways to make a point, I think. Viggo Mortensen, thanks for

coming on HARDtalk.