Browse content similar to 13/07/2014. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Just two months to go until Scotland decides if it should stay | :00:37. | :00:42. | |
As the campaign heads for the final furlong, | :00:43. | :00:45. | |
what are the issues and arguments that will determine the result? | :00:46. | :00:50. | |
The SNP's deputy leader Nicola Sturgeon joins me live. | :00:51. | :00:53. | |
David Cameron's scheduled a major cabinet reshuffle on Tuesday. | :00:54. | :00:56. | |
Many of those tipped for promotion are women. | :00:57. | :00:59. | |
So have efforts to promote diversity in public life barely started or | :01:00. | :01:03. | |
And don't know whether to support Germany or | :01:04. | :01:12. | |
I have been talking to our political guide to the World Cup. | :01:13. | :01:24. | |
I have been talking to our contingent of new UKIP MEPs. | :01:25. | :01:38. | |
It's World Cup final day and as usual the BBC's snagged the | :01:39. | :01:41. | |
Yes, eat your heart out, ITV, because for top football analysis | :01:42. | :01:46. | |
we've got Gary Lineker, Alan Hansen, and Alan Shearer. | :01:47. | :01:50. | |
And for top political analysis you may | :01:51. | :01:52. | |
as well tune in to them too because all we could come up with is Nick | :01:53. | :01:56. | |
David Cameron will reshuffle his cabinet on Tuesday. | :01:57. | :02:06. | |
The Sunday papers are full of stories telling us who'll be | :02:07. | :02:09. | |
in and who'll be out, though they don't really know. | :02:10. | :02:12. | |
The Mail on Sunday has one of the more eye-catching lines, | :02:13. | :02:15. | |
reporting that former defence secretary and right-winger Liam Fox | :02:16. | :02:17. | |
is in line for a return to the political front line. | :02:18. | :02:20. | |
But there's general agreement that women will do well and some | :02:21. | :02:27. | |
of the old men in suits guard will do badly. | :02:28. | :02:30. | |
Here's senior Tory backbencher David Davis speaking to this programme. | :02:31. | :02:40. | |
It's good to make parliament more representative. | :02:41. | :02:47. | |
But you've got to do it in a way that doesn't create | :02:48. | :02:50. | |
injustices, and you can't put people in a job who can't do the job. | :02:51. | :02:53. | |
And I've seen that too over the last 20 years, people being | :02:54. | :03:01. | |
accelerated too far too fast and they come to | :03:02. | :03:04. | |
a screeching halt where they have to catch up with themselves. | :03:05. | :03:09. | |
I am not going to give an example. Is this not a bit cynical? He is | :03:10. | :03:23. | |
going to promote these women into cabinet positions, but they will not | :03:24. | :03:31. | |
be able to do anything. I am sceptical of Cabinet reshuffle. It | :03:32. | :03:36. | |
is an un-written pact in that the media and the government have a | :03:37. | :03:43. | |
great interest in talking it up The government says, haven't we | :03:44. | :03:47. | |
refreshed ourselves? Generally it doesn't refresh the government. | :03:48. | :03:52. | |
David Cameron wants to send out a new signal. You're going to see the | :03:53. | :03:59. | |
old guard getting a P 45 and you will see a lot of women come in and | :04:00. | :04:03. | |
a lot of younger men. We will find there will be a lot of resignations. | :04:04. | :04:10. | |
A lot of, dear Prime Minister, as I told you 18 months ago, I want to | :04:11. | :04:16. | |
move on. Because the Conservatives have this perception of not being | :04:17. | :04:20. | |
very good with women and not being good with black and ethnic minority | :04:21. | :04:25. | |
voters, they are going to want to do something about that. Why did he not | :04:26. | :04:32. | |
do it before? This reshuffle might be the triumph of the a list. A lot | :04:33. | :04:38. | |
of the women coming through the ranks have been from the a list | :04:39. | :04:43. | |
which was a half measure because they knew they could not bring all | :04:44. | :04:47. | |
of them in. You are going to see more women but that is a result of a | :04:48. | :04:52. | |
long-term strategy. David Cameron is not the world's most raging | :04:53. | :04:58. | |
feminist. He is doing this for practical reasons. He knows he has | :04:59. | :05:02. | |
an image problem for the party and he has to solve it. He was stung by | :05:03. | :05:12. | |
that picture of the all-male bench at Prime Minister's Questions | :05:13. | :05:14. | |
because visibly it gave you the problem that you have been talking | :05:15. | :05:20. | |
about. I do not think he has allowed it to be all-male since that | :05:21. | :05:25. | |
embarrassing image. I can understand the criticism made of this approach | :05:26. | :05:28. | |
if it was the case that all the women being promoted by talentless | :05:29. | :05:35. | |
but you have to be very harsh to look at them and say that they would | :05:36. | :05:40. | |
have much less to offer than the likes of Andrew Lansley. You can be | :05:41. | :05:52. | |
pro-feminist. The tests for David Cameron is that having raised | :05:53. | :05:56. | |
expectations he has to give them substantial jobs. They have to be | :05:57. | :06:00. | |
given departments to run or big portfolios to carry. If they are | :06:01. | :06:05. | |
given media campaign positions in the run-up to the election it looks | :06:06. | :06:10. | |
perfunctorily. He is under some trouble to perhaps suggest a female | :06:11. | :06:16. | |
commissioner to the European Union Commission. Jean-Claude Juncker has | :06:17. | :06:24. | |
made clear that if he proposes a woman candidate they will get a | :06:25. | :06:30. | |
better job. Saying they would like ten out of the 28 to be women. We | :06:31. | :06:37. | |
are going to get the name of the British candidate at the same time | :06:38. | :06:43. | |
as the reshuffle. The first face-to-face meeting, he will be | :06:44. | :06:49. | |
able to put a name. There are other names in the frame. People like | :06:50. | :06:56. | |
Archie Norman. That come from? His name is in the frame. There | :06:57. | :07:05. | |
Archie Norman. That come from? His great scepticism of giving it to | :07:06. | :07:07. | |
Andrew Lansley. People would think he was the man who mucked up the | :07:08. | :07:11. | |
reform of the NHS. Who is it going to be? Either a woman | :07:12. | :07:13. | |
favourite rumour is Michael Howard. That had some legs for a while. | :07:14. | :07:51. | |
The Mystic Megs of Fleet Street predict with confidence that the PM | :07:52. | :07:55. | |
is going to promote more women in his cabinet reshuffle. | :07:56. | :07:56. | |
The move can be seen as part of a move across British public life | :07:57. | :08:00. | |
to do more to make our institutions less male and less white. | :08:01. | :08:03. | |
But as the list of schemes to encourage diversity | :08:04. | :09:26. | |
But as the list leader of the Labour Party, and | :09:27. | :09:30. | |
having won against men in the Cabinet, to succeed to be deputy | :09:31. | :09:34. | |
leader of the Labour Party I discovered that I was not to be | :09:35. | :09:39. | |
appointed as Deputy Prime Minister. For women in this country, no matter | :09:40. | :09:43. | |
how able they are, the matter how hard they might work, they are still | :09:44. | :09:49. | |
not equal. There are initiatives to make the world feel more equal. In | :09:50. | :09:54. | |
the City the EU wants a quarter for women in the boardroom but that goal | :09:55. | :09:59. | |
of making 40% of the top floor female. At the BBC the boss of the | :10:00. | :10:04. | |
TV division says no panel show should ever be all-male. In the ever | :10:05. | :10:10. | |
glamorous movie business the British film Institute announced their new | :10:11. | :10:14. | |
thematic system to get lottery funding projects improving diversity | :10:15. | :10:20. | |
on screen and off and helping social mobility. Employers like Crossrail | :10:21. | :10:28. | |
are not allowed to positively discriminate but under the quality | :10:29. | :10:32. | |
act of 2010 if two candidate for a job are just as good you are allowed | :10:33. | :10:36. | |
to base your decision on characteristics like race, sexuality | :10:37. | :10:42. | |
and gender. Some worry it has chipped away at the idea of hiring | :10:43. | :10:49. | |
on merit. A woman and three men going for a job, two of the men are | :10:50. | :10:53. | |
really good and the woman is not quite as good but she gets the job | :10:54. | :10:57. | |
anyway. That will create injustice, a feeling that she did not deserve | :10:58. | :11:04. | |
the job, resentment. It does not advance equality in society at all. | :11:05. | :11:14. | |
On this project they want to leave a concrete legacy of a more diverse | :11:15. | :11:18. | |
construction industry. The question is, what tools do you use when it | :11:19. | :11:20. | |
comes to the rest of society? I'm joined now by | :11:21. | :11:31. | |
Yasmin Alibhai-Brown, a columnist for the Independent | :11:32. | :11:33. | |
and by Munira Mirza, the deputy mayor of London responsible | :11:34. | :11:35. | |
for education and culture. Cabinet wee shovel coming up punches | :11:36. | :11:48. | |
though. Should David Cameron be promoting women? He is going to do | :11:49. | :11:55. | |
it anyway. He should have a long time ago. It does not feel quite | :11:56. | :12:01. | |
right that a few months before the election it would do the party a lot | :12:02. | :12:07. | |
of good to be seen as a party properly reflective of the entire | :12:08. | :12:11. | |
population. He should promote women because they are women? I think he | :12:12. | :12:16. | |
should think about lots of different factors, whether the people he wants | :12:17. | :12:18. | |
promote have proven themselves in their current reefs, whether they | :12:19. | :12:26. | |
are good performers in the media, whether they represent different | :12:27. | :12:30. | |
parts of the party, but the main principle is to promote on basis of | :12:31. | :12:35. | |
merit. There are many talented women who fill that description. It should | :12:36. | :12:39. | |
be that merit is the important thing rather than what you were born with. | :12:40. | :12:43. | |
The thing about positive discrimination as it flies in the | :12:44. | :12:47. | |
face of that kind of principle. You are shaking your head. We have | :12:48. | :12:52. | |
always had positive discrimination. Men of a certain class have | :12:53. | :12:59. | |
appointed in their own image because they feel most comfortable with | :13:00. | :13:04. | |
that. We have had unspoken positive discrimination in this country and | :13:05. | :13:06. | |
every other country throughout history. We are asking as women all | :13:07. | :13:13. | |
minorities, let us get into the same game. What do you say? You cannot | :13:14. | :13:19. | |
solve the racism or the sexism of the past by more racism and sexism. | :13:20. | :13:25. | |
It is not the past. There are complex reasons why a smaller number | :13:26. | :13:30. | |
of women will appear in certain industries. It has a lot to do with | :13:31. | :13:35. | |
childcare, education, expected. You cannot short cut that by setting a | :13:36. | :13:39. | |
target. That is not how you achieve equality. Things are changing and | :13:40. | :13:43. | |
more women are appearing in engineering and so on but it will | :13:44. | :13:49. | |
take time. My worry is that these kinds of measures are | :13:50. | :13:51. | |
counter-productive and undermine the perception that women can do it on | :13:52. | :13:52. | |
their own merit rather counter-productive and undermine the | :13:53. | :13:55. | |
perception that women can do it than because they need a helping hand. It | :13:56. | :14:00. | |
is not a helping hand. It is to say, we are as good as men and these | :14:01. | :14:11. | |
hidden barriers. Dot. Either they are not as good or they do not want | :14:12. | :14:13. | |
it, which is just how we persuade are not as good or they do not want | :14:14. | :14:17. | |
it, which ourselves that it is not happening, or there are barriers. | :14:18. | :14:22. | |
How we judge meritocracy is at the heart of it. Are lots of industries | :14:23. | :14:30. | |
won there are not that many women, such as engineering. We need more | :14:31. | :14:36. | |
engineers generally. I think it is fine to try to encourage more women | :14:37. | :14:43. | |
to study that subject. By setting a target you put pressure on an | :14:44. | :14:50. | |
organisation. You tried to ignore the complex reasons why women do not | :14:51. | :15:12. | |
go into those sectors. I think an all-female short list achieved | :15:13. | :15:21. | |
miracle in Parliament. This is following up from having an | :15:22. | :15:25. | |
injection of women coming up because the system was changed and a large | :15:26. | :15:29. | |
percentage of women went into Parliament under the all-female | :15:30. | :15:36. | |
short list were brilliant, so why not? So if the Prime Minister is | :15:37. | :15:43. | |
mailed the Deputy Prime Minister has to be female and vice versa? Yes, | :15:44. | :15:51. | |
absolutely, 50-50. We need to reflect the population. If we want | :15:52. | :16:00. | |
to play this as a symbolic gesture, ideally we should have one of each. | :16:01. | :16:05. | |
Why should a man get the job if you have a great female prime minister | :16:06. | :16:11. | |
and a great female Deputy Prime Minister? I personally wouldn't mind | :16:12. | :16:18. | |
this. I hear the disgruntled man and I want to come -- them to come with | :16:19. | :16:29. | |
us. You're choosing people on the basis of traits they were born | :16:30. | :16:33. | |
with. Are there too many Indian doctors in the NHS? I would argue | :16:34. | :16:39. | |
not. Given that we tend to have male prime ministers rather than female | :16:40. | :16:43. | |
ones, and we don't see another female one coming down the pipe very | :16:44. | :16:51. | |
quickly... In the time before women short lists by the way. If you had a | :16:52. | :16:57. | |
male prime minister with a female Deputy Prime Minister, wouldn't that | :16:58. | :17:03. | |
give some balance? Why women? Why not working class person, which | :17:04. | :17:08. | |
group do you prioritise? I would go with you that we need something | :17:09. | :17:13. | |
fundamental to change. This idea that what we have now is a | :17:14. | :17:17. | |
reflection of a genuine meritocracy is highly questionable. I would | :17:18. | :17:22. | |
argue that when you look at the statistics things are changing. | :17:23. | :17:23. | |
argue that when you look at the statistics things There are more | :17:24. | :17:26. | |
women appearing in parts of public life, that is a long-term trend but | :17:27. | :17:35. | |
if you are trying to appoint people on what they were born with... That | :17:36. | :17:39. | |
is not the only reason but it is an additional reason. She has to be | :17:40. | :17:42. | |
able to do the job, obviously. I am saying the policy of hazard to | :17:43. | :17:48. | |
discrimination explicitly state that you should choose somebody who is | :17:49. | :17:52. | |
female because they are female. At the moment there is already enough | :17:53. | :17:56. | |
suspicion about women who are successful to get to the senior | :17:57. | :18:03. | |
position and if you institutionalise it you reinforce that suspicion | :18:04. | :18:06. | |
Harriet Harman is still complaining women are not being treated fairly. | :18:07. | :18:13. | |
I think the policy reinforces the prejudice that women are not getting | :18:14. | :18:17. | |
there because they are treated on the same basis. Although you may not | :18:18. | :18:24. | |
want to have the all-female short list forever, wasn't it the kind of | :18:25. | :18:28. | |
shock to the system that made a visible change in female | :18:29. | :18:33. | |
representation, which the Tory side hasn't got? Of course it will work | :18:34. | :18:40. | |
short-term but longer term it has a very degrading effect on the | :18:41. | :18:45. | |
principle of equality and the fact Harriet Harman is saying she wasn't | :18:46. | :18:50. | |
treated equally, whether it is true or not, the perception is still | :18:51. | :18:58. | |
there. A number of women find this position must be reserved for a | :18:59. | :19:02. | |
woman lying patronising, and speaking of patronising women, you | :19:03. | :19:11. | |
spoken your Independent column, she presses all of the buttons for white | :19:12. | :19:15. | |
people... Was that patronising and offensive? Probably. I wrote it | :19:16. | :19:21. | |
because I felt that at the time but the point is that I was a token when | :19:22. | :19:26. | |
I was appointed. The paper brought me in because I was a woman and I | :19:27. | :19:32. | |
was a muslin or whatever. You are not writing about yourself. I was | :19:33. | :19:38. | |
writing... It doesn't mean you don't criticise other women. We absolutely | :19:39. | :19:54. | |
have to be tough, Manira is tough and so am I. Do you want to take | :19:55. | :20:01. | |
back what you wrote? No. Do you really think positive discrimination | :20:02. | :20:07. | |
has gone too far? I think there is already a suspicion out there that | :20:08. | :20:13. | |
in certain sectors women are being promoted for the wrong reasons or | :20:14. | :20:16. | |
ethnic minorities are being promoted for the wrong reasons. That is a | :20:17. | :20:23. | |
shame and my worry is that by tying funding to your ethnicity or your | :20:24. | :20:27. | |
gender, by saying you will get a promotion if you check that box but | :20:28. | :20:31. | |
you feel that resentment and prejudice and undermine the case for | :20:32. | :20:42. | |
inequality. I wanted to be treated equally, because I am capable of | :20:43. | :20:48. | |
doing that job. Only two months to go before Scotland takes its biggest | :20:49. | :20:56. | |
constitutional decision in 300 years - should it quit or stay with the | :20:57. | :21:02. | |
UK? For some in Scotland campaign has been going on forever. What has | :21:03. | :21:06. | |
been the impact on the campaign to date? | :21:07. | :21:13. | |
Alex Salmond says Scotland would remain part of the European Union | :21:14. | :21:18. | |
with sterling as its currency in a monetary union with the rest of the | :21:19. | :21:22. | |
UK, but he has also promised more public spending, increased child | :21:23. | :21:28. | |
care provision and free personal care for the elderly. The SNP claims | :21:29. | :21:36. | |
it would leave people better off by ?1000 though that partly depends on | :21:37. | :21:41. | |
the price of oil. With the Better Together arguing against | :21:42. | :21:48. | |
independence, it has naturally been attacking the SNP on all fronts | :21:49. | :21:52. | |
George Osborne says there will be no monetary union. President Barroso | :21:53. | :21:58. | |
told the BBC it would be extremely difficult for Scotland to join the | :21:59. | :22:03. | |
EU after a yes vote. His successor this week said he agreed. Unions | :22:04. | :22:17. | |
claim Scotland benefit by ?1400 by being part of the UK. A poll this | :22:18. | :22:24. | |
morning shows a significant lead of 57% for the no campaign, leaving the | :22:25. | :22:31. | |
SNP to claim it will go their way in the last ten weeks. Nicola Sturgeon, | :22:32. | :22:36. | |
the Deputy First Minister of Scotland, joins me now. You want an | :22:37. | :22:40. | |
independent Scotland to keep the pound, stay in NATO, stay in the | :22:41. | :22:47. | |
EU, Scotland already has all of that but you cannot guarantee it would | :22:48. | :22:52. | |
have any of it in an independent Scotland, why take the risk? All of | :22:53. | :22:59. | |
these things should be the case because they are in the best | :23:00. | :23:02. | |
interests of Scotland and the rest of the UK but we want the powers to | :23:03. | :23:08. | |
enable us to grow our economy faster, to be productive, and | :23:09. | :23:14. | |
overtime increased the prosperity of people living in Scotland. We also | :23:15. | :23:20. | |
want powers over our social security system so that we can create a | :23:21. | :23:26. | |
system that meets our needs, one that also has a safety net for the | :23:27. | :23:29. | |
most vulnerable people in our society. Independence is about | :23:30. | :23:36. | |
letting us decide our own priorities. You didn't answer my | :23:37. | :23:40. | |
question, you cannot guarantee you would be able to keep the pound | :23:41. | :23:45. | |
within a monetary union, stay in NATO and the EU, you cannot | :23:46. | :23:50. | |
guarantee you could produce any of these things, correct? I would argue | :23:51. | :23:55. | |
that we can because these things are also in the interest of the rest of | :23:56. | :24:00. | |
the UK. No country can be prevented from using the pound, I suggest we | :24:01. | :24:05. | |
use that within a formal monetary union. We have had the UK minister | :24:06. | :24:11. | |
quoted in the Guardian saying the position of the UK Government right | :24:12. | :24:15. | |
now is one based on campaign rhetoric and following a yes vote, | :24:16. | :24:19. | |
of course there would be a currency union. Who is that minister? The | :24:20. | :24:27. | |
Minister is unnamed, but nevertheless that story in the | :24:28. | :24:32. | |
Guardian was a solid one and not substantially denied. So you are | :24:33. | :24:37. | |
basing your monetary policy on one on named minister in one story? | :24:38. | :24:46. | |
Basing it on Common sense because monetary union would be in the best | :24:47. | :24:51. | |
interests for Scotland but also overwhelmingly in the interests of | :24:52. | :24:55. | |
the rest of the UK, given their trading relationship with Scotland | :24:56. | :25:00. | |
and the contribution Scotland's exports make. We are having a very | :25:01. | :25:08. | |
good debate and the UK Government and the no campaign, and this is not | :25:09. | :25:19. | |
a criticism, want to talk up in -- uncertainty to make people feel | :25:20. | :25:25. | |
scared, but after independence there will be constructed process of | :25:26. | :25:29. | |
negotiation. Let's stick with the monetary union because most | :25:30. | :25:32. | |
economists agree it would be very good for an independent Scotland to | :25:33. | :25:36. | |
have a monetary union but George Osborne, Ed Balls, Danny Alexander | :25:37. | :25:41. | |
are unequivocal, they say you won't get it. You claim they are bluffing | :25:42. | :25:47. | |
but again you cannot guarantee that so why the risk? I would say the | :25:48. | :25:51. | |
benefits of independence are substantial but I would also say to | :25:52. | :25:55. | |
George Osborne and his counterparts in the other parties that it would | :25:56. | :25:59. | |
be a very brave Chancellor that says to businesses in the rest of the UK | :26:00. | :26:05. | |
that they have to incur unnecessary additional transaction costs of half | :26:06. | :26:08. | |
a very brave Chancellor that says to businesses in the rest of the UK | :26:09. | :26:11. | |
that they have to incur unnecessary additional transaction costs of | :26:12. | :26:16. | |
half. What we are doing is making a case that is based on common sense | :26:17. | :26:20. | |
and voters in Scotland will listen to that case being put forward by | :26:21. | :26:25. | |
the other side as well, and they will come to a judgement of the | :26:26. | :26:34. | |
common-sense position. Let's look at EU membership because you haven t | :26:35. | :26:37. | |
been able to guarantee the monetary union. When President Barroso said | :26:38. | :26:47. | |
that a seamless transition to EU membership for an independent | :26:48. | :26:50. | |
Scotland was anything but certain, and one said it could even be | :26:51. | :26:55. | |
impossible, you dismissed him because he was standing down, but | :26:56. | :27:05. | |
been -- venue EU president says the same, do you dismissed him? What we | :27:06. | :27:11. | |
are doing... I should say at the outset of this, we have said | :27:12. | :27:16. | |
repeatedly to the UK Government let's go jointly and ask for a | :27:17. | :27:20. | |
formal opinion on the EU commission. The EU commission have | :27:21. | :27:24. | |
said they will only do that at this stage if the UK Government ask for | :27:25. | :27:31. | |
it, they are point blank refusing to do that, you have to ask why? It is | :27:32. | :27:37. | |
in their interests to talk up uncertainty. Scotland is an integral | :27:38. | :27:43. | |
part of the European Union, we have been for 40 years, we comply with | :27:44. | :27:49. | |
the rules and regulations... Mr Juncker knows all of that but he | :27:50. | :27:54. | |
still says it will be anything but a seamless transition. He said you | :27:55. | :27:59. | |
could not join the European Union by sending a letter, that is not our | :28:00. | :28:11. | |
proposal. We set down a robust proposal and the timescale we think | :28:12. | :28:17. | |
is reasonable under these circumstances. There are many | :28:18. | :28:22. | |
nationals of other states living in Scotland right now, if we were to be | :28:23. | :28:28. | |
outside of the European Union for any period of time, something the | :28:29. | :28:31. | |
current treaty doesn't even provide for, they would lose their right to | :28:32. | :28:37. | |
stay here. The interests of Scotland and the interests of European Union | :28:38. | :28:40. | |
are in favour of a seamless transition. It comes down to common | :28:41. | :28:45. | |
sense and people in Scotland will make | :28:46. | :28:45. | |
sense and people in Scotland will their own | :28:46. | :29:18. | |
sense and people in Scotland will so in a thoroughly democratic way. | :29:19. | :29:26. | |
That is the nature of democracy Would you accept the protection of | :29:27. | :29:36. | |
the NATO nuclear umbrella? There is no doubt the SNP's | :29:37. | :31:01. | |
you do not like the idea of nuclear. Why would they like a member like | :31:02. | :31:06. | |
you in? Because Scotland is a significant part of the territory of | :31:07. | :31:09. | |
the North Atlantic. You do not subscribe to the rules. 25 of the | :31:10. | :31:14. | |
member states of NATO are non-nuclear members. You are saying | :31:15. | :31:23. | |
you do not follow the doctrine. NATO has said it wants to move away from | :31:24. | :31:28. | |
reliance on nuclear weapons. An independent Scotland would be | :31:29. | :31:32. | |
entering the majority mainstream of NATO as a country that did not have | :31:33. | :31:37. | |
nuclear weapons. By leading by example our moral authority and | :31:38. | :31:41. | |
encouraging others to do likewise would be increased. Money and oil, | :31:42. | :31:48. | |
the finance minister has said that an independent Scotland would | :31:49. | :31:50. | |
increase public spending by 3% a year. He would pay for that by | :31:51. | :31:55. | |
borrowing. Your First Minister says he is going to stash money in an oil | :31:56. | :32:00. | |
fund. You're going to borrow and save. How does that work? There are | :32:01. | :32:09. | |
two points. Firstly in terms of the outlook for finances and what is one | :32:10. | :32:12. | |
of the central debates of this referendum campaign, austerity that | :32:13. | :32:17. | |
we know will continue if we stay as part of the Westminster system | :32:18. | :32:23. | |
versus prosperity. The economy can afford a higher level of increase in | :32:24. | :32:27. | |
public spending while we continue to have deficit levels at a sustainable | :32:28. | :32:33. | |
level. What is the point of borrowing and saving at the same | :32:34. | :32:38. | |
time? People who have a mortgage and the savings account would not | :32:39. | :32:40. | |
themselves what the wisdom of that is. This is based on recommendations | :32:41. | :32:47. | |
of our expert fiscal Commission that as borrowing reduces to sustainable | :32:48. | :32:53. | |
levels it makes sense to start saving a proportion of our oil | :32:54. | :32:57. | |
wealth. In Norway, which has many similarities to Scotland, they have | :32:58. | :33:03. | |
an oil fund worth ?500 billion. Scotland is part of the Westminster | :33:04. | :33:09. | |
system is sitting on a share of UK debt. We can continue to allow our | :33:10. | :33:15. | |
oil wealth, our vast oil wealth to be mismanaged or we can decide we | :33:16. | :33:19. | |
are going to manage that resource better in the years to come. Your | :33:20. | :33:25. | |
figures do not add up unless you are about oil prices and revenue and you | :33:26. | :33:29. | |
have been consistently wrong in your predictions. Last year you forecast | :33:30. | :33:33. | |
that revenues would be the .7 billion more than they actually work | :33:34. | :33:43. | |
-- 3.7 billion. The cost of the Scottish school system gone. There | :33:44. | :33:48. | |
were particular reasons for that in terms of interruption to production | :33:49. | :33:52. | |
and bigger levels of investment Used ill have to find the money Let | :33:53. | :33:59. | |
me explain. They are based on robust assumptions, firstly a production | :34:00. | :34:03. | |
estimates that is in line with the estimates of the oil and gas | :34:04. | :34:07. | |
industry. Use of figures that are based on production of 10 billion | :34:08. | :34:13. | |
barrels of oil. Oil and gas has been wrong as well. It is 24 billion left | :34:14. | :34:19. | |
to be recovered. That is what is in the UK Government's oil and gas | :34:20. | :34:23. | |
strategy so production in line with industry estimates and an oil price | :34:24. | :34:30. | |
of $110 per barrel which is flat in cash terms would be a real terms | :34:31. | :34:35. | |
reduction. The Department of energy is estimating $128 per barrel so our | :34:36. | :34:40. | |
estimate compared to that is cautious. These are robust estimates | :34:41. | :34:46. | |
based on robust assumptions. Except they have been wrong. Finally, we | :34:47. | :34:53. | |
hear a lot from you and your fellow nationalists, you want a | :34:54. | :34:57. | |
Scandinavian style social democracy, you know how to spend the money but | :34:58. | :35:02. | |
you never tell us about social democratic levels of taxation. Also | :35:03. | :35:05. | |
should grizzlies have higher levels of tax in Scotland does at the | :35:06. | :35:13. | |
moment -- all social grizzlies. I want a Scottish style of social | :35:14. | :35:20. | |
democracy. Free education, free medicines and balancing the books | :35:21. | :35:24. | |
every single year. We want to get more people into work in Scotland, | :35:25. | :35:29. | |
raise the level of distribution in the Labour market and make the | :35:30. | :35:32. | |
economy more productive so we are raising the overall tax revenue | :35:33. | :35:38. | |
Over the last 33 years we have generated more taxpayer head of | :35:39. | :35:41. | |
population than is the case and the rest of the UK. Those last 33 years, | :35:42. | :35:49. | |
some of those years oil prices would have been high and in others they | :35:50. | :35:52. | |
would have been law but we take different decisions. A report showed | :35:53. | :35:57. | |
that if we go as part of the Westminster system down the plate -- | :35:58. | :36:03. | |
route of replacing Trident then the cost will be as high as ?4 billion | :36:04. | :36:09. | |
every year. Our share of that is the hundred million pounds a year. Let | :36:10. | :36:14. | |
us get access to our own resources so we can make different and better | :36:15. | :36:17. | |
decisions about how to spend the resources we have. You are promising | :36:18. | :36:24. | |
Scandinavian style social democratic levels of public spending but you | :36:25. | :36:28. | |
say you will not need a top rate of tax of 56% which is what Scandinavia | :36:29. | :36:36. | |
has, that all 25%, which is what Scandinavia has and VAT of 15%. You | :36:37. | :36:41. | |
are going to have the spending but none of the taxes that make it | :36:42. | :36:46. | |
possible in Scandinavia. For mischievous reasons you are met -- | :36:47. | :36:50. | |
misrepresenting what I am saying. The Scottish economy can afford it | :36:51. | :36:57. | |
and we want to generate more wealth in our economy. We want to use the | :36:58. | :37:01. | |
existing resources Scotland has We are the 14th richest country in the | :37:02. | :37:06. | |
world in terms of what we produce. We do not want to be wasting | :37:07. | :37:11. | |
resources. We want to be spending resources on the things that other | :37:12. | :37:15. | |
priority for the people of Scotland. These are the benefits and the | :37:16. | :37:19. | |
opportunities really get if we take the opportunity of voting yes and | :37:20. | :37:21. | |
becoming independent. will call in the manifesto, I am | :37:22. | :39:59. | |
sure. It will have to be scrutinised properly. The Liberal Democrat | :40:00. | :40:06. | |
position is different. And cable has said that today. Our MPs do not have | :40:07. | :40:12. | |
the minimum threshold. Why should anyone who is a public sector | :40:13. | :40:16. | |
worker? We need to work with the unions. I think it is a shale that | :40:17. | :40:23. | |
make up as antagonised thesd people. As a teacher myself, I know that you | :40:24. | :40:33. | |
did not strike likely. Is hd making things worse? Our members whll be | :40:34. | :40:39. | |
extremely disappointed to hdar that the discussion today is abott strike | :40:40. | :40:47. | |
ballots. What they want to hear is that it is not great, does not fear | :40:48. | :40:49. | |
that people delivering local that people delivering local | :40:50. | :40:54. | |
government services should be asked to work on poverty pay. That they | :40:55. | :40:58. | |
should have no pay rise for five years above inflation. They have | :40:59. | :41:21. | |
lost 20% of the value of thdrapy. Those people should not be `sked to | :41:22. | :41:27. | |
pay `` to make up a deficit. That is not justice. Surely the bal`nce `` | :41:28. | :41:37. | |
the ballot, at two`year`old ballot, why restrict or? Why inconvdnience | :41:38. | :41:45. | |
people. I cannot speak on that. , but we have a mandate for action. | :41:46. | :41:56. | |
Would you have preferred a workplace ballot? We had a clear mand`te. Our | :41:57. | :42:05. | |
members requested that. It hs their decision to strike, not mind. I | :42:06. | :42:15. | |
think attempts to undermine that and make the discussion about the ballot | :42:16. | :42:18. | |
and the legitimacy of the strike, rather than the real issue, which is | :42:19. | :42:22. | |
about fair wages, is the wrong message to send those workers. Fair | :42:23. | :42:29. | |
wages. Liberal Democrats were supposed to be about that. No here | :42:30. | :42:41. | |
is the tax funded part of otr economy been told that they will | :42:42. | :42:44. | |
have to take less each year. People are struggling. That is why we | :42:45. | :42:47. | |
brought in the raising of the tax threshold to ?10,000. That was a key | :42:48. | :42:53. | |
promise and manifesto. On one hand, you need to rebalance the t`x system | :42:54. | :42:56. | |
so that those who are doing the hardest work on mortgages are those | :42:57. | :43:02. | |
that are rewarded. That is why we want a tax above `` on homes above | :43:03. | :43:09. | |
?2 million. So you would rather that we paid them more? I would rather | :43:10. | :43:14. | |
that public sector workers were getting paid... Well, it is not up | :43:15. | :43:22. | |
to me to decide what. If I get elected in the next `` next | :43:23. | :43:27. | |
election, will not be DTP rhce and they do also. I think it is right. | :43:28. | :43:36. | |
The fact that our members are struggling by, will MPs takd 11 , I | :43:37. | :43:42. | |
think that is unfair. There is a crisis in the public sector at the | :43:43. | :43:48. | |
moment, workloads are up. Pdople, we have lost 400,000 jobs ``. | :43:49. | :43:59. | |
It is absolutely right that the government, listens to this. That is | :44:00. | :44:12. | |
what the strike was all abott. It seems that it is not being taken | :44:13. | :44:16. | |
seriously. I think it is behng taken very seriously. Talking abott | :44:17. | :44:24. | |
balances and thresholds, it is a bit of a misnomer. We have to rdmember | :44:25. | :44:26. | |
that the debt `` the deficit that we that the debt `` the deficit that we | :44:27. | :44:32. | |
have. The caution came together in the national interest to trx to | :44:33. | :44:39. | |
skill this country's debts. Would I like to be sitting here as ` member | :44:40. | :44:42. | |
of Parliament, what David C`meron as prime Minster, offering teachers are | :44:43. | :44:49. | |
much bigger pay rise? Of cotrse we would. We're not in this business to | :44:50. | :45:08. | |
make people more power. `` poor People are making money. Th`t is | :45:09. | :45:14. | |
what the public sector is. `` private sector. But in the public | :45:15. | :45:25. | |
sector, we have to be responsible. I do not think the government can move | :45:26. | :45:30. | |
on this. I think the strikes are unhelpful. Do you think there will | :45:31. | :45:43. | |
be changed before the next election? We will have to do that. | :45:44. | :45:49. | |
If we do not get to `` if wd do not see movement, that will happen. | :45:50. | :45:59. | |
Members deserve that. Thank you for coming in. | :46:00. | :46:04. | |
The European elections back in May were a bit of a bloodbath for | :46:05. | :46:08. | |
Liberal Democrats. They werd left one solitary MP representing the | :46:09. | :46:13. | |
south`east. You kept at its best election ever and is now thd largest | :46:14. | :46:18. | |
group from the UK. In the l`st month he had been settling into the new | :46:19. | :46:19. | |
jobs and offices. We have won some very competent | :46:20. | :46:33. | |
MEPs. May 21 We have won some very competent | :46:34. | :46:40. | |
MEPs. May sought ten Liberal Democrat MEPs called from the group. | :46:41. | :46:51. | |
I am beginning to feel like now I set with a group of people, nearly | :46:52. | :46:57. | |
70 of us, who are the fourth largest party in the Parliament, so we will | :46:58. | :47:08. | |
have a lot of sway on the votes Are the others within the Liber`l | :47:09. | :47:11. | |
Democrat groups more federalist Samar is, some are not. The Germans | :47:12. | :47:16. | |
are less federalist, interestingly enough, because they come from a | :47:17. | :47:26. | |
company that is federated. How do you see the next five years? Is it | :47:27. | :47:35. | |
all unknown? I have things that I want to achieve. I want to get | :47:36. | :47:42. | |
environmental protection buhlt in and what to do some more work on the | :47:43. | :47:46. | |
trafficking of human beings. There's a lot that I personally want to do. | :47:47. | :47:53. | |
I just been elected as a qudst. It means that I am the MEP's | :47:54. | :47:57. | |
representative on the bugle that runs the Parliament. It is not like | :47:58. | :48:07. | |
being in Westminster, where one MP cannot gain animate `` cannot get an | :48:08. | :48:16. | |
amendment. We work together, whether I am working with a socialist one | :48:17. | :48:19. | |
day or Christian Democrats the next day, we find people that we can work | :48:20. | :48:26. | |
with and we work. It is what I call grown`up politics. Miguel, one block | :48:27. | :48:36. | |
over, here. The furniture looks like something my grandmother wotld have | :48:37. | :48:41. | |
had. There is supposed to bd a drinks cabinet. Yes, I belidve it is | :48:42. | :48:58. | |
here. What is the letter? I do not know. It is probably a death threat, | :48:59. | :49:04. | |
I would imagine, from the Lhberal Democrats! It is somebody asking for | :49:05. | :49:11. | |
a job. We will appoint the star I warn we're a point staff th`t will | :49:12. | :49:17. | |
do something properly. Therd is no point just enjoying `` employing | :49:18. | :49:18. | |
your friends. And speaking of friends... He is a | :49:19. | :49:32. | |
veteran of the last Parliamdnt, when the party lost half of its LEPs I | :49:33. | :49:38. | |
knew within weeks that therd was going to be trouble. That is not the | :49:39. | :49:46. | |
case this time. Different pdople? Different people, I think some | :49:47. | :49:52. | |
people are born troublemaker is anyway. I do not think we h`ve any | :49:53. | :49:57. | |
of that in this group of people He has a book on fishing. Taking his | :49:58. | :50:14. | |
work seriously? Cod, there `re no coddle left. I do fishing in the | :50:15. | :50:18. | |
channel and when you're catching cod, the common fisheries | :50:19. | :50:53. | |
find somewhere to love? `` the incest. `` they insist. The money is | :50:54. | :51:01. | |
there if you want to make it. I would rather just as nonlivhng, to | :51:02. | :51:06. | |
be honest. It is even more corrupt, even more anti`democratic and even | :51:07. | :52:35. | |
Apart from the bride and groom, the only names on their are of the | :52:36. | :52:41. | |
blade's father and the grool's father. Mothers do not get `lbum | :52:42. | :52:47. | |
again. This woman wants to get things change. If you're | :52:48. | :52:50. | |
passionately about this. Yes, I do. I do not think there should be a | :52:51. | :52:55. | |
legal document which in 2014 is discriminating against women in this | :52:56. | :53:01. | |
way. Cheating in a Victorian week, the whole thing as our business | :53:02. | :53:04. | |
transaction between two fathers Yes. Woman have been written out of | :53:05. | :53:17. | |
history. Is it really that serious? I think that it has very important, | :53:18. | :53:22. | |
because it is part of a widdr pattern. People are very upset about | :53:23. | :53:27. | |
it. They have been explaining on my petition, they have been getting | :53:28. | :53:30. | |
married and not being able to include their mothers. Therd have | :53:31. | :53:37. | |
been registrars have signed the petition who are saying that every | :53:38. | :53:40. | |
day there haven't explained to people that the form is still in use | :53:41. | :53:49. | |
Where I got married, they h`ve one Where I got married, they h`ve one | :53:50. | :53:54. | |
bit that they have had sincd the 1800, with the names of the people | :53:55. | :53:59. | |
that got married and that vhllage. It is a bit of history. Do xou see | :54:00. | :54:07. | |
for that bit away? Not at all. You could have space on the reghsters | :54:08. | :54:11. | |
and on the marriage certificates at the moment to start recording | :54:12. | :54:15. | |
mothers, and perhaps bring hn new certificates and new registdrs when | :54:16. | :54:19. | |
the old ones were used up. H think it is important, in 2014, that this | :54:20. | :54:24. | |
legal inequality needs to bd stopped. People are raising | :54:25. | :54:36. | |
practical objections. I was people using it as a ruse? I think most | :54:37. | :54:41. | |
people are in support of it, or they are not against it. Because there | :54:42. | :54:49. | |
are still an entrenched atthtude and society, you think there nedds to | :54:50. | :54:55. | |
change? Yes, it is an important message. It is part of this wider | :54:56. | :55:03. | |
pattern and there it is being brought to people's attention, with | :55:04. | :55:10. | |
109 in `` MPs signing the e`rly days of motion and the it's been talked | :55:11. | :55:16. | |
about in the House of Commons, I am looking for the Home Office to get | :55:17. | :55:23. | |
it changed. Will the change it? I hope so. The initial reply was that | :55:24. | :55:35. | |
they had no plans to change the law. That is a classic reply. Thdy have | :55:36. | :55:44. | |
come at this week and seeing that the government is actively looking | :55:45. | :55:48. | |
at this. It seems to me that this is a bit of a no`brainer. Why hs it not | :55:49. | :55:57. | |
happening? As we were seeing Elliott, we need to make sure that | :55:58. | :56:03. | |
there are not things stopping people getting equal pay. It took ` lot to | :56:04. | :56:07. | |
get equal marriage fruit Parliament. We need to focus on things that are | :56:08. | :56:11. | |
of the Day today, it's huge inequalities. Why should thd mother | :56:12. | :56:16. | |
not to be inequalities. Why should thd mother | :56:17. | :56:22. | |
there? Some people are brought up either `` | :56:23. | :56:35. | |
campaign to get parents' nales on children who pause passports. `` | :56:36. | :56:45. | |
children's passports. I don't favour is any sinister plot here, ht is | :56:46. | :56:50. | |
just a piece of old law that needs updating. `` I don't think. The only | :56:51. | :56:58. | |
reason the Government is looking at it is because I have mobilised | :56:59. | :57:03. | |
60,000 people online. Have xou signed it? Yes, that is how | :57:04. | :57:09. | |
democracy works. I think shd is onto something. | :57:10. | :57:27. | |
On Monday Government ministdrs fanned out trumpet in new | :57:28. | :57:30. | |
infrastructure growth deals. The Defence Secretary in Oxfordshire | :57:31. | :57:36. | |
said they were trusting loc`l enterprise partnerships. Getting | :57:37. | :57:39. | |
away from centrally determined priorities to locally deterline | :57:40. | :57:40. | |
priorities. A huge flood relief scheme | :57:41. | :57:47. | |
for Oxford's on the list, but six months on from flooding | :57:48. | :57:50. | |
in Basingstoke, some are not back in their homes, and others worry | :57:51. | :57:53. | |
they'll be hit again. If we do get another downpotr, | :57:54. | :57:55. | |
we?re going to be back to how we was before because they're not | :57:56. | :57:59. | |
maintaining the drains. Thousands of care workers | :58:00. | :58:01. | |
in the South are getting less than the minimum wage, because they?re | :58:02. | :58:04. | |
not paid to travel between jobs If I've worked it, | :58:05. | :58:06. | |
I should be paid it. 140 staff at Oxfordshire Cotnty | :58:07. | :58:08. | |
Council could be asked to work in Winchester, as they shard admin | :58:09. | :58:11. | |
and finance with Hampshire. Meanwhile, it's costing ?20,000 | :58:12. | :58:14. | |
a month to keep Reading Prison That's the amount being spent | :58:15. | :58:16. | |
on security, gas and electrhcity. That is ridiculous. And you are so | :58:17. | :58:34. | |
focused on trying to find s`vings, but they are not always obvhous | :58:35. | :58:41. | |
That business with the care workers, somewhere along the lines some | :58:42. | :58:44. | |
private people have... Last time I was on this programme the ldader of | :58:45. | :58:49. | |
Redding Council was sitting next to me, and I suspect they will be `` | :58:50. | :58:59. | |
she will be onto that. `` Rddding. It is very difficult to drive | :59:00. | :59:04. | |
efficiency. Is this idea of growth deals making things more local? | :59:05. | :59:07. | |
Could that go wrong because people have the wrong way? The thing about | :59:08. | :59:13. | |
these growth deals is they have been driven by Nick Clegg' `` Nick | :59:14. | :59:19. | |
Clegg's office. It is at thd heart of localism to drive the economy | :59:20. | :59:24. | |
with people who understand how that local economy works. So the | :59:25. | :59:30. | |
Oxfordshire `` they have worked closely with the county councils and | :59:31. | :59:34. | |
district councils, parish councils, and we have to work out how best to | :59:35. | :59:38. | |
do it. The best people to s`y how to do that other people on the ground. | :59:39. | :59:42. | |
When you have centralisation, that is when you have wastage. More | :59:43. | :59:48. | |
savings to be made to? In the next Parliament? Whoever is in | :59:49. | :59:53. | |
Government, there will be a long`term economic land. We have | :59:54. | :59:57. | |
talked about the local enterprise partnerships, they have dond very | :59:58. | :00:06. | |
well. `` economic plan. Thex have done very well out of the growth | :00:07. | :00:11. | |
deal, and we want more. The coalition is united on pushhng | :00:12. | :00:18. | |
power, pushing resources. To end `` we end our series with the | :00:19. | :00:24. | |
two of you at least United! That is it for today. Thank you to ly | :00:25. | :00:30. | |
guests. You can keep up`to`date by reading my blog. | :00:31. | :00:35. | |
will keep a bit safer. That is all the time we have. | :00:36. | :00:48. | |
So, plenty happening in Parliament this coming week, including | :00:49. | :00:51. | |
a controversial bill to make so-called assisted dying legal and | :00:52. | :00:53. | |
Lord Carey has intervened in the assisted dying debate. Will it make | :00:54. | :01:14. | |
a difference? It will make a difference because we have | :01:15. | :01:20. | |
established in the House of Lords, I am not sure who they speak for and | :01:21. | :01:26. | |
why they should have a privileged position, but he was a big opponent | :01:27. | :01:33. | |
and has made a change of heart. The fact that the Daily Mail has printed | :01:34. | :01:36. | |
this shows this is a big intervention. The Bill being pushed | :01:37. | :01:48. | |
through, is it now on the agenda? I think it is. There are international | :01:49. | :01:54. | |
examples of assisted dying elsewhere. The state of Oregon | :01:55. | :01:59. | |
passed a Bill similar to this in the 1990s and things have not got out of | :02:00. | :02:05. | |
control. That has not been an expansion or abuse. It has settled | :02:06. | :02:07. | |
down and become part of the furniture. That makes it easier for | :02:08. | :02:17. | |
this Bill, to make the case for it. Religious people may still have a | :02:18. | :02:20. | |
principled objection but most other people have a practical objection, | :02:21. | :02:24. | |
which is how to put in place safeguards to deal with unscrupulous | :02:25. | :02:27. | |
relatives or anyone else who wants to abuse this right? Once a | :02:28. | :02:32. | |
controversial issue is only being opposed for practical reasons it is | :02:33. | :02:37. | |
on its way to getting its way. What is the division, is it the Church | :02:38. | :02:40. | |
against everybody else? Is it a right and left division? What is | :02:41. | :02:49. | |
stopping it? It is a very difficult moral issue and there are people who | :02:50. | :02:54. | |
can have genuinely held Christian beliefs or non-Christian beliefs who | :02:55. | :02:59. | |
can be on both sides. I think that the Lord Carey intervention is | :03:00. | :03:03. | |
potentially a game changer not just because he is a former Archbishop of | :03:04. | :03:07. | |
Canterbury but because he was on the Evan Jellicoe side of the Church of | :03:08. | :03:11. | |
England. That is quite a big move. The response was to say, please | :03:12. | :03:18. | |
withdraw your bell and let us have a royal Commission. The Supreme Court | :03:19. | :03:23. | |
kicked the ball back to Parliament when they rejected the cases of | :03:24. | :03:28. | |
three people who had been taking the case and said, we could say that | :03:29. | :03:34. | |
banning the right to life is against the European Court of Human Rights, | :03:35. | :03:38. | |
but it is a moral issue and an issue for Parliament. Parliament needs to | :03:39. | :03:47. | |
decide. The data act that is going to be pushed through Parliament In | :03:48. | :03:52. | |
record time. To comply with a European court judgement. Tom Watson | :03:53. | :04:01. | |
and David Davis, some dissent. Are you so prized with how united the | :04:02. | :04:05. | |
establishment, left, right and centre is? No. There is a great | :04:06. | :04:13. | |
quote saying this has been enacted under the something must be done act | :04:14. | :04:17. | |
and that captures it exactly. Even Cameron says he does not want to | :04:18. | :04:24. | |
look people in the eye and say that he did not do everything he could. | :04:25. | :04:27. | |
There is no end to the power of surveillance. It is all was about | :04:28. | :04:32. | |
drawing a distinction. I am always suspicious when politicians look | :04:33. | :04:36. | |
something up and said, we have all agreed. Are there at the centre is | :04:37. | :04:42. | |
right or is the political establishment right? I think the | :04:43. | :04:51. | |
establishment is right. I think it is stronger than other issues. We | :04:52. | :04:57. | |
are in a unique position where all three political parties have | :04:58. | :04:59. | |
relatively recent experience of government so they now that security | :05:00. | :05:04. | |
threats are not made up by unscrupulous people. The legislation | :05:05. | :05:11. | |
being proposed is not dramatic, it is to fill a gap that was created. I | :05:12. | :05:18. | |
do not see the political controversy. All three political | :05:19. | :05:23. | |
parties support it. David Davis and Liberty are against that, and always | :05:24. | :05:31. | |
are. Would you not have expected... The Lib Dems are in government, but | :05:32. | :05:35. | |
a bit more rebellion on the Labour backbenches? There is no political | :05:36. | :05:42. | |
controversy put outside parliament there's quite a lot of controversy | :05:43. | :05:48. | |
about this. My paper has taken an interest in this. It is interesting, | :05:49. | :05:55. | |
it does not feel, it is not a 1950s, three public school boys | :05:56. | :06:03. | |
setting, let us have this deal. The Liberal Democrats and Labour have | :06:04. | :06:07. | |
serious questions. There's going to be a sunset clause that will run out | :06:08. | :06:15. | |
in 2016. The Liberal Democrats, who asked pretty tough questions, have | :06:16. | :06:21. | |
said there are assurances. Ed Miliband did not go to public | :06:22. | :06:22. | |
school. For many English football fans, | :06:23. | :06:25. | |
tonight's World Cup final presents How do you pick | :06:26. | :06:28. | |
between two traditional foes Well, if you're | :06:29. | :06:31. | |
a political obsessive, like these three, you could always back the | :06:32. | :06:34. | |
nation according to how it votes. The website LabourList has produced | :06:35. | :06:37. | |
a political guide to the tournament. At the beginning of the tournament, | :06:38. | :06:52. | |
it was a fairly balanced playing field politically with 15 left wing | :06:53. | :06:57. | |
and 17 right-wing countries. England found themselves isolated in a group | :06:58. | :07:01. | |
with three left-wing countries. That was the least of their problems | :07:02. | :07:08. | |
There was a clear domination of democratic regimes over | :07:09. | :07:10. | |
authoritarian with only six of oratory and countries making it | :07:11. | :07:13. | |
through to the finals and the only all authoritarian tie was dubbed the | :07:14. | :07:23. | |
worst match of the World Cup. By the second round 16 teams remained. The | :07:24. | :07:26. | |
left had a clear advantage with nine, seven from the right and | :07:27. | :07:31. | |
authoritarian countries all but wiped out. Two representatives | :07:32. | :07:36. | |
remained. Both were beaten by European democracies. By the | :07:37. | :07:45. | |
semi-finals, all was even Stephen. A right-wing Protestant Europe taking | :07:46. | :07:51. | |
on Catholics South America. With one victory apiece, Germany knocking out | :07:52. | :07:56. | |
Brazil and Argentina beating the Dutch, tonight's final repeats that | :07:57. | :08:02. | |
pattern. Who will win? Angela Merkel's Germany or Argentina? | :08:03. | :08:11. | |
We're joined now by Britain's only Labour adviser | :08:12. | :08:13. | |
Should we read political significance in to the fact that the | :08:14. | :08:27. | |
only time England has won the World Cup was under a Labour government? | :08:28. | :08:33. | |
Of course. The problem is we did not qualify for Euro 2008 when it was a | :08:34. | :08:38. | |
Labour government. We have had some pretty shoddy results under a Labour | :08:39. | :08:43. | |
government. As someone under the left, are you backing Argentina | :08:44. | :08:48. | |
Absolutely not. I do not think it has anything to do with politics. It | :08:49. | :08:53. | |
is a bit of fun. People should choose it is Don Hoop plays the best | :08:54. | :09:01. | |
football and the Germans have been fantastic. They were great in 2 10 | :09:02. | :09:07. | |
as well. They started this model in 2008 and that is the sort of thing | :09:08. | :09:12. | |
people should be supporting. Who should a Eurosceptic support? I | :09:13. | :09:16. | |
would not say Argentina because that is the country that has tried to | :09:17. | :09:21. | |
seize British sovereign territory within my lifetime. You were not | :09:22. | :09:29. | |
around for the Blitz. Believe it or not, I was not. There is a strong | :09:30. | :09:34. | |
political case to support Germany. They are probably going to win the | :09:35. | :09:46. | |
World Cup with a clear of -- with players of Polish origin. That sort | :09:47. | :09:50. | |
of cultural change they have forced themselves to go through... You talk | :09:51. | :09:58. | |
about them being right wing, but in fact the way that the German league | :09:59. | :10:03. | |
is structured, and I am an expert, is based on ownership. It is very | :10:04. | :10:09. | |
different from the Premier League. It is about football as a usual | :10:10. | :10:17. | |
good. The ticket prices are lower. The fans are involved in running the | :10:18. | :10:25. | |
club. It is a model that all English football clubs should emulate. | :10:26. | :10:29. | |
Germany had a strong football team under centre right governments and | :10:30. | :10:33. | |
centre left governments and a coalition. A strong football team | :10:34. | :10:45. | |
and a strong economy. The Conservative MP who is the arch | :10:46. | :10:49. | |
Eurosceptic wanted to get us out of the European Union and was for a few | :10:50. | :10:52. | |
weeks ago when people were making jokes about Jean-Claude Juncker he | :10:53. | :10:58. | |
was outraged and said you should not do that, so he could happily support | :10:59. | :11:04. | |
Germany. What was interesting about the authoritarian and democratic | :11:05. | :11:09. | |
regimes, what is great is that the World Cup is run by this open and | :11:10. | :11:21. | |
democratic organisation Fifa. It is similar to the EU in many regards. | :11:22. | :11:27. | |
Two countries led by women. Maybe gender is the thing. We did not win | :11:28. | :11:36. | |
under Margaret Thatcher. There's one big difference with the EU, you | :11:37. | :11:42. | |
cannot flog six Dom Acta gets to go to a European summit. Did you know | :11:43. | :11:49. | |
that Italy won two world cups under Mussolini? Can we | :11:50. | :12:36. | |
that Italy won two world cups under win the European Championship. The | :12:37. | :12:37. | |
first country Scotland have to play is Germany. What could possibly go | :12:38. | :12:40. |